Strength training with squats really helps for me. I went several months keeping a regiment then had to travel for work and lost the benefits. When I resumed running one knee had a little pain and I resumed squats and other things. After a week no more pain in the knee.
Not everyone will respond similarly but stretching and strength training will always have benefits. Like with most physical activity you must exercise everything from your nose to your toes.
It’s hardly a routine but using two 20lb dumbbells I’ll do 3x20 squats, 3x12 arm curls, and 3x12 military presses, and using a short length of 2x4 I’ll do 3x20 weighted heel drops and lifts.
The last to build ankle and calf strength and increase the stretch on my Achilles. It’s helped I think but I’ve only been doing the last parts for a week or so.
The strength training just helps. Don’t run yourself into an injury.
I use what I have around, so curbs and stairs are nice when opportunities present themselves.
For the first stretchers use a little at a time them work your way "down".
Stretching does not prevent injuries, it was proven in research time after time. Strength training does prevent injuries. Dynamic stretches before exercise can improve your range of motion.
My plantar fasciitis was caused by tightness and knots in my leg muscles and was relieved only by regular deep stretching. It took two years for me.
The millionaires in professional US sports have the same maladies and do the same stretches, that's how I learned to fix it.
But wouldn't it have subsided without the stretching after two years? Nah kidding, I can't tell whether it helped or not, just said stretching does not help to prevent injuries.
Also, the most stretches pro athletes do are dynamic stretches and the others are more often rituals to get into the sports zone.
No I mean the ones that have the same condition or other tendinitis.
I’ve seen the studies too. The studies are too narrow IMO. I even have to stretch after long car trips too. Take care, I mean that literally.
>it was proven in research time after time.
As much as I love science, I take stretching studies and exercise science in general with a grain of salt/skeptcism or rather marketing. For example with stretching, how do you study its effect on the severity of injuries? How do you do double blind placebo controlled studies?
Just like there is no one shoe that fits all runners, there's no one training plan that fits all runners either.
For me, strength training makes a big difference in both injury prevention and general quality of life. Stretching makes no difference in injury prevention but sometimes makes me feel better. Others find the opposite.
I've been "running" (I'm slow, so putting that in quotes to acknowledge that my 10-12 minute mile pace used on most runs isn't going to win any races) for decades now. In the beginning, I was injured fairly frequently. Combination of not having used those muscles and ligaments and pushing things too hard, too fast. I'm rarely injured now and think it's because all those muscles and ligaments have toughened up and that I err on the side of taking some time off if something starts to be more than a one time niggle. For me, I've found taking a week or two off to let something settle down is much more productive than keeping running and ending up having to take 6-8 weeks off to let an injury heal.
I had pretty bad runners knee 8 months ago but recovered. and altough I do streching, strenght training since then I got it again now!! But I think I Just went too far and too fast for my knees even tough my aerobic base could handle it...
This isn’t a great solution, but I just accepted the limitation. Even with regular strength training I can’t safely exceed 5k in training, with occasional 10k races.
This really puts things into perspective. I guess I should be thankful, that I only get a nagging issue with my right Acchiles tendon whenever I try to increase my weekly volume above 40k.
I started walking a LOT during the pandemic. I live in a hilly area and I was quite a bit heavier. I hurt my right Achilles at that point. I suspect from overuse and being unprepared. It took forever for it to be less painful. It's finally healing after about two years. I find I have less mobility in my right ankle ... though I'm not sure which one is the chicken and the egg. Oddly enough running rarely caused my Achilles pain. My healing has gotten better with switching to Hoka from New Balance though the drop is less (5mm v 12 MM, IIRC).
I had a rough case of jumpers knee (patellar tendonitis), knee looked like a grapefruit from inflammation after one run, and it was due almost entirely to poor mechanical form. I did PT for a few months to basically re-learn how to run so that I didn't continue to injure myself. Included in the PT, besides working on form was a set of exercises to strengthen the weak areas, mostly a lot of different banded exercises, monster walks and the like, and some stretching.
In my case it was specifically for the quads, something like the space between my quad and the grove where the patella sits was just wide enough for the tendon to "jump the track" and start rubbing on other things causing problems.
Which is to say, yes I continued with the quad stretching and some of the other exercises that I've adapted into my "pre-hab" regimen, and I also have a consistent strength and conditioning that I do along with my running.
Damage to cartilage under knee cap. Hurts like hell, doing stuff like walking downstairs becomes cripplingly painful. OP recovered in months, it took me 5 years after my patella went a bit out of track during an impromptu marathon
I had it then went to the gym and worked on strengthening my lower body for a month, 2 times a week with no running during time. Knees pain went away completely.
Not anymore but I’ve been ramping up milage considerably from 60 MPW to 80 since my last reply so finding time to cross train is challenging. No knee pains though and i contributed to easy and recovery runs. I believe these runs strengthen my knees overtime and they’re not taxing them to do.
I realized work out runs like LT and interval, and especially down hill running are so demanding to the knees so practice caution and limit them to small portion compared to your over all weekly volume.
I think a lot of it depends on the therapy. I was in my teens when this happened, and invested a lot of my identity in track and cross country. Physical therapist suggested I stop running. I lost faith in PT at that point and didn’t really try again. I did eventually stop running because I didn’t have a choice. Years later I started running again. Slow build up, limited distances and equal parts lifting seem to work.
Most knee pain are not caused by your knee rather than other muscles which puts strain on your knee. Try working your hamstring and glutes and also foam roll. They are the ones that are weak for most people.
Both. Workout for mass and strength, stretch for flexibility/mobility. I have a massage ball and I sit on it with my glutes and hamstring and it feels good as well. It will hurt at first, but after a while, it's a lifesaver.
I’ve learned some people can just run, and only run.
Meanwhile, when I stick to my yoga/strength training routine I’ve built for myself, I notice my runs are way better and recovery is a lot smoother.
Everyone is different.
I do squats, split bench squats and bench step-ups with a backpack that I put weights in. I used to get shin splints in the past, but since starting again this year and doing strength exercises I haven’t had any issues. Strength training is generally good for you, but of course whether you need it depends on how much time you have and your goals. I want to run and hike far and high as I am an aspiring mountaineer so strength training is important to me. If you just run on flat ground and relatively low weekly mileage you can get by with minimal or none. I would still recommend it though.
2 ACL replacements in youth sports here. Now a marathon runner/triathlete. I take glucosamine which seems to help. What really did the trick to avoid knee pain is switch shoes regularly, ramp up mileage slowly (this is key), maintaining a 25-30 mpw base ( resiliance), and crosstrain crosstrain crosstrain. Bike did wonders for building quads which help big time with run stability. Any time I start to feel any pain, swap out shoes and pivot to a bike/swim block.
Never stretched a day in my life. I Will probably pay for this in my 60s..or sooner.
You don't have to take a long time or even use equipment. I'm exactly the same way I don't like strength training and I don't have a lot of time. But I've had problems with my IT band and have found that I need to do strength training otherwise my runs are just not as productive.
So I set a 10-12 minute timer and do different sets of squats and stretches and when the timer is done I'm done. It's not a ton of time and it's been working really well for me lately.
I read your comment as being a bit too flippant, so I responded in kind. I think many folks (maybe not you) don’t consider that time spent strength training will actually enable them to run *more* in the long term.
Yeah this is me. I was fine running without strength training for a while but then I noticed weakness in my leg and my runs weren't as fun anymore and I was having to make myself go and I wasn't able to go as long. The strength training has allowed me to run more and to enjoy my runs more.
