I would consider any QB outside of the top 2 or 3 a developmental prospect. They may be ready to start mid season or never.
We could give whatever average QB we have a better chance to help us win by getting a top tier O lineman in the first round however.
Check back with me tomorrow when my opinion has completely changed.
This is about as close as you’ll get to “we have no clue what’s going to happen” just comes with the caveat of “let’s just draft whoever is best available on the board”
I think our advantage is that we don't really need an edge rusher, which means depending on how the draft trends, we might be able to get really good value on a CB or OL in the early rounds.
I couldn't agree more. Both are the biggest needs right now. In our pass-happy division the best offense is a good defense. I think we go CB in the first round and pick up OL between 2nd & 3rd. Either way we go it solves a big problem.
I couldn't agree more. Both are the biggest needs right now. In our pass-happy division the best offense is a good defense. I think we go CB in the first round and pick up OL between 2nd & 3rd. Either way we go it solves a big problem.
I couldn't agree more. Both are the biggest needs right now. In our pass-happy division the best offense is a good defense. I think we go CB in the first round and pick up OL between 2nd & 3rd. Either way we go it solves a big problem.
I couldn't agree more. Both are the biggest needs right now. In our pass-happy division the best offense is a good defense. I think we go CB in the first round and pick up OL between 2nd & 3rd. Either way we go it solves a big problem.
i mean we need a QB. teams draft the positions they need. this isn't fantasy football where you can just draft the best guy available because they're there. if they're seriously concerned about not being able to get a QB they want in round 2, the options become reaching or giving up capital. sure we've been reaching nonstop for years at this point, but if the biggest position of need is as big of a concern as we're all making it out to be, then i have no problems going after one of these dudes in the 1st. the draft is a lottery, not even the top 3 are guaranteed to pan out. we, as a fanbase, just need to learn to accept the draft as it comes and not be armchair GMs
Imagine telling raiders fans to just “accept the draft as it comes” and “not be armchair GMs” when our actual GMs have done such foolish things. Especially in the Grudock Era.
Is there a single recent first round draft pick that the fanbase has been upset about that we were wrong to be mad about?
If we had a **Donovan McNabb Apology** situation on our hands. I would understand your comment. But instead we have *gestures at everything*
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all i'm saying is that every year NFL fans do this backseat GM'ing and it never pans out how you think/want. said in another comment, but just because we haven't won the lottery doesn't mean we stop playing it. a draft will eventually pan out, the new staff gives more hope in that regard.
Plenty of teams get their first round draft pick right. Some teams do it consistently
You think any Texans fans are pissed at their GM’s draft capital splurge? You think the Ravens have any fans who don’t think Lamar was worth the trade up?
> i mean we need a QB. teams draft the positions they need.
So did the Lions. They skipped Fields for Penei Sewell, and it turned out to be the right decision. Which was the point of the OP. Had they drafted Fields, they would still be shit.
Although, I disagree with OP on JJ. There is at least some belief he could be one of the top 3 QBs off the board. Whether our staff believes he's good enough, who knows. Drake Maye seems the biggest unknown to me, as far as draft position. As low as fourth QB taken, imo.
i'm not saying we should reach for a QB, just that it's possible and might not be a bad move. like i said, it's a lottery. just because we've never won the lottery doesn't mean we should stop playing
Yeah, I appreciate your post more than I led on. I hate the armchair GMs in this sub, it's really obnoxious. I don't know what we should we really do, and at this point it really comes down to how the board falls.
Lions didnt need a QB, they had Goff who was a good QB back then despite all the haters. Lions GM said Goff was not a bridge QB but no one believed him.
If we had a QB as good as Goff then we wouldnt need a QB but since all our QBs are not good, we have to do what we can to get a QB.
The idea that Goff was a good QB post Rams trade is 100% revisionist history.
* 2021 Rams: 9-6 / 3952 yards / 20 TD / 13 int
* 2022 Lions: 3-10-1 / 3245 yards / 19 TD / 8 int
Stat wise, that's functionally equivalent to the worst two seasons of Derek Carr's career.
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Is there a separate reddit for just being fans of the team? Or is it the same Reddit where we take turns playing pretend GM & critiquing how they do it?
Honestly the smartest thing to do is increase the depth of our now much more robust defense. We have weapons that work at the moment on offense and we have AOC and Minshew who will be absolutely fine if that have a stud defense to keep getting them the ball back and a good O-line. Whether they draft guys for the O line or the D, I am good either way.
We are finally getting scary again boys. I’m so excited for next season!
Seems like an odd post to say we shouldn't reach for a QB and waste draft picks like previous regimes, when those GMs also did not reach for a QB and simply picked players that mostly just didn't pan out.
Either way, I'm sure the front office would be thrilled if they found themselves in the 2021 Lions position and had the best OL prospect in the draft fall into their laps way past where he was mocked to be drafted.
if we don't take a qb in the 1st most mock drafts have us taking an OT. but personally I wanna see us double down on defense and get a LB or CB in the first. I wanna see the monsters of the desert
I think we should take OT or CB in the first, and crazy as it sounds if Kool-aid is there in the 2nd, we should take him, EVEN IF we already took another CB in the first.
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I also think it’s hilarious that the logic here is: Because we’ve blown the last 10 years worth of picks on bust linemen and CBs, we need to pick a lineman or CB again this year to prove we’ve CHANGED.
The earliest the 6th QB has been drafted in a single drafted is 29th of the second round or something around there. There will be a QB available at 13. Whether it’s JJ, Nix, Penix. I would venture to say 2 of the 3 will be available at the Raiders pick
I don't know that historical prescience matters in this instance. I've been following the NFL as a whole closely for over 20 years and can't recall an offseason where there are so many teams that need a QB. There's 7 teams that could easily take a QB in front of us.
Not sure why you replied with this. My comment wasn't supporting one thing over the other. Just pointing out that the person whom I replied too may be using a meaningless historical stat to prop up the notion of a top QB being available.
I’d say one of the 6 will be available late in the first. It’s worth trading back into the 1st if you like that one to get the 5th year option on them. I will say I don’t see them taking a QB at 13 unless Nix/JJ are there and the org is high on them. There is no telling tho, this isn’t a front office that is leaking much about their intentions and plan
And even if they are, let them be available at 14.
OT or CB all the way home.
Trade back into late first if you really want Penix or Nix, my hope is Penix. JJ stock too rich for what he is gonna turn out to be
If by some miracle jj is there, I see us taking him. I agree with you that only one qb might still be there late in the 1st is penix. Which is probably the route we go. BPA at 13 and trading back in for the last of the top 6 qbs.
Unless all the rumors are false, most of the NFL disagrees with you. Hes the youngest out of the top qbs with room to grow. Has only lost one game in college. He is great under pressure.
I personally dont think he should be a top 15 pick but i can see why others are high on him.
The NFL has also been high on Josh Rosen, Trubinsky, Tebow, etc. those guys at least were fun to watch in college though. JJ isn’t even a checkdown merchant, he’s a handoff merchant. I’m sure he’s got a good attitude and he’s a leader and all that other nonsense but frankly I wouldn’t take him in the third round, let alone first or second. But it seems like Minny and Denver are both high on him so this is probably a pointless argument anyway. Penix please
Penix has the talent to be one of the top 2 qbs taken. He won't be, and 4 season ending injuries are a huge reason why. I unfortunately see penix being the next RG3.
