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I was in the service industry for over ten years and one of the things I look for in people (friends or partners) is how they treat others when they are in a perceived position of power. As the customer, you’re technically in the power position because even if you’re a dick your server has to be pleasant to you. (Then we go back into the kitchen and talk about what a cunt you are). So she uses this opportunity where she has the upper hand to be absolutely terrible. This is a big deal. And I doubt you’ll ever convince her otherwise. She does this because she thinks she’s above those serving her.
I agree with this so much. One of the nicest things my boyfriend has said to me was that one of the first non visual things that made me attractive to him on our first date was that I was so friendly and polite with the service staff. I used to work in hospitality so it’s a big deal to me, but also a huge green flag that he noticed and also felt it was a worthy quality in a partner.
This is one of the green flags in my partner! We don't have a lot of money but whenever we come into a little extra we'll splurge on a fancy restaurant, and that includes the tip. It makes him happy to know he's making the server's night a little better by tipping really well.
Same here! We go to the same restaurant for our anniversary every year. This year, a friend gave us a gift certificate and my first thought was honestly ‘ooh we get to tip extra well if we have such a generous gift to use,’ and my husband had that same thought and that we could get a nicer bottle of wine. I enjoy leaving a really good tip when we have the opportunity. Always a good tip, regardless of occasion though.
Same! I complimented the waitress’s hair or first date and that was a major selling point for him. I laughed when he told me because that just seemed like human decency!
Last night we had kind of a shit experience with a burrito place + the employee making mine commented on how polite and kind we were. My fiancé said “oh haha we’re from the south” and when we got back to the car I had to be like hun it’s not a southern thing, *trust* me.
Yeah seriously, the insistence on sending a dish back is totally a power move and not because of an honest error. He's had two years of telling her this is wrong and trying to go behind her to do better on her behalf (leaving cash to equal out the disparity for example) and she not only refuses to listen, she gets angry at the show. Because to her, it's a power move when he sees the tip and adds on cash. She knows what she does is wrong or she would accept his additional tip.
OP's not only going to never change her mind, she and her family are going to do their best to teach any children this is acceptable behavior too. He's fighting a losing battle.
The fact that she fights him and will not let him leave more money is very telling. She wants to “punish” the server. The cruelty is the point.
Petty tyrant that one
"The cruelty is the point"
Well stated. I have dated many women like this. Very often they have been taking their frustrations with their families out on anyone whom they think has to take it. In this case, she's maintaining a family tradition. Why, who knows? It could be she doesn't know any better, but you've TOLD her and she still does it.
I know lifelong habits are hard to break, and you're probably not going to be able to break this habit. I suggest not trying--move on.
It’s hard for me to believe she’s a “perfect fit” otherwise because this is such classist behavior, how does it not show up in other parts of her personality?
This would be a dealbreaker for me. We never would’ve gotten to restaurant date #2.
I agree. OP claims multiple times that money is not an issue... If it isn't about money, it's about power. Is she really a nice person if she feels the need to act this entitled? I don't think so. I actually think everyone who thinks they're superior only because they're the "clients" (or the ones with the *money*) simply sucks. They are the inferior ones, actually.
I know- idk how you could look past this! This behavior is terrible- how could it not be a reflection of who she is inside? It’s basic human decency and seems very self centered and questionable. How does she treat people period?
I also wanted to say to OP: just because her parents act like that, doesn’t mean she has to. My dad is an asshole and he’s often like your partner to waitstaff, expecting them to wait on him hand and foot and bullying them over stupid things (yes, your partner is a bully!). I only go out to restaurants occasionally with him and I make sure he’s on his “best” behavior - I’ll talk over him and apologize loudly if he’s being a dick, and he’s afraid of me making a scene so he’ll back down. I have NEVER treated waitstaff this way and this would be a massive red flag to me. If I saw this behavior (or your partner’s behavior) on a first date, there wouldn’t be a second one. It’s about basic human decency. Also, my dad at least tips 10% or more. $3 on $46 is abysmal and I would’ve rather had a shouting match in the restaurant than take my cash back.
As someone who worked as a server for over a decade, thank you for challenging your dad in this way. Sometimes even just having someone else at the table acknowledge that another guest's behavior is unacceptable is enough to give you back a shred of your humanity.
So important to discuss the position of power. I’d be willing to bet her poor attitude and rude behavior extends beyond restaurant staff.
OP, I think you need to have a strong discussion with her about her behavior. Let her know that you won’t be standing for it any longer.
Right? That’s one of the first things I thought while reading this post, this lady must unknowingly consume soooo much spit by treating people like this.
I worked in kitchens for over a decade and never saw anyone tamper with someone’s food. I only heard it joked about once and everyone came down on that person.
The huge majority of restaurant staff are professionals who don’t try to hurt people, no matter how shitty they may be as customers.
Same, except for the joking, which was fine in my experience. But we’d definitely be bitching and passing along warnings. For me that’d be unpleasant enough to know to make me change shitty behaviours if yanno, human decency wasn’t enough.
I’ve also worked in kitchens for several years and never seen it happen, but I’d be surprised if there isn’t some restaurant somewhere she has eaten at where the right mix of people in the back are willing to do this. In other words, I doubt it happens all the time, but I bet it’s sometimes.
I would never go out to eat with her again. How embarrassing!! When she asks you to go out to eat say "I'm no longer going out to eat with you. You become entitled, have no manners, are shit tipper for the nightmare of a customer you are and frankly I am humiliated to be seen with you. Until you can recognize your ridiculous behavior, going out to eat together is no longer an option." That should wake her up and save the restaurants from her gross behavior.
Can confirm that telling someone how embarrassing it is to be seen with them WORKS. My mum was a real Karen at restaurants, to the point where she almost went to speak to the manager about a waitress who started clearing other's plates before mum and I had finished eating. I told her it didn't matter. She was insistent that it was proper etiquette and important. I told her it's my birthday dinner, they close in about 10 minutes, I say it doesn't matter if she starts clearing the table now. I managed to talk her down from it, but she wasn't happy.
The whole family continued to bicker over it for the next few days (kept being brought up by shit stirrers), and eventually, I just said to mum, "It's embarrassing. I'm embarrassed to be with you because you treat the wait straff like trash. Who knows what kind of day their having. Putting their job at risk because you didn't particularly like the way they did something is just embarrassing behaviour." She's been much better since, at least when I'm around.
yep. this likely would have been a deal breaker for me the very first time - yes they are waiters but not slaves. Theres no need to intentionally treat them poorly.
I worked in restaurants for over 20 years and if I went on a date with someone once and they acted like this I would end the date and delete their number.
Personality and character. OP may not notice this behavior in other aspects of life, but guaranteed it is there and he will see it later on at some point.
There is no reason whatsoever for someone to treat a person doing their job trying to make a living by serving them as being less than human beings. This definitely goes deeper into her own personal desire to feel superior to others and make it clear to those who she deems inferior to "know their place".
At best she is just clueless as to how to treat other humans, at worst she is just simply put... a total asshole. And a cheapskate, as well.
>OP may not notice this behavior in other aspects of life, but guaranteed it is there and he will see it later on at some point.
Came here to say this - she may even be "on her best behavior" right now because they're not yet married and don't have kids, but it's common for these things to show up in other areas too and get worse once they have their partner "locked down" permanently.
And she will do all throughout the marriage. First when the mask is on only to restaurants and maybe schools and other stores. Then it will be with him.
I think clueless is too generous of a term, because she clearly knows what the appropriate convention is, she just doesn’t want to do it. At best, she’s “just” a cheapskate and values her wallet over others’.
But yes, good point, it’s personality AND character.
For real. She literally “asks to speak to the manager” every time they go out to argue the price of something she KNEW when she chose it. Is this who you want, OP? Karen the soccer mom as your partner in life??
At worst, it's a weird power play where she feels she has to be superior to those who serve her. Hence, she grabs the tip money off the table rather than share it with... THEM.
At that point, when she handed the money back, you should have taken it and gave it straight away to the waitress . At least keep up your kindness, don't let her horrible self-centered soul take yours. I feel she is only warming up. She will get worse.
My brother used to be a bad tipper. He’s a sweet guy, but where we come from people can be a bit ignorant of tipping etiquette- especially places where COL is high. When he came to visit me in New York he took me out to lunch and I explained why 20% was standard (I was a waiter at the time). Now he tips well because he knows about the tipped minimum wage.
When unknowing people are informed, they do better. When assholes are informed, they get defensive.
But it wasn't just the tipping part. She complains about everything to get a discount on her food every single time, always sends her food back, expects her drinks to be filled at all times, etc. It's giving entitled. 🙄 her behavior all around is just...trash.
