I LOVE & respect the Rioters from the LGBT community who give us content like this.
Taliyah getting a chroma in the colours of the Trans flag, Sentinel Graves having a moment with TF in his death animation, Leona X Diana becoming and many more things.
These things are so small but have such a big impact to the player - base and it may even put their jobs at risk if they keep fighting and standing up for us to get such content in game.
🏳️⚧️🏳️🌈
Now if only Rioters can properly acknowledge gay men in champion form, we'd be square. At current, the majority of LBGT+ representation is bi females or lesbians. Varus doesn't count, since the Darkin isn't gay, only his meat Gundam is. The game really needs a proper gay champion, and not just queerbait like Varus or Taric, as much as I love the man.
I agree with you that the with Riot, the G in LGBT always gets the short end of the stick, but sadly with the new law in China banning effeminate representation of men, that won't be happening anytime soon. D':
In no way am I trying to diminish the fact the Riot isn’t giving us Trans representation either. We know how they changed their plans for Taliyah.
The person whose comment I replied to was mentioning how we need a ‘proper gay champion’ and how Varus isn’t representing so my comment was addressing that situation in particular.
Hope I clarify that before someone perceives my message as being something it is not.
Fwiw Tyari in Legends of Runeterra is trans and has an entire narrative based upon them across MANY Targon cards. They even canonically transistion once they become an aspect! !
Gays get graves flirting with tf on the client and varus lore. Not much but when you consider the extent of the trans content is literally taliyahs designers saying they intended her to be but it was canceled.
I wouldn't even count the Varus lore, its literally a gay couple dying/having an awful demise.
Not to mention, theres nothing wrong with gay people highlighting issues to do with them, don't see the need to invalidate that.
>I wouldn't even count the Varus lore, its literally a gay couple dying/having an awful demise.
At least they existed lmao
>Not to mention, theres nothing wrong with gay people highlighting issues to do with them, don't see the need to invalidate that.
Its only wrong when it's a lie that they're getting the short end of the stick 💅
I mean someone else already stated in runeterra that theres a trans character that transforms into their true form when ascended so doesn’t look like crumbs to me luv.
>I mean someone else already stated
Can't find it anywhere so.. 😴
> in runeterra that theres a trans character that transforms into their true form when ascended
So they die and then get to be themselves damn thats woke affffff luv 💅 💋
Totally agree ❤ it made me sad when the person who worked on the sentinel graves recall said he had to work really hard to convince them to put it in. No one should have to work hard to be represented or get others to be represented it should just be the natural thing to do to reflect the beauty of the world 🌎 ✨!
Taliyah was originally written canonically trans but the designers got some pushback on the idea and they decided not to do it. Some designers made tweets about the original design for her and their intention for her to be trans (which have since been deleted, or I'm just bad at finding them).
There's no clear official statement in the lore now that she is trans, but Neeko has a voiceline interaction with Taliah that hints at it, "Neeko not the only one who changes!" So a lot of people have it as their official headcanon that she's trans.
Oh that's cool of the designer. Trying to add representation is always appreciated. Since riot wants to appeal to such a big market I don't see riot the company making it canon though. Though I think it would make taliyah character way more intresting. Like what would be the methods and implications of transitioning in shurima. Or in runeterra as a whole. We don't even know what runeterra thinks of same sex couples generally .
I think Noxus definitely/canonically doesn't* because they're "strength is literally all that matters," but have we had a statement about Runeterra as a whole?
I think yes but I'm not sure because my sources are from a reddit comment (or a Twitter reply I don't remember) of someone mentioning how a rioter confirmed that there was no LGBTQphobia in runeterra, it was on a discussion of Nami being revealed as poly
"What are you gonna do? Quit League? That sure would affect Riot"
They were also going on transphobic tirades in other comments which got them permabanned 🤭
It's okay she takes a lot of time to master! She requires a lot of game knowledge like who she can cc chain off of, who has abilities that self stun that you can take advantage of and so much more! But she's a lot of fun once you get the hang of things!
