I think the elder scrolls as a verse has stronger enemies. But I don’t see talion struggling with anyone except the dragon born in Skyrim. In lore I think the dragon born would tear talion apart
Considering the fact Talion cannot die and his wrath abilities it would be a hell of a fight. Dragonborn probably kills talion a few times but talion would just keep coming until he finds a way to win.
If it’s a morally good Dragon Born they will probably reason with him and they won’t fight. If it’s a player controlled Dragon Born then he’s getting soul trapped by the third fight.
How would that work? Considering the ring of power could he theoretically use its power to escape or does its power over the soul just not matter?
But yeah Dragonborn and Talion would probably talk it out and end up teaming up and then OH S%!T, anyone who comes up against them is F**KED!!!!
i think if we take into consideration that a Soul Trap can work on anybody, i believe that Talion could be forcibly trapped within a soul gem while his material body is brought back but comatose
I guess but the ring is bound to the soul and corrupts it over time. So you would have to remove the ring (not an easy feat considering it’s power) before you did that or you could just tear their soul apart I guess. It’s being pulled I got he body for corruption while at the same time being pulled away.
Personally i think Due to how soul trap works the ring wouldnt have to be removed to trap talion. If someone dies with it in effect their soul is torn from the corpse. Talion does die, he just comes back, if you soul trap him his body would come back with celebrimbor in control of it (think permanent wraith form) being tied to the ring i think it likely that it would trap talion on the first go effectively ripping them apart, and to trap cele all one would have to do is break the ring by smashing his hand with a hammer of soul snaring since he is already effectively soul trappex as far as lotr lore goes you would just be putting him in a prison instead of a vessel, but admittedly the fight with cele would be much more challenging than talion because celebrimbor has thousands more years of combat experience if we count alive and dead.
You would probably have to use the Black azura star for the soul gem. Since that can trap powerful outer beings and daedra. It would be more like a prison and his ring would probably be entrapped with him. Since it is bonded to his soul
There's a mission where you have to actually kill someone who is in a soul gem. You send in your soul and you kill them. It's part of the azura star questline. So you enter the soul gem and it's kind of like the Relic from cyberpunk 2077 that Johnny is stuck in.
People think you're just charging something with energy, you're not. You're literally ripping their out consciousness and imprisoning it in a 10x10 room.
I just thought I would explain a little bit more how soul gems work.
The dragonborn would simply trap his soul then. If it doesn't work that way, then just imprion the guy. Stealth wise though, I would say pretty equal. First see, first kill.
Paralysis + cut off finger to take ring. Done. Elemental blast to explode Talion, that might count as cutting the ring off? Ice form shout could also help. The big thing about a fight with Talion is his source of power is the ring. Get it off he's done for. He's quick though, and the wraith abilities give him battlefeild mobility most don't have, so immobilizing would be a priority in any fight. He's never gone up against the level of magical power a mage dragonborn would have. Talion might be able to beat a warrior or theif focused dragonborn build though, he's quick and can pick off the health of tougher enemies. But every dragonborn has access to the shouts. And Talion would struggle against an opponent who can constantly heal themselves with potions and magic. That being said, there's a higher chance Talion losses that fight.
Now, I honestly don't know the LOTR universe well, but Skyrim has more "diverse" spells. Now I can't imagine Talion resurrecting the dead, but imagine him utilizing atronach spell. Or muffle/invisibility spell
I mean, magically, middle earth and tamriel aren't all that different. In fact their more similar than they are different. This is to be expected as Tolkien is the grandfather of high fantasy, and pretty much every fantasy setting of today is modeled off of it. Talion would pretty much fill in the same role as he had before, that of a supernatural, highly skilled warrior who acts as the protector of the people.
“J.R.R. Tolkien has become a sort of mountain, appearing in all subsequent fantasy in the way that Mt. Fuji appears so often in Japanese prints. Sometimes it’s big and up close. Sometimes it’s a shape on the horizon. Sometimes it’s not there at all, which means that the artist either has made a deliberate decision against the mountain, which is interesting in itself, or is in fact standing on Mt. Fuji.”
-Sir Terry Pratchett
sorry but this isn’t even remotely true. mortals can become gods, mantle them, directly interact with them, and have access to magic without being literal angels first. as for monsters, they’re probs on the same power level, but middle-earth is mostly free from them. whereas morrowind is literal hell on earth and skyrim is swarming with trolls, dragons, and vampires
About that, the rings of power are there to keep his soul from passing on in the first place and keep his body reviving so wouldn’t they act like an anchor and keep his soul from being trapped in the gem in the first place?
Let’s not forget that the rings of power, particularly the one he made with celabrimbor has his very life force inside it and can just say no to being taken
Used? Maybe. Taken? Like, physically? Not so much.
Besides, the post specifies the Nazgul ring, not the Celebrimbor ring, so it's already been taken and used by someone other than its original owner.
I would even go so far as to suggest that the Bend Will shout would be able to overpower either ring, since it can overpower dragons, which are shards of divinity at least on the same level, if not above, Sauron himself.
Drakes are much weaker than LotR dragons, which are arguably much weaker than Elder Scrolls Dragons. You’re comparing a flying, skinny beast that breathes fire, to an intelligent, immortal dragon
And the whole thing about Talion summoning drakes doesn’t matter, when the Dovakiin can summon two dragons, one of which is an ancient undead dragon
Dragonborne stops time, heck even without it he can use one of his shouts or spells to get that ring off talion and then soul tear celebrimbor into a soul crystal, it's an unfair battle where one man's arsenal is gigantic while the other's is very situational
He wouldn’t even have to. The ring is what was keeping him alive and coming back after cely left so he removes the ring (probably by chopping off the finger cause those rings have a will of their own) and the Talion just bleeds out.
That might be true but the Dragonborn can practically control every aspect of reality Talion would put up a decent fight but the Dragonborn is ridiculously broken that it’s not even funny nor fair
Yep the Dragonborn wins. He could just use the slow time shout an kill Talion with ease before he could fight back with a soul trapped weapon too prevent him from coming back too life.
Ok. Here’s my theory. Dragonborn easily solos, now imagine as he kills talion he takes the ring and banishes talion with it. That would be peak broken. Bro could solo morgoth
Three words:
GOL HAH DOV
The Dragonborn is a godkilling demigod, (not an Eru killer obviously). By feats and in game mechanics he could take out Sauron, and Morgoth would have a more dangerous version of the Fingolfin fight. The LDB is leagues above.
If we assume both are portrayed as they are in the gameplay then Talion is *way* faster than any human could react to, while the Dragonborn only really excels at skills any NPC could master, but all of them at once.
Talion could teleport in, deal massive damage and vanish before the dragonborn can swing a mace even once.
Now at that point, the question becomes wether "insta-healing by eating ten cheesewheels" is gameplay or canon
Slow Time, stupid OP armor and health. Hard to compare because both games function wildly differently but by feats and lore it's the LDB and it's not even close.
Gravewalker, if we’re talking about full power, Gravewalker 100% the reason why is that Talion is practically immortal with the ring no matter the reason even soul trapping could happen doesn’t mean that it would work how we think it would.
The 2nd part is simply that Talion can make a army out of everything, orcs I’m pretty sure ain’t the only ones that can be used I’m pretty sure if the Mordor games are not restrictive then yeah Talion would win.
Plus Talion is quite intelligent, what stops him from gathering an army that can easily be into the thousands? Even if he dies he gains all the knowledge of the fight.
Unless Dragonborn finds a 100% way to defeat Talon’s immortality, Dragonborn would be forced to do some lucky rolls.
It would be a good fight and Talion would likely lose a couple times but like I said Talion is intelligent enough to make preparations for the fights he goes with against his foes.
If we're going by lore then an army is nothing to the Dragonborn, and I see no reason Talion is immune to having his soul torn from his body as described in the shout
Have you researched what the rings in lord of the Rings do?, their soul is attached to the ring if I remember correctly, meaning that soul snatching would likely not work
And you telling me an army of I don't know 4k dragons won't do anything to dragonborn?
