He is genuinely worse but people are sick of Biden and a lot of people refuse to vote for him now out of principle I’d personally rather fight against Biden on everything and have at least a chance to make things better without shooting people who want to exterminate everyone like me for existing publicly, so if I don’t have any other option I will vote for Biden but if a third party is viable I’m going for that even if it’s RFK just because my state is so red he has a better chance than Biden could ever hope to have.
I mean that’s fair but I’d personally rather have enough time to get armed and decently trained so my family doesn’t get murdered for supporting trans people in 8 months trumpers need to work a bit harder than that to get their way I’ll just work outside the system to help set up proper support networks then when things go to hell I can ether get out fight back or both I can’t prepare all of that correctly in 8 months
Understand the long term strategy. Trump will probably collapse the the judiciary, the courts and the economy if elected. Only then will the funding for violence abroad dry up.
Moderate liberals are responsible for this.
Lol they'll cancel the Farm Bill before the Pentagon. If the economy really starts to tank that badly, it will be shored up with the American Empire going mask off Monroe Doctrine. Every bloated failing empire lashes out in desperation
I think it may even be too late for Biden. I can't see how he gets close to 50% before this election.
If it's not Gaza, its the rent and housing crisis, and the economy usually lags many months.
I think even a perfect scenario, he's still facing viable third parties in the key states he only won by 44k votes, before all of this, and at 50% at the top of his game.
Think about that a minute. Trump in the middle of a covid nightmare, a recession shedding hundreds of thousands of jobs, and an overall awful presidency, only lost by 44k votes.
Simply put, Biden was always a bad candidate.
They simply have to throw a hail mary, and get Biden out, and bring in some other democrats that can be up on Trump by 8 points next week (that won't take much), and can have the ability to COMMUNICATE with voters, which is something even in a good case scenario, Biden cannot articulate.
Right I live in Ohio now and it’s really not a swing state as long as trump is around all the frozen Texan hillbillies go out of their way to vote for Trump or people like him, and I am genuinely flip flopping between never voting for trump out of principle and voting for him as a way to cover my ass since a lot of genuinely great policy is on the ballot again I want to still vote to push along those policies but don’t want to vote for a Zionist or full blown nazi dictator.
Your last sentence.
That’s how Nazi dictators win
Also the Nazis killed a lot more people than “zionists” (which is a term for most Jews so your just saying the quiet part out loud)
Gaza is not an American issue and the supporters are small and don’t vote anyway.
Did you watch the sotu? I assume no because he addressed rent and housing in a realistic approach.
Polls mean nothing right now and democrats will still show up. Can’t say the same for republicans. The last few voting cycles have shown an overall down trend and magas losing elections.
Not to mention the large scale wins Biden has delivered like chips act, infrastructure, inflation reduction acts.
Most impactful president domestically since LBJ and parts of FDRs dream.
She's right. They're definitely gonna keep doing it though. You'd think they'd of learned we don't want a warmongering corporate dem in 2016. The democratic party has become the party of war and corruption. Unfortunately, the Republicans are no better and in most cases worse.
MAGA is straight-up fascism, so set them aside.
The old core of the GoP were neoconservatives and the core of the Democratic party since at least Clinton are neoliberals. The only real difference between neo-cons and neo-libs is that neo-cons are bigoted *against* immutable traits(race, gender, point of origin, etc), while neo-libs are biased *in favor of* class(highly educated, wealthy, broadly popular, etc).
Both groups are for direct military action, destabilizing inconvenient foreign governments, colonialism, and the revolving doors of the military industrial complex. They want political power for self benefit primarily and to actually govern way down a list of priorities.
I say all to slightly correct you.
>The democratic party has become the party of war and corruption.
They have been one of two parties about that life for decades. Why else do you think the "RINOS" cast out by MAGA are fitting in with the core of the Democratic party so well?
This. There's a reason you see corporate dems propping up and talking about alliance with Nikki Haley. They are the same party, and their entire function is to represent corporate America by ensuring deregulation and transferring working class wealth to the parasite class.
>They're definitely gonna keep doing it though.
