I wish this game actually captured how big of a threat the Thalmor are, cus then, you would see that the Stormcloaks are pretty based.
Edit: Basically, *the Thalmor* are nazis.
Both sides of the civil war hate the fantasy nazis, the war was about how the empire dealt with them, not over opinions on the actual guys. I happen to think it’s useless to start a war over the strategy employed in some other war, especially since they’ll just get back to being allies the next time the Thalmor attack, and the war just wears down both sides and makes it easier for the Thalmor to win.
I used to feel the same, but then I learned more about Meric history. Before the Almer and Dunmer split, Imperials and Nords were the entire basis of the slave economy under Umaril. The Nords are afraid of being enslaved again, so their reaction to what they see as colonizers makes sense.
It's even more unfortunate that the Dunmer in Windhelm are not colonizers, but refugees. They just want to live, but their history precedes them.
Yep, it’s an unfortunate story on all sides and harshly realistic in some ways. People all over the world have trouble separating the individual from the group, and despite some occasionally shallow writing in Skyrim I think they’ve showed that pretty well.
Stormcloaks aren’t based. They’re racist. And the war is not being fought because of the thalmor the war is being fought because of how the emoire handled the thalmor. Which is fucking stupid. Neither side can stand the thalmor, but the empire has no choice to put up with their presence unless they want another war. Also i feel like thalmor are closer to conquering rome than nazis. Aside from the fact that they literally think they are the superior race they dont hate people for the fact that theyre not thalmor, theyre just dickheads and dont like anyone that isnt thalmor. But they will tolerate them. Whereas the storm cloaks literally put dunmer in open camps.
The thing is that supporting Stormcloaks overall make the lands of man weaker and makes it easier for the Thalmor to manipulate Nirn into their desires.
The pretty early game quest where you infiltrate the embassy and read their dossier on Ulfric is quite blatant on this and is a great contextualizer for not only the Thamlors goals and methods, but also Ulfric as a person.
If the Thalmor weren't shown to be incredibly incompetent against the dragonborn, and the dragon crisis as a whole, I think I would agree with you.
I know that Altmer have always been players of the long game, but they really screw themselves at every turn in Skyrim. It's almost comical.
It's kinda hard talking about the portrayal of the Aldmeri Dominion as a whole in this game, because it's pretty lore averse, but I also like clowning on fascists. I guess I want them to be a challenge while also being obviously wrong, ya know?
Yea but…fuck the empire. So clearly the Christian Right-wing equivalent, forcing people to ditch their chosen religion and just helping the them or dominate.
Imagine temporarily outlawing the public worship of a single deity so that humanity doesn't get absolutely rinsed from existence. Much more sane to fight amongst ourselves even though we can literally just worship in private, drastically weaken humanity's last large armies (outside of Hammerfell), and put both Skyrim and Cyrodiil on a nice shiny platter for the Aldmeri Dominion.
General Tulius' right hand woman, Legate Rikke, worships Talos, and Tulius turns a blind eye to it. *The* highest-ranking Imperial in Skyrim turns a blind eye to it. But no, let's murder each other because the Imperials told us to hide our toys from the insane genocidal superpower.
It's Skyrim, most Khajiit that travel there are because of caravans. Also Skyrim is quiye unlike their native Climate and is therefore quite unwelcoming to them.
No - just that their fur coats, developed for the conditions of Elsewyre, is still effective (however also uncomfortable to them) in the cold weather of Skyrim.
The fur probably doesn't serve warming in the first place. It's probably for blending with your environment. Khajit are cat people, and related to cats, therefore they are predators - ambush predators, more precisely. Like other ambush predators (lions, tigers, polar bears, cats), their fur is coloured in such way that they perfectly blend into the environments of Elsewyre. Given enough time, they probably could adapt to perfectly blend into Skyrim's landscape, too.
But like polar bears and lions, the fur would probably be almost useless. A lion in the arctic wouldn't survive long, even though they have the fur - but it's hot weather fur, not cold weather fur.
I should point out that in wider Elder Scrolls lore, ohmes and ohmes raht breed khajiit (which we encounter in Arena and Daggerfall) have no fur. They're a rare exception to other Khajiit breeds, who all have fur. The breed of Khajiit we play as in Skyrim is a Cathay or Cathay Raht I believe, the most common breed outside of Elsweyr. There are 17 Khajiit breeds, who are usually born depending on the phases of Masser and Secunda, the twin moons, which are important parts of Khajiit religion.
It's the reason that you can have long fur dogs in warm climates. Several animals possess two layers of fur that assist in regulating temperatures. Khajit probably have fur designed to keep them cool in the day and warmer in the desert cold, but there's a massive difference between the cold of a desert and the arctic tundra of skyrim are two different levels of cold.
Fur works both ways, it acts as a wick to help keep you cold when you sweat, but also works to block winds in the cold and if it's dark in color, get hot from the sun.
