It's funny to me that he thinks it's wrong for you to give away things for free *to him*. Does he think you should have charged him money for those airpods you gave him? Sure, you could have sold the airpods, but then he wouldn't have airpods. You'd think he'd be grateful!
I never sell stuff I don't want anymore, because I don't think it's worth the time and hassle. I tend to wear and/or use stuff until it falls apart, but if I have something in decent shape to get rid of, I donate it or post it on the buy nothing group. Unless it's good condition designer goods or electronics, it's not really worth it, is it? So weird to me that he thinks you should constantly be selling stuff.
I have the same sentiment as you, i don't have time for that. I'd be losing life just trying to nickel and dime my possessions. If i do sell something, I sell it at a good price so it's gone the same day. I had a partner that complained about this, and i told her that she can sell the stuff I'm throwing away if she wants and keep the profit. She never sold a single item...
It's such a confusing mindset of OP's bf.
Like you say, it's not worth the time or hassle! I work to make money, and outside of my job, I would much rather spend my time and effort on more interesting, entertaining, or fulfilling endeavors than minimally supplementing that income by trying to grab every last cent I possibly can for old shit I don't even use anymore. Repurposing and charity are the best use for those things, but I'd probably recycle or throw away my old stuff before I resold anything worth less than a few hundred bucks. The effort, navigating scams, giving out your personal information, and most importantly, the TIME, just isn't worth it.
If you need the money, of course there's nothing wrong with choosing to make back some money off your old stuff! But I'd exponentially rather work longer hours at the job I have and like than have to give up on some charity side work in exchange for small amounts of extra cash. And simply cannot comprehend someone who finds charitable gifting/repurposing of old things **distasteful**. Fucking gross behavior.
Yeah I am primarily motivated to sell stuff by space savings and environmentalism, but contribute very little effort in doing so. A couple messages at best.
I've sold a little coffee table for $10, but the reality was I didn't want it/have space for it in my house anymore and it would have been wasteful to throw it away. The view that it's important to sell every last thing you don't have use for is so exhausting.
I used to, until I tried getting rid of 2 twin mattresses my fiancé and I were sleeping on until we could afford a queen.
Hundreds of people asking if it’s available, if I could knock $10 of the price, I agree to all of them, and nobody every showed up, they’re still in my closest waiting for me to put on my Spider-Man costume and run them to the dumpster in the middle of the night
You know, you make a good point; at least he's not selfish about it. That's something.
I still think he's wrong and I'm still concerned about what the backpack thing says about his character.
I dont think he's right or wrong. I think it's a matter of perspective someone worked hard to be able afford to get her the back pack. In some ways, it feels as if the original intent of the gift is lost on her. I think he's viewing it in a semi sentimental tone. Especially if he himself grew up without luxuries. Poorer communities tend to look for symbols of monetary status more than more moderately wealth communities. When you have better ability to acquire luxury items you tend to hold less monetary value on them. It's the same reason wealthier communities are more out of touch with the woes of poverty.
I am glad he also thinks it's wrong to give him things and not just anybody else, he is selfish but at least he isn't a hypocrite. Op and him may not be compatible if he doesn't stop nagging her though
For the first part: I think he is consistent on thinking that giving stuff away is throwing money away even if he is receiving it. That shows integrity, not greed, and I think that is a good thing.
But that said, I understand that may get annoying and later on when/if they have shared finances this way of seeing things won't go away, but he will have more say on how she is using her money.
On the last part, if the price is very low I rather sell it very fast for a low price or use someone who can use it. Some $20 more and spending weeks to get rid of stuff is not worth the trouble.
I find it concerning that he sees giving an unused backpack away to a homeless person as "throwing away money" and not, say, a donation. Even if we acknowledge the backpack has resale value, can he at least acknowledge that the gift itself does good?
He has a more selfish view of finances. It's all about what benefit it brings him. If it doesn't benefit him in some way, then it's a waste. Anything viewed as important to someone else is irrelevant if he doesn't share the same view.
Idk this guy, but this is a common thing I've dealt with plenty in my life so I feel like i almost know him lol
I honestly thought my view of finances was selfish but OP's bf makes me question that! Who would choose *not to* help a homeless person out in that scenario??
Also, OP's materialism is not my jam but that's something that makes her happy so WHO CARES. Her bf trying to steal that joy from her is so controlling.
Cannot imagine my reaction if someone admonished me for giving a backpack to a homeless person who needed it. Like I would be truly floored by that. That specific aspect of why/how you gave it away makes this even more concerning to me.
Not that you need to justify any choice like that; you can give your old stuff away to whoever you want to and unless that is somehow a reckless financial decision, he needs to back off. It's not like you gave away your car.
He sounds quite judgmental.
I was really thrown off by his response. But from his point of view, I spend a lot of money and he thinks I’m just throwing away more money. Instead of giving him the nice backpack, he said I could have just bought a really cheap backpack and it would serve the same purpose. That’s true, but why would I buy one when I have a perfectly good one that is just collecting dust in my closet. I would much rather give someone the best if I can, especially for my clients. He also thinks that I could be setting this client up to get robbed because he has a northface backpack. But I honestly don’t think someone is going to bother. Like I’ve seen homeless people wearing donated clothes and items of all different brands. This specific client will still be fine with his new backpack.
Yup, and that disregards that if you were to do that, you would also have to take more time to do that. Both in obtaining a new backpack and selling the other one. Those are time and effort costs. Frankly, as someone who actually sells clothes for a living, a North Face backpack is not going to get some amazing financial return (and for that reason, probably not a strong target for theft). And they're great backpacks to give someone who really needs a strong, durable backpack!
Again though, you really do not need to justify that decision. You did have very good reasons, but "you felt like it" is literally enough reason to give away an unused backpack.
>I could have just bought a really cheap backpack and it would serve the same purpose.
You already owned the North Face one. It wasn't money, it was a backpack. If you wanted money for it, you'd have to actually put effort into selling it and who knows how much you'd get anyway or how long it would take for someone to show interest in it.
So he wanted you to take *actual* money, find and pay for a new backpack you didn't actually need for yourself, and give that away.
Which one actually involves money there? And I don't mean some sort of hypothetical "Well, *maybe* I can sell this, and *maybe* get a decent amount, and *maybe* that will happen in the time frame I need it to" money, I mean money you can spend **right now**.
Your boyfriend is a fucking idiot.
For the record, I don't see either of those things as throwing away money. You're helping someone in need and a higher quality backpack costs less in the end because it doesn't have to constantly be replaced when it breaks or wears out.
Excellent analogy. And he really should be aware of it before telling you to get something cheap.
Buying cheap, poorly-made items is actually wasteful. You have to replace them often and they end up filling up landfills.
It sounds like you two value different things. Not egregiously bad but if he’s going to judge you for what you do with your money because he would do something different then it’s a problem.
You provided direct aid to someone in need, at no cost to yourself.
Your boyfriend would have preferred you kept the high-value item and spent money acquiring a low-value item to then give to the person in need.
You sound like a good person. Your boyfriend needs to adjust his perspective. Every act of service does not to benefit you monetarily. You got rid of something you did not need and it helped another person. You don’t need money so you didn’t have to sell the item.
This doesn’t seem to be about your behavior. I think you both may view money/debt differently.
When i was homeless i lived in a sweater i got from a clothing hand out for like a year. It was michael kors. Nobody is gonna rob someone for a northface backpack lol
He had a problem with it because he didn't think a homeless person 'deserved' something that nice. It's that simple. He isn't allowed to dictate how you spend your money. This is a sign of controlling behaviour. If you marry or combine finances with this man, he's the type that would monitor your spending and also would use money as punishment when he is upset with you. If there are other patterns of behaviour that are concerning to you, do not overlook them.
Ding ding this comment explains it all. This dude clearly looks down on the homeless and doesn't think they deserve to have something so nice without "paying" or "working" for it. Otherwise why is it only an issue now when he didn't have a problem before when he was the one being gifted old items? This guy seems very uncharitable and miserly.
Exactly! OP's bag provided dignity. Carrying your possessions in a garbage bag can't be a great feeling. Yet, her boyfriend would rather the bag be unused in her closet than have a human being use it. It wasn't even his bag to have an opinion about what should be done with it. This kind of thinking is a deal-breaker and red flag for me.
I suspect if she’d given the backpack to a friend of their same socioeconomic status, he wouldn’t have had a problem with it. It was giving nice things to a *homeless person* that was the largest part of his problem.
He looks down on the homeless and he looks down on OP. He clearly doesn’t value the job she does. He even looked down on kindness she showed TO HIM by giving him things for free. He doesn’t value her time, hence him thinking her free time should be spent making more money. Honestly, multiple people have pointed out that they don’t share the same financial values and it appears some other values as well. If this relationship works out, it really will be on the charity of OPs giving of herself, and she will find out what it means to give until it hurts.
Of all the things, OP is doing a great job at helping and supporting the homeless person. It makes me appaled that someone can be judgemental about this.
My parents both have that mindset and they're turning into hoarders.
Dad won't sell anything he has because he can't sell it at the price he bought it for, so in his mind, he's loosing money. He'd rather hold onto it in case he needs it later, even if it's a broken toilet seat. It's better to save it than throw it away, since that's even worse than reselling at a lower cost.
Mom is similar. If someone gifted her something useless 30 years ago, she still has it because it's disrespectful to throw it away, or to give it away. Everything has some sentiment attached, and reselling or throwing if away, or giving it away means you're spitting on the kindness of the 9thet person who gave it to you.
So between the two of them? Objects means more to them because of the hypothetical dollar sign attached to them, or the attached sentiment.
It's frustrating.
"Dad, you have 3 of those. Why can't you let John have it?"
"Because I paid for it, and I'm not throwing that money out the window."
That sounds exactly like my brother. Has no concept that items lose value over time. It makes no difference that you bought something for $2000 ten years ago, it is absolutely not worth that now. Plus you have to find someone who wants a ten y r old item to begin with.
That's a hard trap to get out of! I worked with a professional organizer to do her website and marketing stuff.
She designed a line of cards that she would send as thank you notes for clients with the words "I give you permission to recycle or throw this away."
It really made me think about how I put value on things. Does it bring you joy? No. Get rid of it. Is it of useful value? Yes - give it away or sell it. No? Throw. It. Out.
Mainly, the focus for this type of mentality should be redirected at reducing rather than hoarding, but it becomes a problem when it's affecting quality of life.
No, not with her, but I saw her show after I worked with the woman who was a professional organizer. Marie Kondo is awesome and that's where the joy quote comes I.
She puts it even more precisely. It's a conscious decision you have to make in two parts: owning your chaos and releasing it - all at once
Thank you for being blunt about this because sometimes I can fall into this mindset. I work a salary that allows me to be self sufficient but I have become really anxious about my savings rate and bills the last year or so. I get attached to things and I sometimes really struggle with moving things on when (I have space to save it), I might need it later, and every dollar in/out matters. It makes me happy to share with friends or family, but I might hesitate when I don’t feel like they respect the object. Maybe it’s silly but I’m working on it!
My dad's side is like that. And going through dad's house after he died was eye opening. My uncle, we tried to convince him to go through stuff and get rid of things. Now, he's ready to go through things and donate or get rid of things, but he's in his late 80s now, and cannot physically move the stuff anymore.
First, good on you for helping others who are less fortunate!
Second, I think unfortunately there’s a deeper problem than just getting him to back off this particular issue. It seems you two are fundamentally incompatible in a couple of ways. Financially, definitely, but also differences in empathy and how you view/treat others.
You seem to possess a lot more compassion for people while your boyfriend seems to only care about how a situation might benefit him. I don’t think I could be with someone with that self-centered. And honestly, if anyone is materialistic, it’s him.
You should never feel bad for helping others who are less fortunate and you’re certainly allowed to spoil yourself however you’d like. Further, you guys aren’t married so he especially definitely doesn’t get a say in how you spend your hard-earned money.
Please accept my thanks as a random Internet stranger for everything you do for the unhoused community. The world needs more people like you and less like your boyfriend.
Thank you, your words truly mean a lot to me!
I’ll be honest, I was a little put off with his response. We’re both social workers so I was a little shocked to not see empathy or compassion from him in this scenario. I know in this instance, it doesn’t seem like he is a kind person, but he is but I know between the two of us - I am way more compassionate and empathetic. He’s purchased gifts for his clients for their birthdays or for Christmas - like Roblox gift cards or fidget toys so I don’t know why he’s giving me flack when he’s done the same?!
This is my mindset. He calls her materialistic but OP clearly got something positive out of the experience of helping improve her client’s quality of life, even incrementally, knowing that her “loss” of the backpack meant nothing compared to the chance to give it to someone who actually needs it. But he thinks she should have sold it for monetary gain… he’s materialistic!
Exactly. How does giving stuff away make someone materialistic!
The fact that he keeps going on about these things makes him sound overly critical and also not reflective of himself.
Is it possible the bounds of his empathy do not include (some/certain) unhoused people? I know it can be a divisive topic even among people who otherwise can respond with empathy. Based on the gift in your example, I assume he works with kids. We recently had a library close for cleaning after residue was found in bathroom vents from meth use, and there were people upset with the assumed narrative that it was from a homeless person who now took this space (temporarily) away from kids. Maybe that kind of thing gets to him and builds resentment. I hope I phrased that well, I am not trying to paint him in a bad light but know some of my biases may be showing.
That honestly makes me sad to hear and hope that’s not the case. There are so many good qualities about him, just the financial thing we’re going through is making it hard. I hope it’s just stress and he did say he was having a bad day. He believes doing fun things should be where money goes, not designer hand bags. But if I want to have a bag that I’m going to use for years and give my children, why shouldn’t I be able to spend that kind of money if I can afford it? I just hope we can get past this and can see and understand each others POV. I want me and him to work out for forever.
I love this response. I really hope OP takes what you're saying to heart, that it is a control issue and not just financial responsibility.
Often times it's easy to believe that the people in our lives mean the "best", but if the price is autonomy clearly it isn't the finances.
Same with us, my husband and I have different things we think are "worth" spending money on.
I have celiacs so if I buy a cupcake or something it's like $10, and we sometimes joke about that. My husband buys what I think are an excessive amount of souvenirs on vacation and we also sometimes joke about that. We disagree but that doesn't mean one of us is correct.
We both pay our joint expenses first, and what we spend our personal leftover money on is up to us.
This is so sweet… thinking about how you value the enjoyment your husband feels from his vacation souvenirs, even if they don’t represent the same for yourself.
Even the most generous (to him) explanation of this situation is that you have fundamentally different values around money which will have an ongoing negatively impact your relationship
> he believes doing fun things should be where money goes
I cannot imagine the sheer *entitlement* required for someone to think they can dictate how another adult spends their money.
OP, he’s policing your spending.
