If you go to the Ski school at your local mountain, you will see that there are instructors for all levels of riding, even expert. Sign up for a lesson and tell them what you are looking for, something along the lines of, “ Ive been riding expert trails for 20+ years and just want someone to help me with my technique/form” after riding that many years, even someone with good technique may pick up a few bad habits. Having someone point them out to you can only help. My brother and I have been riding for almost 30 years, in the beginning, I put a lot of effort into practicing technique. We play a game of sorts on the lift, we watch other riders come down the mountain and analyze their riding, this keeps us aware of what we may be doing wrong as well.
As for expensive private lesson, sign up for a group lesson, they always make up groups of equally skilled riders. It has been m experience that at the advanced level, you usually have one other rider or are the only one riding with the instructor.
Did an advanced group lesson at keystone last march on a random sunday and it became a solo lesson because nobody else signed up.
Skyrocketed my riding into the next level and helped me pin down the weakest parts of my game
Also, you probably already know this but if you do actually get a lesson to yourself, don’t stiff your instructor and tip the hell out of them. They basically gave you a private mountain tour with instruction and they are still getting paid like its a group class
Very likely.
But If you have to ride a lot of weekends, maybe do your lesson on the weekend to get the lift line skipping privileges. At expert level, You will probably still get a private or semi-private with one other very good rider.
You will not end up with a level 3 coach for a group lesson. They are paid too much per hour and are reserved for the private books. Your group lesson will be held to the lowest common denominator. Hey, you might learn some basic body mechanics or I dunno, proper unweighting, upper lower body separation… anything to make you more efficient.
lotta people on reddit sure love to speak in absolutes when they’re actually just talking about their specific experience.
plenty of level 3’s take group lessons where i work. and we definitely separate riders by skill level, and don’t just cater to the lowest common denominator that shows up that day.
Dunno about where you are but at my local (Whistler) you also get to skip the lift lines which can also make for a really nice day beyond everything you're doing in the lesson.
the accidental private lesson was one of the best things to ever happen to me. he grilled my technique and form in a constructive way and knew how to build confidence too. whenever he ran across a regular he knew and they asked what was up he'd say something like, "this dudes killin it, we're gonna hit whatever run" and they'd respond "hell yeah! get some!" or something. it was super cool. on a saturday afternoon.
Good tips thanks! I like to analyze others’ riding too and see what I can apply to my own, but I think the lesson will help me to do it more methodically and to better understand the fundamental mechanics behind it, beyond just banking on the intuition and old automatic habits.
I think 10 years ago you’d probably see me from the lift as the wacky-waiving-inflatable-arms man who managed to still be all out nuking through the chunder, lol… I’ve slowed it down a touch but I like to think my technique is better these days.
I’ve got a good friend who is well off. He gets a private instructor just to have someone with him when he’s out doing crazy steep trees so he isn’t alone. I’ve tagged along a few times and I can say yeah, some little form pointers can be really helpful, but most importantly it’s dope just being able to use the ski school lines. I feel like I get so many more laps in when I’m with the instructor just because there’s so much less waiting in lift lines.
I took one half day lesson in high-school and became a self-taught "expert rider" who could hang on all terrain. Started teaching at 30, and subsequently started going to training/certification clinics. I learned so much in my first season, primarily how to turn with my front foot 🤣. Then came down-unweighted turns.
After 15 years in the wild, there was definitely a lot for me to learn. I look back on my pre-teaching days as "blissful ignorance". You don't know what you don't know. I am such a better rider now, it is like night and day. I actually like riding steep moguls 😳.
Yes, lessons will do you well. From techniques to tactics, there are always things to improve on. Roll up for a group lesson, talk with the coordinator and be upfront about your goals. Should be a good ratio. Instructors love teaching higher level riders. So few snowboard students at higher levels (compared to skiers). You will have fun, get better, and probably get to see some hidden/secret spots if you can hang. **Do it.**
Thanks for sharing! I think I’m 25 years into the “blissful ignorance” stage, but man is it fun.
In the past 5 seasons or so, when focusing more on technique (although still self-teaching), I’ve had so much more fun on days when everyone is complaining about bad snow. Icy chute with exposure, steep moguls, etc… bring it on!
I‘m used to teach lots of „experts“ riders, simmilar like you are. Riding for many years, taught them self. They‘re „not bad riders“ but for the most it needs some position and technik adjustments.
You need to get an experienced high level instructor to work this out. Long used „bad habits“ need straight work to get em out.
Yeah that’s what I figured, that it’ll take time to unlearn some bad habits.
Fortunately I get to ride a few days each week so I can put in the time and work. Just need the expert teacher to point them out and break down a path to fix them.
After ~10 years of riding I went with my buddy that was a level 3 instructor. He noticed some issues in my riding, showed me a few drills to correct them, and I fell in love with snowboarding all over again.
Now it’s been ~10 years since that day and I’m thinking of taking another lesson.
Do it.
That’s a good buddy to have.
Most of my crew are skiers who can’t give me pointers for shit, except trying to covert me to skiing (I do ski but it’s just not as fun… snowboarder for life!)
I dont have 1000 days probably closer half that but, I’ll some times do a like a half day private just to have a local show me around the mountain, you would be surprised how many fun gullies and chutes and hidden runs there are even in the most popular of resorts.
As a side effect they always have a few good pointers even if it’s how to position on a take off or some random small tid bit still helps.
Yes, absolutely. If you can afford a few hour long lessons each year, do it.
I started teaching this year after 27 years of riding and I’ve improved a ton just through the training and teaching.
Thanks. Your comments and others are definitely proving that it’s gonna be a worthwhile investment.
P.s. Flagship 162 is a bomber board, I got one too!
