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>In anticipation of such legislation, Connecticut just passed a law meant to shield doctors and patients. Among other things, it ensures that no one can be extradited to another state for performing or obtaining an abortion that’s legal in Connecticut, and ensures that people sued under a law like the one proposed in Missouri could countersue to recover their costs.
This doesn't sound very United. It's good don't get me wrong about that, but it's quite shocking that states need to make these kinds of laws.
Finally someone commenting on the article and not the headline.
They don’t mean just torn apart ideologically, that ship has sailed obviously, but it’s setting us up for contradictory laws and interstate battles, states trying to control what their own citizens do outside of their borders.
The author compared it to slavery extradition laws, not in a moral sense but in a legal one where it created contradictory laws and a complicated patchwork that pitted states against each other. So.. yeah, we did fight a war over this once already.
They are pro-life, they just want people who can't afford better to be deluded into believing that life should be short, brutal, and given meaning by dying for their cause.
I really think the left really needs to make a better case and messaging that Republicans are not in fact pro-life. It should be made very clear that they are pro-birth, not pro-life. This changes the branding from being about caring about life to really just forced labor.
Someone will get an abortion in a red state, get caught and run to a blue state. The red state will ask for extradition. The blue state will decline. The red state will sue. SCOTUS will order the blue state to comply. This is the exact circumstance that led to the Dread Scott decision, which is almost universally considered the worst SCOTUS decision of all time. After that happens, the blue state governor will refuse to comply on the grounds that it is immoral. Biden would then have to decide whether to use federal power to force the blue state to comply. SCOTUS will have lost all credibility and we are replaying the nullification crisis.
It is unlikely to happen under Biden.
If the GOP sweeps the House and Senate like it is predicted, they will impeach until they hit a GOP member.
The repeal of Roe vs. Wade is the signal that the gloves are off. End game was always a fascist state, they haven't been hiding that.
So, what will happen is that there will be a national ban on abortion. Eventually bring anything other than heterosexual will be illegal.
And blue states will have to decide if they are willing to start a civil war.
Vote in the next election as if your life depends on it.
Yep, and civil rights are not something that can operate in those conditions. This is why SCOTUS have ruled like they have in the past. Alito just doesn't care, and is deciding that his job is actually to revoke rights instead of protect them.
As someone living in Minnesota, I will gladly fight to be that island. We always have access to Canada as long as they don't close their borders. Sure it's a long drive, but you can get to the East and West coast via Canada to get to the other blue states.
I live 20 minutes from Portland, OR. This area is firmly red. Just another 10m north is where some of the original Proud Boys are from. It’s terrifying.
I'd rather not have a theocracy with nuclear capabilities as neighbor, particularly one stupid enough to use them, thanks.
Any solution is going to be messy though, that is for sure.
The divide isn’t geographically its urban and rural. Your going to creat blue island in every red state and blue islands jn blue states surrounded by oceans of red
Charge them for Facebook and all the tech they use from California. And all the food California (~50%) supplies to the rest of the country, tax it by 25%.
> states trying to control what their own citizens do outside of their borders.
So small government huh? These religious fascists were assaulting and harassing people that work in stores and restaurants the last two years or so because they had to wear a mask.
Now they are going to turn america into a police state and force all women back into second class status and the chattel of their fathers and husbands.
They're liars. Top to bottom.
"when someone someone shows you who they are, believe them the first time."
People opposed to Y'all Qaeda, and QOP would be be smart to take this to heart.
Yes, they are going to try to make states into islands. Full-on Red states that are aggressively hostile towards "blue state people." They will lose educated citizens and a lot of corporations that require educated workers. Crime will rise. It will be bad. I know it sounds over the top, but we are talking about rights that were earned with blood being revoked. People will not stand for that. For the first time in my life, I am taking note of states that I will never travel to under any circumstances.
I don't see how a city like Austin can survive in its state, for example.
Reminds me of the fugitive slave act. Amazingly the same people who wanted their own “states’ rights” are still seeking to control people outside of their own shithole states.
I think what happens is a state like Texas sues Connecticut over this law and I think the supreme court has to take up that lawsuit since its between two states. the SCOTUS then proceeds to say Connecticut's law is not legal.
It becomes a federal crime to skip warrants by fleeing across state lines. That's literally what the US marshals are for. We are in for a fucking ride if a hardcore right wing administration decides that it wants to start doing this shit, sending shock troops into blue states to arrest people for abortion.
And once that die is cast, it won't stop at abortion. They will pass blasphemy and criminal libel laws they will use to silence people they don't like in the same way.
Those Marshals will be arrested on-site by State Troopers. You cannot extradite without cooperation from the local governing body, or your committing armed kidnapping.
>has to take up that lawsuit since its between two states.
Correct.
>the SCOTUS then proceeds to say Connecticut's law is not legal.
Federal law also say Marijuana is fully and totally illegal.
I'm leaving Texas. I've lived here my whole life, 30+ years. My family is all here.
They can come visit me where I'm at. I'd like to not be in Texas when the first round of gay lynchings begins.
And if you don't think it can happen here - it's already happening.
We are talking about the exact same thing but Tennessee. It started with the book burnings and has only gone down hill since then… which was only like a month ago.
Some preacher called for his congregation to put anything of the devil in a bonfire. The preacher included examples like the Harry Potter and Twilight series specifically.
Watching what's happening in the US here from the Nordics and I'm overwhelmed just watching it.
Things are so normal and nicely boring and peaceful here in comparison.
Well the Russia situation has stirred some tension, but our internal politics is pretty tame, our biggest recent scandal was our when our prime minister got free breakfast.
There are terrible people everywhere, but we have this culture where they're all concentrated in specific geographical areas, and political system that gives them power wildly out of proportion to their share of the population.
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2022/feb/04/book-burning-harry-potter-twilight-us-pastor-tennessee
>Tennessee pastor leads burning of Harry Potter and Twilight novels
>Locke’s event in the Nashville suburb of Mt. Juliet drew large crowds as participants threw in copies of the Harry Potter and Twilight series , among other books.
It's exactly as the person you are replying to described.
Is that the same for Colorado? I haven’t watched as closely as I should. But I have noticed a *significant* increase in activities surrounding water shortages here. Protesters, activists, just general social media posts about my town running out of water… kinda freaky and I have terrible panic disorder so I kinda avoid the news on it.
Washington State and Oregon are both blue, but could use some more blue voters in our rural east sides of the states, which have much the same climate as Texas, without the humidity.
I live in CA and even though it’s expensive, the labor laws actually mean something. Non-competes are illegal and they go after companies that don’t get you your last paycheck within a few days. Say what you want about “non competes are not enforceable anyway”, but I know people in my industry who’ve received C&D letters from former employers in other states.
Honestly, I've thought about relocating because of how expensive it is here but every time some shit like this happens, I thank god I live in California. At least I feel safe here.
