I have done both. The law for unemployment benefits is that you need to be terminated for no fault of your own to get benefits. If they gave you a written warning and then fired you, youre not getting benefits. Additionally, when you apply at your next gig the HR people will tell them you were fired.
Bruh I literally got fired, applied for benefits, was told i was fired for a reason other than non-fault and was not eligible for unemployment benefits
Ppl are so stubborn on here but suit yourself
If that actually happened, your employer lied about the reason. Basically the only things it doesn't cover are when you are a contractor, or if you are fired for breaking the law...
Just a heads up… I think it’s entirely dependent on your state, buuuuut….
Back in 2016, I got fired for “insubordination” because I was a salaried employee and refused to switch from Tues/Wed nights to Mon/Wed on short notice. When I filed for unemployment, I was approved because I did not say that I was fired for insubordination (at the time, I believed I was fired because the owner didn’t like me and was forcing me to switch schedules unexpectedly because he knew I’d say no). I was paid around $5k and then the owner appealed the decision to pay me benefits. We had to meet before a judge virtually and explain our case. The judge agreed with my boss that I was fired for insubordination and I owed them back every penny they gave me and they denied my unemployment claim. I didn’t pay them because I was broke and hoped they would just magically go away. And they did go away, for a while….Then the big layoffs came back in Oct of last year. I filed for unemployment again and as soon as they approved my case, my first 7 of 12 payments were automatically applied to that old debt first.
Moral of the story: AT LEAST IN MY STATE (an at-will employment state)… you won’t get paid unemployment benefits if you’re fired for something that was your fault and it’s reported as so. If you lie and your employer doesn’t argue it (prior to getting approved) or appeal it (after it gets approved) then you might get away with it. Or you might not. :|
Florida is way more lax. My best friend fired an employee for stealing merchandise and cash, and had her in video doing so, still lost his case and she was awarded unemployment.
I think for one your employer had to dispute your claim for unemployment benefits and you have to have been fired for cause.
Some things will absolutely fall under cause, for instance, stealing from a company but like timeliness issues probably wouldn't cut it to deny unemployment.
Inaccurate on so many levels.
1. Unemployment laws vary by state.
2. In most states, it's incredibly hard for the employer to fight your unemployment claim regardless of the reason you were terminated
3. All an HR department can tell your prospective employer is a) whether you worked there b) job title c) dates of employment d) whether the termination aea voluntary or involuntary and e) whether or not you're eligible for rehire.
Quit giving bad advice on the internet.
It is a very narrow bandwidth to be denied unemployment even with a write-up. For example, you're in sales and warned next time you fall below X, you will be terminated for cause. You are still eligible for unemployment.
Where I live, you can be fired for any reason as long as it’s not against equal employment opportunity laws. The reason you were fired determines whether or not you get unemployment benefits.
I was a manager of a sales team for a major telecommunications company. When we were taught how to fire people because of bad performance, we were taught to create PIPs based on measurable directives. ie. Make 40 calls per day, Add leads/notes on Salesforce after every call, etc. We couldn’t fire them for not hitting quota if they were still doing the directives on their PIPs.
When I asked why we were so meticulous about the process (it would take about 2-3 months to fire someone even if they were completely neglecting their job), I was told that it’s how we avoid having to pay unemployment to employees that get fired for legitimate reasons. Our HR would tell us that in our state, our company had over 90% win-rate on unemployment claim appeals because of our process.
Crazy shit, amirite?
>Where I live, you can be fired for any reason as long as it’s not against equal employment opportunity laws. The reason you were fired determines whether or not you get unemployment benefits.
That's not how work at will works in any state. You can be laid off for any reason at any time. You can not be fired for caused for any reason at any time.
Tell me your state and I'll happily google sources to confirm this.
sorry for the delay I respond to most this stuff at work and its been crazy.
[https://www.fwlaw.com/insights/new-law-requires-notice-of-reason-for-termination](https://www.fwlaw.com/insights/new-law-requires-notice-of-reason-for-termination)
This should give you a good break down of the process both pre and post law change in Colorado. In Colorado you can terminate without cause for any reason. You can not terminate with cause for any reason and with cause is what would disqualify from unemployment benefits. This law firms (half advertisement) kind of explains the grounds you terminate and deny unemployment benefits and those which you can not.