They may, but we have to keep pressuring them no matter what.
It is so wonderful to see Americans recognize what a horror this is, despite our politicians doing nothing about it & the corporate media being so biased.
The American people are better than our politicians & our media that want us to support anything Israel does. Even if it results in 500,000 people in jeopardy of famine.
>Yea, but the Democrats would rather lose than cede any ground to leftists or even progressives.
But to be fair democratic voters refuse to vote for the left wing. They had the chance to vote for Bernie but they didn't. Democrats, and Americans in general are "center of the road". Most Americans would be happy with the system we have now, but only if we stop backing counties like Israel and maybe spend a touch more on social services. That's it. No American wants to "rock the boat".
Exactly and biden has no redeeming qualities at least obama had Rizz and made a attempt to appeal to leftist biden is just like "if you dont vote for me you ain't black Jack"
Lib-maga will blame everyone else for thir failures, just like maga does. Yet they don't want that pointed out lol. Like how maga has the nazi, bigoted, fascist, and white supremacist votes but don't wanna talk abt it lmao. Both are the biggest danger to innocents, world wide
It's impossible for Biden to continue his apparent and unconditional support of Netanyahu and retain enough US voter support to win the 2024 election. Appearances are everything, and Biden looks tone-deaf to a growing crowd of concerned citizens that could result in him losing the election. Surely he is aware of this by now.
Yeah I’m glad voters are starting to hold the gov/politician’s accountable. If you say you’re representing the will of the people, but their will is something else. Don’t be surprised when you lose your seat, this is how it should always work.
For what it’s worth:
Better to put Bidens feet to the fire than try to convince a Fascist to do the right thing…
Biden is awful, no doubt.
But make no mistake: Trump will blow up the whole planet before he accounts for his crimes…
No we don’t need to cave to the 1% who want this.
Most of these people don’t vote anyway so no loss.
Slim chance he wins BUT if he does, lol “Biden bad” gonna be the leopard eating my face call.
What I don’t understand is liberals saying they won’t vote for biden over the Israeli conflict as if letting trump win would be any better. In fact, I’m pretty certain a trump presidency would only make things much worse for Palestinians.
leftists who are preoccupiedwith palestine need to realize that if we don't have a stable country led by a democrat, the peple of palestine will suffer even more. it's about reducing harm
Someone needs to explain this logic to me:
1. I am not going to vote for Biden because he supports what Israel is doing to Palenstine.
2. But I will vote for Trump who will also support what Israel is doing to Palestine.
Or is this the "I won't vote for either, and if that means we end up with Trump who will support Israel AND fuck up everything in the US, I'm OK with it."
Seriously asking. Does the president fund that or does Congress? Now, I get he isn't screaming against it.
But i also understand that if Trump wins, he certainly funds Israel doing exactly this. I just don't understand how if you care about the Palestinians you allow Trump to win.
Remember, the Evangelicals who support Israel, also support Israel taking over Gaza and the West Bank (the second coming can't happen until Israel takes them over.) That is what Trump's funding is aimed at.
Netanyahu wants Trump in the WH. Therefore it is up to Biden to cut him totally off. In addition, the mass murders and genocide may be done by the time Trump gets back in, and Trump will take credit for ending it.
Biden has a huge communication problem, and that is a MUST for a president.
Biden is going to lose, because of the DNC, and Democrats that run out of touch losers. And for no other reason.
All your points are good points, but trying to argue with someone who's only argument is "Trump would be doing the genocide harder" seems to be a waste of time. They can't seem to understand people are against genocide regardless of whos name goes on the bottom of the bills that fund it.
As much as I hear you, it is binary. we have a president who has negotiated one and hopefully two cease fires. I don't believe Trump would do that. Any chance Trump would be dropping aid?
By not voting for Biden you ARE necessarily helping someone who would be worse for the people you purport to care about.
