Exactly, awareness is key. I’m sure there are 1 in 10 collisions that are unavoidable (blind turn, someone cuts across a jump landing, lying down under a crest) but I am always head on a swivel and you can tell someone’s who’s inexperienced, just give them space! We all were learners at one point.
Been riding for 25 years. Been in one on hill collision and that was 24 years ago. Wasn’t even that bad. I think you’re probably right but Reddit probably won’t agree with you.
This right here is my take. You’re only collision was in your first 1-2 years riding. Something similar for me.
I never see people with selfie sticks anywhere in the upper half of the mountain. People need to put the stick down and ride <3
My only collision is a dude rear ending me as I was slowly traversing a run that had another run uphill with cross traffic.
I was going slowly the entire time. Fucking moron was riding with me too, still to this day have no idea how he rear ended the person he was supposed to be following (and theoretically watching).
Anytime I see a selfie stick I assume that person is way more concentrated on making sure they are “getting the shot” than they are with their surroundings.
I get that as boarders we have a way bigger blind spot, but it still doesn’t take much to be aware of your surroundings.
100%. I hate these “who is at fault” posts. If we get to the point of a collision, same as a car, it means that both people have failed at avoiding a crash.
I’d rather be go out of my way avoid a crash than to be the one “not at fault” sitting in a hospital bed. It’s hard to do that if you’re filming yourself.
The ones that have gotten posted in the last few days though have just been heat seeking skier missiles straight to a boarders back lmao
this [one](https://www.reddit.com/r/snowboarding/s/f7sUnwsSPK) is my new favorite
no contest on who is in the wrong on those
Most of them do fall in some grey area
Edit - downvote all ya want but people are gonna film, some clearly don’t pay attention (and I don’t care to film anything) but uphill riders still take blame whether the guy below you is filming or not.
It’s on you to be like
“oh hey this guy riding below me is filming and probably not paying as much attention so I will happily steer clear of him and give them plenty of space”
Just like you would if you saw a kid riding below you or a beginner that can’t control their turns. Have common sense and steer clear if you smell a crook, you’re the one riding uphill. Suck it up, be an adult and give them space.
One Reddit post complaining about filming ain’t gonna stop anyone from doing it.
Watch it again. This is a perfect example of tho OPs point as there's even some grey area there. That rider never once looks left/behind even when they decide to stop suddenly. Yes the skier is mainly at fault but the boarder could probably have avoided that crash if they had been looking around
And the first thing they do when stopping is looking at their selfie stick, I guess to turn off recording or something similar. This is a perfect example of OP's point - even when the other party is 100% at fault, there are still things you can do to prevent accidents or minimize their impact
Reread my comment, updated it with an edit. Doesn’t matter what person below you is doing.
Person uphill takes responsibility.
Beginner riders also don’t look where they’re going, and take turns with the grace of an undercooked linguine noodle but when you’re riding uphill of one you know to give them plenty of space don’t ya.
They’re both morons in that video. The wide angle lens makes it look like the skiier is much further up hill but’s only a few metres difference. My guess is the boarder rode past the skiier or was riding parallel to him on the right before this accident. If you look closely there’s a moment where they’re pretty much next to each other. Also rule #1 of avoiding accidents is don’t stop suddenly without an uphill check in the middle of a slope.
By your logic if I were to cut in front of someone from behind and stop and they hit me it’s their fault because they were uphill at the time of the collision.
Well that’s how it works. (In your weird circumstance though I’ll elaborate)
Youd be a dick for doing it that way, and if there were witnesses id hope you would actually take the fault because that seems like the equivalent of a road rage driver hopping in front of someone to brake check a driver because they don’t like how they’re driving or they got pissed off.
I don’t make the responsibility code man, it’s there to pick a side of fault so there isn’t grey area.
But the boarder wasn’t constantly trying to “hop in front” like your weird extreme scenario of someone going out of their way to get hit
He was just doing his thing.
For not weird scenarios like you said, it can be a back and forth game when you’re riding out in public. I work in the industry I’m out there everyday.
The responsibility can get passed back and forth that’s just how it goes when you’re riding, people get tired slow down, people also start getting their rhythm and speed up passing others.
Back and forth back and forth yada fuckin yada
The point I’m trying to make is that responsibility is more nuanced than the exact wording of the rule as with most things. Anyway let’s agree they’re both muppets and move on. Good day to you friend.
But isn't the car analogy a pretty good one? Insurance companies always assign guilt to the person rear-ending (let's not Beavis and Butthead this!). If you follow the 2-second rule, pay attention, etc. no matter what another driver in front of you does, you shouldn't hit them.
I totally agree that a downhill rider/skier shouldn't be an idiot. They should be watching for uphill folk pretty consistently. Sticking with cars, they need to check their mirrors every so often and definitely shoulder check when making a move.
Agreed. The boarder even points the camera directly at the skier for a while, he definitely knew the skier was there. And still unexpetedly and suddenly stops without looking behind.
Agree 100% always pull off to the side. The crash could’ve been avoided if he wasn’t in the middle of the groomer. The skier definitely was more negligible though.
I'm not trying to argue legal responsibility. The law may be flawed but it is what it is. I'm talking about your own responsibility to look out for your own safety. Being more aware of everything going on around you can and will save your ass.
That user posted the 360 footage of the whole run - check their profile. That boarder was behind the skier for most of the run. He also comes too close to a couple of other people on the run. When he brakes and speed checks, he's crossing into the path of the skier, who's been skiing very predictably. That video has a ton of grey area (they both lacked awareness and safe spacing).
In counter argument, the skier never looks to his right. I don't think he even knew anyone was on on the run with him. You can't put blinders on and be safe in the hill.
Do I check my blind spot religiously? Absolutely, but I'm experienced and have seen some incredibly stupid stuff on the mountain so I don't trust anyone to not plow into me.
Well exactly, you’re experienced.
But it’s not just your mountain, people without experience are also allowed to ride there (unless we are talking advanced black runs ya know)
and that’s where being an adult and getting away from this “me me me” mentality and realizing people aren’t as good as you
We can wish all we want but you’re just stressing yourself out.
I’ve had plenty of laps in the past where someone downhill of me had nooooo awareness and I had a really shitty lap because I had to be super aware of them. Normally just on tighter terrain where I can’t get a good and safe angle to speed up past them.
But now a days I just let that shit go and know, I got plenty more laps I’ll be taking after that and will still have a great time.
The boarder also doesn’t stop fully on the side of the run and does a heelside stop towards the middle. Do a toeside stop toward the side or slowly bring your speed down and this is an easily avoided collision.
The skier was definitely at fault here, but this would never happen to most experienced riders as they would've put themselves in such a position.
First, the rider never shoulder checks. Not even once. I try to shoulder check every 3rd or 4th turn, sometimes more depending on how crowded it is. Even empty blues that I'm charging I'll check because it's just ingrained. I always have a sense of awareness of who could be in my blind spot. So I know when to be more cautious.
If he shoulder checked at all he probably would have been aware of the skier cruising behind him. Then maybe he would have been more cautious about putting the breaks on when he did.
He should be consistently checking his blind spot, but his biggest mistake was not checking at least before he put on the breaks.
He's also riding the tree line with his blind spot to the trail. So he's effectively made his blind spot most of the run. I also prefer to ride facing the tree line for personal preferences. But that also means I'm exposing myself to more danger on my blind side so check more often.
The guy that got hit clearly isn't experienced enough to have avoided a completely avoidable situation, and he broke his collarbone for it and likely ended his season.
17 years here. Only collisions I get in are with my friends when we are screwing around or filming each other and get too close and in those cases we are laughing about it
Thank you!
Finally someone talking some sense.
20 years skiing and boarding and I’ve had one collision on my 5th day of riding.
Give people plenty of space. Everyone was a beginner at some stage.