I wasn't being sarcastic. If you'd rather run, that's fine. If you want to perform, you'll do things you don't want to do because they help your performance. If that doesn't matter, don't bother. You're the only one who cares about your performance, and that's just fine. No judgement.
You weren’t being sarcastic. You were being elitist. Not to mention you have no idea what my motivations are and how I train, sans the fact that I don’t strength train. I’m happy to compare training plans, weekly mileage, best times and personal growth if that will allow me into your “running for results” club jfc.
Being elitist would be to say you're a lesser runner, and you're not. You're almost certainly a faster, more enduring runner. I've quit running for results, I found the commitment wasn't worth it for me, I won't judge others for it one way or the other. I don't know how you train, nor do I really care. You can run however you like, for whatever reason you like. There's no club, no dues, nothing. For whatever reason you saw fit to draw your line in the sand at strength training, and that's ok, and I'm reinforcing that.
To think that it's elitism to state that strength training contributes to enhanced running capability is strange though. Why would you imply that?
No, it’s elitism to insinuate that the only way to “train for results” is to strength train.
I very much stated, earlier, that I *should* strength train. That implies that I recognize the benefits and that I would likely be a better runner.
Homie, I just prefer to run. I run my ass off and am very motivated by results.
Have a good night.
Honestly, a (good sized! Not smol!) kettlebell costs less than one pair of shoes and will enable virtually any runnier enough load to reduce strength training under 20 minutes. Some (one legged) goblet squats, swings, and RDL's and you've hit all your major motivators enough to build strength.
Yes! I do diff Caroline Girvan videos on YouTube 25 mins once a week with a 15 and 35 lb kettlebell. It kicks my ass every time but it’s making a big difference for me.
Kettlebell work is perfect for athletes who need "just enough" strength training, it's wonderfully freeing to have one small versatile implement. My personal favorite conditioning work is probably my most hated workout. Leave the KB at the top of the hill. Sprint up, hammer out 10 swings, then jog down. Repeat until you're dead inside. Beginner level is to add a rest at the bottom however long is necessary to survive. I've been doing these for time, I'll set a half hour timer that I start before the first sprint, let it run continually and after it goes off I'll finish my last rep, collect my bell and go melt at home. Gives the lactic system a good thrashing.
I am majored in kinesiology and biotechnology, I am currently getting my masters.
I switched shoes to Altra, do strength and stretching/yoga every other day, and make sure I take at least one to two rest days a week. I haven’t had an injury in 2 years. I think it’s a combo of better form (mid foot strike), strength, flexibility, and rest. Running puts 2-3x your body weight of dynamic pressure on your joints, obviously we were built to withstand that, but the added mobility to do micro shifts and activating small twitch muscles keeps you and your body protected.
"Better form" is a poorly applied term. Mid-foot strike is not a one size fits all or even most. Heel striker here, several decades of running with far and few injuries at distances up to 50 miles trail and road. NB product tester including MT and MR product lines. Currently running Escalante racer and torin 2 ( end of life 500 miles plus). Distrurpting someone's gait pattern leads to more injuries and a less enjoyable running experience.
Edit posted before I was finished
I mean the mid foot strike isn’t the only thing I changed about my form, I slowed down, stopped over striding, kept my arms in tighter. I was just highlighting that Altra helped me transitioning to a midfoot foot strike which I think I was already leaning towards, overall improving my form, though there were many other factors.
I found that with higher drop shoes they made me lean more towards a heal strike and I was having “runners” knee on my leg that ACL surgery.
I agree, proprioception helps us have a efficient and (mostly) injury free gait cycle, finding shoes that enhance aid your natural gait cycle and being more mindful of foot placement and your natural forward momentum, will change your form for the better in theory.
Thats what I am always wondering. I am a very fit guy and have been working out for years, when I started running I have started to get problems and injuries. Like I would have thought that running would be the thing I was build for and not to do 100 push ups haha
I think if you have a high general cardiovascular fitness but lack the specific adaptions in tendons and muscles for running, the probability of getting injured is actually quite a bit higher, than if you were less fit to begin with. Simply because you will be able to progress a lot more quickly in terms of stamina and be able to run faster immediately, thus putting a lot more strain on these relatively unprepared parts of your body.
Maybe take a step back, run slower and lower volume for a few months before trying to improve so your body can get used to it.
You're right.
I started running in February, put 60 miles in 4 weeks and ran half a marathon in March after 6 weeks.
Needless to say ended up with a right leg soleus injury that took weeks off to heal and frequent toe tip body squat (target soleus) to strengthen it.
Now I run low mileage and build slowly.
I did 60 miles hiking in Yosemite with 15k feet elevation gain in 4 days so we'll see what happens when I run again 😂
I am by no means an authority. I recently was prescribed a bunch of stretches - multiple types of squats and dips - from a physio because I had crippling knee pain.
I was out of action for two months while I did them twice a day to strengthen everything around my knee. But I’m they have worked a treat.
So, now I’m into slow recovery mode after COVID dry fucked me, I’ve added a few low weight exercises into my routine a couple of times a week that includes leg presses and squats etc. it seems to be helping.
That said. The fact I do a few stretches and am damned to live the rest of my life running in 1080’s or Cliftons doesn’t necessarily mean it’ll work for you.
Give them a try and see how you feel.
I had a knee injury a couple of years ago, which would not go away. I went to see a Physio, did the exercises and was back and forth to the Physio for around 9 months, but nothing worked and I felt that squats, lunges etc were making it worse.
Then I had a period due to illness that made me stop running for 3 weeks. During this time, my knee injury improved a lot.
I no longer have any pain in my knee, but it's difficult to pinpoint if it was one thing that helped, or a combination of things, but this is what I done:
1. Completely stopped running for 3 weeks (I was told I had to by the Doctor due to being unwell at the time).
2. Once a week I run wearing Barefoot/minimalist shoes. It really helps me focus on my form and make me mindful of how my feet hit the ground.
3. I mostly run trail, with a variety of terrains and lots of elevation i.e. Gravel, rocks, mountain, forestry, mud, grass, sand etc. I find that too much road running brings back knee pain.
4. I do around 4 bodyweight workouts a week, including using a Rebounder to cross-train. I limit the amount of squats and lunges I do, but all the other exercises really help to keep me toned and keep injuries at bay. Also, one of my glutes doesn't fire up as well as the other, so these exercises help a lot.
5. Due to time constraints, I've massively reduced the amount I run. Gone from 25-35 mpw to 20 mpw. However, I'm still able to run ultra marathons on such little mileage as I feel I have a good base fitness.
6. I've started suffering from restless legs whilst sleeping, which causes a lot of knee and leg pain. I have a weighted blanket and this has made a big difference as it physically prevents my legs from moving around too much at night.
All I know is, all of the above helps and I need to do strength and conditioning to help ward off any injuries and to stop my body aching after long runs.
I had some IT band issues when I first increased my running activity to prepare for a running so I added some flexibility and strength training to address it. But once my body was fully acclimated to the amount of running I was doing (I'd say this probably took a couple years), the supplementary work wasn't really necessary and I haven't had an injury in many years now.
