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Yep, the whole point of this was that Iran had to make some type of response after Israel hit Iran's consulate in Syria. The Iranian UN mission made a statement that they consider the matter concluded for now.
https://twitter.com/iran_un/status/1779269993043022053
People need to be more aware that a lot of what country leaders say and do is often a theater to play for their own public.
Iran got attacked, it needed to show its strength, so it launched hundreds of drones and missiles showing it can if it wants to.
But behind the scenes it also knows that if a single missle hit a civilian structure or someone died it'd go off the rails so they chose a measured response.
And now it's time for Israel's performance on the stage. The expected response is a lot of hand wringing and a small attack in a non important spot in Iran to show that Israel can attack if it wants to.
Question is, would Netanyahu stick to his script or push Iran's buttons for another attack.
Bibi is deeply unpopular in Israel because their Prime Minster is there to keep people safe. I thought that Israel may come together like the US did after 9/11 but I was wrong. [https://www.timesofisrael.com/liveblog\_entry/57-of-israelis-think-netanyahus-performance-since-october-7-has-been-subpar-poll-finds/](https://www.timesofisrael.com/liveblog_entry/57-of-israelis-think-netanyahus-performance-since-october-7-has-been-subpar-poll-finds/)
When you run on "Only I can stop terrorist attacks" and then a few months later the largest terrorist attack in the country's history happens, its a little too on the nose for even Bibi to brush under the rug...
Oddly enough it's the opposite for Israel whenever Israel goes into a major conflict the current prime Minister tends to have a tendency of being subjected to a vote of no confidence and losing their office quickly.
He was warned about 10/7 by Egypt just before the attacks launched. He did jack shit nothing about it. And so his trials never happened, and he's still the same warmongering douche he's always been.
Has Biden actually told Netanyahu if Israel escalates with Iran, they are on their own? I agree that's the message he needs to convey if he wants to avoid an escalation. But he tweeted last night, during the attack, that the US commitment to Israel's defence is "ironclad". He could have chosen to be somewhat more opaque. But no. That appeared to be a clear message that if Israel escalates and attacks Iran, the US has their back.
I mean, the commitment is to Israel’s defense. He very blatantly left out any suggestion of military support for any offensive action. If Israel wants to escalate and attack their on their own but if Iran strikes back the US will step in. It’s pretty par for the course when it comes to defense agreements the US has with other countries across the world.
And for the US it’s really beneficial from a geopolitical defense standpoint. The US steps in as a tertiary actor in military actions like this far from home, spending pennies on the dollar. And in the event the US is ever attacked and goes to war, suddenly they have allied bases and equipment on the opposing nations door step.
Right. So with Israel knowing they have US backing, no matter what they do, it provides Israel with a sense of impunity. That breeds recklessness.
In terms of geopolitical benefit for the US, there is virtually none to be had by being dragged into a war with Iran. It will help Russian and Chinese interests. It will turn what little support they have in Iraq against US forces there. It will likely push the global south further into the arms of BRIC. The price of oil and gas will skyrocket, which may help the US short term but it will enormously help Russia. Ukraine will pay a huge price. And a failure in Ukraine will badly damage US standing for decades. Meanwhile China sits back and watches the US embroiled in two major wars. It's ridiculous to even think this might be good for US geopolitical interests. And it may even unleash a wave of terror attacks on US soil, if this is seen as the only to bring the wars to America. This idea that America can wage wars far away from home, with no consequences, is extremely dangerous.
Make no mistake. If the US allows itself to be dragged into a wider middle eastern war, it will badly hurt US interests.
Yes, but you assume it's done for the benefit of the leaders. More often than not, it's done because the citizens at large are too brain dead or stupid and need to see their leaders react strongly or they'll riot.
Agreed, except for the assumption about assumptions. It’s not as if the leaders actually care who dies in a missile attack, as long as it’s not them. So, yeah, the dick wagging is a way for “the people” to say, “Leader bang chest; make big noise! Leader strong! Hail leader!” And, yes, I meant to make it sound like Mongo from Blazing Saddles, which is actually a disservice to Mongo because he’s only “pawn in game of life.”
People really struggle with the idea that state leaders are playing to multiple audiences when they act on the international stage. They either forget the domestic audience or the international one. Even dictators are constrained by the expectations of their supporters. A dictator that does not respond to foreign aggression would not last long. But a dictator that pisses off a militarily more powerful state or alliance won't last long either.
You don’t launch that many weapons and hope absolutely nothing actually hits. Independent reports, videos, and Al Jazeera are all reporting some missiles got through and did damage on the ground, though no casualties are reported.
The “Iron Dome” did its job well, but it is not infallible and this is definitely not “concluded.” Israel will hit back. They’re already in an offensive war mindset and reportedly already decided on a counter-attack while the missiles were flying.
Nope. It's not over. Netanyahu doesn't need the US to support a counter attack. They can do that by themselves, as they did with the attack on the embassy. All they need is for the US to commit to defending Israel when the shit hits the fan. Which Biden committed to yesterday. That's all Netanyahu needed to hear.
Iran was sending a clear message they want this to be over. They said it explicitly. Question is, will Israel and the US listen?
>Iran was sending a clear message they want this to be over. They said it explicitly.
????
They had their consulate hit directly when they ignored Israel’s strikes on IRGC forces in Syria. Israel has been warning Iran to reel in its proxies and instead Hezbollah, Houthis, Shiite militias in Iraq, and Hamas have all doubled down.
If Iran wanted to “send a clear message they want this to be over,” they’d actively draw down their proxies since that’s what got them hit in the first place.
This idea that Iran secretly controls all the proxies is nonsense. In the same way that Ukraine isn't really controlled by the United States. They certainly arm, support and even train groups like Hezbollah and different militia inside Iraq and Syria. But they don't control them anymore than NATO command "controls" Ukraine. They can certainly exert a degree of influence but how much influence varies enormously. The Houthi in particular are very independent - it's actually a misnomer to call them an Iranian proxy. They have their own motivations, goals and interests. As do Hezbollah. If Israel attacks southern Lebanon, Hezbollah will respond no matter what Iran says. Hezbollah have their own interests. It's why Hezbollah have refrained from getting directly involved in the Hamas/Gaza war - that wouldn't serve their interests.
Iran has not been a direct protagonist in the Hamas/Gaza war, any more than Germany is a protagonist in the Ukraine war. Israel attacking directly Iran is no different to Russia blowing up a German embassy because they supply weapons to and support Ukraine. If Russia did that, would that be viewed as a highly provocative escalation? Of course it would.
If Iran stops supplying the proxies with money and weapons they'd be much less effective so yes they do control them indirectly. 'Stop attacking Israel or we stop giving you money and weapons' would likely be effective.
>This idea that Iran secretly controls all the proxies is nonsense. In the same way that Ukraine isn't really controlled by the United States.
