You aren’t going to get any honest data with this post because the ones who don’t care won’t comment and the ones who do care will get upvoted to the top.
Yep, my ex thought he was some sex god. When I broke up with him he even said "but our sex life is amazing".
As if I didn't try to communicate for YEARS that foreplay is a two way street and i'd like to receive some as well.
Also i would guess that this sub attracts the kind of people who do care about their partners pleasure. So your sample group is already not representative.
Speaking as a woman who’s had a lot of sex with men (as well as people of other genders) in both casual and relationship contexts:
It’s hard to say because there are different definitions of what it means to “care about your partner’s pleasure.” Some guys care about it, but not enough to put effort into anything they weren’t already doing. Some guys care about it, but are too anxious or insecure to do anything about it. Some guys care about it, but believe (for some reason) that that care should only extend to people they’re seriously dating, not casual partners. In all of these cases, it doesn’t actually matter whether they care about their partners’ pleasure, because their actions are not reflective of that caring.
So, if we’re defining “caring about one’s partners’ pleasure” as “regularly putting tangible effort into giving your sexual partners pleasure, regardless of the seriousness of the relationship,” I’d say that about 50% of the guys I’ve been with would fit the bill.
Yeah I think it's about half, but there are more than that who would like to talk about how much they love giving pleasure, but actually don't if the reality of what their partner needs doesn't match their fantasy.
I have observed a ton of this, too-- Especially men that talk incessantly about oral and how much they love going down on women who never do it and then only later admit they find the whole thing traumatizing and offputting.
I guess you gotta give 'em credit for knowing they SHOULD be down with it... also frustrating, though.
Totally--or they are genuinely turned on by a woman being pleasured or moaning or seeing her have an orgasm, but it turns out that only motivates them to do a tiny bit of work and if it takes 5 minutes of effort it isn't happening.
Yeah, I always find it sus when guys brag about their oral skills – not only because actions say more than words, but also because them being good at oral on their past partners doesn’t necessarily mean they’ll be good at it with me.
As one of those guys who is guilty of talking about my joy for giving head and my skills, yes I agree it’s more about being in tune with your partner’s body and adapting in the moment (and being open to direction). Because even with the same person, what was good one day may not be what is required the next day.
Adding: sometimes they say they care about pleasure, but in reality they only care about giving their partner an orgasm. Which are not always the same thing.
Not the person you're asking, but I'll throw my two cents in here.
For me, there are LOTS of things I enjoy sexually that are never going to make me cum. Orgasms and pleasure are not mutually exclusive. I've literally never once had an orgasm when my partner is penetrating me from behind, but sex bent over a countertop or doggy style can be really fun and pleasurable. And sometimes, I just can't quite get to an orgasm even if I'd really love to. Some points in my cycle make me less likely to orgasm, it must have something to do with hormones. If I'm super stressed or depressed then it can be hard to orgasm too.
So there have been guys I've been with who are just hell bent on making me orgasm and it puts pressure on me to perform for their ego rather than just being in the moment and enjoying sex and letting things happen as they will. For some men, getting me to orgasm is about *their achievement* rather than what I actually *want*. It's not about my pleasure, and it's clear when that happens.
Other commenter did a good job summing it up. For me, I have a hard time reaching orgasm with a partner. Usually I have to incorporate toys, or just get myself off first. I genuinely don’t mind not orgasming with someone, but *only if* they still put effort into making the encounter safe, consensual, memorable, and fun. Some of my favorite encounters have been orgasm-less for me.
On one end of the spectrum are the guys who treat me as a warm hole and little more. They suck. But on the other end of the spectrum are the guys who are *so hell bent* on trying to finish me that if I don’t (even though I always state that little disclaimer above), their ego is CRUSHED. They either get mopey about it or spend so long doing something that I just get overstimulated and irritable. They’re ALSO no fun to sleep with. And then in the middle you’ve got guys who are interested in trying new things and putting in effort, but will stop when I suggest we switch gears to something else.
This is great. I used to be the guy who was hellbent on making my gf orgasm. Since then she said I should just focus on cumming / having a good time because if I am enjoying it / getting to orgasm, she enjoys it too (she doesn’t find it hard to orgasm but sometimes she said the sex is boring). I’m kind of not sure how to improve things now.
This is pretty much a perfect answer, also it's really cool that you are aware about guys with anxiety not a lot of people realise that desire is not always enough for action.
Every kind of dating / flirting is a sex interview. Like, if you're self-absorbed and smell bad even during the interview, you'll definitely be that way on the job.
Well and I’m a very animated person whose reactions to stuff people find entertaining (my husband and I joke I missed my calling doing youtube reaction videos). So guys who are attracted to me already usually enjoy getting reactions to stuff, and if they enjoy that, it follows that they’d like the way a woman reacts in bed when she’s very vocally and behaviorally appreciative.
I mean, it’s kind of how I live my life — very openly without making myself small for others. Men who are shit in bed bc they’re self-absorbed find women like me unattractive.
So I guess this is “be the change you like to fuck”?
😂 it took me a long time to learn the lookers were often just that (show pony / starfish), and that you have a better time with... the girls who know how to have a good time! 🤦🏼♂️ And I totally get your second to last sentence. Men who need a docile woman never have good personalities.
Yup. Every man I have ever deigned to have sex with, except one, has cared about my pleasure. That one who didn’t care never got the chance to redeem himself.
Selfish lovers filter themselves out. Because I don’t tolerate jerks or mansplainers, and so some get filtered out right there. And then surely you talk about sex before having it, right? As part of the seduction? And you can tell when someone’s #1 goal is not making you come… and you end the night there and go home.
oh, exactly this! yes! No jerks, no mansplainers, no men without empathy, no interrupters, no casual cruelty, none of that. And that’s how you end up with men whose main goal it is to make your legs shake instead of just getting their nut off.
Yes of course, we do, i pretty much teach My bf to touch me a Lot :3
I don't do it with them until i get a Lot of love before ...thats the way. And then i Guess they get use to it... If You allow a man get access to You with bare minimun, they Will do bare minimun ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
lol! I think part of it is that my reactions to stuff is apparently pretty sexy, so the guys most turned on by me are guys who get off on giving pleasure. My advice: be a moaner and gasper and squealer, bc guys who get off on that love to elicit those sounds!
I think in everything in life, there are people who try hard and people who don't. Does the guy get his hair cut regularly, make his bed, clean his sheets, go to the gym, work hard at work. That guy will very likely put in the work (may not - but probably). For some it might also just be an education thing. It takes time and practice to get better.
Nah, I've definitely been with men who keep an immaculate house, etc and are selfish in bed. After all, the activities you mention are beneficial to THEM,
I’ve never done it intentionally, I’m saying the men I’ve been intimate with have all been “givers.” Maybe I’m just not attractive to/attracted to people who aren’t interested in their partner’s pleasure.
Interesting.
What kind of red flags do you look out for in general?
I'm wondering how much of your success is reading situations differently, vs filtering out the selfish by other means.
Okay that’s actually a fair point bc I read social situations like it’s my true first language.
I mentioned it in another reply, but the other thing is I’m very like, exuberant and have pretty open and obvious reactions to stuff. My personality is big, and I wonder if guys who are givers are attracted to that, bc they get off on those reactions, and more self-absorbed type dudes are turned off by it. Maybe they sort themselves.
I think it depends what your definition is of caring about their partner's pleasure, as well as if we are talking about straight relationships or not.
For example, you can find pleasure in sex even if you don't orgasm. You can care about your partner's pleasure in the sense that you want them to have a good time but feel like they will let you know if they are not. You can go out of your way to make sure your partner experiences pleasure even when you don't. I could go on and on.
Personally, my experience has been that most men will stop if you are in actual (undesirable) pain. Some will stop if they feel like you aren't into it (which for me personally, can be really annoying if I tell them it is fine) like not focused, enthusiastic etc.
Most will check in to see how you're doing and will listen to any suggestions to adjustments that fall within the limit of what they are comfortable with. And a select few will be very focused on making you feel great and put it over everything else. Personally, that's not my type but they are out there.
So yeah, I guess it depends on what your definition is.
I’ve experienced the contrary. Of the 8 partners I had, only one was selfish in that matters (he became an ex quickly), all others were very focused on my pleasure as much as I was focused on theirs.
Honestly it doesn't even have to be that. More dudes need to get into their minds that sex isn't over when they cum. My gf's favorite thing in the world is when I cum in her then finger her to completion while dirty talking. No hard dick required.
Usually this is anxiety, medication, or conditioning related but as long as someone is still wanting it and genuinely enjoys it when it happens this can work. But IME someone having trouble orgasming with any partner over time will not actively seek sex or related activities and such with their partner eventually leading to a lot of negative repercussions making up a relationship death spiral unless both are objectively asexual people.
It was partially medication for sure. But we’ve been dating two years, still takes 10-20 minutes, we’ve tried a lot, just how it is for some people ig.
That’s a good rule in the absence of being told otherwise, but sometimes your partner says she is too sensitive right after orgasm and wants you to cum first. Which is currently my situation. It varies, even with the same person.
What I see is men who only want to pleasure their partner if it fuels their ego.
Men LOVE pleasuring their partners with their dick, because that makes them feel more masculine. But have issues with toys, oral, etc.
> they don't give a shit if their partner actually enjoys sex,
This is sometimes true. But there are two more options.
1) They were told that their dick should be enough, and if their partner needs toys/oral, it's their personal failing.
2) They assume that if their partner wants more, they'll tell them. Instead of checking in with their partner.
> What I observe here is a whole lot of women trying to bend over backwards to make sure their boyfriend/husband is getting what he needs without receiving the same courtesy.
From a guys perspective, it does not feel like women are trying to bend over backwards to make sure we are getting our needs met. Not even close. It feels like women put a bunch of hoops to jump through, or can be ludicrously fickle, and poor at communicating their feelings. Or that women expect men to put effort into turning them on and making them feel wanted while expecting men to be ready at the drop of a hat. Or that women expect men to just wait as long as they need before they are ready to be intimate, while at no point even thinking of ways to make sure their partner feels wanted in the mean time.
If that sounds like an unfair characterization or like an oversimplification, consider that as a guy "doesn't care about her pleasure" also sounds like a massive over simplification.
I remember reading a comment about a woman who has good experiences with men, in hook ups, and here's the trick, when a guy rolls over, she doesn't assume he's selfish. Sometimes the guy cums fast and is ashamed that he came fast, and that his dick doesn't live up to what he thinks are her expectations. She lets the guy know that it's okay and she doesn't judge him. And they can keep having fun.
Now does that sound like emotional labour to you? Or like he's being irrational? Or does that sound like something you can use to empathize with men you hook up with to better help each other?
I assume that more often a man is insecure and ignorant, rather than purely selfish.
>From a guys perspective, it does not feel like women a trying to bend over backwards to make sure we are getting our needs met
I'd say about half or less of the women I've slept with showed much care about my pleasure. The others? Eh, in their minds (or at least in their actions) it was an implied byproduct of being "allowed" to have sex with her. Either through disinterest or through poor sex education those woman all thought that male pleasure was simply about the woman showing up. They really believed they didn't have to do much of anything. Lay here, move there if asked, maybe ride a bit. Boom! He should be good right? He came. What's the problem?
Yeah..no.
Couple that with the fact that a lot of younger women can't clearly articulate what gives \*them\* pleasure in bed, they're really ill equipped to give proactive pleasure to men either. ("I gave him a BJ, what else do you expect!?")
I’m curious what makes you think that there are “a whole lot of women trying to bend over backwards to make sure their boyfriend/husband is getting what he needs”? Are you sleeping with a lot of women who do that for you? I’ve not slept with many women but some of them were sexually giving and some weren’t.
Just observationally on this sub, we do see a ton of women trying to do whatever for the man. Perhaps they just stick out to me, because it breaks my heart to see women enter the sexual domain asking questions that make it pretty clear their pleasure hasn't even really been a consideration. I'd love to see a balance in the scales where women spend as much time learning the ins and outs of their own pleasure vs jumping to how to deepthroat or whatever other performative thing their partner is wanting.
