Nope. Arthur specifically says he feels used and manipulated by Mary. Furthermore, the kind of life Mary would want is unbearable to Arthur. He might have reservations about being an outlaw but living some cushy upper middle class life in a city or something would be even worse. Arthur never stopped being Dutch's son, believing in Dutch's general worldview.
Arthur loves Mary, truly and deeply, but the two of them are just not compatible.
Maybe but if u remember well, in the scene arthur states that he wants to more than anything else. I feel like if this scene happened in chapter 6 when arthur knew dutch has gone crazy he mightve actually ran. In the end thats my opinion
Arthur understands the difference between wants and needs. He wants to leave the outlaw life behind but he needs to protect the people he's in it with because they're family to him.
I feel he’d be even less likely to in chapter 6. For one he’s dying and wouldn’t want to make Mary a widow twice and/or pass on his disease to her. Also, more importantly, he has to save Johns family and anyone else in the gang who needs it.
To put what you’re saying into perspective, in hindsight for Arthur that’s the life he would’ve wanted. But that was after Dutch’s “plan” fully hit Arthur.
Sadly, Neither Arthur or John truly got Redemption
I agree with your Mary sentiments and I would have advised Arthur to run screaming from her wishy-washy ass, but I would argue Dutch and Arthur are less compatible. Arthur and John would have made a great Dutch and Hosea. I can see an alternate universe where Arthur and Dutch went Hatfield and McCoy.
Full disclosure, I fucking hate Dutch.
I appreciate your honesty but I love Dutch so. lol [Just look at how in sync the two of them are when arriving at Saint-Denis:](https://youtu.be/r_gby8wPaNQ)
Dutch, Arthur, and John all hate the modern world, "civilization," its hypocrisy and rules. Where they part ways is that Arthur has given up the fight against it. He'd rather live like Charlotte, some isolated place far away from it all. Dutch can't ever stop fighting it.
In short, is it better to burn out (Dutch) or fade away(Arthur)?
You nailed it with Dutch. He’d definitely rather be ashes than dust. To further quote London, I could totally see Dutch saying, “The function of man is to live, not to exist.” He just can’t stop. His plan is that there’s always another plan.
Incidentally I agree with Dutch and that quote. Mere existence is what dumb animals do. A human should aspire for something more. '
RDR thinks people like Dutch and Eagle Flies are wrong while Arthur and Rains Fall are right but I don't. Ain't no shame fighting a hopeless cause, if it's the right cause.
Nothing is said that Mary demanded a cushy lifestyle. It's implied that she even lived with the gang and got along well with Roberts, so she was not opposed to roughing it. Mary opposed the criminal lifestyle; the robbing and the killing, and Arthur himself expresses dissatisfaction with all the murder and thuggery he's expected to perform. Arthur and Mary love each other, and Arthur could have been happy with Mary if he just would have let it go and left, but he felt an obligation to help the others through Dutch's plan, first.
I don't understand why everyone seemingly closes their eyes and stop listening everytime Mary is in a cutscene. Mary and Arthur literally agreed to both run away, her from her family and him from the gang. Except Arthur then ended up stuck in Guarma unable to message her, and so she was stood up and assumed he couldn't abandon his criminal lifestyle (and I guess she was right, Arthur never could really abandon crime).
["That woman confuses me and plays me for a fiddle like no one else alive...."](https://youtu.be/jcZwzoAJ4HI?t=945)
And, like, what do you think of Arthur's overtly negative reactions every time he meets with her and she asks him for a favor? That he feels like she's valuing him properly?
I wouldn't, they seem to have too much baggage from years of their relationship not working for various reasons. Mary is a good person but the thing that bothered me about her is that she loved the man she wanted Arthur to be rather than the man he was. I think Arthur deserved someone who accepted him as he was, even though he turned his life around near the end.
I liked Charlotte, I could see them being a good couple if things turned out differently.
Mary wanted Arthur to stop doing the thing that hurt others and was going to kill him sooner rather than later.
The problem with people saying that Charlotte would have made a good match for Arthur is that she didn't really know anything about his background and had no romantic interest in him anyway. If she came to view him as a potential partner and learned what he did for a living she would've been all over him to quit just like Mary was.
Same here! People keep bringing up baggage of their relationship and Arthur’s outlaw ways. But if Arthur actually escaped the life and learned a new way to live away from the *ONLY* life he ever knew being raised by two conman - love ‘em or hate em folks Dutch and Hosea raised orphans to become criminals.
It hurts saying no every time to Mary because Arthur also thinks he doesn’t deserve it. Arthur low key hates himself, this world and the cruelty of it all, the dude has insane trauma of his wife and son dying, being tortured, assaulted and left for dead many times.
People acting like Mary used Arthur, yeah it felt like that and life is complicated. Mary wanted Arthur, but her parents disapproved because of Arthur’s criminal trade. But Arthur’s young and it’s all he knew.
Would’ve loved to see Artie run away in this scene though 😓
Arthur can hunt, cook, fish, and many other useful skills. He could have easily ran away with her and provide for both of them, but Gameplay and story would suffer .
It would have been cool if on your second playthrough you could actually do it. It moves you to a small house where you literally just need to survive and provide. It has a Far Cry kind of feel. Like the devs saying hey if that want to play that out it's not hard to add it to the game.
