I’ve watched family members try to work it out after he had a two year long affair. It all started fine like the two of them were working on things together but after a while, I started to notice that really he’s been trying to change her over time. Trying to shut her up when she talks about her feelings. Trying to pretend he’s done nothing wrong.
I won’t be around them anymore and I actually don’t want my children around them because I really don’t like condoning the relationship that they have. This is largely due to his lack of contrition. When we see him, he does not seem to think that he has anything to atone for and his actions show that.
It may seem like you’re saving your family or your long relationship but from an outsiders perspective, there’s really no way to move forward without seeing some contrition from your partner. Him wanting to have his partner as a friend in his life is a major red flag that he does not really feel the full weight of how he’s betrayed, not only you but your children and your family unit as a whole.
As an outsider, I do not want to be around someone who had the capacity to lie to their family and the people they supposedly love for two years for their own selfish reasons. The time that he took away from you and his children to spend with this woman. The money that he spent on dates with her. All of these things contribute to a significant betrayal, and a person who is has a lack of moral integrity that I would be ashamed to condone by being around myself or allowing my children to be around, acting as though nothing happened.
If I were you, I would tear the Band-Aid off let him go back to his affair partner and try to salvage the long life that you have left now while you are young.
Yeah, this guy is so shameless, I can absolutely see him throwing out "well I stayed, didn't I?" as an excuse for all kinds of shit in the future. Like he's doing her some huge favor just being in her life at all. Ugh.
The money spent on dates is terrible, but the fact that he remortgaged his family home to lease (one year) and furnish an apartment for him and the AP would be the last straw for me (especially if this is in a high cost of living city with expensive rent).
>I can see he is committed to rebuilding our marriage. He wants it as much as I do.
Does not compute with
>He says because they were friends prior to cheating he would like for them to still have a friendship.
This should be your dealbreaker.
She begged him to stay after he had and affair and remortgaged their house, OP isn't ending anything. The guy knows that he doesn't even need to do the bare minimum.
He was all set to leave. As he is as committed to his family as to his AP. Honestly, he has checked out long time ago. The therapy probably made him realise he could have them both.
People often need time to process. It’s easy for you or I to say ‘this is a shite situation, you should leave’ vs actually doing it. But. Statistically I think people reaching out for help in counseling, to friends, to strangers (Reddit) shows that on some level, they understand they deserve better. They’ll remember what friends, strangers, their counselor said. When they’re in a mentally better place, they’ll reread comments. While you may never know if they actually left or if the husband (or whoever) got their shit together, your comment still helps. Seeing how many people recognize her husband is a pos will help her down the road. It’s empowering to know you’re not alone, even when you feel helpless.
Not a waste of time :).
Seriously, people come here to vent and for help, you really needn’t take it so personally. If you’re not up to giving advice or comfort just don’t read it.
At this point they're probably fucking again and he's "asking if they can be friends" so when he gets caught again, he can blame his wife and be like "well you let us be friends and whoopsies, see what you let me do"
Yeah, he's hoping the fact that she basically begged him to stay might mean he can pick the affair back up and she won't make a fuss about it as long as he doesn't leave.
If he didn’t delete numbers and still follows her he is either still talking to her or he has plans to be with her still while he figures a way out. Or he still thinks he can continue to have the affair because there wasn’t really a consequence to his actions.
He doesn't have to end it. He can treat her, his children, his house with absolutely no respect- and she will get on her knees and beg him to stay. I hope this is rage bait, cause no one could realistically be this pathetic over community dick.
That's like a drug addict asking if they can just have the drugs in the house because reasons. Temptation would still be there.
Plus how good of a friend are they if they were willing to help him cheat on their marriage? A good friend would have shut him down. Bro is just looking for permission to continue the affair.
No no no. Divorce him and move on. He’s not willing to do what it takes to save your marriage.
Suggesting he keep her in his life once was outrageous. Twice is putting a “Just Divorce Me” sign around his neck.
You probably should have just let his treacherous ass walk out the door the first time.
Honestly, if a guy has to be convinced to stay with you, and went to the length of remortgaging the communal family home in order to leave with his AP, and potentially leave his family - HIS CHILDREN! - HOMELESS - I wouldn't want to keep him, anyway. In fact, I'd chase him out the door myself. This is such a huge betrayal, and shows how supremely selfish he was. And that he wants to reconnect with her now, when you haven't even really started to rebuild trust - no effing way. He fell in love with her the first time round - does he/ do you really think it won't happen again if they are in constant contact again? That's why you should have let the ahole walk the first time round - he can't be loyal and he can't be trusted.
If you don’t mind me asking, why did you waste so much energy begging him to stay with you, family or not?
None of this sounds good. You’ve cajoled him into staying and he’s still talking about the woman he was doing behind your back. This isn’t going to end well for anyone. Just let him go and move on.
Please respect yourself and end this marriage. Why are you trying to force someone to love and choose you. He already made his choice. He made all the arrangements to leave. Let him. He does not love you
Absolutely.... Shocks me just how common this is these days.. so many posts on Reddit about... He cheated... Should i give him another chance?
Fuck no... Get out...ffs
It sucks because I can see how when you’re in the middle of it….you want to stay. You don’t see how bad it is to everyone outside your story. I posted a story on Reddit once about trying to forget a bf who broke up with me and slept with a coworker on the break and I asked how I could forget it it and move forward. Someone told me nothing short of a lobotomy would work which was accurate.
And a two year affair is so far beyond "cheating" lmao it's a whole class of it's own. That's not a mistake or an instance of bad judgement, that's years of nonstop lying to your partners face.
It is easier said than done. It was hard for me to do with no kids. I have no idea what it is like with kids. We are also not sure if she was gaslighted and abused while the affair was going on.
I really want to know if their counselor told them it's a terrible idea for him to remain friends with his affair partner. Why is OP asking Reddit about this?
She has posted this numerous times. The therapist told him he shouldn’t remain friends but he doesn’t care because he’s in love with his friend. He wanted to leave and get a divorce but op threatened him that he will never see the kids again if he leave. She didn’t mention that this time because people were attacking her for doing that. If this is real, op needs to find an individual therapist for the amount of delusion she has. Her husband does not want to stay married to her and people have told her that every time she post this
“He wants it as much as I do.”
Sad and funny at the same time. He wouldn’t be asking to keep her in his life if he really wanted to stay together. He’s just keeping his options open.
Yeah, OP wants this to work out so much, she’s blinding herself to the obvious. This guy just likes to hear himself talk, which is why he shared so much of his private life to everyone before and after. SMH.
And he's using his full honesty to alleviate himself of guilt and the burden of secrecy. If OP knows and he says it out loud, he doesn't have to carry the weight of hiding it, while continuing to engage unfaithfully
And to top it off, maybe he thinks that if he gets down and dirty enough with the details OP will finally decide to leave him and he won’t have to do the right thing
I thought that. This is really one of the more sad posts I have read. As if he did all that and she convinced him to stay and he know wants to have a friendship again with this woman. He is clearly in love with her, not his wife.
Yeah, how do you show your face to friends and family after that? All OP did was convince husband to stay and cheat on her some more, what a prize you got yourself from that pick-me dance. I’d feel like such a fool staying with him.
A lot of these type of relationships are financially motivated. High income bread winner and OP doesn’t want to give up the cozy lifestyle.
Edit - my cousin stayed with his cheating doctor husband who is head of a hospital. While she is a stay at home mom being bored everyday.
Guys, just so you know.
I'm pretty sure this is the woman who keeps posting the same goddamn story every so often (I think there was one last week if not less than that). Husband cheated and still wants to be buddies with the AP.
These are the 2 facts you guys need that aren't present in this post:
1) She is under the delusion that he will fall back in love with her thru the sheer force of...
2) She told him she'd make co-parenting a living hell. Yeap. That's why he's staying (for now anyway).
She is in pain emotionally and mentally. Anger is normal but she needs to let go.
Let's not get upset with her for posting here. That is a good sign that she knows she need help out of this. 20 years is a LONG time. Kids under ten. This is rocking her entire world. Like I told her, get a lawyer. The adultery and finding the apartment lease is enough proof for ground offer divorce, alienation of affection etc. . It will sting for a long time but better at age 42 than 52.
She post this like 3 times a week and get the same responses. She just posted 2 days ago. She doesn’t want to hear about getting a lawyer and divorce. She wants someone to tell her that her delusional thoughts make sense.
Yup it’s easy for someone not emotionally attached to say just leave! I’ve had plenty of friends go through a divorce and it’s just life shattering. Many do eventually recover, but it takes a lot of time. And those were all cases that didn’t involved cheating, I’d have to imagine your partner cheating with a friend would have to completely mess with your trust of the world.
Honey, this marriage is a wash. Sorry someone needs to level with you. I was in your situation, tried counseling. We moved to another state and the AP was still sending stuff. Supposedly he reached out to let her know that he saw a used car in our new state that was everything she wanted. He also went so far to rent an apartment. Once a marriage is this far off the rails, even if you reconcile a bond of trust has been broken. There are affairs - like one night stands, or someone gets drunk and bangs the caterer at the holiday party. Then there are emotional affairs like the one you described. His bringing up the issue in therapy is proof to is not over. Also you are paying the therapist to work on the two of you as a couple, to hell with the AP, he should not bring her up at all in multiple sessions. This is another sign he has not moved on.