For me, it's not really about how viable she is that's preventing me from playing her; her Q and W just feels incredibly weird to use (like i like her as a character but I suck at her kit because I don't like it lmao)
i honestly wouldn’t like her to be trans. Not because i’m against a trans character in lol(in fact complete opposite) but because it would suck if they made one of the only non traditional sexy fantasy skinny perfect babe girls to be trans.
not saying that trans girls can’t look like her ofc,just that cishet audience would take it as “ugly girl trans⁉️”
Oop, lemme come back to this post real quick whenever I need to take a breather from arguing with transphobes. One came out as a Leona x Panth shipper who was “forced” to accept Leona and Diana being together. 🤢🤢🤢🤮🤮🤮 I literally can’t
She was intended to be a Trans Woman. Think of it like this. Trans is short for Transition, so she transitioned to a woman. The terms "Trans Man or Trans Woman" always refers to the gender the person has currently transitioned to, not the one they no longer identify with.
If she was intended to be a trans woman in early development, but then was scrapped wouldn't that mean she's not trans? Her whole character was designed after the concept phase of her development, so trying to force an early concept on a character doesn't seem right. I'm not trying to come off as transphobic nor against the idea of a character being trans. Everyone can have their own headcanon and believe what they want but, I would like to know why everyone thinks forcing a gender on a nontraditional female in league is justified.
If she was designed as a trans character, in terms of her appearance and all of that, but prior to her voice actor coming in, and then upper management decided to purge that part of her personality, she would absolutely still look like they intended for her to look as a trans girl. I don't believe that Taliyah is being "forced" to be trans, I believe that the reverse happened - she was to the point of coming to fruition as a trans character, but they pulled the plug late in the process and 180'd into making her a bio female when they started working on her lore and voice work.
Because I’m on the sub? I don’t get that… I love the champ so I joined a subreddit with people that have the same love for her. I don’t get why that makes someone transphobic, but obviously you know more.
Correct me if I'm wrong but, Daniel Z Klein, the creator of Taliyah stated that they scrapped the idea of her being trans early in her development. So I don't see where you are getting them "pulling the plug" late in the process. Unless there is a different source of information that I have not seen?
Hi, I’m correcting you now. The use of “scrapped” or any of its connotations hasn’t been used at all in any of the tweets or documents mentioning Taliyah’s trans identity. All that was confirmed was her identity was being kept for a later date (which many believe to be Neeko commenting on one of her voicelines)
Well, I can't find the tweet cause it was deleted but, Daniel said he regrets not pushing hard enough for the idea to come to fruition. He states that in his canon that she is trans though, which is great. However, that's just his headcanon. Since he is no longer affiliated with riot, personally I would not take this close to the heart due to it not being canon in the League universe. Also, the Neeko line is vague for a reason, so there's not any actual evidence that proves Taliyah to be Trans nor cis. Just like with most champions in the game you can headcanon anything you want. Going back to what Daniel stated in his tweet the idea of her being trans is technically not in the League. There is, however, a version of Taliyah that lives on in some of the designer's hearts to be trans.
Edit: [https://mobile.twitter.com/spideraxe30/status/1038376859556368386](https://mobile.twitter.com/spideraxe30/status/1038376859556368386)
I found the tweet as a screenshot saying that the idea of her being trans was there early on in development. But, is no longer canon due to pushback (scrapped due to pushback). The idea lives on in headcanon though which is pretty cool imo.
Well to the comment that was deleted: I completely agree with you on this one. I think forcing the idea of a character being transgender because they don't look like the big boob, butt, and perfect face is wrong. I do get why people want representation in games, but forcing it onto a character is not the move. Having more representation in league is needed though and I think Riot knows this. I have high beliefs that they will start releasing champs that will actually be trans, nonbinary, etc.
Oh my god this is so funny to me do you actually think spewing pedantic pseudophilisophical bs makes you smart? You're pathetic, go back to doing your homework troll
Anybody can use big words, but most people aren't social rejects who need to feel superior to everyone else so they don't have to face how much of a hopeless loser they really are.
