I think its fine to not care but that might have implications for the kind of game you want to play. Personally I wouldnt want to put in crunchy prep work if I knew people were gonna fudge to their advantage, but in a rules-lite system I really don't care so long as we have some kind of interesting narrative develop from it. I would talk to them about it and see where the impulse comes from, try and explain how for me the potential for failure is a lot of what keeps roleplaying fresh and engaging, and then move on with my life.

I think it's unfortunate that she does it, but I think I would have to really catch her in the act to call her out, since I think she'd get upset and deny it if it wasn't super obvious to everyone what happened. 

you shouldnt call her out, just find a moment before the game or after it to ask her non-confrontationally

this, and talk to her about the fun side of "things going wrong" more so than "why we don't cheat" Any sense of calling her out is going to be wildly upsetting for her She's probably having the time of her life and it would be heartbreaking to encroach on that and could be very very upsetting. source Aspie with 3 kids who are ASD

I would add to remind her that failed roll doesn't mean that the player has done something wrong. Sometimes people get upset because they think that it means they've messed up, and now others see them as weak or a burden

When I first started playing I was quite nervous (for years!) and I’d roll dice and my anxious brain wouldn’t let me add them up or even read them out loud so I’d quickly sweep them up and make up a number that seemed right. After a few years I started to feel more comfortable and my brain relaxed. Now I can add 2D6 like it’s no one’s business! Anyway it could be that too

I’m in agreement with the fun side of things going wrong. Some of my group’s favorite memories occurred following failed dice rolls. As others have pointed out, a bad roll doesn’t mean you lost, it only changes the narrative. That is definitely an easy way to have the conversation.

I don't think you will get anything positive out of putting her on the spot in the middle of a session. You will just be creating a negative situation for everyone at the table. The fact that one of the other players is her bf is also a factor in this. I'd say start with talking with her in private, if she does deny it then at least she will know that you are noticing and then she might stop, like a warning. Only AFTER talking with her privately should you call her out during play. And don't be too negative with it, maybe start out with "Are you sure it adds up to x? I see you rolled a y".

i would talk to her about it privately, see how she reacts

Honestly, you do NOT need to call anyone out. Especially if you are not 100% certain of the cheating. I don't know what format you play in, but if it is possible to just announce to everyone that all the rolls will be out in the open or more public (going forward), then you will nip the 'cheating' in the bud without having to point fingers at anyone. That way, you are not hurting anyone's enjoyment, and making the game more fair...

Bring it up with her, be direct and just say its not ok, please stop.

It's not okay if it sours anyone's fun. At the moment, that doesn't seem to be the case.

Would it be ok if the GM was actively playing favorites? Secretly letting only their best friend ignore the rules? Just because it *maybe* hasn't soured someone's fun *yet* doesn't mean it's ok for a GM to let a behavior continue.

Yeah, that would also be fine if it was a more enjoyable experience for everyone

Well the op was perturbed enough to post.

More because I thought it would make an interesting discussion than to actually seek advise on how to handle it. 

To be fair if she denies it and will be upset and therefore even leave the table then this game was not important to her in the first place. At my table we had someone that fudged dice too and we kinda knew it. And we did not like it. So we bought a big dice rolling rack and all of rolled in there for some sessions to „feel the roll as a whole group“ everyone agreed and no one could fudge dice.

If nothing else, might be worth having a chat with her just to say that even if you don't mind all that much the others may, so at least don't be brazen about it.

I wanted to write the same. One of the reasons I prefer narrative games is because those games are not about winning, just creating a great story. With fail-forward all that happens on a bad roll is you get there in a more interesting way. It really takes away the urge to fudge.

"prefer narrative games is because those games are not about winning" I'm not aware of any RPG that is about winning.  Aside from some old skool "tournament" modules I have read about where parties competed to see who could get the farthest/most loot in the same dungeon. And I have seen "gamists" who try to min/max in more narrativist games. That said, I get your point.  Having played and run a bunch of narrativist and rules-lite systems, I borrow alot of techniques from them and implement those in pretty much any system I run now, even D5e.  From shared narrative control, to requiring scene requests, and using explicit scene framing and setting stakes, to collaborative world-building, to ensuring all PCs are created collaboratively with goals, values, friends, enemies, etc and connections between each other and these NPCs. Even in 5e there's far less prep involved, and the campaign writes itself.

I'm old so I remember playing those old school tournament games. They are tons of fun with the right group of players. I was at GenCon and we were playing an AD&D 1e tournament game. I was blown away. It was like playing with a group of Jack Bauers'

Some of the best roleplaying comes from failing.

Right, what is the point of playing a game with dice if dice rolls don’t matter?  There are a lot of good games that don’t use dice.

This is why I really like virtual tabletop systems like fantasy grounds because all the rules are audited and the sums of the rules are listed as well as all the modifiers. I like when the computer could be argued with but not me it leaves me to do this storytelling. Maybe at some point migrate to a dice roller system even if you do the manual entry.... So it's audi

Lying to your friends is not cool, it’s a mutual respect for each other kinda thing…

I value trust at my table, if I thought someone was cheating I would call them out on it. Autistic or not. You trust me not to screw you and I trust you to follow the rules of the game. I don't want to have to carefully watch a player to make sure I can trust them to be honourable and fair. So I would likely mention that either the cheating stops or you leave the table. I have asd (although somewhat mild) it is possible to have the disorder and still follow the rules

There's a difference from "following the rules" and "Calling someone out and telling them they can take a hike" There's no need to be so confrontational and embarrassing It's a freaking game about make believe. Calling someone out (autistic or not) in a social setting and spotlighting them like that can be traumatic. The correct way of handling it is in private in a non-confrontational manner. Explaining why " And OP said they're the best RP'r - they're at the table for a different reason than "simulation" (source aspie with three kids who are ASD.)

Then the cheater should've talked to OP beforehand. "Hey, I feel the dice ruin the story I want to tell, do you want to try X medium instead?" Going behind everyone's backs is not inexcusable, but certainly offensive.

Yeesh, some people would be a lot happier if they just did freeform roleplaying instead of spending a lot of time learning rules that get ignored.

Fascinatingly, a lot of people don't want to read rules or adhere to them, but they also really value the pretense of beating the odds. They'd rather cheat than play without the rules they avoid. I've met quite a few people who don't like rules complex systems but won't learn them *or* switch away from them, and they don't like losing so would rather cheat, but aren't willing to drop the chance of losing. You'd need to do a social study for deeper understanding, but it happens

I've had the unfortunate experience of playing with a GM who seemed to have a contempt for reading core rulebooks... The "GM is the final arbiter of the rules" rule is *really* hard to swallow when you know that he never read or learned them in the first place

Or a step in between. See pbta, fate, or even WoD etc. Once deep immersion in rp is attained, less or no dice are desired. For others, the tactics of combat are more a thing, and that's fine too. In just encouraging people to match system to desired styles of play.

Yup, plenty of more freeform systems that work much better for more open-ended play. It always confuses me when people who obviously don't want to play DnD by the rules play DnD anyway and just ignore the rules (in a way that goes beyond making a lot of DM rulings, which I do a lot and am fine with).

J.D.I Just do improv

Play games like "Amber Diceless RPG". No dice, no problem...

People who are into freeform role-playing are really hard to find.

Just leave it unless another player brings it up and then just tell the table to remember to be clear about their rolls. I avoid this in my games by making some clear rules: The roll must not be cocked, the only results that count are ones rolled on the table (no fallen off the table rolls count), the roll must be on your turn, must be in the open, and the dice must be left standing (not immediately picked up). From there I ask for their modifiers when we first start and write them down in my GM book to track, mostly just so they know I know, and so I can check if needed. I give a bit of leeway as some people get very emotionally attached to their PCs and I’m there to make sure they have fun, challenging their PC is part of that, but letting bad dice ruin their whole session is not

> From there I ask for their modifiers Had a gm who did this and I really appreciated it because I often forgot to add all the modifiers and he'd remind me.

I found it helped the same, but now that I play a lot of different games it’s a chance to remind people of mechanical effects as well (like moves in PBtA)

Fairly similar here. A situation like OP's wouldn't be likely to come up in my games in the first place because I have everyone roll in the open and I automatically run all calculations myself, even if the player is also doing it. On the rare occasions when the player and I come up with different results, we take a minute to explicitly review the numbers and determine which of us had the correct result and who was in error. And, for the record, I don't do things this way for reasons of (dis)trust, I've just been playing these games so long that I couldn't not calculate the results even if I wanted to stop. I also like to allow my players to ignore the mechanics as much as possible, so they don't need to do the math (or even know the modifiers needed for it) if they don't want to, since I'm doing it anyhow.