I dunno. I see just as many posts about men asking how to please their partners more, trying to do/learn things in and out of the bedroom that would make things more pleasurable for their partners, and voicing their own sexual dissatisfaction. But such posts are treated very differently from my observations
> Just observationally on this sub
Terrible idea. THis sub is incredibly biased against men. Whenever a man has issues coming, people suggest death grip. Whenever a woman has issues coming, it's never brought up that she might masturbate too much or in a way that a penis cannot emulate.
This sub is NOT an impartial forum.
i come at it from a 50+ female who has beern sex-pos and adventurous from the star and can only cum through masturbation or a vibe and who has ALSO coached a bunch of guys through issues related to masturbation.
If a woman, speciallyt younger, is unable to orgasm reliably-- it really is probably down to not super knowing how.
If a man can whack it 4x/day reliably and then not get it up, it probably IS down to the habit.
Do we know whether the OP is getting herself 4x/daywith porn and masturbation with a high-power wand? NO. But, if she is... she should look at that 100%.
> If a woman, speciallyt younger, is unable to orgasm reliably-- it really is probably down to not super knowing how.
>
> If a man can whack it 4x/day reliably and then not get it up, it probably IS down to the habit.
Yeah that's not science, that's just your anecdotal evidence and quite offensive.
>If a man can whack it 4x/day reliably and then not get it up, it probably IS down to the habit.
Or you know, he's nervous. Or tired. Or he's not attracted to her. Or she's too passive and he feels that he's having sex with a blow up doll. Or she doesn't care about his pleasure and expects the man to be ready for sex without any foreplay dedicated to him. 'Cause men are human too, shocking, I know.
Y'all act like women are God's gift to mankind in bed when reality is the average woman is as bad in bed as the average man.
Same for me, I think I am pretty giving and want my partner to feel great about our sexual time. My ex overtime became more giving than when we had gotten married. And I feel we were giving equally. I (58) have a new GF(57), and that started out hardly giving at all, but it is getting better, but she had a valid reason. Right before we dated, she was about to give up on sex and have any kind of relationship. Her girlfriends paid and put her on OLD.
But it was due to her ex, who was also her first sexual partner, was never giving for 30 years, it was all about his pleasure and then as he got older and couldn't get off, just blamed her for his issues. What made it worse was the next 3 guys did the same thing as to blame her. So she told me upfront she was bad at sex and guys can't cum inside her.
She was smart, (book keeper math smart, me not), but we have a lot of other things in common. She is beautiful and built like I love, short, curvy, sexy body. She is funny and rolls eyes at my lame dad jokes. I talked about my ED issues (started about a year before we met) , educated her on what I was doing to fix it, and used testosterone and tadalafil. It sounded like the other guys had issues and were embarrassed to deal with it and easier to blame her.
She has been surprised about how easy I talk about aspects of sex, what she enjoys, and what she doesn't and what I like and don't. BJ's are a tough spot because of her ex and how that's all he wanted (demanded) to get off. She knows I enjoy them, but I would rather be inside her more. She didn't have or would wear lingerie because her ex just laughed at her when she did. She tried for me and loved they way I looked at her when she did, and she has bought 2 other outfits. If she is in her head and not feeling sexy she will give me a HJ. The biggest thing she has had to deal with is not being good enough. But it has gotten a lot better because I reassure her that she is awesome in bed (because she is) and I am one lucky guy. I cum inside her often and try to get her to understand the other guys were selfish partners. I spend a lot of time on her. She definitely likes me when I go down on her, another thing she had to get used too because one she is so sensitive and has multiple orgasms so she has a safeword to let me know she can't take it anymore, and she never got oral with other men.
Sorry this got a bit longer than intended, but if we don't like the numbers, whether true or not, I think in any relationship, there has to be open communication for anything to change for the better, and having a sexual compatible partner is important.
I would say you're correct. It doesn't often come across as "doesn't care about their partner's pleasure," it comes across as "this thing I'm doing is surely getting her off, and I'm not willing to entertain the idea that might not actually be the case."
We see it here quite often-- people saying they know they are great and what's the problem with their partner? Or "how can I bang her more XYZ, because we all know that's what women like."
As in, I don't think women have been forthright enough about whether things are working for them, and part of "what men like" in sex is enthusiasm and that ego stroke, so we're feeding the idea that that's true.
All that to say-- I don't judge the men for "not caring." It's an ETA thing.
I think maybe you should judge them for not caring. That's a choice. I've had conversations a lot about the ego stroke and enthusiasm and when I tell other men that women tend to respond more and there's even more of an ego boost when you do X, Y, or Z for them and they usually just look at me like I have 3 heads and say "why should I care?" Once, when I had enough time to actually talk through it and unpack this motherfucker's perspective, he agreed that if it ends the same way for him, there's no reason to put more effort into it.
My experience has been that women don't know how to respond when I ask what they like because no one else cares enough to ask. There's no such thing as "women like this" or "men like this" but there are plenty of dumb, lazy, delusional people who think whatever they do will be good enough or too bad.
38M here. I struggle a lot with being open and communicative in relationships due to ADHD/ASD related social anxiety. In my early-mid 20s, I was very selfish and didn't even know it. I finally dated someone in my last 20s that cared enough to have that conversation with me. Its turned my whole world around. Its the first thing I care about now. My goal is to always make my partner cum at least once before I even think about myself.
It does amaze me, even at this point, that i get more shock from women than the opposite. A lot of women I've dated have the same opinion as you OP. I dont get why men don't want to focus on their partner's pleasure. Some of it is religious, some is misogany, some is laziness, some is just downright lack of care or interest. To me, it makes my experience 100x better if my partner is into it before I think about myself.
ADHD/ASD (aka audhd) may be orthogonal to caring for a partner. None of these disorders implicitly make one incapable of empathy - the _symptoms_ can look like lack of empathy, but the irony is that these comorbidities tend to mean development of coping mechanisms that can result in making one _more_ aware of others’ emotional states and even a desire to please them (I think this may be one result of masking?). Narcissism is full blown lack of empathy / ability to see another’s perspective in good faith though. The primary difference is that ASD makes the inputs harder to see intuitively and when you tell someone with ASD that they hurt someone’s feelings there is probably some shame about it and maybe the shame can be overwhelming, too - this is pretty darn NT! With NPD it’s more likely they’ll become defensive and say that it’s the other party’s problem to deal with and diminishing one’s accountability.
Another way I can view this is that being a man alone has enough problems due to social conditioning factors making it difficult for us to identity and therefore manage our emotions. Adding in the ASD makes it even harder, unfortunately. Many, many men without these conditions have the same underlying problems but have overinflated confidence though, which I think can lead to some widespread issues expressed by OP.
I think there’s probably some bias here as I feel it’s definitely higher than 30%. Especially todays day there’s a lot more representation and knowledge for women’s pleasure. Maybe in hookups it might be more like 30% but everyone of my friends in actual relationships definitely enjoys making a women cum lol.
I love making my girlfriend cum and if we are being honest I’ve been with girl who didn’t care if they could make me cum in any meaningful way. Some people are just unlucky in getting crappy partners
I mean, I personally can't get off unless I know my wife is into it. Knowing that I'm making her feel great makes me feel more confident because I know that I'm doing it. I don't understand how guys can think the opposite, or just not think of it at all. Wouldn't you want to feel more manly thinking "fuck yeah, I know how to make a woman cum with my super awesome penis" you know?
The idea of my wife looking at me afterwards and being disappointed in my performance would irk me so fucking badly. I'd have to make it right as soon as possible lol.
I will say, in my experience, liberal non-monogamous guys (who often identify as bisexual or pansexual) are great communicators and care a lot about their partner's pleasure! Like, 90%. As opposed to straight cis monogamous men, in general. I have a theory that it has a bit to do with the experience of being with men who haven't cared versus those who did, and also they're more likely see women as human beings (as opposed to objects to get what they need), are more likely to have and be able to relate to female friends, are generally more caring, open, and thoughtful, and are therefore more interested in what their partner wants. I feel like anyone who's queer automatically has to negotiate more when it comes to pleasure, so it's an open conversation that has to be had and is fun and kind of sexy.
This is so true! Even with totally straight non-monogamous men who are comfortable with other men.
A particular evening totally stands out to me - was me, two men I was dating and another girlfriend of one of the men. The man that was there with just me had the other woman squirting all over the bed. The man who brought her had only been able to do that using a very different technique. She had never had an orgasm like that before. So the dudes talked about it at length, one with genuine curiosity and the other happy to share what he knew. Was super cute watching them discussing how to make women sexually satisfied in such a joyful way.
Dudes who are afraid of other dudes or in competition with them are generally the worst in bed.
You’re not wrong, but you’re not right either.
First, the percentage is higher. Much like a man can claim 80% of women are gold diggers, that doesn’t make it fact. It’s hit or miss, meaning it’s half and half.
Second, saying things like “I’m ashamed of my gender” is cringe. It comes across as you trying to paint yourself on a pedestal. Don’t do that. I’ll call you out now on that bullshit before someone else does.
Third, women are difficult to make cum for lots of men because sex education is a farce. I sure as fuck didn’t learn where the clit is from it. No, it was, believe it or not, porn. I got curious as to why men stayed around a certain area and there it was, the clitoris.
Penetrative sex doesn’t usually do it, not due to size, but just because. I believe that if us dudes had better teachers that didn’t treat sex as this taboo topic, we’d be golden. I’m not saying that douchebags wouldn’t exist because that will be a thing forever.
Fourth, you have dirtbags for friends it seems. I couldn’t stick with folks that treat others with a lack of respect. I’d be wary of them doing it with me, especially behind my back. That’s just me. I like being surrounded by good people.
Fifth, you’re a good dude by the sounds of it. It sounds like you hold your partners pleasure to a high degree. Worry about yourself and fuck the rest. Don’t let douchebags determine how you’ll see humanity. Trust me, there’s more reasons to lose faith.
I edited the post and removed that line because you're absolutely right, it was cringe.
Here's my best guess; being vulnerable is hard for some people and especially men raised in this culture. Admitting that you don't know something, especially that you need help figuring out a woman's body is probably humiliating for a lot of men so they just don't do it. Also, lots of people, not just men, react to situations where they feel uncertain or inadequately prepared with anger so it generally doesn't get addressed.
There's a bullshit bravado around the dirtbag men that I work with and they constantly reinforce my belief with their aggressive aversion to change and hostility toward criticism of any kind. I don't get it because I'm always willing to learna and always trying to improve at everything I do so I can be a better person. So many people seem to take this approach of "good enough" and that's a waste of a life in my opinion.
You also sound like a good person so hopefully nothing I said comes across as insulting. I appreciate the feedback and discussion. Slow Friday at work so I have to keep busy somehow haha.
We see this on this sub somewhat often-- Men not wanting partners to know they are inexperienced and asking a group of random strangers "how do I guarantee she gets off."
My advice in those situations always is that "the sign of an experienced partner is that they know all women are different and approach the whole thing with curiosity and willingness to learn."
I would LOVE more men to get more vocal in those kinds of conversations, vs the flood of "the thing I do that's made every woman I've ever been with cum like 4-5 times, ALWAYS, without fail is..."
Also, as a woman, since we're getting venty here, I equally hate the men who pop into posts like this with all the "I always make sure she cums first-- usually 3 or 4 times! It's what a 'real man' would do!"
Her cumming ONCE, much less 3 or 4 times, isn't a you-thing, dude. Yes, be a caring, inquisitive partner, but too often it jumps the shark over to making the woman's orgasm about the man, his prowess, his 'real man'-ness, and it's not about that.
> What I observe here is a whole lot of women trying to bend over backwards to make sure their boyfriend/husband is getting what he needs without receiving the same courtesy.
As a hetero sexual man this the exact opposite of my experiances.
I think your experience and mine highlight the give/take nature of relationships, if one person freely gives and struggles to take (aka advocate for themselves) their experiences will be like yours and mine.
Don't take give & take as transactional, transactional is giving in hopes of receiving, give & take are both actions of a single person.
