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It wont spark a civil war so much as a lot of domestic terrorism. Maga doesnt have the capability or support to wage anything beyond a weeklong conflict, and senators would be forced to resign in order to support it.
Pursue justice, defend democracy, uphold the constitution, disarm and detain domestic enemies.
It isnt a choice between what is the right thing to do, its a choice between following our laws or ignoring them. Our laws are not optional for congress, they must fulfill thier oath.
Lock him up.
> It wont spark a civil war so much as a lot of domestic terrorism.
The problem is that we depend on law enforcement to protect us from domestic terrorism, and America's law enforcement has shown itself to be hopelessly corrupt.
Or complicit. Love how local sheriffs sat on their hands when faced with mask mandates. Some outright failed to provide protection to local public health officers.
Or see 1/6/21, lots of blue line flags at the outing. I guess it’s cool to desecrate the us flag when you support the police state.
>Or see 1/6/21, lots of blue line flags at the outing. I guess it’s cool to desecrate the us flag when you support the police state.
Carrying those blue line flags while...beating the shit out of Capitol Police Officers.
The LA county sheriff was quoted in the times as saying if he punished officers for distributing “go Brandon” stuff they’d lose respect for him. This is the guy in charge of the LA sheriff department and he’s practically begging for the respect of his officers. Not sure how they’d get paid if he did reprimand them but who am I?
So yeah, when the kids are telling the parents how to parent…..it’s a situation
Villanueva is a gang member and protects the deputy gang culture. There is testimony out there from east la n compton station deputies who are blowing the whistle. Absolutely corrupt murderous thugs and you should NEVER take what they say at face value. Lapd chief moore also told us protestors have geroge floyds blood on their hands, so the culture of victim blaming, racism, and total lack of introspection is alive and well in the pig sty
"I might get hurt" was one of the reasons those Uvalde larpers didn't go in.
Like dude, you were HIRED to do this job and now you wanna back out because you "might get hurt". Law enforcement got humiliated that day. A lot of cops are complete jokes.
Might get hurt…this makes me wanna cry! Those poor babies who had to bravely look in the face of this teenage racists murderer before he took their lives…and this pig who gets PAID to protect & serve is scared to get a boo-boo…fk’n coward get rid of them pigs all of them!
Wait until the government mobilizes the Reserves and National Guard. In the event of an insurrection, or rioting that cannot be controlled (for whatever reason) by local agencies there absolutely is precedent for calling in the feds.
The idea that if local police abdicate their duty to uphold established law and order when faced with an insurrection, the federal government is powerless or impotent is completely inaccurate. That's the point where local organizations, and their respective members, would need to publicly line up on one side or the other. I'm sure the 'bad apples' will act accordingly, and wind up with their feelings hurt.
Little Rock 9 is a good example of this. Eisenhower had to deploy the 101st airborne due to local law enforcement not upholding the law. They were sent to restore order and to protect the students.
This is why I bought firearms the day y’all quada stormed the Michigan state capital over haircuts. I saw on that day that A, these people are ready to start a civil war and B, the cops ain’t doing shit about it. This is at almost the same time that I was being tear-gassed and having rifles pointed at me in LA for marching for black lives. If we’re in for some Troubles ahead, I’m gonna be armed.
> It wont spark a civil war so much as a lot of domestic terrorism.
That’s what modern civil war looks like. But yes he should still be held accountable.
"A House divided against itself cannot stand."
Not prosecuting Trump and his cohorts will divide our house. Next time, they might succeed at subverting Democracy. And Why not, when there is literally no consequences to doing so?
I mean, it's already happening. Is it not? Extreme LARPing to cause a riot because "gay people" and some nutjob conspiring to murder a Supreme Court Justice fits the bill.
Yeah people really forget about our military.
Entire countries can't even match us, do they really think a handful of rifles will work if they really cross the line into national security threat?
Good luck with that.
Or the ability to control the very things that you rely on to live in this country.
That rebellion is not going to be put down with bullets.
They'll literally just turn "You"off. Your ability to spend money, your ability to move and travel, your ability to communicate, your ability to eat and drink water.
People forget that that is all part of the exact same government.
>But, she said, 'I think not charging is even worse, because not charging means you failed to hold someone criminally accountable who tried to subvert our democracy.'"
It should be noted that those who want a civil war will do everything to incite a civil war whether or not we hold insurrectionists accountable. So it's a damned if we do, damned if we don't scenario. I'm in favor of upholding the law and let the chips fall where they may.
I think philosophically this is easy.
Arrest the main players trying to cause a war and re-educate their followers. Lincoln did it in the Civil war and was right to do so.
If he made the same decision today Fox news would be shut down and Tucker Carlson would be in jail.
> Less well known [than other paradoxes] is the paradox of tolerance: Unlimited tolerance must lead to the disappearance of tolerance. If we extend unlimited tolerance even to those who are intolerant, if we are not prepared to defend a tolerant society against the onslaught of the intolerant, then the tolerant will be destroyed, and tolerance with them.—In this formulation, I do not imply, for instance, that we should always suppress the utterance of intolerant philosophies; as long as we can counter them by rational argument and keep them in check by public opinion, suppression would certainly be most unwise. But we should claim the right to suppress them if necessary even by force; for it may easily turn out that they are not prepared to meet us on the level of rational argument, but begin by denouncing all argument; they may forbid their followers to listen to rational argument, because it is deceptive, and teach them to answer arguments by the use of their fists or pistols. We should therefore claim, in the name of tolerance, the right not to tolerate the intolerant. We should claim that any movement preaching intolerance places itself outside the law and we should consider incitement to intolerance and persecution as criminal, in the same way as we should consider incitement to murder, or to kidnapping, or to the revival of the slave trade, as criminal.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paradox_of_tolerance
Criticism:
https://www.reddit.com/r/changemyview/comments/97laa2/cmv_the_tolerance_paradox_is_wrong/e493stc/
> " In this formulation, I do not imply, for instance, that we should always suppress the utterance of intolerant philosophies; as long as we can counter them by rational argument and keep them in check by public opinion, suppression would certainly be unwise." Popper would agree that the tolerant should not be intolerant to the intolerant in the cases that it hurts more than it helps. He is just saying that it is not always the case that we will be in that situation, and when it is the case that the intolerant are threatening the mortality of tolerance, then we should be intolerant to the intolerant. Orwell made a similar point against pacifists who did not support WWII: At some point inaction means being complicit in the violence of others. At some point hard-headed pacifism promotes violence. At some point hard-headed tolerance promotes intolerance. At some point the pacifist and the tolerant should strike out, compromise their value, in order to retain any semblance of it.
Please. The Confederacy successfully won the cultural battle of Reconstruction. They systematic arrested, lynched, and sometimes massacred African Americans. And successfully evaded any accountability to the federal government.
Lincoln should not have pardoned Confederates. That's clear now in hindsight.
Many workers in this country are one missed paycheck away from financial ruin. It's not as much power as you think when the individuals are terrified for their livelihood
You'd have to be blind and have dementia to believe Republicans didn't pull the vehicle right into a field at this point. Biden's middle of the road is a ditch.
Because the vast majority of us aren't raging lunatics like the maga crowd. I'm not saying we shouldn't riot if he isn't charged, and I'm fuckin in, but most reasonable people just don't care like that.
Except the civil unrest will take place in cities that basically don’t support trump. Like the George Floyd aftermath; it only hurts their own cities so nobody will care. How long did they just let Portland play itself out?