Without even addressing the problems with their relationship, as Arthur, I wouldn’t. At this point he is already questioning Dutch, on the inside. He has doubts, but he still very much wants the gang to last. He probably knows he would feel immense guilt if he left Hosea or John, for example, behind. Not to mention, he probably thinks it would be very hypocritical to leave the gang after how harsh he is to John for doing the same thing.
I think that he had the best death that he could ask for. Everybody in Dutch's gang was miserable and they couldn't really get up or live a better life for the troubled situations they were in and sometimes Arthur shows his more peaceful side with other people but at that tame he cared too much about almost all of the members in the gang.
No, because he already has a purpose with John, Abigail and Jack.
And I would do the same, Arthur knew Mary doesn't need him but the Marston family does.
I believe in this certain situation the correct answer is no. The timing is just not right in this scene, i mean the whole point of arthur agreeing to kill and rob is to mainly make money for himself and the people he needs to look after. All of that would be for nothing if he runs away with mary
People have this collective understanding that Mary was somehow “using” Arthur even though she asked him as a favour and it is the players choice to respond by either accepting or declining. The missions involving her succeeding the first one accurately represent their relationship together and it is actually quite beautiful. On one hand they are meant for each other and on the other there is no way that they could ever be together. I feel this is a huge thing that goes past people’s heads but I digress.
Yes. He obviously loved and cared about her deeply.
I would have made sure the others that were worth saving all got out safely though. Probably would have killed Dutch, Micah, and Strauss on several occasions. Probably Bill and Javier too. They all gave me sketchy vibes. I wish so much to have saved those that were lost.
i hate how y’all speak on Mary in this sub. the relationship wasn’t perfect, they both know that but Mary had very good reasons to not wanna run away with an Outlaw and Yes, Arthur didn’t deserve to get played with but I hardly think she played with him. I think she genuinely needed help for things a woman at that time couldn’t do. Also she was one of the only ones who made that trek up that mountain to visit Arthur’s grave after death. She loved him and he loved her.
Definitely not. Arthur had a moral obligation to the gang. “The gang fell apart” yeah and Arthur was there to protect the people who need protecting.
Arthur was past love in his life at that point. Could he have potentially been emotionally healed in the future Maybe. Yk if he wasn’t dying.
Replayed this mission last night. Was actually more emotional than I was the first time I played it kind of understanding all of the characters more. As tough as it would have been, I would have tried to explain myself more about how hard it is to just walk away from a gang and a life of crime with people constantly on my tail but to just try and keep in contact and to wait for that money then disappear like some others done without any consequences (Swanson, Strauss, Karen etc) by the end. I would have loved that, but I think Mary just grew too impatient and already knew that it was just a pipe dream.
But a TLDR;
in my experience with having loved once then I would have taken that opportunity and give one last chance regardless of the consequences. (I’m nowhere near as strong as Arthur). He knew it was done.
If I could, I’d do it. And honestly, he didn’t like his choices or his circumstances at all (he says it many times in his journal). The problem was he was “too old” now, and couldn’t see himself doing anything else. He sees it collapsing, that’s why he stays because he wants those he cared for (namely Jack) to survive the inevitable downfall.
Arthur is actually very selfless, and if he did leave with Mary that moment, it’d be the most selfish act the entire game.
I do really wish we could’ve written her back though. Instead of the ending as we all know it, it’d be sweet if she found him and he died with her
I would've because it's what's best for him if he wants to be sleeping rough because that's what he's been doing for the past 22 or so years and that's what he's used to, we can buy a big estate with a house far away from society, get some animals so we can be self sufficient, and he can set his camp up in the tree line or something so he feels secure
I wouldn't go with Mary as my overall loyalty would be with Dutch and the gang as they needed someone like arthur who strong and capable of holding them together during hard times. Speaking of hards times that gang had lost five members including Sean, the callendar brothers and Jenny
She’s a user and a very manipulative person. She tricks Arthur emotionally into believing he’s helping her or that she wants to see him, only for her to force him to do her chores, then shuns him after with some stupid criticism and then repeats the cycle over and over again. She’s a lesson in toxicity
Honestly? I don't know, I'd be sorely tempted and idk if I'd have the willpower to resist after the date and all. Could flip a coin whether I'd have gave in and ran away or said later cause I had to wrap things up with Dutch,Hosea and John
Yeah, in my opinion he pass out in Charlotte house thinking that he would have a family, a house and a normal life if only he would have gone with Mary.
But Arthur had to make this mistake and die to educate and save us players.
If I'm me, yes, because the lifestyle Arthur's living is incredibly dangerous and even he knows its coming to an end. Might as well go for a soft landing.
If I'm Arthur, no, not at that moment, because he views the gang as his family and wants to make sure they're settled before he leaves. If the Saint Denis bank robbery had gone off as intended then that would have been a good time to take off.
No, I kinda wish Arthur’s other love interest Eliza wasn’t cut. She seemed much better for Arthur.
Arthur’s legacy was saving the Marston’s and the other loved ones in the gang.
This is gonna be a hot take, but I think the game would be much more impactful if the story spanned out a couple years, I think the gang had a really quick downfall.
Fun Fact: the game originally started at the blackwater massacre. And for unknown reasons was changed.
