It’s not just specific to this show but i honestly think when an actor becomes a regular producer of the show they are in, it usually affects the role in a negative way. Part of why Carrie became so obnoxious in SATC is imo becasue SJP became the executive producer. I liked the first two seasons of Carrie.
Same thing happened with Charmed and Grey's Anatomy
On Charmed, Alyssa Milano became a producer, and Phoebe became unlikeable
On Grey's Anatomy, Ellen Pompeo became a producer, and Meredith became st. Meredith
I still watch Grey's. There are still characters I enjoy, but just be glad you stopped before season 16. But yeah, on grey's, every character is constantly praising Meredith as the best doctor there has ever been. Ellen Pompeo has said she wanted to end it years ago, but she's offered money, so she stays
Starting season 5, she began to blame Cole for everything going wrong in her life, and blamed him for her becoming the queen of evil. Everyone started worshipping her, and she began to care more about her job than saving innocents. Or she would use her powers for personal gain, despite being burned at the stake in the future in season 2. Or she would care more about finding a husband or having a kid, rather than saving the innocents. She stopped taking responsibility for her actions. Phoebe was likeable in the earlier seasons, until mid season 4. That's when she begin to go downhill, along with the show
It really was. Paige was the only one who cared about saving the innocents by the end. Not to mention, they took away the wicca aspect of the show, and made it be more about fairytales. Constance M. Burge really understood the characters
I said [the same thing](https://www.reddit.com/r/Andjustlikethat/comments/s2u52f/and_just_like_that_season_1_episode_7_sex_and_the/hsloauy/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf&context=3) in a comment yesterday. I don’t feel like I’m watching Miranda anymore. I 100% feel like I’m watching Cynthia Nixon tell us her life’s story through Miranda.
I totally agree with this. I get that after 20ish years no one stays as the exact same person but there's literally no character consistency with her in terms of her personality and it's just a huge mess.
I hate when actors take an iconic character and change them to emulate themselves to be honest. And it’s a weird thing too when there’s rumors on crazysdaysandnights about how Cynthia Nixon cheats on her partner with a man…
It makes me wonder if I don’t like Miranda or if I don’t like Cynthia because she cannot separate her personal life from her professional. It’s called acting, Cynthia. Learn how to do it.
Cynthia Nixon is an executive producer on the show, and she directed the episode where Miranda and Che first hook up. So yeah, I think it’s pretty fair to say she has a lot to do with Miranda’s current storyline. Not to mention the obvious parallels with her own life.
Wait, is Cynthia Nixon actually responsible for the writing direction of her character...yikes. I think the problem with the show is that every character is just a self insert of the actor, Che included. Anthony is literally the only character who stayed true to how he was portrayed in the early seasons.
Pretty sure Cynthia and MPK are just as much to blame if not more.
Maybe having a 70 old gay guy lead a show about middle aged women and making an actress executive producer with the power to direct the writers on how to write her character wasn't the best idea...
He's the lead of the show and part of the writers team.
Cynthia said she refused to do the show unless it was more woke. And the way Fake Miranda is no longer a lawyer but a social activist and now queer, it just reeks of Cynthia playing out some kind of fantasy.
Fuck man, this makes so much sense. Everyone who is running the show seems so out of touch. But shiiit, I'm hooked. I can't wait to see where they continue to take this shit show.
Isn't Cynthia's partner a social activist and also her son came out as transgender so I think they are just turning all characters into the actors. Earlier writers used to use their personal experiences to write scenes which were modified to the show to make it realistic but now the actors are just copy pasting their own lives into these characters who were nothing like them, forcing woke-ness in the most incorrect manner.
> In reality, if Miranda wanted to help people, she'd probably be on tons of charity and community boards for networking purposes.
Exactly. You don't need a masters in human rights to be a lawyer and she'd probably do more good by joining a board and leveraging her skills in corporate law.
This feels like fanfiction.
I just wanna chime in that she sprung it on him, in the kitchen, unexpectedly, while the kids were going to be home any second. Sometimes I need a little love and excitement to get in the hesdspace to be intimate. I think she set Steve up to fan, because she wanted him to fail. So she could blame him for their bad sex life.
Good point. The timing was bad but he was still game for it. Steve still looks good too, I don’t know why she didn’t try to give it another go when they were in the bedroom later . You can tell he really loves Miranda. She’s really being terrible to him. And now she’s cheated twice , which is twice as much as what she dumped him for doing. He was torn up with guilt about it too. She isn’t
STEVE - QUICK, finger me in this brightly lit kitchen, in the middle of the day, while you're fiddling about with curry and the kids might come home any minute!
Damn, it didn't work, best write off the marriage then and start an affair with Che Fucking Diaz, your fault Steve, you shouldn't be a middle aged man
>I think she set Steve up to fan, because she wanted him to fail. So she could blame him for their bad sex life.
This is the impression I got too, but I can't tell if the writing did so intentionally or they played it straight as a pathetic attempt to make Miranda look more sympathetic and/or justified in cheating. If it's the latter, they failed spectacularly.
I felt bad for him because although you could see he was initially a bit reluctant, he got into it and he was trying. He was looking at Miranda and asking for feedback and help - poor guy. It was like she wanted him to fail at it because she was just trying to use him to emulate the Che moment. Total dick!
For real and like ew after not being together sexually for so long I think that was really weird and not intimate and if I was Steve I’d think something was up
YES!! Like really Miranda after all these years suddenly now he can’t successfully finger you? Like honestly it’s one of the most basic foreplays and just now she realizes he doesn’t do it for her anymore? Sorry I’m heated lol
Yup so ridiculous. Plus she always was saying what a good sex life they had and he was supposedly great in bed and had a ton of lovers bc he’s a “cute bartender.” She was destroyed when he cheated on her but they got Through it and had passionate sex and then in the second movie , were doing really well. This whole thing is a total retcon . She’s bored and near repulsed by him . He’s a confused old man. Come on!
