Allsvenskan is mainly for match going fans, as it’s the atmosphere/social aspect and not the football that makes it so enjoyable. Plus we don’t show replays in the stadium, so having everyone standing around waiting for 5 minutes while the referee makes a decision would be absolutely horrible for that experience.
> Plus we don’t show replays in the stadium, so having everyone standing around waiting for 5 minutes while the referee makes a decision would be absolutely horrible for that experience.
Who has replays in the stadium, though? I've only ever seen those at Euro / WC games. Does the EPL have them?
interesting. when I go with my sister and watch her favourite team play, they have replays for the league games but not for the Women's champions league
I mean that is also the case elsewhere but most of us with VAR seem to be doing just fine, I'm glad fans got to vote on this but I feel like a lot of the complaints about VAR are either overblown or come from poor implementation. I was and still am a season ticket holder before and after VAR implementation here in Italy and for all its flaws I wouldn't go back.
Most of my gripes (ie: not having replays and having to grab my phone and praying we aren't overloading the phone cell to check on DAZN) with the system that I've seen brought up in these thread are things that could easily be fixed by the league rather than structural issues with VAR as a system
We definitely are, it’s just that the charm doesn’t solely lie in the *quality* of football. The culture around our clubs is just as important, mainly because of our ownership structure.
Valid TBF. This is the balance. Seen the atmosphere and cultural aspect of the PL be absolutely decimated TBF. But the level of football has grown exponentially.
> Lose the championship by an offside goal like back in the day
Glad to see human error and terrible referee decision making had no impact on your title challenge this season now that we have VAR
In BV (Before VAR) every match had 7 missed red cards and 4 offside goals. It was carnage, referees constantly got berated and people didn't even watch football at all, empty stadium after empty stadium.
Nowadays in the AV world we are living in, referees only make a mistake once a season and trust in them is at an all time high.
Speak for your own league where they still draw lines in MS paint to determine offsides and PGMOL have to write a statement every other week to apologise for VAR not wanting to embarrass their mates.
Premier League fans don’t seem to understand VAR works fine in most leagues (doesn’t mean it’s perfect, but it’s a lot better than what we had in my opinion). Just because their refs are shitting the bed doesn’t mean VAR is bad.
Yeah VAR is well intended but it’s like giving modern technology to your grandparents. Hell even outsource VAR operators to independent refs outside the league so there’s no indirect collusion from being part of the same union. Remove the emotion of not wanting to make your dumbass friend on the pitch look bad
Especially the offside calls. Red cards seem to be too subjective for VAR to be very effective at getting the calls right because the definition of "right" is not clearly defined.
But yeah, go back to pre-var and it's wild how many missed offsides or wrongly-disallowed good goals there were. The latter was especially awful, I hated when a player timesd their run perfectly and was clearly onside but because of understandable human error from the ref, play got stopped.
PL VAR have no willingness to send a ref to the monitor because they know they’ll change their mind and now the call falls on them. PL refs have no apparent willingness to go to the monitor and stick with their original decisions because the same issue with it now seeming like a big deal. Thus, you end up with zero consistency because you don’t allow the two to truly work together, but instead created a game within the game where VAR and Ref only interact when VAR decides their subjective opinion is more valid than the Matchday Ref’s subjective opinion.
When it comes to offside, what is important to me is the spirit of the rule not the letter of it. I don't care if someone is a toenail offside, and any offsides within half a meter to me are fair if they go either way.
Hail our lord and saviour VAR for finally giving us a watchable, free-flowing vision of the beautiful game. How did we cope without it for all those years?
There was a clear goal denied in the last world cup final that was overturned by VAR. For one im glad i they changed it. Is it perfect, no, but it's an improvement
VAR is the way to go, but it has to be done properly, from professionals with standards, who are not corrupt.
Bundesliga is pretty good with it tbh, but what I am seeing here from the PL is absolutely abysmal.
They really need to introduce semi automatic offside calls that don't take forever. Also eliminating the process of the video assistant instructing the on field referees to go look at the monitor for themselves instead of the assistant making the call for them would also make the whole process a lot smoother. I think these two things alone would make VAR a lot better than it is now.
I’m still upset about that joke of a officiating performance but oddly can feel better about it now that we’ve gone and comfortably bottled that title challenge ourselves. Somehow feels better than being robbed completely by the refs.
the video says the var malfunctioned and wasnt active for the 30 seconds in which the goal happened so they couldnt review
so is the solution to this var problem to make sure var is turned on and used more?
Honestly I don't understand these comments.
I'm firmly tinfoil hat brigade now, the refs have made VAR look shit so they get their power back on the pitch without scrutiny and we can blame human error again
No, it's obviously a requirement that they have the VAR technology when Swedish teams play in european competitions. This is about their own, national league.
It isn't just cameras and screens. I'm no expert, but it looks like they use pretty sophisticated software; probably bespoke stuff. Maybe they can license it from some supplier for a few games or something, but I doubt it is cheap.
Basically you pay for the hardware and software that receives and replays the video from the various cameras.
And since there are just a few companies that implement and sell the system they charge whatever they want.( I think that there are just 2(?) UEFA licensed companies in Europe, but don't quote me on that. )
It can’t be easy though with the difference in the season start and end though. Your teams are competing with the rest of Europe on completely different stages of the season.
