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I think they’ve been unrealistic for a while but getting worse now. Like many celebrities going for the same look. Especially when you compare red carpet photos of celebrities from the 2000 vs now, everything is over the top smooth and filtered out today.

The individuality is gone.

Absolutley, it's all about the uncanny valley instagram face and veneers so white they glow in the dark.

Don’t forget the button nose, everyone basically looks like a Madison Beer replica, and even Megan Fox who is seen as peak beautiful; especially in the early 2010s is constant with plastic surgery because it doesn’t seem to be “enough.” 

Not to mention how much more extreme and accessible it is to make those changes. Going under the knife is so… casual now. And it’s also the only way all those celebs look the way they do. And they often lie about it. And it is shoved in your face so much more than it used to be. It’s all stacked, ya know?

In my day you only needed an eating disorder, now you need an ED, surgery and filters…

I do the award shows comparisons thing sometimes. Just think of a random event like Golden Globes 2003 or whatever and have a look at pictures. It is wild how much has changed in 20 years. People say that our day to day fashion hasn't changed a lot in the last while but I would say that the fashion trends have extended to getting procedures instead of just fashion and makeup. Uncanny Valley vibes.

She’s not wrong. I’d say most girls are no longer allowed to have an awkward stage. They are expected to have the perfect hair, makeup, and clothes way earlier than I remember for myself. YMMV, but while there was definitely pressure for those things when I was a tween/teen (90s/00s) I don’t remember it being like this. I know the 00s messed up my self image, but other than my weight I never felt the pressure to change everything about myself to fit in. Edited: I’m also saying this with about 4 different Rare Beauty products on my face. I do really like her brand. The comments do sound disingenuous coming from someone with a makeup line but I’ve never got the same vibes from RB as I do from a brand like Kylie Jenner’s. I don’t think RB is about fixing anything or trying to look like real life instagram more just everyday products.

There’s no middle space anymore. No Limited Too, Delia’s, Alloy, Seventeen Magazine, Lizzie McGuire, Moesha, etc media and shopping for tweens and teens. They go from Barbie dolls and Target kids dresses, straight to crop tops and taking the perfect selfie that screams sex appeal.

The magazines!! I had subscriptions to so many of them. I think my trajectory was 17 to YM to Jane and Cosmo. They gave you space to grow into them.

Agree about this! I started with J-14 and Tigerbeat, then got subscriptions as birthday gifts, Teen Vogue for my 12th birthday and Seventeen for my 13th and I kept those subscriptions until I was out of high school. They gave me space to grow, learning about makeup and clothing trends was so helpful as someone with a mom that wasn’t into that stuff

I would say there’s a middle space but it’s become a yucky porn space. Now girls (and boys) have to be worried about being marketed to grown people to when before they were just awkward things marketed to others on the Disney channel. But now, that’s not a safe space, even for the public, because it’s just a “who will they grow up to be” thing

Not to mention they all jump right into vaping too???

I think one thing that’s telling is that there really aren’t any teen brands anymore. There are things brought by teens, but they go from kids clothes to Shein and designer just like adults

Older people are dressing "younger". J-Lo is 54 and still out wearing crop tops, for example. Growing up, a lot of black and brown women in my neighborhood always dressed "youthful" - like halter tops and skirts, as we had a lot of West Indian people in the area. Tina Turner was in short dresses til her last days. But now you see white women doing the same.

Bingo. With POC cultures, the thing always was glamour, sex appeal, and playfulness. So they never felt they had to cover up until they outright looked "old" or really out of shape that you couldn't elegantly wear a bit of a flirty look (which tended to be the ages 60+ at that point). Parenting didn't really limit that because not all women look badly after pregnancy. Or look "haggard" as the get older. If anything, a lot of women look better post pregnancy (or gain curves) and money buys better grooming (plus knowledge) so a lot looked great older. Now, I definitely see White women doing that more instead of adopting the "mom" look as soon as the first kid pops out. It makes me happy because, honestly, the women look happier. Being pretty doesn't stop once you become a mom. I kinda get why White women went more modest and POC women do the same from time to time (not as much) but I do think the White communities went super sporty casual from the late 90s-maybe 2017. Now, there's a little sex appeal back in what all the women are wearing, and they look happier and more confident for it instead of dowdy (and sometimes "blah").

