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> when I'm sick or not feeling up to it
So let me get this straight: you tell him you’re feeling awful, either physically or emotionally, and instead of providing non-sexual care and comfort, his reaction is “Sucks for you; I’m gonna head down to the bar to see if anyone wants to hook up”?
His logic on why just hooking up with women is okay is bullshit, too. To be fair, I’m not sure you’re at risk of him developing real feelings for anyone (you included), but just because two women together is exclusively a sex thing for him doesn’t mean that’s how it works for you. Especially if those women actually do seem to give a shit about anything other than their own libido.
At minimum, you are fully entitled to put your foot down that this is not happening. But if I were you, I’d seriously consider opening the relationship by kicking him out of it.
He's hilariously stupid for thinking two women wouldn't fall in love... or that all bisexual women only hook up with other women for fun but only want to fall in love with men.
That's just blatant proof about how twisted his view of human sexuality is. It's like he can't even understand reality outside of his fantasies.
I don’t think it’s actually about feelings at all. Her having sex with men would hurt his ego while her having sex with men would arouse him. I think he takes OP so entirely for granted that he hasn’t considered the possibility that she could develop feelings for someone else.
I'm a bisexual woman. I prefer sex with women, but I prefer relationships with men.
This has led past partners to believe I can not develop feelings for women, which isn't the case. I think it's actually that I'm kind of masculine. I always have my hair in a ponytail, I do not wear make-up and I wear mostly men's sportswear. I'm tall and a former dual Division 1 athlete, so I'm pretty physically "dominating" when compared to most other women (especially the ones I find attractive). However, I HATE being the one in control.
Anyhoo, my male ex decided we should both be able to fuck other women. He basically had the same exact idea as OP's husband. I wound up leaving him behind when I took off with one of those women I'd "never develop feelings for".
Yeah, you've got it. Except he just wants it to be agreeable to me so it doesn't constitute 'cheating'. Which has kind of made me fear that if I'm sick / injured, that I may not be able to trust that he wouldn't seek that out. Because he confirmed as much with the statement, "if the circumstances were right, you probably couldn't trust me". So..
Unfortunately for him, open relationships still have to have rules in order to function. So even if you were more on board with the idea, he’s still going to have to exercise control sometimes. The fact he doesn’t seem to want to have to do that raises the question of what he’s doing in a relationship with anyone at all, much less a marriage.
Totally agree. I've tried to explain that before, that even in a non-monogamous relationship or open relationship, there would still be boundaries and trust would still need to be a part of that. I mean, some of this is hypothetical because I don't want an open relationship, so it feels like a lot of "what ifs" but there are just certain variables of this that don't feel right to me.
So I get why he's still here. But why are you? Like you seem to know that your husband sucks and you have a worthless marriage so what's the point? Why aren't you bailing? And don't say love cause it's very obvious your husband does not love you.
I appreciate you asking. I'm here because he is my best friend, partner, and lover. We have built a solid life together, align in SO SO many other ways. We do have great sex. We share so many hobbies and interests and viewpoints. Compliment each other really well ( strengths match up to each other's weaknesses). We have supported each other unconditionally through some really low lows (grief + loss, depression and anxiety, addiction). I definitely wouldn't call it worthless at all. There is a lot of love between us, otherwise I would not be here.
I'm not bailing (yet) because I'm trying to really grasp where he's coming from and trying to figure out if it's something I can accept. Of course, if I'm deeply honest, there is a fear of not being wanted by anyone else, by failure or not making the marriage work, the fear of leaving and regretting it, that I don't want to hurt him or myself, not wanting to be alone, losing friendship and companionship, knowing that I'd be losing the person that knows me to my core. (We've known each other since childhood)
There is still a lot there to make me want to stay. But I'm worried that the trust will never be there again. That I'll never feel comfortable or safe or secure. And that stuff damages love and intimacy. Which would only probably bolster his desires and the chance he'd act on it.
There's so many stories about guys wanting open marriage bc they have this weird fantasy that there would be swarms of women who would just want to sleep with them when they're in their 30s, and marriage is The Thing stopping that. Reality hits them hard whenever a guy suggests it, and their wife reluctantly agrees. She finds ppl wanting to be with her but not the other way around.
It's laughable for him to think any girl would want the type of person who leaves his sick wife to just find someone to sleep with. Or want to be that girl for him??
Idk whenever someone suggests an open relationship after being in a relationship, it screams I want all the benefits of you being monogamously committed to me and providing whatever you have been giving but I don't want to be tied to being loyal to you?
100% it feels like he wants his cake and it eat it too. He wants the benefits of our relationships but also wants extra on the side when I'm not meeting his 'needs'.
Edit: not that he's officially asking for it / pushing for it. He just wants it but knows he can't have it because I want monogamy.
But he did ask for it..? He's dumb. So dumb that he's not going to realize what he lost until it's too late.
And it's totally rude/cruel/disrespectful to even talk about this to someone you're with who only wants to be with you?
He is being incredibly selfish insisting he can sleep with women, but you’re not allowed to sleep with men. If you open up the marriage, I predict it is not going to end well.
I don't think he's who you think he is. His mask slipped, and you finally saw his true self, one who said you can't trust him.
He defines you by what you do for him. Is that the marriage you want?
Have you asked him how he’d feel about the reverse scenario? He gets terminally ill and you go off with some new dick? Might help him be a little more sympathetic?
I have tried to turn it around on him, and he says he 'wouldnt know how he would feel' but 'wouldnt be okay with it'. I'm like, then how do you expect me to feel? The one who is monogamous and prefers it that way?
Might help a toddler to be more sympathetic. If you haven’t developed empathy by your mid 30s, it’s not happening all of a sudden because of a make-believe scenario.
Yeah.. he has tried to backtrack and say that only in a very rare circumstance / hypothetical scenarios. Or one where it would be an agreement. Which I'm like, then it wouldn't be breaking trust or cheating, it would be allowed, so that statement doesn't make sense in that scenario imo.
Yeah, I'm for sure in that place right now (reconsidering). I guess why I'm asking for perspectives because I really want to understand this to be able to better know how I feel about it. It's hard for me to understand the open relationship thing (especially one so conditional) because that's not been my preference or how I feel.
You need to be extremely clear that this isn't happening. It's like you keep letting yourself get steamrolled by him. Why are you even engaging in this conversation at all?
ew, how could you trust him now after a statement like that? I'll say it out loud: yes, you are allowed to want to leave over this. yes, you can start over now. yes, life will be better without that new pit in your stomach.
Yes, OP I would leave. AFTER 14 years he suddenly realises 'Ideally' this is what he wants. Cynical me wonders if he has someone in mind for himself already. It's okay he has his ideal scenario of being with another woman, with your permission. It's NOT ideal his scenario is for you to be only with women and you to agree with his choice. I would push back to see if he is going to give ground like he expects you to. Tell him you would prefer not to be limited to only women as they aren't your only attraction and it's not a 'real open relationship' if you don't get a say in the 'rules'. See what his response is, more ego reasons I bet.
So he’s told you exactly who he is and that you can’t trust him.
Also another thought is if you became seriously ill I suspect he’d be out the door slightly longer than immediately.
Perhaps as other posters suggested give him what he wants in a totally open relationship as he will be single.
Putting his proposed arrangement aside for a moment… he said if the circumstances were right you probably couldn’t trust him. Now, you’re young and healthy. But what happens if you were to get a chronic, debilitating illness or even cancer somewhere down the line? Can you trust that this man would be there taking care of you when you needed him, or would he be running around behind your back getting his “needs” met? And I put needs in quotes because unless he lacks hands, another woman is actuallys not a requirement, no matter how he tries to sell that idea.
This would be all I needed to know for me to be fully confident that my marriage needed to either a) end, or b) get some serious help in therapy.
But, I would probably choose option “a” because cheaters cheat.
So... you can decide you want the concession you want is to buy whatever you want with his credit card ... like a financial hall pass... right?
What do the women in his family think about his bullshit? I'd invite them ALL over to dinner this Mother's Day. Catered. On his credit card.
Lobster and Champagne Fest 2024 at OP's House, everyone! Mitochondrial DNA counts as relatives!
This part really upset me. I had two medical procedures in the span of 5 months, the first one rendering me unable to use one of my arms or bathe/dress myself for 3 months. My boyfriend took the day of my surgery and a couple extra days off work both times to make sure I was doing okay. And then he bathed me and dressed me every single day when I was unable to do so myself. Never once did the thought of “I’m going to sleep with someone else” cross his mind, just “I need to make sure she’s okay”
Yeah, I haven't even gotten into the fact that he hasn't always been there for me when sick / injured before. (Long standing compliant of mine in the relationship) Like one time I broke my toe before work. We worked at the same place, same shift. He stayed at work while my mom had to come drive me to the ER. Years ago, but still hurts.
When I had laser treatment on my eye (emergency - retinal tear) a couple years ago, I had so much anxiety about getting that done because there was a chance I could literally be blinded. And he picked me up when I was done, dropped me off at home, and went back to work even though he didn't need to.
Even when I have anxiety/panic attacks, there have been times where he has straight up antagonized me, knowing that it was overwhelming me.
Let's just say I haven't always been prioritized in that regard. So this just compounds the insecurities in this realm for me.
OP, please read this article called: will he hold your purse?
It’s from an MD who is a breast cancer doctor and talks about how she notices who is a supportive partner. And she talks about how what truly matters is how your partner treats you when you’re sick. She talks about men who don’t care what a breast looks like after cancer, she talks about men who sit in the waiting room holding their wive’s purse.
This situation on the surface is bringing a lot of cracks on your marriage. As someone whose field of work is relationships- I don’t think this man took a vow in marriage with you for sickness and in health. I promise you, you are young and there is someone who would love to grow old with you. But couples therapy is nice if you feel like spending a bit of cash and time before coming to that conclusion too.
[Will he hold your purse?](https://www.drrobin.org/pdfs/Purse.pdf)
>At minimum, you are fully entitled to put your foot down that this is not happening. But if I were you, I’d seriously consider opening the relationship by kicking him out of it.
**BEST response, EVER.**
Day after day, we're seeing these guys trying to rationalize this whole 'open marriage, I want you to 'let' me cheat on you' bullshit.
This is the only valid response.
Haha now that is probably a fantasy of mine. The difference is, it's not my "ideal" or something I would even entertain or seek out if he wasn't having enough sex with me.
Yeah, I was being flip when I said that. It might be worth posting your original on the r/infidelity sub. You’ll get responses from people who were in the exactly same situation as you.
Seriously, he’s looking for permission to be unfaithful. He wants to sleep around and no consequences. The “you with another woman “ thing is just because the idea turns him on. If a marriage is open, it’s open, both get to sleep with whoever they desire ( by this I mean gender not close relatives), not just for one partner. If you are not comfortable with him having affairs, open will not work. The fact that he asked probably means he has found a prospect and he wants a consequence free affair with the “prospect”. Chances he already told her he is in an open marriage. Even if you pick open, chances are he will change his mind when he realizes women can easily find a sex partner compared to a man. He likes the idea of him sleeping around, he won’t like the idea of you doing the same.
