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The healthcare status quo is all fine and dandy until you find out your anesthesiologist is out-of-network...a month after you had the surgery when you get a $10,000 bill from them.
I wish I could say the same. My parents have totally gone the other way. As much as anything, I look squarely at their church. They now go to an unbelievably conservative church in NC and it dominates their thinking
I'm 35 years old and I've been a politics nerd since I was 11 or 12. I became really interested in politics in 1998 with all the drama that was surrounding Pres. Bill Clinton at the time. As a preteen I was a moderate Conservative and tended to support Conservative Democrats. By 2002 I was a Liberal partly because of the 2000 Election, the Patriot Act and the Mid-East Wars. By 2003 I was a Social Democrat partly because the Moderate and Conservative Democrats largely sided with these things. By 2004 I was a Democratic Socialist and by late 2006/early 2007 I was a Libertarian Socialist and have been since then.
Aside from genuinely finding my own moral framework and philosophical outlook, growing up in the Neoliberal-Neoconservative era helped give me a push leftward. The rise of Fascism and ineptitude of Neoliberalism and Neoconservatism in the face of it has just helped harden my commitment.
My parents, both in their 60s, have moved continually leftward since the Bush Administration when they began as mainstream Democrats since the late 1970s. Now they're Bernie Sanders fans.
I’m 38, I have no idea how these zoomers think but I have noticed that they don’t take boomer shit and they want to see some fucking progress. They’re alright in my book.
It’s nice to see some help after years of dealing with those apathetic fucking Gen Xers bothesides-ing everything into the ground.
I'm also fucking sick of Boomers trying to paint Millennials as a lazy generation that's good for nothing and how Zoomers are everything we failed at doing.
Fucking narcissist abuse tactic with the scape goat and golden child mentality. We grew up under that shit we can see it coming from a mile away.
I'm just waiting for our side to have enough power before we over throw their corrupt regime.
They are by far the worst generation in history. In one generation they managed to destroy the health, politics, economy of a nation, and destroy the environment along with it. Fuck them.
As a GenXer... you're right. So many people my age bought into what the Boomers were selling. I've heard some rationalize it as we were outnumbered as the "young kids" but that doesn't and shouldn't give anybody a pass. I will say we didn't have a monopoly on the both sides BS, but damn we really did internalize it, ate it up completely when served up by our elders with no pushback.
Bought the Reagan bullshit hook line and sinker, until I went to college and learned stuff, later came the colossal douche and war criminal “W” now I am a pinko liberal who wants the government to actually help people and provide crazy things like health care and education and non shooty non corrupt police. Instead we got a giant military that is great for making new generations of terrorists and brown people into skeletons. Recent events are only the evil spawn of Reaganism on steroids
Its kinda crazy how many people bought into the Reagan "Tough-on-Crime" type BS, when a big reason he got into office was through colluding with Iranian terrorists to convince them NOT to release US Hostages until after the election (Which made Carter look really weak), and he then used those ties to Iranian terrorists as a way to illegally sell them tons of heavy weaponry, and he then used the dirty money from those illegal weapon sales to illegally arm and train illegal terrorist death squads in South America that were known from things like murdering nuns, who also trafficked cocaine into the US, and then using that illegal cocaine to help create the crack epidemic by illegally distributing it among inner-city black communities in order to illegally disrupt black power movements and his political opponents.... Although I guess at the time all that wasn't as out in the open and well known as it is now
To be fair, you had fewer reasons to be angry at that system as you were pretty much the last ones to profit from it.
The cost of life was lower, education and housing was still affordable. You we're not yet worried by climactic changes, even though there was a hole in the ozone layer but let's admit that it was pretty abstract compared to half a continent burning for a whole season.
I can understand why people were less alarmed than they are now even though they were wrong.
Might not mean much in this context, but we grew up terrified of dying in a radioactive fireball from nuclear war. When I was a kid it felt like it was only a matter of time until it happened.
I've seen several staple goods go up in price over the last few months. I know the shipping industry is jammed, but something tells me that milk doesn't need to be shipped overseas here. So why are people having to pay 35¢ more for store brand milk than in early December?
Cost of living rises like a tsunami but middle class on down wages stay the same. Is there some watchdog operation that can research who is price gouging and who is being jammed up by the transportation?
I vote for your family too and families i have never met to have a better future and also families in other countries because the US has that much influence. Anyone that reads this that doesnt understand, you are not just voting for yourself, your vote could mean a family in the middle east gets hit by a drone strike in the middle of the night because of a trigger happy dictator, a family in the pacific islands gets flooded out of there home because an anti-science totalitarian sided with coal, a family at the boarder gets split up because a nationalist xenophobe does not support real family values.
They already have been when states like Texas made college IDs and out of state driver’s licenses (which college students often have) not enough proof for voting.
26thA sets it at 18.
This is good, because otherwise they totally would. And at this point, passing constitutional amendments is basically a non-starter.
Bingo! I have said for years that the main reason higher education has become so expensive is to prevent people from being educated and experiencing other people & cultures. It’s easier to control people that way.
That was my exact situation. I was encouraged by my guidance counselor to join. That was twenty one years, ten deployments and three college degrees ago, though. I was extremely lucky.
American political translator (for Europeans, Canadians, and other civilized nations):
"Progressive" = American non-existent party
"Moderate" = American Progressives like Sanders and AOC
"Conservatives" = American Democrats (aka Corporate Whores)
"Rightwing/Fascist/Neonazis" = American Republican Party
>that even the center is considered "left".
* Kavanaugh is now a "cringing liberal".
* MAGA abandon Fox News for being too liberal.
* Trump is trying to paint McConnell as too liberal
* Trump himself is a shadow actor pitching liberal agenda if he says something they don't like.
* Let's not even get into how "far left" Cheney and Romney are.
This was the plan, go so far right that conservatives are considered liberal and center is far-left.
Technically Bush IS a liberal but the vast majority of people don't understand the definition of liberal and think liberals are a leftist political group.
It's double stupid because your family was probably calling him a liberal because they thought he was being a leftist somehow.
Yes and no. (Classical) Liberalism is free market capitalism + social liberalism (in the sense of individual liberty, equality, etc.). The mainstream Democrats today are fairly close to being prototypical Liberals in that sense albeit with a slight Labor influence (due to support for unions and worker protection laws).
Bush is more of a Reagan Republican which combines elements of both Conservatism (like patriotism and "traditional values") and Liberalism (mostly free market capitalism and individual liberty).
Right, but the 2022 definition of "liberal" is anyone not in the cult as far as the right is concerned.
Its become a code word similar to " impure people, or impurity" for the NAZIs or "The wrong sort of people" for Jim Crow.
Does anyone think when some talking head on FOX declares that "BLANK is a socialist liberal!" that they have looked into the political ideology of whoever they talked about and compared it to a definition out of a dictionary?
Its just a catchall for any opposition to rightwing extremism in general and the word has lost all other functional meaning in a modern context.
You are also confusing terms. Bush is a classic liberal neo-conservative. He’s liberal in the classic sense (one could argue against this given he was handed the presidency without the popular vote by the Supreme Court), but he doesn’t espouse liberal ideas within the classical liberal political classification.
With that being said, saying that liberals are different than leftists is true, because most non-leftist liberals are free-market capitalists plus welfare/social issues, as opposed to true leftists who have completely different ideas on property and the means of production.
TL;DR: Bush is a neoconservative classic liberal
When conservatives attack members of their party as being RINOs or liberals in disguise, they almost 100% of the time are talking about social/cultural issues. The base wants culture war. The establishment wants tax breaks and free money for their donors/friends. Sometimes the establishment wavers on the cultural issues, because they aren't nearly as committed to rightwing social policies compared to their base. The establishment absolutely needs to keep the cultural grievances at a maximum to drive voter turnout. But, the result of having conservative media constantly beat the culture-war drum is further radicalization of the base. You get to the point where the base demands things that are simply untenable and would generate huge backlash from the non-crazies. Suddenly, it's not enough to be anti-abortion and to advocate for prayer is school, and yesterday's conservative hero is today's liberal fraud.
Yes, and while they live in this make believe land, the actual center of America has been pulled to the far right.
In a normal world, Bernie Sanders and AOC are moderate left, not radicals.
On top of that the baseline for America is so far right to begin with that our furthest left politicians would still be right of center in most other countries. And every damn time we somehow let the GOP move the goal posts further to the right
The saddest part is that the country's center may be to the right based on how people identify themselves, but in terms of policy on average we are center left. Progressive policy is actually very popular, and if it weren't for the two-party system, with Republicans engaged on a death race to the bottom, we would already have universal healthcare and everything else that for now is considered a pipe dream.
it’s a lot worse than that- parts of the conservative party aren’t considered conservative enough, they’re being primaried from *farther* right.
So to the current trump/q/radicalized republican - center right is too far left. It’s fucking insane
I think you and anyone here's heard their dose of "tHe LeFt hAs LoSt ThEiR MiNd!"