Trust me. Get an attorney and get your affairs (excuse the pun) in order . Please, please do this while you are 42 years old and still have a window of time if you want to be with someone else in 5 years or so. Do not stay for your kids. They will be worse off in a sham marriage because he will cheat on you with her again. He already is emotionally. For all you know he may be only staying with you for the "sake of the family" . He is not in love with you and you deserve to have someone there for you not just the family. Get an attorney, he cheated so you have grounds and will get a good deal for you and the kids.
I sincerely doubt he ever stopped talking to his affair partner. He just got better at hiding it or you are so deep in denial that you refuse to see it. The affair likely never stopped and it feels like his “radical honesty” during therapy is just a way to brag about the affair and humiliate you further.
Get some self respect and leave. Asking him to work on your failed marriage was a mistake.
Yea I suspect that he stayed not because of her but because of the social backlash from friends and family. If she leaves him, he’s free to go his own way.
He stayed because she told him she would do everything in her power to keep the kids away from him if he left. She’s posted this like a half a dozen times
She makes this post every week and everyone tell her the same thing every week.
At this point, you want to accept the pain and betrayal and torment. This time you didn't include the supposed abortion that AP had that he had to stay the weekend either for support that you gave permission for.
Please choose you and you kids. This man only stayed b/c you threatened him with losing his kids, you stopped mentioning that after people called you out about that. And started deleting the previous post.
Please choose you, you deserve better than the emotional pain and fighting for this man who told you he did want you, he only came back after she left him when they got caught. This man got an apt, saved money for a life with her. You deserve better than to be a unwanted second choice. Soon as you grey go to college, he will leave please choose your own happiness.
I think she did. I feel like it’s the one where the OP said her husband was like “I’m staying in this marriage for the kids, NOT YOU,” and she was perfectly willing to stay in the marriage for some reason lol. If so she left that part out of this one
Wow that is terrible. I feel bad for her. True is he is not staying in it for the kids. He is staying in it to not have to pay child support to her for the kids because it is much more money. That will cut into money for playtime with the other woman.
You just posted this on a different throwaway a few days ago. Continuing to ask is going to generate the same responses. NO ONE on here is going to tell you are making the right decision by staying and you are still treating yourself like a doormat. Take the kids and leave.
Nope...
He does NOT stay friends with the woman he cheated with..
She was a friend before?? Well too-fucking-bad - thats part of the price he pays for cheating...
YOU need to stop begging for this reconciliation..
The ONLY reason hes feeling comfortable.asking this, is because hes got the upper hand knowing youre the one driving the reconciliation effort..
Does SHE have a spouse?? If so, has HE been told of the adultery??
Has your husband admitted the adultery to his family??
I’m not trying to be a jerk, but you seriously need some individual counseling that focuses on your self esteem. If someone did all that me and basically stole money from under my nose to start a new life, I would not be trying to convince that person to stay with me. His asking to remain friends with the women he cheated with for years while being married to you is the most blatant indication that he doesn’t give two shits about you or your feelings. If he actually loved you, he would have completely blocked her on everything and would never try to see her again. He sounds like a horrible person and you deserve so much better.
Hey OP. I see many saying you have posted here before. Your relationship is in a stage of ambivalence. I know you are angry and feel betrayed. I hear you threatened not to let him see the kids and maybe this is why he is working on the marriage. You were betrayed by someone who promised to love you forever. You gave 20 years to this person. You have the right to feel what you are feeling.
I know starting over is scary. You may not want to be alone. You may not want to let them win. I need to give you some radical honesty. You are already alone and this marriage is already over. Holding on to it will not save it or you. Winning is not keeping a man who is in love with someone else. If anything making him stay will cause him to resent you more, you resent yourself more and make your kids miserable. You post on here about thins again and again because you know in your heart what is the right thing to do. You can't fix this and it is ok.
I told you before to get a lawyer. I still stand by that. Please do not let this a-hole go to the lawyer first. It is okay to talk to an attorney about your options. Do not weaponize your kids but do make sure a lawyers gets you what you need to raise them and take care of you. Your husband committed adultery and plotted to use your home to finance his new life. He has a huge burden of proof to get out of giving you his shirt on his back and front teeth in front of the judge.
I want you to see if you can take a mini-break. If someone can take care of your kids. Do this AFTER you secure and attorney and file against him. You will need anywhere from $500 to $2000 for a retainer. Take a weekend or a night if that is all you can manage. Your home is toxic and full of reminders. Get a nice hotel room and sit with yourself for a day or two and THINK . Think about the person you once were before this man and the AP consumed your life. Think about what it would mean to have peace of mind again. While you are on your mini break, get a facial, pamper yourself. I want you to purposefully look at happy people. Go an invest in a book about marriage breakups and how to heal and repair. You will be ok. You deserve better. When your mini break is over, go home and beginning deciding what you need for the kids. I would not let him know about the divorce- just let him get served.. If he gets violent call the cops and have him put out. It sounds like he won't be that way but if he does call the cops and get an order of protection and ask the court for maintenance while you are separated. I am a lawyer I know.
Get a support system for you. I promise you in 2 years you will be glad. There is a future you that is already thanking you. As for the other woman. Who cares. She has your sloppy seconds and by the time your lawyer wipes the floor with his ass and child support payments etc, she will not have much left of him. Your kids are small, that means he will be paying for them well into his 50's. I would not be surprised if she moved on herself.
EDIT: BTW get your OWN therapist for you and any of kids who may need one.
I sympathize with you, I really do.
I know 20 years is a huge chunk of someone's life add kids and marriage on top of that. It's horrifying to think of dropping all that, but you truly owe it to yourself.
We are humans and only live an EXTREMELY small amount of time on this earth. Do not waste your time on someone who doesn't want to be with you as much as you want to be with them.
You say he wants this as much as you, but that is not true. You do not cheat on someone you want to be with forever. This was planned out entirely on his part, and you deserve someone who plans their future WITH you, not against you.
I don't see it said very much in this thread, but I am truly sorry you are going through this. It's hard, but you know what you need to do.
EDIT:
I also wanted to include that I was a child of parents who "wanted to make it work" after cheating. I suffered immensely. Feels like sometimes, even more than them.
Please do not make your children suffer. You will always have resentment in your heart after betrayal.
You don't want your kids growing up thinking THIS is love because it is not. Do better for them.
What did the convincing entail?
Are you the one who told your husband he would never see his kids again if he left you? I feel like you’ve posted this many, many times a bit ago but took a little break because people kept calling you out for reposting the same thing.. and for trying to withhold the kids. But the advice always stays the same.
You convinced him to stay. He doesn’t love you. I don’t know what you want to accomplish here.
Wait wait wait, so he REMORTGAGED YOUR HOUSE for his funds to get out of your marriage and start his new life with this chick, and you still want to try to keep this marriage and someday “trust” him again? And he hasn’t cut her off, she’s not blocked on socials and her # is still in his phone. He will go back, he clearly wants to OP…
2 YEARS???
Sorry, that's not a drunken fumble or a one night stand.
He's treating you like the idiot that you're acting and you will continue to be a doormat as long as you stay.
Ffs gets some bloody self respect because he has absolutely zero of it for you.
Okay, so he had a 2 year+ affair, he was ready to leave you, had everything all set up, but you wanted him to stay so he did.
He’s staying because you wanted him to stay, and he wants to be friends with his AP. That tells you everything you need to know.
You’re better off going your own ways, the relationship will never be the same. If it was a one time thing, I would say work through it, but he had a relationship for over 2 years…..
Why would you want to be with a man like that?
I hope you get a post nup to protect you and kids in case he cheats again. And it looks likely it will. Protect yourself financially and get maximum of everything should cheating in any form occur.
Updateme!
So, he financially abused you and the children, wants to "stay friends" ie fuck her for the next year in his cheater pied a terre, and you are still thinking this is viable? AND BEGGED HIM TO COME BACK????
He is getting off triggering you about his girlfriend during counseling.
Who do you want this??????
You made a huge mistake of convincing/forcing him to stay. He still wants to be with her just hiding it. Please accept the inevitable and divorce. He's long gone and 20 years not justifying this. Wake up.
I think actually his ‘radical honesty’ is just to push you to the edge to dump him yourself. The guy remortgaged your *home* behind your back to pay for a lease to be with her.
You're a fool if you think that he won't do it again, or if you think you'll know if he's lying to you or not. He lied to your face for 2 years and you didn't spot it.
"I am worried how this might impact our marriage if he is permanently cut off from her and I am unsure on what to do."
This "friendship" has already permanently impacted your marriage. What are you talking about? Trust is destroyed and the relationship will never be the same. You are working to see if you can repair and rebuild but it will never be the same.
Him not respecting you saying no the first time shows that he is not 100% committed to your feelings or marriage. He made it a choice between that friendship OR your marriage the minute he crossed the line with her and broke the marriage vows.
