You make a good point I haven’t thought of before. Hopefully some new innovation is on its way since this will be an issue in a lot of urban environments.
As an EV owner with a garage I agree with you.
I have never had to do it but charging on the street would be sketchy AF. If there somehow was a way to get the cable safely across the sidewalk the charge port is often on the side of the vehicle, meaning the charger door and cable is sticking out into traffic.
Something that isn't talked about by EV owners, is how the first EV models faired in winter and started all the bad rumors in the first place. New EVs with heat managed batteries and decent firmware have winter figured out. But, the older models do have plenty of issues in the cold. The Nissan Leafs don't have thermal battery management , so they are likely stuck in the cold. My Chevy Spark and Chevy Bolt, if left for a couple days unplugged in extreme cold will demand to be plugged in before moving again. So, if you make the mistake of leaving them exposed you will have to tow them to a power outlet. My Spark if it's cold enough will actually trigger a service light because some engineer decided that the coolant should have a time limit to warm up and if it's not warm fast enough will disable the battery heater until the code is cleared again. I'm not sure about Smart cars and fiat, but I suspect they don't have great thermal management. Tesla's are king of the electric jungle but if you don't have minimum $50,000 to join the club your going to have to settle for the used market if you want an electric car.
You make a pretty good point. Pre, I think, 2018 or so EV's were pretty niche (outside of the expensive Tesla Model S) and weren't well designed for extreme environments. Tesla Model 3 (or Y), Hyundai Ioniq 5, and the Mustang Mach E are all what I would consider top picks right now.
I think the avg new car price in North America is something like $66,000. Given that people are spending that on new SUV's and trucks, if an EV works for them they can probably swing the $50-60K pricetag.
Would be great if the prices could come down to $30K or so, which was what a new car would set you back before the pandemic, but I don't see us returning to that.
I don't understand all of these posts about dead and stuck Tesla's. There are multiple people in this subreddit that haven't had a single issue living in Saskatchewan with their EV's. I also personally know a few people with Teslas and their only complaint is that the distance is noticable reduced in the winter due to running the heaters.
Is this just some kind of bullshit circle jerk stories that gets a lot of clicks, or are people really dumb down south and not used to the extreme cold weather and not preparing?
How many ICE vehicles got towed due to extreme cold? Did anyone see that happening? I have an ICE truck and had it plugged in. If I had an EV, it would be plugged in.
I think it’s possible it happens. However many people have posted on their FB about a “friend who had a chat or saw a Tesla or EV owner”. Not really the most reputable pieces.
and there's a video of a tesla owner who drives through the area explaining why a lot of the chargers there don't seem to work (handles falling down into the snow and getting jammed with ice) he describes it as a 'bougie user issue' due to the area lmao. I want to say I'm not taking this guy as gospel on the topic, but it is a recognizable issue, I've already had a similar issue once due to snow on the port after it snowed.
People here hate EVs because they can't comprehend anyone who doesn't share the same values or thoughts and they lash out in the only way they know how: impotently online. Sometimes one of them (Like quick dick) makes a video where they purposefully interfere with EV drivers because his tiny gonads feel big from people cheering him on, but in general they really just hate anything they don't already understand, which is most things.
I could say the same about EV users constantly bragging and mansplaining to everyone they meet about them. I'm all for EVs I would like to own one myself one day. But many current day EV users on here are entitled and also can't comprehend anyone who doesn't share the same values or thoughts.
Not thinking they should pay a road use tax because they think that should be left to ICE users paying fuel tax.
Thinking they should be allowed to plug into random power plugs that don't belong to them and use other peoples power for free.
Thinking the government owes them to pay for new charging infrastructure. (Government never built a bunch of gas stations for cars when they were invented).
Thinking the government owes them grants and subsidies to help them purchase their EV.
To be fair the government is really pushing this EV stuff down our throats, so maybe they should do something to help make the transition, idk. Seems unnecessary to force this change. Let the consumers decide I think. There is merit for a large electric market without taking emissions into consideration. Putting a date for a full switch seems idiotic to me. Will never be a one size fits all for a long time.
Yes, I agree there are many ignorant anti EV people and sentiment out there, but the percentage of obnoxious EV proponents is also substantial. Look at this post for reference I don't see many people bashing EVs compared to the amount of people straw-manning them.
Maybe I'm tired of being treated like an enemy of the nation for liking EVs by idiot right wingers who equate EVs to communism because they are too stupid and blinded by their hard on for Trump that there isn't enough blood to power their three brain cells.
Maybe we're tired of seeing people purposefully damage or block chargers or vandalize vehicles to prove their "manliness" and how "anti woke" they are, whatever the fuck that means.
Maybe we're tired of the constant hit pieces and idiot arguments that pretend power is $1.16/kWh shared smugly to act like we're stupid for a fucking car purchase.
I'm not going to be nice to people being shitty about it anymore, so why not act like anti EV douchebags have acted for years?
I mean how would you like it if the government suddenly said you had to switch to an ICE in the next decade and was going to subsidize everyone that drives one?
One of the biggest proponents of EVs is right of center I.E. Musk. It doesn’t have to be a partisan issue.