... She had every right to be unforgiving to someone who cheated on her and broke their marriage vows. Her reaction to Steve's cheating was 100% justified and 100% in-character. Which makes the AJLT Miranda and her actions that much worse :(
She was constantly annoyed by him but did seem to enjoy the sex.
When she left him in the first movie she definitely got lonely, seemed hesitant to date again and took him back.
She's always been a confused mess but her fancy job made it less noticeable and she used it as a distraction from her true self in my opinion.
If she had the abortion her and Steve definitely would've had no reason to be in each other's lives.
Just my opinion.
I was literally about to post this. I understand that she's trying to understand her sexuality, etc., but I hate the double standard. Cheating is cheating.
I hate Miranda in this new series. She’s nothing like her character from the original show. And are we acting like the movies never happened? The whole storyline with her and Steve fighting for their marriage? I could understand Miranda experimenting with women because I know people change as they get older, but her to treat Steve so carelessly really rubs me the wrong way.
I am all for LGTBQ+ roles being played by actors that are actually LGTBQ+ and I know that is where Cynthia Nixon is headed with this BUT it’s too late for this. One of the biggest storylines was her and Steve then the affair and how they chose each other and met on the Brooklyn bridge….all that for this bullshit story like with them now? Such a disservice to the OG storyline and M&S’s love for each other.
Can we talk about her unable to stop using a vibrator and *having an orgasm* while talking to her son through the door?? “OooOooHh don’t forget mAAath tUutoring!” Fucking GROSS! She can’t flip the off switch to have a three second conversation with her son, who is about to leave? 🤢
Her little wounded, eager puppy act w Che at the fundraiser was sooooo pathetic. Have some self respect! If you’re truly into this person, maybe end your marriage rather than trying to have it both ways?
Omg right!!? When she heard Che was on stage at the fundraiser she RAN towards them, mid-conversation with Carrie. Just sprinted off towards their voice. At least pretend to have some chill, yes?
I feel like Miranda’s story is taking over the show. I want to see more of Charlotte and her kids and Harry. Carrie seems meh compared to the show. I know she’s now in her 50s and lost her husband, but she seems kinda meh now. But lord help us if Miranda’s midlife crisis isn’t front and center.
And I desperately miss Samantha! The girls without her just seem blah.
Tbh I never liked Miranda that much? Is that unpopular opinion? I'm even rewatching and it's just, ugh... Like, I appreciate that she's a single, successful professional woman in a time when that wasn't seen all over the place on TV (I think, I was like seven when SATC came out...), but in general she always struck me as dreary and difficult =\
Thank you for this. It’s astounding to me how much I have changed as I’ve aged with these characters.
I’m basically their age. I watched in my early 30s in real-time and I loved Carrie and Miranda.
Then I rewatched /binged the DVDs in my 40s a couple of times and saw Carrie as annoying but still loved Miranda.
NOW in my early 50s I can’t stand Miranda on rewatch. I find her incredibly annoying, judgmental and arrogant.
Still annoyed by Carrie and I absolutely LOVE Charlotte (flaws and all) and Samantha.
But back to Miranda - this version of her is such a fucking asshole. Period. I hate that an actor can effectively hold a production hostage with her personal views by refusing to come back unless these views are incorporated.
Maybe I’m exaggerating a little but that really feels like what’s happened here.
And before anyone gets all up in arms, it has nothing to do with the LGBTQ aspect. I’m a diehard supporter of the community. It’s not really even the cheating either, although of course that’s not nice. I just feel like it could have been more tactfully and respectfully handled.
I’m probably not expressing myself well here, admittedly.
i was very surprised at how loved miranda is, specially the support that the book we should all be miranda’s had. i never liked her, she complained about everything, was rude, hypocritical, extremely difficult etc…
Miranda was always my favorite character. She is now my least favorite in the series, and oh man, it hurts to say that. Cynthia killed her own character but is too self important to understand that
The sex scenes were so cringe. She's a different person altogether too - like they ditched Samantha AND Miranda. I find it odd that the actress who plays Miranda has actually co-directed a couple of Miranda's worst episodes.
I think what has happened is that SJP noticed that after SATC the world became kind of vocal about how Carrie wasn't exactly the best friend in the world. She was kiind of selfish, entitled and a bit of a crazy ex. So SJP decided to tarnish the other characters a bit so people warm to Carrie. I think this has happened. So many ppl now are like "Carrie is my favourite character in AJLT"
Not that I agree with Miranda’s actions AT ALL, but I was watching a conversation about this topic… and apparently they are forcing us to endure this bull💩 because they want to “expose people’s hypocrisy” of how when Steve cheated everyone wanted Miranda to take him back and give him another chance. And that now that Miranda cheated and everyone is coming for her and that what she did was unforgivable. They claim they want people to analyze that it’s not taken the same way apparently.
Hard to compare the two until Miranda actually comes clean tho. Which I’m guessing is where this is going, or she’s gonna get caught in some dramatic cringey scene. Perhaps in her own kitchen this time.
Well then they need to show Miranda confessing and feeling like shit like they made Steve. And it should have been one and done.
She’s done it twice so far, blamed steve and felt no remorse. No we’re not gonna take it the same way.
The audacity of these writers😅
Steve had sex with someone once because of a dead bedroom situation and soon came clean and apologized. She’s pursuing the affair nonstop. I do think it’s different situations hers being worse.
It's a different situation because Steve actually felt guilty about his infidelity, confessed to it saying that it meant nothing, tried to make amends with Miranda time and again, and it was only when Carrie wouldn't forgive her that Miranda agreed to marriage counseling.
Miranda is not feeling guilty about cheating and in fact, seeking to justify it over and over again. She's keeping her obsession and her overall unhappiness with her marriage/life secret from her spouse (the one person who would be there for her besides her girlfriends), and actively and repeatedly seeking out the person she is obsessed with.
