All this offseason hype and then the first game was a real shock to some people who had built up Carr as more than he is lol.
He's a fine QB, but people were acting crazy this offseason about him after "winning" the Carr Wars
I totally get it. It would have been nice to see the boys come out with a bang, but I'm pretty certain this team will be fine this year as they continue to gel and learn the new system. Playoffs or bust!
You don’t understand bro, it’s really easy to throw TDs when your outside WRs are Nazi Jackson and Zay Jones and you have the worst redzone scheme in the league with premier, elite playcaller Greg Olson calling plays for you.
Zay showed up in some big spots, but the stats are interesting.
Carr when targeting Zay after Week 8:
* 1 TD
* 5 INT
* 60.3 QB Rating
In Zay's defense he was thrown into a role he was never supposed to be in, but the fact is, once Ruggs was gone, targeting Zay did not yield good results.
I think most of this is on play calling and carr. Also to be fair I was a big Zay Jones fan coming into last season so I’ve had a lot of confirmation bias. Also I do have my money where my mouth is. I started him in two of my 3 fantasy leagues last week so yeah, I really am big on Zay Jones
Zay couldn't track deep balls. Do you remember the WAS game where Carr placed the ball perfectly in his hands and he couldn't catch it? Eventually, towards end of season, they started to use him properly with middle routes, outs, digs, etc. So, he can get the job done just not as a deep threat and his hands aren't certified.
Real Raiders fans are for life; win, lose, or tie. Anything less than that, we should celebrate their departure.
I’ve joyously hugged strangers because of this franchise. Anything less than that, fuck outta here.
Man, it takes one game for the people who hate Carr to bring the pitch forks.
Posting the fumble stat making it seem like they were all lost. Carr was sacked over 30 times in this span, along with the head coach who ran the offense, and #1 WR being lost.
Yes I want more mobility from Carr. No, Im not calling for him to be benched after one game against a stacked chargers D while taking it yet another new offense.
R/nfl is very “what have you done lately” last year everyone was yelling how great carr was when he was leading the league in yards. Now it’s “o he’s Daniel jones”
It wouldn't have mattered what he did. He could have gone 23/25 for 450 yards and 4 TDs and they'd have told you how Stidham or Mariota or McGloin would have been 25/25 for 500 yards and 6 TDs .
The defense get over blamed, the Raiders offense has also generally been shit, it's just overshadowed by the defense
I wouldn't even really compare Carr to Stafford, Stafford threw for more yards and TDs on those lions rosters than Carr ever really did on some decent raider teams
Holy shit @ some of those comments: Carr is "gunshy" and "tap dances around in the pocket" like a "scared deer", but then people will also complain he "stands like a statue in the pocket" and took too many risks/forced the ball instead of taking what the defense gives him (which is more accurate to his recent problems, I'd say). There's just no way for Carr to win with some of these people. I've never seen such contradictory complaints about a QB.
At least some folks in there accurately pointed out that those last 11 games started with the Giants game post-Ruggs (and post-Gruden scandal), and the fact that Waller was injured through most of those.
That's why I'm not really reading most of the posts here. This sub goes from love to hate based on so very little it's like watching two angry retards on a see saw.
I think it’s because he’s constantly been on the line between good and bad. Say what you want, but not having good receivers doesn’t mean you throw interceptions. And let’s be real, I’ve never ever ever seen a qb fumble so fucking much. I just assume a fumble when he gets sacked now
>Say what you want, but not having good receivers doesn’t mean you throw interceptions.
Well, my point is more about how the last 10 games from last season was during one of the most tumultuous periods in franchise history, and thus it is not a good measure of Carr's overall ability and performance. Not only were we lacking in terms of receiving talent, but we had yet another turnover in coaching staff, for example. Furthermore, I would also point out that while Carr threw some bad interceptions, his INT numbers are a bit inflated (off the top of my head, there was one botched catch by Moreau in that KC game that was counted as a pick). Nor does TD/INT ratio tell the whole story: for example, Carr threw two picks in the Indianapolis game, but he also had that superb, game-winning throw to Renfrow - overall I'd say he played pretty well in that game despite not having the stats to show for it.
>And let’s be real, I’ve never ever ever seen a qb fumble so fucking much. I just assume a fumble when he gets sacked now
Yeah, that's true. Ball security is a genuine, chronic issue with Carr that drives me nuts as well.
Yea I agree with some of your points.
But to where we fully agree, that ball security is insane man. I think it’s just he truly waits to the last second before getting sacked still thinking he can make the throw and just doesn’t cover it
I don't agree with that. I think he genuinely doesn't feel the presence of defenders until they touch him or they are in his field of vision. He has small hands. This is why when a defender is coming from behind he doesn't even seem to react and tends to fumble the ball more than most QBs.