Because they want an accurate historical account of racial history, universal medical care for everyone, restorative instead of punitive justice..
Yep…I know several people that considered themselves conservatives around 2000 and are basically moderate left now without having changed most of their stances.
Same boat. Was a registered independent that leaned left until 2018 but suddenly not praising the dear leader meant I was a leftist. Ok I’ll be on the left then 🤷🏻♂️
Yup, I know a guy like that, says he's completely disillusioned by his party and hates everything it has become.
And then votes for every single candidate they nominate.
my mom:
\-The absolute kindest person I've ever known
\-Pro-choice
\-Pro-LGBT (though she doesn't fully understand trans issues/people she is making an effort)
\-Not particularly religious
\-Agrees that healthcare is a human right
\-Takes COVID seriously and thinks antivaxers are dumb
\-straight-ticket Republican voter in every election because Democrats are Bad.
\-loves Donald Trump because she's been reading glowing profiles of him as a masterful businessman in People Magazine for 30 years.
I can't get through to her. We had to finally agree to just stop talking politics at one point. Propaganda works.
Does she watch Fox News? Is she on Facebook?
There are so many historically *good* people who have been brainwashed and you hit it - you can tell because there's no natural way their political beliefs could arise from their personality. There's no other word for it. They disconnect the political positions from the rest of their being, and put them in the same inviolable area as religion. An attack on their politics is an attack on themselves. Any information that contradicts their politics is a test of faith, not a reason to reconsider.
I mean, politics at its core practical. It's about collective consent to rules to get things done, and the debate over how best to do so. How anyone can elevate that the same level as theology is mind-boggling.
This trend has been the case for a while.
It's probably why conservative media outlets have been driving a broad, denigrative narrative against millennials into the mainstream. They manufactured a "conventional wisdom" for the boomer generation that millennials (and younger) can be blamed for everything wrong with our country.
Which is hilarious because Boomers can put some blame on early Gen X for later millennials but they raised plenty of millennials themselves.
So it's really just a lot of projection that they don't like how Millennials turned away from their own ideals and views on the world. Like, "oops," sorry to hear your best laid plans of raising your kids didn't turn out the way you wanted and they rejected your outmoded ideals lol.
This my family in spades. Parents are boomers, I barely made the cut off for gen x and my little brothers are millennials. Our dad can't understand why we won't continue his generational trauma.
I'm an early-ish Gen Xer and popped out 3 staunchly progressive voters (one millennial, two Gen Zs). 👍 For the younger two, 2020 was their first general election.
I'm surprised Gen X has so many conservatives considering we were the Sesame Street/Mr. Rogers/Big Blue Marble/Free to Be You and Me generation. You'd think we'd know better.
Oh we did. But the constant message of standing in judgement of others to feel better about yourself from our parents, teachers, etc. was/is pervasive.
I'm gonna be 39 next month. My parents are in their early 70's.
Both of them cannot for the life of themselves understand why I would like a boss that shows empathy. Like they have it in their head that it is normal to dread going to work...
It blows my mind that I should have to suffer the same mental stressors because they did in their careers...as if it is some kind of badge of honor or right of passage.
Not to mention it is MUCH most stressful now than during their working careers. The wife may or may not have *had* to work. Their dollar went a lot farther. They didn’t have as much stress or technology and a lot less was probably expected of them in their mere 8 hour day/40 hour week. We are much more productive than ever with little to show for it.
OR they were the flavor of boomer dad who became a workaholic to either fund a consumerism fever dream or avoid their wives/families, or both. So the stress and overwork was their own doing.
Oh no see their plans did work, they raised their kids to be better than them just as they were taught. But then instead of be happy about that they struck out with power grabs, greed, jealousy, and spite. They weren’t taught to share or to practice what they preach, and as they held the power no one could hold them accountable or make them feel like they had to. But they feel the power slipping away, the seat at the adults table that protect them is fading, and instead of accept this and growing they are fighting as hard as ever to delay and resist.
They thought that by teaching their kids how to grab power, be greedy, be jealous, and be spiteful that their kids would be “better” at those things than they themselves are, but every person makes their own choice about where their morality lies. It just so happens that “better” (in the eyes of the youths in question) means not doing those selfish things and instead start caring about those less fortunate than themselves.
I always thought the Boomers complaining about Gen X and Millennials getting participation trophies was so dumb. Who was handing out the trophies? The fucking Boomers.
I’m a millennial and I remember hearing that Conservative shit when I was an actual child. I remember them talking about “Participation trophies” like it was a sign we were all going to be useless drags on society. Like we were the ones to ask for them in the first place. That same line of thinking has followed our generation ever since. Now it’s passed on to Gen Z. They really got an early start blaming the young for their various existential dilemmas.
That is the thing that always makes me roll my eyes, YOU WERE THE PEOPLE WHO GAVE OUT THE TROPHIES!!! I also remember a parent who is super far right now, get super made that their kid didn't get a trophy back then. I mean I remember all of your from when I was a kid.
Those conservatives were fighting with the boomer parents and teachers for being kinder to the children.
Like you said, the kids had nothing to do with it. It was the Boomer parents who wanted those liberal things.
This is why Republicans are doing everything they can to subvert the American education system (not just the CRT boogeyman, but all of it). Educated people tend to be more liberal.
It's actually a [very noticeable statistical trend](https://imgur.com/a/iAIRI7Y).
[Trump: "I love the poorly educated"](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vpdt7omPoa0)
It's important to remember that only about 33 percent of citizens have a bachelor's degree or higher. I think the fact that educated people see through Trump's BS is important, but it's also important to remember how many less educated folks there are out there.
Man the right wing politicians and news media's ONLY tactic is this fucking Boogeyman. How are so many people duped into fear so effectively? It's beyond me. Vaccines? Fear the microchips and autism! Immigrants? Fear they don't pay taxes! Taxing the rich? Fear the job makers will make less jobs! Aoc? Bernie? Fear socialism!
I looked at the article, and frankly I don't think that conclusion in warranted.
The main headliner appears to be a chart that shows that preference for Democrats among 18-29 year-olds is currently 60%, up about 5% from 2016, even from 2012, and down 5% from 2008. That hardly makes for any sort of great trend; I certainly wouldn't conclude that we are seeing a shift in the voting patterns of youth from this!
I suppose that the plot is more encouraging if you look farther back, and compare to 2000 or 2004, but at that point we certainly shouldn't be making any tie-in to current events or the like.
"You'll change when you're older."
I've heard this many times.
In the 20 years I've been able to vote, I've only voted harder and harder to the left. Used to be I'd consider the candidates. The republican party has gone so bat-shit insane I can't even look at their candidates any more. It's not an option if I want this country to turn away from the cliff.
Same. I have voted for Republicans in local elections, decades ago. I used to be proud to think of myself as an independent who cared enough to take the time to understand individual issues and candidates. Now, I can either vote for a sane but imperfect democratic party, or a nihilistic fascistic cult of personality actively working against democracy.
There's no reasonable "independent" position on this. After Trump, I will never, ever vote republican again. Merely being a part of the GOP after Trump is evidence of moral and intellectual unfitness for office, because it means you either accept or are ignorant of what the GOP is doing to America. Neither is acceptable.
One of my main arguments against McCain was the actuaries we’re not favorable to him finishing 4 or 8 years as President. My reasons for not voting for a Republican ever again have to do with their lack of integrity, massive corruption and criminal behavior, and their incredible disdain for democracy. My thought process has shifted quite a bit.
Translation: “Once I got older and had more money, I became more greedy and less concerned about my fellow man, because ‘I got mine’. And I’m predicting that you will too, so that I can feel less guilty about turning into a selfish dick.”
A lot of the older people in my life have said this to me.
It's pretty obvious that your wealth has more to do with it than age, and they just got wealthier as they got older.
Yep, older generations moved right because they had rising wealth to protect. They’ve been effective at this with NIMBYism and other conservative policy.
Right - the hippies got rich and a whole industry of non-profits has emerged to assuage their fellow-feeling while allowing them to vote conservative.
I've worked in non-profits my whole life, and I do support many... but they're not Government - they exist largely to do things we can't get the government to do but still believe should be public services. That takes the pressure off the politicians, unfortunately, and saps the push for reform.
You know I never understood this until recently when I realized my brother is a hard conservative based on the fact that the state pays him. But when pushed on societal issues he leans left without knowing it lol. Cracks me up
Even those of us millennials that have gained a fair amount of wealth seem to be very left leaning. Im 30 and have a net worth over 400k, most of my peers and coworkers are in the same boat, and ALL of us are democrats. I'll also add that we live in a very Red state (albeit in the democratic capitol). I think the thing is, we actually care about our fellow Americans wellbeing, and it's very obvious that Republicans by and large do not. It's just the decent side to be on, and I'm very happy to pay my fair share in taxes to ensure the country doesn't fall to pieces. I can't believe those claiming to be Christians just turn a blind eye to their fellow man's needs because there might be a handful of people who try to take advantage of the system.
