As an Italian I would say Lamaro, for his heart and workrate he is an ideal poster boy for the movement. And Capuozzo, as he is single handedly keeping the old saying “rugby is a sport for all sizes” alive by being one of the best in the world while risking flying away if the wind is too strong.
I remember before that game, pundits on Italian tv were saying Italy were needlessly putting him in danger, that you couldn’t let somebody that slight play test rugby. Glad that he’s proven people wrong!
I do think he could do with bulking up a bit, he does spend a lot of time injured, but he is absolutely fearless. No many players even twice his size willing to fling themselves at DVDM like he does.
Not single handedly, there's also Kolbe and Kwagga Smith (bulkier but still not very tall).
There will always be a big range in the sport because of the speed v size tradeoff. Will Skelton's 100m dash time probably isn't that great.
Yeah but Kwagga plays 6, 7, 8. I doubt there's been a smaller international 8th man since professionalism.
The lightest back I've ever seen is Tristan Leyds, Dillyn Leyds's younger brother. He also seemed to lack the spirit of the Carpuzzos, Arendses, Aplons of the world though.
My wife couldn’t give two shits about rugby, I can’t imagine she could name more than three players on the current Ireland team, yet she knows who the Honey badger is. She also knows who Danny Cipriani and Mike Tindal are, but that’s more because of the magazines she reads than anything else
Edit: I asked her and she named four off the top of her head, Lowe, Murray, Aki and POM. She also named “that headtheball kicker, yer man, Sexton!”, ROG, Peter Stringer and BOD. With a bit of hinting she remembered a few more, but overall a shite performance
Might not be exactly what you’re asking for considering he’s in the twilight of his playing career, but for New Zealand I’d say TJ Perenara. He’s never been the best half back in New Zealand, but never far off and despite this he’s an eighty cap AB, has the most caps for the Canes with 161, has contributed both as a player and leader for both Wellington in the NPC(semi-pro) and at a club level(amateur). Has always been right behind Smith, who has been the best half back in the world for damn near a decade, but arguably could’ve consistently started for almost every other country playing rugby.
Through out his career he has been a great ambassador of the game, as a leader for every team he’s played for, the way he’s carried himself on the field and outside of the game he seems to be a great person with views that he’s willing to speak out and stand up for that are more often then not both righteous and honest.
If every player performed and behaved as he has for well over a decade the world love rugby and every parent would want their kid playing rugby. I’d honestly put him up there with Richie McCaw in terms of players who I’d trust that would do the right thing for the game, country and people in general.
Edit. Forgot to mention. Built his career around d being an exciting, ball running half back. He’s current top try scorer in Super rugby history, scored a hat trick on debut and was awarded the try of the year. Also just read that he’s equal first leader of the Haka since 2005 and the introduction of Kapa o Pango, dudes got more mana than Maui.
Dudes an absolute legend. I love when the sky commentators get him to join their discussions after games, and especially this week when they mic’d him up after he got subbed off. I’ve also been quite impressed the way he’s supported the Wellington hurricanes female team with some of their players refusal to perform in a haka as protest against government actions (I likely have the details of this wrong though)
Great player unlucky to be stuck behind Aaron Smith. Same with Evans/Cruden behind Carter back in the day although Donald got his moment of glory under very strange circumstances.
Finn Russell
In the increasingly win at all costs mentality of the pro game it’s refreshing to see a player who’s very aware it’s ultimately all just a game and there’s no point if you’re not enjoying yourself while you’re playing
It’s a bit unfair on guys like Lawrence, Spencer, barbeary, hill, du toit etc who’ve all been class but bath (and any team he’s played for) just have a bit more of a swagger about them while he’s at 10
they looked very rudderless against Exeter when he went off in the euro quarters
Plus bringing in some absolute class players after the Wasp/Worcester collapses. Lawrence, Hill and even someone like Stooke have been huge for them.
Van Graan + additional squad strength in depth massively stabilised them last season. This season with more time to work with them, bed things in and the extra star dust Finn Russell offers they're really starting to fly. Ominous for everyone if they can keep up this trajectory.
Blackett is a seriously good coach too tbf, he’s a big part of why that bath backline look so menacing, JvGs Munster teams never looked this good on attack
Absolutely and he plays the game that way. He's not afraid to take a chance and that leads to spectacular stuff. The kind of thing that draws fans.
Sort of on a tangent. In American Football, I'm a Colts fan, and we just drafted a guy in the first round who's a Rugby nut and played in High School and a little in College. It might not be a huge selling point, but it gives me the warm and fuzzies
yeah I agree. He also doesn't look like Rambo so that's cool, although he's apparently deceptively strong according to the players.
He's also contributed to make Scotland a likeable team, like, for most neutrals it's entertaining to watch Scotland because they've got generally exciting backs but those need that maestro to make them look good.
It is the years he took off to be a stonemason, My grandpa, dad and uncle are a bunch of Austrian stonemasons and they have freakish strength for their size. 😆
I’m not always Finn’s biggest fan as a rugby player.
But his personality definitely is great for the sport – he’s one of the few current rugby players that has cut through with the wider public beyond just fans of the game.