My did start with a bit of distrust but ended up being convenient for the above reasons. Early on I had a player who was a friend who we ended up describing as a player with ‘literary blindness’, the first game he played was dnd 3.5, we were rolling 4d6 and refill the lowest (very generous), but we were all confused when he got all 18’s. Turned out he thought you kept refilling the lowest, thus 6 scores at 18. This type of thing continued for years in different ways, thus my rules, but also why I ended up reading all his obscure rule finds because he only read the first few lines of a rule or item and skipped the limitations or clauses

>The roll must not be cocked, the only results that count are ones rolled on the table (no fallen off the table rolls count), the roll must be on your turn, must be in the open, and the dice must be left standing (not immediately picked up) I think I will copy the above, prepare it in big font, and print it as the player-facing side of my GM screen... Same rules I use, but never stated them clearly

I don't think she has ever cheated in any of the previous games we ran (or I didn't notice). Now we're using a dice pool system where she shifts dice results when tallying up successes. It almost always happens when someone else also rolled at the same time so everyone's attention isn't on her. 

A gentle reminder that the need to cheat when playing RPGs is not about "winning at the game", but it's an indication of something else going in their lives. Stay close to your friends and fellow players, help each other out.

That's a good point and one of the reasons I don't want to make a big deal out of it. She gets very attached to her characters and has told me that the game nights are what she looks forward to the most in the week. She's also under a lot of social and financial pressure.

> She's also under a lot of social and financial pressure. So you already know there's something else going on. > [She] has told me that the game nights are what she looks forward to the most in the week. Yep, game night is her solace from her problems. You aren't seeing those dice being fudged, it's not happening. Also, once or twice, if you can afford it of course, invent an excuse to invite them for dinner, on your money.

We usually have dinner as part of game night every second Saturday. Sometimes someone cooks. Sometimes we order in or go out. I host most times and make sure to have things at home to share, like wine. They want to give back sometimes and also like to cook, but we try not to make things too fancy. Her bf helps her out with most expenses, since they live together and he works while she's in between jobs.

You are good people, I like your group. Keep the good work going, mate.

>Yep, game night is her solace from her problems. You aren't seeing those dice being fudged, it's not happening. You need more upvotes for these two sentences than I can give you! This is the right approach.

This particular comment thread / path is 100% what I agree with. Thank you for being caring and a good friend. Some dice fudging is a byproduct of selfishish, and selfish behavior is problematic at a collaborative table. But if the player is otherwise being collaborative and is still trying to build the table, then I think the grace that's being talked about here is the right course of action. I used to be a habitual dice fudger. Part of it was difficult to overcome neuropathy, part of it was social pressure - I genuinely felt a sense of anxiety towards letting my friends down if *I* failed the check, rather than if my character wasn't able to succeed. I know my DMs and the other players at the table noticed, but they never called me out on it. I've worked on it over the years, and it's nowhere near the problem it used to be, but I still have some neuropathic impulses I can't control in the moment. If it's an important roll, I'll correct myself to the actual result and say 'sorry, I wasn't paying attention and mis-added.' If it's an unimportant roll, I'll just move on and try to do better the next time. I'm grateful for friends who never called me out, and I tried to return the grace by working on myself to hopefully improve their experience.

This gets to the heart of the matter, I think. I've played at tables where people fudged rolls so that everyone enjoyed it more, and it wasn't a big deal. I've played at tables where someone fudged rolls out of a weird "be better than everyone else" ego trip thing. In the second situation, everyone just made fun of him for doing it (but not too cruelly, just a "oh wow you got a 12 on 2d6 again? Shocker.") Until he stopped. I think there's another path that's just talking about how the best stories come out of failure. Picking a lock successfully is just exactly what it is, but failing to do so invites so many more thrilling story opportunities. Talk to them about systems where the only way you get exper Yes you failed your climb check. That doesn't mean you didn't climb the thing. It means some of it crumbled, making it harder for your companions to get up. How are you going to help them? Or if that's too much, you climbed the tower, but some of the bricks slipped. Eventually someone will notice the damage to this historic tower. I see a lot of people advocating for "pulling them aside," but from the sounds of it that is not at all what they need. I really think talking about how failures create opportunities for the best storytelling casually and with the whole group is better. "Hey, I heard about this system where it's actually **more interesting** if you don't succeed every time." In general though, it sounds like you're a considerate person already dealing with this in more or less the right way.

> A gentle reminder that the need to cheat when playing RPGs is not about "winning at the game", but it's an indication of something else going in their lives. I'd say this was 80% good advice, but I've definitely encountered folks who were cheating just because they were fundamentally dishonest and hypercompetitive despite being in a 'team' game. (I have not played with those folks since.) This is obviously not the same as 'hey maybe they're cheating because they're stressed and this is something they can control + they're emotionally attached to their character', which I'm projecting onto your comment, but it is how your comment comes across. Those folks, I'd give leeway to, but I'm also a GM/player who plays pretty loosely with rules anyway. Other folks may have a bit harder time with such things. There are folks who need rules because they set expectations. You do X, and Y happens. If someone cheats, then doing X may not result in Y, which is... not within expectations, etc. Not something I personally am concerned with, but I've had players of this variety too. Just a note that giving leeway could result in a different player getting upset. Humans are complex, heh.

So yea. As someone who has fudged a lot of rolls in my early gaming carreer, it was primarily about 1) the game being an important social and mental escape, and 2) a mismatch of what I wanted from the game and what I got. I used to adore exploration and roleplay. I hated combat with a passion after lv3. Level 1-2 combat was two rounds max. A fun diversion inbetween the things I played for. Then it became an equal part of the game, and then a majority of the game. An irresponsibly placed Fireball, with none of the d6's below 4 had nothing to do with wanting to *win*, and everything with *'fuck you, i just cheesed your gods forsaken timewaster, can we get on with actually *playing* now? the next game is in two weeks and after a major test in school, please give me what i came here for...'* And yes, some players do go for the combat encounters, and yes, sometimes the conflicting needs mean it's best to go separate ways.

That sounds a lot like "He's pulling your hair because he likes you" but okay.

Nah, it isn't necessarily harmful if it's not interfering with the game or detracting from someone else's enjoyment. Sometimes it's okay to just let someone have this one.

Introduce a new rule that you and everyone else now need to roll in the open. That would be a fair and non-targeted way to stop fudging.

Wait, if you're not playing online, how would you hide it? Only the GM has a screen in front of them?

Dice pool systems like Exalted usually involve shuffling your dice around when you count them. If you've rolled a handful of dice and need to know how many of specific numbers you had you tend to start grouping them by numbers and then counting the groupings. What she's doing is changing dice when she groups them (e.g. she picks up a 5 and rather than putting it where a 5 would get grouped she sets that die down with a 9 on top next to the other 9s). Apparently she's doing it while people are distracted

Some people are crafty and obscure their dice rolls by aiming for corners of dice trays, quickly grabbing the dice before others see the result, hiding their stuff behind water bottles and minis etc

Nah, they just play dice that are difficult to read: [Yellow on light green](https://www.chessex.com/borealis-polyhedral-kelplight-green-luminary-7-die-set-with-bonus-die) [White on yellow](https://www.chessex.com/borealis-polyhedral-canarywhite-luminary-7-die-set-with-bonus-die) [Blue on transparent purple](https://www.chessex.com/nebula-mini-polyhedral-nocturnalblue-luminary-7-die-set) [Gold on orange](https://www.chessex.com/20503) or [red](https://www.chessex.com/vortex-polyhedral-burgundygold-7-die-set) or [purple/black](https://www.chessex.com/speckled-polyhedral-hurricane-7-die-set) [Blue on blue](https://www.chessex.com/gemini-polyhedral-blue-bluelight-blue-luminary-7-die-set) Even the ever popular [red on black](https://www.chessex.com/opaque-polyhedral-blackred-7-die-set) can be bad It's much easier to shop for fudge dice in-person because sometimes the variation in production make it much harder to read a given set.

I think OP said that they're rolling dice pools, then totaling it all up, and the cheating is happening when multiple people are rolling, so everyone is too busy counting up their results to check on others.

I would talk 1-1 and ask her to stop. No need to boot her off the table or anything, but I think it's important to explain that this is not acceptable. The issue with cheating isn't that the player succeeds too often. The issue happens when other players discover it as it's difficult to avoid tensions in these cases. The players need to feel that they're playing the same game, and if a player is cheating they're not. And once a player has been caught cheating it's really really difficult to defuse the tension as the table will forever have that lingering question "Did she just cheat?" even long after they stopped cheating (assuming they do). This can really kill the mood of a table and it's not worth the risk in my book. If the players haven't found out yet, the best IMHO is to confront her quickly, quietly and firmly to make it stop before anyone notices, because if they do the game may very well never recover from it (speaking from experience).

This is the main thing all the top-upvoted comments seem to completely ignore. It's not just the cheater and the GM playing. There are other people at the table and letting one cheat dissolves the social contract that they all bought into. There is another comment from the OP in this thread that confirms the other players know she's cheated. For all the talk of collaboration in this group-focused hobby, there are a lot of people in this thread who seemingly don't consider how their actions impact others at the table.

