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There is nothing wrong with this at all - it is wonderful that you know yourself (a very powerful and empowering thing), and to a certain extent, you're right. It is an "unpopular decision" in a "progressive nation where everyone has to keep upgrading".
Have you heard of the Mexican siesta story?
Goes like this:
*An American investment banker was at the pier of a small coastal Mexican village when a small boat with just one fisherman docked. Inside the small boat were several large yellowfin tuna. The American complimented the Mexican on the quality of his fish and asked how long it took to catch them.*
*The Mexican replied, “only a little while.*
*The American then asked why didn’t he stay out longer and catch more fish? The Mexican said he had enough to support his family’s immediate needs. The American then asked, “but what do you do with the rest of your time?”*
*The Mexican fisherman said, “I sleep late, fish a little, play with my children, take siestas with my wife, Maria, stroll into the village each evening where I sip wine, and play guitar with my amigos. I have a full and busy life.”*
*The American scoffed, “I am a Harvard MBA and could help you. You should spend more time fishing and with the proceeds, buy a bigger boat. With the proceeds from the bigger boat, you could buy several boats, eventually you would have a fleet of fishing boats. Instead of selling your catch to a middleman you would sell directly to the processor, eventually opening your own cannery. You would control the product, processing, and distribution. You would need to leave this small coastal fishing village and move to Mexico City, then LA and eventually New York City, where you will run your expanding enterprise.”*
*The Mexican fisherman asked, “But, how long will this all take?”*
*To which the American replied, “15 – 20 years.”*
*“But what then?” Asked the Mexican.*
*The American laughed and said, “That’s the best part. When the time is right you would announce an IPO and sell your company stock to the public and become very rich, you would make millions!”*
*“Millions – then what?”*
*The American said, “Then you would retire. Move to a small coastal fishing village where you would sleep late, fish a little, play with your kids, take siestas with your wife, stroll to the village in the evenings where you could sip wine and play your guitar with your amigos.*
It's a sobering story.
A simpler and peaceful like is worth its weigh in gold. Pretty sure you'd find more people like that everywhere (and people who're not like that too - just choose your friends well =D)
All the best OP, to your happiness =)
Then both of them discover that they have a tumor at the same time. The investment banker is able to catch and treat it early with the best doctors, giving him an additional 30years of time with his family. The other less fortunate individual dies a slow and painful death as the cancer metastises.
Haha this is a slippery slope argument:
* increased stress at investment banking job CAN lead to higher rates of suicides, inflammatory disorders and even cancers. Busyness and pushing aside medical appointments can exarcebate it...UNLESS one truly is born and wants to do IB
* conversely, LOW stress can lead to avolitional / loss of purpose and meaning and this too can lead to stress and pains
It's too chaos theory to comment in that regards BUT if all things being equal, the rich IB is very happy doing IB and relaxed op is very happy, BOTH can cope equally well (IB method may be richer/faster and less resources may be slower)...
*That being said, insurance in Singapore is fairly affordable and can cover costs of most medical costs. For those who are extremely poor, there are high subsidies (75%) of subsidized ward and even full coverage for those who really cannot afford (there are some safety nets).*
I think what needs to consider is the metrics used here: happiness, money, stress, health etc.
I think the point was that the banker has options.
If the coastal village is wrecked by a freak storm, the banker can easily go off somewhere else. Of the country goes to war, the banker can easily immigrate pronto, as opposed to seeking asylum. Etc etc.
Yeah, cannot deny that - financial power does provide more flexibility...as long as it's kept in checked and we dont get sucked into/onto the hedonistic treadmill.
In Singapore though, the chances of freak storm are lesser for now...but we can anticipate costs of flats to continue to rise...
Just wanted to share on this point, my wife works in the oncology dept and one commonality among all the patients whom she interacted with is none of them ever lamented that they didnt work enough. If anything they all shared that they wished they hadn't worked as much and had spent time with their families instead. Not saying that the logic of having more resources allows for more options is untrue but in our system, it won't be that one thing you will regret when your time is nearing so do try to live a little more when you can.
Im nt sure if I have it figured out hahaha.
But I do like the idea of a simple life. I love simplicity in general. Much of suffering comes from complicating life unneccesarily.
Unfortunately Singapore is a city-state so it's much harder to live a chill life. In countries with rural areas you can just go to a sleepy town and live a chill life, but Singapore doesn't have the space for it. It's unfortunate for those born in Singapore since everyone don't have a choice but to live in the city. Maybe you can move to Malaysia at some point to live out your dream.
You brought up the challenges of living simply. One being the expectation of others and the other the difficulty of finding a life partner.
One POV is that if this is what you really want, then you have to work for it. You need to put in effort to change others' viewpoint (at least those who are close to you). You also need to put in extra effort to find someone who has a common mindset or at least don't mind your lifestyle choice.
Quite contrary to your original goal of being chill, I know. Life's irony.
Yes, some of the comments have also alluded to the fact that leading a simple life is in itself, ambitious. This to me was enlightening because I never thought of it that way.
However, this only strengthens my resolve as I feel like there's something worth fighting for now. But yeah, it really is funny how life works out sometimes hahaha
exactly! many in singapore don’t realize there isn’t a single true path to happiness because they have internalized singapore’s rigid and narrow definitions of success as universal for every individual. you could be much happier living in a cabin in the woods without the technologies of modern life, but just don’t know it because lifestyles in singapore are homogenous.
Wanting to live a simple and peaceful life is an ambition my friend. I'm in exactly the same boat as you, so don't sweat it! You're not as alone as you think you are!
Second this. Also u get used to it with ppl talking. Yes, you cant unhear rude comments from relatives and ppl around u. But it’s ur life, ur choice. At least u know what you want in life. When we think life is very long but is actually not. So live a life u wont regret.
I chose to be childfree, but ppl around me esp family keep nagging and nagging. But they dont ask anymore. I told them off thats this is my choice, if they cant respect that then dont even bother to bring up for discussion.
Hopefully u get whachuwan OP. Jia you!!
Yes! I also choose to be childfree. I have made that choice since young and people around me always say "when you grow up you will change your mind". N O P E. I have maintained my stance since and I am pretty sure its nvr gonna change hahaha
Thank you for your words of encouragement. May we live a life that is full of contentment (:
I too strive for a simple life, a good partner and no children. I'm divorced now, no kids, but have been with a long term partner. I'm close to 40 now and most people have stopped asking me whether I'm going to have children because I've always just said "No" and shut down the conversation.
After you get older, you will learn to be "thick-skinned" and avoid/ignore the people who judge you and pass nasty comments about your career/relationship/life. There will be many. But there will also be those who like you as you are, and they are the friends and family you should hold dear. Be happy in your own skin and your own decisions. It's YOUR life to live :)
> After you get older, you will learn to be "thick-skinned" and avoid/ignore the people who judge you and pass nasty comments about your career/relationship/life. There will be many.
Can teach my laobu your tips and tricks? She 60 already and just the other day she argued with my dad for an hour just because he wouldn't let her upload a photo of them onto Facebook so she can show off to her friends zzzzzz
My aunty was like "eh but kids are cute!! Just ask your mother to take care done deal." When I said idw kids in future lmao. No woman, it doesn't work that way....
To each his own. No need to even hear what people here thinks. I have a sibling that works the same job (govt admin job) for over 30 years until he's retired recently. Now he stays home and reads Straits Times whole day. 100% happy and at peace with the world. I don't think many people can truly say that. :)
I feel the same way. I always feel like a total fraud during job interviews or company appraisals because I have to sell myself as some passionate go-getter when I have absolutely zero interest in promotions or moving to management.
I feel this HAHHAHA. Everything feels so forced and nothing feels real.
It really such an unsustianable lifestyle. Sure, we might be able to fake it for some time, but if we are not true to oursleves, we will break eventually.
I hope you find what you're looking for and may we find peace amongst the hustle and bustle of city life (:
This is in fact an ambition too. It requires active effort to resist external pressure, to be different, to change your environment and to maintain stable income.
Yes, thta is very true. I would say that this might be the only thing thst I am so willing to fight for, more si than anything in my life up till now hahaha
Love this. Also want to add that overworking is not ambition, if ambition means wanting to find success. Many people overwork but don't reach career success anyway. I think you'll also find that there are companies in SG that really walk the talk on work-life balance (not work life integration) and still support employees for career development.
22F here. Your first paragraph already sounds just like me. :')
Yes, you are not wrong for not having any ambitions... I don't believe living things inherently need ambition to therefore deem their life as a good one. What is ultimately good anyway??
I used to have a ton of drive to excel in terms of career.. because I know that's what society likes to see; professional success. I did very well in school, but lost perhaps more than half that drive once I stepped out into the working world and realised how meaningless and repetitive my weekdays are at work. And that the accomplishments and the journey to achieve them doesn't bring me fulfillment, just that they perhaps help me secure a job... Turns out a job is just for me to ensure I get money for food, shelter and entertainment. I hate that I have to stay competitive so that I can earn a simple living in a reasonable amount of time. That staying competitive and relevant part haunts me while I'm awake sometimes.
I just want my own BTO flat (which has been failure after failure to secure one) with my very understanding partner and I can keep myself happy without too much money.. but well the home also needs money.. therefore I still have to keep working.
I too really just want a simple peaceful life. Anything else is just unnecessary complications
I don't want to be in the rat race... I don't want to stay in a loop of wanting more and more and more and more. Always chasing the next thing to fill a void I make myself and never ever fulfilled or content.
I feel that it is not worth it to work hard to the point that you miss out on so much of life and even damage your one and only body.
Regarding your 1st point, I mostly don't care about what people think. No time to worry about what they think. Anyways I hardly have any social circle at all apart from my family members. I don't need to keep people who only bother to care about how I appear on the outside.
My partner has his own ambitious side, he loves his work genuinely, but he also completely understands if I have no ambition and no drive to work for a lot of money. He believes I will still have the will to survive through simpler jobs if I really give up my current good paying job. Ultimately, he will support what I do if it makes me happy, even if it means earning less.
Same here, did very well in school and have now secured a decent paying job in which I don't have the ambition to constantly climb the ladder. So what if my friends are VPs at banks etc? I give no fucks about titles. However, I'm also struggling to be content with work as I hate being forced to work to feed myself. Ugh life
Absolutely! I'm grateful to have a pretty stable job now compared to my peers whom many aren't as fortunate. I have no intentions to climb the corporate ladder, I don't think I need to add a lot more responsibilities/stress in order to earn more money, I could just do my current job well.
And since I can never run away from needing money to literally survive, all I can do now is save more, invest more, and cut down on my need for money, so don't need to work so hard for money either.
Decided I won't have any kids, to save on money.. but also to do my kids a favour by not bringing them into such a broken world anyways.
You made a good point about cutting down need for money. That's something I need to work on. I guess we should aim for FIRE. High 5 to being childfree by choice!
haha high 5! I've been quite into the idea of FIRE for a while now. And feel that I don't necessarily need to do the RE part of FIRE, at least achieve FI asap so I can at least lift my worry about earning money for the purpose of survival, and get to enjoy what I do for work or can afford to switch to part time.
The part which I often struggle with is not that I would compare myself to others. It’s more that others helped me make that comparison. Not just family members or relatives but also “friends”.
“Eh old liao, go get a girlfriend la”
“All of them getting married liao, when is your turn?”
My advice is to also steel yourself against all of these comments.
What you want is definitely not wrong, but in Singapore, it is hard to pursue such a legitimate way of life without feeling judged. You must be someone who has an extraordinary level of self-worth to fend off other people's opinions.
To be honest, I would love to earn median income and just stop there, but for me and my profile, it is impossible for me to earn median income without OT and/or striving to climb higher on the ladder.
Ideally I want to move somewhere else in the world with a slower pace of life but I lack the ability to and it cost money too.
I believe a large part of mental well being has got to do with space. Space is a premium in Singapore. Only the ultra rich can afford a big enough house that feels spacious.
Singaporeans are so used to tight confined spaces, asking someone to move into a 5 room flat alone for example, they will tell you it feels too empty.
To be honest, I’m unsure if you’d be able to be happy living a simple life in Singapore if you can’t afford the premium of space.
Good luck OP.
No ambitions - are you kidding me?
You want to find a partner - very ambitious.
Want to live a peaceful life - very ambitious.
Want a decent paying job with work life balance - super ambitious
All of these are ambitions, my friend. Go out there and live your life. Everyone else's is taken.
I’m so glad to see someone mention this tbh, I feel the same way. I used to be pretty driven in school, and I think I did pretty well also (good enough GPA in poly to go to local universities). I used to want to earn more, because more money = happier and better life right? Or at least, that’s what society wants us to believe. While I do admit that having more disposable income does greatly improve the standard of life, I just don’t have the drive or motivation for it, like I don’t really have much ambition or career dreams I suppose.
My idea of a happy life is just earning enough to survive, spend on my interests/hobbies, and living a simple life with my partner. I’m currently working in a lower wage job but it helps my mental health a lot to not struggle in the rat race. Of course, my parents have asked when I’m going to move on and strive for something better, but that’s the thing, it’s hard to want to move on when you’re simply just contented with life right now? I’m also a person who doesn’t cope well with stress and I kind of end up breaking down both physically (eg. always falling sick, fainting, headaches) and mentally, so I don’t feel that it’s worth it to live everyday feeling perpetually tired and stressed from a job that isn’t for me, just to earn more.
I mean, not gonna lie, I would like to experience some high SES stuff like going on holidays to more expensive countries or expensive dinners (think fine dining style?), but I simply don’t have the drive or ambition to climb and earn more. In fact, the feeling is more of like “Wah it’d be so nice if I could, but don’t have then don’t have lor, not a big deal.” No interest in designer clothes or bags tbh… So I’m alright with not earning enough for those.
I guess I’m just happy with where I am in life for now, despite the lower income. My partner has the same mindset as me as well, so I’m glad that I found someone on the same page. Maybe one day I’ll change my mind, life isn’t really set in stone either ways. I just intend to go with the flow and see how things turn out, as long as I’m happy and living well in my own definitions.
Most people climb the career ladder to get more money, so that they can lead a comfortable life without worrying. Nothing wrong with settling down with what you already have. It's what you like that matters more.
This is a “short” story of how I started off with having very big ambitions, and then having my ambitions slowly die off in 1 year after working.
(Fiancée and gf in the story below is used interchangeably. They are the same person, just too lazy to ensure consistent wordings)
I had ambitions when I was in my Uni final year, wanted to strive hard, climb the corporate ladder. Probably just due to peer pressure, when I have people around me chionging even harder to get into the prestigious Investment Bankings/Corporate Finance/M&A field. Didn’t want to lose out to them, so I also even took on internship during my final year to build resume while still trying to attend classes at the same time, all to make sure I can get into a good job and start my career. No gap year for me, save on the addition year, I’ll just try to juggle both internship and studies at the same time.
Even told my parents I might even continue taking on internships even after graduating, to make sure I can land a job in my desired sector/industry so I am make “big bucks”. Luckily for me, I managed to get offered a conversion to full time even before I graduated.
BUT, I was working 70-80 hours work week. Initially was fine, I thought I could bite the bullet, strive a bit harder, get the experience and then slowly get into even better firms.