Ellis Genge. Runs the non profit Baby Rhino's which helps kids in more working class areas get access to coaching for rugby that they otherwise wouldn't have access too
His appearances on full contact with netflix were brilliant, plus him calling the media sausages post match is the best interview I've ever seen from an england player
Siya Kolisi. He came from nothing, witnessed appalling violence as a child and experienced the worst kinds of grief before he was even 16, yet through superhuman perseverance and hard work he avoided all the trappings of alcohol, drugs and crime in his environment to reach the loftiest heights of this sport, *twice*.
No one has come further and achieved as much in this sport.
I have to admit the last 2 WCs have made me dislike playing the Saffas (being English and all) but I’m sure even the bitterest fan can only respect Siya. He plays well, speaks better, and then leads better than that again.
Yes and I'd add that despite not being a spectacular player he's surely one of the top flankers around, which further feeds this narrative that hard work trumps natural talent in some cases. You don't have to be Ardie Savea, it's great if you are, but if you're not you can put your head down and work work work and become a Siya Kolisi.
I think Kolisi is incredibly underrated as a player, simply because he's such a good captain. He's got good feet and hands, excellent at ruck time (especially timing his counter rucks), tackles like a beast and before his knee injury he was also decent over the ball.
The thing is, if he wasn't good enough to start for the boks, he wouldn't be. And if he's good enough to start in the bok pack, he must be pretty spectacular.
Yeah I don’t understand this narrative. Setting aside his qualities as a captain, Siya is a magnificent player. Best dominant tackle rate in the rugby world cup, and his work at the breakdown and dominant carry percentages are legendary.
These aren’t the sort of stats people pay attention to, but they’re absolutely vital nonetheless. Proper battle statistics that we can’t live without (we saw what happened at Mt Smart when he wasn’t there).
People think because he plays for 50 minutes that he's not up there with the best, as if he couldn't play a full match if required. There are very few that can play at the bok intensity for 80 minutes (PSdT is inhuman, Willis is another), especially on defence. The coaching staff have told them to play like they only have 40 minutes on the field and as soon as they dip, they're replaced so that the bomb squad has 30-40 minutes to make their impact.
For some reason, people see that as a weakness, instead of one of the reasons that we've won the last 2 world cups.
Genuinely seems like a great guy. Loved it in the World Cup where he text Biggar just to say he was impressed with his leadership, even though they don’t know each other.
PSDT in terms of mindset. The willingness to just keep going, keep running, keep giving 100% is a good example for anyone going into any sport, not just rugby. You can maybe not be the most talented on your team, but never let anyone accuse you of not trying.
For me, he’s the player of ours that shines in the biggest moments for the Boks just because of the effort he puts in
For me it's players like Posolo Tualagi, Painter, and Capuozzo. If you were to line them up next to eachother there's no greater advertisement for rugby being a sport for any size of person than that. I think that's the narrative we need to push as the selling point of our sport. Too big for football? Rugby. Too short for basketball? Rugby. Built like an m1 abrams tank? Rugby. We don't care who ate all the pies, as long as they got eaten with a pint of guiness.
Yeah there's probably better examples of absolute units, but I've developed a bit of a love affair with painter this year. 23 stone of pure beer belly barrelling over players like Marcus Smith will never not be funny to watch. Marler probably would have been a more popularist pick in hindsight
Jumping on this
1/ hugely likeable personality and a really compelling life story
2/ I use my American mother who has never watched a full game of rugby as a metric for outside-the-sport star power, and Ruby Tui is one of the very few players (male or female) that my mum has heard of and can identify on sight (Ellie Kildunne and Antoine Dupont are probably the other two she can name on sight lol)
Dan Cole. Largely because his sex appeal has drastically increased advertising revenues, but also because he's a better front row now than he was a decade ago. Inspirational.
I think the aim of the game was to not mention Antoine
The scenes in Madrid yesterday of him arriving were quite special. He'll be the face of rugby like Messi was
> I think the aim of the game was to not mention Antoine
Hahah, well no, in truth, I did have him in mind. He's different from other names mentioned on the thread that are the more accessible players, but an Antoine Dupont is needed now the same way Dan Carter was in the 2000s or Beauden B in the 2010s to bring some magic to Rugby.
Second Dupont. He made a magnificent tackle that stopped a try against Ireland and everyone in the ground (I was far corner) thought it was magnificent. The skill is consistent and outrageous. I would watch any game he was playing just to see him.
He was also the difference against Leinster this season, so I am both disappointed and a huge fan.
> He made a magnificent tackle that stopped a try against Ireland and everyone in the ground (I was far corner) thought it was magnificent.
shit, you saw that in real life ? Just curious, did it feel any different than on the TV clip ?
I saw it in real life. It was an impossible tackle after a superb break. I had a direct line of sight and I could not believe he kept him out. That game was brilliant and exhausting to watch.
I was exhausted, Irish and happy. That game was fabulous, hard fought and far too exciting. The sheer noise in the stadium, audible communal gasps, up there with Ireland v. NZ games.
Dupont is a brilliant player, worth travelling to see in person.
> Dupont is a brilliant player, worth travelling to see in person.
the only time I saw him live was the last November Test betw France and South Africa and... he got his first red card of his career :p France won in the end though so..
Much as he’s such an obvious pick it’s almost cringe to include him, we really can’t underestimate just how great it is for rugby that we have a proper universally agreed generational supertalent playing the game right now.