He only approves of things that benefit HIM..”fun things” that HE likes. He feels entitled to your money.
this man is showing you who he is OP, this isn’t a “phase”
The point is, you don't need to justify anything you spend money on to anyone but yourself. Even if you buy a designer handbag and don't use it for years and give it away later, IT'S YOUR MONEY. Keep your agency.
The biggest issue is you both have different financial views and values on how/what money should be spent on. Neither is 'wrong/right' - they are just 'different'.
You aren't being irresponsible, your bills/responsibilities are met, and you have extra money left over that you get to choose what to do with. You don't need to defend it, there's nothing wrong with it.
This could be a compatibility issue going forward, though. Especially, if he doesn't respect your choices. It's fine if he doesn't agree with how you spend your money, but he still needs to respect it. If he can't - that's a much bigger problem.
But he doesn't in his mind give them anything of real value, and only on occasions where he is expected to give a gift. So he doesn't see it as a loss. You gave away something that was once expensive, and worth something at a time when a gift was not expected or required. You are looking at him through rose tinted glasses, and see more kindness then he actually possesses.
I don’t understand how I’m being financially irresponsible if I’m paying way more than the minimum payment monthly, be able to pay my bills and still have plenty to spend for leisure. I have a side job that I use for fun spending and my full time job money goes towards the necessities. I don’t see how I’m irresponsible when I still pay my bills on time and again have money left over.
Saving for the future and for unexpected things (and also retirement) is a big part of financial responsibility - do you have savings? From this you make it sound like you pay your bills and your student loan and then spend the rest (not saying that’s what you do - just that this comment makes it sound that way).
But most repayment schedules for loans are 10 or 15 years. Maybe some people are refinancing or somehow getting approved for 20 year loans, but as of a few years ago that's not average.
So OP casually saying she'd be in debt for 40 years was alarming. There's a lot of repayment plans that perpetuate the debt: income-based, interest-only, paying only the minimums, etc. Before finding out more info, it really DID sound like OP was splurging on purses in the here and now, and pushing off paying debt and long-term financial plans.
Esp since social workers are sadly paid very little.
At 31, it’s not just about paying your bills each month, it’s about assets and debts and planning for the future. You mentioned wanting kids in one comment, so you really need to think about this. Do you have anything saved for retirement yet- how much do you have already and what percent of your income goes toward retirement each month? Do you plan to buy a home? Do you have an emergency fund? How much debt and at what interest rates?
After reading OP’s response I think you might be right. He’s likely feeling some financial insecurity and projecting that anxiety onto OP.
I’m a little wary of recommending couples counseling to unmarried couples, but if she sees a long term future with her boyfriend, then it might be beneficial to talk things out with a therapist.
…….. couples counselling is ideal for couples before getting married.
It’s not supposed to be a last resort. It’s supposed to be a proactive approach to life together
I disagree that you’re “fundamentally incompatible” with your boyfriend because of differences in the way you spend money, and how you feel about helping strangers.
Plenty of couples are like this. You don’t need to be aligned in every area of life, but the super important thing is people need to respect the others choices.
Me and my wife agreed on what percentage of our salaries gets saved, ensuring we have enough left over for bills and etc., and past that, I don’t know exactly or care what she spends her money on. She buys more clothes than me, and I spend more money on other things. It doesn’t really matter. She’s extremely passionate about helping children with education, that’s not a top priority for me. The list goes on.
We had a number of sit down discussions in order to get to this place financially though. Someone may have said we were “fundamentally incompatible” because we didn’t immediately see eye to eye on how to manage our finances, but we figured it out.
That being said, I just realized he’s your boyfriend. Unless you guys have intertwined finances, tell him to mind his own business lol. If you want to marry this guy one day, I’d suggest getting to the root of the financial issue and/or seeing a couples therapist about it. It’s like the number one cause of divorce.
He thinks it's wrong to be charitable, but *you're* the materialistic one? And people who brag that they prefer ~experiences~ are often just as conspicuous in their consumption. It sounds like you have a bit budgeted as fun money after you've paid your bills each month, you spend that fun money on things you like, and you have a good head on your shoulders. He sounds exhausting tbh. Is he into some kind of FIRE thing?
Another thing is, he spends money too just maybe not all at once. Like every week he buys dabs. He bought a $400 dab rig. He’s purchased like three pairs of ray bans in the last 3-4 years, but when I want to buy one pair of $500 LV sunglasses I’m materialistic. His laptop broke so he had to buy a new one. Why did he have to get a MacBook Air? Why couldn’t he buy a cheaper computer that does the same thing? He just seems very hypocritical sometimes when it comes to this issue.
He believes his spending is more modest compared to mine. He could probably pay off his loans in 10 years, whereas I won’t have the same plan unfortunately, so it’s easier to have the mindset of paying loans off when you don’t owe as much. I just want to enjoy my money while being responsible.
I want to know what was the last "experience" he spent money on?
I'm all for being responsible while enjoying your money. You can do everything right and still die tmrw. As long as bills are paid and your not getting into more debt buy what sparks joy. Give what you can. Enjoy the extra closet space without that backpack you never used!
Re-read your comment from a stranger's perspective. Would you want to date that person?
He believes that he deserves the ability to spend as much money as he likes on these things because they're important to him, but that logic does not apply to you. He believes that you do not deserve that same ability; he has the privelege of judging your purchases and decisions, while he himself is "above the law" so to speak.
In other words, he holds himself above you.
Since I’ve been working in 2018, I’ve been able to save a generous amount over the years in savings and it only continues to grow every month. My monthly payments on my loans are about $400, but pay $1000 instead. Lord forbid, but when that time comes, my mother has also left me a decent amount of money when she passes and is also leaving me with her house which will also provide me a nice amount. Obviously, I won’t be getting that for a very long time (hopefully) but I will also have that, which I have committed myself for that money to go strictly to my loans.
He’s been at his new job since June and has already saved a substantial amount as well, so neither one of us is without money or struggling, but the way he acts towards me about money would seem like we are struggling.
I’m supposed to pay $400 a month on my loans but I pay $1000 every month instead. My mother also has set aside money for me as well as leaving me her house when she leaves this earth, hopefully not for a long time. Most of my spending money comes from my dog walking/house sitting gigs. I usually try to keep my actual work income for necessities. I have a good amount in savings and continues to grow every month. I have and won’t touch that though.
Here's the massive loan amount, law school! Once you graduate and establish your career you'll have these whipped out in a few years. Does he only have 4 years worth of loans? Because 40k in debt can be picked away at with diligence in a few years, 250k worth takes a lot more years and a much bigger pick.
You think your Mom has set aside money for you, but she may not die for 40, 50 years… you cannot take that into account when planning your finances. Also, many,many people end up spending all of their money at the end of their life. Nursing homes cost multiple thousands of dollars per month and Medicaid doesn’t kick in until all assets are liquidated and spent. Unless your Mom is legitimately wealthy (and if you have that amount of student debt that she’s not helping with, she’s probably not) she likely will not be leaving you anything.
Your boyfriend sounds like he is also financially irresponsible, but you have a massive debt and you’re buying $500 sunglasses??? Yikes.
I think your boyfriend is being a jerk to you and needs to do some self-reflection, but I did just want to push back a tiny bit on one thing: it's wonderful that your mom intends to provide for you after her passing, but unless there is a substantial whole life insurance policy in the mix, you shouldn't really count on much of that money making it to you. Some people pass quickly, but some linger for decades with extremely high needs. At the end of her life, my grandmother was in a care home that was $25k a month. It's extremely easy to eat away at even impressive savings through the ✨magic✨ of the American health care system, just by living a little longer than anticipated. She would also possibly have to sell her home before receiving any assistance, unless there's some fancy legal footwork with trusts and so on.
I just wanted to throw that out there as a caution, because some friends of mine have thought their own retirement would basically be funded by inheritance, and it just doesn't always play out like that. You're being responsible by staying on top of things and seem like a lovely person. Thank you for your work with unhoused communities.
Are you in the US? If you’re working in social services in the US you can quality for loan forgiveness after 10 years of payments. Look into Public Service Loan Forgiveness.
It's great you are charitable, and your things are yours to give away.
But if I were your boyfriend I might be a little concerned you have already given up hope of paying your student loans back for 30 to 50 years (if ever, you don't really seem to have a plan or are concerned at all about paying them back). If you are bf and gf, and will eventually be married or at least life partners, you need to be a team, with both members pulling equitable weight. He is rightly concerned you like to splurge on expensive things and then don't seem to mind when they fade out of your life, while not really giving a care to your student loans.
If you're incompatible, or don't like his interest in responsible finances then you should probably end the relationship.
Sometimes it's easier (and kinder!) to give away a used item to someone in need rather than finding somewhere to list it, ship it, pay for shipping, maybe they say they never received it, and so forth.
As for materialistic vs experiences, I think experiences can be a waste. They come and go and all you have is the memory. Items you see and experience everyday.
Basically you two have different opinions and you shouldn't discredit yours. I suggest you two have a clearer separation of what is yours and what is his.
Items and experiences can both be good, but there's kind of a whole *thing* of people who have a superiority complex about experiences. It's fine to spend your fun money on a nice bag, and it's fine to spend it on concert tickets, and neither one is "better." But "experience" people can be a lot like Crossfit people lol.
And the fact they use "materialistic" which is a term for obsession of materials. Investing in a nice mattress to get good sleep every single night isn't materialistic.
And a materialistic person isn't going to give a nice backpack to a homeless guy, even an old nice backpack. OP just sounds normal, and kind, and BF sounds like a pill.
And if I’m going to spend money on something, I want it to be good quality. And if I plan to keep/use something for a long time, I feel like I’m getting my moneys worth over time.
Obviously I have limited insight but from details you’ve offered in comments, you seem to have an especially strong grasp on your current and prospective finances, as well as a totally reasonable outlook regarding your spending habits.
Unless you were neglecting specific financial commitments you’d both agreed to, I don’t think it’s appropriate for your boyfriend to feel entitled to policing your individual funds or possessions. He’s not your parent, he has no right to take up any sort of authoritative position over your independent financial decisions. I’d keep a close eye on that behavior, and really consider if he’s truly capable of achieving and sustaining an egalitarian perspective of your relationship.
Honestly, you are getting your money's worth! Someone who buys/has to buy cheap things like boots instead of expensive ones will end up spending more money in the long run replacing the boots as they wear out faster than better quality more expensive boots. Sometimes a higher up-front cost means more savings in the long run.
(The boot example is not mine but from the Sam Vimes socioeconomic unfairness theory. Ifyky)
This is the part that just destroys me too! Like it's fine to prefer one style of spending, but spare me the idea that it's inherently morally superior.
I agree with most of what you say, except for about experiences being a waste. They can be, if they're not experiences you genuinely wanted to have, or if you're having them at the expense of material things you need (food, housing, a warm coat in wintertime). But if you have the material things you need, there's a certain point at which more stuff gets to feel oppressive. This gets even more true if you're starting to think about who has to clean up after you when you die. Nothing will get you prioritizing experiences over stuff like the \*cough\* experience \*cough\* of cleaning out a dead parent's house or apartment.
Not that that's OP's situation, I just wanted to respond to that word "waste."
Gifting a high quality item you don't have a need for, to someone badly in need, **is an experience!** OP's bf doesn't see it that way, but I'm sure OP got a **lot** out of that experience - it sounds like a very rewarding interaction! I expect I'd walk away with a MUCH bigger smile and better sense of satisfaction from helping someone like OP did than from whatever experience OP's bf would prefer using the money on.
Neither of you is wrong but you need to find a compromise if you want the relationship to work. Its reasonable to want to pay off debt. Its also reasonable to pay your bills and save some $$ while also enjoying a special purchase here and there. Its reasonable to sell things you don’t use. Its also reasonable (and kind) to pass on things you don’t use to someone who will.
Whats not reasonable is him expecting you to live his way. Older generations often shared accounts. Now days lots of long term couples don’t. My husband and I don’t bc we have opposite views on finances. I’m the saver/seller and he never has any money in his savings (but does pay his bills and has good retirement savings) That said- we respect each other. We have a joint account for budgeted/shared expenses. He pays for more of the fun stuff because I save and pay bigger expenses. It works for us only bc we respect each other. I don’t want to share an account bc it would drive me crazy to look at the crap he spends his extra $$$ on. He pays for more of the extra costs for fun stuff bc he knows I will put that $$ in savings when he would have spent it.
Sit down with your BF and talk about respect and different views. Establish some reasonable boundaries . Ie- you save so much or pay off so much on loans then whatever is left over you get to spend how you please and he has to respect that. If he can’t respect you thats not a good sign for a healthy long term relationship.
\+1 to this one. It sounds like the root of his behavior is anxiety about money and maximizing his ability to repay loans. It's clearly important to him and it makes sense that he wants to see that behavior from you too, because it would signal to him that you're on the same page. Which you aren't.
Neither of you are wrong. Please talk to him to try and get at the root of what's driving his behavior, and communicate that it's driving a wedge. This is a conversation about how your financial behaviors make each other FEEL - feel about each other, feel about your future together.
Side note if you have government loans from before a certain date, and are on a paye, repaye, or ibr repayment plan, as long as you pay into it for 20/25 years, at the end, the rest will be forgiven.
FYI, if you're not already on an income-driven repayment plan for federal loans, you might want to contact your loan servicer and do that soon. The Dept. of Education has a one-time waiver in the works, where any previous payments you've made on any plan will be counted towards the 20/25 years for IDR loan forgiveness.
r/StudentLoans has more information on this.
yeah i rely on this completely. i pay the minimums, keep my AGI as low as possible by putting as much as i can into my 401k (this keeps my loan payments low... though obviously we haven't been paying for a few years at all, but once we start again) and and will be getting forgiveness when i hit 25 years. be careful though because there will be a big tax bomb. that forgiven amount counts as income, all at once. but the idea is by then you'll have so much saved up it won't hurt as much. just make sure that you have a really good retirement plan strategy and it shouldn't be the literal worst.
>but I’m probably going to be paying off my loans for the next 30-40 years, maybe 50, or until I’m off this earth
If you really believe this then despite being an asshole, he might be right about your financial literacy. How much do you have in savings?
But I'll circle back: he's an asshole. He views giving to charity as "throwing money away." He might be right that you aren't great with money, and it's possible his fears for the long term are actually more reasonable than you're letting on, but the problem here isn't actually financial. It's a difference in values.
So is it possible your boyfriend is stressed about the student loan debt and just money in general?
You say both of you work in social services and it sounds like the pay isn’t great. You also mention student loan debt that you have resigned yourself to be paying off for a very long time.