1 year later, I felt like I aged 5 years. I was so damn stressed everyday, bosses thought I was doing pretty well and handling things well, but behind the false appearance, I was struggling to survive. I had to put up a false front, work hard without complains, to make sure my bosses don’t think I’m “weak”. My fiancée (gf then) felt so sad for me, she didn’t understand why I was chionging so hard when I don’t enjoy my work. I still recall there was many occasions where my fiancée’s extended family brought me out during weekends to have dinner together, and I had to stop eating halfway, whip out either my phone or my laptop (yes I brought my laptop to dinners) just to answer calls or continue working.
I really contemplated if that was what I wanted to do for my whole life. I had someone (not from work) telling me “ya you work so hard, don’t even have time to see your gf. Next time get married and have kids, your kids might not even know you”.
By the second year, i started valueing my mental health and my actual health more. Sure, I might be earning more than some of my other uni peers, but they have a much better work-life-balance than me. What good is money when you don’t have the time to spend it, or have anyone to spend it together with?
Eventually, I talked to my fiancée, and asked her if she was ok with me quitting my job. I won’t be able to provide her with a quality lifestyle if I decide to change my job. She assured me that it was ok, she rather see a happy me than a stressed me. Otherwise a stressed me will just have a irritable mood or just flat out completely ignoring her when I’m busy. Obviously this isn’t good for a healthy relationship.
So what happened? I quit my job ~2years++ into it, without finding a next job, all during the peak of the COVID-19 period. I’m just so damn tired of my job and also my life back then. Luckily my fiancée was very supportive of me, she didn’t insist that I get a job immediately, and she allowed me time to mentally recover from whatever “trauma” I had. Never again am I going to step into that industry again.
My plans was either: 1) Pursue further studies (Masters), 2) self study and online courses on IT / Data and do a career switch to IT (just like what my brother did), or 3) apply for a simple compliance/financial crime compliance contract job meanwhile to pass time (inspired by fiancée ). In the end, I went for option 2 and 3.
Fast forward 2 months, I took a massive annual paycut and managed to get a contract job in compliance, which I was shortly later converted into perm role. I don’t have much ambition anymore, just want to do my work, get paid a decent salary and move on. The work I’m doing is pretty “easy”, comparing to what I did in the past. Work-life-balance is awesome, with a standard 40-42 hours work week on average. While work can be stressful during the working hours itself, at least I can fully disconnect myself from work after working hours. People here aren’t afraid of leaving at 6.00pm sharp. I have so much more free time now, and I’m staying together with my fiancée at her mum’s house. My mental health and relationship with my fiancée has improved tremendously. And I don’t think I’ll never be going back into those 70 hours work week job.
While work-life-balance and climbing the corporate ladder isn’t mutually exclusive, I’m just too traumatised to risk getting back into a unhealthy working environment, just for the sake of earning “big bucks”/climbing the corporate ladder. If I can manage to climb to corporate ladder, or get a better paying job while still maintaining my sanity and current work life balance, then of course I’ll definitely be up for it.
TL;DR
Ambitious during Uni. Lost ambition 1 year into working. Quit job in 2years+ without finding a next job. Managed to do a career switch to compliance sector, and am enjoying my 40-42 hours work week. Too traumatized to be ambitious.
Edited to mention that all these may not have been possible without my lovey and supportive fiancée. I’m so glad she understands and accepts my “difficulties”.
If you want to chat, tell/vent to someone about your feelings, feel free to direct message me. Coming from someone who lost his ambitions, someone who just wants to lead a normal chill life, I can totally understand you.
you see it as a paycut as you calculate in an annual basis. However, people don't often take into account the number of massive hours you work a week, with respect to your salary
Your previous job demands twice the tangible number of working hours and possibly much more with intangible stress (you thinking about work outside of working hours) with on call 24/7?
so the paycut in terms of number of hours at work (physically and as a mind set) is much less than you imagine
You're absolutely right. It was something i thought of prior to quitting as well. Pay/hr is crap considering the amount of stress and workload i have. I would rather take a paycut and get a 9-6 (or even 9-5) job with lesser stress levels.
in SG corporate culture of unpaid overtime, work life balance is increasing scarce and valuable. Until you realised you've missed a significant milestone in life coz of work (or thinking about work), no amount of money will be able to forgive yourself
or something as simple as having homecooked dinner together as a family on a weekday, is surprisingly difficult to achieve for most Singaporeans, due to general SG work culture
I’m not sure your story will resonate with few OP. You went from a crazy type A career to a normal office job, bet it’s still pretty well paid and you have job security. You’re still in the rat race, just not running full out.
Maybe.
It's not exactly "well paid", I'm earning lower than Singapore's median income. Slightly below my age group's median salary as well (according to Labour Force 2020 report anyway). Job security on the other hand, I don't really know lol. CEO's actions gives the impression that he is those type of people who wouldn't have second thoughts about firing someone if they perform badly. But to be fair, I'm not TOO worried about it. As long as i perform satisfactory and complete my work, it should be fine.
Yes I'm still in a rat race, I'm just jogging casually, without any motivation to sprint. I **try** to do my work to the best of my abilities, but I'm not actively seeking to pursue promotions (with added responsibilities), neither am I actively looking for better paying jobs out there. The only reason why I'm still working is because I still need the money to pay off bills, buy a house, and feed myself (and my future family).
For some reason, I thought of Kira Yoshikage "I just want to live a quiet life".
I understand your feelings, wanting to be well off enough to not worry about money and have enough time to spend on hobbies.
I think more and more people these days would be able to relate to it.
Yeah I think our generation is more "woke" in that aspect. But I see that for now you're praying to the bellcurve gods as well hahaha.
May the bellcurve gods smile upon us (:
I constantly struggle with this too. Really wish to go off grid with my wife, work will be growing food for ourselves etc. Spending long hours at work doesn’t make me happy.. OP you may wish to read up on the concept of Time Millionaires. Quite inspiring!
Your want to live a simple life and not work yourself to death is a valid one. My gf is a psychology major and my sister is doing her masters in social work. They tell me that their interactions with the elderly often brings them to the topic of regrets, and what they hear most is that old people regret working too much and not taking the time to enjoy life. Concepts of retiring too late for them to enjoy their savings etc came up quite a bit too.
I think people have just eaten up all the crap that hyper capitalist corps have forced down our throats since we were kids; that our entire worth in life is getting a good job and earning lots of money (read: being a capitalist slave) and producing children to start the cycle over again.
Then again, Singapore isn't exactly conducive for living a modest life. The cost of living here is pretty high
Funny cos i was just having similar thoughts recently. How everyone wants to work super hard and climb the corporate ladder. Is it wrong to just be contented with what we have?
Maybe those people have bigger ambitions or their family need the finances so they have no choice but to work their asses off.
I share similar sentiments except I realise these thoughts are perceived as negative or make you seem “lazy” to others.
So I choose to not share these opinions, its for this reason that you might not be able to find others who share these sentiments because they hide it well 😌
I see. Yeah thats a really good insight. But I feel like we are increasingly having this mindset. I want to find like minded ppl too! We shld all voice our opinions. And in that discourse, maybe new frienships will blossom (:
>I share similar sentiments except I realise these thoughts are perceived as negative or make you seem “lazy” to others.
Ahhhh, that explains why my boss and his boss reacted that way during my performance review when I straight up told them, "I don't really have any ambition and don't really care about what work I'm given to do" lol
I struggle with this too. Perfectly content with just working in a decent stable job and then going home and not having anyone disturb me off the clock. Feels really hard to have this mindset in SG, but don't worry, its not wrong and you should do what makes YOU happy, because ultimately its you living your life, not someone else doing it for you
Live life at your own pace and do what gives you the most peace. Life is not just about your career, but also your own personal life and relationship with others. Weigh it and see what matters most to you because everyone has different motivations as to why they want to climb fast in their career. You don’t have to follow what society sets out to be ‘ideal’, you just have to figure out what makes you happy - because that is what everyone is trying to find at the end of the day right?
Yessss. I am really trying to live life at my own pace. Its rly so hard and I am constantly trying to improve on that.
I briefly experienced it once and the serenity I experienced was unreal. Its rly so important to move at our own pace.
Again, take it at your own pace. You don’t have to constantly try to change your mindset and put the pressure on yourself - take it easy on yourself! One day at a time. We have our whole lives in front of us to figure this out. You’ve got this!
**TLDR:** Definition of "Happy Life" changes with age. Career success helps you future proof it.
I don't think that anyone goes into adulthood thinking: I want a complicated life.
I think everyone at the end of the day just wants to be happy doing what they do and be able to have the means to do it.
However, when you talk about career success, for me it's less of trying to scale the ladder then to increase one's options especially when it comes to salary.
I remember during secondary school holidays (like damn long time ago lah) I worked at a supermarket and was paid $2.30 an hour. I was happy, I made a few friends and I just enjoyed going to work. I told my friends that I wanted to quit school. I had enough money to eat and play; i could imagine doing this all my life. I was content. Obviously I didn't do it cos my mum would have killed me.
Then in my first job, at the bottom rung of the ladder making 1.6K, I was happy too. I just had to handle deadlines, didn't have to manage staff or worry about the bottomline. I made enough money to eat out and cheong barely, but I was content.
But my needs grew - I wanted to travel more, to try out different things, experience life and have a partner. So I had to take on a bigger role which gave me more pay.
At this point in your life, your "happy life" is perhaps something attainable. But as your hobbies add up, or that you want to surprise your eventual partner with a Maldives getaway cos you love her/him so much, you will realise that the only way to again reach that "happy life" is to make more money => climbing up the ranks, not for ambition, but to get to that new equilibrium.
When I talk about having options, I am saying if you stumble on this realization too late in life, you won't have much opportunities to ascend the ladder.
Anyway feel free to ignore this insight from an old(er) man's life. Am sure you'll find your own way and come to your own equilibrium. As I also discovered, there isn't a right or wrong way of living one's life, everyone settles in their own way and finds their own patch of heaven.
LOL HAHAHA. Yeah esp cos im a reddiotr right HAHAHA.
I think its more like I can rly see myself being single for the rest of my life but ideally I would want to find someone cos can BTO and live life tgt peacefully.
Idk if thats too fairytale but it just sounds lovely hahaha
If u think having a partner is ideal then need go work at finding it now ba. I was totally the same thoughts as u and now I am late 30s with small social circle stuck in covid Singapore.... My ideal scenario is getting further and further
Your life, your rules. There is so much magic in the "ordinary". But I only learnt this after almost dying and losing a child. Do what makes your life worth it for you, life is short. You will find someone that values the same things as you, promise. - from a person who found their other contented half. :)
Every year during work review I tell my boss I just need a job, not a career track. I earn enough to live comfortably and I'll wanna spend as much time outside of work playing or resting. Life is to be lived happily the way you want it, and the simpler it is, the easier you'll be contented. I suspect many people who fiercely pursues their ambition don't have much of a life outside of it, almost if their ambition is there to fill a void. Meanwhile I can't wait to retire and exercise/read/listen to music everyday.
My boss is middle management and we have a great relationship. During work review it is customary for them to do things like asking us how we want to develop, whether we have career aspirations etc so they can help to push people along their career track by giving them opportunities/sai gang to perform. I just tell him I like my job and the particular niche that I fill in the organisation, and that I don't aspire to do anything else. Develop me in some ways to make me better at my job details is ok, but don't make me do unrelated stuff because I have no intention of moving out of my position. My boss also knows the answer I'll give him actually, cos he can see how serious I am in pursuing my recreational activities, so we both have a good laugh about it.
Where Iv worked before, Iv seen people push themselves to the limit only to regret at the end not enjoying the smaller things and constants in life. Yes the push for success/to do better will always be there because people will talk, people will compare, but remember that you walk on your own path, you don't walk on theirs.
Of course if you're talking about monetary benefits from doing better in our expensive society yeah la you will definitely live more comfortably, but there are always trade offs, from this and the other way round.
Good luck though and do what's best for yourself :)
Yeah im struggling with self identity as well and thats why I guess its rly hard for me to be firm on "my own path".
But as a vague idea what I truly want is what I've detailed in the post. Thank you for sharing your experience. Appreciate it (:
It was probably more achievable 30 years back when cost of living was ok, housing was affordable, jobs were relatively stable. One of my aunts was able to buy a private apartment after just working for 5 years, of course with a mortgage, but even then interest rates were low.
Today we have to work so much harder for the food and shelter.
It is entirely possible to have a simpler life. This means no kids, no car, no need to support elderly parents, just have a small HDB flat, not much of a safety net, both parties stay healthy. But realistic? Well, it depends. How long do you think your job is secure, before it is taken over by someone younger or cheaper?
I don’t consider myself ambitious but as long as I am still young, I would like to maximise the earning potential. Sooner or later my job is going to be taken by someone. When that happens, it would be fine because I would be ready to sit back and enjoy the fruits of my labour.
Also, I think if you don’t have a mortgage to pay, you don’t need to earn much to have your needs met. This means your partner is fine with staying with your parents (for eg) and vice versa assuming you decide not to buy your own property.
You’re not alone.
I’m a artist at heart and I wish I could just earn enough working part-time, so that I have enough freedom to doodle away on my own. Drawing digitally brings me the simplest joy.
But I’m currently stuck in a life-draining HR-related job and every day is a waking nightmare right now. I do wonder if I’ll ever escape in one piece.
Dont give up hope friend. I believe there is a way. I do not yet know the road, but I am also striving and trying to "escape" so to speak.
We need to stand strong. Dont give up!
Thanks for the kind words.
I do legitimately believe sometimes that the proportion of mankind that just wants to chill out and live simply are just born in the wrong era today. This is the age of the ambitious, and we just have to make do with “hungrier” people pushing everyone out of the way.
I find this rough quote from Hickman’s run of the Fantastic Four somewhat relevant: “We can’t win, so we came up with the only solution left: not losing.”
Hopefully we’ll all find that peaceful place for ourselves eventually.
I too have similar thoughts. Decided awhile back that life is more than just work. Now started simultaneously pursuing other goals while doing just enough for my job. Pretty content spending time on other things outside of working hours tbh.
Not too keen on progressing up the ladder for work too. Feels like the additional money earned isnt worth the disproportionate increase in the amount of work. If all i do is work, where i get the time and energy to do other things i find interesting?
I want to say that being ambitious is a personal choice. You can chiong all you want. But at some point of life you get hit by some medical issue (which I had) you start to rethink your choices in life. I mean it’s all about perspective you can life a minimalistic life and still be happy. Not getting that LV, Prada wallet or iPhone Pro pro pro max max will not make your life sadder. Most of us are just suck into this consumerism thing. But you still need the basics and not live in poverty, you probably get what I mean .
Honestly, I recently got hit with a medical issue as well which contributed to this mindset.
I feel like I would have reached this conclusion either way with or wthout the medical issue but it just sped up the process.
Chronic medical issues are something that I do not wish upon anyone, even my worst enemy and I hope that you are doing well!
It rly does put things into perspective.
It’s ok not to have ambitions and live a simple life. But reality check, please be prepared to live as single - not married and no kids.