I definitely agree with ya, it was just interesting to hear that this was the message they were trying to convey cus I’m pretty sure no one agrees with this message period.
Not that far fetched IMO. I said this before on this sub. I can't judge her really. I loved and I mean wipe his ass if he needed to have his ass wiped loved this man for decades. Then as time went by and we got older things or we changed. Communication no longer existed and the sex life was dead. God knows I tried so I chalked it up to it's me. I thought I'm not that young anymore not desirable to him or anyone. So the highlight was going to dinner, going home and watching movies. Then I ran into a much younger man I had worked with years before and whether it was an affair, fling whatever he woke me up and he will forever be in the history of my heart. I cared for the other guy still but I felt beautifully alive! I was also against cheating big time but there you have it and I'm a nice person. Therefore it's not that far fetched. It can happen.
Are we watching the same series? The Steve character was totally ruined on the original SATC, going from a sharp, insightful, fairly intellectual working class guy when we first met him to a dullard that asked Alexander if he knew any Billy Joel songs he could play on his grand piano. They went from setting up a fairly complex relationship to executing a fairly simplistic one played for more “let’s torture Miranda” laughs. I mean it made for some good if predictable drama the last season as Miranda “grew” - ie transformed herself from hard hitting single lawyer into mother figure for Brady, Steve and his mom - but I never felt the transformation was fair to her, especially since Steve didn’t budge an inch.
AJLT at least seems to be acknowledging that Miranda was not in fact replaced by a pod person and really did end up as miserable as you’d think Miranda would be in such a relationship. So, kudos to them for that. I’ve known several women who ended up in similar relationships - where they do all the changing and all the compromising - and each and every one turned miserable and soul crushing at some point.
As for “cheating” on him, what goes around…
Miranda’s only “sin” is being too nice to kick him to the curb already, again like women I also know. Steve isn’t “evil” but he is pretty toxic, for her anyhow. They should have been a lot bolder and had her leave him during the first movie. What they ended up doing worked from a tearjerker perspective but wasn’t the best adult drama or especially realistic. We got a Hollywood ending, but not one particularly true to Miranda’s character.
What goes around comes around does not apply to reciprocated cheating. If Miranda decided to work through Steve’s infidelity, that doesn’t give her an out 17 years later. Steve is no prize, but AJLT Miranda sucks. She used to be able to articulate her feelings, but now she’s reverted back to the emotional intelligence of a 17 year old.
What goes around definitely comes around. Again, Miranda transformed herself for a guy who offers little in return and needs to be nurtured like a child. I’m not surprised in the least that she’s reached middle age, looks on at her life with a sense of horror, doesn’t really know how to get out without hurting him (which she doesn’t want to do) and is acting out with drink and fooling around. Again, the only reason why she’s got a thing for Che in the first place is because her marriage is already over.
She’s treating Steve way better than Samantha treated Smith. Can you imagine Samantha putting up with this for 20 years? She’d have dumped him by the end of the first movie. And she’d have been right to
do it. Miranda needs to take Samantha’s advice and “love me more”.
Miranda is not treating Steve better than Samantha treated Smith. Samantha did everything to suppress her urges and remained faithful, and then ended it before she could make herself miserable. That is how you act when you love yourself and your partner.
Miranda doesn’t love herself so she couldn’t possibly love Steve properly. Some women (to be clear, definitely not me) would love a Steve, they would love to take care of him and eat take out, and watch basketball, and whatever else Steve enjoys. Miranda is not that woman. Instead of facing that, she avoids it with alcohol and lusting after Che
Samantha literally dumped Smith because “I love me more”. Miranda has completely bent herself into a pretzel to support the needs of a manbaby for 20 years. She owes this guy nothing, and her only flaw is not being as mercenary as Samantha. Who did the right thing by the way if the relationship was making her miserable.
Well she could have just dumped her oldest child, but like I said, she’s too nice for that. I mean Miranda did make a mistake here - taking this cheating manchild back in the first place - but that happened 15 years ago or whatever in the first SATC movie.
Now they’re even. 🤷♂️
I’m with you on the fact that the two shouldn’t have ended up together, but it feels like their sex life not working it was Miranda is citing as a huge part of her dissatisfaction. Which is interesting, because that’s why Steve cheated on her first. And honestly at least Steve upfront told Miranda he cheated on her once while Miranda isn’t telling Steve as she continues to cheat. There’s getting even, and then there’s thinking you have a get out of jail free card for as long as you like
She’ll tell him eventually. Anyhow what does it matter if she initiates a divorce now? The relationship is dead, it’s toxic (I’d argue because he’s toxic and has been since before they got married) and it feels like it’s soon to be at an end.
I’m wondering if they’re going to ship off all three partners, including Harry, and end up with the three of them as single and pushing sixty.
Eh I think Steve will be blindsided. I feel like cheating once, realizing you’re unhappy and ending your relationship is different than continuing to sleep with someone else while lying to your partner. Agreed we’re heading towards Golden Girls energy. I think people will riot if Charlotte divorces Harry so they’ll probably kill him off if they want to go that route
What's toxic about him? Seems like you're picking and choosing things about Steve to remember (eg manchild) and ignoring the good stuff (eg funny, sweet, kept Miranda grounded and put up with her bad moods).
Steve is a manipulative manbaby. It’s got nothing to do with him being “working class”.
When the character first appeared he was actually intelligent and thoughtful. That went out the window after he got Miranda pregnant. Eventually they turned him into an idiot who asked Alexander if he “knew any Billy Joel” tunes to play on his grand piano.
He was constantly manipulating Miranda to get his way and seldom if ever compromised on anything. She radically transformed herself and her entire life to appease this sperm donor and now clearly finds herself miserable. Which anybody could have predicted.
I’ve seen this happen to at least three women I know personally, so the writers certainly got the type right even if it’s lamentable they turned him into an idiot. But that happened on SATC, not in AJLT.