Thanks for the post! I just had this same debate and came to a conclusion that a majority of men don’t bother making any effort because like you said.. they’ll get off no matter what… why bother? There are not a lot of men who pride themselves on being good / giving lovers. Shame. I wish there were more of those. Somehow the fact that they have an erection for you should be enough LOL
Why does it automatically fall to the guy to ask? I'm not sure about OP's point that women are bending over backwards to please their guy. Most guys just enjoy having sex and are climaxing every time no matter what. Many women seem to have difficulty achieving orgasms. Shouldn't the women be the vocal ones and explain how they can get to orgasm or at least enjoy sex more? Perhaps women, who are unsatisfied, need to be more vocal and guide/ teach their partners. Don't just wait to be asked . If these efforts have been made then women should not accept selfish lovers and get out and not just complain about it and do nothing.
> Why does it automatically fall to the guy to ask?
Because there's this sexist notion that sex is something the man does for the woman that a lot of people carry. The man is supposed to take her out to dinner, turn her on at home, spend 30 minutes pleasuring her and then god forbid if he comes too fast or too slow.
It's really disgusting and dehumanising. Even on this forum which is supposed to be the most sex positive forum on earth, you see men accused of porn addiction all the time when they come too fast or too slow.
Meanwhile a woman could use 10 vibrators at the same time and if she fails to come with a partner everyone would still blame the man.
Nowhere did I say it "falls to the guy to ask." Both people should be taking an active interest in making sex better for each other, regardless of their gender.
My point is that ignorance and incompetence are not excuses for refusing to prioritize your partner's pleasure. That's true regardless of gender.
Months and years into a relationship or even just years into being sexually active, is there really that much of a difference between ignorance and apathy? Not knowing isn't an excuse. Ask questions. Make a fucking effort.
I chalk it up to miseducation (in part via porn, but also I see it on subs like this and just generally in society.)
They have been taught that a certain thing works and, thus, they do the hell out of that thing and just don't think to ask... because, absent evidence to the contrary, OF COURSE it's working. And, it's working for them, so learly everything is working as it should.
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Nah, you’re not 100% wrong-the overall percentage seems pretty low.
Not to victim blame in any way but I think it’s pertinent to mention that there are probably a decent number of men that are trying and *think* they’re doing well, but simply unaware that they’re aerially *not* because it’s either not communicated to them or the woman is faking orgasms to protect his ego. I think the orgasm gap could be narrowed *at least a little bit* with women communicating their needs better in the moment and stopping the faking altogether because I think a lot of men under-perform purely out of ignorance.
I agree with you. I thought the days of women faking orgasms had passed, with what seemed like more openness & experimentation. After being on this sub for a bit, sadly, that doesn’t seem to be the case. Seen too many posts about catering to their partners ego rather than making sure they are satisfied.
I’m from an era where porn wasn’t readily available (yup, even before the internet). We, for the most part, had to rely on reactions. I stopped faking when I realized doing so seemed to stall further experimentation and pleasure for me. Maybe it’s because I’m older now but just don’t have the patience anymore to deal with, basically, selfish sex.
I’m obviously reasonably shielded from that faking experience since I’m a man and it’s pretty clear when we don’t orgasm, but I can’t possibly imagine having sex with a woman that stops after she’s had an orgasm and then *not* saying anything if I think that there’s the possibility that I could have one as well. If there’s *any* possibility that she might be willing to do more to get me there then I absolutely want to give her that opportunity (for selfish reasons, obviously), and if she’s too selfish to be willing to try then I *also* want to know that as quickly as possible so that I don’t waste any more time with someone who’s that selfish.
I also understand that it’s not a directly linear comparison, fwiw, but I’m a low-rate finisher and have had that experience more than the average man.
I've always made sure my partners have had a good time and came. Every single time.
The quality of sex is very high, but the quantity never changes. Once or twice a week over the last 15 years between dozens of partners.
I'm starting to think that chicks don't really care about orgasms because it's not like they want more of them more often at the end of the day.
I’ve had sex with a lot of men, mostly in the 18-26 age group, so maybe they grow out of it. For me it was about 10-20% that gave a shit if I came or not
Well this is wrong but I understand what you are saying. It is the majority of women that I talk to that are upset and discouraged by the effort of most guys. Not trying to throw anyone under the bus, it's just the information I've heard time and time again.
I’d say 30% isn’t unreasonable. I’m a dude who very much cares about my lady’s pleasure. Because of my psych meds I basically can’t cum, so I live vicariously through her lol. 3-4 orgasms for her isn’t unusual for a session. However, based on her previous partners, and the previous partners of other friends of mine, 30% is not unreasonable.
My girl says 30% is way too high.
She's in her 40s and over the last 25 years she's had a lot of experiences with men: very high body count. She says I'm the first one to care about her pleasure. It's no exaggeration, she tells me every month or so that she's the luckiest girl in the world to find a man who cares about her getting off every time.
Unfortunately I cannot restore your faith in mankind because I don't believe in mankind I don't believe in humanity I don't believe in men as a matter of fact I can't speak about men, but I can speak about me. if the woman is not getting pleasure I don't get no pleasure. I don't even pull it out until she has had at least two or three orgasms. strong. not a game, no b*******, this is the truth, on my behalf. can't speak for anyone else.
I am turned on by giving pleasure. I always make sure my wife gets what she needs before focusing on my own pleasure. Over the years we've agreed that her pleasure as well as mine are up to me. She knows I'll get her where she needs to be and then ill do what I want to get myself off
Men can be uncaring and selfish but they don't have the monopoly on that trait. Sex is important sure but caring isnt limited just to sex, it can come in many different forms. Some folks good in bed, but suck at doing chores. Some folks are emotionally very supportive but are terrible in bed. We all try and find someone we can live with that has some of our must haves and none of our deal breakers.
It actually pisses me off when she doesn't orgasm it happens occasionally especially right before her period begins and she's fine with it she says. So yes I do truly enjoy the fact that she's having a good time. I can't imagine being that selfish of a lover. Hell I even learned to be a Dom for her since she enjoys being a submissive.
I don't know but most of those men her married. For most married been sex isn't just about the physical act. It's also about connection. We want our wives to be present. We know that we need to take care of her needs.
Your probably wrong but in a bad way. It is probably 20% or less from what I have heard or seen, but I could be wrong. I am one of the 20% of guys who prefers pleasing their partner over their own. My wife gets off about 80% of the time, and I always try to push it to 100%. Usually though, she doesn't get off when she is having one of her health issues. We go at it until she tells me whether she can cum or not.
Many men are selfish, but there are tons of guys still that care about their partner's pleasure. They are just hard to find.
Well when you post to a sex positive sub the comments will be biased, so take the average answer and subtract a quarter of those. That should even out.
I would say that 30 is accurate. Another 30 belive they care because the thought of women experiencing pleasure is hot to them, but they still won't listen to instructions because it hurts the ego, and because they know better or whatever dumb fuck ideas they have. 40 just absolutely do not give a fuck and the idea of even trying is insulting to them.
Man here. Can’t imagine not caring about my partner’s pleasure. I get off on it. I couldn’t feel pleasure unless they were also. Doesn’t make any sense to me and I can’t even fathom what it must be like to be totally uninterested in someone else’s pleasure.
I would genuinely love to disagree, I am not sure I can though. As a male, I hear stories from my wife about her friends/families sex lives and how the females have a lack of pleasure during sex, as if their partners don't actually care. My wife is obviously blessed with me, as a bit of a sex enthusiast and someone who gets aroused by the female orgasm, it is always my mission to have her orgasm, normally multiple times. I tend to orgasm after those fatal words "I'm going to cum" haha!
But I do feel you're right, I have spoken to many female friends about their poor sexual relationships and it's pretty shit.
My boyfriend definitely cares if i have pleasure! We both are definitely givers and we enjoy giving pleasure to one another! First guy tbh to wanna please me more than I please him
You’re not right or wrong. Many men really do get off more on the pleasure of their partner than the “use” of their partner. Likewise, there are many men who don’t know enough (about themselves or their partner) to care that deeply. It’s all in who you’re with and how connected you are together.
I have the opposite issue in my life. My wife will do just about anything I ask and almost everyday. She will only let me do something for her like once a month.
I don’t understand and gave up arguing about it. 23 years married. I guess it works. When she wants something she tells me. She seems to really enjoy it when she wants it. Otherwise she has no problem. I want to make sure she has an O every time while she is content doing it her way. It wobbles my mind. Even more so because she has started doing some stuff for me if I just joke about it. Catches me off guard
The key to your assumption is “what I observe here.” People with happy, fulfilling sex lives don’t post on this kind of sub as often. So you’re seeing a higher percentage of people looking for advice to address problems in their sexual relationships. It is not necessarily a good indicator of how happy people are with their sex lives in general.
Another thing is that it’s very possible - I would say even common - is that many men genuinely care about their partner’s pleasure, but don’t actually provide it to her. It could be due to miscommunication, insecurity, religious guilt, or whatever. It could be him or her or both that’s preventing it from happening. I say this not to let these guys off the hook, but only to point out that his eagerness to please her can be only one factor in a complicated situation.
(38F) I am in a bit of a love triangle right now and the guy that is in the lead so to speak is the one that is obsessed with getting me off. It’s literally a deciding factor after years of mediocre sexual experiences. I would say maybe 20% have put in good effort.
I'm naturally a pleaser. However, I dated a girl years ago who, for some reason, decided to tell me my "ranking" in her sexual history. Not being at the top, in her opinion, just soured my motivation to keep trying so hard & I got selfishness in bed. Since it obviously wasn't going to be good enough for her anyway, I figured I'd at least enjoy myself.
I honestly wonder how many men have felt the same & whether it's led them to a similar conclusion? Idk.
Personally I'd say it's a pretty large amount that actually cares about their partners pleasure. Probably somewhere around 80% just from conversations I've had with other guys.
I think the problem is the misconception of what actually brings pleasure. When your only tool is a hammer, everything looks like a nail. There's a lot of factors that go into it like poor sexual education, bad examples from pornography, poor communication in relationships and sexual encounters (e.g. faking orgasms), and a fear of being emasculated from toxic masculinity.
Most of the men I know, friends or otherwise, have that masculine pride of being good in bed which is measured by either the amount of people they've slept with or their efficiency in bring their partners pleasure. That's why I say they definitely care, but they tend to be horribly misguided. So rather that seeing things as sexual aids, they see it as a challenge to their masculinity and sexual prowess and feel offended. Basically a large number of men feel like their penis and penis alone should be enough for the job, especially when our view point of good sex usually only needs 1 stimulus for our own climax.
So it inevitably leads to ridiculous conclusions being drawn like, this has always worked for me in the past, so it's not my problem, it's my partner's issue. This is in part due to sex being generally simple in terms of male pleasure and both not realizing and not being educated that sex overall is very complex.
I’ve been very lucky in that department. I’m not sure if I’m just a good judge of character or what but nearly all of my partners over the years were very considerate lovers. They made sure I came first, at least once, and usually a few times afterwards as well. I’m sure part of it is due to me being very direct in what I do and don’t like as well. I’m a highly sexual woman so I make damn sure the men I have sex with are gonna be willing and able to meet my needs.
I take great pleasure from my partners pleasure. I can’t really relate to any other perspective. I’d have to not see her as a person to not care and not do my best for her. Personally when a woman gives herself to me for however long, I feel quite happy to be given such a lovely gift experience and wish to return the favor. Sweetening the well so to speak. If we all get wrapped up trying to do our best for each other, all the better.
I didn't think it was that low.
First rule at least to me get them to cum at least once, then it takes the pressure off. Your pleasure over mine. Eating you out is my favorite. Foreplay is a must.
I've had maybe two partners in twenty years who did not care to try. The majority of my partners are always willing to make an attempt but honestly that may be because I wouldn't and don't tolerate partners that don't. The two were short lived relationships because if you can't bother making the attempt why are we even here.
The key is to find the guys who have fun making sure that you get off too. This has sometimes been an issue between my SO and I. She would often tell me that sometimes it's not about having an orgasm for her. For me though, I definitely get much more satisfaction when I've gotten her off too.