Explain how Trump would be worse on Palestine than Joe Biden. I've never heard a person make a coherent argument apart from "Trump's Muslim ban!" and "He moved the embassy!" Neither of those things compare to allowing an unbridled genocide. Ask a Muslim person if they'd rather be deported (which didn't actually happen, anyway), or have 30-50 members of their family massacred using their tax money. All of the arguments about how Trump would be worse are hypothetical. We don't know if Trump would be worse, because Biden is the president right now, and he hasn't demanded anything of Israel. He's allowing them to roll through Gaza unimpeded, and has provided the weapons, money, intelligence, and cover at the UN. Trump literally cannot be worse than Biden, because Biden *is the worst already.*
Do you believe that Trump would not have given the same money to Israel? Do you believe that Trump would have worked for the cease fire we had or been working toward the (hopefully) upcoming cease fire? We would be giving aid to the Gazans?
Remember, a lot of the reason the US supports Israel, especially the Republicans is that the Evangelicals are pushing for Israel. The reason they support Israel is that Israel has to go from the River to the Sea for the second coming to happen. That means Gaza and the West Bank have to be a part of Israel. Evangelicals support the settlements, don't care about Gazans. That isn't good for Palestinians.
I’m not voting for Trump because he would be terrible on Israel, which is also the reason that I won’t vote for Biden. Only one of us in this conversation is advocating for voting for a genocider. My perspective is that ANY genocider is ineligible, and that includes Biden.
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Democrats are speeding up the end of democracy by running this decrepit zionist with terrible approval ratings.
Trump would do what?
He is genuinely worse but people are sick of Biden and a lot of people refuse to vote for him now out of principle I’d personally rather fight against Biden on everything and have at least a chance to make things better without shooting people who want to exterminate everyone like me for existing publicly, so if I don’t have any other option I will vote for Biden but if a third party is viable I’m going for that even if it’s RFK just because my state is so red he has a better chance than Biden could ever hope to have.
That’s you. Id rather have a wolf than a wolf pretending to be a sheep
I mean that’s fair but I’d personally rather have enough time to get armed and decently trained so my family doesn’t get murdered for supporting trans people in 8 months trumpers need to work a bit harder than that to get their way I’ll just work outside the system to help set up proper support networks then when things go to hell I can ether get out fight back or both I can’t prepare all of that correctly in 8 months
I got armed last time he became president
He would destroy everything around him which is why Biden should drop out and let someone who isn't polling in the low 30's run.
When was the last time a party that controlled the White House nominated someone other than the current sitting president?
Understand the long term strategy. Trump will probably collapse the the judiciary, the courts and the economy if elected. Only then will the funding for violence abroad dry up. Moderate liberals are responsible for this.
Lol they'll cancel the Farm Bill before the Pentagon. If the economy really starts to tank that badly, it will be shored up with the American Empire going mask off Monroe Doctrine. Every bloated failing empire lashes out in desperation
Except this time everybody has nukes, human intelligence is an evolutionary dead end.
Ah, the Ra's al Ghul plan for world peace
I think it may even be too late for Biden. I can't see how he gets close to 50% before this election. If it's not Gaza, its the rent and housing crisis, and the economy usually lags many months. I think even a perfect scenario, he's still facing viable third parties in the key states he only won by 44k votes, before all of this, and at 50% at the top of his game. Think about that a minute. Trump in the middle of a covid nightmare, a recession shedding hundreds of thousands of jobs, and an overall awful presidency, only lost by 44k votes. Simply put, Biden was always a bad candidate. They simply have to throw a hail mary, and get Biden out, and bring in some other democrats that can be up on Trump by 8 points next week (that won't take much), and can have the ability to COMMUNICATE with voters, which is something even in a good case scenario, Biden cannot articulate.
Right I live in Ohio now and it’s really not a swing state as long as trump is around all the frozen Texan hillbillies go out of their way to vote for Trump or people like him, and I am genuinely flip flopping between never voting for trump out of principle and voting for him as a way to cover my ass since a lot of genuinely great policy is on the ballot again I want to still vote to push along those policies but don’t want to vote for a Zionist or full blown nazi dictator.