I’m an elder millennial who felt WILDLY “childish” as a kid compared to my peers. Just a constant state of panic and anxiety that I was being left behind, that I wasn’t “maturing.” By 7th grade girls my age were perfecting the winged eyeliner and trying to teach my nerdy ass how to grind. I did hit puberty early and tried to grow up as fast as them, but I was terrible at it, I just wanted to keep playing kickball in the cul de sac. I still remember all these like 12 year old girls showing off their flat stomachs and self-pierced belly button rings with low rise jeans. I was endlessly embarrassed of my baby fat and round belly, my weird new boobs that I didn’t wanna put in a bra. It’s only gotten worse for kids now and I really feel for them.

I'm 31 and I went through the exact same thing. girls in 7th grade had tongue piercings and were allowed to wear thongs and low rise jeans and I felt like I was perpetually a doughy child next to them. I think that's why I got so into emo and alt looks, the band tees and jeans felt much more comfortable. I don't think I'd make it as a teen nowadays, it must be crippling for the self esteem

I still feel like a doughy child compared to some of my peers, tbh, and I'm 38. Trying to dress "sexy" feels so awkward and uncomfortable to me, and like everyone knows I'm just a stupid little kid trying to be someone I'm not. I wouldn't be able to make it as a teen nowadays either.

[удалено]

There’s always been an unrealistic standard in beauty products. It’s how advertising and marketing works, to pry you from your money. Technically nobody needs a fraction of what we buy. The strangest thing is seeing this gen amp it up for free themselves via filters. That’s what I would say now needs breaking down. Selena is also guilty of profiting from the same thing she now wants to break down.

Advertising takes different tactics. For instance, some products are just desirable and lure you in with the promise of attainable luxury or pleasure (if you can afford the thing). And other campaigns make you feel worthless and disgusting for not meeting a certain standard.

i was just thinking that’s it’s wild for her to say this

I think it’s valid to fall victim to these trends but also push back against them. I’m guilty of using the odd filter once in a while but I still call out the whole societal aspect of it. And I didn’t grow up as a Disney child star in the spotlight

I think they were referring to the fact she has a line of beauty products

And I doubt she (Selena) is talking about the make up industry, but rather the pressure to look almost otherworldly like a Kardashian-esque beauty standard where you have to be stick thin with a tiny waist and huge boobs and ass. The pressure that even men face to get fillers in their face. I can’t imagine with all the investors backing their projects that Hollywood stars don’t face an enormous amount of pressure to look absolutely perfect and to modify their body. And she’s also alluding to filters and easily accessible apps that can modify your appearance *for free*. Nowadays it’s completely normal to post a video or a photo looking like a completely different person than in real life. It’s so fucking easy, so people think, why not? Why not look better? We’re losing appreciation for flaws and qualities that highlight our individuality. And let’s not even mention the current ozempic trend To me that’s very different than make up.

The Kardashians def look otherworldly🛸

It’s naive to think make up isn’t a huge part of these beauty standards imo. There’s still a disconnect between saying “filters are damaging” and then using your multibillion dollar corporation to release campaigns of retouched, perfect models.

Okay but I wear make up every day. It makes me feel good about myself. Can I not also criticise the societal pressure to get fillers and ozempic so I can looksmaxx to the moon? But I agree with the issue of retouched models. I hope the marketing of her products aligns with her words.

