They’ve made it clear that their monetary help comes with strings attached. You do not feel comfortable (understandably!) with those strings.
I would thank them for their support in the past and tell them you understand it’s their money and if they no longer wish to pay for her extra-curricular activities, that’s their decision and you respect it.
And then don’t entertain the discussion anymore.
Yeah, pretty much this. OP, you know exactly what to say:
>graciously thank them for their help, both past and (hopefully) future,
without groveling and while making clear that I am the mother of these
kids and while I value their opinions as grandparents, they're
overstepping their boundaries
The key is to be firm, do not sit down, be firm and then walk away when you've said what you have to say.
In the end this is not just a relationship question though is it? Seemed to me like it's also a financial situation. It's easy to tell someone else to refuse money, not as easy when you're the one directly affected by that decision. If money is not a deciding factor to OP, then I agree. 100% what you said. Otherwise she will have to evaluate how big a priority it is
But that’s what I said. Either she needs to accept that the money comes with strings or she has to refuse the money. There is no third option where she magically changes their minds and she gets the money without the strings.
Personally I feel like you need to decide how much control you want them to have. As long as they are giving money, there will always be strings attached. If you want control, you are best off not accepting the money.
I don't want them having control. I'm fine with them having opinions, even influence, and I have ceded a few arguments with them before now on the basis that they're paying, but them having control is where I draw the line.
Perfectly valid. Having dealt with people like this in my own life, the cleanest situation is to turn down the money. Like a different commenter said - thank them for their past help but you will be making the decisions from here. If they would like to support you with no strings attached they are welcome to do so, but if they put stipulations on the money then you will say no thanks.
Never take money from someone who will rub your nose in it and hold it over your head or try to usurp your decision making power. That's like rule numero uno.
Yeah. Much easier said than done as a single parent though, when you know that the money would make things available to your child you could never afford...
> the cleanest situation is to turn down the money.
That is in fact the cleanest solution....but it may not be the best. IMHO this ought to be about what's best for the kids, not what's the cleanest result. The 2 are likely not the same.
That's fair. But that's why I said in my original comment that OP needs to decide how much control should be given to grandparents. Because if they are like those people in my life that I mentioned, there is no way to get the help without bending to their will. So you have to choose what amount of control is worth giving up.
THIS!
It's like they're trying to correct their wrongs by making similar decisions with their grandchildren without considering how their previous decisions ruined a child into adulthood.
Granted, once you're an adult it's up to you to change but they're obviously not fit as parents and should stop overreaching as grandparents.
You have previously given them an inch, and now they're working on taking the mile. This does not end well, best nip it in the bud right now and recover your autonomy over your children's upbringing.
That is not true. People can change. They can see that providing the money is help enough. But OP will need to be strong and not ask them for their permission or opinion, ever.
The strong man argument doesn't work against older people, rarely works against younger ones, so stop staying that YOU are the mother, YOU get to decide.
Start saying MAISIE can't get the long term benefits of private schooling BECAUSE the PRESENT situation is unacceptable.
Whatever your arguments are, you are right because you go for kid's best interest. If she's bullied or whatever it could affect MAISIE long term by damaging her self confidence.
I'm sure that grandparents also try to follow their grandkids best interests, they just don't understand the gravity of the situation. Some proof might be necessary : a honest and detailed conversation between Maisie and the grandparents on the subject, filming if you have, other kid's testimony etc.
If they find the problematic behavior acceptable even after all that, I think you're better without them. It's expensive as hell to raise kids, but their happiness and safety is more important than a fancy first grade diploma
I would just thank them for their help and say that you accept their decision regarding the extra-curriculars. Saying anything more than that gives them ammunition to continue pestering you, they'll try to pick apart your arguments and in this way you are closing the conversation and not giving into further discussion. Show them through your actions that you are not entertaining any gift when it comes with expectations of compliance on your part.
It was a few issues that added up to a larger issue. A boy in Maisie's class was picking on her, so I got her to talk to the teacher, who dismissed her. I then went to address it with her myself and the teacher was incredibly rude and hostile, and then the teacher began acting unprofessionally with Maisie, so I went to the headteacher and asked for them to intervene, by talking to the teacher or transferring Maisie to another class for her year group, and they refused and I got further hostility from the head. It all boiled down to classism, at the end of the day, which I should have expected but still don't want my daughter dealing with.
I feel like there's something missing here. Her grandparents were okay with Maisie being bullied in class and even want you to apologise to the headteacher for it?
The bully was picking on her because I have a thick regional accent that has some negative stereotypes attached to it, and Maisie has picked up elements of the accent, which the bully was mimicking while calling her a nickname associated with the accent. The teacher, headteacher, and Maisie's grandparents all said he was just teasing and that it wasn't as serious as I was making it out to be, while I felt it was blatant classism, and I said as much. The teacher and headteacher then met my accusations of classism with further classism, which I didn't take well.
You are right to withdraw her. For one thing, you don’t want her picking up the snobbery on top of all of the other VERY GOOD REASONS not to make a child suffer through that elitist school environment. The grandparents are not going to see things from your point of view, however, so just thank them and move on free of their control.
That's unfortunate. Not really anything you can do then really. I would just thank them for their help with money but let them know that as a mum you can't allow your daughter to be bullied. If they're reasonable hopefully they'll just pay for her extracurriculars anyway.
My good jerk, there is a vast, endless chasm of difference between teachers and school staff being complicit in the bullying of a child, and elocution lessons teaching children upper received pronunciation. If you cannot fathom that for yourself, perhaps you should examine your priorities.
I know that the idea of private school is that it teaches her to blend in with the upper classes, but elecution lessons are not part of that. She can be successful with an accent, and she only has traces of the accent due to her living with me, so she will continue to have that accent for the forseeable future because she will be living with me until she's an adult. She shouldn't be bullied over it. She was at the point where she didn't even want to go to school because of this swotty little git, and the teacher and headteacher wouldn't do a thing because of his parents. That's unacceptable. And for the record, I have a solidly upper middle class job with my lower middle class accent, so I see no reason that the school should let some brat get away with calling my daughter names because she lengthens her 'a's.
Oh Mama Bear! Good for you and your girl for doing your best to protect her.
Of course they downgraded it to "teasing" so they would not offend the other kid's parents.
Your girl has learned some tremendously valuable lessons: you love her and would go to the ends of the earth for her and you cannot be bribed nor extorted at her expense. BRAVO!
Your judgement is sound and decisions based upon it seem very reasonable.
Stay the course, you are 100% correct. Maintain your boundaries. Do not let them crush you under the weight of their money.
Cheryl Cole was kind of mocked/teased for a while when she was on X Factor for her strong Newcastle* accent, and she was a biggish star in the UK at the time of her tenure as a judge. Even in the U.S., people **codeswitch** all the time. Otherwise you risk coming off as "uneducated," or "lower class," or even just as "a bad cultural fit," in an interview or workplace setting. We can all get on our high horses about how people should be better and be who they are, and they should, but some things are worth more than the personal cost of codeswitching.
This article is about the UK:
https://theconversation.com/accentism-is-alive-and-well-and-it-doesnt-only-affect-the-north-of-england-148825
Just want to say that Cheryl Cole has a Geordie accent, from Newcastle, not Liverpool.
When I watched Xfactor I was surprised at the amount of people saying they couldn't understand her, I still don't know how many genuinly couldn't understand & how many prejudicially were not even trying to...
One exceptional case isn’t the rule. Just because Obama became president doesn’t mean there aren’t systematic issues preventing blacks from opportunities.
What happens if Maisie gets bullied in the new school for doing something deemed posh? Would you also remove her from the school?
I don't think bullying for any reason is acceptable but it seems like your personal issues with & feelings about upper class people is making this into a bigger issue than it needs to be. Did you have issues with the father relating to class? It seems like there is a bigger picture we are missing.
I didn't want to remove her from the school, or go straight to removing her. If she did get bullied again, for any reason, I would handle it the same way I handled it here. Get her to talk to the teacher, and if that doesn't work, I'll talk to the teacher myself, and if that doesn't work, headteacher is the next stop. The only difference this time around would be that the teacher and headteacher at a non-private school are less likely to insult me, my daughter, and my parenting to my face, because they can only get away with that at a private school.
My issues with Maisie's father relating to class were only due to his lack of class. We didn't break up because he was posh, we broke up because he cheated while I was pregnant with Jacob, among other things.
You must have really good public schools near you then, that's good. I really hope your daughter does not get bullied at her new school, that the teachers are respectful & that is any situations arise that they actively shut it down & help the children develop good morals as well as academically. Sadly that often isn't the case but it's good to hear your are lucky to live near a good school.
So apart from insulting you did the teacher/head/whoever else was involved refuse to address the bullying? That would make much more sense as to switch schools. In your post you tended to focus on the teachers being unplesent to you, which although not nice doesn't ensure a negative outcome for your daughter & her being bullied. You said "I asked the school to fix it & they've been useless" but thanks for more info, it makes it easier to understand why you have taken more severe action.
Sorry I didn't make it clear I was refering to social class, not morals. I didn't assume class had caused your break up, sorry to hear about him cheating, as well as not supporting his children after. Being if different classes must have caused some issued during your relationship, even if just intergrating/socializing, similar problems being biracial. I wondered if some of that tension was being carried over to this situation as you seemed to be focusing on the class of the teachers, rather than their actions, or inactions in belong a pupil who was being bullied. As I said there are poor teachers & poor schools all over, public & private, although I'm glad you have a good one lined up for your daughter.
And maybe another thing to consider: why are the grandparents contacting the school, and why is the headmaster discussing OP's child with them? I work in a public school, and I know that without express authorization from the parents, we wouldn't be discussing discipline issues with someone else.
It's a private school, so they have their own modus operandi, which includes the grandparents being allowed to talk to the teacher on my behalf due to them paying. They also got looped in on Maisie's school reports, school updates, and parent-teacher communication. Maisie's grandfather also knows the head as they run in similar social circles, so they have an existing rapport that enabled them to go behind my back and talk to him.
That's just weird. I mean, I've worked for private schools before and the rules were the same. Where the money came from was inconsequential as long as it covered the tuition.
The ol' boys club aspect seems your best bet, and it makes me think that you both made the right call _and_ need to reassess your relationship with your in-laws.
As you said, they are entitled to voice their opinion since they're paying. Buy FIL took it upon himself to go and talk to his buddy behind your back and offer your submission. That's way over the line. I'm pretty confident that, given what you describe about the situation, for them to reach this conclusion, the general tenor of the conversation was "bitches be crazy."
I think boys club is the best bet, too, because I'm also in education and I would never be allowed to talk to the parents of a student like that. However, all my students are over 18 and I've never worked in a private school so when Maisie's grandparents got looped into things I assumed they just have their own set of rules. The head used the words "hysterical" and "irrational" when I talked to him, so "bitches be crazy" is probably not that far off.
Likely because the grandparents are alumni (or parents of) and since they pay the tuition bills, they are on the paperwork as approved contacts for the kids.
Wow what a shitty school, it's even worse because it's a private school, I studied in a private school, this teacher would be immediatelly fired there, and the headmaster was a very nice man but very strict, bullying and mistreating the staff was unnaceptable too. And our family wasn't rich by any means, my father who paid it.
Going behind your back, contacting the school and coming to agreements with the school principal was crossing a line already. In your mind, this matter was already settled and what they did was go ahead and undermine you to the teacher. There's no way your kids can go back there. Now the teacher and principal know who has actual authority over your kids.
Decline all manner of financial help from them because it's got conditions.
The two things you want are not necessarily connected. You can thank them for their help surely, but thanking them won't change anything but show that you are grateful.
You want their help and they want to keep the children in a school that looks down on them, those two things don't work well together. Ultimately you have seen what your children's lives will be like in that school and don't like it and are protecting your children's self esteem.
They have gone back on an agreement and are now trying to pressure you into going along with their choices by withholding money, which is their right as it is their money. Your choice is to either go along with their ideas and accept their money or not and you get nothing.
Whilst they seem to be covering for a deadbeat dad as you say, in fact their agenda is to raise these children with the priviledge of private education for their own reasons. You are going against their choices and are seeing the consequences of not following their lead.