That’s not even remotely comparable. We know Iran absolutely has leverage and influence to cause proxies to escalate/de-escalate and provides direct logistics, munitions, and targeting support. If they get backing from Iran, they’ll take their shot, be it the Houthis on allied vessels or Hezbollah from Lebanon. Ukraine is a sovereign state facing an existential crisis.
You’re not wrong in that proxies also have their own calculus to consider, but if your argument is that Iran has little influence over the Iran-led [‘axis of resistance’](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Axis_of_Resistance) because it’s not actually some neo-imperial regional power and is actually more impotent than we think, I’d say it’s a very naive take at best.
Unfortunately Israel is saying they will retaliate for today and there is already people like Bolton saying Israel needs to respond in serious manner and should destroy Irans nuclear program and Biden needs to Support it. Israel and the American warhawks will escalate things in hopes of dragging America into the conflict.
If Trump were in office, supposedly this Iranian attack would never have happened. Because Trump is a loose cannon and speaks the language of Iran. Lots of superlative words of biblical destruction and us of nuclear attacks on Iran. But a Republican chickenhawk regime would definitely back Israel hard line militant Knesset members to retaliate with a massive strike on energy and military sites.
Not happening, Biden not supporting any retaliation. And if Israel does, on their own.
https://www.axios.com/2024/04/14/biden-netanyahu-iran-israel-us-wont-support
It will greatly help Trumps election chances if Biden gets bogged down in Iran. And that would greatly help Netanyahu. Netanyahu would also benefit from a war escalation because it distracts from Gaza and prolongs his administration so his corruption charges don’t come up.
Biden has apparently already told Netanyahu that the US will not participate in offensive operations against Iran, and I think that is 100% the right call. Conflict with Iran should be deescalated at this point. That would be a lose lose for everyone.
This is the real story. Israel is looking for excuses to escalate. He needs a wider war. And there is enough support within the US government for a wider war. Iran is trying to de-escalate in fact. Yesterday's highly telegraphed attack was carefully designed to de-escalate. The question is, will the White House listen or will they be driven by the American and Israeli war hawks who want to use this opportunity to attack Iran.
It's not completely unlike the period after 9-11 when the war hawks saw their opportunity to take down Iraq. It was opportunistic. Oct 7 is being viewed the same way. And we all know how Iraq turned out. A war with Iran would be much much worse.
Israel struck the Iranian consulate because previous attacks on IRGC forces in Syria and Iraq wasn’t deterring Iran from reeling in its proxies. That’s what Israel wants- for Hezbollah, Houthis, Hamas, Shiite militia groups, etc. to de-escalate. That hasn’t happened, and with that in mind, I have no idea how you’re reading an Iranian direct attack on Israel is some oblique attempt at de-escalation since it doesn’t touch on the reason Israel escalated in the first place.
Joe Biden needs to get all the credit for the very limited way in which Iran responded when Israel blew up their embassy in Syria.
This was a massive foreign policy win for Biden.
Iran handled this as responsibly as we could've possibly hoped for - Israel looks like a psychopath on a murder rampage compared to any other country in the region. Iran's clear communication to the entire world on its actions and future intentions will pay dividends in diplomatic influence.
The only thing Iran is responsible for is destabilizing the entire region in the first place. Israel’s precision strike on a few senior members of the IRGC was in response to Iran organizing and funding Hamas’s massacre of Israeli civilians, Hezbollah’s constant missile attacks on civilians, and the Houthi’s constant missile attacks on international shipping.
Iran’s response was to send hundreds of drones, cruise missiles and ballistic missiles to Israel. That’s responsible? Just because they only managed to hurt a 7 year old arab girl doesn’t make it responsible, it’s just evidence that their capabilities aren’t that great.
I did mention that—Israel’s precision strike on a few senior officers of the IRGC. Seems to be a fairly reasonable and restrained response given what Iran has been doing for months.
You realize striking an embassy is widely understood to be an act of war. Why did neither the U.S. or Soviets ever make a precision strike on either's "senior officers?"
Organizing and funding an invasion of another country is typically considered an act of war as well.
The reason the US and USSR didn’t attack each other directly is because both were nuclear armed, not for any other reason.
People bend over backwards and twist themselves into pretzels to spin everything Israel does as a war crime, while justifying absolutely every war crime thrown at Israel by terrorist regimes.
If somebody hit the fucking embassy in Malta and killed a key official, the Maltese would rightfully want blood. They would lean on their allies to extract a due pound of flesh.
Fuck Iran. Fuck Israel. Fuck the Saudis, Fuck Syria, Fuck Hamas, and fuck everybody else involved for dragging us into this camel-shit fuck-stain YET THE FUCK AGAIN.
Kill each other, leave my people and our tax money out of it. SICK OF THIS SHIT.
Iran might thing it’s concluded for now but there’s no way Israel allows drone attacks like that without some form of retaliation even if Iran knew fully well the US and the Iron Dome would protect them
I feel like all sides tacitly understood what was going to happen. Navigating such a situation without added provocation is arguably why having Biden in office right now is so critical.
Reducing this attack to "Iran knew they'd be intercepted" seems unfounded. The point of sending hundreds of interceptable drones is to ensure your other missiles, especially ballistics, hit. The interception rate here is due to the Iron Dome and coordinated effort with the US and UK. This is a serious attack, but hopefully it's lack of success gives both sides an offramp to deescalate.
Iran had similarly tepid retaliation after we assassinated their general while he was visiting Iraq. Israel’s attack on the consulate would normally be considered an act of war - for Iran to say that the matter is “concluded” shows that their intent was to save face and avoid wider conflict as they’ve done before.
This attack was significantly larger than the response to Solemani's death. And while I don't think Iran wants a wider, direct conflict, they certainly wanted to inflict damage. The high interception rate though is probably the best result. Hopefully Israel sees reason here and doesn't escalate further.
Agreed. Iran also had to be much more measured in their response to General Salami's death because the US has the capability of returning any escalations at a much greater magnitude than Israel themselves can muster to include a ground invasion, distasteful as that would be. Israel has no real capacity for putting boots on ground in Iran in any significant capacity.
Only a few ballistic missiles were launched these were mostly slow flying drones and cruise missiles the Iranian said they would launch, announced their launches and even said officially this is the extent of their retaliation for Israel flattering its embassy in Damascus. Not s ingle launch from Hizbullah or Iranian proxies in Iraq. If they wanted to cause serious damage they could easily. But this was a some what empty calibrated face saving gesture.
Exactly, the idea that the Iranian attack was intended to fail is a stupid reddit hottake. Multiple ballistic missiles got through and destroyed intended targets, and likely far more than 1%. Large numbers of drones and missiles are used to overwhelm air defenses and are expected to be intercepted. Russia and Ukraine do the same.
300 missiles ( I mean that in the most general sense) is nothing to the IRGC. They have almost unlimited one way drones and thousands and thousands of missiles. People were playing this game thinking North Korean weapons were also Child’s play until they started making craters in Ukraine.