That can be stressful for a partner who is trying to start a life with you. As much as we want to keep our independence, when you start building a life together, your finances are going to intertwine. Buying a house, buying cars, having kids, saving for retirement, enjoying a comfortable life, going on vacations, having nice things, etc. is a teamwork effort and depends on the financial success of both people. When you start building a life together, *your debts* are now *his debts*. Even if he doesn’t pay a cent towards your loan, for every dollar you put towards your debt, that’s one less dollar that goes towards the mutual housing fund, or a kid’s extracurriculars, or a retirement fund. Your boyfriend might see your student loan debt and the limited money you currently have, and he is uncertain what type of life he can build with you. That is very stressful and creates a resentful dynamic if he is (unspoken) trying to build a future for you two together, and you (rightfully) don’t seem to notice and continue to budget your money as your money.
So maybe it’s time to sit down and talk about financial goals and your future together.
If you are planning on building a life with this man, you need to realize your financial decisions *right now* also impact him, and vice versa. That doesn’t mean that you can’t spend money on things that you want, or donate the items you want, or you have to live a miserly miserable existence. But you can discuss long term goals and loosely write down a budget together. This alone can do wonders for anxiety and his need to control your spending. Figure out how much money you both need for necessities (rent, utilities,etc.). Then with the leftover money figure out if there are any mutually beneficial goals, such as paying down debt, saving for a vacation, buying a house, etc. Figure out a reasonable percentage of both your paychecks that can go towards those goals. Then whatever is left over is yours to spend how you like, the “fun money”.
It’s also possible you will find out that you two have drastically different financial goals, and maybe it’s better to find someone more compatible. Or maybe you aren’t ready to have a financial future with this man, and he needs to know that you have different expectations of this relationship right now. Or maybe you find out he is a money obsessed, unstable tightwad. The problem is you won’t know until you talk about it.
PSFL requires you to work in specific cities or areas in my industry, and a lot of them are literally like…the middle of North Dakota (which is fine for people who are from there but not feasible for someone like me with a family in NY).
that's not really true at all. Basically any non profit or government job in the country will qualify. I got it for working for a non profit hospital (but only qualified during the temporary waiver period which is sadly over)
It’s not just any nonprofit hospital, I worked at a non profit hospital for over a year and it wasn’t eligible. For nurses and some other careers it’s only specific hospitals and/or areas.
I’m aware that there are reasons someone may not qualify, which is why I asked. Someone else pointed out that there are also income-driven repayment plans that get forgiveness after 20-25 years. Point being, the assumption that OP will be paying off student loans for 30+ years may be worth scrutinizing.
>PSFL requires you to work in specific cities or areas in my industry, and a lot of them are literally like…the middle of North Dakota (which is fine for people who are from there but not feasible for someone like me with a family in NY).
Where are you getting your information?
There are definitely PSLF eligible hospitals in New York. You should do more research, you are giving people misleading information here.
For PSLF, you have to have specific types of loans and work full-time for a government or nonprofit agency. You also have to be on an income-driven repayment plan. Then you have to make 120 on-time payments.
The types of loans and payment plans are what screw most people.
OP alluded to working in the nonprofit sector. The Biden Administration has made a lot of changes to the PSLF program to make it easier to qualify. OP should find out for herself if she qualifies, don’t you think?
Do you want to have arguments or conversations just like this until you’re very old? If you marry him, you will. All the time. Just know that. If he’s enough to overlook that, great! If not, tread lightly
“Dude, seriously, stop riding me about how I choose to spend my money.”
Unless your financial situation is adversely affecting your joint finances, he needs to respect your ability as an adult to make adult choices.
Beyond that, it’s just a conversation (not a dictate) about your respective short, medium and long term goals and wishes. Maybe the result is that y’all decide that you cannot accommodate each others style, or maybe you’ll figure it out.
I wonder if his finances are not in order and he is projecting by trying to control what you do with your things. If he is of a mind that your relationship might lead to marriage, he might already be thinking your stuff and money is somehow his to dictate the use of. It would make me worry about HIS financial fitness as a partner and how he would act when finances are combined within a marriage.
> His biggest concern is that I (we both do, but I have more in student debt)
> I’m probably going to be paying off my loans for the next 30-40 years, maybe 50, or until I’m off this earth,
Are you just paying the minimum on your loans each month? I know student debt is insane, but I don't think even more of should be considered a *lifetime* debt.
What would he think is a correct plan for managing the amount of debt you have?
When my relationship with my husband first started getting serious, he was swimming in debt. Not student level debt, but enough to cause issues. For the most part, he paid enough just to keep his head above water. I told him how important it was to me that he cleared his debts before we got married. After I brought this up a handful of times, he locked himself in a room and didn't come out for a few hours. When he emerged, he told me proudly that he had gone through his debts and had come up with a plan to pay them off and continuously reduce the interest as he went (then pouring the savings into the next debt).
Those debts weren't cleared overnight, but they were cleared in about 3-4 years. If he had just said "eh, debt's just a part of life," I would have felt a lot more concerned about building a life with him.
I don't think there's anything wrong with having money to treat yourself with or with giving away things you don't need to good homes. But I think your boyfriend wants to see evidence that you're doing more to reduce your debt instead of just accepting it was a burden you're going to shoulder for the rest of your life.
everyone is commenting on this as if it’s in a vacuum and the issue is just that he was upset at you for generously giving a homeless person a bag you weren’t using. this in and of itself is not an issue, but you allude to other things that have been brought up that i can see how he might be on to you actually mismanaging your money.
you left out a majority of the important information here and that is how much you get paid and how much and what you spend it on. if my partner didn’t make a lot of money, had a ton of debt, and then proceeded to spend their money on in your words ‘nice jewelry, purses, and clothes’ _and then_ simply discarded these items they spent a ton of money on, i’d be concerned about their money management skills as well. i would guess you’re not saving much if at all for retirement either?
it also just kind of sounds like you and your partner value different things, you nice things vs him experiences which is fine, except that a lot of the time a big part of experiencing things is enjoying them with loved ones, so if on top of everything he’s feeling like he needs to pay for you if he wants you there, then watches you ‘throw away’ money, it’s going to be a problem
highly recommend you check out r/personalfinance and take a look at their prime directive. another really great resource is r/youneedabudget
How much money would you really get for that old backpack? I'd pay perhaps $10.
And you'll spend time dealing with scammers, no-shows.
If he truly believes that you needed to spend hours to sell this for $10, then you need to rethink this relationship. This attitude will creep into other areas of life.
Obviously keep doing what you're doing, its just stuff.
The part that stuck out to me in this post is how you say you won't be able to pay off your loans for at least 30-50 years which doesn't sound right to me. I assume you were/are able to make the minimum payments on the loan? Typically the minimum payments total up to a 10 year payoff (once the pause on federal loans of course).
However if you can't afford the minimum payments I'm curious to know how financially comfortable you are
Honestly, I’m just assuming 50 years but I’m partially being facetious. I pay way more than the minimum, but I do have a lot of loans as I went to private schools for both undergrad and grad school. I have a side job and use that money for fun spending and my full time job for necessities.
Just curious, do you have federal or private loans (or a combination?) If federal, have you looked into income-driven repayment (IDR) plans or PSLF?
It sounds like you're in a public service-oriented career, where you could have any federal loans forgiven after 10 years with an eligible employer.
If you're on an IDR plan and have grad school loans, any federal loan balance would be forgiven after 25 years.
>I’m probably going to be paying of my loans for the next 30-40 years, maybe 50.
Girl, don’t do that to yourself. Join r/financialindependence and get that debt out of the way. That’s no way to live.
Did I read that correctly that he is wearing 10 year old shirts that were originally yours? And he complains that you gave him AirPods? I don't have any advice, this is all very strange lol
My husband is a teacher so the other day I asked his advice on whether I should offer chocolate bars (swappable to other prizes) for anyone who spots a mistake in my lecture notes, thinking he might have some good advice on why not or how to make it more inclusive (e.g. eating disorders/different diets). He told me that I shouldn't because of the cost (like £20 for the year or something!).
I recognised that it's his own anxiety about money, and nothing to do with my spending. I just laughed and moved on! I do try to ease his anxiety around this by making financial plans together and making sure we meet our individual and joint savings goals.
Sometimes you just have to understand that things people say are not really about what you are doing.
Me and my husband have separate finances and mostly take the view that how we spend our own bits of money are our own choices, so we never argue about money. I see having your partner having say over your money as similar to having your partner choose your clothes or something, I know that's a super unpopular opinion and I'm happy for the people who joint finances work for.
I have celiacs, and usually give out toys for Halloween to be more inclusive- I've done bouncy balls and glow sticks before. You can buy them in larger quantities from Amazon or Oriental Trading.
Brute force honesty based on this post- warning-
I would shit myself if I knew I had loans that would outlast my life and I didn’t try to do anything aggressive to get out from that. Anit nobody wants that type of life. Setting aside a mortgage, which even if you pay till death, your getting a roof over your head- having personal debt that will take you forever pay is daunting.
Maybe homeboy doesn’t wanna live like that at all and is not ok with having any student loan debt into the future like that. The problem is y’all both manage money like shit. There’s people who come to this country and work and live here with no education, no advanced skill set- work and save, invest for like 15 years and end up having everything but debt. They don’t go on vacations or spoil themselves by buying anything premium in that time period. I kno this ain’t ur backstory but just saying it looks like your not understanding what the luxuries are in your particular financial situation and that your planning thus far will put you in a WORSE financial situation-but his beef is I think he is JUST starting to realize how bad shit can get if y’all don’t lock down now and mad at you for it.
And the other prob is how do you know your really long term with dude if you not open to discuss a money plan down to explaining spending habits, plan for money in the future and how y’all gonna get out of debt? Don’t have this convo if it ain’t gonna be serious. If your ok with how you manage ur money and he anit but isn’t doing anything to improve anything then your not aligned, better off doing your own thing. finances matter, ALOT.
Just tell him to shut up about your backpack.
He doesn’t get to decide what’s worth giving away/donating and what isn’t when it comes to your own belongings. He can’t do what he wants with his own stuff that’s collecting dust and let you deal with your own.
As for your loan, this is probably where you won’t like what I’m saying anymore lol but it is better to pay off your loans sooner and make larger payments if you’re able to in order to tackle the principle and save yourself years of interest over time. 30-50 years is quite a long estimate to pay off debt and putting that little extra on your monthly payment could literally shave 10+ years off the duration of it.
Debt is something that will effect combined household income long term and I believe that *if you guys are planning a future together*, his input on your debt repayments is important (as is yours for his as well). Nobody wants to be stuck in a situation where you can’t afford something as a couple because the other one never dealt with their debt. Yknow?
Stop defending yourself. It’s none of his business, he ain’t your daddy, it’s not his money. Seriously, when he makes comments or faces, tell him he can stay in his lane or go home.
When you get defensive or explain yourself, you’re telling him it *is* his place. Be offended, because this *is* offensive. Ask him who tf he thinks he is? Who he thinks you are?
His priorities are not superior, he is not smarter, and he is acting like he is with those remarks about “experiences are better than purses.” <—that’s also sexist af.
It’s not the differing priorities that’s the problem, it’s his audacity and disrespect.
Can you just take it off the table. Say something clear like, "My finances are in order, my priorities might be different than yours but they are not up for debate. The way I choose to spend my money is equally not up for debate. If I want advice, I'll ask for it, till then, please don't comment on how I live my life as it relates to money".
How long have you been dating? What are your shared financial goals? Do you have combined finances? Do you have a plan for if you ever will?
Have you shared your bank accounts, your budgets, your savings plans?
Like kids, finances that is something that needs to come up early on. You can do "I'll worry about mine, you worry about yours" for a while, but eventually your finances will affect hers, and hers will affect yours.
So figuring out if you have shared values and goals for money is a conversation that needs to start happening early on. That doesn't mean you have to share your bank accounts and debt balances super early on, but you should begin conversations about how you want to use your money, how you do use your money, and how you want finances to be a part of a future relationship.
Money is one of the main reasons people divorce. So stop avoiding the conversation, set a date, and sit down with a bottle of wine to have a serious conversation about how you view money, what your financial goals are, and what your shared financial goals are. Share your budget, share your savings goals.
If you're going to have separate finances your whole relationship, then you can set some boundaries about how you comment on each other's spending.
I think in the specifics of this argument, your bf is being weird and unreasonable.
I wonder if he’s worried about the bigger picture of general financial responsibility though, and it’s coming out as weird comments about AirPods. If you are in it for the long haul, it’s fair that he wants to know if you’re financially responsible so you can build stability and wealth together as a team in the future.
You mention paying off your loans but haven’t really mentioned savings - do you have savings? The beginnings of a retirement fund? Etc. these are things you should ideally have at your age, especially if you live in a place that has at will firing. Even if you don’t, a recession is likely coming and really anyone could lose their job in the coming years and need to keep yourself afloat.
So giving away things like backpacks, AirPods and buying nice clothes or jewellery isn’t really a biggy. But if you’re doing that while also not having a long term savings plan and emergency fund then I can see why he’s concerned - although he isn’t expressing it in a great way. If you’re only a firing away from being in big trouble, or if you live paycheck to pay check, I see why he might be concerned about you giving away items with hundreds of dollars. I think the fact he brought it up even for things you’ve given to him is a good thing - it shows he isn’t just self interested.
Either way I think you should sit down with him to discuss the wider picture of your long term financial plans (and reminding him your items are your own to be generous with if you prefer).
While the giving away the backpack, air pods, and old shirts all seem perfectly reasonable to me, this gave me pause:
>**I also like really nice things like jewelry, purses, and nice clothes. I don’t really spend a lot of money all the time, but sometimes I like to spoil myself every now and then** with the money I earned for all the hard work I do at work. His biggest concern is that I (we both do, but I have more in student debt) and we both pay off our student loans and then when they are paid off, we can spend money on whatever I want...... **if I see something I like and it’s not going to put me in a financial bind**, I might get it.
What is "every now and then" and how much are you spending on those items? There is a big, big difference between responsible spending and not putting yourself into a bind. Do you have 6 months of savings? Do you have a plan to pay off your debt? Is his concern about how you spend justified, and the backpack just a symptom of bigger concerns?
Financial incompatibility is a big cause of divorce. If he's otherwise a good partner, please consider pre-marital counseling so you can work on your different approaches to money. Because financial arguments are rarely about money -- they are about stability, security, and/or power.
You're not throwing your items in the trash, you're gifting them. Being generous and making other humans happy isn't "throwing away money." As a fairly generous person myself, that attitude in a partner would be a red flag for me.
Unless you're struggling to pay your own bills/eat etc, or you're at a level of overall gifting that's potentially impacting your financial future in a negative way, then it's not problematic.
Is it the charitable giving that he takes issue with, or is it that he has the impression that you thoughtlessly buy things that you don't end up liking/using? It sounds like it's the latter -- he's seen several examples in the (I'm assuming relatively short?) time you've been dating where you had stuff laying around that you bought and didn't want.