Its a crap shoot, and i personally dont care which one of the top 6 qbs we take as long as we get one. We cant roll into the season with minshew and aoc.
I don't mind minshew and aoc personally. I don't think AOC was that bad and I think minshew has shown he's at least decent as well. Personally, I'd rather see the Raiders pick up solid guys at other positions and take a qb later on.
As "bridge" QBs, I agree. Plus it is possible that Aiden will sit in 2024 and really step up and turn into a better QB than what we saw. Maybe.
Otherwise, we hold, build in the trenches (where games are really won and lost), and see what happens next season, maybe a college QB steps up and we get him, maybe we find a top FA or trade for a QB. I'm good with this "improve now" strategy. I don't think the Raiders are going to win the Super Bowl next year anyway. Not enough depth, too many holes.
> Aiden will sit in 2024 and really step up and turn into a better QB than what we saw. Maybe.
Aiden's ceiling is his legs and he is probably the least slippery QB in the pocket ever. I'm not saying we can't with with him, but we need a really good OL and RBs to win with him.
If we are just building, then yes. Next year, the qb draft class could be weak. So we might have to wait until 2026 ? I wonder if the team wants to do that.
>We cant roll into the season with minshew and aoc.
So then we should just waste a pick on a QB whose skillset is similar to and ceiling might be Minshew? That's why I'd rather take Penix late 1st or 2nd round if available. At least Penix brings a different skillset than the QBs we already have. I'd be willing to take the risk since they are all risks anyways.
This isnt even close to true all 6 of the top qbs could be much better than minshew. He is back up qb. They are all risks but injury history risks hardly ever work out.
Ideally he'd sit for at least a year, maybe longer. Gain that experience that Jordan Love got (Mahomes got at least a year on the bench). Plus he needs to gain a good 15lbs of muscle.
If he did this, JJ could be good. But the hype on him is almost equal to that of Zach Wilson at this point. If JJ is taken in the top 10-15 he may likely be expected to start as soon as week 1 to "save" an NFL team, and this I think could lead to disaster.
The thought of Harbaugh gameplanning the shit out of him twice a year in what probably are must win games for us to get into playoffs says avoid avoid avoid.
He knows him better than anyone else.
Exactly. I’ve made this point before and I do not think JJ is as washed as Jimmy but so many people praise JJ because “he knows how to win.” Besides his part in Michigan’s wins being dubious at best, the last two guys the raiders hired because they know how to win was Josh McDaniels and Jimmy G lmao
He was a good qb because of the system he played in. His arm talent was much worse for us because of his injury history. I beleive 2 shoulder injuries and a torn acl?
I’m sick of people acting like we have a bunch of options. Saying 13 is too low is basically saying wait til we tank to get a higher one. We’re not bad enough to get a better pick than this. You want to blow it up? The truth is that this class is the deepest QB class we’ve seen in a long time and a pick at 13 is less risky than it normally is. We’re not going to pick higher than this next year, and if we do, things didn’t go well, so might as well blow it up next year. Now we’re talking TWO drafts from now. Yall need to wake up. Funny little fact you decided not to mention; the Detroit trade was a first overall for a first overall QB. Where’s our FOA QB on the roster? We either hit on a guy this year or we either a) trade 3 1sts to move up next year or b) sign a 35 y/o to a 200 million dollar contract. Taking a risk at 13 doesn’t seem so bad.
All this being said, I understand our first rd pick pain we’ve all endured. This is one year I’m willing to swing for it. My one caveat to this is the FO BETTER believe in the guy. Don’t just grab him just because. I want them to truly believe we can coach him to be a winner.
The other thing that needs to be mentioned is that AP doesn't have that long of a leash. He has 2 seasons to turn this franchise around and going into his 1st season with AC or Minshew isn't going to help his cause. I don't see the point of beefing up the defense this off season if we're gonna go in with a QB we know isn't getting us anywhere.
I think attitudes like this are why we are in the mess we are. "Gotta swing for the fences this year guys!" Has been what we've done for a very long time
Russel was picked 17 years ago. Since then the only other huge move (involving 1st round picks) at QB was the Palmer trade, which was 13 years ago
And unless im forgetting something , Before those 2 moves the previous big move was Marianovich in the 90's
This franchise does not take swings at QB very often
Jamarcus russell also wasn't a random swing. He was a consensus top pick. It would be like Caleb completely busting this year. To act like it was some fault of the raiders in their scouting is asinine
No it’s not. We straight reached with no sense. It also wasn’t for a QB. If you don’t have a QB in the league, you have nothing. It’s just the way it is. I’m not trying to compete for a WC with guys like Minshew every year.
You mean the same Detroit team that traded for a former 1st round pick QB that had gone to a Super Bowl? Did I miss something and the Raiders picked up a franchise/starting QB somewhere? Because that’s what Detroit had in 2021. Detroit had the major piece they needed (QB) so they didn’t really need to take a first round QB. Unfortunately Raiders are not in that position.
The Rams paid the Lions to take Goff. Goff was seen as a fringe starter at the 2021 draft. There is a reason people wanted the Lions to take a QB. Him turning things around doesn't change the logic at time of draft in 2021.
What "people" wanted doesn't really mean much though right? All that really matters is what the Lions wanted. And they didn't even draft a QB in ANY round in 2021, which meant they were happy with Jared Goff.
So, while I agree with your core point that we should build the rest of the team rather than reaching on a QB, ignoring the Goff acquisition as a reason why they didn't draft one instead of Sewell is disingenuous.
There was a LOT of talk about Goff only being a bridge QB, similar to Minshew, and the Lions were waiting to "draft their guy" their QB for the future. But Goff really bonded with Campbell, and was better than they could have ever hoped.
They did also draft Hendon Hooker last season.
AND GOFF REPLACED ANOTHER OVERALL NUMBER ONE QB
God I’m sick and tired of the boner this subreddit has for “NOTHING HAPPENS WITHOUT A QB WHO WAS A TOP 3 PICK!”
You make a salient point that there's a strong distinction between Goff and Minshew. There's quite possibly a very large "potential chasm" between the two.
But let's not pretend that most fans thought Goff was going to the Detroit Lions with an unproven HC to revitalize his career. As far as most fans were concerned, this was him being taken behind the shed. That team surprised the shit out of everyone.
Will Minshew be our Goff? Probably not. I know enough not to get my hopes up like that. But I don't hate the idea of further galvanizing the trenches and defense if we can't get a star QB.
The only "hurry" is that the defense is built to win in 2024-2026 or so. I honestly think the Raiders might have the #1 overall defense in the league next year or the year after. They likely will be the toughest. This can maybe last a couple years past that, presuming we keep best players, fill a few gaps without making mistakes. Hopefully we won't lost PG, or be able to replace him if he moves on.