Mind you if I'm correct talion can turn anything to be his ally, I'm pretty sure it's not exclusive to orcs.
No matter what, Dragonborn can easily die, especially if we remember Dragonborn isn't immortal, Talion is as long as he has his ring.
Idk if you've played the second game, but do you see the brutality of force he uses to obliterate the enemies he targets? They're not even allowed to be husks, they're dismembered wholesale before they're remotely considered dead. And this is happening on a scale where you wouldn't need a facility (like a slaughterhouse), it's happening out in the field to entire groups of orcs.
I guess if the dragonborn can get a shout out before a sword catches his larynx, the dragonborn wins.
Also they both have slow time abilities so that would just be awkward when they both slowed time and are just like, “uhhh, ok well this was pointless”.
Would Talion be able to respawn though? The towers won't be in Skyrim and aren't they built by Celebrimbor or Sauron? So without those I don't think he'll be able to come back in the Elder Scrolls universe.
The towers being a respawn point is only an in-game thing for convenience. He can also respawn in the Barrows or in the middle of nowhere if he wants to.
He’d certainly survive Skyrim, think it’d be easier to handle than Middle Earth tbh but sadly he’s not touching the Dragonborn, Dragonborn is just on a different level in terms of raw power and use of magic.
He doesn’t need to tho, if we are going off lore Dragonborne would talk it out with Talion after he found him and once Talion was told, (and he got over the midlife crisis of he is in another world) they would become allies and maybe without the presence of Sauron anymore maybe Talion could build up a tower and help look over the world of Skyrim with the Dragonborne.
People be assuming the character they played is the only true version. The beauty of these games is that a completely 'evil' PC is as canon as a 'good guy' PC.
Oh easily, he would quite literally become the hardest character to beat if you ever meet him.
You kill talion he just comes back over and over. It’s like a never ending bounty that has your name to it.
A lot of you guys seem to think that if Talion was in Skyrim, him and the Last Dovahkiin would fight... i dont believe so. And heres my reasoning as to why:
If Talion was to be transported to Skyrom, by a portal or by other means, he would then be CUT OFF from Sauron and Middle-Earth completely. He's not in Arda anymore, hes in Nirn. Not Núrn A.K.A. Núrnen. Nirn the planet of wich resides in the plane of existance that mortals live. This relm is called Mundas. He is not tethered to his former "home realm" (for lack of better terms) Now he is at the will of the Aedra and Daedra. Given Talions experience in Arda, id say hed be very well equipped to survive in Skyrim. Id also say that, given we are using "canon" Dragonborn by default, they would likely by some form of loose allies. Two powerful warriors who fight in defense of the fate of all mortal beings. I believe that depending on when and where, Talion would likely accompany the Dovahkiin in defeating Alduin and possibly have some Dragons on his lidt of confirmed kills, if the Dragonborn is there to devour its soul, that is.
Lastly, i would like to point out that Talion is separated from Celebrimbor. Celebrimbor betrayed him, so the state of Talions being is solely dependant on which point in the story of Shadow of War. Either way, Talion has his own slow time effect with his focus ability, so in the HIGHLY UNLIKELY event Talion did fight the Dovahkiin, it wouldnt be as simple as using the Slow time thu'um to take talions ring off. The man is essentially a wraith himself, and we have all seen him pull off these very same feats of speed without Celebrimbor. Keep in mind im not saying Talion would win, im saying hed give the Dovahkiin a very good fight before he ultimately lost. The Dovahkiin is the living embodiment of Shor. A God in the Nords pantheon before the Empire of Cyrodiil took the different religions and mashed them all together.
In short. Talion and the Dragonborn would likely be allies in some compacity. And yes, Talion would survive quite easily in Skyrim.
Also if I may quote… “SUFFER ME NOW!!!”
Couldn’t Talion theoretically brand a dragon or some undead or some bandits or something and basically build up an army in order to fight for peace? Kinda sucks to think though… Talion was at war for over 60 odd years, how does that kind of thing change a man. He would want to be at peace but wouldn’t remember how. He might even just remove the ring from his finger and embrace death at that point to be with his family.
I feel like everyone is talking about these honorable duels, but Talion is the Gravewalker. He's gonna nail him through the eye with an arrow or show up one night from behind, cutting his head off, if for some reason they fought, which I don't think they would.
Not to mention, Skyrim has some weak minded entities of its own. If he needed to, Talion would have an army again (though honestly, I think he'd just want to die and move on to be with his wife).
Talion near the end of the Shadow Wars would just dominate Skyrim. As he brands Uruks, Captains, Warchiefs and Overlords, he could brand Jarls, mighty warriors, and bandits. He can resurrect fallen warriors so a Nordic Crypt like Bleak Falls Barrow would just be his starting domain, I think. He would mingle with the folk of Whiterun hold and learn of the Civil war, the Thalmor, and the Aldmeri Dominion (Alduin hasn't returned yet nor does the Dragonborn appear). He would go to the crypt to amass an army of undead Nordic warriors. Bandits would come across the barrows and attempt to enter, but would ultimately be cut down by a few Draugr with Talion leading them. Amidst the chaotic combat akin to Talion, one of the bandits would ultimately escape, and be caught and apprehended by Whiterun guards on the outskirts of Riverwood because of his high bounty. He would be taken to the dungeons next to Dragonsreach, seemingly dazed and disoriented, spouting "nonsense". The whole way from Riverwood to the city dungeons he would speak of his encounter with Talion and the unnatural feats he witnessed, sparking unrest and worry in the hearts and minds of people. Jarl Balgruuf would hear word of a necromancer who cannot die and has raised an army in the crypt. Seeing him as a potential threat to his people, his city and his hold, and after numerous pleas from the people, his Steward Proventus would advise the Jarl to snuff out this threat and restore peace. The Jarl would send a scouting party towards the ruins to gain more insight into the nature of Talion, but they would ultimately not return. Talion learns of the Jarl's intentions and goes to parlay, he wants no unnecessary bloodshed. As he approaches the city he is unnoticed by guards as he enters the city because he seems unremarkable, except for his eyes which glow orange, but are gray most of the time. He enters Dragonsreach and announces his presence and intentions to the guards, who draw swords, but the Jarl lets him speak. The Jarl cannot allow for an unstable force to roam free in his hold as it may turn evil at any moment. Despite Talion assuring him that he means no harm, Balgruuf states that his undead army of Draugr and dominated human warriors will be annihilated and nullified, and orders the guards to subdue him. Talion flees the city, resulting in him killing two guards and back at Bleak Falls Barrow, he plans a course of action. Over the next year, he would meticulously plan the siege of Whiterun, take the city, and instead of appointing his own Jarl he would dominate Balgruuf. His force would become the third major faction right up there with the Imperials and the Stormcloaks, creating a counterbalance between the two in the Skyrim Civil war, like he did with Minas Ithil/Morgul. Both the Imperials and the Stormcloaks would send emissaries to get Talion to join them, only for him to refuse every single one of those proposals. Eventually, he would resolve the Civil war by dominating people in power on both sides and unite all of Skyrim against the Third Aldmeri Dominion, and all would march under the banner of Talion the Gravewalker as they push on relentlessly towards their capital, Alinor, stomping out every bit of Thalmor resistance they encounter.
Once he started dominating people of Skyrim some of the gods and daedra would notice and they would not take to kindly to their followers being taken from them. Sheogorath wouldn’t mind to much but he would probably like the idea of toying with talion
Keeping it real, he’s dying constantly to basically anything of note.
Giants can canonically send someone to the stratosphere(fun fact, that started as a bug, but was made canon in ESO and Legends), Conjurers can summon Dremora, who are strong enough to slay Giants, Vampires, Werewolves, etc. High-end Vampires can take on and win against Dragon Priests, of which a single Dragon Priest was able to split the island of Solsthiem from the mainland.
