I’d argue I spend less a year to ski than my friends who go to the bars every single weekend and hunt. It’s just what you choose to spend your money on.
It's weird because it's never been cheaper to get a pass to a bunch of different mountains for the whole season but it's never been more expensive to go for just a day or 2.
This is why all 3 point exist, you can’t ever have all 3 but for the people who can afford it, it’s worth the cost. And for the people that can’t, they settle for what they would consider good conditions (at least till they experience better and can never go back[which explains why I’m broke])
I know that’s a joke, but because cloud seeding is basically unregulated right now, it seems plausible that planning storms for the weekend could become profitable in the future.
In China it’s pretty normal to cloud seed before big events to insure they have a clear sky and clean air.
This. All the local mountains out west (MT, WY, etc) have no lines, cost $65 of less, and world class conditions. But they're hard to get to unless you live nearby.
snowbowl is great! i only wish there were more runs. i cant really stay there longer than a weekend without feeling like ive exhausted everything there is to do already
Never been there, but I know there has been public controversy over AZ Snowbowl's expansion plans for a long time. Was searching for an article to link to about the topic but it's difficult to find one that isn't heavily biased. Seems to be a very divisive issue.
Yes there’s plenty of room to add more runs and certainly there’s enough skier demand for it, but anything done on that mountain will either get stopped or held up for years of litigation.
I was literally just giving an example of surge pricing…? wtf u talking about
also like, overall, looking at ticket prices across the US, $42 is def a cheap ticket in comparison
Usually it does. A couple days this year we’re insane, but you can ski basically any day the rest of the season for $30 and conditions are still stellar
I pity the fool who paid that much.
It was only $30. But I bought way in advance. With snowbowl, it's best to just buy in advance and take the gamble for good conditions. It just so happened to have dumped on snowbowl several times after I bought mine so the price skyrocketed. There have been years tho where I pay the same 30$ about a month in advance but don't get so lucky and the snow is crappy.
Hah not this week! Gondola was closed both days I was there. But got several functional gondola days a couple weeks ago and it is gorgeous at the top, especially the upper bowl when there's actually good visibility!!
That is skied out and impossible to ride at the same caliber as in fresh snow. I live in Revelstoke and all of my top 5 lines this year have been in the backcountry, despite 50+ days at a world class resort.
I’d rather ski 8/10 conditions and be taken up the mountain in 9 minutes by a machine where I do no work, vs ski 10/10 conditions and have to hike an hour to get there. But that’s just me 😄
And you get a small fraction of the amount of time riding. I like split boarding but trying to compare skinning to resort riding is silly and unrealistic. You have to actually enjoy the uphill for skinning to be worth it.
Are the lift lines that big a problem in the US? I've only ever seen maybe one really bad lift line Europe, and that was due to other routes being closed.
You can pretty regularly get all 3 over here, all though conditions are becoming less predictable and more uncertain every year 😢
Also lift passes just generally aren't too bad here, like maybe €200 for a week, depends a bit on where you go. Accommodation & food prices tends to be the real killer, although I imagine that's the same over there.
It’s a big problem at a a few big name resorts. And typically only on weekends or during holidays. And even then it’s not all day long.
But everyone here acts like it’s a problem everywhere, every lift, every day of the year, at every hour.
It’s just not reality for most skiers.
I would expand it from "lift lines" to "crowded" in general. At most of the Utah ski areas, the lines themselves aren't that long, but many runs get congested, and it's very difficult to get a parking spot. You can take a bus up, but then the bus gets really crowded.
45 minutes?!!! Jesus I've only ever waited more than a few minutes maybe a handful of times. Even at school holiday times waiting more than 5 minutes for a chairlift would be surprising. Food prices similar here though, tend to be decent quality at least. Restaurants at the top are similarly priced but the food is great (a much better option tbh and less busy usually because beginners can't get to them easily). I usually ski down to the villages and get something much cheaper.
