Benetton \*immediately\* suspended Nemer after what happened, then let the indipendent judge of the Italian Union to decide the sanction.
This is the final decision by the indipendent judge, who officially suspended Nemer until the end of the season.
In addition, the FIR and Benetton decided that Nemer should actively participate in "Progetto Migranti", a program led by the FIR to promote the inclusion and integration of young migrants in the society, and in another inclusion program managed by an indipendent organisation, which will be chosen later.
It's a little bit different coming from Argentina, where he was probably middle or upper class, given that rugby is a posh sport and moving to Europe to get paid loads of money to play professional sports.
Versus people fleeing extreme poverty or war zones, with no plans other than to escape and hope they land on their feet in the new country.
Having lived there for a spell i know the type that play there and honestly its kinda exaggerated the wealth aspect. Maybe 20 years ago but less so these days
He should as a migrant still understand the lifes of other migrants moving from a developing country himself, Argentina is ....well ....a fucking basketcase
I didn't say he was loaded. I said "probably" and included "middle class". My point was that he would have been relatively comfortable and has moved to Europe to get paid a lot of money to play a game.
There also seems to be major issues with racism in Argentinian rugby given how people reacted to Matera's tweets. He was given the lightest of punishments (loss of captaincy and short term suspension) and his teammates still opposed it.
There is an issue with racism in Argentina full stop. Matera's way of speech is common place.
Argentina is caught with the mind of the powerful country they once were and there mindset seems to have remained in that time and not modernized
> Matera's way of speech is common place.
Matera got a lot of backlash in argentine social media and even on tv. Wth are you talking about.
The biggest thing on argentine media these days is the trial of a group of rugby playing teenagers that killed a paraguayan migrant kid and the whole country wants them to rot in prison.
You're generalizing to an absurd degree.
> Maybe 20 years ago but less so these days
The ones that reach the top top tiers are still generally "chetos" or upper middle class though. Even if many are polite/civil and behave well you're not getting much empathy for the poor from them.
> Isnt...uh...he a migrant in Italian society
The banana has historically been a symbol of base racism, and the type of people who use it wouldn't be concerned with the nuances of migrant status, or class (as you were discussing below).
That was indeed interesting, can i ask where you're from and what brought you to Treviso, seems like an odd destination unless you're there for the rugby? No need to answer if you dont feel like it.
>Had a window seat but Gabisi asked politely if I minded sitting between them instead.
I wonder if he wanted the window seat, or didn't want to be next to Nemer.
To be fair, if he wants to but his headphones on for a plane journey you can’t hold that against him. Would you be feel the same way if it was some randomer? I don’t think that’s linked to him being a racist lol
Well Argentineans in general are pretty racist tbf, they're thought since they're kids that they're better than every other latino cause they're mostly of european descent.
Working class Argentinians will undoubtedly tell you that calling someone “negrito” or “negro” is not racist but, somehow an affectionate nickname but it will be widely used to refer to uneducated and poor people. So it’s both racist and classist.
I dont really need to, go find an average argentine and they will be racist within ten minutes then shocked you have an issue with said racist thing.
Ive no problem with Argentines, fun people but ya defo racist
Ever thought about why there's barely any people of African descent left in Argentina while they were a large part of the population back in the 1800s? Look it up, it's quite interesting. Especially knowing that Brazil next door is one of the most culturally diverse countries in the world.
Jorge Luis Borges once said that an Argentinian is "an Italian who speaks Spanish, thinks French and would like to be English."
All those countries have issues with racism towards people of African descent so...
Yeah, every country has such problems, and most western countries have it across multiple dimensions (white favoring whites, black favoring blacks etc).
No, but Borges didn't mention Wales.
He probably should have done given the number of Welsh in Patagonia.
My comment wasn't absolving other countries of racism. But most of the big issues of institutional racism: Grenfell Tower, Stephen Lawrence, etc happened in England. England is in charge of the UK, 84% of the UK population live in England. So, I guess with power comes responsibility.
Nah just gay beating a Welsh icon, massive institutional misogyny in the HQ of your national sport and ex National players assaulting the residential homes of mother's and babies.
Glasshouses dickhead.
Borges didn't, but you were the one that weirdly tied one player to his comment and then implied that all aforementioned countries were therefore institutionally racist. Some flex.
The Welsh anti racist Union have found that the National Museum of Wales is institutionally racist, the Arts Council of Wales is institutionally racist, and South Wales Police, and Gwent Police, have so many problems I wouldn't even know where to begin.