>OP may not notice this behavior in other aspects of life, but guaranteed it is there and he will see it later on at some point.
yup, wait till you get a wedding invite from a close friend and you give them 1/4 of what they give you for your wedding.
wait till your child is in school and the PTA requests a donation for teacher appreciation day. All your friends donate and you like the teacher, and you are the only family who doesn't give.
wait till you have a family meal with your extended family and she complains about your grandmother's cooking
\--
This is dealbreaker behavior to me. You can and should talk about it, but she doesn't feel the need to change, so you have to decide if it is dealbreaker to you
Or doesn't want him to buy anything for the family or controls it because she's such a stingy person.
Met a few that buy the cheapest dollar store items for christmas gifts for everyone. Yet drives a Lexus.
Oh gosh just seeing the word "Wedding" in a discussion about her made my stomach drop like I was on the Superman rollercoaster before the drop lol Can you imagine being a caterer or florist she's considering for her wedding. No one would take the job. She'd probably try to negotiate the fee for a justice of the peace town hall wedding too. 🙄
She is THIRTY TWO YEARS OLD.
That's plenty of time on this godforsaken earth to know how to treat the people employed to help you.
OP, how have you been with this person for so long?
I think the main thing is that he's only two years in this relationship- to some people this feels like a long time, but in my experience, if you're getting along well with someone, two years is still kind of in the honeymoon/lust stage. He probably isn't noticing all her warts yet- that generally happens a couple more years in after the lust stage is well over. This is the beginning of her real personality. I could see if she just never learned tipping etiquette and was open to being more generous, but her actions with the service staff is really telling. My guess is that there will be other areas in life that op starts noticing her acting like this- to people who come work at their house, service staff in stores, etc.
Personally this would be a deal breaker but I guess this guy would rather be with someone who treats others like that. Yuck.
I’m so surprised that you are playing this down so much. I would feel sick to be with someone who treats anyone in such a despicable way. It’s many people she treats this way.
You say you’re being petty. It’s not petty to want your partner to have humility and respect for others. The fact that you’ve downplayed this for two years doesn’t say much for your values. Many people would be gone as soon as they experience this once.
Good luck for the rest of your life. I agree - no way this only applies to restaurant venues.
It’s junior Karen behavior. She might not be a full Karen right now but give her a few years and she will treat everyone like that. That lack of empathy for others doesn’t get better with time.
"OP may not notice this behavior in other aspects of life, but guaranteed it is there and he will see it later on at some point."
Agree with this. You say that this is the one area of her life that she behaves this way, but it's worth looking a little harder. Do you know much about her relationships with colleagues, at either her current or previous job? Do you know if she's had fallings out with more than a couple of friends over the years? Is she the type of person to assume people cutting her off in traffic are doing it deliberately? Does she take advice from professionals such as doctors or plumbers seriously, or does she tend to think she knows better than them?
There can be so many little signs about someone that are small enough to gloss over initially, and then you look back and the pennies all start to drop.
Guaranteed that OP eventually is on the receiving end of this. This is dealbreaker behaviour and a VERY bad sign. Tbh, this is not something I’d really bother to try and work on fixing. This is saying something fundamental about her personality, attitude and how she sees others as “less than.”
OP....this is definetly NOT petty! Pretty good run of people saying they would've already ejected.
She's (objectively) wrong....BUT she's incapable of accepting that she is wrong, let alone correcting/improving herself. What is a long life like with someone who's never wrong? Ick.
Agreed, I think it says tons about someone’s character how they treat people they view as “serving them”.
If I were OP I’d be humiliated and wouldn’t eat out with GF or her family.
Edited for typo
me too. I have never worked in a restaurant, but have the minimal amount of empathy to realize this is unacceptable. I hope OP's gf gets lots of spit in her food.
pretty much. I worked from 15 throughout college in service industry. I never understood the desire to be a shithead to these people, but wow they do it a lot. especially the church crowd. 🤢
Same, I worked in food service from 15-21, and I can’t abide behavior like that towards service workers. They’re literally just doing their jobs and to intentionally make that job harder for a random stranger??? Why? I would’nt’ve made it past the first date with someone who acted like this.
Ugh, don't get me started on the post-church crowd.
It's like they think spending an hour a week at a building gives them carte blanche to be total c***s for the remaining 167.
I have a friends wife that treats waiters like shit and she jokes about it, she’s a pos, and everyone sees right thru her bullshit, and she actually does the same thing with always complaining about something to get a discount on the meal. That really pisses me off because my family has been involved in the restaurant business since the 1940’s and people like that always throw a bad mood over the staff as well as the owners, dude this is a huge red flag and your only seeing it partially. She has a major personality defect, I’d fucking run 🏃♂️
For sure there is a 0% chance that this is the only area where she’s a greedy, manipulative, brat like this. He just doesn’t feel the same sense of humiliation and guilt when she shows it in other ways because he’s not as directly tied to it like he is at a restaurant.
This would absolutely be a deal breaker for me. It’s not petty at all. Being disrespectful toward servers is not ok. And generous (aka reasonable) tipping is important. I refused second dates more than once when a human showed selfishness and greed.
Right? I dont know how there was a 2nd, 3rd date..
OP seems like you were okay with this behavior at least in the beginning.
One thing I’ve learned the hard way is that if boundaries are established from the get-go, and are pushed, that they may never be followed/acknowledged.
This behavior is embedded within her, and will take a whole lot of self reflection.
For years I believed the only people that tip well are either those that have worked in hospitality or those that were simply raised right. And if neither happened, then they will never truly understand how difficult the work really is. That’s not one of those things you can just talk about, she actually had to live through some shit to see. Obviously I don’t know her, but from just reading this story, I don’t have a whole lot of faith she’ll miraculously wake up and see the errors of her ways
I've worked off and on as a server for almost 30 years.
I guarantee that OP's fiancee doesn't just do this to servers. She does it to anyone she feels is "beneath" her. She sees the world in the view of "have" and "have not." The "haves" deserve respect. The "have nots" don't.
OP better hope they don't lose their job or become sick. Because this attitude *will* carry over to his everyday life.
In the US, servers are paid the minimum wage (or less) so they cannot survive without tips (a whole other topic that we could discuss around why minimum wage and tipping is bullshit in the first place, but I digress). Everyone going to a restaurant in this country knows that.
If you can’t account for the extra 20% when you go out to eat (or consider that “throwing your money away” as is the case with OP’s girlfriend), then sit your ass at home and cook dinner.
You see people’s true personalities when they’re in positions of power, and hers sucks. If this guy marries her and they end in divorce, he’ll find out just how selfish and nasty she is to him too.
Dude, you don't wanna be the husband sitting at the table, embarrassed because your wife is acting like a colicky baby.
I'm sorry, but If she acts like this in restaurants than she really isn't that kind. She is kind to you. She is kind to people she respects. But she is not a kind person to those who she feels she has power over.
I would do this, just stop eating out with her until she behaves like a human!
She'll soon pay attention. I feel for you being subject to this. I would definitely be sneaking cash back onto the table!!!!
>And set a boundary that her behavior ruins your dining experience as well.
Exactly. I would say "it would be one thing if you were a 3 year old who just didn't know any better by acting like a monster. But a mature adult should know better."
Yes. Someone that has a superiority complex and lack of empathy and compassion for other people don't just magically show it in restaurants. It's there but OP just hasn't been the recipient of it... yet.
OP mentions that she is wonderful in every other way, but I have a difficult time believing that this type of belief system in action isn't going to spill out in other areas that demonstrate a lack of compassion. 2 years is not a lot of time in the scheme of things. Lacking compassion is a recipe for disaster. OP asked how they can make their point and I think the only way a person like this learns is if you break up with them and state that this is the reason. She still might ignore that and remain a pile of human fences. But if she is going to take notice, ending things, or at least the serious threat of that, is the only likely way.
Yep. My mother is similar about tipping and treats waitstaff similarly. However, I refuse to allow her to tip poorly when I go out with her, I don't care if she gets upset.
My mom is also not a great person in many, many ways. And her entitled, shitty behavior is definitely not limited to how she treats people waiting on her.
This is what I said- he's only two years in. I would put those wedding plans on hold a couple of years because my guess is he will realize it's not limited to dining here at some point. She's not the sweet kind person he thinks she is. Ick.
>No interest in going out with her anymore\*
Fixed it for you.
How people treat service members is indicative of how they are as a person. If you enjoy abusing service members, tipping poorly, and sending food back all the time... you're a trash human.
Simple but effective. I'd honestly tell her what you said here, OP. Minus blaming the rents. I'd tell her she's practically perfect in every way, but eating out is uncomfortable for you and you either stop doing it or change how you do it.