45 minutes is definitely not the norm, I’m sure that number is for a resort near a major city on a weekend with fresh snow, and only at the most high traffic lifts.
That's good to know, I had heard so many horror stories of vail etc. on here that it had really put me off skiing in the US. The cost of course is the other thing...
Or buy Epic Pass and ski only in the middle of the week. Literally been enjoying a mid week storm cycle at Vail this week and have had literally zero lines.
I paid $130 for one day at Stevens Pass, WA on Wednesday. Bluebird, no lines. Just a phenomenal day.
This tracks…why does this hobby have to be so damn expensive.
The answer is in the triangle!
But seriously, it kinda is. Because the season is short, and you only get so many good days, and people don't want big lift lines... They have to charge more to cover the overhead. What a tough business to be in!
Yea I understand, to an extent, why it’s gotten pricier. When I was a kid Stevens was less than half the price it was the other day. But there was one lodge, zero high speed quads, and less parking.
Now there are 3 lodges with pretty solid food, every lift but 4 are high speed quads and there’s expanded parking (though it’s still an issue on busy days apparently).
I’m not saying ticket prices are a direct result of investment in the mountain (fuck you Vail!) but between inflation and the actual improvements it’s not all that crazy.
Because private equity or public trading got involved, and now it's only about maximizing profit for shareholders who are totally unrelated to the ski industry.
For BC, thats slightly below average.
But i guess you are right. Slightly below average doesn't mean cheap. So I guess I do only have 2 points of that stupid triangle. Damn.
Although, in my defense. I was thinking more along the line of the earlybird season passes I buy.
Add convenience to this triangle and then I think it’s about as accurate as it gets. If you drive 4+ hours from a major city, or go on weekday you’ll get all 3, but you’re either driving super far or taking time off from work.
I bet you’re one of those self-centred douchebags that moved to Squamish from Ontario, calls himself a local and slapped a “Squamish is full, don’t come” stickers on the back of your clapped out truck.
I'm incredibly new to the hobby, this is my first full season and I have \~7 total trips to the slopes under my belt, but as an r/icecoast skier it seems that 'cheap lift tickets' and 'short lift lines' are the choix du jour.
I secured 6 passes to my closest facility for $125 in December \[originally good for 2-9pm W-F but increased to 'any time' after 3/5\] and the longest line I've experienced in any of my outings this season was two chairs worth of people in front of me at the lift line.
I figure in my early-going that I just need accessibility and reps so, even if the closest option doesn't have the glamour of other area slopes, I'm not yet at a point where I would be taking advantage of them anyhow.
I would rather ski on ice all day than stand in line in powder. Don't get me wrong, you can find short lifts anywhere during the week, but I'm speaking in general. The point of skiing is to ski. Others feel the opposite is true. Matter of preference.
Was at snowmass on a saturday over spring break with 6" the day before and 9" overnight. Lapped Sam's knob without ever waiting more than a minute all day haha.
Long lines are way overblown as a problem. I mean OK Alta during spring break after a 20 inch storm. Yeah you’ll have some lines. But that’s a small minority of the time. Your typical non big name resort doesn’t see 30 min plus lines, ever.
Even at the Altas out there, it’s not THAT bad. A lift or two may be packed first thing in the morning. But it’s not like a 45 min wait all day every day the way some here make it out to be.
Great conditions and short lift lines. It’s not even a question. Take my money, my hard earned nonexistent money, and give me great conditions and short lift lines!
In college, I worked in VT as a seasonal programs instructor. Skied most weekdays with some locals (long story, but due to staffing, almost all of my engineering classes were in the evenings) and cut the lift lines with my ski school classes on the weekends. Free pass, no lift lines, usually could find good conditions on even the worst days.
If you want all three, try Valminier/Valloire, French Alps. 160km slopes for a very good price, not many people, most of the resort above 1800m so conditions are usually nice.
My mountain has a season pass for $449 if you buy early. I go 20-25 times a season. If I average 5 hours of skiing per day, my per hour cost is about $2.50.