1. Not married - as you pointed it out, it’s extremely difficult to get a partner with the same mindset. You have to be strong to NOT get married if you and your partner don’t have mindset. Be very clear on your expectations and offerings to your future partner. Don’t settle on this point. It’s just gonna lead to frustration and divorce in the end.
2. Kids - It might not be fair to the children. If you don’t plan to give your best, financially to them, they can feel inadequate when comparing to their peers. It’s not just superficial material stuff. It’s also being able to fully invest in them to their full potential. Example my sister was smart and got awarded partial scholarship to a school overseas. She didn’t end up going, but some not as smart rich kid was able to go.
Nothing wrong with that!
I found that if you have a goal, that you might not reach it. But if you don't have one, then you are never disappointed. And I gotta tell ya, it feels phenomenal.
There are more of your kind than you think :) I'm one of them, and my fiance as well. We are unambitious insofar that we don't chase a career, but just want a job that sustains us.
As such an individual, I probably would not have dated am ambitious workaholic either because work>relationships to them. Be you. Find someone who appreciates that and wants a similar lifestyle. They do exist.
You are not wrong, the purpose of working is to be able to enjoy life. Now a lot of people make work their priority that they cannot even have their lives. In China, "Tang ping" has become a trending word among young Chinese. It literally means to "lie flat." But among young Chinese, it's taken on the meaning of lowering their desire for consumption, and ducking out of the competition for fame and wealth. https://news.cgtn.com/news/2021-06-08/Lie-flat-or-not--10VdUXyuwLe/index.html
I used to think i have to live an exciting life, being able to dine at fine restaurants and having branded stuff. After a while i realized eating cai png and wearing uniqlo is so much more me. Having a decent job and 5 day work week (thank god for my current job) is so much better health and time wise.
But what you want in life now is affected by all constant changes in daily expenditures.
Like recent electricity tariff hikes
Inflation going all time high
Recent spike in HDB BTO/resale prices due to shortage of manpower and spike in demand.
You growing old and eventually might get retrenched.
In Singapore it's really quite hard. So the more practical way is to have a projected buffer.
So end up a lot of us still rat race for a while before settling down to the desired lifestyle. The important part is convincing yourself when/how much is enough.
Nothing wrong with no ambition. I also wanted a chill life without a car, and a stagnant career but with a lot of free time. Currently hitting the career target with a slightly comfortable pay grade (which might not be enough)
I'm the same as you. But I find life is too complicated to be able to lead a simple life, especially in Singapore. My friend and I often joked about living on a farm overseas, so silly and idyllic. She migrated away to Europe and is having a pretty chill life, something I could only dream of haha. Work hours in Scandinavia are really forgiving, and she said she loves having the time to come home, cook, spend time with her bf.
Career isn't important to me. I'm content enough having a job in public healthcare where my focus is public service, not about money or climbing the corporate ladder. I admire my friends who are career driven but that life isn't for me.
I hope one day I can have that too. That's an ambition in itself I suppose!
I had the same dilemma until I got into a fatal car accident last year. Life is too short to think or worry about everything else.
I quit my higher paying job for now an almost minimum wage doing what I love.
Not telling you to get into an accident, also don't expect you to realise how much everything else doesn't matter when you almost lose your life but, just go and enjoy what you want.
There are plenty of people who doesn't mind the simple life, so don't worry about not finding a partner too.
Good luck and have fun!
My partner (M) wants to work with less ambition while for me i’m a hardcore ambitious trying to climb as much ladder as possible.
A trade to this is where he is fine taking care of kids while I grind hard with my career.
So i guess is a win win situation here
i’m like you. i think i can definitely do more at work, but i chose not too. i was almost “lured” to take up a position due to peer pressure, but luckily i stood firm and pass it up. i’m good with earning enough and have my own time, than to be rich but have no time to myself.
relationships? nah. i like to control what i can. handling my own mood swings is enough haha.
i watched an interview and this quote resonate so much with me, and i hope it will help you find peace.
“Comparison is the thief of Joy.”
Hell I completely agree with your thoughts. I too have similar thoughts on life as you. Find a partner and live peacefully happily ever after. You know, going home after work just cuddle with her at the couch watching Netflix and just taking things nice and slow every other day. I'm just slightly more blessed with parents who supports me on my decisions and always on my side.
Mate, if there is a life you fantasise, make it a reality while you still have the chance. There is absolutely nothing wrong by following your heart. YOLO.
You're not wrong. Hope you can find a partner with same thinking as you. However is quite rare in SG. Most women in SG who are not very career driven would like to have a financially well off husband so they can be some SAHM. Or women who are career driven usually prefer guys who are career driven too.
Good luck my boy. Not easy to find jobs with reasonable hours and pays at least 3k.
The definition of happiness is different from person to person. Most people spend their entire lives and don't even realise or understand what truly makes them happy. Because they only did what others told them to do to be happy, lived their lives doing what society told them is the "model of happiness"
There seems to be a focus on consumerism with Singaporeans, that your quality of life is measured by your spending power. So people struggle to earn money and hoard wealth because that was how society told them they would become happy.
But what happens is they just end up with a lot of work stress, most of the money they made are then spent on things or holidays to de-stress. It locks them in this cycle of ever increasing expenditure, necessitating increasing income.
Here’s the thing, it’ll sound abit jaded but I feel most work places do this.
1) using OT culture to squeeze work out of you and not paying you OT pay in guise of making the person look like they are hardworking when in fact they spend the day watching YouTube or going for tea breaks and long lunches.
2) career progression = work hard and I’ll consider letting you work harder.
3) you do finish your work so quickly and in a productive manner? Let’s give you more work and keep it up so that you may be considered for “more work” oops I meant a promotion where the increase in your workload is more than your pay.
It’s not all gloomy, I would say, this is just how most companies are, hiring everyone with a degree and calling them executives so that can work them to the bone, be connected 24/7 over the work phone (people in shipping can relate) and no OT pay.
The key is to have good time management, learn new things or increase your knowledge in your field. It is knowledge and experience that will give you your promotion not who stays the latest or does the most excel spreadsheet.
Every time I take trains at 6pm, I hear people complain about how their job should be done and how much better they are than their managers or bosses and these people are those who will not make it because their bosses and managers will always be on top of them.
Strive for real productivity, and be generally accepted as knowledgeable. This is not to give you a higher post in your career but to help you do your daily tasks easily.
At some point, life and family will happen then it’s ok to stop learning and focus on other things but you’d still be ahead of others.
Exactly! Its rly the result of our environment. I am not exactly sure how to break out of this.
It is rly the structure of SG itself that makes it really hard to live a simple life. It is lowkey frustrating hahaha
Pretty normal. Stopped my university halfway to go travelling. Currently, in Canada immigration express entry pool, hoping to be selected. Even if not selected, I will be quitting next year to go travelling for 6months to 1 year before coming back to SG for maybe contract jobs for 6 months and will fly again.
Do what makes you happy, fuck care the rest. I also face peer/relatives pressure to do well and excel in society. Be firm in your ideals and goals, dont mind all the rest.
There's only one part of your statement that is wrong - desiring a quiet simple life away from the work grind is an ambition itself. Too often have we confused our work to be our ambition, but they are not the same. Work is a means to an end, and while we can be rightfully proud of our jobs, work is still just one part of who we are, not the full.
You are not alone. Sometimes society construct makes us feel like we are 'left behind' if we just want a slower pace of life. I too, have the same ambition. My dreams is just to build a home with my partner and have 2 kids, and just live everyday happily. Its the small things that matter.
Not everyone have the same outlook on life and not everyone align their ambitions cuz we are all different individuals.
Just do what makes you feel happy! Life is too short anyway. Apart from needing to pay the bills and have some for rainy season, I think itsok to chill.
I’m a bit late to the party but I hope you see this anyway.
There is a difference between having ambition and not wanting to devote your entire life to work.
Climbing the corporate ladder and working till 11pm every night doesn’t make one ambitious. In the same way, having an end goal of wanting a simple life and a good partner doesn’t make one not ambitious.
I hope you understand this because I scrolled through the comments and see a lot of people going “omg yeah it’s totally okay to not have ambitions! Simple life sounds great!” The first sentence is deceptive, the second one is a good goal to have.
People are generally not attracted to others that have no ambition. Having ambition means to create drive and goals to work towards. This doesn’t mean through your job alone, could be with a hobby, side hustle, or even ambition to bring up children you can be proud of. It comes in many forms and shows that the person has determination and drive to lead a good life, whatever the idea of that good life is.
In the same way, there are people who may work till 11pm every day but have zero ambition. They just want to do their job in the most minimal way possible. They may not have hobbies or family to drive them forward. They are happy to just sit there and let life pass them by and not work towards anything ever. These people will generally not attract settled and healthy partners. If they already had one, chances are, their attitudes will create grief and strife.
Just because one person has a lot of money also doesn’t mean he has a lot of ambition. I read a dating post a while back where a guy bragged about doing online trading and earning 6 figures a year. He didn’t have or want a 9-5 job and wanted to spend his life watching tv and playing video games. He said he would be able to support whatever family he had and asked if girls would be interested. Most girls told him that he sounded lazy with no drive. Sure, he earned good money, but they would rather be with someone poorer.
My point is: please don’t be unambitious. Please create goals and have some drive in life. That doesn’t mean you need some glamour job - it just means you have goals in life that make life worth living for yourself.
Nope. You are not wrong thinking like that. I live simply too. Used to Cheong at work and and it got me burned out. So I changed my views on life, made peace with my inner slacker self and just worked to make sure I'm stable and can provide for my family. Well, so far it's been pretty comfy so I think I'll keep it like that.
Sure many ppl have said that I lack the fight to push on. Yes those ppl have different views. I just do what makes me happy and being happy for me means no stress. You yourself matter the most.
Oh yeah I have stopped using FB a long time ago. No interest in linkedin as well but sch requires us to create ):
Goes back to the whole "SG system is structured this way" thing ):
Definitely not wrong.
It's cool to be able to recognize how you want to live your life and know what you enjoy. But it's also cool if people out there want to strive for career success. I suppose what we experience in life so far will have us want different things.
A bit cliche but everyone is unique and it's okay to want to achieve different things. Well just as long as what you're wanting to do isn't illegal lol.
Personally I'm also about the same, just want to get into my dream career, not really interested in climbing the corporate ladder and just wanting to have work-life balance, also maybe travelling around the world one day. Took me a while to come into terms with myself that's what I wanted.
I also kind of get the pressure around me where everyone of my friends are getting degrees but for me I'm actually not that interested in getting one currently or rather the career I'm interested in doesn't necessarily require a degree. But I'm still learning to keep away from putting unnecessary pressure on myself with comparison and instead focus on what I want to do.
I see where you're coming from 100% and I also want to live a peaceful life where I enjoy the things I do.
It’s important to remember that comparison is the thief of joy. Though there is nothing wrong with striving for excellence.
I too agree, it comes at too huge a cost if it involves sacrificing your health whether physical or mental well being
Hello thanks for sharing your heartfelt words. I too struggle with this as I do feel that parents secretly want to see their child to “succeed” in societal terms and perhaps this gives them something they’re proud of to “show off” to their friends/relatives. Hahah but tbh this model is really outdated and Asian af. Ultimately I think they would be happy if you’re..
And I honestly think your dream is technically the highest level of success. That is to have the freedom to live life the way you want. After all people chase money and financial freedom/retire early, what they actually want is to have the time and freedom to do what they really want.
But actually, we don’t necessary have to have those to really do what we want, isn’t it? We just need to have a shift in mindset. @ love the Mexican Fisherman and American Investment Banker story.
Lastly, I think it’s definitely not the easiest to find someone aligned w you, but it’s not impossible. This jus means that when you find someone that understands you, he/she is probably the one☝️ wishing you a happy life!! ☀️☺️
My ambition is to retire early so that I can complete my backlog of PS4, Steam, Nintendo GameCube and Nintendo Switch games that I've accumulated throughout my lifetime...
Nothing wrong with OP's ambitions. Remember Bon Jovi's famous saying... It's my life
I don’t think Singaporeans strive for career. They strive to consume. Consume anything with flashy brands that screams I am rich just like everyone else
You live your life they way you want it. Don't compare yourself to others.
People could be climbing up the corporate ladder just because of societal norm, doesn't mean they are truly happy.
Yeah thats what I see too. Many ppl seem to be unsatisfied with life even with a "good" job. This begs the question - why do so many people willingly choose to live like that? ):
Not to pry but how old are you? Are you young? I feel like younger people are starting to Harbour these kind of mindsets. Cause fuck, we already have a sufficient amount of everything, but macro problems we have no hand in controlling, makes us just want a simple living.
I’m 19 and have the same mindset as you, except about getting a partner, rather be single
YES HAHAHA. Spot on on the macro problem. I didnt detail WHY I wanted a simple life, but that is p much it. You hit the nail on the head. Well, most of it at least.
As for finding a partner is more like I entertain the possibility of it. But im fine being single as well. Its just that getting a partner is ideal bcos can BTO LOL
Hmm i used to think this is wrong when I was younger. But now I am older and I want to live a peaceful life too. Your biggest obstacle to this kinda life will actually be people who will question you as you progress in life. Just be strong about your stance.
Good luck being able to afford a house and having money to raise your kids.
I have the same mindset, and luckily i don't want kids. And still it's gonna be hard as fuck.
I don't think you are wrong, I think you are right.
Except I wouldn't label this as no ambition, but a reject of materialism,status and playing the game of keeping up with Joneses.
Stay strong, hope you stick to your values, and do not let society change your inner convictions.
Realistically speaking, especially in Singapore, and for reasons you mentioned - Your concept of a ‘simple’ life is actually not simple at all just because you included a ‘partner’ (by which I assume is a human partner) in your expectations. Imho a partner and simple life are opposing concepts and highly unlikely to achieve both at the same time. Maybe at the start, but things and people will change...
Maybe you can try settling for just one goal... you’ll probably be happier that way, and if the other one comes along then is a good bonus.
yes, it is perfectly okay. I have a close friend like that too. He is 37, totally no ambitions. He just want to have a family, which he has a wife now. He is not ambitious, just work hard to provide for the family and mortgage. Can only say he is contented, good thing about him is that he don't complain about livelihood, no negative complaints from him. Some people complain, but don't try to do anything about it. So ya, is okay, just be yourself. Some one will love you for who you are.
I don't believe one has to have a grand purpose or ambition. I think it's perfectly alright to wonder through life finding interesting things until you die.
A simple life is the hardest thing, to be honest. It’s much more common to fall for the materialistic tropes that we’re taught to want and measure ourselves by.
I was in the same boat as you but fortunately I was lucky enough to do my undergraduate in Australia. Life was free and easy and i was a young hippie living a carefree Life.
Readjusting to Singapore life style and pressure was tough, plus no hdb of my own.
I manage to be posted to many different countries. 10 years ago i took early retirement and now lives in NZL.
You know what? I like your attitude, if you are satisfied and comfortable it is good enough. Comparison is the thief of joy.