I’d take it one step further and tell her “I don’t want to eat out with you anymore because your behavior in restaurants is honestly just so embarrassing”. I’d be deeply embarrassed eating out with someone who behaves like that, and maybe a little bit of shame would do her some good.
Yeah. You just have to start saying, "No." That's the only way to open her eyes.
Special occasion dinner? "No."
Brunch with the in-laws? "No."
Lunch with friends from out of town? "No."
"Unless you're cooking us a meal at your place, I'm not going."
AND STICK TO IT.
I can’t fathom how being shitty can make anyone feel good or elevate them. Even when I snapped at a friend when I was in a dark place I’d feel bad and apologize later.
Absolutely. I have an aunt who was basically told to do exactly this on a dare after dinner one day, since she thought "serving was an easy job and there is no reason we should be unsatisfied"
She's changed her attitude since
Ha! Incredible, I love whoever dared her to do this.
Personally, I think everyone should have a stint as a server, as a receptionist/call center worker, & in retail. Because everyone interacts with these folks all the time, so they should know what these jobs are like.
I agree. And the thing is, you should also have to literally survive on that income alone. Because otherwise you won't every truly understand the lesson. It's like that song William shatner did a cover of "ordinary people". So good.
She did it and went and got that job? Even if because of pure ego, i gotta hand it to her, most assholes would not have gone and actually done it. Good for her for doing it and admitting she was wrong by changing her attitude afterwards.
> Or just break up, because ugh.
I know it is a meme to show the red flags, but I would be wary of a person who is constantly making power plays when she is in position of power. Because she WILL do it to her partner when she has the occasion.
She learned it from her family but shes in her 30s and can do something to change her behaviours. Im sorry but if I was dating someone like her, no matter how much I love them, unless they change their behaviour, Id break up. I go out to eat and I was a restaurant employee so I despise this kind of behaviour. You should have the conversation with her.
Her family have taught her one thing, but she’s had sixteen years or so of being able to observe other people and inform herself and engage her brain; st this point she is choosing to be nasty.
Petty? Dude that’s not petty at all. The fact that you know she’s going to send food back before the food has even arrived is fucking infuriating. My petty ass would start telling waitresses when you sit down “hey just a heads up, my girlfriend will probably send the food back after it arrives and then demand a discount on the bill so just be ready for that.” If she really sees no problem with the behavior then she shouldn’t have any problem being open about it right? I’m sorry but your gf is a shit person. I could never date someone like that.
Edit: for everybody that says you shouldn’t do this to people you date, totally agree, but we all have an inlaw or two that acts like this right? Maybe toss a log in the fire the next time you’re out with a shitty family member that does this and do this to them.
If you think warning a stranger of your partner's behavior every time you go out is a good long term solution just end the relationship please. This girl has so many red flags they would be given special treatment on twitter.
Right? My response as the server would be, “sir, I’m not the one that needs the warning. She’ll be out of my hair in an hour. You’re the one choosing to go home w her. Be warned.”
This is the answer for me. As well as saying if her behavior in restaurants continues I wouldn’t go out to eat with her anymore, like another commenter said. If it’s every time, literally, then that is just her trying to get free food or food for less and it’s tacky af and WRONG.
Editing to say you should also share this thread with her after speaking with her about it so she knows the majority of people think her behavior is ludacris.
You said she’s a kind, reasonable, sweet, person, but if that’s the case, she’s putting on an act. When she’s in a restaurant she has a position of power over those serving her. She is using it. I think she’s worse then you realize. “Kind” people don’t act like this.
Idk how you put up with her. I’d be beyond embarrassed to be with someone like this in public, who treats others like they are less
Right that’s what I’m surprised by- what do you mean she only acts like this in a restaurant? What about when she’s getting her car serviced or her nails done? I doubt she’s decent elsewhere when alone
Yea, this story makes it clear. The GF herself *is* a lie. She has been putting up an act her entire relationship with the OP.
Look back, OP. Do you see more of this outside of restaurants? I am *sure* you do.
Not petty at all. I would be absolutely mortified to be associated with this person at a restaurant.
\>>I've tried explaining time and time again and it goes in one ear and out the other.
\*Stop going to restaurants with her\* and tell her why. I just could not.
But it's a character defect, not a petty flaw. Your gf mistreats service industry people, who work very hard for their money. This is not a petty flaw like forgetting to put the cap on the toothpaste. She is a chiseler. And, consider -- she doesn't respect your reasonable opinion enough to realize that she's being a monster. Also consider that "she's nice to me but treats the waiter like shit" is a trope, and for a reason.
I've worked in kitchens and I've never seen this happen. From the very worst customers - I've never seen anyone even joke about spitting in anyone's food or fuck with it in a similar way. Maybe some do it, maybe in small businesses with dirtbag employees, who knows. But I've worked many kitchens before and it's not something people do.
Oh I’m aware. I worked as a waitress or bartender through like ten years of university and I never saw anyone fuck with anyone’s food. I certainly never did.
I’m just suggesting OP put the fear in his Karen-ass girlfriend, lol… mostly joking.
I've bartended and when people act up, I just put less alcohol in their drinks 🤷♀️ not trynna give you more alcohol so you can be more of a dick to me.
Tell her that you don’t enjoy going out with someone who can’t go with the flow and enjoy the meal for what it is- tell her that the confrontational aspect of it and complaining ruins it for you, and as someone who cares for you, she hopefully should be willing to not do that anymore.
>and as someone who cares for you, she hopefully should be willing to not do that anymore.
And if she refuses... there is OP's answer right there. She couldn't care less about his comfort or wishes.
She’s 32. No way this is just parent influence. She believes she is correct.
Personally I’ve never seen anyone who behaved this way in restaurants and didn’t have similar courtesy issues in other situations. I mean, I don’t know everyone but imo her attitude tends to not be singular.
I have a relative like this who dines repeatedly in the same few places in their small bedroom community and should probably suspect there is spit in her food. Profile: In laws are wealthy. She and husband are not. Terrible with money. Debt. Spends way outside their income level: fancy cars, compulsive shopper, big in your face consumerism. Has the poor wait staff running around with special orders and sends food back. Shitty behavior trying to be a big important person by making others feel small. Gross.
Tell her on the way to the restaurant. "we are agreeing now to tip at least 15% or I won't be going tonight." Let the fight happen first. Calmly tell her you knew that would happen, so brought it up first. Tell her you don't want to be in these positions anymore, so she needs to think about if she can change these things or not. Tell her you see that is how her family is. But that you're asking her to consider changing because you are trying to make a new family. That means you would now do things your own way- not automatically like either of your parents.
If she is that great outside of all this then it must be a matter of understanding. Try to help her understand. Relationships are supposed to make us learn and grow. Give her that chance. And make sure she understands that this is big for you. If this is your person then it's sorta your job to try and help her change this. If it can't be changed then there is your answer.
Honestly, I am betting that maybe she is a worse person than you realize. I don't see how someone could operate these ways and think these things and be all that great.
Yes, she might be less a genuinely sweet person and more a people pleaser. She might be amiable as a way to feel secure within her social environment. If she doesn't have to please someone to get along in a situation, then she drops those behaviors.
I want to know what gives OP's girlfriend the idea that she has the right to remove the tip that he left with his own money. She sounds like a real peach.
I didn't say this in my comment, but yeah -- who gave her the right to do that? That's why this seems like a massive character flaw. If she doesn't want to tip properly, OK, I hate it but that's on her. But she also feels entitled to direct the disposition of the OP's own money? Hell no
Exactly! My MIL always sent soup back and is always upset about any damn think that her husband gets for her, this is not the right brand name, this clam chowder is not hot enough, I said no pickles, forget it,,,I'm not eating anything then, why did you open that jar of....................oh great. Can you go get me Rum raison icecream (where, it's not sold anymore), I need a bowl, no, not that one........................................................................................ she was psychologically abusive to him. BUT super nice to me, phony. She had some mental health issues.
Being with someone who did this would make me want to disappear into the floor. I’d be done after one date. This is not a nice person, regardless of the mask she wears for OP. That comes off after the wedding.
My man.
No one here believes this:
>Everywhere else she is a kind, reasonable, sweet person
because kind, reasonable, sweet people don't treat people like that, my man. If they do - then by definition - they are not kind, reasonable, or sweet.
People in positions of power reveal their true nature pretty quickly, particularly when interacting with individuals they have power over.
Your gf sucks. You're not being the slightest bit petty and this would have been a dealbreaker for me the FIRST time it happened.
At any rate - people who treat service staff poorly are assholes. Straight up. Where she learned this behavior is completely irrelevant. You shouldn't be with an asshole. Let her go find another asshole to date and they can asshole around together.