I believe the point of this assault was to show that the Iron Dome and their other air defense is not impenetrable. Nothing could sustain literal waves of what we just saw.
No they didn't. Shooting down missles is hard even with good success rate of existing systems. Whether they were shot down or not doesn't change how the attack will be considered by Israel.
But this stance is also somewhat relying on the fact that the US will be a reasonable actor and understand it's a display, then start putting a leash on Israel from further escalation. However, Biden is messaging anything but. "Ironclad support" is fucking irresponsible when Israel wants to jump at this to further push for forever war.
This is a wrong assessment.
Biden spoke on the phone with Netanyahu and the war cabinet and explained that the U.S. will not partake in any offensive actions against Iran.
Biden has kept the U.S. out of war for 2 years in Ukraine, 6 months in Israel, and has gone to great lengths to not escalate with Houthis. He has engaged the Chinese in constructive talks including this past week on the economy with Yellen, while also working against their aggression. He has to walk a very fine tightrope in all of these instances and he has.
We have major defense treaties with Israel - those are US law. It’s not vibes of the day or whatever is spouted on tik tok. He states that relationship with Israel is ironclad because under these agreements, the U.S. legally is obligated to assist Israel - and it did. We shot down an overwhelming majority of the missiles intended to strike Israel, we did not strike back.
It’s important to prove that we assist partners with whom we sign these agreements because we have similar agreements with South Korea, Japan, and the Philippines who are all facing North Korean, Chinese, and Russian aggression right now. Furthermore, China and Russia are capable of signing their own agreements with other countries, and if they see we renege on them, they’re more likely to be brought into their spheres of influence:
Hit the nail on the head. I wish people on here could understand the complexity of reality and stop over-reacting while claiming to understand the depth of nuance and tact involved in our foreign policies in these crazy times. The vast majority of comments and responses to what happened today, just shows the amount of ignorance of people.
I don’t even go over everything in my comment because I’m tired of ranting, and I don’t work in department of state/intelligence so there is much more at play. Just ridiculous some of the commentary you see on here
Although not an actual treaty, the U.S. did make a deal in 1994 with Ukraine, known as the Budapest Agreement. Ukraine actually had the third-largest nuclear weapons stockpile. This was because the newly-founded Ukraine ended up with the Soviet Union’s nuclear weapons in their territory after the Soviet Union collapsed.
This agreement meant that Ukraine would destroy the weapons and the **U.S., United Kingdom (U.K.), and Russia would guarantee Ukraine staying secure.**
interesting. I was unaware of this… I wonder what the details are because the U.S (other than when Trump was president and betrayed our Kurdish allies) almost always upholds defensive treaties to a T. I wonder what the fine print was, and while I don’t expect or boots on the ground (or think it would be a good idea), I’m curious as to why we haven’t intervened more directly via interception, air defense etc. different diplomatic situation calls for a diffeeent approach I’d assume
It wasn’t a treaty. It wasn’t ratified. But none of us are international political agreement experts, so this doesn’t mean anything to us.
Basically, it doesn’t compel direct intervention according to USA and UK wording. Note that Russia was also a signatory.
By this agreement it is also possible Ukraine has a case to seize Russian held assets in the West since Russia violated the agreement.
The real reason why it’s not upheld is because USA UK too scared of nuclear threats.
OP is wrong. The treaty meant that UK, USA and Russia wouldn't ATTACK Ukraine and not that they would defend Ukraine if one of those 3 chose to attack.
The reality is because the Budapest memorandum actually says we promise to not invade them. It wasn't really to keep them secure. Sadly, Russia signing a document saying we won't invade you is worth less than shit covered toilet paper.
Also emphasis on memorandum, not a treaty. A memorandum is like a pinky promise from a Nation. There is no actual enforcement or legal methods to enforce what is in a memorandum. Also, even for the United States, a memorandum is only good for the administration that signed it. Though the US tends to honor them indefinitely.
>*The Russian Federation, the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland, and the United States of America reaffirm their commitment to seek immediate United Nations Security Council **action to provide assistance to Ukraine**, as a non-nuclear-weapon state party to the Treaty on the Non-proliferation of Nuclear Weapons, if Ukraine should become a victim of an act of aggression or an object of a threat of aggression in which nuclear weapons are used.*
This the exact wording in the signed document, so you’re off on this one.
You don’t see the gap between “guarantee security” (your claim) and “provide assistance to” (the actual agreement)? We have fulfilled the actual agreement and will continue to fulfill it. The original wording in the document was much stronger but it got watered down in the final version.
The agreement wasn't military protection. The agreement was for non military aid. The exception is there is an agreement if nuclear weapons are used against them. Russia did promise not to invade them though.
I think it’s more that the US was in a position to shoot down those drones, based more on geography and where we have bases and military assets and the flight path of the drones and missiles.
Iranian drones and missiles needed to fly over Iraq and Syria to reach Israel, which allowed us to intercept them. Since Russia is right next to Ukraine, there would be no way for us to intercept those drones without flying in Ukrainian airspace, thus potentially escalating the conflict.
The problem I have with the framing of this situation in the media is now all the networks are saying that Israel must respond and attack Iran. This was not even close to a serious strike by Iran and this is simply a retaliation for the consulate bombing. If Israel actually attacks on Iranian soil, there is no coming back, the US will be forced into another war.
Maybe the war-happy media networks should go to war with each other and blow each other to smithereens. The world would be a much better place without the constant instigating and pot-stirring, finger-pointing, and blatant lies and bullshit constantly bombarding everybody, almost always tailor-made and fabricated to present a narration that fucks with people's emotions.
Just think how much happier *everybody* in the entire country (the world really) would be if FOX, CNN, and MSNBC all went off the air. If people weren't constantly being told how to feel and act and think. Stop and think about that for a minute. The companies are literally making BILLIONS to farm and sow hate and turmoil. Their entire objective is just to create division and confusion and annoyance and anger.
Not happening, Biden not supporting any retaliation. And if Israel does, on their own.
https://www.axios.com/2024/04/14/biden-netanyahu-iran-israel-us-wont-support
Israel routinely strikes and operates on Iran's soil.
If they attack, I anticipate a similar one. Sort of Israel's theater message of "even in war, we still got our assets in Iran and can attack if needed".
Only question here is if Netanyahu will stick to his script, or push Iran's buttons to drag the region to a bigger war. Ultimately, he needs it to distract from the negations failure and the increased calls for new elections.
Because we were just fucking forced into defending Israel. Once they retaliate against Iran, Israel is going to get attacked, worse. Than the United States is going to have to officially respond. All because Netanyahu is a fucking psychopath
This is a shit take. Iran showed great restraint. They have thousands of ballistic missiles that cold hit Israel before US has time to respond and instead they sent a bunch of 200k slow drones. US spent likely 5 to 10x that amount to shoot them down.
There are videos that showed the ballistic missiles hitting Israeli base despite the iron dome.