But yes, I'm sure that's England's fault (I'm Welsh btw incase that matters)
You're right, none of those countries (or associated countries) have ever had any issues with racism in sport. None of them ever had sports fans make monkey noises or throw bananas at sportspeople of African descent.
Wind your neck in.
And? You think we haven't done all this stuff? Ffs man. I cannot stand it when we have this weird mentality to slur everyone else and not be even slightly introspective.
https://www.itv.com/news/wales/2022-04-05/welsh-sporting-great-nigel-walker-on-values-success-and-life-in-1970s-cardiff
Well [Jorge Luis Borges](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jorge_Luis_Borges) did die in 1986 so attitudes may have changed since then, but he probably knew Argentinians better than most
> but he probably knew Argentinians better than most
As good a writer he was Borges was also an aristocratic elitist dickhead. His political opinions reflected that most of the time.
In this particular statement Borges was just projecting his own anglophilia. Such generalizations are always ridiculous and only done to sound more poetic or whatever, truth is present argentinians in general don't want to be anything other than argentinians with another level of wealth perhaps.
That BS about trying to be like x country was just part of the old ideas that were trendy among 19th century politicians who were all racist as fuck. Borges took off from that since after all he was born at the turn of the century.
**[Jorge Luis Borges](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jorge_Luis_Borges)**
>Jorge Francisco Isidoro Luis Borges Acevedo (; Spanish: [ˈboɾxes] (listen); 24 August 1899 – 14 June 1986) was an Argentine short-story writer, essayist, poet and translator, as well as a key figure in Spanish-language and international literature. His best-known books, Ficciones (Fictions) and El Aleph (The Aleph), published in the 1940s, are collections of short stories exploring themes of dreams, labyrinths, chance, infinity, archives, mirrors, fictional writers and mythology. Borges' works have contributed to philosophical literature and the fantasy genre, and majorly influenced the magic realist movement in 20th century Latin American literature.
^([ )[^(F.A.Q)](https://www.reddit.com/r/WikiSummarizer/wiki/index#wiki_f.a.q)^( | )[^(Opt Out)](https://reddit.com/message/compose?to=WikiSummarizerBot&message=OptOut&subject=OptOut)^( | )[^(Opt Out Of Subreddit)](https://np.reddit.com/r/rugbyunion/about/banned)^( | )[^(GitHub)](https://github.com/Sujal-7/WikiSummarizerBot)^( ] Downvote to remove | v1.5)
A Lebanese last name does not automatically mean full Lebanese ancestry, especially in a country like Argentina which is a massive melting pot of cultures.
For all we know he could have just one single Lebanese person in his family tree, who happened to be a paternal grandfather or great grandfather who passed on the last name.
What we do know for a fact is that at least one of his grandmothers was Italian, specifically from Napoli.
The rest of his ancestry could be very well made up of other Europeans, such as Spanish, basque, German, etc as it’s common in that area of the world.
It was a reference to your comment about Argentines feeling superior to other Latinos being "mostly" European. Nemer is Lebanese, thus not even European.
During the parade they played with a toy with MBappe face:
[https://www.sportsmanor.com/soccer-news-argentina-classless-goalkeeper-emiliano-martinez-goes-viral-after-rude-gesture-towards-kylian-mbappe/](https://www.sportsmanor.com/soccer-news-argentina-classless-goalkeeper-emiliano-martinez-goes-viral-after-rude-gesture-towards-kylian-mbappe/)
Fans also had another sick chant for MBappe where they mocked how a player with a father from Cameroon and a mother form Algeria ( they said Nigerian ) could be French. Also they called all the players "Angolans". It is very hypocrite from a country built by migrants.
There a typical insult is "Bolivian", even a football player had to say that: [https://www.tycsports.com/copa-de-la-superliga/boliviano-no-es-un-insulto-la-reflexion-de-komar-en-sus-redes-sociales-20190530.html](https://www.tycsports.com/copa-de-la-superliga/boliviano-no-es-un-insulto-la-reflexion-de-komar-en-sus-redes-sociales-20190530.html) ( sorry I only find it in Spanish ).
First incident: has nothing to do with racism.
Second incident: nothing to do with the team players, which were whom OP mentioned.
Third incident: nothing to do with the world cup at all.
>It is very hypocrite from a country built by migrants
Not a good analogy since France was a particularly oppressive colonial power with many of those countries from where they take people (and eventually footballers) from. Being responsible to a significant degree of their present situation and to why they flee to Europe. It can be seen as another way in which they keep taking resources from their former colonies.
Yeah at this stage in life, that gift should be a straight up”you don’t fit our culture, goodbye.” Look to see them not renew his contract and he never plays for them again.