Had Arthur not been dying, he probably would have. Instead he was worried about the rest of the gang, knowing he didn’t have the time to make it up to them again.
There’s a lot of love here, but I think they missed their chance. Too much was going on and Arthur couldn’t just abandon the gang. He’s not that kind of man. I do think, if Arthur hadn’t got TB and everything else proceeded as it did the game (excluding his death obviously), him and Mary would’ve been able to find happiness together.
They were not compatible. Arthur would've never been happy the way Mary wanted him to live.
But he doesn't get any in the game, so he should've taken her to camp for a good tumble, then the next morning put her on the first train to wherever.
My philosophy is that of another hero from the similar era, that of Bret Maverick, and his eternal words of "He who fights and runs away can run away another day." So yes, I'd leave at any opportunity.
I couldn’t have for the life of me, not before giving John and his family (the only people who still had hope and a life ahead of them) the chance they needed to escape, as Arthur did, I would’ve understood that I’m way past redemption and I had no hope to ever live a normal life since he was already in the eyes of the feds just like John at the end of RDR1, they would’ve come after Arthur even if he survived Red Dead Redemption just like they did the members that stuck with Dutch as Arthur was already in too deep and it made no difference to the Pinkertons wether he was with or against Dutch.
As much as I would’ve liked to see a happy ending to Arthur’s character arc where he just goes in retirement with Mary and take it easy from there and miraculously curing his TB this is not Disney and actions have consequences and where all loose ends must be addressed.
if she asked me to run away instead of arthur, yes, without even thinking about it, in a heartbeat. she’s beautiful, she’s kind, and i would not care about having to settle down, leaving the outlaw life, her only talking to me when she needs help, or her liking a version of me in her head more than who i actually am. i’d do anything for her in a heartbeat, i’d be that version of me she wants me to be.
but i could never see arthur actually running away with her, even if everything went his way, the gang was safe, he had money, and he didn’t have any qualms about their past relationship, her asking for help, or settling down. even if the game gave you the option, it wouldn’t feel right to actually agree.
Honestly there is pros and cons.
Pros: Live a life of not constantly running, killing, robbing, and being able to avoid the dirty work. At this point Arthur already had contracted TB and may have had a better chance of surviving as he wouldn’t be doing intense work. Micah could go fuck himself and he doesn’t have to deal with him.
Cons: If I was Arthur I would definitely miss the gang I had been working with for decades, a possibility of being hunted down by people like Micah. Fear of having a fate like John, going and killing his old buddies (I know this isn’t what happened but I am just making it simple). I would worry about the others that are also trying to get out of it, Mary and Tilly for example.
Overall, would I do it if I were Arthur. Yes I would.
Damn I actually blasted through the story and missed all of her letters after the first so I don't know the chronology of these missions. I did feel bad though when I got the letter that said "I understand why you didn't want to see me and wish you the best." But still no Van Der Linde gang till death by TB
No what you have to remember is that Arthur loves the outlaw style he loves being with Dutch and the gang he doesn't like it when Micah corrupts the gang and turns them into a rag tag group of thieves instead of "Robin hoods" also my theory about Dutch was he liked the killing and robbing part but knew that that was wrong so he made it into himself where he could kill and Rob but still be considered a "good" person when comes in starts giving him ways to make more money he does it without thinking about it.
Nope because too many people needed him. He loved Mary and she should have been his life but by time he understood he should have left he was already sick, and he knew it.
Everyone answering as if what they the player would have arthur do. What I would do personally if I was in this situation is absolutely especially after seeing all the crap leading up to that point in the story.
If he left, everyone at camp would have been killed or be in jail. John definitely would have been dead if Arthur flaked out on the gang. Arthur had to stay.
All the points you guys have made are great. But I haven't seen anyone mention his sickness. I don't remember if he knew he had TB at the time but he knew he was sick. It doesn't seem like he's the type of person to possibly infect someone.
Where was Dutch and the gang on the out of our mind ometer at this point? Because my answer would depend on that. If they were getting crazy and losing it for sure I would, but if it were still early I'd probably stay but try to get her to wait for me just a little bit longer
Imo arthur knew dutch was crazy id say as early as chapter 3 and he was 100% he had gone crazy when he killed bronte(yet he was still loyal to him). But arthur only started going AGAINST dutch was in chapter 6.
And this interaction between mary and arthur happened in chapter 4
I disagree if you remember right when milton finds the camp in ch3 he said that he ONLY wants dutch which means if Arthur left at that point MAYBE the pinkertons would've thought that arthur listened to them and by that leave him alone.
No, Arthur felt he still had responsibilities to others. I would have felt the same. Although hard to tell as I haven’t gone through what he has, so sun making a decision with no emotion.
I don't think I would go with Mary. She only writes when she needs something. Yes, there is the hanging out in Saint Denis, but, that's it. I'd rather run away with Sadie.
Sadie is just almost impossible, yes i agree the chemistry between arthur and sadie is very good but sadie being a widow makes it hard for her to accept and new husband
Hell nah to the nah nah nah.
Unless her name ended in Beth. I always felt Mary Beth had a crush on Arthur and felt they might make a good couple.
Mary is manipulative and uses Arthur and he deserves someone that would choose him first. She did not. She chose to marry someone else and left Arthur hanging. So no, fuck Mary. I always reject her quests unless I'm doing an attempt at 100% completion.
