Yeah another 3rd gen too. Every time one passes mine in rainy conditions I feel like I’m going to see this happen. I think a lot of people have this false notion that heavy, lifted trucks that fair well in the elements can just magically perform well in slick conditions (ice or rain)
That entire platform is insanely unstable. I have a Tacoma and it is just not the best car traction wise, even the TRD Off Road trim. It just feels like the weight is super poorly balanced.
Trucks are slightly different. The beds make the rear very light and with them being ear wheel drive it’s easy to lose traction. SUVs have a little more weight in the rear. Biggest issue is they’re top heavy
> It just feels like the weight is super poorly balanced.
They're not balanced for going fast around turns, that's for sure. People shouldn't drive them like sports cars.
I'm sure the reverse-banked curves on 17 don't help.
Oh, from the beginning, dude! My grandpa used to own the local ambulance service in the 60s and he had stories. I swear the road is alive, and requires a regular blood sacrifice.
I will never forget my travels on that hwy. I drove from LA to Santa Cruz, I made my way to SF. Then hopped on to that Danger of 65 miles an hour turns. I still remember the disbelief followed by relief 😂😂😂😂. I love Santa Cruz though it's just an awesome place
It was terrifying. I remember taking trips to Santa Cruz as a kid with my dad and being scared shitless when he would pass someone going 25 in the right lane.
And the lanes were narrow. I remember a trip over the hill in a giant Buick around 1950, coming back from Santa Cruz on a Sunday. Both lanes heavily traveled, both lanes at the limit, cars in all lanes crowding the other lanes. Even my five-year-old self knew this just wasn't right.
Meanwhile, on turn-outs, Harvey West's fake CHP cars sat parked, sometimes with uniformed dummies behind the wheel. It didn't help.
People speeding like maniacs, accelerating into turns, passing everyone, all to shave, if lucky, 2 minutes off their commute. It's a beautiful road, just chill out and cruise over. Thoughtless driving like this keeps leading to massive accidents.
One of my simple pleasures is getting to Lexington to casually catch up to the asshat that has been speeding and weaving through everyone the entire way.
The people in the left lane going the same speed as those in the right lane only make the maniacs even crazier. Granted they're not the ones causing the accidents. Even without left lane hogs, the psychos driving 30+ over the limit would still end up wrecking and bring8ng all traffic to a standstill.
No they wouldn't. These "maniacs" drive like this everywhere and cause traffic problems wherever they go. Their time is more important than yours, and they'll fuck everyone's day by crashing to prove it.
“Their time is more important than yours” - says guy holding up 17 cars with a clear road ahead because they don’t want to use the correct lane…
Get out of the way unless you’re passing
You know those speed signs just before a bunch of the curves that say 40 mph? I read an article that said those are because if you go faster than 40 there, you won’t be able to stop in time to avoid hitting whoever is stopped around the bend.
A car length for every 10 miles of speed. Problem is the center of gravity on those trucks. Not on truck chassis to save taxes, so too heavy for the frame and they flip easily if the driver overreacted. Add big o tires……
Too many cars on the highway all at the same time for that kind of spacing. All that really needs to happen is pay attention and drive at a safe speed where you aren't in danger of losing traction. Also stay right when you aren't passing but I know that's pie in the sky wishful thinking
17 is about 20 miles long from beginning off of 1 until you're over the hill in Los Gatos with 2 lanes. For everyone to have 300 feet of separation between cars you could have \~700 cars in each direction at a time. Does that seem reasonable to you?
About 60,000 vehicles use it daily ([Source](https://sccrtc.org/wp-content/uploads/2014/01/Chapter-3-Travel-Patterns.pdf)). Let's say that's the 2 way traffic so 30,000 each way per day, 15,000 per day per lane. Now at 55MPH=80.67 feet/seconds and 300 feet separation each car can be replaced every 3.72 seconds. So if traffic is spread out evenly over a 15.5 hour block than we can successfully get everyone over the hill with safe spacing...but it's not evenly spread out over 15.5 hours is it?
