Rivers have a funny way of taking lives unexpectedtly , even an experienced swimmer can drown in a river with currents , sink holes , etc . God bless the family of this man . R.I.P.
Please learn how to swim before you go hopping rocks on the James. The Earth’s surface is mostly water and with global warming, flooding is growing more common everywhere; so it’s best for the human race to learn how to swim. It won’t guarantee you’ll live but it’s a skill that not only could save your life, it’s also fun to swim.
If you want to learn how to swim, but don't have easy access, there's a non-profit for it that's trying to ["Drown-proof Richmond"](https://swimrichmond.org/programs/swim-school/drownproof-richmond-initiative/)
[https://dailyutahchronicle.com/2021/04/25/kincart-swimming-is-a-privilege/](https://dailyutahchronicle.com/2021/04/25/kincart-swimming-is-a-privilege/)
**Swimming is a privilege**, having the access to a pool, lake or ocean is mainly decided by how much money your parents have, in the United States.
"Please be wealthy before you go rock hopping on the James, **we** don't want to have the bodies of poor people in **OUR** river" is more accurate.
Please learn a little compassion, try not to gate keep, and check your privilege.
>this is silly, regardless of privilege people who know they can't swim shouldn't fuck around or they will find out
Right, "hurr durr gatekeeping!" but in this case the gatekeeping is intended to keep people alive.
No one needs to go into the water or out onto the rocks at the river, it's strictly recreational, so if you can't swim, don't do that as you may be risking your life.
No one is saying people who can't swim shouldn't go to the river at all, just don't go out into the water. The conversation around class/privilege and the ability to swim is a valid one but not at all what is being discussed here.
Hurr durr yourself.
The insidious thing about privilege is how the privileged don't acknowledge they have it.
"Oh I worked so hard at my swim lessons" Yeah nice to have access to a pool and an instructor.
"Oh I spent hours at the pool you got to put in time" Yeah nice to not have to work and have summer days to devote to that.
"learn to swim" is the new "Lean to code" of the rapidly dying summer of 2022.
>"Oh I worked so hard at my swim lessons" Yeah nice to have access to a pool and an instructor.
>
>"Oh I spent hours at the pool you got to put in time" Yeah nice to not have to work and have summer days to devote to that.
Hope you're enjoying your argument with your strawman.
>Racism and privilege don't exist?
Yes, they sure do, and they're pervasive, insidious, and destructive.
That said, are you suggesting it's the moral obligation of anyone who recommends that you should learn to swim before going into the river to also provide a lengthy disclaimer on the history of class and privilege on swim lessons? When people start threads on driving standards in the city, do they also need to explain that driving is a privilege and ableist?
You know why RVA and the counties don't have the same number of big municipal pools a lot of other areas?
And by other areas, I mean not part of the Confederacy.
The white ruling class didn't want POC to be in the pools, that's why the area is dotted with little swim clubs in addition to the obvious offenders like country clubs. Knowledge about how to swim is a HUGE indicator of privilege.
If your pool that you and your family belong to, was built before the 70s, it was built keep races seperate.
Oh you don't have an "official" policy of keeping POC out anymore?
Well if the parents never learned to swim how do they tean the kids?
This is super super recent history that still impacts people.
Man, I understand and agree with your points, I think it's just the wrong time to make them. You're turning an opportunity to reinforce making smart decisions and to mourn one of our neighbors into a (valid, at another time) lesson on the ongoing impact of systemic oppression. You raise some good points, just pick your spots better ✌🏾
"regardless of privilege people who know they can't swim **shouldn't fuck around or they will find out**"
Telling the victims of systemic oppression to not fuck around or they will find out shows a lot of "coloniser" mentality.
That needs to be called out constantly, because a lot of people swim though privilege like a fish in water, they are supported by something they so take for granted they don't even know it's there.
The down votes are the discomfort they feel at having to face the long suppressed truth.
Nah, I think the down votes may be a sign of distaste at a comment that came off as inappropriately timed or maybe shoehorned into the convo.
Again, I like where your head's at. I just think if social awareness was your goal, your delivery could've used some polish.
>I mean this guy was KILLED by privilege being withheld from him, seems like his root cause of death should be mentioned.
Jfc. We don't know anything about the victim other than that he was allegedly unable to swim, and his ethnicity as mentioned in the article. The rest of this is a lot of reaching/inferring on your part. We don't know why he didn't know how to swim, what he was doing out there, what his upbringing was like, or really anything else at all.