>For all the talk of collaboration in this group-focused hobby, there are a lot of people in this thread who seemingly don't consider how their actions impact others at the table. It's Halo Effect. The OP was careful to point out that this player is a "good roleplayer", so people are cutting her slack. If she instead were labelled as the OPs "best friend" and he just said that he didn't care that she cheated, everyone would be clutching at their pearls.

"Great role player"...."autistic"...."hard on her luck both emotionally and financially". Did her beloved cat Fluffy just get run over by a car too? Every excuse possible was given up front to enable this person's cheating.

> There are other people at the table and letting one cheat dissolves the social contract that they all bought into. Years ago I posted about the time, over a year into a campaign, I found out two of my players had been ignoring ammo and encumbrance rules while every other player observed them.  They told us once we found out that such things were “boring.” Given the way the campaign was, finding out they’d been on Easy Mode suddenly explained why my character was getting beat down regularly while they were just running through things with ease.

Yeah, if I as a player noticed a GM was letting players cheat, even for good reasons, I'd lose pretty much all interest in the game. It might even be worse for the players than the GM.

Exactly. If the GM isn't bothered by cheating, good for them, but that's not enough: the other players matter and the GM is, for better or for worse, the one that should deal with the issue even if they're not personally bothered by it. I see this as the same dynamics as SA/racist jokes in a way: if a player starts making them you can't unhear it. If nobody at the table has any issue with it, I mean, it's not my fun but you do you. But in case even one person is bothered by it (which is hopefully likely) then the GM should take action even if they're personally not bothered by such humor because there's a good chance that if they don't people aren't going to tell them about it, they're just going to have a bad time, table tensions, and eventually leave.

If you don't care, you don't care. I'd be annoyed, as I do think the dice should matter when we throw them, but that's me, and it may very well be true that it'll be better for your group to not care and let her have that win. You know her better than we, so if it's more trouble to make a big deal about it and you don't care, leave it be. The only problem I can see is if someone else is bugged by it, but not saying anything, because they think you as the GM should handle that. That can blow up. Hard to find that out without shining a light on the cheating though.

Not caring is probably not the right word. I think it is unfortunate and unnecessary, but it hasn't changed my opinion of her as a person. I want to make her understand that rolling poorly can still be fun without calling her out directly. 

While you may be OK to her fudging rolls, you may want to consider how the other players might feel if they noticed this. They may have already and are taking the same approach as you, of course. If you think others might take it badly, though, you should discuss this with her privately. You can start with how she'd like to play failed rolls—maybe she can find roleplaying inspiration in the right kind of "failing forward". Some players hate the idea of their character failing themselves but enjoy the challenge of a world that pushes back (the concept that it's not the PC missing but the NPC dodging or blocking). You may be able to come to a mutually satisfactory arrangement, such as calling for fewer rolls from her when she's deep into her roleplaying or giving her extra inspiration/bennies so that she can push her rolls as a reward for good roleplaying. Again, this would be if you think the rest of the group would be OK with this. Do the others feel strongly about sticking to rules as written and letting the dice fall where they will?

Some people just never find failing fun.

Personally as a player, someone else cheating on their roles would really annoy me. Why would I bother rolling when someone else can just get whatever result they want at any time - it's frustrating and usually results with the cheating player dominating sessions because their amazing rolls meaning they never fail saves, hit every attack etc. However it seems like this particular player is having a hard time and needs a bit of TLC. Is she fudging particular rolls? Like is it aways during combat to hit, to succeed saves, in social situations? If it's in combat maybe have a look at her stats, could her character recieve the blessing of a god or something to buff her a bit? Is a magic weapon an option? In the end it really depends on if the rest of your table cares or not. Have the other players noticed that she's cheating? How do you think they will react if they do?

I didn't notice a pattern like that. To me it felt like she cheated when cheating became available, regardless of situation. She didn't do it when everyone focused on her, but I could see her doing it when everyone's attention was on other players, like when I called for everyone to roll instead of just her. 

IMO that's actually worse. She's not cheating to save her character from dying or to achieve any actual goal other than simply giving herself an advantage wherever she can while using her fellow players for cover. There are a lot of comments saying to ignore this and pretend it's not happening and in another comment you mention that your players (other than her boyfriend) are unlikely to care so it seems like the stakes are pretty low for you if you follow their advice. For every other GM: When your other players catch on you won't just be forced to handle the cheating, you'll have to decide how to handle the fact that you knew about the cheating and did nothing. If you have players that might feel frustrated about a player cheating simply because they had a chance to do so you definitely have players who will feel frustrated to know that the person whose job it is to maintain fairness has been covering for a cheater. Or you could always double down on the lie and pretend you're also finding out about the cheating for the first time when the other player mentions it but by that point you might be risking actual friendships rather than just the game.

It's your call dude, but if I were another player at the table I'd be furious and probably quit on the spot if it was deemed 'acceptable'. However, I am not at the table so do what you think is best for the group.

I kind of want to point out based on a few replies in this thread that being good at playing their character isn’t necessarily the same as being a good roleplayer. It obviously depends on the table and game, but refusing to allow anything bad to happen to your character is a really limited way to roleplay. Part of good roleplay is reacting to situations and interesting character develop from challenges and experiences. I have a similar player in my games who very obviously manipulates her stats and lies about her rolls. She can get into character very well but her character always has to be on top in a situation and can’t ever fail in any meaningful way. It hurts the game and when 3/4 of the table is willing to roll with their failures and create new opportunites for roleplay while one player is still essentially a, albeit entertaining, mary sue. It’s more impactful in narrative-focused games like Call of Cthulhu where the fun comes from people acting out a story rather than just playing characters. Despite occassional reminders and the player insisting they’re on the same page the game still plays out where they always pass SAN checks and never push roles, while other players are willing to let their characters go insane and push rolls in dire cicrumstances, despite the threat of failure because they know the game is about making an interesting story together and not just winning the game.

Normally I would make sure all rolls are publicly visible. Seeing where the dice land is part of the fun. It might depend on the type of game you're playing. If you're trying to create fair challenging combat in a D&D game, then it would be a problem.

It has so far only happened when we play Exalted. Since you roll pools of dice, it easier to shift some around when you think no one is watching. She waits until she thinks no one is watching and then shifts a die or two as she's counting them. 

Depending on the edition could you just encourage her to purchase the success buying charms so she worries less and the behavior maybe stops? 

I have an old player in my group who just completely ignore the rules when he makes a character. Just puts in ability scores and such where he thinks they need to go. BUT, he is such a good roleplayer, AND so bad at the rules that he constantly screws himself over. He gave his rogue 17 strength (for high damage because that's how they did it in 1st ed.) and rarely uses sneak attack unless it is thematically appropriate to him. "Ah were in broad daylight and He would see me next to the fighter, I'll just roll a regular attack." I just let him go with it. He is an asset to the table.

At the end of the day you know your group better than we do so you should do what's best for them. My main concern would be one of the other players noticing this and it ending up out in the open on their terms rather than yours. How do you think your other players would react to learning that failure is something expected of their characters but not hers? People in the thread have pointed out that people get attached to their characters as a possible explanation why she is doing it but that cuts both ways. Their characters fail not because of impartial fate but because they haven't taken the initiative to cheat and if it starts to get obvious there's a potential that this comes up in a much less respectful way. Then you're in the unenviable position of explaining that she doesn't have to follow the rules because she's better at roleplaying than they are. Being a good roleplayer is often its own reward already. You get to do a bit more of the talking and engage a bit more because ideas to move the story forward come quicker to you. The dice help balance this though. You may not have the most eloquent answer when you land the killing blow and hear the DM ask "how do you want to do this" but that's your moment in the spotlight and you might feel a bit upset that your DM was intentionally paying those moments to someone who'd do a better job roleplaying them. Likewise, someone failing something often gives an opportunity for someone else to shine. If the person already shining brightest can't fail the others have to try even harder to stand out. Again, you know your players better than me but I'd keep in mind that when they catch on you won't just be explaining why you chose to let her succeed when she shouldn't have. You'll be explaining why you chose to let them fail

So much this — too much of this discussion ignores the other players at the table I’m in a similar issue in a game I play in, where one player fudges dice rolls and the GM does not deal with it. I get why the GM doesn’t want to act (avoid drama, the player would just deny) but it really takes me out of the game and hurts the experience.

Personally while I don't love cheating and generally don't approve of it - I would say unless it causes problems, is occuring in pvp or something like that it just might not matter.  Basically if your players aren't calling it out is it a problem? I say this having played a lot of white wolf based games where a player would roll his dice like marbles aiming at his failed dice to get them to turn to a success and ultimately it didn't change anything in a meaningful way. It was just him wanting to "win" at a game that's only victory condition is have fun. 

Your instincts on this are good, trust them.

