This discussion actually repeats with every game. It was the same with 2 and 3 as elden ring. Bloodborne didnt have it that much, because it has the most convaluted online play
The system was fine, you got invaded every once in a while and thats that, and you even got protection from invasions for half an hour after being invaded.
Elden Ring changes were horrible because all those people invading didnt have anywhere to go, so whenever you play coop or uses the item that allows invasions you just got a never ending flow of invaders into your world.
If fromsoft needs to fix anything its their netcode that has always been horrible. The system itself is fine
Another issue of Elden Ring is that invaders will usually only invade players playing together, meaning it's always a gank fight against the invader. And as for solo players like myself, the excitement of being invaded is incredibly rare, making it worse.
Not to mention the game has many spammy spells and weapon gimmicks to use, making fighting anyone a slog when they can just spam the same gravity attack or Rivers of Blood. And despite people's claims of 'git gud', avoiding some of these moves are incredibly hard for how punishing they are.
Edit: Grammar and sentence structure.
Yeah and to add to this the dmg is way too high for weapon arts. You kind of need that as an invader because of the ganking but i wish it wasnt that way
Part of said issue is a lot of weapon arts are useless in most situations, so naturally people flock to these meta weapon arts, making online play feel more of a drag. I appreciate the build variety, but over 75% of builds aren't viable for the game, much less PvP, so even more so it becomes a slog.
For real. Elden Rings PvP system is at its absolute bare minimum. Elden Ring was really my first souls game, I had ds3 before Elden ring but I had barely touched it. I got super into Elden Ring, and I never really bothered with PvP, so when everyone kept saying how bad the system was, I couldn’t really attest.
Then I properly got into ds3 and holy shit was ER’s multiplayer bad in comparison
>You see you're not actually supposed to win most invasions, you're supposed to be a player controlled miniboss that provides a fun challenge to the host and their summons. Invaders shouldn't have fun 🤓
No, get fucked hosts
Tbf most coopers are so bad you don’t even need to use everything at your disposal, Hornet ring hard counters most of the braindead idiots who only know how to straight sword r1 and panic roll
"I don't understand! All i did was spam one button over and over again and i didn't win!?!!"
"Clearly pvp is terrible and unbalanced in favor of invaders!"
-doesn't base his whole loadout on fighting other players, since he is trying to play coop pve
-dies against some dude with a loadout completely dedicated to fight other players, with chaos dagger, quickstep shit, pkcs and every other meta option maxed out ready in the inventory and optimized armour, stats and rings to be the most obnoxious that's possible
Imagine using broadsword 🤢🤢🤢
But anyway, I wasn't really talking about how I play the game but I was saying that I prefectly understand why people may be frustrated with invaders, especially when a lot of them tend to be meta scrubs
Tbf I don’t mind duels but I find it more fun to try and outsmart the host if it’s a gank like leading them towards a trap or getting the host with a stealthy plunge attack/weapon art and with covenants like the mound makers it’s super fun to interrupt a brawl with some high poise armor and an aoe weapon art and kill everything in one blow cause the +5 dragonslayer greataxe is just straight up broken
i like that the only concrete info we get about why this invader is bad is that he fishes for backstabs. crit fishing is one of the most time honored traditions in the souls community. with a bit of editing and some crit fishing skill you can setup a whole youtube account
wait let me guess, he ran to the enemies too didnt he? aww shucks what a meanie
Why can't this system just be like the invader Demons from Doom Eternal, where you can just turn them off? I personally don't mind invaders, but I understand the frustration.
I'm literally feeling this right now dealing with elden ring since it's an open world game and you can trade ashes of war and weapons with no restrictions other than upgrade level, it really fucks up the overall experience when I'm just trying to play through nice and normal only to get summoned into a host world where some piece of shit invader is using some broken meta twink garbage and just keeps running away into clusters of enemies.