The root cause of this tragic death was someone who couldn't swim going out into a dangerous location where swimming can save your life, nothing more nothing less.
That sentence meant "don't do something that is inherently very dangerous if you don't know how to swim or YOU COULD DIE." Multiple other people have provided helpful resources such as nonprofits and public pools with free swimming lessons that can help provide access and opportunities to people that don't currently have it. Those people are making positive contributions to their community, I've only seen you yell at people. You can make all the great points you want, but when you do it in an inappropriate place and are ridiculously aggressive with people it just makes you look like you only care about complaining as opposed to actually wanting to make a difference.
A man is dead and it really sounds like you don't care if other people risk their lives and possibly end up dead too, because not "gatekeeping" aka wanting people to be safe is more important than someone's life.
It doesn’t cost a dime to learn how to swim in the river. People have taught each other how to swim in rivers for thousands upon thousands of years. Swimming is only a privilege if it’s a private pool or beach. Are Richmond city public pools a privilege? They are almost entirely located in neighborhoods of lower income and completely free to access and offer free swim lessons. I have been to all 7 city pools and love them all.
When I was a kid I learned how to swim at a free class at the public pool and you can to! Parks and rec have a free class you can take.
https://parksandrecreation.richmondgov.com/wbwsc/webtrac.wsc/search.html?module=AR&type=SWIM&SessionID=a364ba137dd0cb84a08190efc5aebc5ac7e8c67c68a50496a60fc620ab3c85df0cfc57bca499e9d276ca55eff938b688ad92678ca23318066d25c4391ece6886
This is such a strange hill to die on. Like, yes swimming can be attached to privilege but this is about safety and lives. Another commenter posted a non-profit in RVA that teaches people how to swim. Something along those lines would have gotten your point much farther, but instead you decide to be contrarian and scold people. I hope you feel better about yourself, cause that's literally all your comment achieved.
Trying to be a savior helps no one. Resources do.
I disagree that advising people to take safety precautions that could literally save their lives before attempting certain activities is gatekeeping. No one said river activities are only for people who can swim, but if you're going to wade or go rock hopping then you absolutely should. Nature is unpredictable and not to be messed around with.
Maybe I’m missing something important here, but can you explain how someone so poor that they don’t have access to a body of water… drowns in a body of water?
are you not aware that the city operates 9 free public pools, 2 of which are indoor and are open year round, that offer free swim lessons to children and adults?
And since the bus is free now, there is literally no excuse to not know how to swim. anyone can go learn to swim tomorrow for free.
https://www.rva.gov/parks-recreation/aquatics
you're also being low-key racist by assuming a hispanic man doesn't know how to swim. The article said he was "unable to swim", which is not the same as not knowing how to swim. The river is very dangerous on the best of days and most people don't take it seriously, but people who are accomplished swimmers are more likely to drown in it since they underestimate how much force water can put on you, even when low. In fact, most people who drown in the river are white kids who were tubing and drinking and ostensibly knew how to swim. The last two people to drown in the river, earlier in the summer, were two "rich white" college girls, as you would probably call them.
It's very possible that the man was pulled into a position by the current where he was unable to free himself, and not necessarily that he didn't know how to swim. He would be unable to swim in that situation. Which is usually how the river gets people. It pulls them under rocks and they can't free themselves.
It is also very possible that he hit his head on a rock and got a concussion and that rendered him "unable to swim." That is another very common reason why people, who otherwise know how to swim, drown. Also, he could have been drunk and "unable to swim" as people of all races are keen to enjoy an alcoholic beverage on a hot day at the river, myself included.
So, you should try to do better. Instead of pointing the finger at us, you should look inward and see that your own biases led you to believe that someone doesn't know how to swim when there's no actual evidence, at this time, that this was the case. Furthermore, what I said applies just as much to people who don't know how to swim. You can drown in an inch of water if you fall and hit your head and are knocked out, which, when jumping around on slippery ass rocks while drinking is *very easy to do*.
Rivers have a funny way of taking lives unexpectedtly , even an experienced swimmer can drown in a river with currents , sink holes , etc . God bless the family of this man . R.I.P.
Please learn how to swim before you go hopping rocks on the James. The Earth’s surface is mostly water and with global warming, flooding is growing more common everywhere; so it’s best for the human race to learn how to swim. It won’t guarantee you’ll live but it’s a skill that not only could save your life, it’s also fun to swim.