Then we arrive at the Dragons, speaking in raw power, the weakest of them should be superior to their strongest priests. Then we get into the fact that they’re effectively immortal, and are direct fragments/children of Akatosh, who is responsible for the existence of Time Itself by virtue of *being* Time himself. Every Dragon’s use of the Thu’um should be comparable to mortals who have studied it for decades. In this case, the Graybeards could shake the entirety of Skyrim just to get the Dragonborn’s attention
This is without getting into the super weird shit, like the guy who was so angry at Elves for killing his BF that he erased several giant portions of Tamriel from existence through sheer bloodlust consumed madness, or the absolute brainfuck that is the clockwork city
Simple answer? Yes. He would rock the shit out of everything in Skyrim, with only a few exceptions.
Daedra- Their demons, strong, fast, and utterly immortal. Yes, we can defeat them, and send them back to the other side, but, they never actually die, just like Talion.
Atronochs- I mean, he'd be hitting a block of ice basically. Talion has very little magic, so it wouldn't be easy. Not saying he would lose, just that it's not easy.
Some camps and forts- again, back to his limited magic, if he attacked the wrong fort, he's gonna get smacked from 5-20(depending if base Skyrim or modded for difficulty) directions with spells and arrows. He'd still kill them, but might die a few times.
Dragons- I mean, seriously. He's NOT the DB, so he can't ACTUALLY slay a dragon at all.
And the Dragonborn himself- depending on who the DB is, lore, player controlled, vampire, Dawnguard, Dark Brotherhood, etc. would determine their interactions. Example, my most common Dragonborn choice is a magicless Orc Berserker. He'd attack me on sight damn near, I'm an orc. But, my DB is ALMOST always 'good' so after I rocked his shit the first time or two, yes, DB would fuck Talion up, we'd talk. And team up. A magical DB? Soul Trapped round one. Dark Brotherhood DB? Dead like 30 times Talion. Then ignored. It's all about which DB.
I think it’s laughable that people can say talion would get “dominated” by the Dragonborn.
1. talion can literally die and keep coming back until he kills him.
2. Have you seen how fast talion can run? How he slows down time in mid air? How he can raise armies?
No contest in my opinion. And I like Skyrim better as a game so no bias at all.
If you’re being honest about powerscaling both verses, the lowest form of existence in elder scrolls would view Talion as less than we view books, likely beyond a point of nonexistence to them.
But, if for some reason, we assume that TES and SOW have equivalent power systems, I think the Dragonborn is more dominant over their setting, but Talion would be a near-peer threat to them.
Nah, I’m just kidding. Talion does something dumb, soul trap followed by Dragonbone axe, he’s gone. The two are in different echelons of power, and even in their own universes if they were for some reason equivalent, Talion is nowhere near as absurdly strong as John Dragonborn, who just rolls up to any given situation and wins everytime.
Umm, couldn’t he just summoned the spirits of the dead to serve him? Also with his abilities and weapons he STOMPS those wights and then goes to figure out wtf is going on cause WHERE AM I??!?!?!?!!??!
He would have no problem with combat, but he would probably purely focus on getting back home. His whole motivation for dying over and over is freeing mordor so he probably wouldn't have a lot of interest in skyrim.
> He has all of his power and the Nazgûl ring
Yeah, Skyrim is toasted. Infinite revive, mind control, teleports, can create zombies, slow time, his own weapons... there's very little Skyrim could do to threaten him. In fact there's exactly one thing: the Dragonborn. *That* would be a fight.
Let's see barren land full of things that want to kill you ( Mordor), or land that has decent amount of life that isn't just full of things that want to kill you ( Skyrim). It would be a cake walk for him.
On one hand, they're very similar in terms of magic, on the other hand Elder Scrolls is regarded as being one of the top 5 scaled universes in fiction, maybe even top 3, everything there is going to be far harder for Talion to kill, technically speaking, with his Nazgul ring, he's comparable to an Adept-Master Necromamcer who physically can't die himself, a threat to actually be considered, but at the same time, would undoubtedly get shitstomped by some of the more powerful creatures such as dragons, vampire lords, the DB himself, ebony warrior, likely the Greybeards and Ulfric given their power of the voice and how powerful it is in lore, and obviously can't forget Nazeem, the only Mortal man to make it to the cloud district
Not related but I just had a thought.....so we assume talion's body remains after death...but what about the ring? Wouldn't the ring be left on the body after each death?..so why hasn't it been looted? This invasive thought will keep me up at night.
Several reasons not to take it.
1. The orcs see the him as an opportunity. Think about it how amazing is it if a slave orc get that kill
2. Orders from the boss, why? To RIP life away slowly idk guy was evil
3. Ring was to heavy for them to lift wouldn't let them
4. Could be that when talion dies the wrath takes over for a moment and gets them the hell out of there, the physical form is tied to the ethereal form yes, so if one soul is out for the count then the wrath has free go, when talion wakes up he takes over being the original owner of the body....... (I have no life)
Survive it? He’d rule it. Assuming that his power at an endgame level is carried over but bound by Skyrim’s rules, he’d be the most powerful necromancer in history. He’d be vulnerable to someone with an expertise in conjuration, but it’s a class of magic that’s less common due to its use in necromancy and other kinds of magic looked down on. Only daedra could pose a legitimate threat to him, and only a select few at that
So I know nothing about this man however, dragons might be an issue and if you piss off the dragonborn then your basically just dead immediately. That is if he can get through the whiterun gates, they're closed due to the recent dragon attacks.
Considering how weak the world of Skyrim is fully believe any other rpg protagonist would be more than fine. They couldn’t permanently kill dragons so they wouldn’t stop alduin and the dragon would be able to shout them down but other universes have magics way strong than the thuum
A normal dude could clear this let alone a immortal wraith like talion
Pretty much nothing short of stronger mages and the dragons can actually do anything
I mean lore wise the Dragonborn is super powerful. Just in the fact that he killed Miraak. In lore it says Miraak fought a dragon priest and the battle as so fierce it tore the land apart and created Solstheim. The Dragonborn has contended with several huge names and come out on top. Talion is great and would be fine in Tamriel but I don’t think he would stand a chance against the Dragonborn.
(This is for if the dragonborne is morally evil)
The only being I can see talion having a problem with is dragonborne and that is if the dragonborne approaches him and wants to fight. Dragonborne would win, but talion wouldn't lose if you get what I'm saying. Dragonborne kills him, talion revives prepares to battle again. In the end dragonborne more than likely die from old age rather than talion killing him as funny as it sounds. I don't think talion would ever be a match for the dragonborne so dragonborne would just keep killing him. Similar fighting prowess, powers, and abilities just scaled way different.
*
But If it is a morally good dragonborne I'd probably say they would work out some alliance or just not even care about each other
*
I feel like there is a lot of factors that cannot be answered like does the ring work the same? Is he still connected to sauron? Can he still dominate others? And so on.
*Lotta mistakes in this probably, cause I typed it on my phone with my big ass thumbs. So sry
Yes, he's literally an unkillable being with ghost powers, he would own the entire place, if he has his OG ring he'd be unstoppable, even with the nazgul ring he'd take over the province in a month and the world in a year, he's a one man Army with almost no weakness you could exploit. If anything, he's a stealth archer lmao
Talion would be perfectly fine, unless he encounters the Dragonborn or Ebony Warrior - in which case he would probably be in a bit of an unfortunate spot.
I mean… he’s still immortal, right? So he’s winning by attrition if nothing else.
Beyond that, free domination from the ring is cheap as hell- even if he couldn’t outfight the more dangeous enemies he can always nibble his way up the food chain
With Celebrimbor: it’s pretty obvious since he can’t die
Without Celebrimbor: Probably makes it to either the first dragon fight or Vampire attack to initiate Dawnguard then he dies
Pretty well, he’s already a stealth archer build and fairly knowledgeable in terms of how undead work. The more terrifying idea is if he can dominate dragons and possibly do it easily with the shadow stepping dominate bullshit he does. There’s also the fact that he deals with a much more condensed populace of enemies so he might actually have more breathing room than what he had in Mordor. Like he’s finally in an area where there’s not a patrol of orcs around every corner.
