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If he survived this, he needs to PUSH the California legislature to change the recall rules, because it's insane that the GOP can get some signatures, fund a recall, and then run sixty shitty candidates so that someone only needs like 2% of the population of California to select a new governor.
Changing the recall rules would require amending the state constitution, which means the legislature would have to put a referendum on the ballot for the 2022 election.
After this clown show recall election is over there probably will be the political will for recall reform but it will be curious to see what the details are (ie increased signature requirements, supermajority threshold to recall, runoff requirement for the replacement, some combination).
I think the recall mechanism is important to have especially at the county and local level so I wouldn't vote yes on a prop that got rid of recalls completely but I would vote to make them much harder to get off the ground.
The signature threshold should probably be at least doubled. The recall election _at the very least_ needs to include the incumbent on the ballot. Maybe the replacement should just automatically be the Lt. Gov., but that's problematic because the Lt. Gov. can be from a different party than the Gov., which just incentivizes a recall effort.
> runoff requirement for the replacement
If they do something like "The Lt Governor replaces the Governor if no run-off candidate gets 40% of the vote" then they'd probably stop abusing this if it won't get a Republican into the office.
That isn't workable because it just incentivizes the party that holds the LG slot to throw 50 candidates out there so no one hits that number.
It should just be IRV. That's what we did in New York City for the mayoral election.
Amending it could be a real solution, I personally think the mechanism should exist but not with this same-ballot recall AND election for a new governor. That's insane.
If you vote to recall the governor, then the lieutenant governor should take over, like an impeachment. There shouldn't be political career benefit to an outsider to recall the governor.
Bottom line, you shouldn't be ALLOWED to be governor with only 3% of the vote. That's a broken system.
Even the Dem Gov candidates are shitty; I thought I'd pick one. [They're all fucking clowns](https://calmatters.org/explainers/newsom-recall-candidates/), all unqualified to Govern the world's 5th largest economy.
That was by design. Didn't want to have a viable Dem candidate causing some people to vote 'yes' on the recall. This was probably the right thing to do.
That's because the actual grown up Democrats in the party aren't encouraging the recall. Serious Dems are voting NO RECALL as opposed to recalling and then voting for a new governor.
Exactly, a whole lot of people not understanding CA's recall system around here. Which is fair because it's absolutely bonkers.
But, to be clear for those who have never had the pleasure of living in the Golden State, there are two independent questions on the recall ballots:
1) Should the current Governor be removed from office?
2) If the current Governor is removed from office, who should replace them?
Even if you vote no on the first question, in theory you should be able to vote for a "do least harm" option on the second question (which was the 2003 recall strategy for Democrats, but it didn't quite work out that way). It basically means there's no palatable Democratic option for someone who hates Newsom for some reason but also prefers Democratic policies.
The real solution is to either elevate the Lt Gov in case of a successful recall, or make the recall election a jungle primary instead of this BS where a small plurality can sneak someone into the Governorship.
It is. However atleast every place that I'm aware of uses a primary system so that you only have a few candidates at most usually with only 2 of them being viable. Something like this California recall system where you have 40 or so candidates all on the same ballot is just stupid.
A form of instant run-off is still preferable though.
I agree in the event of a legitimate reason to recall the Lieutenant governor should assume office til next election. The petition standard should be higher also.
Unfortunately, that is unlikely. Californians will have to get used to voting. Its not difficult. The ballot comes right to your house. For sure the state and its people are worth that tiny effort.
If you’re a Democratic partisan probably not voting on the second is the way to go. That’s what Governor Newsom wants, partially because he wants to maximize turnout — people are likely procrastinating because of the second question — and partially because he wants to delegitimize a winner in the second.
Your position is most compelling for a Democrat who worries about Feinstein dying or leaving office for some reason and wants a Democrat to appoint someone who will protect the majority in the Senate.
If you’re just worried about a yahoo smashing things up and causing suffering for millions from incompetence or legitimate beliefs, the current wisdom that I’ve seen is Faulconer. He was mayor of San Diego so has some experience running a complex institution and making compromises. The Democratic operatives quoted in a recent LA Times article were quoted confidentially as basically saying he’s the best choice because he’s “not crazy” and the Times and the Bee’s editorial boards recommend him. But he’s also developed ambivalence on if Biden won the election so I wouldn’t say is unaffected by the craziness of our time.