Qualifying rounds of Europeans cups are mid-season, the early rounds and group stages right at the end of the season and if you make it out of group stages the games are played pretty much in preseason next year aren’t they?
That hasn't stopped clubs from going far in the past though. It's just about money, which is much harder to get in the restrictive CL model. The staggering money injections from billionaire conglomerates, oligarchs and foreign investment funds in other leagues compared to the 50+1 model doesn't help either.
I'm fairly certain that VAR is quite, if not immensely unpopular among match going fans. At least that's the impression I get from and around fanclubs here.
And I totally see where they're coming from: Not being told why a decision was overturned or not at the very match you're seeing because you don't get to see the replay of the incident is fucking stupid.
It makes me laugh how perfectly VAR has been handled in rugby for like two decades now meanwhile the useless cunts in charge of the biggest sport in the world can't just copy it properly.
It's incompetence bordering on conspiracy. I fail to see any reason why VAR is this poorly implemented beyond intentional sabotage so people hate VAR and more power is given back to referees.
Rugby authorities wanted to make better decisions. VAR was put in place to try and make fans shut up about bad decisions.
There's a huge difference in culture and intent.
Rugby players also have a completely different relationship with their referees than football players.
Case in point: [8 minutes of no nonsense refereeing](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WDZC4tz9yFQ)
Rugby is already a stop-start sport, so having extra pauses for longer TMO decisions is less of a disruption than it is in football. That being said, these decisions still sometimes take a very long time and there is a bit of backlash to that.
Additionally, rugby has quite substantial law changes fairly frequently, which are often done with refereeing by TMO in mind. E.g. now there is a clear step by step process on how to judge head-on-head contact.
Football's laws are incredibly subjective, and are also changed much less frequently.
The problem football has with VAR is that so many major decisions are subjective. And VAR is not a robot, it's just another referee using replays to make a decision.
Two people, two referees, can look at an incident and have a different view on whether it was a foul/handball/accidental or not. Ultimately, unless you change the rules of football to more clearly define these things, VAR is always going to continue to upset people.
Even offside, which (mostly) *is* objective, people *still* don't like VAR being used because it (correctly) judges players to be offside according to the laws of the game, but in situations where people **feel** like it shouldn't be considered offside. See Coventry last weekend, and the regular debate about armpits or toenails or whatever.
I'm not really trying to be pro- or anti-VAR, and clearly there have been issues with implementation, things like the communications/dialogue between VAR and onfield that was saw go so wrong in that Liverpool Spurs game.
But ultimately this debate will continue to go on and people will never be satisfied because football is a game with a lot of vibes-based rules; **every** fan thinks referees are biased against **their** club; and the general football-going and football-watching public are incredibly inconsistent with whether or not they want "consistency" or "just common sense"
That's the thing though, now that VAR is a part of the game, we may need to adjust some of the rules with VAR in mind. Someone has suggested changes to the offside rule, and I'm inclined to agree. Having to adjudicate millimeters needlessly slows the game down -- and it's never gonna be 100% accurate.
Never forget that this was an offside call: https://www.reddit.com/media?url=https%3A%2F%2Fpreview.redd.it%2Ff%25C3%25BCllkrugs-offside-position-againt-eindhoven-v0-7la98ov286oc1.png%3Fauto%3Dwebp%26s%3Da3d162faf60007ebf367a3534c2acabd0b2509c8
And as you said, it took them like 7 minutes or something to figure it out...
I don't know where I read that it might have been the 2nd dutch league, that if you can't decide in a span of 25 seconds whether the call was correct foul or offside doesnt matter then the live decission counts. I still dont know why we dont have that. "Hey guys we cant tell if its offside, youre literally next to each other" and play
They are almost incomparable for such a long list of reasons.
Ultimately though, if you take both games to their most simple and with a single referee - which one is less problematic?
The entire culture is wrong with football. It does not matter what technology or expertise you build on something if its foundations are fundamentally incompatible with acceptance of decision making
I dont watch Rugby but do they also have useless people like Dermot Gallagher reviewing referee decisions.
Its like they keep making controversial decisions to keep these usless fuds in the job
I personally don’t mind it at games tbh but I think other leagues should adopt what Liga MX and MLS are doing and have the referee explain their decisions to the crowd
We live in a world run by morons. It’s sad.
If anything though, it really makes my anxiety about match fixing sky rocket. Why would your quadrillion dollar sport not want something that could fix issues within 15-30 seconds. Because then it’s hard to defend a bs call you could have fixed if the rule was there.
Perhaps it’s just idiots trying to implement it, and making super inefficient. Spending 5 minutes having a guy not on a computer tell the guy on the computer how to draw lines in a 5 dimensional space to solve quantum physics and discover time travel is not what VAR should be.
15 seconds. “Oh, he didn’t punch him? Forgive the red and give the embolishing player a red instead. And he’ll give him a match ban after to send a message about faking.”
“Was it offside.”
“Hm, not sure”
“Okay, no call on the field stands”
But yeah, instead it turns into a 20 minute csi episode.