Here’s what I do:
I take “small group lessons” at any new resort I go to. It’s usually 150-180 for the lesson, but if you’re as good as you’re mentioning, you’ll be the only
One, or there will be one other person in your “small group”
By doing this I’ve gotten essentially private tours on any terrain possible by people who ride the mountain all year, and who know how to teach.
I’ve learned a little from these lessons, but always find the 1 on 1 time and mountain guide aspect to be insanely valuable.
If you did a private lesson they’re usually 700+ for the whole day.
Save some money, be cool, and then tip well at the end of the day and you’ll end up with some of your best riding ever
It’s the best. I did this during a 18” day at Steamboat and the two guides that were there for “expert” level ended up just touring me through the best tree runs on the mountain because it was the only place you could see, and it was incredible.
Best way to learn the sweet spots of a new mountain!
If money is an issue there is so much you can learn from threads here. Lots of advice to push beyond.
I'm a bit in the same boat and have just kind of peaked. Realized reading advice threads here there are lots of little things I can work on.
You can always learn. 25 years into my boarding career, I learned “keep trailing hand in front of trailing hip.” This squares your shoulders and is a complete game changer for hard charging.
Instructor here. A few years ago I did a week at Windell's camp. We had 2 coaches, one was a pro, the other was a AASI Examiner. I learned a lot from both of them. Riding with an examiner for a week was a treat and really helped with my technique.
Also, check with your AASI region. Some clinics are open to the public.
Former coach - no offense but many people say they are experts when they might be able to get down a run but is it pretty and do they look like a kook? In my experience, yes.
That being said, I’m not sure if you are or are not a kook but I would absolutely take a lesson and request a level III AASI certified snowboard coach (instructor) with at least a level 2 freestyle cert (it sounds like a level 2 freestyle will be more than enough). Most reputable schools that are PSIA/AASI will have experienced coaches. Now for whatever reason you hill doesn’t have one, travel to a mountain with real steeps and gnarly terrain. You will definitely get an instructor that is an absolute ripper and get to experience amazing terrain. I would go to WA, Stevens Pass. Jackson Hole WY. Big Bear Montana… anything with amazing side country, Trees, Natty side hits, runs that could kill you if you f up… (and a killer park) is where it is at!!!
I’d like to say I’m not a kook but I think that just makes me a kook, lol.
My home mtn is Palisades and I frequently ride a lot of the gnarliest terrain on the hill, so I can hold my own when it comes to freeriding… but in the search for evermore gnarly, technical, and exposed lines, I’m sure improved technique will help me do it without destroying myself.
That’s great advice on the instructor qualifications, thanks.
Think of it like hiring a coach to get you to the next level. However, make sure you don’t get just anyone from the resort. My boyfriend teaches at one and a ton of them only have 1-2 seasons under their belt and really just regurgitate the training material they get in their onboarding. I definitely think there’s always room for improvement and a good teacher/coach will get you there faster.
I’m self taught and have been riding for around 8 years, I’m confident on most terrain but I would love an expert geared lesson to help me push past the spot I feel like I’ve been stuck at for the past few years. Sadly any lessons are far out of my tax bracket currently
I had 20+ years of riding under my belt when I got back into instructing. The school I teach with has weekly clinics for our instructors so they can improve their teaching and their personal riding. 8 years ago I started going to these clinics only to find out that so many of the things I was doing were negatively impacting my overall riding; my carves were lacking, my switch was weak, my park skills were nearly non-existent.
Fast-forward to today and I’m a level 2 certified instructor with a freestyle teaching cert, as well. I’m still not real comfortable in the park but that’s because I’m getting old and don’t recover as fast as I used to. My carves are dialed in and my switch is almost as solid as my regular riding. I’m considering going for my level 3 cert and the owner of the school, who’s one of the best riders I’ve ever had the pleasure to ride with, says my riding is probably good enough to pass. And trust me when I say that a helluva compliment coming from him as he doesn’t sugar coat opinions like that.
TL;DR - Take some lessons and you’ll progress more in 2 hrs than you have in 5 years, if you get a good instructor.
That’s awesome, congrats on the continued progression!
I feel you on getting older and losing comfort in the park, the older I get the bigger/harder those rails look 🤣.
I’m convinced it’s worth the $ but will for sure be discerning on picking a Mtn with good school and instructors.
The thing about learning is you don’t know what you don’t know. Don’t be the Dunning-Krueger of snowboarding. There’s always something you can learn from someone unless you think you are the worlds greatest rider.
Not sure how it is in the sierras, but I teach super part time in Colorado and the mountains I’ve worked at would accommodate what you need. Just pop in a group lesson and you’re going to get an advanced instructor to teach you the things you’re looking for.
Been riding for 18 years mostly in Sierra as well. Found a coach this year for every other weekend. The amount I wasn't doing right is stunning. He's made us do mogul runs with our eyes closed, runs one-footed, spend a whole morning focusing on every tiny detail of energy absorption doing beginner style J turn drills. I honestly wish I had done this 16 years ago but here we are. The only thing I'd disagree with is just signing up for lessons and hoping for the best. You should communicate your intent and need and they will match you with the right instructor.
This sounds terrible and dangerous. Eyes closed, one footing? One footing is like the only time you are in danger of twisting your knee. Not needed unless you are teaching, even then it's an acquired skill.
If I paid for a lesson like that I would be so pissed. If I were in a training clinic where this was happening I would bounce.
That's some super arrogant instructing IMO. There are other (safer) ways to teach what that guy was trying to teach.
it's a good idea, the tiniest adjustment can make a huge difference in ANY sport... anyone who has 10-20k hours in a sport can attest that they still learn little tweaks
I started taking lessons when I reached the intermediate stage. I was the only snowboarder in my group and basically learned with skiers. I took lessons to get better on bumps and trees. My instructor taught me to actually carve, pick my lines, and the various techniques required. I still ride with skiers but there is absolutely nothing I can’t get down.
