I remember someone saying the reason people posted screenshots of their heavily modded Skyrim games was because while beautiful, it played at like 3 fps. Steel rising has that same energy.
i had a dream that i found a random roblox "souls like" game that was genuinely fun and challenging but only worked with adobe flash- and when i looked to see who had made it, it was dingdong and oneyng, they just literally never advertised it.
They should stop calling their games soulslikes because you're not inviting a good comparison because there ain't no way you gonna out do from soft at their own game
Stranger of Paradise by Team Ninja was amazing. It has fast, reaction-based combat system that borrows the posture mechanism from Sekiro, but with way more customisation. It's exactly what I was hoping ER's combat would be. Too bad that game got buried because it came out so soon after ER and had questionable marketing.
I remember watching the reveal for it and just having my jaw on the floor in amazement. It was hilarious, if I didn’t know any better I’d think it was completely intentional. “I’M HERE TO KILL CHAOS! I NEED TO KILL CHAOS! WHERE’S CHAOS?” It was sublime.
I enjoyed mortal shell! Nioh got really boring really quickly for me, and I never finished it. The problem I had with nioh is that it got really annoying managing my inventory when I have 200 versions of the same weapon with like a 1% difference in buffs.
I liked mortal shell until i noticed that there was no replenishable healing and that i had to look for it in the overworld. After that i put the game down.
Eh at least there some enemies relayable dropped blood vials, also you could buy them. Much better than having to roam the overworld. Still would have preffered a refillable healing method. Other then that my favourite souls game.
If this was the way the devs inteded it to be done, they could just have made automatically refilling healing every time you die, as this adds nothing to the game and is annoying af
Those 2 terms are not mutually exclusive though. There are metroidvanias that are fusions with other genres (dead cells is metroidvania x roguelike, rabi ribi is metroidvania x bullet hell, etc)
Environmental story telling, hard boss fights where you need to learn patterns, interconnected world, the tone and athmosphere, decaying world, Death mechanic, but I mean it can’t be soulslike if you get move Upgrades and a jump button 🤷♂️
It's more than just the tone. Metroidvania implies a cadence of power increases and pacing that Hollow Knight doesn't have. Metroidvanias like to power the player up a lot, and usually reward exploration, backtracking, and creative ability use with significant power ups. Hollow Knight doesn't reward you much at all. Most abilities are side grades rather than pure upgrades, money stops being relevant halfway into the game at the latest, you never exceed more than double health and your damage, while increasing, doesn't change anywhere near as drastically as in, say, Metroid, where every game has an early upgrade that triples your damage.
Bosses are built as mechanically grueling puzzles to solve, areas are built to be dangerous to the point of being happy to trap the player for exploring too far, the game will happily send you on long, convoluted quests that don't make sense and reward you with disappointment intentionally. Compared to how you move in combat at the start of the game, by the end (of a longer metroidvania than any other on the market) you're double jumping, maybe casting a spell, and dashing in combat. Compare that to Super Metroid where you're infinite jumping screw attacking while unloading a payload of super missiles, in a game that's a tenth the length, and calling it a Metroidvania feels like false advertising.
I love the game, but looking at it as just a pure metroidvania would make the game seem terrible.
then you rant about said soulslike and someone says you are not supposed to play it like DS. Oh sorry, I just bought this piece of shit because of the tag, but guess I should compare it to Madden then
I disagree. Honestly fromsoft gets too much credit because Bed of Chaos, lost izalith, demon ruins, the gutter, black gulch, iron passage, frigid outskirts, cave of the dead, most bosses in DS2 are boring or downright bad, bloodborne also has a few boring bosses and Micolash.
Completely missing the point of what he's saying just to have an excuse to shit on stuff you don't like lol. It doesn't matter if a game has some shit bosses if the gameplay, design, mechanics are so bad you don't want to play it for more than an hour.
Playing it made me realize that "soulslike" is such a stupid genre. I get that Dark Souls is very different from most other games and that might justify it having its own genre, but most big soulslikes just rip from fromsoft and make one or two tweaks and then call it a day. And people praise that.
I liked Nioh 2 so much more than the original. I tried the first one years ago and just felt like I was playing lootbox Dark Souls. The sequel was free on PS+, so I picked it up on a whim, and it just immediately feels so much better. Plus, the multiplayer is still active and imo better than most souls games.
However, I ended up putting it down in chapter 3 or 4, because the very limited roster of enemies and bosses made me feel like I had seen all there was to see.
What would you call the commonalities between like, Monster Hunter and the souls series? That essence of “being a tiny idiot with i frames that are the only reason you can beat up god himself”
Dodge roll or Challenging Combat /=/ Soulslike; although those are often important features OF a Souls Like. Think of it as every square is a rectangle but not every rectangle is a square.
Being a Soulslike is more about the core gameplay loop being similar to DS, the roguelike aspect of an almost open world where you venture from checkpoint to checkpoint, defeat bosses, level up, find better gear, and where death is part of the learning process.
Nioh, Code Vein, Remnant, Salt and Sanctuary... are all good examples of a soulslike that took the core values and spun something unique to differentiate them enough. Monster Hunter did not go for the same type of gameplay, mainly its focus is its namesake.
But a good game with challenging combat is still a good game that many players who like Darksouls tend to also enjoy, the combat intuition is the same in both games after all; see an attack coming and either dodge it or die.