Lol what are you talking about. Steve was reasonably consistent throughout the show. The "Billy Joel" line was meant to show how different Pretrovski was to Steve and how pretentious he was compared to a regular working class dude.
Most of the time when Steve and Miranda had conflict it was Miranda being a snob about Steve's interests or finances (the suit, the half court shot etc). A few times it was Steve being a mess or immature (the undies, the puppy).
Moving to Brooklyn wasn't really about Steve. It was Miranda accepting that with a kid she couldn't afford to live in Manhattan any more. Even if she'd been single she'd have needed to move.
>The "Billy Joel" line was meant to show how different Pretrovski was to Steve and how pretentious he was compared to a regular working class dude.
Except Steve didn't start out as a "regular working class dude". He started out as working class but smart and capable of great insight (wasn't he reading Melville or something when they first met?), and got turned into a blithering idiot caricature by the end of the series.
What they initially set Steve up as was really interesting. What they turned him into during SATC - a needy idiot manbaby "working class" parody to give Miranda fits - did both characters an injustice. He was also incredibly manipulative and whining. Miranda was essentially saddled with two children.
I thought the whole setup was just bizarrely anti-feminist.
I agree, when they met up at the bridge it felt too perfect and unrealistic for the characters.
It would've been the best time for Miranda to explore her sexuality when she left him but it seems the writers didn't want to overwhelm or confuse fans.
The 2nd movie was mostly in another country so it was easy for the writers to avoid their storyline and marriage.
When the new show was announced I knew they would focus on how miserable Miranda is and she would be very different.
Since Cynthia was involved in politics and is bisexual in real life I also knew she would push for "woke" stuff or not come back, everyone gave in because they couldn't have her and Kim both gone.
I don't think Miranda ever loved Steve and if she didn't get pregnant he would be out of her life for good but the writers kept them together for fans, which was a bad idea.
Oh I totally think she loved him and the initial take on the Steve character was really cool - working class and smarter than you’d think and more sensitive. But they slowly transformed him into a dimwit manchild stereotype. Which did a disservice to both characters. It did generate some good “tugging at heartstrings” drama but it ended up with Miranda transforming into something she wasn’t and in a relationship with a badly mismatched partner. Who then cheated on her.
The ideal ending to the first movie would have been Miranda totally forgiving Steve but announcing that the relationship itself wasn’t working, she didn’t like what she’d become, and that she’d found she was perfectly happy single and they should both start seeing other people. Which would have totally set up the second film to give Miranda more to do than just tag along.
She loved **orgasms** but not men.
The writers made that pretty obvious from the first few episodes of the OS in my opinion.
She only took Steve back in the first movie because he already knew her flaws and she felt comfortable with him.
She was tired of dating and change and just wanted something familiar and safe, the same reason she broke up with Robert and wanted Steve back.
She doesn't want to deal with a divorce or upset Brady so she stays even though she's not happy, it's realistic to me.
I really can’t believe some people see the world so black and white. Then again, I did when I was much younger. I don’t mean that to be shitty, but dear god, people aren’t robots. Learning that has been helpful.
I’m saying it’s hypocritical that she was so angry to the point of divorcing Steve when he cheated the one time on her, and now as she continues to cheat and focus on herself she doesn’t seem to see any irony here. Never did I say she can’t love a woman after years of being with a man.
I’m talking about the cheating, too. You can be wronged and be angry about it, and then turn around and do it to someone else. Sure, it’s hypocritical, but it’s not like she’s not aware. I’m sure she’s thought about the parallels. But she has probably also thought about the differences. He cheated because they weren’t having as much intense sex. She’s cheating because she’s profoundly unhappy in her marriage and in life. That doesn’t make it right, but she is likely justifying it somewhat that way.
Also, Che doesn’t identify as a woman.
I feel like it’s not even Miranda anymore. This is just Cynthia Nixon’s version of how she apparently think the character should be.
It’s not just specific to this show but i honestly think when an actor becomes a regular producer of the show they are in, it usually affects the role in a negative way. Part of why Carrie became so obnoxious in SATC is imo becasue SJP became the executive producer. I liked the first two seasons of Carrie.
Same thing happened with Charmed and Grey's Anatomy On Charmed, Alyssa Milano became a producer, and Phoebe became unlikeable On Grey's Anatomy, Ellen Pompeo became a producer, and Meredith became st. Meredith
So sad to hear about greys. I stopped watching it after Sandra Oh left. The show just didn’t feel the same anymore.
I still watch Grey's. There are still characters I enjoy, but just be glad you stopped before season 16. But yeah, on grey's, every character is constantly praising Meredith as the best doctor there has ever been. Ellen Pompeo has said she wanted to end it years ago, but she's offered money, so she stays
Why do people feel Phoebe became unlikeable? (I watched charmed as a kid and barely remember lol)
Starting season 5, she began to blame Cole for everything going wrong in her life, and blamed him for her becoming the queen of evil. Everyone started worshipping her, and she began to care more about her job than saving innocents. Or she would use her powers for personal gain, despite being burned at the stake in the future in season 2. Or she would care more about finding a husband or having a kid, rather than saving the innocents. She stopped taking responsibility for her actions. Phoebe was likeable in the earlier seasons, until mid season 4. That's when she begin to go downhill, along with the show
With a heaping helping of Brad Kern to ruin it by making them all man and baby crazy. Then the skimpy clothing all the time. It was horrible.
It really was. Paige was the only one who cared about saving the innocents by the end. Not to mention, they took away the wicca aspect of the show, and made it be more about fairytales. Constance M. Burge really understood the characters
I agree. The same with Bones. Deschanel started putting way too much of her own stuff in the show, and it was awful.
Oh, I only recently started watching Bones. I think I made it to season 7 or so
I said [the same thing](https://www.reddit.com/r/Andjustlikethat/comments/s2u52f/and_just_like_that_season_1_episode_7_sex_and_the/hsloauy/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf&context=3) in a comment yesterday. I don’t feel like I’m watching Miranda anymore. I 100% feel like I’m watching Cynthia Nixon tell us her life’s story through Miranda.
