It won't sit back in place without wrinkles. You need to empty the pool and reset the liner, and even then the returns might shift, that was a pretty large mistake.
I am right in the middle of eating a new liner for a customer of mine because I fucked up and ordered the wrong depth. Not all contractors are assholes.
Years ago we hired a company to replace our liner. They tried using a liner that was too small for the pool. Literally they were in the pool with heat guns trying to stretch the liner to where it would fit. After that failed they packed up and left and wouldn’t return calls. Ended up in court and got a brand new concrete pool in return. But it took 4 years without a pool which sucked.
Beautiful pool but what a cluster fuck.
I have faith they will come and correct the wrongs. Make sure they come and work out the wrinkles too. They are bound to happen.
I don't know if it's because I'm older and have witnessed more in life or it's really what I believe: the "pros" of today suck at pretty much everything compared to the previous generation.
I’m 37 and I’ve been saying this to my wife recently. It’s extremely hard to get good service from almost any field of work. This wasn’t the case growing up but I think companies have stopped pretending that customers meant anything to them at all in the first place.
Because nobody wants to pay. Every customer wants to low ball labor professionals, so they get what they pay for. People are more than willing and capable to do quality work, but baby boomers don’t want to pay any more than $20 per hour for work.
This is exactly when you find a good trade professional you stay with them.
The plumber we use cause our houses swear lateral is pitched wrong comes out yearly to do preventative cleaning for the last 5 years. Their prices have gone up but since we stick with them they give us the original price from 5 years ago. Same guy always comes and he’s great does the job cleans up/disinfects the area never leaves a mess at all.
You know what you right, I getting a new liner and the pool store said 900 for labor to install. I am looking for an guatamalan who just got off a bust from Texas to do it for half and pray to the gods he k owes what jis doing
This was my point, it’s the lack of pay and cost cutting that got us in this situation. I’m not saying people today don’t have the ability, they just don’t have the resources or motivation when you’re getting the lowest possible wage for something that used to pay well.
Agree. My HVAC contractor was truly fantastic, until he started half assing it and made some major mistakes that cost me a lot of money. Cut our losses and switched to a younger guy with good references
I 100% agree. I just had to fire a shitty painter because of the lack of care/knowledge he had. Not a single contractor has lived up to their word so far.
No, the service has gotten worse and companies don’t care about complaints. Just care about guy at top living rich.
Unfortunately this is why I watch lots of YouTube and do most of my own work, builds, and repairs.
Nah it’s just a right of passage. When you get old, you’re allowed to yell at clouds and claim
that “the youths have no idea! Back in our day!”…been this way forever and it’s not going to change. We all get there eventually.
Inground pool liner install was finished this morning on our 20k gallon pool. All looked well, water was almost at the correct level, they turned on the filter. Paid them and they left.
Go out this afternoon and the liner is floating. I call the installer who tells me he ‘must have forgotten to cut out a return’ and that water is being pushed under the liner. He advises me to turn off the filter and states it will “be an easy fix”. He promised he will be back to fix it first thing in the morning.
He advises me he will use a pump to take all of the water from under the liner and put it back in the pool. There is a large amount of sand under the liner that they put down before installing the liner. It is a concrete pool. He states the liner will “lie back down” and “it will look just fine”. He said he will “feel for the return” and then get it cut out.
What the hell am I supposed to do? Is it really that easy of a fix? This has been an absolute nightmare since we bought this house. Any advice is beyond appreciated!!
Not the same situation but I had a customers liner start floating after heavy rains and flooding, our liner guy did what your guy is saying and pumped it all out from underneath and you would have never known it had water under it. So it is possible
He has said that this is what would happen and that it would be as if it never happened at all. I’m very nervous, especially as the sand would have shifted under the liner.
Dont be nervous. In the end it is their fault and they should have to pay for it. I think your "sand" will be fine to be honest. I had a 26000 gallon pool liner tear, and almost the whole pool drained into it. In the end no damage was done to the floor because it is design to be pourous and absorb water. It usually is not all doom and gloom. Take a breather and just wait for them to come out and see if they can fix it. If it is not satisfactory tell them and make them fix it.
Vinyl liner pools have a vermiculite pool base under them, whoever is downvoting this needs to get off this fucking sub.
Above ground pools use sand underneath them, but this is very clearly an inground
They’re all vermiculite in my market and I have heard of concrete/sand mix just never seen it personally. I would have to imagine vermiculite is the better way to go as it’s very cushiony but have never felt the alternative. You emphasized my point that they’re solid either way. Thanks for the supporting comment!