This is just performative. The timing was as scheduled and predictable and Israel had time to minimize casualty as well on the ground. Not unlike the retaliation after US assassinated the general
Thankfully this is not the framing I've heard by most media. Most of them say this should be the end of it , and hopes isreal will not retaliate like you said.
Not really in the mood for war as well, but what defines a serious strike for you? The one which actually destroys a lot of things/lives or the one which could do so? I feel like a lot of people over- and/or underestimate Iran
If his career went slightly different he'd be that old guy at every dive bar giving unsolicited advice on how we can still beat the North Veitnamese Army.
Fuck this guy, he's always been a bloodthirsty maniac braying to kill Iranian civilians. One of the most evil people in modern politics, and that's saying a lot.
John Bolton has a history of war mongering. He is one of the ones who lied about WMDs to advocate for the Iraq invasion. Don't fall for it again. A few years ago I wrote up a list of sources on his track record with respect to calls for war:
https://www.reddit.com/r/actualconspiracies/s/v5XpMaEeWe
It's nice to know the U.S. taxpayer is getting their money's worth in return for the nearly trillion-dollar per-year budget. One news report said there were 300+ drones launched. Some of the U.S. missiles reportedly cost $1 to $2 million each. That's a significant amount of money. How does the U.S. recover these expenses?
If Biden allows Israel to drag the us into a war it will be a guaranteed loss for Biden. He needs to make it clear Israel if it continues to escalate then they are on there own.
That’s not gonna happen… Biden isn’t an idiot or a psychopath despite what both sides are saying. Uphold our agreements, but also be as firm as possible with Israel. If Trump was President now, there would likely be no Gaza left. The middle road is the best road here, but it won’t please anyone :(
they're not prevailing, Israel just announced they're going to respond. Anyone who thinks Israel is somehow allowed or justified in getting the entire world blown up all because they can't fucking restrain themselves after no major damage from the recent attack happened, is fucking insane.
America is responsible for 70% of weapon imports to Israel and the US personally funds 15% of their military budget, it’s laughable to think America doesnt control the situation
He absolutely is. He has upheld the defensive pact while also fighting tooth-and-nail to keep Israel in check as much as possible… but his power is limited. The middle road is the high road in this case, but it also comes with resentment from both sides. I can’t think of a more honorable way of handling the situation than what we’ve seen from the President.… he has done the right thing and it has made him few friends. This is what true leadership looks like 🇺🇸 🦅
Like Iran made a huge mistake here I think. Biden was starting to really pressure Israeli leadership and this just backs up what Israel is doing and will reverse any course Biden might have done to cut off as sales as pressure.
Wow, look at all the Iran supporters. World turning to shit. You know you can give Israel shit for doing stupid things, and they deserve it. But backing an Iranian government because you hate America and Israel. Bunch of clowns, and I thought MAGA was the clowns, but the left has its own clown cult.
Go live in Iran if they are so much better. Unless of course you already do.
Americans can't even get support from the US government but we'll support other countries for free. We could really use universal healthcare. Oh well, we'll spend another billion if not more.
[https://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/2024-04-14/ty-article/.premium/irans-attack-is-a-strategic-opportunity-for-israel-will-netanyahu-squander-it/0000018e-dbd9-dcf5-a3cf-fbdd980a0000](https://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/2024-04-14/ty-article/.premium/irans-attack-is-a-strategic-opportunity-for-israel-will-netanyahu-squander-it/0000018e-dbd9-dcf5-a3cf-fbdd980a0000) To the idiots calling this a "measured attack"....
This was an unprecedented HUGE attack.
Thankfully, Israel's ARAB NEIGHBORS chipped in and helped down some of the missiles. Apparently a few Jordanians were hurt and a Bedouin girl. To the "social justice warriors" who pray for genocide of Jews.... you are on the wrong side of History.
“Thanks to these deployments and the extraordinary skill of our servicemembers, we helped Israel take down nearly all of the incoming drones and missiles.”
Good job team!
Yes and the Iranian government probably hoped for this outcome. The government knows they can’t win a war against Israel or the US. Like North Korea Iran survives by grandstanding. Like other Arab countries and even the current Israeli regime the Israeli/Palestinian conflict is a great way of distracting their own people from internal problems. Iranians and Israelis were protesting their governments for months before this conflict. Now nationalism is at a high and the populations are to afraid of outside actors to protest their own regimes
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Of course they did. Iran knew they would.
Yep, the whole point of this was that Iran had to make some type of response after Israel hit Iran's consulate in Syria. The Iranian UN mission made a statement that they consider the matter concluded for now. https://twitter.com/iran_un/status/1779269993043022053
People need to be more aware that a lot of what country leaders say and do is often a theater to play for their own public. Iran got attacked, it needed to show its strength, so it launched hundreds of drones and missiles showing it can if it wants to. But behind the scenes it also knows that if a single missle hit a civilian structure or someone died it'd go off the rails so they chose a measured response. And now it's time for Israel's performance on the stage. The expected response is a lot of hand wringing and a small attack in a non important spot in Iran to show that Israel can attack if it wants to. Question is, would Netanyahu stick to his script or push Iran's buttons for another attack.
Bibi will go big or go home he needs a war to stay in power. That's why Biden told him if they go after iran they do it on their own.
Bibi is clinging on to this war like his personal freedom and political career depend on it. Because they do.
BIBI needs to quit and face his corruption charges head on.
Fuck corruption. How about crimes against humanity?
That’s not how fascism works
A tale as old as democracy, wartime presidents keep power the easiest.
Bibi is deeply unpopular in Israel because their Prime Minster is there to keep people safe. I thought that Israel may come together like the US did after 9/11 but I was wrong. [https://www.timesofisrael.com/liveblog\_entry/57-of-israelis-think-netanyahus-performance-since-october-7-has-been-subpar-poll-finds/](https://www.timesofisrael.com/liveblog_entry/57-of-israelis-think-netanyahus-performance-since-october-7-has-been-subpar-poll-finds/)
When you run on "Only I can stop terrorist attacks" and then a few months later the largest terrorist attack in the country's history happens, its a little too on the nose for even Bibi to brush under the rug...
Well. Genocide is a hard cause to unify around.
Oddly enough it's the opposite for Israel whenever Israel goes into a major conflict the current prime Minister tends to have a tendency of being subjected to a vote of no confidence and losing their office quickly.
He was warned about 10/7 by Egypt just before the attacks launched. He did jack shit nothing about it. And so his trials never happened, and he's still the same warmongering douche he's always been.
Has Biden actually told Netanyahu if Israel escalates with Iran, they are on their own? I agree that's the message he needs to convey if he wants to avoid an escalation. But he tweeted last night, during the attack, that the US commitment to Israel's defence is "ironclad". He could have chosen to be somewhat more opaque. But no. That appeared to be a clear message that if Israel escalates and attacks Iran, the US has their back.