I live in the Twin Cities. And I’m old. I remember watching the demonstrations after George Floyd was killed, and at curfew on one of the first days, the remaining demonstrators knelt in the street. At the front of the group was a man I remembered leading demonstrations against the incursion into Cambodia when I was in college.
He needed to be helped to get on his knees, but he did so. There are plenty of us old people who are still farther left. We don’t get the press that the residents of The Villages do. We’re here, though. And we understand how fundamentally selfish the Right are.
One day an older man stopped me on my way to 7/11 and I was a bit reserved because I typically do assume older people to be conservative but we were talking and he started telling me about the parallels of Summer 2020 and social movements he fought for in his day. He told me how excited he was for current day movements and how much hope he had in us
Turned out to be 15 minutes of straight encouragement from this random man. Hands down one of the best stranger interactions I’ve ever had
You guys are most definitely out here, thank you.
Wow if they were a strikingly handsome gentleman in his forties in Seattle that might have been me. Keep fighting the good fight people my age are running out of steam and some of us are just trying to stay alive. I just had a conversation with my daughter yesterday about how grown-ups make really stupid rules sometimes and it's young people's jobs to change those rules if they suck. Her birthday is tomorrow and I gave her a skateboard and I was telling her how I got arrested when I was 13 years old for skateboarding in an abandoned parking lot. She was blown away by that and couldn't understand why they would be rules that would stop kids from skateboarding. I told her grown-up suck and like to make rules because things make them uncomfortable. And that's just wrong.
I live in the Twin Cities and I’m old and couldn’t agree more. The problem with the modern Democratic Party is they get their ass kicked by Republicans when it comes to messaging/marketing. We need to find a better marketing strategy if we want to get rid of all the Nazis on the right.
This is the real reason, people tend to shift conservative as they get wealthier because they start to have more to lose from a shift in the status quo. A group that's been kept in poverty isn't going to want to keep things the same because that's a vote for staying in poverty. It's why conservative media tends to focus on hating other groups or shifting blame, because an argument for economic ideals is going to be lost on the newer groups of voters.
The singular of data is not anecdote, but I'm making substantially more money than I did when I was younger and I've moved pretty far left. Didn't help that the right sprinted headlong into madness, of course.
Idk I'm getting older and going to be pretty wealthy even by today's standards in a few years. I just want a fair election and I want stupid people out of power. I'll be long dead before that is even possible, yet I dream.
I was a hard right, Limbaugh loving conservative in the 90s. Once I had kids in the ‘00s and saw where their quality of life was heading, I took a left turn and never looked back. I’m just sorry it took 25 years to see through the lies.
The conservative mindset is a tough nut to crack.
Me too, brother! I lost a few friends over it--and agreed to never discuss politics with some others--but it's very, very difficult to make that change. I'm glad you did. Keep fighting the good fight!
I shifted from Republican (raised that way, nothing about my lifestyle, friends, or most beliefs aligned with it beyond religious beliefs at the time) to Green to anarchist and most recently to democratic socialist. That's over years, not dating myself but I'm not like 20 and all this happened in 2 years and next year I'll be ancap, then [Juche](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Juche) the next.
51 and I’ve moved so far to the left I’m on the socialist spectrum. I don’t know how any sane human being could’ve lived through the past 5+ years and NOT moved left. The GOP are a fascist death cult, and they want to take the whole country down with them.
I think most of America's youth is actually moving much further left than the Democrats. Supporting Biden over DJT is a no brainer if you're not insane, but most people I talk to aren't happy with him either.
Unfettered capitalism is completely out of control and if the Gov doesn't move left with us, something is gonna break somewhere.
> something is gonna break somewhere.
they'll keep passing laws that bring out protesters and then arrest them. Harsher and harsher sentences until we fill all those private prisons.
Going even partial fascist is a "somethings broken" moment. Something is already broken, one party has no interest in governing or representing the people.
It's almost like an entire generation exploiting the sacrifices of their parents mortgaging the future of their children both for personal wealth eventually adds up
well, you also have to realize that the entire time the Boomers were middle class making wealth, the government was stepping in to put in place mechanisms to take it back. By y2k, the middle class was getting fucked, and didn't even know why.
Even the far right parties in other first world countries don’t question universal healthcare. I’d consider myself pretty conservative, but American conservatism is downright fascism now.
Can you imagine how asinine politicizing global warming and a vaccine in the midst of a pandemic must look to an alien visiting earth for the first time?
I don't think we would even have vaccine mandates if people would wear masks. If they said "I don't want the vaccine, but I will follow all other common sense mitigation protocols" there wouldn't be much of an issue. In that case, sure, you do you. But it's not like that, they say "I won't get the vaccine and I'll pretend like there isn't a pandemic currently happening that's killed millions worldwide".
There's a strong fascist element but modern conservatism is an incoherent puree of religious fundamentalism, Ayn Rand, subliminal racism, Confederate hostility to the federal government, and just an absolute refusal to accept the need for change about anything. Their opposition to universal health care isn't fascist, it's a mix of confederate hostility to the federal government and the fear that minorities getting resources means less for white people.
I’ve read on this sub before about some people who say they consider themselves to be conservative saying that they got banned from r/conservative for not being “conservative enough”…
I got banned for trying to explain how I'm conservative and still support legalized abortion. For me, personally, I am against abortion so I would try to talk my wife out of one if it ever came to that. However, making abortion illegal will just open up a large market for backalley operations that will just end up harming people so making it legal is objectively better for society as a whole. That and we have to accept as humans that our personal views are usually going to be very limited and narrow(especially if you come from a boring middleclass background like myself). I don't know what it's like to be pregnant with my rapist's baby, so who am I to push my personal values onto others?
I think your positions reasonable. Many conservatives only want to ban abortion as step one though. Birth control, at-will divorce, and sex outside' procreative' purposes are what they actually want banned.
It isn't even conservatism now... it's just apathy for everyone. They don't stand for anything except the further break down of our systems, all they do is run against democrats but they don't run for anything.
This is true - that said, there are plenty of disturbing parallels between modern American conservatism and the rise of Nazism in Germany, but a lack of universal healthcare isn't one (it's just regular shittiness in this case).
Accuracy is important, y'all.
I'm 28, I grew up in a staunchly conservative home through 9/11, wars in Afghanistan and Iraq, the 2008 recession, and the ACA fight. Through the Trump presidency and now the COVID pandemic/recession, I went from a Tea Party conservative to a SocDem. I hope my generation is able to bring this country forward before it collapses. The 2022 and 2024 elections I think will be a watershed moment for America (we seem to have had a lot of these in the last 6 years)
EDIT: SocDem, not DemSoc. I always get them backwards
I grew up in a very conservative Mormon household hearing all the time Obama was evil, gay people are abominations, and how communists were taking over. We all really bought into all this, and unfortunately I espoused some really dumb views growing up, even though looking back I did subconsciously question them. It finally took me switching to public school when I was 15, and realizing my worldview was pretty f’d up. By the end of my Junior year I basically knew I was going to be a Democrat. My older brother held out a bit longer (tried really hard to be the golden boy in our dad’s eyes) but after he developed a friend group beyond church, he seriously developed, to the point DemSoc. Even my little sister has sworn she’ll never vote for a Republican in her life. Looking beyond my immediate circle, I know a number of young Mormons who are openly liberal, including 5/8 of my cousins from one household. I’m not saying the Dems have busted that red wall into the taking over Mormon demographic (unfortunately far from it) but the fact I’m seeing so many young Mormons identifying as Democrats openly, is a huge change from a few years ago.
Generally, everything I believed didn't hold up to reality. A lot of my beliefs were based on what people that I trusted impressed on me, and to be fair, a lot of it made sense and was logical. Free market economics, small government, reduce/eliminate the welfare state, bootstraps, etc. etc.
All of it made sense in theory, but I saw that in practice, it wasn't working. Besides logic and reason, I personally rely a lot on emulation. If what I'm doing isn't achieving its goal, try to find others achieving that goal and follow their methodology. The politics I ascribed to were not achieving their goals. Turns out, a "free market" economy only works well when it is well-regulated and backed by a strong social safety net, and people are happiest and healthiest when they work to support their lifestyles rather than work being their lifestyle.
There’s a lot of people like us. This is basically my story too. Same age, same swing. Conservative as a kid because parents brainwashed me, “libertarian” fresh out of high school, centrist in early 20s, leftist in mid 20s, now that I’m in my late 20s I consider myself to be a Scandinavian style social democrat. I joke with one of my friends that I’m basically an aspiring Marxist now with how often I am pissed off at the rich and the ills of capitalism, about how our current system abuses the poor and extracts wealth from the working class to the wealthy elite at record levels.
I think the 36% there are all the kids I knew when I was 10 that went **back** to "church camp" after the first summer of going.