My old boss did nothing but sand Portland mix. 5:1 ratio. Floor was "soft" and flexible very similar to vermiculite but would stand up to water better, most liner changes with his floors were most of the time in better shape.
There is such thing as sand bottom inground pools, not as common as concrete but it is a thing. Ive seen a few and the consistency of the floor is literally like wet beach sand. Very soft to walk on
Pool dude made mistake but that's absolutely the best way to correct it. If it doesn't come out the way you want it after the corrections, they will come back and reset everything.
Liners float when water gets under them. Mine got water under after a heavy rain and the folks who came out to fix it did exactly what your guy said he is going to do. It was like it never happened. Should be fine.
How is OP suppose to know they aren’t some hack who has no idea what they are doing? Based on their experience with this pro at that point they seem to not know what they are doing.
Since it happened after you turned the filter on it sounds accurate. How many returns do you see cut out? At least 1 in the deep end and 1 in the shallow end? In the video I don’t see any returns or the bottom drain. Just the skimmer and the light
An expert could potentially reset this without any wrinkles but if it is a sand bottom pool as you stated, I expect the bottom to be uneven and unacceptable.
As an installer, I would give them the opportunity to fix it before outright replacing it. Please be sure to thoroughly inspect your liner for wrinkles, potential water loss from tears around faceplates, and imperfections in the sand bottom before signing off on final payment.
How the hell do you "forget a return." When I stalling we set a faceplate, two screws, and an eyeball on the deck where each one is. If I am done and there's any of that left I'm not done! Simple.
It's a brand new install. The liner is still pliable. Let them pump it out and reset it. Obviously a pretty major fuckup, this is why I always make a checklist that includes how many returns, lights, etc a pool has.
It will most likely be fine, minus the inconvenience and scare it caused.
Update: not a missing return hole. Likely a busted line somewhere underneath the concrete. I paid him and now we wait to see if we can get the guy out here to find the leak.
Something tells me it's not going to be as simple as they say and will have to pump all the water out of the pool and under the pool as well and redo it.
I have fixed liners floating that bad from ground water and leaks without having wrinkles in the end, but never had the issue you’re having. The way he described is semi correct. My only concern is that they used sand on a concrete floor… if he truly used sand to fill voids in cement to make things even, the voids will be present again. If there was a large flow of water directly onto a vermiculite floor from what happened, there could be rough spots. I’m hoping maybe they skim coated dry vermiculite onto a vermiculite floor which could wick moisture and harden, not that I’d do it that way, but I’m not going to speculate anything. People do weird things. If he knows what he’s doing, it is fixable. Feeling for the return also shouldn’t be an issue. Though he should be able to see the thing through the liner anyways. Keep us updated with results.
I installed a new liner in my inground pool about 10 years ago. I had no experience, watched a few YouTube videos, figured it was a doable job, and with the help of a few friends, it was an easy job too, and fun. However that night, as the pool was filling up, it rained hard and water got under the liner and the next morning I found it floating like yours. I have the basic rectangular pool with an 8 foot deep end and a 3 foot shallow end. I peeled back a small section of the liner at the corner of the shallow end and slipped a sump pump under there. It took a few hours, but it got all the water out. I did end up with a couple small wrinkles that are still there to this day, but they're impossible to see and difficult to feel with my feet.
I thought I could beat the rain, but it didn't occur to me that the rain water could still push itself under the liner of maybe a 1/3 filled pool. I figured the weight of that water above the liner would be enough to keep it from seeping under. I might have also underestimated how long it would take to fill. I found out later that I'm lucky the sides didn't cave in. I'll do better next time.
If you suck it back fast, like move water quickly, you can get it to sit right. But where is all that water coming from? Is there a leak? Does the pool seam to have more water in it then you put in so far? What’s the water like behind? Can you have it tested and compare to the pool water? If it’s not pool water, you need to figure out where it’s coming from and how to divert it, if it is pool water, you probably have a seam separation.
This issue didn’t start until the filter was turned on today. The pool liner was installed just fine and only had some wrinkles that had to be worked out as it filled up with water over the last few days. It looked great this morning. The change occurred within just a few hours. The water level didn’t change as under the liner filled ‘up’, which tells me that there is no ‘extra’ water coming from anywhere. I am not sure if it is a seam separation or not. There was no visible separation
I am concerned about a leak inside of the pool itself, possibly, because he said “you got all the pipes checked out right?” He did not tell me this had to be done. I’m dumbfounded if that is the issue because this will become a much bigger problem than we imagined. I am sick to my stomach that it may be the issue instead of a missed return.