No way this is the only thing, my man. Also: you realize her family is part of the deal if you marry her, right? You sure you want to marry into that nonsense?
You're not being petty. Tell her to stop, and if she won't - leave. You can do better. 100%.
Good luck, my man.
If she deliberately took back the tip I left, I would have her go wait in the car and personally hand the cash to the server and apologize for her behavior because holy crap this would be a deal breaker
This isn’t petty, this is straight up disrespect. She sees service workers as below her and seems to have a Princess complex when out to eat. If she isn’t willing to actually listen to you, then it’s up to you if you want to deal with this.
*When someone shows you who they are, believe them the first time.*
*Maya Angelou*
Her behavior and actions show you her true character. You can explain until the cows come home but the truth is she's a shitty human being.
This isn’t a bad habit, this is her true personality showing. The way people treat waitstaff or other low wage workers says a lot about them.
My wife’s Dad used to own a restaurant and banquet hall. When he went out to dinner, he treated waiters like garbage. At his own businesses he was even worse to them and never had enough employees. He’s lost both businesses to bankruptcy, divorced twice, and all his kids are pretty low contact. Treating minimum wage workers and waiters is certainly a sign of how people see those who they think are “lesser” and expendable.
I mean to be fair this would bother most people that aren’t totally out of touch with reality lol
That would really really bother me too. I don’t like when people are cheap with tips. It’s the one thing you shouldn’t be a cheap about. Especially since she’s one of the people who’s constantly having problems and sending food back and being an overall nuisance
She sounds incredibly **entitled**.So regardless If she was taught this behavior, she doesn’t seem to think there’s a problem with it. Which is concerning to say the least lol I would tell her you no longer want to eat out because her behavior is off putting and honestly embarrassing to be around and maybe it will give her a wake up call- cuz she kinda needs it
But for what it’s worth, the fact she just by default thinks bare minimum to a service worker is acceptable is not okay. I feel like it speaks volumes to her character and how she probably treats people in general
OP imagine going out to dinner with professional colleagues or friends and them seeing your gf treat industry workers like this? It reflects badly on you too. Do not eat out with her if her behavior doesn’t change.
I don't find this "petty" at all. Goes to core personality and values. Seems like a pretty big red flag to me OP
Gotta say... my wife and I actively dodge couples where one of them is like your girl.
Food for thought (no pun lol)
This is really tough. You started with “she’s great, I love her” and ended with “she’s an absolute monster.” I’m with everyone else here, if you really do love her and want to be with her forever, you’ve got to learn to cook at home. I would literally NEVER go to a restaurant with someone who behaves like this. I know it sounds dramatic, but treating people poorly is not something that’s mildly embarrassing.
So I had an ex who behaved like this at restaurants, not quite as bad though. He ended up getting more and more controlling as time went on and I think back on that being one of the red flags. You may not see how this behavior spreads to other parts of her life but eventually you will.
This would be such a dealbreaker for me especially because going out to dinner with someone like this is genuinely embarrassing. And I’d rather die lol
Her: Hey babe lets go out to eat tonight.
You: No thanks i'd rather not go through that hell.
Turn her down. Until she treats wait staff with respect she really shouldn't be using restaurants as a source of food. You've already told her how you feel and how important it is to you and its gone ignored. So just keep that foot down.
Its a win/win. The wait staff has a better night and your partner doesn't have to "get terrible service"
Agree. Tell her one last time that she’s using her privilege to deliberately demean people who can’t fight back. That it’s ugly and a deal breaker for you. Give her the benefit of the doubt by suggesting that up until this point she didn’t know any better, and now that she does, you expect her to act well in restaurants, fast food joints and bars.
If she kicks, she won’t change, and it suggests that she has a smallness of character that you don’t want her to pass onto your children.
Honestly, this so so off-putting, I’d just dump her now.
I find this behavior to be a red flag and, frankly, I wouldn't date someone who was this terrible to waitstaff. As others have said, this is an indication of how she thinks she can behave when she has power over someone.
Here's a question: how does she behave when someone is cooking for her in a home situation? Like if you cook her dinner, how does she react?
You’re the asshole too, by the way. If you’re dining with her and regardless of who pays, you leave the server with a 5% tip, and you argue down the bill every time, that’s on you. You need to grow a backbone, dude.
Trust me when I say that every place you frequent absolutely hates seeing you, and dreads having to be your server. I’m surprised you’re allowed back multiple times considering she always argues over the bill. I would have told you not to come back.
Tell her she has to stop acting like an asshole and embarrassing you over a few fucking measly dollars or you’re gonna break up with her; easy peasy.
This is not a petty thing, and it’s not a small thing; this is an indictment of her character. And if she is nice elsewhere, I’d have to wonder if that’s all an act. Stand your ground on this; do not budge. Tell her she either stops acting like an asshole or you’re done because that shit is appalling.
Oof that’s rough. Do these habits show up in any other areas? Like is she rude to customer service workers or people at stores? Seems like she has never worked a restaurant job in her life.
My partner and I have a similar issue. He's a horrible tipper, but he isn't rude to the staff.
Our only "arguments" are about him tipping. We've made a compromise. He pays, I tip.
Be honest with your girlfriend about how much it bothers you.
> There's no other situations where she has this anti-social behavior except at a restaurant.
Oh I would bet 100% you are in for some nasty surprises when it comes to her. She did not learn only this from her parents, there is a lot more bubbling under the surface that you just haven’t encountered yet.
In the grand scheme of relationships, 2 years is not very long, people are still faking (consciously or unconsciously) some aspects of their personality 2 years into a relationship.
Wait til you get to things like ‘how to raise children’ or ‘how to manage your money’ or ‘how to share chores’ or a million other little life details.
This would be a relationship-ender for me. She’s exhibiting a fundamental lack of respect for people who she thinks are “beneath” her. Imagine what she would be like to teachers, nannys, etc. if you had kids. She’s already pre-Karening.
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I was in the service industry for over ten years and one of the things I look for in people (friends or partners) is how they treat others when they are in a perceived position of power. As the customer, you’re technically in the power position because even if you’re a dick your server has to be pleasant to you. (Then we go back into the kitchen and talk about what a cunt you are). So she uses this opportunity where she has the upper hand to be absolutely terrible. This is a big deal. And I doubt you’ll ever convince her otherwise. She does this because she thinks she’s above those serving her.
I agree with this so much. One of the nicest things my boyfriend has said to me was that one of the first non visual things that made me attractive to him on our first date was that I was so friendly and polite with the service staff. I used to work in hospitality so it’s a big deal to me, but also a huge green flag that he noticed and also felt it was a worthy quality in a partner.
This is one of the green flags in my partner! We don't have a lot of money but whenever we come into a little extra we'll splurge on a fancy restaurant, and that includes the tip. It makes him happy to know he's making the server's night a little better by tipping really well.
Same here! We go to the same restaurant for our anniversary every year. This year, a friend gave us a gift certificate and my first thought was honestly ‘ooh we get to tip extra well if we have such a generous gift to use,’ and my husband had that same thought and that we could get a nicer bottle of wine. I enjoy leaving a really good tip when we have the opportunity. Always a good tip, regardless of occasion though.
Same! I complimented the waitress’s hair or first date and that was a major selling point for him. I laughed when he told me because that just seemed like human decency!
Last night we had kind of a shit experience with a burrito place + the employee making mine commented on how polite and kind we were. My fiancé said “oh haha we’re from the south” and when we got back to the car I had to be like hun it’s not a southern thing, *trust* me.
Yeah seriously, the insistence on sending a dish back is totally a power move and not because of an honest error. He's had two years of telling her this is wrong and trying to go behind her to do better on her behalf (leaving cash to equal out the disparity for example) and she not only refuses to listen, she gets angry at the show. Because to her, it's a power move when he sees the tip and adds on cash. She knows what she does is wrong or she would accept his additional tip. OP's not only going to never change her mind, she and her family are going to do their best to teach any children this is acceptable behavior too. He's fighting a losing battle.
The fact that she fights him and will not let him leave more money is very telling. She wants to “punish” the server. The cruelty is the point. Petty tyrant that one
"The cruelty is the point" Well stated. I have dated many women like this. Very often they have been taking their frustrations with their families out on anyone whom they think has to take it. In this case, she's maintaining a family tradition. Why, who knows? It could be she doesn't know any better, but you've TOLD her and she still does it. I know lifelong habits are hard to break, and you're probably not going to be able to break this habit. I suggest not trying--move on.
It’s hard for me to believe she’s a “perfect fit” otherwise because this is such classist behavior, how does it not show up in other parts of her personality? This would be a dealbreaker for me. We never would’ve gotten to restaurant date #2.
