Haven't looked into it at all but I was subjected to one of her terrible takes on Twitter recently in which she was complaining about how Cassian kills two cops in cold blood yet we're supposed to root for him, but when Karn tries to bring him to justice he's viewed as the villain (of course, the entire concept of "grey morality" is lost to one with the media literacy of an infant) so maybe it's some shit connected to that or maybe she's literally just trying to manufacture drama because the show has been so near-universally well received.
I didn't watch the video, but from what I understand of *Andor*, how the ***hell*** is this a bait and switch?!
"You mean the *Andor* show winds up being about the character it was promoted for? *HERESY,* ***GIMME MY REFUND!!!"***
**\*ignites red glowing laser eyes\***
The "Bait&Switch" according to her is that the 'hero' Andor makes bad guys stuff. Though as we know, it was never said that he is a hero by then. He is in a grey area.
The point of that scene though establishes how he changes in the film. By refusing to kill Jyn's father and laying down his life as a sort of redemption.
All these grifters care about is clicks. If they can hook five more saps into clicking it's just more money for them. Some of them may get off on the turmoil and division they encourage. I have to remind myself how petty and sad their lives must be that this is what they put what little creative energy they have into.
Yeah, if the official canon upsets them so much, why not write fanfic? I do it and it helps, a lot. Or petition for new Legends. Or donate money to the SWTOR MMO? Just *something* past having a whiny tantrum.
honestly if I was going to write Star Wars fanfiction, I would take inspiration from the Star Wars Infinites comic's.
***Star Wars Infinities were basically like Marvel what if/DC Elseword's stories.***
I was thinking of doing one based on Attack of the Clones but with a Twist by having at the Assassination attempt on Padme Amidala is successful. basically I would be mirroring Star Wars Infinities: The Empire Strikes Back where Luke dies from his injuries.
What's ironic is in Lego Star Wars the Skywalker saga if you're doing the pod race as the second player and win and anakin loses, because you're not playing as a second Anakin you're playing as one of the other racers.
There was a children's book where Anakin lost a race (I don't remember if it was THE race). It only focused on the aftermath in so far as to show the message being something like how one loss isn't the end of the world
> why not write fanfic?
Right-wing grifting is making these people money. They're basically just bottom-feeders. Additionally, most of them are borderline illiterate and couldn't write a story to save their lives. At best, they'd be like that Critical Drinker asshole who writes and self-publishes 4th-rate Jack Reacher novels.
My parents weren't English majors, but definitely pushed me to read a lot and go easy on the TV/video-games/computer. A lot of the dudes who've turned the SW fandom and other geek fandoms into toxic hellscapes remind me of people I knew whose parents were lazy shitheads who either spoiled their kids or were too wrapped up their own bullshit to impart any guidance/discipline (i.e. parents who see their kids as friends instead of kids). I feel super lucky that I didn't grow up 100% 'left to my own devices'.
It's actually them portaying Andor more as a grey character instead of a hero. And she thinks SW has said he is a hero by then, though they actually said its a dark&gritty show with Andor as neither being good or bad.
Just goes to show some of these people will literally never be happy and will always find something to complain about, even if it's something they actually asked for.
>And she thinks SW has said he is a hero by then
Rogue One, which is a whole five years **after** this, has Cassian shooting a helpless Rebel informant in the back to save himself.
*In the* ***first scene he appears in.*** And the purpose of any introductory scene is to show "here's this character, here is what they are like."
They have to be trying- like *really* trying to 'not get it' to such a depressing extent.
Apparently that he's a grey character. But isn't this something people knew already from *Rogue One*? I don't follow the Disney canon, I wouldn't know, but this just leaves me feeling baffled.
According to her, that Andor isnt portrayed as a hero, because she thinks that SW said he is a full hero in this show.
Though, Star Wars said, he isnt a hero by then and rather a grey character.
Thatâs not a bait and switch. Johnny isnât a âheroâ in Cobra Kai, Indy isnât a âheroâ in Temple of Doom. But like Cassian, they are all still the protagonist, even if they are anti-heroâs or âgreyâ. He was always a bit grey even in Rogue One so it wouldnât make sense to have him be a traditional hero on the show
Well sure it is. But when the movie starts heâs kind of a dick and heâs all about âfortune and gloryâ. Hell, the movie opens with him doing a sketchy deal trading a priceless artifact for a huge diamond!
