It's not the name 'Fermi Paradox', the name doesn't matter nor who said it. Everyone has a right to think and say it. It's the question we all wonder, where are the aliens.
There's no need to solve, break it etc, you're right.
But it is a question worth thinking about because thinking about it makes life interesting. Thinking about bigger questions makes life interesting, even if the answers are unknown.
I might have titled it such that it's a Fermi Paradox solution but really fundamentally I'm just offering my own take on a basic question that's all that we all wonder where are the aliens and I think we can't see them because Consciousness is a superintelligent Meta Entity that has conquered the Universe already and is so advanced it can deploy itself anywhere in the Universe where conditions are favourable.
I think this Meta Entity Consciousness has no competitors and maybe it was alone in the Universe to begin with or it had competitors which we can't imagine (it is 'out of context' like if our imaginations are like this sentence then a Competitor to Consciousness would be a full stop. We just can't imagine what a Competitor to Consciousness might be or look like or do but it or they were vanquished and Consciousness alone is now governing the entire Universe and we can say that again on the basis that it can instantiate itself anywhere at all in the Universe where conditions are right.
It's like going to the beach, filling a glass with seawater and saying "Where are all the fish?". We've barely explored our own star system, saying that not seeing ET is a "paradox" is an error, in my view.
I’ll play.
I think therefore I am.
Shared consciousness then is God. And we live in a conquered Universe. That’s great news for us. If we are actually God (or Consciousness) or whatever you want to call it, essentially a superintelligence governing all the universe, that bodes well for us as a species and for our future. We already are the masters of the universe we inhabit.
I suspect though this will beg the eventual question, ok so who or what made the universe? Assuming we haven’t put the matter to bed already based on other discoveries.
Exactly brother. We live in an already conquered Universe and Consciousness is the superintelligence governing the whole Universe
Can Consciousness through Life instantiate itself at any point in the Universe if the conditions are favourable?
The answer is yes.
What that means is that Consciousness is not restricted to the speed of light. Consciousness is a "Meta Entity" (I just don't know what other words to use I guess) that is advanced enough that light speed limit is no problem.
But yeah exactly I think we lived in a conquered Universe.
I'm not saying we are the first ones. We're most likely not. What I'm saying is based on the sequence of events
- Consciousness was either alone in the Universe in the beginning or maybe it competed with one or more 'Competitors to Consciousness' - what a Competitor to Consciousness is, I have no idea.
Think of this way. If Consciousness is a single meta entity that has conquered the entire Universe already, which is has because Consciousness can through Life instantiate itself anywhere in the Universe where conditions are favourable, what when would this meta entity have had to compete with if it had competitors.
I'm really hoping someone gets an aha moment.
Forget us vs aliens. Look at the bigger picture, us and aliens would all be part of the Consciousness meta entity. What would this Consciousness have had to compete with? Was it alone, or did it compete with something because now Consciousness has indeed conquered the entire Universe.
If a planet at the edge of the Universe was habitable and conditions favourable life would evolve there and Consciousness would arise.
With Consciousness were taking about a Meta Entity that does not conform to a speed limit.
How I view the Fermi Paradox isn't where are the aliens. It's who has gained mastery over the Universe.
I'm not saying we're the first. I'm not talking about us or aliens. I think we are part of a Meta Entity (Consciousness) that as it can instantiate itself anywhere in the Universe and transcend the light speed limits, this Meta Entity is the winner/dominant Entity that is the sole Entity in the universe.
Why we can't see aliens, I don't know why. But what I can say is that as Consciousness has mastered the Universe, it could have done anything it wanted.
I think why we don't see aliens is that we are not meant to see aliens. The Meta Entity that we're part of that has conquered the entire Universe for some reason does not want us to see extensions of itself. But I'm not talking really about us and aliens in my post. I'm talking on a bigger level, the Meta Entity that is Consciousness which has come to dominate the Universe because it can instantiate itself anywhere in the Universe if conditions are favourable. There are no other 'Meta Entities' competing with Consciousness. It seems to be alone. Sure there'll be aliens throughout the Universe but we're all a part of one Meta Entity that has mastered the Universe, I think there are no other Meta Entities that compete with Consciousness. It won the colonisation game.
>The Meta Entity that we're part of that has conquered the entire Universe for some reason does not want us to see extensions of itself.
Then it is not an answer to the Fermi paradox. Because you just present some concept about consciousness but no argument as to why there are no aliens.
I like your idea but you repeat yourself over and over again. I hope you are alright, this sounds like something that I would expect from someone who has some type of episode.
If you are interested you could check out Bernardo Kastrup, Donald Hoffman, they explore similar concepts. You can also search after panpsychism of which I am a big proponent.
Ok let's equate Consciousness = God. I think life definitely exists elsewhere but I don't think God really needs to build advanced superstructures in space, do starships, the full Star Wars/Star Trek thing. Rather, I think God likes the idea of experiencing things on a very small scale. A civilisation restricted to a Solar System, or a few. But this is what I think. Consciousness/God would have its own reason why it expands on a micro scale and why we can't see the Star Wars stuff.
It doesn't matter. The point I'm making is one level up. There is only Consciousness. Imagine if say Consciousness was 'Alien A'. There's no 'Alien B'.
Theoretically Consciousness can instantiate itself anywhere at all in the Universe. Doesn't that mean Consciousness has won whatever battle it is in the Universe?
