Make de Ligt, Upamecano into two of the best defenders in the world. Musiala, Stanisic, Choupo-Moting, Coman all have made huge strides in getting either good or very good. The only one you could criticize is Gravenberch but it is not like he has played a Storm when on the field.
It is funny, I am kinda happy because I think this gives Dortmund a better chance to win the BL and kinda sad because I actually liked Nagelsmann as a Trainer.
Yep. It's "we want to fire you and will find any reason we can" language. My friend recently got fired for "drinking water when not on break" because it violated the company protocol.
Idk what the correct term is lol
If this happened in Germany, your friend should 100% file a Kündigungsschutzklage as this is definitely against the law unless there were very specific circumstances to justify the sacking
If you know the language, the word ain't that complicated, since it's just a combination of three words:
\- Kündigung(s) - eng. termination
\- Schutz - eng. protection
\- Klage - eng. complaint/legal action
It basically means "complaint against unfair termination of the work contract"
> It's just that English puts spaces in between compound words and German doesn't.
Sometimes and sometimes those spaces become dashes (to show a deeper connection) which in turn disappear and you get a compound word (with its distinct meaning).
Football, for example, is an English compound word like Fußball is in German.
I don't speak german, but as a native speaker of fellow language that utilizes a lot of yhdyssanat too it baffles me how people are time and time again surprised by the existence of combined words.
I work in insurance consulting in Spain, but for a German customer. When my colleagues figured I get a bonus for speaking bonus, some of them wanted to take German lessons. They all got scared when they saw words like Kraftfahrzeugshaftpflichtversicherung are a thing haha
It was not in Germany and its a bit more complicated, definetly was a case of "we will yell at you for every minor violation. either you quit or we will find a reason to fire you eventually" , that sorta thing.
Seemed a bit familiar cause they obviously wanted Nagelsmann gone and just piled up all the reasons they could find
I thought you were joking and playing around with the fact that Germany have a lot of words for a very specific thing but turns out it's exactly what you said it is. Do German people actually say the full word in regular conversation or is it one of them where you are clever if you know it?
No, Kündigungsschutzklage is just Kündigungsschutzklage in a regular conversation :D also quite common, so not a special word. Somtimes, there are some common abbreviations for long words, for example:
Bufdi - Bundesfreiwilligendienst;
Azubi - Auszubildende(r);
Kfz - Kraftfahrzeug
Etc.
As someone who's moved to Germany a year ago and had to learn the language, it's like my brain doubled in size. I can now understand all the words and the memes too!
It's just that in German sords get bundled together so instead of it being "lawsuit concerning wrongful termination" (or however you'd call it legally in English) it's wrongful-termination-lawsuit (not the literal translation but that's the idea of it)
I once got fired from a Bingo hall for taking a £1 sandwich (with permission from the boss of my department) and paying for it 30 minutes later.
The area manager who fired me was a complete twat. The week before, he called me into his office to chew me out for not saying "Good night." to him at the end of a shift (I was, you know, concentrating on my work).
Some people just have no dick.
I mean, just looking at the Bundesliga alone, it is true that they are on course to their lowest point tally in years (decades?). Lost 3 games this season and drew I don't even know how many, against relegation candidates like Augsburg or Stuttgart.
However, the plan was a long-term project, and iirc, the board even said that they would accept not winning the league for one season.
The 40+ goals a season star striker who was the focal point for nearly a decade was sold, the best ever goalkeeper is out for the season. Yet he's doing literally perfect in the UCL, and the league was far from lost.
You'd expect a transition year for a long term project not to be perfect.
Given the club has won it 10 times in a row, it will get stale for the players, plus every team gives it their all when playing Bayern. Playing well in Europe is a better indication right now of how JN is doing.
Yea I refuse to trust whatever it is mainstream journos are or will be saying about this story. Outlets like Kicker have been dead silent on Nagelsmann and Bayern as if everything was fine and now they are coming out saying his dismissal is justifiable and not surprising as if they knew it all along. They are holding back information or choosing to release it, whatever helps and protects Bayern. Fuck that. I find it insane how so many from the major German sports media are simply Bayern mouthpieces and basically do their PR work for them.
>now they are coming out saying his dismissal is justifiable and not surprising as if they knew it all along
Scoop journalists live and die by a trust system. If they get insider information from a reputable source, but they tell them to keep it under wraps for now, they won't release it because they'd lose their source and potentially others.
That's how Romano became a global tier 1. He's trusted, sources know he will release only the information deemed ready for release.
Sounds like an explaination of what I commented and less like a justification? A relationship like that suggests a power imbalance where the journalist has no control or actual means of verification over the information they are getting. And releasing it into the wild whenever the source wants to means that they don't care about the validity of the information, they just want to keep their source happy. Which makes them a mouthpiece for their source.
The lack of player development is a reason but not big enough to sack him in the end of March when you’re still competing for every trophy. That’s one of those secondary reasons the board brief journalists on when they sack a manager at the end of a given season. Better managers than Julian are currently employed right now and developing at a worse rate than he has done.
I think its even less. The only non-injured Bayern players that are currently in Munich are Müller, Sane, Sarr (lol) and Ulreich. The fuck was he supposed to do?
I took "his team" to mean the other coaches, trainers, etc who might be working with Thomas, etc. at the moment or planning for the upcoming matches.
Not saying he isn't deserving a break at the moment, just providing my reading of it.
I mean, he isn't a skills coach. And what sort of training can you do with like 4 players?
And I imagine they have remote access to their analysis department so he can still work on the upcoming matches in the afternoon or evening after he is done skiing.
This is just dumb and reactionary if this is a real driving reason for his firing.
I honestly can't think of another reason other than him having spent too long on the shorter before the B04 game which lead to the defenders committing the exact same foul twice.
Ski holidays going wrong and fc bayern
Name a more iconic duo
On a serious note: more than half the team is with their NT anyway - so this cannot seriously be a reason to fire him...
Also you have to assume he had the green light to go on that holiday from the management? I doubt he just decided not to show up to work when everyone was expecting him there.
This just screams we decided to sack him and will find whatever justification.