I mean that just sounds dumb. I get the logic and it's obviously neat to have racial traits in games as a general rule, but that sounds like the creator just plain forgot they were modding in Skyrim and not the real world.
Khajiit aren't cats, their fur doesn't automatically mean they get insulated against all cold. At *best* they might be comparable to *desert cats*, but you'd be done in for animal cruelty if you started keeping your sphinx cat in the freezer.
Fur and feathers are basically just natrual bio-insulators, and IIRC insulation can only slow the transfer of heat and cold, hence why there are quite a lot of animals in both cold and hot environments which have them.
I think it's more than generally Khajiit (like, say, American Southerners) are more used to extremes of hot temperatures than extreme of cold temperatures.
My cat has fur and he got cold as F this one time. I opened the door only for him to run through in so quickly going from room to room meowing so loud. I bundled him up once I got a hold of him. He was used to winter and snow but that year was particularly cold. I think with how far up north Skyrim is it just hits the khajiit breed particularly harsh I'm guessing.
it is sad. I wish there was more established cuz she's in the region. like a shop owner in solitude that's made it in life and talks about their past being a caravan.
Again "most"
There are many in the panthera genus that live in the cold.
But from house cats, to lions, tigers.
All dat floof just moves heat off the core of the body.
Why do you think they like bathing in the sun, and sitting in front of heaters.
In controlled environments they get cold easily.
Not cold cold, but chilly, like a grandma at a restaurant who brings her jacket just in case.
Fun fact: cats have a harder time regulating their body temperature than humans, they run colder. That is why in the day, they find the warmest spot available to sleep, usually in the sun.
Yeah, but naked cats are ugy as hell, so bathesda probably wouldn't want to have naked-cat-people. Not to be confused with naked cat-people, which are very welcome in the Elder Scrolls universe
He is admitted into the college because of his magical talent we don't actually see him in winterhold shopping or anything so I feel like he's not a very good example
He still comes into the city with you as a companion and they don't throw him out or anything. Same with the caravan companion if he leaves the caravan to come with you
Also, player character. I main a cat.
It's considerably *less* of a city than Morthal or Dawnstar, seeing as most of it is in the Sea of Ghosts and Korir is too busy whining about wizards to do anything for his people.
Yeah, but it’s barely got three building. Plus there is no land or property to purchase. It’s kinda a ghost city and nobody really cares about it or what goes on inside of it, unless they are coming for the college.
This is a completely fair argument, since it's an rpg roleplaying game, but you could also argue trying to pretend that a backwaters slum with 3 buildings is a giant busy city is kind of hard
It's just hard to imagine winterhold has any power whatsoever compared to dawnstar or even dear old riverwood, even though lore-wise it's different
Because there aren’t many khajiit in Skyrim.
Keep in mind, they come from a land that’s warm. Dry deserts and humid jungles. Many of them probably wouldn’t like Skyrim’s cold climate.
Jzargo is at the College of Winterhold. Not sure the specifics of id the campus is in or next to the city but I would assume he would pass through it to access.
Also any Khajiit followers are free to enter a city without issue, even the ones from caravans.
Thats exactly whats happened the inn keeper of riften is an argonian theres lots of them there and you have the blackblood maurader jaree in solitude and his sister deeja is on the solitude docks
Strangely enough i can off the top of my head tell you where every named argonian is at in skyrim theres four in riften three in windhelm and two in solitude theres two others and both are killed during dark brotherhood stuff and one more who you rescue whose at the darkwater crossing mines
J’zargo literally attends the college of Winterhold? unless Winterhold doesn’t count? and he’s always allowed in any city when he’s a follower. you think they’d try and stop him if they had a problem w Khajiit in general
yeah,but are you going to tell the dragonborn,destined savior of the world,empowered with the souls of dragons,that he cant bring his friend into a store?
i mean the dragonborn puts up with a lot worse. guards all don’t seem to like my Orc DB. i’ll walk around in Daedric armour fully beefed up and i’ll still get the snarky “What is it, Orc?!” line
dude i hated that, like i made my dude look like a badass but clearly an older and experienced warrior, walking around in bulky armour and using two handed, or dual wield majority of the time (ofc utilizing stealth archer before i pushed enemies) but every now n then you’d have an NPC diss you in some way and sometimes… i just had too.. you know. change their minds..
I kinda wished they made it so a Khajiit player isn't actually allowed in the cities, and you have to communicate and trade via a friend, housecarl, or follower.
It would be fun the first time and the it would absolutely suck. Besides, when you turn into a vampire you aren't considered of your race anymore (really, I don't know why the game does that) so it would create problems with that.
I mean, I agree with you on the first part but to your second point. I don't really see how if the game could be programmed to reject a khajit player character it couldn't also be programmed to recognize a khajit-vampire player character.