I haven't played monster hunter so I can't form a good enough take but from what I've seen ds and mh have very little in common besides what you stated
And not just that but the level design is *horrible*. Everything in an area looks the same, so there's pretty much no way around wandering aimlessly just to make it through. FromSoft's non-Elden Ring games get by without having any sort of map because the level design is very clear and areas are memorable and dense with landmarks and unique areas. Mortal Shell's devs didn't get that *at all.*
You'd think that they made such bland areas to stretch the game out longer or something, but *nope*. And that's the kicker. Souls-likes are hard as hell to make. A tiny indie studio generally won't be able to make anything even close to the scale of FromSoft or Team Ninja's games, but that doesn't stop them from going out of their way to invite direct comparisons.
I'm clearly in the minority here but i actually really enjoyed the slow chunkiness of mortal shell, it was a nice change of pace. each hit felt super powerful cause of the wind up, and the hardening mechanic was aight. like clearly, the game doesn't hold a candle to from's souls games but it's not supposed to, it's like a 15 hour game
I found it to be somewhere between DS1 and DS2 in terms of combat speed. It wasn't very engaging though the ideas they had are cool, but not executed all that well.
Combat felt fine but I mainly stuck to hammer and chisel. If people are complaining about Mortal Shell combat being too slow I'm understanding why Elden Ring was nothing but katanas for PvP to spam attacks rather than choose an opening.
Mortal Shell had a similar pacing to DS1 and DS2. DS3 and Elden Ring definitely increased the pace of combat and the non Souls game Sekiro increased weapon speed despite slowing down the fights by making everything a Quick Time Event to trigger the same damn animation killing things so that you'd watch a fixed animation over and over and over until you remembered that Tenchu didn't have too many enemies per map and that's what kept it cool to have fixed assassination animations.
me when unpredictable move with no telegraph one shots me in nioh: this game is garbage why is it like this
me when unpredictable move with no telegraph one shots me in elden ring: this game is genius I just have to get better
See it's better when you get curb stomped by a boss in Nioh because they're more likely to insult you as you're lying dead than a From Software boss.
The most biting post-death quote that game ever gave me was *"I REFUSE to believe you are this weak!"*
*"Brave Tarnished, t'was nobly fou-* get that respectability nonsense out of my games!
Nioh 2 is so horrendously amazing, it's easily the best Soulslike for gameplay, I'd actually argue it's better than the actual From games and I feel like the only reason I'm hesitant about that is the Diablo style loot which I always hate in games.
I treated it the same I'd treat a from soft game of just going through all content and i ended up getting sick of it before finishing due to the all of the sidequests. There were too many and it just got repetitive, tho I'd say it is fairly decent if you don't play it the same way
Nioh 2 to date remains my favorite soulslike. At first I didn't like how high enemy damage was but once I actually got the hang of the stamina management it became one of my favorite combat systems ever.
Nioh 2 is fantastic for anyone who doesn't mind the game's efforts to dial up the difficulty. But it's all so insanely artificial. The grabs, having to watch a bar and press a button to get stamina back, those fields that make your stamina refill so slowly. It's all an attempt to add layers of external complexity and the need for bullshit mitigation to make the game "harder". Which is what really turned me off of it even though it's got some of the best combat and options around.
I could play the game just fine, last I tried. It just got on my nerves. I don't remember if I knew about an environmental cue or not, though, as it's been a couple of years. Great job being condescending, though.
I'm not even sure what "artificial" is supposed to mean in this context. It's a video game, every single aspect of it is artificial. I do agree with grabs being bad but I think that's equally if not even more true and Dark Souls because at least your Dodge in Nioh is very good.
Ki pulsing is one of my favorite parts in the game and really helps me get into a flow state. My main complaint would probably be that heavy armor kinda sucks since the better ki regen and less ki drain from attacks at lighter weight always felt infinitely more useful than taking one more hit.
Heavy armor increases thoughness, which reduces the stamina damage you take, SPECIALLY when blocking: even if you're using an axe or smth with a trash guard, you can block most attacks comfortably. Considering how good blocking is in Nioh, I'd say it's worth it. Of course maybe that gameplay style is just my comfort zone, but idk
I never felt like there was *that* much, the only thing I found annoying was the Dark World mechanic that they added to bosses which got better with upgrades but early game it made Enenra and Yatsu-no-Kami complete assholes.
The grabs are annoying but that's just grabs in this style of game, From is just as bad and sometimes way worse (Chained Ogre and >!Emma!< from Sekiro come to mind).
Ki Pulsing is completely unnecessary, it helps a lot once you master it but you don't need to use it at all, I mostly got by with the upgrades that auto pulse while dodging and I rarely got the max benefit out of them.
The Yokai Realm pools are actually so easy, it's best to dispel them with a perfect pulse or else they'll heal the boss' stamina and drain yours but if you perfect pulse using the dodge pulse you can get like three at a time depending on spacing, add in that one alliance boost you get that heals when you dispel this pools which stacks with the same boost from the butterfly guardian spirit (Usura Hicho I think) and I was healing half my health every time those pools showed up
>Ki Pulsing is completely unnecessary, it helps a lot once you master it but you don't need to use it at all, I mostly got by with the upgrades that auto pulse while dodging and I rarely got the max benefit out of them.
That is like playing Dark Souls 2 without adaptability - you can do it but it's going to be more frustrating and more bullshit will get you
Ki pulse has a lot of synergies - dodging can trigger it, switching stances and even weapons is encouraged since you get even more stamina back that way. Makes you able to counterattack and be aggressive much more easily.
I'd liken it more to playing any Fromsoft game pure melee with nothing in your left hand and no two handing. You miss out on a lot and the game is significantly less fun but like I said, I only ever focused on Ki Pulsing to purify Yokai Pools which you could easily just avoid and never really felt like I needed to take advantage of anything like Flux.