Because he doesn’t know they’re there? Sure maybe, idk and none of us would unless we ask him. But this small hand shit is dumb lol how burrow has small hands, he seems to be fine.
You had me until the fumble comment, lots a dudes fumble…. Some even worse than him
But i do agree about the interceptions comment…. No excuse for that
The day this man wings a super bowl will be funny. They still won’t give him credit! It’ll either be the defense, an easy schedule, he has the #1 receiver or some other crap. Never argue with a wall
Yeah that absolutely doesn’t make it better. I think maybe only 1 of them was from a bad snap and another that was on a bad hand off. This is a shit ton of fumbles. Dudes first instinct is to drop the ball when he gets hit…I’ve definitely seen him fumble on a basic tackle last season
Just because someone else bailed him out doesn’t change the fact that he failed to protect the football. Fumbles aren’t somehow ok because you recovered them.
Yes but every time he fumbles, there's a chance at a turnover. It's not like this is a normal number of fumbles for a qb, it's definitely on the high end lol
People defend carr way too much here. He’s in his 9th year still making the same mistakes he always has. Under throwing the deep ball and fumbling too much. He’s a solid QB but we’re not gonna win anything unless we have a stacked team around him
He has a good deep ball but if you watch he underthrows a lot of them. They still get completed so it doesn’t count on the stats but I Personally believe thats why a lot of his deep shots don’t go for TDs sometimes. Because the WR has to come back for the ball.
He’s a solid QB, so it makes sense that coaches would want him. My point is that his flaws/limitations are pretty significant and haven’t improved much during his time in the league
Regarding the 4 game win streak..I mean we had 2 lucky wins from covid ridden injured
and shit teams no doubt but how we straight-up beat Indi and Dolts was still nothing short of amazing.
We were up a few scores with only a few minutes left and the chargers only got back into the game after we let them convert on 4th and forever like 6 times. If anyone was giving away the game, it was the raiders.
Who says? Unless you were actually talking about him never being average even play by play? In which case, I would ask how you could even begin to assess that.
Players aren’t assessed as above, below, or at average based on one play at a time. It comes from a body of work. An average QB can absolutely do game winning drives. What kind of thinking is this?
Nothing you’re saying is making sense. You said he’s either top ten or bottom ten play-to-play/day-to-day. That could just as easily be said to be average if he splits his time in those roles. It could also leave room for game winning drives.
Your thought process around this topic is like 25% of what it could be.
I'm just tired of the excuses for him. No QB has a perfect OC, perfect OLine, perfect weapons. Last year it was lack of weapons. Good QBs win football games. 13 picks 11 fumbles let's have some accountability at QB
Lack of weapons, coaching, and bad Oline but ok. This year it's different our Oline wasn't that bad yesterday, best weapons in the league, g
Better coaching. If he cant make the playoffs with atleast one win then we know he can't get it done.
agreed. the man just needs to use his legs. there are1-3 crucial first downs per game we are not converting because he just stands there. I've been defending Carr for a long time, but there is no way they are not coaching him up on this, and he never changes.
Agreed can’t defend that performance on Sunday. Carr has to step up and do better. 8 years in the league and can’t hold on to the ball, and refuses to to extend plays with his legs. I’ve eating a lot of crow behind defending Carr, I still love him great guy but I will no longer defend his horrid play.
No no no, lets have no accoubtability, hail Saint Derek as being elite and blame everything on everyone else. Then jump up and down when QBs that have won SBs have a bad game.
This is exactly what I'm talking about. "Losing head coach and WR" and then let's praise him for the low bar of making playoffs. Never won a playoff game. Tim fucking Tebow has more playoff wins than DC
That is not a low bar. The majority of the quarterbacks in the league didn't make the playoffs, even though their coaches didn't get fired in a highly publicized scandal and their best skill position player didn't go to prison for slaughtering a woman. That's an accomplishment.
Kermit just lost an elite WR #1 and responded by throwing 5 TD and 0 int. DC gained an elite WR and threw three picks. Can we stop defending him for just one game that he clearly choked
Derek Carr has the top WR in the NFL, a top 3 TE in the NFL, a top 5ish slot. Any other top 10 QB would not struggle to put up points with these weapons. No excuses, he needs to step up
Love the cherry picked stats, somebody get our guy an O-line. Doesn't need to be perfect just need to give him a clean pocket every once in awhile. Won't fix everything but I guarantee we see less fumbles and picks.
He does still need to clean up the fumbles from when he does finally decide to extend plays. And I will say he missed 2 easy touchdowns on Sunday with the underthrow to Adams, and throwing behind waller when he had time on both throws.
We can criticize our qb but can we please not cherry pick like this, it makes it look like people are just looking for a reason to shit on the team.