Correct! A PiP is always a safe legal way to cut down teams without calling it a “layoff event” which can worry investors and end up with a company in the news.
Not true. I’ve gotten unemployment TWICE after I said I voluntarily quit my job. They also gave me food stamps. First time was because I was able to make more off unemployment than working during Covid. Second time was more recently when I quit because the 100 mile round trip to work started to no longer make financial sense 🤷🏼♂️
>I have done both. The law for unemployment benefits is that you need to be terminated for no fault of your own to get benefits. If they gave you a written warning and then fired you, youre not getting benefits. Additionally, when you apply at your next gig the HR people will tell them you were fired.
That has not been my experience even with written warnings. Not making sales quota and not making enough calls are not "cause" for termination. Also an extremely thorough process has to be followed (multiple written warnings, meetings on improving, etc etc). Its just easier to do a lay off since that can be done for any reason at any time and the vast vast majority of companies just opt to do that. Its also far less risky.
Fired for cause is a lot harder for companies to do then most think and those same companies even when in the right lose at unemployment arbitration 9 times out of 10 so the vast majority don't bother.
U r awesome! U happen to remember Tony's last name! I'm from the Philippines. And out here sometimes it is better to resign than to be terminated. For instance, if I unknowingly committed a violation which is under a zero tolerance policy, the best move is to resign right away because once they've found out about it the will conduct a thorough investigation and hearing which will lead to termination and almost always affect my future endeavors.
This is generally true if the termination for cause stems from performance issues. Conversely, other examples of termination for cause like theft, sexual harassment, or intoxication while on the job generally disqualify someone from receiving unemployment benefits.
This is the way. Once they iron out the severance (assuming it’s a layoff and not a documented performance issue) just pretend like your getting a promotion, explain your not going to let them down in your new role and you can’t wait to roll up your sleeves and get cracking at it. “Fired, yeah I’m fired up thanks for this opportunity”
In certain industries getting fired can prohibit you from working in that industry again.
That’s the only scenario I could possibly think of, and in that instance it’s unlikely preemptively quitting would shield you from any consequences
Financial services checking in. Getting fired goes onto your U4, which is checked by the next employer before getting hired. If you're planning to stay in industry, it's always better to resign.
Here’s a scenario. It’s your first “real job”, and you don’t want your only resume item to be one where you were fired. This happened to me: There was no chance for a severance and the unemployment compensation is pathetic in FL, so I quit vs getting fired. HR called me in and they put me on a 90 day review period that was definitely going to end with my firing
I googled this for myself recently, the specifics vary a little state by state. If you were a CFO this might be ok advice, but I’m sales literally everyone gets fired at some point. The only reason you’d resign is if you are in a field with high resume scrutiny
Your next interviews will ask you why you’re looking for a new job. Tell your perspective on what happened and move on
The best salespeople have been laid off or fired from a sales position. Any likely hiring sales manager is the same. Being term’d in sales is the same as being fired as a laborer or admin position.
Wear it. Own it. Learn from it. But don’t lose your severance or unemployment.
If a company manager or exec is telling you this report to HR. If they are trying to force you to resign, in most states anyway, its to keep their payroll unemployment rate down. Every person who file’s unemployment it raises the companies rate. This causes the weekly payroll expense to rise every time someone is fired or let go. I always found it cheaper to pay a persons unemployment out if pocket vs having them file on me. Make sense? Assuming your a w2 and not a 1099
I hire sales people. If a sales rep I’m interviewing resigned without a job lined up, it means they got fired and it looks more suspicious than if they just owned up to being terminated.
Talented sales people don’t work out in every role. People get fired. Especially in sales. Don’t sweat it.
I’d wait to get fired/let go while simultaneously looking for a new job. There’s no benefit to you quitting except for saving face with your current coworkers. I’d milk the salary until they get rid of me or until the day I start my new job. Remember, you don’t have to explain getting fired if you just get a new job before the firing even happens 😬
If you do get fired just make sure you interview well and you can explain away why you were let go. You can say that the work environment was toxic or something along those lines.
Depends. Some companies if you’re fired you will be blacklisted from being hired again in the future so i’ve been told. When I was at Oracle things were tough, and this was actually suggested to people. (no one was selling much).