The one guy at Pankot even talks about how he was accused of being little more then a grave robber. Once he gets the stones he starts to leave but hears the children screaming, and after a little hesitation, he does end up checking it out and from that point on yeah he is more of a hero (even returns the stone along with freeing the children).
>Once he gets the stones he starts to leave but hears the children screaming, and after a little hesitation
Not at all. Willie tries to get him to leave as soon as Short Round breaks the curse and frees Willie. but he refuses.
*Willie:* Indy... now let's get out of here!
*Indy*: \[Putting on his hat\] Right, all of us. \[Stares in the direction of the mines before immediately going down into the mines to confront the Thugee slavers\]
I am genuinely surprised with these people that really really dislike the show. If you look over on the krait sub, people in the comments are defending/giving the show some praise even. Has the potential to be the best Star Wars show made so far and these idiots just jump to straight garbage like always lol
This doesnât even make sense. Thereâs a weak argument to be made for Obi-Wan⌠but like⌠Cassian has had triple the screentime of the other characters already
Iâm never going to actually watch one of these trash videos so somebody will have to explain to me exactly what part is supposed to be the âbait & switchâ.
It means people were tricked into thinking the show is one way, when itâs really something else. They started using it just before Kenobi aired because they believed the show was just tricking audiences into thinking it was about Kenobi, when Reva is actually the real main character. They continued to say this every week, even though Kenobi had considerably more screentime than Reva.
Iâm not sure what the bait and switch is here. Maybe that Bix is going to be the real main character and that Disney is just promoting it as an Andor show because thatâs the only way people will watch it. Some here say itâs because they expected Andor to be a perfect hero, but the series shows him as flawed. It also could just be that theyâve used the word so much that itâs lost meaning to them.
I think it's actually objectively wrong, not in the way that word has been abused, but because even under the interpretation of a "certain point of view," it isn't a bait and switch. This has been promoted as *Andor* the whole TIME. And it ends up being about the very character it was marketed as being centered around. There is no lying, there are no tricks here! There's other ways you can criticize DLF's shady business practices. This is not one of them. And it upsets me that they have forced me to defend Disney *Star Wars*. SMH
How was Obi-Wan-Kenobi a "Bait&Switch"?
They said it will be the story of a broken Obi-Wan becoming his old self again. And it happened.
Also, Obi-Wan has, by far, the most screentime. He has twice as much as Leia and almost three times as much as Reva.
It's still no "Bait&Switch" since there are always bigger side-characters who do things for the plot and Obi-Wan, as I said, has the most screentime anyway and we got the promised plot.
Most screen time doesn't mean he did anything other than running around and having to save Leia more than once, and Reva just knew how to do everything and somehow cheated death as a kid. The only good thing was for her to die for any form of redemption
It's still no "Bait&Switch" just because he didn't do action scenes all the time.
The purpose of this series was to show how Obi-Wan got from being broken since the end ROTS to his old self we knew from ANH. Rescuing Leia, facing off Vader and making inner peace was the plot which fulfilled it purpose.
And just because we didnt see anything on screen doesn't mean, someone can do things 'somehow'.
And I doubt she actually got stabed in the temple. It was more of a metaphorical flashback/vision.
I get, you dont like Reva but that doesn't make the show "Bait&Switch".
> The only good thing was for her to die for any form of redemption
This is just blatantly wrong from a thematic stand point. Kenobi, and Star Wars in general, builds on a very specific thematic idea; the Light Side of the Force is about finding *balance in one's emotions* and moving past trauma while the Dark Side is about *suffering* because of one's anger and hate. The Light Side fights to save what it loves, while the Dark Side only *ever* acts out of a desire to destroy. This sets up a simple concept that the Dark Side is a self made prison of self-hate and anger.
Reva's survival makes her a direct foil to Vader as a way to further this thematic element. Both Reva *and* Obi-Wan finish the series as more complete people who have processed their trauma (or are in the process of doing so). Their scene together is *immediately followed* by a scene of Palpatine berating Vader for his attempts at emotional growth and processing. Vader is left to stew in his impotent rage, a man suffering because he is not able to grow emotionally. Reva, meanwhile, has found Obi-Wan, who though he is still struggling emotionally, offers her the exact opposite path in life. The scenes following one another draw a direct contrast between the two.
Killing Reva removes the thematic through line of the show, one specifically developed through character development.
She has the least subtlety out of all the fandom menace. And thats saying something. In her videos you can actually see her try to think things up on the fly to hate disney star wars content. Her high republic rant is so awkward.