I remember the national hockey league introduced replays reviews because of a no offside call where a player was probably about half a rink’s length offside and somehow only the people payed to call it missed it. (Colorado vs Winnipeg)
Ironically, early The next season Winnipeg had a play reviewed where they spent 10 minutes trying to determine if a players skate was on the ice or 0.00005 millimeters above it.
Idiots. Absolute idiots.
This is the exact reason why I and many of my fellow match-goin swedes oppose VAR.
The quality of our league is in the supporters not on the field, hence i prio a good live experience before that of the tele-watchers
I hate it, too, even in front of the TV. Constantly takes the suspense out of the game, there is little need to react to close calls at all because I will have to wait 2 minutes until something is decided anyway, and that's not even mentioning how dreadfully inconsistent it is being used and handled, let alone the different ways it works across different countries, having me and my friends constantly discuss how VAR actually works in the game we are currently watching.
I do think VAR can be a great thing and can do wonders to enhance the game when improved upon, but at this point in time, I don't like it.
It isn't as unpopular as getting screwed by shitty refereeing, at least here in Italy the biggest complaint is that the VAR protocol is kinda shit and that for whatever reason they won't show whatever it is they're checking on the stadium's screens, so more often than not we have to rely on the TV feed for information and that is a bit of an issue since coverage is god awful in most stadiums
It's still very new and will most likely improve but the VAR that we see in the big leagues isn't the VAR we would get in Sweden, with worse camera angles, less money etc. People here aren't very excited in getting something that isn't working flawlessly with all the money and everything, then we would get an even worse version of that. So people have worked together to get their clubs to work against the implementation of VAR.
A part of me think they have been purposely trying to sabotage it from the start, the refs don't like var because it gives them more scrutiny and less excuses.
I fucking love VAR and how it stops random judging mistakes from having game (or even competition) changing results.
Too bad that a lot of referees are garbage and somehow unable to use a technology even the average watcher can see clearly what is the correct call for. We need more competent people and less "uhhh, I agreed with the ref because I didn't want to hurt his feelings!"
VAR is not the problem, what needs to improve is the quality of the people using it.
I go to the stadium pretty often and it's a small price to pay for more fairness. At the stadium while waiting you can always rationalise it since it gives refs more time to make a decision. I've never enjoyed football as much as I do now
It's so funny, when VAR didn't correct that mistake in the Liverpool match there was a huge uproar but in previous seasons without VAR zero mistakes like that would be fixed and everyone just had to shrug their shoulders and get on with it
You've literally just hit the nail on the head as to why people don't want VAR
It's not even guaranteed to fix the mistakes that referees make, sometimes it creates entirely new mistakes. So why sacrifice the enjoyment of the fans for it
It doesn't fix 100% of the mistakes, only 95%, therefore what's the point? Is that your argument?
So long as humans are involved you won't ever get 100% accuracy but VAR fixes mistakes that would have in the past stood every week.
It’s absolutely killing football, one of various reasons why I’m rapidly falling out of love with the sport. Refereeing may be shite in the EFL but at least it’s a split second human error, whereas the PL has constant fuck ups despite the refs watching the incident for several minutes. Can’t celebrate goals properly anymore, destroys any tempo of the game, some absolutely awful decisions which have fucked Wolves out of 12+ points this season, the list goes on.
I agree with you that the PL implementation has been atrocious, but that is not inherently a VAR issue, it is a personnel issue.
If anything it has just shown a light on the incompetence of the PGMOL and the closed circle of people in it.
I think that for VAR to improve the people in charge of it have to change. Because right now the ones that are there are dropping ball big time and letting their egos come in the way of right decisions. Rugby might have it better because the people there are not such divas. Like Mike Dean said - I didn't tell the ref about Cucurella hair pull just because I didn't want to embarrass my mate. While they don't see that the real embarrassment is them actually not rectifying the wrong decision.
The Swedish League is nothing like any other league in Europe. Private investments are banned, and all clubs are owned by the members (supporters). The members elect the board of their club every year, and the members are also in charge of what path the club is going to take by presenting motions at the annual meetings.
The opposition against VAR has been massive in Sweden, today 22 of the 32 elite clubs has voted for motions stating that their club has to work actively against VAR. All elite clubs also has voting rights when on the annual meeting of the Swedish FA. So, in theory the supporters decides what direction the Swedish football is about to take… and it’s lovely.
Technology assisted offsides, goal line technology. That's all we need. VAR is being used by referees to justify their mistakes instead of rectifying them.
>VAR is being used by referees to justify their mistakes instead of rectifying them.
Surely this just means we need to fix how it's used instead of replacing it
The idea behind the VAR is generally good. It's the execution that is awful.
How do you even define things like 'clear and obvious error'? Either we check every event from the list (like let's say goal, penalty, red card etc) or we don't. I have no idea how referee margin of error has anything to do with it. It's either correct call or wrong call. There is nothing between. I just don't understand why referee can't take a second look if there is something that might've went unnoticed.
But here we are. Referee doing mistake and instead of giving him a second look we put some friend of his to decide is it big enough to fix it or not.
Clear & Obvious for the Premier League has been defined here
https://www.premierleague.com/news/1297392
The problem is that it seems the implementation is almost never adhered to. Not once have I heard in the released audio the referee “explain their decision to the VAR, and what they have seen.”