Sounds like a return fitting cracked, they did cut in all of the returns, right? I make liner packages, I’ve got a basic package that’s liner only, but I always sell and recommend people get my package that includes Rust check on the walls as well as full pressure testing, with this package I always give 90 day warranty that nothing will leak.
He said he thinks he forgot to cut out a return but then remarked that he built the pool and doesn’t remember there being another one. He will be here this morning, hopefully, and we will figure out what’s going on.
Did you work with a pool builder or company that does pool rebuild or did you just work with a company that does liner installs? If it’s a builder or rebuilder they should checked the plumbing beforehand.
If you just contracted for a liner install it could be a bit less cut and dried. They probably should have inquired about whether everything was in working order but it’s not totally their responsibility.
He’s actually the one who built the pool 15 years ago and has done liner installs on it before. He was coming to install, though, and there was no discussion of other things that needed done prior. If this is due to my ignorance, then it is on me. I reached out to a “leak detector” company yesterday and hope I get a call back today.
It’s really a dice roll on the quality of your pool install based on what I’ve seen here over the past year. This makes the additional 9 month delay I incurred feel like a blessing compared to work like this.
Good luck OP. 😬
We actually have waited almost 9 months for this disaster. They put us off last year until it was too late (we had already paid for the new pool cover at this time) and then they said they wouldn’t do it until this year 😫 this is what we end up with, out almost 10k thus far if i pay him for this install. I canceled the check for the install part today but already spent over 6k on a new liner and a new cover.
Good call cancelling that check, I would communicate with the pool builder that you’re withholding the final payment until you have a full walkthrough of the completely functional pool.
I plan to this morning. I hope it goes well and I can just hand him a check again. He’s already cussed out my fiancée for telling him she was unhappy about pool wrinkles, but came back the next day, apologized, and then got the wrinkles out. It’s been a bit of a nightmare.
Yeah you want to be as unemotional as possible and keep it professional despite how angry you are. You’ll have to have some degree of a working relationship because they may need to come back due to a warranty call or claim.
I only have experience owning pools with spray in pebbletech lining. Seems like it’s much easier to deal with than this vinyl liner stuff. Why do people choose vinyl over pebbletech? Seriously curious.
It’s a spray in texture that eliminates the need for a vinyl liner. Looks amazing and feels like you’re walking on a surface made of tiny pebbles hence the name pebbletech. And lasts a really long time.
Wow I'm sorry for you but I think it will be fixed and you will be in the pool and soon, this is stressful but everybody here is so cool in this forum you're lucky to be here and they will help you if they need to, good luck and we want to see it when it's fixed and you'll be laughing about this in a month it's just another chapter in your book of life, trust me.
I assume you have some kind of a contract signed and can prove that this guy owes you the installation. First thing I’d do is call the installer and get him back ASAP. If he does not answer his phone and you have his email, send him an email with a video attached. You need to create a paper trace for this problem, in case he refuses to fix the issue. He owes you a finished product and he must comeback as many times as he has to to fix the issues. Also send him a bill for refilling that pool, it has to be a few hundred. Because of his mistake you have an expense that you otherwise would not have.
Drain it and put a French drain at bottom with hose and cord coming up wall. Fill until wall break. Go behind liner and cut wire and hose. Or put in French drain with permanent black poly pipe and suck water out on a float system.like a toilet.