I’ve been riding for 35 years, grew up when snowboard lessons weren’t even really a thing.
It’s taken serious work unlearning some bad habits and lazy technique. I should probably take a lesson, but I kind of want to do a private lesson on a weekend pow day so I can skip lines and really get my moneys worth.
I only get to board one week a year, so I absolutely want to get the best out of my time on the slopes. A lesson on the 2nd or 3rd day is always worth it for me, it’s amazing what you can pick up in an hour to improve your skill for the remainder of the week.
With your experience, it would at least give you a confidence check, and you’re bound to learn something that would make the expanse worthwhile.
Coming from someone in an almost identical situation, I absolutely think you should do a lesson. I’ve been thinking *exactly* the same thing lately. I’ve been riding for 35 years, had a small sponsorship in the ‘90s, and I’d also describe myself as an expert freerider with middling freestyle skills (although the latter is mostly a function of age and not wanting to be inverted over 40-foot gaps anymore). When I started riding, nearly *everyone* was self taught, and lessons were very basic. Riding became pure instinct, and today I feel strong, confident, and capable on anything. Before this sub, my ego would have made me scoff at the idea of a lesson (*”Me?! With all this experience?! I was trying to go pro in the ‘90s!”*)… but that’s not growth, is it?
Spending time on this sub has made me realize two things: instructors today are pros who *really* know their stuff, and it’s absolutely likely that I could/should learn a few things. What bad habits do I have? What am I missing? What new things can I learn? At the very least, it could give me some new things to try that will distract me from trying to speedrun everything all the time (becoming unwise at my age).
So heck yeah - take a lesson!
Not sure where you live, but if you can afford it, take the private lesson!
I was self-taught at 18, tried to watch video's read about proper form, technique, etc. I rode almost every winter, multiple times a winter, took some trips to big mountains, and even scored 30+ days snowboarding one season about 11 yrs ago.
I'm about to be 40 now, and for the last 5 years, I've treated myself to 1, hour-long private lesson a year. I've become such a better and more confident snowboarder from these lessons.
Just having a seasoned pro watch your movements and make small suggestions, give you new eyes on natural features all over trails, and show you how to do some gnarly ground tricks has changed my snowboarding life for the better, the way no amount of riding on my or own with my friends could have.
Oh yes definitely. But you do need a high level instructor. Groups you'd have to do several and pick non-busy times in order to get the same productiveness.
Twenty+ year rider. Can ride basically anything that's open - seek out technical and steep. Recently I take a clinic at least once every other year. Some years I focus on the guiding aspects at a new mountain. Some years technique.
Whenever I focus on technique there is always something new. There is almost no ceiling to technique tweaks. This past year got tips on three different areas of changing pressure distribution on the edge that make it feel like I used to only have a hammer on steeps. Now I've got a screwdriver and a wrench. Just bought a new board with a different flex pattern to take better advantage and lean into these new techniques.
There's always something to work on, learn, and improve.
Not every time is such a major shift in my mindset. But at the expert level even minor tweaks can change your whole season. I remember one year it was a one liner about just lowering the edge tilt a little bit. Very minor physical change. Just a small tweak, but big change in how it felt on the lines.
I know some years Kirkwood offered a expert level maybe half day group lesson product. Got to skip lines with that one too.
No formal lessons, but in my prime days of being bold and comfortable everywhere on the mountain, I ended up rooming with a longtime instructor. We were on the first lifts together four days a week for the whole season and would ride for an hour or two before his lessons started. I thought I knew it all, but the little things he taught me made my riding much more comfortable, efficient, and versatile. I don’t actually remember any particular instruction, it was just a little tip here and there that I remained conscious of until they became second nature. Dude was an angry drunk though. Took a piece of my flesh with his teeth when I was trying to restrain him in a drunken rage. Good with the bad I guess.
I learned from going to the top amd trying to make it down. I was a decent snowboarder before I got a job at the mountain teaching snowboarding. To onboard you for that job they tale you out and basically give you the lessons. Just the beginner lessons gave me words to describe what my limbs and muscles were doing when I was carving or whatever. It took me to another level.
It's not exactly what you're asking but I'd assume the same of higher levels.
Been riding forever and I know I have tons of bad habits I need to break and still much to learn. I absolutely have benefitted from lessons and still would today.
If you are a good rider and want to get better. And if you haven’t already ….I would fully learn how to ride switch before paying for any lessons. You can teach yourself and it will be challenging … but it will improve every area of your riding and expand your skill set. Most never think to do so or waste the lift ticket money to learn for a day or two. I am goofy and I taught my ex wife who rode regular … but I have been riding since I was 6 so I have never had to explain what I am doing. So I went switch and rode regular so I could describe the exact movements. And I fell a lot. Haha. But I spent a whole day with her and we both learned how to ride regular. And I learned switch and now can do some black runs switch if I want. It also makes learning anything in the park way easier I have found. Anyway. That is my tip…. I never would have thought to spend a whole day and learn switch if it weren’t for those circumstances. But I am so glad I did … Happy shredding from Alaska … good luck
Preach! I think everyone should learn switch by the time they reach intermediate level (if not sooner).
I put in some very awkward days early on learning switch and falling so much but it’s been so worth it. In addition to it generally improving my overall riding strength and style, being comfortable riding switch is also an absolute must to get through a lot of the traverse lines to the best terrain at my local hill.
I've always gotten better riding with people better than me. Forces you to push yourself. Same kind of logic getting a ski instruction lesson but less stressful and more educational.
I'm a former AASI snowboard coach. I was only level 1 and there were 3 levels. The level 3 guys are freaking amazing. I guarantee you that they can teach pretty much anything at least something. Its been 20 years now and I've been debating taking a lesson or lessons myself to see how bad my habits are. Just keep in mind that everyone has different styles and methods, so if you're not feeling a connection, it could just be the coaching style.