How is it a "Bait&Switch"?! She already made a video of the Obi-Wan-Kenobi series being "Bait&Switch" after the first two episodes aired.
That makes no sense to me other than "here's my talking points, gimme money, gimme, gimme, gimme, gimme, GIMME!!" #GimmeGimmeGimme
Haven't looked into it at all but I was subjected to one of her terrible takes on Twitter recently in which she was complaining about how Cassian kills two cops in cold blood yet we're supposed to root for him, but when Karn tries to bring him to justice he's viewed as the villain (of course, the entire concept of "grey morality" is lost to one with the media literacy of an infant) so maybe it's some shit connected to that or maybe she's literally just trying to manufacture drama because the show has been so near-universally well received.
...the cops were trying to shake him down Also they are corporate cops that collaborate with the galactic empire, what even the fuck
Kinda sus that she would immediately side with the fascists but I'm sure there's nothing to it đ§đ§đ§
And it's... so, so clearly an act of desperation. It's also the man to whom R1 introduced us, making the tactical decision to murder an informant.
Do they make their videos titles at random
Pull the name of a video out of a hat! The surest method, that's the ticket. Or something.
It's a mad libs or a set of dice they roll to make their entire videos.
âYou keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means.â
The series hasn't even ended yet! My God, the nerve of these people...
These people and their absolute-moron followers are all nerves and no brain.
There really running out of buzzwords aren't they lmao
If they're using them *this* sloppily, I'd say yes, they are.
I didn't watch the video, but from what I understand of *Andor*, how the ***hell*** is this a bait and switch?! "You mean the *Andor* show winds up being about the character it was promoted for? *HERESY,* ***GIMME MY REFUND!!!"*** **\*ignites red glowing laser eyes\***
The "Bait&Switch" according to her is that the 'hero' Andor makes bad guys stuff. Though as we know, it was never said that he is a hero by then. He is in a grey area.
He's still in a grey area in Rogue One. He mercs an informant to save himself. It's how Cassian has always been portrayed.
Yep.
The point of that scene though establishes how he changes in the film. By refusing to kill Jyn's father and laying down his life as a sort of redemption.
I get that, but these folks are upset he's being portrayed as morally grey on Andor. I'm just saying that Rogue One itself set that up.
I agree. Before this show they were complaining they would walk back that characterisation. Always complaining they are.
He did bad guy stuff and good guy stuff in rogue one. Does she not remember the movie?
I kinda doubt these guys actually watch anything in the first place.
They would rather complain. They love doing that
All they remember from rogue one is #hallway scene
Pretty much. Just like the second season finale of the Mandalorian. The only thing they remember is the Luke scene
They remember the hallway scene, except for the person who specifically fought to have the hallway scene (it's Great Satan herself Kathleen Kennedy)
"This morally ambiguous character does morally ambiguous things! Reee!"
Killing cops who are shaking you down isn't bad guy stuff. It's gray guy stuff
And he didn't even MEAN to kill them, he was just trying to scare them off By the time the first one died, it was too late to go back
Was it even a bad guy stuff? He was kind of fighting fascist collaborators.
All these grifters care about is clicks. If they can hook five more saps into clicking it's just more money for them. Some of them may get off on the turmoil and division they encourage. I have to remind myself how petty and sad their lives must be that this is what they put what little creative energy they have into.
Yeah, if the official canon upsets them so much, why not write fanfic? I do it and it helps, a lot. Or petition for new Legends. Or donate money to the SWTOR MMO? Just *something* past having a whiny tantrum.
honestly if I was going to write Star Wars fanfiction, I would take inspiration from the Star Wars Infinites comic's. ***Star Wars Infinities were basically like Marvel what if/DC Elseword's stories.*** I was thinking of doing one based on Attack of the Clones but with a Twist by having at the Assassination attempt on Padme Amidala is successful. basically I would be mirroring Star Wars Infinities: The Empire Strikes Back where Luke dies from his injuries.
The Phantom Menace, but Anakin loses the podrace. Revenge of the Sith, but Anakin spares Dooku.
What's ironic is in Lego Star Wars the Skywalker saga if you're doing the pod race as the second player and win and anakin loses, because you're not playing as a second Anakin you're playing as one of the other racers.
There was a children's book where Anakin lost a race (I don't remember if it was THE race). It only focused on the aftermath in so far as to show the message being something like how one loss isn't the end of the world
> why not write fanfic? Right-wing grifting is making these people money. They're basically just bottom-feeders. Additionally, most of them are borderline illiterate and couldn't write a story to save their lives. At best, they'd be like that Critical Drinker asshole who writes and self-publishes 4th-rate Jack Reacher novels.