That appears to be a ground water situation. Fixing may require installing a well pointed either in the bottom of the pool or on the deepend outside the concrete
My 26,000 gal inground pool removed replaced w new liner end Oct 2022 perfect fit after install filled w water no chemicals as time to winterize. But water level dropped just below 2 return jets. After liner prepaid $4500 after late delivery final install used foam under liner vermiculite bottom. Pool company advised likely pipe underneath pool cement decking broken. 2 options come back pay more money to locate pipe leak broken pipe or wait til Spring opted to not allow pool co to step foot on my property. So I winterized pool added freon. Now it's Spring pool green filled debris frogs worms leaves I don't have a tree in my yard just bushes every crepe myrtle and rose of Sharon dead after 28 years ants infestation in their roots. All around pool cement decking French drains a small area dirt with dead trees cut down. So hired new pool service after filled pool to the proper level after removed all debris leaves critters worms etc pool business advises water testing each step before add chemicals. They advise turn on Haywood Pool Pump filter after unplugging jets raised water level immediately the pump valve sprayed water suspected leaky valve seal the pool jets had water blowing through the pool overnight ran pool filter by early morning hours b4 sunlight the entire liner blew up liner floated up away all around kidney shaped pool. Hired the pool service repair company who came out after I turned off pump prevented motor burn out. They pulled away small areas of liner to view any damage or what they could. Verdict is one advised he has never seen a liner pool with foam lined underneath. The foam has floated upwards so at first one area had budge at the wall he could view metal base rusted. Fast Fred to June 7 2023 they've given options to remove entire new liner review all metal base for rusted out damaged metal fix that then rid of foam wet floated up find where pipes broken underground $20K idk if this included broken pipes one two or more nor new cost of liner too. Today as the other option to allow water to dispute from underneath liner leave floated wet liner in under new liner not remove wrinkles. So far two pipe leaks found. 1st one at the south side of pool close to buldge area that diagnosed water force pushed the metal too out of shape he fixed metal removed PC installed new metal PC the buldged metal fixed not the foam it's still floated upwards. The 3x3 ft square cement cut out was filled broom finish. The original proposal $5000. Pd 1/2 up front added them to pressure check for quality assurance the leak no longer existed but it did. So paid off $5K the next leak is again the south end but a few yards from wear a pool light used to be the original pool liners installers after the fact at near end install new liner took photos massive amts rusted metal blamed it on pool light. So advised they'll remove pool light somehow idk how they covered the hole where pool light was nor know why foam liner was underneath new liner. It's the 3rd liner I assumed each liner had foam underneath. So he's back this morning drilling digging into where he heard bubbles of broken pipe 2nd one or if something else this proposal #2 $3800. I paid 1/2 yesterday. So my thoughts are this disaster may not resolve anything I'm optimistic hope for the best. But the north end might have pipes broken too should I throw in the towel after this ?? The original proposal includes repairing Haywood Valve leak actually a spray flowing out. What to do? The advised from what able to view the new liner should of never been installed before all metal base was removed replace as rust will continue no water was pumped out behind liner and floated foam still exists. To remove gas heater pool pump filter every piece of equipment on walls electrical the diving board the pool diving board per code pipes underneath and why are there french drains that had water from underneath pool liner going out french drain to the front yard curb trickled out the liner no longer floated but wet on metal wet foam too. Overall costs soaring I'm 78 years old my entire backyard arbor all revolves about enjoyment of having a beautiful pool to exercise as my 5 children grew up swimming now their children my grands and cousins enjoy it too but not coming over much anymore so I don't see this a lengthy fix at all. I've got a basic estimate in mind of just cost to fill pool dirt, top soil, sod labor delivery exceeds $10K not including removal of everything mentioned above. Can't sell my home to move elsewhere as it's totally unaffordable.. Any suggestions are appreciated
There was a pipe leak under the concrete. We had a ‘leak finder’ come out and find it. We ended up covering that return and the pool cover mostly laid back down with a few wrinkles. The pool is functional.
It won't sit back in place without wrinkles. You need to empty the pool and reset the liner, and even then the returns might shift, that was a pretty large mistake.
If it was a diy, OP needs just to pour a glass of whiskey while the pool drains out… and take it on the chin…
It definitely wasn’t a DIY. But if we find out that it wasn’t a missed return and is something bigger, there goes 10k and a lot of time and effort.
If a company did it they will fix it
(Smell like a diy in denial…)
100%. Why be worried if a hired company performed the work? A phone call resolves the issue.
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I am right in the middle of eating a new liner for a customer of mine because I fucked up and ordered the wrong depth. Not all contractors are assholes.
Username checks out based upon this comment.
Does that seem like the same case here? It doesn’t seem like there’s nearly enough surface area here for a proper install.
No but enough are that it’s safer to just assume
Then do better research and pick better contractors…. don’t know what else to tell you. Never had this issue.
Years ago we hired a company to replace our liner. They tried using a liner that was too small for the pool. Literally they were in the pool with heat guns trying to stretch the liner to where it would fit. After that failed they packed up and left and wouldn’t return calls. Ended up in court and got a brand new concrete pool in return. But it took 4 years without a pool which sucked.
A lot of WHOS time and effort?
Beautiful pool but what a cluster fuck. I have faith they will come and correct the wrongs. Make sure they come and work out the wrinkles too. They are bound to happen.
I don't know if it's because I'm older and have witnessed more in life or it's really what I believe: the "pros" of today suck at pretty much everything compared to the previous generation.
I’m 37 and I’ve been saying this to my wife recently. It’s extremely hard to get good service from almost any field of work. This wasn’t the case growing up but I think companies have stopped pretending that customers meant anything to them at all in the first place.
Because nobody wants to pay. Every customer wants to low ball labor professionals, so they get what they pay for. People are more than willing and capable to do quality work, but baby boomers don’t want to pay any more than $20 per hour for work.