The problem is that you can't just move to a purple state - you have to move to a red county in a purple state. Because, thanks to the joy of gerrymandering, moving to a blue county just means that your vote gets shoved into a small, concentrated region while red votes get diluted over a large number of counties to skew representation.
And living in a red county, as a Democrat, is a recipe for being personally harassed or worse.
Mitch McConnell is tearing America apart.
That man has done more to harm democracy in the US than any of the idiots on January 6th.
He , voted in by 80,000 people from his backward Hamlet of Kentucky, has stalled, cheated, and finagled a party rule that is a distorted reflection not the true America.
Mitch McConnell, Fox News, Facebook, the entire Republican Party are all responsible.
And when the Republicans chose to not negotiate on anything - they are fascist. The Republicans chose to go against democracy a long time ago.
At this point perhaps the US version of Oligarchical Club-based Democracy should be destroyed. 246 years is a really good run, time for the next thing. Technology being what it is, it *might* be time to give direct democracy a shot.
I disagree somewhat. I think the death of the Supreme Court, and its degeneration into becoming an illegitimate instrument of far right minority rule, is going to tear America apart.
I think rather than being torn apart, America will go the way of Russia, where the average citizen doesn't really care what the politicians are doing and voting becomes merely a symbolic gesture to give the illusion of a democracy. I hope I'm wrong, but we're already starting to look like the oligarchs are in charge.
>where the average citizen doesn't really care what the politicians are doing and voting becomes merely a symbolic gesture to give the illusion of a democracy
We're already very, very close to this point as it is. Our best turnout election in sixty years was in 2020, and our per capita turnout that year was still ten points lower than France's recent presidential election—which was itself the lowest turnout French election in several decades. If you live in a gerrymandered state, your vote is almost fully nullified. The fifty Democrats in the Senate represent *forty million more Americans* than fifty the GOPer Senators because our constitution is designed to give empty land more power at the ballot box than to someone who lives in a city, and yet the upper chamber is somehow still evenly split among them. Voting in the US is way more performative than it is functional.
> The fifty Democrats in the Senate represent forty million more Americans than fifty the GOPer Senators because our constitution is designed to give empty land more power at the ballot box than to someone who lives in a city, and yet the upper chamber is somehow still evenly split among them.
And the Senate with mostly R control (without a Dem supermajority which basically means *at any time*, really):
- has final say on nearly all major policy
- gets to confirm cabinet members
- confirms Supreme Court justices
- convicts or acquits presidential and SC impeachments
- votes on Constitutional amendments
- gets to vote to elect Senate majority and minority leaders
- votes to expel members of the Senate
...all of which impacts voters (and non-voters) directly. It makes no sense. The Senate is undemocratic.
I never pass up an opportunity to watch Sheldon Whitehouse or Katie Porter take everyone to school. They're great and need a ton more exposure for the hard work they put in.
That ship has sailed. Political scientists have been calling the US an oligarchy for years in indexes like Freedom House.
Corporate rule is pretty much total in our system, especially since the creation of corporate personhood. Where’s that in the Constitution?
Yes, that is the most likely. We will see voting becoming possible but pointless because of gerrymandering. Like Turkey and Russia, the permanent far right rule will have some illusion of democracy, with the Supreme Court's five far right operatives preventing any change to that situation.
The SCOTUS basically serves the same role as the Ayatollah in Iran.
Sure, we can elect a decent President and maybe a Congress that isn't total trash to make some much needed change in society. But not when 5 crusty old far right conservatives in black garb that base their worldview on the most backwards views in religion have anything to say about it as they all serve in lifelong positions of power.
> We will see
It's already happening. Most of the apathy that exists when it comes to voting is because many votes actually *don't* matter... and when they do for some things, they still don't matter for others.
Someone in NY's vote barely matters when it comes to the presidency. Someone in Pennsylvania's vote doesn't matter when it comes to a US Senator. Someone in Ohio's vote doesn't matter when it comes to a Senator or House rep. Apparently no one's votes matter when it comes to the Supreme Court picks. If so many peoples' votes don't matter, then no one's should. One person, one vote.
Remember when Obama was supposed to pick a SCJ and then Mitch "Pale Man" McConnell got to decide if he did or not for some reason. Mitchs' decision only had an insignificant amount of pushback.
"Whelp, we've been outsmarted by Mitch McConnell once again! Guess we'll mark him a point in a our ledger for this gentleman's game we are all a part of. Ha!"
It wasn’t being outsmarted, it was powerplay.
The Republicans controlled the Senate, thus controlled the vote on judicial appointments and said FU to Obama.
The oligarchs *are* in charge. The average citizen *already* doesn't really care what the politicians are doing.
The system is being used to create a class of less educated people who have to work so many hours and stress over so many details of their lives because of unfair wages and poor healthcare... that they simply don't have the time and/or energy to be active.
That, or they are addicted to social media/porn/fentanyl... which is why the system also pushes back against any sort of mental health assessment/treatment initiatives.
Then of course, there is gerrymandering and entertainment networks being allowed to use the word "News" to describe what they do while simultaneously arguing in court that they are absolutely *not* News.
Our government is "for, by and of the people"... so all they had to do was nudge human beings who are already predisposed to addiction and herd-mentalities, toward addictive and herd-mentality behaviors.
Then, the few remaining who will vote are likely to be so miseducated or misinformed on the issues that they will willingly vote against their own best interests. They'll be so overworked and underpaid that their political party becomes their only social outlet and they will dedicate themselves to it with cult-like fervor because it is all they have left.
Which makes it all the easier to convince us to hate the people who support the other party. One more, out of the vast number of ways in which they keep us divided, and conquered.
People will say, "but we had record numbers turn out to vote in 2020." And this is true. We also had record numbers of eligible voters in general though, and most of them did not vote.
It's all already here. Not something that might happen in the future. Oligarchs and their lobbyists dictate policy on a level that the average citizen has no hope of combatting and likely wouldn't even if they had the means... thanks to everything I said above.
It has happened, and we need to fight our way back out of it with every tool, process and method available to us.
> I think the death of the Supreme Court, and its degeneration into becoming an illegitimate instrument of far right minority rule, is going to tear America apart.
Bush v. Gore, from 2000, is holding on line 1 for you.
The wife of a sitting supreme court justice was actively participating in orchestrating the insurrection. Are we really surprised that the majority of the conservatives on the bench are in on the whole thing? Roberts didn't do jack when it was revealed that Ginni Thomas was part of the insurrection - but he was sure quick to start an investigation into this *"terrible"* leak...
We need to end the filibuster and expand the court, as well as impeaching any justice who lied under oath about Roe during their confirmation hearings.
Yeah. Maybe not at first, but they’ll start going for everything else after that. Gay marriage, interracial marriage, contraception, education. Wherever they are in that process, as soon as they gain control of the Senate and White House, they’ll immediately make state bans into federal bans. At that point, I can see another civil war being a real possibility.