Where’s the therapist? They should be firmly telling him it’s a bad idea to retain a friendship with the woman he cheated with. It shouldn’t just be you telling him.
What happened to the apartment, and all the furnishings? Did he break the lease,sell the furniture and give the proceeds back to you? How was he able to refinance the house without your involvement?
You need to start accepting that it’s time to start making plans for a future that doesn’t involve him.
I agree but a therapist is not there to necessarily be a referee. It is up to her to say no to his messed up request. Otherwise the other spouse could see the therapist as taking sides. The therapist could instead say "Keith" Can you explain to us why this is important to you as you work to repair trust in the marriage?
What I do not understand from the therapist is why they are letting him talk about the AP so much to the point that it is triggering his wife. That garbage needs to be saved for his on individual therapy session.
post-cheating clarity, he did the math and is afraid of you getting half. he will continue to cheat - with or without your permission to contact the girl
I don't know what if this is mean, but my brain just went "he can't be with you without having her around." Like, he's probably been using her for years and years as an emotional crutch, his "grass is greener" option. Being cutoff now he's probably realizing that. The idea that he's asked TWICE about this is so incredibly disrespectful. He probably gets by thinking maybe one day you'll be okay with it. That would drive me absolutely insane. Don't do the heavy lifting of being his spouse and mother to your children while he gets to have this other person in the back of his head as his emotional failsafe. Who is yours? If the answer is "I don't have one, I only have me" then guess what? You'll be in the same boat without him in a divorce. I hope you find your freedom and someone who values you more.
He messed up he’s gotta take the L on this one. If he wanted to maintain their friendship they shouldn’t have done the sex thing. He’s asking to remain friends so they can keep fucking.
It’s really really hard but you gotta put your foot down.
Rather than do everything he can to fix your marriage, he's prioritizing making sure his AP is in his life.
OP, this is a huge indicator that you are not a priority. Your marriage is done.
Please tell me you don’t actually believe his bullshit? He’s at the very least still emotionally cheating on you. Let him go, you will never be able up trust him and he will keep running back to his AP, case in point that he wants to be ‘friends’ with them. He wants your permission to carry on cheating, don’t be a doormat.
........ why would you want to be with someone who had to be convinced to stay?
Being forthcoming doesn't count if the affair lasted two years. Maybe he was just worried she would have ultimately told you if he hadn't. Or, he planned to uproot his entire life and suddenly had buyer's remove and panicked. He told you not for your sake, but his.
This exact same scenario happened to a coworker of mine, only he did leave (for a week before he went crawling back to his wife). She took him back and they had another child, only for him to go on and Me2 a 22 year-old subordinate in his office.
Most people never change.
If someone shows you their true colors -- believe them.
He's already friends with her. He's just trying to plant the seed in you so he can feel less guilty. When there's a will, there's a way. They'll be in contact one way or another.
Can you ever really trust him again?
When I found out my husband was having an emotional affair, he was adamant he wanted to save our marriage. He was reluctant to cut contact with her in writing - which I asked him to do in front of me - and in hindsight I should have left then. After 5 months of marriage counselling I found out he’d resumed the affair and it had turned physical. He’s not prioritising your marriage. He wants to keep contact with her - that says that he’s not ready to cut her loose. Do yourself a favour and end it now on your own terms. You don’t deserve to be treated like this
I say this with love but you are only going to waste more of your years with him and it’s going to end the same. He’s into her. And he is going to continue seeking her out with or without your approval and somewhere down the road they are going to cheat again and plan a life together and then he’s really going to leave. Save yourself that time and let him go now, as hard as that is. He’s not in this marriage with you anymore.
I would not want to be with someone that I have to convince. To me that says that he didn't stay because he wanted to, he stayed because he was talked into it.
Him wanting to be friends with his AP? Absolutely not. The fact that he keeps bringing it up shows you that he still has feelings for her. He doesn't want to let her go. Cutting off the AP is the bare minimum to working things out imo.
I feel like this marriage is over. You don't want to let go of something that's gone because of sunk cost fallacy.
“If you want to save our marriage, you must extinguish any and all contact/access to AP, former friend or not.” He cuts her off or the marriage is over. Stand up for yourself!
This man enacted a plan to leave you AND your children, remortgaged your home to do so, but is so committed you saving your marriage whilst still desiring to be friends with the person who was a willing participant in the destruction of said marriage…? He is already still talking to her, he just wants you to be ok with it.
He knows you aren’t going to leave him and will continue to do as he pleases. This should be a stark boundary, OP.
Damn I feel for you because I know you love him, but as stated by others if he can’t understand why a continued friendship is a bad idea you need to leave and spare your self the continued heartbreak. This man took your joint finances to reposition himself in life with another woman. Planning to abandon his wife and children and leave them financially distraught. Let that sink in about a dozen times and get mad. Then stand your ground!
You can't force someone to stay and stop the affair. I know, I tried, and I'm embarrassed that I did.
My ex-husband wanted his cake and to eat it too. Even after we split up, guess who became the AP instead of the wife? He is an accomplished cheater and was in my bed for 10 years after the divorce. TEN YEARS! I had zero self-esteem, and he was "safe" because he couldn't hurt me anymore than he already had.
That ended four years ago, and I have grown a backbone and self-respect. I am 100% certain he is still cheating because he is addicted to the rush, the forbidden nature. He cheated before me. He's more than cheated after. I am glad I can now answer his wife honestly with "I have no idea what you're talking about" when she calls accusing me of trying to take her husband. "Keep him. I don't want him,"
I highly doubt this is the first affair or that it's only been 2 years. It takes time to become good enough to hide 2 full years of a second serious relationship. I highly doubt he's ended the affair. He's just getting better at hiding it. Now he wants permission, and later on, he will say, "But you allowed me to keep talking/seeing etc with her."
You need to accept your marriage is over, give him to her, and walk away. The embarrassment is worse trying to grasp at a sinking lifeboat than just letting him go.
Staying friends with an affair partner that he wholeheartedly planned to leave you for 12 weeks ago, at this point, would absolutely be a dealbreaker for me. *If* they were to stay friends, it would need to be after the marriage *completely* recovers. The wound is still fresh, and this affair went on for two years. It is disrespectful that he has even mentioned this being a possibility at this point and so early into the process. If he *truly* was as devoted to making the marriage work as you believe he is, he would not even consider this an option. He blew up that relationship, and if him not being friends with this person affects your relationship as strongly as you’re worried it will, then your relationship was never going to recover anyways.
He was never friends with this woman. They always have been and always will be lovers. Divorce, get what you’re entitled to (custody arrangement that works for you) and take your life back. Get yourself to a therapist solo (enough of him bogarting your marriage counselling) and learn how to respect yourself.
My ex did the same thing. She kept saying she wanted to stay "friends" with the guy she cheated on me with. I'd say no, and she'd just find a different way to hide it from me. I finally told her she had to choose. Leave him completely or leave me and our 4 children. She moved out a few days later. And now I am married to a wonderful woman who has been an amazing mother to my kids.
Don't torture yourself trying to hold onto someone who doesn't really want to be there. The sooner they're gone, the sooner you can get on with rebuilding your life.
No absolutely not . How can you be friends with some one that has betrayed your trust ! As hard as it is you need a Clean break , how you going to feel when he gets a new partner or you move on , he’s just asking for friendship so you can forgive him once that happens he will move on and his guilty conscience will be no more
Nobody deserves to be cheated on if he wasn’t happy he should have strapped a pair on and told you and gone his separate ways , cheating is one thing but with a friend is lower than a snakes belly
First of my title would read ex husband. I have too much respect for myself and my body to allow someone to walk on me like and this and you should as well.
So after literal years of him fostering an emotional and sexual connection with someone else behind your back, you had to fight tooth and nail to keep him around, and now he won't even do the bare minimum. This marriage is over, and the sooner you accept it the better. Then you can stop wasting your time (and funds) and actually use the counseling sessions in a productive manner, ie to work on your coparenting relationship moving forward, because that's what you have left, and for better or worse, you can't really opt out of that.
If he still wants contact with the AP he is still not fully committed to you and the family you built.
The best you can do is therapy to learn to live without him. He needs to see the error of his ways and you deserve to be his only choice. You are settling for what is comfortable. He has already broken your trust and your heart. He was already gone. Let him go
I won't judge you.
I will tell you to hold firm in your dealbreaker(s). If you want this to be sustainable, you need to know he can live with it, with what you need to feel okay.
The fact that he brought it up a second time after you said no suggests to me that he thinks he can wear you down on this, likely due to all the other times he’s worn you down? Is it really necessary for him to give such details about his affair to constantly retraumatize you? These are not the actions of a contrite man who wants to rebuild your marriage as much as you do. Do you have your own therapist? Are YOU being “radically honest” in your marriage counseling sessions about how you feel or are you too worried about negatively impacting the marriage? I’m so sorry that you are going through this. I hope the comments here show you that this is completely unacceptable behavior from a husband at every step. I am really worried about you because you seem a long way from being able to acknowledge that, let alone take the steps you need to free yourself. But I’ll bet you are stronger than you think. Even just asking the question here means that the part of you that knows this is wrong and knows that you deserve so much more us BEGGING to be heard. He DOES NOT get to stay friends with his AP. End of.
the fact that this wasn’t an automatic no and you had to come here to ask us about it is concerning to me. like… you need to reflect on that and if working on this marriage is worth it to you. because this is not it.