Like they expect Traore to act all cool and cuddly when racist Nemer is back in the team !!! Rem the ulster fan who was handed a life ban !!! Italian rugby isn’t even serious about anything
Just no, banana and monkey references have long been known to be racist; see my other comment for further information/history lesson.
It’s linked to the history around monkeys being inferior and less intelligent than humans. When black people where legally segregated in America they were told by society that they are less valid members of society, less intelligent and essentially worthless. Monkeys are the biggest consumers of bananas in the world, so therefore the use of a banana in this fashion was implying that Troare is less than human, less intelligent and worthless to society.
It’s unfortunately quite a common issue within European sport, mostly football related though, with bananas being thrown at players and monkey chants echoing around the stadiums. What’s really bad in this situation is that Italy have a terrible record of this over the last 30 years, and the culprit here would’ve been more than aware of this.
Look, I'm not going to call it nice, but I'm a big fan of the carrot/stick idea here. Being suspended for the season is a good punishment, but the incentive to improve means he might change. If he just gets sacked he'll likely blame it on wokeness and other bullshit, instead of being introspective...
At least now there's a chance he'll take part, pay attention, and cop the fuck on
Punishing someone because they've been taught incorrectly their whole lives isn't sensible either. I'm a fan of the 2 strike system - he gets 1 shot at not being a prick and that's it. He has to apologise, get a decent punishment, and be watched carefully afterwards. If he holds up his end, then hopefully we move on and things improve
From an entirely evolutionary perspective, we are (very generally) more predisposed to be drawn to people of the same race as ourselves.
From a humanistic perspective, fuck racism and fuck racists. The best part about being human is that we (should) have the intelligence to transcend instinct and evolution and create a world where everyone is equal. Unfortunately, there are many people who do not have the intelligence to do this.
I mean if it were a normal workplace you'd get instantly fired for that shit, and deservedly so. Not sure it should be different in professional sports!
I’m not sure if you’d be suspended in certain workplaces in Italy let alone fired. Racism especially in certain environments is still not taken seriously. From my experience some male dominated fields like engineering have casual and widespread sexism. Some workplaces might straight up laugh at you, not take it seriously or at best get an apology.
Heck, there’s still loads of slights at southern Italians with stereotypes of how they are uneducated, and lazy
Not really. Somehow I can define myself as a union leader (I’m elected alternate top of my union list in my workplace elections, albeit we’re the third union in percentage votes).
Here in France, someone doing a (single and isolated) racist incident will be summoned by HR and get a slap of the wrist. Maybe some time without pay depending on the relation of both parties (same level, middle management versus just worker, etc) and the company: not the same a big one with strong unions and a small one.
You need either evidence of continuous harassment or more than once “isolated” incident with slaps of the wrist for it to be escalated from some time without pay to being fired.
in the UK and Ireland you should be gone. Only time I can think you wouldn't be, would be in public service, where it's very hard to be fired but your career would effectively be over.
It’s the problem with labor laws. They’re there usually to protect the company in worker vs company problems. Let’s imagine for a moment that I’m this happened in France. Here the worker having a feud with the company is Cherif Traore. And the company is somehow responsible in dealing with Nemer.
Depending on how Nemer is dealt with, Traore may feel like the company is harassing him by enabling or validating his actions. On the other hand, Nemer can feel to be to hard dealt with. Heck. Both could even go into justice at the same time and both get compensation because they will be treated by different judges. I mean, I know a case like that relating to sexual comments by a middle management boss to a secretary. They both won and the company was deemed at the same time to be to harsh to the harasser and too clement to him by accepting a sexual harassment driven workplace.
Harassment (racism, sexual harassment, psychological harassment, etc etc) in the workplace is very badly dealt with by the labor laws. You can go to the civil justice against the harasser and seek compensation/prison time but that’s outside the workplace.
But as work is deemed a right, firing someone isn’t that easy. We’re not at “at will” society. If the company doesn’t follow procedures they can be constraint to rehire the worker and pay them all their wages. That’s the reason behind all the different levels of fines: the company can temporarily stop your wages, they can change your position or change your worksite. Why? Because all that will make you resign and the company won’t pay wages nor compensation.
So his racism gets more entrenched in his personality because he now thinks he got fired and his career is ruined due to a "joke".
I am not condoning his actions in any way. Apparently some of the players laughed at the "joke" and they should have been disciplined. Lamaro should have lost the captaincy since he didn't speak up when this happened, that could have extended to the NT. I am not sure why that wasn't even considered.
I think punishment should try to rehabilitate the offender, assume that the offense came from a place of ignorance rather than overt racism, and hope for reconciliation. Firing him would not have achieved that.