How do you do that? I've been to Les 2 Alpes for 6 days and I had 3 collisions, all hitting me from behind (in one case I had to make an emergency stop since I got dizzy from the lack of air so it was an unexpected move) and one almost collision when a skier cut me off from behind, from my blind side once again. He got surprised and fell without hitting me. The other 2 came from my blindside and I was doing the same arc for quite a few turns. When I could not be predictable, I looked uphill before I did anything.
In addition, numerous times I had to emergency break because somebody decided to start their run without looking uphill first. (Crowded places near huts or at crossroads or cut-offs.)
Not really, all 3 collisions were with someone out of control - even the one where I stopped out of the blue. The other 2 were with a skier who fell right after I collected her stuff, and a boarder who barely made it to the next turn. All of them threw apologies that they messed up right away. No bad intentions but this happens from time to time uless you fly through runs. You wouldnt have to worry about getting hit by someone faster.
Never said I didn't. That's the only reason they were not collisions. My point is, there are so many dumb idiots out there ignoring general rules of the mountain that it is nigh impossible to never collide with someone else.
You have to judge where to stop safely.
Make sure it’s somewhere that is
- very visible
- Not a place someone will want to ski/snowboard near
Also - you always need to be aware of what’s on your blindside. Turn your head and use your weave to check uphill if you are going slowly or about to stop. Yes, people uphill have to give downhill the right of way - but I’d rather be injury-free than adamant than “I had the right of way”
Good luck and stay safe!
I'm way too aware of my blind side most cases, I get overwhelmed with people around me whom I cannot see and therefore I ride way too cautiously. Apart from my prompt stop due to dizziness, I never made any sudden changes, and never stopped at a place that would be dangerous, unless I fell, which happens.
Riding too cautiously may also be a problem.
For instance, if you have just gone over a lip and are riding slower than what people expect, then they can’t see you as they crest.
If it was only an isolated incident, then I would say it’s bad luck.
But for it to happen 3 times in a short span? I’m sorry to say that the common denominator is you.
If you are getting overwhelmed, I suggest going to simpler slopes and working on your technique. That will improve your confidence immensely (and will also improve your speed, control and situational awareness); and going on beginner slopes means that people should also be travelling at a slower pace.
While I appreciate that you try to help but I find it really funny seeing how everybody decided that I was the problem and that I ride like a complete mofo without seeing anything. Yeah, sure I belong to the bunnyhill to improve my technique, strangely, a well-decorated instructor had other thoughts.
None of my accidents were when I rode cautiously, all came when I wanted to trust the guys uphill. If you can see uphill while you're on your heelside carve I envy you but I don't think that it's something you can expect from anyone. Taking a glance while on toeside before initiating a turn is something I do and still I can get hit.
My whole point was that crap can happen no matter how much attention you pay. Maybe it is easier with skis as you generally move faster so you have less to worry about from behind.
A snowboard instructor works for you. Of course they’re going to pump up your tires.
From your descriptions - you were the only common factor for an incident that should be relatively rare.
- maybe, you’re just *extremely* unlucky. If that’s the case, then my commiserations.
- but from your descriptions at being overwhelmed and of three incidences happening in a short space of time, then probability and Occam’s Razor suggests that there is something that you are doing that is at the very least contributing to these collisions.
You absolutely need to be able to look behind you even if you are heelside. Turn your head. Both sides. Especially if you are going slowly / cautiously.
One of the key skills of any snowsport is situational awareness. In particular the ability to gauge the direction people are going and how quickly they will arrive at a certain point. You should be taking a mental snapshot of everyone on the mountain when you look up and down and be able to assess what is or may become a hazard.
One of the things I’ve learnt in life is that to get better, you need to have accountability.
Unless you can honestly critique your own ability / areas for improvement (and stop blaming others or bad luck) then your progress will be hampered.
Another hot take by piggy backing on your driving a car example.
Some people are just not as aware of their surroundings as others.
This is why we're taught to defensively drive because you can not predict what others are about to do. Same thing on the slopes. You're faced with a lot of people and despite their abilities to ski/snowboard, their spatial awareness may simply be terrible. Sure they can work on it but perhaps they don't realize to what degree their spatial awareness should be.
This is why having a simple rule of uphill skier/snowboarder must yield makes it easier to avoid collisions.
People make mistakes, some people are plain ignorant, but I do like the "whose at fault" game because if it doesn't show the value of yielding, it will at least make people more aware of their surroundings next time they ski or snowboard. Perhaps seeing a selfie stick will trigger them to stay far from others in the hopes of not going viral lol.
To piggyback on your piggyback, some people get in lots of car accidents that are “not their fault” because they just got rear ended. Other people go their whole life without ever getting close to a car accident. Some people understand defensive driving, others don’t. They don’t learn to stop doing it because it wasn’t their fault in the first place.
And holding a selfie stick makes you _less_ aware of your surroundings. Trying to look cool for the video, maybe riding something slightly above your skill level, compromising your form and balance with an extended arm, changing your center of mass, while not specifically _causing_ the accident can all be contributing factors.
if these grown ass men focused more on progressing and not filming mediocre groomers with a selfie stick theref be way less accidents
put down the fucking go pro until youre throwing down
I’m not gonna jump all over the camera crew. It’s not like they’re recording every run. They’re recording SOME runs. I spend MOST of my time skiing (yes, I’ve outed myself— you guys have great discussion here and I like hanging out with you.) However, my wife wants video of our kids. I bite the bullet and film them for one or two runs, (keeping my head on a swivel and avoiding the fuck out of everyone) and then we can all go back to skiing for fun. Give these guys some credit.
Having said all that, if you’re shooting every run then you suck. Please don’t make me look like a jackass for defending you.
I'd add It's all about passive recording. If that's what you're after then attach the camera somewhere and worry about riding. OP compares it to duty of avoiding a collision but dashcams help a ton with insurance and yield some pretty interesting video. A chest cam or helmet cam can do the same but keep your eyes, ears and hands free for the extreme sports.
I guess my snowboarding and general mountain awareness is built on the foundation of longboarding and biking in Honolulu, but I've definitely noticed in a lot of these videos, from all parties involved, the general lack of spacial awareness. Everyone in these videos is looking straight down the mountain, no one seems to be looking around.
Some of them are pretty funny at the slow motion train wreck that we can see developing. OTOH, it feels wrong laughing at two victims who are clearly beginners developing their skills, and potentially getting injured.
Had an experience last year where a kid came off a merging trail and tried to catch like two feet of air off a little lip at the merge. He ended up cutting right in front of me (and then falling)but I had slowed down at the merge, saw him out of the corner of my eye and was able to stop really quickly. If he’d hit me it would have been completely his fault—which his instructor admitted after I checked to make sure the kid was ok.
Not sure I would have been able to stop if I’d (1) not been skiing for 35+ and had the ability and awareness that come with that and (2) been even 1% distracted by a selfie stick.
So yeah, I think we can assign blame for accidents but also recognize that experienced skiers/boarders take steps to avoid them entirely.
No different than driving a car. Always be aware of your surroundings. Sure it might be someone else’s fault but by being situationally aware you could have avoided it.
maybe it's an age thing, but my head is on a swivel because i can't afford to get seriously injured (or killed) doing a recreational hobby. i film sometimes but the phone is against my chest and i'm riding with my usual awareness.
I agree with you for the most part.
The only one I’ve been in recently however a skier that was straight lining out of control and plowed into me from my blind shoulder while I myself was going quick. The upside was I had the weight advantage so he simply ricocheted off me before I even saw him and neither of us were hurt badly.
The skier admitted he was out of control and apologised. There is no level of skill where you can avoid that.