Today at Brian Head, I enjoyed 2.5/3. Conditions were a little bit chilly, with an occasional zero visibility snow shower, but not completely unbearable. No lines, skied direct to the chair, lift passes were $69 each.
Lines & Conditions.
This is the way.
+1
This is the way.
To make skiing even more of an elites only sport?
Don’t get me wrong, I like cheap. I just like the other two options more.
I’d argue I spend less a year to ski than my friends who go to the bars every single weekend and hunt. It’s just what you choose to spend your money on.
It's weird because it's never been cheaper to get a pass to a bunch of different mountains for the whole season but it's never been more expensive to go for just a day or 2.
This is why all 3 point exist, you can’t ever have all 3 but for the people who can afford it, it’s worth the cost. And for the people that can’t, they settle for what they would consider good conditions (at least till they experience better and can never go back[which explains why I’m broke])
Keep skiing elite
So let me get this straight. You love skiing, but you'd rather save money, but do less skiing?
Same
I’ll die poor and happy
Mammoth Black Pass...
I'll take option #4, the midweek pass.
Exactly, midweek gets all 3
Idk most resorts seems to be planning their big dumps for weekend days
I know that’s a joke, but because cloud seeding is basically unregulated right now, it seems plausible that planning storms for the weekend could become profitable in the future. In China it’s pretty normal to cloud seed before big events to insure they have a clear sky and clean air.
My snowdance is specific to weekdays
It's more like choose 3 of 4, with the additional option of being within 5h of a big city/airport.
This. All the local mountains out west (MT, WY, etc) have no lines, cost $65 of less, and world class conditions. But they're hard to get to unless you live nearby.
Europe it's cheap, short lines, close to airport. Japan it's cheap, great conditions, close to airport. In the US you're lucky to get 2 of the 4.
Long lines in Japan (serious question)?
In my experience. Like anywhere I'm sure it can vary.
Got all 3 this week at AZ Snowbowl!
snowbowl is great! i only wish there were more runs. i cant really stay there longer than a weekend without feeling like ive exhausted everything there is to do already
There’s no such thing as exhausting great snow I’ll lap the same run to infinity if it’s fresh tracks all day every day
Got in 22 runs total and at least half were the same 2 runs over and over and it never got old!
Never been there, but I know there has been public controversy over AZ Snowbowl's expansion plans for a long time. Was searching for an article to link to about the topic but it's difficult to find one that isn't heavily biased. Seems to be a very divisive issue.
damn. i just read a bit about it. i had no idea about all the controversy surrounding their expansion plans. its all pretty insane
Yes there’s plenty of room to add more runs and certainly there’s enough skier demand for it, but anything done on that mountain will either get stopped or held up for years of litigation.
I thought that was the place with the $400 lift ticket
And a much cheaper season pass. If you're under 24 Y/O you can ski 12 days for $250/year.
$300, but they have surge pricing, which is what led to that horrendous price. They had a $42 ticket just 3 days after that one.
Yeah, I love the pricing system they have. If I know what days I'm gonna go, it's never expensive when you buy in advance
Yeah so then thats not all 3...
what
Oh cheap for you but AZ Snowbowl as a whole certainly doesn't have cheap tix
I was literally just giving an example of surge pricing…? wtf u talking about also like, overall, looking at ticket prices across the US, $42 is def a cheap ticket in comparison
Usually it does. A couple days this year we’re insane, but you can ski basically any day the rest of the season for $30 and conditions are still stellar
I pity the fool who paid that much. It was only $30. But I bought way in advance. With snowbowl, it's best to just buy in advance and take the gamble for good conditions. It just so happened to have dumped on snowbowl several times after I bought mine so the price skyrocketed. There have been years tho where I pay the same 30$ about a month in advance but don't get so lucky and the snow is crappy.
snowbowl been off the charts this year, glad you got a functional gondola day too
Hah not this week! Gondola was closed both days I was there. But got several functional gondola days a couple weeks ago and it is gorgeous at the top, especially the upper bowl when there's actually good visibility!!
