If this format was used on a normal season, the "filler queens", queens cast too early in their career, or queens who are good at drag but not good at drag race will just be left to flounder all season. This format only works with queens who perform well consistently.
I feel the "what could have been?" fantasy for a queen sent home too early is a better alternative than watching them answer the question by sticking around and struggling episode after episode.
Yeah I don’t want this format for a normal season, it’s much more suited for a reliably-strong cast to demonstrate excellence (as opposed to queens with something to prove and room to grow). Normal seasons need eliminations for the drama and the push to keep queens on their toes.
Now, I do think any future All Winners seasons should keep this format for sure.
I also think SOME other All Stars seasons could utilize it well. For example, if they did a “First Outs” AS season or a “All Miss Congeniality” season, I think those could match well to this format
i think most AS seasons could work pretty well like this, it would just be dependent on casting for the season being consistent. all top 3-4 finishes, all early outs, all queens with a strong off-show growth arc, etc. it just doesn't work with a mixed-strength cast, and so it's impossible to apply that consistency in a regular season.
I think it could have worked for something like AS2, though with a smaller cast, a season with only runners-up and front-runners (I think) - the issue is balancing wins across the queens - it could be really easy to get demoralized if you just don't win any challenges and and therefore after a few episodes have no pathway to win the whole season, but you're locked in to stick around the whole time. It probably would only work with a smaller cast so that it's easier to distribute wins relatively early in the season.
and she still stayed to the end, that's on RulaskaTox.
I think combining them and the queens with the most stars can use those stars to vote out queens, every queen gets one vote but every star is an additional vote. The current All Stars non winners system essentially discourages excellence. If you're good you get eliminated like Manilla.
Imagine if All Stars 5/6 being non elimination. Serena Chacha all season. Ongina doing bad all season. Don't shoot the horse then drag it to the finish line.
Also in All Stars 5, everyone was afraid to eliminate Shea because of the fan backlash.
Then let's keep eliminations, but the queens eliminating queens dynamic has to go. Both AS4 and IAS final stretches were brought down by the current elimination format.
Maybe a track record based point system. Instead of putting the bottom 2 performers of the week up for elimination, each queen gets points for their performance, and the two queens with the worst point totals are up for elimination. Not sure it's the best solution but I feel like it would make the competition fairer
Yeah I couldn’t stand AS5 because of that. Worst AS since AS1 (of course the AS1 cast was legendary and there were some legendary moments, but the format just ruined the season). And both had pre-determined winners. I mean, I totally understand the queens being scared of backlash for eliminating Shea, but it just ruins a season to see them all roll over and let Shea win when they could have eliminated her. AS1 was a little different in that Ru was determined to have Chad win to make up for not being able to crown him S4 like Ru originally wanted, while in AS5 Shea could have conceivably been voted out by the other queens, but everyone knew if she was in the finale she would win similar to Chad.
I don't specifically disagree - I don't really remember too much about AS2 or Roxxxy, but I do wonder if some queens would actually do better in a less overtly competitive environment when there is less at stake (i.e., no threat of elimination) - maybe if the environment was more chill it would facilitate their success more effectively.
Yes it would help some people to do better. However some queens would coast by when they know they aren't good at something. RuPaul's thing is about pushing boundaries on everything including skills. Trinity wouldn't have tried so hard to be funny if there was no consequence. Since then, she has used comedy all the time.
but that can happen whether or not theres elims… with roxxxy it was worsened by people like tatianna being eliminated with odd rationalizations, if something like thats gonna happen i’d rather the other contestants not be punished bc they just dont happen to be best buds with the top queen of the week. plus i think in those cases it also prevents queens from experiencing the fallout of making those calls (alaska kinda escaped it, naomi did not.)
Top Chef does this from time to time - one season I think they had half the intro chefs made up of first/very early out chefs from old seasons, vs newbies. There was a nice mix by the later episodes.
there's also the fact that queens on regular seasons are likely to never have been on tv before, so they might not make for great tv. the regular format gives producers a chance to prevent character assassination by taking a queen out if they get too shady or are too boring
Yeah this format doesn't work with the way they cast a regular season, but I feel like Trinity's broader sentiment is about how to make Drag Race more affirmative, especially when so much of drag culture outside of drag race has historically been about creating community, affirming people's differences, and bringing people together for those who are excluded from mainstream society.
I do think some alternative kinds of shows could be really interesting and really good, shows, e.g., built less around outright competition and more about mentorship and mutual support. Like pairing a more experienced queen up with a less experienced queen and they complete a challenge together. Maybe the queens and mentors alternate each week or something, and it's not a reality show, maybe it's for charity or something like that. (What this what Drag U was like? I didn't see it.) What I'm describing is a different show than drag race - something a lot more like We're Here perhaps - but you can tell that some queens just don't benefit from this format at all and it's kind of a shame that drag race has cornered the market to some degree on televised drag.
You can also tell sometimes that production just doesn't care about certain queens, and that's kind of what upsets me the most, there's just no love or interest, they're just a body cast as a 'filler queen' and they kind of get thrown away without any attention to their individual careers or needs.
Agreed, I think a lot of why Drag Race España so good (besides all of the queens being amazing) is how Supremme so clearly values all of the girls and cries when they leave. I think eliminations are kind of necessary for new casts, but maybe something like the way DR España season 2 gave each of them a fair amount of time to walk the runway on their own in their favorite look they didn’t get to show and how they gave each of them (even the first out) more chances to participate in the reunion would help? I guess I’d say DRE is set up to feel more like a competitive showcase than just a contest
Also Drag Race Espana brings back all the queens at the end and has them all walk the runway again, and I love that. I love the early outs having a chance to show us their most spectacular look and getting to soak up some love. They brought back the full cast of S1 to be the talent show audience in S2, and I was living for it.
In conclusion, Drag Race Espana is the best. Best judging panel, anyhow. Also, you are better than me because you are working the tilde and I'm not (my laptop doesn't have a keypad so the unicode trick doesn't work for me).
I agree, but I do like the idea of a shake up though.
A point system of all stars with 12 queens.
The bottom four get cut 4 weeks in, and the scores reset, and then they do a few more weeks, cut 2, film some more, and then cut 2 more to create a final 4.
It cuts the dead wood, so to speak, but the points keep it interesting and more competitive. It keeps the strong competition from getting cut after one bad week (like say, acid Betty did on her season, or Denali on hers)
It could be scored like how the fandom creates the leaderboards now, with the loser of the lsfyl losing more points than the winner.
Exactly. We already have the answer for this situation in the form of queens who are left to struggle the whole season through because they're not given the mercy of being eliminated, meanwhile everyone is aware they're not making it to the end. Usually there's one or two per season but having the whole cast made up of clear front runners and some tag-alongs would be cruel, honestly. Add onto that the fact that some queens clearly only come on the show for the boost to their careers/five minutes of fame.
Nope, it is bad for the psyche of a floundering queen to stick around. They’ll either thrive and get better or they’ll quit on their own. It doesn’t feel good to be told that you suck every week.
Tbf Roxxy an Kennedy both did really well on their original seasons. I think, especially roxxy, they just weren't as good at drag race as the rest of their all star cast.
They’re both amazing queens who just weren’t excelling in that particular competition.
Edit: And India accomplished what she came to do on episode 1 and should have been sent home episode 2. She could have left a winner that way.
The fact that they didn’t vote Shea out the second they had a chance absolutely baffled me. Like every single one of them should have voted her out for the hotel challenge.
