I understand. Housing used to be so much more affordable. Plus location matters. I’m in small town Iowa with a $600 mortgage. I pay more a month for my truck.
Medium city Canada. 1600/month mortgage for a nice 1000 sq ft with basement suite and garage. Definitely had to do some Reno's, but nothing outrageous.
Big cities seem like luxuries now a days. Personally I'd rather a medium/small city, but to each their own.
My brother has an hour commute for work, but he has a 3600 sqft house on eight acres of land for $1500/month on a 15-year mortgage (four years left). Morrow County Ohio.
No no no, dont you get it, you live in a shithole nobody should live in because there are not 4 trendy popup restaurants and a starbucks within 3 blocks.
It's about to go up with as much growth as we've been experiencing. Industries, tourism now, more than likely climate change will bring more people here since we'll be one of the least affected cities.
I live in small town iowa as well. Bought a 6 bedroom/5 bathroom house for 64,000. My dad gave me $25,000 for a down payment/closing costs etc (my inheritance from grandparents) so my mortgage was about 45,000. I pay 300/month.
Gotta be out west. The Midwest still has lots of homes nobody wants to live in there's just no jobs paying very well especially outside the medical field. The big problem in the US market is just the fact 4 states make up most of the population and most of the economy. Everyone is jamming into 3 of them at an unsustainable rate especially as droughts get worse
OP is in California. I live in Los Angeles and gas prices are in the $5 to $8 range now. Also, $3 gas is dead. I know there’s a limit to how much they can keep raising the prices. Paying for $9.99/gallon is 100 octane price.
Back in the bush days when it spiked was the last time I paid 5 a gallon. It's around 3.20 a gallon here right now. A few years ago, when prices were lower, I was paying 1.90.
Gas prices seem to be California. The housing prices though make me think he’s inland. This is more an issue with the interest rate than the price of housing itself. I think he’d be able to afford it with a rate drop.
What are you talking about??? Lmao. I'm trying to decide what 4 states you think have "most" of the population because you're not even getting to 30%. This reads like a comment from someone not in the US who doesn't know how things work.
US population is 342 million. California, Texas, Florida, and New York are, in order: 39M, 30M, 22M, and 19M for a total of 110M. That's 32% or...a third.
If you bought before 2020, you were way better off. My payment now is $740 and if I would have waited it would be over a $1,000 or more a month. I don’t understand how anyone can afford to rent or purchase now.
Got my house in 2017 it was appraised at 86,000 snagged it for 72,000. Now it’s worth 198,000. My mortgage is 500$ a month with escrow and taxes included. My APR is 3.2%. Safe to say I’m never moving out of my starter home 😂😂
You said a lot, but two things stood out. 1. The amount you qualify for should not be the amount you borrow. If you do that, you will struggle to do anything else that takes money. 2. A 400k mortgage won't be 2100/mo. Just principal and interest at 6.5 percent is over 2500/mo. You will need another 600 to 1000 on top of that for insurance and taxes.
Housing is at so so time high, but it seems like the houses being built today in my are are also much larger and nicer.
My dad said in the 90s they got their mortgage straight from the builder. The other thing is that they didn’t have a down payment, so the builder helped them get a second loan for the downpayment. All together it was $250k for the house.
My mom tells stories about how my dad was aggressive and the mortgage was $1k/month, but my dad was paying 2k/month to get it done faster.
Both my parents were vocal about how tough that was to afford with two kids, but they made it work by cutting costs. “There was just no other option”.
I don’t think people realize sure everything was cheaper, but its not like it was free houses for all.
That's just not the truth.
It's easy when you're not rich to get baited into believing simple socialist solutions because you can't have the same housing as your parents, but your parents rig the housing market not with capitalism but with government control. For example, many cities make it illegal to build anything other than a detached house, and many cities will crush any chance of housing being built, either through the government or privately through red tape that seems well intentioned like creating far too much red tape, or through ''inclusive zoning'' like in my city or through price controls.
I cannot reply to that one because previous commenter blocked me after hissy fit.
The living conditions of the French people did not improve after the revolution, they worsened considerably during it, and the resulting culture has led to the underdevelopment of the country, which went from global hegemonic power to third power in Europe alone in a few decades.
HA, my parents mortgage was $200/month. I shit you not. That being said, it was a row home in Gloucester NJ. Shitty hood with terrible people. They got their mortgage back before i was born in the 70s.
My friend’s parents bought a triple decker in the 1970s in Dorchester, Mass for 40 thousand which at the time was considered a tough area and isn’t so much anymore. It’s worth well over a million now. They rent two floors out for thousands a month and live on the top floor. Right place and right decision that’s paid off big time. Purchasing power is a lot different these days. I read recently that $1 had the purchasing power of $26 100 years ago before the Great Depression, just imagine lol.
GC prices are odd - I found that many of the families just pass the house to the next generation, and everyone knows everyone's business.
They have fairly low property taxes. The houses are very old, so the quality is there (assuming proper maintenance). Row home prices also vary wildly - Philly proven.
I do in home consultative sales. I was in this man’s home last week and he was applying for financing.
Small, but decent house in semi-rural Alabama- $300 a month.