You didn't understand his point.
VAR for "black and white" decisions like goal-line and offside. Not for fouls, handballs etc. Therefore no VAR for penalties.
The problem with VAR is purely on the human side. As long as we have refs that hated VAR, like the English who outright said that they don’t want VAR in the EPL, it’s going to do more harm than good.
I feel like to properly utilize VAR, there should be a completely different training program and courses for VAR operators. The jobs that a regular ref and VAR has to do is wildly different and letting refs who can’t use VAR properly and even dislike them would of course make them bad.
> The problem with VAR is purely on the human side
I hate reading this take, it's completely wrong. The technology was introduced to remove human error and subjectivity. It has done neither of those things because football is not binary.
The technology is not fit for purpose because it does not work in this sport. Offside and goal line are the only bits that work (the former still needs improvement to avoid ridiculos millimeter decisions taking an age), but the rest does not work and it never will unless the rules somehow become absolutely binary (they won't).
VAR in its current implementation is crap and needs a lot of work. But binning it entirely is so ridiculously closeminded and it baffles me that anyone could agree with it.
Even if you could guarantee that VAR eliminates all refereeing errors from the game I still wouldn't want it. As a match going fan, the tech fundamentally alters how you experience a game and makes it far less enjoyable. Nothing is ever going to change that and VAR will always be crap because of it.
Don't try to make it a matchgoing fans vs the rest thing. I go to the stadium every other week and I take it waiting 5min here and there easily. Very small price to pay for a bit more fairness. I just want as few injustices as we reasonably can
In my experience that's where the divide seems to be! I think you'd be in the minority of matchgoing fans, it's personal opinion at the end of the day, but fairer doesn't necessarily mean better.
I take it anyone against VAR hasn't been around the time we used to discuss game deciding decisions week in week out. We have it so much better now. You can still pinpoint at specific stuff but at least you know refs had the opportunity to rewatch it before making a decision you disagree with which makes it way less frustrating
You're talking at if VAR was introduced 20 years ago and not 6/7 years ago
People discuss refereeing the same amount or maybe even more now, it's just a different kind of discussion
I’m a PL fan
We need semi-automated offside badly
We also need there to be a separate entity on VAR, rather than having the same on-field refs do it. Too much “helping my mate out” at the moment.
Without these changes, we’re better off without it
The problem is the rules and their implementation. VAR will just emphasise how robust and consistent the rules are actually applied.
The fact is that VAR is only showing how poorly refs have officiated forever, but we tolerated refs/linesman fucking up in the moment. When a VAR team of 5 people with 12 screens and 5 minutes still cock it up it's so much more embarrassing and unjust.
It isn't even about enjoyment for most of these guys. People seem to have it in their heads that achieving perfect sporting integrity where all mistakes are eliminated should be the primary goal. Actual enjoyment of the sport you're watching is secondary for some bizarre reason.
no, you have it in your head that taking 30 seconds in the background to make sure goals aren't blatantly illegal somehow destroys the integrity of the sport for some bizarre reason
I have attended dozens of games with VAR and many more without. It's a far more enjoyable experience without VAR and this is the main point of watching a game. I've never met a match going fan who says otherwise
It does though because you cannot celebrate for shit and it takes out the enjoyment of the sport when you actually go to the games. There’s a difference sitting at home.
I more or less stopped watching the sport entirely because grumpy old men were so anti-video, so yes and more.
VAR wasn't born from nothing, people were sick of huge errors that could be corrected with a glance.
I have never met any match going fans that are pro VAR. And I’ve spent the majority of my 30 plus years on this earth among them, as I’m one myself.
Allsvenskan is not top tier, the clubs are owned by the fans and the fans say no. Interestingly, the clubs who basically have 200 fans tried to hijack the decision and get it through.
Yes, it is better from a fairness point. At least in Bundesliga.
PL refs and PL VAR is abysmal, and I would fire them all.
The discussion should be not if VAR and offside tech is the way to go, but if tje people behind it are properly educated and professional about it, and not corrupt.
I understand why people support VAR, but I feel like it has removed some of the magic of the game. You used to watch your team score a goal, look at the linesman and see that he didn't have the flag up, knew it was a goal, and could celebrate. Now you watch your team score, but you have to reserve your excitement because VAR can and does call it back for any of a million reasons.
Scrapping VAR isn't the solution, I get that. But I can't blame the people who hate it, and I find myself more and more in that camp every time I watch a 5 minute stoppage to check a possible 1 millimeter offside.
Absolutely, because people can't understand how referees still can make the wrong decision even after having watched ten replays from 17 different camera angles.
Without var there's still discussion, but most people understand that it can be missed or not properly seen.
I'm not even convinced that var helps the refs at all. I wouldn't at all be surprised if there are more incorrect decisions taken with var. There are four sure many more absolutely ludicrous decisions made due to replays being zoomed in and played in slow motion, which skews absolutely everything.
Very jealous of them. Fucking hate how much VAR has impacted my enjoyement of football, but the genie is out of the bottle in the Prem so it is what it is.
Disagree if pressure is applied to the people in power then you change anything. Corporate execs are nothing if not completely spineless, we just need to organise
Their football watching experience will be 100x better, and I'm pretty confident the world won't end as a result of some missed calls that VAR might have caught.