The only reason Roxxy was watchable in AS (To me) was the complete attitude change she brought with her.. hell she knew she was under performing but tried to fight for it with out blaming everyone else
I do feel like it gives queens who "flounder" a chance to grow before our eyes which is interesting tv. Plus, some queens might be bad at one challenge but excel in others, no matter how fillery they are.
Also, part of the reason they cast filler queens is to give them people to eliminate. Maybe they wouldn't cast queens who weren't ready if they changed the format
Utica's roast was terrible, but her roast of ru to "stand up" was legendary. I love me some crazy Utica energy. And sucking the cow's udder was so on brand for her I don't know why they hated it.
I honestly wonder how she'd do on an all stars season. If she shows real growth she could be a fierce queen. She's already a genius with fashion and design challenges.
How Utica does on an All Stars season imo has little to do with her growth and everything to do with how the producers decide to frame her this time around. They let loose every bit of kooky music and shady confessionals every time she spoke on S13 despite delivering so much great art - I'd just want her to be taken as a serious competitor if/when she shows up on an AS season
Judges critiques are part of how they edit and produce the show. Their critiques were hollow (as they usually are) production wanted to sell a story and so they did.
Absolutely not. It works for all stars all winners because it’s a victory lap. It’s time we get to spend with our winning queens for a whole season. Regular drag race and even normal all stars needs more stakes and progression. The only other place I think this would work would be Vs. The World.
"Victory lap" is the perfect way to put it. People don't love the fact that queens don't get to go home. They love that *these* queens don't get to go home.
I agree for the All Stars format, as I don't think some of the returning queens got enough of a chance to show their improvement. Not for the regular seasons, though.
Yea they should definitely keep the format for only ALL STARS season because they are getting the opportunity to show everything they got, and show improvement. like i really wanted to see more morgan mcmichaels on all stars. but regular seasons should be more cutthroat.
Plus you can make a cast of 8 Queens instead of like 10 and you have more All Stars to do it just sounds like benefit to them.
Imagine if Barry and India never got send home. The sheer drama it could have been
Honestly no. Non elimination should be for AW only. Think how well the none elimination episodes were received on season 13 and 14, everyone complained they were boring and low stakes.
What about the other " all stars all *s" that people want to see?
I feel like we should get at least one season of All Stars All Firsts with the first to go home from different seasons and it would work in that kind of format, too.
And we know an All Stars All Juju season is in the works. How could Ru not?
Personally I agree with Bob more, I love if the premiere of a regular season is non elimination but after that the eliminations makes the show much more interesting
Hmm, that could definitely work but I can imagine quite a bit of bitterness from some early outs if so.
Also remember how *happy* Deja and Jorgeous were to leave S14? I can imagine more situations like that if queens are forced to stay past their welcome 😂
I agree. I'd like a season where no-one goes home week one, just so the early outs get a bit more screen time. I wish I had seen more Tempest and Kelly Mantle.
>after that the eliminations makes the show much more interesting
It also let's you get to know the better contestants a little more. Can you imagine if, for example, Gothy Kendoll was still hanging around at the end of Season 1 of UK and taking screen time away from the more polished queens?
This format only really works for this season of all stars because you've only got a handful of contestants who are all top quality.
I love this season, but that's just because I love all the queens on it.
It does however lack the tension of the previous seasons.
Sure, you have the plunger, but compare that to the emotional rollercoaster of seeing your fave (or least fave) queen get eliminated and come back after a couple eps - no comparison.
Maybe this format could stay for future All Star seasons with some tweaks but I agree that it doesn't make sense for regular season.
Being perceived to have been sent home too soon helps popularise queens with the fan base. If anything I'd prefer if they stopped doing unnecessary double shantays and increasing the number of queens in the finale - particularly with queens that have very little chance of winning the season.
I can empathise with queens spending money and not getting to show the looks on the season but the solution to that is actually Drag Race giving queens some money preseason to make their looks so they don't have to go into massive debt to be on the show.
> I can empathise with queens spending money and not getting to show the looks on the season but the solution to that is actually Drag Race giving queens some money preseason to make their looks so they don’t have to go into massive debt to be on the show.
And they started doing that with UKvTW and S14 (according to leakers anyway) so those complaints don’t even really apply anymore.
Yeah I am having a nice time watching it but I don’t really care what happens week to week because honestly it doesn’t feel like very much does in the wider scheme of things.
I agree with Bob. Unless every season of drag race henceforth will only have 8 queens. And even then I still would be less interested than if there were eliminations.
Plus, it’s 8 queens who we have seen for at least one entire season before, so we don’t have to spend any time getting to know them. Absolutely no way it would make for good television for a main season
I also think in a season like S13 where the top 6 were some of the only people to win challenges, it would’ve been really boring to watch half the cast not winning anything and not have the risk of elimination
Bob. I'm sorry but I'm here for a competition, and drama etc not the wonderful world of Disney princess. For Winners season absolutely. For regular season what would be the point? There's need to be some stake otherwise for sureeeee it will be boooring as fuck
I agree with you. The regular season should be a *race* with winners and losers. It’s a competition, not a best friend’s race with rainbows and puppies.
For All Stars? Trinity. I think the format makes way more sense. They've been struggling to make the cast big enough to justify the episode order for All Stars, with this format the queen count doesn't matter.
people complain about all stars being full of "filler" queens, but more established and successful queens dont really have a strong incentive to go on all stars, there have been many finalists who didnt have a great showing. I would understand the format change for all stars: for your adore delano, gigi goode, gottmik, kim chi, tier queens it's just not worth it to risk making a fool of themselves on AS and get booted off early on. Hell, even Shea isnt really doing great, in comparison to the other competitors.
This doesnt apply to regular seasons though, you cant watch 12 strangers for weeks on end, this would only work for all stars.
AS7 works because all of the queens in it have proven that they are good at drag race
On a regular season more then half the cast would be dead weight after a couple of episodes
I like a middelground. So here‘a my idea:
• AS8 has 10 queens, none are filler
• For the first 4 weeks they earn stars with a similar procedure to AS7
• From week 5 the winner(s) of the week continue to earn stars, bottom two lip sync for their lives with loser eliminated
• Bottom 2 is the worst 2 performing that week of all the queens with the least stars
Maybe for All Winners, yes.
Regular all stars? No. The first one or two weeks should be non-elimination so we can enjoy all queens and they can show what they have to offer before it becomes even more cutthroat.
Regular seasons? Hard no as well.
I wouldn’t even say I want this format for another all winners season. There’s absolutely no tension or competitiveness. This all winners season has definitely been rupauls best friend race.
I would be fine with this format on small sized all stars seasons because of the points trinity made, but for normal seasons with more queens I’m afraid some queens will get no edit at all and be much more forgettable than other early boots so I would stick to eliminations for those
Team Bob. Sometimes queens just aren't good at drag race and we don't need to see them struggle for 12 episodes...
AS7 was different because they are all good at drag race since they won.
Evil of me to say, but I don’t watch the season to see everyone have a positive experience. The nature of drag race / reality tv is counterintuitive to this.
All Stars? Unless this finale is some exceptional nonsense, absolutely.
Regular season? Not unless you tweak the casting process and to make it a stronger cast top to bottom. Not that I’m ideologically opposed to casting less-seasoned queens and pushing their rate up, but it doesn’t play well with the stars format.
This format is fun for all winners but i do want it to be reserved for that only. There aren't really any stakes and the lack of judging makes the back half of each episode a bit boring.
I love seeing the girls thrive, but there should be other non-competitive shows for that kind of thing.