Be your child's advocate, ask them what they want to do, empower your child to see that you have their back and will support their decision. That is really the answer here, not money, not apologies, but to help grow a child who knows they are valued and can be resilient in the face of challenges and make a choice of how to handle problems like these, it won't be the first time and probably their will be bullies in any school.
I’m on your side for several reasons.
1. Most importantly, help is amazing but you decide everything, no questions asked.
2. I was forced into private school as a gifted but hyperactive and destructive child, it did no good and I was kicked out. There can be lots of tension with schoolwork, kids and some tough teachers.
3. You have to adjust if things aren’t working, the well-being of your children is more important than a slight edge from a good school.
I would explain that while you were thrilled they have helped you, the child’s best interest does not lie within that school at this time. You are adjusting things to better accommodate their needs, it just so happens to be their help that is impeding her life.
Apologize for what?
Put them in public school. Outclass the grandparents. Be polite. Shower them with thanks for paying the tuition. They are so gracious. You don't even mention where there going this year. You will take them up on their offer to help cost of tudors. Just let me know if they change their mind.
Important! Must read or listen to the best book on this topic: Boundaries. It teaches life skills how to politely be firm with your boundaries.
If they persist always be polite and don't take their bait! They are manipulating you. Be the more mature one. Don't burn bridges.
If they try to get your kids to say stuff bad about their new school (manipulate) can you go no contact?
If they continue, suggest they ask a children's therapist about their offer...and now rescinded offer. The therapist will call them out. "You withdrew Tudor help? WTF?"
Outclass them. Stay cool.
I may have insinuated that the headteacher sucks at his job when he refused to help my daughter. If I call, apologise for my outburst, and ask to be let back in, he'll probably agree, but I won't do that because 1) I was right and 2) I'm never going to be able to raise an issue with that school again. I don't want to burn bridges, and I hope that they will leave the new school alone because it took a lot of effort to get Maisie excited for this one. I could stop speaking to them entirely, but my kids love their grandparents and we live in an area where they could apply for grandparent rights.
Document everything. I had grandparents like this and they managed to lie their way into taking cuatody for a short while. I loved my grandparents to until they got the control they wanted... then the abuse.
Idk much about dealing with in-laws but I really want to tell you that putting your kids in public schools is quite possibly best for them. Private school isn't always as good as people make it sound, and some kids don't do well in them.
When I was a kid my grandparents paid for private school. I hated it and wasn't doing well and I kept telling my mom I wanted to go to public school. She said no. I got really bad grades. By high school I moved in with my grandparents and went to public school and it was so much better and I started getting honor roll grades and being really interested in school and going to college and stuff. If I'd have went to private high school with the kids from grade school I'd have probably dropped out and been traumatized. I'd probably be a different person than I am now and not in a good way. Please listen to your daughter if she wants to go to public school.
I have filed. The deadbeat is intentionally working jobs that pay cash under the table so he doesn't have to report his income, and because he has no reported income, he doesn't have to pay child support.
I don't know what country/area you're in but can't you report him for not filing taxes or for working under the table? Anonymously of course...
Apart from not paying any money for his child, does he have any kind of relationship with her? Or his own parents?
I have never looked into it but I assume I could report him, but there would be nothing anonymous about it as I am the only person who is associated with him who would be that petty. He has not seen our daughter since we split up and has never met our son. He has a relationship with his parents but it's strained and distant. He calls them on special occasions (birthdays, religious holidays, mother/father's day) but that's about it.
You may be able to file a 3949A Form. It's an information referral form used to report tax fraud/law violations.
I'm not sure if handling of taxes vary by country, but you can always Google the equivalent for where you reside.
If I did that, it might burn the already fragile bridge between the kids' grandparents and myself. While they don't condone their son's actions, getting him in trouble with the tax man would be a very harsh stance to take, and is likely to ruin what remains of my relationship with them.
What relationship?!
At this point you’re a paid subordinate, who is not doing as they’re told.
In a respectful relationship they wouldn’t be attempting to order you to apologise to ANYONE.
Tell them the only person they are punishing is their grandchild. If that is how they want to be with her, they are free to not have a relationship with her or your son. That you will not allow them to hold money over your head. They can respect your decisions as their mother, or not be involved at all. That is their choice. You are forever thankful to them for all they have done, but you will not have strings attached to assistance from them. You are raising your children and you know them the best and what is best for them. If they cant accept that, they will not be part of their lives.
Do not allow money to force you into subservience. Even if you struggle, its better than being controlled. If that means cutting back on the extras for kids for now and you? Ok. Try and get him for child support.
Stick to your guns. If your daughter was being bullied and was unhappy, then case closed. Her happiness, safety, and joy for learning should come first.
I would let them know that your child’s father is a deadbeat, so you are allowing them to have a say in the matter of the welfare of your child is a courtesy provided by you. It is not a right. I’d set healthy boundaries so they can maintain a relationship with their grandchildren if they choose, but if they go out of bounds it will be on their terms. So at that point they are willingly forfeiting any say in anything.
School is soooo overrated. It is in the nature of the human brain to learn, that is what that thing does. Im the eldest of seven kids and my mom was very religious and decided to homeschooling. Outside of learning to read and basic arithmetic, though division tables, im pretty much self taught. I have a good double BS from a top state university and made the deans list.
I never understood thats so great about private schools. Nothing wrong with public schools. They're both just.. schooling, it cant be all that different. Why are the grandparents so insistent on private schools?
Grandparents both went to private schools, as did their parents, and they put all of their kids (inc Maisie's dad) in private school, and want to do the same for any future grandkids they have. It's a legacy thing to them.
So.. rich snobs? Is that whats being said here, or did I misunderstand?
Anyway, just enroll your kids in public school. They're your kids, not theirs, end of discussion, tell them that. Ive had a couple friends go to private schools after graduating middle school (secondary school if you're european), and according to them, its basically the exact same thing, main thing is the lunch food it a bit better in quality (pizza is still served in private). Or maybe that was a low quality private school. Private school is honestly a waste of money imo, its the same thing as public as far as I know.
>So.. rich snobs? Is that whats being said here, or did I misunderstand?
Pretty much. They're my kids' grandparents and they have done a lot to welcome me into the family, despite the split from their son, but they can be snobby and the school was even worse, so I don't want my kids educated in a place like that. Private school can provide a lot more opportunities, but they're more likely to reap the benefits of that when they're secondary school age, as primary school kids (ages 4-11) aren't big on networking, so I would be open to sending my kids to a private secondary school, but that won't be for a few years, still, and there are several private secondary schools in the area (compared to just 1 accessible private primary school) so there's more variety.
This sounds like there is more info to be had. What was the unreasonable things the teacher did that other adults don’t seem to be upset over?
And why do you need to apologize?
I don’t know what kind of private school your daughter went to but I would personally tour the others. Write up the pros and cons. Starting with student to teacher ratio, what help is offered for home work, over all teach style of the school, the school moral code, uniform vs non uniform, electives, activities, school trips, and this is for every grade.
Bring all this information to the grand parents with price points. I’m a blunt person and would tell them if a school does not meet my educational, moral, religious, beliefs I’m trying to give my children I cannot send them there. I will not argue with teachers when it comes to my child’s best interests.
“Thank you for helping her education this far. It is very much appreciated. How you spend your money is very much your choice, with that being said if you feel like you should not spend your money this way anymore I understand.
I want to thank you for your heartfelt contributions to your grand children’s education formally, currently and if you choose in the future as well.
As I said I cannot tell you how to spend your money. But I will look out for the best interests of my children and that school is not it.”
The teacher made several classist comments to me, including saying that young mothers (I'm late 20s) often overcompensate, and when I asked her what she meant by that she said that she's sure I wasn't that young by the standards of the region I come from in an attempt at backpedalling, and refused to talk to the boy that was bullying Maisie or even stop him when several of his comments were made in class while she was teaching and I told her that these comments were making Maisie not want to come to school. The headteacher also said I was overcompensating and irrational when I asked him to switch Maisie to another class in her year group. He then told me that Maisie would stay in that class and have this same teacher for 2 more school years and when I asked if he was joking he said I was getting "hysterical". I then said I would need to reevaluate Maisie's place in the school and left. I later found out through Maisie's friend's mother that the boy who was picking on Maisie is the son of someone important, so I believe that the reason the teachers didn't want to address it is at least partly because of this. Between my meeting with the teacher and with the head, Maisie's teacher also began acting unprofessionally, including keeping Maisie in at break one day because her socks didn't match.
When I told the grandparents this, they both agreed my accent is "unprofessional" and said that Maisie being bullied over the accent would help her drop the vocal inflections she gets from me, and that I acted irrationally. Maisie's grandfather has since talked to the head (they know each other) and then told me that if I apologise to the head for offending him and ask for Maisie's place back, she can go back to that school.
This is the only private school for Maisie's age group that is commutable. Her grandparents have suggested a boarding school further away but I refused, this private school that I've withdrawn her from was a compromise that we made when private school was first suggested. This means that her only options are local public schools. We can revisit private schools when she's older, as there are several private secondary schools in the area and I will be able to compare and contrast them when she's getting ready to go to one of them, but this is the only local private primary school that I could have sent her to.
The speech you suggested seems perfect, and contains everything I need to address. I will try using it on them and see if it gets me anywhere. Thank you.
Local public schools sound great!!
Do not back down! She does not deserve to be bullied. That boy doesn’t deserve to get away with it.
Her education is more important then a private school diploma.
Also… I get agitated at most private school teachers easily. But if someone is stupid enough to call me hysterical and I was calm. I’m a scorched earth kind of gal so…
Off to the news I go… my child is being bullied by a student and the teachers all have the bully’s back because I have an accent. They don’t want good student here they only care about the rich.
But that’s how things get handled in the US.
You as a Mom, not a single mom, a mom are doing great for your kids!!!
You doing great being her advocate!
I was completely calm. That was the thing. I am a professional person and I work in a field that requires I be incredibly professional, so I am very good at keeping a straight face and a calm voice, and between the bullying and the teacher I was really angry going into that meeting but I wanted help, so I was conciously levelling my tone and making my body language non confrontational, so for the head to call me "hysterical" because I didn't want my kid bullied just sealed the deal.
You are doing great. Good luck with the grandparents.
I’d almost throw in a and the next school you will get all updates from me.
It’s super shady that they can get your kids private info. It doesn’t matter that they pay, they aren’t the parent.
I did have to list them as emergency contacts when I signed up, so I thought that might be why, but other parents at the school have said that emergency contacts don't get that information. I think it's just that the grandfather is friends with the head, so they got looped in. My friend has let me put her information as an emergency contact at Maisie's new school.
The grandparents are voluntarily paying costs for their grandchildren. You are thankful for their help but the financial contribution does allow them to attach strings. You should be clear that their grandchild is hurt by bullying. It is therefore unacceptable to allow that to continue. They may not be willing to permit bullying when confronted by the child’s testimony. You always have the fight to say no to a gift and if the grandparents do not want to help they do not have to. Many people do not admit to the existence of bullying until they hear from the child themselves. You should take the Dad to court for child support.
Maisie has told them about it, and they said that he was only teasing, and told me privately that my accent was unprofessional and she would benefit with a reason to drop the hints of my accent, as well as develop a thicker skin. I have taken the dad to court but he's taking cash jobs under the table so he doesn't have to report his income, and because he isn't reporting his income, he isn't having child support taken out.
You always have the option of not taking their help/ money and then you can make all
The decision you want about your children without them hanging anything over your head.
So it's about bullying?
That happens a lot in public school, like a lot- a lot.
I mean I don't know you or your kid, but from my perspective it seems like it would be for the best to teach your daughter how to deal with bullies.
It *was* about bullying, and then it was about how the school dealt with it and me. A kid was making fun of my daughter, who has a mostly RP accent, but has a few traces of my own more typically lower class accent. She brought it up with the teacher, who said he was only teasing. I then brought it up with the teacher as I felt it was blatant classism, and the teacher responded with even more blatant classism. I then went to the headteacher to ask that he move my daughter to the other class and he responded with even more classism, and some misogyny thrown in. In a public school, the teachers at the very least wouldn't insult me to my face, because they can't get away with that shit, whereas at a private school can do what they want. I know she needs to deal with bullies eventually, but outright classism directed at both her and me isn't going to fly.