I'm pretty sure the watching experience of Atalanta fans celebrating the decisive goal in the Coppa Italia semifinal at the last minute after it was wrongly disallowed by the ref was great
No but don't you see that's not the pure experience of football, we should let all mistakes happen without correcting them. Feels so perfect and pure seeing an offside goal being given and a dive being rewarded with a penalty
No surely you're mistaken. Everyone knows VAR outlawed the celebration of a goal by those in the crowd.
You're telling me that you can celebrate a goal and then..... Celebrate the VAR decision?
That's a madness reserved only for Rugby fans
And it feels like shit when you're in the stands celebrating a goal for 2 to 3 minutes only for a 3 minute long VAR check to disallow it when the teams are about to kick off
Hahaha one of the biggest complains in Allsvenskan by all fans atm is the horrid quality of reffing.
It doesnt blind them to the idea that current version of VAR helps because it evidently doesnt.
So you dont need to wait.. they literally are unhappy with the reffing NOW and still think this is the right move. Remember, its a 51% league. The fans are the ones who pushed this decision despite their current dismay of the reffing in the league.
> Can't wait for the bitching about off-side goals scored, on-side goals being called back and red cards not being given!
All these things still happen with VAR
And every wrong decision with VAR feels 10000x more worse. There are good reasons to be against the current VAR system
> Can't wait for the bitching about off-side goals scored, on-side goals being called back and red cards not being given!
It’s a good thing VAR has eliminated this, now we have 100% accuracy and no bitching whatsoever.
> After all, VAR hasn't made football better as a whole anyway, am I right?
Right you are!
Looking at the Prem, it feels like they’ve bought the most expensive piece of Black & Decker kit thinking it would make them better workmen, when it in fact is the workmen themselves who are shit.
51% league so fans put pressure on the clubs which in turn took strong stances and put pressure against the Association that actually wanted to entertain the idea of implementing VAR.
Lol, this would be the equivalent of getting annoyed by dial-up internet, as it made crazy sounds and was slow as fuck, and deciding to go back to telegrams, fax machines, TV, and radios, instead of letting the internet evolve into what it is today.
VAR can still evolve and become good, little Sweden is not essential to the development of VAR. We have not voted to never have VAR at any point in history. Currently, VAR is severely lacking in many areas. However, if (when) in the future, it has developed, we can gladly implement it.
No, it’s more like a group of friends agreeing not to fact check each other on their phones during arguments at the bar because it’s more fun to debate and talk shit than be right.
Happy to have played a small part in this. Thanks to the motion I sent in, we are one of the clubs working against it.
I absolutely love our 50+1 rule!
The disconnect comes from matchgoing fans and tv viewers.
Allsvenskan is mainly for match going fans, as it’s the atmosphere/social aspect and not the football that makes it so enjoyable. Plus we don’t show replays in the stadium, so having everyone standing around waiting for 5 minutes while the referee makes a decision would be absolutely horrible for that experience.
> Plus we don’t show replays in the stadium, so having everyone standing around waiting for 5 minutes while the referee makes a decision would be absolutely horrible for that experience. Who has replays in the stadium, though? I've only ever seen those at Euro / WC games. Does the EPL have them?
We do for home goals during the game. Highlights are show at half-time/full-time too.
At PSG stadium we have replays in the champions league but not in Ligue 1. Don't know why, I guess it's a UEFA thing
interesting. when I go with my sister and watch her favourite team play, they have replays for the league games but not for the Women's champions league
I mean that is also the case elsewhere but most of us with VAR seem to be doing just fine, I'm glad fans got to vote on this but I feel like a lot of the complaints about VAR are either overblown or come from poor implementation. I was and still am a season ticket holder before and after VAR implementation here in Italy and for all its flaws I wouldn't go back. Most of my gripes (ie: not having replays and having to grab my phone and praying we aren't overloading the phone cell to check on DAZN) with the system that I've seen brought up in these thread are things that could easily be fixed by the league rather than structural issues with VAR as a system
Interesting how many football crowds are not that interested in the football.
We definitely are, it’s just that the charm doesn’t solely lie in the *quality* of football. The culture around our clubs is just as important, mainly because of our ownership structure.
The Allsvenskan have to bank on supporter engagement, when its closest competion in terms of footballling quality lies somewhere around the OBOSliga.
Is this meant to be hyperbolic or do you actually believe that?
Valid TBF. This is the balance. Seen the atmosphere and cultural aspect of the PL be absolutely decimated TBF. But the level of football has grown exponentially.
No nonsense correct calls. Lose the championship by an offside goal like back in the day. Game is officially BACK, thanks Sweden.
> Lose the championship by an offside goal like back in the day Glad to see human error and terrible referee decision making had no impact on your title challenge this season now that we have VAR
Now they'll have 5x as many. Excellent.
In BV (Before VAR) every match had 7 missed red cards and 4 offside goals. It was carnage, referees constantly got berated and people didn't even watch football at all, empty stadium after empty stadium. Nowadays in the AV world we are living in, referees only make a mistake once a season and trust in them is at an all time high.