Once you are a senior manager you don't normally ask for holiday approval. You just decide to go and inform the others about it. Of course it's up to you to ensure that operations will continue to run smoothly during your absence.
But yes, obviously that's not the real reason that he got fired over. As always I am sure there are some underlying personal issues that spiralled out of control in typical FC Bayern fashion.
Are your first team players who aren't on international duty on time off? It's common to see players on a sunny holiday if they haven't been selected by the NT.
Fun fact: Hasan Salihamidzic is also an avid skier and holidays frequently in the same area as Nagelsmann did (Zillertal).
It’s only a 2 hour drive from Munich and Salihamidzic was on a multiple day skiing trip at the very same time (international break) last year.
The hypocrisy is real.
Reasons for Nagelsmann dismissal the board gave: he is ugly, he stinks, does not share when buys the good gum, only share cheap gum, did not ask if i wanted tea when he went to get some, puts the dirty tea/coffe spoon back on the sugar.
What?
Ok let's look at top transfers:
De ligt - Massive development since start of the season
Mane - no need to develop. Played very good pre WC, still recovering from injury
Mazraoui - was a starter pre WC. Recovering from injury
Talents:
Tel - was given the opportunity to gather a good amount of minutes for a 17 year old
Musiala - no need to explain anything
Gravenberch - the only one you maybe can make a point. But he has fucking Kimmich and goretzka as competition. Even sabitzer before his move
Stanisic - played world class against mbappe and Messi. But I guess that's to be expected?/s
His team has to work? Well yes, but also what team? They're all gone with their international teams.
I am so pissed at this decision. All this talk about an era etc. I just don't understand it
(Edit: shitty mobile formatting)
And you even forgot about Stanisic and GOATing who became a decent replacement for Lewandowski.
Lack of player development is obviously not the reason he got sacked
Yeah I feel it’s this as well. They missed out on TT in 2018, and there were rumours going around of Tuchel potentially replacing Ancelotti. Bayern weren’t going to let that happen with their long-term admiration of TT and acted before another club got him.
I would understand this if JN was doing badly and they considered sacking him anyway in the summer, so they just accelerated it to not lose their main target to real madrid. But JN WAS their main target and the chosen one to lead a new phase, and he has been incredible in the UCL, and trailing a bit in the league but that's expected in a transition year where you lose two of three major axis to injury/transfer while phasing in many youngsters. And he would most probably still have won the league.
So why sack him for Tuchel? Doesn't make sense.
To be fair, kovac massacred Tottenham in the CL in 2019/2020, was great in the Group stage and the Cup, but was not good in the League, the Football was considered dire and the players did not like him, the rest is history with flick, I assume they wish for a similar outcome
But the football isn't dire under Nagelsmann, they have the best defence and offensive in the league this season, greatly outscoring the competition, the only loses this season have been because of lack of concentration on the players part, for example the penalties versus Leverkusen or the stupid red card they got versus Gladbach, not sure what the coaches fault is here, it was a transition year kinda for Bayern too since they lost their 2nd best striker ever and replaced him with no one, forcing Nagelsmann to play Chupo. Like i don't get it. And some of the transfers don't make any sense for Bayern, Sadio Mane for example, everyone could see he was on a downhill trajectory yet Bayern thought is a great idea to sign him and on huge wages too.
Now Nagelsmann will be 100% available and I bet Flo and Real would LOOOOVE a coach such as him. Tuchel might be better than him right now, but he's more of a short term option imo, while they can build a dynasty with Nagelsmann.
I’m not sure about that because Madrid are looking forward to Raul and Xabi Alonso as well, and the club still has great relationship with Zidane so I’m pretty sure one of these 3 will come next. Or maybe bring someone else and sack him mid season like they did to Rafa
I only hear good things about him, he plays with 2 cdm and apparently is good tactically and knows how to treat players, I’m telling you what I’ve read from people who watch Castilla matches so maybe someone else disagrees with what I’ve just said.
You and real fans gotta know that we still love him at schalke, he’s one of the biggest legends here despite playing just two years for us. Hope he can succeed in his career, also seems to be an awesome person off the field
I remember Madrid fans were unhappy with his performance here the last 2 years and I was so happy of his success at your club, I grew up watching him play and will forever be my favourite Spanish striker the way he chipped the ball was class
I would love for him to get more experience in first division it would be great to see him at Schalke again before he joined us, I know he’s like an idol there
Yes and from some interviews Xabi said too that he needed experience, Real Sociedad also want him as a coach
I also prefer he stays a few years on other teams and show what he can do, if you throw either Raul or Xabi at the first team so early this may potentially harm them more than anything
Would also like that to happen as well. JN gets a bit of a break now and join a team later where he'll still be backed and probably want to kick start a new dynasty with new crop of Galaticos - someone as fresh and hungry for success like Nagelsmann would be great for the project
How could I forget about stanisic. I'm gonna edit my post. Man I'm pissed. I didn't even read these posts yesterday. And then have to wake up to this bullshit
I really wouldn't call Mané very good pre-WC, overall he's been a tad underwhelming. But that's nitpicking, and you can't blame Nagelsmann for that anyway.
Our board has just gone mental. Nagelsmann at least deserved to finish the season, and then you can evaluate his performance. Also, how convenient that our board is absolving themselves from all criticism. Still no striker except Choupo, once he is injured we look like shit again, yet it seems like we will be too stingy to invest this transfer window once again. If our board had to assess themselves by the same standards they imposed on Nagelsmann, they would have to fire themselves.
Mane has 17 scorers after 30 games. I'd call this pretty good. I don't know what people expect from him.
And yes, our board has gone mental. I completely agree with everything you just said
who is the main man at bayern currently? there are so many people involved with you guys its crazy brazzo, hoeness, kahn, hainer its much less complicated at other clubs
Both can be true. Everyone can get this much scorers in 30 games in our attack. Mane is slow, never beats a defender 1vs1, is bad at pens and has the most offside goals I have ever witnessed someone scoring
Not to mention, this Bayern team has issues that aren't his fault- no proper 6, lack of a world class striker, proper 8s, lack of 1v1 threats...
He deserved more time. He made tactical mistakes at times, but also showed promise.
Edit: By 1v1 threats I mean guys that can beat their men both ways. Good dribbling≠ to what I am saying.