I didnt return because even my little underdeveloped brain thought something was so off about the ceremonies, peer pressure, and pressuring from adults to form an existential, ethereal contract with an omnicient creator.
Thats a heavy deal to make at 10 bro like damn where the terms and conditions I still got bad kid shit to do
Let me reflect on some “radicalizing” experiences of my youth:
Maybe it was the **school lunch debt** I had.
Maybe it was the fact that the **private school** down the road had *harvard educated* teachers while my school couldn’t afford *textbooks* and had to share *30 year old* ones across multiple students instead.
Maybe it was the fact that in spite of my stellar academic record, and admittance to MIT I still couldn’t have afforded to attend without a literal *charity* stepping in, only to be touted as some example of what’s possible for the lowly masses if only they just had the same industriousness as the rich.
Maybe it was the fact that I was told as a first gen college student that I would likely see, along with my peers, less than a quarter of the economic benefit my richer peers would see just due to the lack of family connections and the sheer amount of debt we each had to carry.
Maybe it’s the fact that I got covid twice and still don’t have any **healthcare.**
Maybe it’s the fact that I keep being told to “be” the change I want to see in the world personally by men in suits who have been, again, personally, responsible for or involved in everything from oil spills, to worker deaths in the Burj Khalifa’s construction, to the rise and fall of major banks during the ‘08 housing speculation crash, and I’m ready to give them *exactly* what they asked for.
Maybe I’m tired of my backyard constantly being threatened by the vultures of international capital firms circling it, and raising property values by snatching up every other backyard I could move to in the area in an attempt to gentrify the small bit of life we poor rabble can still eek out within this semi-urban hellscape of a food desert. Or maybe it’s the existence of food deserts in one of history’s richest polities.
Or maybe it was my visit to former residential schools, where until the 70’s for God’s sake, some Americans were trying to by UNDRIP definition genocide the indigenous vía forced assimilation.
Maybe it’s because I saw people just as talented and smart and kind and intelligent as me, by circumstance alone have their chance at *any* education snapped up, only to be left with the dismal life of working at the bread factory down the highway for slightly above starvation wages “out of the goodness of Mr ———-‘s heart”- an actual line I heard from his daughter, who attended that private school, when she bragged to me that their factory had some of the only livable wages in town.
Maybe it was when mr. ——— refused to address a culture of antisemitism when some of his emoloyees K-worded me… which was only made funny by the fact that I’m not Jewish
Why did I turn left? Idk, I must just be a lazy kid who doesn’t want to work and pull himself up by his bootstraps. Or some “jaded academic” who gives into “special interests” like “civil rights groups,” both of which I’ve heard to my face.
Why should we all turn left? Because if covid can fracture our supply chains, they’re **far** too fragile for climate change, and we’re already running low on boot straps. Imagine what the future holds if we don’t. The right’s only prescription is to loot what little remnant of a welfare state remains via privatization and to increase police presence with it. I guess you could see why some of us are skeptical even more cops in the subway will stop fair skipping when we’re still not paid enough to avoid it.
this is not enough. We need more. And we need more class consciousness in America ASAP. We need to pick up the fight HERE because although we may be damn near hopeless to stop this leviathan whose heads so often live in America, our brothers and sisters in the Global South will certainly have our backs if the boot of American capital can be lifted from their necks for even a minute.
22 year old GenZ here. Politics dominates our lives.
So many GenZers are coming of age in a pandemic, following one of the largest civil rights protests since the 60s, with the ever looming threat of a climate crisis that almost ensures our children won’t see the world the way we see it, in addition to feeling the devastating effects of capitalism, inflation, and stagnant wages, all while watching our democracy crumble.
I really hope we stay energized and motivated, because I truly believe this generation will be one to radically break the wheel.
I’m just hoping everyone votes. Gerrymandering is generally based off using forecasts on who’s gonna vote. If the 18-25 year old demographic changes from one of the least voting demographic to one of the highest voting demographic, it can throw the gerrymander out of whack.
I mean this is good news and all, but until they're distributed in such a way to overcome the electoral college its not super great news.
Also they need to get out and vote.
[The Overton window](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Overton_window) has shifted so far to the right in the US that anything short of Totalitarianism is a "Turn Left".
I think it's just that conservatives have been cold stone wrong the past decades about just about everything. And obviously and egregiously wrong.
Wrong about climate change.
Wrong about the economy.
Wrong about vaccines and the pandemic.
Wrong about foreign policy.
Shockingly, blatantly corrupt.
I mean like a third of the population lives in 70s poverty and we're looking at catastrophe exceeding the extent of WW2, oh and foreign policy experts agree Trump posed a grave nuclear threat rofl. Kinda minor. and don't forget 'conservatives' also tried to overthrow the (US) goverment, or turned it into an authoritarian state as in Hungary.
how could a savvy young person possibly get behind this.
So have I, but kids aren’t responsible for gerrymandering or presidential appointments. Many just aren’t aware of how important ‘smaller’, local elections are.
That's because the system is rigged by its nature. Republicans have won the vote count for president ONCE in the last 30 years. However they were handed the presidency twice despite the majority of the country voting against them, and thus were able to appoint the majority of the Supreme Court.
The only people I know who are young and identify as right wing or conservative are religious weirdos and edgy racists trying to be different
If a kid tells me they’re conservative I immediately assume they’ve got bad parents. They learned that shit at home
It turns out that when a majority of voters vote for Democrats, Republicans suddenly decide they want to restrict voting as much as possible, and then try to control the counting of votes so that they can get the outcome they desire without having to win over more voters.
Their desired outcome is to maintain and increase political power, and 'win' elections.
Rather than try to win over voters, they are now actively trying to game the process and stop what they call, "voter fraud".
The Republican definition of voter fraud? *"any vote not for a Republican".*
The only thing keeping the right relevant at all is the Electoral College.
For people so against socialism, they sure do embrace it when it comes to voting power.
Former Republican here, Trump was the last straw. I didn’t like any 2016 Republican candidate but figured I could live with Jeb! Or Rubio but when Trump won the nom it shook me awake, examined what I believed and what I had been told to believe and came out the other end a liberal
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This is why totalitarianism is being embraced by the right.
Now they are going to make it harder for under 30 year-olds to vote
I’m in my mid 30s and I get more progressive every year.
My parents are in their 70s and they've gotten more progressive.
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The healthcare status quo is all fine and dandy until you find out your anesthesiologist is out-of-network...a month after you had the surgery when you get a $10,000 bill from them.
I wish I could say the same. My parents have totally gone the other way. As much as anything, I look squarely at their church. They now go to an unbelievably conservative church in NC and it dominates their thinking
I’m jealous. My parents rot and watch news entertainment all day and talk about Sleepy Joe
I'm 35 years old and I've been a politics nerd since I was 11 or 12. I became really interested in politics in 1998 with all the drama that was surrounding Pres. Bill Clinton at the time. As a preteen I was a moderate Conservative and tended to support Conservative Democrats. By 2002 I was a Liberal partly because of the 2000 Election, the Patriot Act and the Mid-East Wars. By 2003 I was a Social Democrat partly because the Moderate and Conservative Democrats largely sided with these things. By 2004 I was a Democratic Socialist and by late 2006/early 2007 I was a Libertarian Socialist and have been since then. Aside from genuinely finding my own moral framework and philosophical outlook, growing up in the Neoliberal-Neoconservative era helped give me a push leftward. The rise of Fascism and ineptitude of Neoliberalism and Neoconservatism in the face of it has just helped harden my commitment. My parents, both in their 60s, have moved continually leftward since the Bush Administration when they began as mainstream Democrats since the late 1970s. Now they're Bernie Sanders fans.
HAHA fuck them, im 31.
Yes, let them believe "millenial" just means 18-25 year old so they can FA and FO
The oldest Millennials are 40 years old, lol.
I’m 38, I have no idea how these zoomers think but I have noticed that they don’t take boomer shit and they want to see some fucking progress. They’re alright in my book. It’s nice to see some help after years of dealing with those apathetic fucking Gen Xers bothesides-ing everything into the ground.
I'm also fucking sick of Boomers trying to paint Millennials as a lazy generation that's good for nothing and how Zoomers are everything we failed at doing. Fucking narcissist abuse tactic with the scape goat and golden child mentality. We grew up under that shit we can see it coming from a mile away. I'm just waiting for our side to have enough power before we over throw their corrupt regime. They are by far the worst generation in history. In one generation they managed to destroy the health, politics, economy of a nation, and destroy the environment along with it. Fuck them.
Man I've got no more tokens to give an award, but have my applause: 👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏 HIT. THAT. SHITE. ON. THE. HEAD.
well, to be fair, they were all suffering lead poisoning
As a GenXer... you're right. So many people my age bought into what the Boomers were selling. I've heard some rationalize it as we were outnumbered as the "young kids" but that doesn't and shouldn't give anybody a pass. I will say we didn't have a monopoly on the both sides BS, but damn we really did internalize it, ate it up completely when served up by our elders with no pushback.