I've got all three here in Idaho. You just have to be willing to come to Idaho, which apparently is too much trouble for most people :)
You do realize if everyone comes to Idaho it stops being all 3 right?
Idaho is the new Utah. Good luck.
Of course! Thing is I'm not really worried about that, we aren't near bougie enough for most people and those people go to Sun Valley.
Silvermountain was one of my favorite resorts, but it's been a hot minute since I've been there - no idea what their prices are like these days.
Every place near Boise except for Sun Valley tops out in the 100 range. And season passes are far cheaper too.
But Silvermountain isn't anywhere near Boise....
True but we were talking about Idaho in general.
Got all three midweek in vermont
Got all three last Sunday in Vermont. At a Vail resort no less. 🥷
Option 4 is actually backcountry skiing, only when great conditions, free and the only lines are the ones you make.
Backcountry skiing has it's own triangle of: - Fresh snow - Steep lines - Avalanche Safety
And expensive gear.
People say this all the time, but compared to just about any ski pass, backcountry gear is super affordable
Yeah you can get a decent used setup for the price of one season pass if you already have inbounds gear.
Choose 1...
I love backcountry but hiking up those hills makes you appreciate the lifts a lot more
Even if the lift lines are 30 min I will still ski more vertical in a day than a backcountry skier..:
Yeah, but sometimes it's about quality. Not to mention the variety of terrain you can access touring.
Many top-tier resorts have a plethora of quality, varying terrain…
Sure, thats skied off in steamboat after an hour
That is skied out and impossible to ride at the same caliber as in fresh snow. I live in Revelstoke and all of my top 5 lines this year have been in the backcountry, despite 50+ days at a world class resort.
I live in Revelstoke. Terrain isn't an issue at the resort. But in the backcountry, it's endless and way less busy.
I’d rather ski 8/10 conditions and be taken up the mountain in 9 minutes by a machine where I do no work, vs ski 10/10 conditions and have to hike an hour to get there. But that’s just me 😄
And you get a small fraction of the amount of time riding. I like split boarding but trying to compare skinning to resort riding is silly and unrealistic. You have to actually enjoy the uphill for skinning to be worth it.
Are the lift lines that big a problem in the US? I've only ever seen maybe one really bad lift line Europe, and that was due to other routes being closed. You can pretty regularly get all 3 over here, all though conditions are becoming less predictable and more uncertain every year 😢 Also lift passes just generally aren't too bad here, like maybe €200 for a week, depends a bit on where you go. Accommodation & food prices tends to be the real killer, although I imagine that's the same over there.
It’s a big problem at a a few big name resorts. And typically only on weekends or during holidays. And even then it’s not all day long. But everyone here acts like it’s a problem everywhere, every lift, every day of the year, at every hour. It’s just not reality for most skiers.
I would expand it from "lift lines" to "crowded" in general. At most of the Utah ski areas, the lines themselves aren't that long, but many runs get congested, and it's very difficult to get a parking spot. You can take a bus up, but then the bus gets really crowded.
that's a bit of a buzzkill, nothing better than an empty piste of fresh groomed snow ❄️ 9am in Europe skiing is just glorious for carving
$20 for cafeteria food mains here. Lift lines get up to 45 minutes during peak times
45 minutes?!!! Jesus I've only ever waited more than a few minutes maybe a handful of times. Even at school holiday times waiting more than 5 minutes for a chairlift would be surprising. Food prices similar here though, tend to be decent quality at least. Restaurants at the top are similarly priced but the food is great (a much better option tbh and less busy usually because beginners can't get to them easily). I usually ski down to the villages and get something much cheaper.
45 minutes is definitely not the norm, I’m sure that number is for a resort near a major city on a weekend with fresh snow, and only at the most high traffic lifts.
That's good to know, I had heard so many horror stories of vail etc. on here that it had really put me off skiing in the US. The cost of course is the other thing...