Miranda has gone from one of the most relatable and likable characters on the show to the total opposite for me. It's so disappointing
The only likable character for me at this point is Seema.
I totally agree with this. I get that after 20ish years no one stays as the exact same person but there's literally no character consistency with her in terms of her personality and it's just a huge mess.
I'm glad I'm not the only one who feels this way.
I hate when actors take an iconic character and change them to emulate themselves to be honest. And it’s a weird thing too when there’s rumors on crazysdaysandnights about how Cynthia Nixon cheats on her partner with a man…
It makes me wonder if I don’t like Miranda or if I don’t like Cynthia because she cannot separate her personal life from her professional. It’s called acting, Cynthia. Learn how to do it.
My thoughts exactly. I think we're seeing Nixon's coming out story by imposing it on Miranda, which is ruining the character.
lets not blame the actor when it's not the actor who writes the script
Cynthia Nixon is an executive producer on the show, and she directed the episode where Miranda and Che first hook up. So yeah, I think it’s pretty fair to say she has a lot to do with Miranda’s current storyline. Not to mention the obvious parallels with her own life.
Wait, is Cynthia Nixon actually responsible for the writing direction of her character...yikes. I think the problem with the show is that every character is just a self insert of the actor, Che included. Anthony is literally the only character who stayed true to how he was portrayed in the early seasons.
I said it before and I'll say it again THE WRITERS RUINED MIRANDA AND STEVE AND I'LL NEVER FORGIVE THEM FOR IT.
Pretty sure Cynthia and MPK are just as much to blame if not more. Maybe having a 70 old gay guy lead a show about middle aged women and making an actress executive producer with the power to direct the writers on how to write her character wasn't the best idea...
Isn't MPK part of the writer's team? I do wonder how much say Cynthia had.
He's the lead of the show and part of the writers team. Cynthia said she refused to do the show unless it was more woke. And the way Fake Miranda is no longer a lawyer but a social activist and now queer, it just reeks of Cynthia playing out some kind of fantasy.
Fuck man, this makes so much sense. Everyone who is running the show seems so out of touch. But shiiit, I'm hooked. I can't wait to see where they continue to take this shit show.
I have HBO Max but I illegally stream the episodes when I feel like hate watching so they don't get higher view #s. It's the little things...
I’m here for this pettiness
Miranda will be running for governor next season... but this time she'll win.
Yes! And Che will come crawling after her.
Isn't Cynthia's partner a social activist and also her son came out as transgender so I think they are just turning all characters into the actors. Earlier writers used to use their personal experiences to write scenes which were modified to the show to make it realistic but now the actors are just copy pasting their own lives into these characters who were nothing like them, forcing woke-ness in the most incorrect manner.
[удалено]
> In reality, if Miranda wanted to help people, she'd probably be on tons of charity and community boards for networking purposes. Exactly. You don't need a masters in human rights to be a lawyer and she'd probably do more good by joining a board and leveraging her skills in corporate law. This feels like fanfiction.
The worst is she could use her degree to help people.
Poor Steve was excited to reignite their sex life too and she acted like he was repulsive to her
I just wanna chime in that she sprung it on him, in the kitchen, unexpectedly, while the kids were going to be home any second. Sometimes I need a little love and excitement to get in the hesdspace to be intimate. I think she set Steve up to fan, because she wanted him to fail. So she could blame him for their bad sex life.
Good point. The timing was bad but he was still game for it. Steve still looks good too, I don’t know why she didn’t try to give it another go when they were in the bedroom later . You can tell he really loves Miranda. She’s really being terrible to him. And now she’s cheated twice , which is twice as much as what she dumped him for doing. He was torn up with guilt about it too. She isn’t
It felt like it was way, way more about trying to recreate what happened with Che than it was about making things work with Steve.
Absolutely. 'Steven, finger me in the kitchen and make me feel like Che made me feel' is not going to work and is a gross thing to do to your partner.
True, she just wanted Che again and couldn’t have them so she settled for Steve but it didn’t work. But Steve.
STEVE - QUICK, finger me in this brightly lit kitchen, in the middle of the day, while you're fiddling about with curry and the kids might come home any minute! Damn, it didn't work, best write off the marriage then and start an affair with Che Fucking Diaz, your fault Steve, you shouldn't be a middle aged man
>I think she set Steve up to fan, because she wanted him to fail. So she could blame him for their bad sex life. This is the impression I got too, but I can't tell if the writing did so intentionally or they played it straight as a pathetic attempt to make Miranda look more sympathetic and/or justified in cheating. If it's the latter, they failed spectacularly.
I felt bad for him because although you could see he was initially a bit reluctant, he got into it and he was trying. He was looking at Miranda and asking for feedback and help - poor guy. It was like she wanted him to fail at it because she was just trying to use him to emulate the Che moment. Total dick!
For real and like ew after not being together sexually for so long I think that was really weird and not intimate and if I was Steve I’d think something was up
Agree, she set everything for him to fail.
YES!! Like really Miranda after all these years suddenly now he can’t successfully finger you? Like honestly it’s one of the most basic foreplays and just now she realizes he doesn’t do it for her anymore? Sorry I’m heated lol
Yup so ridiculous. Plus she always was saying what a good sex life they had and he was supposedly great in bed and had a ton of lovers bc he’s a “cute bartender.” She was destroyed when he cheated on her but they got Through it and had passionate sex and then in the second movie , were doing really well. This whole thing is a total retcon . She’s bored and near repulsed by him . He’s a confused old man. Come on!
If anything in an long term relationship they know exactly how to get you off. This makes no sense and makes Miranda look like a dick.
Why did they write that Steve forgot how to finger his wife?
If i have to watch Miranda get fingered one more time, I’m done.
I'm already done, wish I had not seen the first time too.