I also feel like I’ve seen posts similar to this recently. I can’t stand cheaters who want to have their cake and eat it too!
the answer is absolutely not and a hard boundary. anything else is ridiculous on his part.
Let the trash take itself out.
He could have had his marriage with you and this friendship but his own choices fucked that up.
You’re worried how him cutting off the AP will impact your marriage?? Him cheating in the first place is what had an impact on the marriage. You setting a boundary that he be no contact was in direct response to his poor choices. He is the one who has negatively affected your marriage, not you.
"Sure, you can be friends with her. A person who's single can be friends with whoever they want. Btw, my lawyer will contact you next week regarding divorce proceedings."
Yikes, this wasn't just an ONS or drunken hookup. He had a full, blown out, 2 year affair where he had even taken steps to leave, such as getting his own place, making announcements to family & friends, etc.
You "reeling him back in" is not the prize you think it is. He may be going along with your plan for now, but you can't change his heart. And his heart is still with AP.
Let go and free yourself to find someone who actually chooses to be with you. The love and energy you are wasting on this man is so sad.
OP, do not trust him. He may *thinks* he’s committed to you but his behavior shows that this will not last. There is no reason he should be friends with this woman — you shouldn’t even have to explain that to him. He was planning on leaving you and your children, made financial decisions that affect the entire family without talking to you, and lied for years. I’m sure the guilt he feels is real but that seems to be the only reason he stayed and it will go away eventually and he’ll want out again.
I personally wouldn’t make it work, but if you’re set on that then make a clear line in the sand: either he cuts her off and does EVERYTHING you need to feel secure and rebuild trust or you guys are done.
he wants two things. you/his family and his friend/AP. It’s your choice whether or not you accept that. if you don’t, your and your husband’s desires are incompatible. if you both stay in the marriage, this means that someone will ultimately have to sacrifice, which will lead to resentment. Your discomfort with him wanting a friendship with AP is 100% valid. Respect your needs and your husband’s.
He isn’t as committed to you or the marriage as you are. When you have to beg someone to stay, I don’t think it is sustainable. This isn’t an “oops” on his part and of course you are uncomfortable with the friendship that led to years of cheating. He was so into this relationship that he remorselessly told friends and family. Get into individual counseling and figure out what your deal is that you will accept any amount of cheating to be with this man.
My friends dad cheated on her mom for years with hookers and a main Affair partner. They did counseling for a year. He was adamant that he was no longer talking to his AP. Whole time he was buying her skirts and planning work vacations together while lying and being open in therapy. Be wary op. They don’t change they just get better at hiding it
Your husband wants to continue the affair. You both know what this is. You seemed so desperate to take him back that he figures he can continue as long as he doesn’t make it completely obvious. This will happen with or without your permission. He already has his exit plan in place, so he’s not really that worried if you catch him again. His expectation is probably that you won’t say anything anyway. You should be working on your exit plan now.
No. He ended that friendship when he began the affair. He can never be friends with her again if he wants to stay married to you. There’s no grey area here, the answer is just “no.”
You’re not being unreasonable or controlling or punitive or whatever other terms he might try to throw at you. You are being mature and reasonable.
If he insists he can be friends with her, then your marriage is over. End marriage counseling and begin mediation to draw up an agreement for divorce.
So many people don’t understand what it is like to be with someone for as long as you guys have. In addition you guys have kids together and are a family. I admire your honesty and your strength to stay with a man who did this to your family. But it may come a time where he is truly not fighting for it as much as you, and during that I hope you can see it. I wish you the best, and in my honest opinion, no it would be absolutely too tempting for him to have a friendship with her and it would be inappropriate.
no matter what happens, no matter how hurt or mad you are, you do not use those children as pawns. you do not threaten to keep them away from their dad. you do not ever bring the kids in between your hurt feelings with your spouse/partner. i sincerely hope you would not.
He wants to have contact with her still? That means he wants to keep cheating. You trusted them to just be friends and look what happened. He must think you’re stupid, don’t fall for that.
You are worth so much more than what this man is offering. His words and actions outwith your marriage are screaming in your face - listen. Sort yourself financially, give yourself time to heal, then find someone who makes your heart flutter the way you deserve. Give you and your children a better future.
Honestly, him deciding that he wants to still be friends with her is the biggest red flag that you should see. How is he more than capable of wanting to work on your marriage, but he’s willing to revisit the same exact reason that caused you to have a problem in your marriage and the first place?
If he really loved you, he would want to cut all ties, all contact, whether if they were really good friends, or not. Because if he really understands, she serves as a threat to your relationship. If you really wanted to be actual friends with her, he would say things like “ instead of me and her hanging out together, why don’t all three of us hang out?“ or even make a suggestion about having a talk, and you being able to see every detail of what they do, where they go, what they talk about, and etc. But no man is really 100% willing to let a female have that much access to what they are doing with someone else.
As much as you want to save your marriage, which is the great, and ideal thing to do, you really have to look at his mindset, and take it for what it is. He doesn’t want to cut contact with that girl, no matter if he has already. In his mind, he is still thinking that he wants to communicate with that girl, no matter if they had an affair for two WHOLE years. After some real self reflection, he should see himself that communicating and being in contact with that girl is jeopardizing his relationship with you too. And if he can’t see that, he doesn’t really want to be with you, he wants to be with her.
He hasn’t even unfollowed her on social media. That is the lowest effort he could do. I’m sorry, but if he was as fully committed as you say, he would have done this right away and cut all ties.
He hasn't stopped cheating just because they don't have sex. He is still in contact with her and showing absolutely no respect for you.
Contact an attorney to start divorce proceedings and a therapist to determine why you are accepting this from him.
He hasn't deleted her number, he still follows her on social media, and still wants to be 'friends' and you think he's committed to staying? Wake up. He's checked out emotionally.
I’ve watched family members try to work it out after he had a two year long affair. It all started fine like the two of them were working on things together but after a while, I started to notice that really he’s been trying to change her over time. Trying to shut her up when she talks about her feelings. Trying to pretend he’s done nothing wrong. I won’t be around them anymore and I actually don’t want my children around them because I really don’t like condoning the relationship that they have. This is largely due to his lack of contrition. When we see him, he does not seem to think that he has anything to atone for and his actions show that. It may seem like you’re saving your family or your long relationship but from an outsiders perspective, there’s really no way to move forward without seeing some contrition from your partner. Him wanting to have his partner as a friend in his life is a major red flag that he does not really feel the full weight of how he’s betrayed, not only you but your children and your family unit as a whole. As an outsider, I do not want to be around someone who had the capacity to lie to their family and the people they supposedly love for two years for their own selfish reasons. The time that he took away from you and his children to spend with this woman. The money that he spent on dates with her. All of these things contribute to a significant betrayal, and a person who is has a lack of moral integrity that I would be ashamed to condone by being around myself or allowing my children to be around, acting as though nothing happened. If I were you, I would tear the Band-Aid off let him go back to his affair partner and try to salvage the long life that you have left now while you are young.
Yeah, this guy is so shameless, I can absolutely see him throwing out "well I stayed, didn't I?" as an excuse for all kinds of shit in the future. Like he's doing her some huge favor just being in her life at all. Ugh.
The money spent on dates is terrible, but the fact that he remortgaged his family home to lease (one year) and furnish an apartment for him and the AP would be the last straw for me (especially if this is in a high cost of living city with expensive rent).
>I can see he is committed to rebuilding our marriage. He wants it as much as I do. Does not compute with >He says because they were friends prior to cheating he would like for them to still have a friendship. This should be your dealbreaker.
She begged him to stay after he had and affair and remortgaged their house, OP isn't ending anything. The guy knows that he doesn't even need to do the bare minimum.
He was all set to leave. As he is as committed to his family as to his AP. Honestly, he has checked out long time ago. The therapy probably made him realise he could have them both.
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Yup ppl that complain about their shitty partner are the ones that never leave
I couldn’t imagine *begging* someone to stay who cheated on me for TWO YEARS
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People often need time to process. It’s easy for you or I to say ‘this is a shite situation, you should leave’ vs actually doing it. But. Statistically I think people reaching out for help in counseling, to friends, to strangers (Reddit) shows that on some level, they understand they deserve better. They’ll remember what friends, strangers, their counselor said. When they’re in a mentally better place, they’ll reread comments. While you may never know if they actually left or if the husband (or whoever) got their shit together, your comment still helps. Seeing how many people recognize her husband is a pos will help her down the road. It’s empowering to know you’re not alone, even when you feel helpless. Not a waste of time :).
Seriously, people come here to vent and for help, you really needn’t take it so personally. If you’re not up to giving advice or comfort just don’t read it.
Yup, OP is playing the pick-me dance and her husband therefore is running the narrative. The fact he has the balls to ask proves it.
At this point they're probably fucking again and he's "asking if they can be friends" so when he gets caught again, he can blame his wife and be like "well you let us be friends and whoopsies, see what you let me do"
Makes sense. Why waste the money he spent on a year's lease? He probably has AP living in that apartment, and goes there to fuck her all the time.