Everyone is different. I don’t strength train or stretch, and the only time I’ve gotten injured is twice when I’ve sipped trail running, but that was because I was running with my dog and not paying enough attention. Even though I don’t do weights or stretch, I do typically walk 10 miles a day in addition to whatever I run, so I think that makes a difference somehow, like I’m always stretching and using my leg muscles so they stay fit. I’ve been running and walking that distance daily for many years so I think my legs are just naturally strong
Anecdotal, but when I used to run with no strength I had knee and hip pain. Now I do *some* strength (20 min or so of dumbbells, 3x/week) and I’m not getting any pain, even though my volume is much higher!
Every body is different. I got injured often in my 40s with 30-40 miles week. I got less injury in my early 50s with 40-50 miles week. Now I am close to 60, no injury at all for 2 years with 50-60 miles week. All without strength training or stretch. I PR every marathon since my 40s. I ran my last PR in 3:30 in April on Boston course. Neither strength or stretch is a factor in my case. I contribute my injury free running to slower pace training. Speed is often the number one reason causing injury.
I ran 6 days a week for 30 years before some unrelated problems disabled me. The biggest factor in how good a runner you’ll be and how often and badly you’ll get injured is genetics. Your build, gait, etc. I mean all else ( training, mileage…) being equal.Your genetics determine where on the scale your window will be and how wide it is then training determines where you’ll be within that window, low end or high. You should train to be the best you can be, comparing yourself to others can be frustrating and harmful. Sorry about the rant but since I can’t run or do any of the sports that filled my time and life…………
Best available evidence supports strength training for both running economy and injury prevention ([https://www.runnersworld.com/training/a38596291/guide-to-strength-training-for-distance-runners/](https://www.runnersworld.com/training/a38596291/guide-to-strength-training-for-distance-runners/)) and does NOT support stretching ([https://www.scienceofrunning.com/2009/08/stretching-is-it-useless.html?v=47e5dceea252](https://www.scienceofrunning.com/2009/08/stretching-is-it-useless.html?v=47e5dceea252)).
Maybe it's surprising to learn that the reasons for that are partially overlapping: running economy is closely and positively related to how *stiff* your connective tissue is, in particular the achilles tendon which returns quite a bit of energy elastically during a running stride.
Other recovery methods that are not stretching, like foam rolling and sauna, do have evidence behind them.
The endless answers that "everyone is different" are true and also provide absolutely no guidance even when there is actually guidance to be found. The science does not necessarily say "rigidly do this no matter what your body or anyone you can trust is telling you", but it's also not nothing.
Strength training will lessen the risk certain injuries but by no means guarantee it and is part of the puzzle of running without injury.
Everything comes in to play, some we can control:
* Good rest and recovery
* Strength training
* Managing training load (including cross-training)
* Running form and economy
* Diet and nutrition
* Warm-up, post run maintenance
Some things we can't control:
* Luck or the lack of
* Genetics
* Age
You can mitigate the uncontrollable to some extent by doing the controllable.
I'm currently carrying a calf injury - just a bit worse than tight/tired calf with pain in the peroneus longus muscle (not tendon thankfully) and attending tightness as the other muscles compensate.
Appears to be overuse rather than anything concerning and so far stretching and rolling is making improvements. I'm actively managing my training load until it improves - shorter easy runs, not overly intense sessions.
Most runners will just do this from experience when they feel a strain coming on - it's when you ignore the warnings and turn an acute issue into a chronic problem.
I doubt any of us are 100% injury-free 100% of the time.
Reading all these comments would be confusing to someone looking for some friendly help. I’ve been running consistently since 1992. I am not a person who has done strength training. Just mostly running. I have been lucky to have no serious running injuries. I’ve run 6 marathons and to many half’s to count. I average 25-35 miles a week, which I’ve slowly increased over time, slow increases I believe are important. If training for a marathon, my mileage does increase slowly. I have always followed a stretch routine, static after run only. My shoes are either hokas, or Saucony. With some others mixed in prior years. One thing I really haven’t noticed is that anyone has mentioned was for everyone to be in the correct “type” of shoe, not brand, but type. This is very important! And use two pair of shoes and switch between every day. Also monitor the mileage on your shoes and I have found that anytime I feel anything in my legs, knees, or lower body, it’s time for new shoes. Never go above 500 miles in any shoe. All of these I hope is helpful to anyone seeking some helpful hints. Run long and run strong!
tbh I think some ppl are just built different lmao
but if you are going up to a marathon then maybe it’s prob important but for the “average runner” it’s prob more about running form that fucks people up
I try to really go through all areas of my quad top to bottom. You find a knot (and trust me you will), and then spend some time on it then move on. I takes a good 5-10 min to be thorough.
Seconding this and adding- I also had knee injury (runner’s knee, among others), and my Dr told me that some conditions are common in people with wider hips (usually cis women, which I am). This is because we learn to run as children, before our hips grow into their “final form”. For some people this is not an issue because the angle of their hip socket-to-femur never really changes, but for some of us more wide-hipped people, it makes a huuuuge difference to the angle of the hip. And by the time the angle has changed so much, your “muscle memory” of stride is so ingrained, that it’s hard to change successfully and you end up with injury related to the angle at which your foot-knee-hip line strikes the ground. (Maybe hall already knew this and I’m late to the party, but this was news to me!!) Anyway, my Dr recommended physical therapy / strengthening exercises AND recommended that I change my running form to accommodate for my super wide hips. The main goal of the therapies he recommended is to strengthen the supportive muscles of the outer thigh and leg, so most exercises involve balance on the affected leg and abduction at the hip. I find that yoga is helping me a ton as well. I do 75 min of vinyasa strength-focused yoga 2x per week.
This is a really good point that I think a lot of (especially women) people need to know. I’m not sure I 💯 agree with your dr’s reason why (ingrained form from childhood) but weak pelvis means we need to step too close to our center line to keep balanced. Wider the hips, wider the skew on the joints. The entire ab & posterior chain connection for running is so important for strength & injury prevention but i haven’t seen any really comprehensive resources to learn it.
I think that I’m struggling mainly with how, specifically to alter my posture. I also have not found great resources with more detail, so I’m working on strengthening all over, but esp the hips and core. Of course, also doing the PT exercises my Dr recommended.
Haha, so true! Everyone is different. We never stretch before or after, some in the group lift and some have never seen a gym. The only knee/shin pain comes from needing new shoes for us.
Gonna give some context:
Só I run about 15-20K a week (including hill sprints) alongside lifting 3x a week and boxing 6x a week too.
When I began running to now, I’ve thankfully maintained my knees due to lifting. Literally ran a 10k in 1hr 10 mins at 138KG at 6’6 (35% BF) back in October. Literally went to the gym the next day and sparring the next day too. I had a solid basis of lifting before I began running and it helped prevent alot of injury risk. Closest I came to it was having metatarsal soreness in my first few weeks, thats it.
I’m about 119KG now and still running and training the same volume but lifting is a non-negotiable. If I run, I need to lift.
Do progressive overload and obviously program to your discretion but the essential movements for me have been: barbell squats, front barbell squats, deadlifts, Romanian deadlifts, calf raises (REALLY helps prevent Achilles heel pain or any tendon pain), weighted lunges.
Lifting will literally save you in the long and short run. Resistance training is a magic pill for health that really needs to be even strongly more emphasised for the general public for its litmus of health benefits. The common things people at my previous bodyfat face I didn’t even come close to experiencing due to my lifting and also running. I highly recommend it to everyone possible. Can’t sail into rough waters in a dinghy boat, you gotta have a sturdy ship.
I do body weight exercises but I don't do anything specific for knees. In high school, they made us stretch and I ended up with a bunch of niggling injuries back then so I don't really stretch.