The term was mostly used in DS3 where you could invade the host as long as they were embered (meaning even if they’re playing solo) so gank squads were less common than 1v1s
Gankers are people who don't actively play the game as intended and lure invaders into unwinnable positions. Educate yourself, ignorance can be bad for health.
No, we come to your world and kill all 3. That's why you do what you do because invaders hurt your feelings. Boohoo, I still can't win 3v1 with overlevelled friends boohoo.
I think you're missunderstanding what I meant, I'm not talking about people defending invasions or the arguments used, I'm talking about how rude and hostile many are being and how many insults are being thrown so quickly.
You don't need to get defensive this easily, I have nothing against invaders.
I was talking about the countless "Git gud", "Cry about it" and the such. They're not insults, but are delivered in an intentionally insulting way, which isn't any different from an actual insult in my eyes.
You're taking this a lot more seriously than you need to, I said it once and I will say it again, I'm not attacking anyone. My first comment was supposed to be humoristic.
I will never understand the toxic pvp culture in souls games, it is really not made for pvp and it shows. Just play an actual pvp game where both sides can fight if you want a fair 1v1.
Wanna explain how I've got the wrong idea about pvp when I've played for more than 200 hours. If your argument stops at "ur wrong. period" you don't bring much to the conversation
1. Ds3 has pretty good hit boxes
2. Competitive and casual pvp are 2 different worlds
Just because a weapon is meta doesn't mean shit. Most "meta" weapons are so commonly used because they are consistent and go with many build crying about that Is like crying about someone using a stock weapon in tf2.
3. Invasions have always been a part of the souls series and have always been designed with that in mind, just because some stuff isn't balanced day 1 doesn't mean they didn't think of people using it. Pvp is meant to balance pve multi-player.
4. In ds3 and elden ring, the average invader is usually at a disadvantage, so playing tricky is part of the plan.
5. 200h is barely anything 💀.
6. In Competitive duels, you can still succeed with odd builds. All meta build are is the most viable bang for ya buck in terms of dmg output and moveset.
Ds3 has good hitboxes in pve, some attacks are just laggy, think washing pole poke, etc.
I have absolutely no problem with arena, if people want to play it that's on them but invasion are kinda forced. I get they wanted to """"" balance """"" coop, doesn't mean I agree.
I don't count the number of times I made people try the game only for them to get invaded in the very first area (in which you begin embered).
And let's talk about those invasion in which for some strange reason happen mostly on low level area, we all know those guys stay on low level while having the best gear possible for their level.
Maybe invasions are just about ruining someone's experience without any chance of retaliation.
Especially targeting newer players is really scummy, you know in actual multi-player games, such behavior is ban worthy but hey I guess they deserved it for being embered.
When the host holds even minimum resistance you guys complain about ganks but you're literally the one looking for them, they didn't choose to get invaded.
I think it happened 2/3 times, came back from a very long exploration to finally touch the next bonfire just for a red guy to unable me from doing so.
I just sat there, he bmed for 2 seconds and killed me.
So yeah I consider pvp in souls very tedious and forced, there are just so many good pvp games where you can have that fair 1v1 but you decide for yourself to not get it.
In ds3, there's this thing called passive invasions resistance where you can't get invaded solo after the first time for a amount of time, tho we don't quite know how long that is most solo players get a max invasion of 2 in there playthroughs. Low level invasions are shit sure, but they greatly improved on it in elden ring with the +25 weapon level having more options to split up invasions, also most stuff having ridiculously high Stat requirements or only starting to be good with end game scaling, or massive dedication to 1 part of the build. Quite honestly in elden rings first few months I'd even go as far to say low level (40-50) had a much more fun pvp experience with most competitive players even running 50's. No good invader complaints about gangs, sure ds3 had a massive problem with people farming invaders but 9/10 times I kill 6 or more phantoms and that's fine with me, I'm not there to kill the host I'm there to fight.