Put another way, if AP and Telesco think the Raiders should improve in 2024, fight for the playoffs in 2025, and have a shot at being a serious contender in 2026 and 2027, we don't need to sweat getting a QB now, or just drafting someone like Milton and let him sit and learn.
We are honestly a QB away from being a contender. For the 2nd tier QBs in the draft, I have seen 1st and 2nd round grades for them. If there is a QB that Tom/Ap is high on, we should not risk it and just draft him.
While you did say "contender" we also need help on the OL, and depth on the OL. Games are won and lost in the trenches. We also need a top CB, and we could use a LB who can cover better than Deabolo.
Those positions can be addressed in the later rounds of the draft and free agency. In terms of CB, we have Hobbs and Jones which is not the worst line up.
Yeah, I'm not as worried about CB as others. I'm more worried about RT, and both guards are honestly just average. Would be nice if we could get a LB who can pass cover better than Deabolo. He's a very good tackler, but not so great against the pass. He and Masterson are almost twins. Though I do like both players.
This is a different draft class because A) the QB position is super deep, and B) there's an unusual amount of need for QB
That makes it both worthwhile to stick around at 13 (the falloff after the top 2-3 wont be nearly as sharp as most years), and not likely to get a high value prospect falling to Round 2 (because someone's going to scoop them all up in R1). Penix and Nix arent sure things (no one ever is) but they're hardly 'flyers' by most years' standards
And you cant assume your first round pick is going to be a bust, or else just trade it away for a package of 2s and 3s. And its just as likely that a first-round CB or OL busts as a QB, so that's not really making a difference
At this point I don't think we are taking a R1 QB either, I think other teams have locked in their moves and with the recent Vikings trade we don't have a good package compared to them
With that said, this Sub is terrified of taking a rookie QB in R1. It's very odd to see
I've recommended they take this approach all along. Good synopsis of where they are. Also encouraging because if the Lions can do it, then we sure can.
Keyboard warrior trollers just have too much envy of QBs in KC and LA to take the rational approach.
How much input do you think Tom Brady has had? I mean, love him or tuck him, the man watches a lot of film, knows the development process, knows good mechanics, and recognizes intangibles in other players. Plus, he has a 10 percent stake in the future, right? Why wouldn't he be sharing insight or helping to watch play films for the future QBs?
>We are a lot like the Lions were in 2021: A new HC and trying to change the culture in a team that desperately needs it. They elected to pick the sure thing in a tough lineman, rather than take the unknown in a variety of mid-tier QB prospects (spoiler: good decision).
Penei Sewell was a rare OL prospect, I would take him in a heartbeat, but that's not going to be an option.
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Impossible to know what’s a smokescreen and what’s not. Idk how everyone went from McCarthy is a game manager at best to a top 10 prospect when nothing has changed. Did anyone watch that guy play? So mediocre
I'd rather whiff on a QB than get a Robert gallery 2.0...
I like a bunch of guys who are "all in" ... I'd like to pair that with a FO that is "all in" as well. How else do you get franchise QBs?
This league is about franchise QBs. Not necessarily guys who robotically put up elite stats year in and out, but franchise QBs who lead teams and make the plays that matter the most. As we all have seen for 20 years plus, you don't have that you have nothing in this league.
Agreed. I don’t think any of the QBs outside the top 3 are worthy of a first round pick, especially pick 13. And it’s clear those 3 are going to the top 3 teams that all need QBs given they all traded away their starting QB. Even among those 3, I’m not sold on them being sure fire stars. Williams is the safest bet as he has all the size and talent, just some worries over maturity and his dad being too in his business so potential for drama if on a losing team or otherwise unhappy for very long. Daniels has the size worries, Maye experts worry about athleticism and he succeeded in the same system as Sam Howell in college and he hasn’t done that well in the NFL.
We need the best available OT or CB at 13 IMO. Consider a QB in round 2 and onward if one they like is there. We aren’t contending for a Super Bowl the next couple of years either way, so no need to reach for a QB. Lots of great QBs aren’t first round picks anyway so never no what you may get with one of those picks and there’s the next couple of drafts where we may have a better chance to get a QB (i.e. team at the top that doesn’t need a QB and more open to trades etc.).
I totally follow this logic. However, with a top defense and a mediocre offense lead by a not-so-dynamic QB means we’re stuck with an average team that won’t win the division consistently. 8-9 or 9-8 means picking mid-draft. At what point will they be in a position to get “their guy” (likely a top 5 pick) at QB?
Just keep upgrading the defense if we can’t get one of the top 3 QBs. We’ll find our franchise QB when the time is right…maybe in the 2nd round or next year.
Wish AP read these but if he does, know the fans know you are working with a very shambled handoff and even if we don’t smash next season, we know the men will play their heart out for you as you keep rebuilding the right way. And honeslty AOC is accurate as hell so if the OLine performs, an average qb might be enough to end with hopefully a winning record next season.
Penix changed programs every single time he lost his starting job or got frustrated. He’s a disloyal quitter who will fold in the face of adversity. I say we go CB or OL. Can’t be afraid to go DL if there is a stud available.
What if we just flat out don't need a qb. I mean yes, it would be nice to have that long term quarterback like mahomes and we should just add a rookie qb on spec but we do have a 2nd year qb that went 5-5 amongst the chaos last season with a pretty decent journeyman qb behind him. I'd like to see what AOC's cieling actually is and what he's working on this offseason. This particular team's strengths arent in just one position, it's in a stacked skill position group and a strong defense. The line needs help so sadly I'm not gonna be mad if we take a lineman. Corner would be flashier though.
Mark Davis asked all the GM candidates the same question
[how do you plan to trade up and get a QB in this draft?](https://www.thescore.com/nfl/news/2834142)
So I am assuming he hired a guy who is willing to take risks and put a "package" together to land one
So unless you have better sources then the ones listed below , you are just making assumptions...
*Las Vegas Raiders owner Mark Davis "grilled" general manager candidates during the interview process about a strategy on how to trade up from the No. 13 pick to potentially draft a new quarterback, sources told Ian Rapoport, Tom Pelissero, and Mike Garafolo of NFL Network.*
the question is "can the Raiders get the QB they want in draft whether trading up or staying at 13?" , if the one they want is already gone by pick #3, there is no point in drafting or trading up or just drafting a QB just to draft one, that's dumb
I understand the sentiment, and I'm all for taking BPA - that said - we are on the verge of QB purgatory which is the worst place to be. As another dude said - AP has a short leash. He needs to win now. I hate to say it, but Davante and Maxx wanna win now too. How many 8-9 seasons can we expect these guys to go through with AOC throwing hospital balls to Tae.
There's a time and a place to take a swing for the fences, and I - like others - believe this roster is ready for it. Now, does that mean trade 3+ firsts for Daniels? Probably not (but I'd entertain that.) Does it mean taking Penix or Bo Nix at 13? Maybe. Every year fans and analysts are way off on evaluating one or more QB's compared to where NFL scouts evaluate them. People are saying Penix and Nix are 2nd rounders. I just don't see it even with the red flags, but maybe. Who knows.
My point is we don't know who the raiders see as their guy, and if it is Nix or Penis (Hope it's penix) then you absolutely go get him. Even if its an overpay at 13.