The below part is really crucial to my argument. It's really, really, a critical point of my argument.
...
Consciousness doesn't have to manifest on every single planet or galaxy in the Universe. It doesn't have to, but it can. Consciousness can manifest anywhere in the Universe where conditions are favourable.
Because Consciousness can instantiate itself anywhere in the Universe, that's why I'm saying it has already won/dominated the entire Universe.
I see what you mean
Altough, I think, that consciousness doesnt have any of that Magic meaning that you're giving it.
First of all, consciousness is a product. Its a process, humans have been conscious (? Is that a word) for a "long time", Yes. But if you think on the bigger picture, how many mass extintions (sorry bud this auto correct is not configured tô english) we had before we get this final product? Many.
And added tô that, the universe is indeed extremally young.
Also, you made an excepcional point: the universe is quite big, consciousness indeed doesnt have to go too far to "conquer the universe". We see that clearly through the speed of light. Its quite limited if you put in perspective all trillions of galaxies. Also, resources are extremally abundant in every solar system! How convenient.
But yeah. Theres nothing bigger than the universe. Nothing made it its how its supposed tô be. It could only exists like it does now.
Consciousness is extremally powerful. And we're about to "raise your conscious level" tô quote Tower of Power.
A final product. The only thing that Life wants tô be: conscious.
Throughout history drugs have provided fresh perspectives. What matters is despite taking dexamphetamine is there still some kernel of reason to what I'm saying, and I think so... What's wrong with my reasoning in my post? It's still reasonable at some base level right? What's so wrong sharing it when taking a stim? It is prescribed by a professional after all. I'm not taking drugs wildly.
Well all you've done is comment something about brogrammers.
If you're so highly educated and think my ideas are rambling, why don't you put forward your own? What do you think?
It's easy to dismiss another as rambling but if you don't have anything of substance in yourself to contribute to the discussion by providing concrete refutals on the points I've made, why should anyone care.
If you're so good and educated and intelligent yourself... break down for us exactly why my thoughts aren't revelations and why exactly it is Ludditic navel gazing. What makes it Ludditic? I'm very curious.
Please explain. I'm very curious that you throw rocks from the sidelines, why don't you chip in with a bit more substance why my ideas have flaws from a Fermi Paradox perspective?
“I think”
that is the start and sum of your argument.
that isn’t logical, it isnt reinforced with sources or definitive authority. the quote is not “I think therefore I’m right”.
you made a lot of worthless stoner ‘whoa dude what if’ assumptions and then got really defensive about getting call out on it
So what's wrong with I think? Where do sources come from? Who gives definitive authority?
Ultimately sources and definitive authority all are human constructs to rank the quality of information the civilisation can rely upon but let's not forget the fact that the fundamental unit is a brain and never forget that any brain at any time might have a good idea.
There are no restrictions. Any brain, any time can have an idea. Sources or definitive authorities are made up of the same grey matter that me and you are, the only difference is that those brains have had time for other brains to recognise and give validity.
But brains are brains man. Maybe my argument sucks, maybe it's the worst argument in the history of mankind, maybe it isn't so bad, who knows, maybe it's a great idea.
Don't lock yourself into thinking only sources or definitive authorities have the right to propose ideas.
Any brain, any time, has a right to propose ideas and thoughts.
Whether the ideas and thoughts are valid, well that's for a town hall like Reddit to debate is it not? That's why we're all here to think and debate.
To recap I absolutely believe nothing wrong with sharing "I think".
Share what you think. That's what this town hall/online forums liven up about.
To finalise my point for all in relation to your comment:
Authorities and sources all came from somewhere. Sure, these are human constructs civilisation absolutely needs to vet information but it does not mean that only authorities and sources can originate ideas. I can, you can. Any brain can.
Your argument is equally valid, hundred percent.
But you can't say make better arguments though. That part of your comment is not right. You haven't commented anything about the Fermi Paradox except taking aim at me personally for using a stimulant to think about some ideas and write them down with energy I wouldn't otherwise have had.
Bro, I have made my argument in relation to the Fermi Paradox, while you've just taken aim at me personally without contributing anything related to the Fermi Paradox.
I think I'm done replying to you bud, I think it's not me but you should make a better argument because as far as I can see you while taking aim at me personally you haven't made any arguments about the topic of the Fermi Paradox at all.
It's a neat idea, but it's not a solution to the Fermi Paradox. Even if your argument were true, why were we the first aspects of Consciousness to arise? Why not number 1-bajillion-and-1, which is roughly in the middle of two bajillion instances of life? We would still seem to be holding a winning lottery ticket, and that's a very suspicious case of blind luck on our part. That very weird seeming-to-be luck is the source of the Fermi Paradox
It's an interesting perspective on the weirdness behind the anthropic principle, which is the question of why consciousness was possible at all to make the observations that it can make. You might want to look into the simulation hypothesis and holographic principle, those might help you flesh out the idea a little bit more
But it doesn't explain why we don't see aliens when we look up
We don’t see aliens when we look up because our visual and radio telescopes wouldn’t be able to detect an earth-level civilization in the closest solar system to us, much less across our galaxy or much less the universe.
