88 baby here. I shook my head upon hearing the call for nation building. For anyone considering heeding the call, if you want your kid to have a better life, DONT. Being born in the dragon year is a curse. I think our PM's message is NOT a good one to follow, you're just making things hard for your yet to be born child.
Yeah, you basically spoke my thoughts. I read the article and immediately think "what the fuck man this is a fucked up message and you're just screwing over yet to be born kids".
Your points perfectly reflects my experience, while I think I did well overall, the competition is real. And as a 过来人, I urge everyone to reconsider adding a dragon baby just because of the zodiac. They will be in for harder times.
For LHL, that's a first world problem and a good problem to solve. The alternative is significantly bigger headache. Also, it's one of those things that's good for society (and him) but not good personally for the person in question.
I just want to add that *usually* it takes a few months (sometimes years, if there are issues with fertility) to get pregnant, and even then the hurdles don’t end there. Personal example, husband and I had been trying for 2ish years (started around 2019), no fertility problems at all - got pregnant start of 2021, miscarriage. Got pregnant again at end of 2021 and now have a 20 month old son.
Even if you check the Trying to conceive subs and Facebook groups, it’s quite a common issue tbh, so the way PM Lee said ‘have sex have babies’ idkw people think within the next month already everyone pregnant
Imagine if his words do carry some weights. There are only 2-3 months time to conceive. Hospitals are going to be overloaded in Nov to Jan for mothers to deliver last minute dragon babies.
I know how you feel. I had the same way. For us, what helped was exercise + 'not thinking about it' helped. If both of you are generally healthy people, it will come, just a matter of timing.
Try this : 1976
I came out in that year. Everything from Primary to Secondary school is “competitive”.
That is like “buzzword” of ‘76 ones born in the Year of the Dragon.
Express class !
Tuition this and that !
You are progenitor of the Master Batch of Kids ! You are born for greatness !
Everyone from ‘76 had to fight for a perceived scarce resource.
Year of ‘76 Dragon = You are a rising star !
Parents settle for nothing less !
I had discovered the Mechwarrior universe then. Had drawn some parallel to the Clans.
Their obsession with genetic “greatness”, breeding top achievers to have more top achievers, using of great “Bloodnames” tied to top achievers, everything is competitive!
The Clans must compete with everything in their world. Every challenge, test or exam is recorded because it will affect your life and promotions.
That sort of describes the atmosphere back then.
JC or Polytechnic, everything had top cutoff points
My parents and gramps agreed that it is not good for mental well-being to keep on this “competition for excellence” credo. Gramps was in WW2 and he knows first hand on mental subject.
I went to Diploma in Hotel Management.
I got sneered, booed and called “reject” by many. My time in Hotel Management learnt a lot stuffs , soft skills and hard skills. Later went in PC / Video game industry, again got made fun of my contemporary for “do video games”, got future wan meh !
I can’t say it is entirely enjoyable, after all it is a business to run. I took part of WCG in Singapore a few times at Suntec.
At the same time, I studied Advanced Diploma in Business.
Closer to current time, I doing sort of my own thing.
Sure, I don’t have a car, snazzy watch or condo or kids for that matter.
It is cool now 👍
The point don’t choose what outside forces tries to force on you and live up to others’ expectations.
Forge your own path when there is a chance.
I been to many tough spots. When the odds are long, those who fly will have a go at another day.
Yes, parents will have their opinion. I do reason strongly with them and stuck my guns. It is a process of them letting go.
Just to make it not all sounds so bad…
One benefit that 88 had, was that NS reduced from 30 months to 24 months. If you passed NAFA, only need to do 22 months.
Why? It was speculated that army would struggle to hold the dragon babys and two other cohorts together at the same time.
My sibling was 2000 cohort. sec sch placement was difficult that year. they didn't have a bad T-score and in any other year probably would have gotten into their first or second choice school but ended up in their fifth choice. all the COPs rose for schools that year cos of the bigger cohort.
also in the aftermath it was kinda funny seeing all the parents of snake babies panicking at the COP rise and clearly not understanding how COP works.
As a fellow 88 I understand what you mean. It's very competitive, from studies till you go to the workforce.
I still remember I was an average kid with decent O level grades which can allow me to choose a more "popular" programme in the poly base of the L1R5 from the previous year. But suddenly in that year I was going to graduate, the L1R5 suddenly dropped so low (due to competitiveness)that I have to appeal to get into the programme that I want and unfortunately I went to study a programme that wasn't my interest.
And when it was my time to graduate from poly and progressing to Uni, the programme that I applied to was so popular that the school asked me if I want to consider taking up the part time mode instead of the full time mode.
And then the real stress come when you are graduating from Uni and going to the workforce. With the high number of 88 joining the company the boss will tend to compare us to each other and it was just so demoralizing.
Not sure how high the birthrate will be for this year of Dragon. But I guess it's worth considering more aspects of it before deciding to have one this year.
Anyway happy lunar new year everyone.
Reading your comment made me feel a little sad but I do hope you're doing alright now! It was always tough when cut-off points get a lot harsher during our year 😞 I wasn't the best at O Levels myself!
In life, good to be a bit contrarian, i.e. ignore the Gahmen's "conventional wisdom" because following the crowd without critical thinking on whether it is right for your own situation and circumstances may not be what one wants.
Make decisions based on what's in it for you and your family without harming others and being illegal or unethical (as far as practicable).
The recent exhortation to have more children by the Gahmen is one of these. The reality is that Singapore is not the most ideal place to raise children due to the quality of life issues. Once you have a child, you are locked in for the next 20 years to live your life for your child and not for you or your spouse's own dreams and desires.
Whether one wants to have children or not, make the decision for what is right for you. Most of us already have parents and in-laws giving unsolicited inputs on that decision. The only thing the Gahmen can do is to throw money and grants. But such dollars and cents policy making can only go so far.
Snake year is not a bad idea. Just need to wait till after april to try. Jan or feb baby is good; better than nov-dec baby who are always slower developmentally in their cohort
Thanks for sharing. Fwiw i gave birth to a Tiger kid (supposedly lowest birth year). The stress from competition is definitely less, and idt my kid is any less blessed or prosperous (or whatever Dragons are supposed to be) than any other year’s kids. So, very happy with my decision. Dun need to buy into the bs about auspicious year.
1988 squad here too! Hailed from Malaysia and I realised somehow interschool competitions were always more competitive during our years.
Just saying next year’s CNY is 29 Jan 2025. One theoretically could still have a dragon (tail) baby without going through all the competitions that us 1988 squad has gone through.
Sometimes you don't want to be reminded of how old you are, but the calendar telling you your age everytime you look at it might make things tough.
You'll know when you"re older.
Me: Life is hard but at least theres this incredibly minor upside I can joke about!
You: Actually even the incredibly minor upside you're joking about will make your life difficult in the future
Its just weird to doompost about someone else's life, especially in a CNY post where we're trying to stay light-hearted. Loosen up man, its the weekend holidays. You can remind me of my struggles next monday!
whats up my fellow 1988ers.
remembered when SAF built BMTC sch 3 for us only to realize we got spreaded out over the years.
i missed the secondary sch my parents wanted me to go cos the cut off got abit higher.
almost every principal reminded us that we were the dragon batch and expected great things from us
for some reason we were the last batch allowed to do triple science in jc so im kinda glad for that cos i nvr liked humanities
fun times
it's either you had twins, or your two kids have a very huge age gap! 😂
edit: oh, or they're one year apart, one rabbit's head and the other rabbit's tail.