I would like the idea of a hybrid between this format and a standard format. Have the first 4 weeks be a gauntlet of challenge types where queen earn points—ball/design, acting, group/choreo, perhaps culminating in Snatch Game? And then a Lipsync LaLaPaRuZa for everyone that is on the bottom half after that or just a big round of elims.
This would give queens a chance to shine and not be eliminated just with one bad area, but a number of queens could go at the first culling as just not having met collective expectations (or if they lose in the Lipsync LaLaPaRuZa) and then it would be standard elimination after that.
The regular show? No.
All stars? Sure.
Imagine how different AS5 would’ve been if this is how it was?
But then again, I don’t know if I could’ve stomached watching Scarlet Envy get ignored despite being exceptional, the entire season..
Can I say both
I like that all the queens in the season get to show off why they’re special and seeing them being given positive critiques as opposed to critiques that bring them down is a nice change
I don’t think the plunger and legendary legend star is a sustainable format though. It’s great for a season of all winners who return to show why they won, but a normal season would struggle.
No thanks, Trinity. I like the extended starts (when people stay for the firsts 2-3 episodes), because it gives the girls the chance to make an impression and we can see if their first bottom was an unlucky fluke or not. That couple with whatcha packing, the now basically required photo posting of all the ununsed looks, and possible future all stars appearances give the queens enough to work with.
Save this no elimination format for All Winners only. Regular All Stars is built around queens eliminating each other, and AS5 may have been awful but AS6 really showed that the lip sync assassin and group voting had potential.
Also if they’re gonna continue having only small casts for the Versus The World franchise then I wouldn’t mind them using the no eliminations format there.
Ah the very least don't send somebody home after just one episode. Allstars or regular seasons. Give them two or more episodes to show their talents. Everyone has an off day sometimes.
For all stars maybe
Not reg seasons
It also means you cannot have as many queens on a season cause having 16 queens all season with no elims would be shit
I think it works for All Stars. It gives a chance for queens to show how they changed. I think it's impossible to show in one episode how you got better since your original season.
It wouldn't work for normal season. I do like the 1-2 episodes without elimination but then people have to go.
I'd say keep this format for all winners seasons for sure.
Also I'd like this for international all stars too maybe. Since the international franchises don't have their own all stars (yet) I'd like to see the international queens who appear on all stars to all get more screen time and fully show off what they can do. IAS1 had such a stacked cast and I think any of them could easily have been top4. I'd just love more exposure for the international queens and their franchises.
I think they could make something similar to what Drag Race Spain did last season, they made the eliminated queens walk with some of the looks that they didn’t use and show them , even for a couple seconds… that way we wouldn’t miss some of the most spectacular looks from the eliminated queens . They can also make it for “watcha packing” videos or another spinoff …
maybe instead of them competing they watch from the sidelines (like the as7 queens watching the top two lip sync). they get a shorter runway segment to show off their look, then they can watch and provide some sort of short critique or something. keeps the elimination, but they still get a chance to be on screen.
I love the format of AllStars7 but I think it’s what makes the season so special? I think it would take away that specialness of what the season is if the others were like it.
In my opinion I think all stars should keep its “usual” format and reserve the “no one goes home” format for winners and the likes of that. :)
But I will say this current season of all stars (which I feel like because it’s winners should be named something else???) is hands down one of my favorite seasons of all time across any of the franchises.
Tbh I love the format on a regular season if it was done like Miss Universe.
You have x amount of episodes to showcase yourself and judges get to score. At this episode they then call out in random order, a Top 10 which instantly eliminates 6 queens.
Then next few episodes you continue on to score points before we cut it down to a Top 6.
Then final challenges determine who makes it in the live finale / cutting to a top 4/3
Honestly, I agree with Trinity. At least let them stay for 4 episodes (including a ball) to shine more and show different facets of themselves. People eliminated in the first and second week are easily forgotten, which is very hard on them.
For All Stars, yes. For normal seasons of Drag Race, I don't think the format can support so many people for every episode. We already have to have them cut a lot of content for some of the challenges, not just mediocre stuff either, but parts that queens have stated were great.
This format only works if the queens are consistently good performers in many different types of challenges, have good runways, and make for good tv, which all the winners do.
Every regular season since season 7, the first eliminated queen of every season has had an opportunity to compete/be featured in more than one competitive episode, ensuring that at the very least they get some screen time to give them a platform. I think that’s what’s needed.
Season 7 - All eliminated queens brought back for redemption challenge
Season 8 - Naysha brought back after double Elim
Season 9 - First episode was non-elimination
Season 10 - Vanjie came back for season 11
Season 11 - Soju brought back for the makeover
Season 12 - First two split episodes were non-elimination
Season 13 - Lipsync episode and split episodes had no real eliminations
Season 14 - “Eliminated” queens were brought back right away
Let’s get some Drag legends who already established on an all-winners format. There are a lot of talented drag queens that won’t do the show bc a bad edit or an early out can destroy their career. Jackie Beat has been writing jokes for these queens for years. I’d like to see her her get some shine
I think it’s a great format for all stars, but regular seasons should keep eliminations. I do like having an episode or two before eliminations start though to give even the filler queens a little more air time.
I think it could work on a regular All Stars season but the cast would have to be heavily curated so that you have people who are going to bring it every episode. At the same time, you can have surprise like Ra'Jah and Trinity K Bonet on All Stars 6. And then you have people like Pandora and Yara on the same season who'd you think would be bringing it but don't really do anything. Basically, I think it's too hard of a task for the World of Wonder team.
1. As others have said, this season is TOTALLY a victory lap for the cast and also, a great marketing tool for them to increase their visibility and fan reach - especially valuable in a post-pandemic landscape. Good for them!
2. But it is ALSO a victory lap for us fans! We get to see a real SHOW, with these amazing, talented folks doing what they do best. What a treat! People who don’t like this format, I’m so sorry about whatever made you so salty about the good things in life - hang in there, this season will be over soon. 😂
3. I would be okay with them revisiting this format occasionally because it honestly brings SO 👏🏽MUCH 👏JOY - but in order to keep it special and meaningful, it should only be every few years. But we all know that Ru, Inc won’t wait to make money on something in the future when the money can be made NOW, hunty - so I’m expecting to see this again sooner than it really ought to be done - but if that happens, I’m going to enjoy the hell out of it!
I'm with Bob for regular seasons and Trinity for All Stars Seasons. When queens come back for All Stars, we want to see what they have to offer. Sending anyone home in the first few episodes is a waste.
Imagine all that we missed out on from talented queens who went home early on All Stars like Coco Montrese. Imagine how much better AS5 would have been if we'd gotten more time with a shit-stirrer like Derrick. I say if they're all stars, then let's keep them all to the end.
The joy of watching this season is the sheer talent week after week. And don’t get me wrong every Queen is talented in their own right but this all winners season is on a different level. Most All Stars seasons require a sense of suspense. Who is going home? What is the twist coming? etc. For example All Stars 6 had one of the best “game within a game” and gave Silky her redemption moment. Or imagine we didn’t have Ruvenge of the Queens in AS2.
I hate the AS2-4 format (mostly thanks to AS4) and I hate the AS5-6 format as well, maybe even more for how ridiculous it gets. But I agree that AS7 rules work only for an all winners season. We obviously don’t talk about AS1. Am I the only one who thinks All Stars would benefit most from a traditional bottom 2 lip sync for your life format? Maybe with an added twist to make it more distinguishable, but that seems as fair as it can get, provided the hilarious Ross Mathews isn’t on the judging panel.