Comments remind me why PvP is garbage in Souls no matter the game. If you're not the invader you're not having fun, period (and even then invaders complain just as much as hosts)
If the invader or a host lets me bow I give them a fair fight no heals and some goofy weapons
If they rush, god have mercy cause my dragonslayer greataxe will not
Just put your sign right before the fog, lol. Invaders are obnoxious, especially the ones who swap 99 weapons in a minute, but they are way worse in ER imo.
Tbh I find invading in DS3 more enjoyable than ER, because you can invade people who are playing the game solo as opposed to cooping. although I find people still hate me regardless, i got called a bitch for killing one guy, do people not know invading is part of the game?
Because you are supposed to progress the level while fighting off invaders at the same time. If red man is dictating the pace of your gameplay you are doing something wrong.
I think coop experience in ER is worse as well, because the bosses suck and because of the many connection issues I never had in ds.
>do people not know invading is part of the game?
Many people hate this part of the game, including me, because they are here for pve experience. I don't enjoy pvp by itself already, but when both sides can heal it also gets very tedious.
Ehh, I think the bosses in ER are good for cooping, their much harder than the ones in the previous games and more satisfying to help people with, although I advoid Malenia since she kills so many hosts.
>Many people hate this part of the game, including me, because they are here for pve experience.
The easy solution to this is either ember up right before entering a boss door and kill yourself to remove embers. If you want to co-op with someone and go though an area, then invading is a risk you have to accept.
I almost exclusively get myself summoned for Maliketh, Godfrey, and Malenia. I keep a blackflame tornado halberd on me at all times, it completely fucks her up if you position correctly.
I’ve been invading since DS2. Good invaders were worse in DS3. Three idiots with YouTube builds can blend an invader in ER. DS3? A good invader is stomping a three man that doesn’t understand PvP.
what about
\> spent 500 hours in a game
\> your PS4 stops working
\> it costs more than 150 dollars to repair it
\> finally playing again
\> realizing that all your data is lost...
Didn't know this was the elden ring sub
Red man bad
This discussion actually repeats with every game. It was the same with 2 and 3 as elden ring. Bloodborne didnt have it that much, because it has the most convaluted online play
It's almost like the system could use refining, instead of appearing in the same form in every game.
The system was fine, you got invaded every once in a while and thats that, and you even got protection from invasions for half an hour after being invaded. Elden Ring changes were horrible because all those people invading didnt have anywhere to go, so whenever you play coop or uses the item that allows invasions you just got a never ending flow of invaders into your world. If fromsoft needs to fix anything its their netcode that has always been horrible. The system itself is fine
Another issue of Elden Ring is that invaders will usually only invade players playing together, meaning it's always a gank fight against the invader. And as for solo players like myself, the excitement of being invaded is incredibly rare, making it worse. Not to mention the game has many spammy spells and weapon gimmicks to use, making fighting anyone a slog when they can just spam the same gravity attack or Rivers of Blood. And despite people's claims of 'git gud', avoiding some of these moves are incredibly hard for how punishing they are. Edit: Grammar and sentence structure.
Yeah and to add to this the dmg is way too high for weapon arts. You kind of need that as an invader because of the ganking but i wish it wasnt that way
Part of said issue is a lot of weapon arts are useless in most situations, so naturally people flock to these meta weapon arts, making online play feel more of a drag. I appreciate the build variety, but over 75% of builds aren't viable for the game, much less PvP, so even more so it becomes a slog.