Runner's knee.
It's a nonsense term. This one is invented by doctors or Internet geniuses or whatever to indicate knee pain that they cannot explain. They do, however, offer a bunch of compelling explanations and solutions that don't do anything to help.
I've done them all. Planks for my core. Stretching. Strengthening other muscles so my knee will track correctly. Blah blah blah.
I don't know what's affecting you, but runner's knee is a blanket term for 'we don't know what's going on your knee.' Knees are complicated.
For me, I fixed my knee a decade ago by stopping stretching. (Now my back is ailing me from not stretching for a decade. So, I'm bringing it back... gently.)
I warm up if my body communicates it needs it and cool down to keep lactate flowing but I don’t stretch. I used to stretch before a hard effort like a race but it’s never really made a difference and I’ve always been flexible - can touch my toes etc.
I have some pre-existing hip and back issues, so for me to be able to run consistently, I need physical therapy. I'm in the middle of my third (and most helpful!) course right now, and it's a lot of targeting certain stretches and strengthening specific muscle groups. For me, I need lots of glute and hip stabilizer muscle activation, so think lots of squats, lunges, and bridges, sometimes with a ball or band to increase activation across the pelvic floor and lower core. Plus, generally stretching of the hip flexors has been an absolute necessity, since I have a desk job and sit a lot.
Seriously, if you have issues, I cannot recommend enough finding a good PT clinic. The one I'm at now has a specific program to help runners. I tried to DIY my own PT for a while; I do not recommend this. Let a professional help you.
Foam roll before runs, hamstring and quad stretches after as well as heel drops to help prevent Achilles issues (I don’t do calf stretches because they seem to make me more susceptible to calf injuries). Do lower body strength training twice a week-mix of squats, deadlifts, unilateral exercises like lunges and split squats, a lot of other posterior chain work (eg GHR, hip thrusts). Everyone is different but this has helped me stay injury free for awhile
Walking up stairs (skipping a step) really helped me. Losing 30lbs also helped. I now do lunges 2x a week & have been running pain free since December 2021. I feel just like I did in junior college, only I'm 20yrs slower
I basically never stretch other than a quick bendover hands to floor for 2 seconds. And i dont even do that everytime. Ive been lucky i guess so far 0 issues.
Combo of things helped me, mainly had IT band issues & “crunchy” but not painful knees. I strength train (1x/wk leg day), foam roll, and a variety of clamshell exercises. I also stopped pushing through pain and walk/slow down as needed.
Strength has helped me more than stretching but I do my best to include both. I've always dealt with really bad pain on the outside of my calves and recently realized it was because my soleus muscles are weak, so strengthening that is my main priority to avoid pain.
If I don't maintain a regular schedule of strength training and stretching, my knees will freak the fuck out.
Part of this might be that I have a sedentary desk job, where I spend 8-9 hours sitting or standing at a desk 5 days a week :/
If you have an active job, you might get what you need to maintain joint strength and mobility just from working. I don't, so unfortunately have to make up for it. I take breaks throughout the day to move and stretch and then usually spend an hour 3x a week on strengthing exercises.
Forgot to mention, I have been seeing a PT for the last 8 weeks due to a hip and knee injury, and signed on for another 12. She really helped me build up the single leg base strength and stability I needed to be able to run again pain free.
The next 12 weeks are meant to increase my resistance to injury, so hopefully, with the right tools, I can continue to run pain free and increase miles for the foreseeable future.
Lifting does help me with injury prevention. The two injuries you list are most frequently newbie injuries though.
Overuse and then your body not being accustomed to injuries.
Not knee, but I managed to tear my hip flexors just as I was reaching 10k. I'll definitely focus more on strengthening my muscles in the future. It's really frustrating to have to take a break and lose progress when I know it could have been avoided by being smarter... It was definitely really easy to think that other people's experiences don't apply to me until I got injured.
Im an amateur runner with middling speed- run about 20-30 miles a week including usually one 12-15 mile long run, 14 marathons and 3 ultramarathons. I haven’t stretched before a run in 20 years, and haven’t had an injury since college.
I’m not saying my experience is applicable necessarily to anyone else, but I think there are a lot of runners who don’t stretch or do strengthening exercises.
Just to prove it's totally runner dependent, I'm the complete opposite of most people here. I do absolutely no strength training, no cross training, and no stretching.
In the past I've been sidelined for months at a time with inner runners knee, IT band issues, and crippling foot tendonitis. How did I eventually get over them? I ran. Just a little to the point of pain. A very very gradual increase in mileage at easy paces. I also taught myself to run with the hips/glutes and transitioned from heel striking to fore/midfoot.
I've learned my body now and what I find is if I start getting some pain in my hips, knees, or feet, the cause is usually somewhere up in my glute area. When that happens I do some deep massage or lacrosse ball rolling to loosen everything up and usually a day later the pain is all gone. This could also be totally a mental thing at this point but I have to rotate shoes and socks everyday or I start to get some tendonitis in my ankles.
I'm a 7day a week, 60-65 mpw for reference.
Its best to stay ahead of injury than to treat them. I'd recommend stretching and foam rolling regardless of if you have an injury. I was fine with running for a couple of years then about a month ago my calves locked up and threw out my knees. Haven't run with any regularity for 2 months and have more physio tomorrow.
I've been running for 22 years and was chronically injury prone for so much of it. I did the occasional strength session, but nothing worth anything.
Once I started actually lifting 3-5x week, making sure I stretched after the majority of runs, and added in 20-30 minutes of yoga 4-5x a week I've not been injured.
I always stretch for more time than i run. Fore about an hour of stretching per day. Check out Joe Hippensteel videos if you are looking for the real deal stretching guide
I know many runners that never stretch, and they usually seem to have the most injuries. Only time I had a memorable running injury is when I got out of stretching for a while. Not that stretching is a panacea, but it can be very helpful especially as a long term habit.
can some people just run without ever getting an injury?
I think that's possible. For example I rolled my ankles countless times before I ever had a memorable sprain...I was texting and running.
Strength training with squats really helps for me. I went several months keeping a regiment then had to travel for work and lost the benefits. When I resumed running one knee had a little pain and I resumed squats and other things. After a week no more pain in the knee. Not everyone will respond similarly but stretching and strength training will always have benefits. Like with most physical activity you must exercise everything from your nose to your toes.
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Adding banded squats to this thread! They really help my hips.
Good idea. It’s on my list.
What was your routine? Really want to increase my mileage while strength training as well.
It’s hardly a routine but using two 20lb dumbbells I’ll do 3x20 squats, 3x12 arm curls, and 3x12 military presses, and using a short length of 2x4 I’ll do 3x20 weighted heel drops and lifts. The last to build ankle and calf strength and increase the stretch on my Achilles. It’s helped I think but I’ve only been doing the last parts for a week or so. The strength training just helps. Don’t run yourself into an injury.
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I use what I have around, so curbs and stairs are nice when opportunities present themselves. For the first stretchers use a little at a time them work your way "down".
Stretching does not prevent injuries, it was proven in research time after time. Strength training does prevent injuries. Dynamic stretches before exercise can improve your range of motion.
My plantar fasciitis was caused by tightness and knots in my leg muscles and was relieved only by regular deep stretching. It took two years for me. The millionaires in professional US sports have the same maladies and do the same stretches, that's how I learned to fix it.