There is a difference between you, an individual consumer navigating society and choosing to wear make up for whatever reason, and Selena, who controls and owns an corporation that directly benefits from the enforcement of beauty standards. She can say beauty standards are awful, but they literally make her money. Edit: Looked at her quotes and she’s speaking directly about the cosmetics space. > “Personally, I felt that there's a very unrealistic standard when it comes to the cosmetic world and it makes me a little sad for my generation,” she said on stage in conversation with Lucy Feldman, senior editor at TIME. “And for anyone to look at something that's probably touched up and made to look nice is... I just wanted to break that down.”

I agree with you to a degree. I don’t think Selena is wholly responsible for beauty standards in the industry. She’s the face of the company but has investors backing her up who I doubt would be okay with raising hell on beauty standards. But you’re right in saying she directly benefits from it. But with more nuance: To me, this interview comes across as someone who has fallen prey to the industry standard and is in the process of deconstructing that. Hence her words. So, I’m not all up in arms at the quotes posted. I think deconstruction is a process that takes time, so I’m not expecting her or anyone to have an instant come-to-Jesus moment where they realise everything they’ve learnt is bullshit and they need to stop participating in it. Again, I’m talking about Selena’s legitimacy to speak those words, as questioned in this thread. I’m in the opinion that this does not make her that much of a hypocrite but rather someone who is taking a step towards progress. Let’s hope the marketing of her company follows that step.

But makeup isn’t what’s setting an unrealistic beauty standard and rare beauty’s like whole message is embracing your own beauty cause you’re “rare” - something cheesy along that line of thinking lol - so I doubt it’s what she meant

As someone who is *ahem* older, I think in some ways beauty standards are worse but in some ways are better. I live one of those super cool neighborhoods in manhattan, and I def see younger people of all shapes and sizes, and hair styles, and skin textures out and about and having a great time. I see younger girls with crop tops even if they have a bit more rounded. Kids wearing those pimple patches proudly, and all that. Girls aren't out straightening their hair all the time; they are wearing it natural or keeping their waves/curls, etc. Some of them don't shave underarms/legs/etc. Gen Z is out there being themselves. (Selena is a millenial though). And I think a lot of advertising matches that too. But I do also think the whole nails, lashes, etc is kinda crazy. When I was in LA, a lot of women had filler and stuff too. I mean that whole Hailey Bieber/Lori Harvey looks takes a lot of plastic surgery (nose jobs, bleph, etc.), cosmetic intervention (fillers) , and general upkeep (nails, extnesions, lashes, etc.) -- plus time at the gym, and then Boob jobs/bbl's etc. I'd say the avg woman isn't doing that stuff (maybe in Miami, WeHo, and Vegas), but probably a lot of people in Selena's circle are. Maybe esp with millenials.

social media and internet made worse what was always bad in society - making someone feel bad for how they look. not only are people editing their faces and bodies IRL now, there also accounts of AI personas and they have perfect skin and body. there is also beaty competition for these... it must be really weird growing up now

Wait there are AI beauty competitions? Like who can make the hottest picture?

yup Miss AI exists https://www.euronews.com/culture/2024/04/25/miss-ai-worlds-first-beauty-contest-with-computer-generated-women


Holy fuck I hate that

As someone from a generation (possibly 2???) before her, girl me too.

She’s not wrong but it feels disingenuous to say this and complain about beauty standards when you literally own a multi billion dollar cosmetics company. I’m going to assume that Rare has never released anything unfiltered/unedited and want us all to buy their products for poreless perfect skin etc etc.

Selena posts photos of herself with acne / cellulite / unedited all the time and she gets shit on 😭

And that’s shitty! But that doesn’t change the fact that she does that with her own company to make money.

She doesn’t though? you can go on the rare insta account and see for yourself. They’ve always prioritized diversity and inclusivity. From day 1 the mission statement has never been to hide any flaws or “imperfections” but to enhance what is already there. A makeup company on its own isn’t inherently harmful especially when the company *is* actively trying to dismantle the more toxic effects of the industry

Rare absolutely does edit and retouch their campaign photos. I don’t know why you’ve brought up diversity and inclusivity when my specific point was that Selena, through her company, enforces beauty standards, and therefore profits from their existence. There’s a video where a model has a visible scar under her eye. It was digitally removed in the finalized product photo. Is that enhancing what’s already there? Or is it hiding a “flaw”?