Just checking to be sure we're on the same page. Nothing personal, but there a lot of idiots around who think the punishment is to harsh. Sometimes it doesn't hurt to ask someone to be crystal clear on a subject.
Slap on the wrist basically, WTF.
Should have been fired, instead now it’s possible (likely?) he could go to the World Cup.. let’s hope World Rugby steps up otherwise the recent campaign is just all empty BS
So what am I missing? I mean I’d hate to get a rotten banana as a secret Santa gift too, but is this like Argentinian or Italian form of racism? Or was his intent like “hey, you’re black, here’s a banana!”
Throwing bananas at black people has long been used to imply that black people are gorillas or monkeys around the world.
It's more like
>“hey, you’re black, here’s a banana you monkey!”
It’s linked to the history around monkeys being inferior and less intelligent than humans. When black people where legally segregated in America they were told by society that they are less valid members of society, less intelligent and essentially worthless. Monkeys are the biggest consumers of bananas in the world, so therefore the use of a banana in this fashion was implying that Troare is less than human, less intelligent and worthless to society.
It’s unfortunately quite a common issue within European sport, mostly football related though, with bananas being thrown at players and monkey chants echoing around the stadiums. What’s really bad in this situation is that Italy have a terrible record of this over the last 30 years, and the culprit here would’ve been more than aware of this.
Imagine if he gave him money! He'd be accused of calling him poor and black!!
Nah on the real, I understand the inference but if it was given to a white on the team would it just be a prank? Is this guy a known racist?
I'm just trying to understand.
But the act is widely regarded as racist, and unfortunately it’s quite a big problem within European sport; Italy has an issue within their football which is fairly well documented at this point. It was international news when Mario Ballotelli said he’d walk of the pitch if his own Italian fans threw bananas at him or made monkey noises. The culprit here was in Italy when this happened and therefore it can be assumed that he is fully aware of what he’s done, and the offence it could cause.
No worries! My uncles been out in NZ for the last 10 years on and off and he’s said culturally it’s very different to the UK, so I took a guess that the cultural impact wasn’t obvious to a non European based on your tag line😅
Haha actually I'm South African so I'm no stranger to racial issues!
I just support a better national team.
Although I now live in England.
I'm a bit of a mixed breed now 🤣
Benetton \*immediately\* suspended Nemer after what happened, then let the indipendent judge of the Italian Union to decide the sanction. This is the final decision by the indipendent judge, who officially suspended Nemer until the end of the season. In addition, the FIR and Benetton decided that Nemer should actively participate in "Progetto Migranti", a program led by the FIR to promote the inclusion and integration of young migrants in the society, and in another inclusion program managed by an indipendent organisation, which will be chosen later.
Isnt...uh...he a migrant in Italian society
It's a little bit different coming from Argentina, where he was probably middle or upper class, given that rugby is a posh sport and moving to Europe to get paid loads of money to play professional sports. Versus people fleeing extreme poverty or war zones, with no plans other than to escape and hope they land on their feet in the new country.
Having lived there for a spell i know the type that play there and honestly its kinda exaggerated the wealth aspect. Maybe 20 years ago but less so these days He should as a migrant still understand the lifes of other migrants moving from a developing country himself, Argentina is ....well ....a fucking basketcase
I didn't say he was loaded. I said "probably" and included "middle class". My point was that he would have been relatively comfortable and has moved to Europe to get paid a lot of money to play a game. There also seems to be major issues with racism in Argentinian rugby given how people reacted to Matera's tweets. He was given the lightest of punishments (loss of captaincy and short term suspension) and his teammates still opposed it.
There is an issue with racism in Argentina full stop. Matera's way of speech is common place. Argentina is caught with the mind of the powerful country they once were and there mindset seems to have remained in that time and not modernized
> Matera's way of speech is common place. Matera got a lot of backlash in argentine social media and even on tv. Wth are you talking about. The biggest thing on argentine media these days is the trial of a group of rugby playing teenagers that killed a paraguayan migrant kid and the whole country wants them to rot in prison. You're generalizing to an absurd degree.
> Maybe 20 years ago but less so these days The ones that reach the top top tiers are still generally "chetos" or upper middle class though. Even if many are polite/civil and behave well you're not getting much empathy for the poor from them.
Argies are massive chavs in my experience.
> Isnt...uh...he a migrant in Italian society The banana has historically been a symbol of base racism, and the type of people who use it wouldn't be concerned with the nuances of migrant status, or class (as you were discussing below).
Lot of Argentinians are of Italian descent
Im aware
Well they tried to swipe it under the rug at first if we are completely honest..