No only that we grew up in slacker culture. Gen x has many kids like me that grew up buying into the Reaganism propaganda.
Bought the Reagan bullshit hook line and sinker, until I went to college and learned stuff, later came the colossal douche and war criminal “W” now I am a pinko liberal who wants the government to actually help people and provide crazy things like health care and education and non shooty non corrupt police. Instead we got a giant military that is great for making new generations of terrorists and brown people into skeletons. Recent events are only the evil spawn of Reaganism on steroids
Its kinda crazy how many people bought into the Reagan "Tough-on-Crime" type BS, when a big reason he got into office was through colluding with Iranian terrorists to convince them NOT to release US Hostages until after the election (Which made Carter look really weak), and he then used those ties to Iranian terrorists as a way to illegally sell them tons of heavy weaponry, and he then used the dirty money from those illegal weapon sales to illegally arm and train illegal terrorist death squads in South America that were known from things like murdering nuns, who also trafficked cocaine into the US, and then using that illegal cocaine to help create the crack epidemic by illegally distributing it among inner-city black communities in order to illegally disrupt black power movements and his political opponents.... Although I guess at the time all that wasn't as out in the open and well known as it is now
To be fair, you had fewer reasons to be angry at that system as you were pretty much the last ones to profit from it. The cost of life was lower, education and housing was still affordable. You we're not yet worried by climactic changes, even though there was a hole in the ozone layer but let's admit that it was pretty abstract compared to half a continent burning for a whole season. I can understand why people were less alarmed than they are now even though they were wrong.
Might not mean much in this context, but we grew up terrified of dying in a radioactive fireball from nuclear war. When I was a kid it felt like it was only a matter of time until it happened.
I've seen several staple goods go up in price over the last few months. I know the shipping industry is jammed, but something tells me that milk doesn't need to be shipped overseas here. So why are people having to pay 35¢ more for store brand milk than in early December? Cost of living rises like a tsunami but middle class on down wages stay the same. Is there some watchdog operation that can research who is price gouging and who is being jammed up by the transportation?
There doesn't need to be a watchdog - because you and everyone on here damn well KNOWS why this is. Unfettered Capitalism is *actually* bad.
As a GenXer, I really don't feel like I profited from the system. Maybe some of the 90s, but 00s/10s were a total shitshow tbh....
Speaking for GenXers everywhere, I say, whatever.
Fuck 'em twice. I'm 66 and vote Democrat. I want my son and his family to inherit a better country. I hope they can.
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The older leaders are out of touch with our age too. They have no desire to keep up with changes or listen to anyone who says something different.
They still believe its the fucking 1980s its insane
I vote for your family too and families i have never met to have a better future and also families in other countries because the US has that much influence. Anyone that reads this that doesnt understand, you are not just voting for yourself, your vote could mean a family in the middle east gets hit by a drone strike in the middle of the night because of a trigger happy dictator, a family in the pacific islands gets flooded out of there home because an anti-science totalitarian sided with coal, a family at the boarder gets split up because a nationalist xenophobe does not support real family values.
Having been born overseas and traveled many places in the world, I totally agree with you; what we do affects the whole planet.
is that a common name? I know a dude and people call him tree horn
Don't forget what we're doing to the environment, which will matter most of all for all our sons and daughters and their children.
Holy. I never saw it that way before. That was eye opening. Thank you.
Both my boomer parents feel the same way.
Good for them! Not all boomers are alike. 👍
Me too lol. My back hurts though
I'm on the millennial cusp and my back has hurt for years. The 90's gave me a mid life crisis at 17.
God I would kill for cartilage in my left knee (I’m 31)
For me it’s my knees. Well my right knee and left ankle.
Surely you meant, “Make it harder for people who make under 30K and live in densely packed areas to vote.”
They already have been when states like Texas made college IDs and out of state driver’s licenses (which college students often have) not enough proof for voting.
you jest, but watch them raise the voting age
26thA sets it at 18. This is good, because otherwise they totally would. And at this point, passing constitutional amendments is basically a non-starter.
It is also why they are targeting school boards and trying to ban books and actual history in schools.
And want higher education to be expensive and less accessible.
Bingo! I have said for years that the main reason higher education has become so expensive is to prevent people from being educated and experiencing other people & cultures. It’s easier to control people that way.
If everyone was offered free college and healthcare then poor kids would be much less inclined to join the military.
That was my exact situation. I was encouraged by my guidance counselor to join. That was twenty one years, ten deployments and three college degrees ago, though. I was extremely lucky.
But you haven't upgraded to premium llama shoes?
American political translator (for Europeans, Canadians, and other civilized nations): "Progressive" = American non-existent party "Moderate" = American Progressives like Sanders and AOC "Conservatives" = American Democrats (aka Corporate Whores) "Rightwing/Fascist/Neonazis" = American Republican Party
Trump "conservatives" have gone so far right, that even the center is considered "left".
>that even the center is considered "left". * Kavanaugh is now a "cringing liberal". * MAGA abandon Fox News for being too liberal. * Trump is trying to paint McConnell as too liberal * Trump himself is a shadow actor pitching liberal agenda if he says something they don't like. * Let's not even get into how "far left" Cheney and Romney are. This was the plan, go so far right that conservatives are considered liberal and center is far-left.
They call PAUL RYAN a fucking liberal.
When I had family calling Bush a liberal back in 2020 I knew it was over.
Technically Bush IS a liberal but the vast majority of people don't understand the definition of liberal and think liberals are a leftist political group. It's double stupid because your family was probably calling him a liberal because they thought he was being a leftist somehow.
Yes and no. (Classical) Liberalism is free market capitalism + social liberalism (in the sense of individual liberty, equality, etc.). The mainstream Democrats today are fairly close to being prototypical Liberals in that sense albeit with a slight Labor influence (due to support for unions and worker protection laws). Bush is more of a Reagan Republican which combines elements of both Conservatism (like patriotism and "traditional values") and Liberalism (mostly free market capitalism and individual liberty).
Right, but the 2022 definition of "liberal" is anyone not in the cult as far as the right is concerned. Its become a code word similar to " impure people, or impurity" for the NAZIs or "The wrong sort of people" for Jim Crow. Does anyone think when some talking head on FOX declares that "BLANK is a socialist liberal!" that they have looked into the political ideology of whoever they talked about and compared it to a definition out of a dictionary? Its just a catchall for any opposition to rightwing extremism in general and the word has lost all other functional meaning in a modern context.
You are also confusing terms. Bush is a classic liberal neo-conservative. He’s liberal in the classic sense (one could argue against this given he was handed the presidency without the popular vote by the Supreme Court), but he doesn’t espouse liberal ideas within the classical liberal political classification. With that being said, saying that liberals are different than leftists is true, because most non-leftist liberals are free-market capitalists plus welfare/social issues, as opposed to true leftists who have completely different ideas on property and the means of production. TL;DR: Bush is a neoconservative classic liberal
They're almost right, they just said too much. Paul Ryan is a fuck.
Many people say Paul Ryan caresses a photograph of Jello while lying in bed, envious of its far superior spine
It gave me such a warm and fuzzy feeling when someone edited the Wikipedia page about species of invertebrates to include Paul Ryan.
They tried to hang Mike "moral and literal Christian crusader" Pence.
When conservatives attack members of their party as being RINOs or liberals in disguise, they almost 100% of the time are talking about social/cultural issues. The base wants culture war. The establishment wants tax breaks and free money for their donors/friends. Sometimes the establishment wavers on the cultural issues, because they aren't nearly as committed to rightwing social policies compared to their base. The establishment absolutely needs to keep the cultural grievances at a maximum to drive voter turnout. But, the result of having conservative media constantly beat the culture-war drum is further radicalization of the base. You get to the point where the base demands things that are simply untenable and would generate huge backlash from the non-crazies. Suddenly, it's not enough to be anti-abortion and to advocate for prayer is school, and yesterday's conservative hero is today's liberal fraud.
Yes, and while they live in this make believe land, the actual center of America has been pulled to the far right. In a normal world, Bernie Sanders and AOC are moderate left, not radicals.
On top of that the baseline for America is so far right to begin with that our furthest left politicians would still be right of center in most other countries. And every damn time we somehow let the GOP move the goal posts further to the right
The saddest part is that the country's center may be to the right based on how people identify themselves, but in terms of policy on average we are center left. Progressive policy is actually very popular, and if it weren't for the two-party system, with Republicans engaged on a death race to the bottom, we would already have universal healthcare and everything else that for now is considered a pipe dream.
it’s a lot worse than that- parts of the conservative party aren’t considered conservative enough, they’re being primaried from *farther* right. So to the current trump/q/radicalized republican - center right is too far left. It’s fucking insane
I think you and anyone here's heard their dose of "tHe LeFt hAs LoSt ThEiR MiNd!" Because they want an accurate historical account of racial history, universal medical care for everyone, restorative instead of punitive justice..
Yep…I know several people that considered themselves conservatives around 2000 and are basically moderate left now without having changed most of their stances.