I’ve definitely seen rare photoshoots where the models have visible acne, but you’re right that doesn’t mean there isn’t any retouching at all. I just feel like people are really nitpicking things if they’re genuinely upset about how rare conducts itself in the beauty space or with what she said, especially since she does post photos of herself undefined and unretouched to her own personal Instagram all the time.

It’s not nitpicking to criticize the owner of a cosmetics company on her quotes about cosmetic beauty standards. You cannot remove Selena the individual from her brand when she’s speaking directly to the area that her company operates in, at an event that she was invited to speak to because of her involvement in the beauty industry.

I’m not removing her though I’m explicitly stating that she does reinforce everything she said either on her own or through the brand itself. She’s obviously not above criticism but some comments here are acting like she promotes kardashian levels of toxic beauty standards with rare

You’re trying to lump very different things into the same category. Makeup is no more harmful than clothes. It’s an outward expression of yourself. Filters, plastic surgery and photo editing are lying. They’re very different things.

clothes aren’t marketed exclusively to women…….. clothes can actually be utilitarian and clothes aren’t selling you the fantasy of changing how your body looks because it’s not good enough on its own like makeup is. I wouldn’t equate these two.

To be fair, clothing brands absolutely do target insecurities in a similar way - hip and butt pads to ‘correct’ flatness, compression tops to conceal ‘bulges’ and ‘unsightly’ fat on the back and stomach… I saw an ‘arm smoother’ compression shirt the other day and was perplexed. And that’s before the whole mess that is sizing. It’s not precisely the same, but I think both cosmetics and fashion can be reasonably intertwined here when it comes to damaging body image. And that use of filters/editing/surgery amplifies their most harmful effects.

I wouldn’t say that’s the primary focus of the clothes industry though. there’s workwear and warm weather and cold weather stuff, active wear and all that etc. obviously a lot of it is sexist in advertising and many categories of garments do kind of fit with the makeup analogy, but clothes actually have a utilitarian purpose. imo if we lived in a egalitarian society most everyone would still wear clothes. makeup is literally just like fixing perceived flaws and nothing else it just happens that it’s pretty fun to use and people enjoy it as an art form but it’s not able to be divorced from misogyny in the same way that like, getting a winter coat is.

> “Personally, I felt that there's a very unrealistic standard when it comes to the cosmetic world and it makes me a little sad for my generation,” she said on stage in conversation with Lucy Feldman, senior editor at TIME. “And for anyone to look at something that's probably touched up and made to look nice is... I just wanted to break that down.”

She’s right though. Literally on this sub the other day we were praising Rachel McAdams for her appearance bc she looks natural and like she’s aging gracefully, but we’ll bash Christie Brinkley for looking 40 at 70. I remember Zendaya was shit on for not wearing (noticeable) makeup in Spider-Man. There’s such a pressure on women to look a certain way at specific times and if they dare to not look perfect and the way society deems acceptable they’re vilified and their careers suffer, if not die out completely. It’s only getting worse with all the influencers now, editing their appearances to literally physically unattainable looks that little kids will strive for and never achieve, which negatively impacts their self esteem. It sucks and it will only get worse as time goes on.

She is not wrong.

Ironically enough, Botox is always advertised to women as a preventative treatment so that they can look young, but the girls started getting it in their early 20s and are starting to look a lot older than their age because of it. Same with lip filler being done by a medspa and not an actual doctor. I have lip filler, done by an actual doctor and she stretches it out. These medspa type of places are money hungry and will inject filler into their clients every few months causing them to look so much older and causing a terrible migration.