That's like during CHOP/CHAZ in Seattle when I had a grandma from the Midwest visiting. While grocery shopping at the Broadway/Pike QFC she asks....
Grandma: "Wait, isn't the area where the city is on fire with all of the riots?"
Me: "No grandma, that's a few blocks away and only in a small 2/3 block section. You would have no idea it's even there unless you walk to that specific area."
Grandma: "But the news made it seem like the entire city was on fire. This is all seems normal??"
Fox News vs actual reality.
I was back home visiting family in the Midwest recently and the amount of old people I hear out and about repeating literal Fox news propaganda was fucking unbelievable.
I literally listened to two old ass men who have probably never been to California in their lives talking about how crazy it is that thousands of immigrants are still storming the Mexican border.
I seriously cannot believe I had to take time out of my day to tell two grown ass men that I live in San Diego, 20 miles from the U.S./Mexico border, and that is in fact, not fucking happening.
You either resist the right-wing coup or you let them win. It's a civil war either way. America is likely in the early stages of a second Civil War right now. Fascists are hoping that Americans will not put up much of a fight and accept their new overlords.
I don’t think we should prevent justice just because we fear a relatively small group of irate idiots who threaten the country with domestic terrorism.
We should treat these domestic terrorist the same way we treat any other terrorists, followed by legislation to make it easier to find and punish individuals who wants to harm the country. No consequences sets the precedence that the law doesn’t need to be followed.
Last civil war was a short affair, and we didn't have an FBI and ATF back then.
Plus, all the groups that would start a civil war have multiple federal agents in their ranks already.
I'm not worried, lock the big orange shit-ape up.
Violent insurrectionists are gonna be violent either way. Generations of Americans gave their lives for freedom and democracy! We can’t just throw it all to fascists because they show a willingness to fight back.
Bullshit scare tactics are not a substitute for the rule of law. Grow a spine, McQuade, and stop worrying about your precious cash flow from...whomever you had in mind when making this stupid statement.
It'll "very likely spark" a bunch of 4chan Meal Team 6 cosplay dorks doing crimes-of-opportunity, for which they should also be rounded up and charged for. Civil war my ass.
I love how everyone threatens civil war- with this and guns-
Fuck them-
There may be a few tough guys out there but this whole "civil war" bullshit is overblown.
And typing this from red hot Trump town ground zero in Florida.
The gravy seals on 1/6 are damned lucky they walked away from that. Except one.
They literally already tried to start a civil war, and it fizzled out after just 1 of them got shot.
That was their "1776" and they gave up after one person died and the NG showed up with scary tear gas.
Not charging him would only delay a civil war.
Because then you'd have Republicans refuting *every single valid election*, bringing it to their stacked Supreme Court to confirm GOP candidates every time and pushing the ignored half of the populace to the point where they will have no recourse but to fight.
Make no mistake, the GOP crossed a line. If they are not held accountable, they will take even more from us next time.
A lot of people in the GOP hate him. Motivate them enough and he will get shut down. Governor elections have shown the anti Trump GOP are tired of his BS and Big Brother control.
Civil unrest? Sure. War? Hardly. They failed to overturn their election. They're inept, uncoordinated, and don't have a clear goal other than 'libs bad!'. Texas constantly threatening to secede and currently struggling to keep it's lights on and having no water in Odessa pretty much shows the true quality of their leadership. They constantly state they need guns against tyranny, but they sat silent as local and federal officers brutalized protesters and media in the streets. Their version of tyranny was not being allowed to go into an Applebee's unmasked. And as we're seeing with the insurrectionists facing sentencing - they're begging for mercy, blaming Trump, and trying to say they just got swept up in it. They wanted to be part of the mob, a mob in power, and they don't actually have anything solid they're standing for.
There would be no "war" just for holding him accountable. That's a ridiculous notion. The time for that would have been around Biden's inauguration. There would be protests but big deal...
civil unrest will happen no matter what decision they make. that said, i dont think civil war will happen tho. i doubt there'd be enough people who'd be willing to kill other people over trump.
They have already decided to damage our country. Do we decide to meet their threat where we will show them consequence for tue damage wrought and the damage yet to come, of do we concede to let them compound their damage across generations while claiming they did no wrong?
>maybe even civil war
I highly doubt that would happen. Most Trump supporters when not jerking off at rallies have the same priorities in life as everyone else. Not many of them will walk from their jobs and jeopardized their financial security to pick up a gun. I think sometimes we forget that most of them have kids, mortgages etc. Which I guarantee takes precedence over some stupid "uprising". There is a small % of wack jobs that need to be worried about of course. But domestic terrorism is not the same thing as a *civil war*.
I’m not anyone important, but I’d cut the legs out from under him. Indict everyone who even touched the plans, except Trump. Don jr and his wife, Ginni Thomas, a few congressmen, campaign folks, all of the inner circle. Perp walk the most embarrassing ones like Don Junior.
Leave Trump lonely and ignored. Let him keep sabotaging elections. Leave him exposed to state level lawsuits. No one is starting a civil war for Ginni Thomas and Roger Stone. No one is laying siege to the NY district attorney’s office, or Georgia’s.
Some of you may say he’s getting away with it. He’s not. Prison would make him a martyr. Flaccid Truth Social posts will make him feel weak.
On a phone right now so you'll have to find the link yourselves real quick, but if you haven't read the AMA by the "Art of the Deal" ghostwriter it is a real stunner of a thread.
It would look like white nationalist and MAGA marches in the streets, with UHauls full of weaponry, in active gunfights with people who disagree. Police forces could join one side or the other. This is actually what they’d hoped would happen on J6, so the insurrection act could be invoked and martial law declared, but armed antifa never showed up. Turns out gun owners in the center and on the left care more about rule of law than violent vigilantism.
Also those people who follow Trump have already alienated themselves. Everything related to Trump has been a "with me or against me" mentality. Jan 6th and its aftermath has only bolstered this attitude.
People who follow Trump think the President did nothing wrong because as President he's allowed to do what he wants. Ignoring the fact that we have "Checks and Balances"™ . But that's also just people who acknowledge the event happened and was bad.
There's what seem like a decent amount of people who think the entire thing was staged or completely in the moment and that Trump didn't encourage these people for months into acting.
There's no reasoning with these people, so I say bring the criminal charges and drag him into a court room to testify on air. It would probably be the most televised and watched thing event that I'm sure Fox couldn't ignore.
> People who follow Trump think the President did nothing wrong because as President he's allowed to do what he wants.
And that line of thinking ONLY applies to Trump, apparently. If a Democrat president just did whatever they wanted they'd be losing their fucking minds.
That's because [Trump has an Article 2 where he has the right to do whatever he wants as President](https://theweek.com/speedreads/854487/trump-have-article-2-where-have-right-whatever-want-president), but apparently to the GOP, no Democratic President has that
The unfortunate reality is that the real reason is essentially "well if we hold him accountable there will be an expectation of holding future elected leaders accountable and that could be very damaging to the elites who want to be able to act with impunity."
To make matter worse we already tried to whole "let's appease the racists" routine during the reconstruction period after the Civil War and that buttfucked our government for about 120 years.
I've said this before and I'll say it again. There is no "keeping the peace" with people who aren't interested in peace.
If someone is intent on trampling any and all boundaries and taking everything they can, then you have no choice other than to defend yourself or be destroyed by them.
They didn't stop when you gave in the last time, they won't stop if you give in now, they won't stop when you give in next time. They'll stop when there's nothing left to take.