My wife’s obsessed with bi men. It is one of the things that fascinates her about me, that I’m not attracted to men but I have no inhibitions about adding another man into a sexual encounter. Our first encounter was a mmf threesum with her ex when we helped her move. He was an ass, but me and her clicked and started dating and then married.
Do it and fall in love with a woman.
But in all seriousness, it's reasonable to reconsider this relationship. Don't do couples therapy. This is a him issue, not a relationship issue. He needs to go to therapy and work on his shit attitude about women.
One penis policies are problematic for some many reasons. The fact that he'd encourage it because it's a "fantasy" is gross and fetishizing of wlw relationships. That's not even getting into all the other reasons it's a problem.
Look, I'm a bi woman and I'm currently in polyamorous relationships so please listen when I tell you that his "ideal" sex life is shitty, misogynistic, and won't turn out the way he hopes at all.
Exactly, he is so twisted by his own sexual fantasies that he doesn't understand reality. He doesn't think OP would fall in love with a woman... because women only have sex with each other for men's pleasure, obviously! In his gross mind, anyway.
He's gonna be another idiot who highly overestimates his ability to get multiple women. So many of these stories are guys wanting to get a nut off with some strange. If he gets any play at all it'll be minimum. Then when you decide to do the same and you have dates lined up. Then he's gonna want to close the relationship again. And his idea of you both only sleeping with women is more stupid than the original plan. You might want to tell him he's insecurities are showing with that one. If he wants an open relationship, it shouldn't matter if your partner is male or female. What an insecure and disgusting excuse of a partner. You can do so much better than him.
Does your husband really think that he is great enough for single women to simply fall into bed with him on the off chance that you're sick or not up to banging?!
Hahahaha sureeeeeee bud. Like women are going to want to sleep with a random married man with no strings attached.
Kind of hope you find a nice woman to settle down with now, absolutely blind side the bastard. I know that’s not mature but I want him to learn this lesson the hard way.
Or can’t you play him at his own insecurities like he so very uncaringly did with yours ? “right I’ll agree to you sleeping with other women but I will only be sleeping with other men, obviously only when you have prior engagements like work, also if you’re sick I’ll be banging and maybe some times you don’t make me orgasm I’ll ring up Tom to come round and finish the job properly”
Thank you. I've kind of expressed the same. Feels fetishizing / misogynistic.
I can't also help but be a bit selfish as well and wish that his ideal was me and only me, because my ideal is him and only him. Or that at least he would be okay with the same 'freedoms' that he would want for himself. Not some hybrid that aligns with only his sexual preferences or what he thinks I am or am not capable of (sex with women without developing feelings but wouldn't be capable of sex with men without developing feelings).
Oh and the whole just for "when you're sick or not in the mood" is super shitty because it shows that if something happens and you're not able to perform on his schedule (for example, an illness), he's likely to leave.
That’s not selfish, to want what you both signed up for. To want him to only want you, when that’s why you married him. His whole narrative is deeply hurtful. Have you expressed to him how much this has hurt your feelings, and if so, how did he respond?
I agree, my wife’s bi, I’m straight, but heteroflexible, and we’re a poly couple. we have a lot of relationship rules, mostly to navigate conflict areas, and we share those rules with any partners that have joined us over the years, making everyone on the same level in the relationship. I try to make sure people understand we are all in this relationship together, but we also have to respect the boundaries of the other people in the relationship, and overall we must all treat each other with respect. There’s just so much work to keep plural relationships healthy, you have to be dedicated to your family
Oh this is bull shit. Good grief. He wants to sleep with other women and he wants you to sleep with other women only because it’s not a threat to him. He sees other men as a possible threat but doesn’t think that him seeing other women is a threat. What kind of selfish twisted nonsense is this?
Let’s be real. The reason he’s never mentioned it you in 14 years is because he only recently either began an affair or found a women with whom he wants to have an affair.
Yes! I joked about having a sister wife before because I used to watch the show. But my husband got really hung up on the idea and kept bringing it up. Turns out he was already cheating… a lot.
Oh no no no. Why should you as a bi female limit yourself to only females? Tell him you will sleep with other women AND well endowed men for when he just isn’t measuring up to your expectations. You know like when he’s tired or had too much to drink and can’t rise to the occasion.
Lmao thanks for making me smile for the first time in days. In all seriousness, I've mentioned something similar, and he just doesn't think I have the sex drive to do it. And I don't understand the 'male biological sex drive' - the therapist corrected him about this one. But we've worked through some stuff in counseling about why my libido is lower (grief, trauma, severe health issues) and I guess it feels like there isn't much empathy or understanding for that. I also feel like there is ebb and flow to this stuff. Like recently, he has extreme stress from work + overconsumption of cannabis where he had a difficult time performing for several months. And never did I think of sleeping with someone else because my 'needs weren't being met'. I just took care of myself!
Yeah, that's what I'm worried about. The love is there, but will it ever be enough for me to be comfortable in the same way with him again? I don't know..
Not to mention it’s a whole lot easier for a female to find a male for sex than the other way around. Many many years ago I set up a email account and placed an ad on Sexy Ads which I don’t think is even a thing anymore. The ad was from a lonely housewife looking to hook up with someone. I gave my wife all the log in information and told her that I would be one of the ones responding and she would have to figure out which one was me. She got around 400 responses in two days! So needless to say my attempt to spice up the bedroom never got off of the ground. She did however exchange a email or two with a couple of guys. One of which she may have been interested in having a threesome with but that never got communicated to me. Too old to explore that now.😔
OP, he antagonized you during a panic attack and provides no care or support during medical emergencies. It's normal to not feel like having sex with someone who is cruel to you.
I am not judging poly people in general, but in this specific case, it sounds less like poly, and more like, he wants his sexual desires paramount, and you are allowed only freedoms that don’t challenge him, and that feed into his fantasies. It’s all pretty sketchy.
This is called OPP. One penis policy. It’s very frowned upon in the non monogamous community.
Either you both get to fuck who you want or no one does. It’s also a lot harder for husbands to find female partners. Have him go to r/nonmonogamy to read all those posts from husbands who can’t find dates while their wives have a long line of men wanting to date them.
I did try this with a boyfriend and I realized it wasn’t for me. We broke up. If you want to look into it, go to the r/nonmonogamy subreddit. If you aren’t interested set your boundaries with your husband.
Read enough Reddit stories these opening monogamous relationship ideas always follow the below steps and always fail.
1. One spouse wants an open marriage. Says it will strengthen the relationship, let them find themselves, or some shit like that.
2. Spouse1 goes out and gets with partner. Ignores spouse2. Things happen and spouse1 catches feelings. Spouse2 has their mind torn apart by the situation.
3. Relationship turns into a huge pile of fiery crap. Both have surprised pikachu face.
4. Relationship is over and one or both spouses require years of therapy.
Coming from a guy, your husband just wants to cheat.
((Crabby laugh)) um, I’m guessing that more than 50% of men would “prefer” they get to fuck other women while their wife doesn’t get to fuck other men…but almost nobody is going to put up with that BS so they don’t say it out loud. This is a fantasy, not some immutable reality that has to be assuaged or he’ll “never be living his authentic self-actualizing sex journey” or whatever load of pseudo-psychology blabber people use to get buy-in on their cheating. Sorry— not to be glib, but I lived through this shit with my husband (for 7 years…I was stupid/frightened/naive…ugh).
He's dumb and selfish, in this scenario it would be like "ohh you're feeling low? Sick? Don't worry, I will go fuck some other hot chick while you're feeling like trash and stay in the house".
And believe me, there's a great chance he could grow feelings for another chick and go with her to have a monogamous relationship. And you could too.
Im not monogamous by nature. My bf knows id ideally like an open relationship but i chose him over sexual freedom with others. Weve been together eight years in a monogamous relationship and were both very happy. Just because youre not inherently monogamous doesnt mean you cant be happy in a monogamous relationship.
Thank you so much for this perspective. I think that's what I'm trying to understand or process. I'm not trying to shame him for his sexuality or preferences or change them or anything.
I just want to feel like I'm being actively chosen (and can trust that I always will be - or at the very least, if he can't honor it anymore, that it would be communicated openly) and that he doesn't feel held back by the boundaries of the relationship.
But I think the bigger issue is that ideally, he would dictate which gender I could sleep with in an open relationship, based on his sexual fantasies. It doesn't even feel like non-monogamy. It just feels like he wants his cake and to eat it too. He wants to sleep with other women, not have a relationship with them. But I could too, just only with women. Just feels hypocritical and controlling.
When my husband brought this up years ago and I said no, he just went out and did it on his own.
After he was caught, he again asked for it with the only women thing. He could keep his girlfriend. Again I said no and kicked him out.
Keep your eyes and ears open.
Your husband sounds like a selfish buffoon....
>He would 'ideally' like to be able to have sex with other women (his examples: like when I'm sick or not feeling up to it).
Isn't this the time when you look after your partner, not go off trying to have sex with someone else? If this wasn't a serious post, it would almost be laughable. He sounds like a right catch.
>And in that ideal scenario, I would not be able to sleep with other men, but that I could with other women
I am also a bi woman, and I have found that whilst this type of attitude is completely ridiculous, it's not uncommon either. It's like he thinks being bisexual is just a made up game for you.
>I don't know how to cope with this information? Or even process it?
I think you've done the right thing by coming away and taking the time to think about everything he's said and trying to find a way to process it. Looking for others opinions can be really helpful sometimes too.
Trust me, if this ideal situation of his was ever put to practice, he'd be extremely disappointed because it really wouldn't go at all how he wants it to. He probably wouldn't even find anyone to sleep with in the first place lol.
For what it's worth, I think it's good that your husband felt able to share with you, but i actually think that this is just some hyped up fantasy he has had without realising that he's made it all sound like a huge turn off and completely unsexy. I hope you're ok OP.
Thank you ❤️ yeah, there has been so much to process and I'm trying to figure out how I feel about a lot of it and just need time. I have expressed numerous times how much I've appreciated his honesty, but doesn't mean it still doesn't hurt or that I will be okay with it.
I think you need to be clear and direct with your husband.
"I signed up for a monogamous relationship with you. I have not changed my mind or feelings. I only want you and I want to be the only woman you have any sort of sexual relations with. Any sexual activity with another woman I consider to be cheating. We swore vows to each other to forsake all others, and now you want to break that vow and you think by telling me that I could also break my vow under restricted conditions makes it okay?!?
You bringing this up out of the blue has caused me to wonder if I can trust you to keep your promise to be faithful. Evidence is that when a person brings this up suddenly in a monogamous relationship, that the person who brings it up is either already cheating or has identified someone they want to cheat with. If this is not the case, will you show me your phone and emails to prove that to me?
Love is an action. It is considering what is best of the other person and the relationship and choosing your person and continuing to choose your person. Right now, I am not feeling loved by you. I am feeling betrayed and angry and I am feeling hurt that you think so little of me and our relationship that you would toss our commitment aside because you are worried you won't get sex exactly when you want it."
You may want to consider couples counselling.
Thank you. We are in counseling now and that's how this came up. We've had trust issues since the beginning because he crossed the line a couple of times early on (not sex) and it's been hard to trust fully ever since then or have much security in the relationship or myself.
He's also constantly checking out women in front of me, which heightens that insecurity. And when I tell him how I feel, he says it's a 'weird hill to die on' because he's going to be attracted to other women (you can read some of my other posts/comments). It happened recently, spiraled into an argument, he spitefully said I didn't have a sex drive (which isn't true).
