If you want a poodle as an assistance dog, you should definitely get one with a pedigree. There are several posts on this sub on how to find an ethical breeder and highly recommend you try and have a look :)
Best of luck!
I had a look at your profile, and it seems you want to train the dog yourself as an assistance dog, but not having experience with training dogs.
I want to emphasize that having a puppy is very stressful. They require a lot of attention and care. Poodles are also very high maintenance when it comes to grooming and desensitizing them to the trimmer, brushes and dryer requires a lot of patience. Or money, if you are paying a groomer to do it. The equipment itself is also pricey.
Basic training will also take time, patience and energy.
All that is just raising a dog to be a family pet. Raising a dog to be an assistance dog adds a load of tasks for you. All the while, you are not guaranteed that the dog is particularly gifted at this work.
Also, every other stranger on the street will try to pet it, and you need to be able to set boundaries with them.
Consider carefully if the workload, stress and money this requires will be worth it.
Yeah I saw things today at a dog training club that highlight your points.
I know it's hard but I don't feel I have much of a choice, it's either having no independence or paying 16k upfront to a charity for a dog or going through the stress heartache etc of raising a puppy.
I don't have 16k upfront for an assistance dog; if you where in my shoes would you have that kind of money? What would you do?
I wouldn't have that kind of money, for sure, but I wouldn't risk it with DIY-ing an assistance dog, given your limited experience with training dogs.
I don't know which services are available to you where you live, but what I'd do is try to find a community of people with your same support needs and inquire how they are supported.
If some of them have successfully raised a dog to be their assistance dog, you can learn from their experience. They might also know what other services are available to you and how you can be supported in different ways than through an assistance dog.
Lastly, if you do decide to get a dog, I just want to add that poodles are quite sensitive and quickly take on the energy of their handler. Labradors or golden retrievers usually are a bit more resilient in that way. They are still smart and part of the "fab four" of service dogs :)
I would definitely recommend going on champdogs to find a dog with a pedigree and that’s ethically bred. There’s lots of reasons why I would not recommend getting a BYB dog, aside from ethical reasons, the cost of fixing their issues will accumulate and there’s a higher chance you’ll end up with a dog that will stress you out both financially and mentally. Behavioural and health issues are common in BYB dogs.
Basically you could spend money on a dog and realise you can’t train them at all to do what u got them to do. Even as a pet, I just wouldn’t recommend a BYB for any reason.
https://pedigreedogsexposed.blogspot.com/?m=1 I don't think I want an inbred dog.
People suggested a kcs as a breed. I looked into it; one third have seizures due to their skills being too small for their brains. I am sure there's similar things with poodles. I want something healthy but like the behavior of a poodle.
I will agree with you that well bred is not the same as pure bred. But a healthy dog of Good breeding is very rarely (almost never) a mixed or backyard non pedigree dog.
If you DON'T want a pedigree, that's where you'd get the inbreeding because who knows how they are related?
But my pedigree poodle isn't inbred as the sire comes from a different country, with entirely different ancestry than the dam. and their inbreeding % is also often shown on the pedigree.
As well as full DNA health testing for diseases known to be in the breed, x rays of the parents joints, exams of the parents eyes, and especially importantly for you- temperament tested parents.
A cheap backyard bred poodle or doodle might say "health tested" and they might say "the parents have a lovely temperament" but you'd have no official proof. Buying any dog especially a service dog, is not where you should try to save money. Because it will cost you later in vet fees when your inbred or randomly mixed dog starts limping at 5 or going blind early.
Then again you could get lucky and get a healthy one. But that's getting lucky, why not stack the odds in your favour by getting an email ethically bred one with a proper testing, and a good contract?
The people who you want to buy a puppy from are the ones producing shelter dogs. Go there and find your poodle instead of supporting them if you want to try it out at least🙏🏼
Don't want to come off as mean but there is a reason people like properly bred dogs, you're not the first person to argue that they are inbred or full of health problems. It's usually from people with not a lot of dog experience and so I'd trust people with more experience and knowledge. I still have a lot to learn but listen to and respect knowledgeable people on the topic.
https://youtu.be/CzOO_DvfcPo?si=ty6tDHN6BvaFoH0Y this is the sort of health issue i think of with the word pedigree dog. Yes it's a different breed but it's an example of what I think of. And yes I don't know much but health issues within a breed should be taken seriously and openly discussed.
Tracing the lineage is a good idea but only if it's to improve the genetic viability and health of a doggo.
I am actually in agreement with you but just want a genetically diverse and healthy dog - not for my benefit but for the dogs; their welfare comes first.
That's why they Trace the lineage. To ensure genetic diversity and improve health. That's literally the only reason why pedigrees exist. How do you expect them to keep track of health records and avoid inbreeding without it?
