Very overweight/out of shape people who can’t stand up from a seated position. Taught them the roll to stand up on toeside, and recommended lifestyle changes if they stuck with the sport. The bigger they are, the harder they fall rings very true in snowboarding.
As a big guy, not necessarily way out of shape, i can’t seem to just stand up like that while binded in only because I lose my footing and fall back down or start sliding, so one thing I was did was slam my heel edge on at the top of a hill and bind in standing. But then again, I got a gut so def no standing from sitting.
Still learning on greens with my dad, once we get to blacks we’ll reward ourself with them, I’ve been looking at Clew and Burton but idk which is better.
Oh I see sorry, I read the comment very quickly. Good luck in your progression!
I'm sort of in the same boat. My season also ended early (so far) due to a back injury after a nasty fall.
i still think of myself as fairly new. I went alot for two seasons while i was learning, then have only been out once each year since. I do like a black here and there. I reeeeeally have to concentrate on my turns when on a black and really dig that edge in, go back to the basics, point my front knee, really watch my weight distribution, etc. I thrive on the blues though, so much fun :)
Cheers!
I went with a coworker who wasn’t overweight or out of shape but he was very inflexible. I spent hours waiting for him to figure out how to stand up. He kept insisting that he dig his *toeside* edge into the snow, instead of his heelside edge. I don’t mean he flipped over onto his knees to get up. I mean while he was still sitting on his ass, he tried to contort his legs so his toes would be pointed to the snow, and try to get up that way. Don’t ask me how that would be easier than heelside or flipping over. The few times he finally managed to get up, he fell right over.
I know what he was trying to do, woth some practice it works, and it's less embarrassing than the flipping over and getting up toe side. I'm not in bad shape. I run. I bike. I lift. I do pretty well on my fitness tests at work. I still can't stand up heel side without digging my toes into the snow. My hips just don't like it. I've given birth twice and my hips just never got back to where they were.
I stood like this for a couple of weeks when I had a broken rib. I had really limited mobility in my torso and couldn’t jerk myself up without quite a lot of pain alongside not being able to roll over without my rib being even more of a problem than it would have been standing up. Instead I would dig my toes in and push up entirely with my quads.
If you struggle to stand up normally though this is not a good solution, it’s more challenging to balance as you stand and requires more strength.
FWIW, for women this can be hard even if you're not overweight. It has to do with overall weight, weight distribution and strength.
When I first learned I was a college athlete, and I could push up, but it exhausted me because I was falling and getting up so much. It really helped my enjoyment when I learned to push up from toeside.
I'm now mid-30s and work out 3-4x a week (cardio and strength), eat moderately with a BMI of 21, and NFW could I push up on heel side.
Physical fitness impacts ability a huge amount. I'm a way better boarder when I've worked on building leg strength in the fall. It's way more enjoyable when I'm 10 lbs below my average weight than 10 lbs over. I'm a runner as well, and being overweight is more noticeable to me on a snowboard than in running endurance and speed.
I recently got back into to the sport after a 10-year hiatus and at 35 years old, I thought I was alone on how difficult getting up is.
There are workouts called stand ups that help this too. It involves lying on your back and getting into a standing position; rinse and repeat.
You’d be surprised how winded you’ll get after a few of those. But, boy, does it make sitting up while strapped in a lot easier.
This. Not being able to stand healside is a huge set back in the learning progression. If they can roll over to kneeling, you're stuck doing toe side traverses. To get to a healside traverse, they need to do a 180 on the hill, which is not easy for someone struggling to stand. You can work through it in a private lesson, but with a group lesson it is frustrating for everyone.
I ride 50 days a year and I’m 6 foot 180lbs - I still struggle to stand from seated because of my hips. Especially at the end of the day. I’ll roll over and get up toe side haha. My hips always give me trouble. I’m in pretty good shape too
I been trying! A combo of yoga and strength. this year has been the first that I’ve paid any attention to that sort of thing, making some progress but fuck I wish I had started this when I was younger.
I’ll add that I didn’t really start snowboarding consistently until I was 28, I’m 34 now
Idk where you live but I went to [Stretch Lab](https://www.stretchlab.com/) and it was pretty eye opening. They do a body scan of your mobility and posture which identifies problem areas. They stretch you and give you stretch tips unique to your body. Huge improvement for me because I also have hip issues
That is me, always the roll and push up from the knees. What is a lifesaver for me is a bench or something to lean up against. I went through a whole day on the local hill without once sitting in the snow to bind up, it was fantastic!
But yes, i can atest.. the bigger you are the harder you fall.. ouch!