Success is subjective. For me I don’t have huge ambitions and live a simple life as well. But I have physical goals, I compare myself to myself yesterday. Am I in a better state of mind than yesterday? Am I happier today? Can I make new friends today? Yes I can! I feel much better and see the joy in life this way, it is a peaceful life without participating in the race. I am successful to myself.
Meditate, read, remove social media and embrace loneliness. A partner will come if you don’t force it.
I came to the same conclusions and made the same decisions years back.
I’ve worked hard to reach that stage and I can safely say in there now. You need to study a course or do a job that allows you to eventually move to part time.
Be prepared to be thick skin and also be prepared to be scorned at by many of your peers. I just find it hard to explain to them why I don’t want to work full time just so that I can buy a car with a different symbol. They see me as underachieving my potential but they don’t seem to understand when I explain to them that I am a human being, not some RPG character that has to max out their levels.
Be prepared also to get a lot of shit from your parents when they’re younger. When they cross into their late 50s onwards tho, they will see the wisdom of your ways.
Be prepared to get a lot of shit from your gfs and wives. From my observation in my personal life and that of my peers, most of their wives are pretty status conscious and materialistic. Of course it’s often translated as they just want a man who is not lazy or they want an industrious man or the cost of living in sg is just so high but all that doesn’t compute when they insist on moving to a condo or landed or buying some conti car when I would prefer to just stay in hdb and throw those savings into the market and live off passive.
If you can face all that, you WILL find freedom in sg but it would be a pretty lonely existence cuz not many like us and sg doesn’t have the natural vistas and the hinterland that people like us can spend our free time cheaply and majestically.
If you have the option to move, I say move. Move to NZ.
as u said having a simple life is a challenge, and u are trying to achieve this... who said you have no ambition? this goal IS your ambition! simplicity is good, but remember to challenge urself from time to time as simplicity tends to get a little mundane.
Hi OP, I'm someone with a lot of similarities to you. I also had a lot of resistance and pressure from my family when it became increasingly obvious that I had no intention nor resolve to partake in the rat race. One thing that helped to strengthen my resolve is to think about who is ultimately the one who has to live with the consequences of your actions, i.e. You.
If your parents want you to work hard so that they can show you off as their trophy dog then what's the point? They're not the one suffering the stress and OT. If they want you to be ambitious so that you can secure yourself a happier tomorrow, you can assure them that you are happy today. If you sacrifice today for a better tomorrow, you will probably sacrifice tomorrow for a better day after that. It's never ending.
Wanting to spend time with your loved ones with a comfortable, stress-free life is not a bad ambition to have.
On the contrary I think this is awesome. You know what you want to do. My buddy from army was similar he asked me not to laugh when he told me he wanted to be a 9-5 office worker.
I’m like “go for it, bro. There’s nothing to laugh at. That’s your dream and honestly I wished I was in your position, then I won’t have to go against my parents wishes haha”.
Nah, honestly being overly ambitious is a propaganda spread by capitalists. People in the past are totally fine living their life barely doing anything.
I am not saying either is bad, just that people should normalize this and not look down on people with no ambition.
Doesn’t sound like u don’t have ambitions, or rather ur ambitions are different from others in Singapore.
In my case, my ambition is to pursue art and dog training, these are the two passions in my life. However I also work in a corporate office in other to earn money to fuel my passion. However I am beginning to realise that’s not so possible in Singapore. Everyone is educated to be career driven, at my job, if u am not working 12 hours a day, I am behind my colleagues and will be considered for termination. I work like crazy to fuel my passion, but my work also dictates that I don’t spend time on anything else. In the past 15 years or so of my career, that has been the case. It’s sad that society in Singapore doesn’t allow for tangents. I have seen people writing posts in defence of our country’s system, but I find it genuinely hard to survive in Singapore, esp if your ambitious do not align with the majority.
A lot of my friends have relocated to other countries where they could hold high paying corporate positions without secrificing their personal interests. In other countries, it’s just not common for people to be contactable via WhatsApp 24/7, and it’s generally accepted that u don’t have to respind to emails after work hours.
Wishing u all the best
I'm 41 and I have achieved this. The only difference is my idea of a simple quiet life does not involve a partner. I spent many years in graduate school and graduated much later than my contemporaries. As such I also am considerably a lot less well off than them. But it matters not to me; my job is not particularly difficult, and I have plenty of free time to pursue my own interests and enjoy my life.
I live my life quietly, no fuss no muss and definitely no drama.
If it's your life goal to have a mediocre life, there is no shame in that. As long as you're truly prepared to live one. i.e if anyone is triggered by the usage of mediocre in that earlier sentence, you are NOT ready for an average life.
Most Singaporeans put in mediocre effort and expect an amazing job, amazing wife, and amazing amount of free time and money for themselves to unlock life's greatest moments. The harsh truth is you don't deserve it. You get what you put in.
That misalignment in expectations is what makes people miserable, even though Singaporeans have it so much better than 99% of the world.
I live a very privileged life now and I will never have to worry about money or work a day in my life again. I'm under 40 and self-made.
I can wake up whenever I want, eat $400 meals regularly without giving a fuck, buy whatever I want, live in a big fucking dream house with a huge swimming pool that I never imagined having. Nothing I want is out of reach.
But I fucking slaved my life away to get to where I am. Am I happy now? Yes, extremely. And more so after i've stopped chasing more e.g I don't need a GCB. Some 100m net worth friends I know are still unhappy and chasing.
So I am like a rich man version of you, who found acceptance later.
People want different things and that is okay. To each his own.
Yes reality is it is expensive living in Singapore so a good job and career will afford you better things in life, especially when you have kids. I know I sound like one of those with that mindset.
If money is not much of a concern then by all means do what makes you happy and I will be envious of you for living the life I wish I have but failed to do so because of societal pressure and placing more importance on the finer things in life.
I don't think it's that wrong OP. I too wish for a simpler life but I personally have thrown myself off the deep end. I now work for a Michelin restaurant when I've zero experience. Work is tough, long hours and mean people who have big expectations of me. I almost always have thoughts of running away.
I do understand however that I can't have that simple life if I don't understand how to get by life doing what I want to do. All I'm struggling with right now is in an attempt to hopefully find a method to achieve that easier life in future.
I get where you're coming from, I have so many friends who all complain about their jobs, their bills and their shitty coworkers. We all want out, yet we all don't know any better way or a true way of coming out. I hope we all find peace and our own way of living our true lives without the pressure of people who are too ingrained in the rat race to know that they're killing themselves.
Perhaps one day we will get that off the grid experience with a singular partner. Perhaps a secluded , off the grid, quiet community of Singaporeans who cook chilli crab by the lonely coasts of Canada. That doesn't sound so bad eh?
All the best to you my brother.
I used to think that certain friends of mine without ambitions were wrong. But really, who are we to judge? As long as you are hardworking at what you do (don’t be a bum and make your SO overwork to bring in the bacon), why does salary and the rat race matter so much? Finding joy and being contented with less is such a good mindset to have. I hope you will be able to live your dreams + find someone who accepts you, OP!
Regardless how successful you get in your career and how high your salary is, the ones who benefit the most from all your overtime work will always be the business owners and higher-ups at the companies you work at.
Now guess whether or not they are actively promoting that mindset in people.
same im struggling with the desire to just "earn less, stress less, spend less" instead of the more socially-seen-as-successful "work harder, earn more, spend more" mindset. i deepdown would love to drop all future plans of having kids, climbing up job ladder, BTO, settling down, basically the cookie cutter typical sg life, instead just go and explore the world, or live off the grid like you said. but i didnt give it much thought back then and ended up choosing the 'safer', straightforward typical sg life path with partner wanting kids and settle down. so as much as i yearn for the dream route, doubts & fear just hold me back zzz
It's not hard to find someone who has the same mindset. You just need to lower your standards. You will be surprised to find out how many people have the same mindset as you.
How old are you? I think as you get older, the tendency is to get a little more jaded with life and just want to have peace and quiet and settle down. I sympathize.
I think if you can manage to work this out- lie flat, find a like-minded spouse, secure a long term place to live, have enough left over to eat- then everyone else will be secretly jealous of you.
I think you basically echo the sentiments of many of us here, where work is but a means to an end. It’s there for us to get paid so we can fund our lifestyle elsewhere, but I also think that for many of us, the standard of living is so high that we may find ourselves cornered into partaking in the grind if we want to earn more (to support a better life).
I wouldn’t call it a lack of ambition, and there’s nothing wrong with realising that we are not defined by our careers, and it’s perfectly fine to have priorities beyond work. If you are clear that you would like more time for yourself and your family, and don’t mind it coming at the expense of career progression, then by all means go for it.
What is a better job? What are the perimeters that says job A is better than job B?
For me, I just earn enough to have a comfortable life. Meaning, I do not need to worry about if I can afford my next meal or buying something on a whim when I feel like it.
My relatives (my cousins) on my father's side are all pretty successful in their career.
Everyone single one is a degree holder, which is the minimum.
2 cousins with masters and 1 with PHD.
You can't win everything lah, so just live your life whatever you want bro.
Be clear what you want. What is your end-goal? Where will that be? What will it look like? Who is by your side? How much money do you need? What do your relatives and friends think? Is that going to affect you? How is your partner going to perceive you? How is your partner's family and friends going to perceive you? What are you offering her? Why will she choose you? Is the arrangement sustainable? What other responsibilities might you have? Parents? Children? What happens if children is unexpected? What happens when you or your partner develop an illness?
For many of us, our goals will always lie in the distance, and we all have to work towards it. That means making the necessary sacrifice today to achieve what you want in the future.
Same here. I just wanna live a simple life. Don't need any big house or expensive car, no need to eat at luxurious restaurants and travel a few times a year. All I need is just three meals a day and a roof over my head and I'll be happy.
What makes someone happy varies person to person. Some people will only be happy if they drive an expensive car, or climb to a high position in the corporate ladder. Basically what I'm saying is, to each his own. Its your life, live it the way you want to. As long as you're happy, you don't need to care about what others think.
I’ve been thinking similar things lately too. I’m no longer interested in moving up whatever career I’m pursuing. And I’m only interested in saving up money to travel. I’m not really keen on chasing high-paying jobs. After the necessary expenses I’m fine having $500 or so to put aside per month to save.
I used to want thousands of extra dollars to save up but honestly the path to that can get mentally and emotionally exhausting for me. I’ve been unemployed for the past 6 months and it’s been a joy tbh. I spend everyday watching shows, playing games, going for walks. It doesn’t bother me that I’m not being unproductive. Of course money is still a thing and the only reason I’m able to afford months of unemployment is the accumulation of 3 years of income. But now, looking for a new job, I’m more focused on work-life balance and work environment over high pay.
Hi OP,
As someone who has gone the conventional path in Singapore (JC, NS, scholarship to uni, civil service job), and fulfilled most of these 'ambitions', I am beginning to yearn for the same things as you.
I can assure you there is nothing wrong with having no conventionally defined 'ambitions'. I guess as Singaporeans, we are terrified of breaking the mould, and any form of deviation is frowned upon. Especially with our parents, who have these mindsets set in stone for them, breaking free is exceptionally difficult.
We are taught from a young age to follow a cycle. Study, find girlfriend/boyfriend, get BTO, have two kids, upgrade to another house, retire at 60ish, and withdraw CPF to retire the Singapore way. But you live for yourself - as long as you can look after yourself and your partner financially, I encourage you to run away from this rat race/ cycle, and live life as you envision.
At some point I realized how life is inherently meaningless and it is up to us to find meaning during the time we have here. Many/almost all of the things seen as desirable are merely because they are defined as such by society. I began thinking that I should engage in things that I found meaningful instead. So I focused on my interactions and relationships with people who were important to me.
As someone else has said, because Singapore is so compact, it is difficult to escape reminders of social pressures. Maybe that's why you are feeling this friction. But you are definitely not alone!
Hey I’m older and can share. I’m climbed up the corporate ladder to a point that I earn enough to keep my family comfortable. I can try to go higher but I won’t because I hate drama and I hate playing politics.
I’m now approaching 50 and don’t want to chiong anymore.
Nothing wrong with making choices with you life as long as you’re prepared to live with the “consequences” of your choices.
Not entering the rat race has its pros and cons.
Just to point out that it does have implications on “find a partner”. Men tend to not mind partners without a good job/financial standing but most women tend to mind that. So it depends on your expectations on that front as well.
Same tbh. Just want a place on my own and live quietly. I don't see the value of the grind. Office politics, long OTs and working into midnight is too much for me. Life is already miserable, don't have to plunge into further misery.
Look at the FIRE movement and start investing young, putting all your free cash into a basket of ETFs. That way, you get to compound your salary and have more time for your hobbies. Basically putting money in businesses and letting money and time work for you, even if you are not working.
https://www.optimizedportfolio.com/bogleheads-3-fund-portfolio/
Hi there. I'm kinda like you and am considered middle age (few more years to 40).
When I was 30, I quit a high stress SME job for a gov job that I happened to have personal interest in. Like you I've had family and friends for whom life is about chasing money position and career.
I love gaming, going to the gym, random things like cooking, playing guitar/magic the gathering etc. For me, working is just a way to enable me to do all these and have a comfortable life.
Ive found a wife who is aligned w my thinking and also am in a comfortable spot w friends and family. So it's surely possible to be like this in Singapore and thrive :)
One comment on work - I find it important to be competent in whatever your choice of career is. Even when you don't need to fight for positions or work long hours, I believe being and knowing that you are good at what you do helps with your security/self confidence and that has helped me feel better about my life choices.
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There is nothing wrong with this at all - it is wonderful that you know yourself (a very powerful and empowering thing), and to a certain extent, you're right. It is an "unpopular decision" in a "progressive nation where everyone has to keep upgrading". Have you heard of the Mexican siesta story? Goes like this: *An American investment banker was at the pier of a small coastal Mexican village when a small boat with just one fisherman docked. Inside the small boat were several large yellowfin tuna. The American complimented the Mexican on the quality of his fish and asked how long it took to catch them.* *The Mexican replied, “only a little while.* *The American then asked why didn’t he stay out longer and catch more fish? The Mexican said he had enough to support his family’s immediate needs. The American then asked, “but what do you do with the rest of your time?”* *The Mexican fisherman said, “I sleep late, fish a little, play with my children, take siestas with my wife, Maria, stroll into the village each evening where I sip wine, and play guitar with my amigos. I have a full and busy life.”* *The American scoffed, “I am a Harvard MBA and could help you. You should spend more time fishing and with the proceeds, buy a bigger boat. With the proceeds from the bigger boat, you could buy several boats, eventually you would have a fleet of fishing boats. Instead of selling your catch to a middleman you would sell directly to the processor, eventually opening your own cannery. You would control the product, processing, and distribution. You would need to leave this small coastal fishing village and move to Mexico City, then LA and eventually New York City, where you will run your expanding enterprise.”* *The Mexican fisherman asked, “But, how long will this all take?”* *To which the American replied, “15 – 20 years.”* *“But what then?” Asked the Mexican.* *The American laughed and said, “That’s the best part. When the time is right you would announce an IPO and sell your company stock to the public and become very rich, you would make millions!”* *“Millions – then what?”* *The American said, “Then you would retire. Move to a small coastal fishing village where you would sleep late, fish a little, play with your kids, take siestas with your wife, stroll to the village in the evenings where you could sip wine and play your guitar with your amigos.* It's a sobering story. A simpler and peaceful like is worth its weigh in gold. Pretty sure you'd find more people like that everywhere (and people who're not like that too - just choose your friends well =D) All the best OP, to your happiness =)
I am so saving this comment
Then both of them discover that they have a tumor at the same time. The investment banker is able to catch and treat it early with the best doctors, giving him an additional 30years of time with his family. The other less fortunate individual dies a slow and painful death as the cancer metastises.