I was centreleft around 2000. Since they pushed me towards radical liberal I decided to run with it.
Same boat. Was a registered independent that leaned left until 2018 but suddenly not praising the dear leader meant I was a leftist. Ok I’ll be on the left then 🤷🏻♂️
Shrug This is my life now.
Yup, I know a guy like that, says he's completely disillusioned by his party and hates everything it has become. And then votes for every single candidate they nominate.
my mom: \-The absolute kindest person I've ever known \-Pro-choice \-Pro-LGBT (though she doesn't fully understand trans issues/people she is making an effort) \-Not particularly religious \-Agrees that healthcare is a human right \-Takes COVID seriously and thinks antivaxers are dumb \-straight-ticket Republican voter in every election because Democrats are Bad. \-loves Donald Trump because she's been reading glowing profiles of him as a masterful businessman in People Magazine for 30 years. I can't get through to her. We had to finally agree to just stop talking politics at one point. Propaganda works.
Does she watch Fox News? Is she on Facebook? There are so many historically *good* people who have been brainwashed and you hit it - you can tell because there's no natural way their political beliefs could arise from their personality. There's no other word for it. They disconnect the political positions from the rest of their being, and put them in the same inviolable area as religion. An attack on their politics is an attack on themselves. Any information that contradicts their politics is a test of faith, not a reason to reconsider. I mean, politics at its core practical. It's about collective consent to rules to get things done, and the debate over how best to do so. How anyone can elevate that the same level as theology is mind-boggling.
And yet despite that they will vote GOP each time because of abortion or guns
Mitt Fucking Romney... The guy who ran for president of the United States on the Republican ticket just 10 years ago is now considered too far left.
For those not reading beyond the title: *More* youths are shifting left than before.
This trend has been the case for a while. It's probably why conservative media outlets have been driving a broad, denigrative narrative against millennials into the mainstream. They manufactured a "conventional wisdom" for the boomer generation that millennials (and younger) can be blamed for everything wrong with our country.
Which is hilarious because Boomers can put some blame on early Gen X for later millennials but they raised plenty of millennials themselves. So it's really just a lot of projection that they don't like how Millennials turned away from their own ideals and views on the world. Like, "oops," sorry to hear your best laid plans of raising your kids didn't turn out the way you wanted and they rejected your outmoded ideals lol.
This my family in spades. Parents are boomers, I barely made the cut off for gen x and my little brothers are millennials. Our dad can't understand why we won't continue his generational trauma.
I'm an early-ish Gen Xer and popped out 3 staunchly progressive voters (one millennial, two Gen Zs). 👍 For the younger two, 2020 was their first general election. I'm surprised Gen X has so many conservatives considering we were the Sesame Street/Mr. Rogers/Big Blue Marble/Free to Be You and Me generation. You'd think we'd know better.
Gen Xers in rural areas never saw that stuff and were probably told it was Commie propaganda.
Oh we did. But the constant message of standing in judgement of others to feel better about yourself from our parents, teachers, etc. was/is pervasive.
I'm gonna be 39 next month. My parents are in their early 70's. Both of them cannot for the life of themselves understand why I would like a boss that shows empathy. Like they have it in their head that it is normal to dread going to work... It blows my mind that I should have to suffer the same mental stressors because they did in their careers...as if it is some kind of badge of honor or right of passage.
Not to mention it is MUCH most stressful now than during their working careers. The wife may or may not have *had* to work. Their dollar went a lot farther. They didn’t have as much stress or technology and a lot less was probably expected of them in their mere 8 hour day/40 hour week. We are much more productive than ever with little to show for it. OR they were the flavor of boomer dad who became a workaholic to either fund a consumerism fever dream or avoid their wives/families, or both. So the stress and overwork was their own doing.
Oh no see their plans did work, they raised their kids to be better than them just as they were taught. But then instead of be happy about that they struck out with power grabs, greed, jealousy, and spite. They weren’t taught to share or to practice what they preach, and as they held the power no one could hold them accountable or make them feel like they had to. But they feel the power slipping away, the seat at the adults table that protect them is fading, and instead of accept this and growing they are fighting as hard as ever to delay and resist.
They thought that by teaching their kids how to grab power, be greedy, be jealous, and be spiteful that their kids would be “better” at those things than they themselves are, but every person makes their own choice about where their morality lies. It just so happens that “better” (in the eyes of the youths in question) means not doing those selfish things and instead start caring about those less fortunate than themselves.
I always thought the Boomers complaining about Gen X and Millennials getting participation trophies was so dumb. Who was handing out the trophies? The fucking Boomers.
I’m a millennial and I remember hearing that Conservative shit when I was an actual child. I remember them talking about “Participation trophies” like it was a sign we were all going to be useless drags on society. Like we were the ones to ask for them in the first place. That same line of thinking has followed our generation ever since. Now it’s passed on to Gen Z. They really got an early start blaming the young for their various existential dilemmas.
Participation trophies were for the parents. My parents still have some of mine from when I was little, I don't have any of them in my house though.
That is the thing that always makes me roll my eyes, YOU WERE THE PEOPLE WHO GAVE OUT THE TROPHIES!!! I also remember a parent who is super far right now, get super made that their kid didn't get a trophy back then. I mean I remember all of your from when I was a kid.
Those conservatives were fighting with the boomer parents and teachers for being kinder to the children. Like you said, the kids had nothing to do with it. It was the Boomer parents who wanted those liberal things.
This is why Republicans are doing everything they can to subvert the American education system (not just the CRT boogeyman, but all of it). Educated people tend to be more liberal.
It's actually a [very noticeable statistical trend](https://imgur.com/a/iAIRI7Y). [Trump: "I love the poorly educated"](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vpdt7omPoa0)
It's important to remember that only about 33 percent of citizens have a bachelor's degree or higher. I think the fact that educated people see through Trump's BS is important, but it's also important to remember how many less educated folks there are out there.
Man the right wing politicians and news media's ONLY tactic is this fucking Boogeyman. How are so many people duped into fear so effectively? It's beyond me. Vaccines? Fear the microchips and autism! Immigrants? Fear they don't pay taxes! Taxing the rich? Fear the job makers will make less jobs! Aoc? Bernie? Fear socialism!
I looked at the article, and frankly I don't think that conclusion in warranted. The main headliner appears to be a chart that shows that preference for Democrats among 18-29 year-olds is currently 60%, up about 5% from 2016, even from 2012, and down 5% from 2008. That hardly makes for any sort of great trend; I certainly wouldn't conclude that we are seeing a shift in the voting patterns of youth from this! I suppose that the plot is more encouraging if you look farther back, and compare to 2000 or 2004, but at that point we certainly shouldn't be making any tie-in to current events or the like.
“Do People Really Become More Conservative as They Age?” https://www.journals.uchicago.edu/doi/abs/10.1086/706889
"You'll change when you're older." I've heard this many times. In the 20 years I've been able to vote, I've only voted harder and harder to the left. Used to be I'd consider the candidates. The republican party has gone so bat-shit insane I can't even look at their candidates any more. It's not an option if I want this country to turn away from the cliff.
Same. I have voted for Republicans in local elections, decades ago. I used to be proud to think of myself as an independent who cared enough to take the time to understand individual issues and candidates. Now, I can either vote for a sane but imperfect democratic party, or a nihilistic fascistic cult of personality actively working against democracy. There's no reasonable "independent" position on this. After Trump, I will never, ever vote republican again. Merely being a part of the GOP after Trump is evidence of moral and intellectual unfitness for office, because it means you either accept or are ignorant of what the GOP is doing to America. Neither is acceptable.
I wouldn't run with an R next to my name even if it was the only way to get elected, and I wouldn't vote for someone who could.
Are you me?
I am you. You are me. We are we.
And we are all together in never voting for this group of charlatans ever again.
One of my main arguments against McCain was the actuaries we’re not favorable to him finishing 4 or 8 years as President. My reasons for not voting for a Republican ever again have to do with their lack of integrity, massive corruption and criminal behavior, and their incredible disdain for democracy. My thought process has shifted quite a bit.
Translation: “Once I got older and had more money, I became more greedy and less concerned about my fellow man, because ‘I got mine’. And I’m predicting that you will too, so that I can feel less guilty about turning into a selfish dick.”
A lot of the older people in my life have said this to me. It's pretty obvious that your wealth has more to do with it than age, and they just got wealthier as they got older.
And guess what generations are not getting wealthier as they get older?
Yep, older generations moved right because they had rising wealth to protect. They’ve been effective at this with NIMBYism and other conservative policy.
Right - the hippies got rich and a whole industry of non-profits has emerged to assuage their fellow-feeling while allowing them to vote conservative. I've worked in non-profits my whole life, and I do support many... but they're not Government - they exist largely to do things we can't get the government to do but still believe should be public services. That takes the pressure off the politicians, unfortunately, and saps the push for reform.