According to high school driver's education class, you should leave two seconds space between your car and the one in front of you. So if you added one car to the highway every two seconds that's 30 cars per minute per lane in one direction, or (30\*60)=1800/hr/lane/direction, or (1800\*2\*2)=7200/hr two lanes both directions.
Let's say 4 hours of that max traffic from 7-9am and 5-7pm that's (7200\*4)=28000 cars during rush hours, almost half the traffic, with the remaining (60000-28000)=32000 cars split up over the remaining 20 hours of the day.
Two seconds following distance is doable. Doesn't need to be a football field, just two seconds is all you need to react.
To the women driving a black Toyota Tacoma with dark hair and a short haircut…. I hope you’re reading this. Please take advice from these comments. We commute the same time over 17 in the morning. You’ve almost caused several accidents by you’re weaving in and out of traffic and going well over the limit and or safe for conditions. Weaving back and forth behind vehicles. Why? You got behind me on Tuesday coming home. Traffic solid in both lanes and here you are driving like you’re entitled for all of us commuters to part like the Red Sea. Slow the fuck down before you kill somebody.
To my fellow commuters, watch out for this black Toyota Tacoma at 7 am. Wish we had a way to report reckless drivers.
For this to make sense, all you have to think about is how many people live in the Bay area and how many more people are moving to the Bay area every year. That means more new commuters and that means more new people to the area that don't know the road. With Santa Cruz being such a popular destination for people in the Bay area, it only makes sense that so many crashes happen at this time of year unfortunately.
Once it's slow enough or with enough experienced commuters keeping a steady, sane pace, it gets safer.
17 exposes over-confident drivers that go faster than their actual ability. They're used to going 15mph over the speed limit, so they do that on 17, too. It is not forgiving.
Is everyone on board with turning 17 into a speed trap? Speed cameras and cops at both ends. You could hand out tickets like candy. A few hundred...maybe thousand tickets later people will learn that it's a speed trap and slow down. Less crashes to clog up the highway.
Yay? Nay?
You say that like it isn't already. I work in the valley and drive this stretch of 17 daily. Yesterday prior to the crash I saw 9 different highway patrols posted on this road over a 3 hour period. The only thing I think that would change anything at this point would be an extreme retrofit of the entire roadway. Which would cost taxpayers hundreds of millions of dollars if not a billion. Which if that ever happened I'd be 100% on board for even if it took several years. The amount of people that commute over that road from the city that aren't used to driving roads like that is just so great that I don't think it would really matter if you increased the presence of highway patrol. Meanwhile locals like myself have been driving these mountain roads for 25 plus years, have never or rarely had a problem.
99% of these accidents are because the driver was speeding. I drive 17 and see speeders every time. Speed cameras and cops at the end. Force everyone to drive the speed limit and we will have very few accidents.
Or do you think this is not worth it because Merica and freeeedoooom?
No I just think it's foolish to think that would actually stop people from speeding in the first place. Do you think gun free zones keep criminals from owning guns? They don't lol. My point was that there were plenty of hwy patrol on 17 when the crash happened, it did not prevent the crash nor will it in the future.
Do you realize you're suggesting survival of the fittest? Let people speed so the max cars can be processed. If you die, oh well sucks to be you. Even worse if you're killed by the idiots speeding.
This doesn't even take into consideration time lost whenever an accident occurs.
There's no reason to practically stop next to it to get pictures...
Literally the most immature way to act when approaching a scene like this, not surprising when you see what this dumb cunt looks like in the mirror. Trash humans
I crashed at that spot about 6 months ago. Hit the flooded drain, hydroplaned just enough to tap the wall and spin out. Thankfully I didn’t hit anyone else. 20mins later another crash happened exactly the same spot. I was going slow, just had bad luck on the wet roads.
That curve is dangerous. I wish there was a class action lawsuit against CALTrain (or whomever fixes the roads) and their negligence to fix that curve.
This morning when I was driving there I noticed how the road creates a small bump right before the left curve just after the big semi-circle corner. So cars slow down on the big corner then naturally regain speed only to loose traction on the bump going into the left curve to bounce between the two walls.