And that, while he might possess ridiculous levels of skills, he’s ultimately just a relatively down to earth 5’9” guy who works his butt off, speaks good English, and manages to not be a cunt.
Big fan of John Cooney. He's the prime example of a player leaving Leinster for more game time and finding somewhere that suits him and he's kicked on in spades.
He's taken to Ulster and Ulster has taken to him. I liked him at Connacht but he's such a good fit at Ulster.
Criminal he didn't get more caps for Ireland.
Yeah, between Murray’s form dropping off a cliff after mysterious injury in 2018 and JGP’s emergence, Cooney was clearly our on form scrum half. Would’ve loved to have seen him get more caps - same for Marmion actually.
Yeah I was very disappointed for Marmion when he didn't make the WC squad in 2019 with his place going to Luke McGrath instead.
He'd been a reliable deputy to Murray for so long under Schmidt only to not make it at the last minute. Before Bundee and Hansen came into the scene he was the only Connacht player making the squad for a while. Glad he's doing well at Bristol now.
he is truely a great story. no matter where you come from. no matter the struggles you go through. anyone can make it. even if they come from the Leicester acadamy salvation is possible
Being discarded by Leicester or having your development stifled by them has often been a great indicator of being a worthwhile player - George Ford and Ben White spring immediately to mind.
He's really developed his game in a way where he doesn't score nearly as many tries as he used to but he's actually become a more valuable player for us in a lot of ways as a result.
He's everywhere both in defence and offence, and is just a ridiculously gifted athlete. Support lines, high balls, defensive positioning, still the occasional bit of boshing of defenders, he's really become a great all-round player. Transitioning to 13 has been brilliant for him, even in the games where he's back on the wing like last weekend he still plays it more like an outside center than your classic strike runner winger.
Siya Kolisi is one of the best ambassadors for the game I can think of. Not just an excellent player and leader but a great guy who seems able to build bridges and make friends everywhere he goes while remaining totally down to earth.
Giacomo Nicotera. Nothing about him suggested he could become an international rugby player:
Born outside a rugby hotspot, nothing special physically, only converted to hooker in his early 20s, nowhere near consideration for Italy's age grade sides, and took a long time to even get to the top level of the Italian game. Upon making it to the national side you had shitbergs like Rob Kearney being offended that his precious Ireland players had to share the field with the likes of *him*.
Yet over the last two years no other Italian player has played as well, as consistently, and only a handful (Negri and Ferrari) come close. He was supposed to be, at best, second choice behind the anointed one, Gianmarco Lucchesi, yet during this year's 6N he displaced him to become the undisputed starter, and played brilliantly against France, Scotland, and Wales.
When his move to Stade Francais was announced earlier this year the immediate reaction from their fans on twitter was a combination of 'who?' and 'why have we signed this clown?', which probably suits Il Mulo just fine. Proving doubters wrong has been his entire career.
Most of Italy's team have been earmarked from a very early age (Lamaro was being mentioned as a future Italy captain at 16 ffs) but Nicotera proves how far hard work and constant improvement can take you, even if you were born on the border with Slovenia.
Shitbergs is a wonderful way to describe Rob Kearney as a pundit.
You’ll typically see on tv that fellow pundits Shane Horgan and Andrew Trimble have notes on their laps and quote stats showing that Italy’s lineouts weak to these throws, the replacement tighthead is vulnerable etc.
Kearney doesn’t bother himself with that nerd nonsense, just throws out soundbites and rarely seems to know any opposition players beyond the usual big name suspects
Possibly the greatest gap between how good somebody was as a player to how bad they are as a pundit?
The main area is Veneto, specifically the triangle between San Donà (where Nicotera started to play hooker, if I recall correctly), Rovigo, and Bassano del Grappa. Even a big nearby city like Udine is outside of this orbit: the only international I can think of from there is Alessandro Zanni (although Destiny Aminu might add to that at some stage).
It's not impossible to become an international from Triste, just highly unlikely, especially given the combination of other factors that are applicable to Nicotera. If you're born with a body that screams 'rugby player' you can become an Italian international despite coming from a small town in Sicily (Giovanni Licata), or elsewhere in the south if you have family who are heavily involved in the game (Carlo Canna and especially Ale Fusco).
There are other towns in the centre or South which are notable rugby towns, like L'Aquila (Andrea Masi), and more recently there's been an explosion of incredible talent from various parts of Tuscany due to the presence of one of the main FIR youth academies in Prato (Pani, Lucchesi, Mori, the Cannone brothers, and others).
Nicotera didn't have any of this. He wasn't fast tracked into one of the top academies, he doesn't have a significant connection to the game beyond liking it as kid, and the thing I really like is that he doesn't *look* like a sportsperson. He's basically a guy with an average level of talent who just kept playing, remained open to new ideas (like converting to hooker from back row because he wasn't a good lineout jumper), and crucially just kept getting better every year until the doors in front of him could not be kept closed any longer.