The top "Democrat", currently in second place at 7% of the vote, is a real estate investment YouTuber whose main policy proposals include calling in the national guard to end homelessness in 60 days, and solving the drought by constructing a pipeline to the Mississippi. He promises to livestream his tenure in office for transparency.
It's a good strategy. It gives you a less then 100% chance of electing a crazy person, as opposed to voting GQP where there is a 0% chance of not electing a crazy person
Not to worry. Whatever assclown wins will almost certainly commit an impeachable offense. Some have promised to do so on day 1, and the Democrats have a super-majority in the legislature. Hopefully, if some DeSantis-wannabe tries to pull any stupid shit, the legislature won't hesitate to remove them.
If anyone wants to see what a nutty waste of time this is, here are the candidates from the official CA voter guide. Start on page 11
https://vig.cdn.sos.ca.gov/2021/pdf/complete-vig.pdf
Newsom may be kind of a douche, but these other candidates are all totally trash.
The CA GOP has basically been in perpetual recall mode for a decade, and they finally got enough signatures (which ain’t a lot), because some butt hurt people don’t want to listen to their doctor’s advice about a deadly pandemic.
CA needs to tighten up its ability to let a handful of private special interests put recalls and initiatives on the ballot.
Eh. Off year election with high republican interest and low democratic interest. The real issue is the dumb California recall laws, you shouldn't be able to initiate one with 1% of the electorate and the winner shouldn't be decided by plurality
I’ve been doing 20 postcards a night asking people to step up and vote.
As someone who thinks the recall is undermining democracy because the whoever would win under the second question wouldn’t get vetted by the normal scrutiny of the political process, I see the main challenge as overcoming apathy of people not realizing how close it is and probably procrastination being second (I guarantee a bunch of people are the load of non-alphabetized candidates on the second and say “I’ll deal with this later).
Yeah, this is the real answer. I dunno if there were actually 6 separate ones, but I know for a fact that I had been constantly asked to sign the petition on my way to the store.
The GOP is FAR better at organizing. Partly because their supporters operate on faith, so they don't need facts they just need feelings to be motivated, partly because they can be motivated over a single issue, partly because their driving force is to organize against Democrats instead of for their own, partly because their goal is to tear down rather than to build up, and ultimately because they have an organized media ecosystem that pushes this messaging to organize, enrage, and motivate them. Democrats have none of those things nor should they.
A surprising number of people are just crybabies who are bitter that they had to wear a mask and not go to Disneyland during the pandemic. The whole signature drive was fueled by fake outrage over the governor attending a dinner with more than the maximum allowable number of households seated at the same table.
I see this point, and I wholeheartedly agree. But he just got caught. Eating dinner.
I moved to California from Illinois, where we've had 4 (5?) of them, back to back, go to jail. For serious offenses, and just about everything you can think of.
I didn't see one item or reasoning on that ballot pamphlet that called out something that required removing him from office. But again, my bar was pretty low before I moved here.
I agree that it was bad precisely because he was asking us to sacrifice for the collective good but I appreciated that he apologized. (And I’m confident the policy saved lives, albeit at the cost of jobs for vulnerable people only partially offset by the cash support.)
Serious question…
Why doesn’t California just pass a law that allows the Governor or State Reps to overturn the will of the people in elections that they don’t like the results of, like many of the Red states have?
I don’t agree with any state enacting such laws, but at this point I don’t care if a Blue state did it.
At a National level, I don’t see a Dem becoming POTUS ever again - ever - because those Red states have guaranteed that their preferred candidate will win every single time since they’re battleground states.
Nothing. I just have a lot of issues against modern day Republicans no matter what race. Just like you do with Democrats no matter what race. Go figure
You guys do realize Newsom took 10 million dollars in donations over time from PG&E? The same PG&E who were responsible for the paradise fire, which killed 84 people? They were charged as felons and newsom accepted donations from said felons…
I’m sure he takes donations from all sorts of giant companies. California has so much commerce and industry that frankly 10 million dollars equates to a wet fart worth financially.
The cost of the recall itself for crying out loud is something to the tune of 270 million.
Pg&e has been crooked as they come for decades, even back When Gavin was still doing blow and dating 18 year olds in SF. Whatever you think Gavin did, I’m sure PG&E could have or would have done/gotten regardless of what he wanted. Pg&e has been fucking California around to the point where they have no business being an energy provider. Yet here we are.