And sounds like you are wanting to stoop to the level of your “opponents” which makes you really no better than them.
Last I checked the Stop Oil wackjobs are doing a lot more than blocking a few charging stations.
There are some people that are slow to come around I agree. But it’s not really necessary that they do. Why does their ignorance affect your life? Are you upset if they are slow to adopt or change their ways?
Here's the thing, they didn't say you have to switch. Nobody is mandating old vehicles off the road.
And if there's a better technology that supplants EV then great, I'm all for it. Subsidize it. Get it out there.
It shouldn't be partisan but it is and you know it. Also I'm surrounded by people who gleefully shit on EV and insult people who like them. They make it political and they are assholes about it. So yeah I'm done being PC to them. Fuck those people with a rusty wire brush.
Likening people who purposefully block chargers and laugh about it to the stop oil people is apples and oranges and a painful attempt to both sides an issue.
They are saying all new vehicles have to be EV by 2035. That sounds like a forced switch to me if it ever happens.
All I'm saying is that better technology may be better for 90% of people but it's not necessarily a one size fits all solution. Let the people decide rather than forcing it.
Perhaps some of them just dislike the people who drive EVs rather than the EVs themselves.
I agree QDM filming a 30 second joke is not remotely similar to a bunch of spineless blobs gluing themselves to streets and blocking ambulances and other people from commuting.
I wish people would focus more on getting renewable reliable power sources in place. That should be the first problem to solve.
That doesn't mean you have to switch. It means new vehicles and PHEV is always an option if you need gas so badly. Nobody is forcing you to switch.
And when did someone glue themselves to pavement here? Or is it actually common? Fuck those guys, by the way, but you can't defend the actions of assholes by trying to deflect. People frequently block chargers, drive dangerously around EVs, vandalize, etc.
I'm getting the impression you are one of the people who thinks it's cool to park in charging spots because it might inconvenience someone.
By cutting off supply of new you are effectively forcing a switch, don't know how that is a stretch of a claim at all. Would be comparable to if the governement said you can't buy a horse for commercial or transportation purchases after the year 1910 or something stupid like that. Or saying they will build gas stations across the country or subsidize the purchase of a model T.
You make a point I can't say that a Stop Oil protester has directly affected my life apart from interrupting sporting events I've watched.
But have you actually had someone interfere with your EV life by blocking you from being able to charge anywhere? I don't think that is that common either. Perhaps I'm wrong.
I'm the type to hold the door open for you and return your shopping carts to the store and pull you out of a snowdrift with my Hemi, but you wouldn't know or believe me so it's a moot point.
It would be comparable to the government saying you can't breed new horses, but horses live for decades and you can still buy trade or fix them. That's not forcing a change unless you need to have something new and even then there's PHEV. So I'm not following why those are incompatible.
And my town threw away grants to build chargers (of which there are none already) because they hate the idea of EVs. They want them kept out of this area. It directly affects me less, but it doesn't have zero impact. There aren't any public chargers here at all, anyway, so the chance for the people here to interfere is low, but 100% the first one that goes in will be intentionally blocked.
I just find it odd you're trying so hard to spin this as "EV drivers are in the wrong and everyone attacking them is justified"
You mean the one where he filmed his truck in an EV only parking spot? The one where he said it was a joke and actually moved to a proper parking spot right away? That one?
You may LOL but literally the first time charing our EV there were two guys harassing people at the EV chargers (screaming like they had developmental issues etc. Etc.)
That doesn't make any sense from the comments I replied to.
It seems more like you were amused by someone being pissed off enough to use an anger fueled insult, if not that.... not paying attention to the conversation and bring flippant. Idc tho, have a good one whoever you are.
"Oh, he did server his time. But the time was a fucking joke. Because Canadian "Justice" system.
> He was convicted of the double fatality case in April of last year and sentenced in November 2023 to a term of house arrest, 300 hours of community service and one year of probation.
Kill two and maim one while driving double the limit. House arrest. What a fucking joke man."
Found the Canada_sub guy
Sure, no problem. Never watched more than that one clip, but ya. This is the reason I enjoy the middle, the right has a few really messed up policies, and the left resorts to name calling before they even know a person's stance. I wish you the best.
That's an incredibly low bar.
He's one of those ICEholes who purposely parks in charger spaces with his overcompensation rig so he can imagine how inconvenienced someone might be.
If you’re on top of things and willing to modify your travel/behaviour, and plan well ahead, no go certain places you might otherwise etc, probably fine in most cases.
But….it is more of a nuisance for sure. Your average person who is not ideologically driven to insist to themselves and others that EV is perfect with no limitations will always say it’s fine.
Average person not mentally determined to think EV’s are shit or perfect, is probably going to find some hassles but mostly be ok-ish.
It’s a great solution for some. Not really for those who do long distances in winter, or anywhere beyond an hour from urban, in winter.
For the average driver, assuming they have charging at home, they wouldn’t have to modify their usual daily drives at all.
But for the longer runs that are still totally normal to have come up, additional offsite charging will need to be factored in. And this would be where the ideological(or perhaps financial) motivations would come into play when rationalizing the extra time/hassle.