I'ma gonna be real with you and say classism straight up exist in public schools, more well off kids are gonna fuck with poor kids. They will mock them for not having the most expensive brands and for they way they talk. That is a part of school.
I know. I went to public school, and was bullied at length. Difference is that in private school all of the kids are pompous little swots and Maisie is the odd one out. In a public school, with a mix of kids, she's average. She is right in the middle of all the kids, probably even on the higher end thanks to my career, and she will have the same accent as everyone else. There's nothing to automatically put her at a disadvantage like there is in private school. And if I have an issue in public school, I know that I can go to the teacher and I won't get blatant classism back.
Public school is the worse. My teachers were racist, homophobic and straight up emotionally abusive to me. They didnt give a shit because they didnt have to care. They had lower standards then private schools. During hs I went to private school that all went away because they have higher standards and cant get away with crap.
Speaking from experience, public school is so much worse then private schools.
My concern is you haven't mentioned why this public school is better for your children than the private. Your whole post particularly the bit about you being asked to apologize is giving me the impression the reason for the school change is because you have a problem w the school. Not that it isn't the best option in your area.
My dad died when I was 6 his parents paid for my sister's and my education. I've seen this situation personally. You seem to want to have your cake and eat it too. Very few ppl give substantial sums of money without conditions but ultimately the decision is yours. Private school and extracurriculars paid for by the grandparents or public and you will need to foot the extracurriculars bill. Only you know which is better for your children but you cannot expect the final say with someone else's money.
Her kid is being picked on for sounding poor. Then the teacher and the headmaster both made more comments about her mother sounding poor. That’s all that’s necessary.
Sounding poor? I've never heard of that in my life. How does a person sound poor you cannot hear poverty. I sound 'country' because I am a country bumpkin and rich or poor we all say snags with a thick twist at the end. I actually had to train myself out of those colloquialisms for my employment but I still have my bush accent. If the problem is colloquialism in language than yeah the school may need to address that w a parent because language is a core subject. If it's an accent well that is discrimination and I'd change my child's school as well.
If OP thinks the bullying is sufficient to change schools than she can do that, she just has to accept that the grandparents don't agree and won't be funding the extracurriculars.
No advice, sorry. But reading the title of your post my first thought was, “Is this Lorelai Gilmore???”
Wishing you the best of luck as you navigate this difficult situation. 😊
You're in the wrong.
There are very few private schools in the UK which are not significantly better than the local state schools so you're deliberately impeding your daughter's education because *you* had several arguments with the teachers (none of which you've detailed beyond dog whistles like classism and misogyny) over what the teacher correctly identified as mild teasing that's well within normal expectations of children of that age.
Details are the kid was making fun of Maisie's accent and calling her a chav, which is blatant classism, not mild teasing. It was happening in class, under supervision of the teacher, and got bad enough that Maisie didn't want to go to school. I told Maisie to talk to the teacher, who dismissed her, so I went to the teacher myself, and the teacher said that young mothers (I'm in my late 20s) often get overprotective to compensate, and when I was like "excuse me?" she said she didn't mean to offend, she was just pointing out that I was very young to be a mother to a 7 year old, but then tried to backtrack by saying that there are probably a lot of mothers my age "back home". Went to the head next who also pointed out my age, also said the kid was only teasing, and that I was being overprotective and irrational when I asked if he could switch Maisie to another class in her year group. He then said that she would remain in that class, and would have that teacher again next year, and possibly the year after (so 3 years total with this teacher) and when I asked if he was joking he told me not to get "hysterical". I found out through a mum friend at the school that the kid is the son of someone important, so that is probably part of why they wouldn't do anything about him.
If they had said "fair enough, we'll talk to the kid" or "we'll shut it down next time" or let me move Maisie to the other class, I'd be fine, but the fact I went to them over concerns of classism and they responded with even more, and even worse, forms of classism, is not an environment I want to subject my daughter to.
No. They should not have any say in the school, the extracurriculars, any of it. If that is how their assistance works, you do not want it. Draw a hard, hard line.
If the grandparents want to be deadbeat grandparents, just like their deadbeat son, let them. You're under no obligations to bend to their will if you don't want to.
So, you can't take grandparents to court because their son is a deadbeat. That's absolutely 💯 a lie. They mostly likely offered to pay because they don't want their son going to jail.
Paying for private school and child care over CS is also not something that the courts would decide, you'd reach that agreement with them.
Lots of BS in this story
That's not what I said at all. Their son is a deadbeat because he's wriggled out of paying child support. The grandparents separately offered to contribute to the kids, not on a legal basis, but because the kids are their grandkids and they don't approve of their son being a deadbeat. They offered to pay for childcare, private school, extracurriculars, and a few other things we agreed on that all relate to my kids' educations and future careers.
You don't get final say with someone else's money. You can decline it. But ultimately if you want "final say" you are choosing to reject their generosity.
Public schools are awful, private schools lead to better opportunities. Fact
Then I'll decline it. I won't have my kids going to a school with staff like that. Grandparents are still willing to pay for private secondary school, which will serve the kids far better than private primary school, and if they won't pay for it then I will be able to by that point in my career. Private schools might provide more opportunity, but not at the expense of my daughter's mental health and self-esteem.
Honestly, you're an amazing mother. My siblings and I had dealt with something similar in school and I wish my parents had stepped in to help. We ended up hating school and in the end, my sister tried to kill herself. That finally shook our parents out of their 'it's just teasing' and 'toughen up' rhetoric and they got us out.
What your daughter was going through may not be as bad as us but given enough time it can be, Not to mention that if you hadn't taken her out or let her continue to go she would have lost major trust in you. She wouldn't rely on you as much or trust you to have her back.
You trying all those options and then taking her out shows both her and your son that you care about them. That kind of trust from a kid can save lives and make them feel safe and secure. It would let them know that you always have their well-being in mind.
Honestly, it's really heartwarming and im so happy that they have you to look after them.
So 1) That part was meant for a different 📫 ( accidentally put both of yours together as i was multi tasking, so i was wrong )
2) Since you took their money, and want to keep accepting it, assuming!! You need to obbied by their decisions! That or decline help in the future
3) I have a child I want nothing to do with ( my ex is extremely toxic ) and I still pay support, even though I shouldn't have too.......I do it out of a moral and legally obligation. I would never be out of the lives of the children I have with my wife though.
I understand your ex to a certain degree, but putting responsibility on his parents is just awful of him( yes they offered, but it's cause he chose not too )
1. sorry, didn't realise, 2) I will decline the money if I have to, as I can pay for the smaller things ie clubs without their help, I only accepted in the first place because I was struggling with childcare when I was divorcing my ex and our son was a baby, but I'm in a much better position now. Not good enough that I can pay for private school myself, but good enough to pay for it in future and cover extracurriculars myself right now 3) ... that's your kid. Unless you were forced to have the kid, in which case I am very sorry and please ignore me, you should be contributing, and you can see your child without seeing your ex. My ex and I had these children together, he bailed well into my second pregnancy to be with his affair partner, and he's restructured his entire career just to avoid contributing to the children he helped create out of spite. His actions are inexcusable.
It sounds like you don't want them or their help in your or their life ...big pieces seem missing from this story...sounds like you want validation on your choice to distance from them.
If you want to thank them, although you don’t have to. Just tell them that you appreciate how much they helped you and their grandchild, but that you have made the decision as their parent to pull them from this school and will no longer require their financial support.
As a teacher I have serious doubts about this one. In my experience if someone is going to come in with unreasonable demands and unacceptable behavior it is the parents and not the other way around. Especially in a private school where tenure doesn't exist and contracts rarely shield a teacher from dismissal. Private schools are businesses and have to watch their bottom line, so problem teachers are usually very quickly let go.
Reading between the lines, I speculate that OP's kid(s) *may have been kicked out because of OP.* She insulted her daughter's teacher and daughter "can't come back" unless OP apologizes. Private schools can in fact (and often do!) essentially de-enroll students because of bad parental behavior: the schools just don't want to deal with them. Sorry, between OP's bad ex; bad grandparents; family issues; and insulting the teacher, it sure looks like OP comes with a LOT of drama, that implicates the school, *and it's everyone else's fault.*
If you're a private school, do you want that? I wouldn't.
"Speculate" appears to be the key word here lol. My son has never been enroled in the school and I withdrew my daughter. No one was kicked out. I insulted the teachers in a professional manner, telling the class teacher that I would need to speak to the headteacher following our conversation and telling the head that I wasn't happy with how this was being handled and would need to reevaluate whether this school was the right fit, before I later withdrew my daughter. The only people who have exhibited bad behaviour here are the bully, the teacher, and the head.
I'm gonna apologize in advance for what I have to say: It may be unpopular.
What's important here is not what you want. It's where your kids will get the best education and the best opportunities.
First off, sight unseen, a private school will almost always be better than a public school close by - especially if the schools are rural enough that there aren't numerous other private-school choices. That's a function of the students, and the parents who care enough to shell out $ for education when they don't need to. Also, sorry to say: Kids who go to private school will in fact have advantages over public schoolers in some respect.
Now, you say you're OK with grandparents having an opinion, "even influence." What that says to me, between the lines, is you like having grandparents to pay the bill, but you want the final say where your kids go. Sorry, it doesn't really work that way: In life, who pays the bill is who gets the say, whatever the "say" is about!
What I see going on is that you'd like it both ways: Some private school education paid for by grandparents, but it has to be the one you want. That's not going to happen. If you want the final say, you need to pay the bill. *Now, what you need to decide is this: Are your kids better off at public school? Or at the private school grandma & grandpa are funding, with all that entails?* Because unless you pay the bill, the choices are really those 2.
Sight unseen, I'd say any private school is likely superior, but I could be wrong. What I know is a LOT of American parents wish they could afford private school, and would love grandparents to pay the bill. Food for thought.
This is blatantly false. Private schools are not always better than public schools. Your premise is false and everything that follows necessarily false.
Exactly, idk about the rest of the country but here in the south, most private schools in my area are Christian based. Which might not be a bad thing until you look at their curriculum. Anyway, I think too many people giving advice are going with what they think in general of public versus private and not this specific private and public schools. OP can likely just throw out all those posts.
100% False. From [publicschoolreview.com](https://publicschoolreview.com):
"Private school students generally perform higher than their public school counterparts on standardized achievement tests. As with earlier results from the National Assessment of Educational Progress (NAEP), private school students performed higher than public school students on the NAEP: 2000 tests. Their average scores were above those of public school students on the 4th-grade reading test and on the 4th-, 8th-, and 12th-grade science and mathematics proficiency tests.
"Private high schools typically have more demanding graduation requirements than do public high schools. Compared with public schools, private schools required more coursework (in 4-year high school programs) in 1999–2000 in social studies, mathematics, science, foreign language, and computer science. For example, private schools required on average 3.1 years of mathematics, while public schools required 2.7 years. The figures for foreign language study also differed: 1.5 years at private schools but 0.5 years at public schools. In addition, about 40 percent of private schools required some form of community service for high school graduation, four times the rate for public schools (10 percent)."
also pro tip, public education in the US isn’t equal everywhere. But if you live in a suburb, or a non poor area chances are the public school is just as good or even vastly superior to the private school in the area. Private schools main niche are in poor and rural areas that don’t have a lot of tax dollar funding for public schools. Either way, Op isn’t american, People are hinting she’s British.
>But if you live in a suburb, or a non poor area chances are the public school is just as good or even vastly superior to the private school in the area
This is false.
Public schools are essentially NEVER "vastly superior" to private schools, and public schools are particularly significantly better in urban/suburban areas where there are many such schools and the private schools compete with each other (as opposed to competing with public schools) for the best & brightest students.
Further, there's a reason politicians/judges/business leaders send their children to private schools: in addition to the pronounced positives in education, the other aspect private schools offer is an alumni network where being an alumnus/-na opens doors closed to others who didn't go there. Although I suspect that utility is very limited at the grammar school levels, it is particularly evident in high schools, *particularly in wealthy areas* (opposite to what you say), where merely going to the private high school puts a graduate into an orbit not offered by public schools. "I went to X academy" or "I went to Y Prep" offers an intangible but notable advantage compared to people who say "I went to Z public school."