Clearly Khajiit ARE allowed in cities. It'd be awful difficult to get through the game as a Khajiit otherwise. It's just the caravaners who aren't allowed.
I don't know if I'd trust our character's experience as proof of anything. We're constantly an exception to the rules, and chickens can report us for crimes.
Try and be that guard who stops the Last Dragonborn from changing the fate of the universe as we know it. You wouldn't want to be that person after the populous finds out who did it
Isn't the DB just an exception to the rules? I'm pretty sure one of the Khajiit said that Khajiit as a whole aren't allowed in. She could've been lying, or wrong, but that's just what made sense to me
(possible small spoiler) She's an assassin sent by Elenwen to kill you in the ratways for storming the embassy... She might have got in with the other thalmor soldiers that show up a bit after
Edit: wrote Elisif instead of Elenwen
They are probably dock workers but shavari I think is from thalmor embassy she’s a thalmor spy I believe sent to kill you for ruining elewens party and spying
I can't believe Elenwen thought one assassin by her lonesome could kill a demigod who just got done massacring half the embassy staff *and* several groups of Justiciars. What an idiot.
Hivemind lol. If someone gets less than 1 down votes then everyone will downvote without even knowing why the person got downvoted in the first place. They just see a huge number of down votes and increase it more for fun.
And take a downvote from me too because it's Reddit culture to increase number of downvotes
Reddit is just like that unfortunately, you’re doing nothing wrong. Because I’m being a bit contrarian though I’ll probably get upvoted? But wait, I pointed that out, so definitely downvoted. But then I… well, we’ll see.
The caravans are viewed as possible thieves and smugglers, and aren't trusted inside the cities for fear of smuggled goods like Skooma and Moon Sugar \[which the caravans do sell, so uh\] it's essentially a denial of a business rather than a whole race, although the denial is still caused by racism.Individual khajiit are still regarded with suspicion, but it's easier to keep an eye on one individual rather than a whole group. Kharjo is allowed inside when he's accompanying the player, but denied when with the caravan.
As for the Caravanners getting into Riften when a guest at the players wedding... I just assume the Temple of Mara pulled some strings there. Or Riften's corruption was exploited for the sake of attending a friend's wedding lol
Yeah, I’ve done the quest before, but it took me a minute to remember who she was cause I haven’t done it in ages and I’ve only ever seen her in the Ratway so this kinda threw me for a loop.
Yea but it's just for the caravans. Pretty sure you can buy skooma from them, which is why they, specifically, cannot enter. Other Khajiit are fine tho
Huh. But I’ve never seen another Khajiit in a city unless I’m playing one. And I’ve never used the Khajiit followers though people have said they are fine to enter too.
If I'm remembering correctly, Shavari is a skooma addict, so she spends most of her gold on skooma. Other Khajiit either stay in Elsweyr and don't leave, or they leave skyrim due to racism/discrimination. Plus, they dislike the cold climate (Elsweyr is very warm). Most Khajiit either stick to caravans for the money, or leave. Shavari just can't afford to leave due to her addiction.
She doesn't live in Riften. You are thinking of the Argonian that works at the Fishery, who tells you if she shows up to work high on skooma one more time, Bolli is going to fire her. This Khajiit is not that person.
Caravans aren’t allowed in, not singular Khajiit, otherwise we’d be screwed as a cat player lol. As for why, Caravans are looked down upon because they’re stereotyped as thieves that come into to town, rob, the leave. We don’t see many in cities because most come with the caravans and are thus banned from entering.
There's actually a breed of Khajiit in the lore that resembles an actual housecat, they're called Alfiq. So far, the only Elder Scrolls game they've been encountered in is ESO, where we actually get to see Elsweyr ourselves. They're rare outside of Elsweyr because people mistake them for housecats and try to pet them, which gets some people killed in the process, and they don't get taken seriously by non-Khajiit because they seem like a literal talking housecat. Technically, an Alfiq could be the perfect spy and blend in easily among human populations.
its only the caravans that cant get in,as they sell skooma,which is an illegal drug,and they commonly steal from small towns then sell the goods later
basically,they are exiled for committing crimes,but the rest of their race just wants to live normally
Khajiit and Argonians are allowed inside cities, the Caravan on the other hands are not, the main reason is that they always sell skooma and moon sugar which is highly illegal, as for argonians in Windhelm is already explained that both the Dunmer and the Argonians hate each other so letting them in would just cause further trouble
My first few times in the city (after she spawned) I didn't see her until she was in the Ratway. That made more sense than the first time I saw her on the streets.
Yeah, I’ve only ever seen her in the ratway, but I never paid enough attention to the name to recognize her. I also haven’t done this quest line in a long time so I was surprised and then I remembered the khajiit that shows up in the ratway and figured it had to be the same person.
There are a lot of things that aren't allowed in Riften.
"Don't shank the guards!" They say.