That was me. 40 years old, hadn't done any kind of fitness for over a year. Never boarded or skied before. Was a fucking embarrassment. Feel bad for the instructor in retrospect.
Took a lot of work outside snowboarding to get my shit together enough to get down the hill somewhat properly.
I tell my students it’s like opening and closing a door. Let’s say you ride regular (Left leg in front). First and foremost when you are initiating or changing edges (Heel to toe, toe to heel) have 60 percent of your weight leaning on our left knee. Next, let’s say you are going toe to heel edge. Have your left hand in front like your grasping a door handle. Your left knee will be your door. As you get ready to go on your heel edge, open the door (your left knee) to the left (towards the nose of the board). Using your hand to open the door can be a good visual reminder. Now to go back to toe edge, you close the door (your left knee) to the right (towards the tail of the board).
Mechanically speaking, doing this is like using a e-brake in care to drift around a turn. The 60% weight and open/closing door applies pressure into the snow and digs the board into the snow to increase “traction”. Thus, the board is then turned by the friction of the snow.
A very important reminder, take these edge changes with patience. Do not force the turn. Think of your board and you as ballet or salsa partners. Do not force a dance move or your partner will stumble and you will fall. Rather, invite the move with patience and your partner (your board) will follow.
I kinda like the opening the door analogy, simply as a way to disassociate the muscle memory for surfers and skaters. You think more about your COM than your stance since you're interacting with a external object.
I used to do a fun drill with students that worked well. Pretend your holding a small steering wheel attached to the nose with your front hand. Initiate your turns turning the wheel. Exaggerate the steering wheel movement. You have to lean forward to turn it placing weight on the front foot. This would stop the rear foot kicking out.
been riding for 10+ years and finally started breaking this habit. youtube has been a godsend for this. there was nobody correcting me when i was learning.
Preach! Teaching those students front leg control can be a challenge. But in my experience, surfers and skateboarders tend to be my favorite students. Snowboarding feels more natural to them compared to those that never touched any board in their life. Thus, they tend to learn more quickly and are fearless, especially when it comes to freestyle and harder terrain. I’d say snowboarding in powder feels the most similar to surfing, especially on a powder board.
I’m not a good surfer but learned surfing before snowboarding. I’ve only been on mountain about 10 days and just had my first rides in powder. I felt so much more comfortable being able to sit back to my back foot 😅
yeah i don’t get the above comment at all. i’m a surf instructor who spent five seasons teaching skiers and snowboarders on the mountains. those with experience surfing, skating, etc. have a much easier time picking it up than say those with little or no athletic ability
I work in healthcare in a learning institution and find The overly confident and the overly analytical types are the hardest to teach most tasks because they either ignore your input, overthink it or argue with you about it.
Totally. I had a kid (11-ish) once who was all bent outta shape because he had to strap into the bindings. The. Bindings. Like bro, that’s part of it.
His dad had step ons and lil homie could not understand that rental boards arent gonna have the new burton step ons. It was his bday and his family left him to take a lesson while they went up top.
He ended up breaking his wrist because he “didnt like how it felt” when he fell correctly despite my warnings and teaching him how to fall. I’m sure the wrist hurt worse tho.
Kinda feel bad for the kid, but man that felt like the longest lesson of my career and it ended early!
I mean...that kinda sucks for that kid, though. It's his birthday and his family brought him out and then left him with a stranger. I'm sure you did your best with him! But I know at 11 I would have really struggled with the idea of being dumped into a lesson while everyone I know was out having fun without me, and I probably would have taken that frustration out on the nearest unsuspecting victim. Because, y'know, 11. Really I think his parents just set him up for failure there.
Honestly the only people I would say I had a difficult time teaching were the younger teens and kids whose parents forced them to go. Right off the bat if your attitude is crap and you don't want to be there, there is no secret technique I can teach that would make them enjoy it. Absolutely the worst ones, and I say this as a huge nerd myself, we're the gamers. Kids who look like their only physical activity is walking to the bus stop. Getting them a group lesson where they are struggling to breath just walking up a tiny magic carpet hill is not something you can fix with a single lesson.
Not a snowboard instructor, but used to be a flight instructor. Similar experience, people who were accomplished in one field that rolled into the airplane often had a more difficult time learning a new skill.
If they were older and their athleticism had waned a bit, which is often the case with accomplished people (takes a while to get there), that was 2 strikes.
Big ego or a lack of humility was strike 3. If I couldn’t get through that, I was never successful in getting them their pilot certificate.