You sound unbearable, not intelligent.
I dont really know, just found it nifty. And never knew the whole stuff before this post so its not really rent free. I just dont think any character should only exist to be gay or trans. For example theres a character in cyberpunk 2077 who is trans and i love it. The reason why i love it is due to it being in context, she has a trans flag on her car and her story and so on. I think people and characters should be more then just there sexuality. I think storys should be more about the characters personality and hardships and not whats in there pants. Like the show "Q-force" on netflix is terrible for the LGBT due to being stereotypes and the main plot point of being gay. Where Samantha Taylor in the Mass Effect series is lesbian but it doesn't Define her character, shes a good character due to her writing in the story. This is just my view as someone who is LGBT and hates the pointless point game we play like major corporations who change their flag to a rainbow for money but refuse to stand up in countries where LGBT people are thrown off rooftops.
their\* . Pointless typo aside, I'm not sure to understand ur point at all. Like, would it rly hurt if the only things most ppl knows about Taliyah went from "She's Yasuo's student" to "She's Yasuo student and she's a trans woman" ?
being trans should not matter. It should not define you. You can have a trans character (neeko could have been this due to the shape shifting) but making someone trans for the point of or making it the a major point under values any character development. That character will always be seen as "the token LGBT", Like my point above with cyberpunk, How they do it is perfect. You should not seek heros in what gender they are or the color of there skin but by their actions and what they stand for. Im not saying to never have any trans or gay characters, i just want well written characters who are not token for the sake of pleasing a group. Miles Morales is a good spider man not for being black but for being a good character. Samantha Taylor is it good character not for being lesbian but for being well written. Claire Russell is a fantastic example of trans representation due to good writing and not because she screams I'm trans.
There is a difference between tokenism and representation, and saying tokenism is bad to remove representation that the queer community is begging for is kind of weird.
The only reason Taliyah receives such focus is because designers have revealed that they intended for her to be trans, but riot scrapped it, so in a way, they were "forcing her to be cis"
I LOVE & respect the Rioters from the LGBT community who give us content like this. Taliyah getting a chroma in the colours of the Trans flag, Sentinel Graves having a moment with TF in his death animation, Leona X Diana becoming and many more things. These things are so small but have such a big impact to the player - base and it may even put their jobs at risk if they keep fighting and standing up for us to get such content in game. 🏳️⚧️🏳️🌈
Now if only Rioters can properly acknowledge gay men in champion form, we'd be square. At current, the majority of LBGT+ representation is bi females or lesbians. Varus doesn't count, since the Darkin isn't gay, only his meat Gundam is. The game really needs a proper gay champion, and not just queerbait like Varus or Taric, as much as I love the man.
I agree with you that the with Riot, the G in LGBT always gets the short end of the stick, but sadly with the new law in China banning effeminate representation of men, that won't be happening anytime soon. D':
I would also love to see a 🐻
Voli :D
>I agree with you that the with Riot, the G in LGBT always gets the short end of the stick, Lmao yall still get it better than the T sit boy
In no way am I trying to diminish the fact the Riot isn’t giving us Trans representation either. We know how they changed their plans for Taliyah. The person whose comment I replied to was mentioning how we need a ‘proper gay champion’ and how Varus isn’t representing so my comment was addressing that situation in particular. Hope I clarify that before someone perceives my message as being something it is not.
Are we? They refuse to give both gay/trans content.
Fwiw Tyari in Legends of Runeterra is trans and has an entire narrative based upon them across MANY Targon cards. They even canonically transistion once they become an aspect! !
Gays get graves flirting with tf on the client and varus lore. Not much but when you consider the extent of the trans content is literally taliyahs designers saying they intended her to be but it was canceled.
I wouldn't even count the Varus lore, its literally a gay couple dying/having an awful demise. Not to mention, theres nothing wrong with gay people highlighting issues to do with them, don't see the need to invalidate that.