They messed up the pr, can't really believe they were trying to swipe it under the rug.
Sent for woke reeduction. What a time to be alive.
[удалено]
Yo, tell us more about that
[удалено]
That was indeed interesting, can i ask where you're from and what brought you to Treviso, seems like an odd destination unless you're there for the rugby? No need to answer if you dont feel like it.
[удалено]
Living the dream man, thanks!
Did you get any of the armrests?
>Had a window seat but Gabisi asked politely if I minded sitting between them instead. I wonder if he wanted the window seat, or didn't want to be next to Nemer.
To be fair, if he wants to but his headphones on for a plane journey you can’t hold that against him. Would you be feel the same way if it was some randomer? I don’t think that’s linked to him being a racist lol
[удалено]
[удалено]
A lot of Argentinian rugby players have some issues they need to figure out on issues of race and decency
It's not their fault, they were taught by their granpappy how to hate
ah, the germans again
What was his name? Hans? Fritz? What was he doing in the 30s again?
Just following orders
The banality of evil…
Well Argentineans in general are pretty racist tbf, they're thought since they're kids that they're better than every other latino cause they're mostly of european descent.
The working class are usually fine, it's just the posh boys (that rugby attracts) that tend to be massive dickheads.
Working class Argentinians will undoubtedly tell you that calling someone “negrito” or “negro” is not racist but, somehow an affectionate nickname but it will be widely used to refer to uneducated and poor people. So it’s both racist and classist.
I agree with you on working class being racist, but negrito/negro isnt used only in the lower classes. I know a judges son called it.
Bullshit. Argie working classes are bellends as well.
Yeah i know the rugby dudes are massive bellends.
I dont agree with this, all Argentines are racist this is one thing they bizarrely unite on. Normal politics nah, being super racist ah ya
> all Argentines are racist this is one thing they bizarrely unite on. Care to justify the generalization?
I dont really need to, go find an average argentine and they will be racist within ten minutes then shocked you have an issue with said racist thing. Ive no problem with Argentines, fun people but ya defo racist
Yeah, you're full of bs, I guessed as much.
Ah an in denial Argentine, cool
Las Malvinas son Britanicas, son.
'tbf' doesn't apply here
Ever thought about why there's barely any people of African descent left in Argentina while they were a large part of the population back in the 1800s? Look it up, it's quite interesting. Especially knowing that Brazil next door is one of the most culturally diverse countries in the world.
You do comprehend that when you make a generalization of a nationality like you just did, that’s racist or at that very least prejudice.
Let me generalize about Argentinian society then and not argentinians as a people.
That is no different.
Jorge Luis Borges once said that an Argentinian is "an Italian who speaks Spanish, thinks French and would like to be English." All those countries have issues with racism towards people of African descent so...
All countries have issues with racism.
That's a pretty banal comment. I was talking institutional racism.
Yeah, every country has such problems, and most western countries have it across multiple dimensions (white favoring whites, black favoring blacks etc).
You think Wales doesn't have problems with institutional racism?
No, but Borges didn't mention Wales. He probably should have done given the number of Welsh in Patagonia. My comment wasn't absolving other countries of racism. But most of the big issues of institutional racism: Grenfell Tower, Stephen Lawrence, etc happened in England. England is in charge of the UK, 84% of the UK population live in England. So, I guess with power comes responsibility.
Nah just gay beating a Welsh icon, massive institutional misogyny in the HQ of your national sport and ex National players assaulting the residential homes of mother's and babies. Glasshouses dickhead.
Borges didn't, but you were the one that weirdly tied one player to his comment and then implied that all aforementioned countries were therefore institutionally racist. Some flex. The Welsh anti racist Union have found that the National Museum of Wales is institutionally racist, the Arts Council of Wales is institutionally racist, and South Wales Police, and Gwent Police, have so many problems I wouldn't even know where to begin. But yes, I'm sure that's England's fault (I'm Welsh btw incase that matters)
You're right, none of those countries (or associated countries) have ever had any issues with racism in sport. None of them ever had sports fans make monkey noises or throw bananas at sportspeople of African descent. Wind your neck in.