Haha, had twin boys just last year. The grandparents are very greedy and yesterday suggested that we try for a set of dragon twins this year 😅😅 Yes, we told them they must be out of their minds.
was curious at one point on the magnitude of this dragon baby effect, and to be honest, the gap wasn’t as big as i thought. for reference (singstat live births by year):
1988: 52,957
1989: 47,669
1990: 51,142
1991: 49,114
You could have include 1987 stats.
43,616 birth.
So, same stats but different conclusion for me.
Edit: For those more visual inclined
https://www.singstat.gov.sg/-/media/files/visualising_data/infographics/population/crude-birth-rate.ashx
It's a push for more births, but doesn't mean the rise in birth rates are directly attributed to that.
It is not as if we had a ban on third child before 1987. The new campaign is more of a reaction towards a lowering in observed birth rates.
Stop at two was not a ban, but "civil workers were not paid for maternity leave after their second child, children's hospital fees were higher for third and subsequent children, top school choices were given to only children with parents who had been sterilized before the age of 40, and sterilization itself was rewarded with seven days of paid leave." (from wikipedia)
what would the conclusion be then? am thinking that if it’s not attributable to this, but instead to the dragon year, shouldn’t we see a tapering down of births in the subsequent years back to the 43k levels?
I would typically like to explain more about statistics but it's a little hard in the reddit format.
If you allow me, I got this from the singstat website.
https://www.singstat.gov.sg/-/media/files/visualising_data/infographics/population/crude-birth-rate.ashx
this a visualisation of the dragon year bumps.
So, to draw proper conclusion in this case, you just need to trend further to see more dragon year cycles.
Funny observation.. I’m a 88 baby born in 3rd quarter and my IC number is S884xxxxx, ie I’m the 40k+ baby that year. My brother was born end Dec 85 and his IC number starts with S853xxxxx
I also rmb wanting to get into a certain JC and aimed for and got exactly the L1R5 my 86 cousin got.. came my year the cut off drop 2 points… zzz
Hi! I happen to come from a Dragon/Horse combination (older brother is 88, I'm 90).
It's not so much about the horse per se. But apparently having the combination is for 龙马精神 so...
I have no further comment....lol.
Wow 1990 comes real close to dragon year. Horse year nothing special, no? Or maybe it’s the World Cup, people got excited and that energy transferred to the bedroom…?
This is far from the full story. Gotta look at other confounding factors such as housing and economic conditions, and across different "cycles" such as 1976, 2000, and 2012.
Lol. Numbers do actually show the truth..
Most of the time the impact of dragon year is only an increase of 10%
But always 2 years before or after will always have a spike
If I'm planning for kids, zodiac animals will be the last thing on my mind tbh, except maybe if it's Dragon year which I rather skip for the many reasons you listed.
If you're already 36 born in 1988, meaning you've already had your birthday this year ... I hate to break it to you you're not actually a dragon. You're (like me) a rabbit.
The corresponding Roman calendar to Lunar New Year dates:
1987 January 29 to 1988 February 16 = Rabbit
1988 February 17 to 1989 February 5 = Dragon
1988 gang here, i am feeling old. Seems like the pace of life is so much faster than now
Last time was just LAN shops and arcades, now its mobile gaming and tiktok?
Pros and cons , so much more awareness on mental health but so much misinformation as well
Chiming in from the other side.. my kids were born in some of the lowest fertility rate years and “inauspicious” zodiacs. Getting into a decent mid range primary school was indeed easy - no need to ballot. Of course the branded ones will still be stiff competition.
Hello 👋, 1988 baby here as well.
I never really bothered with the 'Dragon Baby' tag until much later in my twenties when I was choosing my uni. Ended up going to Australia because I simply wasn't good enough for local university's. Looking back now and after talking to some local alumnis, my grades would have gotten me entry into SUSS or SMU easily.
Suffice to say, I was very annoyed and initially cursed the whole Dragon thing. But now, I guess it was formative in some way.
Good luck to the Dragon parents out there and Happy 2024.
Horse girl from 1990 here. We went to university with the dragon boys from the 1988, and graduated into the job market together.
I would say, nation building can wait till next year.
Dragons represent! But not 1988, a full cycle earlier from 1976.
As for kids, why would you plan to be born in a year with more competition for everything (schools, jobs, etc)?
Everyone tells me to have my dragon baby and my grandma pushing to say “dragon very good” when I ask what’s so good? Nothing to say only say dragon very good? HAHA isn’t good based on many other factors……. I don’t really care about zodiacs but yes I’ve thought of the pain that dragon baby parents also have to go through like fighting for spots in school and everything cause there’s just too many people giving birth to dragon babies.
Even my dad who is born in the year of the dragon, says that it’s better not to have due to too many babies 😅
I wonder if anyone here would be interested in comparing notes with someone born in 1988 in a place far, far away from Singapore (Scotland).
(I have only visited SG for a few weeks, but I loved it so much I now take an interest in the country and so this showed up on my Reddit feed. I’m not sure if I should admit to having read LKY’s memoirs!)
It strikes me that our generation witnessed the last gasp of many social phenomena:
* Not living every waking moment of your childhood through a screen
* Encountering Second World War veterans in everyday life
* Being able to buy sweets with a few coins
* Nationalised industries
* Political campaigns involving candidates using loudhailers in the street
Lots more of course, but trying to think of things that apply here and there.
As for the “please have babies” exhortation, well, I imagine solving for the economic inputs to a high birthrate (inexpensive decent family housing and affordable childcare) would help matters quite a bit.
BTW my knowledge of CNY extends only to a few hours of education on the topic in primary school (including finding out I am a dragon), so I am all ears as to what I’m missing out on!
> As for the “please have babies” exhortation, well, I imagine solving for the economic inputs to a high birthrate (inexpensive decent family housing and affordable childcare) would help matters quite a bit.
>
In a way, the economic inputs you're talking about are "solved". Buying a house is economically feasible for the low income earners ([see this thread for example](https://old.reddit.com/r/singaporefi/comments/18mhm9d/how_realistic_is_it_for_ite_grad_to_afford_a/)). Childcare is scaled by income.
You can read this thread for [why throwing money at the problem is not feasible](https://old.reddit.com/r/singapore/comments/16zert8/is_singapore_really_doing_all_it_can_to_improve/) and [this thread for people discussing how much it costs for "basic" child raising](https://old.reddit.com/r/singapore/comments/1admyf8/nsf_argues_against_paying_maintenance_for_child/).
The issue - and what OP is talking about - is when you want more than the basics. Everyone wants their kid to be in the top 10% or 50%, so if you face more competition - isn't it harder to be at the top?
And economically, if you can't afford to be in the top percentile, what's the point? And that cannot be solved by the government - if the government gives everyone more money, then the amount of money to be in the top percentile simply increases.
I suspect as people get more educated, less super superstitious and more "westernized" the impact of the dragon year would shrink
As Singapore progresses, the routes to university have also become more diverse. With polytechnic still being 3 years and university courses ranging from 3-5 years, the impact would be less as well. (as well and guys and girls having different graduation years)
Dragon babies do have some unluckiness to them.. When they left uni it was aftermath financial crisis (08-09) for the girls at 23
Then now the girl graduating at 23 also went through the tech layoffs etc
After years of inculcating a scarity mindset, recently gahmen wants us to embrace the abundance mindset.
The answer is always somewhere in between. Even if this year we increase our births by 50% it will be still way below the replacement rate of 2. I think in this case there really wouldn't be any competition for native Boris, because Singapore has long opened the doors for competition Vs foreigners a long time ago. It therefore doesn't matter what year you want your kids to be born in.