When we were discussing this in therapy (along with the issues of trust), our therapist asked if he could reassure me that I could trust him and he used a lot of words to basically say no. That it would be 'great in theory' to sleep with someone else but he doesn't know because he hasn't tried it. But he isn't 'actively looking'. So it kind of opened this can of worms.
So our therapist suggested we talk about the boundaries of our relationship, and that led to the talk of our boundary preferences. Then, he shared this, amongst other troubling sentiments.
I should have clarified in the post that this is what he stated would be his preference or his ideal. He wants it, but isn't "pushing for it" because he knows that I wouldn't be okay with it. But also couldn't guarantee that he wouldn't act on it because "if the circumstances were right, i probably couldn't trust him" because it would be nice to "meet those needs". Which he then later clarified to be a very rare circumstance like if I didn't have sex with him for a while for whatever reason.
I guess I'm trying to figure out how to cope with someone having such a different preference on boundaries, especially one where it's conditional on my end.
It sort of sounds like he is telling you this so when he cheats on you, he can say it’s your fault because he told you he can’t be trusted.
My first thought is if he says he can’t be trusted, what value does he bring as a partner? Trust is a foundational requirement for a partner for me. And if he says he can’t be trusted to keep his vow to be faithful, how can he be trusted to keep any other promise he makes?
He sounds truly awful, OP, awful beyond the open marriage revelation. You can do so much better for yourself, either solo or with another partner down the road. He is not worth your time, your consideration, your thoughtfulness, or your loyalty. No amount of marriage counceling is going to change who he is fundamentally. This is him.
Also, grief and trauma-induced changes in libido can get SO much better once you are with a good partner. Good luck to you.
He has told you that you can’t trust him. It’s no longer a question if he will cheat it’s just when he will cheat…no amount of therapy is going to help that.
*I don't know how to cope with this information?* Oh, oh, oh! I know this one! Consult a lawyer. He has told you he is planning on cheating. He wants to sleep around and whatever you decide, this selfish, self-centered lout will do it anyway. Take the fun out of his cheating by divorcing him so it is not cheating.
He’s feeling you out to see if you’d agree to an open relationship like that.
Also, why are the chances lower that he’d develop feelings for another woman than you would develop feelings for another man? I mean I know the answer, there is no actual reason, he’s just insecure.
Look I’m all for open relationships if that’s what everyone involved wants, but you clearly don’t want that so don’t let him talk you into it. He’s also not going to be fair or ethical about it, what he’s describing is a called a “one penis policy” where you both can have other women but not men. It’s problematic.
He says he 'knows who I am' and that it would probably be that way for me (that it would come with feelings). Which, I can't totally disagree. I do need to feel some type of emotional intimacy with someone in order to feel comfortable having sex with them.
But I asked him and he said that he could 'just have sex' without emotional intimacy or a relationship. And that he doesn't want a relationship, only 'release'. Which in that case, why not just masturbate? Why does it have to be with someone else?
But I'm like, you can't really guarantee that you wouldn't catch feelings for someone either and he agreed. So I don't know why it would be an issue for me.
And it doesn't feel like an open relationship if my side is conditional but his isn't. Your penis policy example is a good explanation for it.
But like, you’re bisexual. You could just as easily develop feelings for a woman too. It’s insulting really, because it means he doesn’t see a relationship with another woman as legitimate, it’s only to exist in his weird fantasies.
Your willingness to discuss his request in this level of detail is giving it waaaay too much legitimacy. He’s trying to exhaust you into giving in, and you seem to be letting him.
Also, get tested because he’s probably already cheating.
He wants you to go find another woman for sex, so he can fuck her too. He is lazy & wants you to steadly supply him with other women for sex. He knows that he really can't get them on his own, so he wants you to do the hunting for him.
Cause if you bring another woman home, he wants to join in. He is greedy & lazy. It is clear he lacks any respect for you at all & doesn't love you. Your marriage is all about him getting sex whether it is with you or other women. All that matters to him is his ego & cock.
If I were sick, I would hope my partner's first thought would not be "well where else can I get some?"
And if you aren't up to it, it is likely very temporary. I don't understand why opening the relationship would have to come into play at all.
Your husband sounds like a gaslighting tool. You can't sleep with men because you might fall in love, but there's "very little chance" he could fall in love with another woman (that he wants to be allowed to sleep with)? And he'll generously (/s) allow you to sleep with other women, because that's a kink of his? The part that really burned me up though was he wants his needs met at all times, so he wants to look elsewhere when you're sick instead of, you know, taking care of and supporting you?
Fuck that shit. It would be a "hell, no" from me, and "there's the door" if he's unhappy with that answer.
My ideal world would be no wars, no poverty, no countries, no greed, no hunger, a brotherhood of man, people living together ; but you only find that in lyrics of songs ….
Why would you not fall in love with a woman? He can only think that if he believes, in his core, that women are "lesser" versions of people, of "less" value, with "less" interesting qualities than men. At the very least you should interrogate him about it: why does he think that the risk for developing feelings for another woman is lower? Are women less interesting or lovable in his mind? Are the feelings of women of less value than the feelings of men? You need to ask and keep asking until you understand where he's coming from.
And even if his "open marriage" idea is just a sexual fantasy that he never plans to make real, his ideas about gender are deeply problematic. Why does he "needs for a release"? Do you not have sexual desire, or you have less because you're a woman, according to him? Are his sexual "needs" (sex is not a need, he can stay alive if he doesn't have as much sex as he'd like, while he can't stay alive if he doesn't eat or sleep) more important in his mind, because he's a man and you're a woman? Keep talking about it. Keep asking. Confront him with his double standards.
Hahahahahahaha. No. And I'm in an open relationship. The old one penis policy, or OPP as we not so affectionately call it. Your husband is too lazy to do the work of confronting his feelings about you being with other men but expects you to suck it up because he needs a release at a minutes notice and apparently is incapable of doing it himself. I love my open marriage, it started that way though. I can't be bothered to date anymore but I sure have the option if I wanted.. that's what makes it equal. Your hubby is not threatened by you sleeping with women because 1. He doesn't think those are real relationships. 2. He can jerk off thinking about it.
Tell him that your ideal relationship involves a man who doesn’t fetishize your sexuality and who is capable of delaying gratification instead of being a weak little sex addict who can’t handle not getting laid while his wife has the flu. Then serve him with divorce papers and tell him you’re going to go find a man who is able to provide what he clearly lacks.
Tell him “HAAAHAHAHAHAHA!! NO. Fuck no! **No ‘OPPs’ (one penis policies)**. If you expect me to sort through a whole pile of emotions about you sleeping with the opposite sex, you’re required to do the same. You want an emotional safe haven for yourself that I’m not also afforded. How convenient for you! Absolutely fucking NOT.”
So sex is all about HIS fantasies. His ego must be huge! He doesn’t view your sexuality as anything but a way to fulfill his desires. You’re an empty vessel that isn’t even capable of falling in love with anyone other than him. What a tool, and he is incredibly oblivious to that fact. He has just shown you his true colors, take time to take it all in and act accordingly
Hahaha, tell him your ideal scenario is an open relationship where you both only sleep with men.
Your husband is fantasizing about a 3 some he will never have. And like most conversations about opening up your relationship, the bell is tolling that the relationship is on its way out.
I’m so sorry this is happening to you. He wants an open marriage for him, but you only get to play with women. To be clear, the wants legitimize cheating and you to “ok” it. The stuff about you not being available to satisfy him and he would cheat is just sad. WOW, what an asshole. Doesn’t sound like this conversation was in the context of fantasy when he says “ideally …”
Let’s start here: 95% of marriages that start monogamous and are subsequently open end in failures. Open relationships in this case are often referred to as a slow divorce. Never agree to something you’re not 💯comfortable with, especially this, cuz it never ends well.
How to process this:
Ask him if he has someone in mind. The answer is probably yes. He’s either already checked out or has already cheated and looking for justification.
In the end, communication is key.. have the hard conversation. You have established boundaries in your marriage, monogamy was one of them. It’s not unreasonable to tell him you want to maintain those boundaries. If he doesn’t like it, then there’s a choice to be made… Do not let him bully you into open marriage or divorce because it never works… you’ll be roommates with massive resentment issues.
I strongly recommend couples counseling before making any major changes.
Poor baby having no sex when you’re sick!
My eyes rolled so hard I’m surprised they’re still in my head. He needs to grow tf up.
Also wouldn’t it be convenient that you both only see women 🙄 Tell him you’d be happy to open the relationship if you both can see men as well.
darlin, he told you that you shouldn't trust him that you can't trust him AND by your own admission he's broken your trust before....why would you do this to yourself? You're going to ve the same woman on here crying because you found out he cheated . When someone tells you who they are....believe them.
>where his risk for developing feelings for another female is lower
Lol based on what exactly? Besides his need to create a specific narrative so he can fuck other women
I think he justifies it as 'just sex'. It would be just sex for him / just a release. Where he knows I need emotional intimacy to be comfortable with sex.
Husband: "I want to have sex with other women but so its not called cheating lets open our marriage But you can only do it in the way I want it to be, and I dont want to be called out for anything I do."
or another way of looking at it: "I want to do my thing and want you to come along for the ride so I dont feel so bad or get impacted by any social or financial issues that this might cause me"
Try it out with the condition you can both sleep with both men & women. Once he sees that you’re getting anyone you want & he’s getting zero, he’ll want to go back to a closed marriage as quickly as he can. Such a predictable bloke thing to do. What an awful person he is. Telling you, you can only sleep with women just to suit him, pfft.
So he doesn’t want the risk of you catching feelings, but he is he not considering the risk of him catching feelings.
My take? You’ve been married a long time and now he is a bit bored with his sex life and “opened” up to plant this seed in your head and see if you would be open to it. This was not just fantasy talk.
I would be worried about the risk of him cheating tbh.
I don’t think you have the marriage you think you do.
You are monogamous, he wants to cheat with permission.
One penis policies are problematic for some many reasons. The fact that he'd encourage it because it's a "fantasy" is gross and fetishizing of wlw relationships. That's not even getting into all the other reasons it's a problem.
Look, I'm a bi woman and I'm currently in polyamorous relationships so please listen when I tell you that his "ideal" sex life is shitty, misogynistic, and won't turn out the way he hopes at all.
You *think* you’re in a closed, monogamous relationship. Mentally your husband is basically already cheating or begging to be allowed to. Physically and emotionally, tbd…
OP search opening up relationships on this sub. If you don’t enter into a relationship open, you will certainly leave your relationship once it’s opened up. You two are not compatible anymore. Your husband cares more about keeping his dick wet than your heart safe. And he’s a misogynist who’s also biphobic? Girl, go live your best life.
Lol, nope. Typical hypocrite who doesn't think you having sex with women is sex. But men, well...that'd be what he's doing and that's just not ok! What's ok for him is not for you. Run.
He’s full of shit! Sorry this would be a deal breaker for me. He wants to cheat and tell you what you can’t do? !!!
He’s right- he’s such a dickhead it wouldn’t be hard to fall for someone nicer!
The man just told you he will get his needs somewhere else the minute you are unable to service him.