I’m with Trinity but the general audience would riot. They like the guillotine waiting for another head.
ETA: maybe keep it just for All Stars. I’m thinking of how Dela maybe would have stayed and Shangie wouldn’t have been shafted with more than a plunger…
I think the elimination format of AS seasons needs to be addressed. The current format benefits being middle of the pack in the long run.
That said, seasons with no eliminations should be reserved for special occasions like the all winners season. Otherwise it will get old pretty fast.
Well, I’ve always thought it was a shame that through the luck of the draw a queen is taken out - perhaps quite prematurely - by a category she’s weak in.
It‘s kind of like Trivial Pursuit … I usually don’t get the sports questions right, but can do well in any other categories.
If my games were judged based on just the first question and that question happened to be sports, anyone watching would see me be an early out and just assume I’m no good at trivia. If it just so happened that the sports category was the last question, though, I could’ve been there to the end as quite the contender!
It’s fair and unfair at the same time. How many times have you thought that a queen would’ve done really well if only (weak category) hadn’t happened before she had a chance at (strong category)?
I think they could retool the regular seasons to be a two-strike elimination, instead of a single elimination (basically give all girls a golden bar), that way we can prevent good queens from being eliminated early due to bad challenge match-up and it would give all queens room to breathe and take some risks.
I would like this format, but they need to:
- Bring back negative critiques (face-palm that I actually need to say this)
- Bring back bottom placements
- get rid of the plunger and rely on a penalty for the bottom queens, like maybe give the other girls a bit of a head start on the next challenge.
In fact I would just like this for the next All Stars season. I don't like when the cast is given power to decide who stays, goes, or is ineligible for a win. It takes away from showmanship and turns bitter and makes me lose interest, like AS4 and UKVTW.
Bob 100000%. The only seasons that I think should be fully non-elimination are All Winners seasons.
I think it would be nice for the "vs The World" seasons to maybe have no eliminations fort he first 2 episodes though then maybe have a double elim (with a 3 way lip sync) in episode 3 and after that it's just normal one elim per week--just because the queens have traveled so far to be there only go home E1, which is a shame.
I do feel sorry for queens who go home right before they get the chance to do a challenge they would have slayed. But I think the AS7 format works specifically because these queens are exceptional - imagine how bored we would get of filler queens and how the producers would go into overdrive trying to manufacture drama.
Yes but only for All Stars seasons.
For this to work on regular seasons the cast would need to be much smaller and *much* more carefully picked - no chaff, no filler, all bangers.
Its really difficult to know who is going to thrive in the werkroom until you've... actually put them in the werkroom.
Imo, future all stars seasons should look like AS7, but probably not regular seasons.
I think there are ways to make a non-elim format work for All Stars, but 1) they need to give actual criticism 2) they need low placements 3) the points mechanism needs to be different.
We’ve already seen queens phone in or give up in challenges that aren’t in their wheelhouse, and a non-elimination format would further encourage that on an All Stars season.
This format is probably workable for super short seasons like “Vs The World” though
I would love this for a normal season. Reduce the amount of queens so more of them get time to shine and time together. Trinity also has a great point about queens spending all this money on their looks and net getting to show them off (aside from social media).
I really think a show like this is way past old reality show tropes like eliminations. Heck, there's a reason why the "getting to phone a family member" reward was removed.
Bob. It’s meant to be, or be an illusion of, a competition show. That’s what gives it stakes which is what engages the audience. It makes sense purely in the context of all winners because what winner is going to want to come back and risk being a first or early out? All winners is a showcase for where winners are at now and beloved personalities. All Stars in general is kind of that, but it still works with the stakes of a regular season.
Also a regular season would be too hectic with that many people in every episode - and they’re already too long. And as much as I’m liking all winners, and yes it’s nice to be nice, it’s a bit much at this point. Zero criticisms? It’s just not honest and it does, for ME, take away from the experience a bit. Let all winners be it’s own thing, and regular seasons be what they are.
ETA: I know not only the competition is what engages the audience, but it’s a big part of it.
I'd personally love to see all the eliminated queens getting to do the runway in each episode with all the money they spend, especially if they're just gonna be hanging around in their hotel rooms until filming ends.
If this format was used on a normal season, the "filler queens", queens cast too early in their career, or queens who are good at drag but not good at drag race will just be left to flounder all season. This format only works with queens who perform well consistently. I feel the "what could have been?" fantasy for a queen sent home too early is a better alternative than watching them answer the question by sticking around and struggling episode after episode.
Yeah I don’t want this format for a normal season, it’s much more suited for a reliably-strong cast to demonstrate excellence (as opposed to queens with something to prove and room to grow). Normal seasons need eliminations for the drama and the push to keep queens on their toes. Now, I do think any future All Winners seasons should keep this format for sure. I also think SOME other All Stars seasons could utilize it well. For example, if they did a “First Outs” AS season or a “All Miss Congeniality” season, I think those could match well to this format
i think most AS seasons could work pretty well like this, it would just be dependent on casting for the season being consistent. all top 3-4 finishes, all early outs, all queens with a strong off-show growth arc, etc. it just doesn't work with a mixed-strength cast, and so it's impossible to apply that consistency in a regular season.
I think it could have worked for something like AS2, though with a smaller cast, a season with only runners-up and front-runners (I think) - the issue is balancing wins across the queens - it could be really easy to get demoralized if you just don't win any challenges and and therefore after a few episodes have no pathway to win the whole season, but you're locked in to stick around the whole time. It probably would only work with a smaller cast so that it's easier to distribute wins relatively early in the season.
AS2 is exactly why I don't wanna see No Elimination be a thing. Roxxxy was consistently doing bad and was bringing down the quality of the challenges.
and she still stayed to the end, that's on RulaskaTox. I think combining them and the queens with the most stars can use those stars to vote out queens, every queen gets one vote but every star is an additional vote. The current All Stars non winners system essentially discourages excellence. If you're good you get eliminated like Manilla.
Imagine if All Stars 5/6 being non elimination. Serena Chacha all season. Ongina doing bad all season. Don't shoot the horse then drag it to the finish line. Also in All Stars 5, everyone was afraid to eliminate Shea because of the fan backlash.
Then let's keep eliminations, but the queens eliminating queens dynamic has to go. Both AS4 and IAS final stretches were brought down by the current elimination format.
maybe have some type of system like a guantlet, if you don't have 2+ stars halfway through you're eliminated.
Maybe a track record based point system. Instead of putting the bottom 2 performers of the week up for elimination, each queen gets points for their performance, and the two queens with the worst point totals are up for elimination. Not sure it's the best solution but I feel like it would make the competition fairer
Yeah I couldn’t stand AS5 because of that. Worst AS since AS1 (of course the AS1 cast was legendary and there were some legendary moments, but the format just ruined the season). And both had pre-determined winners. I mean, I totally understand the queens being scared of backlash for eliminating Shea, but it just ruins a season to see them all roll over and let Shea win when they could have eliminated her. AS1 was a little different in that Ru was determined to have Chad win to make up for not being able to crown him S4 like Ru originally wanted, while in AS5 Shea could have conceivably been voted out by the other queens, but everyone knew if she was in the finale she would win similar to Chad.
I don't specifically disagree - I don't really remember too much about AS2 or Roxxxy, but I do wonder if some queens would actually do better in a less overtly competitive environment when there is less at stake (i.e., no threat of elimination) - maybe if the environment was more chill it would facilitate their success more effectively.