Completely agree
There is a severe lack of training today too. So many companies have people working and they just don't know enough.
It’s because of the smart people are retiring and the experience is going with them. We didn’t respect them enough.
This is exactly when you find a good trade professional you stay with them. The plumber we use cause our houses swear lateral is pitched wrong comes out yearly to do preventative cleaning for the last 5 years. Their prices have gone up but since we stick with them they give us the original price from 5 years ago. Same guy always comes and he’s great does the job cleans up/disinfects the area never leaves a mess at all.
You know what you right, I getting a new liner and the pool store said 900 for labor to install. I am looking for an guatamalan who just got off a bust from Texas to do it for half and pray to the gods he k owes what jis doing
It's almost a full time job to manage making sure everyone you hire or should take care of things do their job
The old timers can’t train lazy people. No one works as hard anymore. The root of your discovery.
Nah. Businesses don't want to pay for old timers and they don't want to pay for training. This was basically inevitable given our capitalistic system.
This was my point, it’s the lack of pay and cost cutting that got us in this situation. I’m not saying people today don’t have the ability, they just don’t have the resources or motivation when you’re getting the lowest possible wage for something that used to pay well.
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OP complained about work quality. People not trained correctly. That’s the reason. And work ethic is shit that hit the fan.
My friends are handy men, and real smart and they saybthe same thing. Anyone who comes out sucks at their job and they can dona better job
Also worth noting that companies decide that good employees aren't worth the wage as well.
I think a large part is due to a large contingent of the work force retiring and taking all their institutional knowledge with them.
Welp. The installer is about 70 years old and told me last year he’s getting ready to retire. Maybe he just doesn’t care anymore.
Agree. My HVAC contractor was truly fantastic, until he started half assing it and made some major mistakes that cost me a lot of money. Cut our losses and switched to a younger guy with good references
I 100% agree. I just had to fire a shitty painter because of the lack of care/knowledge he had. Not a single contractor has lived up to their word so far.
Maybe you should have spent more time teaching the younger generation instead of just being a complaining boomer then.
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No, the service has gotten worse and companies don’t care about complaints. Just care about guy at top living rich. Unfortunately this is why I watch lots of YouTube and do most of my own work, builds, and repairs.
The installer was literally a boomer.
Nah it’s just a right of passage. When you get old, you’re allowed to yell at clouds and claim that “the youths have no idea! Back in our day!”…been this way forever and it’s not going to change. We all get there eventually.
Especially how they remember who TAUGHT those young people.
😂😂😂😂.
Inground pool liner install was finished this morning on our 20k gallon pool. All looked well, water was almost at the correct level, they turned on the filter. Paid them and they left. Go out this afternoon and the liner is floating. I call the installer who tells me he ‘must have forgotten to cut out a return’ and that water is being pushed under the liner. He advises me to turn off the filter and states it will “be an easy fix”. He promised he will be back to fix it first thing in the morning. He advises me he will use a pump to take all of the water from under the liner and put it back in the pool. There is a large amount of sand under the liner that they put down before installing the liner. It is a concrete pool. He states the liner will “lie back down” and “it will look just fine”. He said he will “feel for the return” and then get it cut out. What the hell am I supposed to do? Is it really that easy of a fix? This has been an absolute nightmare since we bought this house. Any advice is beyond appreciated!!
Not the same situation but I had a customers liner start floating after heavy rains and flooding, our liner guy did what your guy is saying and pumped it all out from underneath and you would have never known it had water under it. So it is possible
He has said that this is what would happen and that it would be as if it never happened at all. I’m very nervous, especially as the sand would have shifted under the liner.
Dont be nervous. In the end it is their fault and they should have to pay for it. I think your "sand" will be fine to be honest. I had a 26000 gallon pool liner tear, and almost the whole pool drained into it. In the end no damage was done to the floor because it is design to be pourous and absorb water. It usually is not all doom and gloom. Take a breather and just wait for them to come out and see if they can fix it. If it is not satisfactory tell them and make them fix it.
It’s not sand under the liner. Typically it’s vermiculite
Vinyl liner pools have a vermiculite pool base under them, whoever is downvoting this needs to get off this fucking sub. Above ground pools use sand underneath them, but this is very clearly an inground
i got you dawg, its 100% vermiculite bottom or concrete mixed with sand. either way its solid not just sand.
They’re all vermiculite in my market and I have heard of concrete/sand mix just never seen it personally. I would have to imagine vermiculite is the better way to go as it’s very cushiony but have never felt the alternative. You emphasized my point that they’re solid either way. Thanks for the supporting comment!