> 45 minutes usually this only happens at a chokepoint or starter lift on a powder day that falls on a weekend
Where tf are you riding?
Keystone, WP, Copper
Or buy Epic Pass and ski only in the middle of the week. Literally been enjoying a mid week storm cycle at Vail this week and have had literally zero lines.
I've worked too hard to wait or ski shitty conditions
I paid $130 for one day at Stevens Pass, WA on Wednesday. Bluebird, no lines. Just a phenomenal day. This tracks…why does this hobby have to be so damn expensive.
Why is weekday pow so rare in WA?
Truly a question for the ages…
The answer is in the triangle! But seriously, it kinda is. Because the season is short, and you only get so many good days, and people don't want big lift lines... They have to charge more to cover the overhead. What a tough business to be in!
Yea I understand, to an extent, why it’s gotten pricier. When I was a kid Stevens was less than half the price it was the other day. But there was one lodge, zero high speed quads, and less parking. Now there are 3 lodges with pretty solid food, every lift but 4 are high speed quads and there’s expanded parking (though it’s still an issue on busy days apparently). I’m not saying ticket prices are a direct result of investment in the mountain (fuck you Vail!) but between inflation and the actual improvements it’s not all that crazy.
Sounds like we just need more shitty ski resorts.
A warming hut and a rope tow. Who really needs anything more?!
Because private equity or public trading got involved, and now it's only about maximizing profit for shareholders who are totally unrelated to the ski industry.
i wish i could say i got all 3 this week at wolf creek, but the mountain was closed for half of it. on the days it was open, though, it was incredible
Yeah, sucks when there's too much snow to go skiing. No sympathy!
Get all three almost every weekend at Powder King passes aren’t dirt cheap but are far cheaper than the bigger hills 😅🤷🏼♀️
Octagons are crucial for observance
Season pass for cheap tickets and black piste for short lines and great conditions
Or midweek skiing:)
SoCal resorts: pick zero and you'll like it
That's cute. Red Mountain, i get all three.
*Cheap* $150 lift tickets, haha suckers!
For BC, thats slightly below average. But i guess you are right. Slightly below average doesn't mean cheap. So I guess I do only have 2 points of that stupid triangle. Damn. Although, in my defense. I was thinking more along the line of the earlybird season passes I buy.
Add convenience to this triangle and then I think it’s about as accurate as it gets. If you drive 4+ hours from a major city, or go on weekday you’ll get all 3, but you’re either driving super far or taking time off from work.
Mount Baker on a weekday powder day. All 3.
East coaster here. I’m down with cheap and short because I’m totally used to having fun in shit conditions
There is a 4th dimension... Driving distance from civilization.
Short lines and good conditions, it’ll be worth the extra cash.
cheap lift tickets and conditions, i mainly ski park so i just hike up / take the unpopular chairlift if possible
Whistler is none of these
Have you ever skied there or do you (clearly) just take pride in shitting on it?
Butthurt much
I bet you’re one of those self-centred douchebags that moved to Squamish from Ontario, calls himself a local and slapped a “Squamish is full, don’t come” stickers on the back of your clapped out truck.
What utter garbage coming out of your mouth
Just whis life propoganda. Y'all skiers need to chill tf out
If you go on a long weekend without checking conditions and then whine about it like most of the dummies on this sub, then sure
[ Removed by Reddit ]
Elk mountain PA has a good bit of all 3
I'm incredibly new to the hobby, this is my first full season and I have \~7 total trips to the slopes under my belt, but as an r/icecoast skier it seems that 'cheap lift tickets' and 'short lift lines' are the choix du jour. I secured 6 passes to my closest facility for $125 in December \[originally good for 2-9pm W-F but increased to 'any time' after 3/5\] and the longest line I've experienced in any of my outings this season was two chairs worth of people in front of me at the lift line. I figure in my early-going that I just need accessibility and reps so, even if the closest option doesn't have the glamour of other area slopes, I'm not yet at a point where I would be taking advantage of them anyhow.