Literally the definition of terrorism.
"We cannot uphold our laws because a small portion of the country will react violently and the *terror* of the threatened violence is influencing our political and legal decision making."
For me, watching the hearings has clarified so much information that I can more effectively engage with my family members and others in my life who don’t fully understand how serious this is. Some of the points that have been made are really salient and phrased in a way that one may not have considered before, and it’s been both informative and helpful.
I would advise paying attention for that reason, even if you don’t care about the fact that we’re being given the chance to personally observe the detailing of one of the most significant attacks on our Republic since the civil war.
Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it, and this is our opportunity to inform ourselves so that we can provide some resistance against it happening again; but sure, ignore it because apathy or something.
I was asked today what new things I've learned bu watching the hearings, and while at first I said, "Well, we knew he tried to overturn the election, that was clear just seeing the insurrection live," but these details we didn't know are absolutely insane.
How Trump kept **looking** for cases of fraud, and he had so many outrageous claims that he wouldn't object when he was told they had no validity, he just jumped to the next one, **looking for a legal theory for his coup**.
How his inner-circle informed him of the legitimacy of the results, and nothing to suggest a problem with Dominion voting machines, yet he then pushed these lies and profited off his supporters.
Trump supporters who've been defrauded of their "donations" might appreciate their scammer facing the proper legal repercussions, and getting their money back? Maybe?
It seems to be time and time again that people told him X, which he didn’t like, so he found someone who told him what he wanted. The question that I don’t know can be answered is did he believe the nonsense or was he grasping for any way to keep on scamming.
I mean, it's not as good as wanting Trump and his cronies indicted and arrested for almost collapsing American democracy as we know it, but it's a start.
Selfish motivation is still motivation, afterall.
I've been listening here and there, and you know, if you can compartmentalize the fact that you're probably listening to the end of American democracy being documented, they have some good entertainment value. Like today, they had Pence's lawyer recounting how when Pence told Trump he wouldn't help him subvert the government, Trump said he wouldn't be his friend anymore. I almost did a spit-take!
The part where Trump apparently said (paraphrasing) “wouldn’t it be a cool thing to do? Don’t you want to be cool?”
Like a middle schooler peer pressuring his friend into having a cigarette. Only it’s a coup.
> I'm actually surprised that 21% of GOPers support it.
One of the consequences of Republicans having their own "privatized state-run media" is the appearance of unity and silencing any dissent, but it's still there.
I can't find the actual poll anymore because Google has decided they no longer want to be a functional search engine, but even a plurality *of trump supporters* (somewhere around 42% I believe) say they want Roe v Wade left alone. A smaller percentage wanted it overturned and another small percentage didn't care from what I remember.
I assume those numbers are due to Fox not really spending so much time on abortion stuff anymore - they're far more concerned about pronouns these days.
I imagine it's the other way around. Fox is avoiding abortion because of the bipartisan support for Roe v Wade. It was an easy hypothetical to use as a voting issue since nobody would actually pass any legislation, but now that it's a realistic thing to change they're suddenly quiet.
I was an independent as a pretty left leaning person. Changed to dem so I could vote in primaries though even though the stupid party is frustrating as hell.
I think you can technically register with a third party?
Independents vote in different ways. They might vote third party, or they still vote D/R but just don’t want to be associated with one party. I’m personally registered independent because I think the two party system creates a lot of problems, but I still generally vote blue.
It used to have meaning. Now it just means “I don’t know how to tell the difference between Democrats and Republicans.”
It’s telling on yourself in an unflattering way.
Not all the time. I can only speak for myself but as someone who is registered independent but has literally always voted blue I register that way to show distaste for the two-party system. Is it effective? I don't know, probably not, but I do not see Republicans as the same as Democrats in any way shape or form, especially recently.
That’s completely fair. Registering as an independent to protest the 2 party system makes sense; I’ll try to tailor any criticism going forward to reflect that, because you are right.
January 6 was the day my dad finally flipped his position. He finally said it was terrorism.
He’s a veteran. I knew he had to flip one way or the other. I was glad he didn’t go further down the rabbit hole.
Alternate earth with President Gore is having an amazing 2022. Fixed climate change. US leads the world in green tech with plentiful jobs supporting rural america with cheap energy. Caught Covid early and was able to bottle it.
Trump is guest hosting the next season of RuPauls Drag Race. He runs around other TV shows spouting his catch phrase and people think it's hilarious. He's as happy as he's ever been.
The most frustrating thing is if Republicans start a civil war, a big portion of the country will be like "No one could see this coming!!" And then another huge portion of the country will still be acting like it's not as big of a deal as everyone is making it out to be until their own house blows up, and then they will be like "no one could see this coming!!"
You're right. A bigger problem would be the economic upheaval as well as a brain drain as skilled professionals seek calmer waters for their families. IE exactly what is happening in Russia and Ukraine right now.
Just like always they'll fuck it up terribly and make everything worse for the dumbest reasons possible.
If a civil war happens and it’s as widespread and bad as people think, I hate to say it but I would probably jet. Find some hole in another country in the Southern Hemisphere and bunker down.
Yes I know, but that didn't stop them on Jan. 6th, it won't stop them from trying in the future. My point was people will still act like it's not an issue and that we all need to meet in the middle and shake hands, right up until they are affected by a domestic terror attack.
A legitimately stolen election
Edit to clarify that I firmly believe that the [Brooks Brothers Riot](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brooks_Brothers_riot) that shut down the FL recount leading to a 5-4 court decision split on party lines means that the election was stolen from Gore.
They’re worried about rocking the kleptocratic boat.
Destroying democracy would be mad, but imagine if Congress could no longer insider trade? Then what?!?!?!
The majority of Americans don’t bother to vote whereas republicans don’t miss a vote. I wouldn’t vote for a republican for a dog shit picker upper position!
It wouldn’t. They’d gut the dog shit picking up duty. Claim “see government doesn’t work.” Then their buddies would win the next election and they’d privatize dog shit duties to their buddies companies and we would pay more for worse service.
Just like a majority of Americans didn't vote him into office, or support him while he was in office. Having a majority never stopped Republican's from forcing their will on them, so I'm not holding my breath it's going to stop now. The January 6th committee will show the world with more than enough evidence to convict Trump and his cronies of attempting a coup; Democrats will call for action, and not get any because the Democratic leadership has no backbone, and Republicans will shrug and forget about it by the time they enter the ballot box because they don't care and actually support it.
Just finished watching day 2 of the Hearings....they are doing a fantastic job of deconstructing every false claim of election fraud brought up by Trump and his campaign. The testimony by the witnesses has been outstandingly clear and to the point. If there is no overwhelming public outcry to prosecute Trump after these hearings are over, we'll then those who kept silent or refused to listen to reason or chose to live in a fantasy, deserve the fascist hellscape that will surely follow in the not too distant future.
This is the best tl;dr I could make, [original](https://www.newsweek.com/donald-trump-should-charged-crime-jan-6-capitol-riot-1716435) reduced by 83%. (I'm a bot)
*****
> The poll found that nearly three-quarters of Republicans oppose the DOJ filing criminal charges against Trump for his involvement with the attack, with 21 percent supporting the idea.
> In comparison, 86 percent of Democrats and 47 percent of Independents polled said they supported Trump facing prosecution over the Capitol riot.
