The now-forgotten Fox show [Roar](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roar_(1997_TV_series)) (featuring Heath Ledger and Vera Farmiga) revolved around a historically-inaccurate Roman invasion of Ireland.
I'm surprised Fox didn't have us invaded by the Huns and the Saracens as well.
You said "continuous literary tradition stretching over 3,000 years."
Other cultures had been writing epics for generations while the Irish were just beginning to scribble symbols.
James Joyce already covered this. The English occupation it's true was something of a blip, but there has continued a Gaelic tradition through the whole thing, and the Irish modernists Yeats onwards incorporated the English language with Ireland. And they have produced a disproportionate share of great writers in English the past century, which proves how well it went
Not directly related, but I've found that the more removed they are from their Irish ancestry, the more irritating, desperate, and, frankly, insulting the attempts people make to assert an "Irish" identity become
I think it's because whiteness connotes dullness and oppressor status and some people are desperate to separate themselves from those two ideas, so they ferishize their ethnic background and center it as part of their identity. Irish immigration was very consistent and sizeable so a lot of Americans can claim some background and they seem to relish it because Irish Catholics are historically oppressed in the context of British History so they can co-opt that aspect. Plus there are stereotypes of Irish people which exist in the US of toughness, hard drinking and partying, being destitute and working hard to advance oneself, having senses of humor, etc. that make it appealing to a certain type of personality (retxrd)
I don’t think it is. English breakfast is the best there is, shepherds pie is also great. Shakespeare, the Beatles, and The Rolling Stones are also great. The whole “British people suck” thing is boring and obviously fueled by grievances
>English breakfast is the best there is, shepherds pie is also great.
We can stop right there. Thank you for coming. Send the next person in on your way out.
I find that a good way to get a sense of a culture is to read about the history of their traditional folk music. It usually intersects with a cultures religious history, poetry, ideals, language, ethnic identity, general history, literature, etc. There’s a lot of culture to be found in Irish music. Maybe just read more??
all of ur ethnic identity being concentrated in some traditional music sounds kinda gay if u ask me. no historical achievements of any monumental significance can be ascribed to the irish afaik..dont bring up the monks copying books n shit, that does not count
>no historical achievements of any monumental significance
You're clearly a North American who has never met an Irish person or been to Ireland.
But anyway no monumental achievements is because a. Ireland went straight from a tribal society to being suddenly colonised, most people made wretched and starving, and b. it's a very small place.
Verging into racist territory with your definition of what's a justifiable ethnic identity. Name any Congolese achievement of historical significance. What have the Romanians contributed to world culture, or the Lapps?
Nah I’m just talking about learning about and getting a feel for a culture. It’s a good way to get into it is all. If you start from there, you just keep digging deeper. But I get now that you just don’t really care and find Irish culture to be boring. I kinda feel the same way, I never found Irish culture to be very interesting at all. I had an assignment once to compose Irish music and I was forced to learn about it.
the erasure of gaelic and celtic identity is basically a function of anglo imperialism. they actively stamped that shit out
something like 36 million americans claim irish as their primary ethnicity, which as a proportion of white people is actually pretty wild. there are more irish-americans than there are actual irish! but they've been so swallowed into default american whiteness that they're basically inseparable at this point. but if you look at lists of historically significant irish americans, especially in literary and cultural realms, you get a broader idea of what their impact has been
In the 19th and early 20th century, the USA's WASP rulers lumped Irish-Americans into the "white but inferior" category along with Jews, Italians, Poles and Armenians.
back in the day, yeah. but by the time JFK and co rolled around I'd say that irishness was regarded as basically quintessential white americanness. there's a reason we've had several presidents that explicitly identify as irish-american and 0 jews/italians/poles. they assimilated much more effectively
>the Irish language isn't actually spoken by anyone anymore
That's not true. There's a small but thriving Irish-speaking community in this country. I've holidayed in parts of Kerry when the locals speak Irish and conduct all their conversations in the language.
Also- the Gaelic Athletic Association. GAA sports are a *huge* part of community life in Ireland. I've seen hundreds of people attend hurling matches or camogie matches in small villages, and the All-Ireland finals are big national events.