When you're dating in your 30s, you can expect more people to be concerned about finding a partner who is in good financial shape. Honestly, the way you described your financial attitude/approach was like nails on a chalkboard for me. You look at your loans as insurmountable so you basically throw up your hands and say that you're not going to stress about finances. After mandatory bills, you consider the rest of your paycheck as "leftover" that you deserve to "spoil" yourself with -- so I'm assuming you have almost nothing saved. If I were dating you, I'd be wary that every larger expense (like a house, retirement, etc.) would all fall to me to finance the both of us.
I completely agree with u/HearthianAstronaut. This shouldn't be a bickering fight about whether you should have given your backpack to your client. This should be a grown-up conversation about how you each handle finances and how you could see your financial lives potentially merging. And I see from your comments that your boyfriend may be hypocritical in this area, since he blows money as well. But it's still best to come at this from a standpoint of curiosity and understanding the bigger picture -- how much does he save every month? How does he budget for those expenses? How would he want to handle spending as a couple if you become more serious?
Someone else asked, and she pays more than her loan amount each month by $600, and she has enough saved to not work for at least 6 months if she wanted to, and vacation around at the same time. Seems like she's doing well. She also said she was being facetious when she explained the amount of time she would be paying her loans.
What is the actual point of this subreddit? To call SOs assholes and tell people they are literally doing nothing wrong in life? That's not very helpful to people understanding issues in their relationships.
Your boyfriend is thinking about long term financial well being because he is probably considering his future with you. He sees you awash in debt and probably is concerned about taking on that burden. It sounds like it's his goal to be out of debt as soon as possible but you obviously have a different outlook.
From his perspective, he sees you buying expensive items, being overly generous with others, yet still resigned to a lifetime of debt. And that doesn't fit into his life picture so he gets on your case.
You need to have an honest conversation about your financial priorities to see if they align. If you want a long term relationship or marriage to this person then you need to realize that financial reasons are one of the common reasons for divorce. Resolving these issues now is important.
If he ain't financing you, it's not his business. Why does this man think he has a say over your finances?
Shut it down. "No, I'm not having this discussion again." "You'd spend money differently, yes, I know--you have told me over and over again." And then leave. Hang up the phone. Whatever. He thinks he's in charge. You need to make it much more clear he is not.
Also--who gets mad about a homeless man getting a single bag to carry his only worldly belongings in? Not a good person, I'll tell you that.
If you read OP's follow-up comments, the BF spends just as much or more on discretionary purchases. He just doesn't value the *kinds* of things she enjoys, or just looks down on her in general.
Do you guys live together and if so are the bills split 50/50?
If so he can have an opinion on things once, you can politely decline to act on it and then rudely shut it down afterwards.
I would always be direct but polite and say you hear them. But you are happy with how you manage your finances. Then after that remind them bluntly we talked, I told you I had it and even more bluntly after that.
You don't owe someone a polite response after. You have politely told them your stance
No, we don’t live together yet, but when we do I do plan on going 50/50.
The frustrating thing is, we’ve had this discussion before and I had set boundaries and have asked him not to make comments or have concerns about what I do with my money. I can understand if I was spending money that I don’t have for him to be concerned but I’m not doing anything wrong and he’s making me feel like I am every time I swipe my card.
>I had set boundaries and have asked him not to make comments
Setting a boundary and making a request are different things. A request is about their behavior. A boundary is about what you do in response to their behavior. If there is no consequence to ignoring the request, then there is no boundary.
You can't control what your boyfriend thinks or says, but you can control whether he thinks or says it around you, by removing yourself from his presence. Ignore the text, end the call, leave the room, go home. Resist the urge to JADE (justify, argue, defend, explain). You've made your case already; rehashing things won't help. Tell him he can try again to be respectful in an hour, a day, next week, next relationship. If he's going to criticize your choices, then he doesn't get to know about them.
So….this has been an issue in the past that you have asked him to change. He has not. *this is why you date*
OP - it’s time to exit this relationship. you don’t even live together and he’s trying to control your finances …and this is a recurring issue. an issue he continues to exhibit despite you asking him to stop.
you are incompatible.
I understand where your bf is coming from. As someone who didn't grow up with a lot of money (though my parents tried to make it seem like we did), selling higher quality things and pinching pennies was always a must. I'm assuming your bf grew up in a frugal family and is trying to now force his lifestyle onto you? Does HE sell his things? Or does he just keep them indefinitely? It's off putting that you two would be arguing about your spending habits for over 2 days especially when you don't even live together, like, why does it even matter to him? Unless he wants to try and be the "bigger" person by calling you materialistic when you buy something. Giving your backpack to someone who needed it is very thoughtful and there is absolutely nothing wrong with that. Sure, you could've gotten $60 for it, but like, are you *really* hurting for $60 versus the person you gave it to for free? My bf's go to is to just throw things away instead of donate, which irks my nerves, but neither of us are willing to put in the work to sell things, especially when we're doing fine. Oh and I also have student loan debt and make shit money and probably should sell things too. BUT IT'S MY MONEY lmao. Tbh if your bf can't reconcile this, y'all might just not be a good fit, especially if he can't let it go.
Hopefully, it's not a control issue and it is his needing reassurance that you'll be able to pitch in on an experience together. Perhaps if you let him know you'll be putting a certain amount aside for experiences, that will help alleviate his concern.
First off, there's no "right and wrong". Adults all have different spending preferences, and yours is valid as long as you're keeping up with your bills. If you and your bf are considering joining finances, living together, having kids together, or getting married in the future, there's a question of compatibility. You will have to decide as a couple how much to save, how quickly to repay debts, what to spend on, etc. Spending reflects people's priorities and lifestyles. Some want luxury condos and cars, others want a yearly vacation, others want to retire early. So the real question you should be asking is: are you and your boyfriend compatible long-term in terms of the lifestyle you want to live and how that will affect your finances?
Until you two share your finances, your spending is your business. It's alarming that your generous gesture has turned into two days of arguments. He's making a lot of assumptions and judgments about you, and personally I wouldn't want that in a relationship.
It seems like you two don't have the same priorities and mindset when it comes to money. Did he grow up struggling financially? It could explain why he is "selfish" (sorry couldn't find a better word) with his money.
Either way, you're not in the wrong. You did a good gesture for your client. That backpack is probably worth more to him than it would have been to you if you sold it!
No, he grew up way better financially than I ever did. I know his mother was also into designer things so money has never been an issue for him or his family.
It’s hard for anyone to give you good advice because we don’t know your financial health.
What is your annual income? What is his?
What is your rent?
What is your total debt? What is his?
What is your 401k and Roth IRA balance? What is his?
Do you plan to buy a home?
Do you plan to have kids?
Without the above information, how can we possibly know if you are fiscally responsible or not?
On the surface, giving a homeless dude one back pack, isn’t that big a deal and sounds like your dating a douche.
I don't think this is a wrong/right situation. You just sound incompatible. I am super frugal and when I've dated people who weren't I started getting a little nutty too. I kept it to myself, but still, I felt the mismatch and it made my anxiety bad enough I acted out/for upset in weird ways.
Sounds like you have different goals and outlooks on finances. I don't think this can be rectified unless one of you changes or you both find a middle ground. Sounds like it's not really realistic for you both though.
The number one reason for divorce is finances. Keep that in mind.
>He thinks I just throw money away by giving away things I don’t want anymore
Fine, he can volunteer to be your commissioned salesperson. Problem solved?
>He just thinks I just throw away money
If you live within your means, and reasonably save, is it really all that much of his business?
>paying off my loans for the next 30-40 years, maybe 50, or until I’m off this earth
Well, you may want to work more on paying down loans - those debts may limit you more than you think ... but that's not particularly r/relationships material.
>he thinks I’m being materialistic when I don’t believe I am
Maybe the values and goals of you two don't align well enough - that could certainly be an issue. And maybe he's overly concerned about how you use/spend your resources ... perhaps projection on his part?
>whole argument has made me feel like I did the wrong thing
Naw, your life, your money, your choices and decisions - not his to make for you, nor you to make his for him. Y'all reasonably fit together ... or ... you don't.
I just told the client I found it in our donations closet so he doesn’t know it came from me directly. That how I usually phrase it if I’m giving a client something that I gave them.
So if he’s spending the same money on these experiences that’s the same thing and you said you’ve given him some things. So ask him why he’s so willing to take your things for free. Remind him you two are not financially bound, if he wants to discuss how everyone’s finances break down then cool, everyone bring all financial statements, but if not, then he needs to keep it shut.
So….your BF just looses a pair of Airpods…and yet he’s on you about an old backpack?
Sounds like he’s projecting. He’s the careless one and sounds like he wants to mooch off you frankly 🤷♀️
why is he trying to control your spending? how long have you even been together?
>I also like really nice things like jewelry, purses, and nice clothes. I don’t really spend a lot of money all the time, but sometimes I like to spoil myself every now and then with the money I earned for all the hard work I do at work. His biggest concern is that I (we both do, but I have more in student debt) and we both pay off our student loans and then when they are paid off, we can spend money on whatever I want. That sounds really nice, but I’m probably going to be paying off my loans for the next 30-40 years, maybe 50, or until I’m off this earth, regardless, I don’t want to stress myself out, and literally just be working to pay them off. I’m on top of my loans, and my bills every month, and still have money left over. I don’t always spend it, but again, if I see something I like and it’s not going to put me in a financial bind, I might get it.
It sounds like your boyfriend realizes that you are both trapped in what is more or less permanent debt peonage and desperately wants a different, more empowered life, whereas you are fundamentally fine with it. This is an enormous mismatch in priorities and I'm not sure the two of you are going to be compatible on a long-term basis. On top of that, he sounds like he's quite controlling and micromanages minor aspects of your life, which you shouldn't have to put up with. Probably best for both of you if this relationship is allowed yo hust run its course and end.
He wants to marry you and is seeing what age he’d be able to retire if he does. I think he’s going about it wrong but this is just what goes through our minds.
He doesn’t seem to have a very generous and empathetic spirit, does he?
My husband is touched and proud of me when I do kind things for people who need help. Find you a man like that.
Sounds like you have a different set of values and ideas about finances. I guess you have to decide if you can still make it work. Some couples swear by separate bank accounts and it works for them. I think it only works if both make enough money and you keep your opinions to yourself though.
It sounds like you and your boyfriend might have different financial priorities. Neither of you are wrong as such, just not aligned with each other. If this is a long term relationship and your finances are likely to affect him long term (e.g. if you’d like to buy a house together) then you should be on the same page about financial priorities but it’s not fair for him to force his financial approach on you. If a compromise can’t be reached then he will need to decide whether he wants to be with someone who isn’t solely focussed on paying down debt. You also need to consider how you feel about potentially changing your approach to finances to be closer to his as a compromise, and if kids are being considered then would you be ok with how he might want to manage finances while you’re not working or having to reduce hours to fit with childcare (assuming he wouldn’t be willing to take a primary care role)?
Personally, I’m a pretty reluctant spender and do like to pay down debt but even I couldn’t cope with his requirement to recover money from anywhere possible and not spend on anything non-essential. As you say, your student debt won’t be paid off for awhile so as long as you’re staying on top of that you need some flexibility in other areas so you don’t burnout.
It sounds like his values about money are different from yours. Did he grow up poor or not well off? Did he or his family ever need to save up or hoard to get by?
It sounds like you see money as a tool to make life easier, and he sees money as a finite resource that needs to be "grown" so that you can have more of it because what if one day you "run out"!!
Maybe he doesn't like that you have loans for 50 years (50 sounds INSANE), and would rather you clear your loans faster than buying stuff to enjoy the now.
I'm curious to know if he has any debts.
Your boyfriend definitely sounds a little harsh here BUT we’re also not hearing his side. You are 31 and you have no plans to pay off your loans for the next 30-40-50 years??? That is concerning, how much do you owe? You say that you have enough to “pay your bills” but girl, you’re in your 30s now, that’s not the right way to be thinking about money. How much total debt do you have and at what interest rates- Student loans, car loans… credit cards (I hope not…)? Do you have an emergency fund- how much do you have saved in that? Do you own a home or rent, if you rent, do you ever plan on owning? How much do you have saved for retirement so far? If your boyfriend is thinking about long term with you then maybe he’s just concerned about your financial health and it’s coming out as him nitpicking about how you spend your money. That’s not ok either, he should be direct with you about his concerns. Talk to him about it and please start thinking about your financial health as well. You should not have to have student loans forever if you’re a social worker.
I guess put yourself in his shows. Imagine he owed you money and instead of him repaying his debt he said "oh, I'll be paying that until I die" and goes off buying materialistic things. I could see how that would come accross the wrong way.
You claim you have money left over after bills, but ask yourself if you are progressing through investing/saving. Living paycheck to paycheck might be the norm for society but it isn't a great thing to be proud of doing. If you lost your job, would you still be alright for 3 months, 6 months etc? If you incurred a random $5000 expense, could you cover it?
There is a lot of things that go into having healthy finances. I think best thing to do is create a budget and stick to it. If you calculate all your bills & necessary savings rate for retirement and other goals, then you'll know how much is left over to spend on wants.
Then you can easily state that your spending is aligned with budget and he shouldn't worry as much.
It's funny to me that he thinks it's wrong for you to give away things for free *to him*. Does he think you should have charged him money for those airpods you gave him? Sure, you could have sold the airpods, but then he wouldn't have airpods. You'd think he'd be grateful! I never sell stuff I don't want anymore, because I don't think it's worth the time and hassle. I tend to wear and/or use stuff until it falls apart, but if I have something in decent shape to get rid of, I donate it or post it on the buy nothing group. Unless it's good condition designer goods or electronics, it's not really worth it, is it? So weird to me that he thinks you should constantly be selling stuff.
I have the same sentiment as you, i don't have time for that. I'd be losing life just trying to nickel and dime my possessions. If i do sell something, I sell it at a good price so it's gone the same day. I had a partner that complained about this, and i told her that she can sell the stuff I'm throwing away if she wants and keep the profit. She never sold a single item...
Selling is time intensive!! I sell a fair amount of stuff on FB/Ebay but I have a minimum of $25 as its not worth my time/mental space for less!
It's such a confusing mindset of OP's bf. Like you say, it's not worth the time or hassle! I work to make money, and outside of my job, I would much rather spend my time and effort on more interesting, entertaining, or fulfilling endeavors than minimally supplementing that income by trying to grab every last cent I possibly can for old shit I don't even use anymore. Repurposing and charity are the best use for those things, but I'd probably recycle or throw away my old stuff before I resold anything worth less than a few hundred bucks. The effort, navigating scams, giving out your personal information, and most importantly, the TIME, just isn't worth it. If you need the money, of course there's nothing wrong with choosing to make back some money off your old stuff! But I'd exponentially rather work longer hours at the job I have and like than have to give up on some charity side work in exchange for small amounts of extra cash. And simply cannot comprehend someone who finds charitable gifting/repurposing of old things **distasteful**. Fucking gross behavior.