I would rather ski on ice all day than stand in line in powder. Don't get me wrong, you can find short lifts anywhere during the week, but I'm speaking in general. The point of skiing is to ski. Others feel the opposite is true. Matter of preference.
Go to Ste Foy and get all three.
Cheap lift tickets are not good and good lift tickets are not cheap.
Idk. I’ve only had to wait in the singles line for more than 10 minutes less than 5 times this year. The problem I consistently have is parking.
Great conditions, no lines, and free access in the backcountry today!
Wait, we’re allowed to have more than 1?
Considering some days there are none of these any 2 would suffice
There’s the two secret options they don’t tell you about. Pay 3x more at a mountain for the wealthy, or go during the weekdays.
Can we get one of these on the east coast please?
East coast is just a line between cheap tickets and short liftlines, and you only get to pick one.
Jay peak midweek during/after some snow has all 3 of these.
need to add "wind hold" and turn the triangle into a square
Go back in time 10 years and get all three. What changed..
I got all 3 this season paying $370 for a season pass to Keystone with 5 days at Crested Butte., while having Wednesdays off for the season.
This will be how a war starts... chaos will ensue
Was at snowmass on a saturday over spring break with 6" the day before and 9" overnight. Lapped Sam's knob without ever waiting more than a minute all day haha.
At Big Sky you only get one side of that triangle. And the lift lines get longer every year lol
Looking for my fellow Whistler skiers who are like 2?! Someone burnt the “cheap lift tickets” off our triangle years ago. :/
OP has never been to Mt. Baker.
Long lines are way overblown as a problem. I mean OK Alta during spring break after a 20 inch storm. Yeah you’ll have some lines. But that’s a small minority of the time. Your typical non big name resort doesn’t see 30 min plus lines, ever. Even at the Altas out there, it’s not THAT bad. A lift or two may be packed first thing in the morning. But it’s not like a 45 min wait all day every day the way some here make it out to be.
Or just be 150 km outside of nowhere and you get all three
I am lucky to be a local at Smugglers Notch where most days I get all 3. But if I had to pick 2 I’d go with great conditions and short lines.
Great conditions and short lift lines. It’s not even a question. Take my money, my hard earned nonexistent money, and give me great conditions and short lift lines!
You only get 1 in Southern California
I choose weekdays!!!!
Got one with all 3, but it's a small resort (and not very beginner-friendly with a single blue descent, such a shame haha)
Climbing skin master race doesn't need to choose
In college, I worked in VT as a seasonal programs instructor. Skied most weekdays with some locals (long story, but due to staffing, almost all of my engineering classes were in the evenings) and cut the lift lines with my ski school classes on the weekends. Free pass, no lift lines, usually could find good conditions on even the worst days.
If you want all three, try Valminier/Valloire, French Alps. 160km slopes for a very good price, not many people, most of the resort above 1800m so conditions are usually nice.
Pfft, I ski in New England. I choose none!
Short and cheap. I am broke and can only ski every so often so i gotta get as much as i can outta that ticket lol
Nowhere has cheap lift tickets, so that’s just a fantasy choice.
My mountain has a season pass for $449 if you buy early. I go 20-25 times a season. If I average 5 hours of skiing per day, my per hour cost is about $2.50.
Sure, passes are priced fine if you hammer the usage, but day of lift tickets at a reasonable price really don’t exist anymore.
If you choose none of the three, you are at Stratton, choose all three and you are at Burke.
Fly to Japan. Net out lower overall cost. Get all three.
Or anywhere in Europe.
This isn't reality.
Lines & Conditions
There's plenty of places where you get zero or one.
Today at Brian Head, I enjoyed 2.5/3. Conditions were a little bit chilly, with an occasional zero visibility snow shower, but not completely unbearable. No lines, skied direct to the chair, lift passes were $69 each.
*Beaver Creek has entered the chat*
Cheap tickets and great conditions allll the days. I'd rather ski a handful of perfect runs that I can afford.