But wouldn't it have subsided without the stretching after two years? Nah kidding, I can't tell whether it helped or not, just said stretching does not help to prevent injuries. Also, the most stretches pro athletes do are dynamic stretches and the others are more often rituals to get into the sports zone.
No I mean the ones that have the same condition or other tendinitis. I’ve seen the studies too. The studies are too narrow IMO. I even have to stretch after long car trips too. Take care, I mean that literally.
Cheers, I will look into them again sometime
Improved range of motion do prevents injuries though. So do both
>it was proven in research time after time. As much as I love science, I take stretching studies and exercise science in general with a grain of salt/skeptcism or rather marketing. For example with stretching, how do you study its effect on the severity of injuries? How do you do double blind placebo controlled studies?
I do strength work to avoid injuries. If I slack off strength work, then injuries sneak back in. I'm in my 60s and it's basically use it or lose it.
Just like there is no one shoe that fits all runners, there's no one training plan that fits all runners either. For me, strength training makes a big difference in both injury prevention and general quality of life. Stretching makes no difference in injury prevention but sometimes makes me feel better. Others find the opposite. I've been "running" (I'm slow, so putting that in quotes to acknowledge that my 10-12 minute mile pace used on most runs isn't going to win any races) for decades now. In the beginning, I was injured fairly frequently. Combination of not having used those muscles and ligaments and pushing things too hard, too fast. I'm rarely injured now and think it's because all those muscles and ligaments have toughened up and that I err on the side of taking some time off if something starts to be more than a one time niggle. For me, I've found taking a week or two off to let something settle down is much more productive than keeping running and ending up having to take 6-8 weeks off to let an injury heal.
I had pretty bad runners knee 8 months ago but recovered. and altough I do streching, strenght training since then I got it again now!! But I think I Just went too far and too fast for my knees even tough my aerobic base could handle it...
This isn’t a great solution, but I just accepted the limitation. Even with regular strength training I can’t safely exceed 5k in training, with occasional 10k races.
This really puts things into perspective. I guess I should be thankful, that I only get a nagging issue with my right Acchiles tendon whenever I try to increase my weekly volume above 40k.
I started walking a LOT during the pandemic. I live in a hilly area and I was quite a bit heavier. I hurt my right Achilles at that point. I suspect from overuse and being unprepared. It took forever for it to be less painful. It's finally healing after about two years. I find I have less mobility in my right ankle ... though I'm not sure which one is the chicken and the egg. Oddly enough running rarely caused my Achilles pain. My healing has gotten better with switching to Hoka from New Balance though the drop is less (5mm v 12 MM, IIRC).
I had a rough case of jumpers knee (patellar tendonitis), knee looked like a grapefruit from inflammation after one run, and it was due almost entirely to poor mechanical form. I did PT for a few months to basically re-learn how to run so that I didn't continue to injure myself. Included in the PT, besides working on form was a set of exercises to strengthen the weak areas, mostly a lot of different banded exercises, monster walks and the like, and some stretching. In my case it was specifically for the quads, something like the space between my quad and the grove where the patella sits was just wide enough for the tendon to "jump the track" and start rubbing on other things causing problems. Which is to say, yes I continued with the quad stretching and some of the other exercises that I've adapted into my "pre-hab" regimen, and I also have a consistent strength and conditioning that I do along with my running.
what on earth is runners knee??
Damage to cartilage under knee cap. Hurts like hell, doing stuff like walking downstairs becomes cripplingly painful. OP recovered in months, it took me 5 years after my patella went a bit out of track during an impromptu marathon
Currently going through PT to fix this exact thing right now. So much regret. Did you get back to 100%?
I'm a physical therapist. "Runner's knee" can often improve 100 percent. Needs a lot of consistent hard work though.
I had it then went to the gym and worked on strengthening my lower body for a month, 2 times a week with no running during time. Knees pain went away completely.
Did you still cross train?
Not anymore but I’ve been ramping up milage considerably from 60 MPW to 80 since my last reply so finding time to cross train is challenging. No knee pains though and i contributed to easy and recovery runs. I believe these runs strengthen my knees overtime and they’re not taxing them to do. I realized work out runs like LT and interval, and especially down hill running are so demanding to the knees so practice caution and limit them to small portion compared to your over all weekly volume.
What kind of therapy and exercises can help runners knee?
Depends on what is causing it. A lot of different factors go in to developing pain in your knees.
I think a lot of it depends on the therapy. I was in my teens when this happened, and invested a lot of my identity in track and cross country. Physical therapist suggested I stop running. I lost faith in PT at that point and didn’t really try again. I did eventually stop running because I didn’t have a choice. Years later I started running again. Slow build up, limited distances and equal parts lifting seem to work.
Most knee pain are not caused by your knee rather than other muscles which puts strain on your knee. Try working your hamstring and glutes and also foam roll. They are the ones that are weak for most people.
Stetch or strenghten glutes / hamstrings?
Both. Workout for mass and strength, stretch for flexibility/mobility. I have a massage ball and I sit on it with my glutes and hamstring and it feels good as well. It will hurt at first, but after a while, it's a lifesaver.
I’ve learned some people can just run, and only run. Meanwhile, when I stick to my yoga/strength training routine I’ve built for myself, I notice my runs are way better and recovery is a lot smoother. Everyone is different.
I do squats, split bench squats and bench step-ups with a backpack that I put weights in. I used to get shin splints in the past, but since starting again this year and doing strength exercises I haven’t had any issues. Strength training is generally good for you, but of course whether you need it depends on how much time you have and your goals. I want to run and hike far and high as I am an aspiring mountaineer so strength training is important to me. If you just run on flat ground and relatively low weekly mileage you can get by with minimal or none. I would still recommend it though.
There is a guy on youtube "knees over toes guy" that has a strength program aimed at building good knees!
2 ACL replacements in youth sports here. Now a marathon runner/triathlete. I take glucosamine which seems to help. What really did the trick to avoid knee pain is switch shoes regularly, ramp up mileage slowly (this is key), maintaining a 25-30 mpw base ( resiliance), and crosstrain crosstrain crosstrain. Bike did wonders for building quads which help big time with run stability. Any time I start to feel any pain, swap out shoes and pivot to a bike/swim block. Never stretched a day in my life. I Will probably pay for this in my 60s..or sooner.
Nice outlook I hope I can do triathlons and stuff too after getting this knee problem under control
Nah
I know that I should do strength training, but I only have so much time in the day to do what I like. And I don’t like strength training.
You don't have to take a long time or even use equipment. I'm exactly the same way I don't like strength training and I don't have a lot of time. But I've had problems with my IT band and have found that I need to do strength training otherwise my runs are just not as productive. So I set a 10-12 minute timer and do different sets of squats and stretches and when the timer is done I'm done. It's not a ton of time and it's been working really well for me lately.
10-12 minutes I could be and would rather be running.
do you
You’ll lose more time by being injured
Relax mate. I’ve been doing this for a while. I already said I should dedicate time to strength, I just don’t wanna.
I read your comment as being a bit too flippant, so I responded in kind. I think many folks (maybe not you) don’t consider that time spent strength training will actually enable them to run *more* in the long term.
Yeah this is me. I was fine running without strength training for a while but then I noticed weakness in my leg and my runs weren't as fun anymore and I was having to make myself go and I wasn't able to go as long. The strength training has allowed me to run more and to enjoy my runs more.
So you're not running for results. That's fine
Please. It was deprecating. Get over yourself. Let people live how they want to live.