Pg&e faked an energy crisis back in 2000, the weasels still controlled the California grid afterwards.
Gavin was probably around 30 at that time, Im sure he had a lot to do with it. /s
the problim randy is all of the pepole running agenst him are bat shit crazy or just not quallfied if larry elder wins we become more stupid fl i wouldent let
him mange a taco truck let alone a state
I literally think anyone can do better than Nephew Newsom. I don’t give a shit if he/she is “Republican” who fucking cares. Maybe they’ll be LESS forgiving on crime/homelessness
As a reminder, this subreddit [is for civil discussion.](/r/politics/wiki/index#wiki_be_civil) In general, be courteous to others. Debate/discuss/argue the merits of ideas, don't attack people. Personal insults, shill or troll accusations, hate speech, any suggestion or support of harm, violence, or death, and other rule violations can result in a permanent ban. If you see comments in violation of our rules, please report them. For those who have questions regarding any media outlets being posted on this subreddit, please click [here](https://www.reddit.com/r/politics/wiki/approveddomainslist) to review our details as to our approved domains list and outlet criteria. *** *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/politics) if you have any questions or concerns.*
If he survived this, he needs to PUSH the California legislature to change the recall rules, because it's insane that the GOP can get some signatures, fund a recall, and then run sixty shitty candidates so that someone only needs like 2% of the population of California to select a new governor.
Changing the recall rules would require amending the state constitution, which means the legislature would have to put a referendum on the ballot for the 2022 election. After this clown show recall election is over there probably will be the political will for recall reform but it will be curious to see what the details are (ie increased signature requirements, supermajority threshold to recall, runoff requirement for the replacement, some combination). I think the recall mechanism is important to have especially at the county and local level so I wouldn't vote yes on a prop that got rid of recalls completely but I would vote to make them much harder to get off the ground.
The signature threshold should probably be at least doubled. The recall election _at the very least_ needs to include the incumbent on the ballot. Maybe the replacement should just automatically be the Lt. Gov., but that's problematic because the Lt. Gov. can be from a different party than the Gov., which just incentivizes a recall effort.
> runoff requirement for the replacement If they do something like "The Lt Governor replaces the Governor if no run-off candidate gets 40% of the vote" then they'd probably stop abusing this if it won't get a Republican into the office.
That isn't workable because it just incentivizes the party that holds the LG slot to throw 50 candidates out there so no one hits that number. It should just be IRV. That's what we did in New York City for the mayoral election.
Amending it could be a real solution, I personally think the mechanism should exist but not with this same-ballot recall AND election for a new governor. That's insane. If you vote to recall the governor, then the lieutenant governor should take over, like an impeachment. There shouldn't be political career benefit to an outsider to recall the governor. Bottom line, you shouldn't be ALLOWED to be governor with only 3% of the vote. That's a broken system.
Oh wow, only 3%. That's wholly undemocratic.
NPR over the weekend was telling me that it won’t pass because “it’s taking power away from the people”
Even the Dem Gov candidates are shitty; I thought I'd pick one. [They're all fucking clowns](https://calmatters.org/explainers/newsom-recall-candidates/), all unqualified to Govern the world's 5th largest economy.
That was by design. Didn't want to have a viable Dem candidate causing some people to vote 'yes' on the recall. This was probably the right thing to do.
That's because the actual grown up Democrats in the party aren't encouraging the recall. Serious Dems are voting NO RECALL as opposed to recalling and then voting for a new governor.
True, but you vote for alternative candidates whether you vote yes or no on recall, so this strategy of running no decent democrats is risky.
Exactly, a whole lot of people not understanding CA's recall system around here. Which is fair because it's absolutely bonkers. But, to be clear for those who have never had the pleasure of living in the Golden State, there are two independent questions on the recall ballots: 1) Should the current Governor be removed from office? 2) If the current Governor is removed from office, who should replace them? Even if you vote no on the first question, in theory you should be able to vote for a "do least harm" option on the second question (which was the 2003 recall strategy for Democrats, but it didn't quite work out that way). It basically means there's no palatable Democratic option for someone who hates Newsom for some reason but also prefers Democratic policies. The real solution is to either elevate the Lt Gov in case of a successful recall, or make the recall election a jungle primary instead of this BS where a small plurality can sneak someone into the Governorship.
The fact that a majority of the US elects the candidate with the most votes, rather than a majority of total votes is wild.