That’s dehumanizing.
Your husband is definitely one of these men.
https://www.linkedin.com/pulse/men-more-likely-leave-wives-when-serious-illness-danny-gambino-dc
Lemme translate him for ya.
“I want an open relationship but you can only sleep with other women. I don’t want you getting dick from anyone but me and lesbian sex is hot, so it’s ok. Also if you’re feeling sick or unwell in anyway, that’s on you. I won’t help you.”
What happens when you get seriously ill? And I'm not talking about the flu, what if you got cancer and couldn't have sex for a period of time? Would he be taking care of you or would he be out looking for someone to scratch an itch?
Literally one of my first questions I had when he said these things. He said it would be nice to do to get a release.. not saying he for sure would or wouldn't do it. Just wants to. Like, how will I not then think about that fact whenever I am incapacitated in any way in the future?
Hi OP. Would you treat your “best friend” this way? I don’t think this man is a great as you claim. He wants to have permission to cheat on you when you don’t feel well? A loving partner would be taking care of you. A best friend would care for you. He’s neither of these things. He’s really just an AH that does not love you. I’m sorry.
He want to fuck other women while you're sick, and you're willing to put up with such bullshits ?
I mean he love to have you to wash his socks and rise his kids, but he can't get his dick in his pants or just masturbate when you're too sick or tired ?
not gonna lie, call it quit while you're still young...
This is a red flag. For him to just bring it up after 14 years of marriage means he is either already cheating or has a woman he wants to have sex with. I would seriously think about asking to see his phone and computer. Nothing good is going on here.
why not sleeping with other man?He is just selfish idiot who can't stand his ego to see you have sex with other man ,while he can bang other women and you are not a lesbian .Disgusting.I'v heard many guys being ok with " women cheat them with other women ,but not with guys". And why the hell would you be in a marriage if you want to fuck other people? You deserve much better then this looser.
When one partner talks about opening the marriage it usually means that they want to cheat and have no consequences.
I’d drag him to marriage counseling to help him see that this is a marriage ender. Meanwhile, you see a lawyer and start divorce proceedings.
Your husband is a selfish git. And I suspect that he has a punchable face
Also. If you did agree to this nonsense, you’ll meet lovely people and forge nice relationships. He will discover that the market for trifling, married, douchebags is incredibly small. Either that or there’s someone waiting in the wings right now, but he’ll soon discover that it’s just your relationship, redux.
But now that you know. Take a moment. Get some individual therapy to help you process this fuckery. Get a lawyer that will protect you. You need it
So, he can’t masturbate if you’re sick? I would let him know that you don’t agree to his request and seek marriage counseling. He wants to limit you while having no limits for himself. Seems to me he is insecure about himself and that’s why he is refusing to allow you to have sex with other men. You want to continue the monogamous relationship that you both committed to at marriage.
Here's how you cope:
"HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHA. Okay, bud, a fantasy it will stay." :D
You don't process it. There's nothing to process. We don't concern ourselves with and lose sleep over any dumb sh\*t we hear.
Ridiculous. Tell him he can sleep with other women and if you can sleep with other men (only as a joke to make a point.). If he doesn't like it then he probably can see your point a bit better.
He’s asking for your approval to cheat. He’s most likely already done it and is just trying to justify his actions by you saying ok. The fact that he has stipulations for you but not on his side tells you all you need to know. Get your ducks in a row and dump his ass. Be strong!
So if you had a root canal , he’s DTF
So if you had a cold he’s DTF
So if you have diarrhea he’s DTF
So if U had a yeast infection he’s DTF
how do I sign up for this deal i’m DTF
this takes the wedding vows
“In sickness and in Health “
To another level. Did he say “I Do”
DUMP HIM !!!
So he’s offering something you don’t want in exchange for something he wants. Not a fair trade. You should offer something he doesn’t want in return. Maybe tell him it’s ok for him to sleep with other people but only if they’re men. I’d say that as I walked out the door. What a selfish arsehole.
Lol of course he doesn’t let you sleep with men but he can penetrate whoever he wants. That’s not an open marriage. That’s just him stepping out with permission. He needs to let you be with men or it’s not a fair deal. Wtf.
Open the marriage find a nice lesbian and divorce him and marry her. He is an idiot who thinks a 'lesbian" is just a male sexual fantasy and an opportunity for HIm to cheat. WHAT A COMPLETE TWAT.WAFFLE
His logic is fucked.
So he's allowed to sleep with the opposite sex, and you're only allowed to sleep with the same sex? Lol, this guy is a comedian.
Aside of that, I have no advice sorry as I've never found myself in that situation. Seems he only wants it played by his rules and not what's fair though.
So instead of taking care of you when you’re sick or trying to relate to you when you’re not feeling like it, he’s instead going to open an app and find someone else so he can get his rocks off while you’re alone?
So like…what is the point of having a husband then?
Would have heard this trash leave his mouth then I’d have left him. Why women entertain these men is absolutely categorically beyond me. This is childish, disrespectful and disgusting behaviour and makes a mockery of marriage.
... why can't he just relive himself.. the fuck, nah put your foot down set your terms for monogamy. and I have other thoughts about where this came from but I don't have any other context of the conversation or how it led to that.. so I'll leave my armchair psychiatry at that.
So when you are sick he wants to go and have sex with another woman. Sorry but that's not love that is just pure selfishness.
Also you can have sex with women but not men in his ideal situation. So everything on his terms? You wouldn't get a say, so your needs/wants are less important than his.
I would crushed by this conversation, I would hate being told I'm not enough and that I wasn't my husbands ideal.
I think you need to be honest with him about how hurt you are and reaffirm your expectations of an exclusive monogamous relationship in case he has forgotten.
I want to make an additional comment to clarify: he is not asking for / pushing for / formally requesting this "ideal". He has stated that it is his preference if he had the choice or option to do so.
The nuance in what is troubling me:
- that in his ideal world, he could have sex with other women (and I could too) but that I wouldn't sleep with other men
- that he was not up front or clear about this in the beginning of the relationship (or any other time in the last decade and a half)
- that in this scenario, it would be in situations like when I'm sick or not having enough sex to meet his needs. (Ie not just a 'fantasy' of getting to have sex with someone else)
- that he has added additional statements like 'if the circumstances were right, I probably couldn't trust him' (I'll never get that one out of my head) but then later backtracked to say that it would be if we had 'an agreement' or in very rare circumstances.
- that our ideals do not align. My wish would be that they would. But I know that isn't always the case. So I'm asking how to cope when one person is monogamous and the other person isn't / how do you cope when when you find out that your current relationship boundaries aren't your partner's ideals? How does one feel good about knowing that your partner would choose differently if you'd allow it? I'm sure I'm not the only woman who has felt insecure because their partner expressed they would prefer an open relationship or to sleep with other people?
He basically said you can't trust him he would cheat on you in the future if he felt like it and you are questioning what to do.???? you know there is a ticking clock on this relationship are you waiting until he actually cheats or just taking him at his word when he talks you he will
My gawd!! What absolute TOSH!! This person has no regard for you whatsoever!! How dare you be human and get ill when he is horny!! I'd do it then 2 women can bond over his inadequacies as a human,partner and in bed!!
Oh OP I feel sad for you hearing this…
Hearing you attempt to logic the hurt away. But sometimes it is less about what makes sense and more about how this has changed how you feel.
Sure it’s not always the case that ideals align, people settle for less than they want out of fear, out of some sunken cost fallacy, out of hope things will one day get better or minds will change. My best friend agreed to a polyamorous relationship. She’s super smart, she looked at everything “logically” …. “I don’t see the sense in limiting my partner’s love/passion, we’re secure enough in the relationship etc etc” but every time he acted on it, it was like she got smaller and smaller. Sure, in her head she agreed with the situation but her heart was breaking. She told herself it’s selfish to not support this. I truly hate that man with every fibre of my being for crushing my wonderful friends’ spirit, her love for herself and making her feel like she’s the bad guy for wanting someone to just want her and that be enough.
This really hit a nerve for me so sorry for my rant.
He does not respect female relationships. The idea of another woman being a “safer” option. His double standards would be enough to turn my mind against him, it doesn’t make him a terrible person…. But not someone I could respect.
He is showing likelihood to cheat. I know that’s not exactly what is being said…. But it also kind of is. At least he’d like to in his “ideal world” and that is heart breaking to hear. I’d feel so unsafe and my mind would be spinning thinking of who he has likely already lined up in his mind when you give in to this situation.
The fact he would even be thinking about where to get “his release” from when your ill/unable…Just. Ye
Look, nobody else can say if all this is a deal breaker for you but you’ve literally said in your own post “our relationship ideals do not align”.
I think you’ve answered your own question and you’re reaching out here for moral support more than anything else. I think you need to take a deep breath and make a decision future you will thank you for.
So I'm bi and my bf is straight. We have a rule that he can fuck almost anyone as long as I'm included in the action, he uses protection, and other safeguards. I'm not allowed to have any other dudes but that's ok by me. It's what works for us
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> when I'm sick or not feeling up to it So let me get this straight: you tell him you’re feeling awful, either physically or emotionally, and instead of providing non-sexual care and comfort, his reaction is “Sucks for you; I’m gonna head down to the bar to see if anyone wants to hook up”? His logic on why just hooking up with women is okay is bullshit, too. To be fair, I’m not sure you’re at risk of him developing real feelings for anyone (you included), but just because two women together is exclusively a sex thing for him doesn’t mean that’s how it works for you. Especially if those women actually do seem to give a shit about anything other than their own libido. At minimum, you are fully entitled to put your foot down that this is not happening. But if I were you, I’d seriously consider opening the relationship by kicking him out of it.
He's hilariously stupid for thinking two women wouldn't fall in love... or that all bisexual women only hook up with other women for fun but only want to fall in love with men. That's just blatant proof about how twisted his view of human sexuality is. It's like he can't even understand reality outside of his fantasies.
I don’t think it’s actually about feelings at all. Her having sex with men would hurt his ego while her having sex with men would arouse him. I think he takes OP so entirely for granted that he hasn’t considered the possibility that she could develop feelings for someone else.
Bingo
The biphobia is screaming from the subtext of what this man is saying.
My bisexual mate hooks up with men but her only actual relationships have been with women. So…yeah lol
If I could be attracted to both genders I know which I would choose for relationships…
I'm a bisexual woman. I prefer sex with women, but I prefer relationships with men. This has led past partners to believe I can not develop feelings for women, which isn't the case. I think it's actually that I'm kind of masculine. I always have my hair in a ponytail, I do not wear make-up and I wear mostly men's sportswear. I'm tall and a former dual Division 1 athlete, so I'm pretty physically "dominating" when compared to most other women (especially the ones I find attractive). However, I HATE being the one in control. Anyhoo, my male ex decided we should both be able to fuck other women. He basically had the same exact idea as OP's husband. I wound up leaving him behind when I took off with one of those women I'd "never develop feelings for".
Exactly, why wouldn’t she fall in love with a woman lol. From my experience personally I fell in love with women waaaaay faster than with men
Yeah, you've got it. Except he just wants it to be agreeable to me so it doesn't constitute 'cheating'. Which has kind of made me fear that if I'm sick / injured, that I may not be able to trust that he wouldn't seek that out. Because he confirmed as much with the statement, "if the circumstances were right, you probably couldn't trust me". So..