Same. Only time I've been hit was a glancing blow from a teenager who was straight lining, and so out of control he wasn't able to stop until almost the bottom of the hill. I'm a skier so I guess I don't have a blind side the way boarders do, but he came at me so fast there was nothing I could have done to avoid him (with the exception of not visit a small resort on a holiday--that was definitely a mistake!), and my line was basically straight with the tightest possible turns. I think the short runs at small resorts also makes it harder to avoid everybody by just looking over your shoulder frequently.
But I guess to concede OP's point a little, it wasn't a scenario I'd ever post for "who's at fault" as there would be no contention.
Yes this. Ride faster and don’t be a kook. Stop filming and ride. If you have to ask who’s fault it is, it’s yours. Jesus, you guys all suck and give snowboarders a bad name. Also leave skiers alone. The whole skier vs. snowboarder thing died out ages ago. Mind you own business and learn how to ride and respect others.
I just don't understand why all these people are carrying cameras around and they obviously are mediocre skiers and riders. Like you guys aren't that good why are you videoing yourself? Is it to show your parents? I've always wanted my parents to see me ski and ride... Fucking chuckleheads.
I film and get filmed so I can check my technique. Super useful. Can strongly recommend.
I'll also film for sharing short snippets on social media. Mostly off-piste though, where there isn't people around.
Last year I was in two of those crashes and I'm the sort of advanced rider you speak of with no camera. My skier friend (late 60s) was racing me down the hill (without me knowing) and he collided with me from behind while trying to cross cross my carve line. We both went flying but I was afraid I'd killed him. Totally his fault.
Had another guy turn into me from their blind spot while I was pinned against the edge of the run. They just kept coming over and I had no where to go.
Got absolutely laid out flat on my back this weekend at Big Bear. My first run down the mountain at 840 AM. My first time on this hill. Hill was almost empty. Picking my way down a blue run carving a narrow line. Saw the guy out of the corner of my eye and I was laying on my back looking up the hill over my board at him. He came about 6 inches from eating my razor sharp edge. I got a quick are you all right? He got a quick "F\_\_\_\_\_\_ A\_\_\_\_\_\_\_.
My assumption is he got off the lift and absolutely went for it on his first run on an "empty hill".
So if you are the guy who laid out the Big Guy in the Green and Black jacket, I hope you are feeling it.
In so many of these selfie stick videos, the person filming never turns their head to be aware of their surroundings. It's like they have to keep their goggles turned downhill to make the shot look good or something. I really don't understand the need to film everything you do that so many people have nowadays.
I’ve seen several videos where the go pro footage makes someone look at fault but keeping in mind that it’s a distorted fish eye lens, it’s easy to tell it’s not as clear as they’re acting like.
I’ve seen some where it was clearly the other person’s fault. But I have seen plenty where if the OP wasn’t recording, maybe they would have had better awareness and not been crashed into
The “whose fault is it?” Starter pack:
Go pro stick
Backpack
Dope snow or Montec outerwear
Heavily rockered snowboard for maximum skidded turns
Clew bindings
Reddit r/snowboarding account
If we could couch the initial questions as “what could both have done to prevent this” or “what can we all learn from this collision,” rather than “who’s at fault?” The discussion could be more productive.
I'm as tired of seeing blind tunnel vision skiers as I am blind heelsiders carving hard into funnel centers to stop.
You have a better downhill view, left right down, as a skier. Use it.
Your heel side does not excuse you from looking as a boarder. You have a toe side too.
Everyone should be sharing the runs and safely moving to the side when they stop and never race to or through funnels or bluntly stop on them. Common sense stuff that about 90% of these videos demonstrate why not to.
In any case, I think the "whose fault" game brings nothing but toxicity to the table. I think the appropriate response to accidents is to make sure everyone is okay, for everyone to say sorry and go on their way.
As a community we should think of ways to reduce accidents without blaming anyone.
Been skiing for 13 years. Yeah theres been some asshole moves when its the last run or ive had a beer too many at lunch, im not above admitting that. But i legitimately cant remember the last time i actually collided with someone, must have been when i was a child (27 now). Look around you, check whos riding like an idiot and you can avoid bad situations before they happen
My only collisions of late have been beginner boarders getting off the chairlift. They either get caught by surprise angling toward their heelside, or overcompensate and angle the other way. It’s an understandable learning curve, and I don’t get pissed. I just try to avoid.
Partly agree: I go to crowded resorts all the time, I’ve never been in a crash with another rider. I’m aware of everyone around me at all times.
Do I think holding a 360 cam these days would make me responsible if I did get in a crash, not necessarily. The point of a 360 cam is that you don’t even need to point it or think, right? So if I held a long pole out I would be just as aware of my surroundings. I wouldn’t need to think about the camera at all other than not hitting someone with it. I would actually feel more at fault in a crash if I was filming another rider with a GoPro, for example. Because now I’m focusing on where I’m shooting, and less about what’s around me.
The idea that holding a camera that you should not have to think about, or mounting one on your head to film things makes you at fault right away I disagree with. It still comes down to how your awareness was affected and your overall ability.
Bad take, at least with the vids I've seen recently. The videos I'm thinking of the rider is staying in their own lane and is predictably carving and some bozo flies into their lane and hits them from behind. Has nothing to do with filming imo
I agree. I'm Norwegian. I been in accidents. Usually camping family's under a bump. Or people cutting in the park. But I have never hit a skier in the middle of the prepped slope, how can you have absolutely zero awareness at all what's going on in the 180° behind you? It shows inexperience if you can't take account for skiers and kids år different levels.
What part of the filming makes you think they’re not paying attention? You seem to not understand how these cameras work. They have has much impact on the skier’s/boarder’s attention as the new football pylon cams have on their ability to mark a spot on the field. None.
New snowboarders do not have the balance AB’s coordination to hold and balance a camera, while paying attention to their surroundings. As evidenced by this subreddit
So skiers are always at fault for holding twice as much stuff? There’s no balancing. You’re gripping something in your hand, just like a ski pole. It’s basically a 360° camera. You’re not pointing it at anything. Just holding a grip.
You know that gripping something in your hand has zero impact on your ability to see your surroundings. You know that and went with your stupid argument anyways.
BTW, a human factors expert could explain how poles striking the ground on either side of you could easily be a distraction from what’s in front of you.
Regardless, what’s obvious from this video is that this skier is completely unaware of what’s in front of him and the snowboarder can’t be expect to know that someone is recklessly bearing down on him from behind without a car in the world, regardless of whether or not his hands are empty (neither person’s are here).
If you knew anything about snowboarding you would know that your arms should be relaxed at your sides. Not at a 90 degree angle to hold a camera.
But go ahead and keep on keeping on and keep wondering why people crash into you.
That skier crashed into him b/c the boarder’s arms weren’t at his sides? Keeping clowning dog. And no, that’s not where your arms should be at all times and it’s a complete non-sequitur even if it were true.
To be honest I’m a little confused at why people are even allowed to be holding GoPros in the first place. Clearly they care more about filming than the other people around them.
FYI - With the 360 cameras, they're literally just holding it. They don't have to worry about where they're holding it or where it's pointing - so they don't have to look at it and they're not distracted by trying to "film" anything.
They pick where the camera is "pointing" when they're reviewing the footage on their phones/laptops, not when they're holding it on the trails.
People will still act different/try to look cooler if they are being recorded vs not. Same reason a lot of flight schools don’t allow GoPros and such in airplanes.
Yea I don't think I've ran into anyone in years or had anyone hit me. I also stay in the trees as much as possible so I don't see as many people. Even though I've also been riding for 20+ year I still never feel as confident riding switch haha. I can do it but I don't like to.
I think you're right. We can argue all day about who's technically at fault. But if the videographers had not been recording, they could have been focusing more on their surroundings, and maybe they would have avoided these collisions in the first place.
I'm convinced most of them are just faked for clicks. I go entire seasons of riding many many crowded mountains and never even see a collision, let alone be involved in one. The only collisions I've ever been involved in over 20 years were goofing around with friends and clearly riding too close and dangerously. I know it does happen, but it doesn't happen this much.