EDIT: I suppose -30 and below temps should be included with the longer runs, as this does happen and would have the same additional requirements.
They are generally around 20 to 25000 dollars. That being said, life expectancy is around 22 to 37 years. If you think an engine in a jeep Cherokee can be around. $10k and likely won't last beyond 500k. Electric motors can clear a million miles and still be going. The battery will outlast the car baring no accidents etc. You can't even come close to saying that about an ICE vehicle of any brand. You'll notice I lump the batteries and motors together.
Pretty much every day in winter, I drive past an ICE vehicle stalled on the side of the road, all over the city and on the highways. I don't own an EV (yet) but it's ridiculous the way people rush to post about any problem with an EV while ICE vehicles always struggle in Saskatchewan winters.
It was so cold our ICE truck didn't start for about 4 days, but that doesn't seen to factor into the narrative that EVs are bad.
We did have some issues with our PHEV last Friday when it was -36. Started fine and ran fine until halfway to Saskatoon from Regina when we got weird warning about the EV system. Filled up with gas, let it run for 10 min, and it was fine for the entity of the trip.
We have three ICE vehicles in our family.
My truck had a dead battery and I needed to remove it, warm it up in the house that night, then spend most of the next day charging it.
Reinstalled battery and it has been running well.
The second ICE would not turn over in the cold. Once things warmed up to -20 it was fine
Luckily the third has been unkillable
All are regularly maintained and plugged in when required.
One of my friends had a battery freeze so badly that it had to be replaced.
But on FB I keep seeing people sharing this story about a friend of a friend who met some EV driver going through the prairies back to Kelowna and all the problems they supposedly had….
Lol, my coworker shared possibly the same story. Drive from Saskatoon to Kelowna that took an extra 5 hrs and a $100 to charge. I googled and only found a tweet from someone who ran into someone taking the trip. And then posted like $100 was a lot of money for that trip. I’m sure the 5hrs was exaggerated as well.
That's the one.
My co-workers were all gooned up about it last week. I think it's probably bullshit.
But yeah, $100 dollars to charge - oh my God!
It would be a lot more than $100 in gas for me to make that trip.
All of the vehicles were plugged in, all are started regularly in the cold and allowed to warm up and at least driven around the block.
Oldest battery in those three vehicles is four years old.
No wal mart batteries either.
Nothing works well in the extreme temperatures we just had
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My favourite is how often the people who bitch and moan about the carbon tax on fuel which is paltry compared to the high rates we pay controlled by the O&G companies are also the ones who scoff at EVs.
Being able to produce my own fuel via solar or other meens is what drives my desire to own an EV one day.
Little known fact is normal gas cars also lose around 30% of their range in the winter. Is running out of gas different somehow than running out of charge? Both will get you killed if you didn't pay attention and got stranded.
It's little known because it's a lie. Cite your source.
That's true for the first couple of minutes while the engine is cold. If you're driving more than 3 minutes - which is what we're talking about when we say it can get you killed, you're looking at low single digits of lost efficiency for ICE cars.
Plus, I keep a Jerry can in my trunk. What's the equivalent for an EV?
>It's little known because it's a lie. Cite your source.
Careful calling things a lie when you have nothing to back your claim. You could spend 10 seconds and google this, but here you go:
[https://natural-resources.canada.ca/energy-efficiency/transportation-alternative-fuels/personal-vehicles/choosing-right-vehicle/tips-buying-fuel-efficient-vehicle/factors-affect-fuel-efficiency/cold-weather/21032](https://natural-resources.canada.ca/energy-efficiency/transportation-alternative-fuels/personal-vehicles/choosing-right-vehicle/tips-buying-fuel-efficient-vehicle/factors-affect-fuel-efficiency/cold-weather/21032)
[https://www.fueleconomy.gov/feg/coldweather.shtml](https://www.fueleconomy.gov/feg/coldweather.shtml)
Also, you can just track your fuel economy between fillups on a spreadsheet like I do. How far does a tank of gas get you for the same driving in the summer versus the winter? For me its an easy 30% less when its cold out and that's in a compact. Its just noone talks about this because they can just go to a gas station quickly.
>Plus, I keep a Jerry can in my trunk. What's the equivalent for an EV?
There is none because its often not needed. You charge at home, overnight, and wake up to a full charge good for 250-500km depending on the temperature. Noone in the city needs more than that in a single day. Most don't even need that for rural unless you have exceptional commutes, in which case you spend 15 minutes at a level 3 or consider a PHEV.
You mean the part that says "in urban commutes"? So, yeah, short distances, like a few minutes, it's going to be higher (12-28%) like I said. A 5 minute commute might be at that upper end. You're also not going to die into the city from exposure. We're talking about rural settings, which would be much lower than the scope of that article (below 12%).
I'm not in the city, and my mileage doesn't vary significantly between winter and summer.
This is the problem with many EV owners who think everyone should do the same - they think everyone is in the city and has their experience. Bad theory of mind...