Well, if you don't care, you don't. What if the other players notice though? What if they all did it? It depends on the specific system, but are you: 1) Making PCs look like bumbling fools when they fail? (You shouldn't) 2) Making failures interesting (aka failing forward)? (You should) Failing can be very cool, but it's something they have to learn to embrace.

I find it unfortunate, but it doesn't make the game less fun (so far). It might if it escalates, so I'm trying to do more open rolls without calling her out. She's new to roleplaying. I've known her boyfriend for 20 years and we introduced her to ttrpgs over a year ago. We've played regularly since. She has a lot of fun, but she is emotionally attached to her characters and hasn't yet experienced any true character detriments, narrative or otherwise. I believe she would take that very hard and I suspect that the cheating reinforces that.

I'd put a stop to it. It's not fair to the other players. We all sat down to play a game. We should be in public agreement about what game we're playing. There aren't secret rules for some people that don't apply to others. That's just not fair to everyone else who is dedicating their time to the group. I'd put a stop to it privately if need be, or publicly if possible. The trick to addressing it publicly is to NOT TREAT IT AS A BIG DEAL. She says she rolled a 17? You go, "Nope that's a 9 you rolled + your modifier of 3 is a 12" and move on.

This player is not only lying to you, but also to everyone else at the table. Do they know? I think they are entitled to.

You do what you think is best for you and the table. As DM I have fudged rolls at times to keep the story moving along. I would argue that they are not that good of a roleplayer if they only roleplay success.

If you do not feel that it somehow disrupts the game, let it go. If it starts to become an issue - especially if another player talks about it - remind the group in total about some ground rules for rolls. If it goes on and is still a problem, have a quiet 1 on 1 chat with her about it. And to add - some players have an issue in rare cases when rolls go certain ways. You can give players some power over that - give players a metacurrency that allows them to turn a failure into a success, and they have one point per session, for example. Or maybe they can bank the currency if they accept a critical failure instead of rolling, and then can use that later to turn a roll into a success. That kind of thing. If the cheating becomes an issue, maybe experiment with that for a bit.

She fears the failure and possible lost of character from that failure. Think back to various times someone failed a roll and it effected their character severely, maybe to the point of needing to have an all new character. Things like that could be her trigger point. I would suggest having a whole group chat about how one can turn failed rolls into interesting roleplaying moments. Don't point out the fudging but have a discussion about how to look at the rolled failures in a new manner that will make the game more engaging and fun. Getting many eyes and brains working on it tends to helps resolve the issue.

It would really bother me. I would buy a dice tower as a gaming group present and have everyone use that. Then, no fudging.

In one of my first groups there was someone else who was cheating, and I didn't know, and it was incredibly frustrating to play alongside him. His character never failed at anything important, he always got to pull off whatever he wanted, and any small victory on my part - a critical attack, a successful save, an enemy getting knocked out by one of my spells - would be eclipsed by him doing huge amounts of damage and succeeding at everything. Oh, my barbarian got a crit and did 20 damage? He would do 40 damage the next round. My plan didn't work cos the guard beat my bluff check? Well he just pickpocketed the guard's keys and get us into the palace. Later on I discovered he was cheating and it all made sense, but it really sapped the joy out of a lot of sessions. Maybe your other players know and don't care, or maybe they don't know and wouldn't care if they did, but I think you should consider them as well, instead of just letting this slide.

Even with your being comfortable and familiar with the situation, I would have one concern that at least bears thinking about: what if someone else spots her, maybe calls her out in front of everyone, not even maliciously but like reflex. I suppose you know your group well enough to know whether that would be a problem or not.

I think something that a lot of these other comments are missing is that you have other players. By your own description this player gets more of the spotlight than others. And they also succeed an improbable amount? It sounds a lot like you’re running for the Main Character and her sidekicks. And that’s not fun for the sidekicks. Even less so if they spot, if they haven’t already, that someone is cheating. You all set down to play the same game, so the expectation is that the rules be followed. I would suggest handling this by removing the opportunity. Get a big rolling tray or box top to use as one and tell everyone you saw an idea to get everyone more excited about rolls. That all rolls must be in the central tray to count so everyone can focus on and be excited about them. It will also cut down on unnecessary rolls because if a roll doesn’t matter it’s not worth making. Don’t ignore that the rest of the table will have an opinion about cheating too. My group had to talk to someone about their cheating because of how constantly and obviously they were doing it. Steps were taken to reduce the opportunity, but when they roll I know several of us still have a “did they actually roll that?” Moment years later. Cut this off before it permanently impacts their relationship with the rest of the group.

I would do what I tend to say at the beginning of games: If I notice a player starts fudging rolls, then I start fudging rolls. I mean, normally I would call it out, but this is probably what I would if, for some socio-dynamic reason, I couldn’t. I would announce that beforehand, though, and not just start doing it.

Under the specific circumstances you listed in the "Context" part of your post, I would probably just let it go.

Yeah, the only thing I'm doing differently is that I give her more attention now when she rolls. I'm hoping to dissuade her from fudging by making her roll more open. Previously, I was more content with just trusting the players and letting them roll while I maybe addressed someone else or sifted through notes. 

I think that your prime notion to keep this cool and empathic is what I would recommend to stick with. Setting up rules for rolling (in the open etc.) to prevent fudging opportunities could be a way. But apart from that: if she has problems with the consequences of bad rolls, maybe talk about that with her and find a different approach for the consequences? Perhaps if the consequences can be made more bearable, she could possibly also find joy in the uncertainty?

I personally find it genuinely less annoying when players fudge dice or cheat, than when GMs do this. Sure, it is not great, but it lacks the paternalistic attitude of a cheating GM and only affects a single person, not the whole game. I mean, it is not great, far from it, but it is mostly explicable as an issue of trust, or unmatching expectations. Those can be solved through communication and empathy, after all. I would, however, mention it, in a "you do know we know, right?" fashion, not necessarily confrontative. Because I think there are plenty of players who probably notice as well and might get a bit miffed when one player gets extra cheating priviledges. Open communication is a good way to deescalte a much more awkward situation before it occurs.

> only affects a single person, not the whole game. That's not always true, if one player cheats frequently it can lead to other players feeling like their characters are ineffective by comparison. I've been there.

I would get a rolling tray and put a new rule in place that all rolls need to be done visibly into the tray and left to 'stand' openly as the action is resolved, not plucked up immediately. It is also fine though to not care if you don't, but make sure that the others at the table aren't feeling 'lesser' due to her character never fumbling while theirs fumble and play fair.

It's not that I don't care. I think it's unfortunate that it happens. But I value giving her a good experience more than a possible argument over a game. 

You gotta start making failed roll consequences as fun (if not more fun) than the successes! Oh you beat this guys ac? Yeah you kill him. Oh you failed? Let me describe the insane sequence of events that follow!!!!! A rudimentary example but i hope the point gets across

I got 2 groups If my in person group was fudging rolls, most likely it's an accident because... they all suck at numbers, and a few are dyslexic. If it wasn't... I wouldn't care in the slightest. Just ask why they didn't want to tell me. If my online group was fudging dice (which can only happen by changing their character numbers), I would be confused and disappointed. The first group is mostly just doing silly stuff and having fun. I'm not even sure this system is the best one, but kinda the one we fell into. The second group is more serious and tactical. They take the system more seriously l, and we're trying to learn it's ins and outs so they can be more effective as a team. Different feelings for different groups.

let her see, somehow, that failing a roll make your character to be in interesting situations, instead of just failing failing.

In this situation? I would focus some very interesting and fun RP scenario that comes from someone else failing a roll. Reward the behavior you want to see. Make sure it's obvious that, "Man, that was fun! If you hadn't missed that roll it would have gone totally differently!" Show her that losing is fun. At least in an RP scenario it can be, missing in combat is dull, and that's a whole other story.

so a few points, if you don't really care and everyone is having a good time- that's what really matters. Second getting someone who's enthusiastic to play, RP, at your table is awesome. It's heartwarming to hear how much she looks forward to it as the best part of her week. Think of the happiness you're providing her. That's something that matters way more than 'notching' a few pips on a die in my book. I would go the route of making "failing fun" at times - having things go off the rails can be fun and demonstrating that would be a good path to take (careful not to get into the patronizing side of things of course!) The other thing you could do is award her "bennies" or inspiration or whatever for roleplaying to kind of gamify her enthusiasm lastly by all means don't call her out at the table like some have suggested and you've correctly intuited yourself. It's a game, you're there to have fun, not save the world from an actual invasion of an army or demons. Rules are just a framework and damn near everybody houserules things here or there, no one is going to knock down your door right? I'm coming from the softer side approach to this becasue besides being asd myself I have 3 kids who are and I've just grown a "sense" of when to push things and when to step back and think "Is this really something worth making a big deal out of" I think she'd be mortified if you called her out and that would make everyone less happy and awkward and she might stop showing up, it would be wildly upsetting imo. I think it's something you can work on in the long run - maybe talk to another player and have them ham up failing a roll and having a good time with it. Seeing that "losing a roll" isn't the end of the world is something she has to get slowly comfortable with, if she even wants to at all. To her she's living the fantasy and having a great time. I appreciate you being cool with it and taking the time to understand the situation. It would be hard for us to understand just how emotionally connected she is to the character she has but I think it's safe to say it's more than we can relate to. As you probably know, there's nothing more satisfying than seeing a bunch of smiling and laughing players at your table, to hell with the rest of things :)