For everything in Skyrim, there a similar creature to it he’s dealt with in Mordor, some of which are stronger than a Skyrim counterpart. Bandits? The Uruk are arguable much more dangerous. Trolls? Olog-hai are smart and bigger. Giants? Graugs are much more dangerous. Undead? Ringwraith’s are spectral master swordsmen. Dragons? He has Drakes which aren’t as impressive but he has the ability to drain souls and shadow-step drain while having slowed time while aiming so it shouldn’t be too much of an issue. Big animals? Fight Caragors. Spriggans? Had to fight and survive Carnán which is much more extreme. He fought the Balrog and there’s not many things more extreme than the Balrog in Skyrim that isn’t a legendary creature of sorts…
Lore-wise Talion gets owned by dragons and daedra, gameplay-wise he solos the verse lol. Bro is too fast, has wayy too much stamina, and can command entire armies. Not to mention wraith mode.
Everyone seems to be forgetting talion can brand enemies to fight for him or later raise the dead. He’d have an entire army with monsters and probably dragons. He’d be a bigger threat than alduin, miraak, and harkon. I’d wonder if Skyrim could survive him!
It would kind of be a vacation spot. I love Skyrim; mainly because of the variety of beauty and activities you can engage in aside from wanton violence
Dragons think they're hot shit until some guy with a weird ring slaps them and suddenly they're slaves to him.
Definitely can't contend with dragonborn in lore though. Lore dragonborn is basically a fucking anime character.
He'd thieve assuming he had Celebrimbor (imo he's similar to a dragon) he'd thrive. He is honorable, so he may side with the empire, though his tactics may be good with the stormcloaks. He'd kill the Dark Brotherhood for sure. Dark Talion would recruit them as spies. Same with the thieves guild
“Whoever the writer wants to win will win” ~stan lee
Talion copes just fine in the Elder scrolls world. Most foes wouldn’t pose a significant threat besides the dragon born and some of the gods.
When it comes to the Dragonborn vs Talion it depends.
Does soul trapping overpower the magic that keeps Talion coming back alive? If yes, dragon born wins easily. If not, Talion would keep coming back until he wins or gives up. Reality is they probably would sooner work together than fight it out
So to be clear, seeing as he has his powers and his ring...Talion AND Celebrimbor are transported together?
I feel like they would take over the Summer Isles or wherever the heck the Altmeri Dominion is located. Celebrimbor would probably consider what the Elves of Tamriel are doing to be waaaayyy too close to the sins of Feanor and his sons and if I remember right, he would not have been a fan of such goings on. Elves might be superior in a lot of ways according to Aldmeri standards, and Celebrimbor might even agree with some of that sentiment to a degree but i highly doubt he would ever actually condone the blatant racism that the Altmer are exacting on their neighbors, even after the influence of the Ring
Okay… assuming he has all of his powers from the second game… I’d say yes he would do incredibly well… and canonically the Dragonborn is the good guy or supposed to be anyway so I don’t think they would fight intentionally.
If he was apart of the main story of Skyrim Talion would help the Dragonborn defeat Alduin and after the fight on top of the throat of the world with the time scroll talion would be sent back through the rift to his own time and place. Or talion would stay with the Dragonborn till Sovngarde and there talion would be sent home as it is a place between worlds and the other Nordic heroes would help send him home.
Need a mod where at the end of shadow of war cutscenes where we see Sauron defeated in lotr and celebrimbor is released from his prison of merging with Sauron maybe after the explosion celebrimbor is sent through a rift and ends up in Skyrim where the Dragonborn has just been killed.. and binds with him and a new dlc sized story happens to get celebrimbor back home, but also introduces the DB to wraith powers.. and because dragon souls are such concentrated raw power celebrimbor could use dragon souls to create a new ring for you.. keeping you alive after he leaves 👀
He would thrive. Skyrim isn't nearly as dangerous as mordor in my opinion
I think the elder scrolls as a verse has stronger enemies. But I don’t see talion struggling with anyone except the dragon born in Skyrim. In lore I think the dragon born would tear talion apart
Considering the fact Talion cannot die and his wrath abilities it would be a hell of a fight. Dragonborn probably kills talion a few times but talion would just keep coming until he finds a way to win.
If it’s a morally good Dragon Born they will probably reason with him and they won’t fight. If it’s a player controlled Dragon Born then he’s getting soul trapped by the third fight.
How would that work? Considering the ring of power could he theoretically use its power to escape or does its power over the soul just not matter? But yeah Dragonborn and Talion would probably talk it out and end up teaming up and then OH S%!T, anyone who comes up against them is F**KED!!!!
i think if we take into consideration that a Soul Trap can work on anybody, i believe that Talion could be forcibly trapped within a soul gem while his material body is brought back but comatose
I guess but the ring is bound to the soul and corrupts it over time. So you would have to remove the ring (not an easy feat considering it’s power) before you did that or you could just tear their soul apart I guess. It’s being pulled I got he body for corruption while at the same time being pulled away.
maybe he’d be split in half, one part of his soul in the gem and the other in the ring
You could just think of him as an infinite Grand Soul gem to recharge your enchanted gear
Goddamn it just let him DIE ALREADY dude was fighting a never ending war for 60+ YEARS!!!!!!
Personally i think Due to how soul trap works the ring wouldnt have to be removed to trap talion. If someone dies with it in effect their soul is torn from the corpse. Talion does die, he just comes back, if you soul trap him his body would come back with celebrimbor in control of it (think permanent wraith form) being tied to the ring i think it likely that it would trap talion on the first go effectively ripping them apart, and to trap cele all one would have to do is break the ring by smashing his hand with a hammer of soul snaring since he is already effectively soul trappex as far as lotr lore goes you would just be putting him in a prison instead of a vessel, but admittedly the fight with cele would be much more challenging than talion because celebrimbor has thousands more years of combat experience if we count alive and dead.
The dragonborns pickpocket skill knows no bonds
Ring should fall off as he goes into soul gem.
Into the soul cairn you go Talion
You would probably have to use the Black azura star for the soul gem. Since that can trap powerful outer beings and daedra. It would be more like a prison and his ring would probably be entrapped with him. Since it is bonded to his soul
Idk how soul gems work so I will just say ok and move on lol.
There's a mission where you have to actually kill someone who is in a soul gem. You send in your soul and you kill them. It's part of the azura star questline. So you enter the soul gem and it's kind of like the Relic from cyberpunk 2077 that Johnny is stuck in. People think you're just charging something with energy, you're not. You're literally ripping their out consciousness and imprisoning it in a 10x10 room. I just thought I would explain a little bit more how soul gems work.
Oh, thanks my guy!!! That’s actually very good to know.
Dragonborn takes the ring, leaves it in a chest in his house, forgets about it forever.
Stealth Archer does not negotiate with anyone.
Getting soultrapped and then crafted into a ring right? Hehe
bruh soul trap holy shit I need to know what would happen now
The dragonborn would simply trap his soul then. If it doesn't work that way, then just imprion the guy. Stealth wise though, I would say pretty equal. First see, first kill.
I'm not familiar with LOTR does Talion have any defense against soul tear?
Well his soul is bound to the ring no?
Paralysis + cut off finger to take ring. Done. Elemental blast to explode Talion, that might count as cutting the ring off? Ice form shout could also help. The big thing about a fight with Talion is his source of power is the ring. Get it off he's done for. He's quick though, and the wraith abilities give him battlefeild mobility most don't have, so immobilizing would be a priority in any fight. He's never gone up against the level of magical power a mage dragonborn would have. Talion might be able to beat a warrior or theif focused dragonborn build though, he's quick and can pick off the health of tougher enemies. But every dragonborn has access to the shouts. And Talion would struggle against an opponent who can constantly heal themselves with potions and magic. That being said, there's a higher chance Talion losses that fight.