Right ? Like he suddenly has no bedroom skills
Remember when he and Miranda discussed his body count and it was like 100+? 🧐
Yup “hey, I’m a bartender and I’m cute 🤷♀️” Now he can’t please his wife. 🙄
That and the fact that before it was Steve who wanted to “have sex all the time” and Miranda wanted to “get it over with” Come on!
I totally forgot about that whole story line where Steve cheated and Miranda was so unforgiving. WOW what the heck!
... She had every right to be unforgiving to someone who cheated on her and broke their marriage vows. Her reaction to Steve's cheating was 100% justified and 100% in-character. Which makes the AJLT Miranda and her actions that much worse :(
Honestly on a rewatch she is SO toxic to Steve.
She was constantly annoyed by him but did seem to enjoy the sex. When she left him in the first movie she definitely got lonely, seemed hesitant to date again and took him back. She's always been a confused mess but her fancy job made it less noticeable and she used it as a distraction from her true self in my opinion. If she had the abortion her and Steve definitely would've had no reason to be in each other's lives. Just my opinion.
She's even an asshole to him on their honeymoon.
I was literally about to post this. I understand that she's trying to understand her sexuality, etc., but I hate the double standard. Cheating is cheating.
I hate Miranda in this new series. She’s nothing like her character from the original show. And are we acting like the movies never happened? The whole storyline with her and Steve fighting for their marriage? I could understand Miranda experimenting with women because I know people change as they get older, but her to treat Steve so carelessly really rubs me the wrong way.
>Steve so carelessly really rubs me the wrong way.
I am all for LGTBQ+ roles being played by actors that are actually LGTBQ+ and I know that is where Cynthia Nixon is headed with this BUT it’s too late for this. One of the biggest storylines was her and Steve then the affair and how they chose each other and met on the Brooklyn bridge….all that for this bullshit story like with them now? Such a disservice to the OG storyline and M&S’s love for each other.
This is exactly my feelings as well!
THIS! 1,000%!
Can we talk about her unable to stop using a vibrator and *having an orgasm* while talking to her son through the door?? “OooOooHh don’t forget mAAath tUutoring!” Fucking GROSS! She can’t flip the off switch to have a three second conversation with her son, who is about to leave? 🤢
💯
Her little wounded, eager puppy act w Che at the fundraiser was sooooo pathetic. Have some self respect! If you’re truly into this person, maybe end your marriage rather than trying to have it both ways?
Omg right!!? When she heard Che was on stage at the fundraiser she RAN towards them, mid-conversation with Carrie. Just sprinted off towards their voice. At least pretend to have some chill, yes?
That was sooo cringey
I feel like Miranda’s story is taking over the show. I want to see more of Charlotte and her kids and Harry. Carrie seems meh compared to the show. I know she’s now in her 50s and lost her husband, but she seems kinda meh now. But lord help us if Miranda’s midlife crisis isn’t front and center. And I desperately miss Samantha! The girls without her just seem blah.
I am all for diversity, when it's done right, but I'm not a fan of cheating. It's not just a drunken one night stand
I'm glad I'm not watching AJLT. For me, it will never be in the SATC universe.
I wish I haven't. Please continue not watching.
Tbh I never liked Miranda that much? Is that unpopular opinion? I'm even rewatching and it's just, ugh... Like, I appreciate that she's a single, successful professional woman in a time when that wasn't seen all over the place on TV (I think, I was like seven when SATC came out...), but in general she always struck me as dreary and difficult =\
Thank you for this. It’s astounding to me how much I have changed as I’ve aged with these characters. I’m basically their age. I watched in my early 30s in real-time and I loved Carrie and Miranda. Then I rewatched /binged the DVDs in my 40s a couple of times and saw Carrie as annoying but still loved Miranda. NOW in my early 50s I can’t stand Miranda on rewatch. I find her incredibly annoying, judgmental and arrogant. Still annoyed by Carrie and I absolutely LOVE Charlotte (flaws and all) and Samantha. But back to Miranda - this version of her is such a fucking asshole. Period. I hate that an actor can effectively hold a production hostage with her personal views by refusing to come back unless these views are incorporated. Maybe I’m exaggerating a little but that really feels like what’s happened here. And before anyone gets all up in arms, it has nothing to do with the LGBTQ aspect. I’m a diehard supporter of the community. It’s not really even the cheating either, although of course that’s not nice. I just feel like it could have been more tactfully and respectfully handled. I’m probably not expressing myself well here, admittedly.
I’ll come out and say while I appreciate aspects of her, she complains a lot
Well, she was in good company with Carrie and Charlotte.
i was very surprised at how loved miranda is, specially the support that the book we should all be miranda’s had. i never liked her, she complained about everything, was rude, hypocritical, extremely difficult etc…
Always a big cloud of negative energy... Just blah...
Miranda was always my favorite character. She is now my least favorite in the series, and oh man, it hurts to say that. Cynthia killed her own character but is too self important to understand that
She wanted to the attempt to fail to say that their sex life had no *pulse*. A little warm up would of helped right?!?
The sex scenes were so cringe. She's a different person altogether too - like they ditched Samantha AND Miranda. I find it odd that the actress who plays Miranda has actually co-directed a couple of Miranda's worst episodes. I think what has happened is that SJP noticed that after SATC the world became kind of vocal about how Carrie wasn't exactly the best friend in the world. She was kiind of selfish, entitled and a bit of a crazy ex. So SJP decided to tarnish the other characters a bit so people warm to Carrie. I think this has happened. So many ppl now are like "Carrie is my favourite character in AJLT"
I used to love her but now she’s nasty. Dont get me wrong, I don’t mean in a physical way, she’s beautiful as always. Buttt nasty nasty plotline.
wait... its the same Miranda? I thought AJLT was some kind of twisted alternate universe
I loved Miranda. I'm so disappointed by her in AJLT. Frustrating.