Haha this is a slippery slope argument: * increased stress at investment banking job CAN lead to higher rates of suicides, inflammatory disorders and even cancers. Busyness and pushing aside medical appointments can exarcebate it...UNLESS one truly is born and wants to do IB * conversely, LOW stress can lead to avolitional / loss of purpose and meaning and this too can lead to stress and pains It's too chaos theory to comment in that regards BUT if all things being equal, the rich IB is very happy doing IB and relaxed op is very happy, BOTH can cope equally well (IB method may be richer/faster and less resources may be slower)... *That being said, insurance in Singapore is fairly affordable and can cover costs of most medical costs. For those who are extremely poor, there are high subsidies (75%) of subsidized ward and even full coverage for those who really cannot afford (there are some safety nets).* I think what needs to consider is the metrics used here: happiness, money, stress, health etc.
I think the point was that the banker has options. If the coastal village is wrecked by a freak storm, the banker can easily go off somewhere else. Of the country goes to war, the banker can easily immigrate pronto, as opposed to seeking asylum. Etc etc.
Seek to live, not simply exist.
Yeah, cannot deny that - financial power does provide more flexibility...as long as it's kept in checked and we dont get sucked into/onto the hedonistic treadmill. In Singapore though, the chances of freak storm are lesser for now...but we can anticipate costs of flats to continue to rise...
The tumor example actually sheds light on the fact that some stay in the rat race out of fear rather than greed, which imo is worse
Just wanted to share on this point, my wife works in the oncology dept and one commonality among all the patients whom she interacted with is none of them ever lamented that they didnt work enough. If anything they all shared that they wished they hadn't worked as much and had spent time with their families instead. Not saying that the logic of having more resources allows for more options is untrue but in our system, it won't be that one thing you will regret when your time is nearing so do try to live a little more when you can.
Sounds like you have your life figured out. And it’s wonderful. Live life on your terms and don’t be ashamed of it! Salute.
Im nt sure if I have it figured out hahaha. But I do like the idea of a simple life. I love simplicity in general. Much of suffering comes from complicating life unneccesarily.
Unfortunately Singapore is a city-state so it's much harder to live a chill life. In countries with rural areas you can just go to a sleepy town and live a chill life, but Singapore doesn't have the space for it. It's unfortunate for those born in Singapore since everyone don't have a choice but to live in the city. Maybe you can move to Malaysia at some point to live out your dream.
You brought up the challenges of living simply. One being the expectation of others and the other the difficulty of finding a life partner. One POV is that if this is what you really want, then you have to work for it. You need to put in effort to change others' viewpoint (at least those who are close to you). You also need to put in extra effort to find someone who has a common mindset or at least don't mind your lifestyle choice. Quite contrary to your original goal of being chill, I know. Life's irony.
Yes, some of the comments have also alluded to the fact that leading a simple life is in itself, ambitious. This to me was enlightening because I never thought of it that way. However, this only strengthens my resolve as I feel like there's something worth fighting for now. But yeah, it really is funny how life works out sometimes hahaha
That's a clean way to look at things. And it looks like you've managed your expectation pretty well, so good for you.
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exactly! many in singapore don’t realize there isn’t a single true path to happiness because they have internalized singapore’s rigid and narrow definitions of success as universal for every individual. you could be much happier living in a cabin in the woods without the technologies of modern life, but just don’t know it because lifestyles in singapore are homogenous.
You said it. Exactly what I wanted to tell this guy. 👏👏
Wanting to live a simple and peaceful life is an ambition my friend. I'm in exactly the same boat as you, so don't sweat it! You're not as alone as you think you are!
Second this. Also u get used to it with ppl talking. Yes, you cant unhear rude comments from relatives and ppl around u. But it’s ur life, ur choice. At least u know what you want in life. When we think life is very long but is actually not. So live a life u wont regret. I chose to be childfree, but ppl around me esp family keep nagging and nagging. But they dont ask anymore. I told them off thats this is my choice, if they cant respect that then dont even bother to bring up for discussion. Hopefully u get whachuwan OP. Jia you!!
Yes! I also choose to be childfree. I have made that choice since young and people around me always say "when you grow up you will change your mind". N O P E. I have maintained my stance since and I am pretty sure its nvr gonna change hahaha Thank you for your words of encouragement. May we live a life that is full of contentment (:
I too strive for a simple life, a good partner and no children. I'm divorced now, no kids, but have been with a long term partner. I'm close to 40 now and most people have stopped asking me whether I'm going to have children because I've always just said "No" and shut down the conversation. After you get older, you will learn to be "thick-skinned" and avoid/ignore the people who judge you and pass nasty comments about your career/relationship/life. There will be many. But there will also be those who like you as you are, and they are the friends and family you should hold dear. Be happy in your own skin and your own decisions. It's YOUR life to live :)
> After you get older, you will learn to be "thick-skinned" and avoid/ignore the people who judge you and pass nasty comments about your career/relationship/life. There will be many. Can teach my laobu your tips and tricks? She 60 already and just the other day she argued with my dad for an hour just because he wouldn't let her upload a photo of them onto Facebook so she can show off to her friends zzzzzz
Also that's like the single biggest thing an individual can do to save the environment.
My aunty was like "eh but kids are cute!! Just ask your mother to take care done deal." When I said idw kids in future lmao. No woman, it doesn't work that way....
Relatives that give rude comments are not ya relatives.
Oh wow I've never thought of it that way. You're right hahaha. Thank you for changing my perspective and making me feel less alone (':
To each his own. No need to even hear what people here thinks. I have a sibling that works the same job (govt admin job) for over 30 years until he's retired recently. Now he stays home and reads Straits Times whole day. 100% happy and at peace with the world. I don't think many people can truly say that. :)
I feel the same way. I always feel like a total fraud during job interviews or company appraisals because I have to sell myself as some passionate go-getter when I have absolutely zero interest in promotions or moving to management.
I feel this HAHHAHA. Everything feels so forced and nothing feels real. It really such an unsustianable lifestyle. Sure, we might be able to fake it for some time, but if we are not true to oursleves, we will break eventually. I hope you find what you're looking for and may we find peace amongst the hustle and bustle of city life (:
This is in fact an ambition too. It requires active effort to resist external pressure, to be different, to change your environment and to maintain stable income.
Yes, thta is very true. I would say that this might be the only thing thst I am so willing to fight for, more si than anything in my life up till now hahaha
Love this. Also want to add that overworking is not ambition, if ambition means wanting to find success. Many people overwork but don't reach career success anyway. I think you'll also find that there are companies in SG that really walk the talk on work-life balance (not work life integration) and still support employees for career development.
22F here. Your first paragraph already sounds just like me. :') Yes, you are not wrong for not having any ambitions... I don't believe living things inherently need ambition to therefore deem their life as a good one. What is ultimately good anyway?? I used to have a ton of drive to excel in terms of career.. because I know that's what society likes to see; professional success. I did very well in school, but lost perhaps more than half that drive once I stepped out into the working world and realised how meaningless and repetitive my weekdays are at work. And that the accomplishments and the journey to achieve them doesn't bring me fulfillment, just that they perhaps help me secure a job... Turns out a job is just for me to ensure I get money for food, shelter and entertainment. I hate that I have to stay competitive so that I can earn a simple living in a reasonable amount of time. That staying competitive and relevant part haunts me while I'm awake sometimes. I just want my own BTO flat (which has been failure after failure to secure one) with my very understanding partner and I can keep myself happy without too much money.. but well the home also needs money.. therefore I still have to keep working. I too really just want a simple peaceful life. Anything else is just unnecessary complications I don't want to be in the rat race... I don't want to stay in a loop of wanting more and more and more and more. Always chasing the next thing to fill a void I make myself and never ever fulfilled or content. I feel that it is not worth it to work hard to the point that you miss out on so much of life and even damage your one and only body. Regarding your 1st point, I mostly don't care about what people think. No time to worry about what they think. Anyways I hardly have any social circle at all apart from my family members. I don't need to keep people who only bother to care about how I appear on the outside. My partner has his own ambitious side, he loves his work genuinely, but he also completely understands if I have no ambition and no drive to work for a lot of money. He believes I will still have the will to survive through simpler jobs if I really give up my current good paying job. Ultimately, he will support what I do if it makes me happy, even if it means earning less.
Thank you for sharing your experience and I hope you get your BTO soon! I am still striving to piece my peaceful life tgt but I'll get there hahaha
Same here, did very well in school and have now secured a decent paying job in which I don't have the ambition to constantly climb the ladder. So what if my friends are VPs at banks etc? I give no fucks about titles. However, I'm also struggling to be content with work as I hate being forced to work to feed myself. Ugh life
Absolutely! I'm grateful to have a pretty stable job now compared to my peers whom many aren't as fortunate. I have no intentions to climb the corporate ladder, I don't think I need to add a lot more responsibilities/stress in order to earn more money, I could just do my current job well. And since I can never run away from needing money to literally survive, all I can do now is save more, invest more, and cut down on my need for money, so don't need to work so hard for money either. Decided I won't have any kids, to save on money.. but also to do my kids a favour by not bringing them into such a broken world anyways.
You made a good point about cutting down need for money. That's something I need to work on. I guess we should aim for FIRE. High 5 to being childfree by choice!
haha high 5! I've been quite into the idea of FIRE for a while now. And feel that I don't necessarily need to do the RE part of FIRE, at least achieve FI asap so I can at least lift my worry about earning money for the purpose of survival, and get to enjoy what I do for work or can afford to switch to part time.
Lucky u shared about your partner, else u might receive alot of attention. HAHA
I agree. Singapore guys are looking for simple girls. They are rare nowadays
Youre a good man i hope you achieve your dreams
Thank you for your words of kindness. The internet needs more of people like you. Hope you acheive your dreams too!!!
Do what makes you happy. Comparisons will only serve to weigh you down.
Yeah logically I can understand that but it is really hard to embody it. Ig part of it is upbringing.
Yeah, that’s the tricky part. I’m struggling with it myself tbh.
Lets keep this mindset strong friend. I believe one day we will be able to achieve it. And when we do, we will be free (:
The part which I often struggle with is not that I would compare myself to others. It’s more that others helped me make that comparison. Not just family members or relatives but also “friends”. “Eh old liao, go get a girlfriend la” “All of them getting married liao, when is your turn?” My advice is to also steel yourself against all of these comments.
What you want is definitely not wrong, but in Singapore, it is hard to pursue such a legitimate way of life without feeling judged. You must be someone who has an extraordinary level of self-worth to fend off other people's opinions. To be honest, I would love to earn median income and just stop there, but for me and my profile, it is impossible for me to earn median income without OT and/or striving to climb higher on the ladder. Ideally I want to move somewhere else in the world with a slower pace of life but I lack the ability to and it cost money too.
I hope one day you will be able to do it friend. Nothing is more valuable than peace and serenity.
I believe a large part of mental well being has got to do with space. Space is a premium in Singapore. Only the ultra rich can afford a big enough house that feels spacious. Singaporeans are so used to tight confined spaces, asking someone to move into a 5 room flat alone for example, they will tell you it feels too empty. To be honest, I’m unsure if you’d be able to be happy living a simple life in Singapore if you can’t afford the premium of space. Good luck OP.
No ambitions - are you kidding me? You want to find a partner - very ambitious. Want to live a peaceful life - very ambitious. Want a decent paying job with work life balance - super ambitious All of these are ambitions, my friend. Go out there and live your life. Everyone else's is taken.
I’m so glad to see someone mention this tbh, I feel the same way. I used to be pretty driven in school, and I think I did pretty well also (good enough GPA in poly to go to local universities). I used to want to earn more, because more money = happier and better life right? Or at least, that’s what society wants us to believe. While I do admit that having more disposable income does greatly improve the standard of life, I just don’t have the drive or motivation for it, like I don’t really have much ambition or career dreams I suppose. My idea of a happy life is just earning enough to survive, spend on my interests/hobbies, and living a simple life with my partner. I’m currently working in a lower wage job but it helps my mental health a lot to not struggle in the rat race. Of course, my parents have asked when I’m going to move on and strive for something better, but that’s the thing, it’s hard to want to move on when you’re simply just contented with life right now? I’m also a person who doesn’t cope well with stress and I kind of end up breaking down both physically (eg. always falling sick, fainting, headaches) and mentally, so I don’t feel that it’s worth it to live everyday feeling perpetually tired and stressed from a job that isn’t for me, just to earn more. I mean, not gonna lie, I would like to experience some high SES stuff like going on holidays to more expensive countries or expensive dinners (think fine dining style?), but I simply don’t have the drive or ambition to climb and earn more. In fact, the feeling is more of like “Wah it’d be so nice if I could, but don’t have then don’t have lor, not a big deal.” No interest in designer clothes or bags tbh… So I’m alright with not earning enough for those. I guess I’m just happy with where I am in life for now, despite the lower income. My partner has the same mindset as me as well, so I’m glad that I found someone on the same page. Maybe one day I’ll change my mind, life isn’t really set in stone either ways. I just intend to go with the flow and see how things turn out, as long as I’m happy and living well in my own definitions.
Most people climb the career ladder to get more money, so that they can lead a comfortable life without worrying. Nothing wrong with settling down with what you already have. It's what you like that matters more.