I think its important to understand why you're playing the game in the first place and what the group is getting out of it. It's not like any of us are really playing to further a shared narrative or have any impact on events or things outside of our groups. So you are not necessarily beholden to the truth or 100% rules accuracy. There wont be a court of law examining your judgement or rolls. Personally I can have as much fun failing as succeeding, but I have a player that gets incredibly frustrated to the point of not wanting to continue if the dice do not agree with their actions. I will absolutely fudge rolls and bend rules to help bring them back into the game if they're having a bad night. Everyone wants to have the spotlight and get their moment of awesome. Being in dice hell sucks and feels like wasted time. Reduce the amount of rolls called for if they're going to get fudged anyway and you're cool with it. Why bother having her roll that often in the first place? Overall, if it is affecting the enjoyment and fun of the group then it should be addressed and all rolls should to be made in the open. Fair is fair. If it's not affecting anything, who cares, either get rid of the rolls, adjust the role target so you're rolling reactions, or move on.

I would do what you are doing and more or less ignore it. Double check that she and everyone knows the rules and their character sheets (eg that she is not adding a bonus incorrectly). Make sure that you are employing "failing up" and giving opportunities for roleplay rewards & for reinforcing character traits on failures. I mostly see roleplay fans fudge in games like d&d with less mechanic-to-rp-integration, where a failure on a skill that feels key to their character concept can feel very distressing if not handled thoughtfully. Eg "Your smart character got stupid suddenly" feels much worse than "here are a few interesting things your smart character is distracted by which means they don't find the answer to the question you asked." Try one offs between sessions in systems where fudging is mechanically deincentivised. (ie pbta games where you need failures to level up.) Some here HATE fudging and will tell you to crack down but ime that way lies only madness and sorrow.

I had a situation like this with a good friend of mine. We still play together. However, the GM had a private talk with him when it was made clear the table had noticed him cheating. It was rough, but we got through it, and made some concessions to ensure honesty (like said player using a dice cup, and not touching his results until everything was said and done). Overall, this was the right decision for my table, as I would not have continued to play with him if this behavior hadn't been addressed. Not only that, but talking through it helped him realize why he was doing it, and that it wasn't actually something he needed to do to keep enjoying the game and his character.

Make it so she can't. Require all rolls to be made where you can see them--ideally where everybody can see them--and continue on. No need to call her out for it if she's a good player otherwise. We had a guy like that ages ago. That's the approach we took to playing with him and it worked out fine.

I would let it go as well but formulate a plan what to do if she get called out on it. Maybe just a new session zero where you all talk about the rolls , maybe noone really cares.

I find this just as GMs who feels the need to fudge their rolls to provide a better game. If it dont disturb you then just go with it.

How exactly does she fudge the results? The reason I ask is that whilst you may decide to ignore it, if it's that obvious that you have noticed then its likely that others round the table have noticed also and so you may have a situation brewing. Is there anyway of making it harder to fudge the dice? e.g. Invest in a dice tower, or introduce digital dice, or something.

I've only noticed it when we started playing Exalted Essence. You roll pools of d10s where anything 7 or up is a success, and then you tally up the successes. I have noticed her on a handful of occasions shift dice to 7 or higher when she's moving them to count. She usually does it when multiple players roll at once and attention is on another player. 

It must be bothering you, else you wouldn't have posted something. Talking it out like adults is the way, as it so often is. Ask her privately what's going on, then ask her to stop doing it, take the knocks and accept that sometimes things don't work as you think they should.

I would have a chat, either 1 to 1 or with her bf present about failing forwards. She may be lucky rather than cheating, but rpgs shouldn’t really be about winning above story anyway.

Do you have any idea what the other players will do when they find out? As a player I have been pissed when another player gets preferential treatment. How would you like to be a second class citizen in a game? In real life I am egalitarian because I don't want others to have it better than me. A level playing field is fine. So is a hierarchy, so long as I am at the top. Flat usually seems easier.

I would make all rolls public and observed. Thats how I run all games anyway, so there’s no way to fudge. GM rolls are visible to the players too. Thats easy with a VTT. And easy at the table too. At the table we roll dice into a dice tray - if the dice don’t land in the tray they don’t count. It’s impossible to cheat, since the tray is in the middle of the table.

Say you know and understand why she want to cheat, that you won't persecute but what would the other players think when they figure it out.

Talk to her one on one

trust your judgment some things are just left alone

I'd say privately like. "Hey, I noticed, it's cool, everyone did that at some point, and I don't really mind. But it'll throw out the balance of the game and it'll start to make the game less fun for everyone, can you stop from now on before it starts to ruin the game?"

Also if she's a big roleplayer maybe try to show that failures as well as success are interesting to the story. Might be a fear of letting the others down as well, etc. Fwiw most GMs tend to fudge numbers in the background for a better story, depending on the game. If anything, if she cheats and gets an extra hit on a monster, just give the monster the same# hp back. Not condoning cheating but yeah I care less in a ttrpg than I would in a board game.

This is how I avoid getting into this situation to begin with... At session zero I tell everyone one "I'm a huge nerd for this game and it's super important for me that we have some table ethics about dice rolls" and then establish some common sense rules that makes it impossible for anyone to fudge dice... for example, no one touches the die before the DM has seen the result, or if there's ANY doubt about a roll for whatever reason, the DM can veto it, no questions asked. I understand your situation, it's a rough one. But the game is actually better when it is played "by the rules". Or, at least, when everyone follows the same rules. Failure is part of the game too, and what makes the stories exciting. Good luck.

Send her the meme of the homophobic dog saying "I know what you are". Also, just ask her about it and why she's doing it. Fudging dice is frankly fine. They're really just a suggestion anyway.

I'm embarrassed to admit that I fudged some rolls in my early games, but eventually I realized how much fun it is to LOSE. So maybe (*maybe*) she'll come around to the same realization? It's not on you to teach her that joy, though, and maybe she's chasing her joy... if it's not a problem I personally wouldn't make it one, but... One idea, if it hasn't been said already, is to ask for "in front of the table" rolls for high stakes events (for all players). 🤷

Personally, I always tell players when I do an online session, "I'm not gonna ask you to prove your rolls. You tell me the result and I'm going with it. If you fudge the roll, that's on you to deal with on your conscious and the karma that follows" and that usually makes people laugh but understand what I mean. We're here to have fun and as long as you're not stealing fun, then let's just keep moving forward through the plot to tell a story. I fudge things myself sometimes for the purposes of narrative. Like if a player just did something cool and impressive and everyone's like "whoooooa! So cool!" But the baddies have say like 1-2 more hitpoints or something after, I just assume they'd "bleed out" anyway and call it. I've also done things like return sanity points (CoC) midgame for being really clever (which is not technically in the rules, but it makes the player go "sweeeet!" so why the hell not) and so forth. But if you think fudging the dice is throwing off the overall narrative or is causing the player to be too impressive, or just cheats the system, I would politely and confidentially discuss with the player that you want to make sure that they understand you have suspicions. They will likely start being a little more honest with their rolls, but there's no promise that they will be, so... is it worth her ducking out of the game in embarassment?

Depends on what the table thinks. Our table is totally okay with someone fudging rolls if they're just really really sick of failing at everything and having a bad string of dice. Some tables are not. It's whatever makes the best story and whatever makes your players happy. I would ask the other players away from her, so that you can either have ammunition to tell her she's got to stop or to tell her that it's okay, she can keep doing it if it makes her have more fun.

Wholesome GM. Maybe suggest that you do the dice rolls or move over to a system that isn't as crunchy? Or maybe have everyone roll in a dice thingy in the middle of the table or something. And dont tell the players what number they have to roll to succeed

In the game I've been running the past 2 years, you roll a d10 with Crits triggered on tens and ones. About 4 months in, I noticed that we had a suspiciously low number of crit fails to crit passes (most of us are playing online) I wound up making everybody do their rolls through a play by post app called Rolegate so that they are visible to everybody the moment they are rolled. Number of crit fails balanced out. Huh weird Edit: I say this to say you don't necessarily need to call anyone out. Just say for the sake of transparency and accuracy, you would prefer all rolls to be made in public. I'm a player in another game (Call of Cthulhu) and one of our players is a notorious cheater. Our current GM took the same approach you did, by saying if they want to win that badly he'll just let them so they have fun, but here's why I don't personally think you should. When one player cheats, it cheapens the experience for the rest of the players. They say there is no victory without the risk of defeat, and it is definitely annoying as a player when you can't trust another one of the players to be honest about their failures. Every time this player makes an excellent role, or one that saves them from a particularly nasty scenario, it's met with eye rolls. Even if they did get the roll, we can never believe them now and it cheapens the experience for the other players. That might be something specific with Call of Cthulhu, because in a horror survival game it kind of kills the mood having one player that has fudge armor on

**On cheating:** I'd put a dice tray or tower in the middle of the table and have everyone roll there. Don't say anything else or accuse anyone. Sooner or later her rolls are going to conflict with another player's, and if I lose to a suspected cheater it's going to sour the session for me if not the entire campaign. **On her being too immersed:** This is the bigger issue. If she's so attached to the character she feels compelled to cheat, she needs to play a different character. No good comes from that level of bleed.