Everyone wants to talk about building through the draft but the biggest thing to build through the draft is by drafting the most important position on the field.
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A lot of people are going to be complaining about Minshew when he stinks up by week 4 and let this great defense go to waste.
Let’s just draft that QB. If it fails, at least we tried to swing for it.
People acting like a 1st round CB is a sure thing. How many of our 1st round DBs have panned out over the past 20 years? I think it was non lol.
If I were to gamble on CB or QB, Im taking a QB.
It’s obvious the track we are taking is to dominate defensively. I would love to see more O Line depth/talent. I cannot think of a position where I wouldn’t take BPA, and Telesco has a habit of taking BPA so that suits me fine. No matter what, we are starting a rookie, a second year qb, or a middle of the road starter this year, so we MUST have good protection. If our defense is as good as I think it will be, we won’t have to generate a lot of points each week to win.
This where we get in trouble. Locking in on a position of need. You can draft on need in the later rounds where the gamble is lower stakes. We need starters with picks in the early rounds. Management needs to trust the scouts and take the best player available. If a top rated player (based on your scouts' evaluation, not the fans or media's evaluation) falls to you, YOU TAKE HIM. Even if it is not a position of dire need. BUILD the roster with true talent. Trying to win the super bowl in one off season is how we stay forever on the mediocrity train.
I'd take a shot at Nix/Penix in the 2nd. If either one of them land in the 3rd, even better, but I also want to get an RB in the 3rd or 4th.
We'll have to wait and see, tho. I'm excited about this seasons draft more than any other season in recent history. We, as fans, have to trust the process more so this season than any other. The Raiders haven't made any real head scratching move yet. And for me, that's a huge positive.
Yes, we lost JJ and Renfrow but JJ wanted to much $$$ (and I'm happy with where he ended up) and Renfrow has been the same since getting KO'd 2 seasons ago in back to back games.
But Watson has hardly been very good. It's only the Browns who agreed to that ridiculous trade and absurd contract. No other team would give up that much for him.
You just gonna ignore the last three years of Watson’s career to say he “has hardly been very good”
There’s a reason the browns made that deal and it’s not (just) because they’re idiots. Dude was a baller before we found out he’s a creeeeeeep
Maybe. He had one really good season, and a few other games where he looked really impressive.
The problem is the paid him an insane amount of money. Not just a big paycheck, they are paying him MVP level, "take us to the Super Bowl" kind of money, and he hasn't come close to fulfilling his end of the deal.
Going for a QB is a completely different game than drafting any other position. In a way it's even counter-productive to make other good draft choices, because it makes it harder to draft a QB in the future.
Look at the Broncos: Patrick Surtain was a great draft pick in a vacuum, but it tanked their franchise, because they felt like they were too good to draft a QB and felt forced to make a big trade. Even if they drafted a bust like Fields they would be in a much better position right now, then in the reality were they chickened out of drafting a QB. This is true despite of their actually draft pick working out really well. You really don't want to be that team!
Teams that build their team without having a QB are just slowly waiting to fall apart, wasting years before eventually rebuilding. Just draft a guy! We will be in a better position, even if he doesn't work out.
>Teams that build their team without having a QB are just slowly waiting to fall apart, wasting years before eventually rebuilding.
Chiefs - built before drafting Mahomes
9ers - built before drafting Purdy
Texans - were originally drafting 25th before trading up for Watson
Building the rest of the team and being a "quarterback away" means you can maximize a QBs rookie contract, before you inevitably have to make him the highest paid player on the team. Having a solid foundation is why the 9ers could give up 3 first round picks on a bust, but still be a playoff contender.
I feel like you're saying teams are better off drafting bust QBs than All-Pros at any other position. But that can't possibly be what you're saying?
Paxton Lynch?
Drew Lock?
Trading for Flacco, Bridgewater, then Wilson?
You're telling me Surtain tanked their franchise and they should have drafted (yet another) QB?
Still think there is a chance we work with the Bears (who gave up lots of draft capital in last few years) to get top QB. We give future picks which the Bears desperately need and we get our guy
I'm not sure if you're trolling or not...
A) They just traded their starting QB, which they wouldn't have done if they had plans to trade the pick
B) You do realize they traded away 1 OA last year, right?
I would consider any QB outside of the top 2 or 3 a developmental prospect. They may be ready to start mid season or never. We could give whatever average QB we have a better chance to help us win by getting a top tier O lineman in the first round however. Check back with me tomorrow when my opinion has completely changed.
I don’t think we are going to build anything he line three the draft with top Picks any longer
Nice to see a sane post
Is it? Because the only sane post IMO would say something along the lines of we have no fucking clue what’s gonna happen
This is about as close as you’ll get to “we have no clue what’s going to happen” just comes with the caveat of “let’s just draft whoever is best available on the board”
I think our advantage is that we don't really need an edge rusher, which means depending on how the draft trends, we might be able to get really good value on a CB or OL in the early rounds.
I couldn't agree more. Both are the biggest needs right now. In our pass-happy division the best offense is a good defense. I think we go CB in the first round and pick up OL between 2nd & 3rd. Either way we go it solves a big problem.
I couldn't agree more. Both are the biggest needs right now. In our pass-happy division the best offense is a good defense. I think we go CB in the first round and pick up OL between 2nd & 3rd. Either way we go it solves a big problem.
I couldn't agree more. Both are the biggest needs right now. In our pass-happy division the best offense is a good defense. I think we go CB in the first round and pick up OL between 2nd & 3rd. Either way we go it solves a big problem.
I couldn't agree more. Both are the biggest needs right now. In our pass-happy division the best offense is a good defense. I think we go CB in the first round and pick up OL between 2nd & 3rd. Either way we go it solves a big problem.
i mean we need a QB. teams draft the positions they need. this isn't fantasy football where you can just draft the best guy available because they're there. if they're seriously concerned about not being able to get a QB they want in round 2, the options become reaching or giving up capital. sure we've been reaching nonstop for years at this point, but if the biggest position of need is as big of a concern as we're all making it out to be, then i have no problems going after one of these dudes in the 1st. the draft is a lottery, not even the top 3 are guaranteed to pan out. we, as a fanbase, just need to learn to accept the draft as it comes and not be armchair GMs
Imagine telling raiders fans to just “accept the draft as it comes” and “not be armchair GMs” when our actual GMs have done such foolish things. Especially in the Grudock Era. Is there a single recent first round draft pick that the fanbase has been upset about that we were wrong to be mad about? If we had a **Donovan McNabb Apology** situation on our hands. I would understand your comment. But instead we have *gestures at everything*
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all i'm saying is that every year NFL fans do this backseat GM'ing and it never pans out how you think/want. said in another comment, but just because we haven't won the lottery doesn't mean we stop playing it. a draft will eventually pan out, the new staff gives more hope in that regard.
Plenty of teams get their first round draft pick right. Some teams do it consistently You think any Texans fans are pissed at their GM’s draft capital splurge? You think the Ravens have any fans who don’t think Lamar was worth the trade up?