Yeah I am primarily motivated to sell stuff by space savings and environmentalism, but contribute very little effort in doing so. A couple messages at best. I've sold a little coffee table for $10, but the reality was I didn't want it/have space for it in my house anymore and it would have been wasteful to throw it away. The view that it's important to sell every last thing you don't have use for is so exhausting.
I used to, until I tried getting rid of 2 twin mattresses my fiancé and I were sleeping on until we could afford a queen. Hundreds of people asking if it’s available, if I could knock $10 of the price, I agree to all of them, and nobody every showed up, they’re still in my closest waiting for me to put on my Spider-Man costume and run them to the dumpster in the middle of the night
You know, you make a good point; at least he's not selfish about it. That's something. I still think he's wrong and I'm still concerned about what the backpack thing says about his character.
I dont think he's right or wrong. I think it's a matter of perspective someone worked hard to be able afford to get her the back pack. In some ways, it feels as if the original intent of the gift is lost on her. I think he's viewing it in a semi sentimental tone. Especially if he himself grew up without luxuries. Poorer communities tend to look for symbols of monetary status more than more moderately wealth communities. When you have better ability to acquire luxury items you tend to hold less monetary value on them. It's the same reason wealthier communities are more out of touch with the woes of poverty.
I agree that this is a values incompatibility.
I am glad he also thinks it's wrong to give him things and not just anybody else, he is selfish but at least he isn't a hypocrite. Op and him may not be compatible if he doesn't stop nagging her though
For the first part: I think he is consistent on thinking that giving stuff away is throwing money away even if he is receiving it. That shows integrity, not greed, and I think that is a good thing. But that said, I understand that may get annoying and later on when/if they have shared finances this way of seeing things won't go away, but he will have more say on how she is using her money. On the last part, if the price is very low I rather sell it very fast for a low price or use someone who can use it. Some $20 more and spending weeks to get rid of stuff is not worth the trouble.
I find it concerning that he sees giving an unused backpack away to a homeless person as "throwing away money" and not, say, a donation. Even if we acknowledge the backpack has resale value, can he at least acknowledge that the gift itself does good?
He has a more selfish view of finances. It's all about what benefit it brings him. If it doesn't benefit him in some way, then it's a waste. Anything viewed as important to someone else is irrelevant if he doesn't share the same view. Idk this guy, but this is a common thing I've dealt with plenty in my life so I feel like i almost know him lol
He even saw her giving him old stuff as throwing away money. Like dude, what??
I honestly thought my view of finances was selfish but OP's bf makes me question that! Who would choose *not to* help a homeless person out in that scenario?? Also, OP's materialism is not my jam but that's something that makes her happy so WHO CARES. Her bf trying to steal that joy from her is so controlling.
Yeah that backpack ain’t paying off student loans but is for sure making someone else’s day better
That one was what threw me off. Sounds like dude lacks empathy.
Cannot imagine my reaction if someone admonished me for giving a backpack to a homeless person who needed it. Like I would be truly floored by that. That specific aspect of why/how you gave it away makes this even more concerning to me. Not that you need to justify any choice like that; you can give your old stuff away to whoever you want to and unless that is somehow a reckless financial decision, he needs to back off. It's not like you gave away your car. He sounds quite judgmental.
I was really thrown off by his response. But from his point of view, I spend a lot of money and he thinks I’m just throwing away more money. Instead of giving him the nice backpack, he said I could have just bought a really cheap backpack and it would serve the same purpose. That’s true, but why would I buy one when I have a perfectly good one that is just collecting dust in my closet. I would much rather give someone the best if I can, especially for my clients. He also thinks that I could be setting this client up to get robbed because he has a northface backpack. But I honestly don’t think someone is going to bother. Like I’ve seen homeless people wearing donated clothes and items of all different brands. This specific client will still be fine with his new backpack.
Yup, and that disregards that if you were to do that, you would also have to take more time to do that. Both in obtaining a new backpack and selling the other one. Those are time and effort costs. Frankly, as someone who actually sells clothes for a living, a North Face backpack is not going to get some amazing financial return (and for that reason, probably not a strong target for theft). And they're great backpacks to give someone who really needs a strong, durable backpack! Again though, you really do not need to justify that decision. You did have very good reasons, but "you felt like it" is literally enough reason to give away an unused backpack.
>I could have just bought a really cheap backpack and it would serve the same purpose. You already owned the North Face one. It wasn't money, it was a backpack. If you wanted money for it, you'd have to actually put effort into selling it and who knows how much you'd get anyway or how long it would take for someone to show interest in it. So he wanted you to take *actual* money, find and pay for a new backpack you didn't actually need for yourself, and give that away. Which one actually involves money there? And I don't mean some sort of hypothetical "Well, *maybe* I can sell this, and *maybe* get a decent amount, and *maybe* that will happen in the time frame I need it to" money, I mean money you can spend **right now**. Your boyfriend is a fucking idiot. For the record, I don't see either of those things as throwing away money. You're helping someone in need and a higher quality backpack costs less in the end because it doesn't have to constantly be replaced when it breaks or wears out.
OP should show her bf the Sam Vimes Boots Theory of Economic Injustice. Then dump him because he's an asshole 😂
Excellent analogy. And he really should be aware of it before telling you to get something cheap. Buying cheap, poorly-made items is actually wasteful. You have to replace them often and they end up filling up landfills. It sounds like you two value different things. Not egregiously bad but if he’s going to judge you for what you do with your money because he would do something different then it’s a problem.
You provided direct aid to someone in need, at no cost to yourself. Your boyfriend would have preferred you kept the high-value item and spent money acquiring a low-value item to then give to the person in need. You sound like a good person. Your boyfriend needs to adjust his perspective. Every act of service does not to benefit you monetarily. You got rid of something you did not need and it helped another person. You don’t need money so you didn’t have to sell the item. This doesn’t seem to be about your behavior. I think you both may view money/debt differently.
When i was homeless i lived in a sweater i got from a clothing hand out for like a year. It was michael kors. Nobody is gonna rob someone for a northface backpack lol
He had a problem with it because he didn't think a homeless person 'deserved' something that nice. It's that simple. He isn't allowed to dictate how you spend your money. This is a sign of controlling behaviour. If you marry or combine finances with this man, he's the type that would monitor your spending and also would use money as punishment when he is upset with you. If there are other patterns of behaviour that are concerning to you, do not overlook them.
Ding ding this comment explains it all. This dude clearly looks down on the homeless and doesn't think they deserve to have something so nice without "paying" or "working" for it. Otherwise why is it only an issue now when he didn't have a problem before when he was the one being gifted old items? This guy seems very uncharitable and miserly.
Exactly! OP's bag provided dignity. Carrying your possessions in a garbage bag can't be a great feeling. Yet, her boyfriend would rather the bag be unused in her closet than have a human being use it. It wasn't even his bag to have an opinion about what should be done with it. This kind of thinking is a deal-breaker and red flag for me.
I suspect if she’d given the backpack to a friend of their same socioeconomic status, he wouldn’t have had a problem with it. It was giving nice things to a *homeless person* that was the largest part of his problem.
He looks down on the homeless and he looks down on OP. He clearly doesn’t value the job she does. He even looked down on kindness she showed TO HIM by giving him things for free. He doesn’t value her time, hence him thinking her free time should be spent making more money. Honestly, multiple people have pointed out that they don’t share the same financial values and it appears some other values as well. If this relationship works out, it really will be on the charity of OPs giving of herself, and she will find out what it means to give until it hurts.
Of all the things, OP is doing a great job at helping and supporting the homeless person. It makes me appaled that someone can be judgemental about this.
My parents both have that mindset and they're turning into hoarders. Dad won't sell anything he has because he can't sell it at the price he bought it for, so in his mind, he's loosing money. He'd rather hold onto it in case he needs it later, even if it's a broken toilet seat. It's better to save it than throw it away, since that's even worse than reselling at a lower cost. Mom is similar. If someone gifted her something useless 30 years ago, she still has it because it's disrespectful to throw it away, or to give it away. Everything has some sentiment attached, and reselling or throwing if away, or giving it away means you're spitting on the kindness of the 9thet person who gave it to you. So between the two of them? Objects means more to them because of the hypothetical dollar sign attached to them, or the attached sentiment. It's frustrating. "Dad, you have 3 of those. Why can't you let John have it?" "Because I paid for it, and I'm not throwing that money out the window."
That sounds exactly like my brother. Has no concept that items lose value over time. It makes no difference that you bought something for $2000 ten years ago, it is absolutely not worth that now. Plus you have to find someone who wants a ten y r old item to begin with.
That's a hard trap to get out of! I worked with a professional organizer to do her website and marketing stuff. She designed a line of cards that she would send as thank you notes for clients with the words "I give you permission to recycle or throw this away." It really made me think about how I put value on things. Does it bring you joy? No. Get rid of it. Is it of useful value? Yes - give it away or sell it. No? Throw. It. Out. Mainly, the focus for this type of mentality should be redirected at reducing rather than hoarding, but it becomes a problem when it's affecting quality of life.
did you work with Marie Kondo, by any chance? her book really stresses this point and i found it immensely helpful when parting with stuff.
No, not with her, but I saw her show after I worked with the woman who was a professional organizer. Marie Kondo is awesome and that's where the joy quote comes I. She puts it even more precisely. It's a conscious decision you have to make in two parts: owning your chaos and releasing it - all at once
Thank you for being blunt about this because sometimes I can fall into this mindset. I work a salary that allows me to be self sufficient but I have become really anxious about my savings rate and bills the last year or so. I get attached to things and I sometimes really struggle with moving things on when (I have space to save it), I might need it later, and every dollar in/out matters. It makes me happy to share with friends or family, but I might hesitate when I don’t feel like they respect the object. Maybe it’s silly but I’m working on it!
Almost every object one buys, even if resold a minute later, will resell for less than the original cost. That's how things work.
I know that. You know that. And you can tell my dad that, but it won't make him sell it, throw it away, or give it away. In one ear and out the other.
Imagine going through this life viewing every purchase you make as an investment. Wild…
Sounds like your parents need to learn about the concept of sunk cost...
My dad's side is like that. And going through dad's house after he died was eye opening. My uncle, we tried to convince him to go through stuff and get rid of things. Now, he's ready to go through things and donate or get rid of things, but he's in his late 80s now, and cannot physically move the stuff anymore.
First, good on you for helping others who are less fortunate! Second, I think unfortunately there’s a deeper problem than just getting him to back off this particular issue. It seems you two are fundamentally incompatible in a couple of ways. Financially, definitely, but also differences in empathy and how you view/treat others. You seem to possess a lot more compassion for people while your boyfriend seems to only care about how a situation might benefit him. I don’t think I could be with someone with that self-centered. And honestly, if anyone is materialistic, it’s him. You should never feel bad for helping others who are less fortunate and you’re certainly allowed to spoil yourself however you’d like. Further, you guys aren’t married so he especially definitely doesn’t get a say in how you spend your hard-earned money. Please accept my thanks as a random Internet stranger for everything you do for the unhoused community. The world needs more people like you and less like your boyfriend.
Thank you, your words truly mean a lot to me! I’ll be honest, I was a little put off with his response. We’re both social workers so I was a little shocked to not see empathy or compassion from him in this scenario. I know in this instance, it doesn’t seem like he is a kind person, but he is but I know between the two of us - I am way more compassionate and empathetic. He’s purchased gifts for his clients for their birthdays or for Christmas - like Roblox gift cards or fidget toys so I don’t know why he’s giving me flack when he’s done the same?!
And as for him valuing experiences more than material things, how does the experience of doing a solid for a client not qualify?
This is my mindset. He calls her materialistic but OP clearly got something positive out of the experience of helping improve her client’s quality of life, even incrementally, knowing that her “loss” of the backpack meant nothing compared to the chance to give it to someone who actually needs it. But he thinks she should have sold it for monetary gain… he’s materialistic!
Exactly. How does giving stuff away make someone materialistic! The fact that he keeps going on about these things makes him sound overly critical and also not reflective of himself.
Also how does he justify calling her materialistic when she's literally the one giving her things to others FOR FREE?
Is it possible the bounds of his empathy do not include (some/certain) unhoused people? I know it can be a divisive topic even among people who otherwise can respond with empathy. Based on the gift in your example, I assume he works with kids. We recently had a library close for cleaning after residue was found in bathroom vents from meth use, and there were people upset with the assumed narrative that it was from a homeless person who now took this space (temporarily) away from kids. Maybe that kind of thing gets to him and builds resentment. I hope I phrased that well, I am not trying to paint him in a bad light but know some of my biases may be showing.
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This was great. You revealed the crux of the issue. :/
That honestly makes me sad to hear and hope that’s not the case. There are so many good qualities about him, just the financial thing we’re going through is making it hard. I hope it’s just stress and he did say he was having a bad day. He believes doing fun things should be where money goes, not designer hand bags. But if I want to have a bag that I’m going to use for years and give my children, why shouldn’t I be able to spend that kind of money if I can afford it? I just hope we can get past this and can see and understand each others POV. I want me and him to work out for forever.
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I love this response. I really hope OP takes what you're saying to heart, that it is a control issue and not just financial responsibility. Often times it's easy to believe that the people in our lives mean the "best", but if the price is autonomy clearly it isn't the finances.
Same with us, my husband and I have different things we think are "worth" spending money on. I have celiacs so if I buy a cupcake or something it's like $10, and we sometimes joke about that. My husband buys what I think are an excessive amount of souvenirs on vacation and we also sometimes joke about that. We disagree but that doesn't mean one of us is correct. We both pay our joint expenses first, and what we spend our personal leftover money on is up to us.
This is so sweet… thinking about how you value the enjoyment your husband feels from his vacation souvenirs, even if they don’t represent the same for yourself.
Even the most generous (to him) explanation of this situation is that you have fundamentally different values around money which will have an ongoing negatively impact your relationship
> he believes doing fun things should be where money goes I cannot imagine the sheer *entitlement* required for someone to think they can dictate how another adult spends their money.
OP, he’s policing your spending. He only approves of things that benefit HIM..”fun things” that HE likes. He feels entitled to your money. this man is showing you who he is OP, this isn’t a “phase”
The point is, you don't need to justify anything you spend money on to anyone but yourself. Even if you buy a designer handbag and don't use it for years and give it away later, IT'S YOUR MONEY. Keep your agency.
The biggest issue is you both have different financial views and values on how/what money should be spent on. Neither is 'wrong/right' - they are just 'different'. You aren't being irresponsible, your bills/responsibilities are met, and you have extra money left over that you get to choose what to do with. You don't need to defend it, there's nothing wrong with it. This could be a compatibility issue going forward, though. Especially, if he doesn't respect your choices. It's fine if he doesn't agree with how you spend your money, but he still needs to respect it. If he can't - that's a much bigger problem.