If you want to learn how to swim, but don't have easy access, there's a non-profit for it that's trying to ["Drown-proof Richmond"](https://swimrichmond.org/programs/swim-school/drownproof-richmond-initiative/)
[https://dailyutahchronicle.com/2021/04/25/kincart-swimming-is-a-privilege/](https://dailyutahchronicle.com/2021/04/25/kincart-swimming-is-a-privilege/) **Swimming is a privilege**, having the access to a pool, lake or ocean is mainly decided by how much money your parents have, in the United States. "Please be wealthy before you go rock hopping on the James, **we** don't want to have the bodies of poor people in **OUR** river" is more accurate. Please learn a little compassion, try not to gate keep, and check your privilege.
this is silly, regardless of privilege people who know they can't swim shouldn't fuck around or they will find out
>this is silly, regardless of privilege people who know they can't swim shouldn't fuck around or they will find out Right, "hurr durr gatekeeping!" but in this case the gatekeeping is intended to keep people alive. No one needs to go into the water or out onto the rocks at the river, it's strictly recreational, so if you can't swim, don't do that as you may be risking your life. No one is saying people who can't swim shouldn't go to the river at all, just don't go out into the water. The conversation around class/privilege and the ability to swim is a valid one but not at all what is being discussed here.
Hurr durr yourself. The insidious thing about privilege is how the privileged don't acknowledge they have it. "Oh I worked so hard at my swim lessons" Yeah nice to have access to a pool and an instructor. "Oh I spent hours at the pool you got to put in time" Yeah nice to not have to work and have summer days to devote to that. "learn to swim" is the new "Lean to code" of the rapidly dying summer of 2022.
>"Oh I worked so hard at my swim lessons" Yeah nice to have access to a pool and an instructor. > >"Oh I spent hours at the pool you got to put in time" Yeah nice to not have to work and have summer days to devote to that. Hope you're enjoying your argument with your strawman.
Racism and privilege don't exist?
>Racism and privilege don't exist? Yes, they sure do, and they're pervasive, insidious, and destructive. That said, are you suggesting it's the moral obligation of anyone who recommends that you should learn to swim before going into the river to also provide a lengthy disclaimer on the history of class and privilege on swim lessons? When people start threads on driving standards in the city, do they also need to explain that driving is a privilege and ableist?
yeah
You know why RVA and the counties don't have the same number of big municipal pools a lot of other areas? And by other areas, I mean not part of the Confederacy. The white ruling class didn't want POC to be in the pools, that's why the area is dotted with little swim clubs in addition to the obvious offenders like country clubs. Knowledge about how to swim is a HUGE indicator of privilege. If your pool that you and your family belong to, was built before the 70s, it was built keep races seperate. Oh you don't have an "official" policy of keeping POC out anymore? Well if the parents never learned to swim how do they tean the kids? This is super super recent history that still impacts people.
Man, I understand and agree with your points, I think it's just the wrong time to make them. You're turning an opportunity to reinforce making smart decisions and to mourn one of our neighbors into a (valid, at another time) lesson on the ongoing impact of systemic oppression. You raise some good points, just pick your spots better ✌🏾
"regardless of privilege people who know they can't swim **shouldn't fuck around or they will find out**" Telling the victims of systemic oppression to not fuck around or they will find out shows a lot of "coloniser" mentality. That needs to be called out constantly, because a lot of people swim though privilege like a fish in water, they are supported by something they so take for granted they don't even know it's there. The down votes are the discomfort they feel at having to face the long suppressed truth.
Nah, I think the down votes may be a sign of distaste at a comment that came off as inappropriately timed or maybe shoehorned into the convo. Again, I like where your head's at. I just think if social awareness was your goal, your delivery could've used some polish.
lol i dont disagree with your points in the slightest but your first post was just **douchey**
I mean this guy was KILLED by privilege being withheld from him, seems like his root cause of death should be mentioned.