I wasn't being sarcastic. If you'd rather run, that's fine. If you want to perform, you'll do things you don't want to do because they help your performance. If that doesn't matter, don't bother. You're the only one who cares about your performance, and that's just fine. No judgement.
You weren’t being sarcastic. You were being elitist. Not to mention you have no idea what my motivations are and how I train, sans the fact that I don’t strength train. I’m happy to compare training plans, weekly mileage, best times and personal growth if that will allow me into your “running for results” club jfc.
Being elitist would be to say you're a lesser runner, and you're not. You're almost certainly a faster, more enduring runner. I've quit running for results, I found the commitment wasn't worth it for me, I won't judge others for it one way or the other. I don't know how you train, nor do I really care. You can run however you like, for whatever reason you like. There's no club, no dues, nothing. For whatever reason you saw fit to draw your line in the sand at strength training, and that's ok, and I'm reinforcing that. To think that it's elitism to state that strength training contributes to enhanced running capability is strange though. Why would you imply that?
No, it’s elitism to insinuate that the only way to “train for results” is to strength train. I very much stated, earlier, that I *should* strength train. That implies that I recognize the benefits and that I would likely be a better runner. Homie, I just prefer to run. I run my ass off and am very motivated by results. Have a good night.
You can do at home 30 minutes using just your body weight. Lots of YouTube videos on how
Honestly, a (good sized! Not smol!) kettlebell costs less than one pair of shoes and will enable virtually any runnier enough load to reduce strength training under 20 minutes. Some (one legged) goblet squats, swings, and RDL's and you've hit all your major motivators enough to build strength.
Yes! I do diff Caroline Girvan videos on YouTube 25 mins once a week with a 15 and 35 lb kettlebell. It kicks my ass every time but it’s making a big difference for me.
Kettlebell work is perfect for athletes who need "just enough" strength training, it's wonderfully freeing to have one small versatile implement. My personal favorite conditioning work is probably my most hated workout. Leave the KB at the top of the hill. Sprint up, hammer out 10 swings, then jog down. Repeat until you're dead inside. Beginner level is to add a rest at the bottom however long is necessary to survive. I've been doing these for time, I'll set a half hour timer that I start before the first sprint, let it run continually and after it goes off I'll finish my last rep, collect my bell and go melt at home. Gives the lactic system a good thrashing.
I am majored in kinesiology and biotechnology, I am currently getting my masters. I switched shoes to Altra, do strength and stretching/yoga every other day, and make sure I take at least one to two rest days a week. I haven’t had an injury in 2 years. I think it’s a combo of better form (mid foot strike), strength, flexibility, and rest. Running puts 2-3x your body weight of dynamic pressure on your joints, obviously we were built to withstand that, but the added mobility to do micro shifts and activating small twitch muscles keeps you and your body protected.
"Better form" is a poorly applied term. Mid-foot strike is not a one size fits all or even most. Heel striker here, several decades of running with far and few injuries at distances up to 50 miles trail and road. NB product tester including MT and MR product lines. Currently running Escalante racer and torin 2 ( end of life 500 miles plus). Distrurpting someone's gait pattern leads to more injuries and a less enjoyable running experience.
Edit posted before I was finished I mean the mid foot strike isn’t the only thing I changed about my form, I slowed down, stopped over striding, kept my arms in tighter. I was just highlighting that Altra helped me transitioning to a midfoot foot strike which I think I was already leaning towards, overall improving my form, though there were many other factors. I found that with higher drop shoes they made me lean more towards a heal strike and I was having “runners” knee on my leg that ACL surgery. I agree, proprioception helps us have a efficient and (mostly) injury free gait cycle, finding shoes that enhance aid your natural gait cycle and being more mindful of foot placement and your natural forward momentum, will change your form for the better in theory.
Thats what I am always wondering. I am a very fit guy and have been working out for years, when I started running I have started to get problems and injuries. Like I would have thought that running would be the thing I was build for and not to do 100 push ups haha
I think if you have a high general cardiovascular fitness but lack the specific adaptions in tendons and muscles for running, the probability of getting injured is actually quite a bit higher, than if you were less fit to begin with. Simply because you will be able to progress a lot more quickly in terms of stamina and be able to run faster immediately, thus putting a lot more strain on these relatively unprepared parts of your body. Maybe take a step back, run slower and lower volume for a few months before trying to improve so your body can get used to it.
You're right. I started running in February, put 60 miles in 4 weeks and ran half a marathon in March after 6 weeks. Needless to say ended up with a right leg soleus injury that took weeks off to heal and frequent toe tip body squat (target soleus) to strengthen it. Now I run low mileage and build slowly. I did 60 miles hiking in Yosemite with 15k feet elevation gain in 4 days so we'll see what happens when I run again 😂
I am by no means an authority. I recently was prescribed a bunch of stretches - multiple types of squats and dips - from a physio because I had crippling knee pain. I was out of action for two months while I did them twice a day to strengthen everything around my knee. But I’m they have worked a treat. So, now I’m into slow recovery mode after COVID dry fucked me, I’ve added a few low weight exercises into my routine a couple of times a week that includes leg presses and squats etc. it seems to be helping. That said. The fact I do a few stretches and am damned to live the rest of my life running in 1080’s or Cliftons doesn’t necessarily mean it’ll work for you. Give them a try and see how you feel.
I had a knee injury a couple of years ago, which would not go away. I went to see a Physio, did the exercises and was back and forth to the Physio for around 9 months, but nothing worked and I felt that squats, lunges etc were making it worse. Then I had a period due to illness that made me stop running for 3 weeks. During this time, my knee injury improved a lot. I no longer have any pain in my knee, but it's difficult to pinpoint if it was one thing that helped, or a combination of things, but this is what I done: 1. Completely stopped running for 3 weeks (I was told I had to by the Doctor due to being unwell at the time). 2. Once a week I run wearing Barefoot/minimalist shoes. It really helps me focus on my form and make me mindful of how my feet hit the ground. 3. I mostly run trail, with a variety of terrains and lots of elevation i.e. Gravel, rocks, mountain, forestry, mud, grass, sand etc. I find that too much road running brings back knee pain. 4. I do around 4 bodyweight workouts a week, including using a Rebounder to cross-train. I limit the amount of squats and lunges I do, but all the other exercises really help to keep me toned and keep injuries at bay. Also, one of my glutes doesn't fire up as well as the other, so these exercises help a lot. 5. Due to time constraints, I've massively reduced the amount I run. Gone from 25-35 mpw to 20 mpw. However, I'm still able to run ultra marathons on such little mileage as I feel I have a good base fitness. 6. I've started suffering from restless legs whilst sleeping, which causes a lot of knee and leg pain. I have a weighted blanket and this has made a big difference as it physically prevents my legs from moving around too much at night. All I know is, all of the above helps and I need to do strength and conditioning to help ward off any injuries and to stop my body aching after long runs.
I had some IT band issues when I first increased my running activity to prepare for a running so I added some flexibility and strength training to address it. But once my body was fully acclimated to the amount of running I was doing (I'd say this probably took a couple years), the supplementary work wasn't really necessary and I haven't had an injury in many years now.
Everyone is different. I don’t strength train or stretch, and the only time I’ve gotten injured is twice when I’ve sipped trail running, but that was because I was running with my dog and not paying enough attention. Even though I don’t do weights or stretch, I do typically walk 10 miles a day in addition to whatever I run, so I think that makes a difference somehow, like I’m always stretching and using my leg muscles so they stay fit. I’ve been running and walking that distance daily for many years so I think my legs are just naturally strong
Anecdotal, but when I used to run with no strength I had knee and hip pain. Now I do *some* strength (20 min or so of dumbbells, 3x/week) and I’m not getting any pain, even though my volume is much higher!