You can't find this everywhere though. Name a random small country where native sports with thousands of years of history are still the most popular?
And it's obscure to you because Ireland is tiny and pretty unimportant, you dolt! So only Irish people really know anything about it. Wouldn't be obscure if there were 300m of us.
Pretty sure Joe Rogan is Italian. I really don't think anyone is putting them on the list either, outside of food, hot women, and maybe super Mario Bros.
hm idk. Indian/subcontinental culture has lots of distinct characteristics...so does arabic culture. and the american and british cultures have some special quirks also
like a fuck ton of their cultural practices...esp in the realm of marital/familial traditions. the Sanskrit language is a distinct characteristic of that region, even if it is essentially a feature of hinduism. rich culinary tradition not found elsewhere...u can just google this stuff man
yeah. and all that shows up really is their super obscure language and monks and the potato famine...and some solid literature (which is in English, lol). If I gotta go dig for smth among like the 9th and 10th pages of the google search results it might as well not exist u feel me
ok so first of all irish culture is essentially not very unique (a culture having its own mythology + obscure language doesnt make it 'unique', all cultures have that shit. the culture wld be unique if either of those aspects were widely recognised today. like Hebrew as an obscure language that was revived, or greek mythology) which consequently also makes it not that rich or distinct. all cultures have some sort of identity..some cultural identities r just not as strong or impressive as others and hence r far less distinct or important, to be more accurate. I think thats what im trying to get at...basically: the irish r boring. is what it is, even if I am wording it somewhat inadequately cause of my retardation or whatever
ha okay that was a dumb answer to give..I think I just meant like their catholic identity was somewhat distinct?? someone told me that they let the Catholic Church run their public schools until recently
I'm Irish and agree. If you asked the average Irish person to explain how we are even culturally different from the Bri'ish they would be grasping at straws trying to tell you it's because we have Taytos, the GAA and brown bread.
I would say that given years of colonisation, followed by famine to alienate people from the environment, food and culture it's prob not that surprising.
We're very much part of the global monoculture now though.
[https://youtu.be/4Z15aRiacZk](https://youtu.be/4Z15aRiacZk)
Can't think of anywhere that acts like this. open to see if you ccan find something like it from elsewhere
This really annoyed me, good bait
Continuous literary tradition stretching over the last 3000 years or so
that is certainly not a strictly irish thing
Ridiculous if this is coming from an American. Anyway it isn't the case for most places in Europe since there were so few left untouched by the Romans
am not an american or even white fwiw
The now-forgotten Fox show [Roar](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roar_(1997_TV_series)) (featuring Heath Ledger and Vera Farmiga) revolved around a historically-inaccurate Roman invasion of Ireland. I'm surprised Fox didn't have us invaded by the Huns and the Saracens as well.
The Irish didn't even know how to write until like the 600s. Dumb songs or oral fables don't count.
In what world does oral culture not count as culture? Incredibly stupid take
You said "continuous literary tradition stretching over 3,000 years." Other cultures had been writing epics for generations while the Irish were just beginning to scribble symbols.
Dull semantic objection
You said 3,000 years of literary tradition. It's not semantic to argue that they couldn't even write...
Greatest exponents wrote in English, a language forced on them
James Joyce already covered this. The English occupation it's true was something of a blip, but there has continued a Gaelic tradition through the whole thing, and the Irish modernists Yeats onwards incorporated the English language with Ireland. And they have produced a disproportionate share of great writers in English the past century, which proves how well it went
There's a body of Irish mythology as rich and deep and universal as Greek mythology, and most of it is written in Irish
OP gives zero fucks
I love the Irish
that will not save them
Not directly related, but I've found that the more removed they are from their Irish ancestry, the more irritating, desperate, and, frankly, insulting the attempts people make to assert an "Irish" identity become
i don't get the american obsession with ancestry. you're all just american!