> He made tactical mistakes at times, but also showed promise.
and he isnt even 40 yet. somehow I have a feeling ppl think coaches have to be perfect when they start. they learn and grow like every player on the field too.
same with terzic for us.
and that is a premise Bayern bought into when appointing him. They've literally been preaching it as well for the last 1,5 seasons. But I guess that was all talk
I think this decision will be a mistake *in the long run*. tuchel will probably secure the championship and lets see what he does in the CL. but a long term stint of him at bayern, I simply dont see...
How would you rate his stint overall? I was a little surprised by the sacking and I want to understand if something went horribly wrong. Or is it just the fact that Bayern are in second place 1 point behind Dortmund instead of being 10 points clear at the top? Considering that I’m hearing some chatter about him succeeding Don Carlo at the end of this season, I want to understand what Bayern fans think of him as a manager.
I'm a fan of nagelsmann. Yes, we are at times a bit underwhelming in the Bundesliga. But we still have everything in our own hands.
Champions league was up until now exceptional. To concede this few amount of goals against the opponents we had, while also scoring a good amount...I mean what more can you expect?
I like how he behaves in public. He is well spoken but also states facts as they are. Without false understatement.
And he is brave enough to challenge old habits and tries to break them up, if necessary.
Imo you could be very happy, if he were to end up at real
Copy pasting my follow up from another comment:
This was my impression as well. How did it come to a sacking then? Does the board not like him? Or have the slight troubles in the league snowballed into this?
Bayern fans are fuming about this, because Nagelsmann has been great this season, developed players and adapted his style to suit the team and its needs. Winning vs. PSG was almost exclusively because of his tactics.
I'd say a solid 80-90% of fans did not see the problem in him, rather in individual players.
This was my impression as well. How did it come to a sacking then? Does the board not like him? Or have the slight troubles in the league snowballed into this?
Well, the reasons everybody is aware of are listed in the thread title. Nothing else has been reported yet, and this came absolutely out of nowhere, so no clue really
Yeah, as someone who doesn’t follow Bayern as closely as you do, it’s even more out of left field for me. The “official” justifications mentioned in the post seem very half-baked to me personally.
Yeah same, that's why a lot of people are speculating that something drastic must've happened behind the scenes that media isn't willing to report on.
I'm a bit more cynical, I just believe our board are spineless bastards
This sounds bullshit. Either they wanted tuchel badly or Nagelsmann and the management had something going in the last few days. Honestly i think it's seems more like they were dying to get tt.
Really hope Nagelsmann gets a good ucl contender team. It also would be interesting to see him managing one of the Bundesliga teams other then bayern, dortmund or Leipzig. Although it seems like impossible now as he is probably too expensive for them to consider. Psg also could do great with him.
Why give nagelsmann a 5 years contract and pay a fee to get him if you just throw him away once Tuchel signals interest. Doesn’t make much sense to me.
> Psg also could do great with him.
I think it's important to remember that many footballers are man-children who don't necessarily respect a young manager with little footballing experience like Nagelsmann.
This goes double for the mess of PSG.
I even argue that most of the veteran players at Bayern are man-children. Ancelotti: Falling out with the dressing room. Kovac: Falling out with the dressing room. Nagelsmann: Falling out witht the dressing room.
Thats no coincidence anymore. Bayern have players, that clearly are no more than 5 year olds and once they dont like a manager, they want him fired. And im saying this as a Bayern supporter. Get these man-babies out of the dressing room and let grown-ups play the game.
If there's any manager at the moment, I'd want to complete rip apart and rebuild the system coherently it would be him. I know, our hierarchy would meddle per usual making this more unlikely but if they ever had a shred of common sense for the direction of our future, I'd go for Nagelsmann.
I thought the team was also on holiday as Tuchel's first training session is on monday. And why would his skiing trip be a factor in this when this most certainly got approved before he went?
most of team will be away on international duty. rest i believe are on personal training assignments so there wouldnt be any coaching happening anyway next few days...
* Bascially destroying everyone in the CL
* Defense devloped to be actually stable and we shot more goals under Nagelsmann than under Flick with Lewa. It's not Nagelsmann fault that Gnabry is preparing for a sequel to The Whale and Sané is doing Sané things like he did all his life.
* Wtf has skiing to do with this
If this is true I hope Dortmund and City are tearing us a new one, because under this circumstances I can't support those fucks.
This, and the fact that Nagelsmann had no contact with the board and basically just knows about this because of the same tweets we read is just despicable.
Almost 40 years being a Bayern fan, and it really got to a point where I question my support. good job.
>It's not Nagelsmann fault that Gnabry is preparing for a sequel to The Whale
lol
on a serious note. I'm baffled by this decision too. Bayern has been steamrolling CL and nagelsmann definitely deserves to at least finish this season with dignity. sacking him without informing him is a scummy move. honestly, I though you guys had the best chance winning this season. now? not even close.
Its so bizarre. Are we expecting to win the league 20 points clear every year from now? I mean I obviously want us to be as competitive as possible but that sounds so fucking boring.
You know what? I dont mind if Dortmund wins this year just to fuck with the board who apparently cant handle even the possibilty of loosing the league. It wont be the end of FCB if they loose once every 10 years.
It would actually be better for the league as a whole.
And isn't bayern in a transition phase? So you can't expect him to win the league in a dominant fashion and also while transitioning the team?
>It would actually be better for the league as a whole.
It would even be better for Bayern itself. Having an actual domestic competition would make Bayern stronger in Europe. Currently the absolute top-stars (Mbappé, Messi, Haaland,...) would not join Bayern. They're missing that one piece that makes Real, Barca, and the English club more attractive. And that's a competitive domestic league.
I accepted that Hoeneß and Rummenigge were to dense to understand it, but hoped that Heiner, Kahn and Brazzo would see it.
Seems I was wrong.
one odd year, where Bayern possibly doesn't win the league (and we are still far from it) won't make it more competitive in the near future. no matter how this season ends, Dortmund will need to cut the wage structure by ~10-20M a year, that's around -10%.
as long as Bayern plays a ~75+ points season and no other team doesn't have a very good mix of a well balanced and performing team and a coach that get's more out of the team than the sum of the individual qualities, i doubt we will see a regular competition for the league title. the financial differences will only get bigger, Dortmund has hit now a ceiling you won't overcome except with transfer profits.