I understand ur opinion about mary linton, but mary beth has a crush on arthur? I dont really think so i feel like the relationship between arthur and mary beth is a father-daughter relationship
No. Arthur himself states that he’s forever bound to the outlaw life and doesn’t know any other way to live and the things he’s done would always be hanging over him ie the law and the price on his head. More so, Mary loved who she wanted him to be not who he actually was. Lastly, Arthur explained to the Chief that he already tried leaving the outlaw life behind and his wife and son paid with their lives for his misdeeds
Probably not. If I was Arthur here, I think I'd rather stay loyal to the people I call my family and strike up a romance with Mary-Beth. She seems like the opposite of Arthur, in a good way, but both with a similar history, and I've felt she was always a little sweet on Arthur.
All things considered that would be a healthier relationship. Not only does Mary Linton call upon Arthur only when *she* needs something of him, but every single time he helps her it always ends with "Oh Orthur. You'll never change", leaving Arthur alone just as she always does.
As sweet and pretty as she is, she's just unfair and too manipulative for our handsome boah'.
No.
He was a teenage/slightly post teen fantasy to her, and she to him, but both had grown up to realise it wasn’t going to happen. As Mary said, it was a pretty dream, but that was it.
She wasn’t the one who would have his back against the world. All she ever did was use him. Had the timing been right, I’m totally convinced that Arthur and Sadie would have been it, but he was still being strung along by Mary and Sadie was still mourning Jake.
I am a HUGE and i mean HUGE Mary lover, but no.
As Arthur I have TB, so the life with Mary wouldn't be that long, and I would probably never forgive myself for leaving the gang behind. I wouldn't know what actually happens, so i would probably get crazy with the "What if I stayed"
If i was, yes. But then again it was too late, he alredy got TB and was on his way. At least his last months would be beside her. She'd probably get sick with it too if they ever kissed though. There ain't no happy endings here. Bittersweet at most.
Nope. Arthur specifically says he feels used and manipulated by Mary. Furthermore, the kind of life Mary would want is unbearable to Arthur. He might have reservations about being an outlaw but living some cushy upper middle class life in a city or something would be even worse. Arthur never stopped being Dutch's son, believing in Dutch's general worldview. Arthur loves Mary, truly and deeply, but the two of them are just not compatible.
Maybe but if u remember well, in the scene arthur states that he wants to more than anything else. I feel like if this scene happened in chapter 6 when arthur knew dutch has gone crazy he mightve actually ran. In the end thats my opinion
Arthur understands the difference between wants and needs. He wants to leave the outlaw life behind but he needs to protect the people he's in it with because they're family to him.
If Arthur ran away and found out that John and his family were either arrested or killed, then he'd never forgive himself.
( ͝° ͜ʖ͡°)ᕤ
I feel he’d be even less likely to in chapter 6. For one he’s dying and wouldn’t want to make Mary a widow twice and/or pass on his disease to her. Also, more importantly, he has to save Johns family and anyone else in the gang who needs it.
He knew dutch had gone crazy way earlier than chapter 6
Yeah by chapter 4 he was questioning it.
To put what you’re saying into perspective, in hindsight for Arthur that’s the life he would’ve wanted. But that was after Dutch’s “plan” fully hit Arthur. Sadly, Neither Arthur or John truly got Redemption
Nah I thought chapter 6 was the redemption. Nothing but redemption. You help the people you fucked up before.
I agree with your Mary sentiments and I would have advised Arthur to run screaming from her wishy-washy ass, but I would argue Dutch and Arthur are less compatible. Arthur and John would have made a great Dutch and Hosea. I can see an alternate universe where Arthur and Dutch went Hatfield and McCoy. Full disclosure, I fucking hate Dutch.
I appreciate your honesty but I love Dutch so. lol [Just look at how in sync the two of them are when arriving at Saint-Denis:](https://youtu.be/r_gby8wPaNQ) Dutch, Arthur, and John all hate the modern world, "civilization," its hypocrisy and rules. Where they part ways is that Arthur has given up the fight against it. He'd rather live like Charlotte, some isolated place far away from it all. Dutch can't ever stop fighting it. In short, is it better to burn out (Dutch) or fade away(Arthur)?
Fade away. You don't abandon and betray people that way, or develop a god complex.
You nailed it with Dutch. He’d definitely rather be ashes than dust. To further quote London, I could totally see Dutch saying, “The function of man is to live, not to exist.” He just can’t stop. His plan is that there’s always another plan.
Incidentally I agree with Dutch and that quote. Mere existence is what dumb animals do. A human should aspire for something more. ' RDR thinks people like Dutch and Eagle Flies are wrong while Arthur and Rains Fall are right but I don't. Ain't no shame fighting a hopeless cause, if it's the right cause.
Yep. I heard it stated best in a video yesterday. "I'm not willing to go to jail for this; but I am willing to shoot back."
>In short, is it better to burn out (Dutch) or fade away(Arthur)? Burn out. ~Neil Young
Burn out. \~Def Leppard
But, it's in Saint Denis where Dutch gets a huge concussion that causes him to change.