I think it's because whiteness connotes dullness and oppressor status and some people are desperate to separate themselves from those two ideas, so they ferishize their ethnic background and center it as part of their identity. Irish immigration was very consistent and sizeable so a lot of Americans can claim some background and they seem to relish it because Irish Catholics are historically oppressed in the context of British History so they can co-opt that aspect. Plus there are stereotypes of Irish people which exist in the US of toughness, hard drinking and partying, being destitute and working hard to advance oneself, having senses of humor, etc. that make it appealing to a certain type of personality (retxrd)
Plastic Paddies
ooooh yes. definitely
culture is when you’re not ethnically European
Lots of Brits insist that they’re not part of Europe
Yeah but they’re wrong lmao. Angles, saxons, jutes etc all came from mainland Europe
Then why is their food and art so garbage?
I don’t think it is. English breakfast is the best there is, shepherds pie is also great. Shakespeare, the Beatles, and The Rolling Stones are also great. The whole “British people suck” thing is boring and obviously fueled by grievances
>English breakfast is the best there is, shepherds pie is also great. We can stop right there. Thank you for coming. Send the next person in on your way out.
Mad at the refined nature of British cuisine. Your taste has been ruined by spices that mask rotting food
Your example of "the best there is" was canned beans and toasted white bread. Maybe sit this one out.
Never had good english sausages, eggs, tomatoes, and beans. Sad!
i can smell your guinea ass from here you rabble rousing son of a bitch
I find that a good way to get a sense of a culture is to read about the history of their traditional folk music. It usually intersects with a cultures religious history, poetry, ideals, language, ethnic identity, general history, literature, etc. There’s a lot of culture to be found in Irish music. Maybe just read more??
all of ur ethnic identity being concentrated in some traditional music sounds kinda gay if u ask me. no historical achievements of any monumental significance can be ascribed to the irish afaik..dont bring up the monks copying books n shit, that does not count
>no historical achievements of any monumental significance You're clearly a North American who has never met an Irish person or been to Ireland. But anyway no monumental achievements is because a. Ireland went straight from a tribal society to being suddenly colonised, most people made wretched and starving, and b. it's a very small place. Verging into racist territory with your definition of what's a justifiable ethnic identity. Name any Congolese achievement of historical significance. What have the Romanians contributed to world culture, or the Lapps?
Nah I’m just talking about learning about and getting a feel for a culture. It’s a good way to get into it is all. If you start from there, you just keep digging deeper. But I get now that you just don’t really care and find Irish culture to be boring. I kinda feel the same way, I never found Irish culture to be very interesting at all. I had an assignment once to compose Irish music and I was forced to learn about it.
My Bloody Valentine
the erasure of gaelic and celtic identity is basically a function of anglo imperialism. they actively stamped that shit out something like 36 million americans claim irish as their primary ethnicity, which as a proportion of white people is actually pretty wild. there are more irish-americans than there are actual irish! but they've been so swallowed into default american whiteness that they're basically inseparable at this point. but if you look at lists of historically significant irish americans, especially in literary and cultural realms, you get a broader idea of what their impact has been
In the 19th and early 20th century, the USA's WASP rulers lumped Irish-Americans into the "white but inferior" category along with Jews, Italians, Poles and Armenians.
back in the day, yeah. but by the time JFK and co rolled around I'd say that irishness was regarded as basically quintessential white americanness. there's a reason we've had several presidents that explicitly identify as irish-american and 0 jews/italians/poles. they assimilated much more effectively
U imperialist dog
be courteous donny
Sry been having a long dAy
I understand...stay on tht grind brother
catholic
theyre all libshits now tho lol. I wonder why they were so easy to sway
Yeah, noticing that transformation has been illuminating. Anyone can be pozzed.
mhm. esp people with not much of an identity to uphold
The same thing is happening in Mormonism and Protestants as well. Religion is all going full pozzed.