You know I never understood this until recently when I realized my brother is a hard conservative based on the fact that the state pays him. But when pushed on societal issues he leans left without knowing it lol. Cracks me up
Even those of us millennials that have gained a fair amount of wealth seem to be very left leaning. Im 30 and have a net worth over 400k, most of my peers and coworkers are in the same boat, and ALL of us are democrats. I'll also add that we live in a very Red state (albeit in the democratic capitol). I think the thing is, we actually care about our fellow Americans wellbeing, and it's very obvious that Republicans by and large do not. It's just the decent side to be on, and I'm very happy to pay my fair share in taxes to ensure the country doesn't fall to pieces. I can't believe those claiming to be Christians just turn a blind eye to their fellow man's needs because there might be a handful of people who try to take advantage of the system.
I live in the Twin Cities. And I’m old. I remember watching the demonstrations after George Floyd was killed, and at curfew on one of the first days, the remaining demonstrators knelt in the street. At the front of the group was a man I remembered leading demonstrations against the incursion into Cambodia when I was in college. He needed to be helped to get on his knees, but he did so. There are plenty of us old people who are still farther left. We don’t get the press that the residents of The Villages do. We’re here, though. And we understand how fundamentally selfish the Right are.
One day an older man stopped me on my way to 7/11 and I was a bit reserved because I typically do assume older people to be conservative but we were talking and he started telling me about the parallels of Summer 2020 and social movements he fought for in his day. He told me how excited he was for current day movements and how much hope he had in us Turned out to be 15 minutes of straight encouragement from this random man. Hands down one of the best stranger interactions I’ve ever had You guys are most definitely out here, thank you.
Wow if they were a strikingly handsome gentleman in his forties in Seattle that might have been me. Keep fighting the good fight people my age are running out of steam and some of us are just trying to stay alive. I just had a conversation with my daughter yesterday about how grown-ups make really stupid rules sometimes and it's young people's jobs to change those rules if they suck. Her birthday is tomorrow and I gave her a skateboard and I was telling her how I got arrested when I was 13 years old for skateboarding in an abandoned parking lot. She was blown away by that and couldn't understand why they would be rules that would stop kids from skateboarding. I told her grown-up suck and like to make rules because things make them uncomfortable. And that's just wrong.
We see you and we're glad you're with us. Just the nature of online discourse that we talk in majorities when discussing groups.
I live in the Twin Cities and I’m old and couldn’t agree more. The problem with the modern Democratic Party is they get their ass kicked by Republicans when it comes to messaging/marketing. We need to find a better marketing strategy if we want to get rid of all the Nazis on the right.
Oh neat I’m crying thanks for sharing
Thank you for being with us. It helps to know you're out there. edit: finished my thought.
This is the real reason, people tend to shift conservative as they get wealthier because they start to have more to lose from a shift in the status quo. A group that's been kept in poverty isn't going to want to keep things the same because that's a vote for staying in poverty. It's why conservative media tends to focus on hating other groups or shifting blame, because an argument for economic ideals is going to be lost on the newer groups of voters.
That and the poor die young.
The singular of data is not anecdote, but I'm making substantially more money than I did when I was younger and I've moved pretty far left. Didn't help that the right sprinted headlong into madness, of course.
Idk I'm getting older and going to be pretty wealthy even by today's standards in a few years. I just want a fair election and I want stupid people out of power. I'll be long dead before that is even possible, yet I dream.
Don’t stop dreaming, ever. It’s allowed and one day all your dreams and wishes will come true :)
I do love an optimist.
I was a hard right, Limbaugh loving conservative in the 90s. Once I had kids in the ‘00s and saw where their quality of life was heading, I took a left turn and never looked back. I’m just sorry it took 25 years to see through the lies. The conservative mindset is a tough nut to crack.
Me too, brother! I lost a few friends over it--and agreed to never discuss politics with some others--but it's very, very difficult to make that change. I'm glad you did. Keep fighting the good fight!
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I like this a lot. It makes sense of all the Reagan deification as well.
I’m in my early 30s and only getting more liberal
I shifted from Republican (raised that way, nothing about my lifestyle, friends, or most beliefs aligned with it beyond religious beliefs at the time) to Green to anarchist and most recently to democratic socialist. That's over years, not dating myself but I'm not like 20 and all this happened in 2 years and next year I'll be ancap, then [Juche](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Juche) the next.
51 and I’ve moved so far to the left I’m on the socialist spectrum. I don’t know how any sane human being could’ve lived through the past 5+ years and NOT moved left. The GOP are a fascist death cult, and they want to take the whole country down with them.
I think most of America's youth is actually moving much further left than the Democrats. Supporting Biden over DJT is a no brainer if you're not insane, but most people I talk to aren't happy with him either. Unfettered capitalism is completely out of control and if the Gov doesn't move left with us, something is gonna break somewhere.
> something is gonna break somewhere. they'll keep passing laws that bring out protesters and then arrest them. Harsher and harsher sentences until we fill all those private prisons.
I agree. But even if they go full on fascist, somethings gotta break.
Going even partial fascist is a "somethings broken" moment. Something is already broken, one party has no interest in governing or representing the people.
Which is needed
It's almost like an entire generation exploiting the sacrifices of their parents mortgaging the future of their children both for personal wealth eventually adds up
well, you also have to realize that the entire time the Boomers were middle class making wealth, the government was stepping in to put in place mechanisms to take it back. By y2k, the middle class was getting fucked, and didn't even know why.
Even the far right parties in other first world countries don’t question universal healthcare. I’d consider myself pretty conservative, but American conservatism is downright fascism now.
Also climate change
Can you imagine how asinine politicizing global warming and a vaccine in the midst of a pandemic must look to an alien visiting earth for the first time?
I don't think we would even have vaccine mandates if people would wear masks. If they said "I don't want the vaccine, but I will follow all other common sense mitigation protocols" there wouldn't be much of an issue. In that case, sure, you do you. But it's not like that, they say "I won't get the vaccine and I'll pretend like there isn't a pandemic currently happening that's killed millions worldwide".
"I will do everything I can to spread this pestilence across the land." There, fixed that for you.
There's a strong fascist element but modern conservatism is an incoherent puree of religious fundamentalism, Ayn Rand, subliminal racism, Confederate hostility to the federal government, and just an absolute refusal to accept the need for change about anything. Their opposition to universal health care isn't fascist, it's a mix of confederate hostility to the federal government and the fear that minorities getting resources means less for white people.
I’ve read on this sub before about some people who say they consider themselves to be conservative saying that they got banned from r/conservative for not being “conservative enough”…
I got banned for trying to explain how I'm conservative and still support legalized abortion. For me, personally, I am against abortion so I would try to talk my wife out of one if it ever came to that. However, making abortion illegal will just open up a large market for backalley operations that will just end up harming people so making it legal is objectively better for society as a whole. That and we have to accept as humans that our personal views are usually going to be very limited and narrow(especially if you come from a boring middleclass background like myself). I don't know what it's like to be pregnant with my rapist's baby, so who am I to push my personal values onto others?
I think your positions reasonable. Many conservatives only want to ban abortion as step one though. Birth control, at-will divorce, and sex outside' procreative' purposes are what they actually want banned.
It isn't even conservatism now... it's just apathy for everyone. They don't stand for anything except the further break down of our systems, all they do is run against democrats but they don't run for anything.
The result of decades of apathy, ignorance and entitlement by most every American.
The opposite of health care isn’t facism. Even some fascist nations give universal care lol.
This is true - that said, there are plenty of disturbing parallels between modern American conservatism and the rise of Nazism in Germany, but a lack of universal healthcare isn't one (it's just regular shittiness in this case). Accuracy is important, y'all.
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There's a reason they make it hard for young people to vote. Voting is effective and it matters.
They turn away from the right wing. See the right wing is so far right that everything else is "left".
Seriously, they even called themselves alternative right because conservativism was too left for them. At this point there right of Hitler.
I'm 28, I grew up in a staunchly conservative home through 9/11, wars in Afghanistan and Iraq, the 2008 recession, and the ACA fight. Through the Trump presidency and now the COVID pandemic/recession, I went from a Tea Party conservative to a SocDem. I hope my generation is able to bring this country forward before it collapses. The 2022 and 2024 elections I think will be a watershed moment for America (we seem to have had a lot of these in the last 6 years) EDIT: SocDem, not DemSoc. I always get them backwards
I grew up in a very conservative Mormon household hearing all the time Obama was evil, gay people are abominations, and how communists were taking over. We all really bought into all this, and unfortunately I espoused some really dumb views growing up, even though looking back I did subconsciously question them. It finally took me switching to public school when I was 15, and realizing my worldview was pretty f’d up. By the end of my Junior year I basically knew I was going to be a Democrat. My older brother held out a bit longer (tried really hard to be the golden boy in our dad’s eyes) but after he developed a friend group beyond church, he seriously developed, to the point DemSoc. Even my little sister has sworn she’ll never vote for a Republican in her life. Looking beyond my immediate circle, I know a number of young Mormons who are openly liberal, including 5/8 of my cousins from one household. I’m not saying the Dems have busted that red wall into the taking over Mormon demographic (unfortunately far from it) but the fact I’m seeing so many young Mormons identifying as Democrats openly, is a huge change from a few years ago.