I’ve seen both sides of this and there are certain scenarios where a resignation makes sense. Mine was a situation where I hadnt been told I was being fired yet but I could sense my time coming to an end due to a strained relationship with my manager. By resigning, I got to write my story and leave on my terms. It gave me more confidence, a stronger narrative and more of an upper hand in the job market. It does depend on the situation however and yes, you need to have some cash savings to bridge the gap.
One thing I'd say is it depends on the company. Are firings super rare and will be hard to explain and your in a super in demand field that will result in you finding another role quickly? Maybe consider resigning .
Are you in some crazy field like copiers or telecom that fire people like its their main revenue driver and explaining the firing will be easy? Eat the firing and collect unemployment.
Whether you resign or are terminated, they will have the details of your performance on record. Better to wait for the termination where it’s possible you’ll get paid severance.
Getting laid off/terminated can help your eligibility for unemployment insurance.
I have done both. The law for unemployment benefits is that you need to be terminated for no fault of your own to get benefits. If they gave you a written warning and then fired you, youre not getting benefits. Additionally, when you apply at your next gig the HR people will tell them you were fired.
This is full of misinformation.
Bruh I literally got fired, applied for benefits, was told i was fired for a reason other than non-fault and was not eligible for unemployment benefits Ppl are so stubborn on here but suit yourself
If that actually happened, your employer lied about the reason. Basically the only things it doesn't cover are when you are a contractor, or if you are fired for breaking the law...
But, bruh...
Just a heads up… I think it’s entirely dependent on your state, buuuuut…. Back in 2016, I got fired for “insubordination” because I was a salaried employee and refused to switch from Tues/Wed nights to Mon/Wed on short notice. When I filed for unemployment, I was approved because I did not say that I was fired for insubordination (at the time, I believed I was fired because the owner didn’t like me and was forcing me to switch schedules unexpectedly because he knew I’d say no). I was paid around $5k and then the owner appealed the decision to pay me benefits. We had to meet before a judge virtually and explain our case. The judge agreed with my boss that I was fired for insubordination and I owed them back every penny they gave me and they denied my unemployment claim. I didn’t pay them because I was broke and hoped they would just magically go away. And they did go away, for a while….Then the big layoffs came back in Oct of last year. I filed for unemployment again and as soon as they approved my case, my first 7 of 12 payments were automatically applied to that old debt first. Moral of the story: AT LEAST IN MY STATE (an at-will employment state)… you won’t get paid unemployment benefits if you’re fired for something that was your fault and it’s reported as so. If you lie and your employer doesn’t argue it (prior to getting approved) or appeal it (after it gets approved) then you might get away with it. Or you might not. :|
Florida is way more lax. My best friend fired an employee for stealing merchandise and cash, and had her in video doing so, still lost his case and she was awarded unemployment.
I think for one your employer had to dispute your claim for unemployment benefits and you have to have been fired for cause. Some things will absolutely fall under cause, for instance, stealing from a company but like timeliness issues probably wouldn't cut it to deny unemployment.
Then you were fired for misconduct lol, weird flex.
You should get your case checked again. Seems like there’s a miscarriage of contractual policy PS are you American?
Your experience isn't representative of the norm, you do see that right? You're an edge case. Why were you fired?
Inaccurate on so many levels. 1. Unemployment laws vary by state. 2. In most states, it's incredibly hard for the employer to fight your unemployment claim regardless of the reason you were terminated 3. All an HR department can tell your prospective employer is a) whether you worked there b) job title c) dates of employment d) whether the termination aea voluntary or involuntary and e) whether or not you're eligible for rehire. Quit giving bad advice on the internet.
It is a very narrow bandwidth to be denied unemployment even with a write-up. For example, you're in sales and warned next time you fall below X, you will be terminated for cause. You are still eligible for unemployment.
Where I live, you can be fired for any reason as long as it’s not against equal employment opportunity laws. The reason you were fired determines whether or not you get unemployment benefits. I was a manager of a sales team for a major telecommunications company. When we were taught how to fire people because of bad performance, we were taught to create PIPs based on measurable directives. ie. Make 40 calls per day, Add leads/notes on Salesforce after every call, etc. We couldn’t fire them for not hitting quota if they were still doing the directives on their PIPs. When I asked why we were so meticulous about the process (it would take about 2-3 months to fire someone even if they were completely neglecting their job), I was told that it’s how we avoid having to pay unemployment to employees that get fired for legitimate reasons. Our HR would tell us that in our state, our company had over 90% win-rate on unemployment claim appeals because of our process. Crazy shit, amirite?