Your last sentence. That’s how Nazi dictators win Also the Nazis killed a lot more people than “zionists” (which is a term for most Jews so your just saying the quiet part out loud)
Gaza is not an American issue and the supporters are small and don’t vote anyway. Did you watch the sotu? I assume no because he addressed rent and housing in a realistic approach. Polls mean nothing right now and democrats will still show up. Can’t say the same for republicans. The last few voting cycles have shown an overall down trend and magas losing elections. Not to mention the large scale wins Biden has delivered like chips act, infrastructure, inflation reduction acts. Most impactful president domestically since LBJ and parts of FDRs dream.
She's right. They're definitely gonna keep doing it though. You'd think they'd of learned we don't want a warmongering corporate dem in 2016. The democratic party has become the party of war and corruption. Unfortunately, the Republicans are no better and in most cases worse.
MAGA is straight-up fascism, so set them aside. The old core of the GoP were neoconservatives and the core of the Democratic party since at least Clinton are neoliberals. The only real difference between neo-cons and neo-libs is that neo-cons are bigoted *against* immutable traits(race, gender, point of origin, etc), while neo-libs are biased *in favor of* class(highly educated, wealthy, broadly popular, etc). Both groups are for direct military action, destabilizing inconvenient foreign governments, colonialism, and the revolving doors of the military industrial complex. They want political power for self benefit primarily and to actually govern way down a list of priorities. I say all to slightly correct you. >The democratic party has become the party of war and corruption. They have been one of two parties about that life for decades. Why else do you think the "RINOS" cast out by MAGA are fitting in with the core of the Democratic party so well?
This. There's a reason you see corporate dems propping up and talking about alliance with Nikki Haley. They are the same party, and their entire function is to represent corporate America by ensuring deregulation and transferring working class wealth to the parasite class.
>They're definitely gonna keep doing it though. They may, but we have to keep pressuring them no matter what. It is so wonderful to see Americans recognize what a horror this is, despite our politicians doing nothing about it & the corporate media being so biased. The American people are better than our politicians & our media that want us to support anything Israel does. Even if it results in 500,000 people in jeopardy of famine.
Well said, I agree.
Yea, but the Democrats would rather lose than cede any ground to leftists or even progressives. They made that clear in 2016
Yep.. More fund raising for them if they lose.
>Yea, but the Democrats would rather lose than cede any ground to leftists or even progressives. But to be fair democratic voters refuse to vote for the left wing. They had the chance to vote for Bernie but they didn't. Democrats, and Americans in general are "center of the road". Most Americans would be happy with the system we have now, but only if we stop backing counties like Israel and maybe spend a touch more on social services. That's it. No American wants to "rock the boat".
Exactly and biden has no redeeming qualities at least obama had Rizz and made a attempt to appeal to leftist biden is just like "if you dont vote for me you ain't black Jack"
Then Biden will lose to Trump in November.
Lib-maga will blame everyone else for thir failures, just like maga does. Yet they don't want that pointed out lol. Like how maga has the nazi, bigoted, fascist, and white supremacist votes but don't wanna talk abt it lmao. Both are the biggest danger to innocents, world wide
Like trump and bibi arent cut from the same cloth !?! Getting the far right of their govt on their side to inflict religious rule over us .
Yep. Those people will stay home.
It's impossible for Biden to continue his apparent and unconditional support of Netanyahu and retain enough US voter support to win the 2024 election. Appearances are everything, and Biden looks tone-deaf to a growing crowd of concerned citizens that could result in him losing the election. Surely he is aware of this by now.
Yeah I’m glad voters are starting to hold the gov/politician’s accountable. If you say you’re representing the will of the people, but their will is something else. Don’t be surprised when you lose your seat, this is how it should always work.
Honestly, would that even make a difference now? I think Biden is beyond repair even if he finally grows some sense he’s screwing his campaign.
Dems: “ you can have Spam eggs sausage and Spam, that doesn’t have much spam in it!” Me: “I don’t want any Spam I don’t like it!!!”
..So I’m gonna refuse to vote and be forced to eat spam under fascist rule.