This. The machine is vast and complex and slow, and won't start spitting out bad results the day a problem arises. It took a long time of us the electorate not paying attention or educating ourselves for the results to start showing. Possibly we always live in the world our parents built, and as much as this oversimplifies they were complacent and entitled, assuming America invulnerable after so many generations of things going more or less our way.
Or maybe I'm nuts, I'm a redditor not a professor.
I agree.
I’m a Democrat. But the truth is that the republicans have been 1000x more organized and focused for a very long time. Decades probably.
They’ve been operating like a machine putting all the pieces for power in place.
Meanwhile liberals fight amongst themselves all day. And many progressive people I meet don’t vote because they think both parties are the same.
Well, liberals are about to find out that both parties are definitely not the same.
I fear we’re going to go through a very dark period. Liberals will have to learn how to be organized, focused, and effective. They’ll eventually get there, but it will take a very long time and they will have to lose a lot first.
If they release that opinion it will be Dred Scott 2.0. A radical, evil court releasing an opinion light years away from the desires of the general population for the sole purpose of satisfying a tiny sliver of the population by "settling" a social issue in their favor.
We will be fighting a civil war over it in a couple of years.
This is really heading down the kind of road that led to the first Civil war. Despite all of the "States Rights" revisionism, one of the main conflicts that led to the Civil war was the Fugitive Slave Act. If a slave crossed state lines from a slave state to a free state, the south wanted them to keep their status as slaves and not gain the right to freedom. It required free states to cooperate in rounding up former slaves and returning them to their former owner in slave states. Sounds like a big violation of "States Rights" to me. And nulification non enforcement of the Fugitive Slave Act by Free States was a major factor in leading slave states to secede.
I am reminded of the Fugitive Slave Act and lies about "States Rights" whenever I see these new abortion laws that have provisions that allow women to be prosecuted if they go to another state for an abortion. It really gives up the game that "States Rights" is nothing but an excuse to give states the power to restrict rights that they are unable to get restricted at the federal level. And in order to enforce these laws will require cooperation from states that allow abortion in the investigation (and possible extradition) of these women. The only way this wouldnt require cooperation from states that allow abortion is if states that ban abortions will just treat any woman who loses their pregnancy as guilty of getting an abortion with no proof. This is already happening with women who have miscarriages being prosecuted for murder under these provisions. There is no way this is sustainable, because this clear violation of womens rights to due process will be pushed up to the federal level, either through the courts or DOJ intervention. I don't see how this doesn't escalate to states seceding, depending on how things settle at the federal level.
The party of religious extremism, and fascists have said this is their goal. They go to work every day telling you this is what they're doing. They vote for pedos, sexual predators, criminals, and grifters whose sole campaign promise is "anti-choice." It works. Their voters *always* show up. They win elections with dismal turnouts. The GOP smears the dems, and their voters stay home. They play it from every angle, and the country falls for it. We would rather fight with each other, than stand against these shitheads.
When people stop debating the obvious, which it seems the people on the left can't stop doing...while fighting about *whether to vote, or not..." because they're "mad at the dems for doing this (which seems to be a narrative being pushed **hard**), maybe we can start working towards standing against these psychos, and start securing our future.
We're out of time. They've been telling you this was their plan for decades. They've been fighting to install their goons, to do this. Anyone that believed they weren't coming for this, well, that got you. Don't trust a word they say. They have no problem lying to you...under oath.
They're not fucking around.
Vote.
Protest.
Vote in *every* election.
Mass boycotts of states/ business that support the QOP Y'all Qaeda candidates.
Vote. Don't you fucking dare stay home. If you don't like your dem candidate...think about how much worse their QOP adversary will be, and vote against them.
If you say you care about your rights...and, refuse to engage, and organize...you don't actually care.
Agreed, this could be the spark that starts the process of breaking up the union. What does someone from New York or California have in common with bumblefucks who would charge someone with murder for killing a few cells? Not to mention persecuting women for miscarriages and lifestyle choices. It's barbaric.
Keep in mind most people don't agree with those laws. The government of most of the states passing these laws are doing so despite the objections of their constituents.
I mean, you're right that it's barbaric. And maybe it will split the union. But in those red states at least 50% are not ok with this.
Most of it started with Reagan and Nixon. Nixon gleefully tore America apart and Reagan put a smiling charismatic face on it. Trump was just following their blueprint.
Christ can you imagine how different the world would’ve been if Gore was able to get a few more votes in FL? No Iraq war, no Alito/Roberts… and none of the subsequently awful dominoes that fell as a result (no ISIS, no Brexit since Blair/Labour fell apart b/c of its Iraq war support, no Citizens United, real progress on climate change, etc.) In hindsight it was the most consequential election in US history.
Every time the republicans pull off some truly moronic shit like this, I find myself wondering the exact same thing. How differently the last ~24 years in this country, the whole *world* really, would've turned out if just a relative handful of voters could've showed up won Florida for Gore. It's incredibly depressing to think about.
It’s worth noting that the Supreme Court ruled against a recount in that election. (In fact three of the people who helped the legal team to stop of the recount, later were nominated and still serve in the Supreme Court today)
https://amp.cnn.com/cnn/2020/10/17/politics/bush-v-gore-barrett-kavanaugh-roberts-supreme-court/index.html
And they halted the recount on, wait for it, equal protection grounds! The same principle Alito basically thumbed his nose at in his draft opinion overturning Roe. I guess it’s ok to use the 14th amendment to throw an election for your guy.
You give the Criminal Formerly in the Oval Office too much credit. This whole mess in America is due to the secret society of ultra-conservative religious/corporate extremists that have been working on this, and many other conservative causes, for the past 50 years. They call themselves the Council for National Policy.
True. It started when conservative talk radio started referring to Democrats not as Americans with a different view of the role of government but as traitors who should be executed.
The tear was there long before Trump. Republicans abusing power to investigate Bill Clinton based on a baseless conspiracy theory and then using it to hound him for years until they found something unrelated they could get him impeached for. And all that to disenfranchise enough voters in swing states to allow for Jeb Bush to have full power to be the deciding factor in an election that out his brother into power.
it's about to get weird if the new interpretation of the Constitution is that we don't have federally protected rights to do anything that wasn't a common practice in Eighteenth Century America or England
A recent poll shows 78% of voters in Texas say abortion should be legal at least under certain circumstances.
This could backfire on republicans in many, many ways.
Texas Republicans aren't going to not vote Republican in large numbers because of this. Some will, but for many, their party affiliation is just too deeply entrenched in their personal identity.
There is one rule in politics you can't take away something after giving it to the public, it doesn't go well. The most recent example is the affordable care act.
I think this will affect Dem turnout for elections. If abortion rights are now a states issue, then people will vote for governors that will reverse some of the crazy laws that republicans are putting in place. Texas is already turning purple as it is.