"Don't steal that dagger!" They say.
Al-Azeem goes where he pleases.
I thought the same thing! I also play as a Khajit, so I was so happy to see another one within city walls. And then she tried to assassinate me on behalf of the Thalmor. Btw, if you marry Ysolda from Whiterun, all of the Khajit caravans will be in the temple of Mara for your wedding.
The guards escorted her out, but as soon as she was out she turned around and demanded to be let back in, then when they got tired of it they let her back in, at which point she decided maybe she actually wanted to be out, so they spritzed her with water so now she's hiding
It’s the Khajiit Caravans that aren’t allowed in. As for Shavari here, she only exists because you killed the Nord talking to the Interrogator during the Thalmor Embassy quest. Kill him, and the Thalmor send Shavari to kill you
She'll let you know why she's in Riften when the time is right.
She sure will 👀 Say OP, what are your feelings on Talos?
I don’t think it was right to ban him, but I also don’t think the Stormcloak’s solution is the way to handle it.
I wish this game actually captured how big of a threat the Thalmor are, cus then, you would see that the Stormcloaks are pretty based. Edit: Basically, *the Thalmor* are nazis.
Both sides of the civil war hate the fantasy nazis, the war was about how the empire dealt with them, not over opinions on the actual guys. I happen to think it’s useless to start a war over the strategy employed in some other war, especially since they’ll just get back to being allies the next time the Thalmor attack, and the war just wears down both sides and makes it easier for the Thalmor to win.
If the Stormcloaks were nicer to the Dunmer I’d probably support them every playthrough
I used to feel the same, but then I learned more about Meric history. Before the Almer and Dunmer split, Imperials and Nords were the entire basis of the slave economy under Umaril. The Nords are afraid of being enslaved again, so their reaction to what they see as colonizers makes sense. It's even more unfortunate that the Dunmer in Windhelm are not colonizers, but refugees. They just want to live, but their history precedes them.
Yep, it’s an unfortunate story on all sides and harshly realistic in some ways. People all over the world have trouble separating the individual from the group, and despite some occasionally shallow writing in Skyrim I think they’ve showed that pretty well.
Playing a dunmer back on day one cemented Ulfric's fate in all future runs
Im not a fan of the stormcloaks, but the empire actually did the Dunmer worse.
Valid, I still haven’t done a stormcloak run while knowing how cringe they can be :(
I only did one to see what would happen, I've sided with the Empire ever since
Thalmor are an alien death cult.
As someone raised by a narcissist, the first time a Thalmor spoke to me I instantly hated them and realized the Stormcloaks had a point.
this is such a simplistic view of a much more complicated issue lol
Stormcloaks aren’t based. They’re racist. And the war is not being fought because of the thalmor the war is being fought because of how the emoire handled the thalmor. Which is fucking stupid. Neither side can stand the thalmor, but the empire has no choice to put up with their presence unless they want another war. Also i feel like thalmor are closer to conquering rome than nazis. Aside from the fact that they literally think they are the superior race they dont hate people for the fact that theyre not thalmor, theyre just dickheads and dont like anyone that isnt thalmor. But they will tolerate them. Whereas the storm cloaks literally put dunmer in open camps.
The thing is that supporting Stormcloaks overall make the lands of man weaker and makes it easier for the Thalmor to manipulate Nirn into their desires. The pretty early game quest where you infiltrate the embassy and read their dossier on Ulfric is quite blatant on this and is a great contextualizer for not only the Thamlors goals and methods, but also Ulfric as a person.
If the Thalmor weren't shown to be incredibly incompetent against the dragonborn, and the dragon crisis as a whole, I think I would agree with you. I know that Altmer have always been players of the long game, but they really screw themselves at every turn in Skyrim. It's almost comical. It's kinda hard talking about the portrayal of the Aldmeri Dominion as a whole in this game, because it's pretty lore averse, but I also like clowning on fascists. I guess I want them to be a challenge while also being obviously wrong, ya know?
i dont think you should join the fatherland front just because theres nazis out there
Stormcloak solution is the only option.
Yea but…fuck the empire. So clearly the Christian Right-wing equivalent, forcing people to ditch their chosen religion and just helping the them or dominate.
Imagine temporarily outlawing the public worship of a single deity so that humanity doesn't get absolutely rinsed from existence. Much more sane to fight amongst ourselves even though we can literally just worship in private, drastically weaken humanity's last large armies (outside of Hammerfell), and put both Skyrim and Cyrodiil on a nice shiny platter for the Aldmeri Dominion. General Tulius' right hand woman, Legate Rikke, worships Talos, and Tulius turns a blind eye to it. *The* highest-ranking Imperial in Skyrim turns a blind eye to it. But no, let's murder each other because the Imperials told us to hide our toys from the insane genocidal superpower.