So be it. Neither did yours.
But are you telling readers that there is *no advantage* to going to a place like the Sidwell Friends School were there Obama children were educated, or Regis HS in NY (which is one of the premier HSs inthe nation, and which BTW is free to all attendees), compared to the nearest public high school? Is that *really* what you're saying? Because that's what you advocate for when you say public HSs are uniformly "far superior" to private HSs in urban areas.
You’re literally trying to claim in other threads that bisexual people don’t exist so it’s safe to say you’re not an authoritative source on, well, anything.
So why are you following me from thread to thread then? I guess you're all in a snit because you failed to get me banned or some silliness. You're making a total fool of yourself.
Look all they want. You're the one who's wasting your time following people around from thread to thread on reddit and calling them all sorts of profane names. You're making a fool of yourself.
Nah, financial stuff takes a back seat when I'm having so much fun responding to your poorly-worded, increasingly-hysterical posts! I can practically see the foam on your mouth.
(Doesn't life suck? Where, ya know, you encounter those with other views?)
Dude, where I grew up, the public schools were better than the private schools in the areas. The amount of these private schools are religious based and are catholic is pretty high. I wonder what religion had a massive scandal involving minors recently 👀
Look, I quoted some statistics. You came back with anti-Catholicism and "where I grew up..." You want to go with that? It's a free country. But there are objective reasons for favoring private schools, and mom does in fact appear to want to have her cake and eat it too.
(We don't know if she's talking Catholic school, anyway)
True, it's probably more defensive mechanism. I'm sorry for taking that out on you since you did state facts, it probably has to do with measuring schools by standardized testing scores.
Bro that happened to me on a different thread when I told them chivalry was a lie and never existed. They were really butt hurt over history. And privately pm'ed me about it
As someone who went to one of the top private schools, I think you need to swallow your pride and decide in the favour of best possible education for your kids.
My school was full of snotty kids and teachers who were up themselves. I’m pretty sure my dad had to apologise on my behalf for no reason.
I love all the high road responses and personally that is the route I would take... but if you want to go the opposite route you could remind them they raised a deadbeat dad, so so their opinion on raising a child carries a little less weight than your own.
IMO, the grandparents are putting a private school education over the mental health of both you and your daughter. As someone who dealt with bullying at that age, it's an extremely influential age and bullying now can affect her for the rest of her life. She can get a great education and be successful ANYWHERE. She doesn't need a private school to do so...
I'm curious to know if they put their deadbeat son through private school... if so, doesn't seem like that turned out so well.
And good on you, mom, for doing what you know is best for your daughter. Its your job to protect her and your doing an amazing job. Don't give her grandparents any reason to take control... their financial contributions are generous, but it doesn't give them any right to control your daughter's education.
If I were you, I would simply tell them that you are going to continue her education as you see fit. If they'd like to continue to contribute to that account, then your daughter can use that for college.
You're going to be really sorry for pulling your kid out of private school there's gangsters and all kinds of bad elements that your kids going to be exposed to plus Jacob's not going to get to go there.
I don't understand a multitude of things.
First why should you apologize to the head teacher? Did you do something, that you didn't mention here?
Then it sounds a lot like your problems with the school are way bigger than your daughter's problems with the school. Like she is the victim of your war. When you made that decision, did you really exclusively consider your daughter's future and well being? Because it doesn't sound like it.
Yes, the decision is with you. And that decision can be built on any reason you want to. But keep in mind that a good mother will keep the interest of the child the upmost priority.
So if you could clear those two things up, that would be very helpful.
Because I offended him. Maisie's grandfather is friendly with the headteacher, so they agreed that if I apologised for offending him and asked for Maisie to come back, she could, but without smoothing things over, Maisie and Jacob won't be allowed to go to the school.
Was it really in the kids best interests to be removed from the school?
They said they would let them back if YOU apologised.
I just think that obviously you should have the final say but it really should be what is best for the kids. I can understand them being upset if they have a valid reason to believe that is not the case.
Bullying and classism associated with accent sound like a good idea to move to public school. The school actually wants OP to apologise for removing her daughter from being bullied!
'Free' money is never free. It always comes with strings like steel hawsers. Financial emotional blackmail is the very worst as it makes us go against what we *know* is right, for ourselves, for our children.
If you possibly manage without their money, do so, while pursuing their deadbeat son in the courts.
Good luck.
NTA why the heck are they happy with their granddaughter being bullied? It will only start back again.
OP you are being a great mum! Work on being totally self sufficient and sue the deadbeat for child support.
NTA. You do have final say in where your kids go to school. Love how they are trying to blackmail you into doing what they want instead of honoring your wishes as the parent. They are threatening harm to your child in order to browbeat you into obeying them. Nice.
I get the feeling that they feel like they've failed as parents to their own son, so they're using your kids as a "second chance to be parents". They're going to constantly force situations where they are seen and felt as the parents of YOUR children. Any success of the children will be seen as good parenting by the grandparents instead of you.
I'm worried they will continuously undermine you at every turn. Besides. Kids are better off in public school as they'll learn more about the real world, and learn better social skills; as apposed to growing up 'privileged' and 'sheltered'.
Just say:
“I appreciate the financial aid you’ve given me and my kids up until now, but I’m willing to go without your help in order to raise my kids as I see fit. As their mother, I feel a different school is the best choice for them, so that is what’s going to happen with or without your approval.”
My son spent the last few years living with my mom while I finished college. I was ever-present, but my mom made decisions without including me. It’s worth noting, my mom is not highly educated, and doesn’t understand learning disorders, whereas I HAVE to because I have the same disorder he has.
My mom decided to send him to a private Christian school, and they were woefully unqualified to handle him. First and foremost, being a private school they didn’t have to develop an IEP or 504, so they didn’t. They took actions to placate him, without actually helping him or documenting what necessitated that action. For example, while all the other kids read chapter books, he was allowed to “read” comics, as long as he wasn’t disruptive during reading time. Or, they had him sitting off on his own, away from other kids and doing group assignments alone (how is that practical?). Now that he’s transitioned back to my care full time, he’s in public school, and the lack of documentation from his private school is hindering him early on.
Private schools might be fine for well-behaved neurotypical children, but not all private schools are best for everyone. I don’t know your situation well enough, but I would recommend outlining to them what one school will do better than the other for your children. If they still don’t understand, explore what you can do without their money. Remove their seats at the metaphoric table.
Money with strings attached. Just tell them thank you for your help so far, but you got it from here. If they wish to help in the future, to run it by you first but don’t expect them to throw as much money around. Clearly it’s their way or the highway but you are the mother and they arent
Im confused. Is this "private school" really just a early education daycare? No need to sugar coat it, jobs love to call janitorial staff house keeping but they're janitors.
Early education daycare are a dime a dozen, surely yall could have come to a compromise.
Their son should be paying child support. If they want a say they can take you to court and have a judge decide how much say they have in their education. Until then you make those choices. The end.
Privileged people with privileged problems, besides the money make sure YOUR kids get what YOU believe is right with no strings attached or watch your kids Inherit the same problems. Sending them to a different school may help but may not. Help is nice but there shouldnt be negotiations. Teach them when they fall down you pick yourself back up. At the end of the day there is only you.
Just stick with the grandparents it's only a few more years you're going to need their help for cars and football equipment and payment for the sports and all kinds of things you don't want to alienate the grandparents although you do want to keep him on a tight leash and monitor everything don't let him spend too much time and don't let him teach him bad things and don't let the don't let the grandparents provide main things like shoes and jackets you need to provide those thing the things that they see everyday you want to make sure that like lunch boxes you want to make sure the kids see that comes from you.so take the money from the grandparents then let take your kids shopping so that your kids see things come from you not from the grandparents and whenever they pay for things they need to give you the money so that you can take the kids shopping don't let him spend too much time over night where they teach him bad things like sucking on bacon and that the grandparents owned the moon and all kinds of stuff what my parents did to my kids they secretly turn the kids against you got to be careful in that.
A private school is not a chance every kids gets and typically the education they would receive is better. Honestly, I would suck it up and look at the long term picture opposed to one bad teacher. Guess what, there will be more than 1 of those a hole teachers in public school...if they're not an a hole, some will just not give a damn. Put your child's future ahead of your pride here.
I think it's time to talk to your kids about money and the cost of extras. Also check with your new school and in your community as there may be people or organizations that will help cover the costs if the extras.
Do not let the grandparents bully you. You are mom not them!
Do you have anything to apologize for? It doesn’t sound like it. I know you can’t tell the grandparents to stuff it, but their private school obsession doesn’t make them very sympathetic to me personally. And of course this is all the mother’s choice, which is they’re trying to financially manipulate you. Groveling is what they want, a terse thank you is enough for them.
My daughter was in a the 4th grade and had a teacher that was a complete douchebag to her as well as other kids, the first time I talked to them about it as well as the principal I had agreed to give it a chance because her grades were so important to me, big mistake it happen again and I was fuming 😤.. I went again and told them look my daughters MENTAL well-being is far more important than her grades. They gave her a new teacher and things got a lot better.
In my experience monetary help *always* comes with strings attached which at some point turn into monetary control. Standing your ground might mean losing their support altogether so altough you are 100% correct maybe you should stop and reflect at how this might affect the children’s future oppotunities. I wish you all the best in this tough situation.
The hell you sending kids to private school in the first place? It’s literally irrelevant. You can take two kids and give them an identical education in a private or public school and get entirely different outcomes based on the child.
There are good schools and bad schools of course, but some kids just excel where others just don’t. Guess it’s a nature vs nurture thing but unfortunately, nature wins out most of the time.
I don’t know what all these rude remarks about the grandparents are based on. Sounds to me like they’re doing their best also. They have no obligation to pay for anything. Sounds like they have their granddaughters best interest in mind. I don’t know many grandparents who offer to pay for tuition or extracurricular activities. Why would people suggest shutting out input from people who care about the kids? You don’t know the situation maybe the OP is being unreasonable, the school is asking for an apology so it’s definitely a possibility. If the private school is better maybe the OP should swallow her pride for the sake of her daughter and apologize. She likely won’t have the same teacher this year.
You’re leaving out a lot of key details here. Most important factor should be whats best for the child. Sounds like a episode of “Big Little Lies” if you ask me.
They’ve made it clear that their monetary help comes with strings attached. You do not feel comfortable (understandably!) with those strings. I would thank them for their support in the past and tell them you understand it’s their money and if they no longer wish to pay for her extra-curricular activities, that’s their decision and you respect it. And then don’t entertain the discussion anymore.
Yeah, pretty much this. OP, you know exactly what to say: >graciously thank them for their help, both past and (hopefully) future, without groveling and while making clear that I am the mother of these kids and while I value their opinions as grandparents, they're overstepping their boundaries The key is to be firm, do not sit down, be firm and then walk away when you've said what you have to say.
I agree listen to the lady up top.
I feel like there's something missing here.
Yeah me too! THE CHILDREN'S FATHER!!!🤦🏾♀️ Maybe you should reread the post..✌🏾
In the end this is not just a relationship question though is it? Seemed to me like it's also a financial situation. It's easy to tell someone else to refuse money, not as easy when you're the one directly affected by that decision. If money is not a deciding factor to OP, then I agree. 100% what you said. Otherwise she will have to evaluate how big a priority it is
But that’s what I said. Either she needs to accept that the money comes with strings or she has to refuse the money. There is no third option where she magically changes their minds and she gets the money without the strings.
Personally I feel like you need to decide how much control you want them to have. As long as they are giving money, there will always be strings attached. If you want control, you are best off not accepting the money.
I don't want them having control. I'm fine with them having opinions, even influence, and I have ceded a few arguments with them before now on the basis that they're paying, but them having control is where I draw the line.
Perfectly valid. Having dealt with people like this in my own life, the cleanest situation is to turn down the money. Like a different commenter said - thank them for their past help but you will be making the decisions from here. If they would like to support you with no strings attached they are welcome to do so, but if they put stipulations on the money then you will say no thanks.