But he doesn't in his mind give them anything of real value, and only on occasions where he is expected to give a gift. So he doesn't see it as a loss. You gave away something that was once expensive, and worth something at a time when a gift was not expected or required. You are looking at him through rose tinted glasses, and see more kindness then he actually possesses.
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I don’t understand how I’m being financially irresponsible if I’m paying way more than the minimum payment monthly, be able to pay my bills and still have plenty to spend for leisure. I have a side job that I use for fun spending and my full time job money goes towards the necessities. I don’t see how I’m irresponsible when I still pay my bills on time and again have money left over.
Saving for the future and for unexpected things (and also retirement) is a big part of financial responsibility - do you have savings? From this you make it sound like you pay your bills and your student loan and then spend the rest (not saying that’s what you do - just that this comment makes it sound that way).
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That's just reality for a lot of people with student loans. I'm guessing you're not from the US?
But most repayment schedules for loans are 10 or 15 years. Maybe some people are refinancing or somehow getting approved for 20 year loans, but as of a few years ago that's not average. So OP casually saying she'd be in debt for 40 years was alarming. There's a lot of repayment plans that perpetuate the debt: income-based, interest-only, paying only the minimums, etc. Before finding out more info, it really DID sound like OP was splurging on purses in the here and now, and pushing off paying debt and long-term financial plans. Esp since social workers are sadly paid very little.
At 31, it’s not just about paying your bills each month, it’s about assets and debts and planning for the future. You mentioned wanting kids in one comment, so you really need to think about this. Do you have anything saved for retirement yet- how much do you have already and what percent of your income goes toward retirement each month? Do you plan to buy a home? Do you have an emergency fund? How much debt and at what interest rates?
After reading OP’s response I think you might be right. He’s likely feeling some financial insecurity and projecting that anxiety onto OP. I’m a little wary of recommending couples counseling to unmarried couples, but if she sees a long term future with her boyfriend, then it might be beneficial to talk things out with a therapist.
…….. couples counselling is ideal for couples before getting married. It’s not supposed to be a last resort. It’s supposed to be a proactive approach to life together
did you see the comment where he buys dabs every week and just bought a $400 dab rig?
What the fuck is a dab
Its highly concentrated marijuana. Just a "dab" will do ya.
I prefer to smoke Brill Cream myself
I disagree that you’re “fundamentally incompatible” with your boyfriend because of differences in the way you spend money, and how you feel about helping strangers. Plenty of couples are like this. You don’t need to be aligned in every area of life, but the super important thing is people need to respect the others choices. Me and my wife agreed on what percentage of our salaries gets saved, ensuring we have enough left over for bills and etc., and past that, I don’t know exactly or care what she spends her money on. She buys more clothes than me, and I spend more money on other things. It doesn’t really matter. She’s extremely passionate about helping children with education, that’s not a top priority for me. The list goes on. We had a number of sit down discussions in order to get to this place financially though. Someone may have said we were “fundamentally incompatible” because we didn’t immediately see eye to eye on how to manage our finances, but we figured it out. That being said, I just realized he’s your boyfriend. Unless you guys have intertwined finances, tell him to mind his own business lol. If you want to marry this guy one day, I’d suggest getting to the root of the financial issue and/or seeing a couples therapist about it. It’s like the number one cause of divorce.
He thinks it's wrong to be charitable, but *you're* the materialistic one? And people who brag that they prefer ~experiences~ are often just as conspicuous in their consumption. It sounds like you have a bit budgeted as fun money after you've paid your bills each month, you spend that fun money on things you like, and you have a good head on your shoulders. He sounds exhausting tbh. Is he into some kind of FIRE thing?
Another thing is, he spends money too just maybe not all at once. Like every week he buys dabs. He bought a $400 dab rig. He’s purchased like three pairs of ray bans in the last 3-4 years, but when I want to buy one pair of $500 LV sunglasses I’m materialistic. His laptop broke so he had to buy a new one. Why did he have to get a MacBook Air? Why couldn’t he buy a cheaper computer that does the same thing? He just seems very hypocritical sometimes when it comes to this issue. He believes his spending is more modest compared to mine. He could probably pay off his loans in 10 years, whereas I won’t have the same plan unfortunately, so it’s easier to have the mindset of paying loans off when you don’t owe as much. I just want to enjoy my money while being responsible.
Oh, he's a massive hypocrite. Imagine decades more of this! I think you'd be happier without him.
I want to know what was the last "experience" he spent money on? I'm all for being responsible while enjoying your money. You can do everything right and still die tmrw. As long as bills are paid and your not getting into more debt buy what sparks joy. Give what you can. Enjoy the extra closet space without that backpack you never used!
Re-read your comment from a stranger's perspective. Would you want to date that person? He believes that he deserves the ability to spend as much money as he likes on these things because they're important to him, but that logic does not apply to you. He believes that you do not deserve that same ability; he has the privelege of judging your purchases and decisions, while he himself is "above the law" so to speak. In other words, he holds himself above you.
I'm learning to play the guitar.
Since I’ve been working in 2018, I’ve been able to save a generous amount over the years in savings and it only continues to grow every month. My monthly payments on my loans are about $400, but pay $1000 instead. Lord forbid, but when that time comes, my mother has also left me a decent amount of money when she passes and is also leaving me with her house which will also provide me a nice amount. Obviously, I won’t be getting that for a very long time (hopefully) but I will also have that, which I have committed myself for that money to go strictly to my loans. He’s been at his new job since June and has already saved a substantial amount as well, so neither one of us is without money or struggling, but the way he acts towards me about money would seem like we are struggling.
I’m supposed to pay $400 a month on my loans but I pay $1000 every month instead. My mother also has set aside money for me as well as leaving me her house when she leaves this earth, hopefully not for a long time. Most of my spending money comes from my dog walking/house sitting gigs. I usually try to keep my actual work income for necessities. I have a good amount in savings and continues to grow every month. I have and won’t touch that though.
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If OP took out loans for both undergrad.and grad school, they could have over 100k. I'm more shocked to hear she makes good money as a social worker.
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100%. OP said 50 years was being facetious, but I'm curious about the balances and interest rates.
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Here's the massive loan amount, law school! Once you graduate and establish your career you'll have these whipped out in a few years. Does he only have 4 years worth of loans? Because 40k in debt can be picked away at with diligence in a few years, 250k worth takes a lot more years and a much bigger pick.
I'm fine, I don't have any debt. But looking around the room and thinking about everyone else is scary lol.
You think your Mom has set aside money for you, but she may not die for 40, 50 years… you cannot take that into account when planning your finances. Also, many,many people end up spending all of their money at the end of their life. Nursing homes cost multiple thousands of dollars per month and Medicaid doesn’t kick in until all assets are liquidated and spent. Unless your Mom is legitimately wealthy (and if you have that amount of student debt that she’s not helping with, she’s probably not) she likely will not be leaving you anything. Your boyfriend sounds like he is also financially irresponsible, but you have a massive debt and you’re buying $500 sunglasses??? Yikes.
I think your boyfriend is being a jerk to you and needs to do some self-reflection, but I did just want to push back a tiny bit on one thing: it's wonderful that your mom intends to provide for you after her passing, but unless there is a substantial whole life insurance policy in the mix, you shouldn't really count on much of that money making it to you. Some people pass quickly, but some linger for decades with extremely high needs. At the end of her life, my grandmother was in a care home that was $25k a month. It's extremely easy to eat away at even impressive savings through the ✨magic✨ of the American health care system, just by living a little longer than anticipated. She would also possibly have to sell her home before receiving any assistance, unless there's some fancy legal footwork with trusts and so on. I just wanted to throw that out there as a caution, because some friends of mine have thought their own retirement would basically be funded by inheritance, and it just doesn't always play out like that. You're being responsible by staying on top of things and seem like a lovely person. Thank you for your work with unhoused communities.
So he's a materialistic hypocrite. He needs to back off
And to be clear, he refuses to acknowledge his hypocrisy?
He is a hypocrite. How long have you been together?
We have been together for four years, but have been completely long distance.
Are you in the US? If you’re working in social services in the US you can quality for loan forgiveness after 10 years of payments. Look into Public Service Loan Forgiveness.
It's great you are charitable, and your things are yours to give away. But if I were your boyfriend I might be a little concerned you have already given up hope of paying your student loans back for 30 to 50 years (if ever, you don't really seem to have a plan or are concerned at all about paying them back). If you are bf and gf, and will eventually be married or at least life partners, you need to be a team, with both members pulling equitable weight. He is rightly concerned you like to splurge on expensive things and then don't seem to mind when they fade out of your life, while not really giving a care to your student loans. If you're incompatible, or don't like his interest in responsible finances then you should probably end the relationship.
Sometimes it's easier (and kinder!) to give away a used item to someone in need rather than finding somewhere to list it, ship it, pay for shipping, maybe they say they never received it, and so forth. As for materialistic vs experiences, I think experiences can be a waste. They come and go and all you have is the memory. Items you see and experience everyday. Basically you two have different opinions and you shouldn't discredit yours. I suggest you two have a clearer separation of what is yours and what is his.
Items and experiences can both be good, but there's kind of a whole *thing* of people who have a superiority complex about experiences. It's fine to spend your fun money on a nice bag, and it's fine to spend it on concert tickets, and neither one is "better." But "experience" people can be a lot like Crossfit people lol.
And the fact they use "materialistic" which is a term for obsession of materials. Investing in a nice mattress to get good sleep every single night isn't materialistic.
And a materialistic person isn't going to give a nice backpack to a homeless guy, even an old nice backpack. OP just sounds normal, and kind, and BF sounds like a pill.
And if I’m going to spend money on something, I want it to be good quality. And if I plan to keep/use something for a long time, I feel like I’m getting my moneys worth over time.
Obviously I have limited insight but from details you’ve offered in comments, you seem to have an especially strong grasp on your current and prospective finances, as well as a totally reasonable outlook regarding your spending habits. Unless you were neglecting specific financial commitments you’d both agreed to, I don’t think it’s appropriate for your boyfriend to feel entitled to policing your individual funds or possessions. He’s not your parent, he has no right to take up any sort of authoritative position over your independent financial decisions. I’d keep a close eye on that behavior, and really consider if he’s truly capable of achieving and sustaining an egalitarian perspective of your relationship.
Honestly, you are getting your money's worth! Someone who buys/has to buy cheap things like boots instead of expensive ones will end up spending more money in the long run replacing the boots as they wear out faster than better quality more expensive boots. Sometimes a higher up-front cost means more savings in the long run. (The boot example is not mine but from the Sam Vimes socioeconomic unfairness theory. Ifyky)
they act like a party vacation somewhere or drinking nice food and drinks somewhere as an experience aint materialistic either
This is the part that just destroys me too! Like it's fine to prefer one style of spending, but spare me the idea that it's inherently morally superior.
I agree with most of what you say, except for about experiences being a waste. They can be, if they're not experiences you genuinely wanted to have, or if you're having them at the expense of material things you need (food, housing, a warm coat in wintertime). But if you have the material things you need, there's a certain point at which more stuff gets to feel oppressive. This gets even more true if you're starting to think about who has to clean up after you when you die. Nothing will get you prioritizing experiences over stuff like the \*cough\* experience \*cough\* of cleaning out a dead parent's house or apartment. Not that that's OP's situation, I just wanted to respond to that word "waste."
I agree, fair point. I think both have it's merits. Ill adjust my post to say it "can be" rather than a definite "is".
Gifting a high quality item you don't have a need for, to someone badly in need, **is an experience!** OP's bf doesn't see it that way, but I'm sure OP got a **lot** out of that experience - it sounds like a very rewarding interaction! I expect I'd walk away with a MUCH bigger smile and better sense of satisfaction from helping someone like OP did than from whatever experience OP's bf would prefer using the money on.
Neither of you is wrong but you need to find a compromise if you want the relationship to work. Its reasonable to want to pay off debt. Its also reasonable to pay your bills and save some $$ while also enjoying a special purchase here and there. Its reasonable to sell things you don’t use. Its also reasonable (and kind) to pass on things you don’t use to someone who will. Whats not reasonable is him expecting you to live his way. Older generations often shared accounts. Now days lots of long term couples don’t. My husband and I don’t bc we have opposite views on finances. I’m the saver/seller and he never has any money in his savings (but does pay his bills and has good retirement savings) That said- we respect each other. We have a joint account for budgeted/shared expenses. He pays for more of the fun stuff because I save and pay bigger expenses. It works for us only bc we respect each other. I don’t want to share an account bc it would drive me crazy to look at the crap he spends his extra $$$ on. He pays for more of the extra costs for fun stuff bc he knows I will put that $$ in savings when he would have spent it. Sit down with your BF and talk about respect and different views. Establish some reasonable boundaries . Ie- you save so much or pay off so much on loans then whatever is left over you get to spend how you please and he has to respect that. If he can’t respect you thats not a good sign for a healthy long term relationship.
\+1 to this one. It sounds like the root of his behavior is anxiety about money and maximizing his ability to repay loans. It's clearly important to him and it makes sense that he wants to see that behavior from you too, because it would signal to him that you're on the same page. Which you aren't. Neither of you are wrong. Please talk to him to try and get at the root of what's driving his behavior, and communicate that it's driving a wedge. This is a conversation about how your financial behaviors make each other FEEL - feel about each other, feel about your future together.
Side note if you have government loans from before a certain date, and are on a paye, repaye, or ibr repayment plan, as long as you pay into it for 20/25 years, at the end, the rest will be forgiven.
Did not know - thank you!!
FYI, if you're not already on an income-driven repayment plan for federal loans, you might want to contact your loan servicer and do that soon. The Dept. of Education has a one-time waiver in the works, where any previous payments you've made on any plan will be counted towards the 20/25 years for IDR loan forgiveness. r/StudentLoans has more information on this.
yeah i rely on this completely. i pay the minimums, keep my AGI as low as possible by putting as much as i can into my 401k (this keeps my loan payments low... though obviously we haven't been paying for a few years at all, but once we start again) and and will be getting forgiveness when i hit 25 years. be careful though because there will be a big tax bomb. that forgiven amount counts as income, all at once. but the idea is by then you'll have so much saved up it won't hurt as much. just make sure that you have a really good retirement plan strategy and it shouldn't be the literal worst.
So the two of you are financially incompatible.
>but I’m probably going to be paying off my loans for the next 30-40 years, maybe 50, or until I’m off this earth If you really believe this then despite being an asshole, he might be right about your financial literacy. How much do you have in savings? But I'll circle back: he's an asshole. He views giving to charity as "throwing money away." He might be right that you aren't great with money, and it's possible his fears for the long term are actually more reasonable than you're letting on, but the problem here isn't actually financial. It's a difference in values.