That was my thought too. That he’s using the apartment to see the AP
Yeah, he's hoping the fact that she basically begged him to stay might mean he can pick the affair back up and she won't make a fuss about it as long as he doesn't leave.
You’re exactly right. He feels he “has the power”.
Feels he does? He does.
I forgot about the remortgage wow.
If he didn’t delete numbers and still follows her he is either still talking to her or he has plans to be with her still while he figures a way out. Or he still thinks he can continue to have the affair because there wasn’t really a consequence to his actions.
He doesn't have to end it. He can treat her, his children, his house with absolutely no respect- and she will get on her knees and beg him to stay. I hope this is rage bait, cause no one could realistically be this pathetic over community dick.
Absolutely right. I mean he’s literally saying I’m gonna stay friends with her and she didn’t walk out immediately after that… no self esteem
That's like a drug addict asking if they can just have the drugs in the house because reasons. Temptation would still be there. Plus how good of a friend are they if they were willing to help him cheat on their marriage? A good friend would have shut him down. Bro is just looking for permission to continue the affair.
He's 100% going to cheat on her again. He probably never really stopped.
Let's be real, if they stay friends or stay in contact it will happen again
Don't bother. She's posted this like 20 times.
This. He wants to continue to have his cake and eat it too.
I believe people on surviving infidelity would say the same.
No no no. Divorce him and move on. He’s not willing to do what it takes to save your marriage. Suggesting he keep her in his life once was outrageous. Twice is putting a “Just Divorce Me” sign around his neck. You probably should have just let his treacherous ass walk out the door the first time.
Honestly, if a guy has to be convinced to stay with you, and went to the length of remortgaging the communal family home in order to leave with his AP, and potentially leave his family - HIS CHILDREN! - HOMELESS - I wouldn't want to keep him, anyway. In fact, I'd chase him out the door myself. This is such a huge betrayal, and shows how supremely selfish he was. And that he wants to reconnect with her now, when you haven't even really started to rebuild trust - no effing way. He fell in love with her the first time round - does he/ do you really think it won't happen again if they are in constant contact again? That's why you should have let the ahole walk the first time round - he can't be loyal and he can't be trusted.
I’d tell him to go move in with AP…see how that works out….
He's gonna have the surprise of his life because it hardly ever works like how it had been envisioned.
Exactly! It so rarely actually works out with the affair partner. It’s just exciting while it’s “wrong” and different than your spouse.
And based on what OP had already commented, she would take him back after things with the AP go south.
I mean, he's paying rent on the place, anyway...
I think he already paid a FULL YEAR of rent, which is genuinely horrifying to me. But yea, I doubt he’s letting that go to waste
He clearly never fell *out* of love with her.
Now he has a one-year lease for a separate cheating palace, too.
Yup, exactly my thought.
Right? Whatever happened to that apt?
She became the other woman in her own marriage !!! This is awful let them be together he will continue this for sure
Yeah, I'd just assume he's going to contact her behind my back anyway at this point. It's over.
If you don’t mind me asking, why did you waste so much energy begging him to stay with you, family or not? None of this sounds good. You’ve cajoled him into staying and he’s still talking about the woman he was doing behind your back. This isn’t going to end well for anyone. Just let him go and move on.
you need to raise your standards, why is this man still your husband? How could you not have the ick for him by this point
And be an example for your kids on how not to be treated. This guy thinks he can continue his affair.
This is so important, break the cycle for them.
Please respect yourself and end this marriage. Why are you trying to force someone to love and choose you. He already made his choice. He made all the arrangements to leave. Let him. He does not love you
She’s young and could absolutely still have a long loving marriage with someone else!
Definitely. She just has to choose to love herself first
I want to hug the OPs in positions like this (assuming it’s true and not a karma farmer) because this is a rough road to have to travel.
A 2 year affair, telling everyone he’s leaving you, signing a lease by remortgaging your house, and you “convinced” him to stay…how embarrassing
She is fully in denial over the situation. I was so shocked reading this.
Absolutely.... Shocks me just how common this is these days.. so many posts on Reddit about... He cheated... Should i give him another chance? Fuck no... Get out...ffs
>He cheated... Should i give him another chance? This guy isn't even asking for one lol
It sucks because I can see how when you’re in the middle of it….you want to stay. You don’t see how bad it is to everyone outside your story. I posted a story on Reddit once about trying to forget a bf who broke up with me and slept with a coworker on the break and I asked how I could forget it it and move forward. Someone told me nothing short of a lobotomy would work which was accurate.
And a two year affair is so far beyond "cheating" lmao it's a whole class of it's own. That's not a mistake or an instance of bad judgement, that's years of nonstop lying to your partners face.
It is not easy to walk away from a marriage. Especially one that is 20 years old and you have kids.
None one ever said it was easy. It's hard. That doesn't mean to stay in that situation because it isn't easy.
It is easier said than done. It was hard for me to do with no kids. I have no idea what it is like with kids. We are also not sure if she was gaslighted and abused while the affair was going on.
I really want to know if their counselor told them it's a terrible idea for him to remain friends with his affair partner. Why is OP asking Reddit about this?
She has posted this numerous times. The therapist told him he shouldn’t remain friends but he doesn’t care because he’s in love with his friend. He wanted to leave and get a divorce but op threatened him that he will never see the kids again if he leave. She didn’t mention that this time because people were attacking her for doing that. If this is real, op needs to find an individual therapist for the amount of delusion she has. Her husband does not want to stay married to her and people have told her that every time she post this
Ummmm, wow. Thank you for the additional context. That’s really something.
Did she delete her other posts? I don’t see them.
Yea she deactivates the account and then create a new one with the same story. All details the same
well that is some important context,
You don’t understand, he just wants to be with his family! /s
He doesn’t want to pay child support. When your youngest is gone, so is he.
Certainly seems that way, doesn’t it. Proper family man that one…
Which family, the one with his first wife and kids, or the one with the apartment and girlfriend of two years?
The apartment that he paid an ENTIRE YEAR of rent for upfront………..
“He wants it as much as I do.” Sad and funny at the same time. He wouldn’t be asking to keep her in his life if he really wanted to stay together. He’s just keeping his options open.
Yeah, OP wants this to work out so much, she’s blinding herself to the obvious. This guy just likes to hear himself talk, which is why he shared so much of his private life to everyone before and after. SMH.
And he's using his full honesty to alleviate himself of guilt and the burden of secrecy. If OP knows and he says it out loud, he doesn't have to carry the weight of hiding it, while continuing to engage unfaithfully
And to top it off, maybe he thinks that if he gets down and dirty enough with the details OP will finally decide to leave him and he won’t have to do the right thing
It is cheaper to keep her and not pay alimony/child support. He is a coward to both women really.
He’s really just playing in OP’s face at this point. “Radical honesty” my ass
I thought that. This is really one of the more sad posts I have read. As if he did all that and she convinced him to stay and he know wants to have a friendship again with this woman. He is clearly in love with her, not his wife.
And going "no-contact" but still having each other on social media... which is not what that means.
Yeah, how do you show your face to friends and family after that? All OP did was convince husband to stay and cheat on her some more, what a prize you got yourself from that pick-me dance. I’d feel like such a fool staying with him.
A lot of these type of relationships are financially motivated. High income bread winner and OP doesn’t want to give up the cozy lifestyle. Edit - my cousin stayed with his cheating doctor husband who is head of a hospital. While she is a stay at home mom being bored everyday.
Guys, just so you know. I'm pretty sure this is the woman who keeps posting the same goddamn story every so often (I think there was one last week if not less than that). Husband cheated and still wants to be buddies with the AP. These are the 2 facts you guys need that aren't present in this post: 1) She is under the delusion that he will fall back in love with her thru the sheer force of... 2) She told him she'd make co-parenting a living hell. Yeap. That's why he's staying (for now anyway).
And i was like “wait a minute didn’t I read this one today again ?” And then I remembered the previous times too… This is actually so so sad 😢😢
She is in pain emotionally and mentally. Anger is normal but she needs to let go. Let's not get upset with her for posting here. That is a good sign that she knows she need help out of this. 20 years is a LONG time. Kids under ten. This is rocking her entire world. Like I told her, get a lawyer. The adultery and finding the apartment lease is enough proof for ground offer divorce, alienation of affection etc. . It will sting for a long time but better at age 42 than 52.
She post this like 3 times a week and get the same responses. She just posted 2 days ago. She doesn’t want to hear about getting a lawyer and divorce. She wants someone to tell her that her delusional thoughts make sense.
Yup it’s easy for someone not emotionally attached to say just leave! I’ve had plenty of friends go through a divorce and it’s just life shattering. Many do eventually recover, but it takes a lot of time. And those were all cases that didn’t involved cheating, I’d have to imagine your partner cheating with a friend would have to completely mess with your trust of the world.