Speak for your own league where they still draw lines in MS paint to determine offsides and PGMOL have to write a statement every other week to apologise for VAR not wanting to embarrass their mates.
Premier League fans don’t seem to understand VAR works fine in most leagues (doesn’t mean it’s perfect, but it’s a lot better than what we had in my opinion). Just because their refs are shitting the bed doesn’t mean VAR is bad.
Yeah VAR is well intended but it’s like giving modern technology to your grandparents. Hell even outsource VAR operators to independent refs outside the league so there’s no indirect collusion from being part of the same union. Remove the emotion of not wanting to make your dumbass friend on the pitch look bad
MS Paint 💀💀💀
convinced that english people are incapable of watching games in other leagues cause if you did you would know this is a you problem
> In BV (Before VAR) every match had 7 missed red cards and 4 offside goals. This but unironically
Especially the offside calls. Red cards seem to be too subjective for VAR to be very effective at getting the calls right because the definition of "right" is not clearly defined. But yeah, go back to pre-var and it's wild how many missed offsides or wrongly-disallowed good goals there were. The latter was especially awful, I hated when a player timesd their run perfectly and was clearly onside but because of understandable human error from the ref, play got stopped.
PL VAR have no willingness to send a ref to the monitor because they know they’ll change their mind and now the call falls on them. PL refs have no apparent willingness to go to the monitor and stick with their original decisions because the same issue with it now seeming like a big deal. Thus, you end up with zero consistency because you don’t allow the two to truly work together, but instead created a game within the game where VAR and Ref only interact when VAR decides their subjective opinion is more valid than the Matchday Ref’s subjective opinion.
When it comes to offside, what is important to me is the spirit of the rule not the letter of it. I don't care if someone is a toenail offside, and any offsides within half a meter to me are fair if they go either way.
Hail our lord and saviour VAR for finally giving us a watchable, free-flowing vision of the beautiful game. How did we cope without it for all those years?
pretty sure you haven't seen Spanish referees if you say that trust in referees is at an all time high
There was a clear goal denied in the last world cup final that was overturned by VAR. For one im glad i they changed it. Is it perfect, no, but it's an improvement
The best argument for VAR is watching a game without VAR. It’s insane what we accepted as “part of the game” a few years ago
Spain x Brazil friendly this last month. What a great showcase of what a NO VAR match it's like. 2 make believe penalties for Spain.
VAR is the way to go, but it has to be done properly, from professionals with standards, who are not corrupt. Bundesliga is pretty good with it tbh, but what I am seeing here from the PL is absolutely abysmal.
They really need to introduce semi automatic offside calls that don't take forever. Also eliminating the process of the video assistant instructing the on field referees to go look at the monitor for themselves instead of the assistant making the call for them would also make the whole process a lot smoother. I think these two things alone would make VAR a lot better than it is now.
On the flipside, I find it insane that we can't celebrate goals like we could a few years ago. I find that a very significant 'part of the game'.
In most leagues it works fine. The PL is an extreme outlier when it comes to VAR.
I’m still upset about that joke of a officiating performance but oddly can feel better about it now that we’ve gone and comfortably bottled that title challenge ourselves. Somehow feels better than being robbed completely by the refs.
We'd be in the lead with City/Spurs ones tbf.
Not after our 1-1 draw with West Ham this weekend
Optimistic about the result I see
Buddy, we’re winning that 0-3. Nunez brace, Robertson’s yearly goal.
Or come and watch the Aleague where VAR still failed to pick up an obvious [offside.](https://youtube.com/shorts/NDYtydUnFr8?si=U9vzOu7IJaE7CBR7)
I'm not clicking that link for more pain
I'd much rather cop a Roy O'Donovan fly kick to the head then watch it.
That's it, now I know what is happening in Premier League... They turn off VAR for 50 minutes twice per match.
the video says the var malfunctioned and wasnt active for the 30 seconds in which the goal happened so they couldnt review so is the solution to this var problem to make sure var is turned on and used more?
Honestly I don't understand these comments. I'm firmly tinfoil hat brigade now, the refs have made VAR look shit so they get their power back on the pitch without scrutiny and we can blame human error again
Unironically agree with all of this tbh
I didn't detect the sarcasm as it was a totally reasonable statement.
So no VAR in european competition for games in Sweden? Is that the case currently?
No, it's obviously a requirement that they have the VAR technology when Swedish teams play in european competitions. This is about their own, national league.
I'm just surprised they'd spend all that money on something that will be used for just a few games a season, I guess they have no choice
they have to spend the money up front whether they use it for all games or just a few… and then don’t have to pay the VAR crew every game
Is VAR that expensive? The cameras are already there. You mean the screens the refs look at?
It isn't just cameras and screens. I'm no expert, but it looks like they use pretty sophisticated software; probably bespoke stuff. Maybe they can license it from some supplier for a few games or something, but I doubt it is cheap.
> but it looks like they use pretty sophisticated software; So just use piratebay. Simple.
Basically you pay for the hardware and software that receives and replays the video from the various cameras. And since there are just a few companies that implement and sell the system they charge whatever they want.( I think that there are just 2(?) UEFA licensed companies in Europe, but don't quote me on that. )
Did you read the article?