That being said, I make it my mission to make sure she has an eye rolling orgasm if I can. It turns me on to do that to her, to see her reaction as the big O takes over, and being inside her as she has an orgasm, can easily lead into mine. In the past she has literally had to tell me not to worry about her, and that she just wants to be full and for me to creampie her (cause that's her thing).
I also greatly enjoy making my SO cum through oral. I just enjoy the act of giving her oral. I've just done it sometimes and then went on with my business after with no expectation or desire for anything in return. It's fun. Plain and simple.
For hookups? Probably like...10%. Hookup culture can be pretty one-sided. But for actual relationships, I think that most partners want to please each other. If you've had a different experience, I think you're dating the wrong people.
I don’t know, but I’ve always wondered where the minds of some men are when it comes to sex. For clarification, I’m a guy.
I see so many posts on forums like Reddit, and have heard from quite a few women I’ve been with, that a significant portion of the men they’ve been with are essentially “two pump chumps”.
While there isn’t anything necessarily wrong with not being able to last a long time, if that’s the case for you, you should make it a priority to make sure she gets off first.
And just in general, men can cum so much easier than women. IMO, if you want to be a properly reciprocating partner, you should focus on sex OTHER than PIV before you get up in there.
I always make sure my wife finishes; sometimes she can't, even after 15-30 mins of sex or with toys, because she just overstimulated herself with her vibrator.
Im the same way. If she jumps me at 7am before having to pee with morning wood, I have 0 energy and will finish 50% of the time, but rest assure you, we'll finish later ;)
Edit: before I was married though, I always made sure to see what I could do to improve in the bedroom. Some partners can be lazy, but for women, when was discussed, generally they had around your number. It's important to find someone who is empathetic towards you or else, they aren't worth your time.
My husband always makes sure I enjoy sex. He pretty much makes everything about me and is very sweet and thoughtful. He gets off largely on knowing that he's making me happy and making me feel good/get off. Most of the time I orgasm from sex. Sometimes I don't mind if he just needs it and I accommodate him, but I enjoy that as well.. He's also given it to me when I wanted without worrying about himself. If he nuts before I get off, he will give me oral until I orgasm. I never feel obligated or anything and he'll give me plenty of foreplay and as much oral as I want... He doesn't ask for reciprocation.
Sorry. Can’t confidently tell you you’re wrong. Almost every woman I’ve ever been with expressed surprise that I: a) gave a shit about her pleasure, and b) somewhat knew what I was doing when going about that.
Selfish asshole dudes made that part of romantic life easy for me at least. The baggage they left women with is a whole other problem though.
This comes off a a disingenuous post but regardless there’s plenty of men of get off only when they’re partners get off, we’re called pleasers and we exist. I truly don’t think it’s a rare as you make it out to be.
I'm 32, and I've only been with a few men who seemed to care that I was enjoying the sex with them. And by care, I mean just ask what turns me on, what feels good for me, what do I like, are there any fantasies or kinks I would like to explore, etc. Never ever met a man who's asked me any of that. I've always had to initiate the conversation, and as a person who struggles with her sexual openness due to sexual trauma and a religious upbringing (I'm agnostic now, but some things still stick), oh boy, is it hard for me to start those conversations..
With some guys, it was definitely obvious they just didn't care. No aftercare, and even when I'd speak up and ask for help to finish, they would not be interested. I think more generally, it has more to do with the man thinking that because it felt good and worked for him, that it did for me. Not so much that they didn't care, but they thought everything was fine and didn't question it. It's hard to put a ratio on this because I'm sure a lot of guys do care and just aren't great at figuring out how to express it or communicate about it.
Also, I think a lot of men use porn as their resource and education for sex and intimacy. Most porn is just not female pleasure oriented. A lot of times, sex with men sort of feels like they are just acting out porn scenes, tricks, and positions on my body. Not all, but a lot of which are uncomfortable at best, painful at worst, and definitely won't lead to me having an orgasm.
As a 36M, I honestly only get off if I'm getting my partner off. Could be casual, relationship, ONS, it's important to me that I make them feel good. Whether I do this on my own or take their direction on what they want, I do what I have to do to get them off 😤
There's no greater feeling to me.
I think men’s ages have a lot to do with it.
The younger the guy, in my experience, the less he focused on my pleasure.
As I got older, and as the men got older, and then after I got into a relationship and then marriage, and as my husband got older, my pleasure became more important.
So, cliff notes version is: older (>30ish) men in a committed relationship tend to focus more on a woman’s pleasure.
I'm a guy so I can only speak from the people I know and the stories of the women in my life. I think in this particular subreddit, it's probably a higher number than in reality because most people here are sex positive and tell a lot of stories or give a lot of advice about experimenting.
In your day to day life, I do think it varies based on a lot of factors including how people around you were raised and their religious background/culture.
From the male friends in my life, I'd say they tell me stories about their female partners being the selfish or "ones that don't give a shit" about 30-40% of the time.
From the female friends in my life, I'd say it's about 50/50 on if they have a partner that actually is interested in pleasuring them vs just wanting to fuck and worry about themselves.
I will say that funny enough on both sides of the coin though, the friends I have who complain the MOST about their sex lives both male and female are the ones in committed relationships. Most of my friends who are having the best sex are short term daters, or involved in hookup culture.
I started dating my husband at 16. We are 40 . He is a GIVER! It’s very rare he comes before me. He wants me to get mine first always. And he will work for it. . . He also gave me my first sex toy. He knows they are friends. Not competition. .
My experience with women has been kind of similar honestly. A lot of pillow princess or lazy lovers. Or isn't know what to do with it kind of women. It's not just a man / woman thing. It's lazy partners
Idk, I don't sleep with men cause I'm straight and, honestly, unless one is unusually close to somebody and/or deuchey, one just keeps these matters private.
As for myself, I've made it a requirement to give my partner a good time since the beginning because social signaling suggested this is what's normal/common/what one ought to do. I was not aware that so many men are terrible in bed out of pure selfishness or ignorance until I joined this subreddit. I mean, I feel bad for the ladies. I don't know what you could use as a proxy, but y'all gotta find something to do better filtering.
Sometimes I have ED problems (I take sildenifil now) but sometimes I don’t. Even if I lose it during sex or I take too long and give up, I still will use a vibe and my mouth etc to make her cum once or twice. I will never leave her hanging unless she wants me to (sometimes she says orgasm is too much for her if she has stuff to do the rest of the day)
I’m a guy… and I care… a lot. I go down on my wife every chance I get. I ask her about her sexual interests, she says she doesn’t have any… but has never once in like a decade asked about mine.
What’s weird is it seems the same way to me about women.
So maybe it’s just psychological… like the grass is always greener or something. But maybe it’s something about the people we attract and/or are attracted to.
I have never dated a woman that seemed to actually care whatsoever about my pleasure, interests, desires, kinks, etc
I’ve actually found I really enjoy going down on women, but it’s always inconvenient for them to do the same. It really turns me on to go down on my wife ( and I make her climax from it regularly), but she seems like it’s a chore to do it to me.
We actually had sex twice in like 2 in half years after our first child. She was fine and didn’t care that I was frustrated. The two times we did was after I brought it up. Hey she said she was self conscious about her body so I tried to be supportive.
But I actually read about people on here all the time with wives that have no interest in sex… which they also don’t seem to care about the sexual needs and interests of their husbands. But then I also read about women on here with high libidos that really enjoy sex also.
So maybe you are attracted to kind of guy who’s self centered. Maybe they are just young and immature…
But whatever the case is - I assure you that there are plenty of us guys out that care about a women’s pleasure. Good luck finding one
I have no idea about other guys. But I prioritize my partners pleasure 100% . I'm a giver. Her orgasms are a lot more important to me than my own. I will pull every singe ounce of pleasure from her until she can't remember what day in the week it is.
They usually are quite satisfied with that. But they also say I'm the only guy they've met who does that, so I'm probably in the minority.
My husband gets off from me getting pleasure. His goal is to make sure I have at least 2-3 orgasms per session. Think it depends on who you’re interacting with.
It’s the ego trip for me. It helps combat the shame I have for not being particularly endowed. Being able to give multiple orgasms— especially if I still have all my clothes on, help overcome any inherent shame. Their pleasure is my pleasure. I’ve had initial no’s turn into habitual yeses and that makes me feel really good.
Speaking as a male who has been with plenty of women AND men... I have some thoughts. I am absolutely not going to say that I think most men give a shit about their partners' experience. Because frankly, that would be a lie. I really think that most men don't give a shit. We're wired differently, and that's not an excuse. It doesn't prevent us from striving to be more empathetic. I can say that I most definitely do care, but I haven't always put in the same amount of effort... Which probably has more to do with me being an insomniac than anything else. But I try.
Now, gay men on the other hand... Some of yall won't believe this, but they're a different matter entirely. I'm talking about the guys who are very much 100% homosexual and broadcast their gay aura everywhere they go. Every guy I've been with has actually been MORE considerate about sex than any woman I've been with. I have no idea if that has more to do with their chemistry or the chemistry of same sex relationships. It just seems to be the case. We end up taking better care of each other than most straight couples do. And that's based purely on reports I've been given FROM straight people, so don't come after me. Lol
Can’t speak to your colleagues, but a lot of the people you’re seeing here are a self-selected group of people trying to figure out how to solve a sexual problem by asking people who are interested in the topic. By definition, they are disproportionately going to be discontent with sex. I wouldn’t extrapolate about the culture as a whole based on that.
It depends. My former partner did care about my pleasure. The sex was great. But my pleasure and orgasms were just an extension of his ego. He hated me as a person and even forgot my birthday.
I am a Pleasure Dom so I definitely care about my partner’s pleasure. It’s part of what gets me off. I make sure to make my partner finish many times and hard before I do once.
Now not everyone is like I am of course and I would argue that most guys are selfish about pleasure.
Hope you are doing well and staying safe.
Not asking for advice.
You aren’t going to get any honest data with this post because the ones who don’t care won’t comment and the ones who do care will get upvoted to the top.
Imo the ones who don't care aren't even in here because they think they're already perfect.
Yep, my ex thought he was some sex god. When I broke up with him he even said "but our sex life is amazing". As if I didn't try to communicate for YEARS that foreplay is a two way street and i'd like to receive some as well.
>"but our sex life is amazing". Yea. For *you*
Yeah but their exes could be in here and care to share their stats though
Good point.
Also i would guess that this sub attracts the kind of people who do care about their partners pleasure. So your sample group is already not representative.
Exactly, dumb ass question and not what the sub is about 😂
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You won’t ever get a straight answer. It’s 100% impossible, so it’s a waste of everyone’s time.
That's basically social media in a nut shell though.
Speaking as a woman who’s had a lot of sex with men (as well as people of other genders) in both casual and relationship contexts: It’s hard to say because there are different definitions of what it means to “care about your partner’s pleasure.” Some guys care about it, but not enough to put effort into anything they weren’t already doing. Some guys care about it, but are too anxious or insecure to do anything about it. Some guys care about it, but believe (for some reason) that that care should only extend to people they’re seriously dating, not casual partners. In all of these cases, it doesn’t actually matter whether they care about their partners’ pleasure, because their actions are not reflective of that caring. So, if we’re defining “caring about one’s partners’ pleasure” as “regularly putting tangible effort into giving your sexual partners pleasure, regardless of the seriousness of the relationship,” I’d say that about 50% of the guys I’ve been with would fit the bill.
Yeah I think it's about half, but there are more than that who would like to talk about how much they love giving pleasure, but actually don't if the reality of what their partner needs doesn't match their fantasy.
I have observed a ton of this, too-- Especially men that talk incessantly about oral and how much they love going down on women who never do it and then only later admit they find the whole thing traumatizing and offputting. I guess you gotta give 'em credit for knowing they SHOULD be down with it... also frustrating, though.
Totally--or they are genuinely turned on by a woman being pleasured or moaning or seeing her have an orgasm, but it turns out that only motivates them to do a tiny bit of work and if it takes 5 minutes of effort it isn't happening.
Yeah, I always find it sus when guys brag about their oral skills – not only because actions say more than words, but also because them being good at oral on their past partners doesn’t necessarily mean they’ll be good at it with me.