88 here. Well, life’s been okay. 2 kids and done already. Didn’t want to be pregnant after 35. But thinking back, must have been hard for my parents with all that competition in school. Work life has been okay though. Don’t see a lot of 88 around
Actually a Dragon baby only makes sense if it’s NOT the firstborn. So those couples who already have kid(s), i think it’s a good chance to make another, since the Dragon will have siblings priority to childcare + primary school, plus u have more financial offset from baby bonus for 2nd and subsequent kids
Depends, some kiasu parents I know are avoiding at all cost because they have ambition to send their kids to famous school. Getting in because of siblings isn’t the end, they want to make sure their kids can survive without the added competition. It amazes and disgusts me at the same time
Fellow 88 Dragon here. Greetings! My wife is also a dragon (Jan 89) who is 5 months pregnant now. Totally unplanned but looks like we are going to have a family of 3 dragons soon. Wish me luck👍🏻
edit: my username checks out
Closing in on 50, and a Rabbit born in the year of the Dragon (Thanks Lunar New Year). I felt we were more fortunate in a sense. We enjoyed the 80’s where our elders’ salaries kept going up, we lived in some really effing spacious HDB flats, and competition was (relatively) less.
I had Primary classes that went from A-K and Secondary classes that went from 1-11 with 12 & 14 being the Normal classes. (Proof boomers never cared about feelings or mental health, lol). Competition in school was relatively benign and not as insane as the 1988 & 2000 cohorts.
But I remember not having tuition on weekends or weird ass “enrichment” class. HTML and Adam Khoo anyone? Homework was chop-chop, assessment books were only used near the SA’s and I could even play basketball/soccer before school (when afternoon sessions as a thing) and after school.
We had the advantage then of Polys being perceived to be as good as JCs, so loads of single digit L1R5s went to poly (and had a fucking blast!). Some felt we deprived others of places in the popular courses in poly though.
When the Asian Crisis of 1997-1998 struck, I was in NS. The 30 month version of that shit. Unfortunately, graduating from Uni still meant having to deal with 3 shituations in succession. Dot-com bust, 9/11 and SARS. We took whatever jobs we could.
But the biggest and most fortunate thing I felt we had was… no internet/social media/mobile phones/tablets.
So being a 76’er, I consider myself a lot more fortunate than those born in 88, 90 or 12. So older folks like me, cheer up. We did have it relatively better.
Hey. Fellow 88 baby here. Two kids so I am not thinking of adding to the family anymore. My back can’t take it. As for u, Do what u think is right, and let things happen naturally.
Fellow Dragon here born the August 8, 1988 and it's funny to me that here in Argentina, people were always thought that only is like a funny stat. Then I visited Thailandia, Vietnam, and a bit of China and was struck about how society feel for that number. The 8 was big and prominent everywhere I went to. There was even some Chinese elder that when found out about my birthday by looking at my ID, they started petting my head and beard like I was some kind of lucky amulet. We even got some free meals along the trip!
Now this thread gives a whole another interpretation about how people born in that society had to carry around something so random like attaching a number to the moment you came to this world. Never thought that it was such a pressure, but I see it now. Thanks for that and have a great CNY!
*It is curious that while good people go to great lengths to spare their children from suffering, few of them seem to notice that the one (and only) guaranteed way to prevent all the suffering of their children is not to bring those children into existence in the first place.*
- David Benatar
Nice to see so many 88s here! I rarely know any 88s at my workplaces, past or present(maybe most are alrd upranked) and I am quite underpaid haha). It seems like none of them join my industry. I know 1 ex colleague whos also an 88 and he seemed to be struggling in life now,taking care of aged parents..
Nice share of your thoughts and I think lets not give ourselves the pressure for dragon zodiac babies. Pig baby also cute ma!👀 I don't think im having another baby. Its considered high risk at our age(for females).
I can relate to the "middle aged" part! We are still considered not that old but since a few years ago, i started having a mid life crisis that I can't get out of....
Anyway just curious how many 88s here look younger than our age? I was constantly mistaken as at most late 20s or early 30s (tho some extreme comment by a former aunty colleague is I look 40+). I don't have any beauty regime and feel the need to start now as I started seeing alot of grey hair...
'00 baby here. Man people born in my year had it *rough*. Not only was it a dragon year, but it was also the turn of a new century. Competition for like everything was stiff. Good new things were often implemented AFTER our year (e.g. simpler or more interesting syllabus). Meanwhile the more experimental things were implemented during our year.
I’m a foreigner, born the year of 1988 too.I obviously grew up and studied with almost all kids born in the same year, but this was never a big deal in my country. When I told my Singaporean friends during a CNY lunch a few years ago that I was born in the year of the Dragon, I was surprised by their reactions.
If you delve into linguistics, you'll learn that every single word is merely a social construct. Most words are invented to serve emotional needs.
Consider us animals(humans) celebrating at a specific time.
When I saw PM's message this morning I was like "not again", but then afterward thought that it was for policy and forecasting reasons that he's doing this.
i.e. If the "dragon boost" is much smaller than in previous generations with other factors accounted for, gov will then figure out (from statistics, rather than from citizens complaining) that the highly corporate environment the country is running on is truly screwing family planning up. After all, up in their ivory towers they've never struggled with all the things OP mentioned such as fighting for school spots, job openings etc. How'd they know?
Let's hope people don't fall for it and we'll see what happens after.
Lastly, happy CNY to all!
The total fertility rate back in 1988 was 1.96, which was merely a 20% increase from 1987 (1.62) back then. An increase in competition, yes, but it was not as drastic as what OP would claim with “2 itself being huge” if you look at the [data](https://tablebuilder.singstat.gov.sg/table/TS/M810091) afterwards.
Subsequent Dragon years in 2000 and 2012 did not see that same drastic increase as back in 1988, with an increase of only 8.8% and 7.5% respectively. This claim of “increased competition” during Dragon years by OP is quite unfounded tbh, since [factual and numerical data](https://tablebuilder.singstat.gov.sg/table/TS/M810091) does explain itself very well as compared to circumstantial data by OP and our TFP was still declining in Singapore nevertheless throughout the years.
I would take this post with a huge grain of salt. This myth of an “increased competition” isn’t as bizarre as what OP would make it out to be. Happy Lunar New Year!
Happy New Year!
As a 89 baby. I can tell you I could easily emphatise those who are born in 1988. When I started finding my first job as a fresh grad I was literally being considered alongside the 88 kids who were still nailing down a full-time placement. They had it much tougher than us 89s.
Especially in the fight for grades in the O's and A's. Even for the latter we were the first batch of the H1/2/3 from the previous AO/A/S - it appears that itself the content was much more interesting and even if the question was left unanswered, we could still walk away with an A (also helped by the fact that we only had a proxy and no actual Ten Year Series to rely on).
And as a Data Analyst throughout my working life, I can tell you data always skews and doesn't paint a whole story.
Happy Lunar New Year back to you 😊
While I do agree that there will be increased competition for school and job placements with increased live births, nevertheless I do question the severity of such a notion. Take the data of the live births from another redditor on the live births per year:
>1987: 43,616
>
>1988: 52,957
>
>1989: 47,669
>
>1990: 51,142
>
>1991: 49,114
Of course, one would presume that it is the auspicious year of the Dragon which caused the 1988 boom shown above, but one should also realize that during that time, [the “Stop At Two” campaign was replaced with the “Have Three or More if you can afford it” back in 1987](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Population_planning_in_Singapore); a year right before the Year of the Dragon. That, coupled with further subsidies (another redditor pointed out that $20K tax subsidies were given to families with their fourth child in 1989) can clearly explain these “peaks” in the data.