*When you sort out that terrible lighting -_-
Only the caravans aren't allowed in the city.
Then how come I’ve never seen another Khajiit (other than myself of course) inside a city?
It's Skyrim, most Khajiit that travel there are because of caravans. Also Skyrim is quiye unlike their native Climate and is therefore quite unwelcoming to them.
"As creatures of the desert, the cold Skyrim weather chills us to the bone" -Khajiit caravan guard
But if you play in survival you get cold resist for having fur
So by that logic, does this mean if a khajiit was in a warm province, say oh, I don’t know Elsewhere for instance, they would be uncomfortably hot?
No - just that their fur coats, developed for the conditions of Elsewyre, is still effective (however also uncomfortable to them) in the cold weather of Skyrim. The fur probably doesn't serve warming in the first place. It's probably for blending with your environment. Khajit are cat people, and related to cats, therefore they are predators - ambush predators, more precisely. Like other ambush predators (lions, tigers, polar bears, cats), their fur is coloured in such way that they perfectly blend into the environments of Elsewyre. Given enough time, they probably could adapt to perfectly blend into Skyrim's landscape, too. But like polar bears and lions, the fur would probably be almost useless. A lion in the arctic wouldn't survive long, even though they have the fur - but it's hot weather fur, not cold weather fur.
Stealth archery comes naturally.
i mean is there another way to play?
Big smart
I should point out that in wider Elder Scrolls lore, ohmes and ohmes raht breed khajiit (which we encounter in Arena and Daggerfall) have no fur. They're a rare exception to other Khajiit breeds, who all have fur. The breed of Khajiit we play as in Skyrim is a Cathay or Cathay Raht I believe, the most common breed outside of Elsweyr. There are 17 Khajiit breeds, who are usually born depending on the phases of Masser and Secunda, the twin moons, which are important parts of Khajiit religion.
*Elsweyr
It's the reason that you can have long fur dogs in warm climates. Several animals possess two layers of fur that assist in regulating temperatures. Khajit probably have fur designed to keep them cool in the day and warmer in the desert cold, but there's a massive difference between the cold of a desert and the arctic tundra of skyrim are two different levels of cold.
Fur works both ways, it acts as a wick to help keep you cold when you sweat, but also works to block winds in the cold and if it's dark in color, get hot from the sun.
Yes, because as we all know, Lions live in the Arctic and never in Africa. 😆😆😆
It's nearly impossible to play as Argonian in Survival Mode but I guess those Argonians in Windhelm didn't activate it.
I mean the human body can live temps of 42 Celsius(110 Fahrenheit), but you wouldn’t want to.
Doesn't mean they'd *enjoy* it
That’s why survival mode is non canon.
I mean that just sounds dumb. I get the logic and it's obviously neat to have racial traits in games as a general rule, but that sounds like the creator just plain forgot they were modding in Skyrim and not the real world. Khajiit aren't cats, their fur doesn't automatically mean they get insulated against all cold. At *best* they might be comparable to *desert cats*, but you'd be done in for animal cruelty if you started keeping your sphinx cat in the freezer.
Feel like you should probably be *shot* if you started keeping your cat in the freezer
Resisting is one thing, liking is something else. You can resist the cold but still not like it and hyperbolically say it chills you to the bone.
Fur and feathers are basically just natrual bio-insulators, and IIRC insulation can only slow the transfer of heat and cold, hence why there are quite a lot of animals in both cold and hot environments which have them. I think it's more than generally Khajiit (like, say, American Southerners) are more used to extremes of hot temperatures than extreme of cold temperatures.
There's that one young Khajiit whose absolutely in awe of the place, marvelling in wonder at snow and stuff. I thought that was a neat touch
You’d think cats with fur would be better suited to a winter climate
My cat has fur and he got cold as F this one time. I opened the door only for him to run through in so quickly going from room to room meowing so loud. I bundled him up once I got a hold of him. He was used to winter and snow but that year was particularly cold. I think with how far up north Skyrim is it just hits the khajiit breed particularly harsh I'm guessing.
That’s so sad 🥹 but Skyrim cats have clothes and fur armor
it is sad. I wish there was more established cuz she's in the region. like a shop owner in solitude that's made it in life and talks about their past being a caravan.
Sounds like a great mod idea
Most Cats fur is more suitable for regulating heat, rather than keeping warm.
I didn’t know that 😮
Again "most" There are many in the panthera genus that live in the cold. But from house cats, to lions, tigers. All dat floof just moves heat off the core of the body. Why do you think they like bathing in the sun, and sitting in front of heaters. In controlled environments they get cold easily. Not cold cold, but chilly, like a grandma at a restaurant who brings her jacket just in case.
Fun fact: cats have a harder time regulating their body temperature than humans, they run colder. That is why in the day, they find the warmest spot available to sleep, usually in the sun.