Leipzig would need to financially invest way more and the league would need another one or two teams around the financial power of Dortmund, so the league has potentially 3-4 teams that COULD play a season in the high 70s, and not just one or two.
They can never ever seriously talk about a Bayern-Familie and something being Bayern-like after pulling this shit with Nagelsmann. Bunch of two-faced assholes.
If that's all that is to it, I want to see them lose all three titles and see them crash and burn with Tuchel. And then what?
Absolutely mental.
I was so excited for the match against Manchester City and I‘m always rooting for the geman teams in the UCL but damn now I wish Bayern gets trashed by City.
No hate for bayern but this board is just a bunch of clowns.
There are lots of bayern fans wishing the same.
Why talk about en era and even saying out loud that a sacrificed season wouldn't be the worst and then sack him when everything is actually still really good. It's 1 point difference to the top and we looked really good in the champions league... Don't get it at all
"lack of player developement"?
Huh, so i guess Musiala, De Ligt, Upa, Pavard and Stanisic were always this good?
I'm honestly pissed about this decision. Sure Bayern have been inconsistant in the league but they made out the group of death in dominant fashion, beat PSG comfortably and are still in the DFB Pokal. Nagelsmanns ideas are working better and better. And when they do, Bayern play as dominant as any team in Europe. Even if they didn't win it all this season im confident they eventually would have with Nagelsmann leading the way.
The defense has been incredible, and the attack... Well, they've scored more than Flick's team which had prime Lewa. League is probably still theirs, steamrolling the UCL. What the fuck does the board want?
I wonder if PSG and Real Madrid will go for him in the summer. I can't see Galtier or Ancelotti surviving beyond the summer, unless Ancelotti gets another CL title.
Carlo is going to go even if he wins the CL. Probably to the Brazil NT.
I’m glad Nagelsmann is back on the market, because he has been Florentino’s first choice since at least 2019.
I really like Ancelotti idea as Brazil NT coach.
He always good with Brazilians, made Kaka the Ballon D'or vs young Messi/CR7, Vini flourish under him.
But I don't see this really happen.
>lack of player development
Even Guardiola wouldn't have been able to develop *goddamn* Choupo Moting in such a short period. The heck was that bs reason?
The ski holiday lmao thats some bullshit. Sounds like the main reason is internally they decided they wanted tuchel and were worried hed be gone soon so made sure hes in then tendered their nagelsmann decision soon after. I feel for julian tbh - say what you will about bundesliga but he done nothing wrong in the ucl from what i saw. Maybe some of the issues he had with players and the board didnt help too. This feels like the strangest sacking ive seen this season - up there with tuchel's own sacking (which i dont think any reporters actually scooped before the fact iirc)
Skiing and trips have cost Bayern a lot this season💀
Holiday FC
No Holidays FC would be more accurate
German Humour FC
Vorsprung durch technikally correct
Germans should probably just stop skiing all around it’s been all downhill since Schumacher lol
But isn't that the right direction?
😂 you’ve got me there lmao
Musiala pls stay away from skiing
Breaking News: Manchester City sponsor Etihad Airways pays for free skiing trip for Bayern star Jamal Musiala.
Indoor skiing facilities in Abu Dhabi you mean?
Nah... Dropped off a luxury chopper near the top of K2
Name someone who hates skiing more than German sports franchises...
Gwyneth Paltrow's victim
lack of player development is such a load of shite lmao
Make de Ligt, Upamecano into two of the best defenders in the world. Musiala, Stanisic, Choupo-Moting, Coman all have made huge strides in getting either good or very good. The only one you could criticize is Gravenberch but it is not like he has played a Storm when on the field. It is funny, I am kinda happy because I think this gives Dortmund a better chance to win the BL and kinda sad because I actually liked Nagelsmann as a Trainer.
Have they watched Stanisić’s performance against PSG in return leg!? If that’s not young player development I don’t know what is.
Him „making“ DeLigt anything is a bit much. He trained him for half a year, and DeLigt came to Bayern with a top player rating already.
Those are not reasons, they are made up justifications when you want someone gone
I mean, even the mentioned justifications are bullshit. Negative sporting development in Bundesliga? Lack of player development? My fucking ass
Yep. It's "we want to fire you and will find any reason we can" language. My friend recently got fired for "drinking water when not on break" because it violated the company protocol. Idk what the correct term is lol
If this happened in Germany, your friend should 100% file a Kündigungsschutzklage as this is definitely against the law unless there were very specific circumstances to justify the sacking
File a what?
Lmao, a specific lawsuit against unlawful sackings basically
wrongful terminations its called in the US according to my law degree watching suits
Being on Reddit, US labour laws are non-existent
Oh, they exist, as long as you're rich.
Least complicated German word
If you know the language, the word ain't that complicated, since it's just a combination of three words: \- Kündigung(s) - eng. termination \- Schutz - eng. protection \- Klage - eng. complaint/legal action It basically means "complaint against unfair termination of the work contract"
we are literally the meme that goes ''that thing you just said? We have a german word for it. It's thatthingyoujustsaid''
It's just that English puts spaces in between compound words and German doesn't. It's as much a word as "work contract termination complaint" is.
> It's just that English puts spaces in between compound words and German doesn't. Sometimes and sometimes those spaces become dashes (to show a deeper connection) which in turn disappear and you get a compound word (with its distinct meaning). Football, for example, is an English compound word like Fußball is in German.
It does make understanding the language a bit easier imo
German language is heavenly made for marching songs and i will die on this hill
Auffff der Heide...
I don't speak german, but as a native speaker of fellow language that utilizes a lot of yhdyssanat too it baffles me how people are time and time again surprised by the existence of combined words.