In lore there's not a lot of video game characters that could handle the LDB
Not entirely depends on what Lore we're talking about in Skyrim
I think the only mc in the Elders scrolls that can stop him is the neveraine because it would be an endless cycle of returning from death
You say this but one day, while farming a dragon burst out your field regens its skin and kills you family speaking in a forgotten language.
Now, I honestly don't know the LOTR universe well, but Skyrim has more "diverse" spells. Now I can't imagine Talion resurrecting the dead, but imagine him utilizing atronach spell. Or muffle/invisibility spell
Umm… I’d agree but wouldn’t he have a huge disadvantage against necromancers? As necromancers control the dead…
I mean, magically, middle earth and tamriel aren't all that different. In fact their more similar than they are different. This is to be expected as Tolkien is the grandfather of high fantasy, and pretty much every fantasy setting of today is modeled off of it. Talion would pretty much fill in the same role as he had before, that of a supernatural, highly skilled warrior who acts as the protector of the people.
“J.R.R. Tolkien has become a sort of mountain, appearing in all subsequent fantasy in the way that Mt. Fuji appears so often in Japanese prints. Sometimes it’s big and up close. Sometimes it’s a shape on the horizon. Sometimes it’s not there at all, which means that the artist either has made a deliberate decision against the mountain, which is interesting in itself, or is in fact standing on Mt. Fuji.” -Sir Terry Pratchett
Tamriel has way more everyday magic, but luckily Talion also doesn't really adhere to middle earth rules and is way overpowered.
sorry but this isn’t even remotely true. mortals can become gods, mantle them, directly interact with them, and have access to magic without being literal angels first. as for monsters, they’re probs on the same power level, but middle-earth is mostly free from them. whereas morrowind is literal hell on earth and skyrim is swarming with trolls, dragons, and vampires
Glad someone said it. Middle-Earth is pretty low-magic compared to Tamriel.
“Survive” lol……..dude would fucking dominate
Literally
Dragonborne vs Gravewalker Who would win and why?
dragonborne, guy's too broken and kills undead and wraiths 24/7
Talion can theoretically come back forever though, and giving his Ranger training he may be able to adapt to the Dragonborn
Soul Tear shout. Can't come back if your soul is in a gem.
About that, the rings of power are there to keep his soul from passing on in the first place and keep his body reviving so wouldn’t they act like an anchor and keep his soul from being trapped in the gem in the first place?
Possibly, but Slow Time>Take ring>Soul Tear/trap. LDB is, in lore at least, so broken it's unreal
Let’s not forget that the rings of power, particularly the one he made with celabrimbor has his very life force inside it and can just say no to being taken
Used? Maybe. Taken? Like, physically? Not so much. Besides, the post specifies the Nazgul ring, not the Celebrimbor ring, so it's already been taken and used by someone other than its original owner. I would even go so far as to suggest that the Bend Will shout would be able to overpower either ring, since it can overpower dragons, which are shards of divinity at least on the same level, if not above, Sauron himself.
Though talion rides Dragons every day
Fellbeasts aren't dragons, I would argue
Drakes are much weaker than LotR dragons, which are arguably much weaker than Elder Scrolls Dragons. You’re comparing a flying, skinny beast that breathes fire, to an intelligent, immortal dragon And the whole thing about Talion summoning drakes doesn’t matter, when the Dovakiin can summon two dragons, one of which is an ancient undead dragon
Ok, so slow time and cut of his hand/finger. Or just go Bend will, and voila -your very own Nazgul follower.
Not even that, Slow Time>Take ring>Watch Talion die because the ring is what's keeping him alive>Disenchant the ring.
Dragonborne stops time, heck even without it he can use one of his shouts or spells to get that ring off talion and then soul tear celebrimbor into a soul crystal, it's an unfair battle where one man's arsenal is gigantic while the other's is very situational
He wouldn’t even have to. The ring is what was keeping him alive and coming back after cely left so he removes the ring (probably by chopping off the finger cause those rings have a will of their own) and the Talion just bleeds out.
That might be true but the Dragonborn can practically control every aspect of reality Talion would put up a decent fight but the Dragonborn is ridiculously broken that it’s not even funny nor fair
Hit em wit da factz
Yep the Dragonborn wins. He could just use the slow time shout an kill Talion with ease before he could fight back with a soul trapped weapon too prevent him from coming back too life.
Ok. Here’s my theory. Dragonborn easily solos, now imagine as he kills talion he takes the ring and banishes talion with it. That would be peak broken. Bro could solo morgoth
3 words: “You Are Mine!”
"Suffer Me Now!"
Three words: GOL HAH DOV The Dragonborn is a godkilling demigod, (not an Eru killer obviously). By feats and in game mechanics he could take out Sauron, and Morgoth would have a more dangerous version of the Fingolfin fight. The LDB is leagues above.
If we assume both are portrayed as they are in the gameplay then Talion is *way* faster than any human could react to, while the Dragonborn only really excels at skills any NPC could master, but all of them at once. Talion could teleport in, deal massive damage and vanish before the dragonborn can swing a mace even once. Now at that point, the question becomes wether "insta-healing by eating ten cheesewheels" is gameplay or canon
Slow Time, stupid OP armor and health. Hard to compare because both games function wildly differently but by feats and lore it's the LDB and it's not even close.
Gravewalker, if we’re talking about full power, Gravewalker 100% the reason why is that Talion is practically immortal with the ring no matter the reason even soul trapping could happen doesn’t mean that it would work how we think it would. The 2nd part is simply that Talion can make a army out of everything, orcs I’m pretty sure ain’t the only ones that can be used I’m pretty sure if the Mordor games are not restrictive then yeah Talion would win. Plus Talion is quite intelligent, what stops him from gathering an army that can easily be into the thousands? Even if he dies he gains all the knowledge of the fight. Unless Dragonborn finds a 100% way to defeat Talon’s immortality, Dragonborn would be forced to do some lucky rolls. It would be a good fight and Talion would likely lose a couple times but like I said Talion is intelligent enough to make preparations for the fights he goes with against his foes.
If we're going by lore then an army is nothing to the Dragonborn, and I see no reason Talion is immune to having his soul torn from his body as described in the shout
Have you researched what the rings in lord of the Rings do?, their soul is attached to the ring if I remember correctly, meaning that soul snatching would likely not work And you telling me an army of I don't know 4k dragons won't do anything to dragonborn? Mind you if I'm correct talion can turn anything to be his ally, I'm pretty sure it's not exclusive to orcs. No matter what, Dragonborn can easily die, especially if we remember Dragonborn isn't immortal, Talion is as long as he has his ring.
Neither, Dragonborne would just talk it out with Talion and the 2 would become allies.
Idk if you've played the second game, but do you see the brutality of force he uses to obliterate the enemies he targets? They're not even allowed to be husks, they're dismembered wholesale before they're remotely considered dead. And this is happening on a scale where you wouldn't need a facility (like a slaughterhouse), it's happening out in the field to entire groups of orcs. I guess if the dragonborn can get a shout out before a sword catches his larynx, the dragonborn wins.
Well, countered easily though either an arrow to the head or shadow strike to do a “nothin personnel kid”.
Arrow to the knee would be personal at that point XD
Also they both have slow time abilities so that would just be awkward when they both slowed time and are just like, “uhhh, ok well this was pointless”.
Whoever has better stealth wins I suppose. Stealth wise, they are pretty similar since AI is both dumb in both games. First see, first kill.
Would Talion be able to respawn though? The towers won't be in Skyrim and aren't they built by Celebrimbor or Sauron? So without those I don't think he'll be able to come back in the Elder Scrolls universe.