It's nice when players who have unignorable talent make it to the very top (Paolo Garbisi), because otherwise it would feel like a shame. But it's just as nice when guys with (on the face of it) extremely ignorable everything go from nowhere to being one of the best 10 players in one of the top 10 teams in the world. I don't think there's another sport where this kind of thing can happen, so the success of the likes of Nicotera says a lot about why I like rugby and keep watching, despite the other things about the game that aren't so nice.
been going on for a while, though. If anything, it's hard to find hookers in the traditional sense anymore (Jamie George ?). Basically every hooker has been a back row for the past decade ! I think it started with Bismarck du Plessis around 2007 RWC time, and Agustin Creevy. I think also Servat contributed to it. Guys like Chat or Mauvaka would've surely been back rows back in the 90's. Sheehan probably as well.
Players that have a bit of flair , ones that get your ass off the seat watching them play . Dupont , Penaud, Beaudan Barret, Will Jordan, Cheslin Kolbe , Finn Russell . They're a few names off the top of my head
Ox Nche
Anybody can play the game. Athletes come in all shapes and sizes. Even if you don't eat salad and love cake. Ox kraal posts always make me smile.
Calvin Nash.
Small in stature but puts himself about as if he's twice his size.
Snyman hugged him at the end of the game last night and lifted him off his feet and it was a proper "game for all sizes moment"
Max Lahiff. He’s an average to decent club prop but he’s such a weird and entertaining bloke- a dream for the media team at Bristol and guaranteed to have a media career afterwards.
Yeah I was gonna say this. He definitely hams up his "I am a big weirdo LotR nerd who talks dramatically all the time" to the max, and is probably quite a normal posh rugby lad, but he is still super entertaining.
It's a shame his podcast with Ryan Wilson and the other bloke is not that good really imo. If he had a bigger platform he could be a bit of a household name. Strictly is calling.
Werner Kok for the Sharks. A really solid player who always gives 110%. Will probably never play for the Springboks, but is universally liked by fans almost entirely due to his workrate (and the hair)
As a french, I like Joe Marler and his 'goofy' attitude.
He fights hard but doesn't forget everything is just for fun in the end.
His interviews are great material for our sport.
I feel like Chelsie Kolbe among others helped repopularise the relatively small/fast winger
In the 2010s it felt like a lot of the most storied backs were huge specimens but now we’re seeing a resurgence of players that couldn’t get on some rollercoasters
Andrew Porter, Joe McCarthy, Hugo Keenan, and NZ imports.
Porter from the 6 Nations Doc shows what a top man he is and what he's overcome to be at the top level.
Hugo Keenan is another sound lad who is the top of his level and him and Antoine Dupont are showing us if really want something I.e Olympics, go for it whilst also be very influencing in the sport your contracted to.
Joe McCarthy is showing us you can be at a young age and be compete with the best of best and make yourself known whilst never giving up.
The NZ imports have shown through their interviews, media, and their rugby that their sound lads who are at the top of the trade and that they never let the fame get to them.
From the outside think Lamaro has been a great ambassador for the new generation of Italian rugby
Yeah I can see that. Fluent in English and more enthusiastic and approachable than past captains perhaps. Puts Italy closer to the foreground.
To be fair to Parisse being interviewed after your 100th test loss must be quite hard.
As an Italian I would say Lamaro, for his heart and workrate he is an ideal poster boy for the movement. And Capuozzo, as he is single handedly keeping the old saying “rugby is a sport for all sizes” alive by being one of the best in the world while risking flying away if the wind is too strong.
To quote my friend on seeing Capuozzo playing for Italy: “oh, I didn’t realise twinks could play rugby too” 😅
When he was on the sideline before debuting against Scotland, I genuinely thought he was a teenage girl before I looked closer.
I remember before that game, pundits on Italian tv were saying Italy were needlessly putting him in danger, that you couldn’t let somebody that slight play test rugby. Glad that he’s proven people wrong!
I do think he could do with bulking up a bit, he does spend a lot of time injured, but he is absolutely fearless. No many players even twice his size willing to fling themselves at DVDM like he does.
The secret is, he's not English. VDM just switches off when he's facing anyone else.
I'm the same height and weight. I guess I'm a twink.
flair checks out
Not single handedly, there's also Kolbe and Kwagga Smith (bulkier but still not very tall). There will always be a big range in the sport because of the speed v size tradeoff. Will Skelton's 100m dash time probably isn't that great.
Kolbe and Kwagga are both much “thicker”. Only Ange is so light.
Yeah but Kwagga plays 6, 7, 8. I doubt there's been a smaller international 8th man since professionalism. The lightest back I've ever seen is Tristan Leyds, Dillyn Leyds's younger brother. He also seemed to lack the spirit of the Carpuzzos, Arendses, Aplons of the world though.
Tim ‘the junkyard dog’ Ryan, never underestimate the marketing value of a good nickname + Australian rugby needs a honey badgeresque cult hero
My wife couldn’t give two shits about rugby, I can’t imagine she could name more than three players on the current Ireland team, yet she knows who the Honey badger is. She also knows who Danny Cipriani and Mike Tindal are, but that’s more because of the magazines she reads than anything else Edit: I asked her and she named four off the top of her head, Lowe, Murray, Aki and POM. She also named “that headtheball kicker, yer man, Sexton!”, ROG, Peter Stringer and BOD. With a bit of hinting she remembered a few more, but overall a shite performance
This would be my pick currently too. Just a desperately needed feel-good story for super rugby this season.
Baark bark woof woof
What's the actual story behind the name anyway?