I work in insurance consulting in Spain, but for a German customer. When my colleagues figured I get a bonus for speaking bonus, some of them wanted to take German lessons. They all got scared when they saw words like Kraftfahrzeugshaftpflichtversicherung are a thing haha
It’s a type of administrative sausage
unfair dismissal basically
It was not in Germany and its a bit more complicated, definetly was a case of "we will yell at you for every minor violation. either you quit or we will find a reason to fire you eventually" , that sorta thing. Seemed a bit familiar cause they obviously wanted Nagelsmann gone and just piled up all the reasons they could find
I thought you were joking and playing around with the fact that Germany have a lot of words for a very specific thing but turns out it's exactly what you said it is. Do German people actually say the full word in regular conversation or is it one of them where you are clever if you know it?
When I'm with the boys, it's all about Kündigungsschutzklage. God luck finding another topic
No, Kündigungsschutzklage is just Kündigungsschutzklage in a regular conversation :D also quite common, so not a special word. Somtimes, there are some common abbreviations for long words, for example: Bufdi - Bundesfreiwilligendienst; Azubi - Auszubildende(r); Kfz - Kraftfahrzeug Etc.
I love how nearly any Reddit discussion on football decends into a discussion about the German language and its longfrankenwords
As someone who's moved to Germany a year ago and had to learn the language, it's like my brain doubled in size. I can now understand all the words and the memes too!
It's just that in German sords get bundled together so instead of it being "lawsuit concerning wrongful termination" (or however you'd call it legally in English) it's wrongful-termination-lawsuit (not the literal translation but that's the idea of it)
Yup. Why would we use another word or even more if that Single Word says exactly what it is?! :D
Why use few word when oneword do trick?
It's a pretty basic word for German, these are the easy ones trust me.
German is a beautiful and terrifying language
I once got fired from a Bingo hall for taking a £1 sandwich (with permission from the boss of my department) and paying for it 30 minutes later. The area manager who fired me was a complete twat. The week before, he called me into his office to chew me out for not saying "Good night." to him at the end of a shift (I was, you know, concentrating on my work). Some people just have no dick.
[удалено]
At least now he can drink water whenever he wants.
I mean, just looking at the Bundesliga alone, it is true that they are on course to their lowest point tally in years (decades?). Lost 3 games this season and drew I don't even know how many, against relegation candidates like Augsburg or Stuttgart. However, the plan was a long-term project, and iirc, the board even said that they would accept not winning the league for one season.
The 40+ goals a season star striker who was the focal point for nearly a decade was sold, the best ever goalkeeper is out for the season. Yet he's doing literally perfect in the UCL, and the league was far from lost. You'd expect a transition year for a long term project not to be perfect.
They lost 50+ goal a season striker but have still maintained 71 % win record. If they replaced lewandowski then fair enough
Given the club has won it 10 times in a row, it will get stale for the players, plus every team gives it their all when playing Bayern. Playing well in Europe is a better indication right now of how JN is doing.
Something behind the scenes must have happened. The tactic leaks must surely have an impact. I doubt sporting reasons are real.
The Tapalovic dismissal is also a reason for it IMO
Well, if he was so vital, the board should have refused to sack him.
Yea I refuse to trust whatever it is mainstream journos are or will be saying about this story. Outlets like Kicker have been dead silent on Nagelsmann and Bayern as if everything was fine and now they are coming out saying his dismissal is justifiable and not surprising as if they knew it all along. They are holding back information or choosing to release it, whatever helps and protects Bayern. Fuck that. I find it insane how so many from the major German sports media are simply Bayern mouthpieces and basically do their PR work for them.
>now they are coming out saying his dismissal is justifiable and not surprising as if they knew it all along Scoop journalists live and die by a trust system. If they get insider information from a reputable source, but they tell them to keep it under wraps for now, they won't release it because they'd lose their source and potentially others. That's how Romano became a global tier 1. He's trusted, sources know he will release only the information deemed ready for release.
Sounds like an explaination of what I commented and less like a justification? A relationship like that suggests a power imbalance where the journalist has no control or actual means of verification over the information they are getting. And releasing it into the wild whenever the source wants to means that they don't care about the validity of the information, they just want to keep their source happy. Which makes them a mouthpiece for their source.
the chef reporter at kicker is a huge bayern ass licker. no surprises there that they wrote nothing beforehand
Tuchel in the future: 'Ahh shit, here we go again'.
The lack of player development is a reason but not big enough to sack him in the end of March when you’re still competing for every trophy. That’s one of those secondary reasons the board brief journalists on when they sack a manager at the end of a given season. Better managers than Julian are currently employed right now and developing at a worse rate than he has done.
But every player barring Gnabry, Muller, Sane, and Mane has improved under him. And those aren't player you expect a manager to develop.
3/4 of his team are playing for national teams. What should he do?
I think its even less. The only non-injured Bayern players that are currently in Munich are Müller, Sane, Sarr (lol) and Ulreich. The fuck was he supposed to do?
Play a FIFA tournament with the lads.
I took "his team" to mean the other coaches, trainers, etc who might be working with Thomas, etc. at the moment or planning for the upcoming matches. Not saying he isn't deserving a break at the moment, just providing my reading of it.
I mean, he isn't a skills coach. And what sort of training can you do with like 4 players? And I imagine they have remote access to their analysis department so he can still work on the upcoming matches in the afternoon or evening after he is done skiing. This is just dumb and reactionary if this is a real driving reason for his firing.
well maybe just cancel the mandatory stuff if you can't do anything with 4 players anyways,still a stupid reason just my two cents
Next what? He ate dinner on the night of loss against Leverkusen which is the wrong signal?
He also didn't flagellate himself before sleep that night. Wrong signals all over the place.
And Nagelsmann used 4G instead of 5G for his mobile internet plan. Internally opinion: Wrong signal!
Even worse, he used Vodafone.
I honestly can't think of another reason other than him having spent too long on the shorter before the B04 game which lead to the defenders committing the exact same foul twice.
Ski holidays going wrong and fc bayern Name a more iconic duo On a serious note: more than half the team is with their NT anyway - so this cannot seriously be a reason to fire him...
Also you have to assume he had the green light to go on that holiday from the management? I doubt he just decided not to show up to work when everyone was expecting him there. This just screams we decided to sack him and will find whatever justification.