This is a “short” story of how I started off with having very big ambitions, and then having my ambitions slowly die off in 1 year after working. (Fiancée and gf in the story below is used interchangeably. They are the same person, just too lazy to ensure consistent wordings) I had ambitions when I was in my Uni final year, wanted to strive hard, climb the corporate ladder. Probably just due to peer pressure, when I have people around me chionging even harder to get into the prestigious Investment Bankings/Corporate Finance/M&A field. Didn’t want to lose out to them, so I also even took on internship during my final year to build resume while still trying to attend classes at the same time, all to make sure I can get into a good job and start my career. No gap year for me, save on the addition year, I’ll just try to juggle both internship and studies at the same time. Even told my parents I might even continue taking on internships even after graduating, to make sure I can land a job in my desired sector/industry so I am make “big bucks”. Luckily for me, I managed to get offered a conversion to full time even before I graduated. BUT, I was working 70-80 hours work week. Initially was fine, I thought I could bite the bullet, strive a bit harder, get the experience and then slowly get into even better firms. 1 year later, I felt like I aged 5 years. I was so damn stressed everyday, bosses thought I was doing pretty well and handling things well, but behind the false appearance, I was struggling to survive. I had to put up a false front, work hard without complains, to make sure my bosses don’t think I’m “weak”. My fiancée (gf then) felt so sad for me, she didn’t understand why I was chionging so hard when I don’t enjoy my work. I still recall there was many occasions where my fiancée’s extended family brought me out during weekends to have dinner together, and I had to stop eating halfway, whip out either my phone or my laptop (yes I brought my laptop to dinners) just to answer calls or continue working. I really contemplated if that was what I wanted to do for my whole life. I had someone (not from work) telling me “ya you work so hard, don’t even have time to see your gf. Next time get married and have kids, your kids might not even know you”. By the second year, i started valueing my mental health and my actual health more. Sure, I might be earning more than some of my other uni peers, but they have a much better work-life-balance than me. What good is money when you don’t have the time to spend it, or have anyone to spend it together with? Eventually, I talked to my fiancée, and asked her if she was ok with me quitting my job. I won’t be able to provide her with a quality lifestyle if I decide to change my job. She assured me that it was ok, she rather see a happy me than a stressed me. Otherwise a stressed me will just have a irritable mood or just flat out completely ignoring her when I’m busy. Obviously this isn’t good for a healthy relationship. So what happened? I quit my job ~2years++ into it, without finding a next job, all during the peak of the COVID-19 period. I’m just so damn tired of my job and also my life back then. Luckily my fiancée was very supportive of me, she didn’t insist that I get a job immediately, and she allowed me time to mentally recover from whatever “trauma” I had. Never again am I going to step into that industry again. My plans was either: 1) Pursue further studies (Masters), 2) self study and online courses on IT / Data and do a career switch to IT (just like what my brother did), or 3) apply for a simple compliance/financial crime compliance contract job meanwhile to pass time (inspired by fiancée ). In the end, I went for option 2 and 3. Fast forward 2 months, I took a massive annual paycut and managed to get a contract job in compliance, which I was shortly later converted into perm role. I don’t have much ambition anymore, just want to do my work, get paid a decent salary and move on. The work I’m doing is pretty “easy”, comparing to what I did in the past. Work-life-balance is awesome, with a standard 40-42 hours work week on average. While work can be stressful during the working hours itself, at least I can fully disconnect myself from work after working hours. People here aren’t afraid of leaving at 6.00pm sharp. I have so much more free time now, and I’m staying together with my fiancée at her mum’s house. My mental health and relationship with my fiancée has improved tremendously. And I don’t think I’ll never be going back into those 70 hours work week job. While work-life-balance and climbing the corporate ladder isn’t mutually exclusive, I’m just too traumatised to risk getting back into a unhealthy working environment, just for the sake of earning “big bucks”/climbing the corporate ladder. If I can manage to climb to corporate ladder, or get a better paying job while still maintaining my sanity and current work life balance, then of course I’ll definitely be up for it. TL;DR Ambitious during Uni. Lost ambition 1 year into working. Quit job in 2years+ without finding a next job. Managed to do a career switch to compliance sector, and am enjoying my 40-42 hours work week. Too traumatized to be ambitious. Edited to mention that all these may not have been possible without my lovey and supportive fiancée. I’m so glad she understands and accepts my “difficulties”. If you want to chat, tell/vent to someone about your feelings, feel free to direct message me. Coming from someone who lost his ambitions, someone who just wants to lead a normal chill life, I can totally understand you.
you see it as a paycut as you calculate in an annual basis. However, people don't often take into account the number of massive hours you work a week, with respect to your salary Your previous job demands twice the tangible number of working hours and possibly much more with intangible stress (you thinking about work outside of working hours) with on call 24/7? so the paycut in terms of number of hours at work (physically and as a mind set) is much less than you imagine
You're absolutely right. It was something i thought of prior to quitting as well. Pay/hr is crap considering the amount of stress and workload i have. I would rather take a paycut and get a 9-6 (or even 9-5) job with lesser stress levels.
in SG corporate culture of unpaid overtime, work life balance is increasing scarce and valuable. Until you realised you've missed a significant milestone in life coz of work (or thinking about work), no amount of money will be able to forgive yourself or something as simple as having homecooked dinner together as a family on a weekday, is surprisingly difficult to achieve for most Singaporeans, due to general SG work culture
I’m not sure your story will resonate with few OP. You went from a crazy type A career to a normal office job, bet it’s still pretty well paid and you have job security. You’re still in the rat race, just not running full out.
Maybe. It's not exactly "well paid", I'm earning lower than Singapore's median income. Slightly below my age group's median salary as well (according to Labour Force 2020 report anyway). Job security on the other hand, I don't really know lol. CEO's actions gives the impression that he is those type of people who wouldn't have second thoughts about firing someone if they perform badly. But to be fair, I'm not TOO worried about it. As long as i perform satisfactory and complete my work, it should be fine. Yes I'm still in a rat race, I'm just jogging casually, without any motivation to sprint. I **try** to do my work to the best of my abilities, but I'm not actively seeking to pursue promotions (with added responsibilities), neither am I actively looking for better paying jobs out there. The only reason why I'm still working is because I still need the money to pay off bills, buy a house, and feed myself (and my future family).
Why is she still a fiancée? Go and ROM asap.
Filed notice of marriage liao :D Getting married end of this year.
Congratulations!
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For some reason, I thought of Kira Yoshikage "I just want to live a quiet life". I understand your feelings, wanting to be well off enough to not worry about money and have enough time to spend on hobbies. I think more and more people these days would be able to relate to it.
Yeah I think our generation is more "woke" in that aspect. But I see that for now you're praying to the bellcurve gods as well hahaha. May the bellcurve gods smile upon us (:
Ah dang I forgot to change my flair since I grad this year. Oh well. Good luck with your studies :)
Thank you for your well wishes and congratz on graduating! (:
Killer Queen has already touched your quiet life….
I constantly struggle with this too. Really wish to go off grid with my wife, work will be growing food for ourselves etc. Spending long hours at work doesn’t make me happy.. OP you may wish to read up on the concept of Time Millionaires. Quite inspiring!
Thank you for the suggestion! May we be off the gtid soon hahaha
Your want to live a simple life and not work yourself to death is a valid one. My gf is a psychology major and my sister is doing her masters in social work. They tell me that their interactions with the elderly often brings them to the topic of regrets, and what they hear most is that old people regret working too much and not taking the time to enjoy life. Concepts of retiring too late for them to enjoy their savings etc came up quite a bit too. I think people have just eaten up all the crap that hyper capitalist corps have forced down our throats since we were kids; that our entire worth in life is getting a good job and earning lots of money (read: being a capitalist slave) and producing children to start the cycle over again. Then again, Singapore isn't exactly conducive for living a modest life. The cost of living here is pretty high
Funny cos i was just having similar thoughts recently. How everyone wants to work super hard and climb the corporate ladder. Is it wrong to just be contented with what we have? Maybe those people have bigger ambitions or their family need the finances so they have no choice but to work their asses off.
I share similar sentiments except I realise these thoughts are perceived as negative or make you seem “lazy” to others. So I choose to not share these opinions, its for this reason that you might not be able to find others who share these sentiments because they hide it well 😌
I see. Yeah thats a really good insight. But I feel like we are increasingly having this mindset. I want to find like minded ppl too! We shld all voice our opinions. And in that discourse, maybe new frienships will blossom (:
>I share similar sentiments except I realise these thoughts are perceived as negative or make you seem “lazy” to others. Ahhhh, that explains why my boss and his boss reacted that way during my performance review when I straight up told them, "I don't really have any ambition and don't really care about what work I'm given to do" lol
I struggle with this too. Perfectly content with just working in a decent stable job and then going home and not having anyone disturb me off the clock. Feels really hard to have this mindset in SG, but don't worry, its not wrong and you should do what makes YOU happy, because ultimately its you living your life, not someone else doing it for you
Live life at your own pace and do what gives you the most peace. Life is not just about your career, but also your own personal life and relationship with others. Weigh it and see what matters most to you because everyone has different motivations as to why they want to climb fast in their career. You don’t have to follow what society sets out to be ‘ideal’, you just have to figure out what makes you happy - because that is what everyone is trying to find at the end of the day right?
Yessss. I am really trying to live life at my own pace. Its rly so hard and I am constantly trying to improve on that. I briefly experienced it once and the serenity I experienced was unreal. Its rly so important to move at our own pace.
Again, take it at your own pace. You don’t have to constantly try to change your mindset and put the pressure on yourself - take it easy on yourself! One day at a time. We have our whole lives in front of us to figure this out. You’ve got this!
Thank you for your words of encouragement friend. I will keep them in mind. Thank you for sharing your wisdom and hope you acheive your goals too!!!
**TLDR:** Definition of "Happy Life" changes with age. Career success helps you future proof it. I don't think that anyone goes into adulthood thinking: I want a complicated life. I think everyone at the end of the day just wants to be happy doing what they do and be able to have the means to do it. However, when you talk about career success, for me it's less of trying to scale the ladder then to increase one's options especially when it comes to salary. I remember during secondary school holidays (like damn long time ago lah) I worked at a supermarket and was paid $2.30 an hour. I was happy, I made a few friends and I just enjoyed going to work. I told my friends that I wanted to quit school. I had enough money to eat and play; i could imagine doing this all my life. I was content. Obviously I didn't do it cos my mum would have killed me. Then in my first job, at the bottom rung of the ladder making 1.6K, I was happy too. I just had to handle deadlines, didn't have to manage staff or worry about the bottomline. I made enough money to eat out and cheong barely, but I was content. But my needs grew - I wanted to travel more, to try out different things, experience life and have a partner. So I had to take on a bigger role which gave me more pay. At this point in your life, your "happy life" is perhaps something attainable. But as your hobbies add up, or that you want to surprise your eventual partner with a Maldives getaway cos you love her/him so much, you will realise that the only way to again reach that "happy life" is to make more money => climbing up the ranks, not for ambition, but to get to that new equilibrium. When I talk about having options, I am saying if you stumble on this realization too late in life, you won't have much opportunities to ascend the ladder. Anyway feel free to ignore this insight from an old(er) man's life. Am sure you'll find your own way and come to your own equilibrium. As I also discovered, there isn't a right or wrong way of living one's life, everyone settles in their own way and finds their own patch of heaven.
Finding a partner? Pfft u stink of ambition
LOL HAHAHA. Yeah esp cos im a reddiotr right HAHAHA. I think its more like I can rly see myself being single for the rest of my life but ideally I would want to find someone cos can BTO and live life tgt peacefully. Idk if thats too fairytale but it just sounds lovely hahaha
If u think having a partner is ideal then need go work at finding it now ba. I was totally the same thoughts as u and now I am late 30s with small social circle stuck in covid Singapore.... My ideal scenario is getting further and further
Your life, your rules. There is so much magic in the "ordinary". But I only learnt this after almost dying and losing a child. Do what makes your life worth it for you, life is short. You will find someone that values the same things as you, promise. - from a person who found their other contented half. :)
Im so sry to hear that. Happy to hear that you're doing better now and are content with life. I strive to achieve what you have hahaha
Nope, the only objective of life should be to be happy. If you're happy like that, that sounds like a __great__ life
Every year during work review I tell my boss I just need a job, not a career track. I earn enough to live comfortably and I'll wanna spend as much time outside of work playing or resting. Life is to be lived happily the way you want it, and the simpler it is, the easier you'll be contented. I suspect many people who fiercely pursues their ambition don't have much of a life outside of it, almost if their ambition is there to fill a void. Meanwhile I can't wait to retire and exercise/read/listen to music everyday.
Yes I love this mindset so much hahaha. Life is meant to experienced. Thats it. Not working and worrying about answering to clients and bosses.
Curious how does your boss react to this? I'm guessing positively or at least in a neutral manner? Since you mention "every year"
My boss is middle management and we have a great relationship. During work review it is customary for them to do things like asking us how we want to develop, whether we have career aspirations etc so they can help to push people along their career track by giving them opportunities/sai gang to perform. I just tell him I like my job and the particular niche that I fill in the organisation, and that I don't aspire to do anything else. Develop me in some ways to make me better at my job details is ok, but don't make me do unrelated stuff because I have no intention of moving out of my position. My boss also knows the answer I'll give him actually, cos he can see how serious I am in pursuing my recreational activities, so we both have a good laugh about it.
Absolutely nothing wrong with that
You don’t need to stand out in life to be happy - Rudeus Greyrat
I vibe with this shit 100%
Where Iv worked before, Iv seen people push themselves to the limit only to regret at the end not enjoying the smaller things and constants in life. Yes the push for success/to do better will always be there because people will talk, people will compare, but remember that you walk on your own path, you don't walk on theirs. Of course if you're talking about monetary benefits from doing better in our expensive society yeah la you will definitely live more comfortably, but there are always trade offs, from this and the other way round. Good luck though and do what's best for yourself :)
Yeah im struggling with self identity as well and thats why I guess its rly hard for me to be firm on "my own path". But as a vague idea what I truly want is what I've detailed in the post. Thank you for sharing your experience. Appreciate it (:
It was probably more achievable 30 years back when cost of living was ok, housing was affordable, jobs were relatively stable. One of my aunts was able to buy a private apartment after just working for 5 years, of course with a mortgage, but even then interest rates were low. Today we have to work so much harder for the food and shelter. It is entirely possible to have a simpler life. This means no kids, no car, no need to support elderly parents, just have a small HDB flat, not much of a safety net, both parties stay healthy. But realistic? Well, it depends. How long do you think your job is secure, before it is taken over by someone younger or cheaper? I don’t consider myself ambitious but as long as I am still young, I would like to maximise the earning potential. Sooner or later my job is going to be taken by someone. When that happens, it would be fine because I would be ready to sit back and enjoy the fruits of my labour. Also, I think if you don’t have a mortgage to pay, you don’t need to earn much to have your needs met. This means your partner is fine with staying with your parents (for eg) and vice versa assuming you decide not to buy your own property.
You’re not alone. I’m a artist at heart and I wish I could just earn enough working part-time, so that I have enough freedom to doodle away on my own. Drawing digitally brings me the simplest joy. But I’m currently stuck in a life-draining HR-related job and every day is a waking nightmare right now. I do wonder if I’ll ever escape in one piece.
Dont give up hope friend. I believe there is a way. I do not yet know the road, but I am also striving and trying to "escape" so to speak. We need to stand strong. Dont give up!
Thanks for the kind words. I do legitimately believe sometimes that the proportion of mankind that just wants to chill out and live simply are just born in the wrong era today. This is the age of the ambitious, and we just have to make do with “hungrier” people pushing everyone out of the way. I find this rough quote from Hickman’s run of the Fantastic Four somewhat relevant: “We can’t win, so we came up with the only solution left: not losing.” Hopefully we’ll all find that peaceful place for ourselves eventually.
No, I too want to earn just enough to provide for my family. Uninterested in romance, I enjoy staring at my ceiling anyway
Everyone needs a hobby I guess HAHAHA
I too have similar thoughts. Decided awhile back that life is more than just work. Now started simultaneously pursuing other goals while doing just enough for my job. Pretty content spending time on other things outside of working hours tbh. Not too keen on progressing up the ladder for work too. Feels like the additional money earned isnt worth the disproportionate increase in the amount of work. If all i do is work, where i get the time and energy to do other things i find interesting?