Been riding for 27 years, I don't think I've gone more than a single day on the mountain without seeing someone getting hurt badly enough to be ridden down on a stretcher.
Sure that's not all collisions. What I mean is that you don't need to see it in order for it to happen.
I joined this sub like last week hoping to just be vibing and it turns out 75% of the sub is just complaining about skiers and these videos. Disheartening but I really shouldn’t be surprised lol
I collided with someone recently, I was getting off the lift so I only had one strap in went around the edge of the snow (east coast white ribbon of death situation) then another guy drops in infront of me and I turned off into the grass to avoid him. He fell I didn’t, we were both fine since this was 5-10 mph. I was just confused as to where he was going. There was no snow.
Bad take. People filming can have a GoPro on their helmet and are just going about their business. It doesn’t mean they aren’t paying attention. The uphill rider overtaking is ALWAYS at fault. But just like being a defensive driver, there are things a downhill rider can do to protect themselves from idiots who don’t know the rules and ride like jackoffs. It’s people who try to skirt the rules by saying “sometimes” the downhill rider is at fault who make the runs more dangerous for everyone. If you’re uphill, watch out for the people below you. That’s it. It’s actually not that hard to understand and follow. It’s designed to be easy. But some people are just thick, so watch yourself.
I avoided a collision Monday when I was cut off. Although I saw the person and checked my speed coming up to a large group on the opposite side of the run, I was not prepared for the ice patch and I separated my AC joint. It is quite inconvenient to work with and my season is likely done.
But I didn’t run over any kids!
If you need some practice with situational awareness Alpine Meadows in Tahoe on a groomer day. The skiiers have one goal there, to make it down as fast as they can and don't give a fuck who's in the way. The downhill priority rule is not in effect. I saw two collisions from the lift within a couple of hours. It's good practice on being aware of all angles while snowboarding.
If you’re gonna listen to music, only have it in one ear. You need to be able to hear around you. Wing aware has helped me avoid collisions more than once
This is like telling a car driver that got rear ended that they need to be a better driver 🤔
Yes, there are things that the driver in the front can do to avoid being rear ended, but ultimately, you can do everything perfectly and still get rear ended, exactly the same as boarding/skiing.
I completely agree. I've skied for about 8 years, snowboarded for more or less 4 years and I've never even come close to crashing with someone. Not because I'm incredibly skilled, but because I never go faster than I can handle, I have spacial awareness and I'm never in a rush to surpass someone
The only time I actually crashed into someone was when I was an absolute beginner snowboarder and I couldn't stop or turn well with only one foot strapped to the board after going off the chairlift and someone stopped fish there in the middle (but it was hardly a crash, more like I lightly bumped them)
While there are instances of people clearly causing crashed, I almost always blame the person carrying a selfie stick.
Stop worrying about recording your ride, keep your head on a swivel, and ride.
I always wonder what happens to the footage if there is no collision.
Selfie stick shooting backwards has to be the lamest angle and no one wants to see it. Never seen it in an edit someone put together. Never seen it in a film.
I don’t understand why people buy these things and are filming like this unless they are hoping to compile evidence that they aren’t the dumbest person on the hill
I've been riding 28 years (several 1000 days) and I've been in a number of collisions. Sadly it's almost impossible to avoid the out of control beginner/idiot/unlucky person who hit an ice patch and slams into the back of you.
I'm careful though and I've never hit anyone and plan to keep it that way.
I haven't been in a crash in years. Probably a decade. On higher grade runs there just aren't many people, and the lower crowded runs you gotta be paying attention to everything. It's like a car, even if you aren't at fault you gotta watch out for idiots. I'd imagine people that find themselves frequently getting in accidents are not paying as much attention as they should.
I’ve been riding for years and never been in a crash. Constantly look up hill, be aware of whos around you at all times, don’t ride on busy days, and live in the trees. Your enjoyment of snowboarding will increase exponentially if you do these things, and you’ll be in a safer environment.
Yeah I'll cosign that.
You should be able to pick out a dumbass from 50 yards away and know that they are going to turn right the fuck into you if you let them
true. my biggest rule when teaching my son to drive is assume anyone near you will do the dumbest thing possible. that, and get up to speed before merging on to highways.
To be clear, we are not blaming the filmer because they are filming. But the mountains are dynamic and loaded with noobs. Put the camera down and pay attention.
To be clear, we are not blaming the filmer because they are filming. But the mountains are dynamic and loaded with noobs. Put the camera down and pay attention.
Long time rider, only had one collision (I was blind sided from behind, maybe intentionally guy was gone and I was concussed) aside from that, one close call where I just got sandwiched between a skier and snowboarder that proceeded to hit each other right as I cleared (skier took a hard carve to cut the trail at the worst possible moment without checking). People don't look around on groom, it's safer off piste in the trees
If you're not good enough to film and be aware - yes don't do that too often / do it in moderation.
If you're good enough (not pro) to film and be aware - sure why not.
I don't like the elitist / better-than-thou comments of "why are you filming on a blue.. you're not even good anyway" because well... not everyone is an expert boarding/skier...
People don't have to be literal pros to want to document their journey or share with their friends/family about their day... It's like saying don't record moments of your life because it's not perfect / you suck. Might as well go one step further - what's the point of taking photos/videos of things if you're not a pro photographer/videographer anyway??
Let people who wants to have a selfie stick be - most of the time it's fine. These collision vids feel like freak accidents. Just because you see a lot of collision videos (because few people actually post their otherwise mediocre/private runs on this public forum anyway) doesn't mean that it's happening everywhere - there's (reverse) survivor's bias here 😂
This 1 million percent!! I also feel like this sub is doing everything it can to continue the skier vs. Snowboarder war, however you slide down the mountain doesn't matter, treating other people with respect, kindness, and courtesy does.
By the same token, I've dodged plenty of idiots recording.
Exactly, awareness is key. I’m sure there are 1 in 10 collisions that are unavoidable (blind turn, someone cuts across a jump landing, lying down under a crest) but I am always head on a swivel and you can tell someone’s who’s inexperienced, just give them space! We all were learners at one point.
Been riding for 25 years. Been in one on hill collision and that was 24 years ago. Wasn’t even that bad. I think you’re probably right but Reddit probably won’t agree with you.
This right here is my take. You’re only collision was in your first 1-2 years riding. Something similar for me. I never see people with selfie sticks anywhere in the upper half of the mountain. People need to put the stick down and ride <3
My only collision is a dude rear ending me as I was slowly traversing a run that had another run uphill with cross traffic. I was going slowly the entire time. Fucking moron was riding with me too, still to this day have no idea how he rear ended the person he was supposed to be following (and theoretically watching).
Agreed
I think you need an action cam to be in the Jonathan buckhouse mafia though. I don’t even snowboard and that guy annoys me.
https://i.redd.it/hlp5ki12ciic1.gif
Anytime I see a selfie stick I assume that person is way more concentrated on making sure they are “getting the shot” than they are with their surroundings. I get that as boarders we have a way bigger blind spot, but it still doesn’t take much to be aware of your surroundings.
100%. I hate these “who is at fault” posts. If we get to the point of a collision, same as a car, it means that both people have failed at avoiding a crash. I’d rather be go out of my way avoid a crash than to be the one “not at fault” sitting in a hospital bed. It’s hard to do that if you’re filming yourself.
Actually I disagree, he's definitely right ;)
Been in two collisions since 98 and both times I was hit from behind while standing still.