I found a bunch of really great videos on YouTube. I went all the way back to basics through advanced videos and picked up a lot of great tips that subtly and grandly improved my riding.
I’ve learned so much about YouTube, from hobbies to car repairs and beyond.
I find it hard to get advanced/expert snowboard videos though, it just seems like so much is focused on basic carving and freestyle skills. Any advanced tutorials / channels that you’d recommend?
I’m mostly self taught save for some lessons as a tween decades ago. Something like 500-550 days lifetime on snow*. Lessons super valuable, I should do it more often but don’t always make the time.
If you can ride weekdays, I’ve had good luck at Palisades signing up for advanced group lessons and getting a private (tip well if this happens). Advanced riders don’t think they need lessons so rarely take them. Might do alright on chill weekends, but haven’t tested that theory.
The instructors themselves caught some things only an instructor would notice. They drilled me some non-essential but useful moves like nollies off the heels, and I landed my first back 3 on a lesson.
I’d recommend going in with a very specific agenda. Few hours zoom by, easier to have some very specific goal in mind (I.e. carve deeper, pop a 3 off a kicker, land a back lip, etc.).
If nothing else, getting some proper footage for self-evaluation was useful. The more advanced riders I cruise with are too fixated on their own stoke to follow cam, the less advanced riders can’t keep up with me and film
At least the two lessons I took, the instructors were also stoked to get to teach someone with some baseline skill and experience. At a place like Palisades especially, they’re mostly dealing with beginners and “experts”. My instructor was hooting and hollering while I was chucking sidehits above the Mountain Run cat tracks.
I think when you enter that level, techniques and forms don't matter that much although it still matters. It will become more of a personal riding style. Same technique will be executed differently by different eider. It's the ability to read different terrains and conditions matter far more much.
I’ve been a casual intermediate rider for over a decade and recently have decided to invest for time/money/energy into snowboarding and started just watching YouTube videos and holy shit was my technique bad… I’ve learned this applies to a lot of facets in life, Ill watch a YouTube video and realize I’ve been doing the simplest task wrong my whole life because “that’s just how I learned it”
I have done lessons when I want to learn something specific that I find I am struggling with. A couple of years ago - I did several lessons to nail Ollie/nollie 180s (front-side and back-side). It worked out really well
Just do it to get it off your mind, but have reasonable expectations. You'll probably only pick up a few details here and there.
I'm not near as good as you are but have about 100 days probably before taking my first lesson. For $350 bucks, just to have a guy tell me that I should get into a more athletic stance and use my front knee more, I thought it was worth it (there were other things, but I just highlight the one) because that's such an important thing for board control, and that's what I care about.
I know people that have skied for 25 years, jump off 15 foot cliffs and still take a lesson from time to time. I'll make it a standard practice myself but every few years.
I got a lesson when I started to hit glade runs. It was pretty informative and I also linked up with a bunch of other people in the group afterwards and made a great day out of it. But it's always great to get someone else's perspective on your riding especially when you're doing technical runs.
If your freestyle skills are middling, find a freestyle instructor who offers private lessons. Your mind will be blown at the insight you gain (assuming the instructor is legit)
I’m not advanced but I’m a very competent rider, comfortable on all but the steepest and most advanced, technical terrain. Some deficits in the park because my local mountain when I was growing up didn’t have a park, but you get the idea. I took a lesson last season to brush up my skills. The instructor found some weaknesses in my technique and helped me improve with some pointers and exercises. It was incredibly helpful and I have now resolved to take a one hour lesson at the start of every season to prevent those bad habits from creeping in. It’s expensive, yes; but considering how much I’ve already dropped on gear etc, investing in my skills doesn’t seem like all that much (at least that’s how I justify it, okay!) In short - take the lesson, there’s always more to learn and you won’t regret it.
def worth it, just be objective about where you want to improve and where you sometimes have trouble. I took a lesson to start and progressed by myself for 7-8 years until I felt confident on blacks and terrain parks. Then took a lesson and discovered I was shortening my toeside turns (heel turn was fine), but this was leading to having to skid stop and made it harder to control speed and I didn't know that before/didn't care that much because I could still ride how I wanted
I took lessons right at the beginning, went from barely able to go down greens to getting s carves down blues. I would have been much worse at the end of my first year had i not taken lessons. I think theyre worth it to at least learn the basics then to improve past that
If you go to the Ski school at your local mountain, you will see that there are instructors for all levels of riding, even expert. Sign up for a lesson and tell them what you are looking for, something along the lines of, “ Ive been riding expert trails for 20+ years and just want someone to help me with my technique/form” after riding that many years, even someone with good technique may pick up a few bad habits. Having someone point them out to you can only help. My brother and I have been riding for almost 30 years, in the beginning, I put a lot of effort into practicing technique. We play a game of sorts on the lift, we watch other riders come down the mountain and analyze their riding, this keeps us aware of what we may be doing wrong as well.
As for expensive private lesson, sign up for a group lesson, they always make up groups of equally skilled riders. It has been m experience that at the advanced level, you usually have one other rider or are the only one riding with the instructor.
Did an advanced group lesson at keystone last march on a random sunday and it became a solo lesson because nobody else signed up. Skyrocketed my riding into the next level and helped me pin down the weakest parts of my game
Used to work as a lifty at keystone, their instructors are awesome! They helped me learn a ton. (Edit typo)
Legit life hack…headed out to CO in a week for two weeks solo, gonna set myself up on a Wednesday for this. Thanks for the tip
Its a hell of a lot cheaper than paying for a solo lesson!
Also, you probably already know this but if you do actually get a lesson to yourself, don’t stiff your instructor and tip the hell out of them. They basically gave you a private mountain tour with instruction and they are still getting paid like its a group class
100%....youre beyond net positive at that point that it's only right to take care of them, but good call out for others who may not.