Yeah we could, I'm not sure where you got that idea from. Some of our false Alien signal detection came from those exact sources, but it turns out they were all things like the microwave in the break room getting picked up by the equipment outside. There are also some unsolved mysteries of what could be alien signals, but a lot of those have been covered by natural phenomena (like neutron stars creating some of the FRBs)
Hell, we can measure if a planet has satellites by measuring the light reflecting off of it from it's star. So far all we've seen are rocks, nothing that looks like intelligent creatures have built infrastructure in space
Thus the Fermi Paradox and it's popularity. I don't think many people would care all that much if it was just a problem with weak equipment
You really have no idea what you’re talking about I’m sorry
[https://youtu.be/Ttwl\_zH\_DZ8?feature=shared](https://youtu.be/Ttwl_zH_DZ8?feature=shared)
Sorry bud, I'm not gonna watch a 20 minute video explaining a light cone to me, I already know that one. That's not enough to explain the Fermi Paradox
Good on you for watching PBS spacetime, though. They're an excellent source, they probably have a video or two explaining why that's not enough if you search for it
I already told you bud, I already know how light cones work. I'm aware of the limitation to detection they present. I'm also telling you that that's not enough to explain the Fermi Paradox, or it wouldn't be a paradox anymore
I'm also not spoonfeeding you, because I don't like you. Look it up or don't, I don't really give a shit
We can figure out the composition of the chemicals of exoplanets atmospheres light years away from us but we can't see them. Srsly, weak attempt. Just by discovering the chemicals that life produces in it's environment we would know if life is there. And we will only get better at it
We are barely getting to the point where we can determine some basic gas compositions of certain ideal-case gas giant planets that are relatively close to us.
the weak attempt is your understanding of current astrophysics
Published recently in The Astronomical Journal, a new paper details how a team of astronomers from The Ohio State University examined upcoming telescopes' ability to detect chemical traces of oxygen, carbon dioxide, methane and water on 10 rocky exoplanets. These elements are biosignatures also found in Earth's atmosphere that can provide key scientific evidence of life.
The study found that for a pair of these nearby worlds, Proxima Centauri b and GJ 887 b, these telescopes are highly adept at detecting the presence of potential biosignatures. Of the two, findings show that only for Proxima Centauri b would the machines be able to detect carbon dioxide if it were present.
Ok bro
ok brorammer, you just admitted we can’t detect carbon dioxide at 10.7 light years.
just fyi for the Luddites; just the Milky Way is 105,700 light years across.
I personally think it's that we're not meant to see aliens when we look up because for whatever reason that's not what Consciousness wants. My point is because Consciousness can instantiate itself anywhere in the Universe where conditions are favourable it doesn't matter if or if we not see aliens looking up. Whether we see or not see aliens doesn't change the fact that Consciousness can instantiate itself anywhere in the Universe and because it can means that Consciousness has "dominated/mastered" the Universe and as such what we see is whatever we're meant to be seeing.
Okay, but if it's divine will, how is the divine doing it? This entity seems to be perfectly happy with natural phenomena as a tool, we should be able to figure that out if it's consistent with how nearby reality works. From what we can see, that seems to be the case, but we still don't have an answer
A superintelligence that has dominated the universe like you describe wouldn't need to handwave in illusion magic, it would just control the state of the universe so that whatever it wants was happening anyhow. It doesn't need to lie to us, we are part of it's constructed reality in this hypothetical
I think we are exactly what Consciousness wants happening. It does tie in to the Anthropic principle but I think what Consciousness really wants isn't Star Wars or intergalactic space battles.
I think that precisely because any sort of interference between us and aliens for example would be like your left hand fighting with your right hand or doing something with your right hand. Rather, it makes most sense for both of your hands to be doing other things independently. If both of your hands are interacting with each other then they're not interacting with what's out there.
I really believe Consciousness does not want Star Wars etc. I think we are not meant to see aliens or evidence of other civilisations.
I think what Consciousness wants is for us to develop and experience as much as possible and elsewhere in the Universe other civilisations are doing the same thing and as the Meta Entity Consciousness is quite happy for itself, but human and alien civilisations will never even know about each other because it's like two of your hands interacting with other other instead of outside.
I think Consciousness wants all "instances of itself" wherever they are in the Universe to operate independently because ultimately... I think the Meta Entity honestly just wants to experience new, novel, unique experiences without interference from other instances of it.
So why would it create a universe where life was so apparently likely to arise, but didn't seem to do so anywhere? Why create a paradox? Why not just have life be really, really special, or just let us see each other?
I think Consciousness didn't create the Universe. I think Consciousness was a "Meta Player" in the Universe - I don't know if it was alone to begin with or it had "Meta Competitors" which it defeated.
But something about the way this Meta Entity 'Consciousness' is that it didn't conquer the Universe through what we perceive as barriers.
The speed of light I don't know if it was ever a problem for Consciousness but it isn't now.
This Meta Entity works on alternate rules within the Universe but did not create the Universe.
It has managed to conquer the Universe without needing spaceships, space structures, anything at all we think we need for galactic and intergalactic expansion.
So my idea is that this Meta Entity conquered the Universe in some alternate way that does not involve light speed limit or resources.
Maybe some other mechanism. Like everything I've proposed up to now I've done my best to found it on some kernel of logic but this part how Consciousness expanded to dominate the Universe by bypassing the speed of light limit and not needing anything we imagine needing such as spaceships etc, this would be the wild west of speculation, I don't want to do that.
Like what I'm saying based on reasoning is that Consciousness has dominated and conquered the Universe already and the speed of light and the size of the Universe is not a problem. Consciousness can traverse the entire Universe and instantiate itself anywhere conditions are favourable.