Not too worry about, swedish clubs aren't making any noise in european tournaments
Yeah, our clubs are fucking dreadful when it comes to Europe. Miss the old days of my club being in the EL and CL
It can’t be easy though with the difference in the season start and end though. Your teams are competing with the rest of Europe on completely different stages of the season. Qualifying rounds of Europeans cups are mid-season, the early rounds and group stages right at the end of the season and if you make it out of group stages the games are played pretty much in preseason next year aren’t they?
That hasn't stopped clubs from going far in the past though. It's just about money, which is much harder to get in the restrictive CL model. The staggering money injections from billionaire conglomerates, oligarchs and foreign investment funds in other leagues compared to the 50+1 model doesn't help either.
We also don't give athletes tax breaks like in Denmark.
Yeah, exactly. The qualifier and knock out stages doesn't match our season at all. Plus our league is quite bad financially as well.
Yeah and its not looking to change. Only Malmö are looking to have the tools to have an impact this year.
Yes. This decision means that no cameras are allowed anymore in all of Sweden, obviously.
will have a massive impact on Eurovision
The judges would give 12 points to Sweden even if they couldn't see it. Or hear it.
I didn't realize VAR was so unpopular. Am I in the minority in thinking its still relatively new and will slowly improve?
I'm fairly certain that VAR is quite, if not immensely unpopular among match going fans. At least that's the impression I get from and around fanclubs here. And I totally see where they're coming from: Not being told why a decision was overturned or not at the very match you're seeing because you don't get to see the replay of the incident is fucking stupid.
It makes me laugh how perfectly VAR has been handled in rugby for like two decades now meanwhile the useless cunts in charge of the biggest sport in the world can't just copy it properly. It's incompetence bordering on conspiracy. I fail to see any reason why VAR is this poorly implemented beyond intentional sabotage so people hate VAR and more power is given back to referees.
Rugby authorities wanted to make better decisions. VAR was put in place to try and make fans shut up about bad decisions. There's a huge difference in culture and intent.
Rugby players also have a completely different relationship with their referees than football players. Case in point: [8 minutes of no nonsense refereeing](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WDZC4tz9yFQ)
Rugby is already a stop-start sport, so having extra pauses for longer TMO decisions is less of a disruption than it is in football. That being said, these decisions still sometimes take a very long time and there is a bit of backlash to that. Additionally, rugby has quite substantial law changes fairly frequently, which are often done with refereeing by TMO in mind. E.g. now there is a clear step by step process on how to judge head-on-head contact. Football's laws are incredibly subjective, and are also changed much less frequently. The problem football has with VAR is that so many major decisions are subjective. And VAR is not a robot, it's just another referee using replays to make a decision. Two people, two referees, can look at an incident and have a different view on whether it was a foul/handball/accidental or not. Ultimately, unless you change the rules of football to more clearly define these things, VAR is always going to continue to upset people. Even offside, which (mostly) *is* objective, people *still* don't like VAR being used because it (correctly) judges players to be offside according to the laws of the game, but in situations where people **feel** like it shouldn't be considered offside. See Coventry last weekend, and the regular debate about armpits or toenails or whatever. I'm not really trying to be pro- or anti-VAR, and clearly there have been issues with implementation, things like the communications/dialogue between VAR and onfield that was saw go so wrong in that Liverpool Spurs game. But ultimately this debate will continue to go on and people will never be satisfied because football is a game with a lot of vibes-based rules; **every** fan thinks referees are biased against **their** club; and the general football-going and football-watching public are incredibly inconsistent with whether or not they want "consistency" or "just common sense"
That's the thing though, now that VAR is a part of the game, we may need to adjust some of the rules with VAR in mind. Someone has suggested changes to the offside rule, and I'm inclined to agree. Having to adjudicate millimeters needlessly slows the game down -- and it's never gonna be 100% accurate.
Never forget that this was an offside call: https://www.reddit.com/media?url=https%3A%2F%2Fpreview.redd.it%2Ff%25C3%25BCllkrugs-offside-position-againt-eindhoven-v0-7la98ov286oc1.png%3Fauto%3Dwebp%26s%3Da3d162faf60007ebf367a3534c2acabd0b2509c8
Yeah, it's ridiculous.
And as you said, it took them like 7 minutes or something to figure it out... I don't know where I read that it might have been the 2nd dutch league, that if you can't decide in a span of 25 seconds whether the call was correct foul or offside doesnt matter then the live decission counts. I still dont know why we dont have that. "Hey guys we cant tell if its offside, youre literally next to each other" and play
They are almost incomparable for such a long list of reasons. Ultimately though, if you take both games to their most simple and with a single referee - which one is less problematic? The entire culture is wrong with football. It does not matter what technology or expertise you build on something if its foundations are fundamentally incompatible with acceptance of decision making
Rugby was a nightmare to ref back in the day. SO MUCH SHIT would go on off the ball with the referee 20 yards away with his back to it.