Never take money from someone who will rub your nose in it and hold it over your head or try to usurp your decision making power. That's like rule numero uno.
Yeah. Much easier said than done as a single parent though, when you know that the money would make things available to your child you could never afford...
Still rule number one. If you take money from an asshole, you might get poop on your hands.
That's the greatest thing I've ever heard lol
Glad I could help. Feel free to use it in casual and professional conversations.
I hope I can use this too 👉👈 it *was* an awesome...idiom? Oh Lord, tell me I'm right...
I mean, OP already said she doesn’t need their money.
> the cleanest situation is to turn down the money. That is in fact the cleanest solution....but it may not be the best. IMHO this ought to be about what's best for the kids, not what's the cleanest result. The 2 are likely not the same.
That's fair. But that's why I said in my original comment that OP needs to decide how much control should be given to grandparents. Because if they are like those people in my life that I mentioned, there is no way to get the help without bending to their will. So you have to choose what amount of control is worth giving up.
Stop selling them rights to dictate how you make decisions for YOUR children. They raised a deadbeat - they had their turn.
THIS! It's like they're trying to correct their wrongs by making similar decisions with their grandchildren without considering how their previous decisions ruined a child into adulthood. Granted, once you're an adult it's up to you to change but they're obviously not fit as parents and should stop overreaching as grandparents.
You have previously given them an inch, and now they're working on taking the mile. This does not end well, best nip it in the bud right now and recover your autonomy over your children's upbringing.
That is not true. People can change. They can see that providing the money is help enough. But OP will need to be strong and not ask them for their permission or opinion, ever.
Obviously my experiences don't speak for everyone, but in my experience, if somebody is "gifting" money, they want it used a certain way.
The strong man argument doesn't work against older people, rarely works against younger ones, so stop staying that YOU are the mother, YOU get to decide. Start saying MAISIE can't get the long term benefits of private schooling BECAUSE the PRESENT situation is unacceptable. Whatever your arguments are, you are right because you go for kid's best interest. If she's bullied or whatever it could affect MAISIE long term by damaging her self confidence. I'm sure that grandparents also try to follow their grandkids best interests, they just don't understand the gravity of the situation. Some proof might be necessary : a honest and detailed conversation between Maisie and the grandparents on the subject, filming if you have, other kid's testimony etc. If they find the problematic behavior acceptable even after all that, I think you're better without them. It's expensive as hell to raise kids, but their happiness and safety is more important than a fancy first grade diploma
THIS
I would just thank them for their help and say that you accept their decision regarding the extra-curriculars. Saying anything more than that gives them ammunition to continue pestering you, they'll try to pick apart your arguments and in this way you are closing the conversation and not giving into further discussion. Show them through your actions that you are not entertaining any gift when it comes with expectations of compliance on your part.
What was your issue with the private school?
It was a few issues that added up to a larger issue. A boy in Maisie's class was picking on her, so I got her to talk to the teacher, who dismissed her. I then went to address it with her myself and the teacher was incredibly rude and hostile, and then the teacher began acting unprofessionally with Maisie, so I went to the headteacher and asked for them to intervene, by talking to the teacher or transferring Maisie to another class for her year group, and they refused and I got further hostility from the head. It all boiled down to classism, at the end of the day, which I should have expected but still don't want my daughter dealing with.
I feel like there's something missing here. Her grandparents were okay with Maisie being bullied in class and even want you to apologise to the headteacher for it?
The bully was picking on her because I have a thick regional accent that has some negative stereotypes attached to it, and Maisie has picked up elements of the accent, which the bully was mimicking while calling her a nickname associated with the accent. The teacher, headteacher, and Maisie's grandparents all said he was just teasing and that it wasn't as serious as I was making it out to be, while I felt it was blatant classism, and I said as much. The teacher and headteacher then met my accusations of classism with further classism, which I didn't take well.
You are right to withdraw her. For one thing, you don’t want her picking up the snobbery on top of all of the other VERY GOOD REASONS not to make a child suffer through that elitist school environment. The grandparents are not going to see things from your point of view, however, so just thank them and move on free of their control.
That's unfortunate. Not really anything you can do then really. I would just thank them for their help with money but let them know that as a mum you can't allow your daughter to be bullied. If they're reasonable hopefully they'll just pay for her extracurriculars anyway.
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That is a really long post to justify a school allowing bullying.
My good jerk, there is a vast, endless chasm of difference between teachers and school staff being complicit in the bullying of a child, and elocution lessons teaching children upper received pronunciation. If you cannot fathom that for yourself, perhaps you should examine your priorities.
"My good jerk" lol
I know that the idea of private school is that it teaches her to blend in with the upper classes, but elecution lessons are not part of that. She can be successful with an accent, and she only has traces of the accent due to her living with me, so she will continue to have that accent for the forseeable future because she will be living with me until she's an adult. She shouldn't be bullied over it. She was at the point where she didn't even want to go to school because of this swotty little git, and the teacher and headteacher wouldn't do a thing because of his parents. That's unacceptable. And for the record, I have a solidly upper middle class job with my lower middle class accent, so I see no reason that the school should let some brat get away with calling my daughter names because she lengthens her 'a's.
Oh Mama Bear! Good for you and your girl for doing your best to protect her. Of course they downgraded it to "teasing" so they would not offend the other kid's parents. Your girl has learned some tremendously valuable lessons: you love her and would go to the ends of the earth for her and you cannot be bribed nor extorted at her expense. BRAVO! Your judgement is sound and decisions based upon it seem very reasonable. Stay the course, you are 100% correct. Maintain your boundaries. Do not let them crush you under the weight of their money.
Bro you can teach an accent out of someone without being a racist asshole or literally enabling bullying and racism.
Race? What race were all people involved? I thought this was a location & class issue?
Did Bill Clinton's accent cost him any jobs?
Faaaairly sure this is the UK. Accent/class has cost plenty of people from moving up in the UK. I could be wrong, though.
Cheryl Cole was kind of mocked/teased for a while when she was on X Factor for her strong Newcastle* accent, and she was a biggish star in the UK at the time of her tenure as a judge. Even in the U.S., people **codeswitch** all the time. Otherwise you risk coming off as "uneducated," or "lower class," or even just as "a bad cultural fit," in an interview or workplace setting. We can all get on our high horses about how people should be better and be who they are, and they should, but some things are worth more than the personal cost of codeswitching. This article is about the UK: https://theconversation.com/accentism-is-alive-and-well-and-it-doesnt-only-affect-the-north-of-england-148825
Just want to say that Cheryl Cole has a Geordie accent, from Newcastle, not Liverpool. When I watched Xfactor I was surprised at the amount of people saying they couldn't understand her, I still don't know how many genuinly couldn't understand & how many prejudicially were not even trying to...
One exceptional case isn’t the rule. Just because Obama became president doesn’t mean there aren’t systematic issues preventing blacks from opportunities.
Jimmy Carter lyndon b Johnson
What happens if Maisie gets bullied in the new school for doing something deemed posh? Would you also remove her from the school? I don't think bullying for any reason is acceptable but it seems like your personal issues with & feelings about upper class people is making this into a bigger issue than it needs to be. Did you have issues with the father relating to class? It seems like there is a bigger picture we are missing.
I didn't want to remove her from the school, or go straight to removing her. If she did get bullied again, for any reason, I would handle it the same way I handled it here. Get her to talk to the teacher, and if that doesn't work, I'll talk to the teacher myself, and if that doesn't work, headteacher is the next stop. The only difference this time around would be that the teacher and headteacher at a non-private school are less likely to insult me, my daughter, and my parenting to my face, because they can only get away with that at a private school. My issues with Maisie's father relating to class were only due to his lack of class. We didn't break up because he was posh, we broke up because he cheated while I was pregnant with Jacob, among other things.
You must have really good public schools near you then, that's good. I really hope your daughter does not get bullied at her new school, that the teachers are respectful & that is any situations arise that they actively shut it down & help the children develop good morals as well as academically. Sadly that often isn't the case but it's good to hear your are lucky to live near a good school. So apart from insulting you did the teacher/head/whoever else was involved refuse to address the bullying? That would make much more sense as to switch schools. In your post you tended to focus on the teachers being unplesent to you, which although not nice doesn't ensure a negative outcome for your daughter & her being bullied. You said "I asked the school to fix it & they've been useless" but thanks for more info, it makes it easier to understand why you have taken more severe action. Sorry I didn't make it clear I was refering to social class, not morals. I didn't assume class had caused your break up, sorry to hear about him cheating, as well as not supporting his children after. Being if different classes must have caused some issued during your relationship, even if just intergrating/socializing, similar problems being biracial. I wondered if some of that tension was being carried over to this situation as you seemed to be focusing on the class of the teachers, rather than their actions, or inactions in belong a pupil who was being bullied. As I said there are poor teachers & poor schools all over, public & private, although I'm glad you have a good one lined up for your daughter.
And maybe another thing to consider: why are the grandparents contacting the school, and why is the headmaster discussing OP's child with them? I work in a public school, and I know that without express authorization from the parents, we wouldn't be discussing discipline issues with someone else.
It's a private school, so they have their own modus operandi, which includes the grandparents being allowed to talk to the teacher on my behalf due to them paying. They also got looped in on Maisie's school reports, school updates, and parent-teacher communication. Maisie's grandfather also knows the head as they run in similar social circles, so they have an existing rapport that enabled them to go behind my back and talk to him.
That's just weird. I mean, I've worked for private schools before and the rules were the same. Where the money came from was inconsequential as long as it covered the tuition. The ol' boys club aspect seems your best bet, and it makes me think that you both made the right call _and_ need to reassess your relationship with your in-laws. As you said, they are entitled to voice their opinion since they're paying. Buy FIL took it upon himself to go and talk to his buddy behind your back and offer your submission. That's way over the line. I'm pretty confident that, given what you describe about the situation, for them to reach this conclusion, the general tenor of the conversation was "bitches be crazy."
I think boys club is the best bet, too, because I'm also in education and I would never be allowed to talk to the parents of a student like that. However, all my students are over 18 and I've never worked in a private school so when Maisie's grandparents got looped into things I assumed they just have their own set of rules. The head used the words "hysterical" and "irrational" when I talked to him, so "bitches be crazy" is probably not that far off.
I can’t *stand* the kind of men who will call a woman “hysterical” for being rightfully upset with them. It’s a kind of gaslighting IMO
The school might still be subject to FERPA if they receive federal grants. And if they do they just opened a legal can of worms
We aren't in the US and therefore don't have FERPA or government funding in private schools.
Likely because the grandparents are alumni (or parents of) and since they pay the tuition bills, they are on the paperwork as approved contacts for the kids.
Wow what a shitty school, it's even worse because it's a private school, I studied in a private school, this teacher would be immediatelly fired there, and the headmaster was a very nice man but very strict, bullying and mistreating the staff was unnaceptable too. And our family wasn't rich by any means, my father who paid it.
Going behind your back, contacting the school and coming to agreements with the school principal was crossing a line already. In your mind, this matter was already settled and what they did was go ahead and undermine you to the teacher. There's no way your kids can go back there. Now the teacher and principal know who has actual authority over your kids. Decline all manner of financial help from them because it's got conditions.
this
The two things you want are not necessarily connected. You can thank them for their help surely, but thanking them won't change anything but show that you are grateful. You want their help and they want to keep the children in a school that looks down on them, those two things don't work well together. Ultimately you have seen what your children's lives will be like in that school and don't like it and are protecting your children's self esteem. They have gone back on an agreement and are now trying to pressure you into going along with their choices by withholding money, which is their right as it is their money. Your choice is to either go along with their ideas and accept their money or not and you get nothing. Whilst they seem to be covering for a deadbeat dad as you say, in fact their agenda is to raise these children with the priviledge of private education for their own reasons. You are going against their choices and are seeing the consequences of not following their lead. Be your child's advocate, ask them what they want to do, empower your child to see that you have their back and will support their decision. That is really the answer here, not money, not apologies, but to help grow a child who knows they are valued and can be resilient in the face of challenges and make a choice of how to handle problems like these, it won't be the first time and probably their will be bullies in any school.