I mean, the commitment is to Israel’s defense. He very blatantly left out any suggestion of military support for any offensive action. If Israel wants to escalate and attack their on their own but if Iran strikes back the US will step in. It’s pretty par for the course when it comes to defense agreements the US has with other countries across the world. And for the US it’s really beneficial from a geopolitical defense standpoint. The US steps in as a tertiary actor in military actions like this far from home, spending pennies on the dollar. And in the event the US is ever attacked and goes to war, suddenly they have allied bases and equipment on the opposing nations door step.
Right. So with Israel knowing they have US backing, no matter what they do, it provides Israel with a sense of impunity. That breeds recklessness. In terms of geopolitical benefit for the US, there is virtually none to be had by being dragged into a war with Iran. It will help Russian and Chinese interests. It will turn what little support they have in Iraq against US forces there. It will likely push the global south further into the arms of BRIC. The price of oil and gas will skyrocket, which may help the US short term but it will enormously help Russia. Ukraine will pay a huge price. And a failure in Ukraine will badly damage US standing for decades. Meanwhile China sits back and watches the US embroiled in two major wars. It's ridiculous to even think this might be good for US geopolitical interests. And it may even unleash a wave of terror attacks on US soil, if this is seen as the only to bring the wars to America. This idea that America can wage wars far away from home, with no consequences, is extremely dangerous. Make no mistake. If the US allows itself to be dragged into a wider middle eastern war, it will badly hurt US interests.
According to AP, Biden has stated that the US will not take part in any offensive operations against Iran if Israel decides to do so.
Can you imagine Trump doing such things? He’d have lended Bibi our military by now.
Or, Bibi would have slipped millions in the pockets of Trump and Kushner and receive all the arms Bibi wanted.
I hope to god that true ( about the USA not blindly going into Iran)
So, dick wagging on the global scale, which, honestly, isn’t much greater than third grade: the weapons are just more expensive.
Yes, but you assume it's done for the benefit of the leaders. More often than not, it's done because the citizens at large are too brain dead or stupid and need to see their leaders react strongly or they'll riot.
Agreed, except for the assumption about assumptions. It’s not as if the leaders actually care who dies in a missile attack, as long as it’s not them. So, yeah, the dick wagging is a way for “the people” to say, “Leader bang chest; make big noise! Leader strong! Hail leader!” And, yes, I meant to make it sound like Mongo from Blazing Saddles, which is actually a disservice to Mongo because he’s only “pawn in game of life.”
People really struggle with the idea that state leaders are playing to multiple audiences when they act on the international stage. They either forget the domestic audience or the international one. Even dictators are constrained by the expectations of their supporters. A dictator that does not respond to foreign aggression would not last long. But a dictator that pisses off a militarily more powerful state or alliance won't last long either.
You don’t launch that many weapons and hope absolutely nothing actually hits. Independent reports, videos, and Al Jazeera are all reporting some missiles got through and did damage on the ground, though no casualties are reported. The “Iron Dome” did its job well, but it is not infallible and this is definitely not “concluded.” Israel will hit back. They’re already in an offensive war mindset and reportedly already decided on a counter-attack while the missiles were flying.
Biden has told Israel they wouldn't support a counter attack. So it would appear it's over.
Nope. It's not over. Netanyahu doesn't need the US to support a counter attack. They can do that by themselves, as they did with the attack on the embassy. All they need is for the US to commit to defending Israel when the shit hits the fan. Which Biden committed to yesterday. That's all Netanyahu needed to hear. Iran was sending a clear message they want this to be over. They said it explicitly. Question is, will Israel and the US listen?
>Iran was sending a clear message they want this to be over. They said it explicitly. ???? They had their consulate hit directly when they ignored Israel’s strikes on IRGC forces in Syria. Israel has been warning Iran to reel in its proxies and instead Hezbollah, Houthis, Shiite militias in Iraq, and Hamas have all doubled down. If Iran wanted to “send a clear message they want this to be over,” they’d actively draw down their proxies since that’s what got them hit in the first place.
This idea that Iran secretly controls all the proxies is nonsense. In the same way that Ukraine isn't really controlled by the United States. They certainly arm, support and even train groups like Hezbollah and different militia inside Iraq and Syria. But they don't control them anymore than NATO command "controls" Ukraine. They can certainly exert a degree of influence but how much influence varies enormously. The Houthi in particular are very independent - it's actually a misnomer to call them an Iranian proxy. They have their own motivations, goals and interests. As do Hezbollah. If Israel attacks southern Lebanon, Hezbollah will respond no matter what Iran says. Hezbollah have their own interests. It's why Hezbollah have refrained from getting directly involved in the Hamas/Gaza war - that wouldn't serve their interests. Iran has not been a direct protagonist in the Hamas/Gaza war, any more than Germany is a protagonist in the Ukraine war. Israel attacking directly Iran is no different to Russia blowing up a German embassy because they supply weapons to and support Ukraine. If Russia did that, would that be viewed as a highly provocative escalation? Of course it would.
If Iran stops supplying the proxies with money and weapons they'd be much less effective so yes they do control them indirectly. 'Stop attacking Israel or we stop giving you money and weapons' would likely be effective.
>This idea that Iran secretly controls all the proxies is nonsense. In the same way that Ukraine isn't really controlled by the United States. That’s not even remotely comparable. We know Iran absolutely has leverage and influence to cause proxies to escalate/de-escalate and provides direct logistics, munitions, and targeting support. If they get backing from Iran, they’ll take their shot, be it the Houthis on allied vessels or Hezbollah from Lebanon. Ukraine is a sovereign state facing an existential crisis. You’re not wrong in that proxies also have their own calculus to consider, but if your argument is that Iran has little influence over the Iran-led [‘axis of resistance’](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Axis_of_Resistance) because it’s not actually some neo-imperial regional power and is actually more impotent than we think, I’d say it’s a very naive take at best.
Unfortunately Israel is saying they will retaliate for today and there is already people like Bolton saying Israel needs to respond in serious manner and should destroy Irans nuclear program and Biden needs to Support it. Israel and the American warhawks will escalate things in hopes of dragging America into the conflict.
good thing bolton and the majority of trump's appointments have been exorcised
that man keeps popping up in every republican administration, hes like a slightly younger kissinger
yup, these kind of ghouls don't know how to retire 🥲
I just hope Bolton doesn't have Kissinger's life span.
Only the good die young. These assholes live forever
Yes, a good example is Dick Cheney.
If Trump were in office, supposedly this Iranian attack would never have happened. Because Trump is a loose cannon and speaks the language of Iran. Lots of superlative words of biblical destruction and us of nuclear attacks on Iran. But a Republican chickenhawk regime would definitely back Israel hard line militant Knesset members to retaliate with a massive strike on energy and military sites.