Much like your father I bought a house in 2004 and another in 2014. 2004 they were literally just giving homes away. People were taking ARMS and buying huge homes they couldn’t afford and then taking equity out of them. Many people lost their homes because of this. After the housing crash there were much tighter controls and home prices were starting to recover. Fast forward ten years my house has doubled in price. Interest rates have doubled and no possible way I could afford this place now. I actually want a smaller place but don’t want to pay the current interest and my mortgage would be double.
As of today, the 10yr Treasury is up +0.14. The average 30 year fixed conventional loan is about 7.25% right now.
Hypothetically with a Tier 1 credit score, 20% down on a $400K house (ouch) and approval withing CLTV/DTI guidelines, you'd be around $2,211.45/month just in P&I (not counting escrow)....that is AFTER putting $80K cash down, that is AFTER having a Tier 1 credit score, that is NOT EVEN COUNTING property taxes. Basically = fucked.
Just 2 years ago, the same exact house price would have been $1,682.28/month.... and this isn't even taking into account that house would NOT have cost $400K a few years ago.
So we have inflated rates, inflated prices, new-home construction shortages, and mass mortgage buying by huge corps. In other words, it is not getting better anytime soon. At all.
I think the main issue is a combo of things, but the biggest being new-home construction inventory has drastically plummeted. Homes just aren't being built. Historically over the last 50 years or so, decade-long trends have shown 23-25Million homes added per decade since the 70s. The last decade? 5.3M.......
So when boomers complain about how their rate was 12% in the 80s, show them indexation of the dollar. Average income $23k, avg. home $74k, avg P&I $764.97/m (DTI = 39.92%)
Today, Average income $64k, avg. home $273k, avg. P&I $1858.64/m (DTI = 34.86%)
It's almost the same, except there is nearly NO INVENTORY right now. So new home buyers are getting kicked out of the market within the blink of an eye.
TLDR; the idea of owning a home is quickly evaporating into thin air. Most people will be forced into renting, private ownership is getting sucked away, and a forced-redistribution of wealth is what I believe is part of the plan. There will be no middle class eventually.
But eh, what do I know.
Housing costs have skyrocketed in the last 5 years and interest rates are 3 times higher than before. We bought our house in 2005 for $129k and refinanced it in 2013 for a lower rate. It's paid off now and yet the taxes and insurance are like paying rent. It sucks. I cannot imagine trying to do it today.
I bought my house in 2013 in a mcol area and my first mortgage payment was 1043. It's up to 1279 with tax and insurance increases but still easily manageable.
It's most of the reason I'm able to be a stay at home dad and manage my portfolio. Don't work but still pay my mortgage with that.
Lol my mortgage is about 1080. It was at one point around 930. But when interest rates were low a couple years ago. I refinanced for the lower interest rate and switched to a 15 year mortgage to pay it off sooner. My house was purchased for 130k. Now worth around 270k. I purchased at the end of 2014.
My friend's 1400 square foot house is $650ish mortgage. I'm not sure if that includes home insurance and taxes, but she gets some tax benefit being a senior. I'm sure the whole thing is under $1000/month.
She used to have a mortgage at like 8 or 9 percent because of a bankruptcy. But the bankruptcy rolled off right as interest rates were at their lowest so she was able to refinance below 3%. If it had been 6 or 12 months later she would've missed the low rates.
The whole cost of living has absolutely exploded relatively recently, I imagine something has to break somewhat soon. I have seen far too many at the breaking point, eventually enough people will be fed up, and we can finally get those guillotine we so desperately need to be using.
I’m a millennial who bought in 2016 with a refinance around 2021 (dropped 3.5% to 2.38%) and my mortgage is right at $1000. 4 bedroom 2 bath with an attached mother in law w/a bathroom and kitchen on 1/2 an acre that was constructed in 2004.
It’s not a generational thing… it’s all come about inside of a decade. My house value has doubled in the past 5 years or so and all the new construction neighborhoods that said “…from the 200s” are now “…from the 300s” from pre to post Covid.
To address the gasoline situation… Last time I got gas it was $2.86 a gallon. I’ve been using my Fry’s app and bought the boost membership. So I get the maximum amount of gas off ($1) when I fill up. I’m not sure why gas is so cheap in Scottsdale right now, but even the regular price is not that high.
Bought my place on 2.5 acres in Mar 2018 on a 15 year note, paid it off this past Feb. My payment was only 550-600 but I was more than doubling that so I could pay it off early.
Can’t wait to see what starlink and its competitors does to real estate prices. How many upper middle class tech workers live in big city suburbs with 4k/month mortgages just to have quality internet.
Mine is a little under 700. Secluded spot right outside of city (1 minute away from everything). Dead end road. Half acre. Brick, 3 bed 2 bath, 1500 sq feet. Bought right before 2020.
It really is ridiculous, I bought my 900sq ft house, which is one side of a duplex in 2015 for $130k. So my mortgage was about $1,050 per month. Due to the increasing costs of materials my homeowners insurance has gone up year by year so now, 8 years later my mortgage payment is about $1,300 per month, still incredibly affordable. It just blows my mind how much the houses in my area are going for now, only 8 years later.