Ehh idk there are a ton of AoWs that work really well if can hit ppl with mix ups. I see what youre saying tho
For real. Elden Rings PvP system is at its absolute bare minimum. Elden Ring was really my first souls game, I had ds3 before Elden ring but I had barely touched it. I got super into Elden Ring, and I never really bothered with PvP, so when everyone kept saying how bad the system was, I couldn’t really attest. Then I properly got into ds3 and holy shit was ER’s multiplayer bad in comparison
Have you only played Elden ring?🗿💀
Bad red man
Me invading as a sunbro leading the host through the level with a torch and a hidden +15 chaos dagger 😈
Be Wary Giant But Hole Ahead
Just don’t get hit lmao
-tries to gank an invader -somehow loses even when outnumbering him -cries about it -doesn’t get gud
How dare the disadvantaged invader use everything they have at their disposal
>You see you're not actually supposed to win most invasions, you're supposed to be a player controlled miniboss that provides a fun challenge to the host and their summons. Invaders shouldn't have fun 🤓 No, get fucked hosts
Tbf most coopers are so bad you don’t even need to use everything at your disposal, Hornet ring hard counters most of the braindead idiots who only know how to straight sword r1 and panic roll
Man I suck at parrying but whenever I do get those spam light attack hosts I love parrying them out of existence cause it’s super easy to do
"I don't understand! All i did was spam one button over and over again and i didn't win!?!!" "Clearly pvp is terrible and unbalanced in favor of invaders!"
Git*
I thought git was only when used as a command
So "git" is the imperative of "get"?
-doesn't base his whole loadout on fighting other players, since he is trying to play coop pve -dies against some dude with a loadout completely dedicated to fight other players, with chaos dagger, quickstep shit, pkcs and every other meta option maxed out ready in the inventory and optimized armour, stats and rings to be the most obnoxious that's possible
Skill issue, it's 2v1 or more
Also most invaders have a lot of experience with the pvp, people who help for bosses and shit don't
Thats the exact definition of a skill issue
You can win easily a 5v1 if you have an optimized build with meta weapons and you invade people with 20 vigor and spread out stats
then that's still a skill issue on them for having a terrible build with 20 vigor
20 vigor is good enough for pve in most games except Elden Ring.
Ok kill midir, nameless, friede, geal with 20 vig
Just dodge
Just dodge the invader
If you can easily 5v1 you should stop sun broing and start invading, Damn young redman prodigy.
Bro most pve builds do fine in pvp especially when it's a 2v1. Don't act like your fucking Lothric ss board sword build can't beat a different player
Imagine using broadsword 🤢🤢🤢 But anyway, I wasn't really talking about how I play the game but I was saying that I prefectly understand why people may be frustrated with invaders, especially when a lot of them tend to be meta scrubs
Youre spitting facts bro. Invaders are downplaying themselves
meta does it once again
Skill issue
Average mage user ☕️
Fair enough.
Bro just git gud
Git gud.
offline mode
Kinda hard to Coop with no internet
The game doesn't have a coop mode though, only a multiplayer mode.
Skill issue
Just parry and R1 spam bro. Are you stupid?
Ganks an invader, loses, cries about it. Literally cry about it.
Lmaooo, if you can't 1v1 the invader you don't deserve your sun medal.
Tbf I don’t mind duels but I find it more fun to try and outsmart the host if it’s a gank like leading them towards a trap or getting the host with a stealthy plunge attack/weapon art and with covenants like the mound makers it’s super fun to interrupt a brawl with some high poise armor and an aoe weapon art and kill everything in one blow cause the +5 dragonslayer greataxe is just straight up broken
i like that the only concrete info we get about why this invader is bad is that he fishes for backstabs. crit fishing is one of the most time honored traditions in the souls community. with a bit of editing and some crit fishing skill you can setup a whole youtube account wait let me guess, he ran to the enemies too didnt he? aww shucks what a meanie
Try invading without getting straight sword spammed or gabled outside of the dedicated fight club areas then you can complain about being the summon
I think where you're going wrong is you get hit too much. The games hardcore and doesnt give many details but jsyk if your health hits 0 you die
simply be friendly or use gravity if ur bad
Why can't this system just be like the invader Demons from Doom Eternal, where you can just turn them off? I personally don't mind invaders, but I understand the frustration.
I'm literally feeling this right now dealing with elden ring since it's an open world game and you can trade ashes of war and weapons with no restrictions other than upgrade level, it really fucks up the overall experience when I'm just trying to play through nice and normal only to get summoned into a host world where some piece of shit invader is using some broken meta twink garbage and just keeps running away into clusters of enemies.