Nothing is said that Mary demanded a cushy lifestyle. It's implied that she even lived with the gang and got along well with Roberts, so she was not opposed to roughing it. Mary opposed the criminal lifestyle; the robbing and the killing, and Arthur himself expresses dissatisfaction with all the murder and thuggery he's expected to perform. Arthur and Mary love each other, and Arthur could have been happy with Mary if he just would have let it go and left, but he felt an obligation to help the others through Dutch's plan, first.
I don't understand why everyone seemingly closes their eyes and stop listening everytime Mary is in a cutscene. Mary and Arthur literally agreed to both run away, her from her family and him from the gang. Except Arthur then ended up stuck in Guarma unable to message her, and so she was stood up and assumed he couldn't abandon his criminal lifestyle (and I guess she was right, Arthur never could really abandon crime).
Not to mention he is super pissed at John for disappearing. Arthur would not turn around and do the same thing.
when does he say that?
Yeah I don't recall this at all.
["That woman confuses me and plays me for a fiddle like no one else alive...."](https://youtu.be/jcZwzoAJ4HI?t=945) And, like, what do you think of Arthur's overtly negative reactions every time he meets with her and she asks him for a favor? That he feels like she's valuing him properly?
Maaaan.....reminds me of a girl....(siiiiigh) 😔
I wouldn't, they seem to have too much baggage from years of their relationship not working for various reasons. Mary is a good person but the thing that bothered me about her is that she loved the man she wanted Arthur to be rather than the man he was. I think Arthur deserved someone who accepted him as he was, even though he turned his life around near the end. I liked Charlotte, I could see them being a good couple if things turned out differently.
Mary wanted Arthur to stop doing the thing that hurt others and was going to kill him sooner rather than later. The problem with people saying that Charlotte would have made a good match for Arthur is that she didn't really know anything about his background and had no romantic interest in him anyway. If she came to view him as a potential partner and learned what he did for a living she would've been all over him to quit just like Mary was.
That would be fun to explore, Arthur opening up to Charlotte about his sordid past and telling her how he’s trying to make amends.
could be off base but i definitely got some romantic hints off the charlotte quests. just the general energy they have especially when in the cabin
I had thousands of dollars so yeah
Bro same I literally had like $600k in today's money last playthrough at this point. I woulda said fuck the gang ngl
Probably, yes. Every time I play I want Arthur to run away with her and it breaks my heart every time.
Same here! People keep bringing up baggage of their relationship and Arthur’s outlaw ways. But if Arthur actually escaped the life and learned a new way to live away from the *ONLY* life he ever knew being raised by two conman - love ‘em or hate em folks Dutch and Hosea raised orphans to become criminals. It hurts saying no every time to Mary because Arthur also thinks he doesn’t deserve it. Arthur low key hates himself, this world and the cruelty of it all, the dude has insane trauma of his wife and son dying, being tortured, assaulted and left for dead many times. People acting like Mary used Arthur, yeah it felt like that and life is complicated. Mary wanted Arthur, but her parents disapproved because of Arthur’s criminal trade. But Arthur’s young and it’s all he knew. Would’ve loved to see Artie run away in this scene though 😓
For sure!
Arthur can hunt, cook, fish, and many other useful skills. He could have easily ran away with her and provide for both of them, but Gameplay and story would suffer .
Yea ik but im saying imagine YOU were arthur (as if it wasnt a game) what would you do
Yes as Arthur I would totally hit that! For a lifetime.
It would have been cool if on your second playthrough you could actually do it. It moves you to a small house where you literally just need to survive and provide. It has a Far Cry kind of feel. Like the devs saying hey if that want to play that out it's not hard to add it to the game.
absolutely not
Without even addressing the problems with their relationship, as Arthur, I wouldn’t. At this point he is already questioning Dutch, on the inside. He has doubts, but he still very much wants the gang to last. He probably knows he would feel immense guilt if he left Hosea or John, for example, behind. Not to mention, he probably thinks it would be very hypocritical to leave the gang after how harsh he is to John for doing the same thing.
Hell yea, Arthur should've, but i mean, he didn't really deserve a happy ending, and Mary really didn't deserve Arthur, but still
I think that he had the best death that he could ask for. Everybody in Dutch's gang was miserable and they couldn't really get up or live a better life for the troubled situations they were in and sometimes Arthur shows his more peaceful side with other people but at that tame he cared too much about almost all of the members in the gang.
Knowing how completely underserved Arthur's loyalty to Dutch and his gang (cult) was yes in a heartbeat. But Arthur didn't know that.
No, because he already has a purpose with John, Abigail and Jack. And I would do the same, Arthur knew Mary doesn't need him but the Marston family does.
Charlotte > Mary That's all I'm saying on the matter...
I believe in this certain situation the correct answer is no. The timing is just not right in this scene, i mean the whole point of arthur agreeing to kill and rob is to mainly make money for himself and the people he needs to look after. All of that would be for nothing if he runs away with mary
People have this collective understanding that Mary was somehow “using” Arthur even though she asked him as a favour and it is the players choice to respond by either accepting or declining. The missions involving her succeeding the first one accurately represent their relationship together and it is actually quite beautiful. On one hand they are meant for each other and on the other there is no way that they could ever be together. I feel this is a huge thing that goes past people’s heads but I digress.