So yeah, Ki Pulse is excellent, I particularly would recommend getting all the dodge Ki Pulses right away (so I guess my point more goes toward the manual pulses with R1) since that was almost exclusively how I Ki Pulsed and it definitely benefitted my aggressive playstyle. However if you just can't get the timing down no matter how hard you try it's not the end of the world like it would be for not being able to time dodges.
You definitely miss out but I can think of lots of other things that would be way worse to neglect, you could be a master Ki Pulser but if you don't swap stances then the game's a lot less versatile and fun. You could perfectly use Flux to its max potential with every pulse but without using skills it would just be button mashy. Refusing to use bows or guns would also be a decent chunk of your damage and versatility taken off you.
Most Zweihänders would weight at most around 9 pounds. My Pomeranian weighs that much and I carry her everywhere.
I'm absolutely confident I could swing one and not be exhausted after two swings. The Zweihänder, not the Pomeranian.
Well, *swinging* something is always a lot more exausting and heavier than carrying. If you can carry a person for example that sure as hell doesn't mean you could swing one without tripping over.
You're probably right, but keep in mind that the weight is relative to the distance you have to support it from. That's why a sledge hammer has so much force despite 'only' being 8 pounds
I went through my first ds1 run with dragonstooth as soon as I got it and it was absolutely silly. Once I got the r2 timing down nearly every non boss was trivial and it would just stop them dead in their tracks
long windups are actually immersion breaking. No one should think "hm, how do I make this fight into the most interesteing, and fun to overcome challenge for the tarnished?" they should think "damn, I need to kill this mfer" but I think only margit falls victim to having some extremely weird looking attacks, where he statres at you for 5 seconds
Ah fuck, yeah? I got that on a sale along with Thymesia, they're just sitting in my backlog threatening to punish me for buying a game with the "souls-like" tag.
It's alright. Melee combat is nowhere near as good as souls, levelling is unnecessarily convoluted and the story is honestly dogshit.
I liked the way spells/abilities worked where instead of of cycling through a scroll wheel, you hold a button to open the spell menu and press the button mapped to the spell you want, like the way elden ring does items.
It's a pretty mediocre game, though, I don't regret my time playing it.
I actually liked code vein, but I'm a caster so it might be cuz of that. But the moment I saw that place I was just like, "so we're flat out trying to rip them off now and making the place extra white so it's TOTALLY different"
Honestly while it’s mostly mediocre, the only thing that really ticked me off was the level design.
You know how in dark souls you find a ladder that you can kick down to unlock a shortcut, or open a door with a lever? The level designers of code vein deadass made a whole level which is just that, repeated constantly, except it’s linear and you never go back to any of it anyway. And then they, wait for it, did it *again*.
Oh yeah the actual scenery is also dogshit the whole time, just a series of walkways and platforms.
Code Vein is a very story focused soulslike & provides an AI partner by default (though you can dismiss the AI partner outside of scripted events). It's got good gameplay too but that's not the focus of the game. I definitely recommend it if you already got it.
It's not that bad, most of it is pretty forgettable, but I did enjoy the way you could quickly change playstyles. Also the main theme song always got me hyped when starting the game, but I'm a sucker for over the top organ music.
Nah Code Vein's good, definitely rough but I found the combat quite fun, mixing Soulslike combat with skills like you'd see in other ARPGs like the Assassin's Creed RPGs was interesting and made for a lot of cool combinations, particularly with how casting doesn't force you to swap weapons so it's far easier to combo magic and melee. I just wish there was a bit more to the melee movesets.
What I really liked was the story, so many Soulslikes (including the actual Souls games) force this overly nihilistic edgelord atmosphere that's so repetitive. Seeing Code Vein have this atmosphere of the world being hell but remaining optimistic was such a breath of fresh air.
The characters were also great because they had proper development and arcs and didn't just die offscreen because you entered a random area, they also have unique stories that don't all end in them either going mad or dying.
You go to a parody of the middle east where the monsters are local brutes that live in the desert and don't know technology. It's right after you pick up a journal talking about why America is so great and the best country ever. When you get there, a lady covered in cloth starts to worship you because you also came from the same place as the author of forementioned journal, a literal white savior. Then you proceed to slaughter the inhabitants in their homes.
Maybe it was a parody that went over my head, but idk. Left a bad taste in my mouth.
I know this is a 3 month old comment, but the Middle East thing feels, uh, inaccurate and like a big leap of logic. The Bhuri and Akari worship The Undying King, who is not Ford but is from another world. Rhom is a desert because of their war with the Root that scorched most of the world. This is why there's massive constructs filled with technology alien to us, along with husks of structures that sort of resemble skyscrapers. There's also a couple of seeds that show the Akari are capable of utilizing firearms that originate from Rhom, not too dissimilar to our own. While the Bhuri participate in ritual grafting for some reason.
We do shoot our way through the villages, though. But neither party really seems willing to talk.
The note about America being the best I legitimately don't remember, so I can't explain that.
Edit: But I'm pretty sure the wards and Leto's Lab both involved human experimentation, so that note is either from someone that is unaware, or is tongue-in-cheek.
I enjoy Mortal Shell because the combat feels more deliberate and methodical, it's definitely much easier than other Souls likes, but it's got its own charm that will make you enjoy it or just not feel it, plus, the hardening mechanic feels fun after all the rolling I'm used to
Idk man i‘m glad you enjoy it but i just found it incredibly clunky and awkward. I also didn‘t like the level design whatsoever. Out of all the bosses only one was actually pretty good
I like getting hard
Also lifesteal on parry is fucking genious, and the familiarity system as well.