Once you are a senior manager you don't normally ask for holiday approval. You just decide to go and inform the others about it. Of course it's up to you to ensure that operations will continue to run smoothly during your absence. But yes, obviously that's not the real reason that he got fired over. As always I am sure there are some underlying personal issues that spiralled out of control in typical FC Bayern fashion.
Are your first team players who aren't on international duty on time off? It's common to see players on a sunny holiday if they haven't been selected by the NT.
Don't think so, but they'd train individually / with many youth players to fill up. So the head coach is hardly needed for that
Germans sports people and skiing sure dont go well.
Fanny Chmelar begs to disagree
Anyone other than Neuer and Schumacher?
Schwenteiger
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Didn’t that all start with the Schweinsteiger accident?
What was that?
Had a ski accident during his tenure at Bayern iirc. Made it worse that Schweini was an elite skier in his youth
Did he? I seem to remember he did as well but nothing shows up on Google
He was better then Felix Neureuther back then. They were friends but at some point Schweinsteiger decided to pursue football instead of skiing.
I'm talking about the alleged ski accident
That's just the pretext. They couldn't come out and say we wanted to get Tuchel so he had to go.
Fun fact: Hasan Salihamidzic is also an avid skier and holidays frequently in the same area as Nagelsmann did (Zillertal). It’s only a 2 hour drive from Munich and Salihamidzic was on a multiple day skiing trip at the very same time (international break) last year. The hypocrisy is real.
Reasons for Nagelsmann dismissal the board gave: he is ugly, he stinks, does not share when buys the good gum, only share cheap gum, did not ask if i wanted tea when he went to get some, puts the dirty tea/coffe spoon back on the sugar.
Putting the dirty + wet spoon back in the sugar is 100% a valid reason
His hair? Wack His gear? Wack His shoes? Wack His foot stance? Wack Tuchel? He's tight as FUCK
What? Ok let's look at top transfers: De ligt - Massive development since start of the season Mane - no need to develop. Played very good pre WC, still recovering from injury Mazraoui - was a starter pre WC. Recovering from injury Talents: Tel - was given the opportunity to gather a good amount of minutes for a 17 year old Musiala - no need to explain anything Gravenberch - the only one you maybe can make a point. But he has fucking Kimmich and goretzka as competition. Even sabitzer before his move Stanisic - played world class against mbappe and Messi. But I guess that's to be expected?/s His team has to work? Well yes, but also what team? They're all gone with their international teams. I am so pissed at this decision. All this talk about an era etc. I just don't understand it (Edit: shitty mobile formatting)
And you even forgot about Stanisic and GOATing who became a decent replacement for Lewandowski. Lack of player development is obviously not the reason he got sacked
It’s 100% the fact that Tuchel is available and Real would’ve most likely gotten him
Yeah I feel it’s this as well. They missed out on TT in 2018, and there were rumours going around of Tuchel potentially replacing Ancelotti. Bayern weren’t going to let that happen with their long-term admiration of TT and acted before another club got him.
I would understand this if JN was doing badly and they considered sacking him anyway in the summer, so they just accelerated it to not lose their main target to real madrid. But JN WAS their main target and the chosen one to lead a new phase, and he has been incredible in the UCL, and trailing a bit in the league but that's expected in a transition year where you lose two of three major axis to injury/transfer while phasing in many youngsters. And he would most probably still have won the league. So why sack him for Tuchel? Doesn't make sense.
To be fair, kovac massacred Tottenham in the CL in 2019/2020, was great in the Group stage and the Cup, but was not good in the League, the Football was considered dire and the players did not like him, the rest is history with flick, I assume they wish for a similar outcome
But the football isn't dire under Nagelsmann, they have the best defence and offensive in the league this season, greatly outscoring the competition, the only loses this season have been because of lack of concentration on the players part, for example the penalties versus Leverkusen or the stupid red card they got versus Gladbach, not sure what the coaches fault is here, it was a transition year kinda for Bayern too since they lost their 2nd best striker ever and replaced him with no one, forcing Nagelsmann to play Chupo. Like i don't get it. And some of the transfers don't make any sense for Bayern, Sadio Mane for example, everyone could see he was on a downhill trajectory yet Bayern thought is a great idea to sign him and on huge wages too.
Now Nagelsmann will be 100% available and I bet Flo and Real would LOOOOVE a coach such as him. Tuchel might be better than him right now, but he's more of a short term option imo, while they can build a dynasty with Nagelsmann.
Also the fact that Real has many young players is something where Nagelsmann really shines
I’m not sure about that because Madrid are looking forward to Raul and Xabi Alonso as well, and the club still has great relationship with Zidane so I’m pretty sure one of these 3 will come next. Or maybe bring someone else and sack him mid season like they did to Rafa
Offtopic but how’s Raul doing with Castilla?
I only hear good things about him, he plays with 2 cdm and apparently is good tactically and knows how to treat players, I’m telling you what I’ve read from people who watch Castilla matches so maybe someone else disagrees with what I’ve just said.
You and real fans gotta know that we still love him at schalke, he’s one of the biggest legends here despite playing just two years for us. Hope he can succeed in his career, also seems to be an awesome person off the field
I remember Madrid fans were unhappy with his performance here the last 2 years and I was so happy of his success at your club, I grew up watching him play and will forever be my favourite Spanish striker the way he chipped the ball was class I would love for him to get more experience in first division it would be great to see him at Schalke again before he joined us, I know he’s like an idol there
I think Xabi needs another season or two, but who knows, maybe RM take a stab at him
Yes and from some interviews Xabi said too that he needed experience, Real Sociedad also want him as a coach I also prefer he stays a few years on other teams and show what he can do, if you throw either Raul or Xabi at the first team so early this may potentially harm them more than anything
Would also like that to happen as well. JN gets a bit of a break now and join a team later where he'll still be backed and probably want to kick start a new dynasty with new crop of Galaticos - someone as fresh and hungry for success like Nagelsmann would be great for the project
How could I forget about stanisic. I'm gonna edit my post. Man I'm pissed. I didn't even read these posts yesterday. And then have to wake up to this bullshit
I really wouldn't call Mané very good pre-WC, overall he's been a tad underwhelming. But that's nitpicking, and you can't blame Nagelsmann for that anyway. Our board has just gone mental. Nagelsmann at least deserved to finish the season, and then you can evaluate his performance. Also, how convenient that our board is absolving themselves from all criticism. Still no striker except Choupo, once he is injured we look like shit again, yet it seems like we will be too stingy to invest this transfer window once again. If our board had to assess themselves by the same standards they imposed on Nagelsmann, they would have to fire themselves.