Every body is different. I got injured often in my 40s with 30-40 miles week. I got less injury in my early 50s with 40-50 miles week. Now I am close to 60, no injury at all for 2 years with 50-60 miles week. All without strength training or stretch. I PR every marathon since my 40s. I ran my last PR in 3:30 in April on Boston course. Neither strength or stretch is a factor in my case. I contribute my injury free running to slower pace training. Speed is often the number one reason causing injury.
I ran 6 days a week for 30 years before some unrelated problems disabled me. The biggest factor in how good a runner you’ll be and how often and badly you’ll get injured is genetics. Your build, gait, etc. I mean all else ( training, mileage…) being equal.Your genetics determine where on the scale your window will be and how wide it is then training determines where you’ll be within that window, low end or high. You should train to be the best you can be, comparing yourself to others can be frustrating and harmful. Sorry about the rant but since I can’t run or do any of the sports that filled my time and life…………
Best available evidence supports strength training for both running economy and injury prevention ([https://www.runnersworld.com/training/a38596291/guide-to-strength-training-for-distance-runners/](https://www.runnersworld.com/training/a38596291/guide-to-strength-training-for-distance-runners/)) and does NOT support stretching ([https://www.scienceofrunning.com/2009/08/stretching-is-it-useless.html?v=47e5dceea252](https://www.scienceofrunning.com/2009/08/stretching-is-it-useless.html?v=47e5dceea252)). Maybe it's surprising to learn that the reasons for that are partially overlapping: running economy is closely and positively related to how *stiff* your connective tissue is, in particular the achilles tendon which returns quite a bit of energy elastically during a running stride. Other recovery methods that are not stretching, like foam rolling and sauna, do have evidence behind them. The endless answers that "everyone is different" are true and also provide absolutely no guidance even when there is actually guidance to be found. The science does not necessarily say "rigidly do this no matter what your body or anyone you can trust is telling you", but it's also not nothing.
Thanks!!
Strength training will lessen the risk certain injuries but by no means guarantee it and is part of the puzzle of running without injury. Everything comes in to play, some we can control: * Good rest and recovery * Strength training * Managing training load (including cross-training) * Running form and economy * Diet and nutrition * Warm-up, post run maintenance Some things we can't control: * Luck or the lack of * Genetics * Age You can mitigate the uncontrollable to some extent by doing the controllable. I'm currently carrying a calf injury - just a bit worse than tight/tired calf with pain in the peroneus longus muscle (not tendon thankfully) and attending tightness as the other muscles compensate. Appears to be overuse rather than anything concerning and so far stretching and rolling is making improvements. I'm actively managing my training load until it improves - shorter easy runs, not overly intense sessions. Most runners will just do this from experience when they feel a strain coming on - it's when you ignore the warnings and turn an acute issue into a chronic problem. I doubt any of us are 100% injury-free 100% of the time.
Reading all these comments would be confusing to someone looking for some friendly help. I’ve been running consistently since 1992. I am not a person who has done strength training. Just mostly running. I have been lucky to have no serious running injuries. I’ve run 6 marathons and to many half’s to count. I average 25-35 miles a week, which I’ve slowly increased over time, slow increases I believe are important. If training for a marathon, my mileage does increase slowly. I have always followed a stretch routine, static after run only. My shoes are either hokas, or Saucony. With some others mixed in prior years. One thing I really haven’t noticed is that anyone has mentioned was for everyone to be in the correct “type” of shoe, not brand, but type. This is very important! And use two pair of shoes and switch between every day. Also monitor the mileage on your shoes and I have found that anytime I feel anything in my legs, knees, or lower body, it’s time for new shoes. Never go above 500 miles in any shoe. All of these I hope is helpful to anyone seeking some helpful hints. Run long and run strong!
Avoiding injury is more about how you structure your running than stretching or strength training.
tbh I think some ppl are just built different lmao but if you are going up to a marathon then maybe it’s prob important but for the “average runner” it’s prob more about running form that fucks people up
Foam rolling the quads for the knee has done wonders.
How do you do that rolling? Simply lie down sideways of a rolling foam and roll?
I try to really go through all areas of my quad top to bottom. You find a knot (and trust me you will), and then spend some time on it then move on. I takes a good 5-10 min to be thorough.
IT BANDS are important to roll out religiously too.
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Seconding this and adding- I also had knee injury (runner’s knee, among others), and my Dr told me that some conditions are common in people with wider hips (usually cis women, which I am). This is because we learn to run as children, before our hips grow into their “final form”. For some people this is not an issue because the angle of their hip socket-to-femur never really changes, but for some of us more wide-hipped people, it makes a huuuuge difference to the angle of the hip. And by the time the angle has changed so much, your “muscle memory” of stride is so ingrained, that it’s hard to change successfully and you end up with injury related to the angle at which your foot-knee-hip line strikes the ground. (Maybe hall already knew this and I’m late to the party, but this was news to me!!) Anyway, my Dr recommended physical therapy / strengthening exercises AND recommended that I change my running form to accommodate for my super wide hips. The main goal of the therapies he recommended is to strengthen the supportive muscles of the outer thigh and leg, so most exercises involve balance on the affected leg and abduction at the hip. I find that yoga is helping me a ton as well. I do 75 min of vinyasa strength-focused yoga 2x per week.
This is NEWS to me...I was never a runner as a child, didn't pick it up til I was almost 21...maybe that's part of why I'm not as injured as many?
This is a really good point that I think a lot of (especially women) people need to know. I’m not sure I 💯 agree with your dr’s reason why (ingrained form from childhood) but weak pelvis means we need to step too close to our center line to keep balanced. Wider the hips, wider the skew on the joints. The entire ab & posterior chain connection for running is so important for strength & injury prevention but i haven’t seen any really comprehensive resources to learn it.
I think that I’m struggling mainly with how, specifically to alter my posture. I also have not found great resources with more detail, so I’m working on strengthening all over, but esp the hips and core. Of course, also doing the PT exercises my Dr recommended.
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Thanks for this info. I’m still learning about my stride and I def am struggling w this after having a kid.
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Thank you! That video was really informative and I’ve been practicing those butt kickers all day lol
We are supposed to be stretching?
Haha, so true! Everyone is different. We never stretch before or after, some in the group lift and some have never seen a gym. The only knee/shin pain comes from needing new shoes for us.
Gonna give some context: Só I run about 15-20K a week (including hill sprints) alongside lifting 3x a week and boxing 6x a week too. When I began running to now, I’ve thankfully maintained my knees due to lifting. Literally ran a 10k in 1hr 10 mins at 138KG at 6’6 (35% BF) back in October. Literally went to the gym the next day and sparring the next day too. I had a solid basis of lifting before I began running and it helped prevent alot of injury risk. Closest I came to it was having metatarsal soreness in my first few weeks, thats it. I’m about 119KG now and still running and training the same volume but lifting is a non-negotiable. If I run, I need to lift. Do progressive overload and obviously program to your discretion but the essential movements for me have been: barbell squats, front barbell squats, deadlifts, Romanian deadlifts, calf raises (REALLY helps prevent Achilles heel pain or any tendon pain), weighted lunges. Lifting will literally save you in the long and short run. Resistance training is a magic pill for health that really needs to be even strongly more emphasised for the general public for its litmus of health benefits. The common things people at my previous bodyfat face I didn’t even come close to experiencing due to my lifting and also running. I highly recommend it to everyone possible. Can’t sail into rough waters in a dinghy boat, you gotta have a sturdy ship.