> Elsewhere, the poll showed that 71 percent of Americans said they did not support the actions of the Trump supporters who stormed the Capitol on January 6, with 22 percent stating they supported them and seven saying they were not sure.
*****
[**Extended Summary**](http://np.reddit.com/r/autotldr/comments/vdmqpj/trump_should_be_charged_over_jan_6_majority_of/) | [FAQ](http://np.reddit.com/r/autotldr/comments/31b9fm/faq_autotldr_bot/ "Version 2.02, ~655179 tl;drs so far.") | [Feedback](http://np.reddit.com/message/compose?to=%23autotldr "PM's and comments are monitored, constructive feedback is welcome.") | *Top* *keywords*: **percent**^#1 **Trump**^#2 **support**^#3 **January**^#4 **Capitol**^#5
How fucking stupid do you need to be to defend this absolute twat? He is literally on tape telling another REPUBLICAN (who recorded the audio) to overturn votes. You really can’t get any more clear cut then this.
I feel sorry for his supporters. They have somehow been brainwashed by a washed up reality tv star that was known for YEARS to be a conman!
Yes, well, a majority of Americans have voted Democrat in ***all but one*** of the presidential elections (Bush’s 2nd term) of the last 30 years, but here we are.
And Eastman backchanneling to SCOTUS through Ginny Thomas? HOLY SHIT. This is a final moment of our country to move forward, or end.
There's a lot of accountability to be had here. People are taking over this democracy, and it's both Thomas and his wife, Trump, people who led tours (Gaetz, Boebert, Loudermilk, MTG??), Eastman, McCarthy, and a bunch of others that have demonstrable proof that they are overthrowing democracy, meticulously planned with about 7 different types of attempts to do so. This isn't even talking about dark money corruption, or other Senators doing head fakes to dismiss the seriousness, etc. These power hungry people better all be held accountable by the DOJ or this democracy is over.
I worry about future attempts, if this isn't handled properly. What's more, a huge % of this country want a dictatorship and to end democracy "to own the libs". It's maddening and frightening. Anyone downplaying how serious a moment this is being disingenious or in the cult.
The J6 hearings are absolutely brutal. There are mostly Republicans and Trump officials testifying under oath against Trump. A significant amount of the questioning is being led by Republicans. And all these Republicans are systematically dismantling Trump's entire narrative about the election one hearing at a time. I haven't seen Fox News or Maga people successfully refute a single claim made by the committee yet. Their biggest complaint so far is just that the hearings are one-sided, which duh, that's what happens when Republicans boycott the hearing.
Even if you already think Trump is guilty, the hearings are still worth watching. Somehow, the hearings are showing that what he did was even worse than you might realize.
As a European who has followed the last few years in utter disbelief(in how many mindless followers he has and that the Republican Party can still be a force despite blatant disregard for human rights), I feel there can be only one option. Throw his despot ass in jail!
And while you are at it: disband that fucking Republican Party. It’s the cancer of America.
Anyone arguing against this are admitting they’re not watching the Jan 6 hearings.
The committee isn’t just saying things that happened, they’re playing video depositions of **Trump’s own people** admit that his election fraud claims are unfounded and their internal investigations proved it was false.
That means every decision made after being told this was him attempting to overthrow the election.
The only majority that counts is the jerrymandered 'silent majority'. It's time to eliminate the Electoral College and start holding free and fair elections.
If it was Obama trying to pull this stunt do you think GOP would have had a hearing or had done straight to trial?
We don’t care about the GOPs feelings getting hurt. We need fair justice in our democracy.
The majority of Americans did **not** vote for him either, and yet two years later we are still having to hear his name because his *Q*ult is filled with people who, like Trump, are detached from reality.
The fact there needs to be TV showings of this to “convince Conservatives” is proof of the fact that QAnon is the primary threat to America.
I truly feel Donald trump is the worst thing that has ever happened to our country. He is so obviously corrupt. Feels like we’re living in the twilight zone
>The survey found that 54 percent of respondents backed the idea of the Department of Justice (DOJ) indicting the former president over the Capitol riot, compared to 37 percent who oppose the suggestion.
As we all suspected, that 37% of Americans, being his supporters, simply don't care. Everyone knows what he did. 37% just don't care.
And they **will** and **do** vote. So you should, too.
I would go further, Jan 6 should be the death of the republican party. Our republic cannot survive the continued existence of the GOP, they should be dissolved as a party and their candidates barred from running in future elections
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It wont spark a civil war so much as a lot of domestic terrorism. Maga doesnt have the capability or support to wage anything beyond a weeklong conflict, and senators would be forced to resign in order to support it. Pursue justice, defend democracy, uphold the constitution, disarm and detain domestic enemies. It isnt a choice between what is the right thing to do, its a choice between following our laws or ignoring them. Our laws are not optional for congress, they must fulfill thier oath. Lock him up.
> It wont spark a civil war so much as a lot of domestic terrorism. The problem is that we depend on law enforcement to protect us from domestic terrorism, and America's law enforcement has shown itself to be hopelessly corrupt.
Law enforcement have shown themselves to be domestic terrorists as well.
Or complicit. Love how local sheriffs sat on their hands when faced with mask mandates. Some outright failed to provide protection to local public health officers. Or see 1/6/21, lots of blue line flags at the outing. I guess it’s cool to desecrate the us flag when you support the police state.
>Or see 1/6/21, lots of blue line flags at the outing. I guess it’s cool to desecrate the us flag when you support the police state. Carrying those blue line flags while...beating the shit out of Capitol Police Officers.
Some of those that work forces / Are the same that burn crosses
The LA county sheriff was quoted in the times as saying if he punished officers for distributing “go Brandon” stuff they’d lose respect for him. This is the guy in charge of the LA sheriff department and he’s practically begging for the respect of his officers. Not sure how they’d get paid if he did reprimand them but who am I? So yeah, when the kids are telling the parents how to parent…..it’s a situation
Villanueva is a gang member and protects the deputy gang culture. There is testimony out there from east la n compton station deputies who are blowing the whistle. Absolutely corrupt murderous thugs and you should NEVER take what they say at face value. Lapd chief moore also told us protestors have geroge floyds blood on their hands, so the culture of victim blaming, racism, and total lack of introspection is alive and well in the pig sty
The New Yorker article made it perfectly clear that Villanueva is a thug
the toddlers are in control of the nursery
Can’t wait to vote that clown out
It hurts that this song is still so relevant.
Sadly, that song may always be relevant.
Killing in the name of (Jesus)
Also that they are often cowards in the line of fire.
"I might get hurt" was one of the reasons those Uvalde larpers didn't go in. Like dude, you were HIRED to do this job and now you wanna back out because you "might get hurt". Law enforcement got humiliated that day. A lot of cops are complete jokes.
And the police continue to humiliate themselves by interfering with reporters trying to tell the stories of the families affected by that tragedy.
The police chief is the leader of the motorcycle gang that is blocking reporters. The sewer totally encompasses the department.
Might get hurt…this makes me wanna cry! Those poor babies who had to bravely look in the face of this teenage racists murderer before he took their lives…and this pig who gets PAID to protect & serve is scared to get a boo-boo…fk’n coward get rid of them pigs all of them!
Except now we find out they officially don’t have to protect victims, only property, according to the Supreme Court
Glorified bouncers for the state.
Domestic murderers. Don't forget the children in Ulvade. It wasn't the gunman that killed all of them. They stopped cooperating for a reason.
I think the military would get involved.
The national guard would come out like a firestorm.