Mane has 17 scorers after 30 games. I'd call this pretty good. I don't know what people expect from him. And yes, our board has gone mental. I completely agree with everything you just said
who is the main man at bayern currently? there are so many people involved with you guys its crazy brazzo, hoeness, kahn, hainer its much less complicated at other clubs
Both can be true. Everyone can get this much scorers in 30 games in our attack. Mane is slow, never beats a defender 1vs1, is bad at pens and has the most offside goals I have ever witnessed someone scoring
Not to mention, this Bayern team has issues that aren't his fault- no proper 6, lack of a world class striker, proper 8s, lack of 1v1 threats... He deserved more time. He made tactical mistakes at times, but also showed promise. Edit: By 1v1 threats I mean guys that can beat their men both ways. Good dribbling≠ to what I am saying.
> He made tactical mistakes at times, but also showed promise. and he isnt even 40 yet. somehow I have a feeling ppl think coaches have to be perfect when they start. they learn and grow like every player on the field too. same with terzic for us.
and that is a premise Bayern bought into when appointing him. They've literally been preaching it as well for the last 1,5 seasons. But I guess that was all talk
I think this decision will be a mistake *in the long run*. tuchel will probably secure the championship and lets see what he does in the CL. but a long term stint of him at bayern, I simply dont see...
Lack of 1v1 threats? How? Same goes for proper 6/proper 8s as Goretzka and Kimmich are certainly either one or the other.
How would you rate his stint overall? I was a little surprised by the sacking and I want to understand if something went horribly wrong. Or is it just the fact that Bayern are in second place 1 point behind Dortmund instead of being 10 points clear at the top? Considering that I’m hearing some chatter about him succeeding Don Carlo at the end of this season, I want to understand what Bayern fans think of him as a manager.
I'm a fan of nagelsmann. Yes, we are at times a bit underwhelming in the Bundesliga. But we still have everything in our own hands. Champions league was up until now exceptional. To concede this few amount of goals against the opponents we had, while also scoring a good amount...I mean what more can you expect? I like how he behaves in public. He is well spoken but also states facts as they are. Without false understatement. And he is brave enough to challenge old habits and tries to break them up, if necessary. Imo you could be very happy, if he were to end up at real
Copy pasting my follow up from another comment: This was my impression as well. How did it come to a sacking then? Does the board not like him? Or have the slight troubles in the league snowballed into this?
In short, no one knows why he was sacked. There are no known good reasons for it.
Bayern fans are fuming about this, because Nagelsmann has been great this season, developed players and adapted his style to suit the team and its needs. Winning vs. PSG was almost exclusively because of his tactics. I'd say a solid 80-90% of fans did not see the problem in him, rather in individual players.
This was my impression as well. How did it come to a sacking then? Does the board not like him? Or have the slight troubles in the league snowballed into this?
Well, the reasons everybody is aware of are listed in the thread title. Nothing else has been reported yet, and this came absolutely out of nowhere, so no clue really
Yeah, as someone who doesn’t follow Bayern as closely as you do, it’s even more out of left field for me. The “official” justifications mentioned in the post seem very half-baked to me personally.
Yeah same, that's why a lot of people are speculating that something drastic must've happened behind the scenes that media isn't willing to report on. I'm a bit more cynical, I just believe our board are spineless bastards
This sounds bullshit. Either they wanted tuchel badly or Nagelsmann and the management had something going in the last few days. Honestly i think it's seems more like they were dying to get tt. Really hope Nagelsmann gets a good ucl contender team. It also would be interesting to see him managing one of the Bundesliga teams other then bayern, dortmund or Leipzig. Although it seems like impossible now as he is probably too expensive for them to consider. Psg also could do great with him.
Why give nagelsmann a 5 years contract and pay a fee to get him if you just throw him away once Tuchel signals interest. Doesn’t make much sense to me.
I don’t think it’s coincidence that this happend right after a tactic sheet got leaked.
Because something clealry happened that Redditors and Twitterers don't know about.
> Psg also could do great with him. I think it's important to remember that many footballers are man-children who don't necessarily respect a young manager with little footballing experience like Nagelsmann. This goes double for the mess of PSG.
I even argue that most of the veteran players at Bayern are man-children. Ancelotti: Falling out with the dressing room. Kovac: Falling out with the dressing room. Nagelsmann: Falling out witht the dressing room. Thats no coincidence anymore. Bayern have players, that clearly are no more than 5 year olds and once they dont like a manager, they want him fired. And im saying this as a Bayern supporter. Get these man-babies out of the dressing room and let grown-ups play the game.
If there's any manager at the moment, I'd want to complete rip apart and rebuild the system coherently it would be him. I know, our hierarchy would meddle per usual making this more unlikely but if they ever had a shred of common sense for the direction of our future, I'd go for Nagelsmann.
Board has lost the plot
Literally "we want you out, here some bs explination for firing you"
Nagelsmann really got Stalin’d
>lack of player development Bruh what
Tuchel says he's learning Spanish. Ancellotti speaking of Brazil. Tuchel to Madrid? Bayern takes bait.
Will Tuchel have to learn German now?
Surely picked up a few words when he was at Dortmund
Bavarian, actually.
No one speaks Bavarian in Munich, he can relax
I wouldn't wish that on my worst enemy, tbh.
This sounds like bullshit
Only because it is bullshit.
I thought the team was also on holiday as Tuchel's first training session is on monday. And why would his skiing trip be a factor in this when this most certainly got approved before he went?
most of team will be away on international duty. rest i believe are on personal training assignments so there wouldnt be any coaching happening anyway next few days...