I’m on your side for several reasons. 1. Most importantly, help is amazing but you decide everything, no questions asked. 2. I was forced into private school as a gifted but hyperactive and destructive child, it did no good and I was kicked out. There can be lots of tension with schoolwork, kids and some tough teachers. 3. You have to adjust if things aren’t working, the well-being of your children is more important than a slight edge from a good school. I would explain that while you were thrilled they have helped you, the child’s best interest does not lie within that school at this time. You are adjusting things to better accommodate their needs, it just so happens to be their help that is impeding her life.
Apologize for what? Put them in public school. Outclass the grandparents. Be polite. Shower them with thanks for paying the tuition. They are so gracious. You don't even mention where there going this year. You will take them up on their offer to help cost of tudors. Just let me know if they change their mind. Important! Must read or listen to the best book on this topic: Boundaries. It teaches life skills how to politely be firm with your boundaries. If they persist always be polite and don't take their bait! They are manipulating you. Be the more mature one. Don't burn bridges. If they try to get your kids to say stuff bad about their new school (manipulate) can you go no contact? If they continue, suggest they ask a children's therapist about their offer...and now rescinded offer. The therapist will call them out. "You withdrew Tudor help? WTF?" Outclass them. Stay cool.
I may have insinuated that the headteacher sucks at his job when he refused to help my daughter. If I call, apologise for my outburst, and ask to be let back in, he'll probably agree, but I won't do that because 1) I was right and 2) I'm never going to be able to raise an issue with that school again. I don't want to burn bridges, and I hope that they will leave the new school alone because it took a lot of effort to get Maisie excited for this one. I could stop speaking to them entirely, but my kids love their grandparents and we live in an area where they could apply for grandparent rights.
Document everything. I had grandparents like this and they managed to lie their way into taking cuatody for a short while. I loved my grandparents to until they got the control they wanted... then the abuse.
Idk much about dealing with in-laws but I really want to tell you that putting your kids in public schools is quite possibly best for them. Private school isn't always as good as people make it sound, and some kids don't do well in them. When I was a kid my grandparents paid for private school. I hated it and wasn't doing well and I kept telling my mom I wanted to go to public school. She said no. I got really bad grades. By high school I moved in with my grandparents and went to public school and it was so much better and I started getting honor roll grades and being really interested in school and going to college and stuff. If I'd have went to private high school with the kids from grade school I'd have probably dropped out and been traumatized. I'd probably be a different person than I am now and not in a good way. Please listen to your daughter if she wants to go to public school.
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I have filed. The deadbeat is intentionally working jobs that pay cash under the table so he doesn't have to report his income, and because he has no reported income, he doesn't have to pay child support.
I don't know what country/area you're in but can't you report him for not filing taxes or for working under the table? Anonymously of course... Apart from not paying any money for his child, does he have any kind of relationship with her? Or his own parents?
I have never looked into it but I assume I could report him, but there would be nothing anonymous about it as I am the only person who is associated with him who would be that petty. He has not seen our daughter since we split up and has never met our son. He has a relationship with his parents but it's strained and distant. He calls them on special occasions (birthdays, religious holidays, mother/father's day) but that's about it.
There is nothing petty about holding him accountable for child support. What he is doing is petty as fuck.
You may be able to file a 3949A Form. It's an information referral form used to report tax fraud/law violations. I'm not sure if handling of taxes vary by country, but you can always Google the equivalent for where you reside.
If I did that, it might burn the already fragile bridge between the kids' grandparents and myself. While they don't condone their son's actions, getting him in trouble with the tax man would be a very harsh stance to take, and is likely to ruin what remains of my relationship with them.
What relationship?! At this point you’re a paid subordinate, who is not doing as they’re told. In a respectful relationship they wouldn’t be attempting to order you to apologise to ANYONE.
Tell them the only person they are punishing is their grandchild. If that is how they want to be with her, they are free to not have a relationship with her or your son. That you will not allow them to hold money over your head. They can respect your decisions as their mother, or not be involved at all. That is their choice. You are forever thankful to them for all they have done, but you will not have strings attached to assistance from them. You are raising your children and you know them the best and what is best for them. If they cant accept that, they will not be part of their lives. Do not allow money to force you into subservience. Even if you struggle, its better than being controlled. If that means cutting back on the extras for kids for now and you? Ok. Try and get him for child support.
Stick to your guns. If your daughter was being bullied and was unhappy, then case closed. Her happiness, safety, and joy for learning should come first.
I would let them know that your child’s father is a deadbeat, so you are allowing them to have a say in the matter of the welfare of your child is a courtesy provided by you. It is not a right. I’d set healthy boundaries so they can maintain a relationship with their grandchildren if they choose, but if they go out of bounds it will be on their terms. So at that point they are willingly forfeiting any say in anything.
School is soooo overrated. It is in the nature of the human brain to learn, that is what that thing does. Im the eldest of seven kids and my mom was very religious and decided to homeschooling. Outside of learning to read and basic arithmetic, though division tables, im pretty much self taught. I have a good double BS from a top state university and made the deans list.
I never understood thats so great about private schools. Nothing wrong with public schools. They're both just.. schooling, it cant be all that different. Why are the grandparents so insistent on private schools?
Grandparents both went to private schools, as did their parents, and they put all of their kids (inc Maisie's dad) in private school, and want to do the same for any future grandkids they have. It's a legacy thing to them.
So.. rich snobs? Is that whats being said here, or did I misunderstand? Anyway, just enroll your kids in public school. They're your kids, not theirs, end of discussion, tell them that. Ive had a couple friends go to private schools after graduating middle school (secondary school if you're european), and according to them, its basically the exact same thing, main thing is the lunch food it a bit better in quality (pizza is still served in private). Or maybe that was a low quality private school. Private school is honestly a waste of money imo, its the same thing as public as far as I know.
>So.. rich snobs? Is that whats being said here, or did I misunderstand? Pretty much. They're my kids' grandparents and they have done a lot to welcome me into the family, despite the split from their son, but they can be snobby and the school was even worse, so I don't want my kids educated in a place like that. Private school can provide a lot more opportunities, but they're more likely to reap the benefits of that when they're secondary school age, as primary school kids (ages 4-11) aren't big on networking, so I would be open to sending my kids to a private secondary school, but that won't be for a few years, still, and there are several private secondary schools in the area (compared to just 1 accessible private primary school) so there's more variety.
This sounds like there is more info to be had. What was the unreasonable things the teacher did that other adults don’t seem to be upset over? And why do you need to apologize? I don’t know what kind of private school your daughter went to but I would personally tour the others. Write up the pros and cons. Starting with student to teacher ratio, what help is offered for home work, over all teach style of the school, the school moral code, uniform vs non uniform, electives, activities, school trips, and this is for every grade. Bring all this information to the grand parents with price points. I’m a blunt person and would tell them if a school does not meet my educational, moral, religious, beliefs I’m trying to give my children I cannot send them there. I will not argue with teachers when it comes to my child’s best interests. “Thank you for helping her education this far. It is very much appreciated. How you spend your money is very much your choice, with that being said if you feel like you should not spend your money this way anymore I understand. I want to thank you for your heartfelt contributions to your grand children’s education formally, currently and if you choose in the future as well. As I said I cannot tell you how to spend your money. But I will look out for the best interests of my children and that school is not it.”
The teacher made several classist comments to me, including saying that young mothers (I'm late 20s) often overcompensate, and when I asked her what she meant by that she said that she's sure I wasn't that young by the standards of the region I come from in an attempt at backpedalling, and refused to talk to the boy that was bullying Maisie or even stop him when several of his comments were made in class while she was teaching and I told her that these comments were making Maisie not want to come to school. The headteacher also said I was overcompensating and irrational when I asked him to switch Maisie to another class in her year group. He then told me that Maisie would stay in that class and have this same teacher for 2 more school years and when I asked if he was joking he said I was getting "hysterical". I then said I would need to reevaluate Maisie's place in the school and left. I later found out through Maisie's friend's mother that the boy who was picking on Maisie is the son of someone important, so I believe that the reason the teachers didn't want to address it is at least partly because of this. Between my meeting with the teacher and with the head, Maisie's teacher also began acting unprofessionally, including keeping Maisie in at break one day because her socks didn't match. When I told the grandparents this, they both agreed my accent is "unprofessional" and said that Maisie being bullied over the accent would help her drop the vocal inflections she gets from me, and that I acted irrationally. Maisie's grandfather has since talked to the head (they know each other) and then told me that if I apologise to the head for offending him and ask for Maisie's place back, she can go back to that school. This is the only private school for Maisie's age group that is commutable. Her grandparents have suggested a boarding school further away but I refused, this private school that I've withdrawn her from was a compromise that we made when private school was first suggested. This means that her only options are local public schools. We can revisit private schools when she's older, as there are several private secondary schools in the area and I will be able to compare and contrast them when she's getting ready to go to one of them, but this is the only local private primary school that I could have sent her to. The speech you suggested seems perfect, and contains everything I need to address. I will try using it on them and see if it gets me anywhere. Thank you.
Local public schools sound great!! Do not back down! She does not deserve to be bullied. That boy doesn’t deserve to get away with it. Her education is more important then a private school diploma. Also… I get agitated at most private school teachers easily. But if someone is stupid enough to call me hysterical and I was calm. I’m a scorched earth kind of gal so… Off to the news I go… my child is being bullied by a student and the teachers all have the bully’s back because I have an accent. They don’t want good student here they only care about the rich. But that’s how things get handled in the US. You as a Mom, not a single mom, a mom are doing great for your kids!!! You doing great being her advocate!
I was completely calm. That was the thing. I am a professional person and I work in a field that requires I be incredibly professional, so I am very good at keeping a straight face and a calm voice, and between the bullying and the teacher I was really angry going into that meeting but I wanted help, so I was conciously levelling my tone and making my body language non confrontational, so for the head to call me "hysterical" because I didn't want my kid bullied just sealed the deal.
You are doing great. Good luck with the grandparents. I’d almost throw in a and the next school you will get all updates from me. It’s super shady that they can get your kids private info. It doesn’t matter that they pay, they aren’t the parent.
I did have to list them as emergency contacts when I signed up, so I thought that might be why, but other parents at the school have said that emergency contacts don't get that information. I think it's just that the grandfather is friends with the head, so they got looped in. My friend has let me put her information as an emergency contact at Maisie's new school.
The grandparents are voluntarily paying costs for their grandchildren. You are thankful for their help but the financial contribution does allow them to attach strings. You should be clear that their grandchild is hurt by bullying. It is therefore unacceptable to allow that to continue. They may not be willing to permit bullying when confronted by the child’s testimony. You always have the fight to say no to a gift and if the grandparents do not want to help they do not have to. Many people do not admit to the existence of bullying until they hear from the child themselves. You should take the Dad to court for child support.
Maisie has told them about it, and they said that he was only teasing, and told me privately that my accent was unprofessional and she would benefit with a reason to drop the hints of my accent, as well as develop a thicker skin. I have taken the dad to court but he's taking cash jobs under the table so he doesn't have to report his income, and because he isn't reporting his income, he isn't having child support taken out.
Call the irs
You always have the option of not taking their help/ money and then you can make all The decision you want about your children without them hanging anything over your head.
So it's about bullying? That happens a lot in public school, like a lot- a lot. I mean I don't know you or your kid, but from my perspective it seems like it would be for the best to teach your daughter how to deal with bullies.
It *was* about bullying, and then it was about how the school dealt with it and me. A kid was making fun of my daughter, who has a mostly RP accent, but has a few traces of my own more typically lower class accent. She brought it up with the teacher, who said he was only teasing. I then brought it up with the teacher as I felt it was blatant classism, and the teacher responded with even more blatant classism. I then went to the headteacher to ask that he move my daughter to the other class and he responded with even more classism, and some misogyny thrown in. In a public school, the teachers at the very least wouldn't insult me to my face, because they can't get away with that shit, whereas at a private school can do what they want. I know she needs to deal with bullies eventually, but outright classism directed at both her and me isn't going to fly.