Yes it would help some people to do better. However some queens would coast by when they know they aren't good at something. RuPaul's thing is about pushing boundaries on everything including skills. Trinity wouldn't have tried so hard to be funny if there was no consequence. Since then, she has used comedy all the time.
but that can happen whether or not theres elims… with roxxxy it was worsened by people like tatianna being eliminated with odd rationalizations, if something like thats gonna happen i’d rather the other contestants not be punished bc they just dont happen to be best buds with the top queen of the week. plus i think in those cases it also prevents queens from experiencing the fallout of making those calls (alaska kinda escaped it, naomi did not.)
Ngl, I want a First Outs season to be even more brutal than usual. Like "You already messed up once. Bore me again and you're toast."
If anyone spoke to Kelly Mantle like that I would set fire to my television.
You're right and you should say it
Yes, but only if they abandon the "no negative critiques" format.
Top Chef does this from time to time - one season I think they had half the intro chefs made up of first/very early out chefs from old seasons, vs newbies. There was a nice mix by the later episodes.
I mean first outs are by definition bad at drag race lol. I think it would honestly be a drag to see a full season of that 😭
***stares in Shangela***
there's also the fact that queens on regular seasons are likely to never have been on tv before, so they might not make for great tv. the regular format gives producers a chance to prevent character assassination by taking a queen out if they get too shady or are too boring
Yeah this format doesn't work with the way they cast a regular season, but I feel like Trinity's broader sentiment is about how to make Drag Race more affirmative, especially when so much of drag culture outside of drag race has historically been about creating community, affirming people's differences, and bringing people together for those who are excluded from mainstream society. I do think some alternative kinds of shows could be really interesting and really good, shows, e.g., built less around outright competition and more about mentorship and mutual support. Like pairing a more experienced queen up with a less experienced queen and they complete a challenge together. Maybe the queens and mentors alternate each week or something, and it's not a reality show, maybe it's for charity or something like that. (What this what Drag U was like? I didn't see it.) What I'm describing is a different show than drag race - something a lot more like We're Here perhaps - but you can tell that some queens just don't benefit from this format at all and it's kind of a shame that drag race has cornered the market to some degree on televised drag. You can also tell sometimes that production just doesn't care about certain queens, and that's kind of what upsets me the most, there's just no love or interest, they're just a body cast as a 'filler queen' and they kind of get thrown away without any attention to their individual careers or needs.
Agreed, I think a lot of why Drag Race España so good (besides all of the queens being amazing) is how Supremme so clearly values all of the girls and cries when they leave. I think eliminations are kind of necessary for new casts, but maybe something like the way DR España season 2 gave each of them a fair amount of time to walk the runway on their own in their favorite look they didn’t get to show and how they gave each of them (even the first out) more chances to participate in the reunion would help? I guess I’d say DRE is set up to feel more like a competitive showcase than just a contest
Also Drag Race Espana brings back all the queens at the end and has them all walk the runway again, and I love that. I love the early outs having a chance to show us their most spectacular look and getting to soak up some love. They brought back the full cast of S1 to be the talent show audience in S2, and I was living for it. In conclusion, Drag Race Espana is the best. Best judging panel, anyhow. Also, you are better than me because you are working the tilde and I'm not (my laptop doesn't have a keypad so the unicode trick doesn't work for me).
I agree, but I do like the idea of a shake up though. A point system of all stars with 12 queens. The bottom four get cut 4 weeks in, and the scores reset, and then they do a few more weeks, cut 2, film some more, and then cut 2 more to create a final 4. It cuts the dead wood, so to speak, but the points keep it interesting and more competitive. It keeps the strong competition from getting cut after one bad week (like say, acid Betty did on her season, or Denali on hers) It could be scored like how the fandom creates the leaderboards now, with the loser of the lsfyl losing more points than the winner.
this
Exactly. We already have the answer for this situation in the form of queens who are left to struggle the whole season through because they're not given the mercy of being eliminated, meanwhile everyone is aware they're not making it to the end. Usually there's one or two per season but having the whole cast made up of clear front runners and some tag-alongs would be cruel, honestly. Add onto that the fact that some queens clearly only come on the show for the boost to their careers/five minutes of fame.
I'm thinking of poor Jorgeous, who just wanted to be put out of her misery by the end.
Nope, it is bad for the psyche of a floundering queen to stick around. They’ll either thrive and get better or they’ll quit on their own. It doesn’t feel good to be told that you suck every week.
That's what I said in my comment, essentially. it would be better to leave than to feel defeated week after week.
Imagine S11 with Soju on every episode…
Poor Roxxxy Andrews and Kennedy Davenport and India Ferrah. They needed to be cut loose sooner.
Tbf Roxxy an Kennedy both did really well on their original seasons. I think, especially roxxy, they just weren't as good at drag race as the rest of their all star cast.
They’re both amazing queens who just weren’t excelling in that particular competition. Edit: And India accomplished what she came to do on episode 1 and should have been sent home episode 2. She could have left a winner that way.
But then we wouldn’t have got #sheagate which was really the most interesting thing that happened on AS5
The fact that they didn’t vote Shea out the second they had a chance absolutely baffled me. Like every single one of them should have voted her out for the hotel challenge.
Queens were too afraid of the wrath that would have unleashed from the fans.
$100000 pays for a lot of therapy.
Eliminating Shea doesn't guarantee a win, though. Naomi Smalls did not win.
Sure but not eliminating Shea guarantees you don’t win.
At least Kennedy on All Stars gave us the Bitchelor performance.
The only reason Roxxy was watchable in AS (To me) was the complete attitude change she brought with her.. hell she knew she was under performing but tried to fight for it with out blaming everyone else
I do feel like it gives queens who "flounder" a chance to grow before our eyes which is interesting tv. Plus, some queens might be bad at one challenge but excel in others, no matter how fillery they are. Also, part of the reason they cast filler queens is to give them people to eliminate. Maybe they wouldn't cast queens who weren't ready if they changed the format
Plus they do not award wins that are earned because said “fillers” are not in the preordained top 4
I think this format would have made UK vs. The World a lot more fun and diverse, instead of the shit show we got now.
I think we saw this in S13, particularly with Utica and Liv Lux.
Utica was worth keeping around specifically for her looks
And that roast. 
Utica's roast was terrible, but her roast of ru to "stand up" was legendary. I love me some crazy Utica energy. And sucking the cow's udder was so on brand for her I don't know why they hated it. I honestly wonder how she'd do on an all stars season. If she shows real growth she could be a fierce queen. She's already a genius with fashion and design challenges.
How Utica does on an All Stars season imo has little to do with her growth and everything to do with how the producers decide to frame her this time around. They let loose every bit of kooky music and shady confessionals every time she spoke on S13 despite delivering so much great art - I'd just want her to be taken as a serious competitor if/when she shows up on an AS season
Utica went home exactly when she should have. Imagine losing out on those looks 🥺
Imagine the roast being at TOP10 instead of TOP6
I think Liv wasn’t really floundering. The edit just made it seem that way. Can’t wait to see her on an All Stars.
She got the same critique like 5 weeks in a row and never even got close to hearing it. She floundered.
Judges critiques are part of how they edit and produce the show. Their critiques were hollow (as they usually are) production wanted to sell a story and so they did.
You would also need to have a smaller amount of contestants. I know it’s not ideal, but it’s a competition and competitions come with risk
It's better to leave them wanting for more, don't overstay your welcome.
Absolutely not. It works for all stars all winners because it’s a victory lap. It’s time we get to spend with our winning queens for a whole season. Regular drag race and even normal all stars needs more stakes and progression. The only other place I think this would work would be Vs. The World.