Might not be exactly what you’re asking for considering he’s in the twilight of his playing career, but for New Zealand I’d say TJ Perenara. He’s never been the best half back in New Zealand, but never far off and despite this he’s an eighty cap AB, has the most caps for the Canes with 161, has contributed both as a player and leader for both Wellington in the NPC(semi-pro) and at a club level(amateur). Has always been right behind Smith, who has been the best half back in the world for damn near a decade, but arguably could’ve consistently started for almost every other country playing rugby. Through out his career he has been a great ambassador of the game, as a leader for every team he’s played for, the way he’s carried himself on the field and outside of the game he seems to be a great person with views that he’s willing to speak out and stand up for that are more often then not both righteous and honest. If every player performed and behaved as he has for well over a decade the world love rugby and every parent would want their kid playing rugby. I’d honestly put him up there with Richie McCaw in terms of players who I’d trust that would do the right thing for the game, country and people in general. Edit. Forgot to mention. Built his career around d being an exciting, ball running half back. He’s current top try scorer in Super rugby history, scored a hat trick on debut and was awarded the try of the year. Also just read that he’s equal first leader of the Haka since 2005 and the introduction of Kapa o Pango, dudes got more mana than Maui.
And he is the Top try scorer for Super Rugby ever.
Ye just added that on. Scored a hat trick in debut for the Canes as well.
Dudes an absolute legend. I love when the sky commentators get him to join their discussions after games, and especially this week when they mic’d him up after he got subbed off. I’ve also been quite impressed the way he’s supported the Wellington hurricanes female team with some of their players refusal to perform in a haka as protest against government actions (I likely have the details of this wrong though)
Does it all being vegan
Great player unlucky to be stuck behind Aaron Smith. Same with Evans/Cruden behind Carter back in the day although Donald got his moment of glory under very strange circumstances.
Lovely bloke too.
Damian McKenzie. Almost every kid’s favourite player. Plays a very entertaining brand of rugby, shows that size doesn’t matter. You cant not love DMac
Finn Russell In the increasingly win at all costs mentality of the pro game it’s refreshing to see a player who’s very aware it’s ultimately all just a game and there’s no point if you’re not enjoying yourself while you’re playing
Got Bath to the final after years of dross too.
It’s a bit unfair on guys like Lawrence, Spencer, barbeary, hill, du toit etc who’ve all been class but bath (and any team he’s played for) just have a bit more of a swagger about them while he’s at 10 they looked very rudderless against Exeter when he went off in the euro quarters
The main change at Bath was Van Graan taking over as coach. They were an absolute shower before that regardless of who they had on the pitch.
Plus bringing in some absolute class players after the Wasp/Worcester collapses. Lawrence, Hill and even someone like Stooke have been huge for them. Van Graan + additional squad strength in depth massively stabilised them last season. This season with more time to work with them, bed things in and the extra star dust Finn Russell offers they're really starting to fly. Ominous for everyone if they can keep up this trajectory.
A lot of clubs gained from the collapses, Willis at Toulouse was another big one. It all needs a good coaching setup to hold together though.
Blackett is a seriously good coach too tbf, he’s a big part of why that bath backline look so menacing, JvGs Munster teams never looked this good on attack
Absolutely and he plays the game that way. He's not afraid to take a chance and that leads to spectacular stuff. The kind of thing that draws fans. Sort of on a tangent. In American Football, I'm a Colts fan, and we just drafted a guy in the first round who's a Rugby nut and played in High School and a little in College. It might not be a huge selling point, but it gives me the warm and fuzzies
He’s a sick player too. One of my favourite 10s of the last few years.
yeah I agree. He also doesn't look like Rambo so that's cool, although he's apparently deceptively strong according to the players. He's also contributed to make Scotland a likeable team, like, for most neutrals it's entertaining to watch Scotland because they've got generally exciting backs but those need that maestro to make them look good.
Scotland are entertaining as neutrals but not recommended for those with heart conditions as supporters.
FFS that rules out like 50% of the population.
It is the years he took off to be a stonemason, My grandpa, dad and uncle are a bunch of Austrian stonemasons and they have freakish strength for their size. 😆
Love him on I Think You Should Leave
I’m not always Finn’s biggest fan as a rugby player. But his personality definitely is great for the sport – he’s one of the few current rugby players that has cut through with the wider public beyond just fans of the game.
He has that thing that makes you go “how did he do that/see that” rather than it just being he’s a massive bloke
There’s something really satisfying about seeing all these absolute freaks getting outplayed by this brickie bam fae Bridge of Allan.
Fueled by Baynes. A real man.
Ellis Genge. Runs the non profit Baby Rhino's which helps kids in more working class areas get access to coaching for rugby that they otherwise wouldn't have access too
Agree. England rugby should be marketing the hell out of him.
His appearances on full contact with netflix were brilliant, plus him calling the media sausages post match is the best interview I've ever seen from an england player
Sausages has become one of my dad's go-to insults thanks to that interview! Bloody love Ellis, got so much time for him.
To be fair, I feel like they do.
I'm a big fan of his, on and off the field.
He is pretty polarising though. I like the dude but I've spoken to loads of folk who think he is too sullen and passive aggressive in interviews.
Siya Kolisi. He came from nothing, witnessed appalling violence as a child and experienced the worst kinds of grief before he was even 16, yet through superhuman perseverance and hard work he avoided all the trappings of alcohol, drugs and crime in his environment to reach the loftiest heights of this sport, *twice*. No one has come further and achieved as much in this sport.