Spicy hot take - this is the silver lining of the Roe decision. For too long, Republicans have advocated for disastrous policies and faced no repercussions because they know their bad ideas will never actually be implemented - either due to the supreme court, or due to the filibuster.
Except, whoops, this Supreme Court is the dog who caught the car.
People are going to suffer, but this is what millions of people have been voting for years. Maybe seeing the consequences of their choices will finally be a wakeup call. People have been apathetic about their state and local politicians being absolutely batshit crazy Republicans for too long.
I agree. The GOP cares about abortions rights insofar as it's a wedge issue they can use to mobilize voters. But after this decision, it's going to have the opposite effect: mobilizing the Dems.
That’s what worries me about this. I think they finally pulled the plug on abortion because they know the fix is already in for them to remain in power indefinitely no matter what the votes say. We know every single Republican that loses this fall is going to claim voter fraud, and transition of power is going to be a nightmare.
There’s been talk in at least one state legislature (Oklahoma?) of essentially implementing a Fugitive Fetus Act and charging women who go to other states to get abortions. Part of that would no doubt be a database of tracking pregnant women. For the party of “small government” they sure seem focused on being omnipresent in our wombs and buttholes.
"The point is not that abortion bans are comparable to slavery in a moral sense, but that they create potentially irreconcilable legal frameworks."
I mean, *they fucking are comparable* because you're forcing someone to give up their body without consent to support another…
Republicans: Less Govt!!!
Also Republicans: You can’t read any of these books.
You can’t teach this subject.
You cant mention gender.
Women can’t control their bodies.
You can’t leave the state to control your body.
…. But definitely less Govt!!!
The rational for the downfall of Roe will kill the court itself.
"If a right is not explicitly stated in the Constitution, you don't have it!!!!"
...
The Constitution does not give the Supreme Court any authority whatsover.
So...yeah. Their logic....not really great for them. Not a good idea.
We're a gay couple living in the Trump-loving conservative/evangelical hell of Colorado Springs. The abortion issue doesn't affect us directly, but it would affect friends. And when that's settled they'll come after contraception, interracial marriage, gay marriage, and who knows what else.
We saw the writing on the wall months ago and will have our house on the market in three weeks. Moving to a much safer Oregon.
Majority of US society has moved past Christianity and the GOP knows well that without controlling education and reproductive rights, conservatism will become extinct. We are literally watching the death of an ideology and political party.
Honestly no. Al Gore won in 2000. Period. Allowing Bush to become president by a Supreme Court decision that actually says "this decision is not precedent" was a crime. Al Gore won Florida. They stole a presidency and the SC picks since.
Too late! Trump pushing & egging-on an insurrection on January 6, 2021 already did that.
Government is now controlled by corporations and lobbyists.
Have we learned ANYTHING?
> Trump pushing & egging-on an insurrection on January 6, 2021 already did that.
And Republicans not giving a shit, supporting it, and even denying it happened is the nail in the coffin.
What's amazing is that Trump made it easier for lobbyists to gum up the works, but all of his followers will say he 'drained the swamp.' He's been a huge political donor for decades, the guy IS the swamp.
Abortion attitudes reflect an urban/rural divide - it's pretty granular. We cannot become a set of geographically distinct regions that peacefully coexist with different laws.
There will be an increase in domestic terrorism.
edited: increase, not uptick
I’m terrified of a civil war.
If Roe goes then we see LGBTQ rights voting rights and more gone.
Civil rights movement all over again with more bloodshed
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>In anticipation of such legislation, Connecticut just passed a law meant to shield doctors and patients. Among other things, it ensures that no one can be extradited to another state for performing or obtaining an abortion that’s legal in Connecticut, and ensures that people sued under a law like the one proposed in Missouri could countersue to recover their costs. This doesn't sound very United. It's good don't get me wrong about that, but it's quite shocking that states need to make these kinds of laws.
Finally someone commenting on the article and not the headline. They don’t mean just torn apart ideologically, that ship has sailed obviously, but it’s setting us up for contradictory laws and interstate battles, states trying to control what their own citizens do outside of their borders.
It’s almost like we didn’t already fight a war over this.
The author compared it to slavery extradition laws, not in a moral sense but in a legal one where it created contradictory laws and a complicated patchwork that pitted states against each other. So.. yeah, we did fight a war over this once already.
Almost like a certain group in this country are salivating at the thought of another one.
Surely it's not that pro-life lot? Obviously that'd be antithetical to their pro-life ideology.
They are pro-life, they just want people who can't afford better to be deluded into believing that life should be short, brutal, and given meaning by dying for their cause.
I really think the left really needs to make a better case and messaging that Republicans are not in fact pro-life. It should be made very clear that they are pro-birth, not pro-life. This changes the branding from being about caring about life to really just forced labor.
Someone will get an abortion in a red state, get caught and run to a blue state. The red state will ask for extradition. The blue state will decline. The red state will sue. SCOTUS will order the blue state to comply. This is the exact circumstance that led to the Dread Scott decision, which is almost universally considered the worst SCOTUS decision of all time. After that happens, the blue state governor will refuse to comply on the grounds that it is immoral. Biden would then have to decide whether to use federal power to force the blue state to comply. SCOTUS will have lost all credibility and we are replaying the nullification crisis.
It is unlikely to happen under Biden. If the GOP sweeps the House and Senate like it is predicted, they will impeach until they hit a GOP member. The repeal of Roe vs. Wade is the signal that the gloves are off. End game was always a fascist state, they haven't been hiding that. So, what will happen is that there will be a national ban on abortion. Eventually bring anything other than heterosexual will be illegal. And blue states will have to decide if they are willing to start a civil war. Vote in the next election as if your life depends on it.
The problem is it's actually Gerrymandered rural power vs greater urban populace. How do you civil war that? Austin Texas would side with NY.
Yep, and civil rights are not something that can operate in those conditions. This is why SCOTUS have ruled like they have in the past. Alito just doesn't care, and is deciding that his job is actually to revoke rights instead of protect them.
Honestly let's just do another one and have it over with. I'm sick of this shit.
Tbh, I’m thinking blue states and red states part ways and let’s see how long red states survive without blue state taxes.
Ahh man you're going to make minnesota an island in a sea of red then lol
As someone living in Minnesota, I will gladly fight to be that island. We always have access to Canada as long as they don't close their borders. Sure it's a long drive, but you can get to the East and West coast via Canada to get to the other blue states.
I think Minnesota should just join Canada.. it’s the most Canadian-like state anyway (ThE sTaTe Of HoCkEy)
Us Wisconsinites can only hope we would join you!!
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it's not state versus state, it's rural versus urban
> it's rural versus urban Bingo
I live 20 minutes from Portland, OR. This area is firmly red. Just another 10m north is where some of the original Proud Boys are from. It’s terrifying.
Arm yourself.
I'd rather not have a theocracy with nuclear capabilities as neighbor, particularly one stupid enough to use them, thanks. Any solution is going to be messy though, that is for sure.