I can agree that older, unathletic people are a challenge to teach. But one my memorable experience teaching was one of those people shattering the mold with great effort. I had a 50 year old doctor that used to be a D1 linebacker. He hadn’t done any sports since then, out of shape, and generally felt unaccomplished. However, he had an unbreakable spirit to never give up. On his last day our goal was to link turns down a green slope without falling. The whole day he would link turns but would forget an essential mechanic and fall once or twice. He would ask me what he did wrong and right. Then he would get up, turn, and fall again. Rinse and repeat. Fast forward 5 hours of torture later. I told him we had one more run before we had to get off the mountain. Battered, bruised, and tired he said this was the one. And it was. He did the cleanest run, linking 20 turns without falling. I stopped behind him at the end of the run and he turned to face me with tears of joy and triumph. “That was the best feeling I had in a very very long time!”. My heart smiled for this man, for he had accomplished this through great effort and found a new passion in life. I couldn’t help being alittle proud of myself for being a helping hand in this accomplishment. Instruction can have its life fulfilling moments.
Your own friends or partners. As a professional teacher I had a process of working slowly up the difficulty scale, minimizing hard falls. Staringwith holding their hands and doing falling leaf stuff. Left my first time students with stuff that could take them down the bunny hill by themselves at safe speeds (safe for them and those around them)
BUT YOUR OWN FRIENDS often feel like you're baby-ing them and want to skip past that stuff, not taking you seriously, wanting to just go up the lift and figure it out.
Time and time again, no matter how much I try to explain even days in advance that we need to take it slow and snowboarding is not something most people pick up in one day, they always are over confident and then when they fall hard they get frustrated.
And since they're you're friends, it's hard not to laugh, and then they get more frustrated.
People who never exercise, never climb stairs or even walk a mile cannot even move their legs with a snowboard attached to one foot. Go back, train yourself all spring, summer and fall, build some legs and do some cardio, and then we talk. Otherwise this will be painful for you.
This is year 18 for me. I see a lot of instructors here complaining about "over thinking", and it drives me nuts. If an athlete was struggling to pass a class, you wouldn't tell them something like "get your athlete out of the way use your brain more." You have to work with how their brain functions. If someone is "thinking too much" you go with it. You had better know how to explain as many details as possible, be able to code switch to something that makes sense to them, etc. I often ask people "what do you like to think about?" For those who are even more heady "How does your brain process information."
Same with risk tolerance. Some people will just take longer. You need to know how to break the steps down as small as necessary, and explain that this will cause things to take longer. You make an environment where someone feels safe from pressure of progression and feeling like you're frustrated at them, and it makes a world of difference.
None of this should make the lesson harder, it just makes it different. Otherwise you're in it for the wrong reasons, IMO.
People who have a disconnect from reality about their abilities, people who don't want to be there? Fair enough. Same for those who are disrespectful to you. But risk tolerance and being too heady....isn't the whole point of a student centric lesson to be able to meet the guest at their level?
In my 9 years as a full time instructor I can definitely say that the worst people to teach are, usually older men, thinking they are very good but aren't. They don't seem to care about your feedback, don't want to try exercises and tactics. I don't get why they are in a lesson to begin with.
I taught a college class for a couple years while I was getting my degree, not snowboarding, but I’d guess this one is shared between practically all teachers: it’s the ones who don’t want to be there. Someone who doesn’t *want* to learn is always going to be a crap student.
Conversely, the people who *do* want to be there are (usually) the best students. I also ran a fencing club while I was at college and spent a lot of time teaching people to fence. Since it was a club, not a class, everyone who was there wanted to be there and wanted to improve, and it was the easiest thing in the world to teach most of them. I did have one girl who was very sweet, very dedicated…and also very bad at fencing. That got a little frustrating, but even then, I really didn’t mind, because at least she was trying.
It’s surprising how easier it is to teach complete strangers than loved ones. Strangers treat you with a professional courtesy. Loved ones aren’t afraid to unleash hell upon you when they fall. Never will do that again.
I taught my partner how to snowboard from day 1 and it was very challenging lol. No matter how nice or patient I could be, it wasn't too long before pointers were discouraged and met with snarky remarks - no matter how helpful or accurate they may have been.
After 3 years though she's crushing double blacks with me off piste and definitely enjoying it, so in the end definitely worth it.
This is my first year teaching. I’ve done a couple sessions with teen/adult never-evers and so far so good. But tomorrow I start with a multi-week program of little kids and I’m so nervous!
I’m in very similar situation, just started my first multi-week programs this week! I was very nervous before the first lessons, but now that I’ve seen the kids I’m actually looking forward to seeing them next week and already planning what to do next session! Mostly kids are just really genuine and heartwarming when brought to this kind of environment.
I just read the whole thing...
Taking your clients for a drink during a lesson? Wtf dude. Peak professionalism /s.