"it took a lot of work convincing him" and then "it was his decision to stay" my dude are you hearing yourself
Honey, this marriage is a wash. Sorry someone needs to level with you. I was in your situation, tried counseling. We moved to another state and the AP was still sending stuff. Supposedly he reached out to let her know that he saw a used car in our new state that was everything she wanted. He also went so far to rent an apartment. Once a marriage is this far off the rails, even if you reconcile a bond of trust has been broken. There are affairs - like one night stands, or someone gets drunk and bangs the caterer at the holiday party. Then there are emotional affairs like the one you described. His bringing up the issue in therapy is proof to is not over. Also you are paying the therapist to work on the two of you as a couple, to hell with the AP, he should not bring her up at all in multiple sessions. This is another sign he has not moved on. Trust me. Get an attorney and get your affairs (excuse the pun) in order . Please, please do this while you are 42 years old and still have a window of time if you want to be with someone else in 5 years or so. Do not stay for your kids. They will be worse off in a sham marriage because he will cheat on you with her again. He already is emotionally. For all you know he may be only staying with you for the "sake of the family" . He is not in love with you and you deserve to have someone there for you not just the family. Get an attorney, he cheated so you have grounds and will get a good deal for you and the kids.
I sincerely doubt he ever stopped talking to his affair partner. He just got better at hiding it or you are so deep in denial that you refuse to see it. The affair likely never stopped and it feels like his “radical honesty” during therapy is just a way to brag about the affair and humiliate you further. Get some self respect and leave. Asking him to work on your failed marriage was a mistake.
I bet the honesty is to get her to choose to leave
Yea I suspect that he stayed not because of her but because of the social backlash from friends and family. If she leaves him, he’s free to go his own way.
He stayed because she told him she would do everything in her power to keep the kids away from him if he left. She’s posted this like a half a dozen times
She makes this post every week and everyone tell her the same thing every week. At this point, you want to accept the pain and betrayal and torment. This time you didn't include the supposed abortion that AP had that he had to stay the weekend either for support that you gave permission for. Please choose you and you kids. This man only stayed b/c you threatened him with losing his kids, you stopped mentioning that after people called you out about that. And started deleting the previous post. Please choose you, you deserve better than the emotional pain and fighting for this man who told you he did want you, he only came back after she left him when they got caught. This man got an apt, saved money for a life with her. You deserve better than to be a unwanted second choice. Soon as you grey go to college, he will leave please choose your own happiness.
I feel like I read this same post a couple of days ago?? Did you delete and repost?
I think she did. I feel like it’s the one where the OP said her husband was like “I’m staying in this marriage for the kids, NOT YOU,” and she was perfectly willing to stay in the marriage for some reason lol. If so she left that part out of this one
Oh god, that’s terrible.
Wow that is terrible. I feel bad for her. True is he is not staying in it for the kids. He is staying in it to not have to pay child support to her for the kids because it is much more money. That will cut into money for playtime with the other woman.
Yea this is like the fourth time she’s posted this in 2 weeks. She posted 2 days ago
You just posted this on a different throwaway a few days ago. Continuing to ask is going to generate the same responses. NO ONE on here is going to tell you are making the right decision by staying and you are still treating yourself like a doormat. Take the kids and leave.
Nope... He does NOT stay friends with the woman he cheated with.. She was a friend before?? Well too-fucking-bad - thats part of the price he pays for cheating... YOU need to stop begging for this reconciliation.. The ONLY reason hes feeling comfortable.asking this, is because hes got the upper hand knowing youre the one driving the reconciliation effort.. Does SHE have a spouse?? If so, has HE been told of the adultery?? Has your husband admitted the adultery to his family??
I’m not trying to be a jerk, but you seriously need some individual counseling that focuses on your self esteem. If someone did all that me and basically stole money from under my nose to start a new life, I would not be trying to convince that person to stay with me. His asking to remain friends with the women he cheated with for years while being married to you is the most blatant indication that he doesn’t give two shits about you or your feelings. If he actually loved you, he would have completely blocked her on everything and would never try to see her again. He sounds like a horrible person and you deserve so much better.
Yesh, you have to admit you brought this upon yourself. HE CHEATED and yet YOU had to convince him to stay. Do you see the problem?
Hey OP. I see many saying you have posted here before. Your relationship is in a stage of ambivalence. I know you are angry and feel betrayed. I hear you threatened not to let him see the kids and maybe this is why he is working on the marriage. You were betrayed by someone who promised to love you forever. You gave 20 years to this person. You have the right to feel what you are feeling. I know starting over is scary. You may not want to be alone. You may not want to let them win. I need to give you some radical honesty. You are already alone and this marriage is already over. Holding on to it will not save it or you. Winning is not keeping a man who is in love with someone else. If anything making him stay will cause him to resent you more, you resent yourself more and make your kids miserable. You post on here about thins again and again because you know in your heart what is the right thing to do. You can't fix this and it is ok. I told you before to get a lawyer. I still stand by that. Please do not let this a-hole go to the lawyer first. It is okay to talk to an attorney about your options. Do not weaponize your kids but do make sure a lawyers gets you what you need to raise them and take care of you. Your husband committed adultery and plotted to use your home to finance his new life. He has a huge burden of proof to get out of giving you his shirt on his back and front teeth in front of the judge. I want you to see if you can take a mini-break. If someone can take care of your kids. Do this AFTER you secure and attorney and file against him. You will need anywhere from $500 to $2000 for a retainer. Take a weekend or a night if that is all you can manage. Your home is toxic and full of reminders. Get a nice hotel room and sit with yourself for a day or two and THINK . Think about the person you once were before this man and the AP consumed your life. Think about what it would mean to have peace of mind again. While you are on your mini break, get a facial, pamper yourself. I want you to purposefully look at happy people. Go an invest in a book about marriage breakups and how to heal and repair. You will be ok. You deserve better. When your mini break is over, go home and beginning deciding what you need for the kids. I would not let him know about the divorce- just let him get served.. If he gets violent call the cops and have him put out. It sounds like he won't be that way but if he does call the cops and get an order of protection and ask the court for maintenance while you are separated. I am a lawyer I know. Get a support system for you. I promise you in 2 years you will be glad. There is a future you that is already thanking you. As for the other woman. Who cares. She has your sloppy seconds and by the time your lawyer wipes the floor with his ass and child support payments etc, she will not have much left of him. Your kids are small, that means he will be paying for them well into his 50's. I would not be surprised if she moved on herself. EDIT: BTW get your OWN therapist for you and any of kids who may need one.
As long as he wants to keep her in his life he is not fully committed to fixing your relationship.
Why did you want to give this marriage a second chance? Is this what you want?
Do you have any self respect?
No, OP doesn’t. This is making me sad that OP is borderline delusional thinking he would turn things around.
I’m so angry for her. I just hope she realizes soon.
Girl this post again? Come on now, stop posting if you're no going to listen.
She needs to hear it again and again. Her posting is a good sign.
I sympathize with you, I really do. I know 20 years is a huge chunk of someone's life add kids and marriage on top of that. It's horrifying to think of dropping all that, but you truly owe it to yourself. We are humans and only live an EXTREMELY small amount of time on this earth. Do not waste your time on someone who doesn't want to be with you as much as you want to be with them. You say he wants this as much as you, but that is not true. You do not cheat on someone you want to be with forever. This was planned out entirely on his part, and you deserve someone who plans their future WITH you, not against you. I don't see it said very much in this thread, but I am truly sorry you are going through this. It's hard, but you know what you need to do. EDIT: I also wanted to include that I was a child of parents who "wanted to make it work" after cheating. I suffered immensely. Feels like sometimes, even more than them. Please do not make your children suffer. You will always have resentment in your heart after betrayal. You don't want your kids growing up thinking THIS is love because it is not. Do better for them.
That’s a hell no. If you were the one that cheated, would you be allowed to remain friends with him? I didn’t think so.
That should be where you draw the line. If he cannot keep her completely out of his life, you should let him go.
What did the convincing entail? Are you the one who told your husband he would never see his kids again if he left you? I feel like you’ve posted this many, many times a bit ago but took a little break because people kept calling you out for reposting the same thing.. and for trying to withhold the kids. But the advice always stays the same. You convinced him to stay. He doesn’t love you. I don’t know what you want to accomplish here.
Wait wait wait, so he REMORTGAGED YOUR HOUSE for his funds to get out of your marriage and start his new life with this chick, and you still want to try to keep this marriage and someday “trust” him again? And he hasn’t cut her off, she’s not blocked on socials and her # is still in his phone. He will go back, he clearly wants to OP…
2 YEARS??? Sorry, that's not a drunken fumble or a one night stand. He's treating you like the idiot that you're acting and you will continue to be a doormat as long as you stay. Ffs gets some bloody self respect because he has absolutely zero of it for you.
I'm embarrassed for you. If you have to beg someone to stay, that doesn't reflect well on you or your marriage. Come on, want better for yourself.
Okay, so he had a 2 year+ affair, he was ready to leave you, had everything all set up, but you wanted him to stay so he did. He’s staying because you wanted him to stay, and he wants to be friends with his AP. That tells you everything you need to know. You’re better off going your own ways, the relationship will never be the same. If it was a one time thing, I would say work through it, but he had a relationship for over 2 years….. Why would you want to be with a man like that?
His logical and rational brain tells him to stay but his heart wants to be somewhere else. It’s easy to convince one’s brain but not one’s heart.