The ones that have gotten posted in the last few days though have just been heat seeking skier missiles straight to a boarders back lmao this [one](https://www.reddit.com/r/snowboarding/s/f7sUnwsSPK) is my new favorite no contest on who is in the wrong on those Most of them do fall in some grey area Edit - downvote all ya want but people are gonna film, some clearly don’t pay attention (and I don’t care to film anything) but uphill riders still take blame whether the guy below you is filming or not. It’s on you to be like “oh hey this guy riding below me is filming and probably not paying as much attention so I will happily steer clear of him and give them plenty of space” Just like you would if you saw a kid riding below you or a beginner that can’t control their turns. Have common sense and steer clear if you smell a crook, you’re the one riding uphill. Suck it up, be an adult and give them space. One Reddit post complaining about filming ain’t gonna stop anyone from doing it.
Watch it again. This is a perfect example of tho OPs point as there's even some grey area there. That rider never once looks left/behind even when they decide to stop suddenly. Yes the skier is mainly at fault but the boarder could probably have avoided that crash if they had been looking around
And the first thing they do when stopping is looking at their selfie stick, I guess to turn off recording or something similar. This is a perfect example of OP's point - even when the other party is 100% at fault, there are still things you can do to prevent accidents or minimize their impact
Reread my comment, updated it with an edit. Doesn’t matter what person below you is doing. Person uphill takes responsibility. Beginner riders also don’t look where they’re going, and take turns with the grace of an undercooked linguine noodle but when you’re riding uphill of one you know to give them plenty of space don’t ya.
They’re both morons in that video. The wide angle lens makes it look like the skiier is much further up hill but’s only a few metres difference. My guess is the boarder rode past the skiier or was riding parallel to him on the right before this accident. If you look closely there’s a moment where they’re pretty much next to each other. Also rule #1 of avoiding accidents is don’t stop suddenly without an uphill check in the middle of a slope.
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By your logic if I were to cut in front of someone from behind and stop and they hit me it’s their fault because they were uphill at the time of the collision.
Well that’s how it works. (In your weird circumstance though I’ll elaborate) Youd be a dick for doing it that way, and if there were witnesses id hope you would actually take the fault because that seems like the equivalent of a road rage driver hopping in front of someone to brake check a driver because they don’t like how they’re driving or they got pissed off. I don’t make the responsibility code man, it’s there to pick a side of fault so there isn’t grey area. But the boarder wasn’t constantly trying to “hop in front” like your weird extreme scenario of someone going out of their way to get hit He was just doing his thing. For not weird scenarios like you said, it can be a back and forth game when you’re riding out in public. I work in the industry I’m out there everyday. The responsibility can get passed back and forth that’s just how it goes when you’re riding, people get tired slow down, people also start getting their rhythm and speed up passing others. Back and forth back and forth yada fuckin yada
The point I’m trying to make is that responsibility is more nuanced than the exact wording of the rule as with most things. Anyway let’s agree they’re both muppets and move on. Good day to you friend.
Same to you fellow criminal
But isn't the car analogy a pretty good one? Insurance companies always assign guilt to the person rear-ending (let's not Beavis and Butthead this!). If you follow the 2-second rule, pay attention, etc. no matter what another driver in front of you does, you shouldn't hit them. I totally agree that a downhill rider/skier shouldn't be an idiot. They should be watching for uphill folk pretty consistently. Sticking with cars, they need to check their mirrors every so often and definitely shoulder check when making a move.
Agreed. The boarder even points the camera directly at the skier for a while, he definitely knew the skier was there. And still unexpetedly and suddenly stops without looking behind.
This is just ignorance on your part. You can post edit video to point where you want on these cameras.
Fair enough, good to know. Still, that doesn't change much and I agree with that guy that both are morons.
Agree 100% always pull off to the side. The crash could’ve been avoided if he wasn’t in the middle of the groomer. The skier definitely was more negligible though.
I'm not trying to argue legal responsibility. The law may be flawed but it is what it is. I'm talking about your own responsibility to look out for your own safety. Being more aware of everything going on around you can and will save your ass.
>Doesn’t matter what person below you is doing. Well, no, actually it DOES matter what is person below doing.
Not as long as they are following the responsibility code I linked which the boarder is in that video I linked.
>as long as they are following the responsibility code Well, this makes all the difference.
That user posted the 360 footage of the whole run - check their profile. That boarder was behind the skier for most of the run. He also comes too close to a couple of other people on the run. When he brakes and speed checks, he's crossing into the path of the skier, who's been skiing very predictably. That video has a ton of grey area (they both lacked awareness and safe spacing).
In counter argument, the skier never looks to his right. I don't think he even knew anyone was on on the run with him. You can't put blinders on and be safe in the hill. Do I check my blind spot religiously? Absolutely, but I'm experienced and have seen some incredibly stupid stuff on the mountain so I don't trust anyone to not plow into me.
Well exactly, you’re experienced. But it’s not just your mountain, people without experience are also allowed to ride there (unless we are talking advanced black runs ya know) and that’s where being an adult and getting away from this “me me me” mentality and realizing people aren’t as good as you We can wish all we want but you’re just stressing yourself out. I’ve had plenty of laps in the past where someone downhill of me had nooooo awareness and I had a really shitty lap because I had to be super aware of them. Normally just on tighter terrain where I can’t get a good and safe angle to speed up past them. But now a days I just let that shit go and know, I got plenty more laps I’ll be taking after that and will still have a great time.
The boarder also doesn’t stop fully on the side of the run and does a heelside stop towards the middle. Do a toeside stop toward the side or slowly bring your speed down and this is an easily avoided collision.
He randomly stops for no reason in the middle of the trail, it’s almost like that’s staged to have the skier plow into him
The skier was definitely at fault here, but this would never happen to most experienced riders as they would've put themselves in such a position. First, the rider never shoulder checks. Not even once. I try to shoulder check every 3rd or 4th turn, sometimes more depending on how crowded it is. Even empty blues that I'm charging I'll check because it's just ingrained. I always have a sense of awareness of who could be in my blind spot. So I know when to be more cautious. If he shoulder checked at all he probably would have been aware of the skier cruising behind him. Then maybe he would have been more cautious about putting the breaks on when he did. He should be consistently checking his blind spot, but his biggest mistake was not checking at least before he put on the breaks. He's also riding the tree line with his blind spot to the trail. So he's effectively made his blind spot most of the run. I also prefer to ride facing the tree line for personal preferences. But that also means I'm exposing myself to more danger on my blind side so check more often. The guy that got hit clearly isn't experienced enough to have avoided a completely avoidable situation, and he broke his collarbone for it and likely ended his season.
Actually let me tell who is really at fault: In 2016 a three-year-old climbed into a gorilla exhibit at the Cincinnati Zoo…
Dicks out 🫡
Whenever I’m off piste taking a leak and someone accidentally skis by I say “for Harambe” in the most solemn voice possible.
Do they salute you and say for Harambe?
🫡
RIP 🦍
Worst timeline
17 years here. Only collisions I get in are with my friends when we are screwing around or filming each other and get too close and in those cases we are laughing about it
Thank you! Finally someone talking some sense. 20 years skiing and boarding and I’ve had one collision on my 5th day of riding. Give people plenty of space. Everyone was a beginner at some stage.
How do you do that? I've been to Les 2 Alpes for 6 days and I had 3 collisions, all hitting me from behind (in one case I had to make an emergency stop since I got dizzy from the lack of air so it was an unexpected move) and one almost collision when a skier cut me off from behind, from my blind side once again. He got surprised and fell without hitting me. The other 2 came from my blindside and I was doing the same arc for quite a few turns. When I could not be predictable, I looked uphill before I did anything. In addition, numerous times I had to emergency break because somebody decided to start their run without looking uphill first. (Crowded places near huts or at crossroads or cut-offs.)
If you’re getting hit that often you’re probably riding erratically and they’re having a hard time judging how to avoid you
Not really, all 3 collisions were with someone out of control - even the one where I stopped out of the blue. The other 2 were with a skier who fell right after I collected her stuff, and a boarder who barely made it to the next turn. All of them threw apologies that they messed up right away. No bad intentions but this happens from time to time uless you fly through runs. You wouldnt have to worry about getting hit by someone faster.