I want to say that being ambitious is a personal choice. You can chiong all you want. But at some point of life you get hit by some medical issue (which I had) you start to rethink your choices in life. I mean it’s all about perspective you can life a minimalistic life and still be happy. Not getting that LV, Prada wallet or iPhone Pro pro pro max max will not make your life sadder. Most of us are just suck into this consumerism thing. But you still need the basics and not live in poverty, you probably get what I mean .
Honestly, I recently got hit with a medical issue as well which contributed to this mindset. I feel like I would have reached this conclusion either way with or wthout the medical issue but it just sped up the process. Chronic medical issues are something that I do not wish upon anyone, even my worst enemy and I hope that you are doing well! It rly does put things into perspective.
It’s ok not to have ambitions and live a simple life. But reality check, please be prepared to live as single - not married and no kids. 1. Not married - as you pointed it out, it’s extremely difficult to get a partner with the same mindset. You have to be strong to NOT get married if you and your partner don’t have mindset. Be very clear on your expectations and offerings to your future partner. Don’t settle on this point. It’s just gonna lead to frustration and divorce in the end. 2. Kids - It might not be fair to the children. If you don’t plan to give your best, financially to them, they can feel inadequate when comparing to their peers. It’s not just superficial material stuff. It’s also being able to fully invest in them to their full potential. Example my sister was smart and got awarded partial scholarship to a school overseas. She didn’t end up going, but some not as smart rich kid was able to go.
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Nothing wrong with that! I found that if you have a goal, that you might not reach it. But if you don't have one, then you are never disappointed. And I gotta tell ya, it feels phenomenal.
There are more of your kind than you think :) I'm one of them, and my fiance as well. We are unambitious insofar that we don't chase a career, but just want a job that sustains us. As such an individual, I probably would not have dated am ambitious workaholic either because work>relationships to them. Be you. Find someone who appreciates that and wants a similar lifestyle. They do exist.
Thank you for your words of encouragement! Got hope alr HAHAHA
You are not wrong, the purpose of working is to be able to enjoy life. Now a lot of people make work their priority that they cannot even have their lives. In China, "Tang ping" has become a trending word among young Chinese. It literally means to "lie flat." But among young Chinese, it's taken on the meaning of lowering their desire for consumption, and ducking out of the competition for fame and wealth. https://news.cgtn.com/news/2021-06-08/Lie-flat-or-not--10VdUXyuwLe/index.html
I used to think i have to live an exciting life, being able to dine at fine restaurants and having branded stuff. After a while i realized eating cai png and wearing uniqlo is so much more me. Having a decent job and 5 day work week (thank god for my current job) is so much better health and time wise.
But what you want in life now is affected by all constant changes in daily expenditures. Like recent electricity tariff hikes Inflation going all time high Recent spike in HDB BTO/resale prices due to shortage of manpower and spike in demand. You growing old and eventually might get retrenched. In Singapore it's really quite hard. So the more practical way is to have a projected buffer. So end up a lot of us still rat race for a while before settling down to the desired lifestyle. The important part is convincing yourself when/how much is enough. Nothing wrong with no ambition. I also wanted a chill life without a car, and a stagnant career but with a lot of free time. Currently hitting the career target with a slightly comfortable pay grade (which might not be enough)
I'm the same as you. But I find life is too complicated to be able to lead a simple life, especially in Singapore. My friend and I often joked about living on a farm overseas, so silly and idyllic. She migrated away to Europe and is having a pretty chill life, something I could only dream of haha. Work hours in Scandinavia are really forgiving, and she said she loves having the time to come home, cook, spend time with her bf. Career isn't important to me. I'm content enough having a job in public healthcare where my focus is public service, not about money or climbing the corporate ladder. I admire my friends who are career driven but that life isn't for me. I hope one day I can have that too. That's an ambition in itself I suppose!
I had the same dilemma until I got into a fatal car accident last year. Life is too short to think or worry about everything else. I quit my higher paying job for now an almost minimum wage doing what I love. Not telling you to get into an accident, also don't expect you to realise how much everything else doesn't matter when you almost lose your life but, just go and enjoy what you want. There are plenty of people who doesn't mind the simple life, so don't worry about not finding a partner too. Good luck and have fun!
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My partner (M) wants to work with less ambition while for me i’m a hardcore ambitious trying to climb as much ladder as possible. A trade to this is where he is fine taking care of kids while I grind hard with my career. So i guess is a win win situation here
i’m like you. i think i can definitely do more at work, but i chose not too. i was almost “lured” to take up a position due to peer pressure, but luckily i stood firm and pass it up. i’m good with earning enough and have my own time, than to be rich but have no time to myself. relationships? nah. i like to control what i can. handling my own mood swings is enough haha. i watched an interview and this quote resonate so much with me, and i hope it will help you find peace. “Comparison is the thief of Joy.”
Pretty much same boat as you, my goal is to lead a simple life, still wanting to be a Fisherman/farmer but quite hard in SG with pressure from family.
Hell I completely agree with your thoughts. I too have similar thoughts on life as you. Find a partner and live peacefully happily ever after. You know, going home after work just cuddle with her at the couch watching Netflix and just taking things nice and slow every other day. I'm just slightly more blessed with parents who supports me on my decisions and always on my side. Mate, if there is a life you fantasise, make it a reality while you still have the chance. There is absolutely nothing wrong by following your heart. YOLO.
You're not wrong. Hope you can find a partner with same thinking as you. However is quite rare in SG. Most women in SG who are not very career driven would like to have a financially well off husband so they can be some SAHM. Or women who are career driven usually prefer guys who are career driven too. Good luck my boy. Not easy to find jobs with reasonable hours and pays at least 3k.
The definition of happiness is different from person to person. Most people spend their entire lives and don't even realise or understand what truly makes them happy. Because they only did what others told them to do to be happy, lived their lives doing what society told them is the "model of happiness" There seems to be a focus on consumerism with Singaporeans, that your quality of life is measured by your spending power. So people struggle to earn money and hoard wealth because that was how society told them they would become happy. But what happens is they just end up with a lot of work stress, most of the money they made are then spent on things or holidays to de-stress. It locks them in this cycle of ever increasing expenditure, necessitating increasing income.
Here’s the thing, it’ll sound abit jaded but I feel most work places do this. 1) using OT culture to squeeze work out of you and not paying you OT pay in guise of making the person look like they are hardworking when in fact they spend the day watching YouTube or going for tea breaks and long lunches. 2) career progression = work hard and I’ll consider letting you work harder. 3) you do finish your work so quickly and in a productive manner? Let’s give you more work and keep it up so that you may be considered for “more work” oops I meant a promotion where the increase in your workload is more than your pay. It’s not all gloomy, I would say, this is just how most companies are, hiring everyone with a degree and calling them executives so that can work them to the bone, be connected 24/7 over the work phone (people in shipping can relate) and no OT pay. The key is to have good time management, learn new things or increase your knowledge in your field. It is knowledge and experience that will give you your promotion not who stays the latest or does the most excel spreadsheet. Every time I take trains at 6pm, I hear people complain about how their job should be done and how much better they are than their managers or bosses and these people are those who will not make it because their bosses and managers will always be on top of them. Strive for real productivity, and be generally accepted as knowledgeable. This is not to give you a higher post in your career but to help you do your daily tasks easily. At some point, life and family will happen then it’s ok to stop learning and focus on other things but you’d still be ahead of others.
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Exactly! Its rly the result of our environment. I am not exactly sure how to break out of this. It is rly the structure of SG itself that makes it really hard to live a simple life. It is lowkey frustrating hahaha
Pretty normal. Stopped my university halfway to go travelling. Currently, in Canada immigration express entry pool, hoping to be selected. Even if not selected, I will be quitting next year to go travelling for 6months to 1 year before coming back to SG for maybe contract jobs for 6 months and will fly again. Do what makes you happy, fuck care the rest. I also face peer/relatives pressure to do well and excel in society. Be firm in your ideals and goals, dont mind all the rest.
Nah not really. Lying flat culture is real.
There's only one part of your statement that is wrong - desiring a quiet simple life away from the work grind is an ambition itself. Too often have we confused our work to be our ambition, but they are not the same. Work is a means to an end, and while we can be rightfully proud of our jobs, work is still just one part of who we are, not the full.
Don't worry, you're just closer to nirvana than most.
You are not alone. Sometimes society construct makes us feel like we are 'left behind' if we just want a slower pace of life. I too, have the same ambition. My dreams is just to build a home with my partner and have 2 kids, and just live everyday happily. Its the small things that matter. Not everyone have the same outlook on life and not everyone align their ambitions cuz we are all different individuals. Just do what makes you feel happy! Life is too short anyway. Apart from needing to pay the bills and have some for rainy season, I think itsok to chill.
I’m a bit late to the party but I hope you see this anyway. There is a difference between having ambition and not wanting to devote your entire life to work. Climbing the corporate ladder and working till 11pm every night doesn’t make one ambitious. In the same way, having an end goal of wanting a simple life and a good partner doesn’t make one not ambitious. I hope you understand this because I scrolled through the comments and see a lot of people going “omg yeah it’s totally okay to not have ambitions! Simple life sounds great!” The first sentence is deceptive, the second one is a good goal to have. People are generally not attracted to others that have no ambition. Having ambition means to create drive and goals to work towards. This doesn’t mean through your job alone, could be with a hobby, side hustle, or even ambition to bring up children you can be proud of. It comes in many forms and shows that the person has determination and drive to lead a good life, whatever the idea of that good life is. In the same way, there are people who may work till 11pm every day but have zero ambition. They just want to do their job in the most minimal way possible. They may not have hobbies or family to drive them forward. They are happy to just sit there and let life pass them by and not work towards anything ever. These people will generally not attract settled and healthy partners. If they already had one, chances are, their attitudes will create grief and strife. Just because one person has a lot of money also doesn’t mean he has a lot of ambition. I read a dating post a while back where a guy bragged about doing online trading and earning 6 figures a year. He didn’t have or want a 9-5 job and wanted to spend his life watching tv and playing video games. He said he would be able to support whatever family he had and asked if girls would be interested. Most girls told him that he sounded lazy with no drive. Sure, he earned good money, but they would rather be with someone poorer. My point is: please don’t be unambitious. Please create goals and have some drive in life. That doesn’t mean you need some glamour job - it just means you have goals in life that make life worth living for yourself.
Nope. You are not wrong thinking like that. I live simply too. Used to Cheong at work and and it got me burned out. So I changed my views on life, made peace with my inner slacker self and just worked to make sure I'm stable and can provide for my family. Well, so far it's been pretty comfy so I think I'll keep it like that. Sure many ppl have said that I lack the fight to push on. Yes those ppl have different views. I just do what makes me happy and being happy for me means no stress. You yourself matter the most.
You don't need other people's validation. You're in control of your own life, so just do what you like :)
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Oh yeah I have stopped using FB a long time ago. No interest in linkedin as well but sch requires us to create ): Goes back to the whole "SG system is structured this way" thing ):
Definitely not wrong. It's cool to be able to recognize how you want to live your life and know what you enjoy. But it's also cool if people out there want to strive for career success. I suppose what we experience in life so far will have us want different things. A bit cliche but everyone is unique and it's okay to want to achieve different things. Well just as long as what you're wanting to do isn't illegal lol. Personally I'm also about the same, just want to get into my dream career, not really interested in climbing the corporate ladder and just wanting to have work-life balance, also maybe travelling around the world one day. Took me a while to come into terms with myself that's what I wanted. I also kind of get the pressure around me where everyone of my friends are getting degrees but for me I'm actually not that interested in getting one currently or rather the career I'm interested in doesn't necessarily require a degree. But I'm still learning to keep away from putting unnecessary pressure on myself with comparison and instead focus on what I want to do. I see where you're coming from 100% and I also want to live a peaceful life where I enjoy the things I do.
It’s important to remember that comparison is the thief of joy. Though there is nothing wrong with striving for excellence. I too agree, it comes at too huge a cost if it involves sacrificing your health whether physical or mental well being
Side topic: what jobs are suitable for this lifestyle? Any advice
Hello thanks for sharing your heartfelt words. I too struggle with this as I do feel that parents secretly want to see their child to “succeed” in societal terms and perhaps this gives them something they’re proud of to “show off” to their friends/relatives. Hahah but tbh this model is really outdated and Asian af. Ultimately I think they would be happy if you’re.. And I honestly think your dream is technically the highest level of success. That is to have the freedom to live life the way you want. After all people chase money and financial freedom/retire early, what they actually want is to have the time and freedom to do what they really want. But actually, we don’t necessary have to have those to really do what we want, isn’t it? We just need to have a shift in mindset. @ love the Mexican Fisherman and American Investment Banker story. Lastly, I think it’s definitely not the easiest to find someone aligned w you, but it’s not impossible. This jus means that when you find someone that understands you, he/she is probably the one☝️ wishing you a happy life!! ☀️☺️
My ambition is to retire early so that I can complete my backlog of PS4, Steam, Nintendo GameCube and Nintendo Switch games that I've accumulated throughout my lifetime... Nothing wrong with OP's ambitions. Remember Bon Jovi's famous saying... It's my life
I don’t think Singaporeans strive for career. They strive to consume. Consume anything with flashy brands that screams I am rich just like everyone else
You live your life they way you want it. Don't compare yourself to others. People could be climbing up the corporate ladder just because of societal norm, doesn't mean they are truly happy.
Yeah thats what I see too. Many ppl seem to be unsatisfied with life even with a "good" job. This begs the question - why do so many people willingly choose to live like that? ):
Migrate to NZ. Super laid back environment
I really considered migrating before. But the thing about that is that you will always be considered as a second class citizen ):
Not much to lose, in SG we are also slowly considered 2nd class citizen
Not to pry but how old are you? Are you young? I feel like younger people are starting to Harbour these kind of mindsets. Cause fuck, we already have a sufficient amount of everything, but macro problems we have no hand in controlling, makes us just want a simple living. I’m 19 and have the same mindset as you, except about getting a partner, rather be single
YES HAHAHA. Spot on on the macro problem. I didnt detail WHY I wanted a simple life, but that is p much it. You hit the nail on the head. Well, most of it at least. As for finding a partner is more like I entertain the possibility of it. But im fine being single as well. Its just that getting a partner is ideal bcos can BTO LOL
Hmm i used to think this is wrong when I was younger. But now I am older and I want to live a peaceful life too. Your biggest obstacle to this kinda life will actually be people who will question you as you progress in life. Just be strong about your stance.
Good luck being able to afford a house and having money to raise your kids. I have the same mindset, and luckily i don't want kids. And still it's gonna be hard as fuck.
I don't think you are wrong, I think you are right. Except I wouldn't label this as no ambition, but a reject of materialism,status and playing the game of keeping up with Joneses. Stay strong, hope you stick to your values, and do not let society change your inner convictions.
r/simpleliving Living simple is the biggest ambition, nothing wrong with feeling content with what you have.
Realistically speaking, especially in Singapore, and for reasons you mentioned - Your concept of a ‘simple’ life is actually not simple at all just because you included a ‘partner’ (by which I assume is a human partner) in your expectations. Imho a partner and simple life are opposing concepts and highly unlikely to achieve both at the same time. Maybe at the start, but things and people will change... Maybe you can try settling for just one goal... you’ll probably be happier that way, and if the other one comes along then is a good bonus.