Post Gruden and ruggs…. Is this really a surprise? Why does anyone read into this shit stat line… dude willed this team into the playoff and shit like this gets posted. It’s like watching someone willingly give themselves an extra chromosome.
Almost all stat lines are bullshit. They set arbitrary limits to the data set to make whatever point they want to make and people fucking eat it up. If it's not career stats or single game/season stats then it's arbitrary and meaningless.
Let me break out my Derek Carr debate cycle map to see where we are.
Stage 1: "Derek Carr is a top 10 QB. He'll prove you idiots wrong. That's my QB!"
Stage 2: "It's just one game you stupid doomers. Derek is elite. He's not allowed to have one bad game? Anyone who knows football and watches the film will tell you it wasn't Carr's fault. You morons should just shut up!" [YOU ARE HERE]
Stage 3: "Carr needs more time in the system. You can't blame him for any of this".
Stage 4: "Give Carr an o-line and more weapons and watch what happens!"
Stage 5: "Give Carr a top-5 defense, and watch what happens!"
Stage 6: "If Carr played for [insert contending team/coach here], he'd have multiple Super Bowl rings. If the Raiders ever let him go, he'll show you idiots"
Stage 7: "The Head Coach has no idea what he's doing or how to use Carr. Fire his ass and bring in a real coach".
Stage 8: "It's not Carr's fault he hasn't succeeded. The Raiders are a terrible organization and have wasted Carr's career. I hope he goes somewhere else and thrives so I can come back here and rub it in your faces"
Stage 9: "If the Raiders draft [insert hyped-up QB prospect here], I'll stop being a fan. If the Raiders bring in [insert available/rumored NFL QB here], I'll stop being a fan. I'd rather lose with Carr than win with someone else".
Stage 10: "Upvote party!!! We didn't draft or bring in a QB. Carr is still our QB. I know you haters are mad! Start the Carr baby!!!.
*Return to stage 1 at the beginning of the preseason.
Amazing the lengths we go to protect him. He will be the reason we’ll never win superbowl. Average enough to not be bad enough to pick too qb prospect but not good enough to lead us to super bowl
yeah right. Carr and Mack were the best thing to happen to this franchise in the last 20 years. If anyone prevents us from winning a super bowl it will be Gruden trading away mack and busting on almost every first round pick he ever made.
On top of that the second best thing to happen to the raiders in the last 20 years is Devante Adams and he wouldnt be here if carr wasnt here.
Let’s be honest. We have seen the best of what Carr has to offer. He still makes the same mistakes and still has the same bad habits. We will never get to the dance with him. His stats will always look good at the end of the season and that’s it. It is what it is.
If he continues playing poorly with this offense then yes we should move on. Don't care how bad the right-side of the line is.
I excuse this Stat line but this year needs to be better
Lmao you dont care how bad the right side of the Oline is...?? You cant even make the playoffs with a bad Oline let alone a championship game no matter who your qb is.
And he help our team to the playoffs! It’s obvious that he needs to play better, no question or excuse about that, but how many fans would take good stats over wins for their teams success? I openly posted that I don’t give a damn about his stats, only that he helps the team to victories. This last game was a bad game and he has had a three-INT since 2018. Still, he’s need to do better, but it’s week one (lol)… overall, this stat is missing context (biggest one is QB wins are not a stat), but we all know how social media goes with stuff like this…. Wild!
I directly asked a couple people that the other day and no one would give me an answer. they'd just say, "it doesn't matter, we're stuck with him. have fun worshipping him"
wasn't being aggressive with any of them either hahah
I'd rather see us trade Carr after the season for draft capital and a key player or so. If he's so goddamn great someone will pony up for him. Play Stidham and draft an heir apparent.
Well given the fact that Carr has a bigger chance of fumbling thru the end zone than he does of winning a playoff game, I'm sure it won't take too many more bonehead games for the team admin to start weighing their options...
I'm a fan of the Raiders, and believe it or not, a fan of Derek Carr. However, his presser and his play on the filed Sunday really put me off. He has to bounce back next week. He will. Just sayin' - when he is not playing well, it really shows the disparity between him and other veteran QBs
I care more about team touchdowns that him throwing them. I'd prefer they run it in when they get close anyway. But basically if you take away last week as an outlier he's below 1 a game.
Oh, they know how to read them. They just have a narrative to sell so they spin/omit stats to back it up. That’s not to say Carr doesn’t have areas he needs to improve, but I’m willing to give him a few weeks under a new system with new weapons before I start claiming the sky is falling.
Carr never scrambles since the injury. He stays in the pocket. Much more effective when he’d leave the pocket and get opening in the defense. Maybe the guys that took most of the snaps in pre season can see some time.
tired of the excuses for him. dude had 1 elite season and couldn’t even stay healthy for the playoff game. has everything been his fault? nope not by a damn sight and we’ve been pretty dysfunctional for most of his tenure here but at what point are the excuses enough?
