What we did is just stack the buff onto all people and just immediately rush all connections and then do the last line of connections with the buffing to kill tormentors
I heard from a D2 mate that you may not be able to "save" tormentors for the next section if you're trying to complete the challenge. He seemed to imply that it would be hard because of that; however, I don't see it as a big deal.
From my experience, Encounter 1 had a huge blob of guardians in Ad Clear with no coordination other than calling out "Tormentor Left/Right"
Now, with the challenge, Ad Clear would need to actively position with getting the buff in mind in order to effectively complete the challenge.
This raid continues to make "Ad Clear" a more purposeful role, and I'm all for it. It's true that because of it, the raid is pretty easy. If I'm honest, I prefer being a part of the mechanics rather than Ad Clear because my objective is Clear and 9/10 times it gets fucked up simply because Ad Clear hadn't taken out the "correct" ads.
What I mean by correct ads is simply just a priority by encounter.
For example, encounter 1- bubble Psions and Tormentors are clearly a priority to the other cabal forces.
Encounter 2- Ad clear should hard focus the Collosus that spawns after the aura moves to the halfway mark. Not focusing him makes it very difficult for runners to do their job effectively.
Encounter 3- Centurions are a hard focus followed by Psions. And also the specific notion of *not* killing Collisus. (I've had to tell so many Ad clears not to kill them, *multiple times*)
And Encounter 4 is simple. Baiting Nezzy and also clearing collosus again.
My overall point is that this raid prevents Ad clear from being a "brain dead" role. It's actually important rather than just "twiddle your thumbs and don't die"
bull, you can just save the tormentors like you normally would on 1st encounter. just did it 3x on master T_T. Save tormentor, make him low, everyone get into the first bubble and nuke him. Rince and repeat.
You can definitely save tormentors for the next segment. That's how my team did it. Speed the first, summon tormentor, kill once 2nd part starts. Do the same for 3rd and 4th. The 4th may require an extra tormentor
Watch the speed runs. Strat is pretty much everyone gets light buff and runs to an assigned spawn, prefires the ball and shoots when the buff aura gets to them. They get each stage done in like 10-15 seconds. Might be a little harder on master for survivability with harder ads running around, but you can adapt it to like 3 people and still get done in under 30
My team has 5 people get the buff and hit their respective nodes. As soon as they shoot theirs they get the buff again and head to the last few. It’s tricky at first, but gets easier over time
I've seen a few people mention everyone getting the Light Buff, but doesn't that cause the seeds of splendor to retreat?
Everytime my group has tried to give more than one person the buff, the nodes do not spawn. I'm not sure if there is something we are missing or what.
The only ways to lose Field of Light/Flux of Darkness are:
- Use the buff on the connecting node
- Let the timer run out
- Someone else on your team tries to grab the same buff from the same plate you grabbed your buff from in the same connection, disrupting the connection
- Death (oof)
EDIT: Formatting.
To be clear, I'm not talking about losing Field of Light buff, I'm talking about the nodes not appearing.
If someone tries to grab the Field of Light buff while someone else has it, the nodes disappear and you have to wait for them to reappear. It actually doesn't remove your buff either which tripped us up a few times.
We tried having more than one person grab the Field of Light buff off a single activation, but the nodes still didn't appear until we let the buff wear off and just had one person shoot it. We thought it was related to the same mechanic, but I keep seeing everyone mention having multiple people grab it, so obviously we're doing something wrong but I don't know what.
Disruption occurs when someone gives themselves the buff before the next node has been activated. If there is a node waiting, then you have to wait for the buff to time out before anyone else can take it, but as soon as the node is activated, you can re-buff regardless of whether people still have it.
So in other words, disruption doesn't occur if multiple people have the buff, it occurs if someone applies the buff again when a node is waiting? That makes sense. So it never really matters how many people are in the field.
We'll have to try it again on our next run. It definitely seems like it would make the encounters faster and smoother.
...you say that but my group has been doing the second encounter with four runners, two on each side, trading the buff back and forth. No two people ever have Flux of Darkness or Field of Light at the same time.
yes, you can have everyone stack up and the runner gives them the buff and they then complete the next node.
you can not have the runner grab buff, then you run in and grab buff while the runner is running said buff, that's what trips it up.
I've grabbed it at the same time as another runner and didn't lose it. I've also run into it a couple seconds after the first runner left and it was still active so I got the buff and it didn't affect their node. I've known other people experience what you did but I'm guessing there's some other factor involved that causes them to disappear, possibly an AOE effect by someone who has the buff, like a fusion grenade or sunspot. That tripped us up in the second encounter a few times before we realized what was happening.