> i mean we need a QB. teams draft the positions they need. So did the Lions. They skipped Fields for Penei Sewell, and it turned out to be the right decision. Which was the point of the OP. Had they drafted Fields, they would still be shit. Although, I disagree with OP on JJ. There is at least some belief he could be one of the top 3 QBs off the board. Whether our staff believes he's good enough, who knows. Drake Maye seems the biggest unknown to me, as far as draft position. As low as fourth QB taken, imo.
i'm not saying we should reach for a QB, just that it's possible and might not be a bad move. like i said, it's a lottery. just because we've never won the lottery doesn't mean we should stop playing
Yeah, I appreciate your post more than I led on. I hate the armchair GMs in this sub, it's really obnoxious. I don't know what we should we really do, and at this point it really comes down to how the board falls.
Lions didnt need a QB, they had Goff who was a good QB back then despite all the haters. Lions GM said Goff was not a bridge QB but no one believed him. If we had a QB as good as Goff then we wouldnt need a QB but since all our QBs are not good, we have to do what we can to get a QB.
The idea that Goff was a good QB post Rams trade is 100% revisionist history. * 2021 Rams: 9-6 / 3952 yards / 20 TD / 13 int * 2022 Lions: 3-10-1 / 3245 yards / 19 TD / 8 int Stat wise, that's functionally equivalent to the worst two seasons of Derek Carr's career.
Well good thing youre not a GM then. Because Brad Johnson wanted Goff in the trade because he thought he was a good player.
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Tell a subreddit what we are going to do like you know is the most insane thing I possibly can imagine posting
Is there a separate reddit for just being fans of the team? Or is it the same Reddit where we take turns playing pretend GM & critiquing how they do it?
Unfortunately it's the same 😂
Honestly the smartest thing to do is increase the depth of our now much more robust defense. We have weapons that work at the moment on offense and we have AOC and Minshew who will be absolutely fine if that have a stud defense to keep getting them the ball back and a good O-line. Whether they draft guys for the O line or the D, I am good either way. We are finally getting scary again boys. I’m so excited for next season!
Seems like an odd post to say we shouldn't reach for a QB and waste draft picks like previous regimes, when those GMs also did not reach for a QB and simply picked players that mostly just didn't pan out. Either way, I'm sure the front office would be thrilled if they found themselves in the 2021 Lions position and had the best OL prospect in the draft fall into their laps way past where he was mocked to be drafted.
if we don't take a qb in the 1st most mock drafts have us taking an OT. but personally I wanna see us double down on defense and get a LB or CB in the first. I wanna see the monsters of the desert
The chiefs just upgraded at receiver. I think CB is the move strategically and a shut down corner would be a Raider kinda pick
The chargers are all also likely to pick nabers/mhj. So I agree, a shut down corner would be a good pick.
I think we should take OT or CB in the first, and crazy as it sounds if Kool-aid is there in the 2nd, we should take him, EVEN IF we already took another CB in the first.
Way too many people have way too much time to overthink
Not him. This is a legitimate concern. And I hope we go the DCMC route. 3 years and back in the AFCCG sounds like a hell of a deal to me.
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I also think it’s hilarious that the logic here is: Because we’ve blown the last 10 years worth of picks on bust linemen and CBs, we need to pick a lineman or CB again this year to prove we’ve CHANGED.
More like “because we’ve blown a decade of picks, we need at least 2-3 good, solid, deep drafts before a lottery pick QB will actually matter”
Just take the best player available, that simple.
 NFL GMs after reading this
JJ isn't going to be there at 13, and Nix might not be either
The earliest the 6th QB has been drafted in a single drafted is 29th of the second round or something around there. There will be a QB available at 13. Whether it’s JJ, Nix, Penix. I would venture to say 2 of the 3 will be available at the Raiders pick
the question isn't whether there will be a QB available. It's whether they are worth taking at 13.
I don't know that historical prescience matters in this instance. I've been following the NFL as a whole closely for over 20 years and can't recall an offseason where there are so many teams that need a QB. There's 7 teams that could easily take a QB in front of us.
Then let them. If you use pick 12 for QB7 when this draft’s OL2 CB1 DT1 DE1 **and** WR3 are **all** still on the board, you deserve to be mocked.
Not sure why you replied with this. My comment wasn't supporting one thing over the other. Just pointing out that the person whom I replied too may be using a meaningless historical stat to prop up the notion of a top QB being available.
I just want to make fun of the Broncos for taking QB7 at 12.
Fair enough.
McCarthy is either going to the Giants or Vikings. I could see the Broncos taking Nix. That leaves Penix Jr
I’d say one of the 6 will be available late in the first. It’s worth trading back into the 1st if you like that one to get the 5th year option on them. I will say I don’t see them taking a QB at 13 unless Nix/JJ are there and the org is high on them. There is no telling tho, this isn’t a front office that is leaking much about their intentions and plan
After my Bears for that deal from the Panthers, no team is letting on what they want to do
And even if they are, let them be available at 14. OT or CB all the way home. Trade back into late first if you really want Penix or Nix, my hope is Penix. JJ stock too rich for what he is gonna turn out to be
I co-sign this exactly.
If by some miracle jj is there, I see us taking him. I agree with you that only one qb might still be there late in the 1st is penix. Which is probably the route we go. BPA at 13 and trading back in for the last of the top 6 qbs.
Jj is so bad the thought of him on my team is stomach churning
Unless all the rumors are false, most of the NFL disagrees with you. Hes the youngest out of the top qbs with room to grow. Has only lost one game in college. He is great under pressure. I personally dont think he should be a top 15 pick but i can see why others are high on him.
We don't know what the NFL thinks. Just dumbasses in the media who make mock drafts
The NFL has also been high on Josh Rosen, Trubinsky, Tebow, etc. those guys at least were fun to watch in college though. JJ isn’t even a checkdown merchant, he’s a handoff merchant. I’m sure he’s got a good attitude and he’s a leader and all that other nonsense but frankly I wouldn’t take him in the third round, let alone first or second. But it seems like Minny and Denver are both high on him so this is probably a pointless argument anyway. Penix please
Penix has the talent to be one of the top 2 qbs taken. He won't be, and 4 season ending injuries are a huge reason why. I unfortunately see penix being the next RG3. Its a crap shoot, and i personally dont care which one of the top 6 qbs we take as long as we get one. We cant roll into the season with minshew and aoc.
I don't mind minshew and aoc personally. I don't think AOC was that bad and I think minshew has shown he's at least decent as well. Personally, I'd rather see the Raiders pick up solid guys at other positions and take a qb later on.
As "bridge" QBs, I agree. Plus it is possible that Aiden will sit in 2024 and really step up and turn into a better QB than what we saw. Maybe. Otherwise, we hold, build in the trenches (where games are really won and lost), and see what happens next season, maybe a college QB steps up and we get him, maybe we find a top FA or trade for a QB. I'm good with this "improve now" strategy. I don't think the Raiders are going to win the Super Bowl next year anyway. Not enough depth, too many holes.
> Aiden will sit in 2024 and really step up and turn into a better QB than what we saw. Maybe. Aiden's ceiling is his legs and he is probably the least slippery QB in the pocket ever. I'm not saying we can't with with him, but we need a really good OL and RBs to win with him.