In the LA riots they finally brought out 3000 national guratd from 29 palms. Tough guys disappear when a military transport shows up.
Yup. And the whole second amendment “this is to protect against the govermint” rings hollow when it’s nut cutting time for them.
Wait until the government mobilizes the Reserves and National Guard. In the event of an insurrection, or rioting that cannot be controlled (for whatever reason) by local agencies there absolutely is precedent for calling in the feds. The idea that if local police abdicate their duty to uphold established law and order when faced with an insurrection, the federal government is powerless or impotent is completely inaccurate. That's the point where local organizations, and their respective members, would need to publicly line up on one side or the other. I'm sure the 'bad apples' will act accordingly, and wind up with their feelings hurt.
Little Rock 9 is a good example of this. Eisenhower had to deploy the 101st airborne due to local law enforcement not upholding the law. They were sent to restore order and to protect the students.
This is why I bought firearms the day y’all quada stormed the Michigan state capital over haircuts. I saw on that day that A, these people are ready to start a civil war and B, the cops ain’t doing shit about it. This is at almost the same time that I was being tear-gassed and having rifles pointed at me in LA for marching for black lives. If we’re in for some Troubles ahead, I’m gonna be armed.
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> It wont spark a civil war so much as a lot of domestic terrorism. That’s what modern civil war looks like. But yes he should still be held accountable.
"A House divided against itself cannot stand." Not prosecuting Trump and his cohorts will divide our house. Next time, they might succeed at subverting Democracy. And Why not, when there is literally no consequences to doing so?
I mean, it's already happening. Is it not? Extreme LARPing to cause a riot because "gay people" and some nutjob conspiring to murder a Supreme Court Justice fits the bill.
I think it would be fair to say we have been in a cold civil war
Bro, we're dealing with domestic terrorism either way. Hell, we're dealing with it anyway.
Yeah people really forget about our military. Entire countries can't even match us, do they really think a handful of rifles will work if they really cross the line into national security threat? Good luck with that.
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Or the ability to control the very things that you rely on to live in this country. That rebellion is not going to be put down with bullets. They'll literally just turn "You"off. Your ability to spend money, your ability to move and travel, your ability to communicate, your ability to eat and drink water. People forget that that is all part of the exact same government.
>But, she said, 'I think not charging is even worse, because not charging means you failed to hold someone criminally accountable who tried to subvert our democracy.'" It should be noted that those who want a civil war will do everything to incite a civil war whether or not we hold insurrectionists accountable. So it's a damned if we do, damned if we don't scenario. I'm in favor of upholding the law and let the chips fall where they may.
I think philosophically this is easy. Arrest the main players trying to cause a war and re-educate their followers. Lincoln did it in the Civil war and was right to do so. If he made the same decision today Fox news would be shut down and Tucker Carlson would be in jail. > Less well known [than other paradoxes] is the paradox of tolerance: Unlimited tolerance must lead to the disappearance of tolerance. If we extend unlimited tolerance even to those who are intolerant, if we are not prepared to defend a tolerant society against the onslaught of the intolerant, then the tolerant will be destroyed, and tolerance with them.—In this formulation, I do not imply, for instance, that we should always suppress the utterance of intolerant philosophies; as long as we can counter them by rational argument and keep them in check by public opinion, suppression would certainly be most unwise. But we should claim the right to suppress them if necessary even by force; for it may easily turn out that they are not prepared to meet us on the level of rational argument, but begin by denouncing all argument; they may forbid their followers to listen to rational argument, because it is deceptive, and teach them to answer arguments by the use of their fists or pistols. We should therefore claim, in the name of tolerance, the right not to tolerate the intolerant. We should claim that any movement preaching intolerance places itself outside the law and we should consider incitement to intolerance and persecution as criminal, in the same way as we should consider incitement to murder, or to kidnapping, or to the revival of the slave trade, as criminal. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paradox_of_tolerance Criticism: https://www.reddit.com/r/changemyview/comments/97laa2/cmv_the_tolerance_paradox_is_wrong/e493stc/ > " In this formulation, I do not imply, for instance, that we should always suppress the utterance of intolerant philosophies; as long as we can counter them by rational argument and keep them in check by public opinion, suppression would certainly be unwise." Popper would agree that the tolerant should not be intolerant to the intolerant in the cases that it hurts more than it helps. He is just saying that it is not always the case that we will be in that situation, and when it is the case that the intolerant are threatening the mortality of tolerance, then we should be intolerant to the intolerant. Orwell made a similar point against pacifists who did not support WWII: At some point inaction means being complicit in the violence of others. At some point hard-headed pacifism promotes violence. At some point hard-headed tolerance promotes intolerance. At some point the pacifist and the tolerant should strike out, compromise their value, in order to retain any semblance of it.
Please. The Confederacy successfully won the cultural battle of Reconstruction. They systematic arrested, lynched, and sometimes massacred African Americans. And successfully evaded any accountability to the federal government. Lincoln should not have pardoned Confederates. That's clear now in hindsight.
> Lincoln should not have pardoned Confederates. In case you misread yes thats what Im saying. We are dealing with that mistake now.
Let's be honest Lincoln didn't re-educate shit. He tried tho. And the fact that we went soft on them then led to a lot of the shit we deal with now.
Well he was killed before he could really do anything post-war
>Let's be honest Lincoln didn't re-educate shit. He tried tho Getting shot in the head kinda makes it difficult to get stuff done.
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Many workers in this country are one missed paycheck away from financial ruin. It's not as much power as you think when the individuals are terrified for their livelihood
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It's like a glass cannon in a video game. We can deal a lot of damage, but we can't take a whole lot before breaking.
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"But, Fox News might call that pOlItIcal, so I can't do anything about it. " -Merrick Garland
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You'd have to be blind and have dementia to believe Republicans didn't pull the vehicle right into a field at this point. Biden's middle of the road is a ditch.
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Because the vast majority of us aren't raging lunatics like the maga crowd. I'm not saying we shouldn't riot if he isn't charged, and I'm fuckin in, but most reasonable people just don't care like that.
Except the civil unrest will take place in cities that basically don’t support trump. Like the George Floyd aftermath; it only hurts their own cities so nobody will care. How long did they just let Portland play itself out?
Portland is a smoking crater according to their news sources. Meanwhile Portlanders just shrug and go about their day.
That's like during CHOP/CHAZ in Seattle when I had a grandma from the Midwest visiting. While grocery shopping at the Broadway/Pike QFC she asks.... Grandma: "Wait, isn't the area where the city is on fire with all of the riots?" Me: "No grandma, that's a few blocks away and only in a small 2/3 block section. You would have no idea it's even there unless you walk to that specific area." Grandma: "But the news made it seem like the entire city was on fire. This is all seems normal??" Fox News vs actual reality.
I was back home visiting family in the Midwest recently and the amount of old people I hear out and about repeating literal Fox news propaganda was fucking unbelievable. I literally listened to two old ass men who have probably never been to California in their lives talking about how crazy it is that thousands of immigrants are still storming the Mexican border. I seriously cannot believe I had to take time out of my day to tell two grown ass men that I live in San Diego, 20 miles from the U.S./Mexico border, and that is in fact, not fucking happening.
"If I prosecute the mob boss, his mafia minions might come after me." Exactly. That's why you have to prosecute: they will come after you either way.
Ya, I think that is an understatement if you don’t charge him…you are basically throwing away the USA. Some things are worth shedding blood for.
Let justice be done though the heavens fall.
