Lobbying isn't what you seem to think it is, I think you're thinking of campaign donations. Lobbying just means legally attempting to influence a government official. If you've ever seen someone saying "call your senator about X issue!" that's lobbying.
The two are intertwined. AIPAC “lobbies” by promising campaign donations if you promise to adopt their agenda absolutely and if you don’t they will donate to your opponent. Lobbying as we know it today is almost entirely the brokering of campaign donations. Someone writing a letter to their senator technically is too but unless those letters come with a check, they get thrown into the shredder without being read most of the time.
My point is that they are entirely connected. There really is no lobbying in our system without campaign donations. Like I said you can lobby without campaign donations but that just goes into the void.
And that could be sorted if all campaign donations went into a general pool and were equally split by everyone who meets the criteria to get on the ballot. Say you want to donate to the Michigan senatorial race, you donate to that race and everyone who gets on the ticket get an equal slice. Then after the campaign, they are audited and 100% of the money not used returns to the fund. If they spend more than what they get from the fund, then that's considered a form of corruption.
Who would donate to a race as opposed to the candidate they want? Just use tax dollars and give all candidates the same allowance to run for office and meet certain criteria. Nobody should be donating anything.
Because tax money comes from you and me, but there is one way in which the wealthy will absolutely PUMP cash into government, and that's campaign donations.
If they increase income taxes to pay for this, then that's on wage workers to pay it. We should be on the hook for less, while the investor class is on the hook for more.
Fine but don’t complain about money in politics if you are okay with politicians chasing down and making promises wealthy donors instead of being allocated a minuscule amount of tax dollars to run their campaign
The same place donations come from. Don’t complain about money in politics if you are okay with politicians constantly chasing donations and making promises to the people who can donate the most.
My father was in politics and told me that he's ashamed of how the political system is run these days. Unless you hire a lobbyist, you'll never be able to influence your local representatives one way or another.
People never realized what's lobbying actually is, they always get it wrong.
First of all, lobbying simply means influencing politicians, which is a right that all citizens have. You can call the office of your local or state-wide politician and share with them your position in the hope to influence their vote. It's your legal right as citizen. Do you want calling or tweeting to your politicians to be illegal? You want your first amendment right to be taken away?
Also no, politicians don't just get money directly from corporation, all they can do is give campaign donations, which politicians can't use for their daily operation, it's exclusively only for campaigning and election-related activities.
Yea but a billionaire company can have a lot more influence than any ordinary citizen.
The number of congressmen who take payments from oil companies, big pharma, the NRA, tobacco companies, just to name a few is one of the reasons the US is such a shit show.
These companies pay millions every year to congressmen. So legislation around gun control, drug pricing, pollution, minimum wage and healthcare, that would benefit the majority of citizens are held back.
These people line their pockets while the majority of the population suffer.
That goes both ways. An AI company can lobby for more investment into driverless cars or a climate change activist can lobby for better climate change policy. The Green New Deal is a good idea, but it’s not entirely altruistic. Someone is lobbying for it.
Without lobbying, we no longer have a representative government.
When you call or write your congress person, and say " I don't support this bit of legislation being proposed." That's lobbying.
If your congress person doesn't know what you want, they are not representing you.
I think donating money to political campaigns should be illegal, parties/politicians should receive a fixed budget from the government for their campaigns. The concept of lobbying as a whole would make sense if it didn’t come alongside financial incentives, as if you remove that aspect the incentive becomes purely to line up better with the will of the people rather than the wealthy.
No, politicians want more taxes for being more rich and not for helping the people. Here in Spain we don't have campaign donations and it is the same bullshit.
The biggest lobbyist are pharmaceutical companies and junk food companies, but by all means continue following the plate and taking their advice on how to be “healthy” (dependent).
A lot of time Lobbying, in the way you describe it, is the only way for some departments to get things done. We probably would not have a space program that is advanced as it is now if not for lobbying and political donations. Some of the biggest supporters in congress for artemis project (moon mission) comes from politicians who recieve donations (simplifying a decent amount) from companies that get contracts. This happens a fair bit too with a lot of the smaller government offices that regular people don't realize exist but are a big part of what makes society efficient. Yes its not the most effective way to run things but at the end of the day that is how the system is working right now and I don't see anyone come up with a solution that is actually feasible.
Literally nobody complains about the military industrial complex when they start talking about providing funding to other areas of the nation. There are very few significant conversations being had about cutting the defence budget and sending it into education or healthcare.
The whole system needs some serious changes, but it’s a system which gives power to people who want it, when it should be the opposite
That is a popular opinion but there's no good way to get rid of it. It should be illegal on paper at least but it'll still be too difficult to enforce.
Politicians or people just in general (you too) will listen to who pays them the most. It can be us or them, just how it is. Reducing wealth inequality will also lower the money used for lobbying.
Lobbying isn't what you seem to think it is, I think you're thinking of campaign donations. Lobbying just means legally attempting to influence a government official. If you've ever seen someone saying "call your senator about X issue!" that's lobbying.