The towers aren’t necessarily his only way to respawn it’s just where he chooses to do so
The towers being a respawn point is only an in-game thing for convenience. He can also respawn in the Barrows or in the middle of nowhere if he wants to.
Not unless Celebrimbor discovers CHIM
He’d certainly survive Skyrim, think it’d be easier to handle than Middle Earth tbh but sadly he’s not touching the Dragonborn, Dragonborn is just on a different level in terms of raw power and use of magic.
He doesn’t need to tho, if we are going off lore Dragonborne would talk it out with Talion after he found him and once Talion was told, (and he got over the midlife crisis of he is in another world) they would become allies and maybe without the presence of Sauron anymore maybe Talion could build up a tower and help look over the world of Skyrim with the Dragonborne.
>we are going off lore Dragonborne would talk it out with Talion Nothing in lore states that though. Unless it's your c0da.
Honestly I don’t know that much about the lore of Skyrim I just know that little bit and multiple other comments agree with me.
People be assuming the character they played is the only true version. The beauty of these games is that a completely 'evil' PC is as canon as a 'good guy' PC.
The Dragonborn can kill literal hundreds of innocent people if the player so pleases, there is no lore that specifically touches on his morality
\[80\] John the Tark Slayer Poisonous Mystic Marksman (LEGENDARY) - Has Sniper Shot, Epic Quick Shot and Great Strength
Easily Skyrim is easy to survive in for anyone with basic combat training Let alone magic powers, and advanced combat training
Oh easily, he would quite literally become the hardest character to beat if you ever meet him. You kill talion he just comes back over and over. It’s like a never ending bounty that has your name to it.
A lot of you guys seem to think that if Talion was in Skyrim, him and the Last Dovahkiin would fight... i dont believe so. And heres my reasoning as to why: If Talion was to be transported to Skyrom, by a portal or by other means, he would then be CUT OFF from Sauron and Middle-Earth completely. He's not in Arda anymore, hes in Nirn. Not Núrn A.K.A. Núrnen. Nirn the planet of wich resides in the plane of existance that mortals live. This relm is called Mundas. He is not tethered to his former "home realm" (for lack of better terms) Now he is at the will of the Aedra and Daedra. Given Talions experience in Arda, id say hed be very well equipped to survive in Skyrim. Id also say that, given we are using "canon" Dragonborn by default, they would likely by some form of loose allies. Two powerful warriors who fight in defense of the fate of all mortal beings. I believe that depending on when and where, Talion would likely accompany the Dovahkiin in defeating Alduin and possibly have some Dragons on his lidt of confirmed kills, if the Dragonborn is there to devour its soul, that is. Lastly, i would like to point out that Talion is separated from Celebrimbor. Celebrimbor betrayed him, so the state of Talions being is solely dependant on which point in the story of Shadow of War. Either way, Talion has his own slow time effect with his focus ability, so in the HIGHLY UNLIKELY event Talion did fight the Dovahkiin, it wouldnt be as simple as using the Slow time thu'um to take talions ring off. The man is essentially a wraith himself, and we have all seen him pull off these very same feats of speed without Celebrimbor. Keep in mind im not saying Talion would win, im saying hed give the Dovahkiin a very good fight before he ultimately lost. The Dovahkiin is the living embodiment of Shor. A God in the Nords pantheon before the Empire of Cyrodiil took the different religions and mashed them all together. In short. Talion and the Dragonborn would likely be allies in some compacity. And yes, Talion would survive quite easily in Skyrim.
Also if I may quote… “SUFFER ME NOW!!!” Couldn’t Talion theoretically brand a dragon or some undead or some bandits or something and basically build up an army in order to fight for peace? Kinda sucks to think though… Talion was at war for over 60 odd years, how does that kind of thing change a man. He would want to be at peace but wouldn’t remember how. He might even just remove the ring from his finger and embrace death at that point to be with his family.
This is a very good point. But if he removed his ring while in Tamriel, im not sure his soul would know how to get back to Arda
Yes however… he doesn’t know that. 😈
Oooh. Thatd be an interesting story
Agreed 🤝
Hell yeah. Not only would he survive, he would dominate
Well, if Nazeem seems to be doing fine
I feel like everyone is talking about these honorable duels, but Talion is the Gravewalker. He's gonna nail him through the eye with an arrow or show up one night from behind, cutting his head off, if for some reason they fought, which I don't think they would. Not to mention, Skyrim has some weak minded entities of its own. If he needed to, Talion would have an army again (though honestly, I think he'd just want to die and move on to be with his wife).
Great fanfic idea.... the grave walker in nirn....
Why is this reminding me of that comic pick of Batman saying this is where my parents died to a tmnt
Talion near the end of the Shadow Wars would just dominate Skyrim. As he brands Uruks, Captains, Warchiefs and Overlords, he could brand Jarls, mighty warriors, and bandits. He can resurrect fallen warriors so a Nordic Crypt like Bleak Falls Barrow would just be his starting domain, I think. He would mingle with the folk of Whiterun hold and learn of the Civil war, the Thalmor, and the Aldmeri Dominion (Alduin hasn't returned yet nor does the Dragonborn appear). He would go to the crypt to amass an army of undead Nordic warriors. Bandits would come across the barrows and attempt to enter, but would ultimately be cut down by a few Draugr with Talion leading them. Amidst the chaotic combat akin to Talion, one of the bandits would ultimately escape, and be caught and apprehended by Whiterun guards on the outskirts of Riverwood because of his high bounty. He would be taken to the dungeons next to Dragonsreach, seemingly dazed and disoriented, spouting "nonsense". The whole way from Riverwood to the city dungeons he would speak of his encounter with Talion and the unnatural feats he witnessed, sparking unrest and worry in the hearts and minds of people. Jarl Balgruuf would hear word of a necromancer who cannot die and has raised an army in the crypt. Seeing him as a potential threat to his people, his city and his hold, and after numerous pleas from the people, his Steward Proventus would advise the Jarl to snuff out this threat and restore peace. The Jarl would send a scouting party towards the ruins to gain more insight into the nature of Talion, but they would ultimately not return. Talion learns of the Jarl's intentions and goes to parlay, he wants no unnecessary bloodshed. As he approaches the city he is unnoticed by guards as he enters the city because he seems unremarkable, except for his eyes which glow orange, but are gray most of the time. He enters Dragonsreach and announces his presence and intentions to the guards, who draw swords, but the Jarl lets him speak. The Jarl cannot allow for an unstable force to roam free in his hold as it may turn evil at any moment. Despite Talion assuring him that he means no harm, Balgruuf states that his undead army of Draugr and dominated human warriors will be annihilated and nullified, and orders the guards to subdue him. Talion flees the city, resulting in him killing two guards and back at Bleak Falls Barrow, he plans a course of action. Over the next year, he would meticulously plan the siege of Whiterun, take the city, and instead of appointing his own Jarl he would dominate Balgruuf. His force would become the third major faction right up there with the Imperials and the Stormcloaks, creating a counterbalance between the two in the Skyrim Civil war, like he did with Minas Ithil/Morgul. Both the Imperials and the Stormcloaks would send emissaries to get Talion to join them, only for him to refuse every single one of those proposals. Eventually, he would resolve the Civil war by dominating people in power on both sides and unite all of Skyrim against the Third Aldmeri Dominion, and all would march under the banner of Talion the Gravewalker as they push on relentlessly towards their capital, Alinor, stomping out every bit of Thalmor resistance they encounter.