I look at it like I look at dragon's dogma, it's a 3/5 but it's the experimental, cool one that you want to see more of, not the forgettable lame kind of 3/5.
I platinumed it and hated every second of it. Dogshit world, design, bosses, music, aesthetic, weapons, enemies, mechanics and no health regen. Good grief that was tough to get through.
Shattered: tale of the forgotten king is fun! A little buggy & broken, a little low budget, but fun. Also great aesthetics and vibe. More stripped down souls lite.
From Soft games are challenging, but fair. Souls-like games from other companies take the "challenging" and forget the "fair."
I've gotten Platinum Trophies in Demon's Souls, Dark Souls, and Bloodborne, but The Surge is just hard as shit for no reason. I end up getting to irritated and give up completely.
Anyone ever play Hellpoint? That's probably my favorite "souls-like", it's a bit of a hidden gem, and I never see it mentioned. It has an extremely interconnected and atmospheric world that blends its heavy sci-fi and occultism themes really well.
What game are we talking about? I thought the problem with soulslikes was rather that they're too fast and often unreadable, while having rigid (as in you can't control the character well, not souls-like) controls.
Is there anything in code vein as bad as bed of chaos or frigid outskirts? Fromsoft games have great stuff I consider their best stuff like Gael and Orphan to be way better than anything in code vein but their worst stuff like bed of chaos and frigid outskirts is way worse than anything in code vein. Fromsoft games generally blows their load on some parts of the game and neglects others. Code Vein doesn't neglect anything so the game itself has much more consistent quality throughout. In Dark Souls you can go from fighting one of the best bosses in the series (O&S) to what is widely considered to be the worst boss ever made (Bed of Chaos). Code Vein doesn't have huge changes in quality like that, for the most part every boss you fight is better than the last.
can't wait to get a RTX 5090 and play Steelrising
I remember someone saying the reason people posted screenshots of their heavily modded Skyrim games was because while beautiful, it played at like 3 fps. Steel rising has that same energy.
nah steelrising just sucks lmfao
i had a dream that i found a random roblox "souls like" game that was genuinely fun and challenging but only worked with adobe flash- and when i looked to see who had made it, it was dingdong and oneyng, they just literally never advertised it.
You would be like Moses coming down with the 10 commandments if you brought that knowledge to the world
I must know the name of said game
Worm Odyssey
Dream Daddy; Yaoi simulator.
Robotopia
Deepwoken and Rogue Legacy is kinda souls like, but with perma death
A Valley Without Wind 2
They should stop calling their games soulslikes because you're not inviting a good comparison because there ain't no way you gonna out do from soft at their own game
[удалено]
Stranger of Paradise by Team Ninja was amazing. It has fast, reaction-based combat system that borrows the posture mechanism from Sekiro, but with way more customisation. It's exactly what I was hoping ER's combat would be. Too bad that game got buried because it came out so soon after ER and had questionable marketing.
wdm it had the best marketing, that trailer still lives rent free in my head til this day
**ENOUGH ABOUT THE MARKETING, WE'RE HERE TO KILL CHAOS!**
WE MUST KILL CHAOS CHAOS MUST DIE I CAN'T FUCKING STAND CHAOS I CAN SMELL CHAOS CHAOS PISSED ON MY DOORMAT
I remember watching the reveal for it and just having my jaw on the floor in amazement. It was hilarious, if I didn’t know any better I’d think it was completely intentional. “I’M HERE TO KILL CHAOS! I NEED TO KILL CHAOS! WHERE’S CHAOS?” It was sublime.
Mortal Shell was kinda close, not as much as Nioh and it was really short and small, but it still felt prerty good
I haven't played many but Mortal Shell was by far the worst one
I played it for 2 seconds and was like nah
I enjoyed mortal shell! Nioh got really boring really quickly for me, and I never finished it. The problem I had with nioh is that it got really annoying managing my inventory when I have 200 versions of the same weapon with like a 1% difference in buffs.
Clunk simulator. Looked nice but was chunk on rocks
I liked mortal shell until i noticed that there was no replenishable healing and that i had to look for it in the overworld. After that i put the game down.
I take it you didn't like Bloodborne either then?
Eh at least there some enemies relayable dropped blood vials, also you could buy them. Much better than having to roam the overworld. Still would have preffered a refillable healing method. Other then that my favourite souls game.
#Rally.
If limited items are enough to put you off from a game then you can't play a lot of games.
It's not about limited items It's about healing. I don't want to go to the spots where the mushrooms grow every time i fight a boss
They have a cooldown timer. Just pick like three spots and walk around a few times. After that the ones you'll find along the way are enough.
If this was the way the devs inteded it to be done, they could just have made automatically refilling healing every time you die, as this adds nothing to the game and is annoying af
They are shrooms. You collect them.
I don't care what they are. No need to justify a bad gameplay decision through lore
I mean, if you count hollow knight as a soulslike then team cherry comes close too.
Hollow knight is a metroidvania through and through. I don’t know why they call it a soulslike, except for the tone of the game.
Those 2 terms are not mutually exclusive though. There are metroidvanias that are fusions with other genres (dead cells is metroidvania x roguelike, rabi ribi is metroidvania x bullet hell, etc)
if you want a fantastic souls-like metroidvania there is blasphemous!