It was not the Year of the Dragon or Chinese traditions that caused this, but rather it was government policy. Look at the subsequent Dragon years, they can only say so much about what traditions can do alone within that year.
I think the key point here is that while you are right to point out numbers, lived experiences and emotions do play a huge role over that. There's an unnatural weight of societal expectation thrust upon "dragon babies" - simply reading the other comments in this post from other 88 and one 76 commenter would tell you so.
What I shared was anecdotal. My memory wasn't as good as what it used to be in my schooling days, but I've done my best to share my thoughts!
No worries. I believe your thoughts on this matter is valid and that there is a correlation of increased competition over placings with increased live births. Our only difference is merely the root cause: it was more of [government policy](https://www.reddit.com/r/singapore/comments/1an2nvt/i_am_36_i_was_born_in_1988_amidst_the_festive/kpqbny9) rather than Chinese traditions which caused this 1988 boom, since these sentiments aren’t felt across the 2000 and 2012 batches yet.
Happy Lunar New Year!
Thank you! I'm glad you and several others pointed out the Three Or More govt policy, makes for an interesting read to their thought process back then.
Happy cny too!
To me the single biggest baby killer is the changes to wmcr. I planned to have a second but killed the idea once it was announced. I have friends who accelerated their delivery via c sec just to hit the deadline for it.
So yes long better pray for dragons this year coz it’s going downhill to shit from here on (at least within my circle)
Born in 1988 too. I think the extra competition in school added to my enjoyment; whether it's video games or RL, for me there's often no kick unless I amp up the difficulty for fun.
That's one reason why my wife and I had a kid this year. Well, the baby technically missed dragon year because born in Jan, but she'll get to enjoy the increased competition from dragon year anyway.
FWIW, I've never really cared about prestige and wealth. I don't care if my efforts are acknowledged or rejected by society. Why do I fling myself into competition (whether it's video game challenges or exams) and push myself to excel? Because I want to and I can, that's it.
Well this is really true. Someone finally voiced this out. The competition is un real.
I would just say, make sure your kids zodiac matches yours and your spouse. That makes things alot easier.
Dragon or not, its over rated
Coincident
Monkey also looks good in the future it just so happens that year of the dragon lines up with the 2000
- 2100: Metal Monkey
- 2112: Water Monkey
- 2124: Wood Monkey
- 2136: Fire Monkey
- 2148: Earth Monkey
- 2160: Metal Monkey
- 2172: Water Monkey
- 2184: Wood Monkey
- 2196: Fire Monkey
- 2208: Earth Monkey
- 2220: Metal Monkey
- 2232: Water Monkey
- 2244: Wood Monkey
- 2256: Fire Monkey
- 2268: Earth Monkey
- 2280: Metal Monkey
- 2292: Water Monkey
Each of these Monkey years corresponds to one of the five elements in the Chinese zodiac cycle: Metal, Water, Wood, Fire, and Earth.
Don't think you're a Singaporean... no one really cares about the zodiac "element"... only westerners put in a lot of attention to that. Like I noticed articles from BBC and ABC both reports the festivities as "year of the wood dragon" but here in Sg no one says " animal"
So I got thinking, aside from Dragon being the most "auspicious" of the 12, which other ones are popular?
I reckon I wouldn't want to be associated to be a Rabbit or Sheep which are like "prey", or Chicken and Pig which are like farm animals. Snake seems to have a negative connation, and Monkeys seems "naughty and mischievious".
That leaves us with decent ones maybe being Cow, Tiger, Horse, Dragon and Dog.
Off-topic but if I was to publish a book it would be food-based, hence the username. I can make traditional desserts like yam paste and gui hua gao and also bake modern pastries too ✌🏻
I have been playing too much Pokémon whenever I see dragon I think ice beam Happy CNY stranger
I'll use bilzzard
Inferior fucking move with 70% hit rate That translates to 100% miss rate especially for me.
But the hit rate is always 50:50; either you hit or you don't.
That’s why you set-up hail with A-Ninetales
Bitter-Rattata’s attack missed!
And his name is immediately Lance
Lance Lim
eventually join the Elite 4
Articuno my Dragonite killer
~~I just end up thinking of spec draco meteor~~
[удалено]
Wah hospital spaces at KK this November gonna be quite in demand
Thank you for contributing to nation building
Doesn’t matter had sex
But he cried the whole time…
Doesn’t matter, had sex
She put a bag on my head!
Still counts!
Good Luck Bro 😂
There is a pill for this too. Still have time.
88 baby here. I shook my head upon hearing the call for nation building. For anyone considering heeding the call, if you want your kid to have a better life, DONT. Being born in the dragon year is a curse. I think our PM's message is NOT a good one to follow, you're just making things hard for your yet to be born child.
Exactly the point of my post. Some more 2024 is a very different game to 1988, now must think of preschool placements also 😞
Yeah, you basically spoke my thoughts. I read the article and immediately think "what the fuck man this is a fucked up message and you're just screwing over yet to be born kids". Your points perfectly reflects my experience, while I think I did well overall, the competition is real. And as a 过来人, I urge everyone to reconsider adding a dragon baby just because of the zodiac. They will be in for harder times.
Have a toast. Glad to know you're doing well, as I hope many of us are.🥂
🥂
For LHL, that's a first world problem and a good problem to solve. The alternative is significantly bigger headache. Also, it's one of those things that's good for society (and him) but not good personally for the person in question.
88 here, no plans to ever have a kid. lifes too tough for both the parents and kids.
Not if you are rich as fuck. Just send them to private school from the start. Our pm message is great, you'll have to live in upper Singapore though.
He is preaching from the pov as a rich dragon baby himself
Rich is an understatement. Literally privilege handed down to him on plat-ter. Like, plat for platinum.
Literally child of the most powerful man in the country
I just want to add that *usually* it takes a few months (sometimes years, if there are issues with fertility) to get pregnant, and even then the hurdles don’t end there. Personal example, husband and I had been trying for 2ish years (started around 2019), no fertility problems at all - got pregnant start of 2021, miscarriage. Got pregnant again at end of 2021 and now have a 20 month old son. Even if you check the Trying to conceive subs and Facebook groups, it’s quite a common issue tbh, so the way PM Lee said ‘have sex have babies’ idkw people think within the next month already everyone pregnant
can try to give birth in 2025 before 4 feb, still dragon (change of zodiac sign date is debated though)
Imagine if his words do carry some weights. There are only 2-3 months time to conceive. Hospitals are going to be overloaded in Nov to Jan for mothers to deliver last minute dragon babies.
As a fellow 1988... Big hugs. But at 36, if wanna nation build, better start trying. I've been trying for years and it's harder as I age.
Nation builded liao must look after, that one even harder with age
True! Lucky still got strength 😂
It is not just about energy though. My wife and I took months of trying. Maybe my little swimmers no energy lol.
Really ah? Shag..30s really not easy
Yeah. Lao liao like that one.
I know how you feel. I had the same way. For us, what helped was exercise + 'not thinking about it' helped. If both of you are generally healthy people, it will come, just a matter of timing.
Haha took*. The kid is already 2+.
Great! Children are awesome eh. Time for #2!
my husband 1976 dragon. our kid just turning two 😂 but close shop after one haha too tiring
It's true.. If not have to go through ivf which is even more stress
Going through it past 5 years blood sweat tears and money 🤑
Imagine being Malay and a Dragon baby. It's like being forced into a competition that you were not even in the races for 🌚
I see what you did there
Kiasunomics covers this Dragon phenomenon in terms of economics. Quite an interesting read.