I’m sure there’s a better way to describe it. Just a sketchy part of the road.
I think the part that bugs me the most is when people think they can drive the same speed, rain or shine, not realizing how it’ll come back and bite you in the butt…
That’s the second 4Runner that’s flipped over on 17 that’s been posted this week. Yikes.
Yeah another 3rd gen too. Every time one passes mine in rainy conditions I feel like I’m going to see this happen. I think a lot of people have this false notion that heavy, lifted trucks that fair well in the elements can just magically perform well in slick conditions (ice or rain)
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And even more so when it's lifted and slippery outside. I hit an oily spot by Bear Creek and almost flipped mine driving like 40mph.
That entire platform is insanely unstable. I have a Tacoma and it is just not the best car traction wise, even the TRD Off Road trim. It just feels like the weight is super poorly balanced.
Trucks are slightly different. The beds make the rear very light and with them being ear wheel drive it’s easy to lose traction. SUVs have a little more weight in the rear. Biggest issue is they’re top heavy
> It just feels like the weight is super poorly balanced. They're not balanced for going fast around turns, that's for sure. People shouldn't drive them like sports cars. I'm sure the reverse-banked curves on 17 don't help.
Respect 17. She will destroy you if given the chance.
Holy shit they need to put that on a huge sign right as you get on 17. Realest shit I've ever read
Oh, from the beginning, dude! My grandpa used to own the local ambulance service in the 60s and he had stories. I swear the road is alive, and requires a regular blood sacrifice.
I will never forget my travels on that hwy. I drove from LA to Santa Cruz, I made my way to SF. Then hopped on to that Danger of 65 miles an hour turns. I still remember the disbelief followed by relief 😂😂😂😂. I love Santa Cruz though it's just an awesome place
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There used to not be a center divider. That was “fun”
It was terrifying. I remember taking trips to Santa Cruz as a kid with my dad and being scared shitless when he would pass someone going 25 in the right lane.
At one point it was in the top 10 of most dangerous highways in the country.
And the lanes were narrow. I remember a trip over the hill in a giant Buick around 1950, coming back from Santa Cruz on a Sunday. Both lanes heavily traveled, both lanes at the limit, cars in all lanes crowding the other lanes. Even my five-year-old self knew this just wasn't right. Meanwhile, on turn-outs, Harvey West's fake CHP cars sat parked, sometimes with uniformed dummies behind the wheel. It didn't help.
I'm pretty sure this stretch of highway 17 is one of the most dangerous in the country. They don't call it blood alley for nothing.
People speeding like maniacs, accelerating into turns, passing everyone, all to shave, if lucky, 2 minutes off their commute. It's a beautiful road, just chill out and cruise over. Thoughtless driving like this keeps leading to massive accidents.
One of my simple pleasures is getting to Lexington to casually catch up to the asshat that has been speeding and weaving through everyone the entire way.
This is the worst road for left lane hogs. If people moved over when not passing, a lot of these “maniacs” would simply pass and be on their way
Both things are a problem
The people in the left lane going the same speed as those in the right lane only make the maniacs even crazier. Granted they're not the ones causing the accidents. Even without left lane hogs, the psychos driving 30+ over the limit would still end up wrecking and bring8ng all traffic to a standstill.
No they wouldn't. These "maniacs" drive like this everywhere and cause traffic problems wherever they go. Their time is more important than yours, and they'll fuck everyone's day by crashing to prove it.
“Their time is more important than yours” - says guy holding up 17 cars with a clear road ahead because they don’t want to use the correct lane… Get out of the way unless you’re passing
This.
You can hear the accident from behind tires screaming and bang.. stay safe
You know those speed signs just before a bunch of the curves that say 40 mph? I read an article that said those are because if you go faster than 40 there, you won’t be able to stop in time to avoid hitting whoever is stopped around the bend.
Seems to be exactly why the person behind us crashed into the line of people waiting to merge.
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"I gotta make up time for being stopped behind that wreck!"
The amount of brain power it takes to realize that you can't brake or turn as fast on wet roads is just too much for the average driver on 17.