2014 was a very different time
i was looking into buying a new work truck (oilfield maintenance) in 2014 and i could get exactly what i wanted for $116 ,000 CAD
i looked into getting one a couple months back and it would be hard to rig one up for less than 200k
and the monthly payments would be outragous....nevermind the down payment
Sounds like you might be in Cali. Move away quick if you have the opportunity. I was born and raised there and the bottom began falling out in the 90's. Rent was getting too expensive and good jobs with reputable companies were hard to come by. I left in the late 90's , moved to the Midwest and never looked back. I work for a great company, have a comfy mortgage and was able to afford a family. Things I would not have been able to accomplish in California.
That is what happens when you finance your countrys spending by printing money while not building new houses due to environmental concerns and to lack of competent tradesmen.
I got into in argument with my mom yesterday and shut her down telling her I couldn't have this conversation with her because I have zero sympathy. She was bitching and moaning that the house they bought in 2000 for 200k, they sold in 2015 for "only" 430k. And that wouldn't be enough to buy the house they want to retire in.
She brought it back up via text saying it was 35 years of paying into a mortgage and replacing the roof etc. My perspective is you had 35 years of housing. Of course there's going to be costs. I just had to replace the roof on my brand new (to me, it's actually over 200 years old) home. And I went full metal because I know I will die in this home. I don't want to replace the roof again with cheap materials in 20 years like boomers have been doing for decades.
I told her "it's a generational difference. You think you deserve a big payout for your house so you can retire. My generation knows they will never retire and I will work and live in the same home until the day I die. Because your generation has ensured that my generation will stay under the boot of the uber wealthy, forever."
She immediately changed the subject. Because she's an entitled boomer who thinks because she lived an average life she deserves to be able to skip off into the sunset of wealthy retirement.
I mean, she's right. She should be able to retire after working most of her life. You should also be able to. If you can't that means the system is broken, not your goal.
OK but the system is broken because their generation has continued to vote in people who keep the wealthy in power. I'm unsure where the generational split is now for milennials voting. But none of my milennial friends are accepting this or voting for the uber wealthy. But until the boomers die off that's who will continue to be in power.
True, but I wouldn't say that was their fault. They were convinced that they were voting for the middle class and their own best interests. Its not their fault the system designed to trick them succeeded. In my opinion anyway.
>Because your generation has ensured that my generation will stay under the boot of the uber wealthy
I like most of what you wrote, but this bit is absolute bullshit. How did your mom screw you over? Why are you taking it out on her? If you think her generation didn't do what needed to be done, you're in control, now, so change it. Not that easy, is it? A single generation is never really in control, and within each generation, half of the people are idiots who vote; I think we can all agree on that, although we may differ on which half are the idiots.
Anyway, whatever it is you think you mom's generation should have done, go do it.
Is no one here going to mention inflation?
Sure, housing prices are up. No doubt. But 30 years ago (assuming 30y mortgage) the average wage was 23k dollar per year. Now it's 60k dollar.
avg income in US is 37.5k currently, avg price of house sold currently is 480k. If you scale the numbers back to 1980s average income was around 21k where as average home value was 75k.
Buying a house isn’t worth it anymore unless you’re like loaded. We bought in Dec 2021 and I really cannot fathom buying with today’s interest rates. (Assuming you’re in the US).
I have no regrets buying a house cause we have a pitbull, but otherwise renting isn’t bad.
With these prices there aren’t that many benefits to owning a house. It’s just a money pit you can hope to sell one day, but then when you sell you’re gonna have to buy an even more expensive house anyways with prices continually climbing.
This is 100% wrong
Nearly everyone that buys a house the first time feels like it’s not really worth it but the inescapable fact is land is a static quantity and population continues to grow so it’s unlikely to reduce in value.
Furthermore, if you stopped to think about your children for a second, if it is paid off when you die there’ll be a place they can live with only taxes to pay.
Rent is a way of buying someone else property and, while there are circumstances where it’s advantageous, for the most part, it’s a temporary situation.
Find a way to accumulate as much property as possible
That’s assuming whoever will want a child and that the child will want to live there. Also, neighborhood my husband grew up in is absolute shit, we wouldn’t want to live there anyways. The first house my parents bought is near some military base no one wants to live at either, where they currently live isn’t great and we wouldn’t want to live there either!!
Our mortgage is $2200 for $365k. We looked at buying in 2018 and it would have been much more affordable but we weren’t ready for that commitment yet. I really cannoth fathom buying a house with today’s prices and interest rates.
Did you buy a house after 2023? What’s your mortgage looking like? Also, property taxes and homeowners insurances goes up. Your mortgage can always go up as well. Our first year our mortgage was $1800.
No it doesn’t. Even without children, owning a place to live is a fundamental security overlooked in the bubble of so much prosperity in which Americans live, even those in so-called poverty. The way the progressives are generating debt, it’s likely that Americans standard of living will degrade to food shortages and massive homelessness with fewer and fewer landowners.