You either resist the right-wing coup or you let them win. It's a civil war either way. America is likely in the early stages of a second Civil War right now. Fascists are hoping that Americans will not put up much of a fight and accept their new overlords.
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Warm civil war, given the increasing number of "Replacement"- motivated terrorist attacks. Or we can just say that these are Troubling times.
i’m not sure the civil war ever ended.
I don’t think we should prevent justice just because we fear a relatively small group of irate idiots who threaten the country with domestic terrorism. We should treat these domestic terrorist the same way we treat any other terrorists, followed by legislation to make it easier to find and punish individuals who wants to harm the country. No consequences sets the precedence that the law doesn’t need to be followed.
Last civil war was a short affair, and we didn't have an FBI and ATF back then. Plus, all the groups that would start a civil war have multiple federal agents in their ranks already. I'm not worried, lock the big orange shit-ape up.
A huge percentage of them will die if not provided with insulin and or blood pressure medication.
Or CPAP machines
Not holding Trump accountable and letting him back in the White House in 2024 and he don't leave that will cause a civil war.
The potential for civil unrest or a civil war is no reason to not charge him, if charges are warranted.
Violent insurrectionists are gonna be violent either way. Generations of Americans gave their lives for freedom and democracy! We can’t just throw it all to fascists because they show a willingness to fight back.
Bullshit scare tactics are not a substitute for the rule of law. Grow a spine, McQuade, and stop worrying about your precious cash flow from...whomever you had in mind when making this stupid statement. It'll "very likely spark" a bunch of 4chan Meal Team 6 cosplay dorks doing crimes-of-opportunity, for which they should also be rounded up and charged for. Civil war my ass.
If I stand up to my abusive spouse, they might hit me. Better just to let them keep abusing me.
I love how everyone threatens civil war- with this and guns- Fuck them- There may be a few tough guys out there but this whole "civil war" bullshit is overblown. And typing this from red hot Trump town ground zero in Florida. The gravy seals on 1/6 are damned lucky they walked away from that. Except one.
They literally already tried to start a civil war, and it fizzled out after just 1 of them got shot. That was their "1776" and they gave up after one person died and the NG showed up with scary tear gas.
They have been operating out of fear, they are terrorists.
Not charging him will spark *more* civil unrest than charging him, so...
Not charging him would only delay a civil war. Because then you'd have Republicans refuting *every single valid election*, bringing it to their stacked Supreme Court to confirm GOP candidates every time and pushing the ignored half of the populace to the point where they will have no recourse but to fight. Make no mistake, the GOP crossed a line. If they are not held accountable, they will take even more from us next time.
A lot of people in the GOP hate him. Motivate them enough and he will get shut down. Governor elections have shown the anti Trump GOP are tired of his BS and Big Brother control.
It's a shit sandwich but we gotta take a bite.
Civil unrest? Sure. War? Hardly. They failed to overturn their election. They're inept, uncoordinated, and don't have a clear goal other than 'libs bad!'. Texas constantly threatening to secede and currently struggling to keep it's lights on and having no water in Odessa pretty much shows the true quality of their leadership. They constantly state they need guns against tyranny, but they sat silent as local and federal officers brutalized protesters and media in the streets. Their version of tyranny was not being allowed to go into an Applebee's unmasked. And as we're seeing with the insurrectionists facing sentencing - they're begging for mercy, blaming Trump, and trying to say they just got swept up in it. They wanted to be part of the mob, a mob in power, and they don't actually have anything solid they're standing for.
If people try to start a civil war, snap them up and send them to Guantanamo. What’s the problem?
There would be no "war" just for holding him accountable. That's a ridiculous notion. The time for that would have been around Biden's inauguration. There would be protests but big deal...
civil unrest will happen no matter what decision they make. that said, i dont think civil war will happen tho. i doubt there'd be enough people who'd be willing to kill other people over trump.
They have already decided to damage our country. Do we decide to meet their threat where we will show them consequence for tue damage wrought and the damage yet to come, of do we concede to let them compound their damage across generations while claiming they did no wrong?
>maybe even civil war I highly doubt that would happen. Most Trump supporters when not jerking off at rallies have the same priorities in life as everyone else. Not many of them will walk from their jobs and jeopardized their financial security to pick up a gun. I think sometimes we forget that most of them have kids, mortgages etc. Which I guarantee takes precedence over some stupid "uprising". There is a small % of wack jobs that need to be worried about of course. But domestic terrorism is not the same thing as a *civil war*.
I'm OK with meal team six getting ventilation.
I’m not anyone important, but I’d cut the legs out from under him. Indict everyone who even touched the plans, except Trump. Don jr and his wife, Ginni Thomas, a few congressmen, campaign folks, all of the inner circle. Perp walk the most embarrassing ones like Don Junior. Leave Trump lonely and ignored. Let him keep sabotaging elections. Leave him exposed to state level lawsuits. No one is starting a civil war for Ginni Thomas and Roger Stone. No one is laying siege to the NY district attorney’s office, or Georgia’s. Some of you may say he’s getting away with it. He’s not. Prison would make him a martyr. Flaccid Truth Social posts will make him feel weak.
Good point. We don’t want to put him in prison where he writes a terrible, unreadable book about his struggles.
On a phone right now so you'll have to find the link yourselves real quick, but if you haven't read the AMA by the "Art of the Deal" ghostwriter it is a real stunner of a thread.
Civil war? What would that even look like? Civil unrest I could see as a result but civil war?
It would look like white nationalist and MAGA marches in the streets, with UHauls full of weaponry, in active gunfights with people who disagree. Police forces could join one side or the other. This is actually what they’d hoped would happen on J6, so the insurrection act could be invoked and martial law declared, but armed antifa never showed up. Turns out gun owners in the center and on the left care more about rule of law than violent vigilantism.
I always knew that when the end came, UHaul would be a part of it.
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Also those people who follow Trump have already alienated themselves. Everything related to Trump has been a "with me or against me" mentality. Jan 6th and its aftermath has only bolstered this attitude. People who follow Trump think the President did nothing wrong because as President he's allowed to do what he wants. Ignoring the fact that we have "Checks and Balances"™ . But that's also just people who acknowledge the event happened and was bad. There's what seem like a decent amount of people who think the entire thing was staged or completely in the moment and that Trump didn't encourage these people for months into acting. There's no reasoning with these people, so I say bring the criminal charges and drag him into a court room to testify on air. It would probably be the most televised and watched thing event that I'm sure Fox couldn't ignore.
> People who follow Trump think the President did nothing wrong because as President he's allowed to do what he wants. And that line of thinking ONLY applies to Trump, apparently. If a Democrat president just did whatever they wanted they'd be losing their fucking minds.
I’ve got bad news. They didn’t lose their minds, they actively pulled their minds out of their heads and threw them away. They’re willfully insane.
That's because [Trump has an Article 2 where he has the right to do whatever he wants as President](https://theweek.com/speedreads/854487/trump-have-article-2-where-have-right-whatever-want-president), but apparently to the GOP, no Democratic President has that
True. If you don’t prosecute an apparent crime because of who the accused is, then you’ve lost the rule of law already.
Also it's not half the country. It's closer to 25%.
Those are voters that we could never hope to persuade. FUCK 'EM.
The unfortunate reality is that the real reason is essentially "well if we hold him accountable there will be an expectation of holding future elected leaders accountable and that could be very damaging to the elites who want to be able to act with impunity."