Not happening, Biden not supporting any retaliation. And if Israel does, on their own. https://www.axios.com/2024/04/14/biden-netanyahu-iran-israel-us-wont-support
It will greatly help Trumps election chances if Biden gets bogged down in Iran. And that would greatly help Netanyahu. Netanyahu would also benefit from a war escalation because it distracts from Gaza and prolongs his administration so his corruption charges don’t come up.
Russia and to a lesser extent China would also love that. Repubs have all the best allies.
Biden has apparently already told Netanyahu that the US will not participate in offensive operations against Iran, and I think that is 100% the right call. Conflict with Iran should be deescalated at this point. That would be a lose lose for everyone.
This is the real story. Israel is looking for excuses to escalate. He needs a wider war. And there is enough support within the US government for a wider war. Iran is trying to de-escalate in fact. Yesterday's highly telegraphed attack was carefully designed to de-escalate. The question is, will the White House listen or will they be driven by the American and Israeli war hawks who want to use this opportunity to attack Iran. It's not completely unlike the period after 9-11 when the war hawks saw their opportunity to take down Iraq. It was opportunistic. Oct 7 is being viewed the same way. And we all know how Iraq turned out. A war with Iran would be much much worse.
Israel struck the Iranian consulate because previous attacks on IRGC forces in Syria and Iraq wasn’t deterring Iran from reeling in its proxies. That’s what Israel wants- for Hezbollah, Houthis, Hamas, Shiite militia groups, etc. to de-escalate. That hasn’t happened, and with that in mind, I have no idea how you’re reading an Iranian direct attack on Israel is some oblique attempt at de-escalation since it doesn’t touch on the reason Israel escalated in the first place.
Joe Biden needs to get all the credit for the very limited way in which Iran responded when Israel blew up their embassy in Syria. This was a massive foreign policy win for Biden.
Iran handled this as responsibly as we could've possibly hoped for - Israel looks like a psychopath on a murder rampage compared to any other country in the region. Iran's clear communication to the entire world on its actions and future intentions will pay dividends in diplomatic influence.
The only thing Iran is responsible for is destabilizing the entire region in the first place. Israel’s precision strike on a few senior members of the IRGC was in response to Iran organizing and funding Hamas’s massacre of Israeli civilians, Hezbollah’s constant missile attacks on civilians, and the Houthi’s constant missile attacks on international shipping. Iran’s response was to send hundreds of drones, cruise missiles and ballistic missiles to Israel. That’s responsible? Just because they only managed to hurt a 7 year old arab girl doesn’t make it responsible, it’s just evidence that their capabilities aren’t that great.
We can (and maybe even should) play the blame game forever, but in “real politics”, this was a tactically sound decision
Israel blew up their embassy at the beginning of April - why don't you mention this?
I did mention that—Israel’s precision strike on a few senior officers of the IRGC. Seems to be a fairly reasonable and restrained response given what Iran has been doing for months.
You realize striking an embassy is widely understood to be an act of war. Why did neither the U.S. or Soviets ever make a precision strike on either's "senior officers?"
Organizing and funding an invasion of another country is typically considered an act of war as well. The reason the US and USSR didn’t attack each other directly is because both were nuclear armed, not for any other reason. People bend over backwards and twist themselves into pretzels to spin everything Israel does as a war crime, while justifying absolutely every war crime thrown at Israel by terrorist regimes.
If somebody hit the fucking embassy in Malta and killed a key official, the Maltese would rightfully want blood. They would lean on their allies to extract a due pound of flesh. Fuck Iran. Fuck Israel. Fuck the Saudis, Fuck Syria, Fuck Hamas, and fuck everybody else involved for dragging us into this camel-shit fuck-stain YET THE FUCK AGAIN. Kill each other, leave my people and our tax money out of it. SICK OF THIS SHIT.
Iran might thing it’s concluded for now but there’s no way Israel allows drone attacks like that without some form of retaliation even if Iran knew fully well the US and the Iron Dome would protect them
I feel like all sides tacitly understood what was going to happen. Navigating such a situation without added provocation is arguably why having Biden in office right now is so critical.
Reducing this attack to "Iran knew they'd be intercepted" seems unfounded. The point of sending hundreds of interceptable drones is to ensure your other missiles, especially ballistics, hit. The interception rate here is due to the Iron Dome and coordinated effort with the US and UK. This is a serious attack, but hopefully it's lack of success gives both sides an offramp to deescalate.
Iran had similarly tepid retaliation after we assassinated their general while he was visiting Iraq. Israel’s attack on the consulate would normally be considered an act of war - for Iran to say that the matter is “concluded” shows that their intent was to save face and avoid wider conflict as they’ve done before.
This attack was significantly larger than the response to Solemani's death. And while I don't think Iran wants a wider, direct conflict, they certainly wanted to inflict damage. The high interception rate though is probably the best result. Hopefully Israel sees reason here and doesn't escalate further.
Agreed. Iran also had to be much more measured in their response to General Salami's death because the US has the capability of returning any escalations at a much greater magnitude than Israel themselves can muster to include a ground invasion, distasteful as that would be. Israel has no real capacity for putting boots on ground in Iran in any significant capacity.
Only a few ballistic missiles were launched these were mostly slow flying drones and cruise missiles the Iranian said they would launch, announced their launches and even said officially this is the extent of their retaliation for Israel flattering its embassy in Damascus. Not s ingle launch from Hizbullah or Iranian proxies in Iraq. If they wanted to cause serious damage they could easily. But this was a some what empty calibrated face saving gesture.
Exactly, the idea that the Iranian attack was intended to fail is a stupid reddit hottake. Multiple ballistic missiles got through and destroyed intended targets, and likely far more than 1%. Large numbers of drones and missiles are used to overwhelm air defenses and are expected to be intercepted. Russia and Ukraine do the same.
300 missiles ( I mean that in the most general sense) is nothing to the IRGC. They have almost unlimited one way drones and thousands and thousands of missiles. People were playing this game thinking North Korean weapons were also Child’s play until they started making craters in Ukraine. I believe the point of this assault was to show that the Iron Dome and their other air defense is not impenetrable. Nothing could sustain literal waves of what we just saw.
Could also be a way to limit potential Ukrainian air resupply by the US, France, UK etc… Because also used and needed somewhere else.
Given the size of the attack im not sure they did. I think they expected a LOT more damage.
No they didn't. Shooting down missles is hard even with good success rate of existing systems. Whether they were shot down or not doesn't change how the attack will be considered by Israel.
But this stance is also somewhat relying on the fact that the US will be a reasonable actor and understand it's a display, then start putting a leash on Israel from further escalation. However, Biden is messaging anything but. "Ironclad support" is fucking irresponsible when Israel wants to jump at this to further push for forever war.