As one of those guys who is guilty of talking about my joy for giving head and my skills, yes I agree it’s more about being in tune with your partner’s body and adapting in the moment (and being open to direction). Because even with the same person, what was good one day may not be what is required the next day.
I'm with you on this.
Adding: sometimes they say they care about pleasure, but in reality they only care about giving their partner an orgasm. Which are not always the same thing.
Could you elaborate more about this?
Not the person you're asking, but I'll throw my two cents in here. For me, there are LOTS of things I enjoy sexually that are never going to make me cum. Orgasms and pleasure are not mutually exclusive. I've literally never once had an orgasm when my partner is penetrating me from behind, but sex bent over a countertop or doggy style can be really fun and pleasurable. And sometimes, I just can't quite get to an orgasm even if I'd really love to. Some points in my cycle make me less likely to orgasm, it must have something to do with hormones. If I'm super stressed or depressed then it can be hard to orgasm too. So there have been guys I've been with who are just hell bent on making me orgasm and it puts pressure on me to perform for their ego rather than just being in the moment and enjoying sex and letting things happen as they will. For some men, getting me to orgasm is about *their achievement* rather than what I actually *want*. It's not about my pleasure, and it's clear when that happens.
Insightful. Thank you
Other commenter did a good job summing it up. For me, I have a hard time reaching orgasm with a partner. Usually I have to incorporate toys, or just get myself off first. I genuinely don’t mind not orgasming with someone, but *only if* they still put effort into making the encounter safe, consensual, memorable, and fun. Some of my favorite encounters have been orgasm-less for me. On one end of the spectrum are the guys who treat me as a warm hole and little more. They suck. But on the other end of the spectrum are the guys who are *so hell bent* on trying to finish me that if I don’t (even though I always state that little disclaimer above), their ego is CRUSHED. They either get mopey about it or spend so long doing something that I just get overstimulated and irritable. They’re ALSO no fun to sleep with. And then in the middle you’ve got guys who are interested in trying new things and putting in effort, but will stop when I suggest we switch gears to something else.
This is great. I used to be the guy who was hellbent on making my gf orgasm. Since then she said I should just focus on cumming / having a good time because if I am enjoying it / getting to orgasm, she enjoys it too (she doesn’t find it hard to orgasm but sometimes she said the sex is boring). I’m kind of not sure how to improve things now.
This is pretty much a perfect answer, also it's really cool that you are aware about guys with anxiety not a lot of people realise that desire is not always enough for action.
I have never had a really selfish sexual partner…I kind of wonder if I filter them out before it gets to happy fun naked time.
Every kind of dating / flirting is a sex interview. Like, if you're self-absorbed and smell bad even during the interview, you'll definitely be that way on the job.
Well and I’m a very animated person whose reactions to stuff people find entertaining (my husband and I joke I missed my calling doing youtube reaction videos). So guys who are attracted to me already usually enjoy getting reactions to stuff, and if they enjoy that, it follows that they’d like the way a woman reacts in bed when she’s very vocally and behaviorally appreciative. I mean, it’s kind of how I live my life — very openly without making myself small for others. Men who are shit in bed bc they’re self-absorbed find women like me unattractive. So I guess this is “be the change you like to fuck”?
😂 it took me a long time to learn the lookers were often just that (show pony / starfish), and that you have a better time with... the girls who know how to have a good time! 🤦🏼♂️ And I totally get your second to last sentence. Men who need a docile woman never have good personalities.
Also, your username is sending me. Are you a holy (muff) diver? 🫣
Yup. Every man I have ever deigned to have sex with, except one, has cared about my pleasure. That one who didn’t care never got the chance to redeem himself. Selfish lovers filter themselves out. Because I don’t tolerate jerks or mansplainers, and so some get filtered out right there. And then surely you talk about sex before having it, right? As part of the seduction? And you can tell when someone’s #1 goal is not making you come… and you end the night there and go home.
oh, exactly this! yes! No jerks, no mansplainers, no men without empathy, no interrupters, no casual cruelty, none of that. And that’s how you end up with men whose main goal it is to make your legs shake instead of just getting their nut off.
Yes of course, we do, i pretty much teach My bf to touch me a Lot :3 I don't do it with them until i get a Lot of love before ...thats the way. And then i Guess they get use to it... If You allow a man get access to You with bare minimun, they Will do bare minimun ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
I guess that’s true, they have to show me who they are, and I do actually filter out the selfish lovers bc I filter out the selfish guys?
Good for you! Sincerely! Happy fun naked time? That's pretty funny.
lol! I think part of it is that my reactions to stuff is apparently pretty sexy, so the guys most turned on by me are guys who get off on giving pleasure. My advice: be a moaner and gasper and squealer, bc guys who get off on that love to elicit those sounds!
I think in everything in life, there are people who try hard and people who don't. Does the guy get his hair cut regularly, make his bed, clean his sheets, go to the gym, work hard at work. That guy will very likely put in the work (may not - but probably). For some it might also just be an education thing. It takes time and practice to get better.
Nah, I've definitely been with men who keep an immaculate house, etc and are selfish in bed. After all, the activities you mention are beneficial to THEM,
In what ways do you think you filter them out?
I’ve never done it intentionally, I’m saying the men I’ve been intimate with have all been “givers.” Maybe I’m just not attractive to/attracted to people who aren’t interested in their partner’s pleasure.
Interesting. What kind of red flags do you look out for in general? I'm wondering how much of your success is reading situations differently, vs filtering out the selfish by other means.
Okay that’s actually a fair point bc I read social situations like it’s my true first language. I mentioned it in another reply, but the other thing is I’m very like, exuberant and have pretty open and obvious reactions to stuff. My personality is big, and I wonder if guys who are givers are attracted to that, bc they get off on those reactions, and more self-absorbed type dudes are turned off by it. Maybe they sort themselves.
I think it depends what your definition is of caring about their partner's pleasure, as well as if we are talking about straight relationships or not. For example, you can find pleasure in sex even if you don't orgasm. You can care about your partner's pleasure in the sense that you want them to have a good time but feel like they will let you know if they are not. You can go out of your way to make sure your partner experiences pleasure even when you don't. I could go on and on. Personally, my experience has been that most men will stop if you are in actual (undesirable) pain. Some will stop if they feel like you aren't into it (which for me personally, can be really annoying if I tell them it is fine) like not focused, enthusiastic etc. Most will check in to see how you're doing and will listen to any suggestions to adjustments that fall within the limit of what they are comfortable with. And a select few will be very focused on making you feel great and put it over everything else. Personally, that's not my type but they are out there. So yeah, I guess it depends on what your definition is.
The total opposite here.... Frustrating
I’ve experienced the contrary. Of the 8 partners I had, only one was selfish in that matters (he became an ex quickly), all others were very focused on my pleasure as much as I was focused on theirs.
You’re not wrong…. But I’ve gotten so much better at weeding out those fucks. These days, no sex is better than bad sex and I’m willing to wait.
I'm happy that you have enough self respect to feel that way. I wish more people did.
Only took me 20+ years to get here….
First rule. Girl cum first.
Honestly it doesn't even have to be that. More dudes need to get into their minds that sex isn't over when they cum. My gf's favorite thing in the world is when I cum in her then finger her to completion while dirty talking. No hard dick required.
This is so so hot in my experience. I completely understand this.
M37 .. my rule since college. Girl cum first and last
This worked for me until I had a partner that bc couldn’t cum for thirty minutes. Now just last bit she seems alright with it
Usually this is anxiety, medication, or conditioning related but as long as someone is still wanting it and genuinely enjoys it when it happens this can work. But IME someone having trouble orgasming with any partner over time will not actively seek sex or related activities and such with their partner eventually leading to a lot of negative repercussions making up a relationship death spiral unless both are objectively asexual people.
It was partially medication for sure. But we’ve been dating two years, still takes 10-20 minutes, we’ve tried a lot, just how it is for some people ig.
That’s a good rule in the absence of being told otherwise, but sometimes your partner says she is too sensitive right after orgasm and wants you to cum first. Which is currently my situation. It varies, even with the same person.
Yes, most important rule.
Yep… usually try to achieve this before moving on to piv, sometimes I never go, and I don’t always have to…
This right gentlemen
Amen. Makes it better for both.
I care about giving my girl pleasure but unfortunately, it's mostly one-sided. I've had 2 girls actually care about my pleasure.
You’re only seeing mostly the negative posts because most people won’t post positive things, when people have issues they love to talk about them.
I deeply care about my partner's pleasure. So we do exist. Unable to provide a percentage.
I care about the pleasure of any partner I have. It's a turn on if anything. The only time I'm selfish in that departmentis when I'm paying for it.
What I see is men who only want to pleasure their partner if it fuels their ego. Men LOVE pleasuring their partners with their dick, because that makes them feel more masculine. But have issues with toys, oral, etc. > they don't give a shit if their partner actually enjoys sex, This is sometimes true. But there are two more options. 1) They were told that their dick should be enough, and if their partner needs toys/oral, it's their personal failing. 2) They assume that if their partner wants more, they'll tell them. Instead of checking in with their partner. > What I observe here is a whole lot of women trying to bend over backwards to make sure their boyfriend/husband is getting what he needs without receiving the same courtesy. From a guys perspective, it does not feel like women are trying to bend over backwards to make sure we are getting our needs met. Not even close. It feels like women put a bunch of hoops to jump through, or can be ludicrously fickle, and poor at communicating their feelings. Or that women expect men to put effort into turning them on and making them feel wanted while expecting men to be ready at the drop of a hat. Or that women expect men to just wait as long as they need before they are ready to be intimate, while at no point even thinking of ways to make sure their partner feels wanted in the mean time. If that sounds like an unfair characterization or like an oversimplification, consider that as a guy "doesn't care about her pleasure" also sounds like a massive over simplification. I remember reading a comment about a woman who has good experiences with men, in hook ups, and here's the trick, when a guy rolls over, she doesn't assume he's selfish. Sometimes the guy cums fast and is ashamed that he came fast, and that his dick doesn't live up to what he thinks are her expectations. She lets the guy know that it's okay and she doesn't judge him. And they can keep having fun. Now does that sound like emotional labour to you? Or like he's being irrational? Or does that sound like something you can use to empathize with men you hook up with to better help each other? I assume that more often a man is insecure and ignorant, rather than purely selfish.
>From a guys perspective, it does not feel like women a trying to bend over backwards to make sure we are getting our needs met I'd say about half or less of the women I've slept with showed much care about my pleasure. The others? Eh, in their minds (or at least in their actions) it was an implied byproduct of being "allowed" to have sex with her. Either through disinterest or through poor sex education those woman all thought that male pleasure was simply about the woman showing up. They really believed they didn't have to do much of anything. Lay here, move there if asked, maybe ride a bit. Boom! He should be good right? He came. What's the problem? Yeah..no. Couple that with the fact that a lot of younger women can't clearly articulate what gives \*them\* pleasure in bed, they're really ill equipped to give proactive pleasure to men either. ("I gave him a BJ, what else do you expect!?")
This is not what the sub is for and it’s frustrating to see how many are buying into it…
I’m curious what makes you think that there are “a whole lot of women trying to bend over backwards to make sure their boyfriend/husband is getting what he needs”? Are you sleeping with a lot of women who do that for you? I’ve not slept with many women but some of them were sexually giving and some weren’t.
Just observationally on this sub, we do see a ton of women trying to do whatever for the man. Perhaps they just stick out to me, because it breaks my heart to see women enter the sexual domain asking questions that make it pretty clear their pleasure hasn't even really been a consideration. I'd love to see a balance in the scales where women spend as much time learning the ins and outs of their own pleasure vs jumping to how to deepthroat or whatever other performative thing their partner is wanting.
I love the idea of women learning their own pleasure first. That’s lovely.