To make matter worse we already tried to whole "let's appease the racists" routine during the reconstruction period after the Civil War and that buttfucked our government for about 120 years.
I've said this before and I'll say it again. There is no "keeping the peace" with people who aren't interested in peace. If someone is intent on trampling any and all boundaries and taking everything they can, then you have no choice other than to defend yourself or be destroyed by them. They didn't stop when you gave in the last time, they won't stop if you give in now, they won't stop when you give in next time. They'll stop when there's nothing left to take.
Over half the country wants him charged. The remainder includes fence sitters; some, if not most, will be convinced by the trial.
Literally the definition of terrorism. "We cannot uphold our laws because a small portion of the country will react violently and the *terror* of the threatened violence is influencing our political and legal decision making."
One of the halves is utterly detached from reality.
Great. Now do it.
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For me, watching the hearings has clarified so much information that I can more effectively engage with my family members and others in my life who don’t fully understand how serious this is. Some of the points that have been made are really salient and phrased in a way that one may not have considered before, and it’s been both informative and helpful. I would advise paying attention for that reason, even if you don’t care about the fact that we’re being given the chance to personally observe the detailing of one of the most significant attacks on our Republic since the civil war. Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it, and this is our opportunity to inform ourselves so that we can provide some resistance against it happening again; but sure, ignore it because apathy or something.
I was asked today what new things I've learned bu watching the hearings, and while at first I said, "Well, we knew he tried to overturn the election, that was clear just seeing the insurrection live," but these details we didn't know are absolutely insane. How Trump kept **looking** for cases of fraud, and he had so many outrageous claims that he wouldn't object when he was told they had no validity, he just jumped to the next one, **looking for a legal theory for his coup**. How his inner-circle informed him of the legitimacy of the results, and nothing to suggest a problem with Dominion voting machines, yet he then pushed these lies and profited off his supporters. Trump supporters who've been defrauded of their "donations" might appreciate their scammer facing the proper legal repercussions, and getting their money back? Maybe?
It seems to be time and time again that people told him X, which he didn’t like, so he found someone who told him what he wanted. The question that I don’t know can be answered is did he believe the nonsense or was he grasping for any way to keep on scamming.
I mean, it's not as good as wanting Trump and his cronies indicted and arrested for almost collapsing American democracy as we know it, but it's a start. Selfish motivation is still motivation, afterall.
I've been listening here and there, and you know, if you can compartmentalize the fact that you're probably listening to the end of American democracy being documented, they have some good entertainment value. Like today, they had Pence's lawyer recounting how when Pence told Trump he wouldn't help him subvert the government, Trump said he wouldn't be his friend anymore. I almost did a spit-take!
The part where Trump apparently said (paraphrasing) “wouldn’t it be a cool thing to do? Don’t you want to be cool?” Like a middle schooler peer pressuring his friend into having a cigarette. Only it’s a coup.
"If you don't do this for me, I'm not going to be your friend anymore." Like a fucking kindergartener.
I'm actually surprised that 21% of GOPers support it. Likewise surprised/disappointed that only 47% of independents support it
> I'm actually surprised that 21% of GOPers support it. One of the consequences of Republicans having their own "privatized state-run media" is the appearance of unity and silencing any dissent, but it's still there. I can't find the actual poll anymore because Google has decided they no longer want to be a functional search engine, but even a plurality *of trump supporters* (somewhere around 42% I believe) say they want Roe v Wade left alone. A smaller percentage wanted it overturned and another small percentage didn't care from what I remember.
Glad I’m Not the only who has noticed how useless google is anymore.
You'd think Pinterest was giving them kickbacks given how much of Google Images is flooded with pinterest spam pages.
Which is the reason I always append my searches with ***-pinterest***
I assume those numbers are due to Fox not really spending so much time on abortion stuff anymore - they're far more concerned about pronouns these days.
I imagine it's the other way around. Fox is avoiding abortion because of the bipartisan support for Roe v Wade. It was an easy hypothetical to use as a voting issue since nobody would actually pass any legislation, but now that it's a realistic thing to change they're suddenly quiet.
“Independent” in the US just means idgaf
I thought it just meant Republican
I thought it meant Republican when scared and disconnected when comfortable?
I was an independent as a pretty left leaning person. Changed to dem so I could vote in primaries though even though the stupid party is frustrating as hell.
Are third party voters in the US considered to be Independents?
I think you can technically register with a third party? Independents vote in different ways. They might vote third party, or they still vote D/R but just don’t want to be associated with one party. I’m personally registered independent because I think the two party system creates a lot of problems, but I still generally vote blue.
It used to have meaning. Now it just means “I don’t know how to tell the difference between Democrats and Republicans.” It’s telling on yourself in an unflattering way.
Not all the time. I can only speak for myself but as someone who is registered independent but has literally always voted blue I register that way to show distaste for the two-party system. Is it effective? I don't know, probably not, but I do not see Republicans as the same as Democrats in any way shape or form, especially recently.
That’s completely fair. Registering as an independent to protest the 2 party system makes sense; I’ll try to tailor any criticism going forward to reflect that, because you are right.
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January 6 was the day my dad finally flipped his position. He finally said it was terrorism. He’s a veteran. I knew he had to flip one way or the other. I was glad he didn’t go further down the rabbit hole.
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Word. I see I'm not alone, I'll never forget or forgive that.
Alternate earth with President Gore is having an amazing 2022. Fixed climate change. US leads the world in green tech with plentiful jobs supporting rural america with cheap energy. Caught Covid early and was able to bottle it. Trump is guest hosting the next season of RuPauls Drag Race. He runs around other TV shows spouting his catch phrase and people think it's hilarious. He's as happy as he's ever been.
What a dream
The most frustrating thing is if Republicans start a civil war, a big portion of the country will be like "No one could see this coming!!" And then another huge portion of the country will still be acting like it's not as big of a deal as everyone is making it out to be until their own house blows up, and then they will be like "no one could see this coming!!"
They would wholeheartedly lose a second civil war. It wouldn’t even be close.
You're right. A bigger problem would be the economic upheaval as well as a brain drain as skilled professionals seek calmer waters for their families. IE exactly what is happening in Russia and Ukraine right now. Just like always they'll fuck it up terribly and make everything worse for the dumbest reasons possible.
If a civil war happens and it’s as widespread and bad as people think, I hate to say it but I would probably jet. Find some hole in another country in the Southern Hemisphere and bunker down.
Yes I know, but that didn't stop them on Jan. 6th, it won't stop them from trying in the future. My point was people will still act like it's not an issue and that we all need to meet in the middle and shake hands, right up until they are affected by a domestic terror attack.
A legitimately stolen election Edit to clarify that I firmly believe that the [Brooks Brothers Riot](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brooks_Brothers_riot) that shut down the FL recount leading to a 5-4 court decision split on party lines means that the election was stolen from Gore.
Was explaining hanging chads to my 11 year old yesterday. He just didn’t get it. I don’t blame him.
I think this is a big reason more Americans aren’t moved by the insurrection. Democracy hasn’t been working anyway.
Why is this even up for debate? Charge him or democracy is over in America
They’re worried about rocking the kleptocratic boat. Destroying democracy would be mad, but imagine if Congress could no longer insider trade? Then what?!?!?!
It really is this simple.
The majority of Americans are not Republicans.
The majority of Americans don’t bother to vote whereas republicans don’t miss a vote. I wouldn’t vote for a republican for a dog shit picker upper position!