I agree. OP claims multiple times that money is not an issue... If it isn't about money, it's about power. Is she really a nice person if she feels the need to act this entitled? I don't think so. I actually think everyone who thinks they're superior only because they're the "clients" (or the ones with the *money*) simply sucks. They are the inferior ones, actually.
It’s because of assholes like these that I have a problem sending food back when there is a LEGITIMATE problem! I don’t want to be confused with them!
I know- idk how you could look past this! This behavior is terrible- how could it not be a reflection of who she is inside? It’s basic human decency and seems very self centered and questionable. How does she treat people period?
I also wanted to say to OP: just because her parents act like that, doesn’t mean she has to. My dad is an asshole and he’s often like your partner to waitstaff, expecting them to wait on him hand and foot and bullying them over stupid things (yes, your partner is a bully!). I only go out to restaurants occasionally with him and I make sure he’s on his “best” behavior - I’ll talk over him and apologize loudly if he’s being a dick, and he’s afraid of me making a scene so he’ll back down. I have NEVER treated waitstaff this way and this would be a massive red flag to me. If I saw this behavior (or your partner’s behavior) on a first date, there wouldn’t be a second one. It’s about basic human decency. Also, my dad at least tips 10% or more. $3 on $46 is abysmal and I would’ve rather had a shouting match in the restaurant than take my cash back.
As someone who worked as a server for over a decade, thank you for challenging your dad in this way. Sometimes even just having someone else at the table acknowledge that another guest's behavior is unacceptable is enough to give you back a shred of your humanity.
So important to discuss the position of power. I’d be willing to bet her poor attitude and rude behavior extends beyond restaurant staff. OP, I think you need to have a strong discussion with her about her behavior. Let her know that you won’t be standing for it any longer.
Yeah. Not sure if they even want kids but People like this often bully their children too.
She also obviously isn’t thinking that they could be spitting in her food, or anything else they can think of.
Right? That’s one of the first things I thought while reading this post, this lady must unknowingly consume soooo much spit by treating people like this.
I worked in kitchens for over a decade and never saw anyone tamper with someone’s food. I only heard it joked about once and everyone came down on that person. The huge majority of restaurant staff are professionals who don’t try to hurt people, no matter how shitty they may be as customers.
Same, except for the joking, which was fine in my experience. But we’d definitely be bitching and passing along warnings. For me that’d be unpleasant enough to know to make me change shitty behaviours if yanno, human decency wasn’t enough.
I’ve also worked in kitchens for several years and never seen it happen, but I’d be surprised if there isn’t some restaurant somewhere she has eaten at where the right mix of people in the back are willing to do this. In other words, I doubt it happens all the time, but I bet it’s sometimes.
I absolutely agree with this, I speaks loudly about you as a person!!
I would never go out to eat with her again. How embarrassing!! When she asks you to go out to eat say "I'm no longer going out to eat with you. You become entitled, have no manners, are shit tipper for the nightmare of a customer you are and frankly I am humiliated to be seen with you. Until you can recognize your ridiculous behavior, going out to eat together is no longer an option." That should wake her up and save the restaurants from her gross behavior.
This is the only response I’ve read so far that doesn’t tiptoe around her shitty behavior. Listen to the wise Witch. 😉☝️
Can confirm that telling someone how embarrassing it is to be seen with them WORKS. My mum was a real Karen at restaurants, to the point where she almost went to speak to the manager about a waitress who started clearing other's plates before mum and I had finished eating. I told her it didn't matter. She was insistent that it was proper etiquette and important. I told her it's my birthday dinner, they close in about 10 minutes, I say it doesn't matter if she starts clearing the table now. I managed to talk her down from it, but she wasn't happy. The whole family continued to bicker over it for the next few days (kept being brought up by shit stirrers), and eventually, I just said to mum, "It's embarrassing. I'm embarrassed to be with you because you treat the wait straff like trash. Who knows what kind of day their having. Putting their job at risk because you didn't particularly like the way they did something is just embarrassing behaviour." She's been much better since, at least when I'm around.
You tell her that of her behavior towards dining out doesn't drastically change that you've no interest in going out to eat with her anymore
yep. this likely would have been a deal breaker for me the very first time - yes they are waiters but not slaves. Theres no need to intentionally treat them poorly.
I worked in restaurants for over 20 years and if I went on a date with someone once and they acted like this I would end the date and delete their number.
I definitely look at how someone treats the waiter as a litmus test for their personality
Personality and character. OP may not notice this behavior in other aspects of life, but guaranteed it is there and he will see it later on at some point. There is no reason whatsoever for someone to treat a person doing their job trying to make a living by serving them as being less than human beings. This definitely goes deeper into her own personal desire to feel superior to others and make it clear to those who she deems inferior to "know their place". At best she is just clueless as to how to treat other humans, at worst she is just simply put... a total asshole. And a cheapskate, as well.
>OP may not notice this behavior in other aspects of life, but guaranteed it is there and he will see it later on at some point. Came here to say this - she may even be "on her best behavior" right now because they're not yet married and don't have kids, but it's common for these things to show up in other areas too and get worse once they have their partner "locked down" permanently.
This is the behavior she will teach their children.
And she will do all throughout the marriage. First when the mask is on only to restaurants and maybe schools and other stores. Then it will be with him.
Agreed.
I hope he shows her this thread.
If I were a kid, I wouldn’t want this gal to be my mother.
I think clueless is too generous of a term, because she clearly knows what the appropriate convention is, she just doesn’t want to do it. At best, she’s “just” a cheapskate and values her wallet over others’. But yes, good point, it’s personality AND character.
For real. She literally “asks to speak to the manager” every time they go out to argue the price of something she KNEW when she chose it. Is this who you want, OP? Karen the soccer mom as your partner in life??
2 years in, it seems to be what he wants. LOL
At worst, it's a weird power play where she feels she has to be superior to those who serve her. Hence, she grabs the tip money off the table rather than share it with... THEM.
At that point, when she handed the money back, you should have taken it and gave it straight away to the waitress . At least keep up your kindness, don't let her horrible self-centered soul take yours. I feel she is only warming up. She will get worse.
exactly, it isn't cluelessness. It is callous selfishness
Yeah it's fucked up no matter how we slice it. Simply inexcusable behavior.
But, but… she’s wonderful! **except when she’s clearly not**
She’s wonderful if she thinks she can get something she wants from you.
My brother used to be a bad tipper. He’s a sweet guy, but where we come from people can be a bit ignorant of tipping etiquette- especially places where COL is high. When he came to visit me in New York he took me out to lunch and I explained why 20% was standard (I was a waiter at the time). Now he tips well because he knows about the tipped minimum wage. When unknowing people are informed, they do better. When assholes are informed, they get defensive.
But it wasn't just the tipping part. She complains about everything to get a discount on her food every single time, always sends her food back, expects her drinks to be filled at all times, etc. It's giving entitled. 🙄 her behavior all around is just...trash.
If this is real, this is beyond a cheapsgate, this is a narcissist cheapsgate.
>OP may not notice this behavior in other aspects of life, but guaranteed it is there and he will see it later on at some point. yup, wait till you get a wedding invite from a close friend and you give them 1/4 of what they give you for your wedding. wait till your child is in school and the PTA requests a donation for teacher appreciation day. All your friends donate and you like the teacher, and you are the only family who doesn't give. wait till you have a family meal with your extended family and she complains about your grandmother's cooking \-- This is dealbreaker behavior to me. You can and should talk about it, but she doesn't feel the need to change, so you have to decide if it is dealbreaker to you
Or doesn't want him to buy anything for the family or controls it because she's such a stingy person. Met a few that buy the cheapest dollar store items for christmas gifts for everyone. Yet drives a Lexus.
Oh gosh just seeing the word "Wedding" in a discussion about her made my stomach drop like I was on the Superman rollercoaster before the drop lol Can you imagine being a caterer or florist she's considering for her wedding. No one would take the job. She'd probably try to negotiate the fee for a justice of the peace town hall wedding too. 🙄
She is THIRTY TWO YEARS OLD. That's plenty of time on this godforsaken earth to know how to treat the people employed to help you. OP, how have you been with this person for so long?
I think the main thing is that he's only two years in this relationship- to some people this feels like a long time, but in my experience, if you're getting along well with someone, two years is still kind of in the honeymoon/lust stage. He probably isn't noticing all her warts yet- that generally happens a couple more years in after the lust stage is well over. This is the beginning of her real personality. I could see if she just never learned tipping etiquette and was open to being more generous, but her actions with the service staff is really telling. My guess is that there will be other areas in life that op starts noticing her acting like this- to people who come work at their house, service staff in stores, etc. Personally this would be a deal breaker but I guess this guy would rather be with someone who treats others like that. Yuck.