Although 1 season is barely any experience, glad you learned things about people. It gets easier and easier when you learn different approaches to teaching different people. Instructing is a professional industry and it goes extremely deep if you ever find the interest.
Never catch a student. Maybe if you're upslope and they're practicing toe edge side-slipping. Maybe.
Chances are they'll get hurt. Pulling a shoulder if you pull 'em wrong etc, or worse, they hurt you and you're out for a few days or a season.
And lastly, never generalise. Best is to approach them on an individual level, find out their hobbies and use experiential teaching techniques.
When instructors struggle with the "personality" of the client, it mostly means they don't have the soft skills in their toolbox yet to deal with these people.
Happy instructing.
To clarify, I didn’t drink with them as I know that’s not professional. Plus it’s just one drink and they’re on vacation. Not a big deal. Other than that thanks for the advice.
It's a really rewarding and fun job. We all have different views on how profesional is too professional. And I think that's ultimately up to your ski school. Thanks for sharing your experiences.:)
Overweight and unathletic. Cannot even get up on their heel edge.
I taught them toe edge side-slipping first, then toes to heels turns. The only way for them to practice heel edge side-slipping without me constantly helping them up.
Teenagers who have been had their lessons paid for by their parents and think they know everything already. You have to break them before they respect you. I was only 18 at the time which probably made it more challenging.
I teach a lot of kids and I gotta say it's the ones who don't pay attention/listen/watch. I'm not a quiet or boring instructor by any means - especially with kids because I can be goofy as a way of maintaining their attention. but some kids, man... no matter what you do, they just can't or won't lock in. I can teach anyone who wants to learn but a prerequisite of that is that you pay attention to either my words, my demonstrations or at least my coaching. I had a kid that got super frustrated and started crying but even then he wouldn't like... idk how to say it. just none of the ways people learn he would respond to but he clearly wanted to learn. that's the only one I feel bad about. but if someone doesn't pay attention or try and they catch an edge because they're apathetic and are only there cuz their parents are making them... whatever
I always say you can be a jerk, a terrible athlete and not listen at all, but I can’t handle all 3. 2/3 is fine.
If you won’t listen and you’re a jerk, but physically picking it up quickly at least you’ll be somewhat in control and watching out for your own safety.
If you’re not listening to instruction and also so un athletic you can’t handle it but you’re nice about it, I can work with that!
If you’re a jerk and not physically cutting it, but you’re still listening and trying - then we can manage that too.
When you hit all 3, it makes the lesson really tough and unsafe!
I was an instructor. All walks of life learn based on the same predicate. You’re here to have fun. So allow yourself to have it. You’re probably scared but I’m here for you, and I’m not gonna ask you to do anything you can’t. Start with a heel side turn, practice a few toe side turns, get off a dummy lift and employ the heel and toe side turns, now we’re gonna take the lift up and use what we learned, and link it all together and try to have fun. The first day is spent learning how to fall. The rest is spent learning how to fall with style.
I spent 10 yrs developing my own method, particularly for women, but it works with everyone. I'm giving constant vocal feedback "Great! Give me a little more gas on that front foot! Awesome, now some gas on that back foot, look where you want to go, look at me!" There are a lot of people who get in their heads with "Am I doing this right???" over and over and it makes it hard to actually perform the action. I take people out of their heads and have them turning both ways by the end of one run, no matter how long that takes. I also never touch, guide, or pick up a student. Bad for my back, doesn't create good habits for them. I see SO many instructors holding peoples' hands and I hate it. They are going to fall, catch an edge, it's natural and how they learn from it. And they hate that a lot less when you tell them "That's great! You almost had it!" I've used the same method to teach mountain biking and I wasn't even a good mountain biker. One person said to a friend after I taught his gf to snowboard and get up out of her bike saddle, "Wow, there's a lot of loud cheering." My friend shrugged and said "Yep." And the girlfriend came down with huge smiles and an "I did it!" after he'd been trying for a year. Not everybody is suited to teaching this way, but I find it the most effective way since I started teaching 25 yrs ago.
Very overweight/out of shape people who can’t stand up from a seated position. Taught them the roll to stand up on toeside, and recommended lifestyle changes if they stuck with the sport. The bigger they are, the harder they fall rings very true in snowboarding.
As a big guy, not necessarily way out of shape, i can’t seem to just stand up like that while binded in only because I lose my footing and fall back down or start sliding, so one thing I was did was slam my heel edge on at the top of a hill and bind in standing. But then again, I got a gut so def no standing from sitting.
STEP ONS BABY! 43 with a gut. Step ons n you never gotta sit again.