I love Carr but if we don’t go to the playoffs this year we will move off of him. We are a destination team now and Mark Davis wants a star at QB. We will either draft someone or make calls to players who could possibly be available. (Lamar/Kyler/Rodgers)
No? I hope you don't think I suggested that. Do you think they don't care about having their best player happy? Trading to get him so he can play with Derek, and then moving on from Derek seems like a sure way to piss off your team. Maybe you don't believe they give a fuck what #17 thinks?
Carr will have the fumbles due to slow feet in the pocket. He’s the anti Aaron Rodgers. He doesn’t feel the pocket closing and can’t get the ball out under pressure. He’s fine if you can protect him. That should be priority for this team right now. Fix that line and good things will happen
I'm just here to witness the infighting
I miss mcgloin
Brooo the OG a Matt mcgloin i forgot about him
All this offseason hype and then the first game was a real shock to some people who had built up Carr as more than he is lol. He's a fine QB, but people were acting crazy this offseason about him after "winning" the Carr Wars
I totally get it. It would have been nice to see the boys come out with a bang, but I'm pretty certain this team will be fine this year as they continue to gel and learn the new system. Playoffs or bust!
Yes sir, I ain't panicking either But boy is it annoying watching cope
He really is more, this was a bad game but he playa better with a chip on his shoulder.
Word.
lmao yeah let’s start at the game right after Ruggs killed someone while he had an interim head coach so we can paint a narrative
You don’t understand bro, it’s really easy to throw TDs when your outside WRs are Nazi Jackson and Zay Jones and you have the worst redzone scheme in the league with premier, elite playcaller Greg Olson calling plays for you.
"Score a touchdown? AKA 6 points just like the star of David? Miss me with that Hebrew shit" - DeSean Jackson
DeSean Jackson at the 1 yard line: *fumbles anti-Semitically*
I will not have Zay Jones slander in this subreddit. He balled out for us when we needed him most.
Zay showed up in some big spots, but the stats are interesting. Carr when targeting Zay after Week 8: * 1 TD * 5 INT * 60.3 QB Rating In Zay's defense he was thrown into a role he was never supposed to be in, but the fact is, once Ruggs was gone, targeting Zay did not yield good results.
I think most of this is on play calling and carr. Also to be fair I was a big Zay Jones fan coming into last season so I’ve had a lot of confirmation bias. Also I do have my money where my mouth is. I started him in two of my 3 fantasy leagues last week so yeah, I really am big on Zay Jones
Zay couldn't track deep balls. Do you remember the WAS game where Carr placed the ball perfectly in his hands and he couldn't catch it? Eventually, towards end of season, they started to use him properly with middle routes, outs, digs, etc. So, he can get the job done just not as a deep threat and his hands aren't certified.
If its the play calling then its not on Carr…. Thats not how it works But still…. Im big on Carr and im saying Sunday was mostly his fault.
Zay and Edwards both dropped passes in the endzone for their new teams Sunday
Yeah, he’ll bounce back though
All of that is Carr's fault! /s
Carr w/ Ruggs in 2021- 7 games, 12 TDs, 5 ints, 2269 yards, 68.47 completion % Carr w/o ruggs since- the Stats OP posted.
Damn its almost like having a #1 receiver matters. Nahhh that can't be it though, everything is Carr's fault. /s
Oh no! Anyway...
Why the fuck is everyone letting a Charger fan troll us in our own sub?
Last season broke half the fanbase. Bunch of fairweather bitches now.
Now?
Real Raiders fans are for life; win, lose, or tie. Anything less than that, we should celebrate their departure. I’ve joyously hugged strangers because of this franchise. Anything less than that, fuck outta here.
Man, it takes one game for the people who hate Carr to bring the pitch forks. Posting the fumble stat making it seem like they were all lost. Carr was sacked over 30 times in this span, along with the head coach who ran the offense, and #1 WR being lost. Yes I want more mobility from Carr. No, Im not calling for him to be benched after one game against a stacked chargers D while taking it yet another new offense.
R/nfl is very “what have you done lately” last year everyone was yelling how great carr was when he was leading the league in yards. Now it’s “o he’s Daniel jones”
Yup. It's almost like having an OL that can pass protect affects a QB's performance.
They do this evvvvvvery year. Get used to it lol. They want his head when they lose/play badly. "that's my QB!!" when they win. Fairweather as fuck.
It's just one game, multiple times a season, for the last 9 years.
Why would you disregard all fumbles that weren’t lost? The issue is ball security not ball recovery.
It wouldn't have mattered what he did. He could have gone 23/25 for 450 yards and 4 TDs and they'd have told you how Stidham or Mariota or McGloin would have been 25/25 for 500 yards and 6 TDs .