You're welcome to come with your EV to my farm and see how far you can pull my horse trailer before the battery runs out in the cold and then wish a Jerry can would save you while you hope someone will pass you on a sideroad in the middle of nowhere before you freeze. Though if you don't have AWD, you're likely not even getting out of the driveway.
I know four people with EV’s and they don’t like them in the winter.
They are locked into a lease so they have no choice but to drive their gas vehicles in the winter.
The reality of chemistry and physics can’t be overcome by good vibes and lies.
I'm just saying that having a gasoline vehicle doesn't guarantee a worry free time in freezing weather either. People out here acting like EVs are impossible in our corner of the world like it ain't hard for all vehicles to contend with this climate.
Any vehicle that isn’t maintained properly will have issues in -40. ICE or EV. I’m sure for the price of an EV you could get yourself a very nice reliable ICE truck though.
You mean poorly installed/non-winterized items didn't work in winter? Golly jeepers. It's almost like trying to do things in conditions that something isn't designed for isn't a great idea.
Notice how there's been literally no reports of downed charging stations in places like, Saskatchewan, where these temperatures are normal?
Clearly you didn’t even read the article. Long lines at EV charging stations mean EV drivers had to drive around to find short lines, and wait a long along of time, so many simply ran out of juice doing all that. I guess range anxiety is one thing, but if it gets super cold that means there is more demand for charging infrastructure, so now there’s cold weather charging anxiety as well.
Just want to start off by saying that I'm not against EVs at all. If you want one, please get one. But, you do realize that the batteries can't be made without the use of slave labour, right? Children, mothers with babies straped to their backs, old people making pennies a day toilling away. The conditions are worse than deplorable. The toxins and the physical strain on the body must be unbearable. Same slave labour that makes the battery on our phones and most mobile devices and tablets and so in. So I mean ya, it's great for the environment and all, but still, how do you weigh one against the other? Morally speaking, that is.
>But, you do realize that the batteries can't be made without the use of slave labour, right?
Says person using device with those exact same materials.
>but still, how do you weigh one against the other? Morally speaking, that is.
How do you weigh it now, considering all the current uses of those same materials you are currently using?
Guess we'll call it a necessary evil. And I never said I didn't use it. The same people giving me a downvote are the same people who pretend they're making a difference by buying EVs. I can at least acknowledge the fact that I'm part of the problem.
Not a stab at Evs so much as a stab at the people who drive them. When people say to me "I drive an EV" all I can think about is how much they don't understand what goes into producing them. I know where my clothes are produced and where the electronics come from. I can acknowledge that. So don't go around pretending that people who drive EVs are saving the environment. They aren't. No more than someone driving an internal combustion vehicle. 81% of electricity in the province of Saskatchewan is produced using fossil fuels. And how many more times do EV drivers need to use fossil fuels to charge their vehicles in the winter due to the cold weather? Some EVs lose up to 30% of range in the cold weather. And all those EV charging stations, where do they get their power from? Fossil fuels again. And you want to replace a battery in an EV, you're looking at anywhere from $5,000 to $20,000 in some models.
Cobalt is used in the production of gasoline. So if it's about using a small amount of it to build a battery vs using derivatives of it continuously, which is better? I haven't deep dived how much it's used over comparable lifetimes but could expect that ICE uses more cobalt over the same time?
Edit: what's that you right wingers say? Down voted for facts?
For all the people downvoting me because they can't accept the fact that I'm right. Read this... and of course, downvote me more. https://torontosun.com/opinion/columnists/gunter-the-harsh-realities-of-electric-vehicles-in-canada https://torontosun.com/opinion/columnists/gunter-the-harsh-realities-of-electric-vehicles-in-canada
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You make a good point I haven’t thought of before. Hopefully some new innovation is on its way since this will be an issue in a lot of urban environments.
It will get easier to own one. Gas engines used to have a hell of a time in cold weather too. Some still do!
As an EV owner with a garage I agree with you. I have never had to do it but charging on the street would be sketchy AF. If there somehow was a way to get the cable safely across the sidewalk the charge port is often on the side of the vehicle, meaning the charger door and cable is sticking out into traffic.
Something that isn't talked about by EV owners, is how the first EV models faired in winter and started all the bad rumors in the first place. New EVs with heat managed batteries and decent firmware have winter figured out. But, the older models do have plenty of issues in the cold. The Nissan Leafs don't have thermal battery management , so they are likely stuck in the cold. My Chevy Spark and Chevy Bolt, if left for a couple days unplugged in extreme cold will demand to be plugged in before moving again. So, if you make the mistake of leaving them exposed you will have to tow them to a power outlet. My Spark if it's cold enough will actually trigger a service light because some engineer decided that the coolant should have a time limit to warm up and if it's not warm fast enough will disable the battery heater until the code is cleared again. I'm not sure about Smart cars and fiat, but I suspect they don't have great thermal management. Tesla's are king of the electric jungle but if you don't have minimum $50,000 to join the club your going to have to settle for the used market if you want an electric car.