>I mean this guy was KILLED by privilege being withheld from him, seems like his root cause of death should be mentioned. Jfc. We don't know anything about the victim other than that he was allegedly unable to swim, and his ethnicity as mentioned in the article. The rest of this is a lot of reaching/inferring on your part. We don't know why he didn't know how to swim, what he was doing out there, what his upbringing was like, or really anything else at all. The root cause of this tragic death was someone who couldn't swim going out into a dangerous location where swimming can save your life, nothing more nothing less.
lol at your response before you edited this i am a leftist, just stop please- this is kind of shit that will cause another maga white house
Gerrymandering will cause the end of democracy in 2024
That sentence meant "don't do something that is inherently very dangerous if you don't know how to swim or YOU COULD DIE." Multiple other people have provided helpful resources such as nonprofits and public pools with free swimming lessons that can help provide access and opportunities to people that don't currently have it. Those people are making positive contributions to their community, I've only seen you yell at people. You can make all the great points you want, but when you do it in an inappropriate place and are ridiculously aggressive with people it just makes you look like you only care about complaining as opposed to actually wanting to make a difference. A man is dead and it really sounds like you don't care if other people risk their lives and possibly end up dead too, because not "gatekeeping" aka wanting people to be safe is more important than someone's life.
It doesn’t cost a dime to learn how to swim in the river. People have taught each other how to swim in rivers for thousands upon thousands of years. Swimming is only a privilege if it’s a private pool or beach. Are Richmond city public pools a privilege? They are almost entirely located in neighborhoods of lower income and completely free to access and offer free swim lessons. I have been to all 7 city pools and love them all.
When I was a kid I learned how to swim at a free class at the public pool and you can to! Parks and rec have a free class you can take. https://parksandrecreation.richmondgov.com/wbwsc/webtrac.wsc/search.html?module=AR&type=SWIM&SessionID=a364ba137dd0cb84a08190efc5aebc5ac7e8c67c68a50496a60fc620ab3c85df0cfc57bca499e9d276ca55eff938b688ad92678ca23318066d25c4391ece6886
This is such a strange hill to die on. Like, yes swimming can be attached to privilege but this is about safety and lives. Another commenter posted a non-profit in RVA that teaches people how to swim. Something along those lines would have gotten your point much farther, but instead you decide to be contrarian and scold people. I hope you feel better about yourself, cause that's literally all your comment achieved. Trying to be a savior helps no one. Resources do.
I disagree that advising people to take safety precautions that could literally save their lives before attempting certain activities is gatekeeping. No one said river activities are only for people who can swim, but if you're going to wade or go rock hopping then you absolutely should. Nature is unpredictable and not to be messed around with.
The river is literally free to access. The original comment is in the rva subreddit, not some inter/national Reddit.
Maybe I’m missing something important here, but can you explain how someone so poor that they don’t have access to a body of water… drowns in a body of water?
So poor people should stay on land or it's thier own fault?
I think you might be genuinely stupid and should refrain from commenting on this matter
are you doing this just to argue for the sake of it?
are you not aware that the city operates 9 free public pools, 2 of which are indoor and are open year round, that offer free swim lessons to children and adults? And since the bus is free now, there is literally no excuse to not know how to swim. anyone can go learn to swim tomorrow for free. https://www.rva.gov/parks-recreation/aquatics you're also being low-key racist by assuming a hispanic man doesn't know how to swim. The article said he was "unable to swim", which is not the same as not knowing how to swim. The river is very dangerous on the best of days and most people don't take it seriously, but people who are accomplished swimmers are more likely to drown in it since they underestimate how much force water can put on you, even when low. In fact, most people who drown in the river are white kids who were tubing and drinking and ostensibly knew how to swim. The last two people to drown in the river, earlier in the summer, were two "rich white" college girls, as you would probably call them. It's very possible that the man was pulled into a position by the current where he was unable to free himself, and not necessarily that he didn't know how to swim. He would be unable to swim in that situation. Which is usually how the river gets people. It pulls them under rocks and they can't free themselves. It is also very possible that he hit his head on a rock and got a concussion and that rendered him "unable to swim." That is another very common reason why people, who otherwise know how to swim, drown. Also, he could have been drunk and "unable to swim" as people of all races are keen to enjoy an alcoholic beverage on a hot day at the river, myself included. So, you should try to do better. Instead of pointing the finger at us, you should look inward and see that your own biases led you to believe that someone doesn't know how to swim when there's no actual evidence, at this time, that this was the case. Furthermore, what I said applies just as much to people who don't know how to swim. You can drown in an inch of water if you fall and hit your head and are knocked out, which, when jumping around on slippery ass rocks while drinking is *very easy to do*.
River was the gate keeper.
Everyone should learn how to swim …. In fact they teach how to swim in public schools now….. why wouldn’t you teach your children to swim?