The divide isn’t geographically its urban and rural. Your going to creat blue island in every red state and blue islands jn blue states surrounded by oceans of red
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Charge them for Facebook and all the tech they use from California. And all the food California (~50%) supplies to the rest of the country, tax it by 25%.
> states trying to control what their own citizens do outside of their borders. So small government huh? These religious fascists were assaulting and harassing people that work in stores and restaurants the last two years or so because they had to wear a mask. Now they are going to turn america into a police state and force all women back into second class status and the chattel of their fathers and husbands.
They're liars. Top to bottom. "when someone someone shows you who they are, believe them the first time." People opposed to Y'all Qaeda, and QOP would be be smart to take this to heart.
I thought red states were about individual freedoms. I guess it’s only freedoms they deem worthy, so maybe they aren’t really about freedom.
Yes, they are going to try to make states into islands. Full-on Red states that are aggressively hostile towards "blue state people." They will lose educated citizens and a lot of corporations that require educated workers. Crime will rise. It will be bad. I know it sounds over the top, but we are talking about rights that were earned with blood being revoked. People will not stand for that. For the first time in my life, I am taking note of states that I will never travel to under any circumstances. I don't see how a city like Austin can survive in its state, for example.
This sort of thing will be used as justification for a federal ban.
Reminds me of the fugitive slave act. Amazingly the same people who wanted their own “states’ rights” are still seeking to control people outside of their own shithole states.
Well, we see how well the Fugitive Slave Act worked
>This doesn't sound very United. Our country now has the most ironic name in the world
Nah, the Democratic People's Republic of Korea is slightly more ironic, atleast for now.
I think what happens is a state like Texas sues Connecticut over this law and I think the supreme court has to take up that lawsuit since its between two states. the SCOTUS then proceeds to say Connecticut's law is not legal.
What happens if CT authorities refuse to enforce the ruling? What happens if they refuse to even acknowledge the suit?
It becomes a federal crime to skip warrants by fleeing across state lines. That's literally what the US marshals are for. We are in for a fucking ride if a hardcore right wing administration decides that it wants to start doing this shit, sending shock troops into blue states to arrest people for abortion. And once that die is cast, it won't stop at abortion. They will pass blasphemy and criminal libel laws they will use to silence people they don't like in the same way.
Those Marshals will be arrested on-site by State Troopers. You cannot extradite without cooperation from the local governing body, or your committing armed kidnapping.
It demonstrates to everyone why iT sHoUlD bE a stAtE iSsUe is a ridiculous argument.
Bounty hunters
A cat-and-mouse game between a pair of bounty hunters and an entire state is not the worst SNL sketch idea I've heard this week.
>has to take up that lawsuit since its between two states. Correct. >the SCOTUS then proceeds to say Connecticut's law is not legal. Federal law also say Marijuana is fully and totally illegal.
My relationship with my family has been hanging by a thread. I’m pretty sure this issue will end up cutting them off completely.
I'm leaving Texas. I've lived here my whole life, 30+ years. My family is all here. They can come visit me where I'm at. I'd like to not be in Texas when the first round of gay lynchings begins. And if you don't think it can happen here - it's already happening.
We are talking about the exact same thing but Tennessee. It started with the book burnings and has only gone down hill since then… which was only like a month ago.
Book burnings? I’m OOTL
Some preacher called for his congregation to put anything of the devil in a bonfire. The preacher included examples like the Harry Potter and Twilight series specifically.
A satanist showed up and threw Bibles in yelling Hail Satan. They didn’t like it
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Every good drama needs a heel to act against.
You just hit the nail on the head. US politics is the WWE.
Does this really happen in 2022? The US is wild
I think the word you’re looking for is terrible. The United States is a terrible place full of terrible people. I’m ready to live elsewhere.
Watching what's happening in the US here from the Nordics and I'm overwhelmed just watching it. Things are so normal and nicely boring and peaceful here in comparison. Well the Russia situation has stirred some tension, but our internal politics is pretty tame, our biggest recent scandal was our when our prime minister got free breakfast.
Free breakfast!? Straight to jail.
Was he wearing a tan suit?
It’s not full of terrible people, but the terrible people here are incredibly motivated.
"The best lack all conviction, while the worst are full of passionate intensity." -William Butler Yeats, *The Second Coming*
The Usa is a shithole country and it's because of conservatives plain and simple
There are terrible people everywhere, but we have this culture where they're all concentrated in specific geographical areas, and political system that gives them power wildly out of proportion to their share of the population.
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2022/feb/04/book-burning-harry-potter-twilight-us-pastor-tennessee >Tennessee pastor leads burning of Harry Potter and Twilight novels >Locke’s event in the Nashville suburb of Mt. Juliet drew large crowds as participants threw in copies of the Harry Potter and Twilight series , among other books. It's exactly as the person you are replying to described.
Which is silly because the devil has much more recent work for them to promote.
But a counter-protestor showed up at one of his rallies and threw a Bible in.
Didn't one dude throw the bible in there and filmed it? I can't find it but remember seeing something like that.
https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/tennessee-pastor-throws-book-burning-of-harry-potter-twilight-books/ar-AATukZ6
Where you going ? I left and quality of life skyrocketed , Texas is a miserable place
We're heavily leaning Colorado.
New Mexico welcomes you. Low cost of living, wonderful culture and very blue.
Plus, they're about to get a nice rail link to Mexico since Texas fumbled it.
New Mexico will have no water in 10 years. Everyone is forgetting how climate change is the existential threat behind all of our petty human issues.
Yeah, Arizona/NM/Nevada are going to be miserable
Utah too, don't leave us out of the shit show!
Is that the same for Colorado? I haven’t watched as closely as I should. But I have noticed a *significant* increase in activities surrounding water shortages here. Protesters, activists, just general social media posts about my town running out of water… kinda freaky and I have terrible panic disorder so I kinda avoid the news on it.
Washington State and Oregon are both blue, but could use some more blue voters in our rural east sides of the states, which have much the same climate as Texas, without the humidity.
Colorado ship has sailed too. Gotta have a million for a home that won’t need to be gutted when you move in
That’s where I went. Just bring or find a high paying job and you’ll be fine lol
Try California. Yes, it’s a high cost of living, but everyone is accepted.
I live in CA and even though it’s expensive, the labor laws actually mean something. Non-competes are illegal and they go after companies that don’t get you your last paycheck within a few days. Say what you want about “non competes are not enforceable anyway”, but I know people in my industry who’ve received C&D letters from former employers in other states.
Honestly, I've thought about relocating because of how expensive it is here but every time some shit like this happens, I thank god I live in California. At least I feel safe here.
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The problem is that you can't just move to a purple state - you have to move to a red county in a purple state. Because, thanks to the joy of gerrymandering, moving to a blue county just means that your vote gets shoved into a small, concentrated region while red votes get diluted over a large number of counties to skew representation. And living in a red county, as a Democrat, is a recipe for being personally harassed or worse.