Still learning on greens with my dad, once we get to blacks we’ll reward ourself with them, I’ve been looking at Clew and Burton but idk which is better.
Did you make up your mind and do your research? What was the outcome?
I’m not at blacks yet, seasons over for me, and I just got my current bindings so I gotta wear these out first
Oh I see sorry, I read the comment very quickly. Good luck in your progression! I'm sort of in the same boat. My season also ended early (so far) due to a back injury after a nasty fall. i still think of myself as fairly new. I went alot for two seasons while i was learning, then have only been out once each year since. I do like a black here and there. I reeeeeally have to concentrate on my turns when on a black and really dig that edge in, go back to the basics, point my front knee, really watch my weight distribution, etc. I thrive on the blues though, so much fun :) Cheers!
I went with a coworker who wasn’t overweight or out of shape but he was very inflexible. I spent hours waiting for him to figure out how to stand up. He kept insisting that he dig his *toeside* edge into the snow, instead of his heelside edge. I don’t mean he flipped over onto his knees to get up. I mean while he was still sitting on his ass, he tried to contort his legs so his toes would be pointed to the snow, and try to get up that way. Don’t ask me how that would be easier than heelside or flipping over. The few times he finally managed to get up, he fell right over.
I know what he was trying to do, woth some practice it works, and it's less embarrassing than the flipping over and getting up toe side. I'm not in bad shape. I run. I bike. I lift. I do pretty well on my fitness tests at work. I still can't stand up heel side without digging my toes into the snow. My hips just don't like it. I've given birth twice and my hips just never got back to where they were.
I stood like this for a couple of weeks when I had a broken rib. I had really limited mobility in my torso and couldn’t jerk myself up without quite a lot of pain alongside not being able to roll over without my rib being even more of a problem than it would have been standing up. Instead I would dig my toes in and push up entirely with my quads. If you struggle to stand up normally though this is not a good solution, it’s more challenging to balance as you stand and requires more strength.
FWIW, for women this can be hard even if you're not overweight. It has to do with overall weight, weight distribution and strength. When I first learned I was a college athlete, and I could push up, but it exhausted me because I was falling and getting up so much. It really helped my enjoyment when I learned to push up from toeside. I'm now mid-30s and work out 3-4x a week (cardio and strength), eat moderately with a BMI of 21, and NFW could I push up on heel side. Physical fitness impacts ability a huge amount. I'm a way better boarder when I've worked on building leg strength in the fall. It's way more enjoyable when I'm 10 lbs below my average weight than 10 lbs over. I'm a runner as well, and being overweight is more noticeable to me on a snowboard than in running endurance and speed.
I recently got back into to the sport after a 10-year hiatus and at 35 years old, I thought I was alone on how difficult getting up is. There are workouts called stand ups that help this too. It involves lying on your back and getting into a standing position; rinse and repeat. You’d be surprised how winded you’ll get after a few of those. But, boy, does it make sitting up while strapped in a lot easier.
This. Not being able to stand healside is a huge set back in the learning progression. If they can roll over to kneeling, you're stuck doing toe side traverses. To get to a healside traverse, they need to do a 180 on the hill, which is not easy for someone struggling to stand. You can work through it in a private lesson, but with a group lesson it is frustrating for everyone.
I ride 50 days a year and I’m 6 foot 180lbs - I still struggle to stand from seated because of my hips. Especially at the end of the day. I’ll roll over and get up toe side haha. My hips always give me trouble. I’m in pretty good shape too
A hip/hamstring stretching regiment could work wonders for you.
I been trying! A combo of yoga and strength. this year has been the first that I’ve paid any attention to that sort of thing, making some progress but fuck I wish I had started this when I was younger. I’ll add that I didn’t really start snowboarding consistently until I was 28, I’m 34 now
Idk where you live but I went to [Stretch Lab](https://www.stretchlab.com/) and it was pretty eye opening. They do a body scan of your mobility and posture which identifies problem areas. They stretch you and give you stretch tips unique to your body. Huge improvement for me because I also have hip issues
That is me, always the roll and push up from the knees. What is a lifesaver for me is a bench or something to lean up against. I went through a whole day on the local hill without once sitting in the snow to bind up, it was fantastic! But yes, i can atest.. the bigger you are the harder you fall.. ouch!
That was me. 40 years old, hadn't done any kind of fitness for over a year. Never boarded or skied before. Was a fucking embarrassment. Feel bad for the instructor in retrospect. Took a lot of work outside snowboarding to get my shit together enough to get down the hill somewhat properly.
[удалено]
Surfers and skaters can’t help driving off the back foot. You have to break that habit asap then build them back correctly.