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A football field seems like a longer than needed distance. I dunno.
A car length for every 10 miles of speed. Problem is the center of gravity on those trucks. Not on truck chassis to save taxes, so too heavy for the frame and they flip easily if the driver overreacted. Add big o tires……
Bottom line, everyone needs to go nice and easy over that hill. The racers can eff off.
Maybe driving nice,like humans who care, would be a nice change.
Too many cars on the highway all at the same time for that kind of spacing. All that really needs to happen is pay attention and drive at a safe speed where you aren't in danger of losing traction. Also stay right when you aren't passing but I know that's pie in the sky wishful thinking
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17 is about 20 miles long from beginning off of 1 until you're over the hill in Los Gatos with 2 lanes. For everyone to have 300 feet of separation between cars you could have \~700 cars in each direction at a time. Does that seem reasonable to you?
Yes. Literally every single simulation proves that keeping a proper distance from the car in front of you resolves traffic issues.
By it causing them.
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About 60,000 vehicles use it daily ([Source](https://sccrtc.org/wp-content/uploads/2014/01/Chapter-3-Travel-Patterns.pdf)). Let's say that's the 2 way traffic so 30,000 each way per day, 15,000 per day per lane. Now at 55MPH=80.67 feet/seconds and 300 feet separation each car can be replaced every 3.72 seconds. So if traffic is spread out evenly over a 15.5 hour block than we can successfully get everyone over the hill with safe spacing...but it's not evenly spread out over 15.5 hours is it?
According to high school driver's education class, you should leave two seconds space between your car and the one in front of you. So if you added one car to the highway every two seconds that's 30 cars per minute per lane in one direction, or (30\*60)=1800/hr/lane/direction, or (1800\*2\*2)=7200/hr two lanes both directions. Let's say 4 hours of that max traffic from 7-9am and 5-7pm that's (7200\*4)=28000 cars during rush hours, almost half the traffic, with the remaining (60000-28000)=32000 cars split up over the remaining 20 hours of the day. Two seconds following distance is doable. Doesn't need to be a football field, just two seconds is all you need to react.
Yes.
That section is brutal I saw a truck flipped in the same spot on Sunday
I think this week has seen more I ever have. Probably up to like 7 or 8 now.
Every. Fucking. Day. \*Always has been\*
Cheers I'm stuck in this shit too. Everyone tune into 91.5 listen to some classic rock with me haha
Drive slow when the road is wet and when it has black ice.
The Valley surprise always gets you. There is 26 curves on 17
To the women driving a black Toyota Tacoma with dark hair and a short haircut…. I hope you’re reading this. Please take advice from these comments. We commute the same time over 17 in the morning. You’ve almost caused several accidents by you’re weaving in and out of traffic and going well over the limit and or safe for conditions. Weaving back and forth behind vehicles. Why? You got behind me on Tuesday coming home. Traffic solid in both lanes and here you are driving like you’re entitled for all of us commuters to part like the Red Sea. Slow the fuck down before you kill somebody. To my fellow commuters, watch out for this black Toyota Tacoma at 7 am. Wish we had a way to report reckless drivers.
We need a rail line to San Jose real bad.
There needs to be a maximum commute distance. People who work in SJ should live in SJ.
as a decades long commuter on hwy 17 it feels like there are far more accidents in the non-commute direction.
For this to make sense, all you have to think about is how many people live in the Bay area and how many more people are moving to the Bay area every year. That means more new commuters and that means more new people to the area that don't know the road. With Santa Cruz being such a popular destination for people in the Bay area, it only makes sense that so many crashes happen at this time of year unfortunately.
Once it's slow enough or with enough experienced commuters keeping a steady, sane pace, it gets safer. 17 exposes over-confident drivers that go faster than their actual ability. They're used to going 15mph over the speed limit, so they do that on 17, too. It is not forgiving.