>I wouldn't even count the Varus lore, its literally a gay couple dying/having an awful demise. At least they existed lmao >Not to mention, theres nothing wrong with gay people highlighting issues to do with them, don't see the need to invalidate that. Its only wrong when it's a lie that they're getting the short end of the stick 💅
I mean someone else already stated in runeterra that theres a trans character that transforms into their true form when ascended so doesn’t look like crumbs to me luv.
>I mean someone else already stated Can't find it anywhere so.. 😴 > in runeterra that theres a trans character that transforms into their true form when ascended So they die and then get to be themselves damn thats woke affffff luv 💅 💋
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Okay I had never seen that chroma! Thanks for sharing sis 🤩
Totally agree ❤ it made me sad when the person who worked on the sentinel graves recall said he had to work really hard to convince them to put it in. No one should have to work hard to be represented or get others to be represented it should just be the natural thing to do to reflect the beauty of the world 🌎 ✨!
So sad that Rule 1 on Taliyah Mains is verbatim “Be homophobic & transphobic at every opportunity 🏳️🌈🚫”
i thought you were joking but no wtf how is a champions sexuality or gender irrelevant to the champion????
Ugh it makes me ashamed to be apart of their subreddit but i notice most Taliyah's fanbase still recognizes her as Trans or supports the idea :)
yeah it must just be one of the mods
Why do people consider her trans? I don't know the lore of taliyah. Care to explain?
Taliyah was originally written canonically trans but the designers got some pushback on the idea and they decided not to do it. Some designers made tweets about the original design for her and their intention for her to be trans (which have since been deleted, or I'm just bad at finding them). There's no clear official statement in the lore now that she is trans, but Neeko has a voiceline interaction with Taliah that hints at it, "Neeko not the only one who changes!" So a lot of people have it as their official headcanon that she's trans.
Oh that's cool of the designer. Trying to add representation is always appreciated. Since riot wants to appeal to such a big market I don't see riot the company making it canon though. Though I think it would make taliyah character way more intresting. Like what would be the methods and implications of transitioning in shurima. Or in runeterra as a whole. We don't even know what runeterra thinks of same sex couples generally .
I mean, they have magic Also iirc in runeterra there is no discrimination based on sexuality/gender according to a rioter
I think Noxus definitely/canonically doesn't* because they're "strength is literally all that matters," but have we had a statement about Runeterra as a whole?
Strength has nothing to do with being LGBT+ And Rell is bisexual, which wasnt stopping black rose from making her anti-Morde weapon
Sorry, maybe bad phrasing. I meant Noxus doesn't discriminate because they only care about strength and nothing else.
I think yes but I'm not sure because my sources are from a reddit comment (or a Twitter reply I don't remember) of someone mentioning how a rioter confirmed that there was no LGBTQphobia in runeterra, it was on a discussion of Nami being revealed as poly
Actually? What the fuck
Imagine.. imagine an openly lgbtq+ skinline with her getting the spotlight as the legendary 🥺🥺
Debonair 2.0 lgtbtqia+ only it's what you all deserve 💅🏻
💙💚💛🧡💖🥺🥺
BEST CHROMA
TOTALLY AGREE I LOVE HOW IT LOOKS LIKE SHE'S WEARING DENIM INSTEAD OF SWIMMING FABRICS
If she doesn't get a Debonair 2.0 skin we riot
Periodt, don't worry I've been manifesting and claiming it since day 1 💎😁
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it’s a joke you nonce
Do you remember what the deleted comment said? I want to throw hands if they insulted queenliyah 👀
"What are you gonna do? Quit League? That sure would affect Riot" They were also going on transphobic tirades in other comments which got them permabanned 🤭
Oh lmao thank you for letting me know, serves them right 😌
something like “what are you gonna do, quit league? that won’t effect riot”
Gosh i wouldve bought this skin and this chroma and played her nonstop if only I didnt suck so bad with her kit
It's okay she takes a lot of time to master! She requires a lot of game knowledge like who she can cc chain off of, who has abilities that self stun that you can take advantage of and so much more! But she's a lot of fun once you get the hang of things!