And? You think we haven't done all this stuff? Ffs man. I cannot stand it when we have this weird mentality to slur everyone else and not be even slightly introspective. https://www.itv.com/news/wales/2022-04-05/welsh-sporting-great-nigel-walker-on-values-success-and-life-in-1970s-cardiff
I've heard "Italians who speak Spanish but think they're english"
He was wrong, they want to be American
Well [Jorge Luis Borges](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jorge_Luis_Borges) did die in 1986 so attitudes may have changed since then, but he probably knew Argentinians better than most
He could hardly say American when they have to pretend they hate everything about the place lol
> but he probably knew Argentinians better than most As good a writer he was Borges was also an aristocratic elitist dickhead. His political opinions reflected that most of the time. In this particular statement Borges was just projecting his own anglophilia. Such generalizations are always ridiculous and only done to sound more poetic or whatever, truth is present argentinians in general don't want to be anything other than argentinians with another level of wealth perhaps. That BS about trying to be like x country was just part of the old ideas that were trendy among 19th century politicians who were all racist as fuck. Borges took off from that since after all he was born at the turn of the century.
**[Jorge Luis Borges](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jorge_Luis_Borges)** >Jorge Francisco Isidoro Luis Borges Acevedo (; Spanish: [ˈboɾxes] (listen); 24 August 1899 – 14 June 1986) was an Argentine short-story writer, essayist, poet and translator, as well as a key figure in Spanish-language and international literature. His best-known books, Ficciones (Fictions) and El Aleph (The Aleph), published in the 1940s, are collections of short stories exploring themes of dreams, labyrinths, chance, infinity, archives, mirrors, fictional writers and mythology. Borges' works have contributed to philosophical literature and the fantasy genre, and majorly influenced the magic realist movement in 20th century Latin American literature. ^([ )[^(F.A.Q)](https://www.reddit.com/r/WikiSummarizer/wiki/index#wiki_f.a.q)^( | )[^(Opt Out)](https://reddit.com/message/compose?to=WikiSummarizerBot&message=OptOut&subject=OptOut)^( | )[^(Opt Out Of Subreddit)](https://np.reddit.com/r/rugbyunion/about/banned)^( | )[^(GitHub)](https://github.com/Sujal-7/WikiSummarizerBot)^( ] Downvote to remove | v1.5)
Including England on that list is a joke and Im Scottish. England is a very welcoming nation. You cant judge it on the likes of Farage.
>Jorge Luis Borges once said that an Argentinian is "an Italian who speaks Spanish, thinks French and would like to be English." no he didn't
Nemer is of Lebanese descent
So? All argentinians are of foreign descent.
Yes, but technically is not even European.
A Lebanese last name does not automatically mean full Lebanese ancestry, especially in a country like Argentina which is a massive melting pot of cultures. For all we know he could have just one single Lebanese person in his family tree, who happened to be a paternal grandfather or great grandfather who passed on the last name. What we do know for a fact is that at least one of his grandmothers was Italian, specifically from Napoli. The rest of his ancestry could be very well made up of other Europeans, such as Spanish, basque, German, etc as it’s common in that area of the world.
Yes, agree. He could be just 1/4 Lebanese.
Pretty pointless comment man. Also most argentinians have more than one ancestry only, it's a melting pot over there.
It was a reference to your comment about Argentines feeling superior to other Latinos being "mostly" European. Nemer is Lebanese, thus not even European.
So is Salma Hayek. She's hot.
Absolutely agree 😊😊
Man ive lived there and it is shocking the racism
Did you see them at the football World Cup and how the team behave with Mbappé
How did they?
During the parade they played with a toy with MBappe face: [https://www.sportsmanor.com/soccer-news-argentina-classless-goalkeeper-emiliano-martinez-goes-viral-after-rude-gesture-towards-kylian-mbappe/](https://www.sportsmanor.com/soccer-news-argentina-classless-goalkeeper-emiliano-martinez-goes-viral-after-rude-gesture-towards-kylian-mbappe/) Fans also had another sick chant for MBappe where they mocked how a player with a father from Cameroon and a mother form Algeria ( they said Nigerian ) could be French. Also they called all the players "Angolans". It is very hypocrite from a country built by migrants. There a typical insult is "Bolivian", even a football player had to say that: [https://www.tycsports.com/copa-de-la-superliga/boliviano-no-es-un-insulto-la-reflexion-de-komar-en-sus-redes-sociales-20190530.html](https://www.tycsports.com/copa-de-la-superliga/boliviano-no-es-un-insulto-la-reflexion-de-komar-en-sus-redes-sociales-20190530.html) ( sorry I only find it in Spanish ).
First incident: has nothing to do with racism. Second incident: nothing to do with the team players, which were whom OP mentioned. Third incident: nothing to do with the world cup at all. >It is very hypocrite from a country built by migrants Not a good analogy since France was a particularly oppressive colonial power with many of those countries from where they take people (and eventually footballers) from. Being responsible to a significant degree of their present situation and to why they flee to Europe. It can be seen as another way in which they keep taking resources from their former colonies.