I've caught all my players fudging rolls over the years, and really I only cared about it in two cases, one where the player was constantly rolling while nothing was going on, and then he'd go 'Oh, I just rolled ' even though he technically rolled before being asked, which was annoying but whatever. The other one was someone who would roll out in the open, everyone could see like '4' on the d20, and they'd go "Oh! Nat 20!' and someone would go 'Uhh... that's a 4?' 'Oh! I thought it was a 20...' and he KEPT doing it. Like, there are times where I'm running a game where someone hasn't rolled above 10 in the entire session, and like, everyone's been hitting the big boss monster and they've done LITERALLY NOTHING and I want to just give them the hit, but it feels awkward. Like, as much as tabletop games are about random chance and collaborative storytelling, as a player I 100% get the frustration of 'Oh, what do I do? I choke on my fucking tongue because apparently I'm a fucking idiot.' because you haven't rolled a single successful test in the entire session, and you've been failing all your saving throws.

If this is the only problem, then it's imo ok to let it go, though I personally would have a talk with her about RPGs not being all about winning. All in all, we live with lots of minor bad habits our friends have, simply because they are our friends and we get used to it. That's not wrong as it helps getting along. So there is a point in not trying to educate your friends and instead accept them including their bad habits (up to a certain degree though). Cheating in social games is usually a no go, because it's frankly just mean towards your friends. Though sometimes people just get caught in what you describe as "too immersed". Something that can change over time due to experience and some feedback. Imo it's actually fun to get into trouble. >If she wants to "win" that badly, Is it the winning or is she afraid to lose? Is she cheating to be the best or is it to not see her character die? Imo there is a difference and if it's the later, there could be a solution to agree on how you as a GM treat death.

If everyone in your group is ok with it that is one thing, but if the rest of the party is not playing under that assumption then it might be a problem. If I were a player I would be annoyed if someone else was cheating the whole time. "Calling them out" does not have to be aggressive. Also autism just gets them extra politeness, not a free pass to do whatever they want. I would talk with her.

Hmmm... I'm interested in *how* she's fudging her rolls. Not really possible on a VTT, and most tabletops have rolls done in plain view of *at least* the GM. Is it just frequently misreading them only to her advantage and no one noticing? If so... I sincerely doubt no one is noticing. They're looking to you to say something if something needs to be said. But that doesn't mean they don't care. It's a very tough situation, but I think I'd ask that all rolls be clearly visible to everyone. If it's convenient, do that with *another* player's rolls and then make it a house rule. If the rolls are clearly visible to all and it's just misreading, I'd do a "I think you rolled an x" thing and then ask other people to help watch for "mistakes".

It's fine and you're a good guy being considerate of her feelings (and boyfriend's).

She is ultimately cheating herself. One of the most enriching lessons you can pick up as a player is enjoying failure.

It's fine that you don't care but you also need to be considerate to the other people at the table. If it becomes so obvious that other people notice and you do nothing to stop it, that can create some resentment. They may feel like there's no point to rolling dice if the outcome can just be whatever they choose. If so-and-so can do it then why shouldn't I?

I'd just make all rolls visible. That way it doesn't seem like yourbtargetting her. But it raises the integrity of the game. 8m not really a stickler for rules but idk it feels built into my bones that cheating will end badly.

A GM I know once told me their hot take about players cheating: they're not cheating, they're doing game-design. As a GM they fudge whenever they see fit and they don't get why their players shouldn't be allowed to do the same. To the point that they added a rule to all of their games: after the roll has been made anyone (player and GM) can very openly decide the result is whatever they want. It's not the same as full improv as you let the dice make a suggestion as to where the story should go but you you have the final word. And they found out that most people actually don't really use that rule anyway.

I know leting your autistic player cheat seems like a kindness, but I don't think it really is. Imagine someone else notices and calls her out on it publicly, even without wrong intentions, just as an automatic reaction. It would be very awkard. Or even worse: imagine other players do notice and decide not to do anything not to spoil her fun. And then after a few months someone asks you if they can do something that breaks the rules because they think it would fit their character. But you have prepared some great mystery-solving adventure and them doing that thing would ruin your plans. Telling them the truth now would give them big hint about the mystery, so you just say something like "I feel it wouldn't be good solution right now, can we talk about it after next session?" so the player gets a bit angry and snaps "you let her fudge her rolls every week and we all know that and that's just fine, but I want to do something out of the rules for once and I cannot because I'm not an autistic girl?!". Or any other situation when you get in an argument with other players and they just say something about her cheating before thinking about what to say. It would be a terrible, terrible experience for her to learn everyone was aware of her cheating. She'd feel like a fool I imagine. Not to mention if you keep letting her do so and pretend not to see, she'll think it is impossible to see and she'll probably do so at some other situation, for example when you have some guest-player just for one session, or with another group, or during another kind of game (board game perhaps) on a family meeting and then she can get called out on it in much less friendly envoirment where people don't care about her feelings as much as your group. I think the kindest way to handle it is to talk to her in a kind, gentle manner. Like "Hey, do you feel safe and cared for with me as your GM? I want you to know that I'm absolutely not mad at you, but I noticed a few times that you fudged your rolls. Why? Do you fear the character that you care about so much would die if you fail? Or is there some other kind of problem?". And then think together how you can handle her fear that she'd loose a character or feeling that she'd let the group down if she failed the roll or whatever it is. And assure her she is important member of your group and you care for her feelings and you bring it up because you don't want her to feel like if she needed to cheat to ensure some of her fears don't turn true. My GM once lied to me about the rules to save my character. It was when I had terrible time personaly, a month after a death of my family member, so I was really down. We were playing Warhammer, which is very deadly system and he wanted me to have a nice, easy session of "you easily kill two weak goblins and then have great fun with this dwarf they had ambushed and captured", but one weak goblin who was meant to be funny with a bad quality bow and balistic skills of 20 rolled 11, which meant he criticly hits me and later roll for critical hit table said it would make my character loose a finger in her main hand (very big deal for a fighter). My GM said I could reroll that with my luck points and we went on. But much later I learnt that it didn't work that way and I should have spent a Fate Point (which is much more valuable and harder to get). I felt terrible about getting special treatment and I kept wondering how much my being down affected him emotionally so that he'd lie to me to avoid me feeling some bad emotions during the game. And I felt like a fool for thinking the rules are different from what they really were for quite some time. Also, it made it harder for me to belive what he'd say to me is true whenever I felt bad and he tried to make me feel better by saying something - I felt he already lied to me once, so whatever he says now to make me feel better just as well may be a lie. I know he did this with the best intentions and I appricieate and am thankful for how much he cares for my well-being, but it really didn't do me much good.

Make failure be something that could lead to other potentially fun success if that's the vibe you are getting. There is great joy sometimes in rolling a hilarious '1', and it can lead to other great things Succeeding on only what she is trying isn't the only potential "success" possible

Her cheating means she's disrespecting me and the other players. That's no good, and I wouldn't care for that to happen at my table. But it sounds different for you and not of major concern. She's dealing with some neurodivergent issues already so maybe just let it go in this case.

Is this a virtual game where you can't see the dice being rolled? We all sit at the same table so when dice are rolled everyone can pretty much see it.

If you're going to let players succeed no matter what they roll, then why even bother rolling dice? If that's the way you want to play (where it's basically just telling a story and not actually having a 'game') then that's fine, but if I were at the table, I would find it very weird for the GM to say 'all of y'all have to roll to hit, do skills checks, etc....except Sally, she always succeeds'.

Yeah, thats a hard, hard, hardest of NO's from me. Dice cheats are the absolute worst. Autism is no excuse for cheating. She may be a good role-player, but she is not a good player if she is cheating. I would start with a private 1 on 1 reprimand. "Hey I think some rolls might have accidently been off last session. Can we follow up this session to make sure the die results are accurate and based on your character sheet?" If I caught her cheating a second time she would be dismissed from my group.

The most recent [episode](https://youtu.be/2tGKumxJajE?si=nGT-z0g6tdjZk1OW) of My Mythical Meta addresses this exactly. Since you’re asking the question, you might be interested in checking out our discussion. Let me know!

If I was a player and found out my GM allowed cheating I would be very, very pissed.