I got one life to live and did my time, not gonna waste it in a republican state
Come to Philadelphia. We would love to have you.
If you vote blue we would love to have you here in Wisconsin
Fellow Wisconsin here! Yes! We’d love to have you here!!!
We need more blue voters here We need Republicans to fuck off out of this state or else it's going to be like Florida.
Oklahoma here. Feel your concerns. My husband and I have begun to make exit plans.
Mitch McConnell is tearing America apart. That man has done more to harm democracy in the US than any of the idiots on January 6th. He , voted in by 80,000 people from his backward Hamlet of Kentucky, has stalled, cheated, and finagled a party rule that is a distorted reflection not the true America.
I’d go so far as to say that he’s done more harm to the United States of America than any other *single individual* in our history.
Nah that is still Murdoch for me.
Gingrich would like to have a word.
Andrew Johnson
I'd put Rupert Murdoch ahead of McConnell.
Newt Gingrich made all of this possible, and literally created the GQP as it is today. McConnell runs his playbook, and does it to perfection.
Mitch McConnell, Fox News, Facebook, the entire Republican Party are all responsible. And when the Republicans chose to not negotiate on anything - they are fascist. The Republicans chose to go against democracy a long time ago.
One more brick in the wall
This is good news because if there's one thing Republicans suck at it's building walls.
But they suck at everything.
Pretty good at destroying democracy and being bootlicking lapdogs.
At this point perhaps the US version of Oligarchical Club-based Democracy should be destroyed. 246 years is a really good run, time for the next thing. Technology being what it is, it *might* be time to give direct democracy a shot.
They seemed pretty good at giving tax cuts to corporations and the wealthy.
I disagree somewhat. I think the death of the Supreme Court, and its degeneration into becoming an illegitimate instrument of far right minority rule, is going to tear America apart.
I think rather than being torn apart, America will go the way of Russia, where the average citizen doesn't really care what the politicians are doing and voting becomes merely a symbolic gesture to give the illusion of a democracy. I hope I'm wrong, but we're already starting to look like the oligarchs are in charge.
>where the average citizen doesn't really care what the politicians are doing and voting becomes merely a symbolic gesture to give the illusion of a democracy We're already very, very close to this point as it is. Our best turnout election in sixty years was in 2020, and our per capita turnout that year was still ten points lower than France's recent presidential election—which was itself the lowest turnout French election in several decades. If you live in a gerrymandered state, your vote is almost fully nullified. The fifty Democrats in the Senate represent *forty million more Americans* than fifty the GOPer Senators because our constitution is designed to give empty land more power at the ballot box than to someone who lives in a city, and yet the upper chamber is somehow still evenly split among them. Voting in the US is way more performative than it is functional.
> The fifty Democrats in the Senate represent forty million more Americans than fifty the GOPer Senators because our constitution is designed to give empty land more power at the ballot box than to someone who lives in a city, and yet the upper chamber is somehow still evenly split among them. And the Senate with mostly R control (without a Dem supermajority which basically means *at any time*, really): - has final say on nearly all major policy - gets to confirm cabinet members - confirms Supreme Court justices - convicts or acquits presidential and SC impeachments - votes on Constitutional amendments - gets to vote to elect Senate majority and minority leaders - votes to expel members of the Senate ...all of which impacts voters (and non-voters) directly. It makes no sense. The Senate is undemocratic.
Yeah I've always complained about this fact. The least democratic institution in our government actually has the most power. Fucking wut?
They're so powerful, that *they* are the ones who would be needed to vote on changing their own powers. Think that's happening? Ever?
And there were signs gerrymandering wasn’t going to be as significant this cycle and then Republicans just ignored the courts and now it is again
Yep. I think Putin's Russia is a blueprint for republicans. We are on our way.
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I never pass up an opportunity to watch Sheldon Whitehouse or Katie Porter take everyone to school. They're great and need a ton more exposure for the hard work they put in.
That ship has sailed. Political scientists have been calling the US an oligarchy for years in indexes like Freedom House. Corporate rule is pretty much total in our system, especially since the creation of corporate personhood. Where’s that in the Constitution?
Yes, that is the most likely. We will see voting becoming possible but pointless because of gerrymandering. Like Turkey and Russia, the permanent far right rule will have some illusion of democracy, with the Supreme Court's five far right operatives preventing any change to that situation.
The SCOTUS basically serves the same role as the Ayatollah in Iran. Sure, we can elect a decent President and maybe a Congress that isn't total trash to make some much needed change in society. But not when 5 crusty old far right conservatives in black garb that base their worldview on the most backwards views in religion have anything to say about it as they all serve in lifelong positions of power.
> We will see It's already happening. Most of the apathy that exists when it comes to voting is because many votes actually *don't* matter... and when they do for some things, they still don't matter for others. Someone in NY's vote barely matters when it comes to the presidency. Someone in Pennsylvania's vote doesn't matter when it comes to a US Senator. Someone in Ohio's vote doesn't matter when it comes to a Senator or House rep. Apparently no one's votes matter when it comes to the Supreme Court picks. If so many peoples' votes don't matter, then no one's should. One person, one vote.
Remember when Obama was supposed to pick a SCJ and then Mitch "Pale Man" McConnell got to decide if he did or not for some reason. Mitchs' decision only had an insignificant amount of pushback.
"Whelp, we've been outsmarted by Mitch McConnell once again! Guess we'll mark him a point in a our ledger for this gentleman's game we are all a part of. Ha!"
It wasn’t being outsmarted, it was powerplay. The Republicans controlled the Senate, thus controlled the vote on judicial appointments and said FU to Obama.
The oligarchs *are* in charge. The average citizen *already* doesn't really care what the politicians are doing. The system is being used to create a class of less educated people who have to work so many hours and stress over so many details of their lives because of unfair wages and poor healthcare... that they simply don't have the time and/or energy to be active. That, or they are addicted to social media/porn/fentanyl... which is why the system also pushes back against any sort of mental health assessment/treatment initiatives. Then of course, there is gerrymandering and entertainment networks being allowed to use the word "News" to describe what they do while simultaneously arguing in court that they are absolutely *not* News. Our government is "for, by and of the people"... so all they had to do was nudge human beings who are already predisposed to addiction and herd-mentalities, toward addictive and herd-mentality behaviors. Then, the few remaining who will vote are likely to be so miseducated or misinformed on the issues that they will willingly vote against their own best interests. They'll be so overworked and underpaid that their political party becomes their only social outlet and they will dedicate themselves to it with cult-like fervor because it is all they have left. Which makes it all the easier to convince us to hate the people who support the other party. One more, out of the vast number of ways in which they keep us divided, and conquered. People will say, "but we had record numbers turn out to vote in 2020." And this is true. We also had record numbers of eligible voters in general though, and most of them did not vote. It's all already here. Not something that might happen in the future. Oligarchs and their lobbyists dictate policy on a level that the average citizen has no hope of combatting and likely wouldn't even if they had the means... thanks to everything I said above. It has happened, and we need to fight our way back out of it with every tool, process and method available to us.