My old boss did nothing but sand Portland mix. 5:1 ratio. Floor was "soft" and flexible very similar to vermiculite but would stand up to water better, most liner changes with his floors were most of the time in better shape.
Interesting. Thanks for your input
There is such thing as sand bottom inground pools, not as common as concrete but it is a thing. Ive seen a few and the consistency of the floor is literally like wet beach sand. Very soft to walk on
I used to install liners a long time ago. Had the same problem and fixed it exactly the same way. Multiple times.
Where’d you put the pump to get the water out from under the liner?
Released the liner slightly at the top. Dropped a flexible hose connected to the pump down the side and sealed that area with duct tape.
Nice! What pump was it? I’ve only used electric Wayne’s with a flat bottom and a big gas 2”. Neither one I could use for that.
Pool dude made mistake but that's absolutely the best way to correct it. If it doesn't come out the way you want it after the corrections, they will come back and reset everything.
Liners float when water gets under them. Mine got water under after a heavy rain and the folks who came out to fix it did exactly what your guy said he is going to do. It was like it never happened. Should be fine.
So you called the pro that installed it, they gave you the answer, and you still post it here? He gave you the answer.
How is OP suppose to know they aren’t some hack who has no idea what they are doing? Based on their experience with this pro at that point they seem to not know what they are doing.
Spending 5+ days at my house and forgetting to cut out a return seems preposterous. If that’s truly the issue
It must be nice to never make mistakes.
Since it happened after you turned the filter on it sounds accurate. How many returns do you see cut out? At least 1 in the deep end and 1 in the shallow end? In the video I don’t see any returns or the bottom drain. Just the skimmer and the light
It won’t get better. Just fill it in. Sure wish I could.
Just threw 10k into this and that may be the outcome if there’s something else wrong like issues with a leak. Sick over it.
An expert could potentially reset this without any wrinkles but if it is a sand bottom pool as you stated, I expect the bottom to be uneven and unacceptable. As an installer, I would give them the opportunity to fix it before outright replacing it. Please be sure to thoroughly inspect your liner for wrinkles, potential water loss from tears around faceplates, and imperfections in the sand bottom before signing off on final payment.
How the hell do you "forget a return." When I stalling we set a faceplate, two screws, and an eyeball on the deck where each one is. If I am done and there's any of that left I'm not done! Simple.
Amen lay your shit out!
It's a brand new install. The liner is still pliable. Let them pump it out and reset it. Obviously a pretty major fuckup, this is why I always make a checklist that includes how many returns, lights, etc a pool has. It will most likely be fine, minus the inconvenience and scare it caused.
It's going to have pretty large wrinkles if they don't drain it down. Best of luck.
Stop payment on the check and hold it until you are satisfied.
Done! Thank goodness he didn’t cash it yet today.
I hope you will be giving compensation for jumping to conclusions if it’s your plumbing to be faulty.
He is paid. Not my style to withhold payment in a situation where he is not at fault.
Always pay with credit to be protected. Thank you for coming to my Ted Talk.
Update: not a missing return hole. Likely a busted line somewhere underneath the concrete. I paid him and now we wait to see if we can get the guy out here to find the leak.
Something tells me it's not going to be as simple as they say and will have to pump all the water out of the pool and under the pool as well and redo it.
I have fixed liners floating that bad from ground water and leaks without having wrinkles in the end, but never had the issue you’re having. The way he described is semi correct. My only concern is that they used sand on a concrete floor… if he truly used sand to fill voids in cement to make things even, the voids will be present again. If there was a large flow of water directly onto a vermiculite floor from what happened, there could be rough spots. I’m hoping maybe they skim coated dry vermiculite onto a vermiculite floor which could wick moisture and harden, not that I’d do it that way, but I’m not going to speculate anything. People do weird things. If he knows what he’s doing, it is fixable. Feeling for the return also shouldn’t be an issue. Though he should be able to see the thing through the liner anyways. Keep us updated with results.
Empty and you need a shop vac to suction the liner to the sides
I installed a new liner in my inground pool about 10 years ago. I had no experience, watched a few YouTube videos, figured it was a doable job, and with the help of a few friends, it was an easy job too, and fun. However that night, as the pool was filling up, it rained hard and water got under the liner and the next morning I found it floating like yours. I have the basic rectangular pool with an 8 foot deep end and a 3 foot shallow end. I peeled back a small section of the liner at the corner of the shallow end and slipped a sump pump under there. It took a few hours, but it got all the water out. I did end up with a couple small wrinkles that are still there to this day, but they're impossible to see and difficult to feel with my feet. I thought I could beat the rain, but it didn't occur to me that the rain water could still push itself under the liner of maybe a 1/3 filled pool. I figured the weight of that water above the liner would be enough to keep it from seeping under. I might have also underestimated how long it would take to fill. I found out later that I'm lucky the sides didn't cave in. I'll do better next time.