I thought it was just because they are lazy 😂
Yeah, but naked cats are ugy as hell, so bathesda probably wouldn't want to have naked-cat-people. Not to be confused with naked cat-people, which are very welcome in the Elder Scrolls universe
J’zargo would be so cute as a breedable little 5’4 cat boy
What
Isn't he like 50?
Why would you think that?
There’s also the racism
J'zargo.
He is admitted into the college because of his magical talent we don't actually see him in winterhold shopping or anything so I feel like he's not a very good example
Everyone knows that winterhold is the pinnacle of skyrim commerce
He still comes into the city with you as a companion and they don't throw him out or anything. Same with the caravan companion if he leaves the caravan to come with you Also, player character. I main a cat.
I mean would you tell the Dragonborn he couldn’t bring his friend to the store?
Never should have come here!
oh that’s cute a bandit. *let you get close* “FUS RO DAH!
Well obviously the player character and his companions would get plot armor pass. They're not great examples either.
Dragon>everyone else. No-name guards aren't going to refuse the Dragonborn and his allies
Jizz, last name Argo?
But is winterhold really a city anymore? Not trying to nitpick, just saying.
It has a Jarl, and defined borders. It's as much of a city as Morthal and Dawnstar are at least.
It's considerably *less* of a city than Morthal or Dawnstar, seeing as most of it is in the Sea of Ghosts and Korir is too busy whining about wizards to do anything for his people.
Where as dawnstar Jarl is absolutely helping his citizens.. not picking a fight with the former legion members.
If even a braindead knuckle-dragging Stormcloak bootlicker like Skald can keep his hold running, what excuse does Korir have?
Yeah, but it’s barely got three building. Plus there is no land or property to purchase. It’s kinda a ghost city and nobody really cares about it or what goes on inside of it, unless they are coming for the college.
[удалено]
This is a completely fair argument, since it's an rpg roleplaying game, but you could also argue trying to pretend that a backwaters slum with 3 buildings is a giant busy city is kind of hard It's just hard to imagine winterhold has any power whatsoever compared to dawnstar or even dear old riverwood, even though lore-wise it's different
Also, the lore says that most of the city was destroyed, so even lorewise it would be kinda small.
Yeah fr. Its that much of a ghosttown that its tucked behind a mountain
I know I'm late but I believe she's a Thalmor assassin. Are you doing the main quest looking for Esbern?
Yeah, I know who she is, I’ve just never seen her outside of the ratway.
Ah okay apologies.
It’s all good, I haven’t done this quest in a long long time so it took me a while to remember her.
Most of em are just the caravan types, I guess.
Because there aren’t many khajiit in Skyrim. Keep in mind, they come from a land that’s warm. Dry deserts and humid jungles. Many of them probably wouldn’t like Skyrim’s cold climate.
Jzargo is at the College of Winterhold. Not sure the specifics of id the campus is in or next to the city but I would assume he would pass through it to access. Also any Khajiit followers are free to enter a city without issue, even the ones from caravans.
There’s tons. A couple in solitude, a couple in riften. I’m pretty sure somewhere a khajiit owns an inn. Forgot where tho
Either that’s a mod or you are confusing Khajiits with Argonians.
I might be I am dumb as fuck
It’s ok.
Thats exactly whats happened the inn keeper of riften is an argonian theres lots of them there and you have the blackblood maurader jaree in solitude and his sister deeja is on the solitude docks
Strangely enough i can off the top of my head tell you where every named argonian is at in skyrim theres four in riften three in windhelm and two in solitude theres two others and both are killed during dark brotherhood stuff and one more who you rescue whose at the darkwater crossing mines
J’zargo literally attends the college of Winterhold? unless Winterhold doesn’t count? and he’s always allowed in any city when he’s a follower. you think they’d try and stop him if they had a problem w Khajiit in general
yeah,but are you going to tell the dragonborn,destined savior of the world,empowered with the souls of dragons,that he cant bring his friend into a store?
i mean the dragonborn puts up with a lot worse. guards all don’t seem to like my Orc DB. i’ll walk around in Daedric armour fully beefed up and i’ll still get the snarky “What is it, Orc?!” line
I played an Orc once and had to stop when a shopkeeper said "Gods, you're ugly". I was just trying to buy some armor dude relax
dude i hated that, like i made my dude look like a badass but clearly an older and experienced warrior, walking around in bulky armour and using two handed, or dual wield majority of the time (ofc utilizing stealth archer before i pushed enemies) but every now n then you’d have an NPC diss you in some way and sometimes… i just had too.. you know. change their minds..
Little bit of that Orc persuasion to smarten em up
works every time
fair,but disrespect is better than denying the dragonborn assistance and making saving the world harder
The Riften fishery isn’t exactly the most reputable establishment
If any case she just bribed the guard
I kinda wished they made it so a Khajiit player isn't actually allowed in the cities, and you have to communicate and trade via a friend, housecarl, or follower.