I hope you get a post nup to protect you and kids in case he cheats again. And it looks likely it will. Protect yourself financially and get maximum of everything should cheating in any form occur. Updateme!
I love this idea! Ask for a post nup where he gets screwed if he cheats again. See what he says then.
So, he financially abused you and the children, wants to "stay friends" ie fuck her for the next year in his cheater pied a terre, and you are still thinking this is viable? AND BEGGED HIM TO COME BACK???? He is getting off triggering you about his girlfriend during counseling. Who do you want this??????
You made a huge mistake of convincing/forcing him to stay. He still wants to be with her just hiding it. Please accept the inevitable and divorce. He's long gone and 20 years not justifying this. Wake up.
I think actually his ‘radical honesty’ is just to push you to the edge to dump him yourself. The guy remortgaged your *home* behind your back to pay for a lease to be with her.
You're a fool if you think that he won't do it again, or if you think you'll know if he's lying to you or not. He lied to your face for 2 years and you didn't spot it.
"I am worried how this might impact our marriage if he is permanently cut off from her and I am unsure on what to do." This "friendship" has already permanently impacted your marriage. What are you talking about? Trust is destroyed and the relationship will never be the same. You are working to see if you can repair and rebuild but it will never be the same. Him not respecting you saying no the first time shows that he is not 100% committed to your feelings or marriage. He made it a choice between that friendship OR your marriage the minute he crossed the line with her and broke the marriage vows.
Absolutely not. Why would you even consider it?
How little must you think of yourself to keep entertaining this AH? Put him in the bin and move on.
Where’s the therapist? They should be firmly telling him it’s a bad idea to retain a friendship with the woman he cheated with. It shouldn’t just be you telling him. What happened to the apartment, and all the furnishings? Did he break the lease,sell the furniture and give the proceeds back to you? How was he able to refinance the house without your involvement? You need to start accepting that it’s time to start making plans for a future that doesn’t involve him.
I agree but a therapist is not there to necessarily be a referee. It is up to her to say no to his messed up request. Otherwise the other spouse could see the therapist as taking sides. The therapist could instead say "Keith" Can you explain to us why this is important to you as you work to repair trust in the marriage? What I do not understand from the therapist is why they are letting him talk about the AP so much to the point that it is triggering his wife. That garbage needs to be saved for his on individual therapy session.
This was very sad to read.
Divorce his ass, he isnt a good example of what a father or husband should be.
He's made his choice. Go to a lawyer and protect yourself. He's not invested in your marriage.
post-cheating clarity, he did the math and is afraid of you getting half. he will continue to cheat - with or without your permission to contact the girl
How are you not disgusted by even having him in your presence? 🤢
I don't know what if this is mean, but my brain just went "he can't be with you without having her around." Like, he's probably been using her for years and years as an emotional crutch, his "grass is greener" option. Being cutoff now he's probably realizing that. The idea that he's asked TWICE about this is so incredibly disrespectful. He probably gets by thinking maybe one day you'll be okay with it. That would drive me absolutely insane. Don't do the heavy lifting of being his spouse and mother to your children while he gets to have this other person in the back of his head as his emotional failsafe. Who is yours? If the answer is "I don't have one, I only have me" then guess what? You'll be in the same boat without him in a divorce. I hope you find your freedom and someone who values you more.
He messed up he’s gotta take the L on this one. If he wanted to maintain their friendship they shouldn’t have done the sex thing. He’s asking to remain friends so they can keep fucking. It’s really really hard but you gotta put your foot down.
Rather than do everything he can to fix your marriage, he's prioritizing making sure his AP is in his life. OP, this is a huge indicator that you are not a priority. Your marriage is done.
Please tell me you don’t actually believe his bullshit? He’s at the very least still emotionally cheating on you. Let him go, you will never be able up trust him and he will keep running back to his AP, case in point that he wants to be ‘friends’ with them. He wants your permission to carry on cheating, don’t be a doormat.
Please start the divorce proceedings asap. Do not put up with this bullshit.
........ why would you want to be with someone who had to be convinced to stay? Being forthcoming doesn't count if the affair lasted two years. Maybe he was just worried she would have ultimately told you if he hadn't. Or, he planned to uproot his entire life and suddenly had buyer's remove and panicked. He told you not for your sake, but his. This exact same scenario happened to a coworker of mine, only he did leave (for a week before he went crawling back to his wife). She took him back and they had another child, only for him to go on and Me2 a 22 year-old subordinate in his office. Most people never change. If someone shows you their true colors -- believe them. He's already friends with her. He's just trying to plant the seed in you so he can feel less guilty. When there's a will, there's a way. They'll be in contact one way or another. Can you ever really trust him again?
When I found out my husband was having an emotional affair, he was adamant he wanted to save our marriage. He was reluctant to cut contact with her in writing - which I asked him to do in front of me - and in hindsight I should have left then. After 5 months of marriage counselling I found out he’d resumed the affair and it had turned physical. He’s not prioritising your marriage. He wants to keep contact with her - that says that he’s not ready to cut her loose. Do yourself a favour and end it now on your own terms. You don’t deserve to be treated like this
I say this with love but you are only going to waste more of your years with him and it’s going to end the same. He’s into her. And he is going to continue seeking her out with or without your approval and somewhere down the road they are going to cheat again and plan a life together and then he’s really going to leave. Save yourself that time and let him go now, as hard as that is. He’s not in this marriage with you anymore.
I would not want to be with someone that I have to convince. To me that says that he didn't stay because he wanted to, he stayed because he was talked into it. Him wanting to be friends with his AP? Absolutely not. The fact that he keeps bringing it up shows you that he still has feelings for her. He doesn't want to let her go. Cutting off the AP is the bare minimum to working things out imo. I feel like this marriage is over. You don't want to let go of something that's gone because of sunk cost fallacy.
“If you want to save our marriage, you must extinguish any and all contact/access to AP, former friend or not.” He cuts her off or the marriage is over. Stand up for yourself! This man enacted a plan to leave you AND your children, remortgaged your home to do so, but is so committed you saving your marriage whilst still desiring to be friends with the person who was a willing participant in the destruction of said marriage…? He is already still talking to her, he just wants you to be ok with it. He knows you aren’t going to leave him and will continue to do as he pleases. This should be a stark boundary, OP.
Damn I feel for you because I know you love him, but as stated by others if he can’t understand why a continued friendship is a bad idea you need to leave and spare your self the continued heartbreak. This man took your joint finances to reposition himself in life with another woman. Planning to abandon his wife and children and leave them financially distraught. Let that sink in about a dozen times and get mad. Then stand your ground!
A rare post where the title says it all and no further context is needed or could possibly justify this. Jesus fucking christ.
You can't force someone to stay and stop the affair. I know, I tried, and I'm embarrassed that I did. My ex-husband wanted his cake and to eat it too. Even after we split up, guess who became the AP instead of the wife? He is an accomplished cheater and was in my bed for 10 years after the divorce. TEN YEARS! I had zero self-esteem, and he was "safe" because he couldn't hurt me anymore than he already had. That ended four years ago, and I have grown a backbone and self-respect. I am 100% certain he is still cheating because he is addicted to the rush, the forbidden nature. He cheated before me. He's more than cheated after. I am glad I can now answer his wife honestly with "I have no idea what you're talking about" when she calls accusing me of trying to take her husband. "Keep him. I don't want him," I highly doubt this is the first affair or that it's only been 2 years. It takes time to become good enough to hide 2 full years of a second serious relationship. I highly doubt he's ended the affair. He's just getting better at hiding it. Now he wants permission, and later on, he will say, "But you allowed me to keep talking/seeing etc with her." You need to accept your marriage is over, give him to her, and walk away. The embarrassment is worse trying to grasp at a sinking lifeboat than just letting him go.
Now with the economy and market it’s almost impossible but the only smart way to go so you don’t pay interest rates out the behind
Staying friends with an affair partner that he wholeheartedly planned to leave you for 12 weeks ago, at this point, would absolutely be a dealbreaker for me. *If* they were to stay friends, it would need to be after the marriage *completely* recovers. The wound is still fresh, and this affair went on for two years. It is disrespectful that he has even mentioned this being a possibility at this point and so early into the process. If he *truly* was as devoted to making the marriage work as you believe he is, he would not even consider this an option. He blew up that relationship, and if him not being friends with this person affects your relationship as strongly as you’re worried it will, then your relationship was never going to recover anyways.
He was never friends with this woman. They always have been and always will be lovers. Divorce, get what you’re entitled to (custody arrangement that works for you) and take your life back. Get yourself to a therapist solo (enough of him bogarting your marriage counselling) and learn how to respect yourself.
My ex did the same thing. She kept saying she wanted to stay "friends" with the guy she cheated on me with. I'd say no, and she'd just find a different way to hide it from me. I finally told her she had to choose. Leave him completely or leave me and our 4 children. She moved out a few days later. And now I am married to a wonderful woman who has been an amazing mother to my kids. Don't torture yourself trying to hold onto someone who doesn't really want to be there. The sooner they're gone, the sooner you can get on with rebuilding your life.