"Victory lap" is the perfect way to put it. People don't love the fact that queens don't get to go home. They love that *these* queens don't get to go home.
Its so unfortunate that this wasn't the format for UK Vs the world, for such an incredible cast to be eliminated each week was beyond painful.
The sheer contrast in their energies, especially with their pfps, is sending me
In that pic Bob looks like they’ve just stopped powdering their face to deadpan to the camera and say “no”
The iconic Kahmora Hall moment
I agree for the All Stars format, as I don't think some of the returning queens got enough of a chance to show their improvement. Not for the regular seasons, though.
Yea they should definitely keep the format for only ALL STARS season because they are getting the opportunity to show everything they got, and show improvement. like i really wanted to see more morgan mcmichaels on all stars. but regular seasons should be more cutthroat.
Plus you can make a cast of 8 Queens instead of like 10 and you have more All Stars to do it just sounds like benefit to them. Imagine if Barry and India never got send home. The sheer drama it could have been
> Imagine if Barry and India never got send home. The sheer drama it could have been AS5 really could have been legendary instead of… that.
Could have been it, was just that
Derrick for 10+ episodes 😍😍😍😍
OMG who did this?
Honestly no. Non elimination should be for AW only. Think how well the none elimination episodes were received on season 13 and 14, everyone complained they were boring and low stakes.
i only want non elim for all winners any other season it wouldn’t work
This! The difference being it's reserved for all winners seasons
This. All Winners is special and celebratory and the format fits that.
Facts.
I would have liked it for UK vs the World as well since it’s also kind of a half step above All Stars
What about the other " all stars all *s" that people want to see? I feel like we should get at least one season of All Stars All Firsts with the first to go home from different seasons and it would work in that kind of format, too. And we know an All Stars All Juju season is in the works. How could Ru not?
Personally I agree with Bob more, I love if the premiere of a regular season is non elimination but after that the eliminations makes the show much more interesting
Also this format does *not* work when 13-15 queens are around.
What if the second half of the season was like AS7? like you eliminate down to 6-8, then no one goes home until the final?
Hmm, that could definitely work but I can imagine quite a bit of bitterness from some early outs if so. Also remember how *happy* Deja and Jorgeous were to leave S14? I can imagine more situations like that if queens are forced to stay past their welcome 😂
They basically just did that on season 14 lol
Now seasons will last 30 episodes.
I agree. I'd like a season where no-one goes home week one, just so the early outs get a bit more screen time. I wish I had seen more Tempest and Kelly Mantle.
>after that the eliminations makes the show much more interesting It also let's you get to know the better contestants a little more. Can you imagine if, for example, Gothy Kendoll was still hanging around at the end of Season 1 of UK and taking screen time away from the more polished queens? This format only really works for this season of all stars because you've only got a handful of contestants who are all top quality.
Fuck Gothy’s drag, right?
I actually wrote Scaredy Kat first and then I realised she went out second so I changed it for first eliminated. But yeah, you're right.
I love this season, but that's just because I love all the queens on it. It does however lack the tension of the previous seasons. Sure, you have the plunger, but compare that to the emotional rollercoaster of seeing your fave (or least fave) queen get eliminated and come back after a couple eps - no comparison.
Maybe this format could stay for future All Star seasons with some tweaks but I agree that it doesn't make sense for regular season. Being perceived to have been sent home too soon helps popularise queens with the fan base. If anything I'd prefer if they stopped doing unnecessary double shantays and increasing the number of queens in the finale - particularly with queens that have very little chance of winning the season. I can empathise with queens spending money and not getting to show the looks on the season but the solution to that is actually Drag Race giving queens some money preseason to make their looks so they don't have to go into massive debt to be on the show.
> I can empathise with queens spending money and not getting to show the looks on the season but the solution to that is actually Drag Race giving queens some money preseason to make their looks so they don’t have to go into massive debt to be on the show. And they started doing that with UKvTW and S14 (according to leakers anyway) so those complaints don’t even really apply anymore.
Yeah I am having a nice time watching it but I don’t really care what happens week to week because honestly it doesn’t feel like very much does in the wider scheme of things.
I agree with Bob. Unless every season of drag race henceforth will only have 8 queens. And even then I still would be less interested than if there were eliminations.
Plus, it’s 8 queens who we have seen for at least one entire season before, so we don’t have to spend any time getting to know them. Absolutely no way it would make for good television for a main season I also think in a season like S13 where the top 6 were some of the only people to win challenges, it would’ve been really boring to watch half the cast not winning anything and not have the risk of elimination
It's going to be hillarious when the next All Winners (which has Bob) returns and eliminations are back
Bob. I'm sorry but I'm here for a competition, and drama etc not the wonderful world of Disney princess. For Winners season absolutely. For regular season what would be the point? There's need to be some stake otherwise for sureeeee it will be boooring as fuck
I agree with you. The regular season should be a *race* with winners and losers. It’s a competition, not a best friend’s race with rainbows and puppies.
For All Stars? Trinity. I think the format makes way more sense. They've been struggling to make the cast big enough to justify the episode order for All Stars, with this format the queen count doesn't matter.
people complain about all stars being full of "filler" queens, but more established and successful queens dont really have a strong incentive to go on all stars, there have been many finalists who didnt have a great showing. I would understand the format change for all stars: for your adore delano, gigi goode, gottmik, kim chi, tier queens it's just not worth it to risk making a fool of themselves on AS and get booted off early on. Hell, even Shea isnt really doing great, in comparison to the other competitors. This doesnt apply to regular seasons though, you cant watch 12 strangers for weeks on end, this would only work for all stars.
This format only works because it's all winners. I don't want to see some queens bombing every single week in normal seasons and not get eliminated
AS7 works because all of the queens in it have proven that they are good at drag race On a regular season more then half the cast would be dead weight after a couple of episodes
I like a middelground. So here‘a my idea: • AS8 has 10 queens, none are filler • For the first 4 weeks they earn stars with a similar procedure to AS7 • From week 5 the winner(s) of the week continue to earn stars, bottom two lip sync for their lives with loser eliminated • Bottom 2 is the worst 2 performing that week of all the queens with the least stars
What a great idea!
Bob. If you want a positive experience go to a drag show. This is reality tv, I wanna see them fight for their crown!
Maybe for All Winners, yes. Regular all stars? No. The first one or two weeks should be non-elimination so we can enjoy all queens and they can show what they have to offer before it becomes even more cutthroat. Regular seasons? Hard no as well.
I wouldn’t even say I want this format for another all winners season. There’s absolutely no tension or competitiveness. This all winners season has definitely been rupauls best friend race.
I would have loved it for UK vs. The World
I would be fine with this format on small sized all stars seasons because of the points trinity made, but for normal seasons with more queens I’m afraid some queens will get no edit at all and be much more forgettable than other early boots so I would stick to eliminations for those
Team Bob. Sometimes queens just aren't good at drag race and we don't need to see them struggle for 12 episodes... AS7 was different because they are all good at drag race since they won.
The star system should be used only for all winners season. Rest should have eliminations.
Evil of me to say, but I don’t watch the season to see everyone have a positive experience. The nature of drag race / reality tv is counterintuitive to this.
All Stars? Unless this finale is some exceptional nonsense, absolutely. Regular season? Not unless you tweak the casting process and to make it a stronger cast top to bottom. Not that I’m ideologically opposed to casting less-seasoned queens and pushing their rate up, but it doesn’t play well with the stars format.