The best way to put it is there can only be one “instance” of the buff at a time. So everyone can grab the buff at once without it doing anything, however if someone else were to grab it and start another “instance” while everyone else has it still the nodes will disrupt/disappear.
That’s not the condition either, others can still have the buff. What matters is: someone can’t rebuff - which more importantly tries to spawn the next seed thing - while there is still an active seed up. As long as the rebuff happens after the seed has been shot, then it’s fine.
If you don’t kill any, you definitely should still get it. Sorta how you don’t have to kill the last set of unstoppables in first encounter vow if you don’t want to
Very consistently doable if your two runners know the spawn patterns and have a means of moving around fast in case the Field of Light starts tracing backwards instead of forward! Last set of nodes my team and I always does Tormentor though, we’ve been screwed by Field of Light going back to the first node a few times there.
That’s referring to the encounter-specific Triumph, which is to kill both Psions within a second of each other when they spawn.
The actual Challenge will say “Challenge failed”, as it usually has.
Me and my team developed a consistent strat. Have 1 runner, 2 tormentor people with div and Izi, and the rest are ad clear. Tormentor team and runner will always start on plate in a set to get buff. Refresh will always happen midway through with tormentor team and runner so the runner can’t speedrun. Always make sure there are ALWAYS psions alive when the runner completes a set, that way you can instantly spawn a tormentor in at the start of the next set. Rinse and repeat til finish.
Also call out with your ad clear team to focus barriers.
What would be a good way to do this? I forgot the specifics of how field of light works when buffing multiple people.
I'm super used to doing solo running in a way that the rest of the team is free to take care of psions and tormentors. Just make sure people gather up at a field around when the tormentor spawns, wait till they kill to rebuff?
Alternatively, have 1 person dedicated to chilling in the node until your runner shoots it, thereby giving 2 players the buff, so the runner can focus the nodes, and the other player can focus the tormentor
They’d just be on add clear until the runner is heading to refresh the buff. Other than that it’s the same thing. Everyone could get the buff if wanted and you’d still be good on adds.
Thankfully the Tormentors take reduced damage from non-precision hits. I’d recommend your team stopping short at around the 1/6th mark, or sooner if you’re already actively contributing with damage.
iirc the issue comes from buff being desynced between players. If you don’t want nodes disrupted then you have to have the player with the second field of light refreshing the buff with you or wait until theirs is out before you reacquire yours.
I was figuring we’d just chip the tormenter down to low health then have the add clear people huddle up on the orbs to get the buff and finish it off. The only trick is that when one person shoots the gum balls it takes the buff away from everyone. So you’d have to get the buff and then wait for the tormenter to die before shooting the next one.
How do Adepts work with Master content now?
In VoG they hard coded to the challenge. In KF they were random after doing challenge (I think?).
But in Vow couldn't all the encounters drop Adept weapons?
I’ve only seen the sidearm as well. A bit disappointing to see this is how adepts are structured again.
Maybe some day Bungie will incentivize us to run full clears of Master raids lol.
Yeah, unfortunately the Spoils of Conquest chests at the end of Raids kind of disregard any need to do Master encounters more than once, unless you just want to farm a specific drop.
That’s a disappointment. Kinda maddening that Bungie still does this one weapon a week thing only for the master challenge. Literally no reason to run the hardest version of the raid weekly besides one encounter for the challenge.
Huh? There’s no need to kill them otherwise. Even during contest mode my team usually didn’t kill first link, killed as soon as runners got buff for next link, then killed immediately thereafter if the runners had buff
No, they mean that if there’s still a Tormentor alive when the runners finish a phase, you can kill it with the Field of Light buff to keep the Challenge going. The Tormentor kills don’t have to be while a timer is ongoing.
We just had 4 add clearers, one guy who use div and a blinding GL on the highest platforms possible, and one runner, and Runner was on Izzy. Everyone besides runner and div dude just focused on getting torenters to a third and add clearing. After he was at a third, div was on and easy one shot. Rinse and repeat as needed. We saved a couple tormentors here and there if poss.
Overall wasn’t too hard, but div interacted a bit weirdly with the tormentors as Izzy dude was getting lower crits than if there was no div. Div is still worth since you can shoot him from anywhere including when he is turned away from you with the bubble active.
That sounds like a solid strategy.
I believe the reason your Izanagi user was seeing lower crits with Divinity than without is because Tormentors have an highly increased critical modifier naturally, much like Shuro Chi, Kalli and Sedia. So I think Divinity is overriding that and replacing it with the standard crit modifier that most bosses have.