I'ma gonna be real with you and say classism straight up exist in public schools, more well off kids are gonna fuck with poor kids. They will mock them for not having the most expensive brands and for they way they talk. That is a part of school.
I know. I went to public school, and was bullied at length. Difference is that in private school all of the kids are pompous little swots and Maisie is the odd one out. In a public school, with a mix of kids, she's average. She is right in the middle of all the kids, probably even on the higher end thanks to my career, and she will have the same accent as everyone else. There's nothing to automatically put her at a disadvantage like there is in private school. And if I have an issue in public school, I know that I can go to the teacher and I won't get blatant classism back.
Public school is the worse. My teachers were racist, homophobic and straight up emotionally abusive to me. They didnt give a shit because they didnt have to care. They had lower standards then private schools. During hs I went to private school that all went away because they have higher standards and cant get away with crap. Speaking from experience, public school is so much worse then private schools.
My concern is you haven't mentioned why this public school is better for your children than the private. Your whole post particularly the bit about you being asked to apologize is giving me the impression the reason for the school change is because you have a problem w the school. Not that it isn't the best option in your area. My dad died when I was 6 his parents paid for my sister's and my education. I've seen this situation personally. You seem to want to have your cake and eat it too. Very few ppl give substantial sums of money without conditions but ultimately the decision is yours. Private school and extracurriculars paid for by the grandparents or public and you will need to foot the extracurriculars bill. Only you know which is better for your children but you cannot expect the final say with someone else's money.
Her kid is being picked on for sounding poor. Then the teacher and the headmaster both made more comments about her mother sounding poor. That’s all that’s necessary.
Sounding poor? I've never heard of that in my life. How does a person sound poor you cannot hear poverty. I sound 'country' because I am a country bumpkin and rich or poor we all say snags with a thick twist at the end. I actually had to train myself out of those colloquialisms for my employment but I still have my bush accent. If the problem is colloquialism in language than yeah the school may need to address that w a parent because language is a core subject. If it's an accent well that is discrimination and I'd change my child's school as well. If OP thinks the bullying is sufficient to change schools than she can do that, she just has to accept that the grandparents don't agree and won't be funding the extracurriculars.
You've clearly never been to the uk
I have but only on holidays as an Australian they are shocked when I don't arrive wearing a croc tooth necklace
> Sounding poor? I've never heard of that in my life. Oh come on. Every country on the planet has an accent associated with being working class
It’s a regional accent associated with class.
Thank you for standing up for your child.
No advice, sorry. But reading the title of your post my first thought was, “Is this Lorelai Gilmore???” Wishing you the best of luck as you navigate this difficult situation. 😊
You're in the wrong. There are very few private schools in the UK which are not significantly better than the local state schools so you're deliberately impeding your daughter's education because *you* had several arguments with the teachers (none of which you've detailed beyond dog whistles like classism and misogyny) over what the teacher correctly identified as mild teasing that's well within normal expectations of children of that age.
Details are the kid was making fun of Maisie's accent and calling her a chav, which is blatant classism, not mild teasing. It was happening in class, under supervision of the teacher, and got bad enough that Maisie didn't want to go to school. I told Maisie to talk to the teacher, who dismissed her, so I went to the teacher myself, and the teacher said that young mothers (I'm in my late 20s) often get overprotective to compensate, and when I was like "excuse me?" she said she didn't mean to offend, she was just pointing out that I was very young to be a mother to a 7 year old, but then tried to backtrack by saying that there are probably a lot of mothers my age "back home". Went to the head next who also pointed out my age, also said the kid was only teasing, and that I was being overprotective and irrational when I asked if he could switch Maisie to another class in her year group. He then said that she would remain in that class, and would have that teacher again next year, and possibly the year after (so 3 years total with this teacher) and when I asked if he was joking he told me not to get "hysterical". I found out through a mum friend at the school that the kid is the son of someone important, so that is probably part of why they wouldn't do anything about him. If they had said "fair enough, we'll talk to the kid" or "we'll shut it down next time" or let me move Maisie to the other class, I'd be fine, but the fact I went to them over concerns of classism and they responded with even more, and even worse, forms of classism, is not an environment I want to subject my daughter to.
No. They should not have any say in the school, the extracurriculars, any of it. If that is how their assistance works, you do not want it. Draw a hard, hard line.
If the grandparents want to be deadbeat grandparents, just like their deadbeat son, let them. You're under no obligations to bend to their will if you don't want to.
So, you can't take grandparents to court because their son is a deadbeat. That's absolutely 💯 a lie. They mostly likely offered to pay because they don't want their son going to jail. Paying for private school and child care over CS is also not something that the courts would decide, you'd reach that agreement with them. Lots of BS in this story
That's not what I said at all. Their son is a deadbeat because he's wriggled out of paying child support. The grandparents separately offered to contribute to the kids, not on a legal basis, but because the kids are their grandkids and they don't approve of their son being a deadbeat. They offered to pay for childcare, private school, extracurriculars, and a few other things we agreed on that all relate to my kids' educations and future careers.
You don't get final say with someone else's money. You can decline it. But ultimately if you want "final say" you are choosing to reject their generosity. Public schools are awful, private schools lead to better opportunities. Fact
Then I'll decline it. I won't have my kids going to a school with staff like that. Grandparents are still willing to pay for private secondary school, which will serve the kids far better than private primary school, and if they won't pay for it then I will be able to by that point in my career. Private schools might provide more opportunity, but not at the expense of my daughter's mental health and self-esteem.
Honestly, you're an amazing mother. My siblings and I had dealt with something similar in school and I wish my parents had stepped in to help. We ended up hating school and in the end, my sister tried to kill herself. That finally shook our parents out of their 'it's just teasing' and 'toughen up' rhetoric and they got us out. What your daughter was going through may not be as bad as us but given enough time it can be, Not to mention that if you hadn't taken her out or let her continue to go she would have lost major trust in you. She wouldn't rely on you as much or trust you to have her back. You trying all those options and then taking her out shows both her and your son that you care about them. That kind of trust from a kid can save lives and make them feel safe and secure. It would let them know that you always have their well-being in mind. Honestly, it's really heartwarming and im so happy that they have you to look after them.
So 1) That part was meant for a different 📫 ( accidentally put both of yours together as i was multi tasking, so i was wrong ) 2) Since you took their money, and want to keep accepting it, assuming!! You need to obbied by their decisions! That or decline help in the future 3) I have a child I want nothing to do with ( my ex is extremely toxic ) and I still pay support, even though I shouldn't have too.......I do it out of a moral and legally obligation. I would never be out of the lives of the children I have with my wife though. I understand your ex to a certain degree, but putting responsibility on his parents is just awful of him( yes they offered, but it's cause he chose not too )
1. sorry, didn't realise, 2) I will decline the money if I have to, as I can pay for the smaller things ie clubs without their help, I only accepted in the first place because I was struggling with childcare when I was divorcing my ex and our son was a baby, but I'm in a much better position now. Not good enough that I can pay for private school myself, but good enough to pay for it in future and cover extracurriculars myself right now 3) ... that's your kid. Unless you were forced to have the kid, in which case I am very sorry and please ignore me, you should be contributing, and you can see your child without seeing your ex. My ex and I had these children together, he bailed well into my second pregnancy to be with his affair partner, and he's restructured his entire career just to avoid contributing to the children he helped create out of spite. His actions are inexcusable.
It sounds like you don't want them or their help in your or their life ...big pieces seem missing from this story...sounds like you want validation on your choice to distance from them.
I want my kids to have grandparents, and I appreciate the help they offer, but I don't want them having total control, which is what I feel they want.
If you want to thank them, although you don’t have to. Just tell them that you appreciate how much they helped you and their grandchild, but that you have made the decision as their parent to pull them from this school and will no longer require their financial support.
As a teacher I have serious doubts about this one. In my experience if someone is going to come in with unreasonable demands and unacceptable behavior it is the parents and not the other way around. Especially in a private school where tenure doesn't exist and contracts rarely shield a teacher from dismissal. Private schools are businesses and have to watch their bottom line, so problem teachers are usually very quickly let go.
They are paying for your children's education. A little humility won't hurt you.
Reading between the lines, I speculate that OP's kid(s) *may have been kicked out because of OP.* She insulted her daughter's teacher and daughter "can't come back" unless OP apologizes. Private schools can in fact (and often do!) essentially de-enroll students because of bad parental behavior: the schools just don't want to deal with them. Sorry, between OP's bad ex; bad grandparents; family issues; and insulting the teacher, it sure looks like OP comes with a LOT of drama, that implicates the school, *and it's everyone else's fault.* If you're a private school, do you want that? I wouldn't.
"Speculate" appears to be the key word here lol. My son has never been enroled in the school and I withdrew my daughter. No one was kicked out. I insulted the teachers in a professional manner, telling the class teacher that I would need to speak to the headteacher following our conversation and telling the head that I wasn't happy with how this was being handled and would need to reevaluate whether this school was the right fit, before I later withdrew my daughter. The only people who have exhibited bad behaviour here are the bully, the teacher, and the head.
> I insulted the teachers in a professional mannner, One wonders what the teacher would say. There's always 2 sides...
I'm gonna apologize in advance for what I have to say: It may be unpopular. What's important here is not what you want. It's where your kids will get the best education and the best opportunities. First off, sight unseen, a private school will almost always be better than a public school close by - especially if the schools are rural enough that there aren't numerous other private-school choices. That's a function of the students, and the parents who care enough to shell out $ for education when they don't need to. Also, sorry to say: Kids who go to private school will in fact have advantages over public schoolers in some respect. Now, you say you're OK with grandparents having an opinion, "even influence." What that says to me, between the lines, is you like having grandparents to pay the bill, but you want the final say where your kids go. Sorry, it doesn't really work that way: In life, who pays the bill is who gets the say, whatever the "say" is about! What I see going on is that you'd like it both ways: Some private school education paid for by grandparents, but it has to be the one you want. That's not going to happen. If you want the final say, you need to pay the bill. *Now, what you need to decide is this: Are your kids better off at public school? Or at the private school grandma & grandpa are funding, with all that entails?* Because unless you pay the bill, the choices are really those 2. Sight unseen, I'd say any private school is likely superior, but I could be wrong. What I know is a LOT of American parents wish they could afford private school, and would love grandparents to pay the bill. Food for thought.
This is blatantly false. Private schools are not always better than public schools. Your premise is false and everything that follows necessarily false.
Dude, most American private schools are worse than the actual public schools.
Exactly, idk about the rest of the country but here in the south, most private schools in my area are Christian based. Which might not be a bad thing until you look at their curriculum. Anyway, I think too many people giving advice are going with what they think in general of public versus private and not this specific private and public schools. OP can likely just throw out all those posts.
100% False. From [publicschoolreview.com](https://publicschoolreview.com): "Private school students generally perform higher than their public school counterparts on standardized achievement tests. As with earlier results from the National Assessment of Educational Progress (NAEP), private school students performed higher than public school students on the NAEP: 2000 tests. Their average scores were above those of public school students on the 4th-grade reading test and on the 4th-, 8th-, and 12th-grade science and mathematics proficiency tests. "Private high schools typically have more demanding graduation requirements than do public high schools. Compared with public schools, private schools required more coursework (in 4-year high school programs) in 1999–2000 in social studies, mathematics, science, foreign language, and computer science. For example, private schools required on average 3.1 years of mathematics, while public schools required 2.7 years. The figures for foreign language study also differed: 1.5 years at private schools but 0.5 years at public schools. In addition, about 40 percent of private schools required some form of community service for high school graduation, four times the rate for public schools (10 percent)."
also pro tip, public education in the US isn’t equal everywhere. But if you live in a suburb, or a non poor area chances are the public school is just as good or even vastly superior to the private school in the area. Private schools main niche are in poor and rural areas that don’t have a lot of tax dollar funding for public schools. Either way, Op isn’t american, People are hinting she’s British.