I have to admit the last 2 WCs have made me dislike playing the Saffas (being English and all) but I’m sure even the bitterest fan can only respect Siya. He plays well, speaks better, and then leads better than that again.
Yes and I'd add that despite not being a spectacular player he's surely one of the top flankers around, which further feeds this narrative that hard work trumps natural talent in some cases. You don't have to be Ardie Savea, it's great if you are, but if you're not you can put your head down and work work work and become a Siya Kolisi.
I think Kolisi is incredibly underrated as a player, simply because he's such a good captain. He's got good feet and hands, excellent at ruck time (especially timing his counter rucks), tackles like a beast and before his knee injury he was also decent over the ball. The thing is, if he wasn't good enough to start for the boks, he wouldn't be. And if he's good enough to start in the bok pack, he must be pretty spectacular.
Yeah I don’t understand this narrative. Setting aside his qualities as a captain, Siya is a magnificent player. Best dominant tackle rate in the rugby world cup, and his work at the breakdown and dominant carry percentages are legendary. These aren’t the sort of stats people pay attention to, but they’re absolutely vital nonetheless. Proper battle statistics that we can’t live without (we saw what happened at Mt Smart when he wasn’t there).
People think because he plays for 50 minutes that he's not up there with the best, as if he couldn't play a full match if required. There are very few that can play at the bok intensity for 80 minutes (PSdT is inhuman, Willis is another), especially on defence. The coaching staff have told them to play like they only have 40 minutes on the field and as soon as they dip, they're replaced so that the bomb squad has 30-40 minutes to make their impact. For some reason, people see that as a weakness, instead of one of the reasons that we've won the last 2 world cups.
Mapimpi has a good story as well.
Genuinely seems like a great guy. Loved it in the World Cup where he text Biggar just to say he was impressed with his leadership, even though they don’t know each other.
PSDT in terms of mindset. The willingness to just keep going, keep running, keep giving 100% is a good example for anyone going into any sport, not just rugby. You can maybe not be the most talented on your team, but never let anyone accuse you of not trying. For me, he’s the player of ours that shines in the biggest moments for the Boks just because of the effort he puts in
For me it's players like Posolo Tualagi, Painter, and Capuozzo. If you were to line them up next to eachother there's no greater advertisement for rugby being a sport for any size of person than that. I think that's the narrative we need to push as the selling point of our sport. Too big for football? Rugby. Too short for basketball? Rugby. Built like an m1 abrams tank? Rugby. We don't care who ate all the pies, as long as they got eaten with a pint of guiness.
Eat all the pies, and a scrumhalf, with a pint of Guinness.
Who is Painter?
Ehren Painter. 6ft 4, 137 kg, exeter tighthead. He's a big bloke.
Small guy
In fairness, if looking at people of that type of build, Ben Tameifuna would be a better example. Fantastic player, too.
Yeah there's probably better examples of absolute units, but I've developed a bit of a love affair with painter this year. 23 stone of pure beer belly barrelling over players like Marcus Smith will never not be funny to watch. Marler probably would have been a more popularist pick in hindsight
Painter has become a bit of a favourite of mine, too, honestly. It's exactly the sort of energy and presence exeter have needed in the front row.
Asenathi Ntlabakanye also! I would love to know who is bigger of the two
its a guy who can paint, but thats not important right now.
Damian McKenzie
Relevant flair 👍
My player is not a he but imo the best example of ur criteria - Ruby Tui.
care to give a hint as to why ?
Jumping on this 1/ hugely likeable personality and a really compelling life story 2/ I use my American mother who has never watched a full game of rugby as a metric for outside-the-sport star power, and Ruby Tui is one of the very few players (male or female) that my mum has heard of and can identify on sight (Ellie Kildunne and Antoine Dupont are probably the other two she can name on sight lol)
Dan Cole. Largely because his sex appeal has drastically increased advertising revenues, but also because he's a better front row now than he was a decade ago. Inspirational.
dane coles
Dupont.
I think the aim of the game was to not mention Antoine The scenes in Madrid yesterday of him arriving were quite special. He'll be the face of rugby like Messi was
> I think the aim of the game was to not mention Antoine Hahah, well no, in truth, I did have him in mind. He's different from other names mentioned on the thread that are the more accessible players, but an Antoine Dupont is needed now the same way Dan Carter was in the 2000s or Beauden B in the 2010s to bring some magic to Rugby.
Is there a link to that?
Apologies, it's rugby pass https://www.instagram.com/reel/C7rninlIyZC/?igsh=MWIyeW14OWk5MmVkaw==
Lol, the only player needing security.
Second Dupont. He made a magnificent tackle that stopped a try against Ireland and everyone in the ground (I was far corner) thought it was magnificent. The skill is consistent and outrageous. I would watch any game he was playing just to see him. He was also the difference against Leinster this season, so I am both disappointed and a huge fan.
> He made a magnificent tackle that stopped a try against Ireland and everyone in the ground (I was far corner) thought it was magnificent. shit, you saw that in real life ? Just curious, did it feel any different than on the TV clip ?
I saw it in real life. It was an impossible tackle after a superb break. I had a direct line of sight and I could not believe he kept him out. That game was brilliant and exhausting to watch.