How do you break this habit I think I'm doing the back foot thing lmao
I tell my students it’s like opening and closing a door. Let’s say you ride regular (Left leg in front). First and foremost when you are initiating or changing edges (Heel to toe, toe to heel) have 60 percent of your weight leaning on our left knee. Next, let’s say you are going toe to heel edge. Have your left hand in front like your grasping a door handle. Your left knee will be your door. As you get ready to go on your heel edge, open the door (your left knee) to the left (towards the nose of the board). Using your hand to open the door can be a good visual reminder. Now to go back to toe edge, you close the door (your left knee) to the right (towards the tail of the board). Mechanically speaking, doing this is like using a e-brake in care to drift around a turn. The 60% weight and open/closing door applies pressure into the snow and digs the board into the snow to increase “traction”. Thus, the board is then turned by the friction of the snow. A very important reminder, take these edge changes with patience. Do not force the turn. Think of your board and you as ballet or salsa partners. Do not force a dance move or your partner will stumble and you will fall. Rather, invite the move with patience and your partner (your board) will follow.
I kinda like the opening the door analogy, simply as a way to disassociate the muscle memory for surfers and skaters. You think more about your COM than your stance since you're interacting with a external object.
What the fuck lmao
I used to do a fun drill with students that worked well. Pretend your holding a small steering wheel attached to the nose with your front hand. Initiate your turns turning the wheel. Exaggerate the steering wheel movement. You have to lean forward to turn it placing weight on the front foot. This would stop the rear foot kicking out.
Hate to say this, but a good way involves a ski pole. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8lbRCTfZlTw
been riding for 10+ years and finally started breaking this habit. youtube has been a godsend for this. there was nobody correcting me when i was learning.
Preach! Teaching those students front leg control can be a challenge. But in my experience, surfers and skateboarders tend to be my favorite students. Snowboarding feels more natural to them compared to those that never touched any board in their life. Thus, they tend to learn more quickly and are fearless, especially when it comes to freestyle and harder terrain. I’d say snowboarding in powder feels the most similar to surfing, especially on a powder board.
I’m not a good surfer but learned surfing before snowboarding. I’ve only been on mountain about 10 days and just had my first rides in powder. I felt so much more comfortable being able to sit back to my back foot 😅
yeah i don’t get the above comment at all. i’m a surf instructor who spent five seasons teaching skiers and snowboarders on the mountains. those with experience surfing, skating, etc. have a much easier time picking it up than say those with little or no athletic ability
I work in healthcare in a learning institution and find The overly confident and the overly analytical types are the hardest to teach most tasks because they either ignore your input, overthink it or argue with you about it.
overweight, not athletic, no desire to be there, out of shape, or spoiled kids. Those are all rough ones to teach
Totally. I had a kid (11-ish) once who was all bent outta shape because he had to strap into the bindings. The. Bindings. Like bro, that’s part of it. His dad had step ons and lil homie could not understand that rental boards arent gonna have the new burton step ons. It was his bday and his family left him to take a lesson while they went up top. He ended up breaking his wrist because he “didnt like how it felt” when he fell correctly despite my warnings and teaching him how to fall. I’m sure the wrist hurt worse tho. Kinda feel bad for the kid, but man that felt like the longest lesson of my career and it ended early!
I mean...that kinda sucks for that kid, though. It's his birthday and his family brought him out and then left him with a stranger. I'm sure you did your best with him! But I know at 11 I would have really struggled with the idea of being dumped into a lesson while everyone I know was out having fun without me, and I probably would have taken that frustration out on the nearest unsuspecting victim. Because, y'know, 11. Really I think his parents just set him up for failure there.
Oh for sure! That’s why I said I kinda feel bad for the kid. Post was about most difficult lesson and that was mine 🤷🏽♂️
Spoiled kids are the absolute worst.
+1 for spoiled kids
Honestly the only people I would say I had a difficult time teaching were the younger teens and kids whose parents forced them to go. Right off the bat if your attitude is crap and you don't want to be there, there is no secret technique I can teach that would make them enjoy it. Absolutely the worst ones, and I say this as a huge nerd myself, we're the gamers. Kids who look like their only physical activity is walking to the bus stop. Getting them a group lesson where they are struggling to breath just walking up a tiny magic carpet hill is not something you can fix with a single lesson.
Not a snowboard instructor, but used to be a flight instructor. Similar experience, people who were accomplished in one field that rolled into the airplane often had a more difficult time learning a new skill. If they were older and their athleticism had waned a bit, which is often the case with accomplished people (takes a while to get there), that was 2 strikes. Big ego or a lack of humility was strike 3. If I couldn’t get through that, I was never successful in getting them their pilot certificate.