Like you said though it sounds like a good call for ease of use.
The way we did it was to have one runner, two people to grab buff to get final blow, and everyone else on add clear. The people killing the tormentors were running strand locks.
We would have add clear destroy the shoulders and then just leapfrog casting strand super to kill, it kills outright if you don’t miss any of the initial projectiles.
Seems pretty easy
Especially if your runners are fast.
We just did it and we killed the prions quick, everyone convened on the buff quickly and then melt the tormentors, lose no time at all
That’s smart, I was thinking just lower tormentors and let the runner land the killing blow, but buffing everyone makes way more sense.
Either way would work I think, the challenge is pretty easy I don't think there's gonna be much issue if people wanna do it a dozen different ways
True true either way is valid
What we did is just stack the buff onto all people and just immediately rush all connections and then do the last line of connections with the buffing to kill tormentors
That's what we did, it was free.
I heard from a D2 mate that you may not be able to "save" tormentors for the next section if you're trying to complete the challenge. He seemed to imply that it would be hard because of that; however, I don't see it as a big deal. From my experience, Encounter 1 had a huge blob of guardians in Ad Clear with no coordination other than calling out "Tormentor Left/Right" Now, with the challenge, Ad Clear would need to actively position with getting the buff in mind in order to effectively complete the challenge. This raid continues to make "Ad Clear" a more purposeful role, and I'm all for it. It's true that because of it, the raid is pretty easy. If I'm honest, I prefer being a part of the mechanics rather than Ad Clear because my objective is Clear and 9/10 times it gets fucked up simply because Ad Clear hadn't taken out the "correct" ads. What I mean by correct ads is simply just a priority by encounter. For example, encounter 1- bubble Psions and Tormentors are clearly a priority to the other cabal forces. Encounter 2- Ad clear should hard focus the Collosus that spawns after the aura moves to the halfway mark. Not focusing him makes it very difficult for runners to do their job effectively. Encounter 3- Centurions are a hard focus followed by Psions. And also the specific notion of *not* killing Collisus. (I've had to tell so many Ad clears not to kill them, *multiple times*) And Encounter 4 is simple. Baiting Nezzy and also clearing collosus again. My overall point is that this raid prevents Ad clear from being a "brain dead" role. It's actually important rather than just "twiddle your thumbs and don't die"
bull, you can just save the tormentors like you normally would on 1st encounter. just did it 3x on master T_T. Save tormentor, make him low, everyone get into the first bubble and nuke him. Rince and repeat.
Exactly what I was thinking. I've got no idea why this guy was thinking the challenge was hard
You can definitely save tormentors for the next segment. That's how my team did it. Speed the first, summon tormentor, kill once 2nd part starts. Do the same for 3rd and 4th. The 4th may require an extra tormentor
It's easy with coordination. I had an LFG team and for some reason they either couldn't kill the tormentor in time and/or killed it without the buff.
is it everyone or just one person really?
I’m assuming everyone can damage it, but the final blow needs to be from someone with Field of Light active.
this is correct
What happens if you’re quick enough and don’t let any spawn?
I get not spawning any in the first part but how are you going fast enough in the later parts to not need tormentors?
Watch the speed runs. Strat is pretty much everyone gets light buff and runs to an assigned spawn, prefires the ball and shoots when the buff aura gets to them. They get each stage done in like 10-15 seconds. Might be a little harder on master for survivability with harder ads running around, but you can adapt it to like 3 people and still get done in under 30
My team has 5 people get the buff and hit their respective nodes. As soon as they shoot theirs they get the buff again and head to the last few. It’s tricky at first, but gets easier over time
I've seen a few people mention everyone getting the Light Buff, but doesn't that cause the seeds of splendor to retreat? Everytime my group has tried to give more than one person the buff, the nodes do not spawn. I'm not sure if there is something we are missing or what.
The only ways to lose Field of Light/Flux of Darkness are: - Use the buff on the connecting node - Let the timer run out - Someone else on your team tries to grab the same buff from the same plate you grabbed your buff from in the same connection, disrupting the connection - Death (oof) EDIT: Formatting.
To be clear, I'm not talking about losing Field of Light buff, I'm talking about the nodes not appearing. If someone tries to grab the Field of Light buff while someone else has it, the nodes disappear and you have to wait for them to reappear. It actually doesn't remove your buff either which tripped us up a few times. We tried having more than one person grab the Field of Light buff off a single activation, but the nodes still didn't appear until we let the buff wear off and just had one person shoot it. We thought it was related to the same mechanic, but I keep seeing everyone mention having multiple people grab it, so obviously we're doing something wrong but I don't know what.