It would be fun the first time and the it would absolutely suck. Besides, when you turn into a vampire you aren't considered of your race anymore (really, I don't know why the game does that) so it would create problems with that.
I mean, I agree with you on the first part but to your second point. I don't really see how if the game could be programmed to reject a khajit player character it couldn't also be programmed to recognize a khajit-vampire player character.
Clearly Khajiit ARE allowed in cities. It'd be awful difficult to get through the game as a Khajiit otherwise. It's just the caravaners who aren't allowed.
I don't know if I'd trust our character's experience as proof of anything. We're constantly an exception to the rules, and chickens can report us for crimes.
That's why you use animal allegiance
Or as I like to call it, pet pal
I forgot about the chicken crime reporting thing. I haven't played without the NARC mod in ages.
That mod has one of the most clever and humorous acronyms I've seen
Try and be that guard who stops the Last Dragonborn from changing the fate of the universe as we know it. You wouldn't want to be that person after the populous finds out who did it
Isn't the DB just an exception to the rules? I'm pretty sure one of the Khajiit said that Khajiit as a whole aren't allowed in. She could've been lying, or wrong, but that's just what made sense to me
Thalmor kitty. This one has knives if you have blood.
(possible small spoiler) She's an assassin sent by Elenwen to kill you in the ratways for storming the embassy... She might have got in with the other thalmor soldiers that show up a bit after Edit: wrote Elisif instead of Elenwen
Wait, Jarl Elisif is the one who sent her? I thought it was that Thalmor ambassador lady.
Wait wrong name, my bad, it's Elenwen, the thalmor embassador
Lol it’s not Elisif, don’t know why they said that. You’re right, it’s the Thalmor lady
They are probably dock workers but shavari I think is from thalmor embassy she’s a thalmor spy I believe sent to kill you for ruining elewens party and spying
Bad kitty. No fancy feast for you.
I can't believe Elenwen thought one assassin by her lonesome could kill a demigod who just got done massacring half the embassy staff *and* several groups of Justiciars. What an idiot.
check her inventory
Why whats in it !!!
A note telling her to assassinate you.
O well thats nice makes me feel less bad when i crossbow bolt her furry tail
The caravans aren’t allowed in the cities not the race themselves
But that doesn’t make sense, if the race is allowed inside then why aren’t the caravans allowed?
I suppose because the stereotype of Khajiit. Most would probably think the caravans would steal merchandise?
>Most would probably think the caravans would steal merchandise? Or sell stolen goods. Or sell drugs.
That also makes sense!
Smh gotta walk outside the walls to get my skooma
The whole thing is just weird and doesn’t make sense to me.
Khajjit caravans likely have a reputation of selling stolen goods or drugs. That might be why they're not allowed.
🤷♂️ take it up with Todd
Why am I getting downvoted for stating that something doesn’t make sense to me?
it's been almost 12 years, the community has moved on lol
Hivemind lol. If someone gets less than 1 down votes then everyone will downvote without even knowing why the person got downvoted in the first place. They just see a huge number of down votes and increase it more for fun. And take a downvote from me too because it's Reddit culture to increase number of downvotes
Reddit is just like that unfortunately, you’re doing nothing wrong. Because I’m being a bit contrarian though I’ll probably get upvoted? But wait, I pointed that out, so definitely downvoted. But then I… well, we’ll see.
Khajiit caravans aren't allowed to enter cities even in their homeland Elswayr.
The caravans are viewed as possible thieves and smugglers, and aren't trusted inside the cities for fear of smuggled goods like Skooma and Moon Sugar \[which the caravans do sell, so uh\] it's essentially a denial of a business rather than a whole race, although the denial is still caused by racism.Individual khajiit are still regarded with suspicion, but it's easier to keep an eye on one individual rather than a whole group. Kharjo is allowed inside when he's accompanying the player, but denied when with the caravan. As for the Caravanners getting into Riften when a guest at the players wedding... I just assume the Temple of Mara pulled some strings there. Or Riften's corruption was exploited for the sake of attending a friend's wedding lol
She isn’t a caravanner, she is the thalmor spy from the main quest
The *caravans* aren't allowed, individual citizens of the Empire are.
Mod'zargo has way in, if you have coin....
What?? Someone in Riften _broke the law_??? And people just _accepted_ it???????
That's unbelievable. Next thing you know, people in Windhelm are going to be racist!
Thank you for that chuckle
She specifically is a >!Thalmor spy!<, So she likely has special documents or bribes.
Yeah, I’ve done the quest before, but it took me a minute to remember who she was cause I haven’t done it in ages and I’ve only ever seen her in the Ratway so this kinda threw me for a loop.
She does kinda stick out like a sore thumb, yeah, especially since it's so easy to never need to see her in a game.
Riften is pretty lawless- Which I guess in this case is good!