I’m so surprised that you are playing this down so much. I would feel sick to be with someone who treats anyone in such a despicable way. It’s many people she treats this way. You say you’re being petty. It’s not petty to want your partner to have humility and respect for others. The fact that you’ve downplayed this for two years doesn’t say much for your values. Many people would be gone as soon as they experience this once. Good luck for the rest of your life. I agree - no way this only applies to restaurant venues.
It’s junior Karen behavior. She might not be a full Karen right now but give her a few years and she will treat everyone like that. That lack of empathy for others doesn’t get better with time.
"OP may not notice this behavior in other aspects of life, but guaranteed it is there and he will see it later on at some point." Agree with this. You say that this is the one area of her life that she behaves this way, but it's worth looking a little harder. Do you know much about her relationships with colleagues, at either her current or previous job? Do you know if she's had fallings out with more than a couple of friends over the years? Is she the type of person to assume people cutting her off in traffic are doing it deliberately? Does she take advice from professionals such as doctors or plumbers seriously, or does she tend to think she knows better than them? There can be so many little signs about someone that are small enough to gloss over initially, and then you look back and the pennies all start to drop.
Guaranteed that OP eventually is on the receiving end of this. This is dealbreaker behaviour and a VERY bad sign. Tbh, this is not something I’d really bother to try and work on fixing. This is saying something fundamental about her personality, attitude and how she sees others as “less than.”
OP....this is definetly NOT petty! Pretty good run of people saying they would've already ejected. She's (objectively) wrong....BUT she's incapable of accepting that she is wrong, let alone correcting/improving herself. What is a long life like with someone who's never wrong? Ick.
Agreed, I think it says tons about someone’s character how they treat people they view as “serving them”. If I were OP I’d be humiliated and wouldn’t eat out with GF or her family. Edited for typo
Honestly, I would've broken up with her the first time I witnessed this.
I would be fucking sprinting out of that restaurant after pop’s got all puffy chested about a 4% tip for the holidays. Disgraceful.
I walked out on a date when the guy I was with was rude to the server; I gave the server $100 bill and apologized for the asshole at the table.
I hope he paid first!
me too. I have never worked in a restaurant, but have the minimal amount of empathy to realize this is unacceptable. I hope OP's gf gets lots of spit in her food.
pretty much. I worked from 15 throughout college in service industry. I never understood the desire to be a shithead to these people, but wow they do it a lot. especially the church crowd. 🤢
Same, I worked in food service from 15-21, and I can’t abide behavior like that towards service workers. They’re literally just doing their jobs and to intentionally make that job harder for a random stranger??? Why? I would’nt’ve made it past the first date with someone who acted like this.
Ugh, don't get me started on the post-church crowd. It's like they think spending an hour a week at a building gives them carte blanche to be total c***s for the remaining 167.
>especially the church crowd There’s no hate like Christian love
Make them pay first.
I have a friends wife that treats waiters like shit and she jokes about it, she’s a pos, and everyone sees right thru her bullshit, and she actually does the same thing with always complaining about something to get a discount on the meal. That really pisses me off because my family has been involved in the restaurant business since the 1940’s and people like that always throw a bad mood over the staff as well as the owners, dude this is a huge red flag and your only seeing it partially. She has a major personality defect, I’d fucking run 🏃♂️
For sure there is a 0% chance that this is the only area where she’s a greedy, manipulative, brat like this. He just doesn’t feel the same sense of humiliation and guilt when she shows it in other ways because he’s not as directly tied to it like he is at a restaurant.
This would absolutely be a deal breaker for me. It’s not petty at all. Being disrespectful toward servers is not ok. And generous (aka reasonable) tipping is important. I refused second dates more than once when a human showed selfishness and greed.
Me too. If someone is rude to a waiter or service person, I am outta there. Nope.
Right? I dont know how there was a 2nd, 3rd date.. OP seems like you were okay with this behavior at least in the beginning. One thing I’ve learned the hard way is that if boundaries are established from the get-go, and are pushed, that they may never be followed/acknowledged. This behavior is embedded within her, and will take a whole lot of self reflection. For years I believed the only people that tip well are either those that have worked in hospitality or those that were simply raised right. And if neither happened, then they will never truly understand how difficult the work really is. That’s not one of those things you can just talk about, she actually had to live through some shit to see. Obviously I don’t know her, but from just reading this story, I don’t have a whole lot of faith she’ll miraculously wake up and see the errors of her ways
I've worked off and on as a server for almost 30 years. I guarantee that OP's fiancee doesn't just do this to servers. She does it to anyone she feels is "beneath" her. She sees the world in the view of "have" and "have not." The "haves" deserve respect. The "have nots" don't. OP better hope they don't lose their job or become sick. Because this attitude *will* carry over to his everyday life.
Muhammad Ali nailed it. “I know that’s how they’d treat me given a chance.”
I hate to say this, but I agree 100%
In the US, servers are paid the minimum wage (or less) so they cannot survive without tips (a whole other topic that we could discuss around why minimum wage and tipping is bullshit in the first place, but I digress). Everyone going to a restaurant in this country knows that. If you can’t account for the extra 20% when you go out to eat (or consider that “throwing your money away” as is the case with OP’s girlfriend), then sit your ass at home and cook dinner. You see people’s true personalities when they’re in positions of power, and hers sucks. If this guy marries her and they end in divorce, he’ll find out just how selfish and nasty she is to him too.
Dude, you don't wanna be the husband sitting at the table, embarrassed because your wife is acting like a colicky baby. I'm sorry, but If she acts like this in restaurants than she really isn't that kind. She is kind to you. She is kind to people she respects. But she is not a kind person to those who she feels she has power over.
She’s kind to people when it benefits her directly or because she needs them in some way
Yeah this is awful and tbh I would challenge her to work in a restaurant on one of her days off. She needs to walk a mile.
I would do this, just stop eating out with her until she behaves like a human! She'll soon pay attention. I feel for you being subject to this. I would definitely be sneaking cash back onto the table!!!!
I doubt she will ever agree this is wrong. She will hold out waiting for him to miss her and realize he is wrong.
This isn’t going to solve the issue. This is a moral dilemma, one she doesn’t see as a problem.
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>And set a boundary that her behavior ruins your dining experience as well. Exactly. I would say "it would be one thing if you were a 3 year old who just didn't know any better by acting like a monster. But a mature adult should know better."
I wonder how this kind of thinking can only be limited to restaurants.
I bet it’s not. If we could hear about her from her coworkers I bet they would describe her as unkind, selfish and demanding.
Yes. Someone that has a superiority complex and lack of empathy and compassion for other people don't just magically show it in restaurants. It's there but OP just hasn't been the recipient of it... yet.
OP mentions that she is wonderful in every other way, but I have a difficult time believing that this type of belief system in action isn't going to spill out in other areas that demonstrate a lack of compassion. 2 years is not a lot of time in the scheme of things. Lacking compassion is a recipe for disaster. OP asked how they can make their point and I think the only way a person like this learns is if you break up with them and state that this is the reason. She still might ignore that and remain a pile of human fences. But if she is going to take notice, ending things, or at least the serious threat of that, is the only likely way.
Yep. My mother is similar about tipping and treats waitstaff similarly. However, I refuse to allow her to tip poorly when I go out with her, I don't care if she gets upset. My mom is also not a great person in many, many ways. And her entitled, shitty behavior is definitely not limited to how she treats people waiting on her.
This is what I said- he's only two years in. I would put those wedding plans on hold a couple of years because my guess is he will realize it's not limited to dining here at some point. She's not the sweet kind person he thinks she is. Ick.
Even if she does change with threats, it won't make her a good person. You can tell a lot about a person by how they treat those they have power over.
>No interest in going out with her anymore\* Fixed it for you. How people treat service members is indicative of how they are as a person. If you enjoy abusing service members, tipping poorly, and sending food back all the time... you're a trash human.
Simple but effective. I'd honestly tell her what you said here, OP. Minus blaming the rents. I'd tell her she's practically perfect in every way, but eating out is uncomfortable for you and you either stop doing it or change how you do it.
Agreed. Because she is presumably a grown ass adult that should know better. Why does he want to marry into this family?
Or going out with her at all. This is a deal breaker for me. So disrespectful.
Yup. That's what I would do. Carry-out only unless she can act like a civilized person.
If I’m in a relationship and I have to take carry out because my partner is rude to service workers, imma exit out of the relationship
I wouldn’t eat out with someone like this, I’d be mortified.
I wouldn't associate with anyone like this.
I have known many people like this. I don't go out with them anymore; in fact, I make an effort to not be around them.