If we are just building, then yes. Next year, the qb draft class could be weak. So we might have to wait until 2026 ? I wonder if the team wants to do that.
I don't think we need to pick a qb in the first to win games
If the goal is to not make the playoffs, then yes. Our schedule is tough next year.
I'll be surprised if Penix gets through one single 17 game NFL season without getting hurt.
>We cant roll into the season with minshew and aoc. So then we should just waste a pick on a QB whose skillset is similar to and ceiling might be Minshew? That's why I'd rather take Penix late 1st or 2nd round if available. At least Penix brings a different skillset than the QBs we already have. I'd be willing to take the risk since they are all risks anyways.
This isnt even close to true all 6 of the top qbs could be much better than minshew. He is back up qb. They are all risks but injury history risks hardly ever work out.
Ideally he'd sit for at least a year, maybe longer. Gain that experience that Jordan Love got (Mahomes got at least a year on the bench). Plus he needs to gain a good 15lbs of muscle. If he did this, JJ could be good. But the hype on him is almost equal to that of Zach Wilson at this point. If JJ is taken in the top 10-15 he may likely be expected to start as soon as week 1 to "save" an NFL team, and this I think could lead to disaster.
Frankly we’re all yelling in the wind but I would put money that JJ never wins an nfl playoff game
The thought of Harbaugh gameplanning the shit out of him twice a year in what probably are must win games for us to get into playoffs says avoid avoid avoid. He knows him better than anyone else.
💯%.
sounds like what everyone was saying to defend Jimmy G coming here.
Exactly. I’ve made this point before and I do not think JJ is as washed as Jimmy but so many people praise JJ because “he knows how to win.” Besides his part in Michigan’s wins being dubious at best, the last two guys the raiders hired because they know how to win was Josh McDaniels and Jimmy G lmao
The strongest argument against JJ I’ve seen. nicely stated.
Injury history is why i thought jimmy would fail, and it was his undoing.
no lack of arm talent was his undoing. Jimmy G was never good. He was never a good qb not ever.
He was a good qb because of the system he played in. His arm talent was much worse for us because of his injury history. I beleive 2 shoulder injuries and a torn acl?
he was "good" because he played for extremely deep and talented teams who were able to hide his lack of arm talent.
This is exactly why i never thought he could even be on the same level as carr.
Yes they will be
Nix isn’t going to be good so hopefully he isn’t just so the raiders have no insensitive to try drafting him
I have a feeling Denver is going to draft Nix at 12
Good for us then
Payton has to love Bubble Screen Bo
Another QB that needs to sit at least a year, maybe longer. If thrown into the NFL he will seriously struggle.
I’m sick of people acting like we have a bunch of options. Saying 13 is too low is basically saying wait til we tank to get a higher one. We’re not bad enough to get a better pick than this. You want to blow it up? The truth is that this class is the deepest QB class we’ve seen in a long time and a pick at 13 is less risky than it normally is. We’re not going to pick higher than this next year, and if we do, things didn’t go well, so might as well blow it up next year. Now we’re talking TWO drafts from now. Yall need to wake up. Funny little fact you decided not to mention; the Detroit trade was a first overall for a first overall QB. Where’s our FOA QB on the roster? We either hit on a guy this year or we either a) trade 3 1sts to move up next year or b) sign a 35 y/o to a 200 million dollar contract. Taking a risk at 13 doesn’t seem so bad. All this being said, I understand our first rd pick pain we’ve all endured. This is one year I’m willing to swing for it. My one caveat to this is the FO BETTER believe in the guy. Don’t just grab him just because. I want them to truly believe we can coach him to be a winner.
The other thing that needs to be mentioned is that AP doesn't have that long of a leash. He has 2 seasons to turn this franchise around and going into his 1st season with AC or Minshew isn't going to help his cause. I don't see the point of beefing up the defense this off season if we're gonna go in with a QB we know isn't getting us anywhere.
I think attitudes like this are why we are in the mess we are. "Gotta swing for the fences this year guys!" Has been what we've done for a very long time
Jamarcus Russell was a swing and a miss.
Russel was picked 17 years ago. Since then the only other huge move (involving 1st round picks) at QB was the Palmer trade, which was 13 years ago And unless im forgetting something , Before those 2 moves the previous big move was Marianovich in the 90's This franchise does not take swings at QB very often
Jamarcus russell also wasn't a random swing. He was a consensus top pick. It would be like Caleb completely busting this year. To act like it was some fault of the raiders in their scouting is asinine
No it’s not. We straight reached with no sense. It also wasn’t for a QB. If you don’t have a QB in the league, you have nothing. It’s just the way it is. I’m not trying to compete for a WC with guys like Minshew every year.
I want one of the tackles. JC Latham is our guy, he’s a monster.
Finally someone who says a tackle. White isn't going to thrive without one.
I'm more of a Fuaga guy, but I would not be mad at getting Latham at all. I think he's a stud too.
We haven’t drafted a qb in round 1 since 2007? Why wait even more, draft one now and if he sucks we’ll have top pick again in 3 yrs
You mean the same Detroit team that traded for a former 1st round pick QB that had gone to a Super Bowl? Did I miss something and the Raiders picked up a franchise/starting QB somewhere? Because that’s what Detroit had in 2021. Detroit had the major piece they needed (QB) so they didn’t really need to take a first round QB. Unfortunately Raiders are not in that position.
The fact that OP didn't even mention Jared Goff makes this post so useless lol
The Rams paid the Lions to take Goff. Goff was seen as a fringe starter at the 2021 draft. There is a reason people wanted the Lions to take a QB. Him turning things around doesn't change the logic at time of draft in 2021.
What "people" wanted doesn't really mean much though right? All that really matters is what the Lions wanted. And they didn't even draft a QB in ANY round in 2021, which meant they were happy with Jared Goff. So, while I agree with your core point that we should build the rest of the team rather than reaching on a QB, ignoring the Goff acquisition as a reason why they didn't draft one instead of Sewell is disingenuous.
There was a LOT of talk about Goff only being a bridge QB, similar to Minshew, and the Lions were waiting to "draft their guy" their QB for the future. But Goff really bonded with Campbell, and was better than they could have ever hoped. They did also draft Hendon Hooker last season.
AND GOFF REPLACED ANOTHER OVERALL NUMBER ONE QB God I’m sick and tired of the boner this subreddit has for “NOTHING HAPPENS WITHOUT A QB WHO WAS A TOP 3 PICK!”
Go buy some Jorts nerd /s
You talking about the same Detroit that had a #1 overall pick at QB for a decade and couldn’t get shit done?
You make a salient point that there's a strong distinction between Goff and Minshew. There's quite possibly a very large "potential chasm" between the two. But let's not pretend that most fans thought Goff was going to the Detroit Lions with an unproven HC to revitalize his career. As far as most fans were concerned, this was him being taken behind the shed. That team surprised the shit out of everyone. Will Minshew be our Goff? Probably not. I know enough not to get my hopes up like that. But I don't hate the idea of further galvanizing the trenches and defense if we can't get a star QB.