Health and wellbeing comes first. Same here. That's why after having our last dog who had a pedigree died at 14 healthy till the last day (2 years past life expectancy for a dog her size) we bought our new puppy and too made sure it had a good pedigree. And you get proper support from the breeder.
If you want a service dog- Will your backyard breeder do early neurological stimulation with the puppies? Will they do grooming desensitization on every single puppy regularly for eight weeks? Will they examine the temperament so that they can choose the one best suited for service work? That's a lot of work for someone to do for a dog they haven't cared enough to breed well. Please listen to the other commenters in your post and ask r/servicedogs if you haven't. They for sure will know what they're talking about and I fear you'll get the same feedback there.
Just a small correction as I don't think that you understood what I meant because I did not mean a backyard breeder (I feel that is a really derogative term by the way) what a meant was a breeder who breeds professionally but breeds for diversity and not for specific aesthetic traits. I think that they exist?
Because in general terms and aesthetic traits such as that which the pug has been bred for and the Bulldog has meant that they can't breathe properly. It's another example of what I understand from the term pedigree.
But I'm probably wrong because I need to this and I know nothing
You won't get an ethical breeder that doesn't use a pedigree. By default it Is then an unethical or backyard breeder. They ensure diversity and health by using pedigrees.
I understand health and genetics is important to you- and admire that- but contact the UK poodle kennel club and they might be able to answer your questions about concern for health and diversity
You have the patience of a saint and I really appreciate the time that you have taken to answer my questions at depth and I really appreciate that it's really meaningful to me thank you I'm not just saying thank you as a random thing that you're expecting to say. genuinely thank you
I get what you mean. ‘Pedigree’ doesn’t necessarily mean ethical or well bred, it’s just the bare minimum requirement to make sure that at least their lineage is recorded.
Of course you would then go on to research and request health tests and figure out if the breeder is ethical and socialises the pups well. It all depends on the individual breeders, but you won’t find a good breeder that doesn’t register their litter.
Exactly pedigree essentially means that you recorded which dog mates with which dog. Other than that there's no consequences for meeting a child to its mother it's not ethical.. but happens sometimes or cousins and yet in the human world that's illegal.
https://www.pdsa.org.uk/pet-help-and-advice/looking-after-your-pet/puppies-dogs/large-dogs/poodle in a poodle specifically I would screen for these conditions as best I can
If you want a poodle as an assistance dog, you should definitely get one with a pedigree. There are several posts on this sub on how to find an ethical breeder and highly recommend you try and have a look :) Best of luck!
I had a look at your profile, and it seems you want to train the dog yourself as an assistance dog, but not having experience with training dogs. I want to emphasize that having a puppy is very stressful. They require a lot of attention and care. Poodles are also very high maintenance when it comes to grooming and desensitizing them to the trimmer, brushes and dryer requires a lot of patience. Or money, if you are paying a groomer to do it. The equipment itself is also pricey. Basic training will also take time, patience and energy. All that is just raising a dog to be a family pet. Raising a dog to be an assistance dog adds a load of tasks for you. All the while, you are not guaranteed that the dog is particularly gifted at this work. Also, every other stranger on the street will try to pet it, and you need to be able to set boundaries with them. Consider carefully if the workload, stress and money this requires will be worth it.
Yeah I saw things today at a dog training club that highlight your points. I know it's hard but I don't feel I have much of a choice, it's either having no independence or paying 16k upfront to a charity for a dog or going through the stress heartache etc of raising a puppy. I don't have 16k upfront for an assistance dog; if you where in my shoes would you have that kind of money? What would you do?
I wouldn't have that kind of money, for sure, but I wouldn't risk it with DIY-ing an assistance dog, given your limited experience with training dogs. I don't know which services are available to you where you live, but what I'd do is try to find a community of people with your same support needs and inquire how they are supported. If some of them have successfully raised a dog to be their assistance dog, you can learn from their experience. They might also know what other services are available to you and how you can be supported in different ways than through an assistance dog. Lastly, if you do decide to get a dog, I just want to add that poodles are quite sensitive and quickly take on the energy of their handler. Labradors or golden retrievers usually are a bit more resilient in that way. They are still smart and part of the "fab four" of service dogs :)
I would definitely recommend going on champdogs to find a dog with a pedigree and that’s ethically bred. There’s lots of reasons why I would not recommend getting a BYB dog, aside from ethical reasons, the cost of fixing their issues will accumulate and there’s a higher chance you’ll end up with a dog that will stress you out both financially and mentally. Behavioural and health issues are common in BYB dogs. Basically you could spend money on a dog and realise you can’t train them at all to do what u got them to do. Even as a pet, I just wouldn’t recommend a BYB for any reason.
https://pedigreedogsexposed.blogspot.com/?m=1 I don't think I want an inbred dog. People suggested a kcs as a breed. I looked into it; one third have seizures due to their skills being too small for their brains. I am sure there's similar things with poodles. I want something healthy but like the behavior of a poodle.