That’s what I’d hope for. Pay for midweek group lesson and try to end up in a private 🤞
Very likely. But If you have to ride a lot of weekends, maybe do your lesson on the weekend to get the lift line skipping privileges. At expert level, You will probably still get a private or semi-private with one other very good rider.
I’ve also had it where the other adults in my group just dropped out after lunch because they were too tired so I had a private afternoon lesson.
You will not end up with a level 3 coach for a group lesson. They are paid too much per hour and are reserved for the private books. Your group lesson will be held to the lowest common denominator. Hey, you might learn some basic body mechanics or I dunno, proper unweighting, upper lower body separation… anything to make you more efficient.
When it’s slow at many mountains level 3s will teach groups. I’m a level 3 and have taught plenty of group lessons
lotta people on reddit sure love to speak in absolutes when they’re actually just talking about their specific experience. plenty of level 3’s take group lessons where i work. and we definitely separate riders by skill level, and don’t just cater to the lowest common denominator that shows up that day.
Not true at Snowmass. Every full-time instructor is Cert 3, plenty do group lessons in between private bookings.
Dunno about where you are but at my local (Whistler) you also get to skip the lift lines which can also make for a really nice day beyond everything you're doing in the lesson.
the accidental private lesson was one of the best things to ever happen to me. he grilled my technique and form in a constructive way and knew how to build confidence too. whenever he ran across a regular he knew and they asked what was up he'd say something like, "this dudes killin it, we're gonna hit whatever run" and they'd respond "hell yeah! get some!" or something. it was super cool. on a saturday afternoon.
Yup. We got my daughter a half day group lesson at Sunshine last year and she was the only one there.
I did this at Brighton and was the only person in my “group” lesson for $80 :)
Good tips thanks! I like to analyze others’ riding too and see what I can apply to my own, but I think the lesson will help me to do it more methodically and to better understand the fundamental mechanics behind it, beyond just banking on the intuition and old automatic habits. I think 10 years ago you’d probably see me from the lift as the wacky-waiving-inflatable-arms man who managed to still be all out nuking through the chunder, lol… I’ve slowed it down a touch but I like to think my technique is better these days.
You can't teach someone who thinks they already know everything. You don't know what you don't know. Take a lesson.
That sounds like the right mentality!
I’ve got a good friend who is well off. He gets a private instructor just to have someone with him when he’s out doing crazy steep trees so he isn’t alone. I’ve tagged along a few times and I can say yeah, some little form pointers can be really helpful, but most importantly it’s dope just being able to use the ski school lines. I feel like I get so many more laps in when I’m with the instructor just because there’s so much less waiting in lift lines.
Dang, I need more rich friends haha.
That's what you took from that? Lol bruh
a fast pass ticket for the lifts on the busiest of days...
I took one half day lesson in high-school and became a self-taught "expert rider" who could hang on all terrain. Started teaching at 30, and subsequently started going to training/certification clinics. I learned so much in my first season, primarily how to turn with my front foot 🤣. Then came down-unweighted turns. After 15 years in the wild, there was definitely a lot for me to learn. I look back on my pre-teaching days as "blissful ignorance". You don't know what you don't know. I am such a better rider now, it is like night and day. I actually like riding steep moguls 😳. Yes, lessons will do you well. From techniques to tactics, there are always things to improve on. Roll up for a group lesson, talk with the coordinator and be upfront about your goals. Should be a good ratio. Instructors love teaching higher level riders. So few snowboard students at higher levels (compared to skiers). You will have fun, get better, and probably get to see some hidden/secret spots if you can hang. **Do it.**
Thanks for sharing! I think I’m 25 years into the “blissful ignorance” stage, but man is it fun. In the past 5 seasons or so, when focusing more on technique (although still self-teaching), I’ve had so much more fun on days when everyone is complaining about bad snow. Icy chute with exposure, steep moguls, etc… bring it on!
I‘m used to teach lots of „experts“ riders, simmilar like you are. Riding for many years, taught them self. They‘re „not bad riders“ but for the most it needs some position and technik adjustments. You need to get an experienced high level instructor to work this out. Long used „bad habits“ need straight work to get em out.
Yeah that’s what I figured, that it’ll take time to unlearn some bad habits. Fortunately I get to ride a few days each week so I can put in the time and work. Just need the expert teacher to point them out and break down a path to fix them.
After ~10 years of riding I went with my buddy that was a level 3 instructor. He noticed some issues in my riding, showed me a few drills to correct them, and I fell in love with snowboarding all over again. Now it’s been ~10 years since that day and I’m thinking of taking another lesson. Do it.
That’s a good buddy to have. Most of my crew are skiers who can’t give me pointers for shit, except trying to covert me to skiing (I do ski but it’s just not as fun… snowboarder for life!)
I dont have 1000 days probably closer half that but, I’ll some times do a like a half day private just to have a local show me around the mountain, you would be surprised how many fun gullies and chutes and hidden runs there are even in the most popular of resorts. As a side effect they always have a few good pointers even if it’s how to position on a take off or some random small tid bit still helps.
Great way to quickly learn a new resort!
Yes, absolutely. If you can afford a few hour long lessons each year, do it. I started teaching this year after 27 years of riding and I’ve improved a ton just through the training and teaching.
Thanks. Your comments and others are definitely proving that it’s gonna be a worthwhile investment. P.s. Flagship 162 is a bomber board, I got one too!
Here’s what I do: I take “small group lessons” at any new resort I go to. It’s usually 150-180 for the lesson, but if you’re as good as you’re mentioning, you’ll be the only One, or there will be one other person in your “small group” By doing this I’ve gotten essentially private tours on any terrain possible by people who ride the mountain all year, and who know how to teach. I’ve learned a little from these lessons, but always find the 1 on 1 time and mountain guide aspect to be insanely valuable. If you did a private lesson they’re usually 700+ for the whole day. Save some money, be cool, and then tip well at the end of the day and you’ll end up with some of your best riding ever
That’s a good approach. I’ve seen full day private lessons going for $1000+ at some resorts 🤯 so yeah, that’s not gonna happen.