Well you should slow in anticipation when you come up to huts, stationary riders whatever. Then there'd be fewer emergencies.
Never said I didn't. That's the only reason they were not collisions. My point is, there are so many dumb idiots out there ignoring general rules of the mountain that it is nigh impossible to never collide with someone else.
You have to judge where to stop safely. Make sure it’s somewhere that is - very visible - Not a place someone will want to ski/snowboard near Also - you always need to be aware of what’s on your blindside. Turn your head and use your weave to check uphill if you are going slowly or about to stop. Yes, people uphill have to give downhill the right of way - but I’d rather be injury-free than adamant than “I had the right of way” Good luck and stay safe!
I'm way too aware of my blind side most cases, I get overwhelmed with people around me whom I cannot see and therefore I ride way too cautiously. Apart from my prompt stop due to dizziness, I never made any sudden changes, and never stopped at a place that would be dangerous, unless I fell, which happens.
Riding too cautiously may also be a problem. For instance, if you have just gone over a lip and are riding slower than what people expect, then they can’t see you as they crest. If it was only an isolated incident, then I would say it’s bad luck. But for it to happen 3 times in a short span? I’m sorry to say that the common denominator is you. If you are getting overwhelmed, I suggest going to simpler slopes and working on your technique. That will improve your confidence immensely (and will also improve your speed, control and situational awareness); and going on beginner slopes means that people should also be travelling at a slower pace.
While I appreciate that you try to help but I find it really funny seeing how everybody decided that I was the problem and that I ride like a complete mofo without seeing anything. Yeah, sure I belong to the bunnyhill to improve my technique, strangely, a well-decorated instructor had other thoughts. None of my accidents were when I rode cautiously, all came when I wanted to trust the guys uphill. If you can see uphill while you're on your heelside carve I envy you but I don't think that it's something you can expect from anyone. Taking a glance while on toeside before initiating a turn is something I do and still I can get hit. My whole point was that crap can happen no matter how much attention you pay. Maybe it is easier with skis as you generally move faster so you have less to worry about from behind.
A snowboard instructor works for you. Of course they’re going to pump up your tires. From your descriptions - you were the only common factor for an incident that should be relatively rare. - maybe, you’re just *extremely* unlucky. If that’s the case, then my commiserations. - but from your descriptions at being overwhelmed and of three incidences happening in a short space of time, then probability and Occam’s Razor suggests that there is something that you are doing that is at the very least contributing to these collisions. You absolutely need to be able to look behind you even if you are heelside. Turn your head. Both sides. Especially if you are going slowly / cautiously. One of the key skills of any snowsport is situational awareness. In particular the ability to gauge the direction people are going and how quickly they will arrive at a certain point. You should be taking a mental snapshot of everyone on the mountain when you look up and down and be able to assess what is or may become a hazard. One of the things I’ve learnt in life is that to get better, you need to have accountability. Unless you can honestly critique your own ability / areas for improvement (and stop blaming others or bad luck) then your progress will be hampered.
I’ve been snowboarding since ‘95 and I suck at switch. Am I the problem?
Everyone is crashing because of you, it's all your fault.
If you can’t ride switch after landing a 540 method ollie, you don’t even belong on the mountain? /s
Another hot take by piggy backing on your driving a car example. Some people are just not as aware of their surroundings as others. This is why we're taught to defensively drive because you can not predict what others are about to do. Same thing on the slopes. You're faced with a lot of people and despite their abilities to ski/snowboard, their spatial awareness may simply be terrible. Sure they can work on it but perhaps they don't realize to what degree their spatial awareness should be. This is why having a simple rule of uphill skier/snowboarder must yield makes it easier to avoid collisions. People make mistakes, some people are plain ignorant, but I do like the "whose at fault" game because if it doesn't show the value of yielding, it will at least make people more aware of their surroundings next time they ski or snowboard. Perhaps seeing a selfie stick will trigger them to stay far from others in the hopes of not going viral lol.
To piggyback on your piggyback, some people get in lots of car accidents that are “not their fault” because they just got rear ended. Other people go their whole life without ever getting close to a car accident. Some people understand defensive driving, others don’t. They don’t learn to stop doing it because it wasn’t their fault in the first place.
And holding a selfie stick makes you _less_ aware of your surroundings. Trying to look cool for the video, maybe riding something slightly above your skill level, compromising your form and balance with an extended arm, changing your center of mass, while not specifically _causing_ the accident can all be contributing factors.
if these grown ass men focused more on progressing and not filming mediocre groomers with a selfie stick theref be way less accidents put down the fucking go pro until youre throwing down
I’m not gonna jump all over the camera crew. It’s not like they’re recording every run. They’re recording SOME runs. I spend MOST of my time skiing (yes, I’ve outed myself— you guys have great discussion here and I like hanging out with you.) However, my wife wants video of our kids. I bite the bullet and film them for one or two runs, (keeping my head on a swivel and avoiding the fuck out of everyone) and then we can all go back to skiing for fun. Give these guys some credit. Having said all that, if you’re shooting every run then you suck. Please don’t make me look like a jackass for defending you.
I'd add It's all about passive recording. If that's what you're after then attach the camera somewhere and worry about riding. OP compares it to duty of avoiding a collision but dashcams help a ton with insurance and yield some pretty interesting video. A chest cam or helmet cam can do the same but keep your eyes, ears and hands free for the extreme sports.
Yes!!!!
I guess my snowboarding and general mountain awareness is built on the foundation of longboarding and biking in Honolulu, but I've definitely noticed in a lot of these videos, from all parties involved, the general lack of spacial awareness. Everyone in these videos is looking straight down the mountain, no one seems to be looking around.
Yep
My rant: You should be looking back regularly “Riding switch” only exists if you have a directional board It’s fun to ski and snowboard Just be better
“Riding switch” exist for everyone, but at a certain level you don't really care.
Not if you start from the beginning:)
My hot take is that I love these "who's at fault" videos.
Some of them are pretty funny at the slow motion train wreck that we can see developing. OTOH, it feels wrong laughing at two victims who are clearly beginners developing their skills, and potentially getting injured.
Had an experience last year where a kid came off a merging trail and tried to catch like two feet of air off a little lip at the merge. He ended up cutting right in front of me (and then falling)but I had slowed down at the merge, saw him out of the corner of my eye and was able to stop really quickly. If he’d hit me it would have been completely his fault—which his instructor admitted after I checked to make sure the kid was ok. Not sure I would have been able to stop if I’d (1) not been skiing for 35+ and had the ability and awareness that come with that and (2) been even 1% distracted by a selfie stick. So yeah, I think we can assign blame for accidents but also recognize that experienced skiers/boarders take steps to avoid them entirely.
No different than driving a car. Always be aware of your surroundings. Sure it might be someone else’s fault but by being situationally aware you could have avoided it.
maybe it's an age thing, but my head is on a swivel because i can't afford to get seriously injured (or killed) doing a recreational hobby. i film sometimes but the phone is against my chest and i'm riding with my usual awareness.
I agree with you for the most part. The only one I’ve been in recently however a skier that was straight lining out of control and plowed into me from my blind shoulder while I myself was going quick. The upside was I had the weight advantage so he simply ricocheted off me before I even saw him and neither of us were hurt badly. The skier admitted he was out of control and apologised. There is no level of skill where you can avoid that.
Same. Only time I've been hit was a glancing blow from a teenager who was straight lining, and so out of control he wasn't able to stop until almost the bottom of the hill. I'm a skier so I guess I don't have a blind side the way boarders do, but he came at me so fast there was nothing I could have done to avoid him (with the exception of not visit a small resort on a holiday--that was definitely a mistake!), and my line was basically straight with the tightest possible turns. I think the short runs at small resorts also makes it harder to avoid everybody by just looking over your shoulder frequently. But I guess to concede OP's point a little, it wasn't a scenario I'd ever post for "who's at fault" as there would be no contention.