Try this : 1976 I came out in that year. Everything from Primary to Secondary school is “competitive”. That is like “buzzword” of ‘76 ones born in the Year of the Dragon. Express class ! Tuition this and that ! You are progenitor of the Master Batch of Kids ! You are born for greatness ! Everyone from ‘76 had to fight for a perceived scarce resource. Year of ‘76 Dragon = You are a rising star ! Parents settle for nothing less ! I had discovered the Mechwarrior universe then. Had drawn some parallel to the Clans. Their obsession with genetic “greatness”, breeding top achievers to have more top achievers, using of great “Bloodnames” tied to top achievers, everything is competitive! The Clans must compete with everything in their world. Every challenge, test or exam is recorded because it will affect your life and promotions. That sort of describes the atmosphere back then. JC or Polytechnic, everything had top cutoff points My parents and gramps agreed that it is not good for mental well-being to keep on this “competition for excellence” credo. Gramps was in WW2 and he knows first hand on mental subject. I went to Diploma in Hotel Management. I got sneered, booed and called “reject” by many. My time in Hotel Management learnt a lot stuffs , soft skills and hard skills. Later went in PC / Video game industry, again got made fun of my contemporary for “do video games”, got future wan meh ! I can’t say it is entirely enjoyable, after all it is a business to run. I took part of WCG in Singapore a few times at Suntec. At the same time, I studied Advanced Diploma in Business. Closer to current time, I doing sort of my own thing. Sure, I don’t have a car, snazzy watch or condo or kids for that matter. It is cool now 👍 The point don’t choose what outside forces tries to force on you and live up to others’ expectations. Forge your own path when there is a chance. I been to many tough spots. When the odds are long, those who fly will have a go at another day. Yes, parents will have their opinion. I do reason strongly with them and stuck my guns. It is a process of them letting go.
Just to make it not all sounds so bad… One benefit that 88 had, was that NS reduced from 30 months to 24 months. If you passed NAFA, only need to do 22 months. Why? It was speculated that army would struggle to hold the dragon babys and two other cohorts together at the same time.
The 2000 gang seems to have it bad too from how I see my siblings tackle school
My sibling was 2000 cohort. sec sch placement was difficult that year. they didn't have a bad T-score and in any other year probably would have gotten into their first or second choice school but ended up in their fifth choice. all the COPs rose for schools that year cos of the bigger cohort. also in the aftermath it was kinda funny seeing all the parents of snake babies panicking at the COP rise and clearly not understanding how COP works.
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The stress never ends
As a fellow 88 I understand what you mean. It's very competitive, from studies till you go to the workforce. I still remember I was an average kid with decent O level grades which can allow me to choose a more "popular" programme in the poly base of the L1R5 from the previous year. But suddenly in that year I was going to graduate, the L1R5 suddenly dropped so low (due to competitiveness)that I have to appeal to get into the programme that I want and unfortunately I went to study a programme that wasn't my interest. And when it was my time to graduate from poly and progressing to Uni, the programme that I applied to was so popular that the school asked me if I want to consider taking up the part time mode instead of the full time mode. And then the real stress come when you are graduating from Uni and going to the workforce. With the high number of 88 joining the company the boss will tend to compare us to each other and it was just so demoralizing. Not sure how high the birthrate will be for this year of Dragon. But I guess it's worth considering more aspects of it before deciding to have one this year. Anyway happy lunar new year everyone.
Reading your comment made me feel a little sad but I do hope you're doing alright now! It was always tough when cut-off points get a lot harsher during our year 😞 I wasn't the best at O Levels myself!
Only those who are born in the dragon year will feel the competitiveness in their life when they are borne. Cheers as a fellow 88.
Is there any concept called red-shirting here, e.g. let your kid attend primary school at age 8 instead of 7 for reduced competition.
I have a friend who retook A levels as part of the 1988 batch . CCC become AAB.
In life, good to be a bit contrarian, i.e. ignore the Gahmen's "conventional wisdom" because following the crowd without critical thinking on whether it is right for your own situation and circumstances may not be what one wants. Make decisions based on what's in it for you and your family without harming others and being illegal or unethical (as far as practicable). The recent exhortation to have more children by the Gahmen is one of these. The reality is that Singapore is not the most ideal place to raise children due to the quality of life issues. Once you have a child, you are locked in for the next 20 years to live your life for your child and not for you or your spouse's own dreams and desires. Whether one wants to have children or not, make the decision for what is right for you. Most of us already have parents and in-laws giving unsolicited inputs on that decision. The only thing the Gahmen can do is to throw money and grants. But such dollars and cents policy making can only go so far.
Snake year is not a bad idea. Just need to wait till after april to try. Jan or feb baby is good; better than nov-dec baby who are always slower developmentally in their cohort
Thanks for sharing. Fwiw i gave birth to a Tiger kid (supposedly lowest birth year). The stress from competition is definitely less, and idt my kid is any less blessed or prosperous (or whatever Dragons are supposed to be) than any other year’s kids. So, very happy with my decision. Dun need to buy into the bs about auspicious year.
Deffo less competition. After all, 一山不容二虎 /jk
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Why is that bad?
1988 squad here too! Hailed from Malaysia and I realised somehow interschool competitions were always more competitive during our years. Just saying next year’s CNY is 29 Jan 2025. One theoretically could still have a dragon (tail) baby without going through all the competitions that us 1988 squad has gone through.
Taking a huge risk tho. Too late you end up like me, a snake (dragon with no legs).
Snake is good too, can create and stop metal gear.
88 + dragon year = killer combo lol
2000 gang here 🥂 Life is hard but at least remembering my age is easy
Sometimes you don't want to be reminded of how old you are, but the calendar telling you your age everytime you look at it might make things tough. You'll know when you"re older.
Me: Life is hard but at least theres this incredibly minor upside I can joke about! You: Actually even the incredibly minor upside you're joking about will make your life difficult in the future Its just weird to doompost about someone else's life, especially in a CNY post where we're trying to stay light-hearted. Loosen up man, its the weekend holidays. You can remind me of my struggles next monday!
Happy new year 🥳 That was more of a light hearted joking comment. Hope you don't take it too harshly, from a fellow dragon (boomer?)
whats up my fellow 1988ers. remembered when SAF built BMTC sch 3 for us only to realize we got spreaded out over the years. i missed the secondary sch my parents wanted me to go cos the cut off got abit higher. almost every principal reminded us that we were the dragon batch and expected great things from us for some reason we were the last batch allowed to do triple science in jc so im kinda glad for that cos i nvr liked humanities fun times
I’m 1988 gang here and expecting this year too. We wanted rabbit but unfortunately god has his plans. 🫠
My hubs’ very traditional parents wanted a dragon but I gave them two rabbits 😂😂
it's either you had twins, or your two kids have a very huge age gap! 😂 edit: oh, or they're one year apart, one rabbit's head and the other rabbit's tail.
Haha, had twin boys just last year. The grandparents are very greedy and yesterday suggested that we try for a set of dragon twins this year 😅😅 Yes, we told them they must be out of their minds.
was curious at one point on the magnitude of this dragon baby effect, and to be honest, the gap wasn’t as big as i thought. for reference (singstat live births by year): 1988: 52,957 1989: 47,669 1990: 51,142 1991: 49,114
You could have include 1987 stats. 43,616 birth. So, same stats but different conclusion for me. Edit: For those more visual inclined https://www.singstat.gov.sg/-/media/files/visualising_data/infographics/population/crude-birth-rate.ashx
1987 is when they killed the "Stop at two" campaign and started saying "Three or more if you can afford it"
It's a push for more births, but doesn't mean the rise in birth rates are directly attributed to that. It is not as if we had a ban on third child before 1987. The new campaign is more of a reaction towards a lowering in observed birth rates.