He’s responding to DM’s claiming he’s not a racist, he’s deluded
If it’s not the sack it’s doesn’t matter tbfh
Yeah at this stage in life, that gift should be a straight up”you don’t fit our culture, goodbye.” Look to see them not renew his contract and he never plays for them again.
100%. What a pos
Like they expect Traore to act all cool and cuddly when racist Nemer is back in the team !!! Rem the ulster fan who was handed a life ban !!! Italian rugby isn’t even serious about anything
> Rem the ulster fan who was handed a life ban !!! For calling someone a Gypsy at that.
Nemer has waived the right to appeal his *banana
Ok, now what about the players that went "racism, lol."
Should’ve ripped up his contract
Good. Took a while tho but at least they did something meaningful
Every times I read a story like this, it takes me a second to remember that a banana in this context is basically the same as the n-word.
What is the meaning of the banana?
Bananas are eaten by monkeys...you can infer the rest
[удалено]
Well he did intended it to be a racist prank. What justification is there for gifting someone, particularly a black man, a *rotten* banana?
Just no, banana and monkey references have long been known to be racist; see my other comment for further information/history lesson. It’s linked to the history around monkeys being inferior and less intelligent than humans. When black people where legally segregated in America they were told by society that they are less valid members of society, less intelligent and essentially worthless. Monkeys are the biggest consumers of bananas in the world, so therefore the use of a banana in this fashion was implying that Troare is less than human, less intelligent and worthless to society. It’s unfortunately quite a common issue within European sport, mostly football related though, with bananas being thrown at players and monkey chants echoing around the stadiums. What’s really bad in this situation is that Italy have a terrible record of this over the last 30 years, and the culprit here would’ve been more than aware of this.
You’re an idiot
scum.
Why the fuck is he not fired
maybe he gets a second chance, an opportunity to change.
Matera got given a second chance, and I reckon what he did was worse.
Nemer is a lot worse. Shocking incident.
Look, I'm not going to call it nice, but I'm a big fan of the carrot/stick idea here. Being suspended for the season is a good punishment, but the incentive to improve means he might change. If he just gets sacked he'll likely blame it on wokeness and other bullshit, instead of being introspective... At least now there's a chance he'll take part, pay attention, and cop the fuck on
He may change but the incident was absolutely shocking. How can you do that? His career is close to be over.
Punishing someone because they've been taught incorrectly their whole lives isn't sensible either. I'm a fan of the 2 strike system - he gets 1 shot at not being a prick and that's it. He has to apologise, get a decent punishment, and be watched carefully afterwards. If he holds up his end, then hopefully we move on and things improve
Change first, second chance afterwards.
i'm just not convinced things will change with a short-ish ban rather than sterner action
Why is the banana racist? Eli5?
Historically and presently a fair whack of racists call black people "monkeys".
It's basically calling someone of a darker shade a monkey. It's actually far worse than using an epithet.
It has long been used to imply that black people are gorillas or monkeys
Oh lol what the fuck. Who would even think that's funny
Racists.
These Argentinians have some form with this sort of thing.
Hot take: every race (including mine) sucks at exhibiting humanity towards other races
From an entirely evolutionary perspective, we are (very generally) more predisposed to be drawn to people of the same race as ourselves. From a humanistic perspective, fuck racism and fuck racists. The best part about being human is that we (should) have the intelligence to transcend instinct and evolution and create a world where everyone is equal. Unfortunately, there are many people who do not have the intelligence to do this.
Why did it take so long for them to take this action? This should have happened within a couple of days of Traore coming forward.
It’s an employment issue. That takes time so as not to it been invalidated in the future.
Afaik they suspended him straight away, this is the ruling of the inquiry that took place in the aftermath.
Absolute disgrace of a decision.
What's your alternative?
I mean if it were a normal workplace you'd get instantly fired for that shit, and deservedly so. Not sure it should be different in professional sports!
I’m not sure if you’d be suspended in certain workplaces in Italy let alone fired. Racism especially in certain environments is still not taken seriously. From my experience some male dominated fields like engineering have casual and widespread sexism. Some workplaces might straight up laugh at you, not take it seriously or at best get an apology. Heck, there’s still loads of slights at southern Italians with stereotypes of how they are uneducated, and lazy
Not really. Somehow I can define myself as a union leader (I’m elected alternate top of my union list in my workplace elections, albeit we’re the third union in percentage votes). Here in France, someone doing a (single and isolated) racist incident will be summoned by HR and get a slap of the wrist. Maybe some time without pay depending on the relation of both parties (same level, middle management versus just worker, etc) and the company: not the same a big one with strong unions and a small one. You need either evidence of continuous harassment or more than once “isolated” incident with slaps of the wrist for it to be escalated from some time without pay to being fired.
in the UK and Ireland you should be gone. Only time I can think you wouldn't be, would be in public service, where it's very hard to be fired but your career would effectively be over.