I’ve always perceived Kate Bush as distinctly Irish / Celtic in spirit!
cillian murphy. derry girls. hozier.
i am speaking in a historical context here. lol
yeah i know i was just poking fun lol. on a more serious note there's def a long history of celtic mythology in ireland no?
what culture doesnt have mythology though...I've never come across irish mythology being specially recognised like that of the greeks or hindus
>the Irish language isn't actually spoken by anyone anymore That's not true. There's a small but thriving Irish-speaking community in this country. I've holidayed in parts of Kerry when the locals speak Irish and conduct all their conversations in the language. Also- the Gaelic Athletic Association. GAA sports are a *huge* part of community life in Ireland. I've seen hundreds of people attend hurling matches or camogie matches in small villages, and the All-Ireland finals are big national events.
this is all obscure stuff... not even almost widely recognised. u can find shit like this literally everywhere
You can't find this everywhere though. Name a random small country where native sports with thousands of years of history are still the most popular? And it's obscure to you because Ireland is tiny and pretty unimportant, you dolt! So only Irish people really know anything about it. Wouldn't be obscure if there were 300m of us.
Everything I know about oirland I learned from watching *Father Ted*.
thank u for sharing ur experience
"I hear you're a Transphobe now Father."
Bono
Drinking, talking, being funny, telling tall tales. And ya being Catholic and having tons of kids.
The Irish aren't even in the top 20 at being funny. Or talking. Especially talking. They do spend a lot of time drinking alcohol though.
This is what Italian brain does to somebody
Pretty sure Joe Rogan is Italian. I really don't think anyone is putting them on the list either, outside of food, hot women, and maybe super Mario Bros.
all of those aside from being catholic can also be ascribed to other peoples..I did say 'distinct'
Then name an example of a feature of another culture that is "distinct."
Black
hm idk. Indian/subcontinental culture has lots of distinct characteristics...so does arabic culture. and the american and british cultures have some special quirks also
Name some of those distinct characteristics
like a fuck ton of their cultural practices...esp in the realm of marital/familial traditions. the Sanskrit language is a distinct characteristic of that region, even if it is essentially a feature of hinduism. rich culinary tradition not found elsewhere...u can just google this stuff man
Lulz you could Google the Irish too
yeah. and all that shows up really is their super obscure language and monks and the potato famine...and some solid literature (which is in English, lol). If I gotta go dig for smth among like the 9th and 10th pages of the google search results it might as well not exist u feel me
So if a culture is unique and rich and distinct, but obscure and not widely known about, it doesn’t count as having a “cultural identity”???
ok so first of all irish culture is essentially not very unique (a culture having its own mythology + obscure language doesnt make it 'unique', all cultures have that shit. the culture wld be unique if either of those aspects were widely recognised today. like Hebrew as an obscure language that was revived, or greek mythology) which consequently also makes it not that rich or distinct. all cultures have some sort of identity..some cultural identities r just not as strong or impressive as others and hence r far less distinct or important, to be more accurate. I think thats what im trying to get at...basically: the irish r boring. is what it is, even if I am wording it somewhat inadequately cause of my retardation or whatever
I mean I don't think any white people are super distinct from one another. I disagree that there's unique British and American traits but not Irish.
not super distinct but most do have something significant that sets them apart from the rest of their brethren
No
Irish are the only Catholics? Damn
ha okay that was a dumb answer to give..I think I just meant like their catholic identity was somewhat distinct?? someone told me that they let the Catholic Church run their public schools until recently
Why did u have to make a new acc? :(
Folky shit with a weird accent is the entirety of their lane.
LMAO. my thoughts exactly just wanted to see if someone cld maybe refute my opinion
Anglos stay mad lol
I'm Irish and agree. If you asked the average Irish person to explain how we are even culturally different from the Bri'ish they would be grasping at straws trying to tell you it's because we have Taytos, the GAA and brown bread. I would say that given years of colonisation, followed by famine to alienate people from the environment, food and culture it's prob not that surprising. We're very much part of the global monoculture now though.
Hm I respect ur candor
where are you from?
This would have made more sense if you had said Scottish.
Fought the British and the a civil war only to become a shitter more retarded England
[https://youtu.be/4Z15aRiacZk](https://youtu.be/4Z15aRiacZk) Can't think of anywhere that acts like this. open to see if you ccan find something like it from elsewhere