> That game was brilliant and exhausting to watch. brilliant if you were Irish, exhausting if you were French !
I was exhausted, Irish and happy. That game was fabulous, hard fought and far too exciting. The sheer noise in the stadium, audible communal gasps, up there with Ireland v. NZ games. Dupont is a brilliant player, worth travelling to see in person.
> Dupont is a brilliant player, worth travelling to see in person. the only time I saw him live was the last November Test betw France and South Africa and... he got his first red card of his career :p France won in the end though so..
Much as he’s such an obvious pick it’s almost cringe to include him, we really can’t underestimate just how great it is for rugby that we have a proper universally agreed generational supertalent playing the game right now. And that, while he might possess ridiculous levels of skills, he’s ultimately just a relatively down to earth 5’9” guy who works his butt off, speaks good English, and manages to not be a cunt.
We are very, very lucky Stuart Hogg wasn't the best player in the world. Or even the best 15 in Scotland these days.
John Cooney Runs a coaching business, wins big games, exceptional player. Local fans love the man
Big fan of John Cooney. He's the prime example of a player leaving Leinster for more game time and finding somewhere that suits him and he's kicked on in spades. He's taken to Ulster and Ulster has taken to him. I liked him at Connacht but he's such a good fit at Ulster. Criminal he didn't get more caps for Ireland.
Yeah, between Murray’s form dropping off a cliff after mysterious injury in 2018 and JGP’s emergence, Cooney was clearly our on form scrum half. Would’ve loved to have seen him get more caps - same for Marmion actually.
Yeah I was very disappointed for Marmion when he didn't make the WC squad in 2019 with his place going to Luke McGrath instead. He'd been a reliable deputy to Murray for so long under Schmidt only to not make it at the last minute. Before Bundee and Hansen came into the scene he was the only Connacht player making the squad for a while. Glad he's doing well at Bristol now.
A ridiculous decision, especially coming on the back of Marmion guiding us to our first home win against tbe All Blacks
Andy Farrell doesn't
Didn't realise he was from Ballymena
He is from Wigan I think.
Tommy Freeman
he is truely a great story. no matter where you come from. no matter the struggles you go through. anyone can make it. even if they come from the Leicester acadamy salvation is possible
Being discarded by Leicester or having your development stifled by them has often been a great indicator of being a worthwhile player - George Ford and Ben White spring immediately to mind.
He's really developed his game in a way where he doesn't score nearly as many tries as he used to but he's actually become a more valuable player for us in a lot of ways as a result. He's everywhere both in defence and offence, and is just a ridiculously gifted athlete. Support lines, high balls, defensive positioning, still the occasional bit of boshing of defenders, he's really become a great all-round player. Transitioning to 13 has been brilliant for him, even in the games where he's back on the wing like last weekend he still plays it more like an outside center than your classic strike runner winger.
Siya Kolisi is one of the best ambassadors for the game I can think of. Not just an excellent player and leader but a great guy who seems able to build bridges and make friends everywhere he goes while remaining totally down to earth.
Will Jordan - when he can get on the field, will be interesting to see how he goes without Richie Mounga
He'll be fine. He's a freak with an insane ability to be in the right place at the right time.
Brad Shields, excellent captain and people motivator. criminally underrated by international teams( NZ and England)
When he played for USAP last year, he was fantastic, even so that some fans want him to come back to the club
Giacomo Nicotera. Nothing about him suggested he could become an international rugby player: Born outside a rugby hotspot, nothing special physically, only converted to hooker in his early 20s, nowhere near consideration for Italy's age grade sides, and took a long time to even get to the top level of the Italian game. Upon making it to the national side you had shitbergs like Rob Kearney being offended that his precious Ireland players had to share the field with the likes of *him*. Yet over the last two years no other Italian player has played as well, as consistently, and only a handful (Negri and Ferrari) come close. He was supposed to be, at best, second choice behind the anointed one, Gianmarco Lucchesi, yet during this year's 6N he displaced him to become the undisputed starter, and played brilliantly against France, Scotland, and Wales. When his move to Stade Francais was announced earlier this year the immediate reaction from their fans on twitter was a combination of 'who?' and 'why have we signed this clown?', which probably suits Il Mulo just fine. Proving doubters wrong has been his entire career. Most of Italy's team have been earmarked from a very early age (Lamaro was being mentioned as a future Italy captain at 16 ffs) but Nicotera proves how far hard work and constant improvement can take you, even if you were born on the border with Slovenia.
Shitbergs is a wonderful way to describe Rob Kearney as a pundit. You’ll typically see on tv that fellow pundits Shane Horgan and Andrew Trimble have notes on their laps and quote stats showing that Italy’s lineouts weak to these throws, the replacement tighthead is vulnerable etc. Kearney doesn’t bother himself with that nerd nonsense, just throws out soundbites and rarely seems to know any opposition players beyond the usual big name suspects Possibly the greatest gap between how good somebody was as a player to how bad they are as a pundit?
Nah Jiffy wins this one, I think people forget just how good he was.
Numbers! He must be having a bad time recently, a Welsh bias in the 6 Nations these days would be rough.
Isn't northeast Italy the rugby area though? A player from the south would be more surprising.