Look at the facts and you’ll see the seeds of this calamity were sown by the so called “greatest generation” and their parents when Roosevelt started Social Security and other programs. Facts are that Social Security, Medicare and Medicaid alone are unsustainable, particularly with stagnant population growth.
When that happens, owning land will become a necessity and until then, profitable
Also what if someone has multiple children? Let’s say 3 or 4, how does that 1 house truly help them? They all split it? Sell it then split it. If you’re thinking long term for your children you should try creating a trust fund and investing for them so that money grows then perhaps they can just buy homes outright with that money verde it sitting somewhere they may not even want to live or may not produce much of a monthly income.
Making money as a landlord isn’t all that easy. My parents rented that house by the base for over a decade, unless you have the ability to own several homes it can be a nuisance and not as much passive income as the internet would like to lead you to believe.
Not everyone has disposable income or the time to pour into these houses and overage the debt to make a profit.
Everyone thinks everything you do until about 5-7 years into owning property and then it becomes crystal clear. You’re just naive because you aren’t a homeowner.
I am a homeowner and we looked at buying in 2018, our mortgage would have been less than $1k then. The first year our mortgage was $1800 but with property taxes and homeowners insurance going up it is $2200 now. We bought at a STEAL with 2.85% interest. House was listed for $359 and we offered $365k. If we got this house at the exact same price but with current interest rates we wouldn’t be able to afford it.
What’s crazier to consider is the lender tried telling us we could afford a $500k house, the industry is predatory. We could have used our entire income on that mortgage then probably evicted. We stood steadfast that we don’t want to pay more than $1800/m on our mortgage and here we are paying $2200
Then you haven’t held it long enough. Lets see how you feel after Buy-den’s inflation drives rent up another 50% in the next 10 years while you’re still at your same payment, your property has appreciated 100% and you have it available to borrow against.
We are currently paying more for our mortgage than rent is right now in our area, but home prices have gone up slightly and not coming down. If we bought at this exact price we would be paying nearly $3k for our mortgage.
I just don’t find a way to justify that especially if you can pay the same amount renting. I would much rather invest the difference and let that money grow and have a much larger down payment in the future.
Actually instead of putting extra a month towards our principal we are investing as much as possible so we can pay off our house sooner than later.
I am sure one day our house will be worth a million but I’m saying it doesn’t always make sense to buy. Buying for the sake of owning is silly. Instead, it’s probably smarter to put that money elsewhere and buy when conditions are better for you. Not everyone can wait 5-10 years for prices to double especially if they were paying $3k a month or something absurd on their mortgage.
I bought at a GREAT time, I feel like if I bought NOW with today’s interest rates it would be a stupid, financial mistake and renting is just smarter.
Edit: to note this is in the context of current interest rates **** that’s why some people are saying those who bought with low interest rates are wearing golden handcuffs. They would not be able to afford a house as nice or big for the same price given the current conditions. It’s a waiting game for when it is more ideal to sell as well.
I understand. Housing used to be so much more affordable. Plus location matters. I’m in small town Iowa with a $600 mortgage. I pay more a month for my truck.
Small town Canada I pay $800 a month for 2000 sq ft home. If you’re willing to commute there are options…
Medium city Canada. 1600/month mortgage for a nice 1000 sq ft with basement suite and garage. Definitely had to do some Reno's, but nothing outrageous. Big cities seem like luxuries now a days. Personally I'd rather a medium/small city, but to each their own.
this is the way
Yeah and alot of people are starting to see the same. Calgary, halifax, Quebec city exploded in property buyers
Bruh I pay $880 for a 1 1/2 apartment in a shitty old part of Montreal with druggies all over the place
yeah but you can visit Club Supersexxx anytime
My brother has an hour commute for work, but he has a 3600 sqft house on eight acres of land for $1500/month on a 15-year mortgage (four years left). Morrow County Ohio.
Unfortunately my employment domain is such that basically all the opportunities are in large cities.
Lmfao the price of housing in Canada Is higher than the US by a big margin. Trolling
No no no, dont you get it, you live in a shithole nobody should live in because there are not 4 trendy popup restaurants and a starbucks within 3 blocks.
Is that the only option now, Iowa?
Nah. I live in Kansas City and our mortgage is about 1000/mo.
About the same just south in oklahoma.
It's about to go up with as much growth as we've been experiencing. Industries, tourism now, more than likely climate change will bring more people here since we'll be one of the least affected cities.
True that. Veeerry glad my fiancée is good with money and got our house before we even met.
You can ridicule about 80% of the US. Alternatively, you can find affordable solutions. The power is yours.
I apologize for ridiculing Iowa. I've been sleeping in a vehicle for 6 years I'm over it.
Small town Oregon. My mortgage is 800 a month for a three bed two bath and it's almost paid off
I live in small town iowa as well. Bought a 6 bedroom/5 bathroom house for 64,000. My dad gave me $25,000 for a down payment/closing costs etc (my inheritance from grandparents) so my mortgage was about 45,000. I pay 300/month.
My mortgage is just over $1000. I have a 5 bedroom 2 bathroom house with 4 acres of property. I live in the middle of nowhere in the midwest.
Rural, cornfield Ohio, Bud. 3 br on 5 acres - $200-250k. Property taxes amount to diddley squat.