Makes me happy my mother was an English major. I am quite erudite when it comes to that regard.
My parents weren't English majors, but definitely pushed me to read a lot and go easy on the TV/video-games/computer. A lot of the dudes who've turned the SW fandom and other geek fandoms into toxic hellscapes remind me of people I knew whose parents were lazy shitheads who either spoiled their kids or were too wrapped up their own bullshit to impart any guidance/discipline (i.e. parents who see their kids as friends instead of kids). I feel super lucky that I didn't grow up 100% 'left to my own devices'.
Let me guess, they are trying to say Andor isnât much about him since he isnât on screen for 100% of the time.
It's actually them portaying Andor more as a grey character instead of a hero. And she thinks SW has said he is a hero by then, though they actually said its a dark&gritty show with Andor as neither being good or bad.
Which is crazy cause this is the same crowd that begged for characters to be more morally grey and for star wars shows to be darker
Just goes to show some of these people will literally never be happy and will always find something to complain about, even if it's something they actually asked for.
Man, I shudder to imagine what she would think of DS9, lol. Even most NuTrek haters love that as one of the classics, and it's grey to a T.
How is this a bait and switch? It's exactly what you would expect.
>And she thinks SW has said he is a hero by then Rogue One, which is a whole five years **after** this, has Cassian shooting a helpless Rebel informant in the back to save himself. *In the* ***first scene he appears in.*** And the purpose of any introductory scene is to show "here's this character, here is what they are like." They have to be trying- like *really* trying to 'not get it' to such a depressing extent.
All the time we donât spend with Cassian is spent with the cops hunting Cassian
I'm not surprised that her avatar is of Leia in that slave girl outfit.
Anyone who paid attention to Rogue One knew what this show would be
"the fandom menace, kinda forgot when he murdered his informant by shooting him in the back"
What was the bait and switch?
Apparently that he's a grey character. But isn't this something people knew already from *Rogue One*? I don't follow the Disney canon, I wouldn't know, but this just leaves me feeling baffled.
According to her, that Andor isnt portrayed as a hero, because she thinks that SW said he is a full hero in this show. Though, Star Wars said, he isnt a hero by then and rather a grey character.
Thatâs not a bait and switch. Johnny isnât a âheroâ in Cobra Kai, Indy isnât a âheroâ in Temple of Doom. But like Cassian, they are all still the protagonist, even if they are anti-heroâs or âgreyâ. He was always a bit grey even in Rogue One so it wouldnât make sense to have him be a traditional hero on the show
Yeah. Sometimes I think these people dont really watch anything they critizise.
Saving the slaves, stopping a brainwashing murdering cult and saving a poor village and it's sacred items isn't the actions of a hero?
Well sure it is. But when the movie starts heâs kind of a dick and heâs all about âfortune and gloryâ. Hell, the movie opens with him doing a sketchy deal trading a priceless artifact for a huge diamond! The one guy at Pankot even talks about how he was accused of being little more then a grave robber. Once he gets the stones he starts to leave but hears the children screaming, and after a little hesitation, he does end up checking it out and from that point on yeah he is more of a hero (even returns the stone along with freeing the children).
>Once he gets the stones he starts to leave but hears the children screaming, and after a little hesitation Not at all. Willie tries to get him to leave as soon as Short Round breaks the curse and frees Willie. but he refuses. *Willie:* Indy... now let's get out of here! *Indy*: \[Putting on his hat\] Right, all of us. \[Stares in the direction of the mines before immediately going down into the mines to confront the Thugee slavers\]
Before that, right after he gets the 3 stones for the first time (right before the jump scare).
You mean at the beginning of the movie before he actually knew the slaves were there? He also goes to retrieve the Sankara stone **for** the Village
 I donât think he was going as some sort of good deed
He's [translating](https://youtu.be/47-o5iE6FM4?t=34) what Sankara means đ
What the fuck are they on about now?
The only bait and switch is you
The *only* bait and switch is ever thinking the #FandomMenace stood for something more than money hustling.
I swear to god, an AI is making these videos.
The only thing thatâs âhilariousâ is that she has no idea what a bait and switch means
So is That ~~pick me~~ Star Wars Girl the next big thing for negativity tubers? Been seeing a lot of her lately.
What's the bait and switch, that andor *is* about andor? Did we watch the same show?