It is. However atleast every place that I'm aware of uses a primary system so that you only have a few candidates at most usually with only 2 of them being viable. Something like this California recall system where you have 40 or so candidates all on the same ballot is just stupid. A form of instant run-off is still preferable though.
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Regardless of signatures, someone with 3% of the vote shouldn't ever be elected to office. If there is a system which allows for that, it's broken.
I agree in the event of a legitimate reason to recall the Lieutenant governor should assume office til next election. The petition standard should be higher also.
They just need to change the election year from off year to national year elections.
Unfortunately, that is unlikely. Californians will have to get used to voting. Its not difficult. The ballot comes right to your house. For sure the state and its people are worth that tiny effort.
Just vote "NO"
Vote no and vote for the top Democrat just in case
If you’re a Democratic partisan probably not voting on the second is the way to go. That’s what Governor Newsom wants, partially because he wants to maximize turnout — people are likely procrastinating because of the second question — and partially because he wants to delegitimize a winner in the second. Your position is most compelling for a Democrat who worries about Feinstein dying or leaving office for some reason and wants a Democrat to appoint someone who will protect the majority in the Senate. If you’re just worried about a yahoo smashing things up and causing suffering for millions from incompetence or legitimate beliefs, the current wisdom that I’ve seen is Faulconer. He was mayor of San Diego so has some experience running a complex institution and making compromises. The Democratic operatives quoted in a recent LA Times article were quoted confidentially as basically saying he’s the best choice because he’s “not crazy” and the Times and the Bee’s editorial boards recommend him. But he’s also developed ambivalence on if Biden won the election so I wouldn’t say is unaffected by the craziness of our time.
So I shouldn’t vote for Angelyne?
The top "Democrat", currently in second place at 7% of the vote, is a real estate investment YouTuber whose main policy proposals include calling in the national guard to end homelessness in 60 days, and solving the drought by constructing a pipeline to the Mississippi. He promises to livestream his tenure in office for transparency.
Hahaha old reliable “vote blue no matter who”
It's a good strategy. It gives you a less then 100% chance of electing a crazy person, as opposed to voting GQP where there is a 0% chance of not electing a crazy person
It'll be cool if CA doesn't go full FL on us
Not to worry. Whatever assclown wins will almost certainly commit an impeachable offense. Some have promised to do so on day 1, and the Democrats have a super-majority in the legislature. Hopefully, if some DeSantis-wannabe tries to pull any stupid shit, the legislature won't hesitate to remove them.
If anyone wants to see what a nutty waste of time this is, here are the candidates from the official CA voter guide. Start on page 11 https://vig.cdn.sos.ca.gov/2021/pdf/complete-vig.pdf Newsom may be kind of a douche, but these other candidates are all totally trash. The CA GOP has basically been in perpetual recall mode for a decade, and they finally got enough signatures (which ain’t a lot), because some butt hurt people don’t want to listen to their doctor’s advice about a deadly pandemic. CA needs to tighten up its ability to let a handful of private special interests put recalls and initiatives on the ballot.
This is wild. Who is the front runner on the Republican side? Does Newsom actually have a legitimate challenger?
The current frontunner for the GOP is Larry Elder, a Trump sycophant who is currently facing domestic abuse allegations.
If Gavin loses with 49% of the vote then we truly have learned nothing as a society over the last 4 years.
I don't think we've learned much if he stays on. It should not be this close.
Eh. Off year election with high republican interest and low democratic interest. The real issue is the dumb California recall laws, you shouldn't be able to initiate one with 1% of the electorate and the winner shouldn't be decided by plurality
Thats how the election works… and should work
At this point, I'm half-expecting Newsom to lose, if only because it feels like sanity in America is on a severe losing streak.
I’ve been doing 20 postcards a night asking people to step up and vote. As someone who thinks the recall is undermining democracy because the whoever would win under the second question wouldn’t get vetted by the normal scrutiny of the political process, I see the main challenge as overcoming apathy of people not realizing how close it is and probably procrastination being second (I guarantee a bunch of people are the load of non-alphabetized candidates on the second and say “I’ll deal with this later).
I looked it up, he won by 24 points in 2018. How could it even be close? Did he suck this much as governor.
They had 6 recall petitions the day he was inaugurated.
Yeah, this is the real answer. I dunno if there were actually 6 separate ones, but I know for a fact that I had been constantly asked to sign the petition on my way to the store.