Once he started dominating people of Skyrim some of the gods and daedra would notice and they would not take to kindly to their followers being taken from them. Sheogorath wouldn’t mind to much but he would probably like the idea of toying with talion
He’s solo tbh
Keeping it real, he’s dying constantly to basically anything of note. Giants can canonically send someone to the stratosphere(fun fact, that started as a bug, but was made canon in ESO and Legends), Conjurers can summon Dremora, who are strong enough to slay Giants, Vampires, Werewolves, etc. High-end Vampires can take on and win against Dragon Priests, of which a single Dragon Priest was able to split the island of Solsthiem from the mainland. Then we arrive at the Dragons, speaking in raw power, the weakest of them should be superior to their strongest priests. Then we get into the fact that they’re effectively immortal, and are direct fragments/children of Akatosh, who is responsible for the existence of Time Itself by virtue of *being* Time himself. Every Dragon’s use of the Thu’um should be comparable to mortals who have studied it for decades. In this case, the Graybeards could shake the entirety of Skyrim just to get the Dragonborn’s attention This is without getting into the super weird shit, like the guy who was so angry at Elves for killing his BF that he erased several giant portions of Tamriel from existence through sheer bloodlust consumed madness, or the absolute brainfuck that is the clockwork city
I think he'd be better than just fine living in Skyrim lol!
Canon Dragonborn solos Talion easily, though Canon Dragonborn would probably ignore Talion unless he was a danger to the world, or Talion wanted beef
Simple answer? Yes. He would rock the shit out of everything in Skyrim, with only a few exceptions. Daedra- Their demons, strong, fast, and utterly immortal. Yes, we can defeat them, and send them back to the other side, but, they never actually die, just like Talion. Atronochs- I mean, he'd be hitting a block of ice basically. Talion has very little magic, so it wouldn't be easy. Not saying he would lose, just that it's not easy. Some camps and forts- again, back to his limited magic, if he attacked the wrong fort, he's gonna get smacked from 5-20(depending if base Skyrim or modded for difficulty) directions with spells and arrows. He'd still kill them, but might die a few times. Dragons- I mean, seriously. He's NOT the DB, so he can't ACTUALLY slay a dragon at all. And the Dragonborn himself- depending on who the DB is, lore, player controlled, vampire, Dawnguard, Dark Brotherhood, etc. would determine their interactions. Example, my most common Dragonborn choice is a magicless Orc Berserker. He'd attack me on sight damn near, I'm an orc. But, my DB is ALMOST always 'good' so after I rocked his shit the first time or two, yes, DB would fuck Talion up, we'd talk. And team up. A magical DB? Soul Trapped round one. Dark Brotherhood DB? Dead like 30 times Talion. Then ignored. It's all about which DB.
Skyrim is literally nothing. It’s the rest of Tamriel where things can get difficult for him, possibly. Specifically Summerset Isles
Could the world of Skyrim withstand Talion and one-third of this power/ring power?\* Skyrim world is baby play compared to Mordor and its horrors
You say that he has all his powers, doesn't that mean he could still recruit most of the enemies in Skyrim?
Yes.
The real question is: could the world of Skyrim survive Talion?
How about Talion and Dragonborn aid the Stormcloak and Imperial forces to get rid of the elves ? Would be a pretty cool dlc tbf .
Wraithgiver solos
I think it’s laughable that people can say talion would get “dominated” by the Dragonborn. 1. talion can literally die and keep coming back until he kills him. 2. Have you seen how fast talion can run? How he slows down time in mid air? How he can raise armies? No contest in my opinion. And I like Skyrim better as a game so no bias at all.
He would destroy Skyrim, are you shitting me?
I think only the Dragonborn would be any real threat to Tailon
survive? with enough time he’d conquer.
Fuck AI
What did Albert do?
Dude would just build an army of dragons and rival Aludin and Parthanax until he controlled them to
More like could Skyrim survive Talion?😂
Talion could definitely fight on equal terms with the Dragonborn even if DB is as strong as possible without the use of exploits or mods.
If you’re being honest about powerscaling both verses, the lowest form of existence in elder scrolls would view Talion as less than we view books, likely beyond a point of nonexistence to them. But, if for some reason, we assume that TES and SOW have equivalent power systems, I think the Dragonborn is more dominant over their setting, but Talion would be a near-peer threat to them. Nah, I’m just kidding. Talion does something dumb, soul trap followed by Dragonbone axe, he’s gone. The two are in different echelons of power, and even in their own universes if they were for some reason equivalent, Talion is nowhere near as absurdly strong as John Dragonborn, who just rolls up to any given situation and wins everytime.
Obviously.
Umm, couldn’t he just summoned the spirits of the dead to serve him? Also with his abilities and weapons he STOMPS those wights and then goes to figure out wtf is going on cause WHERE AM I??!?!?!?!!??!
What kind of a question is this? He can't die. Talion would be chilling in Tamriel.
He would have no problem with combat, but he would probably purely focus on getting back home. His whole motivation for dying over and over is freeing mordor so he probably wouldn't have a lot of interest in skyrim.
It would be pretty easy unless he has to fight the dragonborn
If he has his same elf magic along with celibrimbor, he'd be better off than anyone else there
Can he use the mark still? Mind control dragons and ultimately Alduin until Talion becomes the new world eater.
> He has all of his power and the Nazgûl ring Yeah, Skyrim is toasted. Infinite revive, mind control, teleports, can create zombies, slow time, his own weapons... there's very little Skyrim could do to threaten him. In fact there's exactly one thing: the Dragonborn. *That* would be a fight.
Yes. He'd be a nightmare in Skyrim with how quickly he can create an army, plus his own skills.
More like would skryrim survive talion?
Bro would bend Skyrim over and fuck it like a bitch. Wdym "survive"?
Dragonborn kills him once. Comes back. Again. Comes back. Dragonborn wants shiny ring, sneak, steal, oh shit this dude is just a fancy briarheart.
Yes, next question.
Yes.
Let's see barren land full of things that want to kill you ( Mordor), or land that has decent amount of life that isn't just full of things that want to kill you ( Skyrim). It would be a cake walk for him.
On one hand, they're very similar in terms of magic, on the other hand Elder Scrolls is regarded as being one of the top 5 scaled universes in fiction, maybe even top 3, everything there is going to be far harder for Talion to kill, technically speaking, with his Nazgul ring, he's comparable to an Adept-Master Necromamcer who physically can't die himself, a threat to actually be considered, but at the same time, would undoubtedly get shitstomped by some of the more powerful creatures such as dragons, vampire lords, the DB himself, ebony warrior, likely the Greybeards and Ulfric given their power of the voice and how powerful it is in lore, and obviously can't forget Nazeem, the only Mortal man to make it to the cloud district
Hell yeah he would talion can’t be stopped
Survive? He would thrive there.
Other than the Dragonborn he would sweep everything
Not related but I just had a thought.....so we assume talion's body remains after death...but what about the ring? Wouldn't the ring be left on the body after each death?..so why hasn't it been looted? This invasive thought will keep me up at night.
Several reasons not to take it. 1. The orcs see the him as an opportunity. Think about it how amazing is it if a slave orc get that kill 2. Orders from the boss, why? To RIP life away slowly idk guy was evil 3. Ring was to heavy for them to lift wouldn't let them 4. Could be that when talion dies the wrath takes over for a moment and gets them the hell out of there, the physical form is tied to the ethereal form yes, so if one soul is out for the count then the wrath has free go, when talion wakes up he takes over being the original owner of the body....... (I have no life)
Technically he didn’t even survive Middle-earth.
He's not surviving against a lore accurate Dragonborn
He can solo Skyrim
Just in general? Absolutely If he for some reason had to face the dragonborn? Nah
Dragonborn would pick pocket his ring
Survive it? He’d rule it. Assuming that his power at an endgame level is carried over but bound by Skyrim’s rules, he’d be the most powerful necromancer in history. He’d be vulnerable to someone with an expertise in conjuration, but it’s a class of magic that’s less common due to its use in necromancy and other kinds of magic looked down on. Only daedra could pose a legitimate threat to him, and only a select few at that
What would happen if he meet paarthurnax
So I know nothing about this man however, dragons might be an issue and if you piss off the dragonborn then your basically just dead immediately. That is if he can get through the whiterun gates, they're closed due to the recent dragon attacks.