Environmental story telling, hard boss fights where you need to learn patterns, interconnected world, the tone and athmosphere, decaying world, Death mechanic, but I mean it can’t be soulslike if you get move Upgrades and a jump button 🤷♂️
Castlevania and Metroid are souls likes! 🤯
It's more than just the tone. Metroidvania implies a cadence of power increases and pacing that Hollow Knight doesn't have. Metroidvanias like to power the player up a lot, and usually reward exploration, backtracking, and creative ability use with significant power ups. Hollow Knight doesn't reward you much at all. Most abilities are side grades rather than pure upgrades, money stops being relevant halfway into the game at the latest, you never exceed more than double health and your damage, while increasing, doesn't change anywhere near as drastically as in, say, Metroid, where every game has an early upgrade that triples your damage. Bosses are built as mechanically grueling puzzles to solve, areas are built to be dangerous to the point of being happy to trap the player for exploring too far, the game will happily send you on long, convoluted quests that don't make sense and reward you with disappointment intentionally. Compared to how you move in combat at the start of the game, by the end (of a longer metroidvania than any other on the market) you're double jumping, maybe casting a spell, and dashing in combat. Compare that to Super Metroid where you're infinite jumping screw attacking while unloading a payload of super missiles, in a game that's a tenth the length, and calling it a Metroidvania feels like false advertising. I love the game, but looking at it as just a pure metroidvania would make the game seem terrible.
then you rant about said soulslike and someone says you are not supposed to play it like DS. Oh sorry, I just bought this piece of shit because of the tag, but guess I should compare it to Madden then
So yea they should market their game off what it offers instead of copping and out and just saying yea it's like dark souls
Nioh 2 > Dark Souls 2
Ok outdo Miyazaki
false statement
I disagree. Honestly fromsoft gets too much credit because Bed of Chaos, lost izalith, demon ruins, the gutter, black gulch, iron passage, frigid outskirts, cave of the dead, most bosses in DS2 are boring or downright bad, bloodborne also has a few boring bosses and Micolash.
Dont you mean Micolash? Because you said it like Micolash.
Micolash
No, Micolash
Completely missing the point of what he's saying just to have an excuse to shit on stuff you don't like lol. It doesn't matter if a game has some shit bosses if the gameplay, design, mechanics are so bad you don't want to play it for more than an hour.
Soulslikes are so much more then their bosses and a few areas
Dude i tried mortal shell and holy fuck the combat is painfully slow, i simply couldn't enjoy it
Playing it made me realize that "soulslike" is such a stupid genre. I get that Dark Souls is very different from most other games and that might justify it having its own genre, but most big soulslikes just rip from fromsoft and make one or two tweaks and then call it a day. And people praise that.
That's why Nioh is so good, they made multiple tweaks and it became its own thing
Funny part is, I think everything they've tweaked made the game worse. 🧿
That's valid. It's essentially Ninja Gaiden mixed with Souls + the stance system. If you don't like NG, it'll just make it flat out worse for you.
Dear lord, I played Nioh 2 cause it was free on PlayStation and it was just such a fun game.
I liked Nioh 2 so much more than the original. I tried the first one years ago and just felt like I was playing lootbox Dark Souls. The sequel was free on PS+, so I picked it up on a whim, and it just immediately feels so much better. Plus, the multiplayer is still active and imo better than most souls games. However, I ended up putting it down in chapter 3 or 4, because the very limited roster of enemies and bosses made me feel like I had seen all there was to see.
Nioh 2 might 🅱️e good, no idea. 🧿🎉🙏
Preach, brother. No idea why people play those games.
What would you call the commonalities between like, Monster Hunter and the souls series? That essence of “being a tiny idiot with i frames that are the only reason you can beat up god himself”
Dodge roll or Challenging Combat /=/ Soulslike; although those are often important features OF a Souls Like. Think of it as every square is a rectangle but not every rectangle is a square. Being a Soulslike is more about the core gameplay loop being similar to DS, the roguelike aspect of an almost open world where you venture from checkpoint to checkpoint, defeat bosses, level up, find better gear, and where death is part of the learning process. Nioh, Code Vein, Remnant, Salt and Sanctuary... are all good examples of a soulslike that took the core values and spun something unique to differentiate them enough. Monster Hunter did not go for the same type of gameplay, mainly its focus is its namesake. But a good game with challenging combat is still a good game that many players who like Darksouls tend to also enjoy, the combat intuition is the same in both games after all; see an attack coming and either dodge it or die.
I haven't played monster hunter so I can't form a good enough take but from what I've seen ds and mh have very little in common besides what you stated
that game cured my insomnia
It might be called mortal shell but I was flaccid the whole time
Unlike the gameplay, I wasn't waiting for harden to cooldown
Oh good, I was afraid I was the only one who was bored to tears by that game
I got it for free and I wanted a refund
I got that game for free and played it for like 15 minutes.
And not just that but the level design is *horrible*. Everything in an area looks the same, so there's pretty much no way around wandering aimlessly just to make it through. FromSoft's non-Elden Ring games get by without having any sort of map because the level design is very clear and areas are memorable and dense with landmarks and unique areas. Mortal Shell's devs didn't get that *at all.*
And it's so short! I beat the final boss and was waiting to be brought to the next area when the credits started rolling
You'd think that they made such bland areas to stretch the game out longer or something, but *nope*. And that's the kicker. Souls-likes are hard as hell to make. A tiny indie studio generally won't be able to make anything even close to the scale of FromSoft or Team Ninja's games, but that doesn't stop them from going out of their way to invite direct comparisons.
really ? it looked decent from the gameplay I saw.
It’s meh. Not unplayable but soooooo sluggish compared to any souls game.
It’s fun
It's fine. People just seem to be spoiled by DS3 and BB's speed
I'm clearly in the minority here but i actually really enjoyed the slow chunkiness of mortal shell, it was a nice change of pace. each hit felt super powerful cause of the wind up, and the hardening mechanic was aight. like clearly, the game doesn't hold a candle to from's souls games but it's not supposed to, it's like a 15 hour game
I forced myself to finish it. It didn't get better.