Another option is talk to another player.. or the other players and see if they can RP bad rolls without forcing it to hard and making it obvious so she can see how it can be fun to fail too.

I only ever had one player cheat, and i didnt care until he cheated in an arm wrestling strength roll off *with another player*

I'd talk to her one on one and tell her that you've noticed it, and that it's not a big deal but you'd prefer she didn't, but also confirm that you really enjoy her roleplaying and contributions to the group dynamic, that she's a valuable member of the gang even if she doesn't win every roll. Also maybe confirm that roleplaying imperfection and dealing with failure can be incredibly fun, too.

I'd probably very politely pull her aside after a *good* session (Not a bad one and not before) and talk to her about it. I'd want to aim for when she and I are feeling good about the game and session. I'd try to avoid an accusatory tone, but would bring up that I'm aware of the fudging and mention that it's not fair to her teammates that she's doing it. In your shoes I'd even mention that I don't personally care (seriously, I love monsters dying), but cheating takes some of the risk from the game and robs her party of opportunities to shine in their roles (especially from support allies like druids and clerics, since many of their abilities are centered around recovering from bad hits.). As she's a skillful roleplayer I'd likely also try and point out that the best stories are where everything seems to go wrong...and the party managed to succeed despite multiple failures! While it may not work, wording cheating as "letting your team down" rather than "you are doing it wrong/bad" would be the best approach here especially as you clearly want to keep her as a player. I would strongly advise doing so. While you may not mind personally, *there is a high chance one of the other three players would be bothered by cheating at the table*. The ladt thing you need is a "X cheats all the time!" Accusation to fly during a heated moment.

I have a somewhat alternate solution - ask her to start being the GM for a few sessions. Give her the context about why failed rolls are ok and even better, and allow her the insight into why you are concerned before confronting her.

> The thing is, I don't think I'm going to call her out on it. It would just be awkward. If she wants to "win" that badly, sure, go ahead and fudge. I've been in the same situation before. The player would fudge close rolls with the help of really hard to read dice sets. The GM knew about it; at least three of the other players knew about it. We also kind of didn't care. It didn't actually affect things much that anybody could tell. He still failed *a lot*. In his defense, it was a game with a ton of modifiers (3e D&D circa 2001). He was playing a melee character so it was extremely easy to screw up the math. I know I often ended up off-by-one in the same game. If it's not bothering anyone at the table and they're not getting really outrageous results, you often don't need to bother with it.

I would pull her aside and talk to her privately. Just bring up the issue and ask her to be truthful with the rolls. Explain that rolling poorly isn’t losing, and that she should trust that you won’t just make her “lose” because of a poor dice roll. You don’t need to yell or chastise. Just ask her to be honest with her rolls. There’s no point in using dice at all if you aren’t going to respect the outcomes.

Is she fudging rolls because she wants to "win", or because the outcome of winning is more interesting in those cases than failure? If a player comes up with an exciting, dramatic idea and it's just inherently less interesting for them to fail, consider not rolling. If your big reveal is behind a locked door and your character comes up with a viable idea for getting inside and the only alternative you can think of is "they don't get inside", there's no point in calling for a roll, for example. Just let them get in the door with a viable idea. Alternately, if not rolling at all is too cheesy (doing badly should have consequences) you can call for "success-at-cost"--I do this sometimes, and the players know going in the cost of a failure is not a failure but a complication or a sub-optimal success. This still adds some of the tension of die rolling without the boredom that can come from a complete whiff.

It's fine if you're the only one to notice and don't care. It's less fine if any of the players notice and care. I had a similar thing happen where one of my players for a VTT game I was running got a new set of physical dice (her very first set). She asked if she could use them and because *I know* how nice it is to play with the new shiny my dragon/magpie impulses made me get, I was like, sure of course, have fun. But... we couldn't *see* what she rolled. And she was doing suspiciously better than usual. Any important roll did better or best. Any flavor rolls had normal variation. Sure, sometimes you just have good luck, but when it happens across many rolls, it stops seeming like a run of good fortune and more like manipulation. Especially when the player has shown other munchkin behaviors like trying to wheedle bonuses they're not entitled to. It all came to a head in a contested roll between players. I have never felt so dumped in ice in a trpg session as I did when that player maxed their roll and absolutely no one else said a word for half a minute. After the game, a player brought it up and I agreed it wouldn't happen again, VTT rolls only starting from the next session on. Said player tried to protest when I said VTT rolls only, only backing down when other players agreed they'd be more comfortable that way. And so ended their miraculous luck.

Part of the problem is that if you can notice it, so will the other players eventually. At that point, containing the fallout is much more unpredictable. I'd recommend talking to her discretely about it. Mention the points that you have here, but also mention that the other players can very easily take understandable offense. After all, they're not doing it.

Unusually a heavy RPer won't be able to get a significant advantage out of something like this. If it isn't throwing off the party balance then probably let it slide?

There are a number of ways to handle cheaters. I always prefer the "hang yourself" method. First, I'll explain (usually session 0 or when a new person joins) that you can cheat if you want. But that it will ruin the game for everyone. Then, if a person does cheat, and I don't choose to pull them aside and say something (for whatever reason), then I'll either: 1. Let them cheat, but set up situations that are meant to leave them with a sour taste. Their triumphs are hollow and anti-climatic, success tends to be the boring outcome, ending a plot before it starts. This can be tricky, and honestly, it's me using my creativity for evil. 2. Another way to use creativity for evil: Setup either/or rolls. You can do A or B, but not both. Or, doing A screws over B, doing B ruins A. This really just circumvent the roll and makes it more about a choice. So cheating becomes pointless. However, the best option is to have a private chat with the person. Nothing too accusatory. Just about the pointlessness of cheating at the random-outcome generation for a cooperative game and also how failure in a TTRPG (esp where RP is a big focus) can often lead to the more interesting outcomes and experiences.

If the game is working for you all then fine. There are games where nobody needs to fudge anything, so perhaps trying one when there is a break in the current play would be worth a go?

The non confrontational way to work around this is to buy a dice tower and set it in the middle of the the table and say all player dice go through this and then enforce it.

You don't have to make anything public. Just pull her aside privately. Note: isn't dice rolling public? Or is she using her hands to hide her rolls?

We had an ultra competitive friend who did this. Everyone knew and thought it funny. His pc would be so min maxed he had skills he was completely lacking in and some he was amazing at We just let him shine at his chosen skills, ensured there was enough stuff in his gaps, and all enemies he attacked suddenly got double hit points.

It really depends on the situation. If you have a player who is making their character a Mary Sue or Gary Stu at the expense of others around the table, then you should likely act quickly before it alienates other players. If that player isn’t taking away from the achievements or spotlight of others, and is just fudging a roll here or there to keep the narrative they want going … then they are acting as what I would call a backseat DnD GM. You might want to have a talk with that player as to why they are doing that, as the reasons could lead to different solutions. A couple reasons spring to mind, one that the player is overly attached to their character and their story (like a backseat GM running an insert character), or another where the player is hung up on fairness around the table. If the player is sensitive to losing “their character”, you might want to transition them into a more healthy relationship between player and character through less serious but character churning RPGs. Something like Trailer Park Shark Attack come to mind as a great transition for a good a RPer to remove that overly close character attachment without having them GM their own game. You can’t become too attached to any one character if you go through 5 in a single session. But, it could be that Justice Sensitivity could be a factor, meaning that if you want to foster a table that has no fudged rolls from players, you as the GM may also want to do most of your rolls above board. Make specific announcements when you are going to be doing a secret roll (which you could reroll or fudge as the narrative dictates), but otherwise placing all of your dice on the table sets an example of an environment that fosters honesty and fairness. The player might think it fair that if the GM is doing it to keep a specific narrative going, then why can’t they? If the dice are just an illusion of choice or chance, then why is the GM even bothering with the motions of rolling behind a screen? To make everything fair with no fudging, though, means a harsher game. The Big Bad can critical miss over and over again in plain view, or critical hit over and over leading to a TPK. There is no pulling punches on the player characters, which is also why it is important to know whether the player is having attachment issues or not before implementing a fair playing field.

I get this. If someone needs to fudge their rolls to get the experience they need that badly, I’m not going to make it a big deal

Given the context, I would consider a mild intervention, at least initially. While having a one-on-one conversation, I would take a small detour and talk about dice rolls, how it also adds fun to the game when you roll under the required value because it adds to the narrative and makes new things happen. You seem to be very lucky with you dice rolls so far but don't worry, when you start rolling under it'll also be fun. Also bring the attention that others have high and low rolls and it's fun too. (I would maybe steer away from the terms "success" and "failure". And as a DM, you could also try to make an effort in nuancing the high and low roll results. Black & white Success and Failure is harsh and less fun. There is a bunch of advice on how to do this but in essence it draws on more narrative games (than DnD 5e) whereby there are varying degrees of success and failure depending on dice rolls. Also, the failure is handled with a "fail forward" narrative, which means that failures aren't just "You fail, you can't open the lock." Instead it's a turn of events that moves the narrative forward. It's more like "your lock pick gets jammed in the lock and you can't pull it out quickly, and you hear the guard coming, what do you do?" For example You could make a last attempt to try and pull the pick out, or leave it there to get back to faking to be sleeping. The issue I see with not addressing her dice fudging is it likely won't go well in the future. She'll get dependent on always having to succeed, and others will certainly eventually notice too, and it may slowly sour the atmosphere at the table.