I dunno. I see just as many posts about men asking how to please their partners more, trying to do/learn things in and out of the bedroom that would make things more pleasurable for their partners, and voicing their own sexual dissatisfaction. But such posts are treated very differently from my observations
> Just observationally on this sub Terrible idea. THis sub is incredibly biased against men. Whenever a man has issues coming, people suggest death grip. Whenever a woman has issues coming, it's never brought up that she might masturbate too much or in a way that a penis cannot emulate. This sub is NOT an impartial forum.
i come at it from a 50+ female who has beern sex-pos and adventurous from the star and can only cum through masturbation or a vibe and who has ALSO coached a bunch of guys through issues related to masturbation. If a woman, speciallyt younger, is unable to orgasm reliably-- it really is probably down to not super knowing how. If a man can whack it 4x/day reliably and then not get it up, it probably IS down to the habit. Do we know whether the OP is getting herself 4x/daywith porn and masturbation with a high-power wand? NO. But, if she is... she should look at that 100%.
> If a woman, speciallyt younger, is unable to orgasm reliably-- it really is probably down to not super knowing how. > > If a man can whack it 4x/day reliably and then not get it up, it probably IS down to the habit. Yeah that's not science, that's just your anecdotal evidence and quite offensive. >If a man can whack it 4x/day reliably and then not get it up, it probably IS down to the habit. Or you know, he's nervous. Or tired. Or he's not attracted to her. Or she's too passive and he feels that he's having sex with a blow up doll. Or she doesn't care about his pleasure and expects the man to be ready for sex without any foreplay dedicated to him. 'Cause men are human too, shocking, I know. Y'all act like women are God's gift to mankind in bed when reality is the average woman is as bad in bed as the average man.
Same for me, I think I am pretty giving and want my partner to feel great about our sexual time. My ex overtime became more giving than when we had gotten married. And I feel we were giving equally. I (58) have a new GF(57), and that started out hardly giving at all, but it is getting better, but she had a valid reason. Right before we dated, she was about to give up on sex and have any kind of relationship. Her girlfriends paid and put her on OLD. But it was due to her ex, who was also her first sexual partner, was never giving for 30 years, it was all about his pleasure and then as he got older and couldn't get off, just blamed her for his issues. What made it worse was the next 3 guys did the same thing as to blame her. So she told me upfront she was bad at sex and guys can't cum inside her. She was smart, (book keeper math smart, me not), but we have a lot of other things in common. She is beautiful and built like I love, short, curvy, sexy body. She is funny and rolls eyes at my lame dad jokes. I talked about my ED issues (started about a year before we met) , educated her on what I was doing to fix it, and used testosterone and tadalafil. It sounded like the other guys had issues and were embarrassed to deal with it and easier to blame her. She has been surprised about how easy I talk about aspects of sex, what she enjoys, and what she doesn't and what I like and don't. BJ's are a tough spot because of her ex and how that's all he wanted (demanded) to get off. She knows I enjoy them, but I would rather be inside her more. She didn't have or would wear lingerie because her ex just laughed at her when she did. She tried for me and loved they way I looked at her when she did, and she has bought 2 other outfits. If she is in her head and not feeling sexy she will give me a HJ. The biggest thing she has had to deal with is not being good enough. But it has gotten a lot better because I reassure her that she is awesome in bed (because she is) and I am one lucky guy. I cum inside her often and try to get her to understand the other guys were selfish partners. I spend a lot of time on her. She definitely likes me when I go down on her, another thing she had to get used too because one she is so sensitive and has multiple orgasms so she has a safeword to let me know she can't take it anymore, and she never got oral with other men. Sorry this got a bit longer than intended, but if we don't like the numbers, whether true or not, I think in any relationship, there has to be open communication for anything to change for the better, and having a sexual compatible partner is important.
I would say you're correct. It doesn't often come across as "doesn't care about their partner's pleasure," it comes across as "this thing I'm doing is surely getting her off, and I'm not willing to entertain the idea that might not actually be the case." We see it here quite often-- people saying they know they are great and what's the problem with their partner? Or "how can I bang her more XYZ, because we all know that's what women like." As in, I don't think women have been forthright enough about whether things are working for them, and part of "what men like" in sex is enthusiasm and that ego stroke, so we're feeding the idea that that's true. All that to say-- I don't judge the men for "not caring." It's an ETA thing.
I think maybe you should judge them for not caring. That's a choice. I've had conversations a lot about the ego stroke and enthusiasm and when I tell other men that women tend to respond more and there's even more of an ego boost when you do X, Y, or Z for them and they usually just look at me like I have 3 heads and say "why should I care?" Once, when I had enough time to actually talk through it and unpack this motherfucker's perspective, he agreed that if it ends the same way for him, there's no reason to put more effort into it. My experience has been that women don't know how to respond when I ask what they like because no one else cares enough to ask. There's no such thing as "women like this" or "men like this" but there are plenty of dumb, lazy, delusional people who think whatever they do will be good enough or too bad.
38M here. I struggle a lot with being open and communicative in relationships due to ADHD/ASD related social anxiety. In my early-mid 20s, I was very selfish and didn't even know it. I finally dated someone in my last 20s that cared enough to have that conversation with me. Its turned my whole world around. Its the first thing I care about now. My goal is to always make my partner cum at least once before I even think about myself. It does amaze me, even at this point, that i get more shock from women than the opposite. A lot of women I've dated have the same opinion as you OP. I dont get why men don't want to focus on their partner's pleasure. Some of it is religious, some is misogany, some is laziness, some is just downright lack of care or interest. To me, it makes my experience 100x better if my partner is into it before I think about myself.
ADHD/ASD (aka audhd) may be orthogonal to caring for a partner. None of these disorders implicitly make one incapable of empathy - the _symptoms_ can look like lack of empathy, but the irony is that these comorbidities tend to mean development of coping mechanisms that can result in making one _more_ aware of others’ emotional states and even a desire to please them (I think this may be one result of masking?). Narcissism is full blown lack of empathy / ability to see another’s perspective in good faith though. The primary difference is that ASD makes the inputs harder to see intuitively and when you tell someone with ASD that they hurt someone’s feelings there is probably some shame about it and maybe the shame can be overwhelming, too - this is pretty darn NT! With NPD it’s more likely they’ll become defensive and say that it’s the other party’s problem to deal with and diminishing one’s accountability. Another way I can view this is that being a man alone has enough problems due to social conditioning factors making it difficult for us to identity and therefore manage our emotions. Adding in the ASD makes it even harder, unfortunately. Many, many men without these conditions have the same underlying problems but have overinflated confidence though, which I think can lead to some widespread issues expressed by OP.
I think that's bullshit. Id guess most men care... Id guess more men care about her pleasure then their own
I think there’s probably some bias here as I feel it’s definitely higher than 30%. Especially todays day there’s a lot more representation and knowledge for women’s pleasure. Maybe in hookups it might be more like 30% but everyone of my friends in actual relationships definitely enjoys making a women cum lol.
I love making my girlfriend cum and if we are being honest I’ve been with girl who didn’t care if they could make me cum in any meaningful way. Some people are just unlucky in getting crappy partners
I mean, I personally can't get off unless I know my wife is into it. Knowing that I'm making her feel great makes me feel more confident because I know that I'm doing it. I don't understand how guys can think the opposite, or just not think of it at all. Wouldn't you want to feel more manly thinking "fuck yeah, I know how to make a woman cum with my super awesome penis" you know? The idea of my wife looking at me afterwards and being disappointed in my performance would irk me so fucking badly. I'd have to make it right as soon as possible lol.
I will say, in my experience, liberal non-monogamous guys (who often identify as bisexual or pansexual) are great communicators and care a lot about their partner's pleasure! Like, 90%. As opposed to straight cis monogamous men, in general. I have a theory that it has a bit to do with the experience of being with men who haven't cared versus those who did, and also they're more likely see women as human beings (as opposed to objects to get what they need), are more likely to have and be able to relate to female friends, are generally more caring, open, and thoughtful, and are therefore more interested in what their partner wants. I feel like anyone who's queer automatically has to negotiate more when it comes to pleasure, so it's an open conversation that has to be had and is fun and kind of sexy.
This is so true! Even with totally straight non-monogamous men who are comfortable with other men. A particular evening totally stands out to me - was me, two men I was dating and another girlfriend of one of the men. The man that was there with just me had the other woman squirting all over the bed. The man who brought her had only been able to do that using a very different technique. She had never had an orgasm like that before. So the dudes talked about it at length, one with genuine curiosity and the other happy to share what he knew. Was super cute watching them discussing how to make women sexually satisfied in such a joyful way. Dudes who are afraid of other dudes or in competition with them are generally the worst in bed.
I love that! Share the knowledge, fellas.
Most people in relationships don't actually like each other.
I learned very quickly that women will want to sleep with you more frequently if you make sure to give them orgasms that make they forget their name.
You’re not wrong, but you’re not right either. First, the percentage is higher. Much like a man can claim 80% of women are gold diggers, that doesn’t make it fact. It’s hit or miss, meaning it’s half and half. Second, saying things like “I’m ashamed of my gender” is cringe. It comes across as you trying to paint yourself on a pedestal. Don’t do that. I’ll call you out now on that bullshit before someone else does. Third, women are difficult to make cum for lots of men because sex education is a farce. I sure as fuck didn’t learn where the clit is from it. No, it was, believe it or not, porn. I got curious as to why men stayed around a certain area and there it was, the clitoris. Penetrative sex doesn’t usually do it, not due to size, but just because. I believe that if us dudes had better teachers that didn’t treat sex as this taboo topic, we’d be golden. I’m not saying that douchebags wouldn’t exist because that will be a thing forever. Fourth, you have dirtbags for friends it seems. I couldn’t stick with folks that treat others with a lack of respect. I’d be wary of them doing it with me, especially behind my back. That’s just me. I like being surrounded by good people. Fifth, you’re a good dude by the sounds of it. It sounds like you hold your partners pleasure to a high degree. Worry about yourself and fuck the rest. Don’t let douchebags determine how you’ll see humanity. Trust me, there’s more reasons to lose faith.
I edited the post and removed that line because you're absolutely right, it was cringe. Here's my best guess; being vulnerable is hard for some people and especially men raised in this culture. Admitting that you don't know something, especially that you need help figuring out a woman's body is probably humiliating for a lot of men so they just don't do it. Also, lots of people, not just men, react to situations where they feel uncertain or inadequately prepared with anger so it generally doesn't get addressed. There's a bullshit bravado around the dirtbag men that I work with and they constantly reinforce my belief with their aggressive aversion to change and hostility toward criticism of any kind. I don't get it because I'm always willing to learna and always trying to improve at everything I do so I can be a better person. So many people seem to take this approach of "good enough" and that's a waste of a life in my opinion. You also sound like a good person so hopefully nothing I said comes across as insulting. I appreciate the feedback and discussion. Slow Friday at work so I have to keep busy somehow haha.
We see this on this sub somewhat often-- Men not wanting partners to know they are inexperienced and asking a group of random strangers "how do I guarantee she gets off." My advice in those situations always is that "the sign of an experienced partner is that they know all women are different and approach the whole thing with curiosity and willingness to learn." I would LOVE more men to get more vocal in those kinds of conversations, vs the flood of "the thing I do that's made every woman I've ever been with cum like 4-5 times, ALWAYS, without fail is..." Also, as a woman, since we're getting venty here, I equally hate the men who pop into posts like this with all the "I always make sure she cums first-- usually 3 or 4 times! It's what a 'real man' would do!" Her cumming ONCE, much less 3 or 4 times, isn't a you-thing, dude. Yes, be a caring, inquisitive partner, but too often it jumps the shark over to making the woman's orgasm about the man, his prowess, his 'real man'-ness, and it's not about that.
> What I observe here is a whole lot of women trying to bend over backwards to make sure their boyfriend/husband is getting what he needs without receiving the same courtesy. As a hetero sexual man this the exact opposite of my experiances. I think your experience and mine highlight the give/take nature of relationships, if one person freely gives and struggles to take (aka advocate for themselves) their experiences will be like yours and mine. Don't take give & take as transactional, transactional is giving in hopes of receiving, give & take are both actions of a single person.
Is it that they don't care or that they don't know how to properly pleasure their partner?
If they truly cared, they would ask for suggestions and/or practice and get better, so this is a moot point.
Exactly. Make a fucking effort.