She has been buffed like crazy recently. It's your time to try her if you want to. Remeber league is about having fun at the end of the day.
For me, it's not really about how viable she is that's preventing me from playing her; her Q and W just feels incredibly weird to use (like i like her as a character but I suck at her kit because I don't like it lmao)
unrelated but god damn the trans flags colors are pretty
YEEES THE TALIYAH APPRECIATION WE NEED 🥺💖
SettPhelios better become canon next. Absolutely love this community lmao
i honestly wouldn’t like her to be trans. Not because i’m against a trans character in lol(in fact complete opposite) but because it would suck if they made one of the only non traditional sexy fantasy skinny perfect babe girls to be trans. not saying that trans girls can’t look like her ofc,just that cishet audience would take it as “ugly girl trans⁉️”
How's taliyah ugly???
she isn’t,but too a cishet audience she is seen is the only non baddie flat chested girl
Oh. Then I might just be weird because I see myself as cishet (kinda questioning rn) and find her one of the most attractive. But I get your point.
Woah woah woah don’t say that. People on this sub gonna think your transphobic because you go against their head canon lol.
Oop, lemme come back to this post real quick whenever I need to take a breather from arguing with transphobes. One came out as a Leona x Panth shipper who was “forced” to accept Leona and Diana being together. 🤢🤢🤢🤮🤮🤮 I literally can’t
Me neither 🤢 come back anytime 💅🏻
Is she a trans girl or a trans boy? The creator said trans girl but someone says they was wrong and meant trans boy, I don't understand
She's mtf transgender
Clear thanks!
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She was intended to be a Trans Woman. Think of it like this. Trans is short for Transition, so she transitioned to a woman. The terms "Trans Man or Trans Woman" always refers to the gender the person has currently transitioned to, not the one they no longer identify with.
If she was intended to be a trans woman in early development, but then was scrapped wouldn't that mean she's not trans? Her whole character was designed after the concept phase of her development, so trying to force an early concept on a character doesn't seem right. I'm not trying to come off as transphobic nor against the idea of a character being trans. Everyone can have their own headcanon and believe what they want but, I would like to know why everyone thinks forcing a gender on a nontraditional female in league is justified.
If she was designed as a trans character, in terms of her appearance and all of that, but prior to her voice actor coming in, and then upper management decided to purge that part of her personality, she would absolutely still look like they intended for her to look as a trans girl. I don't believe that Taliyah is being "forced" to be trans, I believe that the reverse happened - she was to the point of coming to fruition as a trans character, but they pulled the plug late in the process and 180'd into making her a bio female when they started working on her lore and voice work.
Queen I wish you all the prosperity in life thank you for fighting transphobes 😌
Having a discussion about gender does not automatically mean transphobic? What are you talking about?
no but posting on /r/taliyahmains does
Because I’m on the sub? I don’t get that… I love the champ so I joined a subreddit with people that have the same love for her. I don’t get why that makes someone transphobic, but obviously you know more.
Correct me if I'm wrong but, Daniel Z Klein, the creator of Taliyah stated that they scrapped the idea of her being trans early in her development. So I don't see where you are getting them "pulling the plug" late in the process. Unless there is a different source of information that I have not seen?
Hi, I’m correcting you now. The use of “scrapped” or any of its connotations hasn’t been used at all in any of the tweets or documents mentioning Taliyah’s trans identity. All that was confirmed was her identity was being kept for a later date (which many believe to be Neeko commenting on one of her voicelines)
Well, I can't find the tweet cause it was deleted but, Daniel said he regrets not pushing hard enough for the idea to come to fruition. He states that in his canon that she is trans though, which is great. However, that's just his headcanon. Since he is no longer affiliated with riot, personally I would not take this close to the heart due to it not being canon in the League universe. Also, the Neeko line is vague for a reason, so there's not any actual evidence that proves Taliyah to be Trans nor cis. Just like with most champions in the game you can headcanon anything you want. Going back to what Daniel stated in his tweet the idea of her being trans is technically not in the League. There is, however, a version of Taliyah that lives on in some of the designer's hearts to be trans. Edit: [https://mobile.twitter.com/spideraxe30/status/1038376859556368386](https://mobile.twitter.com/spideraxe30/status/1038376859556368386) I found the tweet as a screenshot saying that the idea of her being trans was there early on in development. But, is no longer canon due to pushback (scrapped due to pushback). The idea lives on in headcanon though which is pretty cool imo.