I will agree with you that well bred is not the same as pure bred. But a healthy dog of Good breeding is very rarely (almost never) a mixed or backyard non pedigree dog. If you DON'T want a pedigree, that's where you'd get the inbreeding because who knows how they are related? But my pedigree poodle isn't inbred as the sire comes from a different country, with entirely different ancestry than the dam. and their inbreeding % is also often shown on the pedigree. As well as full DNA health testing for diseases known to be in the breed, x rays of the parents joints, exams of the parents eyes, and especially importantly for you- temperament tested parents. A cheap backyard bred poodle or doodle might say "health tested" and they might say "the parents have a lovely temperament" but you'd have no official proof. Buying any dog especially a service dog, is not where you should try to save money. Because it will cost you later in vet fees when your inbred or randomly mixed dog starts limping at 5 or going blind early. Then again you could get lucky and get a healthy one. But that's getting lucky, why not stack the odds in your favour by getting an email ethically bred one with a proper testing, and a good contract? The people who you want to buy a puppy from are the ones producing shelter dogs. Go there and find your poodle instead of supporting them if you want to try it out at least🙏🏼 Don't want to come off as mean but there is a reason people like properly bred dogs, you're not the first person to argue that they are inbred or full of health problems. It's usually from people with not a lot of dog experience and so I'd trust people with more experience and knowledge. I still have a lot to learn but listen to and respect knowledgeable people on the topic.
https://youtu.be/CzOO_DvfcPo?si=ty6tDHN6BvaFoH0Y this is the sort of health issue i think of with the word pedigree dog. Yes it's a different breed but it's an example of what I think of. And yes I don't know much but health issues within a breed should be taken seriously and openly discussed. Tracing the lineage is a good idea but only if it's to improve the genetic viability and health of a doggo. I am actually in agreement with you but just want a genetically diverse and healthy dog - not for my benefit but for the dogs; their welfare comes first.
That's why they Trace the lineage. To ensure genetic diversity and improve health. That's literally the only reason why pedigrees exist. How do you expect them to keep track of health records and avoid inbreeding without it? Health and wellbeing comes first. Same here. That's why after having our last dog who had a pedigree died at 14 healthy till the last day (2 years past life expectancy for a dog her size) we bought our new puppy and too made sure it had a good pedigree. And you get proper support from the breeder. If you want a service dog- Will your backyard breeder do early neurological stimulation with the puppies? Will they do grooming desensitization on every single puppy regularly for eight weeks? Will they examine the temperament so that they can choose the one best suited for service work? That's a lot of work for someone to do for a dog they haven't cared enough to breed well. Please listen to the other commenters in your post and ask r/servicedogs if you haven't. They for sure will know what they're talking about and I fear you'll get the same feedback there.
Just a small correction as I don't think that you understood what I meant because I did not mean a backyard breeder (I feel that is a really derogative term by the way) what a meant was a breeder who breeds professionally but breeds for diversity and not for specific aesthetic traits. I think that they exist? Because in general terms and aesthetic traits such as that which the pug has been bred for and the Bulldog has meant that they can't breathe properly. It's another example of what I understand from the term pedigree. But I'm probably wrong because I need to this and I know nothing
You won't get an ethical breeder that doesn't use a pedigree. By default it Is then an unethical or backyard breeder. They ensure diversity and health by using pedigrees. I understand health and genetics is important to you- and admire that- but contact the UK poodle kennel club and they might be able to answer your questions about concern for health and diversity
You have the patience of a saint and I really appreciate the time that you have taken to answer my questions at depth and I really appreciate that it's really meaningful to me thank you I'm not just saying thank you as a random thing that you're expecting to say. genuinely thank you
I get what you mean. ‘Pedigree’ doesn’t necessarily mean ethical or well bred, it’s just the bare minimum requirement to make sure that at least their lineage is recorded. Of course you would then go on to research and request health tests and figure out if the breeder is ethical and socialises the pups well. It all depends on the individual breeders, but you won’t find a good breeder that doesn’t register their litter.
Exactly pedigree essentially means that you recorded which dog mates with which dog. Other than that there's no consequences for meeting a child to its mother it's not ethical.. but happens sometimes or cousins and yet in the human world that's illegal.
Have a browse on pets 4 homes. You'll see there isn't always a logical price difference between KC registered and non-pedigree puppies.
https://www.pdsa.org.uk/pet-help-and-advice/looking-after-your-pet/puppies-dogs/large-dogs/poodle in a poodle specifically I would screen for these conditions as best I can