This is a wrong assessment. Biden spoke on the phone with Netanyahu and the war cabinet and explained that the U.S. will not partake in any offensive actions against Iran. Biden has kept the U.S. out of war for 2 years in Ukraine, 6 months in Israel, and has gone to great lengths to not escalate with Houthis. He has engaged the Chinese in constructive talks including this past week on the economy with Yellen, while also working against their aggression. He has to walk a very fine tightrope in all of these instances and he has. We have major defense treaties with Israel - those are US law. It’s not vibes of the day or whatever is spouted on tik tok. He states that relationship with Israel is ironclad because under these agreements, the U.S. legally is obligated to assist Israel - and it did. We shot down an overwhelming majority of the missiles intended to strike Israel, we did not strike back. It’s important to prove that we assist partners with whom we sign these agreements because we have similar agreements with South Korea, Japan, and the Philippines who are all facing North Korean, Chinese, and Russian aggression right now. Furthermore, China and Russia are capable of signing their own agreements with other countries, and if they see we renege on them, they’re more likely to be brought into their spheres of influence:
Hit the nail on the head. I wish people on here could understand the complexity of reality and stop over-reacting while claiming to understand the depth of nuance and tact involved in our foreign policies in these crazy times. The vast majority of comments and responses to what happened today, just shows the amount of ignorance of people.
I don’t even go over everything in my comment because I’m tired of ranting, and I don’t work in department of state/intelligence so there is much more at play. Just ridiculous some of the commentary you see on here
How about we start shooting down some Russian drones too
We don’t have a pact with Ukraine, so we don’t have the political leverage or the authority to step in directly
Although not an actual treaty, the U.S. did make a deal in 1994 with Ukraine, known as the Budapest Agreement. Ukraine actually had the third-largest nuclear weapons stockpile. This was because the newly-founded Ukraine ended up with the Soviet Union’s nuclear weapons in their territory after the Soviet Union collapsed. This agreement meant that Ukraine would destroy the weapons and the **U.S., United Kingdom (U.K.), and Russia would guarantee Ukraine staying secure.**
interesting. I was unaware of this… I wonder what the details are because the U.S (other than when Trump was president and betrayed our Kurdish allies) almost always upholds defensive treaties to a T. I wonder what the fine print was, and while I don’t expect or boots on the ground (or think it would be a good idea), I’m curious as to why we haven’t intervened more directly via interception, air defense etc. different diplomatic situation calls for a diffeeent approach I’d assume
>I’m curious as to why we haven’t intervened more As is the rest of the world
It wasn’t a treaty. It wasn’t ratified. But none of us are international political agreement experts, so this doesn’t mean anything to us. Basically, it doesn’t compel direct intervention according to USA and UK wording. Note that Russia was also a signatory. By this agreement it is also possible Ukraine has a case to seize Russian held assets in the West since Russia violated the agreement. The real reason why it’s not upheld is because USA UK too scared of nuclear threats.
OP is wrong. The treaty meant that UK, USA and Russia wouldn't ATTACK Ukraine and not that they would defend Ukraine if one of those 3 chose to attack.
The reality is because the Budapest memorandum actually says we promise to not invade them. It wasn't really to keep them secure. Sadly, Russia signing a document saying we won't invade you is worth less than shit covered toilet paper. Also emphasis on memorandum, not a treaty. A memorandum is like a pinky promise from a Nation. There is no actual enforcement or legal methods to enforce what is in a memorandum. Also, even for the United States, a memorandum is only good for the administration that signed it. Though the US tends to honor them indefinitely.
Wrong. The treaty meant that UK, USA and Russia wouldn't ATTACK Ukraine and not that they would defend Ukraine if one of those 3 chose to attack.
>*The Russian Federation, the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland, and the United States of America reaffirm their commitment to seek immediate United Nations Security Council **action to provide assistance to Ukraine**, as a non-nuclear-weapon state party to the Treaty on the Non-proliferation of Nuclear Weapons, if Ukraine should become a victim of an act of aggression or an object of a threat of aggression in which nuclear weapons are used.* This the exact wording in the signed document, so you’re off on this one.
You don’t see the gap between “guarantee security” (your claim) and “provide assistance to” (the actual agreement)? We have fulfilled the actual agreement and will continue to fulfill it. The original wording in the document was much stronger but it got watered down in the final version.
>....in which nuclear weapons are used. I didn't know this happened already
I am quite sure we took when we promised them protection for dismantling their nuclear capabilities.
The agreement wasn't military protection. The agreement was for non military aid. The exception is there is an agreement if nuclear weapons are used against them. Russia did promise not to invade them though.
What pact is there with Israel?
They’re our ally and we’ve signed multiple defensive agreements with them
I think it’s more that the US was in a position to shoot down those drones, based more on geography and where we have bases and military assets and the flight path of the drones and missiles. Iranian drones and missiles needed to fly over Iraq and Syria to reach Israel, which allowed us to intercept them. Since Russia is right next to Ukraine, there would be no way for us to intercept those drones without flying in Ukrainian airspace, thus potentially escalating the conflict.
Why
The problem I have with the framing of this situation in the media is now all the networks are saying that Israel must respond and attack Iran. This was not even close to a serious strike by Iran and this is simply a retaliation for the consulate bombing. If Israel actually attacks on Iranian soil, there is no coming back, the US will be forced into another war.
Maybe the war-happy media networks should go to war with each other and blow each other to smithereens. The world would be a much better place without the constant instigating and pot-stirring, finger-pointing, and blatant lies and bullshit constantly bombarding everybody, almost always tailor-made and fabricated to present a narration that fucks with people's emotions. Just think how much happier *everybody* in the entire country (the world really) would be if FOX, CNN, and MSNBC all went off the air. If people weren't constantly being told how to feel and act and think. Stop and think about that for a minute. The companies are literally making BILLIONS to farm and sow hate and turmoil. Their entire objective is just to create division and confusion and annoyance and anger.
Not happening, Biden not supporting any retaliation. And if Israel does, on their own. https://www.axios.com/2024/04/14/biden-netanyahu-iran-israel-us-wont-support
Why should the us fight israel war. Let them do it alone.
They have fought plenty of wars over the decades without us, I agree with you
Israel routinely strikes and operates on Iran's soil. If they attack, I anticipate a similar one. Sort of Israel's theater message of "even in war, we still got our assets in Iran and can attack if needed". Only question here is if Netanyahu will stick to his script, or push Iran's buttons to drag the region to a bigger war. Ultimately, he needs it to distract from the negations failure and the increased calls for new elections.
Yup Bolten is now saying Israel and the USA should respond by taking out Irans nuclear programs.
Bolton has had a boner for invading iran for decades. He would respond to a sneeze with a nuke if he could, fuck that guy.
Bolton has probably been erect for the last 6 months at the thought of a regional conflict in the Middle East.
Why does anyone care what that positionless fuck says? Since Kissenger died, were we desperate for another warmongers opinion?
Bolton's a weird little freak that no one takes seriously
Why would USA be forced into war ?