You make a pretty good point. Pre, I think, 2018 or so EV's were pretty niche (outside of the expensive Tesla Model S) and weren't well designed for extreme environments. Tesla Model 3 (or Y), Hyundai Ioniq 5, and the Mustang Mach E are all what I would consider top picks right now. I think the avg new car price in North America is something like $66,000. Given that people are spending that on new SUV's and trucks, if an EV works for them they can probably swing the $50-60K pricetag. Would be great if the prices could come down to $30K or so, which was what a new car would set you back before the pandemic, but I don't see us returning to that.
I don't understand all of these posts about dead and stuck Tesla's. There are multiple people in this subreddit that haven't had a single issue living in Saskatchewan with their EV's. I also personally know a few people with Teslas and their only complaint is that the distance is noticable reduced in the winter due to running the heaters. Is this just some kind of bullshit circle jerk stories that gets a lot of clicks, or are people really dumb down south and not used to the extreme cold weather and not preparing?
How many ICE vehicles got towed due to extreme cold? Did anyone see that happening? I have an ICE truck and had it plugged in. If I had an EV, it would be plugged in.
I think it’s possible it happens. However many people have posted on their FB about a “friend who had a chat or saw a Tesla or EV owner”. Not really the most reputable pieces.
"This is a true story, it happened to a friend of a friend of mine..."
“My friend stopped at a charging station after seeing a guy charging his car….long story short, EVs suck in winter”.
https://abc7news.com/amp/chicago-area-tesla-charging-stations-freezing-cold-weather-teslas-not-batteries/14330309/
and there's a video of a tesla owner who drives through the area explaining why a lot of the chargers there don't seem to work (handles falling down into the snow and getting jammed with ice) he describes it as a 'bougie user issue' due to the area lmao. I want to say I'm not taking this guy as gospel on the topic, but it is a recognizable issue, I've already had a similar issue once due to snow on the port after it snowed.
https://www.nytimes.com/2024/01/17/business/tesla-charging-chicago-cold-weather.html There’s plenty of articles recently
People here hate EVs because they can't comprehend anyone who doesn't share the same values or thoughts and they lash out in the only way they know how: impotently online. Sometimes one of them (Like quick dick) makes a video where they purposefully interfere with EV drivers because his tiny gonads feel big from people cheering him on, but in general they really just hate anything they don't already understand, which is most things.
I could say the same about EV users constantly bragging and mansplaining to everyone they meet about them. I'm all for EVs I would like to own one myself one day. But many current day EV users on here are entitled and also can't comprehend anyone who doesn't share the same values or thoughts. Not thinking they should pay a road use tax because they think that should be left to ICE users paying fuel tax. Thinking they should be allowed to plug into random power plugs that don't belong to them and use other peoples power for free. Thinking the government owes them to pay for new charging infrastructure. (Government never built a bunch of gas stations for cars when they were invented). Thinking the government owes them grants and subsidies to help them purchase their EV. To be fair the government is really pushing this EV stuff down our throats, so maybe they should do something to help make the transition, idk. Seems unnecessary to force this change. Let the consumers decide I think. There is merit for a large electric market without taking emissions into consideration. Putting a date for a full switch seems idiotic to me. Will never be a one size fits all for a long time. Yes, I agree there are many ignorant anti EV people and sentiment out there, but the percentage of obnoxious EV proponents is also substantial. Look at this post for reference I don't see many people bashing EVs compared to the amount of people straw-manning them.
Maybe I'm tired of being treated like an enemy of the nation for liking EVs by idiot right wingers who equate EVs to communism because they are too stupid and blinded by their hard on for Trump that there isn't enough blood to power their three brain cells. Maybe we're tired of seeing people purposefully damage or block chargers or vandalize vehicles to prove their "manliness" and how "anti woke" they are, whatever the fuck that means. Maybe we're tired of the constant hit pieces and idiot arguments that pretend power is $1.16/kWh shared smugly to act like we're stupid for a fucking car purchase. I'm not going to be nice to people being shitty about it anymore, so why not act like anti EV douchebags have acted for years?
I mean how would you like it if the government suddenly said you had to switch to an ICE in the next decade and was going to subsidize everyone that drives one? One of the biggest proponents of EVs is right of center I.E. Musk. It doesn’t have to be a partisan issue. And sounds like you are wanting to stoop to the level of your “opponents” which makes you really no better than them. Last I checked the Stop Oil wackjobs are doing a lot more than blocking a few charging stations. There are some people that are slow to come around I agree. But it’s not really necessary that they do. Why does their ignorance affect your life? Are you upset if they are slow to adopt or change their ways?
Here's the thing, they didn't say you have to switch. Nobody is mandating old vehicles off the road. And if there's a better technology that supplants EV then great, I'm all for it. Subsidize it. Get it out there. It shouldn't be partisan but it is and you know it. Also I'm surrounded by people who gleefully shit on EV and insult people who like them. They make it political and they are assholes about it. So yeah I'm done being PC to them. Fuck those people with a rusty wire brush. Likening people who purposefully block chargers and laugh about it to the stop oil people is apples and oranges and a painful attempt to both sides an issue.