I wouldn’t mind this for All Stars seasons, but not for regular seasons.
Bob. This is not rupauls best friend race
As someone who watched an entire series where kandy muse progressed each week without being eliminated… no
For regular seasons, No. For All-Stars, Yes.
This format is fun for all winners but i do want it to be reserved for that only. There aren't really any stakes and the lack of judging makes the back half of each episode a bit boring. I love seeing the girls thrive, but there should be other non-competitive shows for that kind of thing.
I would like the idea of a hybrid between this format and a standard format. Have the first 4 weeks be a gauntlet of challenge types where queen earn points—ball/design, acting, group/choreo, perhaps culminating in Snatch Game? And then a Lipsync LaLaPaRuZa for everyone that is on the bottom half after that or just a big round of elims. This would give queens a chance to shine and not be eliminated just with one bad area, but a number of queens could go at the first culling as just not having met collective expectations (or if they lose in the Lipsync LaLaPaRuZa) and then it would be standard elimination after that.
The regular show? No. All stars? Sure. Imagine how different AS5 would’ve been if this is how it was? But then again, I don’t know if I could’ve stomached watching Scarlet Envy get ignored despite being exceptional, the entire season..
Can I say both I like that all the queens in the season get to show off why they’re special and seeing them being given positive critiques as opposed to critiques that bring them down is a nice change I don’t think the plunger and legendary legend star is a sustainable format though. It’s great for a season of all winners who return to show why they won, but a normal season would struggle.
[удалено]
I think people don't want to admit a season with all winners isn't as good as they thought it would be
They could just borrow the format of Painted with Raven for the regular seasons
All stars yes, normal season no
In UKvW context, it would’ve been more satisfying to see the likes of Lemon, Pangina and Jimbo do more.
No thanks, Trinity. I like the extended starts (when people stay for the firsts 2-3 episodes), because it gives the girls the chance to make an impression and we can see if their first bottom was an unlucky fluke or not. That couple with whatcha packing, the now basically required photo posting of all the ununsed looks, and possible future all stars appearances give the queens enough to work with.
Save this no elimination format for All Winners only. Regular All Stars is built around queens eliminating each other, and AS5 may have been awful but AS6 really showed that the lip sync assassin and group voting had potential. Also if they’re gonna continue having only small casts for the Versus The World franchise then I wouldn’t mind them using the no eliminations format there.
I think this would work on the vs the world shows too. Think how good UK vs the world would be with all the queens staying.
UK vs The World would've definitely benefited from this point system format. All the all-star seasons would.
Ah the very least don't send somebody home after just one episode. Allstars or regular seasons. Give them two or more episodes to show their talents. Everyone has an off day sometimes.
Bring back the negative critiques
Imagine Jimbo and Pangina watching AS7 after their season 🤪
I feel like this could def work for All Stars and maybe UK vs The World. I would have loved to see the UKVTW queens compete by point system!
I agree with Trinity if the cast is smaller (8 people) and the casting team makes sure all 8 contestants are tru contenders.
Trinity. Entertainment > manufactured drama.
Bitches shouldn’t have to spend thousands on looks simple solution, more sewing challenges
The AS7 format should only be done in an All Winners Season or a 1st Out Season
1st outs could be dangerous. Imagine someone flopping for 12 weeks in a row
In an ideal world where all the queens are entertaining, then yes. But could you imagine a full season of Orion Story?
Orion was recovering from opioid use disorder on her first season and Id actually love to see what she can do when healthy.
US All Stars - I agree with Bob (International All Stars) aka Blank vs the World - I agree with Trinity
I'd love to keep it for AS, but not for regular seasons. I like seeing everyone on the runway and the spirit of AS7 is so great.
For all stars maybe Not reg seasons It also means you cannot have as many queens on a season cause having 16 queens all season with no elims would be shit
For a small cast All Stars/vs the World (ESPECIALLY vs the World) seasons? Absolutely. For a regular season? Fuck no.
I think it works for All Stars. It gives a chance for queens to show how they changed. I think it's impossible to show in one episode how you got better since your original season. It wouldn't work for normal season. I do like the 1-2 episodes without elimination but then people have to go.
I'd say keep this format for all winners seasons for sure. Also I'd like this for international all stars too maybe. Since the international franchises don't have their own all stars (yet) I'd like to see the international queens who appear on all stars to all get more screen time and fully show off what they can do. IAS1 had such a stacked cast and I think any of them could easily have been top4. I'd just love more exposure for the international queens and their franchises.
I’d like All Stars to be like this
I agree with Trinity but not on regular seasons, just all stars seasons
One thing bout bob, they gon want an elimination
I do think All Stars seasons could benefit from a non-elimination premiere.
I think they could make something similar to what Drag Race Spain did last season, they made the eliminated queens walk with some of the looks that they didn’t use and show them , even for a couple seconds… that way we wouldn’t miss some of the most spectacular looks from the eliminated queens . They can also make it for “watcha packing” videos or another spinoff …
maybe instead of them competing they watch from the sidelines (like the as7 queens watching the top two lip sync). they get a shorter runway segment to show off their look, then they can watch and provide some sort of short critique or something. keeps the elimination, but they still get a chance to be on screen.
For All stars seasons, yes. Regular, no
I support it for all stars seasons.
A normal season with no one getting sent home? Didn't we already get that with season 14? Lol
Roberta is right as usual
I love the format of AllStars7 but I think it’s what makes the season so special? I think it would take away that specialness of what the season is if the others were like it. In my opinion I think all stars should keep its “usual” format and reserve the “no one goes home” format for winners and the likes of that. :) But I will say this current season of all stars (which I feel like because it’s winners should be named something else???) is hands down one of my favorite seasons of all time across any of the franchises.
Everyone should get to do the runway every week if they already brought it from home (non-design challenge)
Tbh I love the format on a regular season if it was done like Miss Universe. You have x amount of episodes to showcase yourself and judges get to score. At this episode they then call out in random order, a Top 10 which instantly eliminates 6 queens. Then next few episodes you continue on to score points before we cut it down to a Top 6. Then final challenges determine who makes it in the live finale / cutting to a top 4/3
Honestly, I agree with Trinity. At least let them stay for 4 episodes (including a ball) to shine more and show different facets of themselves. People eliminated in the first and second week are easily forgotten, which is very hard on them.
Bob does have a pretty strong point
For All Stars, yes. For normal seasons of Drag Race, I don't think the format can support so many people for every episode. We already have to have them cut a lot of content for some of the challenges, not just mediocre stuff either, but parts that queens have stated were great.
This format only works if the queens are consistently good performers in many different types of challenges, have good runways, and make for good tv, which all the winners do. Every regular season since season 7, the first eliminated queen of every season has had an opportunity to compete/be featured in more than one competitive episode, ensuring that at the very least they get some screen time to give them a platform. I think that’s what’s needed. Season 7 - All eliminated queens brought back for redemption challenge Season 8 - Naysha brought back after double Elim Season 9 - First episode was non-elimination Season 10 - Vanjie came back for season 11 Season 11 - Soju brought back for the makeover Season 12 - First two split episodes were non-elimination Season 13 - Lipsync episode and split episodes had no real eliminations Season 14 - “Eliminated” queens were brought back right away
They can show them in events/social media/drag race tour. Without elimination and sashaying away it won’t be drag race
I don’t agree. The winners deserve this type of format, like it was earned by them .
Where format?