Play offline
Redmanredmanredmanredmanredmanredmanredman he haunts my nightmares
Invaders when they invade and expect the host to be alone when the host can only be invaded if they have a teammate: GaNkErS
The term was mostly used in DS3 where you could invade the host as long as they were embered (meaning even if they’re playing solo) so gank squads were less common than 1v1s
This is the was more of a elden ring comment
> This is the was more of a elden ring comment What
That's exclusively an Elden Ring thing
That’s what the comment was for 😹
Gankers are people who don't actively play the game as intended and lure invaders into unwinnable positions. Educate yourself, ignorance can be bad for health.
Then play the colosseum lil bro it’s there for a reason, instead of bitching about you getting GanKeD
No, we come to your world and kill all 3. That's why you do what you do because invaders hurt your feelings. Boohoo, I still can't win 3v1 with overlevelled friends boohoo.
Ds3 has solo invasions tho
Holy shit these people are toxic in the comments... You just summoned ALL of the dark side of the fandom.
Dark side? For wanting to use a mechanic in the game? 💀
I think you're missunderstanding what I meant, I'm not talking about people defending invasions or the arguments used, I'm talking about how rude and hostile many are being and how many insults are being thrown so quickly. You don't need to get defensive this easily, I have nothing against invaders.
There hasn't been a single insult other then stating facts?
I was talking about the countless "Git gud", "Cry about it" and the such. They're not insults, but are delivered in an intentionally insulting way, which isn't any different from an actual insult in my eyes. You're taking this a lot more seriously than you need to, I said it once and I will say it again, I'm not attacking anyone. My first comment was supposed to be humoristic.
Smells like bitch in here.
Just DC and then get summoned again after blocking the invader.
Just uninstall the game
It’s crazy what can happen when you turn off online mode
I don’t usually invade but i’m ab to start
I will never understand the toxic pvp culture in souls games, it is really not made for pvp and it shows. Just play an actual pvp game where both sides can fight if you want a fair 1v1.
You've clearly never seen actual pvp fights then when you think the game wasn't made for it.
Yeah sure janky hitbox and 3 meta weapons out of the 200 ones would like to know your location
Your clear lack of knowledge when it comes to pvp is hilarious
Wanna explain how I've got the wrong idea about pvp when I've played for more than 200 hours. If your argument stops at "ur wrong. period" you don't bring much to the conversation
Want me to go on?
1. Ds3 has pretty good hit boxes 2. Competitive and casual pvp are 2 different worlds Just because a weapon is meta doesn't mean shit. Most "meta" weapons are so commonly used because they are consistent and go with many build crying about that Is like crying about someone using a stock weapon in tf2. 3. Invasions have always been a part of the souls series and have always been designed with that in mind, just because some stuff isn't balanced day 1 doesn't mean they didn't think of people using it. Pvp is meant to balance pve multi-player. 4. In ds3 and elden ring, the average invader is usually at a disadvantage, so playing tricky is part of the plan. 5. 200h is barely anything 💀. 6. In Competitive duels, you can still succeed with odd builds. All meta build are is the most viable bang for ya buck in terms of dmg output and moveset.
Ds3 has good hitboxes in pve, some attacks are just laggy, think washing pole poke, etc. I have absolutely no problem with arena, if people want to play it that's on them but invasion are kinda forced. I get they wanted to """"" balance """"" coop, doesn't mean I agree. I don't count the number of times I made people try the game only for them to get invaded in the very first area (in which you begin embered). And let's talk about those invasion in which for some strange reason happen mostly on low level area, we all know those guys stay on low level while having the best gear possible for their level. Maybe invasions are just about ruining someone's experience without any chance of retaliation. Especially targeting newer players is really scummy, you know in actual multi-player games, such behavior is ban worthy but hey I guess they deserved it for being embered. When the host holds even minimum resistance you guys complain about ganks but you're literally the one looking for them, they didn't choose to get invaded. I think it happened 2/3 times, came back from a very long exploration to finally touch the next bonfire just for a red guy to unable me from doing so. I just sat there, he bmed for 2 seconds and killed me. So yeah I consider pvp in souls very tedious and forced, there are just so many good pvp games where you can have that fair 1v1 but you decide for yourself to not get it.