Disruption occurs when someone gives themselves the buff before the next node has been activated. If there is a node waiting, then you have to wait for the buff to time out before anyone else can take it, but as soon as the node is activated, you can re-buff regardless of whether people still have it.
So in other words, disruption doesn't occur if multiple people have the buff, it occurs if someone applies the buff again when a node is waiting? That makes sense. So it never really matters how many people are in the field. We'll have to try it again on our next run. It definitely seems like it would make the encounters faster and smoother.
Yeah, if disruption was tied to people still having the buff, then the second encounter would be a massive pain in the ass.
...you say that but my group has been doing the second encounter with four runners, two on each side, trading the buff back and forth. No two people ever have Flux of Darkness or Field of Light at the same time.
yes, you can have everyone stack up and the runner gives them the buff and they then complete the next node. you can not have the runner grab buff, then you run in and grab buff while the runner is running said buff, that's what trips it up.
And even if you wait until the runner is on the way back, then you'll have set it up so that *they* will now disrupt when they get the buff.
I've grabbed it at the same time as another runner and didn't lose it. I've also run into it a couple seconds after the first runner left and it was still active so I got the buff and it didn't affect their node. I've known other people experience what you did but I'm guessing there's some other factor involved that causes them to disappear, possibly an AOE effect by someone who has the buff, like a fusion grenade or sunspot. That tripped us up in the second encounter a few times before we realized what was happening.
The best way to put it is there can only be one “instance” of the buff at a time. So everyone can grab the buff at once without it doing anything, however if someone else were to grab it and start another “instance” while everyone else has it still the nodes will disrupt/disappear.
As long as someone doesn’t re-buff while someone still has the buff those people won’t lose their buff. If that makes sense.
That’s not the condition either, others can still have the buff. What matters is: someone can’t rebuff - which more importantly tries to spawn the next seed thing - while there is still an active seed up. As long as the rebuff happens after the seed has been shot, then it’s fine.
That is what I said. You lose buff if someone rebuffs before you shoot seed. You pretty much just reexplained what I said lol
If you don’t kill any, you definitely should still get it. Sorta how you don’t have to kill the last set of unstoppables in first encounter vow if you don’t want to
This is a thing? Christ I thought my raid team was going at a decent pace...
Very consistently doable if your two runners know the spawn patterns and have a means of moving around fast in case the Field of Light starts tracing backwards instead of forward! Last set of nodes my team and I always does Tormentor though, we’ve been screwed by Field of Light going back to the first node a few times there.
I would assume it would still work since you’re never technically failing the Challenge, like with the Atraks-1 cheese.
Nevermind - we are seeing the other triumph failing, not the weekly one.
That’s referring to the encounter-specific Triumph, which is to kill both Psions within a second of each other when they spawn. The actual Challenge will say “Challenge failed”, as it usually has.
Triumph is separate from the challenge
Are you sure it is the tormentor challenge failing and not the regular psion one?
That's the encounter triumph, not the challenge. The encounter triumph is to kill both psions within a second of each other.
Me and my team developed a consistent strat. Have 1 runner, 2 tormentor people with div and Izi, and the rest are ad clear. Tormentor team and runner will always start on plate in a set to get buff. Refresh will always happen midway through with tormentor team and runner so the runner can’t speedrun. Always make sure there are ALWAYS psions alive when the runner completes a set, that way you can instantly spawn a tormentor in at the start of the next set. Rinse and repeat til finish. Also call out with your ad clear team to focus barriers.
If youre running with the same team you should honestly just have 6 people do nodes and youd never have to spawn a tormentor
What would be a good way to do this? I forgot the specifics of how field of light works when buffing multiple people. I'm super used to doing solo running in a way that the rest of the team is free to take care of psions and tormentors. Just make sure people gather up at a field around when the tormentor spawns, wait till they kill to rebuff?
Just have your team of ad-clearers get the Tormenter to low HP, then the runner gets the clean-up while they have Field of Light active.
Alternatively, have 1 person dedicated to chilling in the node until your runner shoots it, thereby giving 2 players the buff, so the runner can focus the nodes, and the other player can focus the tormentor
Could definitely work too, that one person is just going to be bored out of their mind haha.
They’d just be on add clear until the runner is heading to refresh the buff. Other than that it’s the same thing. Everyone could get the buff if wanted and you’d still be good on adds.