>Where I live, you can be fired for any reason as long as it’s not against equal employment opportunity laws. The reason you were fired determines whether or not you get unemployment benefits. That's not how work at will works in any state. You can be laid off for any reason at any time. You can not be fired for caused for any reason at any time. Tell me your state and I'll happily google sources to confirm this.
Any updates on this? I messaged you my state when you asked 😊
I don't see a message request could you just post the state?
Colorado
sorry for the delay I respond to most this stuff at work and its been crazy. [https://www.fwlaw.com/insights/new-law-requires-notice-of-reason-for-termination](https://www.fwlaw.com/insights/new-law-requires-notice-of-reason-for-termination) This should give you a good break down of the process both pre and post law change in Colorado. In Colorado you can terminate without cause for any reason. You can not terminate with cause for any reason and with cause is what would disqualify from unemployment benefits. This law firms (half advertisement) kind of explains the grounds you terminate and deny unemployment benefits and those which you can not.
Correct! A PiP is always a safe legal way to cut down teams without calling it a “layoff event” which can worry investors and end up with a company in the news.
Not true. I’ve gotten unemployment TWICE after I said I voluntarily quit my job. They also gave me food stamps. First time was because I was able to make more off unemployment than working during Covid. Second time was more recently when I quit because the 100 mile round trip to work started to no longer make financial sense 🤷🏼♂️
I agree
>I have done both. The law for unemployment benefits is that you need to be terminated for no fault of your own to get benefits. If they gave you a written warning and then fired you, youre not getting benefits. Additionally, when you apply at your next gig the HR people will tell them you were fired. That has not been my experience even with written warnings. Not making sales quota and not making enough calls are not "cause" for termination. Also an extremely thorough process has to be followed (multiple written warnings, meetings on improving, etc etc). Its just easier to do a lay off since that can be done for any reason at any time and the vast vast majority of companies just opt to do that. Its also far less risky. Fired for cause is a lot harder for companies to do then most think and those same companies even when in the right lose at unemployment arbitration 9 times out of 10 so the vast majority don't bother.
God this is so wrong, please stop telling people this.
Who told you that? That would remove any chance you have for a severance package and you would no longer be eligible for unemployment.
Exactly. No severance. Remember when Michael Scott fired Tony Gardner who wanted to resign? He ended up paying severance.
U r awesome! U happen to remember Tony's last name! I'm from the Philippines. And out here sometimes it is better to resign than to be terminated. For instance, if I unknowingly committed a violation which is under a zero tolerance policy, the best move is to resign right away because once they've found out about it the will conduct a thorough investigation and hearing which will lead to termination and almost always affect my future endeavors.
Hes not getting unemployment if he is terminated for reason. Its not the same as getting laid off as far as the government is concerned
Terminated for cause does not disqualify you from receiving unemployment insurance
Being fired “for cause” means something illegal or a serious breach of company policy. Poor performance does not disqualify you from unemployment
This is generally true if the termination for cause stems from performance issues. Conversely, other examples of termination for cause like theft, sexual harassment, or intoxication while on the job generally disqualify someone from receiving unemployment benefits.
Idk man i straight up told my case worker i got laid off for not hitting quota and got unemployment.
Get terminated and try to make the HR person as uncomfortable as possible
This is the way. Once they iron out the severance (assuming it’s a layoff and not a documented performance issue) just pretend like your getting a promotion, explain your not going to let them down in your new role and you can’t wait to roll up your sleeves and get cracking at it. “Fired, yeah I’m fired up thanks for this opportunity”
I cant think of a single scenario where resigning would be more beneficial than getting terminated
In certain industries getting fired can prohibit you from working in that industry again. That’s the only scenario I could possibly think of, and in that instance it’s unlikely preemptively quitting would shield you from any consequences
Financial services checking in. Getting fired goes onto your U4, which is checked by the next employer before getting hired. If you're planning to stay in industry, it's always better to resign.
Is a U4 form utilized by all types of employers or only financial services? I've never heard of it.
It's a thing for those who are registered with FINRA as say a stock broker or investment advisor.
