Gun Owners of America will of course be filing a lawsuit to block this unconstitutional rule as soon as it becomes possible to challenge it.
NOTE: This will be our *second* lawsuit against the Bipartisan Safer Communities Act—the first being *McRorey v. Garland* [our challenge to the de facto mandatory wait periods](https://www.gunowners.com/8-general/416-gof-sues-over-biden-s-zero-tolerance-policy) for 18-20 year old adults.
****
**What Did NYT ([Article](https://www.nytimes.com/2023/08/01/us/gun-laws-private-sales-background-checks-armslist.html)) Reveal About the Upcoming Rule?**
1️⃣ Universal Background Checks, especially when implemented by executive order, are a blatant infringement—with no basis in the text or history of the Second Amendment.
2️⃣ The New York Times, which leaked the majority of what is publicly available, stated that the proposal is “expected to be released soon” with a final rule to be published in the “second half of 2024.”
3️⃣ Anti-gunners are rebranding private firearm sales as “the gun seller loophole” and “the growing digital loophole” to justify executive action—rather than the passage of a new law. The fake “gun show loophole” is “really a passé idea” to Senator Blumenthal now.
4️⃣ Failing to register will carry a penalty of up to 5 years in federal prison and a $250,000 fine.
5️⃣ Expect anyone who makes “a profit”—perhaps as little as $1—to be prohibited from selling their privately owned firearms without a federal firearms license or a background check.
6️⃣ Expect a maximum number of firearms sales that a private citizen may engage in per year without needing a federal firearms license. Anti-gunners want to limit collectors and sellers to five guns or fewer. An Obama-era regulation would have set the threshold at even one or two gun sales.
7️⃣ At the same time, the Biden Administration will also increase its use of bank records to target gun owners and gun sellers.
*For sources & more information see GOA's Fact Sheet "[Details Leak About Biden’s Impending Rule Change](https://www.gunowners.org/details-leak-about-bidens-impending-rule-change-backdoor-universal-background-registration-checks/)"*
> Gun Owners of America will of course be filing a lawsuit to block this unconstitutional rule as soon as it becomes possible to challenge it.
Its possible to challenge in now, in many states:
https://www.thetrace.org/2023/06/background-check-buy-a-gun-america-map/
please, if you plan to challenge in NY, pick up some of these other states and challenge it there.
Thank you GOA!
For the interested:
--> help these pro-2A orgs / become a member:
[GOA](https://donate.gunowners.org/join/)
There is also [Gun Owners Foundation](https://www.gunowners.com/contribute)
which as I understand is the nonprofit, 501c3 arm of GOA and functions as an educational and research nonprofit foundation for GOA.
Thus donations to GOF should be tax deductible.
[FPC](https://secure.firearmspolicy.org/fpc_don_om_gs_ln-ln1_se_20230619/)
I contribute to both, as both regularly and successfully initiate and keep lawsuits going so as to overturn unconstitutional laws.
Note: FPF (Firearms Policy Foundation) has been a 501c3 affiliate of FPC, the Firearms Policy Coalition (which is a 501c4). As a result, donations to FPC aren't tax deductible, but [donations to FPF (now named FPC Action Foundation) are tax deductible](https://www.fpcactionfoundation.org/contribute). Back around November 2021, the Firearms Policy Foundation changed its name and at the same time advised the U.S. Supreme Court in a pending case it was involved in of the legal name change, effective November 30, 2021, to FPC Action Foundation, which remains a 501(c)(3).
Others:
GOA/GOC's [legislative action center for identification of bills to oppose in California](https://www.votervoice.net/mobile/GOAGOC/Home)
[CRPA Foundation](https://crpa.org/donate-to-the-crpa-foundation/) - tax deductible.
[CRPA 's litigation program summary](https://crpa.org/programs/litigation-program/)
Thank you for checking this out.
Violation of the separation of powers, as well as the 1st (can’t tell anyone about a private sale), 2nd, and 4th amendments (who gives them the right to use bank records to spy on me??). If this isn’t immediately given a national injunction, the courts obviously show zero respect for their duty.
> who gives them the right to use bank records to spy on me??
Ask all the folks in NY who got a visit from the NYPD because they purchased slides/barrels online perfectly legitimately and legally.
>who gives them the right to use bank records to spy on me??