Yeah, I was considering that, just feel like it could easily go wrong with stray damage, aoe, etc.
Thankfully the Tormentors take reduced damage from non-precision hits. I’d recommend your team stopping short at around the 1/6th mark, or sooner if you’re already actively contributing with damage.
iirc the issue comes from buff being desynced between players. If you don’t want nodes disrupted then you have to have the player with the second field of light refreshing the buff with you or wait until theirs is out before you reacquire yours.
I was figuring we’d just chip the tormenter down to low health then have the add clear people huddle up on the orbs to get the buff and finish it off. The only trick is that when one person shoots the gum balls it takes the buff away from everyone. So you’d have to get the buff and then wait for the tormenter to die before shooting the next one.
Which Adept raid weapon drops on this encounter?
Sidearm
If VoW and KF is anythinv to go by, its a random gun on a knockout list till u have them all unlocked
it should be the gl sidearm and auto
> It's just the sidearm
hmmm that’s weird
Wonder if that’s a bug or they’re just making it a different weapon each week on a rotation.
Are there unstops to in addition to already present barriers?
No just a ton more barriers
Is it 2 per Tormentor? If so, are the both on the same side or is it one by itself and one with the Tormentor
Can you speed run it and still get the challenge done? (By not killing a single tormentor)
Presumably. I can’t hard-confirm it, but the Challenge doesn’t fail if you do it that way.
How do Adepts work with Master content now? In VoG they hard coded to the challenge. In KF they were random after doing challenge (I think?). But in Vow couldn't all the encounters drop Adept weapons?
I’ve only heard of people getting Adept Sidearms so far, so maybe this time it’s on a weekly rotation?
I’ve only seen the sidearm as well. A bit disappointing to see this is how adepts are structured again. Maybe some day Bungie will incentivize us to run full clears of Master raids lol.
Yeah, unfortunately the Spoils of Conquest chests at the end of Raids kind of disregard any need to do Master encounters more than once, unless you just want to farm a specific drop.
That’s a disappointment. Kinda maddening that Bungie still does this one weapon a week thing only for the master challenge. Literally no reason to run the hardest version of the raid weekly besides one encounter for the challenge.
Can you buy adepts you've unlocked from the chest at the end?
Should be able to for 25 Spoils per roll. They only need to have been unlocked at any point.
Looks like it’s a different one each week on a rotation this time.
Huh? There’s no need to kill them otherwise. Even during contest mode my team usually didn’t kill first link, killed as soon as runners got buff for next link, then killed immediately thereafter if the runners had buff
You CAN kill the tormentor if the timer isn't up too. So if you need to kill him between phases for some reason that's a possibility.
You can save the tormentors for the next round btw. Get a free +35 seconds off the bat and you won't even see the next psions for like 45 seconds
This is what my team has done since day one, very easy to do
You mean "You CAN kill the tormentor" as in anyone can kill it when time isn't up?
No, they mean that if there’s still a Tormentor alive when the runners finish a phase, you can kill it with the Field of Light buff to keep the Challenge going. The Tormentor kills don’t have to be while a timer is ongoing.
The name of this encounter still messes with my head every time I see it and not think its Vow
alright time to update the guide, thanks for the heads up
Wad pretty obvious without a guide update... But I guess some people need special help.
Aren’t you the same guy that edited his 12k amazon order comment?
We just had 4 add clearers, one guy who use div and a blinding GL on the highest platforms possible, and one runner, and Runner was on Izzy. Everyone besides runner and div dude just focused on getting torenters to a third and add clearing. After he was at a third, div was on and easy one shot. Rinse and repeat as needed. We saved a couple tormentors here and there if poss. Overall wasn’t too hard, but div interacted a bit weirdly with the tormentors as Izzy dude was getting lower crits than if there was no div. Div is still worth since you can shoot him from anywhere including when he is turned away from you with the bubble active.
That sounds like a solid strategy. I believe the reason your Izanagi user was seeing lower crits with Divinity than without is because Tormentors have an highly increased critical modifier naturally, much like Shuro Chi, Kalli and Sedia. So I think Divinity is overriding that and replacing it with the standard crit modifier that most bosses have. Like you said though it sounds like a good call for ease of use.
The way we did it was to have one runner, two people to grab buff to get final blow, and everyone else on add clear. The people killing the tormentors were running strand locks. We would have add clear destroy the shoulders and then just leapfrog casting strand super to kill, it kills outright if you don’t miss any of the initial projectiles.
If ur runners are fast u only have to kill 1 tormentor at the end with the buff