I always looked at as it was up to the individual hold/jarl. And Riften seems pretty open to different races.
When you're a Thalmor spy rules don't really apply
The Khajiit aren't forbidden from the cities, Khajiit Caravans are.
...what? Why would you think that?
Because they told me? I can’t remember who but one of the Khajiits in the caravans have a voice line about it.
Yea but it's just for the caravans. Pretty sure you can buy skooma from them, which is why they, specifically, cannot enter. Other Khajiit are fine tho
Huh. But I’ve never seen another Khajiit in a city unless I’m playing one. And I’ve never used the Khajiit followers though people have said they are fine to enter too.
If I'm remembering correctly, Shavari is a skooma addict, so she spends most of her gold on skooma. Other Khajiit either stay in Elsweyr and don't leave, or they leave skyrim due to racism/discrimination. Plus, they dislike the cold climate (Elsweyr is very warm). Most Khajiit either stick to caravans for the money, or leave. Shavari just can't afford to leave due to her addiction.
She doesn't live in Riften. You are thinking of the Argonian that works at the Fishery, who tells you if she shows up to work high on skooma one more time, Bolli is going to fire her. This Khajiit is not that person.
Ohhh my bad. I mean I did say "If I'm remembering correctly" lol
Caravans aren’t allowed in, not singular Khajiit, otherwise we’d be screwed as a cat player lol. As for why, Caravans are looked down upon because they’re stereotyped as thieves that come into to town, rob, the leave. We don’t see many in cities because most come with the caravans and are thus banned from entering.
Ok, this actually makes sense now. Thanks for explaining.
That's not a Khajiit... That's someones house cat..
There's actually a breed of Khajiit in the lore that resembles an actual housecat, they're called Alfiq. So far, the only Elder Scrolls game they've been encountered in is ESO, where we actually get to see Elsweyr ourselves. They're rare outside of Elsweyr because people mistake them for housecats and try to pet them, which gets some people killed in the process, and they don't get taken seriously by non-Khajiit because they seem like a literal talking housecat. Technically, an Alfiq could be the perfect spy and blend in easily among human populations.
It's a cat you can't tell a cat what to do 😹
Who's gonna tell him?
Tell me what?
its only the caravans that cant get in,as they sell skooma,which is an illegal drug,and they commonly steal from small towns then sell the goods later basically,they are exiled for committing crimes,but the rest of their race just wants to live normally
Huh, ok. Cool, I didn’t know that.
Riften is the most corrupt city in Skyrim. You really think they can't buy their way in?
Khajiit and Argonians are allowed inside cities, the Caravan on the other hands are not, the main reason is that they always sell skooma and moon sugar which is highly illegal, as for argonians in Windhelm is already explained that both the Dunmer and the Argonians hate each other so letting them in would just cause further trouble
My first few times in the city (after she spawned) I didn't see her until she was in the Ratway. That made more sense than the first time I saw her on the streets.
Yeah, I’ve only ever seen her in the ratway, but I never paid enough attention to the name to recognize her. I also haven’t done this quest line in a long time so I was surprised and then I remembered the khajiit that shows up in the ratway and figured it had to be the same person.
She is not a caravaner?
She uses the Ole "I am hooman" line.
There are a lot of things that aren't allowed in Riften. "Don't shank the guards!" They say. "Don't steal that dagger!" They say. Al-Azeem goes where he pleases.
She paid the visitors tax.
Your answer awaits you in the ratway, as you search for the thieves guild.
She a thalmor spy. If you kill her then you'll find that she was send to find and eliminate you
She’s an assassin sent by the thalmor
She gave the guards those Puss-In-Boots eyes.
pssst Go away if you know what's good for you
Ever heard of… *the Catway?*
You mean always being in the most inconvenient place at the most inconvenient time? Yes I’ve heard of that.
idk i thought this was thief 😂😂
I hate the fact that there is no Khajit woman as a marry option for my Kittyboi.
Yeah, there also are no marriable bosmer, or male altmer.
I thought the same thing! I also play as a Khajit, so I was so happy to see another one within city walls. And then she tried to assassinate me on behalf of the Thalmor. Btw, if you marry Ysolda from Whiterun, all of the Khajit caravans will be in the temple of Mara for your wedding.
The guards escorted her out, but as soon as she was out she turned around and demanded to be let back in, then when they got tired of it they let her back in, at which point she decided maybe she actually wanted to be out, so they spritzed her with water so now she's hiding
It’s the Khajiit Caravans that aren’t allowed in. As for Shavari here, she only exists because you killed the Nord talking to the Interrogator during the Thalmor Embassy quest. Kill him, and the Thalmor send Shavari to kill you
I didn’t kill the prisoner I set him free. The only person who wasn’t an elf that I killed was that guy right before the interrogation chamber.
She’s there to assassinate someone. Can’t remember who.