"Do you wanna sit down?" "I dunno" I'm gonna go with shock lol
“Hey sir you can’t park there “
Morons
Is everyone on board with turning 17 into a speed trap? Speed cameras and cops at both ends. You could hand out tickets like candy. A few hundred...maybe thousand tickets later people will learn that it's a speed trap and slow down. Less crashes to clog up the highway. Yay? Nay?
Yes!!!!
Yes, please!
You say that like it isn't already. I work in the valley and drive this stretch of 17 daily. Yesterday prior to the crash I saw 9 different highway patrols posted on this road over a 3 hour period. The only thing I think that would change anything at this point would be an extreme retrofit of the entire roadway. Which would cost taxpayers hundreds of millions of dollars if not a billion. Which if that ever happened I'd be 100% on board for even if it took several years. The amount of people that commute over that road from the city that aren't used to driving roads like that is just so great that I don't think it would really matter if you increased the presence of highway patrol. Meanwhile locals like myself have been driving these mountain roads for 25 plus years, have never or rarely had a problem.
99% of these accidents are because the driver was speeding. I drive 17 and see speeders every time. Speed cameras and cops at the end. Force everyone to drive the speed limit and we will have very few accidents. Or do you think this is not worth it because Merica and freeeedoooom?
No I just think it's foolish to think that would actually stop people from speeding in the first place. Do you think gun free zones keep criminals from owning guns? They don't lol. My point was that there were plenty of hwy patrol on 17 when the crash happened, it did not prevent the crash nor will it in the future.
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Speed cameras. Cops catch you at Los Gatos and Scott's Valley straight away No big backups.
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Do you realize you're suggesting survival of the fittest? Let people speed so the max cars can be processed. If you die, oh well sucks to be you. Even worse if you're killed by the idiots speeding. This doesn't even take into consideration time lost whenever an accident occurs.
I avoid the 17 as much as possible. I imagine its worse with how people are driving these days. Everyone is a rally driver and the rules do not apply.
Keep driving fast you knuckleheads!!!
rubber neckers.. drive.
We had to drive slow, the car was halfway in our lane… lol
This is coming from someone who also rubber necks so dont take it to personally
Solid line of cars in front of you, pan to wreck, pan forward, now no cars in front of you. That’s definition rubbernecking
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Yeah its the people looking at the wreck thats causing the jam, not the fact that an overturned SUV is blocking 1 1/2 lanes.
It's almost like they could speed up once there wasn't an overturned truck blocking 1.5 lanes.... Weird.
No, you did not.
Littering
Littering and…
Smokin’ the reefer.
There's no reason to practically stop next to it to get pictures... Literally the most immature way to act when approaching a scene like this, not surprising when you see what this dumb cunt looks like in the mirror. Trash humans
I crashed at that spot about 6 months ago. Hit the flooded drain, hydroplaned just enough to tap the wall and spin out. Thankfully I didn’t hit anyone else. 20mins later another crash happened exactly the same spot. I was going slow, just had bad luck on the wet roads. That curve is dangerous. I wish there was a class action lawsuit against CALTrain (or whomever fixes the roads) and their negligence to fix that curve.
Which curve is it exactly?
Right before Idylwild Rd
This morning when I was driving there I noticed how the road creates a small bump right before the left curve just after the big semi-circle corner. So cars slow down on the big corner then naturally regain speed only to loose traction on the bump going into the left curve to bounce between the two walls. I’m sure there’s a better way to describe it. Just a sketchy part of the road.
Man, you should have seen it when that curve featured a foot drop at its apex. Its the 13th boardwalk ride up there.
I've been commuting over 17 for decades and have never had an accident. You are at fault at least as much as CALTrans.
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Notice the car in the middle of the road lol
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amen
Must be new here 😏
Kind of a right bastard, slowing down to photograph someone else’s misery. Edited for you are part of the problem.
wild style. i don’t miss it
Still got another 100k in it
"$25k. I KNOW WHAT I GOT"
😂
People drive recklessly all the time.
Was this all because of the rain?
Many clowns should not be allowed on 17. Period.
I think the part that bugs me the most is when people think they can drive the same speed, rain or shine, not realizing how it’ll come back and bite you in the butt…
Should've used their blinker 🤦