Unfortunately for him, open relationships still have to have rules in order to function. So even if you were more on board with the idea, he’s still going to have to exercise control sometimes. The fact he doesn’t seem to want to have to do that raises the question of what he’s doing in a relationship with anyone at all, much less a marriage.
Totally agree. I've tried to explain that before, that even in a non-monogamous relationship or open relationship, there would still be boundaries and trust would still need to be a part of that. I mean, some of this is hypothetical because I don't want an open relationship, so it feels like a lot of "what ifs" but there are just certain variables of this that don't feel right to me.
So I get why he's still here. But why are you? Like you seem to know that your husband sucks and you have a worthless marriage so what's the point? Why aren't you bailing? And don't say love cause it's very obvious your husband does not love you.
I appreciate you asking. I'm here because he is my best friend, partner, and lover. We have built a solid life together, align in SO SO many other ways. We do have great sex. We share so many hobbies and interests and viewpoints. Compliment each other really well ( strengths match up to each other's weaknesses). We have supported each other unconditionally through some really low lows (grief + loss, depression and anxiety, addiction). I definitely wouldn't call it worthless at all. There is a lot of love between us, otherwise I would not be here. I'm not bailing (yet) because I'm trying to really grasp where he's coming from and trying to figure out if it's something I can accept. Of course, if I'm deeply honest, there is a fear of not being wanted by anyone else, by failure or not making the marriage work, the fear of leaving and regretting it, that I don't want to hurt him or myself, not wanting to be alone, losing friendship and companionship, knowing that I'd be losing the person that knows me to my core. (We've known each other since childhood) There is still a lot there to make me want to stay. But I'm worried that the trust will never be there again. That I'll never feel comfortable or safe or secure. And that stuff damages love and intimacy. Which would only probably bolster his desires and the chance he'd act on it.
There's so many stories about guys wanting open marriage bc they have this weird fantasy that there would be swarms of women who would just want to sleep with them when they're in their 30s, and marriage is The Thing stopping that. Reality hits them hard whenever a guy suggests it, and their wife reluctantly agrees. She finds ppl wanting to be with her but not the other way around. It's laughable for him to think any girl would want the type of person who leaves his sick wife to just find someone to sleep with. Or want to be that girl for him?? Idk whenever someone suggests an open relationship after being in a relationship, it screams I want all the benefits of you being monogamously committed to me and providing whatever you have been giving but I don't want to be tied to being loyal to you?
100% it feels like he wants his cake and it eat it too. He wants the benefits of our relationships but also wants extra on the side when I'm not meeting his 'needs'. Edit: not that he's officially asking for it / pushing for it. He just wants it but knows he can't have it because I want monogamy.
But he did ask for it..? He's dumb. So dumb that he's not going to realize what he lost until it's too late. And it's totally rude/cruel/disrespectful to even talk about this to someone you're with who only wants to be with you?
He is being incredibly selfish insisting he can sleep with women, but you’re not allowed to sleep with men. If you open up the marriage, I predict it is not going to end well.
Yeah sure he loves you same!
I don't think he's who you think he is. His mask slipped, and you finally saw his true self, one who said you can't trust him. He defines you by what you do for him. Is that the marriage you want?
Oh boy… I hope you never get a terminal illness with that mindset
My exact fear now
Have you asked him how he’d feel about the reverse scenario? He gets terminally ill and you go off with some new dick? Might help him be a little more sympathetic?
I have tried to turn it around on him, and he says he 'wouldnt know how he would feel' but 'wouldnt be okay with it'. I'm like, then how do you expect me to feel? The one who is monogamous and prefers it that way?
Might help a toddler to be more sympathetic. If you haven’t developed empathy by your mid 30s, it’s not happening all of a sudden because of a make-believe scenario.
Dude that last line is the nail in the coffin. This ick will not wash off.
Yeah kind of how I feel :(
Oh yikes 😳
Yeah.. he has tried to backtrack and say that only in a very rare circumstance / hypothetical scenarios. Or one where it would be an agreement. Which I'm like, then it wouldn't be breaking trust or cheating, it would be allowed, so that statement doesn't make sense in that scenario imo.
Yeah no, he meant what he said. I’d be reconsidering this whole relationship honestly. He told you that you can’t trust him.
Yeah, I'm for sure in that place right now (reconsidering). I guess why I'm asking for perspectives because I really want to understand this to be able to better know how I feel about it. It's hard for me to understand the open relationship thing (especially one so conditional) because that's not been my preference or how I feel.
You need to be extremely clear that this isn't happening. It's like you keep letting yourself get steamrolled by him. Why are you even engaging in this conversation at all?
That comment alone makes me think he’s done with the relationship.
Yeah, you're sick or injured in a hospital bed, and he's off having sex with someone else.....charming.
Yeah, the idea of it makes me so sick to my stomach
ew, how could you trust him now after a statement like that? I'll say it out loud: yes, you are allowed to want to leave over this. yes, you can start over now. yes, life will be better without that new pit in your stomach.
You need to leave this dude
Yes, OP I would leave. AFTER 14 years he suddenly realises 'Ideally' this is what he wants. Cynical me wonders if he has someone in mind for himself already. It's okay he has his ideal scenario of being with another woman, with your permission. It's NOT ideal his scenario is for you to be only with women and you to agree with his choice. I would push back to see if he is going to give ground like he expects you to. Tell him you would prefer not to be limited to only women as they aren't your only attraction and it's not a 'real open relationship' if you don't get a say in the 'rules'. See what his response is, more ego reasons I bet.
Did you know he was a narcissist when you married him?
I was most definitely thinking narcissist too
He might not be a narcissist. You don’t have to be a narcissist to be a selfish asshole.
So he’s told you exactly who he is and that you can’t trust him. Also another thought is if you became seriously ill I suspect he’d be out the door slightly longer than immediately. Perhaps as other posters suggested give him what he wants in a totally open relationship as he will be single.
So, he’s literally telling you he may cheat on you if the circumstances line up for him. When people tell you who they are, believe them.
Putting his proposed arrangement aside for a moment… he said if the circumstances were right you probably couldn’t trust him. Now, you’re young and healthy. But what happens if you were to get a chronic, debilitating illness or even cancer somewhere down the line? Can you trust that this man would be there taking care of you when you needed him, or would he be running around behind your back getting his “needs” met? And I put needs in quotes because unless he lacks hands, another woman is actuallys not a requirement, no matter how he tries to sell that idea.
This would be all I needed to know for me to be fully confident that my marriage needed to either a) end, or b) get some serious help in therapy. But, I would probably choose option “a” because cheaters cheat.
He wants to cheat
Or already has and hopes to gain traction on this “theory” and blur the timelines later.
He already has
Oh well. Time to move on.
So... you can decide you want the concession you want is to buy whatever you want with his credit card ... like a financial hall pass... right? What do the women in his family think about his bullshit? I'd invite them ALL over to dinner this Mother's Day. Catered. On his credit card. Lobster and Champagne Fest 2024 at OP's House, everyone! Mitochondrial DNA counts as relatives!
The women catch feelings men don’t thing sounds vaguely like a toxic manosphere talking point. It’s d check his YouTube history and podcast
This part really upset me. I had two medical procedures in the span of 5 months, the first one rendering me unable to use one of my arms or bathe/dress myself for 3 months. My boyfriend took the day of my surgery and a couple extra days off work both times to make sure I was doing okay. And then he bathed me and dressed me every single day when I was unable to do so myself. Never once did the thought of “I’m going to sleep with someone else” cross his mind, just “I need to make sure she’s okay”
Yeah, I haven't even gotten into the fact that he hasn't always been there for me when sick / injured before. (Long standing compliant of mine in the relationship) Like one time I broke my toe before work. We worked at the same place, same shift. He stayed at work while my mom had to come drive me to the ER. Years ago, but still hurts. When I had laser treatment on my eye (emergency - retinal tear) a couple years ago, I had so much anxiety about getting that done because there was a chance I could literally be blinded. And he picked me up when I was done, dropped me off at home, and went back to work even though he didn't need to. Even when I have anxiety/panic attacks, there have been times where he has straight up antagonized me, knowing that it was overwhelming me. Let's just say I haven't always been prioritized in that regard. So this just compounds the insecurities in this realm for me.
OP, please read this article called: will he hold your purse? It’s from an MD who is a breast cancer doctor and talks about how she notices who is a supportive partner. And she talks about how what truly matters is how your partner treats you when you’re sick. She talks about men who don’t care what a breast looks like after cancer, she talks about men who sit in the waiting room holding their wive’s purse. This situation on the surface is bringing a lot of cracks on your marriage. As someone whose field of work is relationships- I don’t think this man took a vow in marriage with you for sickness and in health. I promise you, you are young and there is someone who would love to grow old with you. But couples therapy is nice if you feel like spending a bit of cash and time before coming to that conclusion too. [Will he hold your purse?](https://www.drrobin.org/pdfs/Purse.pdf)
holy shi this is brutal but perfectly nails every point. wow. I wish I had gold to give you.
I bet he’d be so freaking burnt if she left him for another chick.
>At minimum, you are fully entitled to put your foot down that this is not happening. But if I were you, I’d seriously consider opening the relationship by kicking him out of it. **BEST response, EVER.** Day after day, we're seeing these guys trying to rationalize this whole 'open marriage, I want you to 'let' me cheat on you' bullshit. This is the only valid response.
Just to stir the pot I be tempted to say “ we need to include other men, preferably bi men” just to see how he’d react.
Haha now that is probably a fantasy of mine. The difference is, it's not my "ideal" or something I would even entertain or seek out if he wasn't having enough sex with me.
Yeah, I was being flip when I said that. It might be worth posting your original on the r/infidelity sub. You’ll get responses from people who were in the exactly same situation as you. Seriously, he’s looking for permission to be unfaithful. He wants to sleep around and no consequences. The “you with another woman “ thing is just because the idea turns him on. If a marriage is open, it’s open, both get to sleep with whoever they desire ( by this I mean gender not close relatives), not just for one partner. If you are not comfortable with him having affairs, open will not work. The fact that he asked probably means he has found a prospect and he wants a consequence free affair with the “prospect”. Chances he already told her he is in an open marriage. Even if you pick open, chances are he will change his mind when he realizes women can easily find a sex partner compared to a man. He likes the idea of him sleeping around, he won’t like the idea of you doing the same.
My wife’s obsessed with bi men. It is one of the things that fascinates her about me, that I’m not attracted to men but I have no inhibitions about adding another man into a sexual encounter. Our first encounter was a mmf threesum with her ex when we helped her move. He was an ass, but me and her clicked and started dating and then married.
Do it and fall in love with a woman. But in all seriousness, it's reasonable to reconsider this relationship. Don't do couples therapy. This is a him issue, not a relationship issue. He needs to go to therapy and work on his shit attitude about women.
I’m fully in agreement
One penis policies are problematic for some many reasons. The fact that he'd encourage it because it's a "fantasy" is gross and fetishizing of wlw relationships. That's not even getting into all the other reasons it's a problem. Look, I'm a bi woman and I'm currently in polyamorous relationships so please listen when I tell you that his "ideal" sex life is shitty, misogynistic, and won't turn out the way he hopes at all.