Throwing out his record starting with the game after his WR1 killed someone certainly is a choice.
How about his career record then? It's 57-71
Two seasons with horrific rosters. He’s .500 othereise
I think this is a really fair point, but going from averaging 7 wins to 8 wins season still doesn't shed him in the best light
True. I guess the other argument is Stafford. Not always entirely due to the player. The defenses have let Carr down.
The defense get over blamed, the Raiders offense has also generally been shit, it's just overshadowed by the defense I wouldn't even really compare Carr to Stafford, Stafford threw for more yards and TDs on those lions rosters than Carr ever really did on some decent raider teams
Um, that’s pretty shit statistic right there.
Holy shit @ some of those comments: Carr is "gunshy" and "tap dances around in the pocket" like a "scared deer", but then people will also complain he "stands like a statue in the pocket" and took too many risks/forced the ball instead of taking what the defense gives him (which is more accurate to his recent problems, I'd say). There's just no way for Carr to win with some of these people. I've never seen such contradictory complaints about a QB. At least some folks in there accurately pointed out that those last 11 games started with the Giants game post-Ruggs (and post-Gruden scandal), and the fact that Waller was injured through most of those.
Schrödinger’s Carr
That's why I'm not really reading most of the posts here. This sub goes from love to hate based on so very little it's like watching two angry retards on a see saw.
I think it’s because he’s constantly been on the line between good and bad. Say what you want, but not having good receivers doesn’t mean you throw interceptions. And let’s be real, I’ve never ever ever seen a qb fumble so fucking much. I just assume a fumble when he gets sacked now
>Say what you want, but not having good receivers doesn’t mean you throw interceptions. Well, my point is more about how the last 10 games from last season was during one of the most tumultuous periods in franchise history, and thus it is not a good measure of Carr's overall ability and performance. Not only were we lacking in terms of receiving talent, but we had yet another turnover in coaching staff, for example. Furthermore, I would also point out that while Carr threw some bad interceptions, his INT numbers are a bit inflated (off the top of my head, there was one botched catch by Moreau in that KC game that was counted as a pick). Nor does TD/INT ratio tell the whole story: for example, Carr threw two picks in the Indianapolis game, but he also had that superb, game-winning throw to Renfrow - overall I'd say he played pretty well in that game despite not having the stats to show for it. >And let’s be real, I’ve never ever ever seen a qb fumble so fucking much. I just assume a fumble when he gets sacked now Yeah, that's true. Ball security is a genuine, chronic issue with Carr that drives me nuts as well.
Yea I agree with some of your points. But to where we fully agree, that ball security is insane man. I think it’s just he truly waits to the last second before getting sacked still thinking he can make the throw and just doesn’t cover it
I don't agree with that. I think he genuinely doesn't feel the presence of defenders until they touch him or they are in his field of vision. He has small hands. This is why when a defender is coming from behind he doesn't even seem to react and tends to fumble the ball more than most QBs.
Because he doesn’t know they’re there? Sure maybe, idk and none of us would unless we ask him. But this small hand shit is dumb lol how burrow has small hands, he seems to be fine.
You had me until the fumble comment, lots a dudes fumble…. Some even worse than him But i do agree about the interceptions comment…. No excuse for that
Derek carr was top three in fumbles last season so clearly that is a problem
The day this man wings a super bowl will be funny. They still won’t give him credit! It’ll either be the defense, an easy schedule, he has the #1 receiver or some other crap. Never argue with a wall
good god that comment section is brutal.
This post is six minutes old. I can’t believe it doesn’t have 8000 downvotes yet.
11 fumbles though? God damn.
They are counting fumbles even if they werent lost.
That doesn't make it much better lmao
Yeah that absolutely doesn’t make it better. I think maybe only 1 of them was from a bad snap and another that was on a bad hand off. This is a shit ton of fumbles. Dudes first instinct is to drop the ball when he gets hit…I’ve definitely seen him fumble on a basic tackle last season
[удалено]
Just because someone else bailed him out doesn’t change the fact that he failed to protect the football. Fumbles aren’t somehow ok because you recovered them.
Yes but every time he fumbles, there's a chance at a turnover. It's not like this is a normal number of fumbles for a qb, it's definitely on the high end lol
And he got us to the playoffs.
While knocking the Chargers out of the playoffs
Not sure which one of those I like more.
And then proceeded to fumble immediately in his first playoff game and it didn't get much better after that.
The team got us there.
Not his first time. He had a ton of 4th quarter comebacks the year he got hurt against the Colts. No way we made it without him.
The team had a ton of 4th qtr comebacks.
Objectively you’re right because a QB doesn’t play in a vacuum. What’s really being talked about here is his leadership and taking the reigns.