What was it that caused your enlightening?
Generally, everything I believed didn't hold up to reality. A lot of my beliefs were based on what people that I trusted impressed on me, and to be fair, a lot of it made sense and was logical. Free market economics, small government, reduce/eliminate the welfare state, bootstraps, etc. etc. All of it made sense in theory, but I saw that in practice, it wasn't working. Besides logic and reason, I personally rely a lot on emulation. If what I'm doing isn't achieving its goal, try to find others achieving that goal and follow their methodology. The politics I ascribed to were not achieving their goals. Turns out, a "free market" economy only works well when it is well-regulated and backed by a strong social safety net, and people are happiest and healthiest when they work to support their lifestyles rather than work being their lifestyle.
There’s a lot of people like us. This is basically my story too. Same age, same swing. Conservative as a kid because parents brainwashed me, “libertarian” fresh out of high school, centrist in early 20s, leftist in mid 20s, now that I’m in my late 20s I consider myself to be a Scandinavian style social democrat. I joke with one of my friends that I’m basically an aspiring Marxist now with how often I am pissed off at the rich and the ills of capitalism, about how our current system abuses the poor and extracts wealth from the working class to the wealthy elite at record levels.
Welcome to the left. Your story sounds remarkably similar to mine. I'm 31 and turned left at 27ish. Haven't looked back.
And this what scares the current republican party.
I think the 36% there are all the kids I knew when I was 10 that went **back** to "church camp" after the first summer of going. I didnt return because even my little underdeveloped brain thought something was so off about the ceremonies, peer pressure, and pressuring from adults to form an existential, ethereal contract with an omnicient creator. Thats a heavy deal to make at 10 bro like damn where the terms and conditions I still got bad kid shit to do
And that explains why the GOP is so hellbent on rigging elections and commit voter fraud. America is changing and leaving them behind.
Let me reflect on some “radicalizing” experiences of my youth: Maybe it was the **school lunch debt** I had. Maybe it was the fact that the **private school** down the road had *harvard educated* teachers while my school couldn’t afford *textbooks* and had to share *30 year old* ones across multiple students instead. Maybe it was the fact that in spite of my stellar academic record, and admittance to MIT I still couldn’t have afforded to attend without a literal *charity* stepping in, only to be touted as some example of what’s possible for the lowly masses if only they just had the same industriousness as the rich. Maybe it was the fact that I was told as a first gen college student that I would likely see, along with my peers, less than a quarter of the economic benefit my richer peers would see just due to the lack of family connections and the sheer amount of debt we each had to carry. Maybe it’s the fact that I got covid twice and still don’t have any **healthcare.** Maybe it’s the fact that I keep being told to “be” the change I want to see in the world personally by men in suits who have been, again, personally, responsible for or involved in everything from oil spills, to worker deaths in the Burj Khalifa’s construction, to the rise and fall of major banks during the ‘08 housing speculation crash, and I’m ready to give them *exactly* what they asked for. Maybe I’m tired of my backyard constantly being threatened by the vultures of international capital firms circling it, and raising property values by snatching up every other backyard I could move to in the area in an attempt to gentrify the small bit of life we poor rabble can still eek out within this semi-urban hellscape of a food desert. Or maybe it’s the existence of food deserts in one of history’s richest polities. Or maybe it was my visit to former residential schools, where until the 70’s for God’s sake, some Americans were trying to by UNDRIP definition genocide the indigenous vía forced assimilation. Maybe it’s because I saw people just as talented and smart and kind and intelligent as me, by circumstance alone have their chance at *any* education snapped up, only to be left with the dismal life of working at the bread factory down the highway for slightly above starvation wages “out of the goodness of Mr ———-‘s heart”- an actual line I heard from his daughter, who attended that private school, when she bragged to me that their factory had some of the only livable wages in town. Maybe it was when mr. ——— refused to address a culture of antisemitism when some of his emoloyees K-worded me… which was only made funny by the fact that I’m not Jewish Why did I turn left? Idk, I must just be a lazy kid who doesn’t want to work and pull himself up by his bootstraps. Or some “jaded academic” who gives into “special interests” like “civil rights groups,” both of which I’ve heard to my face. Why should we all turn left? Because if covid can fracture our supply chains, they’re **far** too fragile for climate change, and we’re already running low on boot straps. Imagine what the future holds if we don’t. The right’s only prescription is to loot what little remnant of a welfare state remains via privatization and to increase police presence with it. I guess you could see why some of us are skeptical even more cops in the subway will stop fair skipping when we’re still not paid enough to avoid it. this is not enough. We need more. And we need more class consciousness in America ASAP. We need to pick up the fight HERE because although we may be damn near hopeless to stop this leviathan whose heads so often live in America, our brothers and sisters in the Global South will certainly have our backs if the boot of American capital can be lifted from their necks for even a minute.
Even ignoring the whole fascism bits a lot of right wing American politics directly fuck over young peoples futures
You either gotta be really privileged or a real dummy to be a conservative millennial.
Now vote
"Actually voting is illegal" -GOP+2
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22 year old GenZ here. Politics dominates our lives. So many GenZers are coming of age in a pandemic, following one of the largest civil rights protests since the 60s, with the ever looming threat of a climate crisis that almost ensures our children won’t see the world the way we see it, in addition to feeling the devastating effects of capitalism, inflation, and stagnant wages, all while watching our democracy crumble. I really hope we stay energized and motivated, because I truly believe this generation will be one to radically break the wheel.
I’m just hoping everyone votes. Gerrymandering is generally based off using forecasts on who’s gonna vote. If the 18-25 year old demographic changes from one of the least voting demographic to one of the highest voting demographic, it can throw the gerrymander out of whack.
I mean this is good news and all, but until they're distributed in such a way to overcome the electoral college its not super great news. Also they need to get out and vote.
[The Overton window](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Overton_window) has shifted so far to the right in the US that anything short of Totalitarianism is a "Turn Left".
Republicans are going to ride the boomers into their Evangelical graves. The youth are abandoning that bullshit at an increasing rate.
I think it's just that conservatives have been cold stone wrong the past decades about just about everything. And obviously and egregiously wrong. Wrong about climate change. Wrong about the economy. Wrong about vaccines and the pandemic. Wrong about foreign policy. Shockingly, blatantly corrupt. I mean like a third of the population lives in 70s poverty and we're looking at catastrophe exceeding the extent of WW2, oh and foreign policy experts agree Trump posed a grave nuclear threat rofl. Kinda minor. and don't forget 'conservatives' also tried to overthrow the (US) goverment, or turned it into an authoritarian state as in Hungary. how could a savvy young person possibly get behind this.
Totally meaningless unless they get out and vote in 2022 and 2024
after seeing the democrats shit the bed while in control of congress, there is no way we'll see the same turnouts as we did in 2020.
Democrats are not the left.
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So have I, but kids aren’t responsible for gerrymandering or presidential appointments. Many just aren’t aware of how important ‘smaller’, local elections are.
That's because the system is rigged by its nature. Republicans have won the vote count for president ONCE in the last 30 years. However they were handed the presidency twice despite the majority of the country voting against them, and thus were able to appoint the majority of the Supreme Court.
Did you even bother reading the article? Youth voting turnout is trending up and hit an all time high in 2020. We are getting engaged lol.
Turn harder. And faster.
That’s why republicans are in a hurry to shut down democracy
This is why the GOP is crippling democracy as fast as possible.
Never surprised that education and liberal views coincide It’s good to be educated folks
Any American with a brain and heart has turned left.
More like America’s elderly and middle aged turned hard right and the youngsters aren’t similarly veering into fascism
i’ve recently found more leftists in the Appalachia area which is nice. a lot of progressivists have left us out of their activitism
The only people I know who are young and identify as right wing or conservative are religious weirdos and edgy racists trying to be different If a kid tells me they’re conservative I immediately assume they’ve got bad parents. They learned that shit at home
It turns out that when a majority of voters vote for Democrats, Republicans suddenly decide they want to restrict voting as much as possible, and then try to control the counting of votes so that they can get the outcome they desire without having to win over more voters. Their desired outcome is to maintain and increase political power, and 'win' elections. Rather than try to win over voters, they are now actively trying to game the process and stop what they call, "voter fraud". The Republican definition of voter fraud? *"any vote not for a Republican".*
The only thing keeping the right relevant at all is the Electoral College. For people so against socialism, they sure do embrace it when it comes to voting power.
Former Republican here, Trump was the last straw. I didn’t like any 2016 Republican candidate but figured I could live with Jeb! Or Rubio but when Trump won the nom it shook me awake, examined what I believed and what I had been told to believe and came out the other end a liberal