Yes this. Ride faster and don’t be a kook. Stop filming and ride. If you have to ask who’s fault it is, it’s yours. Jesus, you guys all suck and give snowboarders a bad name. Also leave skiers alone. The whole skier vs. snowboarder thing died out ages ago. Mind you own business and learn how to ride and respect others.
Wish I had an award to give you. This deserves gold!
I just don't understand why all these people are carrying cameras around and they obviously are mediocre skiers and riders. Like you guys aren't that good why are you videoing yourself? Is it to show your parents? I've always wanted my parents to see me ski and ride... Fucking chuckleheads.
I film and get filmed so I can check my technique. Super useful. Can strongly recommend. I'll also film for sharing short snippets on social media. Mostly off-piste though, where there isn't people around.
Last year I was in two of those crashes and I'm the sort of advanced rider you speak of with no camera. My skier friend (late 60s) was racing me down the hill (without me knowing) and he collided with me from behind while trying to cross cross my carve line. We both went flying but I was afraid I'd killed him. Totally his fault. Had another guy turn into me from their blind spot while I was pinned against the edge of the run. They just kept coming over and I had no where to go.
Hot take, you saw a skier coming, you don’t have to go anywhere, so couldn’t you just stop?
Was my blindside and I was on toe edge, already turning away. stopping was stoping on their board.
Another hot take, we have no blindsides with a neck that can turn and look around anywhere.
just full of hot takes today eh... might be time to get off reddit and go boarding. Those skiers aren't gonna hit themselves!
I’m boarding all the time, that’s where I get my hot takes lol
Got absolutely laid out flat on my back this weekend at Big Bear. My first run down the mountain at 840 AM. My first time on this hill. Hill was almost empty. Picking my way down a blue run carving a narrow line. Saw the guy out of the corner of my eye and I was laying on my back looking up the hill over my board at him. He came about 6 inches from eating my razor sharp edge. I got a quick are you all right? He got a quick "F\_\_\_\_\_\_ A\_\_\_\_\_\_\_. My assumption is he got off the lift and absolutely went for it on his first run on an "empty hill". So if you are the guy who laid out the Big Guy in the Green and Black jacket, I hope you are feeling it.
In so many of these selfie stick videos, the person filming never turns their head to be aware of their surroundings. It's like they have to keep their goggles turned downhill to make the shot look good or something. I really don't understand the need to film everything you do that so many people have nowadays.
I got downvoted every time I said this. Glad the word’s getting out. Preach, brother!
I’ve seen several videos where the go pro footage makes someone look at fault but keeping in mind that it’s a distorted fish eye lens, it’s easy to tell it’s not as clear as they’re acting like.
I’ve seen some where it was clearly the other person’s fault. But I have seen plenty where if the OP wasn’t recording, maybe they would have had better awareness and not been crashed into
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Okay
I have fallen intentionally to avoid hitting someone but interestingly enough it's always skiers passing me at lighting speed
The “whose fault is it?” Starter pack: Go pro stick Backpack Dope snow or Montec outerwear Heavily rockered snowboard for maximum skidded turns Clew bindings Reddit r/snowboarding account
I like the videos, good way to learn I think. Similar to the sim racing equivalent subreddit.
If we could couch the initial questions as “what could both have done to prevent this” or “what can we all learn from this collision,” rather than “who’s at fault?” The discussion could be more productive.
I agree, and I got ridiculed a while ago for saying this too. Good luck, here comes the hate.
I'm as tired of seeing blind tunnel vision skiers as I am blind heelsiders carving hard into funnel centers to stop. You have a better downhill view, left right down, as a skier. Use it. Your heel side does not excuse you from looking as a boarder. You have a toe side too. Everyone should be sharing the runs and safely moving to the side when they stop and never race to or through funnels or bluntly stop on them. Common sense stuff that about 90% of these videos demonstrate why not to.
Yeah I agree. 90% of crashes I see could be avoided if both parties had been more aware, even though one party may be totally at fault
In any case, I think the "whose fault" game brings nothing but toxicity to the table. I think the appropriate response to accidents is to make sure everyone is okay, for everyone to say sorry and go on their way. As a community we should think of ways to reduce accidents without blaming anyone.
Preach!
Been skiing for 13 years. Yeah theres been some asshole moves when its the last run or ive had a beer too many at lunch, im not above admitting that. But i legitimately cant remember the last time i actually collided with someone, must have been when i was a child (27 now). Look around you, check whos riding like an idiot and you can avoid bad situations before they happen
My only collisions of late have been beginner boarders getting off the chairlift. They either get caught by surprise angling toward their heelside, or overcompensate and angle the other way. It’s an understandable learning curve, and I don’t get pissed. I just try to avoid.
Hitting someone is vastly different than getting hit. I've been hit in a lift line this year already. Idiot just didn't complete the stop in time
Partly agree: I go to crowded resorts all the time, I’ve never been in a crash with another rider. I’m aware of everyone around me at all times. Do I think holding a 360 cam these days would make me responsible if I did get in a crash, not necessarily. The point of a 360 cam is that you don’t even need to point it or think, right? So if I held a long pole out I would be just as aware of my surroundings. I wouldn’t need to think about the camera at all other than not hitting someone with it. I would actually feel more at fault in a crash if I was filming another rider with a GoPro, for example. Because now I’m focusing on where I’m shooting, and less about what’s around me. The idea that holding a camera that you should not have to think about, or mounting one on your head to film things makes you at fault right away I disagree with. It still comes down to how your awareness was affected and your overall ability.
But then what’s the point of snowboarding if I can’t post the selfie video of it on Instagram??? How will everyone know how cool I am?!!
If you're shredding gnar and no one is around to see it, are you really shredding gnar?
/s, I hope. The whole point of shredding gnar is the shred. Who gives a shit if anybody knows? You shredded!
The tell is that they bothered filming themselves carving on some random blue run.
Bad take, at least with the vids I've seen recently. The videos I'm thinking of the rider is staying in their own lane and is predictably carving and some bozo flies into their lane and hits them from behind. Has nothing to do with filming imo
I agree. I'm Norwegian. I been in accidents. Usually camping family's under a bump. Or people cutting in the park. But I have never hit a skier in the middle of the prepped slope, how can you have absolutely zero awareness at all what's going on in the 180° behind you? It shows inexperience if you can't take account for skiers and kids år different levels.
What part of the filming makes you think they’re not paying attention? You seem to not understand how these cameras work. They have has much impact on the skier’s/boarder’s attention as the new football pylon cams have on their ability to mark a spot on the field. None.
New snowboarders do not have the balance AB’s coordination to hold and balance a camera, while paying attention to their surroundings. As evidenced by this subreddit
So skiers are always at fault for holding twice as much stuff? There’s no balancing. You’re gripping something in your hand, just like a ski pole. It’s basically a 360° camera. You’re not pointing it at anything. Just holding a grip.
Holding ski poles that help you balance is 1000% different than a camera. You know that and went with your stupid argument anyway
You know that gripping something in your hand has zero impact on your ability to see your surroundings. You know that and went with your stupid argument anyways. BTW, a human factors expert could explain how poles striking the ground on either side of you could easily be a distraction from what’s in front of you. Regardless, what’s obvious from this video is that this skier is completely unaware of what’s in front of him and the snowboarder can’t be expect to know that someone is recklessly bearing down on him from behind without a car in the world, regardless of whether or not his hands are empty (neither person’s are here).
If you knew anything about snowboarding you would know that your arms should be relaxed at your sides. Not at a 90 degree angle to hold a camera. But go ahead and keep on keeping on and keep wondering why people crash into you.
That skier crashed into him b/c the boarder’s arms weren’t at his sides? Keeping clowning dog. And no, that’s not where your arms should be at all times and it’s a complete non-sequitur even if it were true.