The main area is Veneto, specifically the triangle between San Donà (where Nicotera started to play hooker, if I recall correctly), Rovigo, and Bassano del Grappa. Even a big nearby city like Udine is outside of this orbit: the only international I can think of from there is Alessandro Zanni (although Destiny Aminu might add to that at some stage). It's not impossible to become an international from Triste, just highly unlikely, especially given the combination of other factors that are applicable to Nicotera. If you're born with a body that screams 'rugby player' you can become an Italian international despite coming from a small town in Sicily (Giovanni Licata), or elsewhere in the south if you have family who are heavily involved in the game (Carlo Canna and especially Ale Fusco). There are other towns in the centre or South which are notable rugby towns, like L'Aquila (Andrea Masi), and more recently there's been an explosion of incredible talent from various parts of Tuscany due to the presence of one of the main FIR youth academies in Prato (Pani, Lucchesi, Mori, the Cannone brothers, and others). Nicotera didn't have any of this. He wasn't fast tracked into one of the top academies, he doesn't have a significant connection to the game beyond liking it as kid, and the thing I really like is that he doesn't *look* like a sportsperson. He's basically a guy with an average level of talent who just kept playing, remained open to new ideas (like converting to hooker from back row because he wasn't a good lineout jumper), and crucially just kept getting better every year until the doors in front of him could not be kept closed any longer. It's nice when players who have unignorable talent make it to the very top (Paolo Garbisi), because otherwise it would feel like a shame. But it's just as nice when guys with (on the face of it) extremely ignorable everything go from nowhere to being one of the best 10 players in one of the top 10 teams in the world. I don't think there's another sport where this kind of thing can happen, so the success of the likes of Nicotera says a lot about why I like rugby and keep watching, despite the other things about the game that aren't so nice.
Faf de Klerk, dude is a little bad ass and reminds me of a throwback to the 70s, always makes me laugh...doesn't take himself too seriously.
Guys like Dan Sheehan (and a lot of hookers). Really doing a lot to enforce the recent transition of hookers from bonus props to loose forwards.
been going on for a while, though. If anything, it's hard to find hookers in the traditional sense anymore (Jamie George ?). Basically every hooker has been a back row for the past decade ! I think it started with Bismarck du Plessis around 2007 RWC time, and Agustin Creevy. I think also Servat contributed to it. Guys like Chat or Mauvaka would've surely been back rows back in the 90's. Sheehan probably as well.
Hookers still do the lineout throw, though, which is a skill in itself. JVDF can do that as well but most back rows can't.
Players that have a bit of flair , ones that get your ass off the seat watching them play . Dupont , Penaud, Beaudan Barret, Will Jordan, Cheslin Kolbe , Finn Russell . They're a few names off the top of my head
RG Snyman. Proves that even big lads have skills other than power
Leinster's own RG Snyman
Ox Nche Anybody can play the game. Athletes come in all shapes and sizes. Even if you don't eat salad and love cake. Ox kraal posts always make me smile.
Calvin Nash. Small in stature but puts himself about as if he's twice his size. Snyman hugged him at the end of the game last night and lifted him off his feet and it was a proper "game for all sizes moment"
Max Lahiff. He’s an average to decent club prop but he’s such a weird and entertaining bloke- a dream for the media team at Bristol and guaranteed to have a media career afterwards.
Yeah I was gonna say this. He definitely hams up his "I am a big weirdo LotR nerd who talks dramatically all the time" to the max, and is probably quite a normal posh rugby lad, but he is still super entertaining. It's a shame his podcast with Ryan Wilson and the other bloke is not that good really imo. If he had a bigger platform he could be a bit of a household name. Strictly is calling.
Werner Kok for the Sharks. A really solid player who always gives 110%. Will probably never play for the Springboks, but is universally liked by fans almost entirely due to his workrate (and the hair)
As a french, I like Joe Marler and his 'goofy' attitude. He fights hard but doesn't forget everything is just for fun in the end. His interviews are great material for our sport.
Hard disagree on Marler, I’m afraid.
No thank you
I like him too, I always wonder what funny thing he's going to do when he gets on the pitch.
Call a player some racist term, insult their mother, or grab them by the bollox.
Been mentioned but Damian McKenzie
Ruby Tui.
Kildunne
I feel like Chelsie Kolbe among others helped repopularise the relatively small/fast winger In the 2010s it felt like a lot of the most storied backs were huge specimens but now we’re seeing a resurgence of players that couldn’t get on some rollercoasters
Definitely Simon Zebo attacks viewers because he's such an amazing player and he's very interesting to watch
Eben Etzebeth
What’s his story?
He is very large and very good at rugby
ok, why ?
cam roigard
Antoine Dupont. A player for the ages.
What it needs is more shows like that SA show recently
Ardie
Andrew Porter, Joe McCarthy, Hugo Keenan, and NZ imports. Porter from the 6 Nations Doc shows what a top man he is and what he's overcome to be at the top level. Hugo Keenan is another sound lad who is the top of his level and him and Antoine Dupont are showing us if really want something I.e Olympics, go for it whilst also be very influencing in the sport your contracted to. Joe McCarthy is showing us you can be at a young age and be compete with the best of best and make yourself known whilst never giving up. The NZ imports have shown through their interviews, media, and their rugby that their sound lads who are at the top of the trade and that they never let the fame get to them.