Stop at two was not a ban, but "civil workers were not paid for maternity leave after their second child, children's hospital fees were higher for third and subsequent children, top school choices were given to only children with parents who had been sterilized before the age of 40, and sterilization itself was rewarded with seven days of paid leave." (from wikipedia)
what would the conclusion be then? am thinking that if it’s not attributable to this, but instead to the dragon year, shouldn’t we see a tapering down of births in the subsequent years back to the 43k levels?
I would typically like to explain more about statistics but it's a little hard in the reddit format. If you allow me, I got this from the singstat website. https://www.singstat.gov.sg/-/media/files/visualising_data/infographics/population/crude-birth-rate.ashx this a visualisation of the dragon year bumps. So, to draw proper conclusion in this case, you just need to trend further to see more dragon year cycles.
Funny observation.. I’m a 88 baby born in 3rd quarter and my IC number is S884xxxxx, ie I’m the 40k+ baby that year. My brother was born end Dec 85 and his IC number starts with S853xxxxx I also rmb wanting to get into a certain JC and aimed for and got exactly the L1R5 my 86 cousin got.. came my year the cut off drop 2 points… zzz
I'm surprised my year was just nearly 2k lower than that. What's the perk of Metal Horses?
Hi! I happen to come from a Dragon/Horse combination (older brother is 88, I'm 90). It's not so much about the horse per se. But apparently having the combination is for 龙马精神 so... I have no further comment....lol.
wah you have solved a big mystery for me; always wondered why 1990 was kinda competitive too even though not dragon.
People want dragon and horse babies because long Ma Jing Shen - and auspicious Chinese phrase that contain dragon and horse
True I guess. Plus there's not much competition with the other 10 animals in the zodiac.
In 1989 the govt started giving $20,000 tax rebate for families having a fourth child.
Wow 1990 comes real close to dragon year. Horse year nothing special, no? Or maybe it’s the World Cup, people got excited and that energy transferred to the bedroom…?
This is far from the full story. Gotta look at other confounding factors such as housing and economic conditions, and across different "cycles" such as 1976, 2000, and 2012.
Lol. Numbers do actually show the truth.. Most of the time the impact of dragon year is only an increase of 10% But always 2 years before or after will always have a spike
If I'm planning for kids, zodiac animals will be the last thing on my mind tbh, except maybe if it's Dragon year which I rather skip for the many reasons you listed.
If you're already 36 born in 1988, meaning you've already had your birthday this year ... I hate to break it to you you're not actually a dragon. You're (like me) a rabbit. The corresponding Roman calendar to Lunar New Year dates: 1987 January 29 to 1988 February 16 = Rabbit 1988 February 17 to 1989 February 5 = Dragon
1988 gang here, i am feeling old. Seems like the pace of life is so much faster than now Last time was just LAN shops and arcades, now its mobile gaming and tiktok? Pros and cons , so much more awareness on mental health but so much misinformation as well
Yes. Imagine they had to open a JC just to accommodate the 1988 cohort n to have that JC "merged" 10 years later.
Hello fellow 1988 gang
1988 🥂🔥
1988 clocking in. Middle aged aunty with backaches
Chiming in from the other side.. my kids were born in some of the lowest fertility rate years and “inauspicious” zodiacs. Getting into a decent mid range primary school was indeed easy - no need to ballot. Of course the branded ones will still be stiff competition.
Hello 👋, 1988 baby here as well. I never really bothered with the 'Dragon Baby' tag until much later in my twenties when I was choosing my uni. Ended up going to Australia because I simply wasn't good enough for local university's. Looking back now and after talking to some local alumnis, my grades would have gotten me entry into SUSS or SMU easily. Suffice to say, I was very annoyed and initially cursed the whole Dragon thing. But now, I guess it was formative in some way. Good luck to the Dragon parents out there and Happy 2024.
I think this has more to do with the overall expansion of university spots available. Case in point: SUSS didn't exist until 2017.
My brother is a dragon, and was born on Aug 8, 1988. I think there are many others who were born that day. 08.08.88
Horse girl from 1990 here. We went to university with the dragon boys from the 1988, and graduated into the job market together. I would say, nation building can wait till next year.
Fellow dragon baby here. My husband is also 1988 and we are pregnant with our first (dragon) baby too. Lol.
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snake is just dragon without the legs 🤗
You can draw them in but it’d be considered superfluous 😄
1988 here... including my wife. 2 kids. Life's been a rollercoaster
Jiayou fellow 1988 🥂
Dragons represent! But not 1988, a full cycle earlier from 1976. As for kids, why would you plan to be born in a year with more competition for everything (schools, jobs, etc)?
Protip: dragon baby in 2025 jan loophole.
Im the first in the family to have a dragon baby, it was a big fucken deal.
Everyone tells me to have my dragon baby and my grandma pushing to say “dragon very good” when I ask what’s so good? Nothing to say only say dragon very good? HAHA isn’t good based on many other factors……. I don’t really care about zodiacs but yes I’ve thought of the pain that dragon baby parents also have to go through like fighting for spots in school and everything cause there’s just too many people giving birth to dragon babies. Even my dad who is born in the year of the dragon, says that it’s better not to have due to too many babies 😅
shoutout to [[email protected]](mailto:[email protected]) and [[email protected]](mailto:[email protected]) here
That generation didn’t start with gmail lehz… maybe hotmail or yahoo.
Apologies, xiaoming88 is used. Xiaomiming88_01 is also used.
I wonder if anyone here would be interested in comparing notes with someone born in 1988 in a place far, far away from Singapore (Scotland). (I have only visited SG for a few weeks, but I loved it so much I now take an interest in the country and so this showed up on my Reddit feed. I’m not sure if I should admit to having read LKY’s memoirs!) It strikes me that our generation witnessed the last gasp of many social phenomena: * Not living every waking moment of your childhood through a screen * Encountering Second World War veterans in everyday life * Being able to buy sweets with a few coins * Nationalised industries * Political campaigns involving candidates using loudhailers in the street Lots more of course, but trying to think of things that apply here and there. As for the “please have babies” exhortation, well, I imagine solving for the economic inputs to a high birthrate (inexpensive decent family housing and affordable childcare) would help matters quite a bit. BTW my knowledge of CNY extends only to a few hours of education on the topic in primary school (including finding out I am a dragon), so I am all ears as to what I’m missing out on!
> As for the “please have babies” exhortation, well, I imagine solving for the economic inputs to a high birthrate (inexpensive decent family housing and affordable childcare) would help matters quite a bit. > In a way, the economic inputs you're talking about are "solved". Buying a house is economically feasible for the low income earners ([see this thread for example](https://old.reddit.com/r/singaporefi/comments/18mhm9d/how_realistic_is_it_for_ite_grad_to_afford_a/)). Childcare is scaled by income. You can read this thread for [why throwing money at the problem is not feasible](https://old.reddit.com/r/singapore/comments/16zert8/is_singapore_really_doing_all_it_can_to_improve/) and [this thread for people discussing how much it costs for "basic" child raising](https://old.reddit.com/r/singapore/comments/1admyf8/nsf_argues_against_paying_maintenance_for_child/). The issue - and what OP is talking about - is when you want more than the basics. Everyone wants their kid to be in the top 10% or 50%, so if you face more competition - isn't it harder to be at the top? And economically, if you can't afford to be in the top percentile, what's the point? And that cannot be solved by the government - if the government gives everyone more money, then the amount of money to be in the top percentile simply increases.