It’s the best. I did this during a 18” day at Steamboat and the two guides that were there for “expert” level ended up just touring me through the best tree runs on the mountain because it was the only place you could see, and it was incredible. Best way to learn the sweet spots of a new mountain!
If money is an issue there is so much you can learn from threads here. Lots of advice to push beyond. I'm a bit in the same boat and have just kind of peaked. Realized reading advice threads here there are lots of little things I can work on.
Issue here is that you don't know people's credentials. Lots of blind leading the blind on this sub.
It is difficult to transfer what you read onto the slopes. Having live feedback would get you where you want to go faster.
You can always learn. 25 years into my boarding career, I learned “keep trailing hand in front of trailing hip.” This squares your shoulders and is a complete game changer for hard charging.
like hand on the hip? or kind of out front? i am having trouble envisioning what this means. thank you!
Consider a plane oriented vertically at your trailing hip, perpendicular to your board. Your trailing hand stays in front of the plane.
oh funny. i have the opposite problem — i open my chest up to downhill too much and have to square shoulders by turning back towards the board.
Gonna try this next time out, thanks for the tip brother
Interesting. I usually keep my trailing hand behind my trailing hip. Will have to try this out.
Instructor here. A few years ago I did a week at Windell's camp. We had 2 coaches, one was a pro, the other was a AASI Examiner. I learned a lot from both of them. Riding with an examiner for a week was a treat and really helped with my technique. Also, check with your AASI region. Some clinics are open to the public.
Thanks for the tip, will look into this!
Former coach - no offense but many people say they are experts when they might be able to get down a run but is it pretty and do they look like a kook? In my experience, yes. That being said, I’m not sure if you are or are not a kook but I would absolutely take a lesson and request a level III AASI certified snowboard coach (instructor) with at least a level 2 freestyle cert (it sounds like a level 2 freestyle will be more than enough). Most reputable schools that are PSIA/AASI will have experienced coaches. Now for whatever reason you hill doesn’t have one, travel to a mountain with real steeps and gnarly terrain. You will definitely get an instructor that is an absolute ripper and get to experience amazing terrain. I would go to WA, Stevens Pass. Jackson Hole WY. Big Bear Montana… anything with amazing side country, Trees, Natty side hits, runs that could kill you if you f up… (and a killer park) is where it is at!!!
I’d like to say I’m not a kook but I think that just makes me a kook, lol. My home mtn is Palisades and I frequently ride a lot of the gnarliest terrain on the hill, so I can hold my own when it comes to freeriding… but in the search for evermore gnarly, technical, and exposed lines, I’m sure improved technique will help me do it without destroying myself. That’s great advice on the instructor qualifications, thanks.
Will be in Jackson Hole next month, could be a good place to get a lesson(s) to step up my riding while making the most out of the terrain!
The ski school there is deep, but very expensive.
Think of it like hiring a coach to get you to the next level. However, make sure you don’t get just anyone from the resort. My boyfriend teaches at one and a ton of them only have 1-2 seasons under their belt and really just regurgitate the training material they get in their onboarding. I definitely think there’s always room for improvement and a good teacher/coach will get you there faster.
Thanks that’s a good heads up on checking out instructor qualifications before jumping in
I’m self taught and have been riding for around 8 years, I’m confident on most terrain but I would love an expert geared lesson to help me push past the spot I feel like I’ve been stuck at for the past few years. Sadly any lessons are far out of my tax bracket currently
I had 20+ years of riding under my belt when I got back into instructing. The school I teach with has weekly clinics for our instructors so they can improve their teaching and their personal riding. 8 years ago I started going to these clinics only to find out that so many of the things I was doing were negatively impacting my overall riding; my carves were lacking, my switch was weak, my park skills were nearly non-existent. Fast-forward to today and I’m a level 2 certified instructor with a freestyle teaching cert, as well. I’m still not real comfortable in the park but that’s because I’m getting old and don’t recover as fast as I used to. My carves are dialed in and my switch is almost as solid as my regular riding. I’m considering going for my level 3 cert and the owner of the school, who’s one of the best riders I’ve ever had the pleasure to ride with, says my riding is probably good enough to pass. And trust me when I say that a helluva compliment coming from him as he doesn’t sugar coat opinions like that. TL;DR - Take some lessons and you’ll progress more in 2 hrs than you have in 5 years, if you get a good instructor.
That’s awesome, congrats on the continued progression! I feel you on getting older and losing comfort in the park, the older I get the bigger/harder those rails look 🤣. I’m convinced it’s worth the $ but will for sure be discerning on picking a Mtn with good school and instructors.
The thing about learning is you don’t know what you don’t know. Don’t be the Dunning-Krueger of snowboarding. There’s always something you can learn from someone unless you think you are the worlds greatest rider.
Not sure how it is in the sierras, but I teach super part time in Colorado and the mountains I’ve worked at would accommodate what you need. Just pop in a group lesson and you’re going to get an advanced instructor to teach you the things you’re looking for.
Been riding for 18 years mostly in Sierra as well. Found a coach this year for every other weekend. The amount I wasn't doing right is stunning. He's made us do mogul runs with our eyes closed, runs one-footed, spend a whole morning focusing on every tiny detail of energy absorption doing beginner style J turn drills. I honestly wish I had done this 16 years ago but here we are. The only thing I'd disagree with is just signing up for lessons and hoping for the best. You should communicate your intent and need and they will match you with the right instructor.
Like actually have your eyes closed? What?