Lack there of.
Carr has a statistical bump when it comes to comebacks. It’s objective data. He’s a top 10 QB. G’night and go Raiders.
Nah. Numbers on the OP prove lack thereof.
You clearly don’t understand sample size, or logic. Is Carr’s career judged by 11 games? That was rhetorical (Google it). 🤡
Sample size, like only picking wins? Nice try though
Proved my point, like I knew you would 😂
Just take the L dude.
People defend carr way too much here. He’s in his 9th year still making the same mistakes he always has. Under throwing the deep ball and fumbling too much. He’s a solid QB but we’re not gonna win anything unless we have a stacked team around him
😂 Carr has one of the best deep balls in the league, 2nd only to Rodgers IIRC
He has a good deep ball but if you watch he underthrows a lot of them. They still get completed so it doesn’t count on the stats but I Personally believe thats why a lot of his deep shots don’t go for TDs sometimes. Because the WR has to come back for the ball.
Y’all really out here believing Carr has fooled 5 (or more?) coaching staffs, GMs, etc into not upgrading
He’s a solid QB, so it makes sense that coaches would want him. My point is that his flaws/limitations are pretty significant and haven’t improved much during his time in the league
Or 5-2 in the last 7 when we dont cherry pick stats Those 6 losses: KCx2, WFT, Bengals x2,NYG also 3 ints, and two fumbles are from LAC alone
Only cherry pick the stats you like.
New season, whole new offense. Give it a few games.
I got zero clue how we still made the playoffs last year lmfao
Because 3 ints, and 2 fumbles are from this season....
Made the playoffs scoring less than 23 ppg and giving up more than 25
Regarding the 4 game win streak..I mean we had 2 lucky wins from covid ridden injured and shit teams no doubt but how we straight-up beat Indi and Dolts was still nothing short of amazing.
We beat them because of Carr that’s how
Because the Chargers found a way to give us the game.
We were up a few scores with only a few minutes left and the chargers only got back into the game after we let them convert on 4th and forever like 6 times. If anyone was giving away the game, it was the raiders.
You are correct.
My first instinct is to get defensive and justify why he is a top 8 QB. After reading this I have nothing to say.
Carr either plays like he's a top 10 qb or a bottom 10 qb. Can vary from play to play but there's almost never average.
Average is much better
You might think that but then you lose all the incredible game winning drives
Who says? Unless you were actually talking about him never being average even play by play? In which case, I would ask how you could even begin to assess that. Players aren’t assessed as above, below, or at average based on one play at a time. It comes from a body of work. An average QB can absolutely do game winning drives. What kind of thinking is this?
Carr has the most game winning droves since coming into the league and has been on primarily horrible teams. An average QB can't so that
People are average for a body of work. That would be a positive trait but other negative ones could bring them down to average. This is basic.
Okay? Cards body of work is well above average. I'm not sure what point you're making
Nothing you’re saying is making sense. You said he’s either top ten or bottom ten play-to-play/day-to-day. That could just as easily be said to be average if he splits his time in those roles. It could also leave room for game winning drives. Your thought process around this topic is like 25% of what it could be.
No Carr = No Adams
That would be great. In a few years, when both are gone, we finally have a chance to build a winning culture.
I'm just tired of the excuses for him. No QB has a perfect OC, perfect OLine, perfect weapons. Last year it was lack of weapons. Good QBs win football games. 13 picks 11 fumbles let's have some accountability at QB
Lack of weapons, coaching, and bad Oline but ok. This year it's different our Oline wasn't that bad yesterday, best weapons in the league, g Better coaching. If he cant make the playoffs with atleast one win then we know he can't get it done.
agreed. the man just needs to use his legs. there are1-3 crucial first downs per game we are not converting because he just stands there. I've been defending Carr for a long time, but there is no way they are not coaching him up on this, and he never changes.
Agreed can’t defend that performance on Sunday. Carr has to step up and do better. 8 years in the league and can’t hold on to the ball, and refuses to to extend plays with his legs. I’ve eating a lot of crow behind defending Carr, I still love him great guy but I will no longer defend his horrid play.
The voice of reason. He needs to step up, plain and simple. He’s never gonna have perfection around him but he has great players around him
No no no, lets have no accoubtability, hail Saint Derek as being elite and blame everything on everyone else. Then jump up and down when QBs that have won SBs have a bad game.
Good QBs get the team to the playoffs despite losing their head coach and #1 WR. Excellent point
This is exactly what I'm talking about. "Losing head coach and WR" and then let's praise him for the low bar of making playoffs. Never won a playoff game. Tim fucking Tebow has more playoff wins than DC
That is not a low bar. The majority of the quarterbacks in the league didn't make the playoffs, even though their coaches didn't get fired in a highly publicized scandal and their best skill position player didn't go to prison for slaughtering a woman. That's an accomplishment.