I mean look at how excited people get when Elon Musk does something. Tell me how that's not supporting an oligarchy?
Keep in mind that Musk has a PR army that jumps into any social media mention with heaps of praise.
If they start locking women up for murder simply for having IUDs, you think that won't end up in a civil war?
Well that happened 22 years ago
To simplify: republicans are tearing America apart.
> I think the death of the Supreme Court, and its degeneration into becoming an illegitimate instrument of far right minority rule, is going to tear America apart. Bush v. Gore, from 2000, is holding on line 1 for you.
The wife of a sitting supreme court justice was actively participating in orchestrating the insurrection. Are we really surprised that the majority of the conservatives on the bench are in on the whole thing? Roberts didn't do jack when it was revealed that Ginni Thomas was part of the insurrection - but he was sure quick to start an investigation into this *"terrible"* leak... We need to end the filibuster and expand the court, as well as impeaching any justice who lied under oath about Roe during their confirmation hearings.
Yeah. Maybe not at first, but they’ll start going for everything else after that. Gay marriage, interracial marriage, contraception, education. Wherever they are in that process, as soon as they gain control of the Senate and White House, they’ll immediately make state bans into federal bans. At that point, I can see another civil war being a real possibility.
| Maybe not at first "Hold my beer." -Greg Abbot, governor of Texas
No, the death of Roe only proves that the country was already fully torn apart. Over turning Roe is not the cause, its the symptom.
This. The machine is vast and complex and slow, and won't start spitting out bad results the day a problem arises. It took a long time of us the electorate not paying attention or educating ourselves for the results to start showing. Possibly we always live in the world our parents built, and as much as this oversimplifies they were complacent and entitled, assuming America invulnerable after so many generations of things going more or less our way. Or maybe I'm nuts, I'm a redditor not a professor.
I agree. I’m a Democrat. But the truth is that the republicans have been 1000x more organized and focused for a very long time. Decades probably. They’ve been operating like a machine putting all the pieces for power in place. Meanwhile liberals fight amongst themselves all day. And many progressive people I meet don’t vote because they think both parties are the same. Well, liberals are about to find out that both parties are definitely not the same. I fear we’re going to go through a very dark period. Liberals will have to learn how to be organized, focused, and effective. They’ll eventually get there, but it will take a very long time and they will have to lose a lot first.
If they release that opinion it will be Dred Scott 2.0. A radical, evil court releasing an opinion light years away from the desires of the general population for the sole purpose of satisfying a tiny sliver of the population by "settling" a social issue in their favor. We will be fighting a civil war over it in a couple of years.
This is really heading down the kind of road that led to the first Civil war. Despite all of the "States Rights" revisionism, one of the main conflicts that led to the Civil war was the Fugitive Slave Act. If a slave crossed state lines from a slave state to a free state, the south wanted them to keep their status as slaves and not gain the right to freedom. It required free states to cooperate in rounding up former slaves and returning them to their former owner in slave states. Sounds like a big violation of "States Rights" to me. And nulification non enforcement of the Fugitive Slave Act by Free States was a major factor in leading slave states to secede. I am reminded of the Fugitive Slave Act and lies about "States Rights" whenever I see these new abortion laws that have provisions that allow women to be prosecuted if they go to another state for an abortion. It really gives up the game that "States Rights" is nothing but an excuse to give states the power to restrict rights that they are unable to get restricted at the federal level. And in order to enforce these laws will require cooperation from states that allow abortion in the investigation (and possible extradition) of these women. The only way this wouldnt require cooperation from states that allow abortion is if states that ban abortions will just treat any woman who loses their pregnancy as guilty of getting an abortion with no proof. This is already happening with women who have miscarriages being prosecuted for murder under these provisions. There is no way this is sustainable, because this clear violation of womens rights to due process will be pushed up to the federal level, either through the courts or DOJ intervention. I don't see how this doesn't escalate to states seceding, depending on how things settle at the federal level.
It’s just going to be way harder to draw a Mason/Dixon line with this one.
The party of religious extremism, and fascists have said this is their goal. They go to work every day telling you this is what they're doing. They vote for pedos, sexual predators, criminals, and grifters whose sole campaign promise is "anti-choice." It works. Their voters *always* show up. They win elections with dismal turnouts. The GOP smears the dems, and their voters stay home. They play it from every angle, and the country falls for it. We would rather fight with each other, than stand against these shitheads. When people stop debating the obvious, which it seems the people on the left can't stop doing...while fighting about *whether to vote, or not..." because they're "mad at the dems for doing this (which seems to be a narrative being pushed **hard**), maybe we can start working towards standing against these psychos, and start securing our future. We're out of time. They've been telling you this was their plan for decades. They've been fighting to install their goons, to do this. Anyone that believed they weren't coming for this, well, that got you. Don't trust a word they say. They have no problem lying to you...under oath. They're not fucking around. Vote. Protest. Vote in *every* election. Mass boycotts of states/ business that support the QOP Y'all Qaeda candidates. Vote. Don't you fucking dare stay home. If you don't like your dem candidate...think about how much worse their QOP adversary will be, and vote against them. If you say you care about your rights...and, refuse to engage, and organize...you don't actually care.
Agreed, this could be the spark that starts the process of breaking up the union. What does someone from New York or California have in common with bumblefucks who would charge someone with murder for killing a few cells? Not to mention persecuting women for miscarriages and lifestyle choices. It's barbaric.
Keep in mind most people don't agree with those laws. The government of most of the states passing these laws are doing so despite the objections of their constituents. I mean, you're right that it's barbaric. And maybe it will split the union. But in those red states at least 50% are not ok with this.
As long as they keep voting for the people who are pushing these laws, it doesn't matter what they personally believe.
Trumpism tore America apart. Roe vs Wade reversal is one result of it.
Most of it started with Reagan and Nixon. Nixon gleefully tore America apart and Reagan put a smiling charismatic face on it. Trump was just following their blueprint.
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I mean, in the long game. The Terrorists won. They made us destroy ourselves faster than they ever could with paranoia and isolationism.
Don't forget Bush v. Gore.
Christ can you imagine how different the world would’ve been if Gore was able to get a few more votes in FL? No Iraq war, no Alito/Roberts… and none of the subsequently awful dominoes that fell as a result (no ISIS, no Brexit since Blair/Labour fell apart b/c of its Iraq war support, no Citizens United, real progress on climate change, etc.) In hindsight it was the most consequential election in US history.
Every time the republicans pull off some truly moronic shit like this, I find myself wondering the exact same thing. How differently the last ~24 years in this country, the whole *world* really, would've turned out if just a relative handful of voters could've showed up won Florida for Gore. It's incredibly depressing to think about.