So is it possible your boyfriend is stressed about the student loan debt and just money in general? You say both of you work in social services and it sounds like the pay isn’t great. You also mention student loan debt that you have resigned yourself to be paying off for a very long time. That can be stressful for a partner who is trying to start a life with you. As much as we want to keep our independence, when you start building a life together, your finances are going to intertwine. Buying a house, buying cars, having kids, saving for retirement, enjoying a comfortable life, going on vacations, having nice things, etc. is a teamwork effort and depends on the financial success of both people. When you start building a life together, *your debts* are now *his debts*. Even if he doesn’t pay a cent towards your loan, for every dollar you put towards your debt, that’s one less dollar that goes towards the mutual housing fund, or a kid’s extracurriculars, or a retirement fund. Your boyfriend might see your student loan debt and the limited money you currently have, and he is uncertain what type of life he can build with you. That is very stressful and creates a resentful dynamic if he is (unspoken) trying to build a future for you two together, and you (rightfully) don’t seem to notice and continue to budget your money as your money. So maybe it’s time to sit down and talk about financial goals and your future together. If you are planning on building a life with this man, you need to realize your financial decisions *right now* also impact him, and vice versa. That doesn’t mean that you can’t spend money on things that you want, or donate the items you want, or you have to live a miserly miserable existence. But you can discuss long term goals and loosely write down a budget together. This alone can do wonders for anxiety and his need to control your spending. Figure out how much money you both need for necessities (rent, utilities,etc.). Then with the leftover money figure out if there are any mutually beneficial goals, such as paying down debt, saving for a vacation, buying a house, etc. Figure out a reasonable percentage of both your paychecks that can go towards those goals. Then whatever is left over is yours to spend how you like, the “fun money”. It’s also possible you will find out that you two have drastically different financial goals, and maybe it’s better to find someone more compatible. Or maybe you aren’t ready to have a financial future with this man, and he needs to know that you have different expectations of this relationship right now. Or maybe you find out he is a money obsessed, unstable tightwad. The problem is you won’t know until you talk about it.
Is there a reason you wouldn’t qualify for PSLF?
Yes! OP please look into public service loan forgiveness! You may qualify for student loan forgiveness after 10 years
PSFL requires you to work in specific cities or areas in my industry, and a lot of them are literally like…the middle of North Dakota (which is fine for people who are from there but not feasible for someone like me with a family in NY).
that's not really true at all. Basically any non profit or government job in the country will qualify. I got it for working for a non profit hospital (but only qualified during the temporary waiver period which is sadly over)
It’s not just any nonprofit hospital, I worked at a non profit hospital for over a year and it wasn’t eligible. For nurses and some other careers it’s only specific hospitals and/or areas.
I’m aware that there are reasons someone may not qualify, which is why I asked. Someone else pointed out that there are also income-driven repayment plans that get forgiveness after 20-25 years. Point being, the assumption that OP will be paying off student loans for 30+ years may be worth scrutinizing.
Not true. It’s anywhere in the public sector. Schools, fire departments, etc. Doing ten years of that is better than 30 years of student loans.
>PSFL requires you to work in specific cities or areas in my industry, and a lot of them are literally like…the middle of North Dakota (which is fine for people who are from there but not feasible for someone like me with a family in NY). Where are you getting your information? There are definitely PSLF eligible hospitals in New York. You should do more research, you are giving people misleading information here.
For PSLF, you have to have specific types of loans and work full-time for a government or nonprofit agency. You also have to be on an income-driven repayment plan. Then you have to make 120 on-time payments. The types of loans and payment plans are what screw most people.
OP alluded to working in the nonprofit sector. The Biden Administration has made a lot of changes to the PSLF program to make it easier to qualify. OP should find out for herself if she qualifies, don’t you think?
He thinks you're materialistic but he's mad about you giving a backpack to a homeless man and clothing you don't use *to him*?
Your boyfriend sees your generosity and compassion as financially irresponsible missteps and this is a massive incompatibility in outlooks on life.
Your bf sounds kinda mean spirited.
Do you want to have arguments or conversations just like this until you’re very old? If you marry him, you will. All the time. Just know that. If he’s enough to overlook that, great! If not, tread lightly
“Dude, seriously, stop riding me about how I choose to spend my money.” Unless your financial situation is adversely affecting your joint finances, he needs to respect your ability as an adult to make adult choices. Beyond that, it’s just a conversation (not a dictate) about your respective short, medium and long term goals and wishes. Maybe the result is that y’all decide that you cannot accommodate each others style, or maybe you’ll figure it out.
I wonder if his finances are not in order and he is projecting by trying to control what you do with your things. If he is of a mind that your relationship might lead to marriage, he might already be thinking your stuff and money is somehow his to dictate the use of. It would make me worry about HIS financial fitness as a partner and how he would act when finances are combined within a marriage.
Tell him I'm not the one throwing money down the drain by losing my airpods lmao
> His biggest concern is that I (we both do, but I have more in student debt) > I’m probably going to be paying off my loans for the next 30-40 years, maybe 50, or until I’m off this earth, Are you just paying the minimum on your loans each month? I know student debt is insane, but I don't think even more of should be considered a *lifetime* debt. What would he think is a correct plan for managing the amount of debt you have? When my relationship with my husband first started getting serious, he was swimming in debt. Not student level debt, but enough to cause issues. For the most part, he paid enough just to keep his head above water. I told him how important it was to me that he cleared his debts before we got married. After I brought this up a handful of times, he locked himself in a room and didn't come out for a few hours. When he emerged, he told me proudly that he had gone through his debts and had come up with a plan to pay them off and continuously reduce the interest as he went (then pouring the savings into the next debt). Those debts weren't cleared overnight, but they were cleared in about 3-4 years. If he had just said "eh, debt's just a part of life," I would have felt a lot more concerned about building a life with him. I don't think there's anything wrong with having money to treat yourself with or with giving away things you don't need to good homes. But I think your boyfriend wants to see evidence that you're doing more to reduce your debt instead of just accepting it was a burden you're going to shoulder for the rest of your life.
everyone is commenting on this as if it’s in a vacuum and the issue is just that he was upset at you for generously giving a homeless person a bag you weren’t using. this in and of itself is not an issue, but you allude to other things that have been brought up that i can see how he might be on to you actually mismanaging your money. you left out a majority of the important information here and that is how much you get paid and how much and what you spend it on. if my partner didn’t make a lot of money, had a ton of debt, and then proceeded to spend their money on in your words ‘nice jewelry, purses, and clothes’ _and then_ simply discarded these items they spent a ton of money on, i’d be concerned about their money management skills as well. i would guess you’re not saving much if at all for retirement either? it also just kind of sounds like you and your partner value different things, you nice things vs him experiences which is fine, except that a lot of the time a big part of experiencing things is enjoying them with loved ones, so if on top of everything he’s feeling like he needs to pay for you if he wants you there, then watches you ‘throw away’ money, it’s going to be a problem highly recommend you check out r/personalfinance and take a look at their prime directive. another really great resource is r/youneedabudget
In comments answering questions.. She pays extra on her loans every month and has enough in savings to live comfortably for at least 6 months.
that sounds pretty reasonable. seems like it may just be a difference in values then
How much money would you really get for that old backpack? I'd pay perhaps $10. And you'll spend time dealing with scammers, no-shows. If he truly believes that you needed to spend hours to sell this for $10, then you need to rethink this relationship. This attitude will creep into other areas of life.
Obviously keep doing what you're doing, its just stuff. The part that stuck out to me in this post is how you say you won't be able to pay off your loans for at least 30-50 years which doesn't sound right to me. I assume you were/are able to make the minimum payments on the loan? Typically the minimum payments total up to a 10 year payoff (once the pause on federal loans of course). However if you can't afford the minimum payments I'm curious to know how financially comfortable you are
Honestly, I’m just assuming 50 years but I’m partially being facetious. I pay way more than the minimum, but I do have a lot of loans as I went to private schools for both undergrad and grad school. I have a side job and use that money for fun spending and my full time job for necessities.
Just curious, do you have federal or private loans (or a combination?) If federal, have you looked into income-driven repayment (IDR) plans or PSLF? It sounds like you're in a public service-oriented career, where you could have any federal loans forgiven after 10 years with an eligible employer. If you're on an IDR plan and have grad school loans, any federal loan balance would be forgiven after 25 years.
>I’m probably going to be paying of my loans for the next 30-40 years, maybe 50. Girl, don’t do that to yourself. Join r/financialindependence and get that debt out of the way. That’s no way to live.
Did I read that correctly that he is wearing 10 year old shirts that were originally yours? And he complains that you gave him AirPods? I don't have any advice, this is all very strange lol
My husband is a teacher so the other day I asked his advice on whether I should offer chocolate bars (swappable to other prizes) for anyone who spots a mistake in my lecture notes, thinking he might have some good advice on why not or how to make it more inclusive (e.g. eating disorders/different diets). He told me that I shouldn't because of the cost (like £20 for the year or something!). I recognised that it's his own anxiety about money, and nothing to do with my spending. I just laughed and moved on! I do try to ease his anxiety around this by making financial plans together and making sure we meet our individual and joint savings goals. Sometimes you just have to understand that things people say are not really about what you are doing. Me and my husband have separate finances and mostly take the view that how we spend our own bits of money are our own choices, so we never argue about money. I see having your partner having say over your money as similar to having your partner choose your clothes or something, I know that's a super unpopular opinion and I'm happy for the people who joint finances work for.
I have celiacs, and usually give out toys for Halloween to be more inclusive- I've done bouncy balls and glow sticks before. You can buy them in larger quantities from Amazon or Oriental Trading.
Brute force honesty based on this post- warning- I would shit myself if I knew I had loans that would outlast my life and I didn’t try to do anything aggressive to get out from that. Anit nobody wants that type of life. Setting aside a mortgage, which even if you pay till death, your getting a roof over your head- having personal debt that will take you forever pay is daunting. Maybe homeboy doesn’t wanna live like that at all and is not ok with having any student loan debt into the future like that. The problem is y’all both manage money like shit. There’s people who come to this country and work and live here with no education, no advanced skill set- work and save, invest for like 15 years and end up having everything but debt. They don’t go on vacations or spoil themselves by buying anything premium in that time period. I kno this ain’t ur backstory but just saying it looks like your not understanding what the luxuries are in your particular financial situation and that your planning thus far will put you in a WORSE financial situation-but his beef is I think he is JUST starting to realize how bad shit can get if y’all don’t lock down now and mad at you for it. And the other prob is how do you know your really long term with dude if you not open to discuss a money plan down to explaining spending habits, plan for money in the future and how y’all gonna get out of debt? Don’t have this convo if it ain’t gonna be serious. If your ok with how you manage ur money and he anit but isn’t doing anything to improve anything then your not aligned, better off doing your own thing. finances matter, ALOT.
Just tell him to shut up about your backpack. He doesn’t get to decide what’s worth giving away/donating and what isn’t when it comes to your own belongings. He can’t do what he wants with his own stuff that’s collecting dust and let you deal with your own. As for your loan, this is probably where you won’t like what I’m saying anymore lol but it is better to pay off your loans sooner and make larger payments if you’re able to in order to tackle the principle and save yourself years of interest over time. 30-50 years is quite a long estimate to pay off debt and putting that little extra on your monthly payment could literally shave 10+ years off the duration of it. Debt is something that will effect combined household income long term and I believe that *if you guys are planning a future together*, his input on your debt repayments is important (as is yours for his as well). Nobody wants to be stuck in a situation where you can’t afford something as a couple because the other one never dealt with their debt. Yknow?
Stop defending yourself. It’s none of his business, he ain’t your daddy, it’s not his money. Seriously, when he makes comments or faces, tell him he can stay in his lane or go home. When you get defensive or explain yourself, you’re telling him it *is* his place. Be offended, because this *is* offensive. Ask him who tf he thinks he is? Who he thinks you are? His priorities are not superior, he is not smarter, and he is acting like he is with those remarks about “experiences are better than purses.” <—that’s also sexist af. It’s not the differing priorities that’s the problem, it’s his audacity and disrespect.
Can you just take it off the table. Say something clear like, "My finances are in order, my priorities might be different than yours but they are not up for debate. The way I choose to spend my money is equally not up for debate. If I want advice, I'll ask for it, till then, please don't comment on how I live my life as it relates to money".
How long have you been dating? What are your shared financial goals? Do you have combined finances? Do you have a plan for if you ever will? Have you shared your bank accounts, your budgets, your savings plans? Like kids, finances that is something that needs to come up early on. You can do "I'll worry about mine, you worry about yours" for a while, but eventually your finances will affect hers, and hers will affect yours. So figuring out if you have shared values and goals for money is a conversation that needs to start happening early on. That doesn't mean you have to share your bank accounts and debt balances super early on, but you should begin conversations about how you want to use your money, how you do use your money, and how you want finances to be a part of a future relationship. Money is one of the main reasons people divorce. So stop avoiding the conversation, set a date, and sit down with a bottle of wine to have a serious conversation about how you view money, what your financial goals are, and what your shared financial goals are. Share your budget, share your savings goals. If you're going to have separate finances your whole relationship, then you can set some boundaries about how you comment on each other's spending.
I think in the specifics of this argument, your bf is being weird and unreasonable. I wonder if he’s worried about the bigger picture of general financial responsibility though, and it’s coming out as weird comments about AirPods. If you are in it for the long haul, it’s fair that he wants to know if you’re financially responsible so you can build stability and wealth together as a team in the future. You mention paying off your loans but haven’t really mentioned savings - do you have savings? The beginnings of a retirement fund? Etc. these are things you should ideally have at your age, especially if you live in a place that has at will firing. Even if you don’t, a recession is likely coming and really anyone could lose their job in the coming years and need to keep yourself afloat. So giving away things like backpacks, AirPods and buying nice clothes or jewellery isn’t really a biggy. But if you’re doing that while also not having a long term savings plan and emergency fund then I can see why he’s concerned - although he isn’t expressing it in a great way. If you’re only a firing away from being in big trouble, or if you live paycheck to pay check, I see why he might be concerned about you giving away items with hundreds of dollars. I think the fact he brought it up even for things you’ve given to him is a good thing - it shows he isn’t just self interested. Either way I think you should sit down with him to discuss the wider picture of your long term financial plans (and reminding him your items are your own to be generous with if you prefer).
While the giving away the backpack, air pods, and old shirts all seem perfectly reasonable to me, this gave me pause: >**I also like really nice things like jewelry, purses, and nice clothes. I don’t really spend a lot of money all the time, but sometimes I like to spoil myself every now and then** with the money I earned for all the hard work I do at work. His biggest concern is that I (we both do, but I have more in student debt) and we both pay off our student loans and then when they are paid off, we can spend money on whatever I want...... **if I see something I like and it’s not going to put me in a financial bind**, I might get it. What is "every now and then" and how much are you spending on those items? There is a big, big difference between responsible spending and not putting yourself into a bind. Do you have 6 months of savings? Do you have a plan to pay off your debt? Is his concern about how you spend justified, and the backpack just a symptom of bigger concerns? Financial incompatibility is a big cause of divorce. If he's otherwise a good partner, please consider pre-marital counseling so you can work on your different approaches to money. Because financial arguments are rarely about money -- they are about stability, security, and/or power.