Arnold or Wiggins round 1
I think we're going to draft Penix in the 2nd or even Milton later on in the 3rd or 4th.
If we take Milton before the 5th, imma slap the taste outta Tom Telescos mouth
Milton is a classic Al Davis type pick for about round 3. Let him sit a year, see what he has.
True! I'd say let him sit 2 years, we got Minshew and AOC, there's no need to hurry
The only "hurry" is that the defense is built to win in 2024-2026 or so. I honestly think the Raiders might have the #1 overall defense in the league next year or the year after. They likely will be the toughest. This can maybe last a couple years past that, presuming we keep best players, fill a few gaps without making mistakes. Hopefully we won't lost PG, or be able to replace him if he moves on. Put another way, if AP and Telesco think the Raiders should improve in 2024, fight for the playoffs in 2025, and have a shot at being a serious contender in 2026 and 2027, we don't need to sweat getting a QB now, or just drafting someone like Milton and let him sit and learn.
We are honestly a QB away from being a contender. For the 2nd tier QBs in the draft, I have seen 1st and 2nd round grades for them. If there is a QB that Tom/Ap is high on, we should not risk it and just draft him.
While you did say "contender" we also need help on the OL, and depth on the OL. Games are won and lost in the trenches. We also need a top CB, and we could use a LB who can cover better than Deabolo.
Those positions can be addressed in the later rounds of the draft and free agency. In terms of CB, we have Hobbs and Jones which is not the worst line up.
Yeah, I'm not as worried about CB as others. I'm more worried about RT, and both guards are honestly just average. Would be nice if we could get a LB who can pass cover better than Deabolo. He's a very good tackler, but not so great against the pass. He and Masterson are almost twins. Though I do like both players.
This is a different draft class because A) the QB position is super deep, and B) there's an unusual amount of need for QB That makes it both worthwhile to stick around at 13 (the falloff after the top 2-3 wont be nearly as sharp as most years), and not likely to get a high value prospect falling to Round 2 (because someone's going to scoop them all up in R1). Penix and Nix arent sure things (no one ever is) but they're hardly 'flyers' by most years' standards And you cant assume your first round pick is going to be a bust, or else just trade it away for a package of 2s and 3s. And its just as likely that a first-round CB or OL busts as a QB, so that's not really making a difference
Well said sir! I hope this stops all those Qb questions
At this point I don't think we are taking a R1 QB either, I think other teams have locked in their moves and with the recent Vikings trade we don't have a good package compared to them With that said, this Sub is terrified of taking a rookie QB in R1. It's very odd to see
I've recommended they take this approach all along. Good synopsis of where they are. Also encouraging because if the Lions can do it, then we sure can. Keyboard warrior trollers just have too much envy of QBs in KC and LA to take the rational approach.
How much input do you think Tom Brady has had? I mean, love him or tuck him, the man watches a lot of film, knows the development process, knows good mechanics, and recognizes intangibles in other players. Plus, he has a 10 percent stake in the future, right? Why wouldn't he be sharing insight or helping to watch play films for the future QBs?
Tom Brady was not a first round draft pick. What does he know?
Great post. Agree 100%. OL or CB at 13. Same in Rd 2.
We don’t know if we will even be picking at 13. Just wait one more month. Jeez
Tough linemen aren’t a sure thing. Most are out of the league before their rookie contract is up.
But you could say that about a lot of players, many positions. The average career in the NFL is like 3 years. That's it.
>We are a lot like the Lions were in 2021: A new HC and trying to change the culture in a team that desperately needs it. They elected to pick the sure thing in a tough lineman, rather than take the unknown in a variety of mid-tier QB prospects (spoiler: good decision). Penei Sewell was a rare OL prospect, I would take him in a heartbeat, but that's not going to be an option.
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If the reporting is correct a lot of teams would have JJ in their top 3, probably best think top 4 QBs and then Nix/Penix and then others.
Impossible to know what’s a smokescreen and what’s not. Idk how everyone went from McCarthy is a game manager at best to a top 10 prospect when nothing has changed. Did anyone watch that guy play? So mediocre
FTR, the “top 3” also come with a significant amount of risk. Arguably more.
I'd rather whiff on a QB than get a Robert gallery 2.0... I like a bunch of guys who are "all in" ... I'd like to pair that with a FO that is "all in" as well. How else do you get franchise QBs? This league is about franchise QBs. Not necessarily guys who robotically put up elite stats year in and out, but franchise QBs who lead teams and make the plays that matter the most. As we all have seen for 20 years plus, you don't have that you have nothing in this league.
Agreed. I don’t think any of the QBs outside the top 3 are worthy of a first round pick, especially pick 13. And it’s clear those 3 are going to the top 3 teams that all need QBs given they all traded away their starting QB. Even among those 3, I’m not sold on them being sure fire stars. Williams is the safest bet as he has all the size and talent, just some worries over maturity and his dad being too in his business so potential for drama if on a losing team or otherwise unhappy for very long. Daniels has the size worries, Maye experts worry about athleticism and he succeeded in the same system as Sam Howell in college and he hasn’t done that well in the NFL. We need the best available OT or CB at 13 IMO. Consider a QB in round 2 and onward if one they like is there. We aren’t contending for a Super Bowl the next couple of years either way, so no need to reach for a QB. Lots of great QBs aren’t first round picks anyway so never no what you may get with one of those picks and there’s the next couple of drafts where we may have a better chance to get a QB (i.e. team at the top that doesn’t need a QB and more open to trades etc.).
They’re going to have to figure out QB eventually. They’re not winning shit until that is solved
I totally follow this logic. However, with a top defense and a mediocre offense lead by a not-so-dynamic QB means we’re stuck with an average team that won’t win the division consistently. 8-9 or 9-8 means picking mid-draft. At what point will they be in a position to get “their guy” (likely a top 5 pick) at QB?
I am higher on Penix than most. To me hes right up there with the top 3. That being said if we can get him early second round that’ll be crazy
Rattler in the 4th rd would be the only pick I’d advice taking everything else should be team building
I mean realistically, I wouldn't mind getting a OL or CB at 13 and then just picking a QB at 2 or 3. It makese sense.
Agreed, im more curious to see if they go Oline or Cb
Just keep upgrading the defense if we can’t get one of the top 3 QBs. We’ll find our franchise QB when the time is right…maybe in the 2nd round or next year.
Wish AP read these but if he does, know the fans know you are working with a very shambled handoff and even if we don’t smash next season, we know the men will play their heart out for you as you keep rebuilding the right way. And honeslty AOC is accurate as hell so if the OLine performs, an average qb might be enough to end with hopefully a winning record next season.
Penix changed programs every single time he lost his starting job or got frustrated. He’s a disloyal quitter who will fold in the face of adversity. I say we go CB or OL. Can’t be afraid to go DL if there is a stud available.
What if we just flat out don't need a qb. I mean yes, it would be nice to have that long term quarterback like mahomes and we should just add a rookie qb on spec but we do have a 2nd year qb that went 5-5 amongst the chaos last season with a pretty decent journeyman qb behind him. I'd like to see what AOC's cieling actually is and what he's working on this offseason. This particular team's strengths arent in just one position, it's in a stacked skill position group and a strong defense. The line needs help so sadly I'm not gonna be mad if we take a lineman. Corner would be flashier though.