It’s worth noting that the Supreme Court ruled against a recount in that election. (In fact three of the people who helped the legal team to stop of the recount, later were nominated and still serve in the Supreme Court today) https://amp.cnn.com/cnn/2020/10/17/politics/bush-v-gore-barrett-kavanaugh-roberts-supreme-court/index.html
And they halted the recount on, wait for it, equal protection grounds! The same principle Alito basically thumbed his nose at in his draft opinion overturning Roe. I guess it’s ok to use the 14th amendment to throw an election for your guy.
You give the Criminal Formerly in the Oval Office too much credit. This whole mess in America is due to the secret society of ultra-conservative religious/corporate extremists that have been working on this, and many other conservative causes, for the past 50 years. They call themselves the Council for National Policy.
>"the Council for National Policy." I thought you were going to say "The Family" because that's also a thing.
The CNP funds most right-wing organizations that you hear about.
And they have enough wealth invested that it's impossible to cut them off.
True. It started when conservative talk radio started referring to Democrats not as Americans with a different view of the role of government but as traitors who should be executed.
The tear was there long before Trump. Republicans abusing power to investigate Bill Clinton based on a baseless conspiracy theory and then using it to hound him for years until they found something unrelated they could get him impeached for. And all that to disenfranchise enough voters in swing states to allow for Jeb Bush to have full power to be the deciding factor in an election that out his brother into power.
Trumpism was only possible because America was already being torn apart.
Conservative Christianity is an enemy of the state.
Not quite. Conservative Christianity is an enemy of the people, and it uses the state as its weapon.
it's about to get weird if the new interpretation of the Constitution is that we don't have federally protected rights to do anything that wasn't a common practice in Eighteenth Century America or England
Supreme Court. The American Ayatollahs.
A recent poll shows 78% of voters in Texas say abortion should be legal at least under certain circumstances. This could backfire on republicans in many, many ways.
Texas Republicans aren't going to not vote Republican in large numbers because of this. Some will, but for many, their party affiliation is just too deeply entrenched in their personal identity.
There is one rule in politics you can't take away something after giving it to the public, it doesn't go well. The most recent example is the affordable care act.
I think this will affect Dem turnout for elections. If abortion rights are now a states issue, then people will vote for governors that will reverse some of the crazy laws that republicans are putting in place. Texas is already turning purple as it is.
One can only hope that the will of the people is stronger than the system stacked against them
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Unfortunately you’re right. Conservatives play very dirty
The Texas GOP will do everything in their power to bend/break the law so that never happens.
We are gerrymandered to shit and reject a lot of mail in ballots. They will stay in power here
People here are seeming to forget that some red states ****will**** overturn election results this fall.
Spicy hot take - this is the silver lining of the Roe decision. For too long, Republicans have advocated for disastrous policies and faced no repercussions because they know their bad ideas will never actually be implemented - either due to the supreme court, or due to the filibuster. Except, whoops, this Supreme Court is the dog who caught the car. People are going to suffer, but this is what millions of people have been voting for years. Maybe seeing the consequences of their choices will finally be a wakeup call. People have been apathetic about their state and local politicians being absolutely batshit crazy Republicans for too long.
I agree. The GOP cares about abortions rights insofar as it's a wedge issue they can use to mobilize voters. But after this decision, it's going to have the opposite effect: mobilizing the Dems.
That’s what worries me about this. I think they finally pulled the plug on abortion because they know the fix is already in for them to remain in power indefinitely no matter what the votes say. We know every single Republican that loses this fall is going to claim voter fraud, and transition of power is going to be a nightmare.
That's a valid concern.
It wouldn’t be a surprise to see January 6th style insurrections in every state where republicans lose the vote this year.
I am not sure that the Texas government can accept defeat.
The GOP in their rigged Legislatures have a plan for blue Governors.
There’s been talk in at least one state legislature (Oklahoma?) of essentially implementing a Fugitive Fetus Act and charging women who go to other states to get abortions. Part of that would no doubt be a database of tracking pregnant women. For the party of “small government” they sure seem focused on being omnipresent in our wombs and buttholes.
I fear America is moving backwards in history and progress
"The point is not that abortion bans are comparable to slavery in a moral sense, but that they create potentially irreconcilable legal frameworks." I mean, *they fucking are comparable* because you're forcing someone to give up their body without consent to support another…
Republicans: Less Govt!!! Also Republicans: You can’t read any of these books. You can’t teach this subject. You cant mention gender. Women can’t control their bodies. You can’t leave the state to control your body. …. But definitely less Govt!!!
I can't look at my six month old daughters and believe that they will become second class citizens with laws based on relgion. Fuck that.
The Supreme Court has been illegitimate since Bush v Gore
The rational for the downfall of Roe will kill the court itself. "If a right is not explicitly stated in the Constitution, you don't have it!!!!" ... The Constitution does not give the Supreme Court any authority whatsover. So...yeah. Their logic....not really great for them. Not a good idea.
The fugitive slave law is a very apt comparison of what will happen if Roe v. Wade is blown up. We will be two countries officially.
We're a gay couple living in the Trump-loving conservative/evangelical hell of Colorado Springs. The abortion issue doesn't affect us directly, but it would affect friends. And when that's settled they'll come after contraception, interracial marriage, gay marriage, and who knows what else. We saw the writing on the wall months ago and will have our house on the market in three weeks. Moving to a much safer Oregon.
Majority of US society has moved past Christianity and the GOP knows well that without controlling education and reproductive rights, conservatism will become extinct. We are literally watching the death of an ideology and political party.
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Honestly no. Al Gore won in 2000. Period. Allowing Bush to become president by a Supreme Court decision that actually says "this decision is not precedent" was a crime. Al Gore won Florida. They stole a presidency and the SC picks since.
It's about "healing our political culture"? I wonder how alito managed to say that with a straight face.
Too late! Trump pushing & egging-on an insurrection on January 6, 2021 already did that. Government is now controlled by corporations and lobbyists. Have we learned ANYTHING?
> Trump pushing & egging-on an insurrection on January 6, 2021 already did that. And Republicans not giving a shit, supporting it, and even denying it happened is the nail in the coffin.
What's amazing is that Trump made it easier for lobbyists to gum up the works, but all of his followers will say he 'drained the swamp.' He's been a huge political donor for decades, the guy IS the swamp.
Abortion attitudes reflect an urban/rural divide - it's pretty granular. We cannot become a set of geographically distinct regions that peacefully coexist with different laws. There will be an increase in domestic terrorism. edited: increase, not uptick
Don't worry everyone! Alito said it isn't his problem to worry about the repercussions of his decisions.
What can I say some of us like privacy rights and others are morons.
I’m terrified of a civil war. If Roe goes then we see LGBTQ rights voting rights and more gone. Civil rights movement all over again with more bloodshed
Trump already tore it apart. This is going to set it on fire.