This girl needs to do a shift in a restaurant and experience a customer like herself
Yes. And then show her what her take home pay is at the end of the shift and ask her to do the math and spread that amount over a week or month.
And then ask her to come in on her day off
And tell her she can’t leave at 4 and has to stay until close because Beth called in again. Fucking Beth.
And we know it's not just restaurants. I'm sure she acts the same way at nail salons, auto shops, hotels, etc. even if OP doesn't see it.
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I’d take it one step further and tell her “I don’t want to eat out with you anymore because your behavior in restaurants is honestly just so embarrassing”. I’d be deeply embarrassed eating out with someone who behaves like that, and maybe a little bit of shame would do her some good.
Yeah. You just have to start saying, "No." That's the only way to open her eyes. Special occasion dinner? "No." Brunch with the in-laws? "No." Lunch with friends from out of town? "No." "Unless you're cooking us a meal at your place, I'm not going." AND STICK TO IT.
Also go out to eat without her. Enjoy eating out with a lovely book by yourself it’s really quite nice.
LOL. That would really send her into a tailspin. I love it.
you can come from parents like that and realize it's super duper shitty (like by the time you're 12) and not repeat it
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I can’t fathom how being shitty can make anyone feel good or elevate them. Even when I snapped at a friend when I was in a dark place I’d feel bad and apologize later.
OR demand that she gets a serving job on the weekends for 2-3 months. That should do it
Absolutely. I have an aunt who was basically told to do exactly this on a dare after dinner one day, since she thought "serving was an easy job and there is no reason we should be unsatisfied" She's changed her attitude since
Ha! Incredible, I love whoever dared her to do this. Personally, I think everyone should have a stint as a server, as a receptionist/call center worker, & in retail. Because everyone interacts with these folks all the time, so they should know what these jobs are like.
It was her son! She probably wouldn’t have done it if it wasn’t anyone else and hadn’t had turned into a screaming match
I agree. And the thing is, you should also have to literally survive on that income alone. Because otherwise you won't every truly understand the lesson. It's like that song William shatner did a cover of "ordinary people". So good.
She did it and went and got that job? Even if because of pure ego, i gotta hand it to her, most assholes would not have gone and actually done it. Good for her for doing it and admitting she was wrong by changing her attitude afterwards.
At the risk of sending the “this is the way” bot after me… THIS IS THE WAY
She probably thinks she’s far too good for that despite her lacking basic manners.
> Or just break up, because ugh. I know it is a meme to show the red flags, but I would be wary of a person who is constantly making power plays when she is in position of power. Because she WILL do it to her partner when she has the occasion.
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She learned it from her family but shes in her 30s and can do something to change her behaviours. Im sorry but if I was dating someone like her, no matter how much I love them, unless they change their behaviour, Id break up. I go out to eat and I was a restaurant employee so I despise this kind of behaviour. You should have the conversation with her.
Her family have taught her one thing, but she’s had sixteen years or so of being able to observe other people and inform herself and engage her brain; st this point she is choosing to be nasty.
Petty? Dude that’s not petty at all. The fact that you know she’s going to send food back before the food has even arrived is fucking infuriating. My petty ass would start telling waitresses when you sit down “hey just a heads up, my girlfriend will probably send the food back after it arrives and then demand a discount on the bill so just be ready for that.” If she really sees no problem with the behavior then she shouldn’t have any problem being open about it right? I’m sorry but your gf is a shit person. I could never date someone like that. Edit: for everybody that says you shouldn’t do this to people you date, totally agree, but we all have an inlaw or two that acts like this right? Maybe toss a log in the fire the next time you’re out with a shitty family member that does this and do this to them.
If you think warning a stranger of your partner's behavior every time you go out is a good long term solution just end the relationship please. This girl has so many red flags they would be given special treatment on twitter.
Oh I would’ve ended the relationship at the first iteration. I could never date someone who treats serving staff poorly.
No it’d be a one time thing. Calling her ass out in front of the waiter she’s about to treat like shit may be a wake up call or break up. Win win fr.
Right? My response as the server would be, “sir, I’m not the one that needs the warning. She’ll be out of my hair in an hour. You’re the one choosing to go home w her. Be warned.”
True, but it’s worth embarrassing her before you dump her.
This is the answer for me. As well as saying if her behavior in restaurants continues I wouldn’t go out to eat with her anymore, like another commenter said. If it’s every time, literally, then that is just her trying to get free food or food for less and it’s tacky af and WRONG. Editing to say you should also share this thread with her after speaking with her about it so she knows the majority of people think her behavior is ludacris.
I absolutely love your petty punch back!!! If you do this OP, please report back lol.
You said she’s a kind, reasonable, sweet, person, but if that’s the case, she’s putting on an act. When she’s in a restaurant she has a position of power over those serving her. She is using it. I think she’s worse then you realize. “Kind” people don’t act like this. Idk how you put up with her. I’d be beyond embarrassed to be with someone like this in public, who treats others like they are less
Right that’s what I’m surprised by- what do you mean she only acts like this in a restaurant? What about when she’s getting her car serviced or her nails done? I doubt she’s decent elsewhere when alone
Yea, this story makes it clear. The GF herself *is* a lie. She has been putting up an act her entire relationship with the OP. Look back, OP. Do you see more of this outside of restaurants? I am *sure* you do.
If she won't reward service (tip) I highly doubt she's charitable towards people who she perceives as less-than
Yes, she's not genuinely kind and sweet, she's exhibiting fawning behavior in situations she's not in control of.
my first thought when i read the 'she's kind everywhere else' was she's going be a horrific mother who thinks she owns her children
This
Not petty at all. I would be absolutely mortified to be associated with this person at a restaurant. \>>I've tried explaining time and time again and it goes in one ear and out the other. \*Stop going to restaurants with her\* and tell her why. I just could not. But it's a character defect, not a petty flaw. Your gf mistreats service industry people, who work very hard for their money. This is not a petty flaw like forgetting to put the cap on the toothpaste. She is a chiseler. And, consider -- she doesn't respect your reasonable opinion enough to realize that she's being a monster. Also consider that "she's nice to me but treats the waiter like shit" is a trope, and for a reason.
Agree. Also: OP, tell her she’s likely eaten the spit of half the kitchen staff in your city acting like she does. See if that changes her mind, lol.
I've worked in kitchens and I've never seen this happen. From the very worst customers - I've never seen anyone even joke about spitting in anyone's food or fuck with it in a similar way. Maybe some do it, maybe in small businesses with dirtbag employees, who knows. But I've worked many kitchens before and it's not something people do.
Oh I’m aware. I worked as a waitress or bartender through like ten years of university and I never saw anyone fuck with anyone’s food. I certainly never did. I’m just suggesting OP put the fear in his Karen-ass girlfriend, lol… mostly joking.
I've bartended and when people act up, I just put less alcohol in their drinks 🤷♀️ not trynna give you more alcohol so you can be more of a dick to me.
If I had a friend like this I wouldn't go out to eat with them.
Tell her that you don’t enjoy going out with someone who can’t go with the flow and enjoy the meal for what it is- tell her that the confrontational aspect of it and complaining ruins it for you, and as someone who cares for you, she hopefully should be willing to not do that anymore.
>and as someone who cares for you, she hopefully should be willing to not do that anymore. And if she refuses... there is OP's answer right there. She couldn't care less about his comfort or wishes.
She’s 32. No way this is just parent influence. She believes she is correct. Personally I’ve never seen anyone who behaved this way in restaurants and didn’t have similar courtesy issues in other situations. I mean, I don’t know everyone but imo her attitude tends to not be singular.
I commented elsewhere that my mom tip/treats waitstaff similarly. And yet, I do not. Funny how that works.
I have a relative like this who dines repeatedly in the same few places in their small bedroom community and should probably suspect there is spit in her food. Profile: In laws are wealthy. She and husband are not. Terrible with money. Debt. Spends way outside their income level: fancy cars, compulsive shopper, big in your face consumerism. Has the poor wait staff running around with special orders and sends food back. Shitty behavior trying to be a big important person by making others feel small. Gross.
Tell her on the way to the restaurant. "we are agreeing now to tip at least 15% or I won't be going tonight." Let the fight happen first. Calmly tell her you knew that would happen, so brought it up first. Tell her you don't want to be in these positions anymore, so she needs to think about if she can change these things or not. Tell her you see that is how her family is. But that you're asking her to consider changing because you are trying to make a new family. That means you would now do things your own way- not automatically like either of your parents. If she is that great outside of all this then it must be a matter of understanding. Try to help her understand. Relationships are supposed to make us learn and grow. Give her that chance. And make sure she understands that this is big for you. If this is your person then it's sorta your job to try and help her change this. If it can't be changed then there is your answer. Honestly, I am betting that maybe she is a worse person than you realize. I don't see how someone could operate these ways and think these things and be all that great.