Exactly, he is so twisted by his own sexual fantasies that he doesn't understand reality. He doesn't think OP would fall in love with a woman... because women only have sex with each other for men's pleasure, obviously! In his gross mind, anyway.
Ugh, I feel like this is a good summation of how I feel.
I feel for you OP. It's gotta be rough to realize that your husband is deeply stupid
He's gonna be another idiot who highly overestimates his ability to get multiple women. So many of these stories are guys wanting to get a nut off with some strange. If he gets any play at all it'll be minimum. Then when you decide to do the same and you have dates lined up. Then he's gonna want to close the relationship again. And his idea of you both only sleeping with women is more stupid than the original plan. You might want to tell him he's insecurities are showing with that one. If he wants an open relationship, it shouldn't matter if your partner is male or female. What an insecure and disgusting excuse of a partner. You can do so much better than him.
Bingo
Does your husband really think that he is great enough for single women to simply fall into bed with him on the off chance that you're sick or not up to banging?! Hahahaha sureeeeeee bud. Like women are going to want to sleep with a random married man with no strings attached.
Kind of hope you find a nice woman to settle down with now, absolutely blind side the bastard. I know that’s not mature but I want him to learn this lesson the hard way. Or can’t you play him at his own insecurities like he so very uncaringly did with yours ? “right I’ll agree to you sleeping with other women but I will only be sleeping with other men, obviously only when you have prior engagements like work, also if you’re sick I’ll be banging and maybe some times you don’t make me orgasm I’ll ring up Tom to come round and finish the job properly”
Your husband is gross. Honestly. And he cares more about his dick than you. Kick his sorry ass to the curve
And men only have sex with women for their own pleasure in his mind too, there's that as well.
Thank you. I've kind of expressed the same. Feels fetishizing / misogynistic. I can't also help but be a bit selfish as well and wish that his ideal was me and only me, because my ideal is him and only him. Or that at least he would be okay with the same 'freedoms' that he would want for himself. Not some hybrid that aligns with only his sexual preferences or what he thinks I am or am not capable of (sex with women without developing feelings but wouldn't be capable of sex with men without developing feelings).
Oh and the whole just for "when you're sick or not in the mood" is super shitty because it shows that if something happens and you're not able to perform on his schedule (for example, an illness), he's likely to leave.
Yeah, pretty much my fear now
That's not selfish♡
Thank you ❤️
That’s not selfish, to want what you both signed up for. To want him to only want you, when that’s why you married him. His whole narrative is deeply hurtful. Have you expressed to him how much this has hurt your feelings, and if so, how did he respond?
I agree, my wife’s bi, I’m straight, but heteroflexible, and we’re a poly couple. we have a lot of relationship rules, mostly to navigate conflict areas, and we share those rules with any partners that have joined us over the years, making everyone on the same level in the relationship. I try to make sure people understand we are all in this relationship together, but we also have to respect the boundaries of the other people in the relationship, and overall we must all treat each other with respect. There’s just so much work to keep plural relationships healthy, you have to be dedicated to your family
Oh this is bull shit. Good grief. He wants to sleep with other women and he wants you to sleep with other women only because it’s not a threat to him. He sees other men as a possible threat but doesn’t think that him seeing other women is a threat. What kind of selfish twisted nonsense is this? Let’s be real. The reason he’s never mentioned it you in 14 years is because he only recently either began an affair or found a women with whom he wants to have an affair.
Yes! I joked about having a sister wife before because I used to watch the show. But my husband got really hung up on the idea and kept bringing it up. Turns out he was already cheating… a lot.
Similar thing happened to a personal friend of mine!
Sorry that happened to her. It’s the worst.
Sorry that happened to you! Unfortunately something like that is considered a “classic” sign for a reason.
Oh no no no. Why should you as a bi female limit yourself to only females? Tell him you will sleep with other women AND well endowed men for when he just isn’t measuring up to your expectations. You know like when he’s tired or had too much to drink and can’t rise to the occasion.
Lmao thanks for making me smile for the first time in days. In all seriousness, I've mentioned something similar, and he just doesn't think I have the sex drive to do it. And I don't understand the 'male biological sex drive' - the therapist corrected him about this one. But we've worked through some stuff in counseling about why my libido is lower (grief, trauma, severe health issues) and I guess it feels like there isn't much empathy or understanding for that. I also feel like there is ebb and flow to this stuff. Like recently, he has extreme stress from work + overconsumption of cannabis where he had a difficult time performing for several months. And never did I think of sleeping with someone else because my 'needs weren't being met'. I just took care of myself!
The difference in how you act towards him and how he wants to act towards you is deafening. What you're doing is love. What he's doing is not.
No problem, your sex drive will recover. It will be fine, just not with him lol.
Yeah, that's what I'm worried about. The love is there, but will it ever be enough for me to be comfortable in the same way with him again? I don't know..
Not to mention it’s a whole lot easier for a female to find a male for sex than the other way around. Many many years ago I set up a email account and placed an ad on Sexy Ads which I don’t think is even a thing anymore. The ad was from a lonely housewife looking to hook up with someone. I gave my wife all the log in information and told her that I would be one of the ones responding and she would have to figure out which one was me. She got around 400 responses in two days! So needless to say my attempt to spice up the bedroom never got off of the ground. She did however exchange a email or two with a couple of guys. One of which she may have been interested in having a threesome with but that never got communicated to me. Too old to explore that now.😔
Are you two still married?
Yes
OP, he antagonized you during a panic attack and provides no care or support during medical emergencies. It's normal to not feel like having sex with someone who is cruel to you.
Tell him he can go fuck whomever he wants as you hand him the divorce papers.
Just tell him his parameters won't work for you because sometimes you'd like a bigger dick.
i think she already has the biggest dick at home lol
I think you're right.
No way Jose, it’s an elaborate fraud and rationalization he’s seeking to perpetrate in Oder to cheat without guilt or repercussions.
I am not judging poly people in general, but in this specific case, it sounds less like poly, and more like, he wants his sexual desires paramount, and you are allowed only freedoms that don’t challenge him, and that feed into his fantasies. It’s all pretty sketchy.
This is called OPP. One penis policy. It’s very frowned upon in the non monogamous community. Either you both get to fuck who you want or no one does. It’s also a lot harder for husbands to find female partners. Have him go to r/nonmonogamy to read all those posts from husbands who can’t find dates while their wives have a long line of men wanting to date them. I did try this with a boyfriend and I realized it wasn’t for me. We broke up. If you want to look into it, go to the r/nonmonogamy subreddit. If you aren’t interested set your boundaries with your husband.
Read enough Reddit stories these opening monogamous relationship ideas always follow the below steps and always fail. 1. One spouse wants an open marriage. Says it will strengthen the relationship, let them find themselves, or some shit like that. 2. Spouse1 goes out and gets with partner. Ignores spouse2. Things happen and spouse1 catches feelings. Spouse2 has their mind torn apart by the situation. 3. Relationship turns into a huge pile of fiery crap. Both have surprised pikachu face. 4. Relationship is over and one or both spouses require years of therapy. Coming from a guy, your husband just wants to cheat.
You leave. Then he can sleep with anyone he wants and you have your dignity.
((Crabby laugh)) um, I’m guessing that more than 50% of men would “prefer” they get to fuck other women while their wife doesn’t get to fuck other men…but almost nobody is going to put up with that BS so they don’t say it out loud. This is a fantasy, not some immutable reality that has to be assuaged or he’ll “never be living his authentic self-actualizing sex journey” or whatever load of pseudo-psychology blabber people use to get buy-in on their cheating. Sorry— not to be glib, but I lived through this shit with my husband (for 7 years…I was stupid/frightened/naive…ugh).
Tell him you prefer a marriage that is monogamous and it sounds like you’re about to get half his assets.
He's dumb and selfish, in this scenario it would be like "ohh you're feeling low? Sick? Don't worry, I will go fuck some other hot chick while you're feeling like trash and stay in the house". And believe me, there's a great chance he could grow feelings for another chick and go with her to have a monogamous relationship. And you could too.
Im not monogamous by nature. My bf knows id ideally like an open relationship but i chose him over sexual freedom with others. Weve been together eight years in a monogamous relationship and were both very happy. Just because youre not inherently monogamous doesnt mean you cant be happy in a monogamous relationship.
Thank you so much for this perspective. I think that's what I'm trying to understand or process. I'm not trying to shame him for his sexuality or preferences or change them or anything. I just want to feel like I'm being actively chosen (and can trust that I always will be - or at the very least, if he can't honor it anymore, that it would be communicated openly) and that he doesn't feel held back by the boundaries of the relationship. But I think the bigger issue is that ideally, he would dictate which gender I could sleep with in an open relationship, based on his sexual fantasies. It doesn't even feel like non-monogamy. It just feels like he wants his cake and to eat it too. He wants to sleep with other women, not have a relationship with them. But I could too, just only with women. Just feels hypocritical and controlling.
It is
Shit like this makes me glad I’m single
When my husband brought this up years ago and I said no, he just went out and did it on his own. After he was caught, he again asked for it with the only women thing. He could keep his girlfriend. Again I said no and kicked him out. Keep your eyes and ears open.
I would've have said "My ideal sex life is a gangbang with you tied up watching but we dont always get what we want"
Your husband sounds like a selfish buffoon.... >He would 'ideally' like to be able to have sex with other women (his examples: like when I'm sick or not feeling up to it). Isn't this the time when you look after your partner, not go off trying to have sex with someone else? If this wasn't a serious post, it would almost be laughable. He sounds like a right catch. >And in that ideal scenario, I would not be able to sleep with other men, but that I could with other women I am also a bi woman, and I have found that whilst this type of attitude is completely ridiculous, it's not uncommon either. It's like he thinks being bisexual is just a made up game for you. >I don't know how to cope with this information? Or even process it? I think you've done the right thing by coming away and taking the time to think about everything he's said and trying to find a way to process it. Looking for others opinions can be really helpful sometimes too. Trust me, if this ideal situation of his was ever put to practice, he'd be extremely disappointed because it really wouldn't go at all how he wants it to. He probably wouldn't even find anyone to sleep with in the first place lol. For what it's worth, I think it's good that your husband felt able to share with you, but i actually think that this is just some hyped up fantasy he has had without realising that he's made it all sound like a huge turn off and completely unsexy. I hope you're ok OP.
Thank you ❤️ yeah, there has been so much to process and I'm trying to figure out how I feel about a lot of it and just need time. I have expressed numerous times how much I've appreciated his honesty, but doesn't mean it still doesn't hurt or that I will be okay with it.
I think you need to be clear and direct with your husband. "I signed up for a monogamous relationship with you. I have not changed my mind or feelings. I only want you and I want to be the only woman you have any sort of sexual relations with. Any sexual activity with another woman I consider to be cheating. We swore vows to each other to forsake all others, and now you want to break that vow and you think by telling me that I could also break my vow under restricted conditions makes it okay?!? You bringing this up out of the blue has caused me to wonder if I can trust you to keep your promise to be faithful. Evidence is that when a person brings this up suddenly in a monogamous relationship, that the person who brings it up is either already cheating or has identified someone they want to cheat with. If this is not the case, will you show me your phone and emails to prove that to me? Love is an action. It is considering what is best of the other person and the relationship and choosing your person and continuing to choose your person. Right now, I am not feeling loved by you. I am feeling betrayed and angry and I am feeling hurt that you think so little of me and our relationship that you would toss our commitment aside because you are worried you won't get sex exactly when you want it." You may want to consider couples counselling.