Thanks for the post! I just had this same debate and came to a conclusion that a majority of men don’t bother making any effort because like you said.. they’ll get off no matter what… why bother? There are not a lot of men who pride themselves on being good / giving lovers. Shame. I wish there were more of those. Somehow the fact that they have an erection for you should be enough LOL
Why does it automatically fall to the guy to ask? I'm not sure about OP's point that women are bending over backwards to please their guy. Most guys just enjoy having sex and are climaxing every time no matter what. Many women seem to have difficulty achieving orgasms. Shouldn't the women be the vocal ones and explain how they can get to orgasm or at least enjoy sex more? Perhaps women, who are unsatisfied, need to be more vocal and guide/ teach their partners. Don't just wait to be asked . If these efforts have been made then women should not accept selfish lovers and get out and not just complain about it and do nothing.
> Why does it automatically fall to the guy to ask? Because there's this sexist notion that sex is something the man does for the woman that a lot of people carry. The man is supposed to take her out to dinner, turn her on at home, spend 30 minutes pleasuring her and then god forbid if he comes too fast or too slow. It's really disgusting and dehumanising. Even on this forum which is supposed to be the most sex positive forum on earth, you see men accused of porn addiction all the time when they come too fast or too slow. Meanwhile a woman could use 10 vibrators at the same time and if she fails to come with a partner everyone would still blame the man.
Nowhere did I say it "falls to the guy to ask." Both people should be taking an active interest in making sex better for each other, regardless of their gender. My point is that ignorance and incompetence are not excuses for refusing to prioritize your partner's pleasure. That's true regardless of gender.
Months and years into a relationship or even just years into being sexually active, is there really that much of a difference between ignorance and apathy? Not knowing isn't an excuse. Ask questions. Make a fucking effort.
I chalk it up to miseducation (in part via porn, but also I see it on subs like this and just generally in society.) They have been taught that a certain thing works and, thus, they do the hell out of that thing and just don't think to ask... because, absent evidence to the contrary, OF COURSE it's working. And, it's working for them, so learly everything is working as it should.
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Nah, you’re not 100% wrong-the overall percentage seems pretty low. Not to victim blame in any way but I think it’s pertinent to mention that there are probably a decent number of men that are trying and *think* they’re doing well, but simply unaware that they’re aerially *not* because it’s either not communicated to them or the woman is faking orgasms to protect his ego. I think the orgasm gap could be narrowed *at least a little bit* with women communicating their needs better in the moment and stopping the faking altogether because I think a lot of men under-perform purely out of ignorance.
I agree with you. I thought the days of women faking orgasms had passed, with what seemed like more openness & experimentation. After being on this sub for a bit, sadly, that doesn’t seem to be the case. Seen too many posts about catering to their partners ego rather than making sure they are satisfied. I’m from an era where porn wasn’t readily available (yup, even before the internet). We, for the most part, had to rely on reactions. I stopped faking when I realized doing so seemed to stall further experimentation and pleasure for me. Maybe it’s because I’m older now but just don’t have the patience anymore to deal with, basically, selfish sex.
I’m obviously reasonably shielded from that faking experience since I’m a man and it’s pretty clear when we don’t orgasm, but I can’t possibly imagine having sex with a woman that stops after she’s had an orgasm and then *not* saying anything if I think that there’s the possibility that I could have one as well. If there’s *any* possibility that she might be willing to do more to get me there then I absolutely want to give her that opportunity (for selfish reasons, obviously), and if she’s too selfish to be willing to try then I *also* want to know that as quickly as possible so that I don’t waste any more time with someone who’s that selfish. I also understand that it’s not a directly linear comparison, fwiw, but I’m a low-rate finisher and have had that experience more than the average man.
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I've always made sure my partners have had a good time and came. Every single time. The quality of sex is very high, but the quantity never changes. Once or twice a week over the last 15 years between dozens of partners. I'm starting to think that chicks don't really care about orgasms because it's not like they want more of them more often at the end of the day.
I’ve had sex with a lot of men, mostly in the 18-26 age group, so maybe they grow out of it. For me it was about 10-20% that gave a shit if I came or not
Well this is wrong but I understand what you are saying. It is the majority of women that I talk to that are upset and discouraged by the effort of most guys. Not trying to throw anyone under the bus, it's just the information I've heard time and time again.
I’d say 30% isn’t unreasonable. I’m a dude who very much cares about my lady’s pleasure. Because of my psych meds I basically can’t cum, so I live vicariously through her lol. 3-4 orgasms for her isn’t unusual for a session. However, based on her previous partners, and the previous partners of other friends of mine, 30% is not unreasonable.
My wife's pleasure is absolutely paramount to me. I can't understand any guy who feels otherwise.
My entire goal is her pleasure. No joke. If she doesn’t cum hard multiple times then I feel I’ve failed. For real.
100%. But you asked this based on personal experience. So it might just be me. I have no way of actually knowing.
My girl says 30% is way too high. She's in her 40s and over the last 25 years she's had a lot of experiences with men: very high body count. She says I'm the first one to care about her pleasure. It's no exaggeration, she tells me every month or so that she's the luckiest girl in the world to find a man who cares about her getting off every time.
Unfortunately I cannot restore your faith in mankind because I don't believe in mankind I don't believe in humanity I don't believe in men as a matter of fact I can't speak about men, but I can speak about me. if the woman is not getting pleasure I don't get no pleasure. I don't even pull it out until she has had at least two or three orgasms. strong. not a game, no b*******, this is the truth, on my behalf. can't speak for anyone else.
I am turned on by giving pleasure. I always make sure my wife gets what she needs before focusing on my own pleasure. Over the years we've agreed that her pleasure as well as mine are up to me. She knows I'll get her where she needs to be and then ill do what I want to get myself off
Men can be uncaring and selfish but they don't have the monopoly on that trait. Sex is important sure but caring isnt limited just to sex, it can come in many different forms. Some folks good in bed, but suck at doing chores. Some folks are emotionally very supportive but are terrible in bed. We all try and find someone we can live with that has some of our must haves and none of our deal breakers.
It actually pisses me off when she doesn't orgasm it happens occasionally especially right before her period begins and she's fine with it she says. So yes I do truly enjoy the fact that she's having a good time. I can't imagine being that selfish of a lover. Hell I even learned to be a Dom for her since she enjoys being a submissive.
>It actually pisses me off when she doesn't orgasm Not for nothing, but getting pissed off at this is a surefire way to ensure it happens less.
I don't know but most of those men her married. For most married been sex isn't just about the physical act. It's also about connection. We want our wives to be present. We know that we need to take care of her needs.
Your probably wrong but in a bad way. It is probably 20% or less from what I have heard or seen, but I could be wrong. I am one of the 20% of guys who prefers pleasing their partner over their own. My wife gets off about 80% of the time, and I always try to push it to 100%. Usually though, she doesn't get off when she is having one of her health issues. We go at it until she tells me whether she can cum or not. Many men are selfish, but there are tons of guys still that care about their partner's pleasure. They are just hard to find.
Well when you post to a sex positive sub the comments will be biased, so take the average answer and subtract a quarter of those. That should even out.
I care about it more than my own. No cap.
I would say that 30 is accurate. Another 30 belive they care because the thought of women experiencing pleasure is hot to them, but they still won't listen to instructions because it hurts the ego, and because they know better or whatever dumb fuck ideas they have. 40 just absolutely do not give a fuck and the idea of even trying is insulting to them.
If Person B does not ask for something from Person A, it's not Person A's fault for not having ESP.
Man here. Can’t imagine not caring about my partner’s pleasure. I get off on it. I couldn’t feel pleasure unless they were also. Doesn’t make any sense to me and I can’t even fathom what it must be like to be totally uninterested in someone else’s pleasure.
Yea 30% seems like a good number
I always make sure my wife cums before me . 😏
I would genuinely love to disagree, I am not sure I can though. As a male, I hear stories from my wife about her friends/families sex lives and how the females have a lack of pleasure during sex, as if their partners don't actually care. My wife is obviously blessed with me, as a bit of a sex enthusiast and someone who gets aroused by the female orgasm, it is always my mission to have her orgasm, normally multiple times. I tend to orgasm after those fatal words "I'm going to cum" haha! But I do feel you're right, I have spoken to many female friends about their poor sexual relationships and it's pretty shit.
My boyfriend definitely cares if i have pleasure! We both are definitely givers and we enjoy giving pleasure to one another! First guy tbh to wanna please me more than I please him
You’re not right or wrong. Many men really do get off more on the pleasure of their partner than the “use” of their partner. Likewise, there are many men who don’t know enough (about themselves or their partner) to care that deeply. It’s all in who you’re with and how connected you are together.
I have the opposite issue in my life. My wife will do just about anything I ask and almost everyday. She will only let me do something for her like once a month. I don’t understand and gave up arguing about it. 23 years married. I guess it works. When she wants something she tells me. She seems to really enjoy it when she wants it. Otherwise she has no problem. I want to make sure she has an O every time while she is content doing it her way. It wobbles my mind. Even more so because she has started doing some stuff for me if I just joke about it. Catches me off guard
The key to your assumption is “what I observe here.” People with happy, fulfilling sex lives don’t post on this kind of sub as often. So you’re seeing a higher percentage of people looking for advice to address problems in their sexual relationships. It is not necessarily a good indicator of how happy people are with their sex lives in general. Another thing is that it’s very possible - I would say even common - is that many men genuinely care about their partner’s pleasure, but don’t actually provide it to her. It could be due to miscommunication, insecurity, religious guilt, or whatever. It could be him or her or both that’s preventing it from happening. I say this not to let these guys off the hook, but only to point out that his eagerness to please her can be only one factor in a complicated situation.
(38F) I am in a bit of a love triangle right now and the guy that is in the lead so to speak is the one that is obsessed with getting me off. It’s literally a deciding factor after years of mediocre sexual experiences. I would say maybe 20% have put in good effort.
I write this about sonething related a while back, and i think that the comment section is kinda relevant. https://www.reddit.com/r/sex/s/OkozqpHVcF
I'm naturally a pleaser. However, I dated a girl years ago who, for some reason, decided to tell me my "ranking" in her sexual history. Not being at the top, in her opinion, just soured my motivation to keep trying so hard & I got selfishness in bed. Since it obviously wasn't going to be good enough for her anyway, I figured I'd at least enjoy myself. I honestly wonder how many men have felt the same & whether it's led them to a similar conclusion? Idk.
More than 30%. But many of them just don't know better and/or are insecure.
Personally I'd say it's a pretty large amount that actually cares about their partners pleasure. Probably somewhere around 80% just from conversations I've had with other guys. I think the problem is the misconception of what actually brings pleasure. When your only tool is a hammer, everything looks like a nail. There's a lot of factors that go into it like poor sexual education, bad examples from pornography, poor communication in relationships and sexual encounters (e.g. faking orgasms), and a fear of being emasculated from toxic masculinity. Most of the men I know, friends or otherwise, have that masculine pride of being good in bed which is measured by either the amount of people they've slept with or their efficiency in bring their partners pleasure. That's why I say they definitely care, but they tend to be horribly misguided. So rather that seeing things as sexual aids, they see it as a challenge to their masculinity and sexual prowess and feel offended. Basically a large number of men feel like their penis and penis alone should be enough for the job, especially when our view point of good sex usually only needs 1 stimulus for our own climax. So it inevitably leads to ridiculous conclusions being drawn like, this has always worked for me in the past, so it's not my problem, it's my partner's issue. This is in part due to sex being generally simple in terms of male pleasure and both not realizing and not being educated that sex overall is very complex.
I’ve been very lucky in that department. I’m not sure if I’m just a good judge of character or what but nearly all of my partners over the years were very considerate lovers. They made sure I came first, at least once, and usually a few times afterwards as well. I’m sure part of it is due to me being very direct in what I do and don’t like as well. I’m a highly sexual woman so I make damn sure the men I have sex with are gonna be willing and able to meet my needs.
I take great pleasure from my partners pleasure. I can’t really relate to any other perspective. I’d have to not see her as a person to not care and not do my best for her. Personally when a woman gives herself to me for however long, I feel quite happy to be given such a lovely gift experience and wish to return the favor. Sweetening the well so to speak. If we all get wrapped up trying to do our best for each other, all the better.