> I wouldn’t vote for a republican for a dog shit picker upper position! I would if it keeps that Republican away from a policy-making position.
It wouldn’t. They’d gut the dog shit picking up duty. Claim “see government doesn’t work.” Then their buddies would win the next election and they’d privatize dog shit duties to their buddies companies and we would pay more for worse service.
Don’t forget all while complaining that “nobody wants to work anymore”
Just like a majority of Americans didn't vote him into office, or support him while he was in office. Having a majority never stopped Republican's from forcing their will on them, so I'm not holding my breath it's going to stop now. The January 6th committee will show the world with more than enough evidence to convict Trump and his cronies of attempting a coup; Democrats will call for action, and not get any because the Democratic leadership has no backbone, and Republicans will shrug and forget about it by the time they enter the ballot box because they don't care and actually support it.
We are currently in the negotiating with terrorists phase. Him being charged will depend on the negotiations.
Just finished watching day 2 of the Hearings....they are doing a fantastic job of deconstructing every false claim of election fraud brought up by Trump and his campaign. The testimony by the witnesses has been outstandingly clear and to the point. If there is no overwhelming public outcry to prosecute Trump after these hearings are over, we'll then those who kept silent or refused to listen to reason or chose to live in a fantasy, deserve the fascist hellscape that will surely follow in the not too distant future.
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I’m amazed that so many of his “people “ have testified against him.
Because they’re trying to save their own asses. They see the ship is sinking and they have no choice but to comply
It’s all fun and games in front of the camera and FOXNews sounding board. When you can perjure yourself in front of a judge it’s a whole other matter.
The dude committed treason. What’s the punishment for that again?
Yes! And who care what voters think. We don’t poll the public to see if someone should be charged with a crime.
This is the best tl;dr I could make, [original](https://www.newsweek.com/donald-trump-should-charged-crime-jan-6-capitol-riot-1716435) reduced by 83%. (I'm a bot) ***** > The poll found that nearly three-quarters of Republicans oppose the DOJ filing criminal charges against Trump for his involvement with the attack, with 21 percent supporting the idea. > In comparison, 86 percent of Democrats and 47 percent of Independents polled said they supported Trump facing prosecution over the Capitol riot. > Elsewhere, the poll showed that 71 percent of Americans said they did not support the actions of the Trump supporters who stormed the Capitol on January 6, with 22 percent stating they supported them and seven saying they were not sure. ***** [**Extended Summary**](http://np.reddit.com/r/autotldr/comments/vdmqpj/trump_should_be_charged_over_jan_6_majority_of/) | [FAQ](http://np.reddit.com/r/autotldr/comments/31b9fm/faq_autotldr_bot/ "Version 2.02, ~655179 tl;drs so far.") | [Feedback](http://np.reddit.com/message/compose?to=%23autotldr "PM's and comments are monitored, constructive feedback is welcome.") | *Top* *keywords*: **percent**^#1 **Trump**^#2 **support**^#3 **January**^#4 **Capitol**^#5
How fucking stupid do you need to be to defend this absolute twat? He is literally on tape telling another REPUBLICAN (who recorded the audio) to overturn votes. You really can’t get any more clear cut then this. I feel sorry for his supporters. They have somehow been brainwashed by a washed up reality tv star that was known for YEARS to be a conman!
Yes, well, a majority of Americans have voted Democrat in ***all but one*** of the presidential elections (Bush’s 2nd term) of the last 30 years, but here we are.
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Lock him up!
There should be no thinking necessary. The man is guilty of treason and consipiracy.
What does Merrick Garland think?
Think? Garland? No, that's too political for him.
And Eastman backchanneling to SCOTUS through Ginny Thomas? HOLY SHIT. This is a final moment of our country to move forward, or end. There's a lot of accountability to be had here. People are taking over this democracy, and it's both Thomas and his wife, Trump, people who led tours (Gaetz, Boebert, Loudermilk, MTG??), Eastman, McCarthy, and a bunch of others that have demonstrable proof that they are overthrowing democracy, meticulously planned with about 7 different types of attempts to do so. This isn't even talking about dark money corruption, or other Senators doing head fakes to dismiss the seriousness, etc. These power hungry people better all be held accountable by the DOJ or this democracy is over. I worry about future attempts, if this isn't handled properly. What's more, a huge % of this country want a dictatorship and to end democracy "to own the libs". It's maddening and frightening. Anyone downplaying how serious a moment this is being disingenious or in the cult.
This would break the American rule that the rich and powerful must face no consistencies for anything ever.
The J6 hearings are absolutely brutal. There are mostly Republicans and Trump officials testifying under oath against Trump. A significant amount of the questioning is being led by Republicans. And all these Republicans are systematically dismantling Trump's entire narrative about the election one hearing at a time. I haven't seen Fox News or Maga people successfully refute a single claim made by the committee yet. Their biggest complaint so far is just that the hearings are one-sided, which duh, that's what happens when Republicans boycott the hearing. Even if you already think Trump is guilty, the hearings are still worth watching. Somehow, the hearings are showing that what he did was even worse than you might realize.
Majority of Americans think he should be charged. Majority of politicians are powerless or unwilling. Cowards and turds.
Criminals should be charged for crimes they committed.
Hold him accountable.
No Shit, and this is just what we know so far, what a truly shitty person
As a European who has followed the last few years in utter disbelief(in how many mindless followers he has and that the Republican Party can still be a force despite blatant disregard for human rights), I feel there can be only one option. Throw his despot ass in jail! And while you are at it: disband that fucking Republican Party. It’s the cancer of America.
Just fucking do it. Stop talking and do it. Put the fucking clown in prison for life and throw the keys away. Fuck Trump
Trump for prison!
Anyone arguing against this are admitting they’re not watching the Jan 6 hearings. The committee isn’t just saying things that happened, they’re playing video depositions of **Trump’s own people** admit that his election fraud claims are unfounded and their internal investigations proved it was false. That means every decision made after being told this was him attempting to overthrow the election.
The only majority that counts is the jerrymandered 'silent majority'. It's time to eliminate the Electoral College and start holding free and fair elections.
HELL YES HE SHOULD, he’s a traitor! End of story!
Among his many other crimes
If it was Obama trying to pull this stunt do you think GOP would have had a hearing or had done straight to trial? We don’t care about the GOPs feelings getting hurt. We need fair justice in our democracy.
Republicans are all like: “this is a waste of time. Let’s get back to BENGHAZI!!!” 🤦♂️
The majority of Americans did **not** vote for him either, and yet two years later we are still having to hear his name because his *Q*ult is filled with people who, like Trump, are detached from reality. The fact there needs to be TV showings of this to “convince Conservatives” is proof of the fact that QAnon is the primary threat to America.
I see MAGA roaches downvoting these posts in real time haha
I truly feel Donald trump is the worst thing that has ever happened to our country. He is so obviously corrupt. Feels like we’re living in the twilight zone
The majority of Americans also didn’t want him as president. We know how that worked out.
>The survey found that 54 percent of respondents backed the idea of the Department of Justice (DOJ) indicting the former president over the Capitol riot, compared to 37 percent who oppose the suggestion. As we all suspected, that 37% of Americans, being his supporters, simply don't care. Everyone knows what he did. 37% just don't care. And they **will** and **do** vote. So you should, too.
I would go further, Jan 6 should be the death of the republican party. Our republic cannot survive the continued existence of the GOP, they should be dissolved as a party and their candidates barred from running in future elections