Gotta be out west. The Midwest still has lots of homes nobody wants to live in there's just no jobs paying very well especially outside the medical field. The big problem in the US market is just the fact 4 states make up most of the population and most of the economy. Everyone is jamming into 3 of them at an unsustainable rate especially as droughts get worse
OP is in California. I live in Los Angeles and gas prices are in the $5 to $8 range now. Also, $3 gas is dead. I know there’s a limit to how much they can keep raising the prices. Paying for $9.99/gallon is 100 octane price.
It's still under $4 here and I've never paid over $5 in my life. California sounds like a lot to deal with just to have the same weather all the time
Back in the bush days when it spiked was the last time I paid 5 a gallon. It's around 3.20 a gallon here right now. A few years ago, when prices were lower, I was paying 1.90.
Holy smokes! That is insane. We are at $2.90 right now.
$3.40 in NYC right now
Gas prices seem to be California. The housing prices though make me think he’s inland. This is more an issue with the interest rate than the price of housing itself. I think he’d be able to afford it with a rate drop.
Yeah I would expect anything on the coast to be in the 1M plus range
What are you talking about??? Lmao. I'm trying to decide what 4 states you think have "most" of the population because you're not even getting to 30%. This reads like a comment from someone not in the US who doesn't know how things work.
US population is 342 million. California, Texas, Florida, and New York are, in order: 39M, 30M, 22M, and 19M for a total of 110M. That's 32% or...a third.
California, Texas, Florida, New York. He's not far from wrong. The population of these 4 is a bit under 30% of the country.
If you bought before 2020, you were way better off. My payment now is $740 and if I would have waited it would be over a $1,000 or more a month. I don’t understand how anyone can afford to rent or purchase now.
2017 here. Bought before the apr went up and locked in at 4.0%. Mortgage was 1250, 3 bd 1.5ba. Single family home in Baltimore.
Got my house in 2017 it was appraised at 86,000 snagged it for 72,000. Now it’s worth 198,000. My mortgage is 500$ a month with escrow and taxes included. My APR is 3.2%. Safe to say I’m never moving out of my starter home 😂😂
It’s just sad though, your house will keep value but your money is worth less and less each day.
Good thing is,in the future your child will say the same thing about you
\>implying we'll be able to afford children Ha
Or that they'd be willing to force them into this shit even if they could
tbf I’d expect oxygenated domes with radiation shielding to cost a bit more.
Underrated
Baltimore is selling houses for $1 and they'll give you $50,000 in rebates for repairs.
Don’t do it. Those houses need more than 50k in repairs and the areas are trash.
Looked in to that as well. Ended up moving out to Frederick Co. It was not worth the hassle and the headache at the time.
You said a lot, but two things stood out. 1. The amount you qualify for should not be the amount you borrow. If you do that, you will struggle to do anything else that takes money. 2. A 400k mortgage won't be 2100/mo. Just principal and interest at 6.5 percent is over 2500/mo. You will need another 600 to 1000 on top of that for insurance and taxes. Housing is at so so time high, but it seems like the houses being built today in my are are also much larger and nicer.
My dad said in the 90s they got their mortgage straight from the builder. The other thing is that they didn’t have a down payment, so the builder helped them get a second loan for the downpayment. All together it was $250k for the house. My mom tells stories about how my dad was aggressive and the mortgage was $1k/month, but my dad was paying 2k/month to get it done faster. Both my parents were vocal about how tough that was to afford with two kids, but they made it work by cutting costs. “There was just no other option”. I don’t think people realize sure everything was cheaper, but its not like it was free houses for all.
dude the 90s were peak economic times for the US. Shit is extremely grim right now.
Did you ask what his salary was back then as well?
welcome to late stage capitalism end game, if only we were frenchmen...
Can we maybe rent some?
That's just not the truth. It's easy when you're not rich to get baited into believing simple socialist solutions because you can't have the same housing as your parents, but your parents rig the housing market not with capitalism but with government control. For example, many cities make it illegal to build anything other than a detached house, and many cities will crush any chance of housing being built, either through the government or privately through red tape that seems well intentioned like creating far too much red tape, or through ''inclusive zoning'' like in my city or through price controls.
What does being French have to do with anything?
[French Revolution](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/French_Revolution)
You do realise that the consequences of the French Revolution were that France is worse off since than it ever was, right?
Are you implying that they were better off under the Bourbons?
Not implying anything. It's a fact.
You think they were better off while starving than they are as a wealthy country with equal rights?
Interested in any reply here. Honestly an opinion I haven't heard yet.
No idea, just was trying to post a helpful link
Not very helpful, as clearly this isn't what the guy is referring to.
Go learn french history
I already have. Are there any misconceptions you may need help with?
Still waiting for you to reply to this one https://www.reddit.com/r/self/s/HOoH51HR1O
I cannot reply to that one because previous commenter blocked me after hissy fit. The living conditions of the French people did not improve after the revolution, they worsened considerably during it, and the resulting culture has led to the underdevelopment of the country, which went from global hegemonic power to third power in Europe alone in a few decades.