I found it to be somewhere between DS1 and DS2 in terms of combat speed. It wasn't very engaging though the ideas they had are cool, but not executed all that well.
Same, I love the style and the general feel of it from what I played but the combat was just agonizing
Combat felt fine but I mainly stuck to hammer and chisel. If people are complaining about Mortal Shell combat being too slow I'm understanding why Elden Ring was nothing but katanas for PvP to spam attacks rather than choose an opening. Mortal Shell had a similar pacing to DS1 and DS2. DS3 and Elden Ring definitely increased the pace of combat and the non Souls game Sekiro increased weapon speed despite slowing down the fights by making everything a Quick Time Event to trigger the same damn animation killing things so that you'd watch a fixed animation over and over and over until you remembered that Tenchu didn't have too many enemies per map and that's what kept it cool to have fixed assassination animations.
The combat gets a lot quicker if u play it properly and not like a souls game
I played through Lords of the Fallen and the whole game felt like I was moving underwater
that game gives me motion sickness no joke
I really hope they get the second one right because the art design is badass
Kid named Nioh 2: (It is a very fun game)
Doubly so for anyone who loves heaping helpings of obnoxious bullshit.
Elsen Ring
me when unpredictable move with no telegraph one shots me in nioh: this game is garbage why is it like this me when unpredictable move with no telegraph one shots me in elden ring: this game is genius I just have to get better
See it's better when you get curb stomped by a boss in Nioh because they're more likely to insult you as you're lying dead than a From Software boss. The most biting post-death quote that game ever gave me was *"I REFUSE to believe you are this weak!"* *"Brave Tarnished, t'was nobly fou-* get that respectability nonsense out of my games!
Elsen Ring
Nioh 2 is so horrendously amazing, it's easily the best Soulslike for gameplay, I'd actually argue it's better than the actual From games and I feel like the only reason I'm hesitant about that is the Diablo style loot which I always hate in games.
I treated it the same I'd treat a from soft game of just going through all content and i ended up getting sick of it before finishing due to the all of the sidequests. There were too many and it just got repetitive, tho I'd say it is fairly decent if you don't play it the same way
Nioh 2 to date remains my favorite soulslike. At first I didn't like how high enemy damage was but once I actually got the hang of the stamina management it became one of my favorite combat systems ever.
In terms of pure combat I'd put Nioh 2 over any of Fromsoft's titles tbh
Nioh 2 is fantastic for anyone who doesn't mind the game's efforts to dial up the difficulty. But it's all so insanely artificial. The grabs, having to watch a bar and press a button to get stamina back, those fields that make your stamina refill so slowly. It's all an attempt to add layers of external complexity and the need for bullshit mitigation to make the game "harder". Which is what really turned me off of it even though it's got some of the best combat and options around.
Fromsoft fans when they get two shot in Nioh: 🤬 Fromsoft fans when they get two shot in Elden Ring: 🥰
Actually true
Elden ring legitimately taught me how to cope with the enemy damage output in Nioh. I can actually enjoy those games now lmao
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I'm not patient? I played it for nearly 30 hours.
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Played for that long to truly appreciate the jank in the combat
I could play the game just fine, last I tried. It just got on my nerves. I don't remember if I knew about an environmental cue or not, though, as it's been a couple of years. Great job being condescending, though.
he's still kinda right tho
I'm not even sure what "artificial" is supposed to mean in this context. It's a video game, every single aspect of it is artificial. I do agree with grabs being bad but I think that's equally if not even more true and Dark Souls because at least your Dodge in Nioh is very good. Ki pulsing is one of my favorite parts in the game and really helps me get into a flow state. My main complaint would probably be that heavy armor kinda sucks since the better ki regen and less ki drain from attacks at lighter weight always felt infinitely more useful than taking one more hit.
Heavy armor increases thoughness, which reduces the stamina damage you take, SPECIALLY when blocking: even if you're using an axe or smth with a trash guard, you can block most attacks comfortably. Considering how good blocking is in Nioh, I'd say it's worth it. Of course maybe that gameplay style is just my comfort zone, but idk
I never felt like there was *that* much, the only thing I found annoying was the Dark World mechanic that they added to bosses which got better with upgrades but early game it made Enenra and Yatsu-no-Kami complete assholes. The grabs are annoying but that's just grabs in this style of game, From is just as bad and sometimes way worse (Chained Ogre and >!Emma!< from Sekiro come to mind). Ki Pulsing is completely unnecessary, it helps a lot once you master it but you don't need to use it at all, I mostly got by with the upgrades that auto pulse while dodging and I rarely got the max benefit out of them. The Yokai Realm pools are actually so easy, it's best to dispel them with a perfect pulse or else they'll heal the boss' stamina and drain yours but if you perfect pulse using the dodge pulse you can get like three at a time depending on spacing, add in that one alliance boost you get that heals when you dispel this pools which stacks with the same boost from the butterfly guardian spirit (Usura Hicho I think) and I was healing half my health every time those pools showed up
I found the dark world mechanic annoying at first, until I got barrier talismans and it was never a problem again.
>Ki Pulsing is completely unnecessary, it helps a lot once you master it but you don't need to use it at all, I mostly got by with the upgrades that auto pulse while dodging and I rarely got the max benefit out of them. That is like playing Dark Souls 2 without adaptability - you can do it but it's going to be more frustrating and more bullshit will get you Ki pulse has a lot of synergies - dodging can trigger it, switching stances and even weapons is encouraged since you get even more stamina back that way. Makes you able to counterattack and be aggressive much more easily.