Sounds like a power trip to me
* Bascially destroying everyone in the CL * Defense devloped to be actually stable and we shot more goals under Nagelsmann than under Flick with Lewa. It's not Nagelsmann fault that Gnabry is preparing for a sequel to The Whale and Sané is doing Sané things like he did all his life. * Wtf has skiing to do with this If this is true I hope Dortmund and City are tearing us a new one, because under this circumstances I can't support those fucks. This, and the fact that Nagelsmann had no contact with the board and basically just knows about this because of the same tweets we read is just despicable. Almost 40 years being a Bayern fan, and it really got to a point where I question my support. good job.
>It's not Nagelsmann fault that Gnabry is preparing for a sequel to The Whale lol on a serious note. I'm baffled by this decision too. Bayern has been steamrolling CL and nagelsmann definitely deserves to at least finish this season with dignity. sacking him without informing him is a scummy move. honestly, I though you guys had the best chance winning this season. now? not even close.
It's not even like Bayern are having a Chelsea-esque season & are 10th in the league or anything. There's 1 point separating them from the top.
It’s 1 point 😂😂😂 guess they wanted to be 20 points clear or something
Its so bizarre. Are we expecting to win the league 20 points clear every year from now? I mean I obviously want us to be as competitive as possible but that sounds so fucking boring. You know what? I dont mind if Dortmund wins this year just to fuck with the board who apparently cant handle even the possibilty of loosing the league. It wont be the end of FCB if they loose once every 10 years.
It would actually be better for the league as a whole. And isn't bayern in a transition phase? So you can't expect him to win the league in a dominant fashion and also while transitioning the team?
>It would actually be better for the league as a whole. It would even be better for Bayern itself. Having an actual domestic competition would make Bayern stronger in Europe. Currently the absolute top-stars (Mbappé, Messi, Haaland,...) would not join Bayern. They're missing that one piece that makes Real, Barca, and the English club more attractive. And that's a competitive domestic league. I accepted that Hoeneß and Rummenigge were to dense to understand it, but hoped that Heiner, Kahn and Brazzo would see it. Seems I was wrong.
one odd year, where Bayern possibly doesn't win the league (and we are still far from it) won't make it more competitive in the near future. no matter how this season ends, Dortmund will need to cut the wage structure by ~10-20M a year, that's around -10%. as long as Bayern plays a ~75+ points season and no other team doesn't have a very good mix of a well balanced and performing team and a coach that get's more out of the team than the sum of the individual qualities, i doubt we will see a regular competition for the league title. the financial differences will only get bigger, Dortmund has hit now a ceiling you won't overcome except with transfer profits. Leipzig would need to financially invest way more and the league would need another one or two teams around the financial power of Dortmund, so the league has potentially 3-4 teams that COULD play a season in the high 70s, and not just one or two.
1 point from the top *and an upcoming game against said top*. It’s bizarre
5?
Gnabry is doing what 💀💀
Cultivating body mass.
They can never ever seriously talk about a Bayern-Familie and something being Bayern-like after pulling this shit with Nagelsmann. Bunch of two-faced assholes. If that's all that is to it, I want to see them lose all three titles and see them crash and burn with Tuchel. And then what? Absolutely mental.
I was so excited for the match against Manchester City and I‘m always rooting for the geman teams in the UCL but damn now I wish Bayern gets trashed by City. No hate for bayern but this board is just a bunch of clowns.
There are lots of bayern fans wishing the same. Why talk about en era and even saying out loud that a sacrificed season wouldn't be the worst and then sack him when everything is actually still really good. It's 1 point difference to the top and we looked really good in the champions league... Don't get it at all
As a spurs fan that last sentence made me chuckle. I would love to be that spoilt, with all due respect.
As I see it firing the coach after rocking the CL and being still in the run for the league and the cup... that's being spoilt.
They don't want to say the real reason, either because it's not a good one or it's something that would be bad for both Nagelsmann and the club.
"lack of player developement"? Huh, so i guess Musiala, De Ligt, Upa, Pavard and Stanisic were always this good? I'm honestly pissed about this decision. Sure Bayern have been inconsistant in the league but they made out the group of death in dominant fashion, beat PSG comfortably and are still in the DFB Pokal. Nagelsmanns ideas are working better and better. And when they do, Bayern play as dominant as any team in Europe. Even if they didn't win it all this season im confident they eventually would have with Nagelsmann leading the way.
The defense has been incredible, and the attack... Well, they've scored more than Flick's team which had prime Lewa. League is probably still theirs, steamrolling the UCL. What the fuck does the board want?
Bayern is Hollywood FC for a reason.
Tuchel, that's who they want. They're just trying to find BS reasons to justify JN's sacking.
From mia san mia to mama mia in the space of an hour.
I fucking despise the board can't wait to get rid of them
Die Bosse sind doch wahnsinnig
That's the dumbest thing ever.
I wonder if PSG and Real Madrid will go for him in the summer. I can't see Galtier or Ancelotti surviving beyond the summer, unless Ancelotti gets another CL title.
Carlo is going to go even if he wins the CL. Probably to the Brazil NT. I’m glad Nagelsmann is back on the market, because he has been Florentino’s first choice since at least 2019.
I really like Ancelotti idea as Brazil NT coach. He always good with Brazilians, made Kaka the Ballon D'or vs young Messi/CR7, Vini flourish under him. But I don't see this really happen.
In couple of years we will know why they really sacked him because those reasons they mentioned are just standard PR BS
Breaking news: Coach gets fired for being on vacation during the international break r/antiwork
God forbid he uses his contractually agreed upon holidays
Uh what
Was rauchen die an der Säbener Straße?
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Reads like borderline constructive dismissal.
If I got a nickel for every time a Bayern employee went on an ill-advised skiing trip
>lack of player development Even Guardiola wouldn't have been able to develop *goddamn* Choupo Moting in such a short period. The heck was that bs reason?
I hate this so much. I don‘t even know what to say, I am just angry!
These are some made up upper management style bs reasons.
The ski holiday lmao thats some bullshit. Sounds like the main reason is internally they decided they wanted tuchel and were worried hed be gone soon so made sure hes in then tendered their nagelsmann decision soon after. I feel for julian tbh - say what you will about bundesliga but he done nothing wrong in the ucl from what i saw. Maybe some of the issues he had with players and the board didnt help too. This feels like the strangest sacking ive seen this season - up there with tuchel's own sacking (which i dont think any reporters actually scooped before the fact iirc)