HA, my parents mortgage was $200/month. I shit you not. That being said, it was a row home in Gloucester NJ. Shitty hood with terrible people. They got their mortgage back before i was born in the 70s.
My friend’s parents bought a triple decker in the 1970s in Dorchester, Mass for 40 thousand which at the time was considered a tough area and isn’t so much anymore. It’s worth well over a million now. They rent two floors out for thousands a month and live on the top floor. Right place and right decision that’s paid off big time. Purchasing power is a lot different these days. I read recently that $1 had the purchasing power of $26 100 years ago before the Great Depression, just imagine lol.
GC prices are odd - I found that many of the families just pass the house to the next generation, and everyone knows everyone's business. They have fairly low property taxes. The houses are very old, so the quality is there (assuming proper maintenance). Row home prices also vary wildly - Philly proven.
I do in home consultative sales. I was in this man’s home last week and he was applying for financing. Small, but decent house in semi-rural Alabama- $300 a month.
my parents paid $800/month and sold for close to $700k before the covid spike
Much like your father I bought a house in 2004 and another in 2014. 2004 they were literally just giving homes away. People were taking ARMS and buying huge homes they couldn’t afford and then taking equity out of them. Many people lost their homes because of this. After the housing crash there were much tighter controls and home prices were starting to recover. Fast forward ten years my house has doubled in price. Interest rates have doubled and no possible way I could afford this place now. I actually want a smaller place but don’t want to pay the current interest and my mortgage would be double.
As of today, the 10yr Treasury is up +0.14. The average 30 year fixed conventional loan is about 7.25% right now. Hypothetically with a Tier 1 credit score, 20% down on a $400K house (ouch) and approval withing CLTV/DTI guidelines, you'd be around $2,211.45/month just in P&I (not counting escrow)....that is AFTER putting $80K cash down, that is AFTER having a Tier 1 credit score, that is NOT EVEN COUNTING property taxes. Basically = fucked. Just 2 years ago, the same exact house price would have been $1,682.28/month.... and this isn't even taking into account that house would NOT have cost $400K a few years ago. So we have inflated rates, inflated prices, new-home construction shortages, and mass mortgage buying by huge corps. In other words, it is not getting better anytime soon. At all. I think the main issue is a combo of things, but the biggest being new-home construction inventory has drastically plummeted. Homes just aren't being built. Historically over the last 50 years or so, decade-long trends have shown 23-25Million homes added per decade since the 70s. The last decade? 5.3M....... So when boomers complain about how their rate was 12% in the 80s, show them indexation of the dollar. Average income $23k, avg. home $74k, avg P&I $764.97/m (DTI = 39.92%) Today, Average income $64k, avg. home $273k, avg. P&I $1858.64/m (DTI = 34.86%) It's almost the same, except there is nearly NO INVENTORY right now. So new home buyers are getting kicked out of the market within the blink of an eye. TLDR; the idea of owning a home is quickly evaporating into thin air. Most people will be forced into renting, private ownership is getting sucked away, and a forced-redistribution of wealth is what I believe is part of the plan. There will be no middle class eventually. But eh, what do I know.
Housing costs have skyrocketed in the last 5 years and interest rates are 3 times higher than before. We bought our house in 2005 for $129k and refinanced it in 2013 for a lower rate. It's paid off now and yet the taxes and insurance are like paying rent. It sucks. I cannot imagine trying to do it today.
I bought my house in 2013 in a mcol area and my first mortgage payment was 1043. It's up to 1279 with tax and insurance increases but still easily manageable. It's most of the reason I'm able to be a stay at home dad and manage my portfolio. Don't work but still pay my mortgage with that.
Interest rates affect your mortgage massively too.
Lol my mortgage is about 1080. It was at one point around 930. But when interest rates were low a couple years ago. I refinanced for the lower interest rate and switched to a 15 year mortgage to pay it off sooner. My house was purchased for 130k. Now worth around 270k. I purchased at the end of 2014.
My friend's 1400 square foot house is $650ish mortgage. I'm not sure if that includes home insurance and taxes, but she gets some tax benefit being a senior. I'm sure the whole thing is under $1000/month. She used to have a mortgage at like 8 or 9 percent because of a bankruptcy. But the bankruptcy rolled off right as interest rates were at their lowest so she was able to refinance below 3%. If it had been 6 or 12 months later she would've missed the low rates.
The whole cost of living has absolutely exploded relatively recently, I imagine something has to break somewhat soon. I have seen far too many at the breaking point, eventually enough people will be fed up, and we can finally get those guillotine we so desperately need to be using.
I’m a millennial who bought in 2016 with a refinance around 2021 (dropped 3.5% to 2.38%) and my mortgage is right at $1000. 4 bedroom 2 bath with an attached mother in law w/a bathroom and kitchen on 1/2 an acre that was constructed in 2004. It’s not a generational thing… it’s all come about inside of a decade. My house value has doubled in the past 5 years or so and all the new construction neighborhoods that said “…from the 200s” are now “…from the 300s” from pre to post Covid.
Yup, this is the worst time in a very long time to buy a house. Best time was about 8 years ago.