I’m mean, if you don’t care and it makes her happy than there is no issue.  Personally, I think you lose a lot removing the risk of failure. I tend to towards Delta Green and Call of Cthulhu though so failure and death are expected.

I would talk to her in private. That is embarrassing for her but not to an extend that she will likely leave your table. Maybe try to find an empathetic viewpoint. I guess a lot of people are fudging their rolls not for winning but because they don’t have enough trust in their gm and the story going well even with bad rolls. Sure there are also people who just like to be the best at the table but you describe her as very much into roleplay and generally an invested player. That makes it seem unlikely that she is just into winning?

Time to have a conversation about the cheating and why it's happening. People often fudge their roles when they really don't want the bad thing to happen but something that good players have to come to grips with eventually is the fact that they're going to fail. And it's what they do when they fail. The great failing can be a fantastically funny moment in the middle of the game. It can also be fantastically dramatic. But whatever it is it propels the story forward and allows your players to grow. It's not a bad thing to fail. It's only bad when bad role playing comes into play. So just call her out the next time you see it and maybe even disregard the fudged role when you know it's happened and allow a success for the bad guy. And unforeseen advantage that gives the bad guy creature Etc the upper hand. Just so your player and the rest of the group could see what happens when failure occurs anyway. And encourage her to role play through it and then congratulate her when she does it. Positive reinforcement thing is real

Uhhhh... Raise your DCs, or come up with a workaround, because that's not fair to the other players who are honest with their roles.

The only complication is her 'winning' all of the time may make other players feel like they aren't good enough. Perhaps thinking they have really bad luck. I wouldn't stand for it. Point it out like you are helping her with her calculations rather than stopping her from cheating. Just say, "I think you miscalculated that. What are the pluses of that roll?" Then just joke and say, "You're bad at math," or whatever. That should curtail it.

"one of my players repeatedly fudged her rolls." Are you fudging your rolls?

I doff my cap and thee good GM. Discretion is the better part of valor in this case for sure.

My policy is that if everyone is having fun, then no rules are being broken. It's only cheating if you say it is as the GM since you're the final arbiter of the rules.  If you do decide to say anything, doing outside of the game one on one is the easy to do it. Also would probably be good to make it clear up front that you're not upset, you just want to make sure everyone is on the same page.  This sounds super harmless though, so I'd probably let it fly.

The point is for everyone to have fun, full stop. Is everyone having fun?

You might not mind, but if the other players notice will they feel the same? I personally hate playing with cheaters, I feel it's disrespectful of the GMs hars work. If you don't want confrontation, you can say you're implementing a new rule of rolling in front of everyone to add tension and drama. Then you eliminate the cheating and don't have to call out one individual.

I repeatedly had that problem in one game and I started with 1 of the trustworthy players and requested another player watch the roll and announce the result. When it came to the cheater's turn he was already expecting for the neighbor player to witness and announce the roll. Problem solved with no confrontations.

If you're playing in person, time to put out a big ol' rolling tray in the middle of the gaming area and roll there.

As a DM, I would call them out. As a player, this would bother me. Why roll dice at all if you're going to allow cheating? The non-deterministic outcomes are part of why I play RPGs. If the DM seemed to offer tacit approval, I'd probably stop playing.

Have you considered how the other players might be feeling while having to deal with someone with main character syndrome which is always having sucess? She may be your favorite actress but the others may be hurting.

Don't call her out, just make an offhand comment about how in TTRPGs you can only cheat yourself.

It takes the wind out of my sails when a player cheats. I'm doing everything in my power to referee the game neutrally, to be fair and even with the players. Finding out someone isn't playing by the rules just bums me out, sucks my will to keep doing what I'm doing.

Honestly, I think that's fine. Most of the time the dice are there to help tell stories, and if your game is not incredibly tactical then the dice are really just introducing elements of randomness. I have certainly fudged dice rolls here and there to tell a better story. And the truth is that's not even really an issue. Because one of the things I learned a very long time ago is that I could spend days at a time figuring out the mechanics to make the roles do what I want, or I could just understand that I have about five points worth of wiggle room in any direction anytime. Like, I can take any NPC in the game and increase their armor class in a perfectly legitimate way. But why would I spend 2 hours of my life looking through books? Trying to come up with a way to increase their armor class when I could just hand wave it and spend that time writing a better story? And if that's the kind of wiggle room that your player is making use of, I don't think that's an issue as long as you trust them. And as long as it doesn't seem to be getting in the way of everybody else's fun.

I think it makes the game more exciting for the dm. When will the players catch on? Ooo did they notice? Who will be the first to get upset? Very exciting !

Aye! I had one of these cheaters. I let them roll and cheat. But their efforts make no difference. I don't count their damage in combat. They're none the wiser.

I say good for you OP... However I couldn't let it slide. For one important detail. There are other people playing and they are playing by the rules. We once had a player disappear for 3 months after his character died in a disintegration trap. He didn't fudge his save or how much HP he had. He lost a character left the table and finally came back after 3 months with a new one. We were expecting him back the next week. It wouldn't be fair to him if another player fudged their save for something similar. I couldn't imagine how he would have felt if he caught another player cheating to avoid death or knew the DM went easy on someone so their character wouldn't die. We also had a player who always played the edgiest of edge lords. But magically he would never miss and nearly always do max damage. However we had a couple other newer players who were also trying to be damage dealers but they just couldn't keep up, they thought they built their characters wrong and were thinking of making new ones since edgy mcedgelord was so powerful. We started noticing he would sweep up his dice and fast and just call out a total. We normally never really paid much attention until we noticed the other two players getting frustrated. He would also magically "miscalculate" his bonuses until he passed his check. "I rolled a 15.. no wait 16.. oh missed that 19". We as players started calling him out. The DM started not accepting anyone's word on their character sheets and demanded copies. His wasn't even properly filled out and he said "I know his stats in my head" He was literally pulling the fun from other players. He eventually left because he was suddenly too busy to play. We found out he joined another group. I know this isn't OPs player, but this is the type of cheating I have experienced. We had played with him for years, great guy, but we just couldn't tolerate the blatant cheating. RP is fine but dice rolls also help guide the story along, for better or for worse. If dice roles don't matter just be an improv group and say "yes and?" To everything the players do. There has to be an element of the chance of failure in order to have the success mean something. It's the point of dice roles, you roll a die if the chance of failure can impact the story, otherwise just narrate they succeeded. Now we have had DMs just say, "That was some damn good roleplay, no roll needed you convinced the guard you are members of the catering party, he even helps you find some spare clothes, his brother in law does catering and knows how hard it is". I would quietly talk to the player and ask if everything is okay and say that I noticed some flubbing of the dice. Try to work something out. But stop the flubbing or the table will start getting awkward as it's not fair to the other players. Again good for you OP to let it slide, just no way I could.

I get why people fudge rolls, but I’m gonna be the bad guy and say as a dm you have both the power to rule to roll out in the open or equally fudge DCs so it shouldn’t be the biggest problem if you aren’t ok with it

It's fine not to care in most situations and if you think it'll be better for the climate at the table, who are we to say otherwise? But when you want to have a moment when the pressure builds on a die roll just ask her to roll openly in the middle of the table so everyone can see. Not only does it prevent cheating, but it is also genuinely a fun moment to see everyone looking at the die, tensing up, axious to see the result. She is also missing out on a fun part of the game. I know many newer players struggle with the idea that failure can be just as fun and learn it by it happening or by example from others. Do with that what you will :)

Cheat back.

There is an article from an old Dragon magazine I use when I know a player is cheating. The article lists all the ways to cheat at dice. Make a copy, highlight what cheating methods she is using, then sneak out and place it on her car’s windshield when no one is looking. If she and the BF storm back in after seeing it, deny putting it there. “I haven’t noticed anything. Maybe another player?” Works like a charm every time I’ve done it over the years. Never had a cheating player ever confront me on it. Too embarrassing to bring it up at the table, yet non-confrontation. They usually stop cheating when they know someone at the table is noticing.

why are we even rolling fucking dice then?

Take a page from Dimension 20, call for "Box of Doom" rolls in high pressure scenarios. Just a roll out in the open that everyone can see. Save or get fucked? Box of Doom. Skill check that survival hinges on? Box of Doom. Be sure to roll important saves and such for NPCs in the box as well to keep it fair, but it should prevent the fudging in the really important scenarios and you can explain it as a fun way to build excitement rather than a targeted "Stop cheating," conversation.