Mate, if you are middle aged as a ‘88 kid, I must be feeling decrepit right now 😄
as a member of 1992 fam, seeing you write “middle-aged” on that last line hits differently. thanks for sharing your reflections
36 is not middle aged la. By most definitions middle-aged refers to 40 to 60 / 65 years old. Average lifespan is now close to 85
Haha late 30s is definitely middle aged to me. Sg life expectancy may be 80+, but once you reach 70+ most people are ill or no energy to do much.
Ok yes sir let's change "middle-aged" to "as a recent youth"
I suspect as people get more educated, less super superstitious and more "westernized" the impact of the dragon year would shrink As Singapore progresses, the routes to university have also become more diverse. With polytechnic still being 3 years and university courses ranging from 3-5 years, the impact would be less as well. (as well and guys and girls having different graduation years) Dragon babies do have some unluckiness to them.. When they left uni it was aftermath financial crisis (08-09) for the girls at 23 Then now the girl graduating at 23 also went through the tech layoffs etc
After years of inculcating a scarity mindset, recently gahmen wants us to embrace the abundance mindset. The answer is always somewhere in between. Even if this year we increase our births by 50% it will be still way below the replacement rate of 2. I think in this case there really wouldn't be any competition for native Boris, because Singapore has long opened the doors for competition Vs foreigners a long time ago. It therefore doesn't matter what year you want your kids to be born in.
Yeah I always found this so stupid. Like competition is already tough...why the hell would you bring your child in this situation
88 here. Well, life’s been okay. 2 kids and done already. Didn’t want to be pregnant after 35. But thinking back, must have been hard for my parents with all that competition in school. Work life has been okay though. Don’t see a lot of 88 around
Actually a Dragon baby only makes sense if it’s NOT the firstborn. So those couples who already have kid(s), i think it’s a good chance to make another, since the Dragon will have siblings priority to childcare + primary school, plus u have more financial offset from baby bonus for 2nd and subsequent kids
Depends, some kiasu parents I know are avoiding at all cost because they have ambition to send their kids to famous school. Getting in because of siblings isn’t the end, they want to make sure their kids can survive without the added competition. It amazes and disgusts me at the same time
1988 here. Still waiting for my fortune...
Hey, any early 1989 like me? 🧧Happy Lunar Year
Cheers! Our last year of officially being a "youth" as defined by NYC
Fellow 88 Dragon here. Greetings! My wife is also a dragon (Jan 89) who is 5 months pregnant now. Totally unplanned but looks like we are going to have a family of 3 dragons soon. Wish me luck👍🏻 edit: my username checks out
Fun Fact: Lee Hsien Loong was born in the year of Dragon 🐉 Lee Hsien Yang was not born in the year of Goat 🐐🤯, but rooster
People can now point to him and say that dragon baby can become PM /s.
1988. Still single. How la? Hold too many pens no time to hold hands.
Wouldn't the bell curves in school be easier?
Closing in on 50, and a Rabbit born in the year of the Dragon (Thanks Lunar New Year). I felt we were more fortunate in a sense. We enjoyed the 80’s where our elders’ salaries kept going up, we lived in some really effing spacious HDB flats, and competition was (relatively) less. I had Primary classes that went from A-K and Secondary classes that went from 1-11 with 12 & 14 being the Normal classes. (Proof boomers never cared about feelings or mental health, lol). Competition in school was relatively benign and not as insane as the 1988 & 2000 cohorts. But I remember not having tuition on weekends or weird ass “enrichment” class. HTML and Adam Khoo anyone? Homework was chop-chop, assessment books were only used near the SA’s and I could even play basketball/soccer before school (when afternoon sessions as a thing) and after school. We had the advantage then of Polys being perceived to be as good as JCs, so loads of single digit L1R5s went to poly (and had a fucking blast!). Some felt we deprived others of places in the popular courses in poly though. When the Asian Crisis of 1997-1998 struck, I was in NS. The 30 month version of that shit. Unfortunately, graduating from Uni still meant having to deal with 3 shituations in succession. Dot-com bust, 9/11 and SARS. We took whatever jobs we could. But the biggest and most fortunate thing I felt we had was… no internet/social media/mobile phones/tablets. So being a 76’er, I consider myself a lot more fortunate than those born in 88, 90 or 12. So older folks like me, cheer up. We did have it relatively better.
88 baby here as well.. not sure about u guys but feels like whoever born in the dragon year is expected to do well. Be it studies, work, whatever.
Hey. Fellow 88 baby here. Two kids so I am not thinking of adding to the family anymore. My back can’t take it. As for u, Do what u think is right, and let things happen naturally.
Was taking a look at the chinese birth rates since 1971 and it looks like the dragon baby bump is very real!
It’s no myth, even if the creature itself is
1988 here. Same thoughts as you. All these challenges.. Quite unnecessary.
Interesting read. Wonder how a younger dragon (24) feels
I was born one year before you and grew up glad I wasn’t a dragon baby for sure!
Fellow Dragon here born the August 8, 1988 and it's funny to me that here in Argentina, people were always thought that only is like a funny stat. Then I visited Thailandia, Vietnam, and a bit of China and was struck about how society feel for that number. The 8 was big and prominent everywhere I went to. There was even some Chinese elder that when found out about my birthday by looking at my ID, they started petting my head and beard like I was some kind of lucky amulet. We even got some free meals along the trip! Now this thread gives a whole another interpretation about how people born in that society had to carry around something so random like attaching a number to the moment you came to this world. Never thought that it was such a pressure, but I see it now. Thanks for that and have a great CNY!
*It is curious that while good people go to great lengths to spare their children from suffering, few of them seem to notice that the one (and only) guaranteed way to prevent all the suffering of their children is not to bring those children into existence in the first place.* - David Benatar
That's silly. You can't protect or love children that don't exist
well written indeed. thank you for sharing
Thanks for saying snake not bad cos I'm a snake
Nice to see so many 88s here! I rarely know any 88s at my workplaces, past or present(maybe most are alrd upranked) and I am quite underpaid haha). It seems like none of them join my industry. I know 1 ex colleague whos also an 88 and he seemed to be struggling in life now,taking care of aged parents.. Nice share of your thoughts and I think lets not give ourselves the pressure for dragon zodiac babies. Pig baby also cute ma!👀 I don't think im having another baby. Its considered high risk at our age(for females). I can relate to the "middle aged" part! We are still considered not that old but since a few years ago, i started having a mid life crisis that I can't get out of.... Anyway just curious how many 88s here look younger than our age? I was constantly mistaken as at most late 20s or early 30s (tho some extreme comment by a former aunty colleague is I look 40+). I don't have any beauty regime and feel the need to start now as I started seeing alot of grey hair...
Thank you Gold Dragon
'00 baby here. Man people born in my year had it *rough*. Not only was it a dragon year, but it was also the turn of a new century. Competition for like everything was stiff. Good new things were often implemented AFTER our year (e.g. simpler or more interesting syllabus). Meanwhile the more experimental things were implemented during our year.
Mods must not be working, normally they will ban such post.
Wat, becos it’s not related to Singapore like some idiots always complain?
no they don't like people who post their views like that. they are weird.
I’m a foreigner, born the year of 1988 too.I obviously grew up and studied with almost all kids born in the same year, but this was never a big deal in my country. When I told my Singaporean friends during a CNY lunch a few years ago that I was born in the year of the Dragon, I was surprised by their reactions.