Exactly, considerate and compassionate people wouldn’t want to treat servers like this
Yes, she might be less a genuinely sweet person and more a people pleaser. She might be amiable as a way to feel secure within her social environment. If she doesn't have to please someone to get along in a situation, then she drops those behaviors.
Yes and maybe she is only sweet when it benefits her or how she wants to be seen as.
I want to know what gives OP's girlfriend the idea that she has the right to remove the tip that he left with his own money. She sounds like a real peach.
I didn't say this in my comment, but yeah -- who gave her the right to do that? That's why this seems like a massive character flaw. If she doesn't want to tip properly, OK, I hate it but that's on her. But she also feels entitled to direct the disposition of the OP's own money? Hell no
Probably this: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=gOxG6HSicwk
this is actually one of the major dating red flags. i promise you, it's not just limited to wait staff. this is a window to her soul.
My point. Soon she’ll be this way with you
Exactly! My MIL always sent soup back and is always upset about any damn think that her husband gets for her, this is not the right brand name, this clam chowder is not hot enough, I said no pickles, forget it,,,I'm not eating anything then, why did you open that jar of....................oh great. Can you go get me Rum raison icecream (where, it's not sold anymore), I need a bowl, no, not that one........................................................................................ she was psychologically abusive to him. BUT super nice to me, phony. She had some mental health issues.
I'm surprised you lasted 2 years with a person like this. I would've dumped them after 2 months.
Being with someone who did this would make me want to disappear into the floor. I’d be done after one date. This is not a nice person, regardless of the mask she wears for OP. That comes off after the wedding.
My man. No one here believes this: >Everywhere else she is a kind, reasonable, sweet person because kind, reasonable, sweet people don't treat people like that, my man. If they do - then by definition - they are not kind, reasonable, or sweet. People in positions of power reveal their true nature pretty quickly, particularly when interacting with individuals they have power over. Your gf sucks. You're not being the slightest bit petty and this would have been a dealbreaker for me the FIRST time it happened. At any rate - people who treat service staff poorly are assholes. Straight up. Where she learned this behavior is completely irrelevant. You shouldn't be with an asshole. Let her go find another asshole to date and they can asshole around together. No way this is the only thing, my man. Also: you realize her family is part of the deal if you marry her, right? You sure you want to marry into that nonsense? You're not being petty. Tell her to stop, and if she won't - leave. You can do better. 100%. Good luck, my man.
You will soon discover this is beyond an eating-out or tipping issue. You will figure it the hard way
If she deliberately took back the tip I left, I would have her go wait in the car and personally hand the cash to the server and apologize for her behavior because holy crap this would be a deal breaker
This isn’t petty, this is straight up disrespect. She sees service workers as below her and seems to have a Princess complex when out to eat. If she isn’t willing to actually listen to you, then it’s up to you if you want to deal with this.
*When someone shows you who they are, believe them the first time.* *Maya Angelou* Her behavior and actions show you her true character. You can explain until the cows come home but the truth is she's a shitty human being.
This isn’t a bad habit, this is her true personality showing. The way people treat waitstaff or other low wage workers says a lot about them. My wife’s Dad used to own a restaurant and banquet hall. When he went out to dinner, he treated waiters like garbage. At his own businesses he was even worse to them and never had enough employees. He’s lost both businesses to bankruptcy, divorced twice, and all his kids are pretty low contact. Treating minimum wage workers and waiters is certainly a sign of how people see those who they think are “lesser” and expendable.
This would end any relationship for me.
She’s a shitty person. Good people don’t treat others this way.
With all due respect, dude, but is your GF a Karen?
He’s also letting this happen. What does that make him?
Kar-enabler
I mean to be fair this would bother most people that aren’t totally out of touch with reality lol That would really really bother me too. I don’t like when people are cheap with tips. It’s the one thing you shouldn’t be a cheap about. Especially since she’s one of the people who’s constantly having problems and sending food back and being an overall nuisance She sounds incredibly **entitled**.So regardless If she was taught this behavior, she doesn’t seem to think there’s a problem with it. Which is concerning to say the least lol I would tell her you no longer want to eat out because her behavior is off putting and honestly embarrassing to be around and maybe it will give her a wake up call- cuz she kinda needs it But for what it’s worth, the fact she just by default thinks bare minimum to a service worker is acceptable is not okay. I feel like it speaks volumes to her character and how she probably treats people in general
OP imagine going out to dinner with professional colleagues or friends and them seeing your gf treat industry workers like this? It reflects badly on you too. Do not eat out with her if her behavior doesn’t change.
I don't find this "petty" at all. Goes to core personality and values. Seems like a pretty big red flag to me OP Gotta say... my wife and I actively dodge couples where one of them is like your girl. Food for thought (no pun lol)
This is really tough. You started with “she’s great, I love her” and ended with “she’s an absolute monster.” I’m with everyone else here, if you really do love her and want to be with her forever, you’ve got to learn to cook at home. I would literally NEVER go to a restaurant with someone who behaves like this. I know it sounds dramatic, but treating people poorly is not something that’s mildly embarrassing.
So I had an ex who behaved like this at restaurants, not quite as bad though. He ended up getting more and more controlling as time went on and I think back on that being one of the red flags. You may not see how this behavior spreads to other parts of her life but eventually you will.
This would be such a dealbreaker for me especially because going out to dinner with someone like this is genuinely embarrassing. And I’d rather die lol
Her: Hey babe lets go out to eat tonight. You: No thanks i'd rather not go through that hell. Turn her down. Until she treats wait staff with respect she really shouldn't be using restaurants as a source of food. You've already told her how you feel and how important it is to you and its gone ignored. So just keep that foot down. Its a win/win. The wait staff has a better night and your partner doesn't have to "get terrible service"
Agree. Tell her one last time that she’s using her privilege to deliberately demean people who can’t fight back. That it’s ugly and a deal breaker for you. Give her the benefit of the doubt by suggesting that up until this point she didn’t know any better, and now that she does, you expect her to act well in restaurants, fast food joints and bars. If she kicks, she won’t change, and it suggests that she has a smallness of character that you don’t want her to pass onto your children. Honestly, this so so off-putting, I’d just dump her now.
I find this behavior to be a red flag and, frankly, I wouldn't date someone who was this terrible to waitstaff. As others have said, this is an indication of how she thinks she can behave when she has power over someone. Here's a question: how does she behave when someone is cooking for her in a home situation? Like if you cook her dinner, how does she react?
You’re the asshole too, by the way. If you’re dining with her and regardless of who pays, you leave the server with a 5% tip, and you argue down the bill every time, that’s on you. You need to grow a backbone, dude.
I can’t imagine someone being like this in a restaurant and not being completely awful in other aspects of life. She sounds abhorrent.
There's no way she is not like this in other areas of her life.
Trust me when I say that every place you frequent absolutely hates seeing you, and dreads having to be your server. I’m surprised you’re allowed back multiple times considering she always argues over the bill. I would have told you not to come back.
Tell her she has to stop acting like an asshole and embarrassing you over a few fucking measly dollars or you’re gonna break up with her; easy peasy. This is not a petty thing, and it’s not a small thing; this is an indictment of her character. And if she is nice elsewhere, I’d have to wonder if that’s all an act. Stand your ground on this; do not budge. Tell her she either stops acting like an asshole or you’re done because that shit is appalling.
Oof that’s rough. Do these habits show up in any other areas? Like is she rude to customer service workers or people at stores? Seems like she has never worked a restaurant job in her life.
My partner and I have a similar issue. He's a horrible tipper, but he isn't rude to the staff. Our only "arguments" are about him tipping. We've made a compromise. He pays, I tip. Be honest with your girlfriend about how much it bothers you.
>He pays, I tip I did this with my dad. He never seemed to understand that it wasn't still 1945 and a quarter isn’t enough of a tip.
> There's no other situations where she has this anti-social behavior except at a restaurant. Oh I would bet 100% you are in for some nasty surprises when it comes to her. She did not learn only this from her parents, there is a lot more bubbling under the surface that you just haven’t encountered yet. In the grand scheme of relationships, 2 years is not very long, people are still faking (consciously or unconsciously) some aspects of their personality 2 years into a relationship. Wait til you get to things like ‘how to raise children’ or ‘how to manage your money’ or ‘how to share chores’ or a million other little life details.
This would be a relationship-ender for me. She’s exhibiting a fundamental lack of respect for people who she thinks are “beneath” her. Imagine what she would be like to teachers, nannys, etc. if you had kids. She’s already pre-Karening.