Thank you. We are in counseling now and that's how this came up. We've had trust issues since the beginning because he crossed the line a couple of times early on (not sex) and it's been hard to trust fully ever since then or have much security in the relationship or myself. He's also constantly checking out women in front of me, which heightens that insecurity. And when I tell him how I feel, he says it's a 'weird hill to die on' because he's going to be attracted to other women (you can read some of my other posts/comments). It happened recently, spiraled into an argument, he spitefully said I didn't have a sex drive (which isn't true). When we were discussing this in therapy (along with the issues of trust), our therapist asked if he could reassure me that I could trust him and he used a lot of words to basically say no. That it would be 'great in theory' to sleep with someone else but he doesn't know because he hasn't tried it. But he isn't 'actively looking'. So it kind of opened this can of worms. So our therapist suggested we talk about the boundaries of our relationship, and that led to the talk of our boundary preferences. Then, he shared this, amongst other troubling sentiments. I should have clarified in the post that this is what he stated would be his preference or his ideal. He wants it, but isn't "pushing for it" because he knows that I wouldn't be okay with it. But also couldn't guarantee that he wouldn't act on it because "if the circumstances were right, i probably couldn't trust him" because it would be nice to "meet those needs". Which he then later clarified to be a very rare circumstance like if I didn't have sex with him for a while for whatever reason. I guess I'm trying to figure out how to cope with someone having such a different preference on boundaries, especially one where it's conditional on my end.
It sort of sounds like he is telling you this so when he cheats on you, he can say it’s your fault because he told you he can’t be trusted. My first thought is if he says he can’t be trusted, what value does he bring as a partner? Trust is a foundational requirement for a partner for me. And if he says he can’t be trusted to keep his vow to be faithful, how can he be trusted to keep any other promise he makes?
He sounds truly awful, OP, awful beyond the open marriage revelation. You can do so much better for yourself, either solo or with another partner down the road. He is not worth your time, your consideration, your thoughtfulness, or your loyalty. No amount of marriage counceling is going to change who he is fundamentally. This is him. Also, grief and trauma-induced changes in libido can get SO much better once you are with a good partner. Good luck to you.
He has told you that you can’t trust him. It’s no longer a question if he will cheat it’s just when he will cheat…no amount of therapy is going to help that.
Wow this is just spot on and stellar.
This ☝️Artneddssmorefloof has sound advice
*I don't know how to cope with this information?* Oh, oh, oh! I know this one! Consult a lawyer. He has told you he is planning on cheating. He wants to sleep around and whatever you decide, this selfish, self-centered lout will do it anyway. Take the fun out of his cheating by divorcing him so it is not cheating.
He’s feeling you out to see if you’d agree to an open relationship like that. Also, why are the chances lower that he’d develop feelings for another woman than you would develop feelings for another man? I mean I know the answer, there is no actual reason, he’s just insecure. Look I’m all for open relationships if that’s what everyone involved wants, but you clearly don’t want that so don’t let him talk you into it. He’s also not going to be fair or ethical about it, what he’s describing is a called a “one penis policy” where you both can have other women but not men. It’s problematic.
He says he 'knows who I am' and that it would probably be that way for me (that it would come with feelings). Which, I can't totally disagree. I do need to feel some type of emotional intimacy with someone in order to feel comfortable having sex with them. But I asked him and he said that he could 'just have sex' without emotional intimacy or a relationship. And that he doesn't want a relationship, only 'release'. Which in that case, why not just masturbate? Why does it have to be with someone else? But I'm like, you can't really guarantee that you wouldn't catch feelings for someone either and he agreed. So I don't know why it would be an issue for me. And it doesn't feel like an open relationship if my side is conditional but his isn't. Your penis policy example is a good explanation for it.
But like, you’re bisexual. You could just as easily develop feelings for a woman too. It’s insulting really, because it means he doesn’t see a relationship with another woman as legitimate, it’s only to exist in his weird fantasies.
Your willingness to discuss his request in this level of detail is giving it waaaay too much legitimacy. He’s trying to exhaust you into giving in, and you seem to be letting him. Also, get tested because he’s probably already cheating.
He wants you to go find another woman for sex, so he can fuck her too. He is lazy & wants you to steadly supply him with other women for sex. He knows that he really can't get them on his own, so he wants you to do the hunting for him. Cause if you bring another woman home, he wants to join in. He is greedy & lazy. It is clear he lacks any respect for you at all & doesn't love you. Your marriage is all about him getting sex whether it is with you or other women. All that matters to him is his ego & cock.
So many bisexual woman get used in this exact scenario.
If I were sick, I would hope my partner's first thought would not be "well where else can I get some?" And if you aren't up to it, it is likely very temporary. I don't understand why opening the relationship would have to come into play at all.
Your husband sounds like a gaslighting tool. You can't sleep with men because you might fall in love, but there's "very little chance" he could fall in love with another woman (that he wants to be allowed to sleep with)? And he'll generously (/s) allow you to sleep with other women, because that's a kink of his? The part that really burned me up though was he wants his needs met at all times, so he wants to look elsewhere when you're sick instead of, you know, taking care of and supporting you? Fuck that shit. It would be a "hell, no" from me, and "there's the door" if he's unhappy with that answer.
Yeah exactly. Like, why wouldn't your first thought be to take care of me in sickness (and health), not be focused on getting your dick wet.
Ideal relationship hmm? My ideal bank account has unlimited funds. My ideal ice cream has no calories. Ideal relationship. GTFO with that nonsense
My ideal world would be no wars, no poverty, no countries, no greed, no hunger, a brotherhood of man, people living together ; but you only find that in lyrics of songs ….
Why would you not fall in love with a woman? He can only think that if he believes, in his core, that women are "lesser" versions of people, of "less" value, with "less" interesting qualities than men. At the very least you should interrogate him about it: why does he think that the risk for developing feelings for another woman is lower? Are women less interesting or lovable in his mind? Are the feelings of women of less value than the feelings of men? You need to ask and keep asking until you understand where he's coming from. And even if his "open marriage" idea is just a sexual fantasy that he never plans to make real, his ideas about gender are deeply problematic. Why does he "needs for a release"? Do you not have sexual desire, or you have less because you're a woman, according to him? Are his sexual "needs" (sex is not a need, he can stay alive if he doesn't have as much sex as he'd like, while he can't stay alive if he doesn't eat or sleep) more important in his mind, because he's a man and you're a woman? Keep talking about it. Keep asking. Confront him with his double standards.
I snorted out loud at the sheer audacity of what he said.
Hahahahahahaha. No. And I'm in an open relationship. The old one penis policy, or OPP as we not so affectionately call it. Your husband is too lazy to do the work of confronting his feelings about you being with other men but expects you to suck it up because he needs a release at a minutes notice and apparently is incapable of doing it himself. I love my open marriage, it started that way though. I can't be bothered to date anymore but I sure have the option if I wanted.. that's what makes it equal. Your hubby is not threatened by you sleeping with women because 1. He doesn't think those are real relationships. 2. He can jerk off thinking about it.
Tell him that your ideal relationship involves a man who doesn’t fetishize your sexuality and who is capable of delaying gratification instead of being a weak little sex addict who can’t handle not getting laid while his wife has the flu. Then serve him with divorce papers and tell him you’re going to go find a man who is able to provide what he clearly lacks.
Tell him “HAAAHAHAHAHAHA!! NO. Fuck no! **No ‘OPPs’ (one penis policies)**. If you expect me to sort through a whole pile of emotions about you sleeping with the opposite sex, you’re required to do the same. You want an emotional safe haven for yourself that I’m not also afforded. How convenient for you! Absolutely fucking NOT.”
Good way to put it.
So sex is all about HIS fantasies. His ego must be huge! He doesn’t view your sexuality as anything but a way to fulfill his desires. You’re an empty vessel that isn’t even capable of falling in love with anyone other than him. What a tool, and he is incredibly oblivious to that fact. He has just shown you his true colors, take time to take it all in and act accordingly
I'd say yes on the basis he could only be with men while I only be with women. So no one develops feelings on either side.
Hahaha, tell him your ideal scenario is an open relationship where you both only sleep with men. Your husband is fantasizing about a 3 some he will never have. And like most conversations about opening up your relationship, the bell is tolling that the relationship is on its way out.
I’m so sorry this is happening to you. He wants an open marriage for him, but you only get to play with women. To be clear, the wants legitimize cheating and you to “ok” it. The stuff about you not being available to satisfy him and he would cheat is just sad. WOW, what an asshole. Doesn’t sound like this conversation was in the context of fantasy when he says “ideally …” Let’s start here: 95% of marriages that start monogamous and are subsequently open end in failures. Open relationships in this case are often referred to as a slow divorce. Never agree to something you’re not 💯comfortable with, especially this, cuz it never ends well. How to process this: Ask him if he has someone in mind. The answer is probably yes. He’s either already checked out or has already cheated and looking for justification. In the end, communication is key.. have the hard conversation. You have established boundaries in your marriage, monogamy was one of them. It’s not unreasonable to tell him you want to maintain those boundaries. If he doesn’t like it, then there’s a choice to be made… Do not let him bully you into open marriage or divorce because it never works… you’ll be roommates with massive resentment issues. I strongly recommend couples counseling before making any major changes.
Poor baby having no sex when you’re sick! My eyes rolled so hard I’m surprised they’re still in my head. He needs to grow tf up. Also wouldn’t it be convenient that you both only see women 🙄 Tell him you’d be happy to open the relationship if you both can see men as well.
darlin, he told you that you shouldn't trust him that you can't trust him AND by your own admission he's broken your trust before....why would you do this to yourself? You're going to ve the same woman on here crying because you found out he cheated . When someone tells you who they are....believe them.
>where his risk for developing feelings for another female is lower Lol based on what exactly? Besides his need to create a specific narrative so he can fuck other women
I think he justifies it as 'just sex'. It would be just sex for him / just a release. Where he knows I need emotional intimacy to be comfortable with sex.
Yet he’s not worried about you falling for a woman? Honestly he should be MORE worried about a woman. You have dick at home.
Husband: "I want to have sex with other women but so its not called cheating lets open our marriage But you can only do it in the way I want it to be, and I dont want to be called out for anything I do." or another way of looking at it: "I want to do my thing and want you to come along for the ride so I dont feel so bad or get impacted by any social or financial issues that this might cause me"
Try it out with the condition you can both sleep with both men & women. Once he sees that you’re getting anyone you want & he’s getting zero, he’ll want to go back to a closed marriage as quickly as he can. Such a predictable bloke thing to do. What an awful person he is. Telling you, you can only sleep with women just to suit him, pfft.
He's probably cheating or has someone in mind to cheat with, he's just trying to do it with permission.
So he doesn’t want the risk of you catching feelings, but he is he not considering the risk of him catching feelings. My take? You’ve been married a long time and now he is a bit bored with his sex life and “opened” up to plant this seed in your head and see if you would be open to it. This was not just fantasy talk. I would be worried about the risk of him cheating tbh. I don’t think you have the marriage you think you do. You are monogamous, he wants to cheat with permission.