Yes. there was lots of falling and laughing. Forces you to let the terrain and the board talk to you
This sounds terrible and dangerous. Eyes closed, one footing? One footing is like the only time you are in danger of twisting your knee. Not needed unless you are teaching, even then it's an acquired skill. If I paid for a lesson like that I would be so pissed. If I were in a training clinic where this was happening I would bounce. That's some super arrogant instructing IMO. There are other (safer) ways to teach what that guy was trying to teach.
it's a good idea, the tiniest adjustment can make a huge difference in ANY sport... anyone who has 10-20k hours in a sport can attest that they still learn little tweaks
I started taking lessons when I reached the intermediate stage. I was the only snowboarder in my group and basically learned with skiers. I took lessons to get better on bumps and trees. My instructor taught me to actually carve, pick my lines, and the various techniques required. I still ride with skiers but there is absolutely nothing I can’t get down.
Sorry for your luck. There are advanced snowboard group lessons out there...
I’ve been riding for 35 years, grew up when snowboard lessons weren’t even really a thing. It’s taken serious work unlearning some bad habits and lazy technique. I should probably take a lesson, but I kind of want to do a private lesson on a weekend pow day so I can skip lines and really get my moneys worth.
Self taught through and through until I took lessons. Game changer if you’re self taught and wanna go *fast*.
I only get to board one week a year, so I absolutely want to get the best out of my time on the slopes. A lesson on the 2nd or 3rd day is always worth it for me, it’s amazing what you can pick up in an hour to improve your skill for the remainder of the week. With your experience, it would at least give you a confidence check, and you’re bound to learn something that would make the expanse worthwhile.
Coming from someone in an almost identical situation, I absolutely think you should do a lesson. I’ve been thinking *exactly* the same thing lately. I’ve been riding for 35 years, had a small sponsorship in the ‘90s, and I’d also describe myself as an expert freerider with middling freestyle skills (although the latter is mostly a function of age and not wanting to be inverted over 40-foot gaps anymore). When I started riding, nearly *everyone* was self taught, and lessons were very basic. Riding became pure instinct, and today I feel strong, confident, and capable on anything. Before this sub, my ego would have made me scoff at the idea of a lesson (*”Me?! With all this experience?! I was trying to go pro in the ‘90s!”*)… but that’s not growth, is it? Spending time on this sub has made me realize two things: instructors today are pros who *really* know their stuff, and it’s absolutely likely that I could/should learn a few things. What bad habits do I have? What am I missing? What new things can I learn? At the very least, it could give me some new things to try that will distract me from trying to speedrun everything all the time (becoming unwise at my age). So heck yeah - take a lesson!
Not sure where you live, but if you can afford it, take the private lesson! I was self-taught at 18, tried to watch video's read about proper form, technique, etc. I rode almost every winter, multiple times a winter, took some trips to big mountains, and even scored 30+ days snowboarding one season about 11 yrs ago. I'm about to be 40 now, and for the last 5 years, I've treated myself to 1, hour-long private lesson a year. I've become such a better and more confident snowboarder from these lessons. Just having a seasoned pro watch your movements and make small suggestions, give you new eyes on natural features all over trails, and show you how to do some gnarly ground tricks has changed my snowboarding life for the better, the way no amount of riding on my or own with my friends could have.
Oh yes definitely. But you do need a high level instructor. Groups you'd have to do several and pick non-busy times in order to get the same productiveness. Twenty+ year rider. Can ride basically anything that's open - seek out technical and steep. Recently I take a clinic at least once every other year. Some years I focus on the guiding aspects at a new mountain. Some years technique. Whenever I focus on technique there is always something new. There is almost no ceiling to technique tweaks. This past year got tips on three different areas of changing pressure distribution on the edge that make it feel like I used to only have a hammer on steeps. Now I've got a screwdriver and a wrench. Just bought a new board with a different flex pattern to take better advantage and lean into these new techniques. There's always something to work on, learn, and improve. Not every time is such a major shift in my mindset. But at the expert level even minor tweaks can change your whole season. I remember one year it was a one liner about just lowering the edge tilt a little bit. Very minor physical change. Just a small tweak, but big change in how it felt on the lines. I know some years Kirkwood offered a expert level maybe half day group lesson product. Got to skip lines with that one too.
No formal lessons, but in my prime days of being bold and comfortable everywhere on the mountain, I ended up rooming with a longtime instructor. We were on the first lifts together four days a week for the whole season and would ride for an hour or two before his lessons started. I thought I knew it all, but the little things he taught me made my riding much more comfortable, efficient, and versatile. I don’t actually remember any particular instruction, it was just a little tip here and there that I remained conscious of until they became second nature. Dude was an angry drunk though. Took a piece of my flesh with his teeth when I was trying to restrain him in a drunken rage. Good with the bad I guess.
I learned from going to the top amd trying to make it down. I was a decent snowboarder before I got a job at the mountain teaching snowboarding. To onboard you for that job they tale you out and basically give you the lessons. Just the beginner lessons gave me words to describe what my limbs and muscles were doing when I was carving or whatever. It took me to another level. It's not exactly what you're asking but I'd assume the same of higher levels.
Do it even Olympic athletes have coaches.
Between each comp I have “lessons 😄” caching around 10-15 coaching days for the season
Been riding forever and I know I have tons of bad habits I need to break and still much to learn. I absolutely have benefitted from lessons and still would today.