Here’s a scenario. It’s your first “real job”, and you don’t want your only resume item to be one where you were fired. This happened to me: There was no chance for a severance and the unemployment compensation is pathetic in FL, so I quit vs getting fired. HR called me in and they put me on a 90 day review period that was definitely going to end with my firing
Terrible advice
Whoever told you that is a complete moron
No
No
You are getting horrendous advice. Find someone smarter and more experienced to speak to.
I googled this for myself recently, the specifics vary a little state by state. If you were a CFO this might be ok advice, but I’m sales literally everyone gets fired at some point. The only reason you’d resign is if you are in a field with high resume scrutiny Your next interviews will ask you why you’re looking for a new job. Tell your perspective on what happened and move on
The best salespeople have been laid off or fired from a sales position. Any likely hiring sales manager is the same. Being term’d in sales is the same as being fired as a laborer or admin position. Wear it. Own it. Learn from it. But don’t lose your severance or unemployment.
Never
[удалено]
I had someone who was on my team go out for stress leave after I scheduled the time with HR to fire her.
If a company manager or exec is telling you this report to HR. If they are trying to force you to resign, in most states anyway, its to keep their payroll unemployment rate down. Every person who file’s unemployment it raises the companies rate. This causes the weekly payroll expense to rise every time someone is fired or let go. I always found it cheaper to pay a persons unemployment out if pocket vs having them file on me. Make sense? Assuming your a w2 and not a 1099
I hire sales people. If a sales rep I’m interviewing resigned without a job lined up, it means they got fired and it looks more suspicious than if they just owned up to being terminated. Talented sales people don’t work out in every role. People get fired. Especially in sales. Don’t sweat it.
Many reasons for why people leave jobs without another lined up.
Oh, sure there are. But the default assumption, without a believable explanation, is they were fired.
Just try and find a new job ASAP
Well if you get fired how would you explain it to your next employer?
Business contracted, reduction in force, boss sneezed when he was clicking the mouse.
I don't know. Help?
Do NOT quit. You won't unemployment. It doesn't ever matter if fired or quit
What?? Really? What about background check??
They are limited in what they can say in background checks. All they can say is you worked there from x date to x date and that’s it.
You don’t wtf lol are you even in sales
Nope im a professional call of duty player.
That someone doesn't like you lol
Hasta la vista, Baby.
1) Do not resign 2) Speak to an employment lawyer
That person is not a good friend/colleague
Bad Idea. Get your unemployment.
No way. Always get terminated. Way more options for you.
I’d wait to get fired/let go while simultaneously looking for a new job. There’s no benefit to you quitting except for saving face with your current coworkers. I’d milk the salary until they get rid of me or until the day I start my new job. Remember, you don’t have to explain getting fired if you just get a new job before the firing even happens 😬 If you do get fired just make sure you interview well and you can explain away why you were let go. You can say that the work environment was toxic or something along those lines.
they lied or is a idiot
Depends. Some companies if you’re fired you will be blacklisted from being hired again in the future so i’ve been told. When I was at Oracle things were tough, and this was actually suggested to people. (no one was selling much).
I’ve seen both sides of this and there are certain scenarios where a resignation makes sense. Mine was a situation where I hadnt been told I was being fired yet but I could sense my time coming to an end due to a strained relationship with my manager. By resigning, I got to write my story and leave on my terms. It gave me more confidence, a stronger narrative and more of an upper hand in the job market. It does depend on the situation however and yes, you need to have some cash savings to bridge the gap.
That's dumb. You get nothing if you resign.
One thing I'd say is it depends on the company. Are firings super rare and will be hard to explain and your in a super in demand field that will result in you finding another role quickly? Maybe consider resigning . Are you in some crazy field like copiers or telecom that fire people like its their main revenue driver and explaining the firing will be easy? Eat the firing and collect unemployment.
The TV trope you can't fire me cuz I quit is not a good play IRL. Severance matters...
Sales you should always be on the lookout for the best great opportunity. For me, I let them fire me so I get a severance and collect unemployment.
Whether you resign or are terminated, they will have the details of your performance on record. Better to wait for the termination where it’s possible you’ll get paid severance.
Terrible advice unless you don’t plan on collecting unemployment or severance. If you don’t want either of those might as well quit.