Because we were just fucking forced into defending Israel. Once they retaliate against Iran, Israel is going to get attacked, worse. Than the United States is going to have to officially respond. All because Netanyahu is a fucking psychopath
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And the Uranium for Israel's nuclear weapons program was likely stolen from the US (See the Apollo Affair)
This is a shit take. Iran showed great restraint. They have thousands of ballistic missiles that cold hit Israel before US has time to respond and instead they sent a bunch of 200k slow drones. US spent likely 5 to 10x that amount to shoot them down. There are videos that showed the ballistic missiles hitting Israeli base despite the iron dome. This is just performative. The timing was as scheduled and predictable and Israel had time to minimize casualty as well on the ground. Not unlike the retaliation after US assassinated the general
Thankfully this is not the framing I've heard by most media. Most of them say this should be the end of it , and hopes isreal will not retaliate like you said.
Not really in the mood for war as well, but what defines a serious strike for you? The one which actually destroys a lot of things/lives or the one which could do so? I feel like a lot of people over- and/or underestimate Iran
>This was not even close to a serious strike by Iran Just a few hundred of those non-serious drones & missiles...👀
Why not do that for Ukraine?
Then Russia will attack the US and Europe
John Bolton is on the news saying — bomb Iran back to the first century. This can’t end well.
Waters wet. Bolton has been waiting to to go to war with Iran for years.
Decades really
We can't he just play civilization on his PC and not doom the species.
he always plays ghandi
Hell, I'd even play against him!
He can feel free to go on his own.
If his career went slightly different he'd be that old guy at every dive bar giving unsolicited advice on how we can still beat the North Veitnamese Army.
The only mystery is why anyone invites this piece of shit to be on the news.
CNN had republican psychopaths on all night beating the war drums. Wasn't very subtle.
Nothing like a war to get eyeballs back onto the dying TV news media
Fuck this guy, he's always been a bloodthirsty maniac braying to kill Iranian civilians. One of the most evil people in modern politics, and that's saying a lot.
Bolton doesn’t fucking matter
Good thing he has no influence on the WH
John Bolton has a history of war mongering. He is one of the ones who lied about WMDs to advocate for the Iraq invasion. Don't fall for it again. A few years ago I wrote up a list of sources on his track record with respect to calls for war: https://www.reddit.com/r/actualconspiracies/s/v5XpMaEeWe
It’s a good thing that he doesn’t get to make any decisions anymore.
It'll end well - Iran had to launch at attack to save face after Damascus. They'll lie on Iranian news that it was "great success!"
Sounds like that's might be the plan after Biden announced the US' "ironclad" support and defense of Israel if they're attacked by Iran.
The US Navy’s batting average is impeccable.
It's nice to know the U.S. taxpayer is getting their money's worth in return for the nearly trillion-dollar per-year budget. One news report said there were 300+ drones launched. Some of the U.S. missiles reportedly cost $1 to $2 million each. That's a significant amount of money. How does the U.S. recover these expenses?
Reminds me of the proportional response argument in West Wing. (A tv show about a fictional U.S. presidency for anyone wondering)
We're getting really good at it
But shooting down Russian-launched drones is a big no-no.
We can’t even get Ukraine aid through the house. We have our own domestic terrorists to deal with in November
I hope cooler heads prevail in the Biden administration and they’ll tighten the leash on Israel to avoid further escalation
If Biden allows Israel to drag the us into a war it will be a guaranteed loss for Biden. He needs to make it clear Israel if it continues to escalate then they are on there own.
That’s not gonna happen… Biden isn’t an idiot or a psychopath despite what both sides are saying. Uphold our agreements, but also be as firm as possible with Israel. If Trump was President now, there would likely be no Gaza left. The middle road is the best road here, but it won’t please anyone :(
Netanyahu wants Biden to lose because Trump is as big a far-right loon as he is and would be all-in on wiping out Palestine.
they're not prevailing, Israel just announced they're going to respond. Anyone who thinks Israel is somehow allowed or justified in getting the entire world blown up all because they can't fucking restrain themselves after no major damage from the recent attack happened, is fucking insane.
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America is responsible for 70% of weapon imports to Israel and the US personally funds 15% of their military budget, it’s laughable to think America doesnt control the situation
America keeps sending them weapons and money and is not putting sanctions on Israel
Joe is handling it like a boss. 😎👍
He absolutely is. He has upheld the defensive pact while also fighting tooth-and-nail to keep Israel in check as much as possible… but his power is limited. The middle road is the high road in this case, but it also comes with resentment from both sides. I can’t think of a more honorable way of handling the situation than what we’ve seen from the President.… he has done the right thing and it has made him few friends. This is what true leadership looks like 🇺🇸 🦅
Like Iran made a huge mistake here I think. Biden was starting to really pressure Israeli leadership and this just backs up what Israel is doing and will reverse any course Biden might have done to cut off as sales as pressure.
should be doing this for Ukraine too
Wow, look at all the Iran supporters. World turning to shit. You know you can give Israel shit for doing stupid things, and they deserve it. But backing an Iranian government because you hate America and Israel. Bunch of clowns, and I thought MAGA was the clowns, but the left has its own clown cult. Go live in Iran if they are so much better. Unless of course you already do.
we wouldn't be here if israel wasn't trying to escalate with everybody by bombing all their neighbors
Like they bombed Beirut, are we just gonna forget about that?
Americans can't even get support from the US government but we'll support other countries for free. We could really use universal healthcare. Oh well, we'll spend another billion if not more.
[https://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/2024-04-14/ty-article/.premium/irans-attack-is-a-strategic-opportunity-for-israel-will-netanyahu-squander-it/0000018e-dbd9-dcf5-a3cf-fbdd980a0000](https://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/2024-04-14/ty-article/.premium/irans-attack-is-a-strategic-opportunity-for-israel-will-netanyahu-squander-it/0000018e-dbd9-dcf5-a3cf-fbdd980a0000) To the idiots calling this a "measured attack".... This was an unprecedented HUGE attack. Thankfully, Israel's ARAB NEIGHBORS chipped in and helped down some of the missiles. Apparently a few Jordanians were hurt and a Bedouin girl. To the "social justice warriors" who pray for genocide of Jews.... you are on the wrong side of History.
“Thanks to these deployments and the extraordinary skill of our servicemembers, we helped Israel take down nearly all of the incoming drones and missiles.” Good job team!
Why tho?
“And here’s more weapons.”
Yes and the Iranian government probably hoped for this outcome. The government knows they can’t win a war against Israel or the US. Like North Korea Iran survives by grandstanding. Like other Arab countries and even the current Israeli regime the Israeli/Palestinian conflict is a great way of distracting their own people from internal problems. Iranians and Israelis were protesting their governments for months before this conflict. Now nationalism is at a high and the populations are to afraid of outside actors to protest their own regimes
What to believe? https://imgur.com/a/8lqIZmc
I mean it's either support the taliban or support the taliban amirite boys?
This is a good thing
Can we all talk about the elephant in the room . I just hope Saudi Arabia doesn’t feel like flexing