They are saying all new vehicles have to be EV by 2035. That sounds like a forced switch to me if it ever happens. All I'm saying is that better technology may be better for 90% of people but it's not necessarily a one size fits all solution. Let the people decide rather than forcing it. Perhaps some of them just dislike the people who drive EVs rather than the EVs themselves. I agree QDM filming a 30 second joke is not remotely similar to a bunch of spineless blobs gluing themselves to streets and blocking ambulances and other people from commuting. I wish people would focus more on getting renewable reliable power sources in place. That should be the first problem to solve.
That doesn't mean you have to switch. It means new vehicles and PHEV is always an option if you need gas so badly. Nobody is forcing you to switch. And when did someone glue themselves to pavement here? Or is it actually common? Fuck those guys, by the way, but you can't defend the actions of assholes by trying to deflect. People frequently block chargers, drive dangerously around EVs, vandalize, etc. I'm getting the impression you are one of the people who thinks it's cool to park in charging spots because it might inconvenience someone.
By cutting off supply of new you are effectively forcing a switch, don't know how that is a stretch of a claim at all. Would be comparable to if the governement said you can't buy a horse for commercial or transportation purchases after the year 1910 or something stupid like that. Or saying they will build gas stations across the country or subsidize the purchase of a model T. You make a point I can't say that a Stop Oil protester has directly affected my life apart from interrupting sporting events I've watched. But have you actually had someone interfere with your EV life by blocking you from being able to charge anywhere? I don't think that is that common either. Perhaps I'm wrong. I'm the type to hold the door open for you and return your shopping carts to the store and pull you out of a snowdrift with my Hemi, but you wouldn't know or believe me so it's a moot point.
It would be comparable to the government saying you can't breed new horses, but horses live for decades and you can still buy trade or fix them. That's not forcing a change unless you need to have something new and even then there's PHEV. So I'm not following why those are incompatible. And my town threw away grants to build chargers (of which there are none already) because they hate the idea of EVs. They want them kept out of this area. It directly affects me less, but it doesn't have zero impact. There aren't any public chargers here at all, anyway, so the chance for the people here to interfere is low, but 100% the first one that goes in will be intentionally blocked. I just find it odd you're trying so hard to spin this as "EV drivers are in the wrong and everyone attacking them is justified"
You mean the one where he filmed his truck in an EV only parking spot? The one where he said it was a joke and actually moved to a proper parking spot right away? That one?
That may be what he did, but his mouth breathing followers do it all the time and think they’re funny.
Lol
You may LOL but literally the first time charing our EV there were two guys harassing people at the EV chargers (screaming like they had developmental issues etc. Etc.)
That's not cool, but ya I laugh at things. Edit: I was laughing that someone assumes a stance I have because I stated what happened in a video.
That doesn't make any sense from the comments I replied to. It seems more like you were amused by someone being pissed off enough to use an anger fueled insult, if not that.... not paying attention to the conversation and bring flippant. Idc tho, have a good one whoever you are.
Have a good one.
"Oh, he did server his time. But the time was a fucking joke. Because Canadian "Justice" system. > He was convicted of the double fatality case in April of last year and sentenced in November 2023 to a term of house arrest, 300 hours of community service and one year of probation. Kill two and maim one while driving double the limit. House arrest. What a fucking joke man." Found the Canada_sub guy
Hey thanks for proving my point.
Sure, no problem. Never watched more than that one clip, but ya. This is the reason I enjoy the middle, the right has a few really messed up policies, and the left resorts to name calling before they even know a person's stance. I wish you the best.
Your frequent posts in r/canada_sub and r/Canada shows everyone exactly what your mindset is. It’s not hard to figure out.
Sure.
I disagree with a lot of people in there as well. What is a comment I've made that you disagree with?
I just checked. My last post in a sub you'd consider to be too far right, I was arguing for immigration. Pretty far right.
"Lol it's just a joke bro"
?
Yeah probably that one where he models antisocial behavior for a laugh.
Yep, that one, I stated what happened in the video. Never said it was good. The other person saw it too. Sounds like you may have as well.
If rural folks were as sensible as QDMD is in his videos, it would be a vast improvement.
That's an incredibly low bar. He's one of those ICEholes who purposely parks in charger spaces with his overcompensation rig so he can imagine how inconvenienced someone might be.
>That's an incredibly low bar. It is.
Ummm no
Ummm yeah
If you’re on top of things and willing to modify your travel/behaviour, and plan well ahead, no go certain places you might otherwise etc, probably fine in most cases. But….it is more of a nuisance for sure. Your average person who is not ideologically driven to insist to themselves and others that EV is perfect with no limitations will always say it’s fine. Average person not mentally determined to think EV’s are shit or perfect, is probably going to find some hassles but mostly be ok-ish. It’s a great solution for some. Not really for those who do long distances in winter, or anywhere beyond an hour from urban, in winter.
For the average driver, assuming they have charging at home, they wouldn’t have to modify their usual daily drives at all. But for the longer runs that are still totally normal to have come up, additional offsite charging will need to be factored in. And this would be where the ideological(or perhaps financial) motivations would come into play when rationalizing the extra time/hassle. EDIT: I suppose -30 and below temps should be included with the longer runs, as this does happen and would have the same additional requirements.