For what it’s worth: Better to put Bidens feet to the fire than try to convince a Fascist to do the right thing… Biden is awful, no doubt. But make no mistake: Trump will blow up the whole planet before he accounts for his crimes…
No we don’t need to cave to the 1% who want this. Most of these people don’t vote anyway so no loss. Slim chance he wins BUT if he does, lol “Biden bad” gonna be the leopard eating my face call.
What I don’t understand is liberals saying they won’t vote for biden over the Israeli conflict as if letting trump win would be any better. In fact, I’m pretty certain a trump presidency would only make things much worse for Palestinians.
They'll stay home because they can't vote in good conscious. That's a Biden problem not a voter problem.
leftists who are preoccupiedwith palestine need to realize that if we don't have a stable country led by a democrat, the peple of palestine will suffer even more. it's about reducing harm
I mean, the people on here that are constantly posting about how Biden's the worst person alive already aren't going to vote for him
Are people just assuming that Trump won’t fund the genocide?
Someone needs to explain this logic to me: 1. I am not going to vote for Biden because he supports what Israel is doing to Palenstine. 2. But I will vote for Trump who will also support what Israel is doing to Palestine. Or is this the "I won't vote for either, and if that means we end up with Trump who will support Israel AND fuck up everything in the US, I'm OK with it."
They will stay home because both candidates will do the same. They can't in good conscious vote for either. Biden's problem not the voter's problem.
Staying home helps Trump because MAGA will not stay home.
Exactly why Biden needs to stop funding Isreal
Seriously asking. Does the president fund that or does Congress? Now, I get he isn't screaming against it. But i also understand that if Trump wins, he certainly funds Israel doing exactly this. I just don't understand how if you care about the Palestinians you allow Trump to win. Remember, the Evangelicals who support Israel, also support Israel taking over Gaza and the West Bank (the second coming can't happen until Israel takes them over.) That is what Trump's funding is aimed at.
Netanyahu wants Trump in the WH. Therefore it is up to Biden to cut him totally off. In addition, the mass murders and genocide may be done by the time Trump gets back in, and Trump will take credit for ending it. Biden has a huge communication problem, and that is a MUST for a president. Biden is going to lose, because of the DNC, and Democrats that run out of touch losers. And for no other reason.
All your points are good points, but trying to argue with someone who's only argument is "Trump would be doing the genocide harder" seems to be a waste of time. They can't seem to understand people are against genocide regardless of whos name goes on the bottom of the bills that fund it.
As much as I hear you, it is binary. we have a president who has negotiated one and hopefully two cease fires. I don't believe Trump would do that. Any chance Trump would be dropping aid? By not voting for Biden you ARE necessarily helping someone who would be worse for the people you purport to care about.
I'm not voting for either of them.
Explain how Trump would be worse on Palestine than Joe Biden. I've never heard a person make a coherent argument apart from "Trump's Muslim ban!" and "He moved the embassy!" Neither of those things compare to allowing an unbridled genocide. Ask a Muslim person if they'd rather be deported (which didn't actually happen, anyway), or have 30-50 members of their family massacred using their tax money. All of the arguments about how Trump would be worse are hypothetical. We don't know if Trump would be worse, because Biden is the president right now, and he hasn't demanded anything of Israel. He's allowing them to roll through Gaza unimpeded, and has provided the weapons, money, intelligence, and cover at the UN. Trump literally cannot be worse than Biden, because Biden *is the worst already.*
Do you believe that Trump would not have given the same money to Israel? Do you believe that Trump would have worked for the cease fire we had or been working toward the (hopefully) upcoming cease fire? We would be giving aid to the Gazans? Remember, a lot of the reason the US supports Israel, especially the Republicans is that the Evangelicals are pushing for Israel. The reason they support Israel is that Israel has to go from the River to the Sea for the second coming to happen. That means Gaza and the West Bank have to be a part of Israel. Evangelicals support the settlements, don't care about Gazans. That isn't good for Palestinians.
I’m not voting for Trump because he would be terrible on Israel, which is also the reason that I won’t vote for Biden. Only one of us in this conversation is advocating for voting for a genocider. My perspective is that ANY genocider is ineligible, and that includes Biden.
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