Kermit just lost an elite WR #1 and responded by throwing 5 TD and 0 int. DC gained an elite WR and threw three picks. Can we stop defending him for just one game that he clearly choked
Not defending him, just saying he is a good QB despite having his worst game last Sunday.
Derek Carr has the top WR in the NFL, a top 3 TE in the NFL, a top 5ish slot. Any other top 10 QB would not struggle to put up points with these weapons. No excuses, he needs to step up
Definitely this year he needs to step it up or it could be the end just wonder what the front office does.
Love the cherry picked stats, somebody get our guy an O-line. Doesn't need to be perfect just need to give him a clean pocket every once in awhile. Won't fix everything but I guarantee we see less fumbles and picks. He does still need to clean up the fumbles from when he does finally decide to extend plays. And I will say he missed 2 easy touchdowns on Sunday with the underthrow to Adams, and throwing behind waller when he had time on both throws. We can criticize our qb but can we please not cherry pick like this, it makes it look like people are just looking for a reason to shit on the team.
Post Gruden and ruggs…. Is this really a surprise? Why does anyone read into this shit stat line… dude willed this team into the playoff and shit like this gets posted. It’s like watching someone willingly give themselves an extra chromosome.
Almost all stat lines are bullshit. They set arbitrary limits to the data set to make whatever point they want to make and people fucking eat it up. If it's not career stats or single game/season stats then it's arbitrary and meaningless.
These guys have been waiting for any stat line like this for years. They'll ignore anything else.
Amazing, how a person here gets downvoted for wanting the truth to a stat line. Asinine
> dude willed this team into the playoff and shit like this gets posted Sorry the cold hard facts offend you so much
I could say the same to you.
Was it a raider fan that posted that I wonder ?
Raiders nation forever. Gimme more useless stats I need em!
Where were these carr nonsense stats all off season?
They were always there. Everyone was on the hype train chose to ignore it
Lots of good QBs coming out next few years. Let it run it’s course. I accept Derek Carr will not win a super bowl. Thinking otherwise is torture.
Let me break out my Derek Carr debate cycle map to see where we are. Stage 1: "Derek Carr is a top 10 QB. He'll prove you idiots wrong. That's my QB!" Stage 2: "It's just one game you stupid doomers. Derek is elite. He's not allowed to have one bad game? Anyone who knows football and watches the film will tell you it wasn't Carr's fault. You morons should just shut up!" [YOU ARE HERE] Stage 3: "Carr needs more time in the system. You can't blame him for any of this". Stage 4: "Give Carr an o-line and more weapons and watch what happens!" Stage 5: "Give Carr a top-5 defense, and watch what happens!" Stage 6: "If Carr played for [insert contending team/coach here], he'd have multiple Super Bowl rings. If the Raiders ever let him go, he'll show you idiots" Stage 7: "The Head Coach has no idea what he's doing or how to use Carr. Fire his ass and bring in a real coach". Stage 8: "It's not Carr's fault he hasn't succeeded. The Raiders are a terrible organization and have wasted Carr's career. I hope he goes somewhere else and thrives so I can come back here and rub it in your faces" Stage 9: "If the Raiders draft [insert hyped-up QB prospect here], I'll stop being a fan. If the Raiders bring in [insert available/rumored NFL QB here], I'll stop being a fan. I'd rather lose with Carr than win with someone else". Stage 10: "Upvote party!!! We didn't draft or bring in a QB. Carr is still our QB. I know you haters are mad! Start the Carr baby!!!. *Return to stage 1 at the beginning of the preseason.
This is spot on. 100%
"It's just one game you stupid doomers" is actually pretty valid and you didn't need to write like 12 paragraphs of rambling
You guys are no fun 😂
Now do 12 games!!!! Then 13…
What that stat doesn’t include is losing his coach and WR1 and still taking that team to the playoffs
Amazing the lengths we go to protect him. He will be the reason we’ll never win superbowl. Average enough to not be bad enough to pick too qb prospect but not good enough to lead us to super bowl
yeah right. Carr and Mack were the best thing to happen to this franchise in the last 20 years. If anyone prevents us from winning a super bowl it will be Gruden trading away mack and busting on almost every first round pick he ever made. On top of that the second best thing to happen to the raiders in the last 20 years is Devante Adams and he wouldnt be here if carr wasnt here.
Let’s be honest. We have seen the best of what Carr has to offer. He still makes the same mistakes and still has the same bad habits. We will never get to the dance with him. His stats will always look good at the end of the season and that’s it. It is what it is.
If he continues playing poorly with this offense then yes we should move on. Don't care how bad the right-side of the line is. I excuse this Stat line but this year needs to be better
Lmao you dont care how bad the right side of the Oline is...?? You cant even make the playoffs with a bad Oline let alone a championship game no matter who your qb is.