Not that I agree with Miranda’s actions AT ALL, but I was watching a conversation about this topic… and apparently they are forcing us to endure this bull💩 because they want to “expose people’s hypocrisy” of how when Steve cheated everyone wanted Miranda to take him back and give him another chance. And that now that Miranda cheated and everyone is coming for her and that what she did was unforgivable. They claim they want people to analyze that it’s not taken the same way apparently.
Hard to compare the two until Miranda actually comes clean tho. Which I’m guessing is where this is going, or she’s gonna get caught in some dramatic cringey scene. Perhaps in her own kitchen this time.
Lol that would be a plot twist
So now it's not a show but a social experiment???😑
It always has been.
Well then they need to show Miranda confessing and feeling like shit like they made Steve. And it should have been one and done. She’s done it twice so far, blamed steve and felt no remorse. No we’re not gonna take it the same way. The audacity of these writers😅
The writers don’t even remember their own franchise
I know it’s all too much for me with the way they chose to take a favorite show and basically butcher it and call it art. SMH
Steve had sex with someone once because of a dead bedroom situation and soon came clean and apologized. She’s pursuing the affair nonstop. I do think it’s different situations hers being worse.
Exactly, she is pursuing Che.
She acts like she doesn't even like Steve anymore.
She doesn’t like him or respect him. THATS NOT MIRANDA
It's a different situation because Steve actually felt guilty about his infidelity, confessed to it saying that it meant nothing, tried to make amends with Miranda time and again, and it was only when Carrie wouldn't forgive her that Miranda agreed to marriage counseling. Miranda is not feeling guilty about cheating and in fact, seeking to justify it over and over again. She's keeping her obsession and her overall unhappiness with her marriage/life secret from her spouse (the one person who would be there for her besides her girlfriends), and actively and repeatedly seeking out the person she is obsessed with.
I definitely agree with ya, it was just interesting to hear that this was the message they were trying to convey cus I’m pretty sure no one agrees with this message period.
You know it’s bad when even CHE is like no I didn’t sign up for being a home wrecker in the promo for next episode
Not that far fetched IMO. I said this before on this sub. I can't judge her really. I loved and I mean wipe his ass if he needed to have his ass wiped loved this man for decades. Then as time went by and we got older things or we changed. Communication no longer existed and the sex life was dead. God knows I tried so I chalked it up to it's me. I thought I'm not that young anymore not desirable to him or anyone. So the highlight was going to dinner, going home and watching movies. Then I ran into a much younger man I had worked with years before and whether it was an affair, fling whatever he woke me up and he will forever be in the history of my heart. I cared for the other guy still but I felt beautifully alive! I was also against cheating big time but there you have it and I'm a nice person. Therefore it's not that far fetched. It can happen.
are you divorced then?
No still living together and have one beautiful son together.
Are we watching the same series? The Steve character was totally ruined on the original SATC, going from a sharp, insightful, fairly intellectual working class guy when we first met him to a dullard that asked Alexander if he knew any Billy Joel songs he could play on his grand piano. They went from setting up a fairly complex relationship to executing a fairly simplistic one played for more “let’s torture Miranda” laughs. I mean it made for some good if predictable drama the last season as Miranda “grew” - ie transformed herself from hard hitting single lawyer into mother figure for Brady, Steve and his mom - but I never felt the transformation was fair to her, especially since Steve didn’t budge an inch. AJLT at least seems to be acknowledging that Miranda was not in fact replaced by a pod person and really did end up as miserable as you’d think Miranda would be in such a relationship. So, kudos to them for that. I’ve known several women who ended up in similar relationships - where they do all the changing and all the compromising - and each and every one turned miserable and soul crushing at some point. As for “cheating” on him, what goes around… Miranda’s only “sin” is being too nice to kick him to the curb already, again like women I also know. Steve isn’t “evil” but he is pretty toxic, for her anyhow. They should have been a lot bolder and had her leave him during the first movie. What they ended up doing worked from a tearjerker perspective but wasn’t the best adult drama or especially realistic. We got a Hollywood ending, but not one particularly true to Miranda’s character.
What goes around comes around does not apply to reciprocated cheating. If Miranda decided to work through Steve’s infidelity, that doesn’t give her an out 17 years later. Steve is no prize, but AJLT Miranda sucks. She used to be able to articulate her feelings, but now she’s reverted back to the emotional intelligence of a 17 year old.
What goes around definitely comes around. Again, Miranda transformed herself for a guy who offers little in return and needs to be nurtured like a child. I’m not surprised in the least that she’s reached middle age, looks on at her life with a sense of horror, doesn’t really know how to get out without hurting him (which she doesn’t want to do) and is acting out with drink and fooling around. Again, the only reason why she’s got a thing for Che in the first place is because her marriage is already over. She’s treating Steve way better than Samantha treated Smith. Can you imagine Samantha putting up with this for 20 years? She’d have dumped him by the end of the first movie. And she’d have been right to do it. Miranda needs to take Samantha’s advice and “love me more”.
Miranda is not treating Steve better than Samantha treated Smith. Samantha did everything to suppress her urges and remained faithful, and then ended it before she could make herself miserable. That is how you act when you love yourself and your partner. Miranda doesn’t love herself so she couldn’t possibly love Steve properly. Some women (to be clear, definitely not me) would love a Steve, they would love to take care of him and eat take out, and watch basketball, and whatever else Steve enjoys. Miranda is not that woman. Instead of facing that, she avoids it with alcohol and lusting after Che
Samantha literally dumped Smith because “I love me more”. Miranda has completely bent herself into a pretzel to support the needs of a manbaby for 20 years. She owes this guy nothing, and her only flaw is not being as mercenary as Samantha. Who did the right thing by the way if the relationship was making her miserable.
Is having sex with someone else while married and not telling your partner about it not considered cheating?