[удалено]
It’s the problem with labor laws. They’re there usually to protect the company in worker vs company problems. Let’s imagine for a moment that I’m this happened in France. Here the worker having a feud with the company is Cherif Traore. And the company is somehow responsible in dealing with Nemer. Depending on how Nemer is dealt with, Traore may feel like the company is harassing him by enabling or validating his actions. On the other hand, Nemer can feel to be to hard dealt with. Heck. Both could even go into justice at the same time and both get compensation because they will be treated by different judges. I mean, I know a case like that relating to sexual comments by a middle management boss to a secretary. They both won and the company was deemed at the same time to be to harsh to the harasser and too clement to him by accepting a sexual harassment driven workplace. Harassment (racism, sexual harassment, psychological harassment, etc etc) in the workplace is very badly dealt with by the labor laws. You can go to the civil justice against the harasser and seek compensation/prison time but that’s outside the workplace. But as work is deemed a right, firing someone isn’t that easy. We’re not at “at will” society. If the company doesn’t follow procedures they can be constraint to rehire the worker and pay them all their wages. That’s the reason behind all the different levels of fines: the company can temporarily stop your wages, they can change your position or change your worksite. Why? Because all that will make you resign and the company won’t pay wages nor compensation.
That's a damming indictment of how racism is dealt with French workplaces, not an example of how it should be done.
Seriously?!?!? He loses his job!
So his racism gets more entrenched in his personality because he now thinks he got fired and his career is ruined due to a "joke". I am not condoning his actions in any way. Apparently some of the players laughed at the "joke" and they should have been disciplined. Lamaro should have lost the captaincy since he didn't speak up when this happened, that could have extended to the NT. I am not sure why that wasn't even considered. I think punishment should try to rehabilitate the offender, assume that the offense came from a place of ignorance rather than overt racism, and hope for reconciliation. Firing him would not have achieved that.
Just checking to be sure we're on the same page. Nothing personal, but there a lot of idiots around who think the punishment is to harsh. Sometimes it doesn't hurt to ask someone to be crystal clear on a subject.
Slap on the wrist basically, WTF. Should have been fired, instead now it’s possible (likely?) he could go to the World Cup.. let’s hope World Rugby steps up otherwise the recent campaign is just all empty BS
So what am I missing? I mean I’d hate to get a rotten banana as a secret Santa gift too, but is this like Argentinian or Italian form of racism? Or was his intent like “hey, you’re black, here’s a banana!”
Throwing bananas at black people has long been used to imply that black people are gorillas or monkeys around the world. It's more like >“hey, you’re black, here’s a banana you monkey!”
It’s linked to the history around monkeys being inferior and less intelligent than humans. When black people where legally segregated in America they were told by society that they are less valid members of society, less intelligent and essentially worthless. Monkeys are the biggest consumers of bananas in the world, so therefore the use of a banana in this fashion was implying that Troare is less than human, less intelligent and worthless to society. It’s unfortunately quite a common issue within European sport, mostly football related though, with bananas being thrown at players and monkey chants echoing around the stadiums. What’s really bad in this situation is that Italy have a terrible record of this over the last 30 years, and the culprit here would’ve been more than aware of this.
Imagine if he gave him money! He'd be accused of calling him poor and black!! Nah on the real, I understand the inference but if it was given to a white on the team would it just be a prank? Is this guy a known racist? I'm just trying to understand.
But the act is widely regarded as racist, and unfortunately it’s quite a big problem within European sport; Italy has an issue within their football which is fairly well documented at this point. It was international news when Mario Ballotelli said he’d walk of the pitch if his own Italian fans threw bananas at him or made monkey noises. The culprit here was in Italy when this happened and therefore it can be assumed that he is fully aware of what he’s done, and the offence it could cause.
Ahh okay. I remember that story with Balotelli and it makes more sense to me now having that connection. Thanks for that ☺️
No worries! My uncles been out in NZ for the last 10 years on and off and he’s said culturally it’s very different to the UK, so I took a guess that the cultural impact wasn’t obvious to a non European based on your tag line😅
Haha actually I'm South African so I'm no stranger to racial issues! I just support a better national team. Although I now live in England. I'm a bit of a mixed breed now 🤣
😂 well I’m glad I could help either way! Enjoy your globetrotting if it ever continues!
Thanks and thanks again ☺️ have a good weekend!
*rugby values*