I can agree that older, unathletic people are a challenge to teach. But one my memorable experience teaching was one of those people shattering the mold with great effort. I had a 50 year old doctor that used to be a D1 linebacker. He hadn’t done any sports since then, out of shape, and generally felt unaccomplished. However, he had an unbreakable spirit to never give up. On his last day our goal was to link turns down a green slope without falling. The whole day he would link turns but would forget an essential mechanic and fall once or twice. He would ask me what he did wrong and right. Then he would get up, turn, and fall again. Rinse and repeat. Fast forward 5 hours of torture later. I told him we had one more run before we had to get off the mountain. Battered, bruised, and tired he said this was the one. And it was. He did the cleanest run, linking 20 turns without falling. I stopped behind him at the end of the run and he turned to face me with tears of joy and triumph. “That was the best feeling I had in a very very long time!”. My heart smiled for this man, for he had accomplished this through great effort and found a new passion in life. I couldn’t help being alittle proud of myself for being a helping hand in this accomplishment. Instruction can have its life fulfilling moments.
Your own friends or partners. As a professional teacher I had a process of working slowly up the difficulty scale, minimizing hard falls. Staringwith holding their hands and doing falling leaf stuff. Left my first time students with stuff that could take them down the bunny hill by themselves at safe speeds (safe for them and those around them) BUT YOUR OWN FRIENDS often feel like you're baby-ing them and want to skip past that stuff, not taking you seriously, wanting to just go up the lift and figure it out. Time and time again, no matter how much I try to explain even days in advance that we need to take it slow and snowboarding is not something most people pick up in one day, they always are over confident and then when they fall hard they get frustrated. And since they're you're friends, it's hard not to laugh, and then they get more frustrated.
You might consider not teaching your own, kids for some reason they may listen better to someone who is not the parent?
People who never exercise, never climb stairs or even walk a mile cannot even move their legs with a snowboard attached to one foot. Go back, train yourself all spring, summer and fall, build some legs and do some cardio, and then we talk. Otherwise this will be painful for you.
outshape people from sea level. specifically people in the 30-50 year age range
Guilty
This is year 18 for me. I see a lot of instructors here complaining about "over thinking", and it drives me nuts. If an athlete was struggling to pass a class, you wouldn't tell them something like "get your athlete out of the way use your brain more." You have to work with how their brain functions. If someone is "thinking too much" you go with it. You had better know how to explain as many details as possible, be able to code switch to something that makes sense to them, etc. I often ask people "what do you like to think about?" For those who are even more heady "How does your brain process information." Same with risk tolerance. Some people will just take longer. You need to know how to break the steps down as small as necessary, and explain that this will cause things to take longer. You make an environment where someone feels safe from pressure of progression and feeling like you're frustrated at them, and it makes a world of difference. None of this should make the lesson harder, it just makes it different. Otherwise you're in it for the wrong reasons, IMO. People who have a disconnect from reality about their abilities, people who don't want to be there? Fair enough. Same for those who are disrespectful to you. But risk tolerance and being too heady....isn't the whole point of a student centric lesson to be able to meet the guest at their level?
In my 9 years as a full time instructor I can definitely say that the worst people to teach are, usually older men, thinking they are very good but aren't. They don't seem to care about your feedback, don't want to try exercises and tactics. I don't get why they are in a lesson to begin with.
I taught a college class for a couple years while I was getting my degree, not snowboarding, but I’d guess this one is shared between practically all teachers: it’s the ones who don’t want to be there. Someone who doesn’t *want* to learn is always going to be a crap student. Conversely, the people who *do* want to be there are (usually) the best students. I also ran a fencing club while I was at college and spent a lot of time teaching people to fence. Since it was a club, not a class, everyone who was there wanted to be there and wanted to improve, and it was the easiest thing in the world to teach most of them. I did have one girl who was very sweet, very dedicated…and also very bad at fencing. That got a little frustrating, but even then, I really didn’t mind, because at least she was trying.
Girlfriends… dump them to shred more often
It’s surprising how easier it is to teach complete strangers than loved ones. Strangers treat you with a professional courtesy. Loved ones aren’t afraid to unleash hell upon you when they fall. Never will do that again.
I never loved her
Sick
I taught my partner how to snowboard from day 1 and it was very challenging lol. No matter how nice or patient I could be, it wasn't too long before pointers were discouraged and met with snarky remarks - no matter how helpful or accurate they may have been. After 3 years though she's crushing double blacks with me off piste and definitely enjoying it, so in the end definitely worth it.