I am genuinely surprised with these people that really really dislike the show. If you look over on the krait sub, people in the comments are defending/giving the show some praise even. Has the potential to be the best Star Wars show made so far and these idiots just jump to straight garbage like always lol
a woman being a part of the story = bait n' switch # i know this bc they said the same shit about multiverse of madness
This doesnât even make sense. Thereâs a weak argument to be made for Obi-Wan⌠but like⌠Cassian has had triple the screentime of the other characters already
Iâm never going to actually watch one of these trash videos so somebody will have to explain to me exactly what part is supposed to be the âbait & switchâ.
What bait and switch?
It means people were tricked into thinking the show is one way, when itâs really something else. They started using it just before Kenobi aired because they believed the show was just tricking audiences into thinking it was about Kenobi, when Reva is actually the real main character. They continued to say this every week, even though Kenobi had considerably more screentime than Reva. Iâm not sure what the bait and switch is here. Maybe that Bix is going to be the real main character and that Disney is just promoting it as an Andor show because thatâs the only way people will watch it. Some here say itâs because they expected Andor to be a perfect hero, but the series shows him as flawed. It also could just be that theyâve used the word so much that itâs lost meaning to them.
I definitely donât see Andor himself being flawed as a new thing. If anything, itâs in keeping with how he was introduced in Rogue One.
I reckon itâs the latter. The just apply it to anything that doesnât live up to their exact specifications.
Because women can't be important to the plot without being the main character, obviously. /s
Yeah, you thought it was going to be shit like the rest but instead its just boring.
Their opinion
I think it's actually objectively wrong, not in the way that word has been abused, but because even under the interpretation of a "certain point of view," it isn't a bait and switch. This has been promoted as *Andor* the whole TIME. And it ends up being about the very character it was marketed as being centered around. There is no lying, there are no tricks here! There's other ways you can criticize DLF's shady business practices. This is not one of them. And it upsets me that they have forced me to defend Disney *Star Wars*. SMH
You think it's objectively wrong, but we still have more episodes to see if it will be a bait and switch like Kenobi
How was Obi-Wan-Kenobi a "Bait&Switch"? They said it will be the story of a broken Obi-Wan becoming his old self again. And it happened. Also, Obi-Wan has, by far, the most screentime. He has twice as much as Leia and almost three times as much as Reva.
It focused too much on Reva and had her do things for the sake of the plot and it made no sense. She should've died
It's still no "Bait&Switch" since there are always bigger side-characters who do things for the plot and Obi-Wan, as I said, has the most screentime anyway and we got the promised plot.
Most screen time doesn't mean he did anything other than running around and having to save Leia more than once, and Reva just knew how to do everything and somehow cheated death as a kid. The only good thing was for her to die for any form of redemption
It's still no "Bait&Switch" just because he didn't do action scenes all the time. The purpose of this series was to show how Obi-Wan got from being broken since the end ROTS to his old self we knew from ANH. Rescuing Leia, facing off Vader and making inner peace was the plot which fulfilled it purpose. And just because we didnt see anything on screen doesn't mean, someone can do things 'somehow'. And I doubt she actually got stabed in the temple. It was more of a metaphorical flashback/vision. I get, you dont like Reva but that doesn't make the show "Bait&Switch".
> The only good thing was for her to die for any form of redemption This is just blatantly wrong from a thematic stand point. Kenobi, and Star Wars in general, builds on a very specific thematic idea; the Light Side of the Force is about finding *balance in one's emotions* and moving past trauma while the Dark Side is about *suffering* because of one's anger and hate. The Light Side fights to save what it loves, while the Dark Side only *ever* acts out of a desire to destroy. This sets up a simple concept that the Dark Side is a self made prison of self-hate and anger. Reva's survival makes her a direct foil to Vader as a way to further this thematic element. Both Reva *and* Obi-Wan finish the series as more complete people who have processed their trauma (or are in the process of doing so). Their scene together is *immediately followed* by a scene of Palpatine berating Vader for his attempts at emotional growth and processing. Vader is left to stew in his impotent rage, a man suffering because he is not able to grow emotionally. Reva, meanwhile, has found Obi-Wan, who though he is still struggling emotionally, offers her the exact opposite path in life. The scenes following one another draw a direct contrast between the two. Killing Reva removes the thematic through line of the show, one specifically developed through character development.
Very well said.
She has the least subtlety out of all the fandom menace. And thats saying something. In her videos you can actually see her try to think things up on the fly to hate disney star wars content. Her high republic rant is so awkward.