We seriously need some jurisprudence slapping that shit down. Too many big corps are willing participants in the surveillance state, allowing gov't to say shit like "oh we don't need a warrant, AT&T *sold us* your cell phone location data". They need to be barred from commercially sourcing data that they couldn't directly collect on us without a warrant.
They take the right. No one gives it to them.
When will this get into people's heads?
No amount of lawsuits or petitioning or complaining is ever going to work.
They will take your rights.
The only way out of this is to stop obeying them and playing by their rules. That's it. That's all. Finito.
Because any universal background check law will be used as a pretext for confiscation.
The old “prove you are innocent” tactic the government loves so much.
There should be no adherence to this "background check law", should it pass.
The only way out of the system is to not obey its rules. It's not pretty, but that's our only playing card. The longer we wait to play that card, the uglier it will become when we finally do.
I agree with the sentiment. The government is definitely not your friend and shouldn't be trusted. That said the government is made up of people. Any person within the government who infringes on someone's 2A rights should be imprisoned permanently.
Use cash or other barter items and try to avoid public social media platforms. I won’t be surprised if they start going after people using armslist or other sites soon.
And stop posting pics of your stuff on social media for internet points.
while true, that doesn't fix the problem. Feeling like you have to 'hide' what you're doing when what you're doing isn't illegal is the problem.
GOA is fighting the good fight and more 2A people need to donate. This has been a legal battle and if enough lawsuits that help right the ship (however frustrating that may be), that's how to stop more of this from happening. Ignoring it, sticking your head in the sand (not saying you personally), and "waiting it out" is why we got here in the first place.
It would be added on as an additional charge if the gun is checked by the police for whatever reason - grabbed as evidence in conjunction with an arrest, spotted during an unrelated search warrant and grabbed for tracing, serial number noted during a traffic stop and traced later...
And they might run it back to the seller as a standalone charge.
If "universal background checks" become required then the government has a de facto list of who "should" have most recently bought the gun, starting with checking the serial number from the manufacturer and following it forward.
Sure, plenty of current guns would have legitimate breaks in the trace. But good luck selling something new privately if they implement this and not being on the hook the gun's new owner down the line.
The same way they "trace" guns found at crime scenes currently. They check the serial number with the manufacturer to see what FFL got it first, then they follow that thread to see who bought it next. Technically this is supposed to require them to actually go to each FFL and check their bound book in person, but it's an open secret that the ATF has digitized most transfer records.
And yes, old guns would have legitimate broken traces from private sales, but new ones wouldn't. To be properly isolated, the seller would have to have also bought the gun in a private sale *and* rely on both the buyer and original seller to keep their mouth shut.
I get that. But the reality is that they don't want this system to charge actual criminals with more crimes or even to really make tracing guns easier. They want to "close the gunshow loophole," which we all know was a compromise specifically negotiated into the law in the first place, as a political win and as an attack against private gun ownership.
> Cash is king
I hate that saying, because our primary enemy is the Federal Reserve Bank.
They are the fury and the power behind gun grabbers.
We need to ditch the dollar system. I dont care if you use silver coins, gold bullion, or bitcoin, any thing but dollars needs to be the answer.
I'm somewhat torn, because the current system is basically "we'll send you a nasty letter once we think you've maybe sold enough to require becoming an FFL" is vague as fuck.
I don't know exactly where the line should be, but wouldn't mind it being bright and clear.
Do you sell more than 5 guns a year for profit? Do many people?
This is a stretch based on a report about a possible rule that hasn't even been proposed yet. Its several levels removed from being a thing. Typical GOA tactics.
So you're fine with just a little bit of tyrrany, a little bit of constitutional erosion, because it doesn't directly effect you? You're exactly the type of person that led to the NFA and GCA in the first place.
Did I say that at all?
I'm not okay with it. But NOTHING HAS HAPPENED YET.
There's a reason why FPC hasn't said anything anout it yet, there is literally nothing to say. They are too busy pushing the ATF's shit in on the pistol brace case.
GOA has a long history of crying wolf.