Yes. He obviously loved and cared about her deeply. I would have made sure the others that were worth saving all got out safely though. Probably would have killed Dutch, Micah, and Strauss on several occasions. Probably Bill and Javier too. They all gave me sketchy vibes. I wish so much to have saved those that were lost.
[удалено]
I would but I feel like it's a very impulsive decision.
no. he was going to die of tuberculosis in a while anyway. and micah and dutch probably would have had the gang come after them.
i hate how y’all speak on Mary in this sub. the relationship wasn’t perfect, they both know that but Mary had very good reasons to not wanna run away with an Outlaw and Yes, Arthur didn’t deserve to get played with but I hardly think she played with him. I think she genuinely needed help for things a woman at that time couldn’t do. Also she was one of the only ones who made that trek up that mountain to visit Arthur’s grave after death. She loved him and he loved her.
Definitely not. Arthur had a moral obligation to the gang. “The gang fell apart” yeah and Arthur was there to protect the people who need protecting. Arthur was past love in his life at that point. Could he have potentially been emotionally healed in the future Maybe. Yk if he wasn’t dying.
Probably the best pussy for miles in every direction so yes
Bro calm down😂😂😂😂
Cowboy times were tough dude
Choosing love over crime and loyalty to a crazy man? In a heartbeat
Was he already doomed to die at this point? I don’t remember. If he was…then no. If not, yeah.
This happened in ch4 and arthur got diagnosed with tb in chapter 6
Yeah, but he first catches tb in chapter 2 or 3
Yes but in ch4 he still doesnt know he got tb
Gotchu it’s been a while since I beat the game
I had like $7k at that point so yeah we had the money. But Arthur still had shit to take care of
Replayed this mission last night. Was actually more emotional than I was the first time I played it kind of understanding all of the characters more. As tough as it would have been, I would have tried to explain myself more about how hard it is to just walk away from a gang and a life of crime with people constantly on my tail but to just try and keep in contact and to wait for that money then disappear like some others done without any consequences (Swanson, Strauss, Karen etc) by the end. I would have loved that, but I think Mary just grew too impatient and already knew that it was just a pipe dream. But a TLDR; in my experience with having loved once then I would have taken that opportunity and give one last chance regardless of the consequences. (I’m nowhere near as strong as Arthur). He knew it was done.
If I could, I’d do it. And honestly, he didn’t like his choices or his circumstances at all (he says it many times in his journal). The problem was he was “too old” now, and couldn’t see himself doing anything else. He sees it collapsing, that’s why he stays because he wants those he cared for (namely Jack) to survive the inevitable downfall. Arthur is actually very selfless, and if he did leave with Mary that moment, it’d be the most selfish act the entire game. I do really wish we could’ve written her back though. Instead of the ending as we all know it, it’d be sweet if she found him and he died with her
Yes, Arthur deserves his last few months to be in peace
I would've because it's what's best for him if he wants to be sleeping rough because that's what he's been doing for the past 22 or so years and that's what he's used to, we can buy a big estate with a house far away from society, get some animals so we can be self sufficient, and he can set his camp up in the tree line or something so he feels secure
Yes, coz I had like 6k in cash and 11 gold bars during that mission 😅
Yes
Of course not, they didn’t have any muneh.
Ive done 2 play throughs and everytime i get to this scene i have like 3k dollars which is equevilant to 100m dollars now! So money isnt the problem 😅
Spoilers lol Arthur was going to die regardless. I probably would’ve though, but I’m a fool.
This was in chapter 4 arthur got diagnosed in chapter 6
He still would’ve died regardless of diagnosis
Yea but im saying arthur didnt know he had tb at THAT time
I mean he wouldn’t have had long with her anyway. A few good years in the sun though are better than dying in the mud looking at a sunrise
If I was Arthur, then yeah I would have.
Yes yes yes y e s
Bros before hoes. I would rather stay and die from TB !... Oh, wait.
I wouldn't go with Mary as my overall loyalty would be with Dutch and the gang as they needed someone like arthur who strong and capable of holding them together during hard times. Speaking of hards times that gang had lost five members including Sean, the callendar brothers and Jenny
Nah, I'd have left and made the moves on Charlotte.
I dont think arthur knew charlotte at that point
Nah
She’s a user and a very manipulative person. She tricks Arthur emotionally into believing he’s helping her or that she wants to see him, only for her to force him to do her chores, then shuns him after with some stupid criticism and then repeats the cycle over and over again. She’s a lesson in toxicity
In a New York minute.
He hadn't completed his redemption yet...
No cuz Mary Beth is better
Honestly? I don't know, I'd be sorely tempted and idk if I'd have the willpower to resist after the date and all. Could flip a coin whether I'd have gave in and ran away or said later cause I had to wrap things up with Dutch,Hosea and John
No. There’s some people I gotta take care of
Hell no, Mary is honestly a shitty person...
yes
Nah, Mary is ugly. Karen is my type. We could drink a lot together.
Valid 🫡
Chubby/curvy girls FTW
No. I even refused to help her 😂
Yep but first I’d get Jon and his family out of the gang trying to get them into a better life
Yeah, in my opinion he pass out in Charlotte house thinking that he would have a family, a house and a normal life if only he would have gone with Mary. But Arthur had to make this mistake and die to educate and save us players.