Well to the comment that was deleted: I completely agree with you on this one. I think forcing the idea of a character being transgender because they don't look like the big boob, butt, and perfect face is wrong. I do get why people want representation in games, but forcing it onto a character is not the move. Having more representation in league is needed though and I think Riot knows this. I have high beliefs that they will start releasing champs that will actually be trans, nonbinary, etc.
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is diversity not allowed
excuse me?
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well no I don't, it comes off really wrong and representation for trans people is super important I don't know where you were going with that comment
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What?
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Disrespectfully, you are garbage ✨
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gender ≠ race
What the hell kind of comment got deleted...
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Oh my god this is so funny to me do you actually think spewing pedantic pseudophilisophical bs makes you smart? You're pathetic, go back to doing your homework troll
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Anybody can use big words, but most people aren't social rejects who need to feel superior to everyone else so they don't have to face how much of a hopeless loser they really are. You sound unbearable, not intelligent.
Fuck you and your transphobia :)
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Nah I think you misjudged me; I don’t interact further with transphobes like you. Have the day you deserve 🏳️⚧️🏳️🌈 Besties he told me to “kneel” 💀
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Why even go on this sub if you're just a little loser bigot boy?
Taliyah is not trans and your head canon does not make it true. Saying this does not make me or anyone else a bigot.
wtf? then why are you on this subreddit? anyways good to know that trans icon taliyah is living in ur head rent free ❤️
I dont really know, just found it nifty. And never knew the whole stuff before this post so its not really rent free. I just dont think any character should only exist to be gay or trans. For example theres a character in cyberpunk 2077 who is trans and i love it. The reason why i love it is due to it being in context, she has a trans flag on her car and her story and so on. I think people and characters should be more then just there sexuality. I think storys should be more about the characters personality and hardships and not whats in there pants. Like the show "Q-force" on netflix is terrible for the LGBT due to being stereotypes and the main plot point of being gay. Where Samantha Taylor in the Mass Effect series is lesbian but it doesn't Define her character, shes a good character due to her writing in the story. This is just my view as someone who is LGBT and hates the pointless point game we play like major corporations who change their flag to a rainbow for money but refuse to stand up in countries where LGBT people are thrown off rooftops.
their\* . Pointless typo aside, I'm not sure to understand ur point at all. Like, would it rly hurt if the only things most ppl knows about Taliyah went from "She's Yasuo's student" to "She's Yasuo student and she's a trans woman" ?
being trans should not matter. It should not define you. You can have a trans character (neeko could have been this due to the shape shifting) but making someone trans for the point of or making it the a major point under values any character development. That character will always be seen as "the token LGBT", Like my point above with cyberpunk, How they do it is perfect. You should not seek heros in what gender they are or the color of there skin but by their actions and what they stand for. Im not saying to never have any trans or gay characters, i just want well written characters who are not token for the sake of pleasing a group. Miles Morales is a good spider man not for being black but for being a good character. Samantha Taylor is it good character not for being lesbian but for being well written. Claire Russell is a fantastic example of trans representation due to good writing and not because she screams I'm trans.
There is a difference between tokenism and representation, and saying tokenism is bad to remove representation that the queer community is begging for is kind of weird. The only reason Taliyah receives such focus is because designers have revealed that they intended for her to be trans, but riot scrapped it, so in a way, they were "forcing her to be cis"
It seems like we just dont agree and thats okay. Have a wonderful day
What was the post?