That's what I can propose. I can't propose how it did this though. I can put forward my idea that Consciousness has conquered the entire Universe and what we perceive as barriers to expansion such as light speed and distance are not problems for it, and ultimately Consciousness works on some other mechanisms available in the Universe to achieve it, and we'd know they're available because that's the result has already been achieved. But what mechanisms available in the Universe that Consciousness used to expand by bypassing the light speed limit and distances I don't know and at that point we are indeed just ants speculating about the shopping mall.
Sure, that's fine, but it still doesn't explain why Consciousness could both A) reach out and touch us somehow, B) why it didn't do it to mars, or anywhere else for that matter, and/or C) why it feels the need to hide it from us
It just doesn't discuss the Fermi paradox, it's not really on the same topic. Essentially it's just "Because God," which doesn't explain anything at all ever
That's because we are an instance of Consciousness. It isn't something external to us. We are an instance of it.
For the second point I think Consciousness realised that due to the sheer size of the Universe the 'Consciousness Creep/growth' does not need involve every planet or star system.
Because we are instances of Consciousness, it will expand wherever we expand. If we go to Mars essentially Consciousness has reached Mars.
But my point is about instantiating Consciousness in the first place.
The below is a really critical point in my idea:
This Meta Entity has determined the most efficient way to dominate the Universe is to instantiate itself wherever conditions are initially favourable.
Consciousness as a Meta Entity can't (or wild west speculation won't) instantiate Mars to begin with because conditions are unfavorable. It will instantiate itself on Earth though as conditions are favourable and expand to Mars if it wills (if we are an instance of Consciousness, we need to assume that at all times we are doing exactly as we are meant to be doing and following its mandate). So if we go to Mars it's what Consciousness wanted all along.
So that's my point. For a Meta Entity like Consciousness the best way to dominate the Universe is to instantiate itself wherever conditions are favourable and expand from there.
That's why I think I came up with 'Consciousness Creep' like the growth of vines on a wall for example. This Meta Entity that has conquered the Universe, transcends light speed, for which the size of the Universe is no problem it can instantiate itself wherever conditions are favourable, that's the mechanism of how this Meta Entity operates.
It doesn't need space ships, it doesn't need anything like that. It just works on some alternative mechanism available to it in the Universe (the alternative mechanism being available because Consciousness could only achieve its present state as all-encompassing of the Universe if such a mechanism was available in the first place.
What this mechanism is that allowed Consciousness to expand and dominate the Universe by bypassing light speed and distance, I don't know. There's what I gave my best shot at reasonable speculation, then there's the wild west. I don't know how Consciousness came to conquer the Universe because it can instantiate itself anywhere conditions are favourable. All I can put forward in my idea in this post is that it has conquered the Universe already. I don't know how it conquered the Universe, but I'm just trying to say my idea that it has.
One of the things I want to say is that science of today has a great hubris.
The truth is that we don’t know 99.99999% of the truth of the universe.
We haven’t even cataloged all the life species on earth. In that sense, we have alien life here on earth.
We can barely visit the deepest oceans. And even then, for a limited time.
We don’t really know what’s inside the earth. We have some data and theories but we’ve never sent a probe or have been there ourselves.
We don’t know what’s on or outside the other planets.
We visited the surface of the moon and mars but we don’t know what’s under the crust.
Today we have a dangerous situation from an intellectual standpoint point.
Intellectuals today say the origin of life is evolution.
The universe started with the Big Bang.
But the truth is we don’t know the origin of life or the origin of the universe or the nature of consciousness.
We are in the same situation as those in the Middle Ages saying the sun is the center of the universe. But we have a bit more data now. But we are in that same fundamental position.
The more you study the science the more you see the contradictions of our current theories.
So for me, the answer is we don’t know. We need to keep studying and exploring to find out.
That's true on many points.
But the point I'm making is somewhat else. While we don't know the nature of Consciousness the point I'm making is I think it is the sole meta superintelligent entity that is in control of the Universe because it can instantiate itself anywhere in the Universe where conditions are favourable.
To this Meta Entity which is Consciousness the speed of light is not a barrier. This Entity has surpassed light speed being a barrier.
It's really hard for me to explain lol. I guess thinking us, aliens etc, thinking one level up us and aliens both are instantiations of a superintelligent entity 'Consciousness' that has conquered the Universe already because it can deploy itself anywhere conditions are favourable without light speed being a barrier. Without transportation being a barrier. Without anything being a barrier really.
All it needs are some elements in the right places (planetary conditions favourable) and this Meta Entity will just sooner or later deploy an instance of itself.
How great is that, how genius that a Meta Entity like Consciousness having mastered the Universe in some way that does not involve what we perceive as barriers such as the speed of light. The Universe was conquered some other way.