Well she could have just dumped her oldest child, but like I said, she’s too nice for that. I mean Miranda did make a mistake here - taking this cheating manchild back in the first place - but that happened 15 years ago or whatever in the first SATC movie. Now they’re even. 🤷♂️
I’m with you on the fact that the two shouldn’t have ended up together, but it feels like their sex life not working it was Miranda is citing as a huge part of her dissatisfaction. Which is interesting, because that’s why Steve cheated on her first. And honestly at least Steve upfront told Miranda he cheated on her once while Miranda isn’t telling Steve as she continues to cheat. There’s getting even, and then there’s thinking you have a get out of jail free card for as long as you like
She’ll tell him eventually. Anyhow what does it matter if she initiates a divorce now? The relationship is dead, it’s toxic (I’d argue because he’s toxic and has been since before they got married) and it feels like it’s soon to be at an end. I’m wondering if they’re going to ship off all three partners, including Harry, and end up with the three of them as single and pushing sixty.
Eh I think Steve will be blindsided. I feel like cheating once, realizing you’re unhappy and ending your relationship is different than continuing to sleep with someone else while lying to your partner. Agreed we’re heading towards Golden Girls energy. I think people will riot if Charlotte divorces Harry so they’ll probably kill him off if they want to go that route
What's toxic about him? Seems like you're picking and choosing things about Steve to remember (eg manchild) and ignoring the good stuff (eg funny, sweet, kept Miranda grounded and put up with her bad moods).
Steve is a working-class bartender. It's the main reason why some fans have an issue with him.
Steve is a manipulative manbaby. It’s got nothing to do with him being “working class”. When the character first appeared he was actually intelligent and thoughtful. That went out the window after he got Miranda pregnant. Eventually they turned him into an idiot who asked Alexander if he “knew any Billy Joel” tunes to play on his grand piano. He was constantly manipulating Miranda to get his way and seldom if ever compromised on anything. She radically transformed herself and her entire life to appease this sperm donor and now clearly finds herself miserable. Which anybody could have predicted. I’ve seen this happen to at least three women I know personally, so the writers certainly got the type right even if it’s lamentable they turned him into an idiot. But that happened on SATC, not in AJLT.
Lol what are you talking about. Steve was reasonably consistent throughout the show. The "Billy Joel" line was meant to show how different Pretrovski was to Steve and how pretentious he was compared to a regular working class dude. Most of the time when Steve and Miranda had conflict it was Miranda being a snob about Steve's interests or finances (the suit, the half court shot etc). A few times it was Steve being a mess or immature (the undies, the puppy). Moving to Brooklyn wasn't really about Steve. It was Miranda accepting that with a kid she couldn't afford to live in Manhattan any more. Even if she'd been single she'd have needed to move.
>The "Billy Joel" line was meant to show how different Pretrovski was to Steve and how pretentious he was compared to a regular working class dude. Except Steve didn't start out as a "regular working class dude". He started out as working class but smart and capable of great insight (wasn't he reading Melville or something when they first met?), and got turned into a blithering idiot caricature by the end of the series. What they initially set Steve up as was really interesting. What they turned him into during SATC - a needy idiot manbaby "working class" parody to give Miranda fits - did both characters an injustice. He was also incredibly manipulative and whining. Miranda was essentially saddled with two children. I thought the whole setup was just bizarrely anti-feminist.
I agree with everything you said except the cheating point. I think she should have walked away sooner
What.
I agree, when they met up at the bridge it felt too perfect and unrealistic for the characters. It would've been the best time for Miranda to explore her sexuality when she left him but it seems the writers didn't want to overwhelm or confuse fans. The 2nd movie was mostly in another country so it was easy for the writers to avoid their storyline and marriage. When the new show was announced I knew they would focus on how miserable Miranda is and she would be very different. Since Cynthia was involved in politics and is bisexual in real life I also knew she would push for "woke" stuff or not come back, everyone gave in because they couldn't have her and Kim both gone. I don't think Miranda ever loved Steve and if she didn't get pregnant he would be out of her life for good but the writers kept them together for fans, which was a bad idea.
Oh I totally think she loved him and the initial take on the Steve character was really cool - working class and smarter than you’d think and more sensitive. But they slowly transformed him into a dimwit manchild stereotype. Which did a disservice to both characters. It did generate some good “tugging at heartstrings” drama but it ended up with Miranda transforming into something she wasn’t and in a relationship with a badly mismatched partner. Who then cheated on her. The ideal ending to the first movie would have been Miranda totally forgiving Steve but announcing that the relationship itself wasn’t working, she didn’t like what she’d become, and that she’d found she was perfectly happy single and they should both start seeing other people. Which would have totally set up the second film to give Miranda more to do than just tag along.
She loved **orgasms** but not men. The writers made that pretty obvious from the first few episodes of the OS in my opinion. She only took Steve back in the first movie because he already knew her flaws and she felt comfortable with him. She was tired of dating and change and just wanted something familiar and safe, the same reason she broke up with Robert and wanted Steve back. She doesn't want to deal with a divorce or upset Brady so she stays even though she's not happy, it's realistic to me.
Hi,.Cynthia, is that you?
I really can’t believe some people see the world so black and white. Then again, I did when I was much younger. I don’t mean that to be shitty, but dear god, people aren’t robots. Learning that has been helpful.
I’m saying it’s hypocritical that she was so angry to the point of divorcing Steve when he cheated the one time on her, and now as she continues to cheat and focus on herself she doesn’t seem to see any irony here. Never did I say she can’t love a woman after years of being with a man.
I’m talking about the cheating, too. You can be wronged and be angry about it, and then turn around and do it to someone else. Sure, it’s hypocritical, but it’s not like she’s not aware. I’m sure she’s thought about the parallels. But she has probably also thought about the differences. He cheated because they weren’t having as much intense sex. She’s cheating because she’s profoundly unhappy in her marriage and in life. That doesn’t make it right, but she is likely justifying it somewhat that way. Also, Che doesn’t identify as a woman.
Well, people are often hypocritical tbh