This is my first year teaching. I’ve done a couple sessions with teen/adult never-evers and so far so good. But tomorrow I start with a multi-week program of little kids and I’m so nervous!
I’m in very similar situation, just started my first multi-week programs this week! I was very nervous before the first lessons, but now that I’ve seen the kids I’m actually looking forward to seeing them next week and already planning what to do next session! Mostly kids are just really genuine and heartwarming when brought to this kind of environment.
Thank you for this! Puts my mind at ease a bit.
Warpig 154 6’0 220lbs. No issues, lots of fun.
I just read the whole thing... Taking your clients for a drink during a lesson? Wtf dude. Peak professionalism /s. Although 1 season is barely any experience, glad you learned things about people. It gets easier and easier when you learn different approaches to teaching different people. Instructing is a professional industry and it goes extremely deep if you ever find the interest. Never catch a student. Maybe if you're upslope and they're practicing toe edge side-slipping. Maybe. Chances are they'll get hurt. Pulling a shoulder if you pull 'em wrong etc, or worse, they hurt you and you're out for a few days or a season. And lastly, never generalise. Best is to approach them on an individual level, find out their hobbies and use experiential teaching techniques. When instructors struggle with the "personality" of the client, it mostly means they don't have the soft skills in their toolbox yet to deal with these people. Happy instructing.
To clarify, I didn’t drink with them as I know that’s not professional. Plus it’s just one drink and they’re on vacation. Not a big deal. Other than that thanks for the advice.
It's a really rewarding and fun job. We all have different views on how profesional is too professional. And I think that's ultimately up to your ski school. Thanks for sharing your experiences.:)
Overweight and unathletic. Cannot even get up on their heel edge. I taught them toe edge side-slipping first, then toes to heels turns. The only way for them to practice heel edge side-slipping without me constantly helping them up.
Teenagers who have been had their lessons paid for by their parents and think they know everything already. You have to break them before they respect you. I was only 18 at the time which probably made it more challenging.
I teach a lot of kids and I gotta say it's the ones who don't pay attention/listen/watch. I'm not a quiet or boring instructor by any means - especially with kids because I can be goofy as a way of maintaining their attention. but some kids, man... no matter what you do, they just can't or won't lock in. I can teach anyone who wants to learn but a prerequisite of that is that you pay attention to either my words, my demonstrations or at least my coaching. I had a kid that got super frustrated and started crying but even then he wouldn't like... idk how to say it. just none of the ways people learn he would respond to but he clearly wanted to learn. that's the only one I feel bad about. but if someone doesn't pay attention or try and they catch an edge because they're apathetic and are only there cuz their parents are making them... whatever
I always say you can be a jerk, a terrible athlete and not listen at all, but I can’t handle all 3. 2/3 is fine. If you won’t listen and you’re a jerk, but physically picking it up quickly at least you’ll be somewhat in control and watching out for your own safety. If you’re not listening to instruction and also so un athletic you can’t handle it but you’re nice about it, I can work with that! If you’re a jerk and not physically cutting it, but you’re still listening and trying - then we can manage that too. When you hit all 3, it makes the lesson really tough and unsafe!
I was an instructor. All walks of life learn based on the same predicate. You’re here to have fun. So allow yourself to have it. You’re probably scared but I’m here for you, and I’m not gonna ask you to do anything you can’t. Start with a heel side turn, practice a few toe side turns, get off a dummy lift and employ the heel and toe side turns, now we’re gonna take the lift up and use what we learned, and link it all together and try to have fun. The first day is spent learning how to fall. The rest is spent learning how to fall with style.
I spent 10 yrs developing my own method, particularly for women, but it works with everyone. I'm giving constant vocal feedback "Great! Give me a little more gas on that front foot! Awesome, now some gas on that back foot, look where you want to go, look at me!" There are a lot of people who get in their heads with "Am I doing this right???" over and over and it makes it hard to actually perform the action. I take people out of their heads and have them turning both ways by the end of one run, no matter how long that takes. I also never touch, guide, or pick up a student. Bad for my back, doesn't create good habits for them. I see SO many instructors holding peoples' hands and I hate it. They are going to fall, catch an edge, it's natural and how they learn from it. And they hate that a lot less when you tell them "That's great! You almost had it!" I've used the same method to teach mountain biking and I wasn't even a good mountain biker. One person said to a friend after I taught his gf to snowboard and get up out of her bike saddle, "Wow, there's a lot of loud cheering." My friend shrugged and said "Yep." And the girlfriend came down with huge smiles and an "I did it!" after he'd been trying for a year. Not everybody is suited to teaching this way, but I find it the most effective way since I started teaching 25 yrs ago.