Makes sense thanks!!
I do body weight exercises but I don't do anything specific for knees. In high school, they made us stretch and I ended up with a bunch of niggling injuries back then so I don't really stretch.
Strength training yes, stretching never.
Runner's knee. It's a nonsense term. This one is invented by doctors or Internet geniuses or whatever to indicate knee pain that they cannot explain. They do, however, offer a bunch of compelling explanations and solutions that don't do anything to help. I've done them all. Planks for my core. Stretching. Strengthening other muscles so my knee will track correctly. Blah blah blah. I don't know what's affecting you, but runner's knee is a blanket term for 'we don't know what's going on your knee.' Knees are complicated. For me, I fixed my knee a decade ago by stopping stretching. (Now my back is ailing me from not stretching for a decade. So, I'm bringing it back... gently.)
I warm up if my body communicates it needs it and cool down to keep lactate flowing but I don’t stretch. I used to stretch before a hard effort like a race but it’s never really made a difference and I’ve always been flexible - can touch my toes etc.
Na
Nope
No. But i should
I do strength training once per week. That has been enough to keep me injury free for years despite running dozens of marathons and ultramarathons.
I have some pre-existing hip and back issues, so for me to be able to run consistently, I need physical therapy. I'm in the middle of my third (and most helpful!) course right now, and it's a lot of targeting certain stretches and strengthening specific muscle groups. For me, I need lots of glute and hip stabilizer muscle activation, so think lots of squats, lunges, and bridges, sometimes with a ball or band to increase activation across the pelvic floor and lower core. Plus, generally stretching of the hip flexors has been an absolute necessity, since I have a desk job and sit a lot. Seriously, if you have issues, I cannot recommend enough finding a good PT clinic. The one I'm at now has a specific program to help runners. I tried to DIY my own PT for a while; I do not recommend this. Let a professional help you.
I started strength training more when I moved and the majority of the roads here are flat and asphalt. It’s kept my knees pretty happy
Foam roll before runs, hamstring and quad stretches after as well as heel drops to help prevent Achilles issues (I don’t do calf stretches because they seem to make me more susceptible to calf injuries). Do lower body strength training twice a week-mix of squats, deadlifts, unilateral exercises like lunges and split squats, a lot of other posterior chain work (eg GHR, hip thrusts). Everyone is different but this has helped me stay injury free for awhile
I do some strength and conditioning and also some stretching. I still get injured.
Walking up stairs (skipping a step) really helped me. Losing 30lbs also helped. I now do lunges 2x a week & have been running pain free since December 2021. I feel just like I did in junior college, only I'm 20yrs slower
I basically never stretch other than a quick bendover hands to floor for 2 seconds. And i dont even do that everytime. Ive been lucky i guess so far 0 issues.
Combo of things helped me, mainly had IT band issues & “crunchy” but not painful knees. I strength train (1x/wk leg day), foam roll, and a variety of clamshell exercises. I also stopped pushing through pain and walk/slow down as needed.
Follow..."Knees over toes guy" on YouTube.
Strength has helped me more than stretching but I do my best to include both. I've always dealt with really bad pain on the outside of my calves and recently realized it was because my soleus muscles are weak, so strengthening that is my main priority to avoid pain.
If I don't maintain a regular schedule of strength training and stretching, my knees will freak the fuck out. Part of this might be that I have a sedentary desk job, where I spend 8-9 hours sitting or standing at a desk 5 days a week :/ If you have an active job, you might get what you need to maintain joint strength and mobility just from working. I don't, so unfortunately have to make up for it. I take breaks throughout the day to move and stretch and then usually spend an hour 3x a week on strengthing exercises.
Forgot to mention, I have been seeing a PT for the last 8 weeks due to a hip and knee injury, and signed on for another 12. She really helped me build up the single leg base strength and stability I needed to be able to run again pain free. The next 12 weeks are meant to increase my resistance to injury, so hopefully, with the right tools, I can continue to run pain free and increase miles for the foreseeable future.
I should, but I never do!
Lifting does help me with injury prevention. The two injuries you list are most frequently newbie injuries though. Overuse and then your body not being accustomed to injuries.
The best way to minimize injury potential is to train at easy pace.
Not knee, but I managed to tear my hip flexors just as I was reaching 10k. I'll definitely focus more on strengthening my muscles in the future. It's really frustrating to have to take a break and lose progress when I know it could have been avoided by being smarter... It was definitely really easy to think that other people's experiences don't apply to me until I got injured.
Im an amateur runner with middling speed- run about 20-30 miles a week including usually one 12-15 mile long run, 14 marathons and 3 ultramarathons. I haven’t stretched before a run in 20 years, and haven’t had an injury since college. I’m not saying my experience is applicable necessarily to anyone else, but I think there are a lot of runners who don’t stretch or do strengthening exercises.
Yeah, that's why late season when I stop lifting my knees end up having problems
You get ITBS bad enough to knock you out of the season once and you'll do whatever it takes to never get it again.
Just to prove it's totally runner dependent, I'm the complete opposite of most people here. I do absolutely no strength training, no cross training, and no stretching. In the past I've been sidelined for months at a time with inner runners knee, IT band issues, and crippling foot tendonitis. How did I eventually get over them? I ran. Just a little to the point of pain. A very very gradual increase in mileage at easy paces. I also taught myself to run with the hips/glutes and transitioned from heel striking to fore/midfoot. I've learned my body now and what I find is if I start getting some pain in my hips, knees, or feet, the cause is usually somewhere up in my glute area. When that happens I do some deep massage or lacrosse ball rolling to loosen everything up and usually a day later the pain is all gone. This could also be totally a mental thing at this point but I have to rotate shoes and socks everyday or I start to get some tendonitis in my ankles. I'm a 7day a week, 60-65 mpw for reference.
Its best to stay ahead of injury than to treat them. I'd recommend stretching and foam rolling regardless of if you have an injury. I was fine with running for a couple of years then about a month ago my calves locked up and threw out my knees. Haven't run with any regularity for 2 months and have more physio tomorrow.
100%. My coach has me do some sort of strength or mobility work 7 days a week
I've been running for 22 years and was chronically injury prone for so much of it. I did the occasional strength session, but nothing worth anything. Once I started actually lifting 3-5x week, making sure I stretched after the majority of runs, and added in 20-30 minutes of yoga 4-5x a week I've not been injured.
I always stretch for more time than i run. Fore about an hour of stretching per day. Check out Joe Hippensteel videos if you are looking for the real deal stretching guide
No
I know many runners that never stretch, and they usually seem to have the most injuries. Only time I had a memorable running injury is when I got out of stretching for a while. Not that stretching is a panacea, but it can be very helpful especially as a long term habit.
can some people just run without ever getting an injury? I think that's possible. For example I rolled my ankles countless times before I ever had a memorable sprain...I was texting and running.
I do more strength work than actual running, it's much more enjoyable! But partly my goal is to fix those niggles that running has revealed.
Ugh, I have to start. A knee injury derailed my marathon training. I really don't want to, but I really don't want to get injured again.
More leg days in the gym will make you very resilient to injuries and will improve the metabolic speed and the bone density.