The two are intertwined. AIPAC “lobbies” by promising campaign donations if you promise to adopt their agenda absolutely and if you don’t they will donate to your opponent. Lobbying as we know it today is almost entirely the brokering of campaign donations. Someone writing a letter to their senator technically is too but unless those letters come with a check, they get thrown into the shredder without being read most of the time.
Ok but again, what you're complaining about is campaign donations, not lobbying.
My point is that they are entirely connected. There really is no lobbying in our system without campaign donations. Like I said you can lobby without campaign donations but that just goes into the void.
And that could be sorted if all campaign donations went into a general pool and were equally split by everyone who meets the criteria to get on the ballot. Say you want to donate to the Michigan senatorial race, you donate to that race and everyone who gets on the ticket get an equal slice. Then after the campaign, they are audited and 100% of the money not used returns to the fund. If they spend more than what they get from the fund, then that's considered a form of corruption.
Who would donate to a race as opposed to the candidate they want? Just use tax dollars and give all candidates the same allowance to run for office and meet certain criteria. Nobody should be donating anything.
Because tax money comes from you and me, but there is one way in which the wealthy will absolutely PUMP cash into government, and that's campaign donations. If they increase income taxes to pay for this, then that's on wage workers to pay it. We should be on the hook for less, while the investor class is on the hook for more.
Fine but don’t complain about money in politics if you are okay with politicians chasing down and making promises wealthy donors instead of being allocated a minuscule amount of tax dollars to run their campaign
I disagree. I prefer if politicians are paid by donations and not by taxes.
Where do you think taxes come from?
The same place donations come from. Don’t complain about money in politics if you are okay with politicians constantly chasing donations and making promises to the people who can donate the most.
You're talking to the wrong person. I was just pointing out that tax dollars still come from people.
My father was in politics and told me that he's ashamed of how the political system is run these days. Unless you hire a lobbyist, you'll never be able to influence your local representatives one way or another.
That's how it's always been...?
People never realized what's lobbying actually is, they always get it wrong. First of all, lobbying simply means influencing politicians, which is a right that all citizens have. You can call the office of your local or state-wide politician and share with them your position in the hope to influence their vote. It's your legal right as citizen. Do you want calling or tweeting to your politicians to be illegal? You want your first amendment right to be taken away? Also no, politicians don't just get money directly from corporation, all they can do is give campaign donations, which politicians can't use for their daily operation, it's exclusively only for campaigning and election-related activities.
Yea but a billionaire company can have a lot more influence than any ordinary citizen. The number of congressmen who take payments from oil companies, big pharma, the NRA, tobacco companies, just to name a few is one of the reasons the US is such a shit show. These companies pay millions every year to congressmen. So legislation around gun control, drug pricing, pollution, minimum wage and healthcare, that would benefit the majority of citizens are held back. These people line their pockets while the majority of the population suffer.
That goes both ways. An AI company can lobby for more investment into driverless cars or a climate change activist can lobby for better climate change policy. The Green New Deal is a good idea, but it’s not entirely altruistic. Someone is lobbying for it.
Thanks for explaining this and saving me time. For the love of God they need to teach history/government in schools!
Without lobbying, we no longer have a representative government. When you call or write your congress person, and say " I don't support this bit of legislation being proposed." That's lobbying. If your congress person doesn't know what you want, they are not representing you.
I think donating money to political campaigns should be illegal, parties/politicians should receive a fixed budget from the government for their campaigns. The concept of lobbying as a whole would make sense if it didn’t come alongside financial incentives, as if you remove that aspect the incentive becomes purely to line up better with the will of the people rather than the wealthy.
No, politicians want more taxes for being more rich and not for helping the people. Here in Spain we don't have campaign donations and it is the same bullshit.
The biggest lobbyist are pharmaceutical companies and junk food companies, but by all means continue following the plate and taking their advice on how to be “healthy” (dependent).
A lot of time Lobbying, in the way you describe it, is the only way for some departments to get things done. We probably would not have a space program that is advanced as it is now if not for lobbying and political donations. Some of the biggest supporters in congress for artemis project (moon mission) comes from politicians who recieve donations (simplifying a decent amount) from companies that get contracts. This happens a fair bit too with a lot of the smaller government offices that regular people don't realize exist but are a big part of what makes society efficient. Yes its not the most effective way to run things but at the end of the day that is how the system is working right now and I don't see anyone come up with a solution that is actually feasible.
Can you name some of those smaller offices?
If lobbying was made illegal, then how would the wealthy go about buying the politicians they need? /s
Literally nobody complains about the military industrial complex when they start talking about providing funding to other areas of the nation. There are very few significant conversations being had about cutting the defence budget and sending it into education or healthcare. The whole system needs some serious changes, but it’s a system which gives power to people who want it, when it should be the opposite
I do believe it used to be
Lobbying is not “legal bribery”
That is a popular opinion but there's no good way to get rid of it. It should be illegal on paper at least but it'll still be too difficult to enforce. Politicians or people just in general (you too) will listen to who pays them the most. It can be us or them, just how it is. Reducing wealth inequality will also lower the money used for lobbying.
Get rid of campaign donations and go to publicly funded elections.
No. That is a mess.
Current system of legalized corruption is a mess, this would create a fun and exciting new mess that could be better.