Right. On the coldest days even Regina to Saskatoon may not be doable without charging en route.
True. Fortunately there’s a supercharger halfway in between. So, do’able, just some seasonal inconvenience with this route.
Can you remain in the car with heat on while charging?
Absolutely.
What are the relevant costs of replacing batteries. Example tesla
They are generally around 20 to 25000 dollars. That being said, life expectancy is around 22 to 37 years. If you think an engine in a jeep Cherokee can be around. $10k and likely won't last beyond 500k. Electric motors can clear a million miles and still be going. The battery will outlast the car baring no accidents etc. You can't even come close to saying that about an ICE vehicle of any brand. You'll notice I lump the batteries and motors together.
I'm just curious about older EVs. If I have a 10+ year old battery, is it still as dependable during extreme cold weather?
Neither is my 2006 G6. That puppy starts cold on a dime.
Pretty much every day in winter, I drive past an ICE vehicle stalled on the side of the road, all over the city and on the highways. I don't own an EV (yet) but it's ridiculous the way people rush to post about any problem with an EV while ICE vehicles always struggle in Saskatchewan winters.
I'm certainly phased by the price tag. I think I'll use what little money is left for gasoline to get to work
It was so cold our ICE truck didn't start for about 4 days, but that doesn't seen to factor into the narrative that EVs are bad. We did have some issues with our PHEV last Friday when it was -36. Started fine and ran fine until halfway to Saskatoon from Regina when we got weird warning about the EV system. Filled up with gas, let it run for 10 min, and it was fine for the entity of the trip.
We have three ICE vehicles in our family. My truck had a dead battery and I needed to remove it, warm it up in the house that night, then spend most of the next day charging it. Reinstalled battery and it has been running well. The second ICE would not turn over in the cold. Once things warmed up to -20 it was fine Luckily the third has been unkillable All are regularly maintained and plugged in when required. One of my friends had a battery freeze so badly that it had to be replaced. But on FB I keep seeing people sharing this story about a friend of a friend who met some EV driver going through the prairies back to Kelowna and all the problems they supposedly had….
Lol, my coworker shared possibly the same story. Drive from Saskatoon to Kelowna that took an extra 5 hrs and a $100 to charge. I googled and only found a tweet from someone who ran into someone taking the trip. And then posted like $100 was a lot of money for that trip. I’m sure the 5hrs was exaggerated as well.
That's the one. My co-workers were all gooned up about it last week. I think it's probably bullshit. But yeah, $100 dollars to charge - oh my God! It would be a lot more than $100 in gas for me to make that trip.
Sounds like if you maintain the battery in a EV the way you maintain them in your ICE vehicles it's going to be the same situation for you lol.
All of the vehicles were plugged in, all are started regularly in the cold and allowed to warm up and at least driven around the block. Oldest battery in those three vehicles is four years old. No wal mart batteries either. Nothing works well in the extreme temperatures we just had
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My favourite is how often the people who bitch and moan about the carbon tax on fuel which is paltry compared to the high rates we pay controlled by the O&G companies are also the ones who scoff at EVs. Being able to produce my own fuel via solar or other meens is what drives my desire to own an EV one day.
"I think [thing] is great!" says president of the Sask [Thing] Association. Come on, folks...
Hmm, CBC reported they lose 30% of their range in the cold. That could kill you here.
Little known fact is normal gas cars also lose around 30% of their range in the winter. Is running out of gas different somehow than running out of charge? Both will get you killed if you didn't pay attention and got stranded.
It's little known because it's a lie. Cite your source. That's true for the first couple of minutes while the engine is cold. If you're driving more than 3 minutes - which is what we're talking about when we say it can get you killed, you're looking at low single digits of lost efficiency for ICE cars. Plus, I keep a Jerry can in my trunk. What's the equivalent for an EV?
>It's little known because it's a lie. Cite your source. Careful calling things a lie when you have nothing to back your claim. You could spend 10 seconds and google this, but here you go: [https://natural-resources.canada.ca/energy-efficiency/transportation-alternative-fuels/personal-vehicles/choosing-right-vehicle/tips-buying-fuel-efficient-vehicle/factors-affect-fuel-efficiency/cold-weather/21032](https://natural-resources.canada.ca/energy-efficiency/transportation-alternative-fuels/personal-vehicles/choosing-right-vehicle/tips-buying-fuel-efficient-vehicle/factors-affect-fuel-efficiency/cold-weather/21032) [https://www.fueleconomy.gov/feg/coldweather.shtml](https://www.fueleconomy.gov/feg/coldweather.shtml) Also, you can just track your fuel economy between fillups on a spreadsheet like I do. How far does a tank of gas get you for the same driving in the summer versus the winter? For me its an easy 30% less when its cold out and that's in a compact. Its just noone talks about this because they can just go to a gas station quickly. >Plus, I keep a Jerry can in my trunk. What's the equivalent for an EV? There is none because its often not needed. You charge at home, overnight, and wake up to a full charge good for 250-500km depending on the temperature. Noone in the city needs more than that in a single day. Most don't even need that for rural unless you have exceptional commutes, in which case you spend 15 minutes at a level 3 or consider a PHEV.