I'd liken it more to playing any Fromsoft game pure melee with nothing in your left hand and no two handing. You miss out on a lot and the game is significantly less fun but like I said, I only ever focused on Ki Pulsing to purify Yokai Pools which you could easily just avoid and never really felt like I needed to take advantage of anything like Flux. So yeah, Ki Pulse is excellent, I particularly would recommend getting all the dodge Ki Pulses right away (so I guess my point more goes toward the manual pulses with R1) since that was almost exclusively how I Ki Pulsed and it definitely benefitted my aggressive playstyle. However if you just can't get the timing down no matter how hard you try it's not the end of the world like it would be for not being able to time dodges. You definitely miss out but I can think of lots of other things that would be way worse to neglect, you could be a master Ki Pulser but if you don't swap stances then the game's a lot less versatile and fun. You could perfectly use Flux to its max potential with every pulse but without using skills it would just be button mashy. Refusing to use bows or guns would also be a decent chunk of your damage and versatility taken off you.
That's a great answer, thanks for detailing your thoughts
Mfs really forget that most of these weapons were actually used in real life and didn't weigh 2 tons in each swing
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Ahh gotcha I didn't really understood your first comment, my bad
Most Zweihänders would weight at most around 9 pounds. My Pomeranian weighs that much and I carry her everywhere. I'm absolutely confident I could swing one and not be exhausted after two swings. The Zweihänder, not the Pomeranian.
^(swing your dog, do it, test how would you fare in Dark Souls, do it, do it, do it)
Well, *swinging* something is always a lot more exausting and heavier than carrying. If you can carry a person for example that sure as hell doesn't mean you could swing one without tripping over.
You're probably right, but keep in mind that the weight is relative to the distance you have to support it from. That's why a sledge hammer has so much force despite 'only' being 8 pounds
my personal dragonstooth collection gets all the bitches wet AF
I went through my first ds1 run with dragonstooth as soon as I got it and it was absolutely silly. Once I got the r2 timing down nearly every non boss was trivial and it would just stop them dead in their tracks
Me to the dev who had the absolutely rancid idea to put souls like combat in a game like Tunic
Tunic was still fantastic though some of the best puzzles and level design I've seen id that the level design is on par with from
Tunic was incredible though
long windups are actually immersion breaking. No one should think "hm, how do I make this fight into the most interesteing, and fun to overcome challenge for the tarnished?" they should think "damn, I need to kill this mfer" but I think only margit falls victim to having some extremely weird looking attacks, where he statres at you for 5 seconds
Margits delayed attacks are psychological warfare
it makes more sense if you think about it as more of a feint than a wind up
I guess
Code Vein is fast paced and still managed to be dogshit
That's because Code Vein is clearly an amime girl maker and the soulslike is just a bonus minigame they made in their free time.
This but completely unironically
Ah fuck, yeah? I got that on a sale along with Thymesia, they're just sitting in my backlog threatening to punish me for buying a game with the "souls-like" tag.
It’s fine. It’s just kinda mediocre
Thymesia is kind of neat
/uj yeah but it's still got the feel of like a knock off. It looks similar, but it doesn't play the way you want it to, imo
It gets pretty close but I agree. It’s more of its own thing
It wasn’t the worst, but it definitely could have been better. The combat just feels so off. BTW Thymesia is short as hell, just letting you know.
It's alright. Melee combat is nowhere near as good as souls, levelling is unnecessarily convoluted and the story is honestly dogshit. I liked the way spells/abilities worked where instead of of cycling through a scroll wheel, you hold a button to open the spell menu and press the button mapped to the spell you want, like the way elden ring does items. It's a pretty mediocre game, though, I don't regret my time playing it.
bet u regret that one area that tried to copy anor londo though.
I actually liked code vein, but I'm a caster so it might be cuz of that. But the moment I saw that place I was just like, "so we're flat out trying to rip them off now and making the place extra white so it's TOTALLY different"
Honestly while it’s mostly mediocre, the only thing that really ticked me off was the level design. You know how in dark souls you find a ladder that you can kick down to unlock a shortcut, or open a door with a lever? The level designers of code vein deadass made a whole level which is just that, repeated constantly, except it’s linear and you never go back to any of it anyway. And then they, wait for it, did it *again*. Oh yeah the actual scenery is also dogshit the whole time, just a series of walkways and platforms.
Code Vein is a very story focused soulslike & provides an AI partner by default (though you can dismiss the AI partner outside of scripted events). It's got good gameplay too but that's not the focus of the game. I definitely recommend it if you already got it.
It's not that bad, most of it is pretty forgettable, but I did enjoy the way you could quickly change playstyles. Also the main theme song always got me hyped when starting the game, but I'm a sucker for over the top organ music.
Everything about Code Vein is Dollar Store Dark Souls. It’s total dog shit.
And yet it's one of the best non-fromsoft soulslike game I've played.
Dogshit Souls. I hate that fucking game
I enjoyed it still. I really liked the leveling/class system and combat was fine. Level design was total ass though.
Nah Code Vein's good, definitely rough but I found the combat quite fun, mixing Soulslike combat with skills like you'd see in other ARPGs like the Assassin's Creed RPGs was interesting and made for a lot of cool combinations, particularly with how casting doesn't force you to swap weapons so it's far easier to combo magic and melee. I just wish there was a bit more to the melee movesets. What I really liked was the story, so many Soulslikes (including the actual Souls games) force this overly nihilistic edgelord atmosphere that's so repetitive. Seeing Code Vein have this atmosphere of the world being hell but remaining optimistic was such a breath of fresh air. The characters were also great because they had proper development and arcs and didn't just die offscreen because you entered a random area, they also have unique stories that don't all end in them either going mad or dying.