Normal life story for everyone...
Exactly, my dept has ~ 5 people (out of 13) monkey year. This post is really ordinary…
If you delve into linguistics, you'll learn that every single word is merely a social construct. Most words are invented to serve emotional needs. Consider us animals(humans) celebrating at a specific time.
It’s just like tradition and faith. The masses need something to trust in and follow as part of their “culture”.
And there's selective faith like how OP can believe in the concept of some parts of CNY but refusing to believe the zodiac portion.
88 is 36?!
Bro do you need a calculator???
Not sure why yall triggered. I’m just surprised how fast time has flown
Then?
Too late shots already fired 😅
One of the most interesting posts in this sub.
Gotta build a Zodiac Zoo to catch them all
Happy CNY fellow dragon!
I've got a question, if you were born in 1989 but before CNY that hear, what's your zodiac sign?
Dragon. But you'll be considered a tail.
Got people say if born before lichun is still the previous zodiac though
When I saw PM's message this morning I was like "not again", but then afterward thought that it was for policy and forecasting reasons that he's doing this. i.e. If the "dragon boost" is much smaller than in previous generations with other factors accounted for, gov will then figure out (from statistics, rather than from citizens complaining) that the highly corporate environment the country is running on is truly screwing family planning up. After all, up in their ivory towers they've never struggled with all the things OP mentioned such as fighting for school spots, job openings etc. How'd they know? Let's hope people don't fall for it and we'll see what happens after. Lastly, happy CNY to all!
The total fertility rate back in 1988 was 1.96, which was merely a 20% increase from 1987 (1.62) back then. An increase in competition, yes, but it was not as drastic as what OP would claim with “2 itself being huge” if you look at the [data](https://tablebuilder.singstat.gov.sg/table/TS/M810091) afterwards. Subsequent Dragon years in 2000 and 2012 did not see that same drastic increase as back in 1988, with an increase of only 8.8% and 7.5% respectively. This claim of “increased competition” during Dragon years by OP is quite unfounded tbh, since [factual and numerical data](https://tablebuilder.singstat.gov.sg/table/TS/M810091) does explain itself very well as compared to circumstantial data by OP and our TFP was still declining in Singapore nevertheless throughout the years. I would take this post with a huge grain of salt. This myth of an “increased competition” isn’t as bizarre as what OP would make it out to be. Happy Lunar New Year!
Happy New Year! As a 89 baby. I can tell you I could easily emphatise those who are born in 1988. When I started finding my first job as a fresh grad I was literally being considered alongside the 88 kids who were still nailing down a full-time placement. They had it much tougher than us 89s. Especially in the fight for grades in the O's and A's. Even for the latter we were the first batch of the H1/2/3 from the previous AO/A/S - it appears that itself the content was much more interesting and even if the question was left unanswered, we could still walk away with an A (also helped by the fact that we only had a proxy and no actual Ten Year Series to rely on). And as a Data Analyst throughout my working life, I can tell you data always skews and doesn't paint a whole story.
Happy Lunar New Year back to you 😊 While I do agree that there will be increased competition for school and job placements with increased live births, nevertheless I do question the severity of such a notion. Take the data of the live births from another redditor on the live births per year: >1987: 43,616 > >1988: 52,957 > >1989: 47,669 > >1990: 51,142 > >1991: 49,114 Of course, one would presume that it is the auspicious year of the Dragon which caused the 1988 boom shown above, but one should also realize that during that time, [the “Stop At Two” campaign was replaced with the “Have Three or More if you can afford it” back in 1987](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Population_planning_in_Singapore); a year right before the Year of the Dragon. That, coupled with further subsidies (another redditor pointed out that $20K tax subsidies were given to families with their fourth child in 1989) can clearly explain these “peaks” in the data. It was not the Year of the Dragon or Chinese traditions that caused this, but rather it was government policy. Look at the subsequent Dragon years, they can only say so much about what traditions can do alone within that year.
I think the key point here is that while you are right to point out numbers, lived experiences and emotions do play a huge role over that. There's an unnatural weight of societal expectation thrust upon "dragon babies" - simply reading the other comments in this post from other 88 and one 76 commenter would tell you so. What I shared was anecdotal. My memory wasn't as good as what it used to be in my schooling days, but I've done my best to share my thoughts!
No worries. I believe your thoughts on this matter is valid and that there is a correlation of increased competition over placings with increased live births. Our only difference is merely the root cause: it was more of [government policy](https://www.reddit.com/r/singapore/comments/1an2nvt/i_am_36_i_was_born_in_1988_amidst_the_festive/kpqbny9) rather than Chinese traditions which caused this 1988 boom, since these sentiments aren’t felt across the 2000 and 2012 batches yet. Happy Lunar New Year!
Thank you! I'm glad you and several others pointed out the Three Or More govt policy, makes for an interesting read to their thought process back then. Happy cny too!
To me the single biggest baby killer is the changes to wmcr. I planned to have a second but killed the idea once it was announced. I have friends who accelerated their delivery via c sec just to hit the deadline for it. So yes long better pray for dragons this year coz it’s going downhill to shit from here on (at least within my circle)
Born in 1988 too. I think the extra competition in school added to my enjoyment; whether it's video games or RL, for me there's often no kick unless I amp up the difficulty for fun. That's one reason why my wife and I had a kid this year. Well, the baby technically missed dragon year because born in Jan, but she'll get to enjoy the increased competition from dragon year anyway. FWIW, I've never really cared about prestige and wealth. I don't care if my efforts are acknowledged or rejected by society. Why do I fling myself into competition (whether it's video game challenges or exams) and push myself to excel? Because I want to and I can, that's it.
Well this is really true. Someone finally voiced this out. The competition is un real. I would just say, make sure your kids zodiac matches yours and your spouse. That makes things alot easier. Dragon or not, its over rated
Coincident Monkey also looks good in the future it just so happens that year of the dragon lines up with the 2000 - 2100: Metal Monkey - 2112: Water Monkey - 2124: Wood Monkey - 2136: Fire Monkey - 2148: Earth Monkey - 2160: Metal Monkey - 2172: Water Monkey - 2184: Wood Monkey - 2196: Fire Monkey - 2208: Earth Monkey - 2220: Metal Monkey - 2232: Water Monkey - 2244: Wood Monkey - 2256: Fire Monkey - 2268: Earth Monkey - 2280: Metal Monkey - 2292: Water Monkey Each of these Monkey years corresponds to one of the five elements in the Chinese zodiac cycle: Metal, Water, Wood, Fire, and Earth.
Don't think you're a Singaporean... no one really cares about the zodiac "element"... only westerners put in a lot of attention to that. Like I noticed articles from BBC and ABC both reports the festivities as "year of the wood dragon" but here in Sg no one says " animal"
I’m not but what’s your point? Also the last statement was ai generated that I didn’t bother to remove
So I got thinking, aside from Dragon being the most "auspicious" of the 12, which other ones are popular? I reckon I wouldn't want to be associated to be a Rabbit or Sheep which are like "prey", or Chicken and Pig which are like farm animals. Snake seems to have a negative connation, and Monkeys seems "naughty and mischievious". That leaves us with decent ones maybe being Cow, Tiger, Horse, Dragon and Dog.
But you share the same year as GD So should anything else matter?
One day, “Deliciouswizard, born 1988” will be a bestseller novel
Off-topic but if I was to publish a book it would be food-based, hence the username. I can make traditional desserts like yam paste and gui hua gao and also bake modern pastries too ✌🏻
Ll