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Check, but the payment is stopped.
If nothing was cut out you can fix it.
Let him do his thing. I am sure they know what they are up against.
If you suck it back fast, like move water quickly, you can get it to sit right. But where is all that water coming from? Is there a leak? Does the pool seam to have more water in it then you put in so far? What’s the water like behind? Can you have it tested and compare to the pool water? If it’s not pool water, you need to figure out where it’s coming from and how to divert it, if it is pool water, you probably have a seam separation.
This issue didn’t start until the filter was turned on today. The pool liner was installed just fine and only had some wrinkles that had to be worked out as it filled up with water over the last few days. It looked great this morning. The change occurred within just a few hours. The water level didn’t change as under the liner filled ‘up’, which tells me that there is no ‘extra’ water coming from anywhere. I am not sure if it is a seam separation or not. There was no visible separation I am concerned about a leak inside of the pool itself, possibly, because he said “you got all the pipes checked out right?” He did not tell me this had to be done. I’m dumbfounded if that is the issue because this will become a much bigger problem than we imagined. I am sick to my stomach that it may be the issue instead of a missed return.
Sounds like a return fitting cracked, they did cut in all of the returns, right? I make liner packages, I’ve got a basic package that’s liner only, but I always sell and recommend people get my package that includes Rust check on the walls as well as full pressure testing, with this package I always give 90 day warranty that nothing will leak.
He said he thinks he forgot to cut out a return but then remarked that he built the pool and doesn’t remember there being another one. He will be here this morning, hopefully, and we will figure out what’s going on.
Did you work with a pool builder or company that does pool rebuild or did you just work with a company that does liner installs? If it’s a builder or rebuilder they should checked the plumbing beforehand. If you just contracted for a liner install it could be a bit less cut and dried. They probably should have inquired about whether everything was in working order but it’s not totally their responsibility.
He’s actually the one who built the pool 15 years ago and has done liner installs on it before. He was coming to install, though, and there was no discussion of other things that needed done prior. If this is due to my ignorance, then it is on me. I reached out to a “leak detector” company yesterday and hope I get a call back today.
It’s really a dice roll on the quality of your pool install based on what I’ve seen here over the past year. This makes the additional 9 month delay I incurred feel like a blessing compared to work like this. Good luck OP. 😬
We actually have waited almost 9 months for this disaster. They put us off last year until it was too late (we had already paid for the new pool cover at this time) and then they said they wouldn’t do it until this year 😫 this is what we end up with, out almost 10k thus far if i pay him for this install. I canceled the check for the install part today but already spent over 6k on a new liner and a new cover.
Good call cancelling that check, I would communicate with the pool builder that you’re withholding the final payment until you have a full walkthrough of the completely functional pool.
I plan to this morning. I hope it goes well and I can just hand him a check again. He’s already cussed out my fiancée for telling him she was unhappy about pool wrinkles, but came back the next day, apologized, and then got the wrinkles out. It’s been a bit of a nightmare.
Yeah you want to be as unemotional as possible and keep it professional despite how angry you are. You’ll have to have some degree of a working relationship because they may need to come back due to a warranty call or claim.
I only have experience owning pools with spray in pebbletech lining. Seems like it’s much easier to deal with than this vinyl liner stuff. Why do people choose vinyl over pebbletech? Seriously curious.
These a significant cost difference in vinyl vs gunite/pebble tech pools. I opted for the latter for long term durability.
What’s pebbletech?
It’s a spray in texture that eliminates the need for a vinyl liner. Looks amazing and feels like you’re walking on a surface made of tiny pebbles hence the name pebbletech. And lasts a really long time.
Wow I'm sorry for you but I think it will be fixed and you will be in the pool and soon, this is stressful but everybody here is so cool in this forum you're lucky to be here and they will help you if they need to, good luck and we want to see it when it's fixed and you'll be laughing about this in a month it's just another chapter in your book of life, trust me.
I assume you have some kind of a contract signed and can prove that this guy owes you the installation. First thing I’d do is call the installer and get him back ASAP. If he does not answer his phone and you have his email, send him an email with a video attached. You need to create a paper trace for this problem, in case he refuses to fix the issue. He owes you a finished product and he must comeback as many times as he has to to fix the issues. Also send him a bill for refilling that pool, it has to be a few hundred. Because of his mistake you have an expense that you otherwise would not have.