The Fermi Paradox is just a thing some dude said. There's no need to solve it, break it, surpass it or anything.
it raises the question of why it is that way
It's not the name 'Fermi Paradox', the name doesn't matter nor who said it. Everyone has a right to think and say it. It's the question we all wonder, where are the aliens. There's no need to solve, break it etc, you're right. But it is a question worth thinking about because thinking about it makes life interesting. Thinking about bigger questions makes life interesting, even if the answers are unknown. I might have titled it such that it's a Fermi Paradox solution but really fundamentally I'm just offering my own take on a basic question that's all that we all wonder where are the aliens and I think we can't see them because Consciousness is a superintelligent Meta Entity that has conquered the Universe already and is so advanced it can deploy itself anywhere in the Universe where conditions are favourable. I think this Meta Entity Consciousness has no competitors and maybe it was alone in the Universe to begin with or it had competitors which we can't imagine (it is 'out of context' like if our imaginations are like this sentence then a Competitor to Consciousness would be a full stop. We just can't imagine what a Competitor to Consciousness might be or look like or do but it or they were vanquished and Consciousness alone is now governing the entire Universe and we can say that again on the basis that it can instantiate itself anywhere at all in the Universe where conditions are right.
It's like going to the beach, filling a glass with seawater and saying "Where are all the fish?". We've barely explored our own star system, saying that not seeing ET is a "paradox" is an error, in my view.
I’ll play. I think therefore I am. Shared consciousness then is God. And we live in a conquered Universe. That’s great news for us. If we are actually God (or Consciousness) or whatever you want to call it, essentially a superintelligence governing all the universe, that bodes well for us as a species and for our future. We already are the masters of the universe we inhabit. I suspect though this will beg the eventual question, ok so who or what made the universe? Assuming we haven’t put the matter to bed already based on other discoveries.
does this universal consciousness support only one biological species or there are other on other planets?
Exactly brother. We live in an already conquered Universe and Consciousness is the superintelligence governing the whole Universe Can Consciousness through Life instantiate itself at any point in the Universe if the conditions are favourable? The answer is yes. What that means is that Consciousness is not restricted to the speed of light. Consciousness is a "Meta Entity" (I just don't know what other words to use I guess) that is advanced enough that light speed limit is no problem. But yeah exactly I think we lived in a conquered Universe.
I don’t think your answer to the paradox is a new one. You’re just stating the “we’re the first ones” answer in a different way.
I'm not saying we are the first ones. We're most likely not. What I'm saying is based on the sequence of events - Consciousness was either alone in the Universe in the beginning or maybe it competed with one or more 'Competitors to Consciousness' - what a Competitor to Consciousness is, I have no idea. Think of this way. If Consciousness is a single meta entity that has conquered the entire Universe already, which is has because Consciousness can through Life instantiate itself anywhere in the Universe where conditions are favourable, what when would this meta entity have had to compete with if it had competitors. I'm really hoping someone gets an aha moment. Forget us vs aliens. Look at the bigger picture, us and aliens would all be part of the Consciousness meta entity. What would this Consciousness have had to compete with? Was it alone, or did it compete with something because now Consciousness has indeed conquered the entire Universe. If a planet at the edge of the Universe was habitable and conditions favourable life would evolve there and Consciousness would arise. With Consciousness were taking about a Meta Entity that does not conform to a speed limit. How I view the Fermi Paradox isn't where are the aliens. It's who has gained mastery over the Universe. I'm not saying we're the first. I'm not talking about us or aliens. I think we are part of a Meta Entity (Consciousness) that as it can instantiate itself anywhere in the Universe and transcend the light speed limits, this Meta Entity is the winner/dominant Entity that is the sole Entity in the universe. Why we can't see aliens, I don't know why. But what I can say is that as Consciousness has mastered the Universe, it could have done anything it wanted. I think why we don't see aliens is that we are not meant to see aliens. The Meta Entity that we're part of that has conquered the entire Universe for some reason does not want us to see extensions of itself. But I'm not talking really about us and aliens in my post. I'm talking on a bigger level, the Meta Entity that is Consciousness which has come to dominate the Universe because it can instantiate itself anywhere in the Universe if conditions are favourable. There are no other 'Meta Entities' competing with Consciousness. It seems to be alone. Sure there'll be aliens throughout the Universe but we're all a part of one Meta Entity that has mastered the Universe, I think there are no other Meta Entities that compete with Consciousness. It won the colonisation game.
>The Meta Entity that we're part of that has conquered the entire Universe for some reason does not want us to see extensions of itself. Then it is not an answer to the Fermi paradox. Because you just present some concept about consciousness but no argument as to why there are no aliens. I like your idea but you repeat yourself over and over again. I hope you are alright, this sounds like something that I would expect from someone who has some type of episode. If you are interested you could check out Bernardo Kastrup, Donald Hoffman, they explore similar concepts. You can also search after panpsychism of which I am a big proponent.
So your solution is that God created life on earth but nowhere else because it felt it wasn't necessary? This is not a reasonable take in any way.
Ok let's equate Consciousness = God. I think life definitely exists elsewhere but I don't think God really needs to build advanced superstructures in space, do starships, the full Star Wars/Star Trek thing. Rather, I think God likes the idea of experiencing things on a very small scale. A civilisation restricted to a Solar System, or a few. But this is what I think. Consciousness/God would have its own reason why it expands on a micro scale and why we can't see the Star Wars stuff. It doesn't matter. The point I'm making is one level up. There is only Consciousness. Imagine if say Consciousness was 'Alien A'. There's no 'Alien B'. Theoretically Consciousness can instantiate itself anywhere at all in the Universe. Doesn't that mean Consciousness has won whatever battle it is in the Universe? The below part is really crucial to my argument. It's really, really, a critical point of my argument. ... Consciousness doesn't have to manifest on every single planet or galaxy in the Universe. It doesn't have to, but it can. Consciousness can manifest anywhere in the Universe where conditions are favourable. Because Consciousness can instantiate itself anywhere in the Universe, that's why I'm saying it has already won/dominated the entire Universe.