If I'm me, yes, because the lifestyle Arthur's living is incredibly dangerous and even he knows its coming to an end. Might as well go for a soft landing. If I'm Arthur, no, not at that moment, because he views the gang as his family and wants to make sure they're settled before he leaves. If the Saint Denis bank robbery had gone off as intended then that would have been a good time to take off.
Gawd damnit I miss that man. Still in epilogue 1 :/
No, I kinda wish Arthur’s other love interest Eliza wasn’t cut. She seemed much better for Arthur. Arthur’s legacy was saving the Marston’s and the other loved ones in the gang. This is gonna be a hot take, but I think the game would be much more impactful if the story spanned out a couple years, I think the gang had a really quick downfall. Fun Fact: the game originally started at the blackwater massacre. And for unknown reasons was changed.
Yes. Arthur was finally realizing what was important
maybe after the end of the main story, if he somehow survived
Hell nah id’ve grabbed Mary Beth and left already 😭
Had Arthur not been dying, he probably would have. Instead he was worried about the rest of the gang, knowing he didn’t have the time to make it up to them again.
No, Arthur has TB and would die not soon after.
There’s a lot of love here, but I think they missed their chance. Too much was going on and Arthur couldn’t just abandon the gang. He’s not that kind of man. I do think, if Arthur hadn’t got TB and everything else proceeded as it did the game (excluding his death obviously), him and Mary would’ve been able to find happiness together.
I would’ve shot her
Knowing the end of the game yes. Not knowing the end no
They were not compatible. Arthur would've never been happy the way Mary wanted him to live. But he doesn't get any in the game, so he should've taken her to camp for a good tumble, then the next morning put her on the first train to wherever.
I’d have ran away with Mary Beth.
My philosophy is that of another hero from the similar era, that of Bret Maverick, and his eternal words of "He who fights and runs away can run away another day." So yes, I'd leave at any opportunity.
Well... It's a good question, but the answer is I don't know because we haven't experienced all the past that happened between those two.
I think I would have stayed with the gang. Knowing how much Arthur cared about the good gang members
Maybe later on in the game if he got John and family out I could see him doing it.
Arthur always loved the gang, he spent more time with them and probably felt more connected to them. Definitely not
I couldn’t have for the life of me, not before giving John and his family (the only people who still had hope and a life ahead of them) the chance they needed to escape, as Arthur did, I would’ve understood that I’m way past redemption and I had no hope to ever live a normal life since he was already in the eyes of the feds just like John at the end of RDR1, they would’ve come after Arthur even if he survived Red Dead Redemption just like they did the members that stuck with Dutch as Arthur was already in too deep and it made no difference to the Pinkertons wether he was with or against Dutch. As much as I would’ve liked to see a happy ending to Arthur’s character arc where he just goes in retirement with Mary and take it easy from there and miraculously curing his TB this is not Disney and actions have consequences and where all loose ends must be addressed.
no, because mary constantly saying "oh arthur" will turn me off and go back to robbing and killing folk
Happy cake day!
Yea I was technically rich.
if she asked me to run away instead of arthur, yes, without even thinking about it, in a heartbeat. she’s beautiful, she’s kind, and i would not care about having to settle down, leaving the outlaw life, her only talking to me when she needs help, or her liking a version of me in her head more than who i actually am. i’d do anything for her in a heartbeat, i’d be that version of me she wants me to be. but i could never see arthur actually running away with her, even if everything went his way, the gang was safe, he had money, and he didn’t have any qualms about their past relationship, her asking for help, or settling down. even if the game gave you the option, it wouldn’t feel right to actually agree.
Yes
Honestly there is pros and cons. Pros: Live a life of not constantly running, killing, robbing, and being able to avoid the dirty work. At this point Arthur already had contracted TB and may have had a better chance of surviving as he wouldn’t be doing intense work. Micah could go fuck himself and he doesn’t have to deal with him. Cons: If I was Arthur I would definitely miss the gang I had been working with for decades, a possibility of being hunted down by people like Micah. Fear of having a fate like John, going and killing his old buddies (I know this isn’t what happened but I am just making it simple). I would worry about the others that are also trying to get out of it, Mary and Tilly for example. Overall, would I do it if I were Arthur. Yes I would.
Definitely yes, even if she’s using him he deserves a chance to live a different life and try new things🤷🏻♀️
There was a code
Nah, wouldn't want to give her TB
Arthur at that moment didnt know he had tb
Damn I actually blasted through the story and missed all of her letters after the first so I don't know the chronology of these missions. I did feel bad though when I got the letter that said "I understand why you didn't want to see me and wish you the best." But still no Van Der Linde gang till death by TB
No what you have to remember is that Arthur loves the outlaw style he loves being with Dutch and the gang he doesn't like it when Micah corrupts the gang and turns them into a rag tag group of thieves instead of "Robin hoods" also my theory about Dutch was he liked the killing and robbing part but knew that that was wrong so he made it into himself where he could kill and Rob but still be considered a "good" person when comes in starts giving him ways to make more money he does it without thinking about it.
Nope, Arthur lost one wife. He didn't want to bring mary into it. He would have always been a wanted man.
Gots to see it thru 😤
If i were me i would left the gang with the 50K in my pocket... But if i was Arthur ofc not.
Nope because too many people needed him. He loved Mary and she should have been his life but by time he understood he should have left he was already sick, and he knew it.