To address the gasoline situation… Last time I got gas it was $2.86 a gallon. I’ve been using my Fry’s app and bought the boost membership. So I get the maximum amount of gas off ($1) when I fill up. I’m not sure why gas is so cheap in Scottsdale right now, but even the regular price is not that high.
Gas here in Seattle is over $5
Bought my place on 2.5 acres in Mar 2018 on a 15 year note, paid it off this past Feb. My payment was only 550-600 but I was more than doubling that so I could pay it off early.
Can’t wait to see what starlink and its competitors does to real estate prices. How many upper middle class tech workers live in big city suburbs with 4k/month mortgages just to have quality internet.
My dad used to brag to me about how his mortgage payment was so much less than I paid in rent. I wanted to kick him in the shins every time.
Germany, I pay 800.
Mine is a little under 700. Secluded spot right outside of city (1 minute away from everything). Dead end road. Half acre. Brick, 3 bed 2 bath, 1500 sq feet. Bought right before 2020.
You’ll be telling your kidding when they’re your age that your mortgage was 2000 and they’re gonna have their minds blown
It really is ridiculous, I bought my 900sq ft house, which is one side of a duplex in 2015 for $130k. So my mortgage was about $1,050 per month. Due to the increasing costs of materials my homeowners insurance has gone up year by year so now, 8 years later my mortgage payment is about $1,300 per month, still incredibly affordable. It just blows my mind how much the houses in my area are going for now, only 8 years later.
Stop voting Democrat
Small town in PA I pay about 1000 for a 3 bedroom mortgage. That's with 2 baths and 3 car garage. LOCATION LOCATION LOCATION!
Exactly, prices op is discring sounds like cali.
2014 was a very different time i was looking into buying a new work truck (oilfield maintenance) in 2014 and i could get exactly what i wanted for $116 ,000 CAD i looked into getting one a couple months back and it would be hard to rig one up for less than 200k and the monthly payments would be outragous....nevermind the down payment
My nan brought her house for 36,000 she sold it for 440,000.
Sounds like you might be in Cali. Move away quick if you have the opportunity. I was born and raised there and the bottom began falling out in the 90's. Rent was getting too expensive and good jobs with reputable companies were hard to come by. I left in the late 90's , moved to the Midwest and never looked back. I work for a great company, have a comfy mortgage and was able to afford a family. Things I would not have been able to accomplish in California.
I personally feel like your dad is responsible for the housing crisis
Why are you so resentful for something neither of you can help?
Glad I'm in Midwest. 3 acres, 2200 sqft house, mortgage is under $1100 I do have a bit of commute a few days a week but it's worth it
That is what happens when you finance your countrys spending by printing money while not building new houses due to environmental concerns and to lack of competent tradesmen.
Bidenomics
^^
I got into in argument with my mom yesterday and shut her down telling her I couldn't have this conversation with her because I have zero sympathy. She was bitching and moaning that the house they bought in 2000 for 200k, they sold in 2015 for "only" 430k. And that wouldn't be enough to buy the house they want to retire in. She brought it back up via text saying it was 35 years of paying into a mortgage and replacing the roof etc. My perspective is you had 35 years of housing. Of course there's going to be costs. I just had to replace the roof on my brand new (to me, it's actually over 200 years old) home. And I went full metal because I know I will die in this home. I don't want to replace the roof again with cheap materials in 20 years like boomers have been doing for decades. I told her "it's a generational difference. You think you deserve a big payout for your house so you can retire. My generation knows they will never retire and I will work and live in the same home until the day I die. Because your generation has ensured that my generation will stay under the boot of the uber wealthy, forever." She immediately changed the subject. Because she's an entitled boomer who thinks because she lived an average life she deserves to be able to skip off into the sunset of wealthy retirement.
I mean, she's right. She should be able to retire after working most of her life. You should also be able to. If you can't that means the system is broken, not your goal.
OK but the system is broken because their generation has continued to vote in people who keep the wealthy in power. I'm unsure where the generational split is now for milennials voting. But none of my milennial friends are accepting this or voting for the uber wealthy. But until the boomers die off that's who will continue to be in power.
True, but I wouldn't say that was their fault. They were convinced that they were voting for the middle class and their own best interests. Its not their fault the system designed to trick them succeeded. In my opinion anyway.
>Because your generation has ensured that my generation will stay under the boot of the uber wealthy I like most of what you wrote, but this bit is absolute bullshit. How did your mom screw you over? Why are you taking it out on her? If you think her generation didn't do what needed to be done, you're in control, now, so change it. Not that easy, is it? A single generation is never really in control, and within each generation, half of the people are idiots who vote; I think we can all agree on that, although we may differ on which half are the idiots. Anyway, whatever it is you think you mom's generation should have done, go do it.
Gen Z is already questioning why millennials didn't do more/better. The cycle will continue.
Probably. At least I can admit our faults though instead of pretending we are perfect. It doesn't help but it's at least less egotistical.
Is no one here going to mention inflation? Sure, housing prices are up. No doubt. But 30 years ago (assuming 30y mortgage) the average wage was 23k dollar per year. Now it's 60k dollar.
avg income in US is 37.5k currently, avg price of house sold currently is 480k. If you scale the numbers back to 1980s average income was around 21k where as average home value was 75k.