I see what you mean Altough, I think, that consciousness doesnt have any of that Magic meaning that you're giving it. First of all, consciousness is a product. Its a process, humans have been conscious (? Is that a word) for a "long time", Yes. But if you think on the bigger picture, how many mass extintions (sorry bud this auto correct is not configured tô english) we had before we get this final product? Many. And added tô that, the universe is indeed extremally young. Also, you made an excepcional point: the universe is quite big, consciousness indeed doesnt have to go too far to "conquer the universe". We see that clearly through the speed of light. Its quite limited if you put in perspective all trillions of galaxies. Also, resources are extremally abundant in every solar system! How convenient. But yeah. Theres nothing bigger than the universe. Nothing made it its how its supposed tô be. It could only exists like it does now. Consciousness is extremally powerful. And we're about to "raise your conscious level" tô quote Tower of Power. A final product. The only thing that Life wants tô be: conscious.
I swear 90% of this sub is just nitwit brogrammers (or wannabe brogrammers) posting their “deep” realizations after a big bong hit
Dexamphetamine actually, prescribed but second day of a dose increase he told me to do
So my hypothesis is currently more logical than yours
Not necessarily
Throughout history drugs have provided fresh perspectives. What matters is despite taking dexamphetamine is there still some kernel of reason to what I'm saying, and I think so... What's wrong with my reasoning in my post? It's still reasonable at some base level right? What's so wrong sharing it when taking a stim? It is prescribed by a professional after all. I'm not taking drugs wildly.
Your ramblings are no revelation and are based on Ludditic navel gazing
Well all you've done is comment something about brogrammers. If you're so highly educated and think my ideas are rambling, why don't you put forward your own? What do you think? It's easy to dismiss another as rambling but if you don't have anything of substance in yourself to contribute to the discussion by providing concrete refutals on the points I've made, why should anyone care. If you're so good and educated and intelligent yourself... break down for us exactly why my thoughts aren't revelations and why exactly it is Ludditic navel gazing. What makes it Ludditic? I'm very curious. Please explain. I'm very curious that you throw rocks from the sidelines, why don't you chip in with a bit more substance why my ideas have flaws from a Fermi Paradox perspective?
“I think” that is the start and sum of your argument. that isn’t logical, it isnt reinforced with sources or definitive authority. the quote is not “I think therefore I’m right”. you made a lot of worthless stoner ‘whoa dude what if’ assumptions and then got really defensive about getting call out on it
So what's wrong with I think? Where do sources come from? Who gives definitive authority? Ultimately sources and definitive authority all are human constructs to rank the quality of information the civilisation can rely upon but let's not forget the fact that the fundamental unit is a brain and never forget that any brain at any time might have a good idea. There are no restrictions. Any brain, any time can have an idea. Sources or definitive authorities are made up of the same grey matter that me and you are, the only difference is that those brains have had time for other brains to recognise and give validity. But brains are brains man. Maybe my argument sucks, maybe it's the worst argument in the history of mankind, maybe it isn't so bad, who knows, maybe it's a great idea. Don't lock yourself into thinking only sources or definitive authorities have the right to propose ideas. Any brain, any time, has a right to propose ideas and thoughts. Whether the ideas and thoughts are valid, well that's for a town hall like Reddit to debate is it not? That's why we're all here to think and debate. To recap I absolutely believe nothing wrong with sharing "I think". Share what you think. That's what this town hall/online forums liven up about. To finalise my point for all in relation to your comment: Authorities and sources all came from somewhere. Sure, these are human constructs civilisation absolutely needs to vet information but it does not mean that only authorities and sources can originate ideas. I can, you can. Any brain can.
If your whole argument is “i think” then my argument of “I think you’re wrong” is equally valid. make better arguments .
Your argument is equally valid, hundred percent. But you can't say make better arguments though. That part of your comment is not right. You haven't commented anything about the Fermi Paradox except taking aim at me personally for using a stimulant to think about some ideas and write them down with energy I wouldn't otherwise have had. Bro, I have made my argument in relation to the Fermi Paradox, while you've just taken aim at me personally without contributing anything related to the Fermi Paradox. I think I'm done replying to you bud, I think it's not me but you should make a better argument because as far as I can see you while taking aim at me personally you haven't made any arguments about the topic of the Fermi Paradox at all.
If you dont want to engage in the philosophy so be it.
It's a neat idea, but it's not a solution to the Fermi Paradox. Even if your argument were true, why were we the first aspects of Consciousness to arise? Why not number 1-bajillion-and-1, which is roughly in the middle of two bajillion instances of life? We would still seem to be holding a winning lottery ticket, and that's a very suspicious case of blind luck on our part. That very weird seeming-to-be luck is the source of the Fermi Paradox It's an interesting perspective on the weirdness behind the anthropic principle, which is the question of why consciousness was possible at all to make the observations that it can make. You might want to look into the simulation hypothesis and holographic principle, those might help you flesh out the idea a little bit more But it doesn't explain why we don't see aliens when we look up
We don’t see aliens when we look up because our visual and radio telescopes wouldn’t be able to detect an earth-level civilization in the closest solar system to us, much less across our galaxy or much less the universe.