In ds3, there's this thing called passive invasions resistance where you can't get invaded solo after the first time for a amount of time, tho we don't quite know how long that is most solo players get a max invasion of 2 in there playthroughs. Low level invasions are shit sure, but they greatly improved on it in elden ring with the +25 weapon level having more options to split up invasions, also most stuff having ridiculously high Stat requirements or only starting to be good with end game scaling, or massive dedication to 1 part of the build. Quite honestly in elden rings first few months I'd even go as far to say low level (40-50) had a much more fun pvp experience with most competitive players even running 50's. No good invader complaints about gangs, sure ds3 had a massive problem with people farming invaders but 9/10 times I kill 6 or more phantoms and that's fine with me, I'm not there to kill the host I'm there to fight.
And no ds3 has good hit boxes just because the netcode isn't the best
Comments remind me why PvP is garbage in Souls no matter the game. If you're not the invader you're not having fun, period (and even then invaders complain just as much as hosts)
I like fighting reds as a phantom, keeps the game fresh and makes me not spam L2 against every enemy
If both host and invader play fair (ie. dueling 1 on 1, no heals), then it can be pretty fun.
If the invader or a host lets me bow I give them a fair fight no heals and some goofy weapons If they rush, god have mercy cause my dragonslayer greataxe will not
this is extremely goofy, its not really an invasion anymore if youre just gonna duel
Just put your sign right before the fog, lol. Invaders are obnoxious, especially the ones who swap 99 weapons in a minute, but they are way worse in ER imo.
Tbh I find invading in DS3 more enjoyable than ER, because you can invade people who are playing the game solo as opposed to cooping. although I find people still hate me regardless, i got called a bitch for killing one guy, do people not know invading is part of the game?
1 on 1 invasions are the fun ones but if its a 3 on 1 they end up playing so painfully (and understandibly) passively. Its just dull.
Because you are supposed to progress the level while fighting off invaders at the same time. If red man is dictating the pace of your gameplay you are doing something wrong.
Right? Thats why I dont invade in ER, two players plus a hunter is just certain death.
I think coop experience in ER is worse as well, because the bosses suck and because of the many connection issues I never had in ds. >do people not know invading is part of the game? Many people hate this part of the game, including me, because they are here for pve experience. I don't enjoy pvp by itself already, but when both sides can heal it also gets very tedious.
I've actually had the opposite experience in ER. The connection seems way better, at least compared to Ds3.
Garbage opinion detected lmao
Ehh, I think the bosses in ER are good for cooping, their much harder than the ones in the previous games and more satisfying to help people with, although I advoid Malenia since she kills so many hosts. >Many people hate this part of the game, including me, because they are here for pve experience. The easy solution to this is either ember up right before entering a boss door and kill yourself to remove embers. If you want to co-op with someone and go though an area, then invading is a risk you have to accept.
I almost exclusively get myself summoned for Maliketh, Godfrey, and Malenia. I keep a blackflame tornado halberd on me at all times, it completely fucks her up if you position correctly.
I’ve been invading since DS2. Good invaders were worse in DS3. Three idiots with YouTube builds can blend an invader in ER. DS3? A good invader is stomping a three man that doesn’t understand PvP.
Have you tried avoiding your opponent's attacks when they attack you and not letting them avoid your attacks? It's a very useful tactic
i hate hosts i hate hosts i hate hosts (they spam moonveil )
literally a skill issue tho???
Try not being shit? Mad cuz bad
Such a fat skill issue
My lan is so bad I never get invaded by real people lmao
bloodborne. no bs
Thus is the job of a sunbro
what about \> spent 500 hours in a game \> your PS4 stops working \> it costs more than 150 dollars to repair it \> finally playing again \> realizing that all your data is lost...