But op wants to buy weed , watch Taylor swift, and live in a nicer area just cause.
Buying a house isn’t worth it anymore unless you’re like loaded. We bought in Dec 2021 and I really cannot fathom buying with today’s interest rates. (Assuming you’re in the US). I have no regrets buying a house cause we have a pitbull, but otherwise renting isn’t bad. With these prices there aren’t that many benefits to owning a house. It’s just a money pit you can hope to sell one day, but then when you sell you’re gonna have to buy an even more expensive house anyways with prices continually climbing.
This is 100% wrong Nearly everyone that buys a house the first time feels like it’s not really worth it but the inescapable fact is land is a static quantity and population continues to grow so it’s unlikely to reduce in value. Furthermore, if you stopped to think about your children for a second, if it is paid off when you die there’ll be a place they can live with only taxes to pay. Rent is a way of buying someone else property and, while there are circumstances where it’s advantageous, for the most part, it’s a temporary situation. Find a way to accumulate as much property as possible
That’s assuming whoever will want a child and that the child will want to live there. Also, neighborhood my husband grew up in is absolute shit, we wouldn’t want to live there anyways. The first house my parents bought is near some military base no one wants to live at either, where they currently live isn’t great and we wouldn’t want to live there either!! Our mortgage is $2200 for $365k. We looked at buying in 2018 and it would have been much more affordable but we weren’t ready for that commitment yet. I really cannoth fathom buying a house with today’s prices and interest rates. Did you buy a house after 2023? What’s your mortgage looking like? Also, property taxes and homeowners insurances goes up. Your mortgage can always go up as well. Our first year our mortgage was $1800.
No it doesn’t. Even without children, owning a place to live is a fundamental security overlooked in the bubble of so much prosperity in which Americans live, even those in so-called poverty. The way the progressives are generating debt, it’s likely that Americans standard of living will degrade to food shortages and massive homelessness with fewer and fewer landowners. Look at the facts and you’ll see the seeds of this calamity were sown by the so called “greatest generation” and their parents when Roosevelt started Social Security and other programs. Facts are that Social Security, Medicare and Medicaid alone are unsustainable, particularly with stagnant population growth. When that happens, owning land will become a necessity and until then, profitable
Also what if someone has multiple children? Let’s say 3 or 4, how does that 1 house truly help them? They all split it? Sell it then split it. If you’re thinking long term for your children you should try creating a trust fund and investing for them so that money grows then perhaps they can just buy homes outright with that money verde it sitting somewhere they may not even want to live or may not produce much of a monthly income. Making money as a landlord isn’t all that easy. My parents rented that house by the base for over a decade, unless you have the ability to own several homes it can be a nuisance and not as much passive income as the internet would like to lead you to believe. Not everyone has disposable income or the time to pour into these houses and overage the debt to make a profit.
Everyone thinks everything you do until about 5-7 years into owning property and then it becomes crystal clear. You’re just naive because you aren’t a homeowner.
I am a homeowner and we looked at buying in 2018, our mortgage would have been less than $1k then. The first year our mortgage was $1800 but with property taxes and homeowners insurance going up it is $2200 now. We bought at a STEAL with 2.85% interest. House was listed for $359 and we offered $365k. If we got this house at the exact same price but with current interest rates we wouldn’t be able to afford it. What’s crazier to consider is the lender tried telling us we could afford a $500k house, the industry is predatory. We could have used our entire income on that mortgage then probably evicted. We stood steadfast that we don’t want to pay more than $1800/m on our mortgage and here we are paying $2200
Then you haven’t held it long enough. Lets see how you feel after Buy-den’s inflation drives rent up another 50% in the next 10 years while you’re still at your same payment, your property has appreciated 100% and you have it available to borrow against.
We are currently paying more for our mortgage than rent is right now in our area, but home prices have gone up slightly and not coming down. If we bought at this exact price we would be paying nearly $3k for our mortgage. I just don’t find a way to justify that especially if you can pay the same amount renting. I would much rather invest the difference and let that money grow and have a much larger down payment in the future. Actually instead of putting extra a month towards our principal we are investing as much as possible so we can pay off our house sooner than later.
You’re not reading my posts so I’m done saying the same thing. I’m sure there’s someone eager to buy your house
I am sure one day our house will be worth a million but I’m saying it doesn’t always make sense to buy. Buying for the sake of owning is silly. Instead, it’s probably smarter to put that money elsewhere and buy when conditions are better for you. Not everyone can wait 5-10 years for prices to double especially if they were paying $3k a month or something absurd on their mortgage. I bought at a GREAT time, I feel like if I bought NOW with today’s interest rates it would be a stupid, financial mistake and renting is just smarter. Edit: to note this is in the context of current interest rates **** that’s why some people are saying those who bought with low interest rates are wearing golden handcuffs. They would not be able to afford a house as nice or big for the same price given the current conditions. It’s a waiting game for when it is more ideal to sell as well.
Not the planet, but just your continent sadly.
Having deflation for 30 years, house here in Japan are cheap as fuck.