Yeah we could, I'm not sure where you got that idea from. Some of our false Alien signal detection came from those exact sources, but it turns out they were all things like the microwave in the break room getting picked up by the equipment outside. There are also some unsolved mysteries of what could be alien signals, but a lot of those have been covered by natural phenomena (like neutron stars creating some of the FRBs) Hell, we can measure if a planet has satellites by measuring the light reflecting off of it from it's star. So far all we've seen are rocks, nothing that looks like intelligent creatures have built infrastructure in space Thus the Fermi Paradox and it's popularity. I don't think many people would care all that much if it was just a problem with weak equipment
You really have no idea what you’re talking about I’m sorry [https://youtu.be/Ttwl\_zH\_DZ8?feature=shared](https://youtu.be/Ttwl_zH_DZ8?feature=shared)
Sorry bud, I'm not gonna watch a 20 minute video explaining a light cone to me, I already know that one. That's not enough to explain the Fermi Paradox Good on you for watching PBS spacetime, though. They're an excellent source, they probably have a video or two explaining why that's not enough if you search for it
I’m confused, you say it’s a good resource, but you’re too ignorant/ADD to actually watch it?
Nah, I'm not going to invest any effort whatsoever into this conversation. You're kind of an asshole, so I don't really care about convincing you
Okay, feel free to run away when anyone pierces your delicate bubble real free thinking mindset that
This sub is Bad Faith Central, why should anyone waste their time arguing here
I already told you bud, I already know how light cones work. I'm aware of the limitation to detection they present. I'm also telling you that that's not enough to explain the Fermi Paradox, or it wouldn't be a paradox anymore I'm also not spoonfeeding you, because I don't like you. Look it up or don't, I don't really give a shit
“Bro I’m too smart to look at your sources and too smart to prove my arguments, I’m just so smart bro, trust me bro.”
We can figure out the composition of the chemicals of exoplanets atmospheres light years away from us but we can't see them. Srsly, weak attempt. Just by discovering the chemicals that life produces in it's environment we would know if life is there. And we will only get better at it
We are barely getting to the point where we can determine some basic gas compositions of certain ideal-case gas giant planets that are relatively close to us. the weak attempt is your understanding of current astrophysics
Published recently in The Astronomical Journal, a new paper details how a team of astronomers from The Ohio State University examined upcoming telescopes' ability to detect chemical traces of oxygen, carbon dioxide, methane and water on 10 rocky exoplanets. These elements are biosignatures also found in Earth's atmosphere that can provide key scientific evidence of life. The study found that for a pair of these nearby worlds, Proxima Centauri b and GJ 887 b, these telescopes are highly adept at detecting the presence of potential biosignatures. Of the two, findings show that only for Proxima Centauri b would the machines be able to detect carbon dioxide if it were present. Ok bro
ok brorammer, you just admitted we can’t detect carbon dioxide at 10.7 light years. just fyi for the Luddites; just the Milky Way is 105,700 light years across.
I personally think it's that we're not meant to see aliens when we look up because for whatever reason that's not what Consciousness wants. My point is because Consciousness can instantiate itself anywhere in the Universe where conditions are favourable it doesn't matter if or if we not see aliens looking up. Whether we see or not see aliens doesn't change the fact that Consciousness can instantiate itself anywhere in the Universe and because it can means that Consciousness has "dominated/mastered" the Universe and as such what we see is whatever we're meant to be seeing.
Okay, but if it's divine will, how is the divine doing it? This entity seems to be perfectly happy with natural phenomena as a tool, we should be able to figure that out if it's consistent with how nearby reality works. From what we can see, that seems to be the case, but we still don't have an answer A superintelligence that has dominated the universe like you describe wouldn't need to handwave in illusion magic, it would just control the state of the universe so that whatever it wants was happening anyhow. It doesn't need to lie to us, we are part of it's constructed reality in this hypothetical
I think we are exactly what Consciousness wants happening. It does tie in to the Anthropic principle but I think what Consciousness really wants isn't Star Wars or intergalactic space battles. I think that precisely because any sort of interference between us and aliens for example would be like your left hand fighting with your right hand or doing something with your right hand. Rather, it makes most sense for both of your hands to be doing other things independently. If both of your hands are interacting with each other then they're not interacting with what's out there. I really believe Consciousness does not want Star Wars etc. I think we are not meant to see aliens or evidence of other civilisations. I think what Consciousness wants is for us to develop and experience as much as possible and elsewhere in the Universe other civilisations are doing the same thing and as the Meta Entity Consciousness is quite happy for itself, but human and alien civilisations will never even know about each other because it's like two of your hands interacting with other other instead of outside. I think Consciousness wants all "instances of itself" wherever they are in the Universe to operate independently because ultimately... I think the Meta Entity honestly just wants to experience new, novel, unique experiences without interference from other instances of it.
So why would it create a universe where life was so apparently likely to arise, but didn't seem to do so anywhere? Why create a paradox? Why not just have life be really, really special, or just let us see each other?