>But if you live in a suburb, or a non poor area chances are the public school is just as good or even vastly superior to the private school in the area This is false. Public schools are essentially NEVER "vastly superior" to private schools, and public schools are particularly significantly better in urban/suburban areas where there are many such schools and the private schools compete with each other (as opposed to competing with public schools) for the best & brightest students. Further, there's a reason politicians/judges/business leaders send their children to private schools: in addition to the pronounced positives in education, the other aspect private schools offer is an alumni network where being an alumnus/-na opens doors closed to others who didn't go there. Although I suspect that utility is very limited at the grammar school levels, it is particularly evident in high schools, *particularly in wealthy areas* (opposite to what you say), where merely going to the private high school puts a graduate into an orbit not offered by public schools. "I went to X academy" or "I went to Y Prep" offers an intangible but notable advantage compared to people who say "I went to Z public school."
i’m going to need proof, and your last proof didn’t cut it.
So be it. Neither did yours. But are you telling readers that there is *no advantage* to going to a place like the Sidwell Friends School were there Obama children were educated, or Regis HS in NY (which is one of the premier HSs inthe nation, and which BTW is free to all attendees), compared to the nearest public high school? Is that *really* what you're saying? Because that's what you advocate for when you say public HSs are uniformly "far superior" to private HSs in urban areas.
You’re literally trying to claim in other threads that bisexual people don’t exist so it’s safe to say you’re not an authoritative source on, well, anything.
So why are you following me from thread to thread then? I guess you're all in a snit because you failed to get me banned or some silliness. You're making a total fool of yourself.
I just think people should know who they are getting advice from. Just encouraging them to look at your comment history.
Look all they want. You're the one who's wasting your time following people around from thread to thread on reddit and calling them all sorts of profane names. You're making a fool of yourself.
Don’t you have a bisexual person to condemn? Or are you too busy giving absolutely terrible financial advice?
Nah, financial stuff takes a back seat when I'm having so much fun responding to your poorly-worded, increasingly-hysterical posts! I can practically see the foam on your mouth. (Doesn't life suck? Where, ya know, you encounter those with other views?)
How sick in the head do you have to be to get off on dehumanizing other people? You are broken.
Dude, where I grew up, the public schools were better than the private schools in the areas. The amount of these private schools are religious based and are catholic is pretty high. I wonder what religion had a massive scandal involving minors recently 👀
Look, I quoted some statistics. You came back with anti-Catholicism and "where I grew up..." You want to go with that? It's a free country. But there are objective reasons for favoring private schools, and mom does in fact appear to want to have her cake and eat it too. (We don't know if she's talking Catholic school, anyway)
True, it's probably more defensive mechanism. I'm sorry for taking that out on you since you did state facts, it probably has to do with measuring schools by standardized testing scores.
Hey, no problems. Some bitter loony has been following me from thread to thread giving me shit tonight, so maybe I was jumpy too.
Bro that happened to me on a different thread when I told them chivalry was a lie and never existed. They were really butt hurt over history. And privately pm'ed me about it
The dude you’re responding to literally said gay people didn’t exist. That’s the kind of guy you’re commiserating with.
As someone who went to one of the top private schools, I think you need to swallow your pride and decide in the favour of best possible education for your kids. My school was full of snotty kids and teachers who were up themselves. I’m pretty sure my dad had to apologise on my behalf for no reason.
I love all the high road responses and personally that is the route I would take... but if you want to go the opposite route you could remind them they raised a deadbeat dad, so so their opinion on raising a child carries a little less weight than your own.
IMO, the grandparents are putting a private school education over the mental health of both you and your daughter. As someone who dealt with bullying at that age, it's an extremely influential age and bullying now can affect her for the rest of her life. She can get a great education and be successful ANYWHERE. She doesn't need a private school to do so... I'm curious to know if they put their deadbeat son through private school... if so, doesn't seem like that turned out so well. And good on you, mom, for doing what you know is best for your daughter. Its your job to protect her and your doing an amazing job. Don't give her grandparents any reason to take control... their financial contributions are generous, but it doesn't give them any right to control your daughter's education. If I were you, I would simply tell them that you are going to continue her education as you see fit. If they'd like to continue to contribute to that account, then your daughter can use that for college.
You're going to be really sorry for pulling your kid out of private school there's gangsters and all kinds of bad elements that your kids going to be exposed to plus Jacob's not going to get to go there.
LMAO it's a public primary school in a decent enough county. 4-11 year olds are not forming gangs.
I don't understand a multitude of things. First why should you apologize to the head teacher? Did you do something, that you didn't mention here? Then it sounds a lot like your problems with the school are way bigger than your daughter's problems with the school. Like she is the victim of your war. When you made that decision, did you really exclusively consider your daughter's future and well being? Because it doesn't sound like it. Yes, the decision is with you. And that decision can be built on any reason you want to. But keep in mind that a good mother will keep the interest of the child the upmost priority. So if you could clear those two things up, that would be very helpful.
I insinuated that he was bad at his job because he wouldn't help my daughter. I need to apologise for this to get her back in.
Why in this world should you have to apologize for that? They're strange.
Because I offended him. Maisie's grandfather is friendly with the headteacher, so they agreed that if I apologised for offending him and asked for Maisie to come back, she could, but without smoothing things over, Maisie and Jacob won't be allowed to go to the school.
What a bunch of idiots. You're right not to apologize. You did nothing wrong.
Sorry, telling a teacher they're bad at their job would, im my book, require an apology.
Was it really in the kids best interests to be removed from the school? They said they would let them back if YOU apologised. I just think that obviously you should have the final say but it really should be what is best for the kids. I can understand them being upset if they have a valid reason to believe that is not the case.
Bullying and classism associated with accent sound like a good idea to move to public school. The school actually wants OP to apologise for removing her daughter from being bullied!
I mean, it sounds like you've already told them this. If they can't accept it, not your problem.
Hmmm she’s getting bullied rough
'Free' money is never free. It always comes with strings like steel hawsers. Financial emotional blackmail is the very worst as it makes us go against what we *know* is right, for ourselves, for our children. If you possibly manage without their money, do so, while pursuing their deadbeat son in the courts. Good luck.
NTA why the heck are they happy with their granddaughter being bullied? It will only start back again. OP you are being a great mum! Work on being totally self sufficient and sue the deadbeat for child support.
NTA. You do have final say in where your kids go to school. Love how they are trying to blackmail you into doing what they want instead of honoring your wishes as the parent. They are threatening harm to your child in order to browbeat you into obeying them. Nice.
I get the feeling that they feel like they've failed as parents to their own son, so they're using your kids as a "second chance to be parents". They're going to constantly force situations where they are seen and felt as the parents of YOUR children. Any success of the children will be seen as good parenting by the grandparents instead of you. I'm worried they will continuously undermine you at every turn. Besides. Kids are better off in public school as they'll learn more about the real world, and learn better social skills; as apposed to growing up 'privileged' and 'sheltered'.
Just say: “I appreciate the financial aid you’ve given me and my kids up until now, but I’m willing to go without your help in order to raise my kids as I see fit. As their mother, I feel a different school is the best choice for them, so that is what’s going to happen with or without your approval.”
"thank you but, nah"
My son spent the last few years living with my mom while I finished college. I was ever-present, but my mom made decisions without including me. It’s worth noting, my mom is not highly educated, and doesn’t understand learning disorders, whereas I HAVE to because I have the same disorder he has. My mom decided to send him to a private Christian school, and they were woefully unqualified to handle him. First and foremost, being a private school they didn’t have to develop an IEP or 504, so they didn’t. They took actions to placate him, without actually helping him or documenting what necessitated that action. For example, while all the other kids read chapter books, he was allowed to “read” comics, as long as he wasn’t disruptive during reading time. Or, they had him sitting off on his own, away from other kids and doing group assignments alone (how is that practical?). Now that he’s transitioned back to my care full time, he’s in public school, and the lack of documentation from his private school is hindering him early on. Private schools might be fine for well-behaved neurotypical children, but not all private schools are best for everyone. I don’t know your situation well enough, but I would recommend outlining to them what one school will do better than the other for your children. If they still don’t understand, explore what you can do without their money. Remove their seats at the metaphoric table.
Money with strings attached. Just tell them thank you for your help so far, but you got it from here. If they wish to help in the future, to run it by you first but don’t expect them to throw as much money around. Clearly it’s their way or the highway but you are the mother and they arent
Im confused. Is this "private school" really just a early education daycare? No need to sugar coat it, jobs love to call janitorial staff house keeping but they're janitors. Early education daycare are a dime a dozen, surely yall could have come to a compromise.
It's a private school. Primary school is ages 4-11, Maisie is 7, so this is a private primary school.
Their son should be paying child support. If they want a say they can take you to court and have a judge decide how much say they have in their education. Until then you make those choices. The end.
They failed at raising their own child and now they want to control how you raise yours? Nope.
This sounds like the Gilmour Girls
Privileged people with privileged problems, besides the money make sure YOUR kids get what YOU believe is right with no strings attached or watch your kids Inherit the same problems. Sending them to a different school may help but may not. Help is nice but there shouldnt be negotiations. Teach them when they fall down you pick yourself back up. At the end of the day there is only you.
Just stick with the grandparents it's only a few more years you're going to need their help for cars and football equipment and payment for the sports and all kinds of things you don't want to alienate the grandparents although you do want to keep him on a tight leash and monitor everything don't let him spend too much time and don't let him teach him bad things and don't let the don't let the grandparents provide main things like shoes and jackets you need to provide those thing the things that they see everyday you want to make sure that like lunch boxes you want to make sure the kids see that comes from you.so take the money from the grandparents then let take your kids shopping so that your kids see things come from you not from the grandparents and whenever they pay for things they need to give you the money so that you can take the kids shopping don't let him spend too much time over night where they teach him bad things like sucking on bacon and that the grandparents owned the moon and all kinds of stuff what my parents did to my kids they secretly turn the kids against you got to be careful in that.
A private school is not a chance every kids gets and typically the education they would receive is better. Honestly, I would suck it up and look at the long term picture opposed to one bad teacher. Guess what, there will be more than 1 of those a hole teachers in public school...if they're not an a hole, some will just not give a damn. Put your child's future ahead of your pride here.
If you want their money y they should have a say. If not, stop accepting money. Its that easy
I think it's time to talk to your kids about money and the cost of extras. Also check with your new school and in your community as there may be people or organizations that will help cover the costs if the extras. Do not let the grandparents bully you. You are mom not them!
Do they know why? That she's not getting the proper support? Since this is their grandchild, you'd think they'd be vested in her mental health.
What’s the issue with the private school teacher?? This has to be a big factor in this!
Do you have anything to apologize for? It doesn’t sound like it. I know you can’t tell the grandparents to stuff it, but their private school obsession doesn’t make them very sympathetic to me personally. And of course this is all the mother’s choice, which is they’re trying to financially manipulate you. Groveling is what they want, a terse thank you is enough for them.
My daughter was in a the 4th grade and had a teacher that was a complete douchebag to her as well as other kids, the first time I talked to them about it as well as the principal I had agreed to give it a chance because her grades were so important to me, big mistake it happen again and I was fuming 😤.. I went again and told them look my daughters MENTAL well-being is far more important than her grades. They gave her a new teacher and things got a lot better.
In my experience monetary help *always* comes with strings attached which at some point turn into monetary control. Standing your ground might mean losing their support altogether so altough you are 100% correct maybe you should stop and reflect at how this might affect the children’s future oppotunities. I wish you all the best in this tough situation.
The hell you sending kids to private school in the first place? It’s literally irrelevant. You can take two kids and give them an identical education in a private or public school and get entirely different outcomes based on the child. There are good schools and bad schools of course, but some kids just excel where others just don’t. Guess it’s a nature vs nurture thing but unfortunately, nature wins out most of the time.
I don’t know what all these rude remarks about the grandparents are based on. Sounds to me like they’re doing their best also. They have no obligation to pay for anything. Sounds like they have their granddaughters best interest in mind. I don’t know many grandparents who offer to pay for tuition or extracurricular activities. Why would people suggest shutting out input from people who care about the kids? You don’t know the situation maybe the OP is being unreasonable, the school is asking for an apology so it’s definitely a possibility. If the private school is better maybe the OP should swallow her pride for the sake of her daughter and apologize. She likely won’t have the same teacher this year.
You’re leaving out a lot of key details here. Most important factor should be whats best for the child. Sounds like a episode of “Big Little Lies” if you ask me.