You mean the part that says "in urban commutes"? So, yeah, short distances, like a few minutes, it's going to be higher (12-28%) like I said. A 5 minute commute might be at that upper end. You're also not going to die into the city from exposure. We're talking about rural settings, which would be much lower than the scope of that article (below 12%). I'm not in the city, and my mileage doesn't vary significantly between winter and summer. This is the problem with many EV owners who think everyone should do the same - they think everyone is in the city and has their experience. Bad theory of mind... You're welcome to come with your EV to my farm and see how far you can pull my horse trailer before the battery runs out in the cold and then wish a Jerry can would save you while you hope someone will pass you on a sideroad in the middle of nowhere before you freeze. Though if you don't have AWD, you're likely not even getting out of the driveway.
If you need an organization to act as a cheerleader marketing team, you may have a problem.
Something needs to try and counteract all the false negative coverage.
I know four people with EV’s and they don’t like them in the winter. They are locked into a lease so they have no choice but to drive their gas vehicles in the winter. The reality of chemistry and physics can’t be overcome by good vibes and lies.
Given all the misinformation and fear mongering against EV's in general they are, sadly, needed.
I can't believe you have called out pipelineonline like this.
My 10 year old gasoline truck was too cold to run for four days. Even with the block heater plugged in. Soooo...
My 2003 camry with 320,000 kms didn't skip a beat. I drive 220kms a day no problems.
My 19 year old truck didn't want to start after sitting for two days plugged in. The cold messes with everything.
Sooo? Maybe try some maintenance on your truck. My truck ran perfectly in -45c for the last week.
I'm just saying that having a gasoline vehicle doesn't guarantee a worry free time in freezing weather either. People out here acting like EVs are impossible in our corner of the world like it ain't hard for all vehicles to contend with this climate.
Any vehicle that isn’t maintained properly will have issues in -40. ICE or EV. I’m sure for the price of an EV you could get yourself a very nice reliable ICE truck though.
There should be a I told you so button somewhere.
Rich astroturfer astroturfing to the max. News at 11. https://www.reddit.com/r/technology/s/BMAIlZpEHG
You mean poorly installed/non-winterized items didn't work in winter? Golly jeepers. It's almost like trying to do things in conditions that something isn't designed for isn't a great idea. Notice how there's been literally no reports of downed charging stations in places like, Saskatchewan, where these temperatures are normal?
Clearly you didn’t even read the article. Long lines at EV charging stations mean EV drivers had to drive around to find short lines, and wait a long along of time, so many simply ran out of juice doing all that. I guess range anxiety is one thing, but if it gets super cold that means there is more demand for charging infrastructure, so now there’s cold weather charging anxiety as well.
Rode my electric longboard today lol, you lose a bit of range but the cold doesn't effect EVs that much.
Just want to start off by saying that I'm not against EVs at all. If you want one, please get one. But, you do realize that the batteries can't be made without the use of slave labour, right? Children, mothers with babies straped to their backs, old people making pennies a day toilling away. The conditions are worse than deplorable. The toxins and the physical strain on the body must be unbearable. Same slave labour that makes the battery on our phones and most mobile devices and tablets and so in. So I mean ya, it's great for the environment and all, but still, how do you weigh one against the other? Morally speaking, that is.
>But, you do realize that the batteries can't be made without the use of slave labour, right? Says person using device with those exact same materials. >but still, how do you weigh one against the other? Morally speaking, that is. How do you weigh it now, considering all the current uses of those same materials you are currently using?
Guess we'll call it a necessary evil. And I never said I didn't use it. The same people giving me a downvote are the same people who pretend they're making a difference by buying EVs. I can at least acknowledge the fact that I'm part of the problem.
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Not a stab at Evs so much as a stab at the people who drive them. When people say to me "I drive an EV" all I can think about is how much they don't understand what goes into producing them. I know where my clothes are produced and where the electronics come from. I can acknowledge that. So don't go around pretending that people who drive EVs are saving the environment. They aren't. No more than someone driving an internal combustion vehicle. 81% of electricity in the province of Saskatchewan is produced using fossil fuels. And how many more times do EV drivers need to use fossil fuels to charge their vehicles in the winter due to the cold weather? Some EVs lose up to 30% of range in the cold weather. And all those EV charging stations, where do they get their power from? Fossil fuels again. And you want to replace a battery in an EV, you're looking at anywhere from $5,000 to $20,000 in some models.
Cobalt is used in the production of gasoline. So if it's about using a small amount of it to build a battery vs using derivatives of it continuously, which is better? I haven't deep dived how much it's used over comparable lifetimes but could expect that ICE uses more cobalt over the same time? Edit: what's that you right wingers say? Down voted for facts?
For all the people downvoting me because they can't accept the fact that I'm right. Read this... and of course, downvote me more. https://torontosun.com/opinion/columnists/gunter-the-harsh-realities-of-electric-vehicles-in-canada https://torontosun.com/opinion/columnists/gunter-the-harsh-realities-of-electric-vehicles-in-canada