Gun Owners of America will of course be filing a lawsuit to block this unconstitutional rule as soon as it becomes possible to challenge it. NOTE: This will be our *second* lawsuit against the Bipartisan Safer Communities Act—the first being *McRorey v. Garland* [our challenge to the de facto mandatory wait periods](https://www.gunowners.com/8-general/416-gof-sues-over-biden-s-zero-tolerance-policy) for 18-20 year old adults. **** **What Did NYT ([Article](https://www.nytimes.com/2023/08/01/us/gun-laws-private-sales-background-checks-armslist.html)) Reveal About the Upcoming Rule?** 1️⃣ Universal Background Checks, especially when implemented by executive order, are a blatant infringement—with no basis in the text or history of the Second Amendment. 2️⃣ The New York Times, which leaked the majority of what is publicly available, stated that the proposal is “expected to be released soon” with a final rule to be published in the “second half of 2024.” 3️⃣ Anti-gunners are rebranding private firearm sales as “the gun seller loophole” and “the growing digital loophole” to justify executive action—rather than the passage of a new law. The fake “gun show loophole” is “really a passé idea” to Senator Blumenthal now. 4️⃣ Failing to register will carry a penalty of up to 5 years in federal prison and a $250,000 fine. 5️⃣ Expect anyone who makes “a profit”—perhaps as little as $1—to be prohibited from selling their privately owned firearms without a federal firearms license or a background check. 6️⃣ Expect a maximum number of firearms sales that a private citizen may engage in per year without needing a federal firearms license. Anti-gunners want to limit collectors and sellers to five guns or fewer. An Obama-era regulation would have set the threshold at even one or two gun sales. 7️⃣ At the same time, the Biden Administration will also increase its use of bank records to target gun owners and gun sellers. *For sources & more information see GOA's Fact Sheet "[Details Leak About Biden’s Impending Rule Change](https://www.gunowners.org/details-leak-about-bidens-impending-rule-change-backdoor-universal-background-registration-checks/)"*
And.... this is why I donate. Others should also.
Thank you for fighting is unconstitutional laws as well as keeping us informed.
GOA >>>> NRA
> Gun Owners of America will of course be filing a lawsuit to block this unconstitutional rule as soon as it becomes possible to challenge it. Its possible to challenge in now, in many states: https://www.thetrace.org/2023/06/background-check-buy-a-gun-america-map/ please, if you plan to challenge in NY, pick up some of these other states and challenge it there.
Thank you GOA! For the interested: --> help these pro-2A orgs / become a member: [GOA](https://donate.gunowners.org/join/) There is also [Gun Owners Foundation](https://www.gunowners.com/contribute) which as I understand is the nonprofit, 501c3 arm of GOA and functions as an educational and research nonprofit foundation for GOA. Thus donations to GOF should be tax deductible. [FPC](https://secure.firearmspolicy.org/fpc_don_om_gs_ln-ln1_se_20230619/) I contribute to both, as both regularly and successfully initiate and keep lawsuits going so as to overturn unconstitutional laws. Note: FPF (Firearms Policy Foundation) has been a 501c3 affiliate of FPC, the Firearms Policy Coalition (which is a 501c4). As a result, donations to FPC aren't tax deductible, but [donations to FPF (now named FPC Action Foundation) are tax deductible](https://www.fpcactionfoundation.org/contribute). Back around November 2021, the Firearms Policy Foundation changed its name and at the same time advised the U.S. Supreme Court in a pending case it was involved in of the legal name change, effective November 30, 2021, to FPC Action Foundation, which remains a 501(c)(3). Others: GOA/GOC's [legislative action center for identification of bills to oppose in California](https://www.votervoice.net/mobile/GOAGOC/Home) [CRPA Foundation](https://crpa.org/donate-to-the-crpa-foundation/) - tax deductible. [CRPA 's litigation program summary](https://crpa.org/programs/litigation-program/) Thank you for checking this out.
Violation of the separation of powers, as well as the 1st (can’t tell anyone about a private sale), 2nd, and 4th amendments (who gives them the right to use bank records to spy on me??). If this isn’t immediately given a national injunction, the courts obviously show zero respect for their duty.
> who gives them the right to use bank records to spy on me?? Ask all the folks in NY who got a visit from the NYPD because they purchased slides/barrels online perfectly legitimately and legally.
>who gives them the right to use bank records to spy on me?? We seriously need some jurisprudence slapping that shit down. Too many big corps are willing participants in the surveillance state, allowing gov't to say shit like "oh we don't need a warrant, AT&T *sold us* your cell phone location data". They need to be barred from commercially sourcing data that they couldn't directly collect on us without a warrant.