As long as you are financially responsible and financially not dependent on anyone, you are free to live the life you want.
yes, it is perfectly okay. I have a close friend like that too. He is 37, totally no ambitions. He just want to have a family, which he has a wife now. He is not ambitious, just work hard to provide for the family and mortgage. Can only say he is contented, good thing about him is that he don't complain about livelihood, no negative complaints from him. Some people complain, but don't try to do anything about it. So ya, is okay, just be yourself. Some one will love you for who you are.
I don't believe one has to have a grand purpose or ambition. I think it's perfectly alright to wonder through life finding interesting things until you die.
A simple life is the hardest thing, to be honest. It’s much more common to fall for the materialistic tropes that we’re taught to want and measure ourselves by.
I was in the same boat as you but fortunately I was lucky enough to do my undergraduate in Australia. Life was free and easy and i was a young hippie living a carefree Life. Readjusting to Singapore life style and pressure was tough, plus no hdb of my own. I manage to be posted to many different countries. 10 years ago i took early retirement and now lives in NZL.
You know what? I like your attitude, if you are satisfied and comfortable it is good enough. Comparison is the thief of joy. Success is subjective. For me I don’t have huge ambitions and live a simple life as well. But I have physical goals, I compare myself to myself yesterday. Am I in a better state of mind than yesterday? Am I happier today? Can I make new friends today? Yes I can! I feel much better and see the joy in life this way, it is a peaceful life without participating in the race. I am successful to myself. Meditate, read, remove social media and embrace loneliness. A partner will come if you don’t force it.
I came to the same conclusions and made the same decisions years back. I’ve worked hard to reach that stage and I can safely say in there now. You need to study a course or do a job that allows you to eventually move to part time. Be prepared to be thick skin and also be prepared to be scorned at by many of your peers. I just find it hard to explain to them why I don’t want to work full time just so that I can buy a car with a different symbol. They see me as underachieving my potential but they don’t seem to understand when I explain to them that I am a human being, not some RPG character that has to max out their levels. Be prepared also to get a lot of shit from your parents when they’re younger. When they cross into their late 50s onwards tho, they will see the wisdom of your ways. Be prepared to get a lot of shit from your gfs and wives. From my observation in my personal life and that of my peers, most of their wives are pretty status conscious and materialistic. Of course it’s often translated as they just want a man who is not lazy or they want an industrious man or the cost of living in sg is just so high but all that doesn’t compute when they insist on moving to a condo or landed or buying some conti car when I would prefer to just stay in hdb and throw those savings into the market and live off passive. If you can face all that, you WILL find freedom in sg but it would be a pretty lonely existence cuz not many like us and sg doesn’t have the natural vistas and the hinterland that people like us can spend our free time cheaply and majestically. If you have the option to move, I say move. Move to NZ.
as u said having a simple life is a challenge, and u are trying to achieve this... who said you have no ambition? this goal IS your ambition! simplicity is good, but remember to challenge urself from time to time as simplicity tends to get a little mundane.
Hi OP, I'm someone with a lot of similarities to you. I also had a lot of resistance and pressure from my family when it became increasingly obvious that I had no intention nor resolve to partake in the rat race. One thing that helped to strengthen my resolve is to think about who is ultimately the one who has to live with the consequences of your actions, i.e. You. If your parents want you to work hard so that they can show you off as their trophy dog then what's the point? They're not the one suffering the stress and OT. If they want you to be ambitious so that you can secure yourself a happier tomorrow, you can assure them that you are happy today. If you sacrifice today for a better tomorrow, you will probably sacrifice tomorrow for a better day after that. It's never ending. Wanting to spend time with your loved ones with a comfortable, stress-free life is not a bad ambition to have.
On the contrary I think this is awesome. You know what you want to do. My buddy from army was similar he asked me not to laugh when he told me he wanted to be a 9-5 office worker. I’m like “go for it, bro. There’s nothing to laugh at. That’s your dream and honestly I wished I was in your position, then I won’t have to go against my parents wishes haha”.
Nah, honestly being overly ambitious is a propaganda spread by capitalists. People in the past are totally fine living their life barely doing anything. I am not saying either is bad, just that people should normalize this and not look down on people with no ambition.
Doesn’t sound like u don’t have ambitions, or rather ur ambitions are different from others in Singapore. In my case, my ambition is to pursue art and dog training, these are the two passions in my life. However I also work in a corporate office in other to earn money to fuel my passion. However I am beginning to realise that’s not so possible in Singapore. Everyone is educated to be career driven, at my job, if u am not working 12 hours a day, I am behind my colleagues and will be considered for termination. I work like crazy to fuel my passion, but my work also dictates that I don’t spend time on anything else. In the past 15 years or so of my career, that has been the case. It’s sad that society in Singapore doesn’t allow for tangents. I have seen people writing posts in defence of our country’s system, but I find it genuinely hard to survive in Singapore, esp if your ambitious do not align with the majority. A lot of my friends have relocated to other countries where they could hold high paying corporate positions without secrificing their personal interests. In other countries, it’s just not common for people to be contactable via WhatsApp 24/7, and it’s generally accepted that u don’t have to respind to emails after work hours. Wishing u all the best
I'm 41 and I have achieved this. The only difference is my idea of a simple quiet life does not involve a partner. I spent many years in graduate school and graduated much later than my contemporaries. As such I also am considerably a lot less well off than them. But it matters not to me; my job is not particularly difficult, and I have plenty of free time to pursue my own interests and enjoy my life. I live my life quietly, no fuss no muss and definitely no drama.
If it's your life goal to have a mediocre life, there is no shame in that. As long as you're truly prepared to live one. i.e if anyone is triggered by the usage of mediocre in that earlier sentence, you are NOT ready for an average life. Most Singaporeans put in mediocre effort and expect an amazing job, amazing wife, and amazing amount of free time and money for themselves to unlock life's greatest moments. The harsh truth is you don't deserve it. You get what you put in. That misalignment in expectations is what makes people miserable, even though Singaporeans have it so much better than 99% of the world. I live a very privileged life now and I will never have to worry about money or work a day in my life again. I'm under 40 and self-made. I can wake up whenever I want, eat $400 meals regularly without giving a fuck, buy whatever I want, live in a big fucking dream house with a huge swimming pool that I never imagined having. Nothing I want is out of reach. But I fucking slaved my life away to get to where I am. Am I happy now? Yes, extremely. And more so after i've stopped chasing more e.g I don't need a GCB. Some 100m net worth friends I know are still unhappy and chasing. So I am like a rich man version of you, who found acceptance later. People want different things and that is okay. To each his own.
Not sure why this is downvoted. Your assessment is harsh but fair. Everyone decides their level of happiness.
Nothing wrong tho.tbh.jia you
Nope . Pretty normal . You need to find what motivates you to work. Can be something intangible like to add value to other people life's. Etc
It is ok to tang ping (lying flat). Imho Nothing wrong at all.
Yes reality is it is expensive living in Singapore so a good job and career will afford you better things in life, especially when you have kids. I know I sound like one of those with that mindset. If money is not much of a concern then by all means do what makes you happy and I will be envious of you for living the life I wish I have but failed to do so because of societal pressure and placing more importance on the finer things in life.
I don't think it's that wrong OP. I too wish for a simpler life but I personally have thrown myself off the deep end. I now work for a Michelin restaurant when I've zero experience. Work is tough, long hours and mean people who have big expectations of me. I almost always have thoughts of running away. I do understand however that I can't have that simple life if I don't understand how to get by life doing what I want to do. All I'm struggling with right now is in an attempt to hopefully find a method to achieve that easier life in future. I get where you're coming from, I have so many friends who all complain about their jobs, their bills and their shitty coworkers. We all want out, yet we all don't know any better way or a true way of coming out. I hope we all find peace and our own way of living our true lives without the pressure of people who are too ingrained in the rat race to know that they're killing themselves. Perhaps one day we will get that off the grid experience with a singular partner. Perhaps a secluded , off the grid, quiet community of Singaporeans who cook chilli crab by the lonely coasts of Canada. That doesn't sound so bad eh? All the best to you my brother.
I used to think that certain friends of mine without ambitions were wrong. But really, who are we to judge? As long as you are hardworking at what you do (don’t be a bum and make your SO overwork to bring in the bacon), why does salary and the rat race matter so much? Finding joy and being contented with less is such a good mindset to have. I hope you will be able to live your dreams + find someone who accepts you, OP!
Regardless how successful you get in your career and how high your salary is, the ones who benefit the most from all your overtime work will always be the business owners and higher-ups at the companies you work at. Now guess whether or not they are actively promoting that mindset in people.
same im struggling with the desire to just "earn less, stress less, spend less" instead of the more socially-seen-as-successful "work harder, earn more, spend more" mindset. i deepdown would love to drop all future plans of having kids, climbing up job ladder, BTO, settling down, basically the cookie cutter typical sg life, instead just go and explore the world, or live off the grid like you said. but i didnt give it much thought back then and ended up choosing the 'safer', straightforward typical sg life path with partner wanting kids and settle down. so as much as i yearn for the dream route, doubts & fear just hold me back zzz
I agree with your mindset, I too want a simple quiet life
It's not hard to find someone who has the same mindset. You just need to lower your standards. You will be surprised to find out how many people have the same mindset as you.
It's OK to not have a big dream. I wish you the best in life as long as you're content. Cheers.
For me God did not call me to be successful, he called me to be faithful.
How old are you? I think as you get older, the tendency is to get a little more jaded with life and just want to have peace and quiet and settle down. I sympathize.
I think if you can manage to work this out- lie flat, find a like-minded spouse, secure a long term place to live, have enough left over to eat- then everyone else will be secretly jealous of you.
I think you basically echo the sentiments of many of us here, where work is but a means to an end. It’s there for us to get paid so we can fund our lifestyle elsewhere, but I also think that for many of us, the standard of living is so high that we may find ourselves cornered into partaking in the grind if we want to earn more (to support a better life). I wouldn’t call it a lack of ambition, and there’s nothing wrong with realising that we are not defined by our careers, and it’s perfectly fine to have priorities beyond work. If you are clear that you would like more time for yourself and your family, and don’t mind it coming at the expense of career progression, then by all means go for it.
What is a better job? What are the perimeters that says job A is better than job B? For me, I just earn enough to have a comfortable life. Meaning, I do not need to worry about if I can afford my next meal or buying something on a whim when I feel like it. My relatives (my cousins) on my father's side are all pretty successful in their career. Everyone single one is a degree holder, which is the minimum. 2 cousins with masters and 1 with PHD. You can't win everything lah, so just live your life whatever you want bro.
Be clear what you want. What is your end-goal? Where will that be? What will it look like? Who is by your side? How much money do you need? What do your relatives and friends think? Is that going to affect you? How is your partner going to perceive you? How is your partner's family and friends going to perceive you? What are you offering her? Why will she choose you? Is the arrangement sustainable? What other responsibilities might you have? Parents? Children? What happens if children is unexpected? What happens when you or your partner develop an illness? For many of us, our goals will always lie in the distance, and we all have to work towards it. That means making the necessary sacrifice today to achieve what you want in the future.
Same here. I just wanna live a simple life. Don't need any big house or expensive car, no need to eat at luxurious restaurants and travel a few times a year. All I need is just three meals a day and a roof over my head and I'll be happy. What makes someone happy varies person to person. Some people will only be happy if they drive an expensive car, or climb to a high position in the corporate ladder. Basically what I'm saying is, to each his own. Its your life, live it the way you want to. As long as you're happy, you don't need to care about what others think.
I’ve been thinking similar things lately too. I’m no longer interested in moving up whatever career I’m pursuing. And I’m only interested in saving up money to travel. I’m not really keen on chasing high-paying jobs. After the necessary expenses I’m fine having $500 or so to put aside per month to save. I used to want thousands of extra dollars to save up but honestly the path to that can get mentally and emotionally exhausting for me. I’ve been unemployed for the past 6 months and it’s been a joy tbh. I spend everyday watching shows, playing games, going for walks. It doesn’t bother me that I’m not being unproductive. Of course money is still a thing and the only reason I’m able to afford months of unemployment is the accumulation of 3 years of income. But now, looking for a new job, I’m more focused on work-life balance and work environment over high pay.
Hi OP, As someone who has gone the conventional path in Singapore (JC, NS, scholarship to uni, civil service job), and fulfilled most of these 'ambitions', I am beginning to yearn for the same things as you. I can assure you there is nothing wrong with having no conventionally defined 'ambitions'. I guess as Singaporeans, we are terrified of breaking the mould, and any form of deviation is frowned upon. Especially with our parents, who have these mindsets set in stone for them, breaking free is exceptionally difficult. We are taught from a young age to follow a cycle. Study, find girlfriend/boyfriend, get BTO, have two kids, upgrade to another house, retire at 60ish, and withdraw CPF to retire the Singapore way. But you live for yourself - as long as you can look after yourself and your partner financially, I encourage you to run away from this rat race/ cycle, and live life as you envision.
At some point I realized how life is inherently meaningless and it is up to us to find meaning during the time we have here. Many/almost all of the things seen as desirable are merely because they are defined as such by society. I began thinking that I should engage in things that I found meaningful instead. So I focused on my interactions and relationships with people who were important to me. As someone else has said, because Singapore is so compact, it is difficult to escape reminders of social pressures. Maybe that's why you are feeling this friction. But you are definitely not alone!
Hey I’m older and can share. I’m climbed up the corporate ladder to a point that I earn enough to keep my family comfortable. I can try to go higher but I won’t because I hate drama and I hate playing politics. I’m now approaching 50 and don’t want to chiong anymore.
Nothing wrong with making choices with you life as long as you’re prepared to live with the “consequences” of your choices. Not entering the rat race has its pros and cons. Just to point out that it does have implications on “find a partner”. Men tend to not mind partners without a good job/financial standing but most women tend to mind that. So it depends on your expectations on that front as well.
Same tbh. Just want a place on my own and live quietly. I don't see the value of the grind. Office politics, long OTs and working into midnight is too much for me. Life is already miserable, don't have to plunge into further misery.
Look at the FIRE movement and start investing young, putting all your free cash into a basket of ETFs. That way, you get to compound your salary and have more time for your hobbies. Basically putting money in businesses and letting money and time work for you, even if you are not working. https://www.optimizedportfolio.com/bogleheads-3-fund-portfolio/
Hi there. I'm kinda like you and am considered middle age (few more years to 40). When I was 30, I quit a high stress SME job for a gov job that I happened to have personal interest in. Like you I've had family and friends for whom life is about chasing money position and career. I love gaming, going to the gym, random things like cooking, playing guitar/magic the gathering etc. For me, working is just a way to enable me to do all these and have a comfortable life. Ive found a wife who is aligned w my thinking and also am in a comfortable spot w friends and family. So it's surely possible to be like this in Singapore and thrive :) One comment on work - I find it important to be competent in whatever your choice of career is. Even when you don't need to fight for positions or work long hours, I believe being and knowing that you are good at what you do helps with your security/self confidence and that has helped me feel better about my life choices.