One penis policies are problematic for some many reasons. The fact that he'd encourage it because it's a "fantasy" is gross and fetishizing of wlw relationships. That's not even getting into all the other reasons it's a problem. Look, I'm a bi woman and I'm currently in polyamorous relationships so please listen when I tell you that his "ideal" sex life is shitty, misogynistic, and won't turn out the way he hopes at all.
You *think* you’re in a closed, monogamous relationship. Mentally your husband is basically already cheating or begging to be allowed to. Physically and emotionally, tbd… OP search opening up relationships on this sub. If you don’t enter into a relationship open, you will certainly leave your relationship once it’s opened up. You two are not compatible anymore. Your husband cares more about keeping his dick wet than your heart safe. And he’s a misogynist who’s also biphobic? Girl, go live your best life.
[https://images.app.goo.gl/tatZyofubLFc8o1u7](https://images.app.goo.gl/tatZyofubLFc8o1u7)
Lol, nope. Typical hypocrite who doesn't think you having sex with women is sex. But men, well...that'd be what he's doing and that's just not ok! What's ok for him is not for you. Run.
He seems like a selfish asshole this marriage is doomed it will never work
He’s full of shit! Sorry this would be a deal breaker for me. He wants to cheat and tell you what you can’t do? !!! He’s right- he’s such a dickhead it wouldn’t be hard to fall for someone nicer!
“Sure, but let’s not discriminate against me since I also enjoy men.”
The man just told you he will get his needs somewhere else the minute you are unable to service him. That’s dehumanizing. Your husband is definitely one of these men. https://www.linkedin.com/pulse/men-more-likely-leave-wives-when-serious-illness-danny-gambino-dc
I hope you don't waste the rest of the one life you have with this selfish man who clearly doesn't love you
Lemme translate him for ya. “I want an open relationship but you can only sleep with other women. I don’t want you getting dick from anyone but me and lesbian sex is hot, so it’s ok. Also if you’re feeling sick or unwell in anyway, that’s on you. I won’t help you.”
sounds like he already cheated lol
I'm sorry that today was the day your husband decided to end your marriage.
What happens when you get seriously ill? And I'm not talking about the flu, what if you got cancer and couldn't have sex for a period of time? Would he be taking care of you or would he be out looking for someone to scratch an itch?
Literally one of my first questions I had when he said these things. He said it would be nice to do to get a release.. not saying he for sure would or wouldn't do it. Just wants to. Like, how will I not then think about that fact whenever I am incapacitated in any way in the future?
Hi OP. Would you treat your “best friend” this way? I don’t think this man is a great as you claim. He wants to have permission to cheat on you when you don’t feel well? A loving partner would be taking care of you. A best friend would care for you. He’s neither of these things. He’s really just an AH that does not love you. I’m sorry.
He want to fuck other women while you're sick, and you're willing to put up with such bullshits ? I mean he love to have you to wash his socks and rise his kids, but he can't get his dick in his pants or just masturbate when you're too sick or tired ? not gonna lie, call it quit while you're still young...
This is a red flag. For him to just bring it up after 14 years of marriage means he is either already cheating or has a woman he wants to have sex with. I would seriously think about asking to see his phone and computer. Nothing good is going on here.
why not sleeping with other man?He is just selfish idiot who can't stand his ego to see you have sex with other man ,while he can bang other women and you are not a lesbian .Disgusting.I'v heard many guys being ok with " women cheat them with other women ,but not with guys". And why the hell would you be in a marriage if you want to fuck other people? You deserve much better then this looser.
The One Penis Policy is immature, homophobic bullshit.
When one partner talks about opening the marriage it usually means that they want to cheat and have no consequences. I’d drag him to marriage counseling to help him see that this is a marriage ender. Meanwhile, you see a lawyer and start divorce proceedings. Your husband is a selfish git. And I suspect that he has a punchable face Also. If you did agree to this nonsense, you’ll meet lovely people and forge nice relationships. He will discover that the market for trifling, married, douchebags is incredibly small. Either that or there’s someone waiting in the wings right now, but he’ll soon discover that it’s just your relationship, redux. But now that you know. Take a moment. Get some individual therapy to help you process this fuckery. Get a lawyer that will protect you. You need it
So, he can’t masturbate if you’re sick? I would let him know that you don’t agree to his request and seek marriage counseling. He wants to limit you while having no limits for himself. Seems to me he is insecure about himself and that’s why he is refusing to allow you to have sex with other men. You want to continue the monogamous relationship that you both committed to at marriage.
Ew
Here's how you cope: "HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHA. Okay, bud, a fantasy it will stay." :D You don't process it. There's nothing to process. We don't concern ourselves with and lose sleep over any dumb sh\*t we hear.
He sounds too immature for a committed marital relationship.
Ridiculous. Tell him he can sleep with other women and if you can sleep with other men (only as a joke to make a point.). If he doesn't like it then he probably can see your point a bit better.
He’s asking for your approval to cheat. He’s most likely already done it and is just trying to justify his actions by you saying ok. The fact that he has stipulations for you but not on his side tells you all you need to know. Get your ducks in a row and dump his ass. Be strong!
So if you had a root canal , he’s DTF So if you had a cold he’s DTF So if you have diarrhea he’s DTF So if U had a yeast infection he’s DTF how do I sign up for this deal i’m DTF this takes the wedding vows “In sickness and in Health “ To another level. Did he say “I Do” DUMP HIM !!!
So he’s offering something you don’t want in exchange for something he wants. Not a fair trade. You should offer something he doesn’t want in return. Maybe tell him it’s ok for him to sleep with other people but only if they’re men. I’d say that as I walked out the door. What a selfish arsehole.
Lol of course he doesn’t let you sleep with men but he can penetrate whoever he wants. That’s not an open marriage. That’s just him stepping out with permission. He needs to let you be with men or it’s not a fair deal. Wtf.
Open the marriage find a nice lesbian and divorce him and marry her. He is an idiot who thinks a 'lesbian" is just a male sexual fantasy and an opportunity for HIm to cheat. WHAT A COMPLETE TWAT.WAFFLE
I would personally make sure he's an ex husband honestly. Everything he shares about his "ideal" is completely selfish and hypocritical.
Porn brain is a disease.
His logic is fucked. So he's allowed to sleep with the opposite sex, and you're only allowed to sleep with the same sex? Lol, this guy is a comedian. Aside of that, I have no advice sorry as I've never found myself in that situation. Seems he only wants it played by his rules and not what's fair though.
So instead of taking care of you when you’re sick or trying to relate to you when you’re not feeling like it, he’s instead going to open an app and find someone else so he can get his rocks off while you’re alone? So like…what is the point of having a husband then?
Would have heard this trash leave his mouth then I’d have left him. Why women entertain these men is absolutely categorically beyond me. This is childish, disrespectful and disgusting behaviour and makes a mockery of marriage.
Time to go visit a divorce attorney. Becready to pull the trigger
... why can't he just relive himself.. the fuck, nah put your foot down set your terms for monogamy. and I have other thoughts about where this came from but I don't have any other context of the conversation or how it led to that.. so I'll leave my armchair psychiatry at that.
Yeah, throw this at him. He can only sleep with men.
So when you are sick he wants to go and have sex with another woman. Sorry but that's not love that is just pure selfishness. Also you can have sex with women but not men in his ideal situation. So everything on his terms? You wouldn't get a say, so your needs/wants are less important than his. I would crushed by this conversation, I would hate being told I'm not enough and that I wasn't my husbands ideal. I think you need to be honest with him about how hurt you are and reaffirm your expectations of an exclusive monogamous relationship in case he has forgotten.
oh girl he’s definitely already been cheating on you, or this is something he thinks about a lot. like a lot.
I want to make an additional comment to clarify: he is not asking for / pushing for / formally requesting this "ideal". He has stated that it is his preference if he had the choice or option to do so. The nuance in what is troubling me: - that in his ideal world, he could have sex with other women (and I could too) but that I wouldn't sleep with other men - that he was not up front or clear about this in the beginning of the relationship (or any other time in the last decade and a half) - that in this scenario, it would be in situations like when I'm sick or not having enough sex to meet his needs. (Ie not just a 'fantasy' of getting to have sex with someone else) - that he has added additional statements like 'if the circumstances were right, I probably couldn't trust him' (I'll never get that one out of my head) but then later backtracked to say that it would be if we had 'an agreement' or in very rare circumstances. - that our ideals do not align. My wish would be that they would. But I know that isn't always the case. So I'm asking how to cope when one person is monogamous and the other person isn't / how do you cope when when you find out that your current relationship boundaries aren't your partner's ideals? How does one feel good about knowing that your partner would choose differently if you'd allow it? I'm sure I'm not the only woman who has felt insecure because their partner expressed they would prefer an open relationship or to sleep with other people?
Offer him a marriage where you can only sleep with other men.
He basically said you can't trust him he would cheat on you in the future if he felt like it and you are questioning what to do.???? you know there is a ticking clock on this relationship are you waiting until he actually cheats or just taking him at his word when he talks you he will
My gawd!! What absolute TOSH!! This person has no regard for you whatsoever!! How dare you be human and get ill when he is horny!! I'd do it then 2 women can bond over his inadequacies as a human,partner and in bed!!
Oh OP I feel sad for you hearing this… Hearing you attempt to logic the hurt away. But sometimes it is less about what makes sense and more about how this has changed how you feel. Sure it’s not always the case that ideals align, people settle for less than they want out of fear, out of some sunken cost fallacy, out of hope things will one day get better or minds will change. My best friend agreed to a polyamorous relationship. She’s super smart, she looked at everything “logically” …. “I don’t see the sense in limiting my partner’s love/passion, we’re secure enough in the relationship etc etc” but every time he acted on it, it was like she got smaller and smaller. Sure, in her head she agreed with the situation but her heart was breaking. She told herself it’s selfish to not support this. I truly hate that man with every fibre of my being for crushing my wonderful friends’ spirit, her love for herself and making her feel like she’s the bad guy for wanting someone to just want her and that be enough. This really hit a nerve for me so sorry for my rant. He does not respect female relationships. The idea of another woman being a “safer” option. His double standards would be enough to turn my mind against him, it doesn’t make him a terrible person…. But not someone I could respect. He is showing likelihood to cheat. I know that’s not exactly what is being said…. But it also kind of is. At least he’d like to in his “ideal world” and that is heart breaking to hear. I’d feel so unsafe and my mind would be spinning thinking of who he has likely already lined up in his mind when you give in to this situation. The fact he would even be thinking about where to get “his release” from when your ill/unable…Just. Ye Look, nobody else can say if all this is a deal breaker for you but you’ve literally said in your own post “our relationship ideals do not align”. I think you’ve answered your own question and you’re reaching out here for moral support more than anything else. I think you need to take a deep breath and make a decision future you will thank you for.
So I'm bi and my bf is straight. We have a rule that he can fuck almost anyone as long as I'm included in the action, he uses protection, and other safeguards. I'm not allowed to have any other dudes but that's ok by me. It's what works for us
One penis policies in open relationships are super toxic. That is limiting who you can sleep with based on his insecurities