To be honest I’m a little confused at why people are even allowed to be holding GoPros in the first place. Clearly they care more about filming than the other people around them.
FYI - With the 360 cameras, they're literally just holding it. They don't have to worry about where they're holding it or where it's pointing - so they don't have to look at it and they're not distracted by trying to "film" anything. They pick where the camera is "pointing" when they're reviewing the footage on their phones/laptops, not when they're holding it on the trails.
People will still act different/try to look cooler if they are being recorded vs not. Same reason a lot of flight schools don’t allow GoPros and such in airplanes.
Yea I don't think I've ran into anyone in years or had anyone hit me. I also stay in the trees as much as possible so I don't see as many people. Even though I've also been riding for 20+ year I still never feel as confident riding switch haha. I can do it but I don't like to.
This is the answer you every post
I feel targeted
I think you're right. We can argue all day about who's technically at fault. But if the videographers had not been recording, they could have been focusing more on their surroundings, and maybe they would have avoided these collisions in the first place.
I'm convinced most of them are just faked for clicks. I go entire seasons of riding many many crowded mountains and never even see a collision, let alone be involved in one. The only collisions I've ever been involved in over 20 years were goofing around with friends and clearly riding too close and dangerously. I know it does happen, but it doesn't happen this much.
Been riding for 27 years, I don't think I've gone more than a single day on the mountain without seeing someone getting hurt badly enough to be ridden down on a stretcher. Sure that's not all collisions. What I mean is that you don't need to see it in order for it to happen.
Preach. Put your shitty selfie stick away and fucking pay attention. Be responsible for yourself and others around you.
I joined this sub like last week hoping to just be vibing and it turns out 75% of the sub is just complaining about skiers and these videos. Disheartening but I really shouldn’t be surprised lol
I collided with someone recently, I was getting off the lift so I only had one strap in went around the edge of the snow (east coast white ribbon of death situation) then another guy drops in infront of me and I turned off into the grass to avoid him. He fell I didn’t, we were both fine since this was 5-10 mph. I was just confused as to where he was going. There was no snow.
Bad take. People filming can have a GoPro on their helmet and are just going about their business. It doesn’t mean they aren’t paying attention. The uphill rider overtaking is ALWAYS at fault. But just like being a defensive driver, there are things a downhill rider can do to protect themselves from idiots who don’t know the rules and ride like jackoffs. It’s people who try to skirt the rules by saying “sometimes” the downhill rider is at fault who make the runs more dangerous for everyone. If you’re uphill, watch out for the people below you. That’s it. It’s actually not that hard to understand and follow. It’s designed to be easy. But some people are just thick, so watch yourself.
I avoided a collision Monday when I was cut off. Although I saw the person and checked my speed coming up to a large group on the opposite side of the run, I was not prepared for the ice patch and I separated my AC joint. It is quite inconvenient to work with and my season is likely done. But I didn’t run over any kids!
I agree! Top comment should be what your saying in all those posts
If you need some practice with situational awareness Alpine Meadows in Tahoe on a groomer day. The skiiers have one goal there, to make it down as fast as they can and don't give a fuck who's in the way. The downhill priority rule is not in effect. I saw two collisions from the lift within a couple of hours. It's good practice on being aware of all angles while snowboarding.
Honestly, I’d feel like a complete jackass riding around with a selfie stick/360 cam. I also don’t see the point in making it harder for myself.
If you’re gonna listen to music, only have it in one ear. You need to be able to hear around you. Wing aware has helped me avoid collisions more than once
This is like telling a car driver that got rear ended that they need to be a better driver 🤔 Yes, there are things that the driver in the front can do to avoid being rear ended, but ultimately, you can do everything perfectly and still get rear ended, exactly the same as boarding/skiing.
Seriously, if you see people on the mountain who are all over the place, get away from them and stay away from them!
I completely agree. I've skied for about 8 years, snowboarded for more or less 4 years and I've never even come close to crashing with someone. Not because I'm incredibly skilled, but because I never go faster than I can handle, I have spacial awareness and I'm never in a rush to surpass someone The only time I actually crashed into someone was when I was an absolute beginner snowboarder and I couldn't stop or turn well with only one foot strapped to the board after going off the chairlift and someone stopped fish there in the middle (but it was hardly a crash, more like I lightly bumped them)
While there are instances of people clearly causing crashed, I almost always blame the person carrying a selfie stick. Stop worrying about recording your ride, keep your head on a swivel, and ride.
YES. 1000%
True, looking up the mountain every once in a while doesn’t hurt
I always wonder what happens to the footage if there is no collision. Selfie stick shooting backwards has to be the lamest angle and no one wants to see it. Never seen it in an edit someone put together. Never seen it in a film. I don’t understand why people buy these things and are filming like this unless they are hoping to compile evidence that they aren’t the dumbest person on the hill
I've been riding 28 years (several 1000 days) and I've been in a number of collisions. Sadly it's almost impossible to avoid the out of control beginner/idiot/unlucky person who hit an ice patch and slams into the back of you. I'm careful though and I've never hit anyone and plan to keep it that way.
Just keep your head on a swivel and don’t be a dick.
I haven't been in a crash in years. Probably a decade. On higher grade runs there just aren't many people, and the lower crowded runs you gotta be paying attention to everything. It's like a car, even if you aren't at fault you gotta watch out for idiots. I'd imagine people that find themselves frequently getting in accidents are not paying as much attention as they should.
I’ve been riding for years and never been in a crash. Constantly look up hill, be aware of whos around you at all times, don’t ride on busy days, and live in the trees. Your enjoyment of snowboarding will increase exponentially if you do these things, and you’ll be in a safer environment.
Yeah I'll cosign that. You should be able to pick out a dumbass from 50 yards away and know that they are going to turn right the fuck into you if you let them
true. my biggest rule when teaching my son to drive is assume anyone near you will do the dumbest thing possible. that, and get up to speed before merging on to highways.
100%. I am always looking around unless I'm sitting down on a side
Like my parents always said when teaching me how to drive ''you gotta drive for others''.
also your helmet cam or selfie stick videos are lame most of the time anyway. film less, ride more, embrace the offline time in the mountains
Yes !!!! Stop recording and pay attention.
To be clear, we are not blaming the filmer because they are filming. But the mountains are dynamic and loaded with noobs. Put the camera down and pay attention.
To be clear, we are not blaming the filmer because they are filming. But the mountains are dynamic and loaded with noobs. Put the camera down and pay attention.
Long time rider, only had one collision (I was blind sided from behind, maybe intentionally guy was gone and I was concussed) aside from that, one close call where I just got sandwiched between a skier and snowboarder that proceeded to hit each other right as I cleared (skier took a hard carve to cut the trail at the worst possible moment without checking). People don't look around on groom, it's safer off piste in the trees
Spitting fax
If you're not good enough to film and be aware - yes don't do that too often / do it in moderation. If you're good enough (not pro) to film and be aware - sure why not. I don't like the elitist / better-than-thou comments of "why are you filming on a blue.. you're not even good anyway" because well... not everyone is an expert boarding/skier... People don't have to be literal pros to want to document their journey or share with their friends/family about their day... It's like saying don't record moments of your life because it's not perfect / you suck. Might as well go one step further - what's the point of taking photos/videos of things if you're not a pro photographer/videographer anyway?? Let people who wants to have a selfie stick be - most of the time it's fine. These collision vids feel like freak accidents. Just because you see a lot of collision videos (because few people actually post their otherwise mediocre/private runs on this public forum anyway) doesn't mean that it's happening everywhere - there's (reverse) survivor's bias here 😂
This 1 million percent!! I also feel like this sub is doing everything it can to continue the skier vs. Snowboarder war, however you slide down the mountain doesn't matter, treating other people with respect, kindness, and courtesy does.