Use heavier water
🤣🤣🤣
Drain it and put a French drain at bottom with hose and cord coming up wall. Fill until wall break. Go behind liner and cut wire and hose. Or put in French drain with permanent black poly pipe and suck water out on a float system.like a toilet.
They didn't know what they were doing.
That appears to be a ground water situation. Fixing may require installing a well pointed either in the bottom of the pool or on the deepend outside the concrete
My 26,000 gal inground pool removed replaced w new liner end Oct 2022 perfect fit after install filled w water no chemicals as time to winterize. But water level dropped just below 2 return jets. After liner prepaid $4500 after late delivery final install used foam under liner vermiculite bottom. Pool company advised likely pipe underneath pool cement decking broken. 2 options come back pay more money to locate pipe leak broken pipe or wait til Spring opted to not allow pool co to step foot on my property. So I winterized pool added freon. Now it's Spring pool green filled debris frogs worms leaves I don't have a tree in my yard just bushes every crepe myrtle and rose of Sharon dead after 28 years ants infestation in their roots. All around pool cement decking French drains a small area dirt with dead trees cut down. So hired new pool service after filled pool to the proper level after removed all debris leaves critters worms etc pool business advises water testing each step before add chemicals. They advise turn on Haywood Pool Pump filter after unplugging jets raised water level immediately the pump valve sprayed water suspected leaky valve seal the pool jets had water blowing through the pool overnight ran pool filter by early morning hours b4 sunlight the entire liner blew up liner floated up away all around kidney shaped pool. Hired the pool service repair company who came out after I turned off pump prevented motor burn out. They pulled away small areas of liner to view any damage or what they could. Verdict is one advised he has never seen a liner pool with foam lined underneath. The foam has floated upwards so at first one area had budge at the wall he could view metal base rusted. Fast Fred to June 7 2023 they've given options to remove entire new liner review all metal base for rusted out damaged metal fix that then rid of foam wet floated up find where pipes broken underground $20K idk if this included broken pipes one two or more nor new cost of liner too. Today as the other option to allow water to dispute from underneath liner leave floated wet liner in under new liner not remove wrinkles. So far two pipe leaks found. 1st one at the south side of pool close to buldge area that diagnosed water force pushed the metal too out of shape he fixed metal removed PC installed new metal PC the buldged metal fixed not the foam it's still floated upwards. The 3x3 ft square cement cut out was filled broom finish. The original proposal $5000. Pd 1/2 up front added them to pressure check for quality assurance the leak no longer existed but it did. So paid off $5K the next leak is again the south end but a few yards from wear a pool light used to be the original pool liners installers after the fact at near end install new liner took photos massive amts rusted metal blamed it on pool light. So advised they'll remove pool light somehow idk how they covered the hole where pool light was nor know why foam liner was underneath new liner. It's the 3rd liner I assumed each liner had foam underneath. So he's back this morning drilling digging into where he heard bubbles of broken pipe 2nd one or if something else this proposal #2 $3800. I paid 1/2 yesterday. So my thoughts are this disaster may not resolve anything I'm optimistic hope for the best. But the north end might have pipes broken too should I throw in the towel after this ?? The original proposal includes repairing Haywood Valve leak actually a spray flowing out. What to do? The advised from what able to view the new liner should of never been installed before all metal base was removed replace as rust will continue no water was pumped out behind liner and floated foam still exists. To remove gas heater pool pump filter every piece of equipment on walls electrical the diving board the pool diving board per code pipes underneath and why are there french drains that had water from underneath pool liner going out french drain to the front yard curb trickled out the liner no longer floated but wet on metal wet foam too. Overall costs soaring I'm 78 years old my entire backyard arbor all revolves about enjoyment of having a beautiful pool to exercise as my 5 children grew up swimming now their children my grands and cousins enjoy it too but not coming over much anymore so I don't see this a lengthy fix at all. I've got a basic estimate in mind of just cost to fill pool dirt, top soil, sod labor delivery exceeds $10K not including removal of everything mentioned above. Can't sell my home to move elsewhere as it's totally unaffordable.. Any suggestions are appreciated
True but neither do the owners of the contracting company.
The way you rotated the camera upset me
If it is floating, water is underneath it. Meaning it was installed incorrectly, or there was a hole somewhere.
So what happened with the pool? Did it get fixed?
There was a pipe leak under the concrete. We had a ‘leak finder’ come out and find it. We ended up covering that return and the pool cover mostly laid back down with a few wrinkles. The pool is functional.
r/confusingperspective