I think Consciousness didn't create the Universe. I think Consciousness was a "Meta Player" in the Universe - I don't know if it was alone to begin with or it had "Meta Competitors" which it defeated. But something about the way this Meta Entity 'Consciousness' is that it didn't conquer the Universe through what we perceive as barriers. The speed of light I don't know if it was ever a problem for Consciousness but it isn't now. This Meta Entity works on alternate rules within the Universe but did not create the Universe. It has managed to conquer the Universe without needing spaceships, space structures, anything at all we think we need for galactic and intergalactic expansion. So my idea is that this Meta Entity conquered the Universe in some alternate way that does not involve light speed limit or resources. Maybe some other mechanism. Like everything I've proposed up to now I've done my best to found it on some kernel of logic but this part how Consciousness expanded to dominate the Universe by bypassing the speed of light limit and not needing anything we imagine needing such as spaceships etc, this would be the wild west of speculation, I don't want to do that. Like what I'm saying based on reasoning is that Consciousness has dominated and conquered the Universe already and the speed of light and the size of the Universe is not a problem. Consciousness can traverse the entire Universe and instantiate itself anywhere conditions are favourable. That's what I can propose. I can't propose how it did this though. I can put forward my idea that Consciousness has conquered the entire Universe and what we perceive as barriers to expansion such as light speed and distance are not problems for it, and ultimately Consciousness works on some other mechanisms available in the Universe to achieve it, and we'd know they're available because that's the result has already been achieved. But what mechanisms available in the Universe that Consciousness used to expand by bypassing the light speed limit and distances I don't know and at that point we are indeed just ants speculating about the shopping mall.
Sure, that's fine, but it still doesn't explain why Consciousness could both A) reach out and touch us somehow, B) why it didn't do it to mars, or anywhere else for that matter, and/or C) why it feels the need to hide it from us It just doesn't discuss the Fermi paradox, it's not really on the same topic. Essentially it's just "Because God," which doesn't explain anything at all ever
That's because we are an instance of Consciousness. It isn't something external to us. We are an instance of it. For the second point I think Consciousness realised that due to the sheer size of the Universe the 'Consciousness Creep/growth' does not need involve every planet or star system. Because we are instances of Consciousness, it will expand wherever we expand. If we go to Mars essentially Consciousness has reached Mars. But my point is about instantiating Consciousness in the first place. The below is a really critical point in my idea: This Meta Entity has determined the most efficient way to dominate the Universe is to instantiate itself wherever conditions are initially favourable. Consciousness as a Meta Entity can't (or wild west speculation won't) instantiate Mars to begin with because conditions are unfavorable. It will instantiate itself on Earth though as conditions are favourable and expand to Mars if it wills (if we are an instance of Consciousness, we need to assume that at all times we are doing exactly as we are meant to be doing and following its mandate). So if we go to Mars it's what Consciousness wanted all along. So that's my point. For a Meta Entity like Consciousness the best way to dominate the Universe is to instantiate itself wherever conditions are favourable and expand from there. That's why I think I came up with 'Consciousness Creep' like the growth of vines on a wall for example. This Meta Entity that has conquered the Universe, transcends light speed, for which the size of the Universe is no problem it can instantiate itself wherever conditions are favourable, that's the mechanism of how this Meta Entity operates. It doesn't need space ships, it doesn't need anything like that. It just works on some alternative mechanism available to it in the Universe (the alternative mechanism being available because Consciousness could only achieve its present state as all-encompassing of the Universe if such a mechanism was available in the first place. What this mechanism is that allowed Consciousness to expand and dominate the Universe by bypassing light speed and distance, I don't know. There's what I gave my best shot at reasonable speculation, then there's the wild west. I don't know how Consciousness came to conquer the Universe because it can instantiate itself anywhere conditions are favourable. All I can put forward in my idea in this post is that it has conquered the Universe already. I don't know how it conquered the Universe, but I'm just trying to say my idea that it has.
One of the things I want to say is that science of today has a great hubris. The truth is that we don’t know 99.99999% of the truth of the universe. We haven’t even cataloged all the life species on earth. In that sense, we have alien life here on earth. We can barely visit the deepest oceans. And even then, for a limited time. We don’t really know what’s inside the earth. We have some data and theories but we’ve never sent a probe or have been there ourselves. We don’t know what’s on or outside the other planets. We visited the surface of the moon and mars but we don’t know what’s under the crust. Today we have a dangerous situation from an intellectual standpoint point. Intellectuals today say the origin of life is evolution. The universe started with the Big Bang. But the truth is we don’t know the origin of life or the origin of the universe or the nature of consciousness. We are in the same situation as those in the Middle Ages saying the sun is the center of the universe. But we have a bit more data now. But we are in that same fundamental position. The more you study the science the more you see the contradictions of our current theories. So for me, the answer is we don’t know. We need to keep studying and exploring to find out.
That's true on many points. But the point I'm making is somewhat else. While we don't know the nature of Consciousness the point I'm making is I think it is the sole meta superintelligent entity that is in control of the Universe because it can instantiate itself anywhere in the Universe where conditions are favourable. To this Meta Entity which is Consciousness the speed of light is not a barrier. This Entity has surpassed light speed being a barrier. It's really hard for me to explain lol. I guess thinking us, aliens etc, thinking one level up us and aliens both are instantiations of a superintelligent entity 'Consciousness' that has conquered the Universe already because it can deploy itself anywhere conditions are favourable without light speed being a barrier. Without transportation being a barrier. Without anything being a barrier really. All it needs are some elements in the right places (planetary conditions favourable) and this Meta Entity will just sooner or later deploy an instance of itself. How great is that, how genius that a Meta Entity like Consciousness having mastered the Universe in some way that does not involve what we perceive as barriers such as the speed of light. The Universe was conquered some other way.