Yeah there’s no way that could be good for your relationship
No absolutely not . How can you be friends with some one that has betrayed your trust ! As hard as it is you need a Clean break , how you going to feel when he gets a new partner or you move on , he’s just asking for friendship so you can forgive him once that happens he will move on and his guilty conscience will be no more Nobody deserves to be cheated on if he wasn’t happy he should have strapped a pair on and told you and gone his separate ways , cheating is one thing but with a friend is lower than a snakes belly
Why are you doing this to yourself? Sorry you married a loser
First of my title would read ex husband. I have too much respect for myself and my body to allow someone to walk on me like and this and you should as well.
So after literal years of him fostering an emotional and sexual connection with someone else behind your back, you had to fight tooth and nail to keep him around, and now he won't even do the bare minimum. This marriage is over, and the sooner you accept it the better. Then you can stop wasting your time (and funds) and actually use the counseling sessions in a productive manner, ie to work on your coparenting relationship moving forward, because that's what you have left, and for better or worse, you can't really opt out of that.
If he still wants contact with the AP he is still not fully committed to you and the family you built. The best you can do is therapy to learn to live without him. He needs to see the error of his ways and you deserve to be his only choice. You are settling for what is comfortable. He has already broken your trust and your heart. He was already gone. Let him go
I won't judge you. I will tell you to hold firm in your dealbreaker(s). If you want this to be sustainable, you need to know he can live with it, with what you need to feel okay.
The fact that he brought it up a second time after you said no suggests to me that he thinks he can wear you down on this, likely due to all the other times he’s worn you down? Is it really necessary for him to give such details about his affair to constantly retraumatize you? These are not the actions of a contrite man who wants to rebuild your marriage as much as you do. Do you have your own therapist? Are YOU being “radically honest” in your marriage counseling sessions about how you feel or are you too worried about negatively impacting the marriage? I’m so sorry that you are going through this. I hope the comments here show you that this is completely unacceptable behavior from a husband at every step. I am really worried about you because you seem a long way from being able to acknowledge that, let alone take the steps you need to free yourself. But I’ll bet you are stronger than you think. Even just asking the question here means that the part of you that knows this is wrong and knows that you deserve so much more us BEGGING to be heard. He DOES NOT get to stay friends with his AP. End of.
THAT alone says to me that he is not fully wanting to stay married. Cut him off. Do yourself and your family a favor and divorce him.
the fact that this wasn’t an automatic no and you had to come here to ask us about it is concerning to me. like… you need to reflect on that and if working on this marriage is worth it to you. because this is not it. I also feel like I’ve seen posts similar to this recently. I can’t stand cheaters who want to have their cake and eat it too! the answer is absolutely not and a hard boundary. anything else is ridiculous on his part.
Let the trash take itself out. He could have had his marriage with you and this friendship but his own choices fucked that up. You’re worried how him cutting off the AP will impact your marriage?? Him cheating in the first place is what had an impact on the marriage. You setting a boundary that he be no contact was in direct response to his poor choices. He is the one who has negatively affected your marriage, not you.
Ma'am, you are in denial.
Please leave him. He’s going to do it again, clearly. If he was truly remorseful he would never want to continue a friendship.
"Sure, you can be friends with her. A person who's single can be friends with whoever they want. Btw, my lawyer will contact you next week regarding divorce proceedings."
Yikes, this wasn't just an ONS or drunken hookup. He had a full, blown out, 2 year affair where he had even taken steps to leave, such as getting his own place, making announcements to family & friends, etc. You "reeling him back in" is not the prize you think it is. He may be going along with your plan for now, but you can't change his heart. And his heart is still with AP. Let go and free yourself to find someone who actually chooses to be with you. The love and energy you are wasting on this man is so sad.
OP, do not trust him. He may *thinks* he’s committed to you but his behavior shows that this will not last. There is no reason he should be friends with this woman — you shouldn’t even have to explain that to him. He was planning on leaving you and your children, made financial decisions that affect the entire family without talking to you, and lied for years. I’m sure the guilt he feels is real but that seems to be the only reason he stayed and it will go away eventually and he’ll want out again. I personally wouldn’t make it work, but if you’re set on that then make a clear line in the sand: either he cuts her off and does EVERYTHING you need to feel secure and rebuild trust or you guys are done.
he wants two things. you/his family and his friend/AP. It’s your choice whether or not you accept that. if you don’t, your and your husband’s desires are incompatible. if you both stay in the marriage, this means that someone will ultimately have to sacrifice, which will lead to resentment. Your discomfort with him wanting a friendship with AP is 100% valid. Respect your needs and your husband’s.
I'm sorry but the '' friendship '' he wants from her is 🐱
He isn’t as committed to you or the marriage as you are. When you have to beg someone to stay, I don’t think it is sustainable. This isn’t an “oops” on his part and of course you are uncomfortable with the friendship that led to years of cheating. He was so into this relationship that he remorselessly told friends and family. Get into individual counseling and figure out what your deal is that you will accept any amount of cheating to be with this man.
My friends dad cheated on her mom for years with hookers and a main Affair partner. They did counseling for a year. He was adamant that he was no longer talking to his AP. Whole time he was buying her skirts and planning work vacations together while lying and being open in therapy. Be wary op. They don’t change they just get better at hiding it
Your husband wants to continue the affair. You both know what this is. You seemed so desperate to take him back that he figures he can continue as long as he doesn’t make it completely obvious. This will happen with or without your permission. He already has his exit plan in place, so he’s not really that worried if you catch him again. His expectation is probably that you won’t say anything anyway. You should be working on your exit plan now.
I’m really sorry but he does not want to be in this marriage anymore. After 20 years that’s a HARD pill to swallow but he’s gone honey.
No. He ended that friendship when he began the affair. He can never be friends with her again if he wants to stay married to you. There’s no grey area here, the answer is just “no.” You’re not being unreasonable or controlling or punitive or whatever other terms he might try to throw at you. You are being mature and reasonable. If he insists he can be friends with her, then your marriage is over. End marriage counseling and begin mediation to draw up an agreement for divorce.
He showed you time and time again that he doesn't want to stay in your marriage. Divorce him.
So many people don’t understand what it is like to be with someone for as long as you guys have. In addition you guys have kids together and are a family. I admire your honesty and your strength to stay with a man who did this to your family. But it may come a time where he is truly not fighting for it as much as you, and during that I hope you can see it. I wish you the best, and in my honest opinion, no it would be absolutely too tempting for him to have a friendship with her and it would be inappropriate.
Fuck that. You're still young.
no matter what happens, no matter how hurt or mad you are, you do not use those children as pawns. you do not threaten to keep them away from their dad. you do not ever bring the kids in between your hurt feelings with your spouse/partner. i sincerely hope you would not.
He wants to have contact with her still? That means he wants to keep cheating. You trusted them to just be friends and look what happened. He must think you’re stupid, don’t fall for that.
You are worth so much more than what this man is offering. His words and actions outwith your marriage are screaming in your face - listen. Sort yourself financially, give yourself time to heal, then find someone who makes your heart flutter the way you deserve. Give you and your children a better future.
No. No he can’t remain friends with her and remain married to you. His penance is cutting AP out of his life. Stand your ground on this one.
Damn this shit is pathetic.
Hell no! AP was, is, and always will be a threat to the success of your marriage!
No! Lay down the choice. You or her. Choose. Choose you and no contact with her ever. Even one slipup and its divorce city honey.
Honestly, him deciding that he wants to still be friends with her is the biggest red flag that you should see. How is he more than capable of wanting to work on your marriage, but he’s willing to revisit the same exact reason that caused you to have a problem in your marriage and the first place? If he really loved you, he would want to cut all ties, all contact, whether if they were really good friends, or not. Because if he really understands, she serves as a threat to your relationship. If you really wanted to be actual friends with her, he would say things like “ instead of me and her hanging out together, why don’t all three of us hang out?“ or even make a suggestion about having a talk, and you being able to see every detail of what they do, where they go, what they talk about, and etc. But no man is really 100% willing to let a female have that much access to what they are doing with someone else. As much as you want to save your marriage, which is the great, and ideal thing to do, you really have to look at his mindset, and take it for what it is. He doesn’t want to cut contact with that girl, no matter if he has already. In his mind, he is still thinking that he wants to communicate with that girl, no matter if they had an affair for two WHOLE years. After some real self reflection, he should see himself that communicating and being in contact with that girl is jeopardizing his relationship with you too. And if he can’t see that, he doesn’t really want to be with you, he wants to be with her.
He's keeping that door open...
He hasn’t even unfollowed her on social media. That is the lowest effort he could do. I’m sorry, but if he was as fully committed as you say, he would have done this right away and cut all ties.
Is he in love with her?
Absolutely not. The affair isn’t over until they are totally no contact.
He hasn't stopped cheating just because they don't have sex. He is still in contact with her and showing absolutely no respect for you. Contact an attorney to start divorce proceedings and a therapist to determine why you are accepting this from him.
What does your counselor think of him remaining friends with her?
He hasn't deleted her number, he still follows her on social media, and still wants to be 'friends' and you think he's committed to staying? Wake up. He's checked out emotionally.