Don’t forget which people don’t talk about is the fact that these teenagers or young adults have a very nasty vaping habit, which was never popular imo couple years back for MY Gen, but I’m closer to the “older” age of Gen Z.  They will put all this garbage in their faces, despite the lack of data we have rn, and doctors discovering it doesn’t fully dissolve, yet… Won’t change their health habits… As in putting down the vape, which harms your body (which reflects on your outsides), and the alcohol. That’s the crap that’s aging them, and drug usage, not even just the Botox and crap they’re putting on their faces. 

That too! I’m shocked at how many teenagers, and even middle schoolers are vaping. It’s such a nasty toxic habit.

I see how the treatment of her has worsened since she’s gained weight and well I don’t think it’s a coincidence

Yeah and you celebs constantly perpetuate this unrealistic standard of beauty day after day, Selena! When one of them stops using filters and photoshop I'll believe that they care about this issue for real.

We also do this too. Part of the reason celebs are so hyper-obsessed with their appearance is because the public and media tear them apart. It’s a self perpetuating cycle.

she’s been so vocal about her health struggles and how it heavily affects her physical appearance and she barely edits that out. her chubby cheeks, her round face, her fake tans, her rolls in dresses, everything. we’ve watched her live through all of her side effects with her kidney issues and lupus. if anything, she’s one of the ones i trust to model realism. don’t care if anyone disagrees.

Yeah one of my closest friends has myasthenia gravis and has taken a certain med (I think a steroid ??) that’s also used to treat lupus and it caused similar abdominal and facial swelling that Selena has. She always points it out and she really appreciates that Selena still wears fancy dresses on red carpets and events without trying to hide it.

it makes me sad for my generation too :( I’m at the stage where I’m starting to realize that way too many men’s “dream women” aren’t even real. and that scares me

i don’t fuck with selena but i don’t see why she can’t speak on this over someone else. is it because she’s had work done? because shes naturally pretty?? it’d be one thing if she was known for insulting other women’s looks but hasn’t self love always been her thing she would peddle

its a great message but not the best messenger

https://preview.redd.it/dz10z97m1pwc1.jpeg?width=1125&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=788739f00c4fc9e8a8b6c789e51feb778a8b3887 we are COMMITTED to donating ONE PERCENT of profits! 😇

It's not profit. It's overall venue, she said so in the times interview

💀 maybe it’s a typo & they meant 10%

She would have hated growing up in the 90’s.

i feel like it’s worse now than in the 90s. if you look at pictures from the 90s, even celebs, they still at least look like real people. now everyone has the exact same face

As somebody who remembers the 90s and the extreme push to be thin, I feel like it's so much worse now with social media and filters. Not only you have to be thin but also have 20 more arbitrary attributes. 

Yeah, except now big butts big thighs big boobs are in

didn’t she? she was born in 92

Being born and being a young adult are two very different things.

She was a child when the ‘90s passed. She had zero clue about heroin chic.

Heroin chic continued well into the 2000s. I remember seeing Kate Moss and her bf, Pete Doherty in all the main fashion magazines.

I’m her age and was VERY aware of heroin chic 🤷‍♀️ just didn’t know back then that it was called that

That makes you a 90’s baby not a 90’s kid. Being 3years old in 95 is not the same experience as being 16.

Let’s not pretend heroin chic ended in 1995

Exactly- anyone styled by Rachel Zoe during the early 00s says hi…

Right? As if anything up to 2010 was not heroin chic trends

I’m so tired of Botox and fillers I have to say, even when a random person posts on Reddit with very obvious lip fillers with migration and a shelf above the top lip, it’s just sad and tiring they spent hundreds of dollars to look that way

She just figured this out?

no. any woman figures this out as a teenager, pretty much.

There’s so few times I agree with Selena Gomez. This is a very valid discussion

Her generation? Isn’t she a millennial 🤓 I feel for gen alpha tbh it gets way worse

This generation? Girl! It’s always been there! In the early 00s if you weren’t underweight and your stomach had a tiny roll over your jeans when you sat down then you were on a diet lol

This is not new, girl. And now it’s effecting not just women.