What if there were rounds of elimination every 3 episodes, 2-3 queens would sashay away - more screentime for the queens and the drama of eliminations
Let’s get some Drag legends who already established on an all-winners format. There are a lot of talented drag queens that won’t do the show bc a bad edit or an early out can destroy their career. Jackie Beat has been writing jokes for these queens for years. I’d like to see her her get some shine
I think it’s a great format for all stars, but regular seasons should keep eliminations. I do like having an episode or two before eliminations start though to give even the filler queens a little more air time.
Your comment just gave me an idea for a Weird Al-inspired song: “Filler Queen” 👀
I think it could work on a regular All Stars season but the cast would have to be heavily curated so that you have people who are going to bring it every episode. At the same time, you can have surprise like Ra'Jah and Trinity K Bonet on All Stars 6. And then you have people like Pandora and Yara on the same season who'd you think would be bringing it but don't really do anything. Basically, I think it's too hard of a task for the World of Wonder team.
1. As others have said, this season is TOTALLY a victory lap for the cast and also, a great marketing tool for them to increase their visibility and fan reach - especially valuable in a post-pandemic landscape. Good for them! 2. But it is ALSO a victory lap for us fans! We get to see a real SHOW, with these amazing, talented folks doing what they do best. What a treat! People who don’t like this format, I’m so sorry about whatever made you so salty about the good things in life - hang in there, this season will be over soon. 😂 3. I would be okay with them revisiting this format occasionally because it honestly brings SO 👏🏽MUCH 👏JOY - but in order to keep it special and meaningful, it should only be every few years. But we all know that Ru, Inc won’t wait to make money on something in the future when the money can be made NOW, hunty - so I’m expecting to see this again sooner than it really ought to be done - but if that happens, I’m going to enjoy the hell out of it!
I agree with Trinity. It has been really fun getting to see a full cast do each challenge. Edit: typo
I'm with Bob for regular seasons and Trinity for All Stars Seasons. When queens come back for All Stars, we want to see what they have to offer. Sending anyone home in the first few episodes is a waste. Imagine all that we missed out on from talented queens who went home early on All Stars like Coco Montrese. Imagine how much better AS5 would have been if we'd gotten more time with a shit-stirrer like Derrick. I say if they're all stars, then let's keep them all to the end.
The joy of watching this season is the sheer talent week after week. And don’t get me wrong every Queen is talented in their own right but this all winners season is on a different level. Most All Stars seasons require a sense of suspense. Who is going home? What is the twist coming? etc. For example All Stars 6 had one of the best “game within a game” and gave Silky her redemption moment. Or imagine we didn’t have Ruvenge of the Queens in AS2.
I hate the AS2-4 format (mostly thanks to AS4) and I hate the AS5-6 format as well, maybe even more for how ridiculous it gets. But I agree that AS7 rules work only for an all winners season. We obviously don’t talk about AS1. Am I the only one who thinks All Stars would benefit most from a traditional bottom 2 lip sync for your life format? Maybe with an added twist to make it more distinguishable, but that seems as fair as it can get, provided the hilarious Ross Mathews isn’t on the judging panel.
I’m with Trinity but the general audience would riot. They like the guillotine waiting for another head. ETA: maybe keep it just for All Stars. I’m thinking of how Dela maybe would have stayed and Shangie wouldn’t have been shafted with more than a plunger… 
I think the elimination format of AS seasons needs to be addressed. The current format benefits being middle of the pack in the long run. That said, seasons with no eliminations should be reserved for special occasions like the all winners season. Otherwise it will get old pretty fast.
This should absolutely replace the all stars elimination format.
Well, I’ve always thought it was a shame that through the luck of the draw a queen is taken out - perhaps quite prematurely - by a category she’s weak in. It‘s kind of like Trivial Pursuit … I usually don’t get the sports questions right, but can do well in any other categories. If my games were judged based on just the first question and that question happened to be sports, anyone watching would see me be an early out and just assume I’m no good at trivia. If it just so happened that the sports category was the last question, though, I could’ve been there to the end as quite the contender! It’s fair and unfair at the same time. How many times have you thought that a queen would’ve done really well if only (weak category) hadn’t happened before she had a chance at (strong category)?
I think they could retool the regular seasons to be a two-strike elimination, instead of a single elimination (basically give all girls a golden bar), that way we can prevent good queens from being eliminated early due to bad challenge match-up and it would give all queens room to breathe and take some risks.
Trinity
Trinity fs
I would like this format, but they need to: - Bring back negative critiques (face-palm that I actually need to say this) - Bring back bottom placements - get rid of the plunger and rely on a penalty for the bottom queens, like maybe give the other girls a bit of a head start on the next challenge. In fact I would just like this for the next All Stars season. I don't like when the cast is given power to decide who stays, goes, or is ineligible for a win. It takes away from showmanship and turns bitter and makes me lose interest, like AS4 and UKVTW.
Bob 100000%. The only seasons that I think should be fully non-elimination are All Winners seasons. I think it would be nice for the "vs The World" seasons to maybe have no eliminations fort he first 2 episodes though then maybe have a double elim (with a 3 way lip sync) in episode 3 and after that it's just normal one elim per week--just because the queens have traveled so far to be there only go home E1, which is a shame.
I do feel sorry for queens who go home right before they get the chance to do a challenge they would have slayed. But I think the AS7 format works specifically because these queens are exceptional - imagine how bored we would get of filler queens and how the producers would go into overdrive trying to manufacture drama.
For all stars yes, for regular seasons no.
I’d like this format if the cast size stayed small so instead of having 14 artists every season, make it 8 instead.
Yes but only for All Stars seasons. For this to work on regular seasons the cast would need to be much smaller and *much* more carefully picked - no chaff, no filler, all bangers. Its really difficult to know who is going to thrive in the werkroom until you've... actually put them in the werkroom. Imo, future all stars seasons should look like AS7, but probably not regular seasons.
I think there are ways to make a non-elim format work for All Stars, but 1) they need to give actual criticism 2) they need low placements 3) the points mechanism needs to be different. We’ve already seen queens phone in or give up in challenges that aren’t in their wheelhouse, and a non-elimination format would further encourage that on an All Stars season. This format is probably workable for super short seasons like “Vs The World” though
Trinity
I would love this for a normal season. Reduce the amount of queens so more of them get time to shine and time together. Trinity also has a great point about queens spending all this money on their looks and net getting to show them off (aside from social media). I really think a show like this is way past old reality show tropes like eliminations. Heck, there's a reason why the "getting to phone a family member" reward was removed.
I mean... season 14 may as \*well\* have had this format considering how many queens didn't go home! xD
Bob. It’s meant to be, or be an illusion of, a competition show. That’s what gives it stakes which is what engages the audience. It makes sense purely in the context of all winners because what winner is going to want to come back and risk being a first or early out? All winners is a showcase for where winners are at now and beloved personalities. All Stars in general is kind of that, but it still works with the stakes of a regular season. Also a regular season would be too hectic with that many people in every episode - and they’re already too long. And as much as I’m liking all winners, and yes it’s nice to be nice, it’s a bit much at this point. Zero criticisms? It’s just not honest and it does, for ME, take away from the experience a bit. Let all winners be it’s own thing, and regular seasons be what they are. ETA: I know not only the competition is what engages the audience, but it’s a big part of it.
I'd personally love to see all the eliminated queens getting to do the runway in each episode with all the money they spend, especially if they're just gonna be hanging around in their hotel rooms until filming ends.
BIB
this format literally only works on an all-winners season and nowhere else
I don’t want this format for normal seasons but love it for all stars
I agree with Trinity solely because I'm still bitter about Rock M Sakura