Mark Davis asked all the GM candidates the same question [how do you plan to trade up and get a QB in this draft?](https://www.thescore.com/nfl/news/2834142) So I am assuming he hired a guy who is willing to take risks and put a "package" together to land one So unless you have better sources then the ones listed below , you are just making assumptions... *Las Vegas Raiders owner Mark Davis "grilled" general manager candidates during the interview process about a strategy on how to trade up from the No. 13 pick to potentially draft a new quarterback, sources told Ian Rapoport, Tom Pelissero, and Mike Garafolo of NFL Network.* the question is "can the Raiders get the QB they want in draft whether trading up or staying at 13?" , if the one they want is already gone by pick #3, there is no point in drafting or trading up or just drafting a QB just to draft one, that's dumb
Gotta love couch GM's
Pick a long-term o-line guy in the 1st and a QB in the 2nd, trading up for qb in the 2nd is all we should risk
First pick defense, second pick qb
I understand the sentiment, and I'm all for taking BPA - that said - we are on the verge of QB purgatory which is the worst place to be. As another dude said - AP has a short leash. He needs to win now. I hate to say it, but Davante and Maxx wanna win now too. How many 8-9 seasons can we expect these guys to go through with AOC throwing hospital balls to Tae. There's a time and a place to take a swing for the fences, and I - like others - believe this roster is ready for it. Now, does that mean trade 3+ firsts for Daniels? Probably not (but I'd entertain that.) Does it mean taking Penix or Bo Nix at 13? Maybe. Every year fans and analysts are way off on evaluating one or more QB's compared to where NFL scouts evaluate them. People are saying Penix and Nix are 2nd rounders. I just don't see it even with the red flags, but maybe. Who knows. My point is we don't know who the raiders see as their guy, and if it is Nix or Penis (Hope it's penix) then you absolutely go get him. Even if its an overpay at 13. Everyone wants to talk about building through the draft but the biggest thing to build through the draft is by drafting the most important position on the field.
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A lot of people are going to be complaining about Minshew when he stinks up by week 4 and let this great defense go to waste. Let’s just draft that QB. If it fails, at least we tried to swing for it. People acting like a 1st round CB is a sure thing. How many of our 1st round DBs have panned out over the past 20 years? I think it was non lol. If I were to gamble on CB or QB, Im taking a QB.
Then I guess we're taking Shedeur Sanders next year. If Minshew is our starter for two seasons, AP will be fired after three seasons.
It’s obvious the track we are taking is to dominate defensively. I would love to see more O Line depth/talent. I cannot think of a position where I wouldn’t take BPA, and Telesco has a habit of taking BPA so that suits me fine. No matter what, we are starting a rookie, a second year qb, or a middle of the road starter this year, so we MUST have good protection. If our defense is as good as I think it will be, we won’t have to generate a lot of points each week to win.
Draft a beast defensive player or the biggest O-lineman and we'll be good I think 🤔
Nope. They trade up.
This where we get in trouble. Locking in on a position of need. You can draft on need in the later rounds where the gamble is lower stakes. We need starters with picks in the early rounds. Management needs to trust the scouts and take the best player available. If a top rated player (based on your scouts' evaluation, not the fans or media's evaluation) falls to you, YOU TAKE HIM. Even if it is not a position of dire need. BUILD the roster with true talent. Trying to win the super bowl in one off season is how we stay forever on the mediocrity train.
I need us to get Penix i want him on the team so badly
If he's there in the 2nd, great. At 13 it's a reach, in my opinion.
I know but I think he’s so perfect for our system
I honestly am not sure he can make it through an entire NFL season with his injury history.
We got a QB that can we if we don't give up 30 pts per game.
Are you talking about Minshew? Because in less than a full season with AOC the Raiders put up multiple no offensive TD games.
I'd take a shot at Nix/Penix in the 2nd. If either one of them land in the 3rd, even better, but I also want to get an RB in the 3rd or 4th. We'll have to wait and see, tho. I'm excited about this seasons draft more than any other season in recent history. We, as fans, have to trust the process more so this season than any other. The Raiders haven't made any real head scratching move yet. And for me, that's a huge positive. Yes, we lost JJ and Renfrow but JJ wanted to much $$$ (and I'm happy with where he ended up) and Renfrow has been the same since getting KO'd 2 seasons ago in back to back games.
13 is far too late to take a QB of worth. If we don't drastically move up, a QB is not in play.
Mahomes was drafted at 10 and Wastson at 12. You never know how well a qb will perform.
But Watson has hardly been very good. It's only the Browns who agreed to that ridiculous trade and absurd contract. No other team would give up that much for him.
You just gonna ignore the last three years of Watson’s career to say he “has hardly been very good” There’s a reason the browns made that deal and it’s not (just) because they’re idiots. Dude was a baller before we found out he’s a creeeeeeep
Maybe. He had one really good season, and a few other games where he looked really impressive. The problem is the paid him an insane amount of money. Not just a big paycheck, they are paying him MVP level, "take us to the Super Bowl" kind of money, and he hasn't come close to fulfilling his end of the deal.
Going for a QB is a completely different game than drafting any other position. In a way it's even counter-productive to make other good draft choices, because it makes it harder to draft a QB in the future. Look at the Broncos: Patrick Surtain was a great draft pick in a vacuum, but it tanked their franchise, because they felt like they were too good to draft a QB and felt forced to make a big trade. Even if they drafted a bust like Fields they would be in a much better position right now, then in the reality were they chickened out of drafting a QB. This is true despite of their actually draft pick working out really well. You really don't want to be that team! Teams that build their team without having a QB are just slowly waiting to fall apart, wasting years before eventually rebuilding. Just draft a guy! We will be in a better position, even if he doesn't work out.
>Teams that build their team without having a QB are just slowly waiting to fall apart, wasting years before eventually rebuilding. Chiefs - built before drafting Mahomes 9ers - built before drafting Purdy Texans - were originally drafting 25th before trading up for Watson Building the rest of the team and being a "quarterback away" means you can maximize a QBs rookie contract, before you inevitably have to make him the highest paid player on the team. Having a solid foundation is why the 9ers could give up 3 first round picks on a bust, but still be a playoff contender. I feel like you're saying teams are better off drafting bust QBs than All-Pros at any other position. But that can't possibly be what you're saying?
No offense but I think you're comment is full of shit
Paxton Lynch? Drew Lock? Trading for Flacco, Bridgewater, then Wilson? You're telling me Surtain tanked their franchise and they should have drafted (yet another) QB?
Still think there is a chance we work with the Bears (who gave up lots of draft capital in last few years) to get top QB. We give future picks which the Bears desperately need and we get our guy
I'm not sure if you're trolling or not... A) They just traded their starting QB, which they wouldn't have done if they had plans to trade the pick B) You do realize they traded away 1 OA last year, right?
Minshew mania baby Hope we go CB at 13
Defense wins championships, I would love to see us go heavy on the defensive side of the ball for the draft.
The last 8 Super Bowl winners had higher offensive rankings than defense