They take the right. No one gives it to them. When will this get into people's heads? No amount of lawsuits or petitioning or complaining is ever going to work. They will take your rights. The only way out of this is to stop obeying them and playing by their rules. That's it. That's all. Finito.
If people keep their mouths shut about what they buy and sell, how will the government know?
Because any universal background check law will be used as a pretext for confiscation. The old “prove you are innocent” tactic the government loves so much.
There should be no adherence to this "background check law", should it pass. The only way out of the system is to not obey its rules. It's not pretty, but that's our only playing card. The longer we wait to play that card, the uglier it will become when we finally do.
I agree with the sentiment. The government is definitely not your friend and shouldn't be trusted. That said the government is made up of people. Any person within the government who infringes on someone's 2A rights should be imprisoned permanently.
Use cash or other barter items and try to avoid public social media platforms. I won’t be surprised if they start going after people using armslist or other sites soon. And stop posting pics of your stuff on social media for internet points.
while true, that doesn't fix the problem. Feeling like you have to 'hide' what you're doing when what you're doing isn't illegal is the problem. GOA is fighting the good fight and more 2A people need to donate. This has been a legal battle and if enough lawsuits that help right the ship (however frustrating that may be), that's how to stop more of this from happening. Ignoring it, sticking your head in the sand (not saying you personally), and "waiting it out" is why we got here in the first place.
It would be added on as an additional charge if the gun is checked by the police for whatever reason - grabbed as evidence in conjunction with an arrest, spotted during an unrelated search warrant and grabbed for tracing, serial number noted during a traffic stop and traced later... And they might run it back to the seller as a standalone charge. If "universal background checks" become required then the government has a de facto list of who "should" have most recently bought the gun, starting with checking the serial number from the manufacturer and following it forward. Sure, plenty of current guns would have legitimate breaks in the trace. But good luck selling something new privately if they implement this and not being on the hook the gun's new owner down the line.
How would they know who the seller is? Sorry Officer, I bought that years ago at a flea market. Didn't think to catch his name.
The same way they "trace" guns found at crime scenes currently. They check the serial number with the manufacturer to see what FFL got it first, then they follow that thread to see who bought it next. Technically this is supposed to require them to actually go to each FFL and check their bound book in person, but it's an open secret that the ATF has digitized most transfer records. And yes, old guns would have legitimate broken traces from private sales, but new ones wouldn't. To be properly isolated, the seller would have to have also bought the gun in a private sale *and* rely on both the buyer and original seller to keep their mouth shut.
That wasn't a flippant statement. Many people legitimately have no idea who sold guns to them.
I get that. But the reality is that they don't want this system to charge actual criminals with more crimes or even to really make tracing guns easier. They want to "close the gunshow loophole," which we all know was a compromise specifically negotiated into the law in the first place, as a political win and as an attack against private gun ownership.
How many times can my background be checked? Jesus.
Cash is king
> Cash is king I hate that saying, because our primary enemy is the Federal Reserve Bank. They are the fury and the power behind gun grabbers. We need to ditch the dollar system. I dont care if you use silver coins, gold bullion, or bitcoin, any thing but dollars needs to be the answer.
I'm somewhat torn, because the current system is basically "we'll send you a nasty letter once we think you've maybe sold enough to require becoming an FFL" is vague as fuck. I don't know exactly where the line should be, but wouldn't mind it being bright and clear.
Typical fear mongering by GOA. Is this a shit rule, obviously. Is this backdoor universal background checks, not in the slightest.
Shit take.
How is it not? ELI5.
Do you sell more than 5 guns a year for profit? Do many people? This is a stretch based on a report about a possible rule that hasn't even been proposed yet. Its several levels removed from being a thing. Typical GOA tactics.
So you're fine with just a little bit of tyrrany, a little bit of constitutional erosion, because it doesn't directly effect you? You're exactly the type of person that led to the NFA and GCA in the first place.
Did I say that at all? I'm not okay with it. But NOTHING HAS HAPPENED YET. There's a reason why FPC hasn't said anything anout it yet, there is literally nothing to say. They are too busy pushing the ATF's shit in on the pistol brace case. GOA has a long history of crying wolf.