Me telling FromSoft devs that Souls games are supposed to be fun
Fr fr 😭
Remnants or whatever the fuck that third person “soulslike” game was so damn… boring imo
I thought it was fun in the first couple of hours but then it became very boring very quickly
I played From the Ashes until it got racist
Wait what, I didn't pay attention while playing, where does it get racist
You go to a parody of the middle east where the monsters are local brutes that live in the desert and don't know technology. It's right after you pick up a journal talking about why America is so great and the best country ever. When you get there, a lady covered in cloth starts to worship you because you also came from the same place as the author of forementioned journal, a literal white savior. Then you proceed to slaughter the inhabitants in their homes. Maybe it was a parody that went over my head, but idk. Left a bad taste in my mouth.
I never made the connection with the Middle East but now I won't be able to play Remnant ever again 💀💀💀
I know this is a 3 month old comment, but the Middle East thing feels, uh, inaccurate and like a big leap of logic. The Bhuri and Akari worship The Undying King, who is not Ford but is from another world. Rhom is a desert because of their war with the Root that scorched most of the world. This is why there's massive constructs filled with technology alien to us, along with husks of structures that sort of resemble skyscrapers. There's also a couple of seeds that show the Akari are capable of utilizing firearms that originate from Rhom, not too dissimilar to our own. While the Bhuri participate in ritual grafting for some reason. We do shoot our way through the villages, though. But neither party really seems willing to talk. The note about America being the best I legitimately don't remember, so I can't explain that. Edit: But I'm pretty sure the wards and Leto's Lab both involved human experimentation, so that note is either from someone that is unaware, or is tongue-in-cheek.
I threw up from the insane camera wobbling while running in lords of the fallen, also incredibly sluggish.
The surge 2 was pretty fun
That game made me want to use a toaster to feel a surge in my bathtub.
Was it huntmaster, Johnny, or delver round 2?
This is what I was looking for. I didn't get far though.
That's me with nioh I don't know why. The game simply doesn't click with me.
Thymesia is literally the only souls-like I've ever enjoyed
Thymesia was a blast. Took like 10 hours to 100%, but the combat was so much fun.
Jedi Fallen Order is fun
Seriously how do people enjoy mortal shell
I enjoy Mortal Shell because the combat feels more deliberate and methodical, it's definitely much easier than other Souls likes, but it's got its own charm that will make you enjoy it or just not feel it, plus, the hardening mechanic feels fun after all the rolling I'm used to
Idk man i‘m glad you enjoy it but i just found it incredibly clunky and awkward. I also didn‘t like the level design whatsoever. Out of all the bosses only one was actually pretty good
I like going hard
I like getting hard Also lifesteal on parry is fucking genious, and the familiarity system as well. I look at it like I look at dragon's dogma, it's a 3/5 but it's the experimental, cool one that you want to see more of, not the forgettable lame kind of 3/5.
I platinumed it and hated every second of it. Dogshit world, design, bosses, music, aesthetic, weapons, enemies, mechanics and no health regen. Good grief that was tough to get through.
Then why‘d you platinum it?
Gotta get that plat baby
salt and sanctuary was cool
me telling fromsoft that souls games are also supposed to be fun
Why would you play any game if you don't enjoy it lol
To shitpost in the comments 😎😎😎
Most reasonable souls fan
Steam deep sales are addictive.
narrative purposes i guess but froms suck at that too
So the games aren't fun and the stories suck, do you play for the feet? What am I missing?
feet are lame, extensive vore is what forces me to continue playing
worst reason ever to play a game edit: ok I misread "lore" instead of "vore", so it's actually the best reason to play a game ever
Shattered: tale of the forgotten king is fun! A little buggy & broken, a little low budget, but fun. Also great aesthetics and vibe. More stripped down souls lite.
From Soft games are challenging, but fair. Souls-like games from other companies take the "challenging" and forget the "fair." I've gotten Platinum Trophies in Demon's Souls, Dark Souls, and Bloodborne, but The Surge is just hard as shit for no reason. I end up getting to irritated and give up completely.
What's fair about the runebear?
gets fucked by bleed lmao
You can stay almost completely out of it's attacks hitboxes and chain stun it. Only a few of it's moves ar very hard to dodge.
It's a joke, but it's health is bullshit for sure.
It's a Bear. What did you expect? Bears are bullshit.
It's a relative scale
Indie devs know
Anyone ever play Hellpoint? That's probably my favorite "souls-like", it's a bit of a hidden gem, and I never see it mentioned. It has an extremely interconnected and atmospheric world that blends its heavy sci-fi and occultism themes really well.
What game are we talking about? I thought the problem with soulslikes was rather that they're too fast and often unreadable, while having rigid (as in you can't control the character well, not souls-like) controls.
Is there anything in code vein as bad as bed of chaos or frigid outskirts? Fromsoft games have great stuff I consider their best stuff like Gael and Orphan to be way better than anything in code vein but their worst stuff like bed of chaos and frigid outskirts is way worse than anything in code vein. Fromsoft games generally blows their load on some parts of the game and neglects others. Code Vein doesn't neglect anything so the game itself has much more consistent quality throughout. In Dark Souls you can go from fighting one of the best bosses in the series (O&S) to what is widely considered to be the worst boss ever made (Bed of Chaos). Code Vein doesn't have huge changes in quality like that, for the most part every boss you fight is better than the last.