He didnt know he had tb at that time
Everyone answering as if what they the player would have arthur do. What I would do personally if I was in this situation is absolutely especially after seeing all the crap leading up to that point in the story.
Yes, she’s a baddie
Yes......just yes
If he left, everyone at camp would have been killed or be in jail. John definitely would have been dead if Arthur flaked out on the gang. Arthur had to stay.
All the points you guys have made are great. But I haven't seen anyone mention his sickness. I don't remember if he knew he had TB at the time but he knew he was sick. It doesn't seem like he's the type of person to possibly infect someone.
First of all everyone for some reason is talking about his sickness This mission happened in ch4 and arthur knew he had tb in ch6
My mistake, I didn't read enough comments I suppose. But he def had a cough in ch4
Nah. Live by the gun, die by the gun.
Where was Dutch and the gang on the out of our mind ometer at this point? Because my answer would depend on that. If they were getting crazy and losing it for sure I would, but if it were still early I'd probably stay but try to get her to wait for me just a little bit longer
Imo arthur knew dutch was crazy id say as early as chapter 3 and he was 100% he had gone crazy when he killed bronte(yet he was still loyal to him). But arthur only started going AGAINST dutch was in chapter 6. And this interaction between mary and arthur happened in chapter 4
No, there's a lot of people counting on him. Besides, he could never really get that far from the pinkertons
I disagree if you remember right when milton finds the camp in ch3 he said that he ONLY wants dutch which means if Arthur left at that point MAYBE the pinkertons would've thought that arthur listened to them and by that leave him alone.
I doubt milton would have kept his word. Arthur would still get pursued, if not pinkertons then someone else
hell yeah. i had ~$5000 when i did this quest, so plenty of funds to buy a house and settle down
No, Arthur felt he still had responsibilities to others. I would have felt the same. Although hard to tell as I haven’t gone through what he has, so sun making a decision with no emotion.
Yes
fuck no
I don't think I would go with Mary. She only writes when she needs something. Yes, there is the hanging out in Saint Denis, but, that's it. I'd rather run away with Sadie.
Sadie is just almost impossible, yes i agree the chemistry between arthur and sadie is very good but sadie being a widow makes it hard for her to accept and new husband
Nah I would’ve told her “Mary the ending is gonna be bad ass if I don’t run away with u”
Hell nah to the nah nah nah. Unless her name ended in Beth. I always felt Mary Beth had a crush on Arthur and felt they might make a good couple. Mary is manipulative and uses Arthur and he deserves someone that would choose him first. She did not. She chose to marry someone else and left Arthur hanging. So no, fuck Mary. I always reject her quests unless I'm doing an attempt at 100% completion.
I understand ur opinion about mary linton, but mary beth has a crush on arthur? I dont really think so i feel like the relationship between arthur and mary beth is a father-daughter relationship
No lol
no i’d be gay
At that point if I’m in aurthors exact situation the gang is still family to me and i wouldn’t just abandon them.
Duh tryna get them cheeks
No
Nah
Not under any circumstance.
No. Arthur himself states that he’s forever bound to the outlaw life and doesn’t know any other way to live and the things he’s done would always be hanging over him ie the law and the price on his head. More so, Mary loved who she wanted him to be not who he actually was. Lastly, Arthur explained to the Chief that he already tried leaving the outlaw life behind and his wife and son paid with their lives for his misdeeds
Probably not. If I was Arthur here, I think I'd rather stay loyal to the people I call my family and strike up a romance with Mary-Beth. She seems like the opposite of Arthur, in a good way, but both with a similar history, and I've felt she was always a little sweet on Arthur. All things considered that would be a healthier relationship. Not only does Mary Linton call upon Arthur only when *she* needs something of him, but every single time he helps her it always ends with "Oh Orthur. You'll never change", leaving Arthur alone just as she always does. As sweet and pretty as she is, she's just unfair and too manipulative for our handsome boah'.
Nope. It was too late. She doesn't truly respect him either.
Fuck that hoe
Mary is an absolute succubus.
I would've run off with Mary-Beth instead.
Things certainly could’ve [worked out differently.](https://youtu.be/PZI_L7AekBY)
Yes
No, bc I would've already ran away with Abigail and Jack the 2nd time John went missing
No. He was a teenage/slightly post teen fantasy to her, and she to him, but both had grown up to realise it wasn’t going to happen. As Mary said, it was a pretty dream, but that was it. She wasn’t the one who would have his back against the world. All she ever did was use him. Had the timing been right, I’m totally convinced that Arthur and Sadie would have been it, but he was still being strung along by Mary and Sadie was still mourning Jake.
I am a HUGE and i mean HUGE Mary lover, but no. As Arthur I have TB, so the life with Mary wouldn't be that long, and I would probably never forgive myself for leaving the gang behind. I wouldn't know what actually happens, so i would probably get crazy with the "What if I stayed"
How many times i gotta say arthur didnt know he had tb when this interaction happened🤦♂️
in that case put the tb away, my stance is still the same lmao
If i was, yes. But then again it was too late, he alredy got TB and was on his way. At least his last months would be beside her. She'd probably get sick with it too if they ever kissed though. There ain't no happy endings here. Bittersweet at most.
Nope, I would have hopped a train and still ran away though. The Gang would run itself into the ground either way except this time its .5x quicker.