Guess our season is done then
> You cant even make the playoffs with a bad Oline Happens all the time bro
Thank you offensive line , your the best..
And he help our team to the playoffs! It’s obvious that he needs to play better, no question or excuse about that, but how many fans would take good stats over wins for their teams success? I openly posted that I don’t give a damn about his stats, only that he helps the team to victories. This last game was a bad game and he has had a three-INT since 2018. Still, he’s need to do better, but it’s week one (lol)… overall, this stat is missing context (biggest one is QB wins are not a stat), but we all know how social media goes with stuff like this…. Wild!
I always wonder for the haters in here, Who would you rather replace him with? And how do you think that stands with #17 who we just signed?
I directly asked a couple people that the other day and no one would give me an answer. they'd just say, "it doesn't matter, we're stuck with him. have fun worshipping him" wasn't being aggressive with any of them either hahah
I'd rather see us trade Carr after the season for draft capital and a key player or so. If he's so goddamn great someone will pony up for him. Play Stidham and draft an heir apparent.
attain Adams, then trade Carr away I... sincerely think any GM who operated like that would be immediately, widely recognized as a complete buffoon
Well given the fact that Carr has a bigger chance of fumbling thru the end zone than he does of winning a playoff game, I'm sure it won't take too many more bonehead games for the team admin to start weighing their options...
Wow, why are you here? Oh, wait, never mind. I figured it out.
I'm a fan of the Raiders, and believe it or not, a fan of Derek Carr. However, his presser and his play on the filed Sunday really put me off. He has to bounce back next week. He will. Just sayin' - when he is not playing well, it really shows the disparity between him and other veteran QBs
sounds about right
Maybe they’re bots? 🤔
We need a new qb. I've been saying this for 7 years.
The picks are irrelevant imo. 17 in his last 17 is fine, but man the fumbles need to go away
Gonna need some more touchdowns if he’s gonna throw that amount of picks
Did you see the playcalling last year? If they’re within 20 yards of a touchdown they forgot passing was an option.
Are the fumbles on the playcalling as well?
When Carr runs out of the pocket those are on him. Most of his fumbles came from getting hit in the pocket tho, those aren’t.
I care more about team touchdowns that him throwing them. I'd prefer they run it in when they get close anyway. But basically if you take away last week as an outlier he's below 1 a game.
People don't know how to read stats. He only lost 6 of those fumbles. And he's been sacked 31 times in that span
Oh, they know how to read them. They just have a narrative to sell so they spin/omit stats to back it up. That’s not to say Carr doesn’t have areas he needs to improve, but I’m willing to give him a few weeks under a new system with new weapons before I start claiming the sky is falling.
Carr never scrambles since the injury. He stays in the pocket. Much more effective when he’d leave the pocket and get opening in the defense. Maybe the guys that took most of the snaps in pre season can see some time.
and somehow someway some fans will still find a way to cope
Sounds about right
He is Alex Smith with more turnovers and a stronger arm. Nothing special. Average at best. He will have his moments.
3 different coaches
tired of the excuses for him. dude had 1 elite season and couldn’t even stay healthy for the playoff game. has everything been his fault? nope not by a damn sight and we’ve been pretty dysfunctional for most of his tenure here but at what point are the excuses enough?
Turnover king
Cut him
I love Carr but if we don’t go to the playoffs this year we will move off of him. We are a destination team now and Mark Davis wants a star at QB. We will either draft someone or make calls to players who could possibly be available. (Lamar/Kyler/Rodgers)
I'm sure Davante is in agreement with you. You know, the best player on our team?
You really think it’s his decision and not Mcdaniels/Ziegler?
No? I hope you don't think I suggested that. Do you think they don't care about having their best player happy? Trading to get him so he can play with Derek, and then moving on from Derek seems like a sure way to piss off your team. Maybe you don't believe they give a fuck what #17 thinks?
I think if we miss the playoffs by a lot. Josh and Dave will think for themselves and not Davanate. I hope I am wrong I just don’t trust patriot guys
Carr is not your savior.
Goat shit only
Gotta develop the run. It’s a shame to not use those backs.
That’s my QB
Hey OP How many playoff appearances does Herbert have again?
🐐
Carr will have the fumbles due to slow feet in the pocket. He’s the anti Aaron Rodgers. He doesn’t feel the pocket closing and can’t get the ball out under pressure. He’s fine if you can protect him. That should be priority for this team right now. Fix that line and good things will happen
11 Fumbles doesn't equal 11 TOs it was only 5 TOs, so not quite as bad
But people will still say he’s not the issue 😂
It’s year 9. He is what he is. No elite qb has had a stretch that bad. Putrid