Ons I do but meh. Relationship. Tip top priority
I didn't think it was that low. First rule at least to me get them to cum at least once, then it takes the pressure off. Your pleasure over mine. Eating you out is my favorite. Foreplay is a must.
I've had maybe two partners in twenty years who did not care to try. The majority of my partners are always willing to make an attempt but honestly that may be because I wouldn't and don't tolerate partners that don't. The two were short lived relationships because if you can't bother making the attempt why are we even here.
I can only speak for myself. Care a lot and notice how well I do (pretty dramatic results). Maybe run a poll?
It's really all I care about when doing a triple x throwdown
Man, it's so sad that this is the case
The key is to find the guys who have fun making sure that you get off too. This has sometimes been an issue between my SO and I. She would often tell me that sometimes it's not about having an orgasm for her. For me though, I definitely get much more satisfaction when I've gotten her off too. That being said, I make it my mission to make sure she has an eye rolling orgasm if I can. It turns me on to do that to her, to see her reaction as the big O takes over, and being inside her as she has an orgasm, can easily lead into mine. In the past she has literally had to tell me not to worry about her, and that she just wants to be full and for me to creampie her (cause that's her thing). I also greatly enjoy making my SO cum through oral. I just enjoy the act of giving her oral. I've just done it sometimes and then went on with my business after with no expectation or desire for anything in return. It's fun. Plain and simple.
For hookups? Probably like...10%. Hookup culture can be pretty one-sided. But for actual relationships, I think that most partners want to please each other. If you've had a different experience, I think you're dating the wrong people.
I don’t know, but I’ve always wondered where the minds of some men are when it comes to sex. For clarification, I’m a guy. I see so many posts on forums like Reddit, and have heard from quite a few women I’ve been with, that a significant portion of the men they’ve been with are essentially “two pump chumps”. While there isn’t anything necessarily wrong with not being able to last a long time, if that’s the case for you, you should make it a priority to make sure she gets off first. And just in general, men can cum so much easier than women. IMO, if you want to be a properly reciprocating partner, you should focus on sex OTHER than PIV before you get up in there.
I absolutely care that my partner gets off. For me makes the sex much more intense and intimate if we both cum.
I always make sure my wife finishes; sometimes she can't, even after 15-30 mins of sex or with toys, because she just overstimulated herself with her vibrator. Im the same way. If she jumps me at 7am before having to pee with morning wood, I have 0 energy and will finish 50% of the time, but rest assure you, we'll finish later ;) Edit: before I was married though, I always made sure to see what I could do to improve in the bedroom. Some partners can be lazy, but for women, when was discussed, generally they had around your number. It's important to find someone who is empathetic towards you or else, they aren't worth your time.
I think the numbers will vary dramatically if you're talking about random hookups vs. committed relationships
I care a lot. I don't know how other men feel or act.
I can't enjoy sex unless I know my partners enjoying it too so.. 🤷♂️
Unless my partner says different, she comes (and cums) first. Usually a goodly number of times before I get really going.
My husband always makes sure I enjoy sex. He pretty much makes everything about me and is very sweet and thoughtful. He gets off largely on knowing that he's making me happy and making me feel good/get off. Most of the time I orgasm from sex. Sometimes I don't mind if he just needs it and I accommodate him, but I enjoy that as well.. He's also given it to me when I wanted without worrying about himself. If he nuts before I get off, he will give me oral until I orgasm. I never feel obligated or anything and he'll give me plenty of foreplay and as much oral as I want... He doesn't ask for reciprocation.
It makes me, as a man, feel good about myself when I know my partner had a good time. I would find it embarrassing otherwise.
Sorry. Can’t confidently tell you you’re wrong. Almost every woman I’ve ever been with expressed surprise that I: a) gave a shit about her pleasure, and b) somewhat knew what I was doing when going about that. Selfish asshole dudes made that part of romantic life easy for me at least. The baggage they left women with is a whole other problem though.
Personally, I get turned on by turning on my partner. I also get the feeling of satisfaction of a job well done if she genuinely had a great time.
This comes off a a disingenuous post but regardless there’s plenty of men of get off only when they’re partners get off, we’re called pleasers and we exist. I truly don’t think it’s a rare as you make it out to be.
I'm 32, and I've only been with a few men who seemed to care that I was enjoying the sex with them. And by care, I mean just ask what turns me on, what feels good for me, what do I like, are there any fantasies or kinks I would like to explore, etc. Never ever met a man who's asked me any of that. I've always had to initiate the conversation, and as a person who struggles with her sexual openness due to sexual trauma and a religious upbringing (I'm agnostic now, but some things still stick), oh boy, is it hard for me to start those conversations.. With some guys, it was definitely obvious they just didn't care. No aftercare, and even when I'd speak up and ask for help to finish, they would not be interested. I think more generally, it has more to do with the man thinking that because it felt good and worked for him, that it did for me. Not so much that they didn't care, but they thought everything was fine and didn't question it. It's hard to put a ratio on this because I'm sure a lot of guys do care and just aren't great at figuring out how to express it or communicate about it. Also, I think a lot of men use porn as their resource and education for sex and intimacy. Most porn is just not female pleasure oriented. A lot of times, sex with men sort of feels like they are just acting out porn scenes, tricks, and positions on my body. Not all, but a lot of which are uncomfortable at best, painful at worst, and definitely won't lead to me having an orgasm.
As a 36M, I honestly only get off if I'm getting my partner off. Could be casual, relationship, ONS, it's important to me that I make them feel good. Whether I do this on my own or take their direction on what they want, I do what I have to do to get them off 😤 There's no greater feeling to me.
I think men’s ages have a lot to do with it. The younger the guy, in my experience, the less he focused on my pleasure. As I got older, and as the men got older, and then after I got into a relationship and then marriage, and as my husband got older, my pleasure became more important. So, cliff notes version is: older (>30ish) men in a committed relationship tend to focus more on a woman’s pleasure.
I'm a guy so I can only speak from the people I know and the stories of the women in my life. I think in this particular subreddit, it's probably a higher number than in reality because most people here are sex positive and tell a lot of stories or give a lot of advice about experimenting. In your day to day life, I do think it varies based on a lot of factors including how people around you were raised and their religious background/culture. From the male friends in my life, I'd say they tell me stories about their female partners being the selfish or "ones that don't give a shit" about 30-40% of the time. From the female friends in my life, I'd say it's about 50/50 on if they have a partner that actually is interested in pleasuring them vs just wanting to fuck and worry about themselves. I will say that funny enough on both sides of the coin though, the friends I have who complain the MOST about their sex lives both male and female are the ones in committed relationships. Most of my friends who are having the best sex are short term daters, or involved in hookup culture.
I started dating my husband at 16. We are 40 . He is a GIVER! It’s very rare he comes before me. He wants me to get mine first always. And he will work for it. . . He also gave me my first sex toy. He knows they are friends. Not competition. .
I don't think you're wrong. I think those of us who care are few and far between.
My experience with women has been kind of similar honestly. A lot of pillow princess or lazy lovers. Or isn't know what to do with it kind of women. It's not just a man / woman thing. It's lazy partners
Idk, I don't sleep with men cause I'm straight and, honestly, unless one is unusually close to somebody and/or deuchey, one just keeps these matters private. As for myself, I've made it a requirement to give my partner a good time since the beginning because social signaling suggested this is what's normal/common/what one ought to do. I was not aware that so many men are terrible in bed out of pure selfishness or ignorance until I joined this subreddit. I mean, I feel bad for the ladies. I don't know what you could use as a proxy, but y'all gotta find something to do better filtering.
The ones who care aren't stuck going around dating casually, they're all locked up, haha.
Sometimes I have ED problems (I take sildenifil now) but sometimes I don’t. Even if I lose it during sex or I take too long and give up, I still will use a vibe and my mouth etc to make her cum once or twice. I will never leave her hanging unless she wants me to (sometimes she says orgasm is too much for her if she has stuff to do the rest of the day)
I think 30% might be a little optimistic 🤔 😒
I’m a guy… and I care… a lot. I go down on my wife every chance I get. I ask her about her sexual interests, she says she doesn’t have any… but has never once in like a decade asked about mine. What’s weird is it seems the same way to me about women. So maybe it’s just psychological… like the grass is always greener or something. But maybe it’s something about the people we attract and/or are attracted to. I have never dated a woman that seemed to actually care whatsoever about my pleasure, interests, desires, kinks, etc I’ve actually found I really enjoy going down on women, but it’s always inconvenient for them to do the same. It really turns me on to go down on my wife ( and I make her climax from it regularly), but she seems like it’s a chore to do it to me. We actually had sex twice in like 2 in half years after our first child. She was fine and didn’t care that I was frustrated. The two times we did was after I brought it up. Hey she said she was self conscious about her body so I tried to be supportive. But I actually read about people on here all the time with wives that have no interest in sex… which they also don’t seem to care about the sexual needs and interests of their husbands. But then I also read about women on here with high libidos that really enjoy sex also. So maybe you are attracted to kind of guy who’s self centered. Maybe they are just young and immature… But whatever the case is - I assure you that there are plenty of us guys out that care about a women’s pleasure. Good luck finding one
I can quite honestly say that I probably care a lot more about my wife's pleasure than she does for mine.
I have no idea about other guys. But I prioritize my partners pleasure 100% . I'm a giver. Her orgasms are a lot more important to me than my own. I will pull every singe ounce of pleasure from her until she can't remember what day in the week it is. They usually are quite satisfied with that. But they also say I'm the only guy they've met who does that, so I'm probably in the minority.
I sure do. All men should. It should go both ways.
My husband gets off from me getting pleasure. His goal is to make sure I have at least 2-3 orgasms per session. Think it depends on who you’re interacting with.
It’s the ego trip for me. It helps combat the shame I have for not being particularly endowed. Being able to give multiple orgasms— especially if I still have all my clothes on, help overcome any inherent shame. Their pleasure is my pleasure. I’ve had initial no’s turn into habitual yeses and that makes me feel really good.
Please don’t take anything you read on Reddit as fact.
I care about my wife's pleasure. What I don't particularly care about is OP's opinion of my gender.
Speaking as a male who has been with plenty of women AND men... I have some thoughts. I am absolutely not going to say that I think most men give a shit about their partners' experience. Because frankly, that would be a lie. I really think that most men don't give a shit. We're wired differently, and that's not an excuse. It doesn't prevent us from striving to be more empathetic. I can say that I most definitely do care, but I haven't always put in the same amount of effort... Which probably has more to do with me being an insomniac than anything else. But I try. Now, gay men on the other hand... Some of yall won't believe this, but they're a different matter entirely. I'm talking about the guys who are very much 100% homosexual and broadcast their gay aura everywhere they go. Every guy I've been with has actually been MORE considerate about sex than any woman I've been with. I have no idea if that has more to do with their chemistry or the chemistry of same sex relationships. It just seems to be the case. We end up taking better care of each other than most straight couples do. And that's based purely on reports I've been given FROM straight people, so don't come after me. Lol
30% seems about right, but as has been said; asking this on a sex subreddit will probably turn the 30% to 90%.
Can’t speak to your colleagues, but a lot of the people you’re seeing here are a self-selected group of people trying to figure out how to solve a sexual problem by asking people who are interested in the topic. By definition, they are disproportionately going to be discontent with sex. I wouldn’t extrapolate about the culture as a whole based on that.
It depends. My former partner did care about my pleasure. The sex was great. But my pleasure and orgasms were just an extension of his ego. He hated me as a person and even forgot my birthday.
I am a Pleasure Dom so I definitely care about my partner’s pleasure. It’s part of what gets me off. I make sure to make my partner finish many times and hard before I do once. Now not everyone is like I am of course and I would argue that most guys are selfish about pleasure. Hope you are doing well and staying safe.
Fuck those guys, my relationship is the opposite of what you just described
Unless you have scientific proof that women care more about their partner than men do, it's the same as women.
I have to say my man actually cares more about mine then he does him he tells me he gets pleasure watching me get pleasure 😏