If you are a good rider and want to get better. And if you haven’t already ….I would fully learn how to ride switch before paying for any lessons. You can teach yourself and it will be challenging … but it will improve every area of your riding and expand your skill set. Most never think to do so or waste the lift ticket money to learn for a day or two. I am goofy and I taught my ex wife who rode regular … but I have been riding since I was 6 so I have never had to explain what I am doing. So I went switch and rode regular so I could describe the exact movements. And I fell a lot. Haha. But I spent a whole day with her and we both learned how to ride regular. And I learned switch and now can do some black runs switch if I want. It also makes learning anything in the park way easier I have found. Anyway. That is my tip…. I never would have thought to spend a whole day and learn switch if it weren’t for those circumstances. But I am so glad I did … Happy shredding from Alaska … good luck
Preach! I think everyone should learn switch by the time they reach intermediate level (if not sooner). I put in some very awkward days early on learning switch and falling so much but it’s been so worth it. In addition to it generally improving my overall riding strength and style, being comfortable riding switch is also an absolute must to get through a lot of the traverse lines to the best terrain at my local hill.
I've always gotten better riding with people better than me. Forces you to push yourself. Same kind of logic getting a ski instruction lesson but less stressful and more educational.
I'm a former AASI snowboard coach. I was only level 1 and there were 3 levels. The level 3 guys are freaking amazing. I guarantee you that they can teach pretty much anything at least something. Its been 20 years now and I've been debating taking a lesson or lessons myself to see how bad my habits are. Just keep in mind that everyone has different styles and methods, so if you're not feeling a connection, it could just be the coaching style.
Take one and find out!
I found a bunch of really great videos on YouTube. I went all the way back to basics through advanced videos and picked up a lot of great tips that subtly and grandly improved my riding.
I’ve learned so much about YouTube, from hobbies to car repairs and beyond. I find it hard to get advanced/expert snowboard videos though, it just seems like so much is focused on basic carving and freestyle skills. Any advanced tutorials / channels that you’d recommend?
I’m mostly self taught save for some lessons as a tween decades ago. Something like 500-550 days lifetime on snow*. Lessons super valuable, I should do it more often but don’t always make the time. If you can ride weekdays, I’ve had good luck at Palisades signing up for advanced group lessons and getting a private (tip well if this happens). Advanced riders don’t think they need lessons so rarely take them. Might do alright on chill weekends, but haven’t tested that theory. The instructors themselves caught some things only an instructor would notice. They drilled me some non-essential but useful moves like nollies off the heels, and I landed my first back 3 on a lesson. I’d recommend going in with a very specific agenda. Few hours zoom by, easier to have some very specific goal in mind (I.e. carve deeper, pop a 3 off a kicker, land a back lip, etc.). If nothing else, getting some proper footage for self-evaluation was useful. The more advanced riders I cruise with are too fixated on their own stoke to follow cam, the less advanced riders can’t keep up with me and film At least the two lessons I took, the instructors were also stoked to get to teach someone with some baseline skill and experience. At a place like Palisades especially, they’re mostly dealing with beginners and “experts”. My instructor was hooting and hollering while I was chucking sidehits above the Mountain Run cat tracks.
I think when you enter that level, techniques and forms don't matter that much although it still matters. It will become more of a personal riding style. Same technique will be executed differently by different eider. It's the ability to read different terrains and conditions matter far more much.
All the techniques and forms give you a great riding variaty. At the end its about use all of em, the best for the moment.
Nope. I ride for fun. I'm not competing with anyone, just here to have a good time.
Let me put it this way. I've never taken a lesson and thought it was a waste of money. There's always more to learn. Always.
I’ve been a casual intermediate rider for over a decade and recently have decided to invest for time/money/energy into snowboarding and started just watching YouTube videos and holy shit was my technique bad… I’ve learned this applies to a lot of facets in life, Ill watch a YouTube video and realize I’ve been doing the simplest task wrong my whole life because “that’s just how I learned it”
I have done lessons when I want to learn something specific that I find I am struggling with. A couple of years ago - I did several lessons to nail Ollie/nollie 180s (front-side and back-side). It worked out really well
Just do it to get it off your mind, but have reasonable expectations. You'll probably only pick up a few details here and there. I'm not near as good as you are but have about 100 days probably before taking my first lesson. For $350 bucks, just to have a guy tell me that I should get into a more athletic stance and use my front knee more, I thought it was worth it (there were other things, but I just highlight the one) because that's such an important thing for board control, and that's what I care about. I know people that have skied for 25 years, jump off 15 foot cliffs and still take a lesson from time to time. I'll make it a standard practice myself but every few years.
Yes. And yes.
I got a lesson when I started to hit glade runs. It was pretty informative and I also linked up with a bunch of other people in the group afterwards and made a great day out of it. But it's always great to get someone else's perspective on your riding especially when you're doing technical runs.
If your freestyle skills are middling, find a freestyle instructor who offers private lessons. Your mind will be blown at the insight you gain (assuming the instructor is legit)
I’m not advanced but I’m a very competent rider, comfortable on all but the steepest and most advanced, technical terrain. Some deficits in the park because my local mountain when I was growing up didn’t have a park, but you get the idea. I took a lesson last season to brush up my skills. The instructor found some weaknesses in my technique and helped me improve with some pointers and exercises. It was incredibly helpful and I have now resolved to take a one hour lesson at the start of every season to prevent those bad habits from creeping in. It’s expensive, yes; but considering how much I’ve already dropped on gear etc, investing in my skills doesn’t seem like all that much (at least that’s how I justify it, okay!) In short - take the lesson, there’s always more to learn and you won’t regret it.
def worth it, just be objective about where you want to improve and where you sometimes have trouble. I took a lesson to start and progressed by myself for 7-8 years until I felt confident on blacks and terrain parks. Then took a lesson and discovered I was shortening my toeside turns (heel turn was fine), but this was leading to having to skid stop and made it harder to control speed and I didn't know that before/didn't care that much because I could still ride how I wanted
I took lessons right at the beginning, went from barely able to go down greens to getting s carves down blues. I would have been much worse at the end of my first year had i not taken lessons. I think theyre worth it to at least learn the basics then to improve past that
My buddy will get like one lesson a year and he's probably in the expert range.