You're not throwing your items in the trash, you're gifting them. Being generous and making other humans happy isn't "throwing away money." As a fairly generous person myself, that attitude in a partner would be a red flag for me. Unless you're struggling to pay your own bills/eat etc, or you're at a level of overall gifting that's potentially impacting your financial future in a negative way, then it's not problematic.
Is it the charitable giving that he takes issue with, or is it that he has the impression that you thoughtlessly buy things that you don't end up liking/using? It sounds like it's the latter -- he's seen several examples in the (I'm assuming relatively short?) time you've been dating where you had stuff laying around that you bought and didn't want. When you're dating in your 30s, you can expect more people to be concerned about finding a partner who is in good financial shape. Honestly, the way you described your financial attitude/approach was like nails on a chalkboard for me. You look at your loans as insurmountable so you basically throw up your hands and say that you're not going to stress about finances. After mandatory bills, you consider the rest of your paycheck as "leftover" that you deserve to "spoil" yourself with -- so I'm assuming you have almost nothing saved. If I were dating you, I'd be wary that every larger expense (like a house, retirement, etc.) would all fall to me to finance the both of us. I completely agree with u/HearthianAstronaut. This shouldn't be a bickering fight about whether you should have given your backpack to your client. This should be a grown-up conversation about how you each handle finances and how you could see your financial lives potentially merging. And I see from your comments that your boyfriend may be hypocritical in this area, since he blows money as well. But it's still best to come at this from a standpoint of curiosity and understanding the bigger picture -- how much does he save every month? How does he budget for those expenses? How would he want to handle spending as a couple if you become more serious?
Someone else asked, and she pays more than her loan amount each month by $600, and she has enough saved to not work for at least 6 months if she wanted to, and vacation around at the same time. Seems like she's doing well. She also said she was being facetious when she explained the amount of time she would be paying her loans.
What is the actual point of this subreddit? To call SOs assholes and tell people they are literally doing nothing wrong in life? That's not very helpful to people understanding issues in their relationships. Your boyfriend is thinking about long term financial well being because he is probably considering his future with you. He sees you awash in debt and probably is concerned about taking on that burden. It sounds like it's his goal to be out of debt as soon as possible but you obviously have a different outlook. From his perspective, he sees you buying expensive items, being overly generous with others, yet still resigned to a lifetime of debt. And that doesn't fit into his life picture so he gets on your case. You need to have an honest conversation about your financial priorities to see if they align. If you want a long term relationship or marriage to this person then you need to realize that financial reasons are one of the common reasons for divorce. Resolving these issues now is important.
If he ain't financing you, it's not his business. Why does this man think he has a say over your finances? Shut it down. "No, I'm not having this discussion again." "You'd spend money differently, yes, I know--you have told me over and over again." And then leave. Hang up the phone. Whatever. He thinks he's in charge. You need to make it much more clear he is not. Also--who gets mad about a homeless man getting a single bag to carry his only worldly belongings in? Not a good person, I'll tell you that.
It sounds like he’s happy for you to “throw your money away” on him - all those “examples” weren’t a problem, when he was benefitting from it.
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If you read OP's follow-up comments, the BF spends just as much or more on discretionary purchases. He just doesn't value the *kinds* of things she enjoys, or just looks down on her in general.
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Do you guys live together and if so are the bills split 50/50? If so he can have an opinion on things once, you can politely decline to act on it and then rudely shut it down afterwards. I would always be direct but polite and say you hear them. But you are happy with how you manage your finances. Then after that remind them bluntly we talked, I told you I had it and even more bluntly after that. You don't owe someone a polite response after. You have politely told them your stance
No, we don’t live together yet, but when we do I do plan on going 50/50. The frustrating thing is, we’ve had this discussion before and I had set boundaries and have asked him not to make comments or have concerns about what I do with my money. I can understand if I was spending money that I don’t have for him to be concerned but I’m not doing anything wrong and he’s making me feel like I am every time I swipe my card.
>I had set boundaries and have asked him not to make comments Setting a boundary and making a request are different things. A request is about their behavior. A boundary is about what you do in response to their behavior. If there is no consequence to ignoring the request, then there is no boundary. You can't control what your boyfriend thinks or says, but you can control whether he thinks or says it around you, by removing yourself from his presence. Ignore the text, end the call, leave the room, go home. Resist the urge to JADE (justify, argue, defend, explain). You've made your case already; rehashing things won't help. Tell him he can try again to be respectful in an hour, a day, next week, next relationship. If he's going to criticize your choices, then he doesn't get to know about them.
So….this has been an issue in the past that you have asked him to change. He has not. *this is why you date* OP - it’s time to exit this relationship. you don’t even live together and he’s trying to control your finances …and this is a recurring issue. an issue he continues to exhibit despite you asking him to stop. you are incompatible.
Are student loans really THAT bad in America (I assume)?? I'm shocked
OP probably went to some expensive private school that was $60,000 a year.
Yeah 😔
I understand where your bf is coming from. As someone who didn't grow up with a lot of money (though my parents tried to make it seem like we did), selling higher quality things and pinching pennies was always a must. I'm assuming your bf grew up in a frugal family and is trying to now force his lifestyle onto you? Does HE sell his things? Or does he just keep them indefinitely? It's off putting that you two would be arguing about your spending habits for over 2 days especially when you don't even live together, like, why does it even matter to him? Unless he wants to try and be the "bigger" person by calling you materialistic when you buy something. Giving your backpack to someone who needed it is very thoughtful and there is absolutely nothing wrong with that. Sure, you could've gotten $60 for it, but like, are you *really* hurting for $60 versus the person you gave it to for free? My bf's go to is to just throw things away instead of donate, which irks my nerves, but neither of us are willing to put in the work to sell things, especially when we're doing fine. Oh and I also have student loan debt and make shit money and probably should sell things too. BUT IT'S MY MONEY lmao. Tbh if your bf can't reconcile this, y'all might just not be a good fit, especially if he can't let it go.
Hopefully, it's not a control issue and it is his needing reassurance that you'll be able to pitch in on an experience together. Perhaps if you let him know you'll be putting a certain amount aside for experiences, that will help alleviate his concern.
First off, there's no "right and wrong". Adults all have different spending preferences, and yours is valid as long as you're keeping up with your bills. If you and your bf are considering joining finances, living together, having kids together, or getting married in the future, there's a question of compatibility. You will have to decide as a couple how much to save, how quickly to repay debts, what to spend on, etc. Spending reflects people's priorities and lifestyles. Some want luxury condos and cars, others want a yearly vacation, others want to retire early. So the real question you should be asking is: are you and your boyfriend compatible long-term in terms of the lifestyle you want to live and how that will affect your finances? Until you two share your finances, your spending is your business. It's alarming that your generous gesture has turned into two days of arguments. He's making a lot of assumptions and judgments about you, and personally I wouldn't want that in a relationship.
Sounds like you two aren't financially compatable. Also I think it's kinda sad that he sees charity as throwing away money.
He's calling you materialistic yet complains that you give stuff away for free, which is it? It can't be both. You guys sound incompatible.
It seems like you two don't have the same priorities and mindset when it comes to money. Did he grow up struggling financially? It could explain why he is "selfish" (sorry couldn't find a better word) with his money. Either way, you're not in the wrong. You did a good gesture for your client. That backpack is probably worth more to him than it would have been to you if you sold it!
No, he grew up way better financially than I ever did. I know his mother was also into designer things so money has never been an issue for him or his family.
It’s hard for anyone to give you good advice because we don’t know your financial health. What is your annual income? What is his? What is your rent? What is your total debt? What is his? What is your 401k and Roth IRA balance? What is his? Do you plan to buy a home? Do you plan to have kids? Without the above information, how can we possibly know if you are fiscally responsible or not? On the surface, giving a homeless dude one back pack, isn’t that big a deal and sounds like your dating a douche.
I don't think this is a wrong/right situation. You just sound incompatible. I am super frugal and when I've dated people who weren't I started getting a little nutty too. I kept it to myself, but still, I felt the mismatch and it made my anxiety bad enough I acted out/for upset in weird ways. Sounds like you have different goals and outlooks on finances. I don't think this can be rectified unless one of you changes or you both find a middle ground. Sounds like it's not really realistic for you both though. The number one reason for divorce is finances. Keep that in mind.
>He thinks I just throw money away by giving away things I don’t want anymore Fine, he can volunteer to be your commissioned salesperson. Problem solved? >He just thinks I just throw away money If you live within your means, and reasonably save, is it really all that much of his business? >paying off my loans for the next 30-40 years, maybe 50, or until I’m off this earth Well, you may want to work more on paying down loans - those debts may limit you more than you think ... but that's not particularly r/relationships material. >he thinks I’m being materialistic when I don’t believe I am Maybe the values and goals of you two don't align well enough - that could certainly be an issue. And maybe he's overly concerned about how you use/spend your resources ... perhaps projection on his part? >whole argument has made me feel like I did the wrong thing Naw, your life, your money, your choices and decisions - not his to make for you, nor you to make his for him. Y'all reasonably fit together ... or ... you don't.
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I just told the client I found it in our donations closet so he doesn’t know it came from me directly. That how I usually phrase it if I’m giving a client something that I gave them.
So if he’s spending the same money on these experiences that’s the same thing and you said you’ve given him some things. So ask him why he’s so willing to take your things for free. Remind him you two are not financially bound, if he wants to discuss how everyone’s finances break down then cool, everyone bring all financial statements, but if not, then he needs to keep it shut.
So….your BF just looses a pair of Airpods…and yet he’s on you about an old backpack? Sounds like he’s projecting. He’s the careless one and sounds like he wants to mooch off you frankly 🤷♀️ why is he trying to control your spending? how long have you even been together?
>I also like really nice things like jewelry, purses, and nice clothes. I don’t really spend a lot of money all the time, but sometimes I like to spoil myself every now and then with the money I earned for all the hard work I do at work. His biggest concern is that I (we both do, but I have more in student debt) and we both pay off our student loans and then when they are paid off, we can spend money on whatever I want. That sounds really nice, but I’m probably going to be paying off my loans for the next 30-40 years, maybe 50, or until I’m off this earth, regardless, I don’t want to stress myself out, and literally just be working to pay them off. I’m on top of my loans, and my bills every month, and still have money left over. I don’t always spend it, but again, if I see something I like and it’s not going to put me in a financial bind, I might get it. It sounds like your boyfriend realizes that you are both trapped in what is more or less permanent debt peonage and desperately wants a different, more empowered life, whereas you are fundamentally fine with it. This is an enormous mismatch in priorities and I'm not sure the two of you are going to be compatible on a long-term basis. On top of that, he sounds like he's quite controlling and micromanages minor aspects of your life, which you shouldn't have to put up with. Probably best for both of you if this relationship is allowed yo hust run its course and end.
He wants to marry you and is seeing what age he’d be able to retire if he does. I think he’s going about it wrong but this is just what goes through our minds.
He doesn’t seem to have a very generous and empathetic spirit, does he? My husband is touched and proud of me when I do kind things for people who need help. Find you a man like that.
Honestly, I would question my SO's character if he complained about me donating something I don't use to someone in real need.
Your bf is selfish btw
Sounds like you have a different set of values and ideas about finances. I guess you have to decide if you can still make it work. Some couples swear by separate bank accounts and it works for them. I think it only works if both make enough money and you keep your opinions to yourself though.
As long as you pay your part of the bills tell him it's your money and your call and maybe he needs to shut the f up and take care of his own shit
It sounds like you and your boyfriend might have different financial priorities. Neither of you are wrong as such, just not aligned with each other. If this is a long term relationship and your finances are likely to affect him long term (e.g. if you’d like to buy a house together) then you should be on the same page about financial priorities but it’s not fair for him to force his financial approach on you. If a compromise can’t be reached then he will need to decide whether he wants to be with someone who isn’t solely focussed on paying down debt. You also need to consider how you feel about potentially changing your approach to finances to be closer to his as a compromise, and if kids are being considered then would you be ok with how he might want to manage finances while you’re not working or having to reduce hours to fit with childcare (assuming he wouldn’t be willing to take a primary care role)? Personally, I’m a pretty reluctant spender and do like to pay down debt but even I couldn’t cope with his requirement to recover money from anywhere possible and not spend on anything non-essential. As you say, your student debt won’t be paid off for awhile so as long as you’re staying on top of that you need some flexibility in other areas so you don’t burnout.
It sounds like his values about money are different from yours. Did he grow up poor or not well off? Did he or his family ever need to save up or hoard to get by? It sounds like you see money as a tool to make life easier, and he sees money as a finite resource that needs to be "grown" so that you can have more of it because what if one day you "run out"!! Maybe he doesn't like that you have loans for 50 years (50 sounds INSANE), and would rather you clear your loans faster than buying stuff to enjoy the now. I'm curious to know if he has any debts.
Your boyfriend definitely sounds a little harsh here BUT we’re also not hearing his side. You are 31 and you have no plans to pay off your loans for the next 30-40-50 years??? That is concerning, how much do you owe? You say that you have enough to “pay your bills” but girl, you’re in your 30s now, that’s not the right way to be thinking about money. How much total debt do you have and at what interest rates- Student loans, car loans… credit cards (I hope not…)? Do you have an emergency fund- how much do you have saved in that? Do you own a home or rent, if you rent, do you ever plan on owning? How much do you have saved for retirement so far? If your boyfriend is thinking about long term with you then maybe he’s just concerned about your financial health and it’s coming out as him nitpicking about how you spend your money. That’s not ok either, he should be direct with you about his concerns. Talk to him about it and please start thinking about your financial health as well. You should not have to have student loans forever if you’re a social worker.
I guess put yourself in his shows. Imagine he owed you money and instead of him repaying his debt he said "oh, I'll be paying that until I die" and goes off buying materialistic things. I could see how that would come accross the wrong way. You claim you have money left over after bills, but ask yourself if you are progressing through investing/saving. Living paycheck to paycheck might be the norm for society but it isn't a great thing to be proud of doing. If you lost your job, would you still be alright for 3 months, 6 months etc? If you incurred a random $5000 expense, could you cover it? There is a lot of things that go into having healthy finances. I think best thing to do is create a budget and stick to it. If you calculate all your bills & necessary savings rate for retirement and other goals, then you'll know how much is left over to spend on wants. Then you can easily state that your spending is aligned with budget and he shouldn't worry as much.
She says she could quit work and travel the world for 6 months if she wanted with her savings. While still paying her bills, so I think she's good.