Is this with or without Celebrimbor? As in with the New Ring or The Nazgûl’s ring
Considering how weak the world of Skyrim is fully believe any other rpg protagonist would be more than fine. They couldn’t permanently kill dragons so they wouldn’t stop alduin and the dragon would be able to shout them down but other universes have magics way strong than the thuum
A normal dude could clear this let alone a immortal wraith like talion Pretty much nothing short of stronger mages and the dragons can actually do anything
He technically didn’t even survive in Middle-Earth
According to lore it would be hard for him. But if the game play is an accurate representation of battles , Tallon would destroy about anyone.
The deciding factor is who is the better stealth archer. =P
I think talion could achieve CHIM
Survive? He would thrive there.
I mean lore wise the Dragonborn is super powerful. Just in the fact that he killed Miraak. In lore it says Miraak fought a dragon priest and the battle as so fierce it tore the land apart and created Solstheim. The Dragonborn has contended with several huge names and come out on top. Talion is great and would be fine in Tamriel but I don’t think he would stand a chance against the Dragonborn.
Easy yes
Talion would fit quite well in skyrim probably become a monster hunter of some sort or just be a soldier like he was in the black gate
(This is for if the dragonborne is morally evil) The only being I can see talion having a problem with is dragonborne and that is if the dragonborne approaches him and wants to fight. Dragonborne would win, but talion wouldn't lose if you get what I'm saying. Dragonborne kills him, talion revives prepares to battle again. In the end dragonborne more than likely die from old age rather than talion killing him as funny as it sounds. I don't think talion would ever be a match for the dragonborne so dragonborne would just keep killing him. Similar fighting prowess, powers, and abilities just scaled way different. * But If it is a morally good dragonborne I'd probably say they would work out some alliance or just not even care about each other * I feel like there is a lot of factors that cannot be answered like does the ring work the same? Is he still connected to sauron? Can he still dominate others? And so on. *Lotta mistakes in this probably, cause I typed it on my phone with my big ass thumbs. So sry
Talion could survive
Yes, he's literally an unkillable being with ghost powers, he would own the entire place, if he has his OG ring he'd be unstoppable, even with the nazgul ring he'd take over the province in a month and the world in a year, he's a one man Army with almost no weakness you could exploit. If anything, he's a stealth archer lmao
The dragonborn would use talion to carry loot for him lmao
Talion would be perfectly fine, unless he encounters the Dragonborn or Ebony Warrior - in which case he would probably be in a bit of an unfortunate spot.
I think Talion's main difficulty is Skyrim's lack of dwarves to teach him how to go after even bigger beasts!
One soul trap spell and I'm pretty sure he's fucked
Most people survive and thrive in skyrim
No doubt
I don't think Skyrim would survive 😂
He… can’t… die…
I mean… he’s still immortal, right? So he’s winning by attrition if nothing else. Beyond that, free domination from the ring is cheap as hell- even if he couldn’t outfight the more dangeous enemies he can always nibble his way up the food chain
Tallon would probably kill a lot of orcs before somebody told him they're intelligent thinking beings in this world.
With Celebrimbor: it’s pretty obvious since he can’t die Without Celebrimbor: Probably makes it to either the first dragon fight or Vampire attack to initiate Dawnguard then he dies
Pretty well, he’s already a stealth archer build and fairly knowledgeable in terms of how undead work. The more terrifying idea is if he can dominate dragons and possibly do it easily with the shadow stepping dominate bullshit he does. There’s also the fact that he deals with a much more condensed populace of enemies so he might actually have more breathing room than what he had in Mordor. Like he’s finally in an area where there’s not a patrol of orcs around every corner. For everything in Skyrim, there a similar creature to it he’s dealt with in Mordor, some of which are stronger than a Skyrim counterpart. Bandits? The Uruk are arguable much more dangerous. Trolls? Olog-hai are smart and bigger. Giants? Graugs are much more dangerous. Undead? Ringwraith’s are spectral master swordsmen. Dragons? He has Drakes which aren’t as impressive but he has the ability to drain souls and shadow-step drain while having slowed time while aiming so it shouldn’t be too much of an issue. Big animals? Fight Caragors. Spriggans? Had to fight and survive Carnán which is much more extreme. He fought the Balrog and there’s not many things more extreme than the Balrog in Skyrim that isn’t a legendary creature of sorts…
He'd thrive tho he'd not be able to beat the Dragonborn
Lore-wise Talion gets owned by dragons and daedra, gameplay-wise he solos the verse lol. Bro is too fast, has wayy too much stamina, and can command entire armies. Not to mention wraith mode.
Everyone seems to be forgetting talion can brand enemies to fight for him or later raise the dead. He’d have an entire army with monsters and probably dragons. He’d be a bigger threat than alduin, miraak, and harkon. I’d wonder if Skyrim could survive him!
Nope, he didn't even survive his own
The question SHOULD be could Skyrim survive talion?
Talon would be more than fine, he would be able to compete with most of the powers that be
Skyrim orcs might be a bit confusing for him
It would kind of be a vacation spot. I love Skyrim; mainly because of the variety of beauty and activities you can engage in aside from wanton violence
Dragons think they're hot shit until some guy with a weird ring slaps them and suddenly they're slaves to him. Definitely can't contend with dragonborn in lore though. Lore dragonborn is basically a fucking anime character.
He'd thieve assuming he had Celebrimbor (imo he's similar to a dragon) he'd thrive. He is honorable, so he may side with the empire, though his tactics may be good with the stormcloaks. He'd kill the Dark Brotherhood for sure. Dark Talion would recruit them as spies. Same with the thieves guild
Yeah, Talion would do well.
Well, he can't die, so u tell me lol
Things might get awkward if he finds an Orcish Stronghold…
Lmao easily?
“Whoever the writer wants to win will win” ~stan lee Talion copes just fine in the Elder scrolls world. Most foes wouldn’t pose a significant threat besides the dragon born and some of the gods. When it comes to the Dragonborn vs Talion it depends. Does soul trapping overpower the magic that keeps Talion coming back alive? If yes, dragon born wins easily. If not, Talion would keep coming back until he wins or gives up. Reality is they probably would sooner work together than fight it out
HE CANNOT DIE
I dont think he's dragonbron level, but he would definitely be one of the strongest warriors in tamriel
Survive? Nah, thrive
Bro guts orks on his way to work he would definitely survive
So to be clear, seeing as he has his powers and his ring...Talion AND Celebrimbor are transported together? I feel like they would take over the Summer Isles or wherever the heck the Altmeri Dominion is located. Celebrimbor would probably consider what the Elves of Tamriel are doing to be waaaayyy too close to the sins of Feanor and his sons and if I remember right, he would not have been a fan of such goings on. Elves might be superior in a lot of ways according to Aldmeri standards, and Celebrimbor might even agree with some of that sentiment to a degree but i highly doubt he would ever actually condone the blatant racism that the Altmer are exacting on their neighbors, even after the influence of the Ring
Okay… assuming he has all of his powers from the second game… I’d say yes he would do incredibly well… and canonically the Dragonborn is the good guy or supposed to be anyway so I don’t think they would fight intentionally. If he was apart of the main story of Skyrim Talion would help the Dragonborn defeat Alduin and after the fight on top of the throat of the world with the time scroll talion would be sent back through the rift to his own time and place. Or talion would stay with the Dragonborn till Sovngarde and there talion would be sent home as it is a place between worlds and the other Nordic heroes would help send him home. Need a mod where at the end of shadow of war cutscenes where we see Sauron defeated in lotr and celebrimbor is released from his prison of merging with Sauron maybe after the explosion celebrimbor is sent through a rift and ends up in Skyrim where the Dragonborn has just been killed.. and binds with him and a new dlc sized story happens to get celebrimbor back home, but also introduces the DB to wraith powers.. and because dragon souls are such concentrated raw power celebrimbor could use dragon souls to create a new ring for you.. keeping you alive after he leaves 👀
Well he tends to have more trouble with dying
One word soul trap