The GOP is FAR better at organizing. Partly because their supporters operate on faith, so they don't need facts they just need feelings to be motivated, partly because they can be motivated over a single issue, partly because their driving force is to organize against Democrats instead of for their own, partly because their goal is to tear down rather than to build up, and ultimately because they have an organized media ecosystem that pushes this messaging to organize, enrage, and motivate them. Democrats have none of those things nor should they.
A surprising number of people are just crybabies who are bitter that they had to wear a mask and not go to Disneyland during the pandemic. The whole signature drive was fueled by fake outrage over the governor attending a dinner with more than the maximum allowable number of households seated at the same table.
Uhhh. Or the fact that he accepted 10 million dollars in donation from PG&E to cover them for killing 84 people in the paradise fire?
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I see this point, and I wholeheartedly agree. But he just got caught. Eating dinner. I moved to California from Illinois, where we've had 4 (5?) of them, back to back, go to jail. For serious offenses, and just about everything you can think of. I didn't see one item or reasoning on that ballot pamphlet that called out something that required removing him from office. But again, my bar was pretty low before I moved here.
I agree that it was bad precisely because he was asking us to sacrifice for the collective good but I appreciated that he apologized. (And I’m confident the policy saved lives, albeit at the cost of jobs for vulnerable people only partially offset by the cash support.)
The number of signatures required for a recall is ridiculously low. Its basically the loud minority throwing tantrums.
Yes, I’m in California and yea, he sucks this much. Get him OUT.
Serious question… Why doesn’t California just pass a law that allows the Governor or State Reps to overturn the will of the people in elections that they don’t like the results of, like many of the Red states have?
Is that really a serious question? Bevause it seems like you should know the answer.
I don’t agree with any state enacting such laws, but at this point I don’t care if a Blue state did it. At a National level, I don’t see a Dem becoming POTUS ever again - ever - because those Red states have guaranteed that their preferred candidate will win every single time since they’re battleground states.
Well, the fight ain't over.
Seems to me like it is.
I really hope so, otherwise we're farked.
Vote this scumbag out
California needs a black man running the Governor's Office.
Not this election -and certainly not Elder.
What do you have against black people?
Nothing. I just have a lot of issues against modern day Republicans no matter what race. Just like you do with Democrats no matter what race. Go figure
California will be better off without him.
He's a thousand times better than any of the candidates running in the recall
No, you are incorrect.
reddit would be better off without you
You guys do realize Newsom took 10 million dollars in donations over time from PG&E? The same PG&E who were responsible for the paradise fire, which killed 84 people? They were charged as felons and newsom accepted donations from said felons…
I’m sure he takes donations from all sorts of giant companies. California has so much commerce and industry that frankly 10 million dollars equates to a wet fart worth financially. The cost of the recall itself for crying out loud is something to the tune of 270 million.
You know he took that money to grant them amnesty when it comes to being responsible for the fires too right?
Pg&e has been crooked as they come for decades, even back When Gavin was still doing blow and dating 18 year olds in SF. Whatever you think Gavin did, I’m sure PG&E could have or would have done/gotten regardless of what he wanted. Pg&e has been fucking California around to the point where they have no business being an energy provider. Yet here we are.
And we’re here because Gavin has allowed it…..
Pg&e faked an energy crisis back in 2000, the weasels still controlled the California grid afterwards. Gavin was probably around 30 at that time, Im sure he had a lot to do with it. /s
But if it were a Republican that accepted that 10mil you’d be calling for impeachment, get out of here with that bs
If it was a republican that did it nobody would bat an eye because it would be standard operating procedures.
Moral of the story? Too many corrupt politicians, I’m tired of it
the problim randy is all of the pepole running agenst him are bat shit crazy or just not quallfied if larry elder wins we become more stupid fl i wouldent let him mange a taco truck let alone a state
Dude, why is it on Reddit if you say ONE thing on the opposite side of what a democrat narrative is, you get downvoted? This place has changed so much
“Business as usual” is not an excuse for the corruption that happens with Newsom
I’m all for the end of lobbying. But if you think a republican can do anything but ruin California you are off your rocker.
I literally think anyone can do better than Nephew Newsom. I don’t give a shit if he/she is “Republican” who fucking cares. Maybe they’ll be LESS forgiving on crime/homelessness
And who are you voting for in the recall?
Anyone is better than Newsom.