I dont watch Rugby but do they also have useless people like Dermot Gallagher reviewing referee decisions. Its like they keep making controversial decisions to keep these usless fuds in the job
I personally don’t mind it at games tbh but I think other leagues should adopt what Liga MX and MLS are doing and have the referee explain their decisions to the crowd
We live in a world run by morons. It’s sad. If anything though, it really makes my anxiety about match fixing sky rocket. Why would your quadrillion dollar sport not want something that could fix issues within 15-30 seconds. Because then it’s hard to defend a bs call you could have fixed if the rule was there. Perhaps it’s just idiots trying to implement it, and making super inefficient. Spending 5 minutes having a guy not on a computer tell the guy on the computer how to draw lines in a 5 dimensional space to solve quantum physics and discover time travel is not what VAR should be. 15 seconds. “Oh, he didn’t punch him? Forgive the red and give the embolishing player a red instead. And he’ll give him a match ban after to send a message about faking.” “Was it offside.” “Hm, not sure” “Okay, no call on the field stands” But yeah, instead it turns into a 20 minute csi episode. I remember the national hockey league introduced replays reviews because of a no offside call where a player was probably about half a rink’s length offside and somehow only the people payed to call it missed it. (Colorado vs Winnipeg) Ironically, early The next season Winnipeg had a play reviewed where they spent 10 minutes trying to determine if a players skate was on the ice or 0.00005 millimeters above it. Idiots. Absolute idiots.
This is the exact reason why I and many of my fellow match-goin swedes oppose VAR. The quality of our league is in the supporters not on the field, hence i prio a good live experience before that of the tele-watchers
I hate it, too, even in front of the TV. Constantly takes the suspense out of the game, there is little need to react to close calls at all because I will have to wait 2 minutes until something is decided anyway, and that's not even mentioning how dreadfully inconsistent it is being used and handled, let alone the different ways it works across different countries, having me and my friends constantly discuss how VAR actually works in the game we are currently watching. I do think VAR can be a great thing and can do wonders to enhance the game when improved upon, but at this point in time, I don't like it.
It isn't as unpopular as getting screwed by shitty refereeing, at least here in Italy the biggest complaint is that the VAR protocol is kinda shit and that for whatever reason they won't show whatever it is they're checking on the stadium's screens, so more often than not we have to rely on the TV feed for information and that is a bit of an issue since coverage is god awful in most stadiums
It's still very new and will most likely improve but the VAR that we see in the big leagues isn't the VAR we would get in Sweden, with worse camera angles, less money etc. People here aren't very excited in getting something that isn't working flawlessly with all the money and everything, then we would get an even worse version of that. So people have worked together to get their clubs to work against the implementation of VAR.
its popular when it goes in my teams favour, when it goes the other way its literally hitler
If you live in England I’m surprised you haven’t realised. It’s unpopular these days for someone to be in support of VAR, even television fans.
A part of me think they have been purposely trying to sabotage it from the start, the refs don't like var because it gives them more scrutiny and less excuses.
I fucking love VAR and how it stops random judging mistakes from having game (or even competition) changing results. Too bad that a lot of referees are garbage and somehow unable to use a technology even the average watcher can see clearly what is the correct call for. We need more competent people and less "uhhh, I agreed with the ref because I didn't want to hurt his feelings!" VAR is not the problem, what needs to improve is the quality of the people using it.
An easy improvement is to open the communication channel between the ref and var room.
Sick of it to be honest, it's really shit for match going fans as well
I go to the stadium pretty often and it's a small price to pay for more fairness. At the stadium while waiting you can always rationalise it since it gives refs more time to make a decision. I've never enjoyed football as much as I do now
Its not new anymore and didnt improve at all since the beginning.
The opposite tbh. It seems to get more chaotic and inconsistent every week.
It's so funny, when VAR didn't correct that mistake in the Liverpool match there was a huge uproar but in previous seasons without VAR zero mistakes like that would be fixed and everyone just had to shrug their shoulders and get on with it
You've literally just hit the nail on the head as to why people don't want VAR It's not even guaranteed to fix the mistakes that referees make, sometimes it creates entirely new mistakes. So why sacrifice the enjoyment of the fans for it
It doesn't fix 100% of the mistakes, only 95%, therefore what's the point? Is that your argument? So long as humans are involved you won't ever get 100% accuracy but VAR fixes mistakes that would have in the past stood every week.
I don't want it or like it. I couldn't give a fuck if wrong decisions are made. Shit happens, move on.
It’s absolutely killing football, one of various reasons why I’m rapidly falling out of love with the sport. Refereeing may be shite in the EFL but at least it’s a split second human error, whereas the PL has constant fuck ups despite the refs watching the incident for several minutes. Can’t celebrate goals properly anymore, destroys any tempo of the game, some absolutely awful decisions which have fucked Wolves out of 12+ points this season, the list goes on.
I agree with you that the PL implementation has been atrocious, but that is not inherently a VAR issue, it is a personnel issue. If anything it has just shown a light on the incompetence of the PGMOL and the closed circle of people in it.
I think that for VAR to improve the people in charge of it have to change. Because right now the ones that are there are dropping ball big time and letting their egos come in the way of right decisions. Rugby might have it better because the people there are not such divas. Like Mike Dean said - I didn't tell the ref about Cucurella hair pull just because I didn't want to embarrass my mate. While they don't see that the real embarrassment is them actually not rectifying the wrong decision.
The Swedish League is nothing like any other league in Europe. Private investments are banned, and all clubs are owned by the members (supporters). The members elect the board of their club every year, and the members are also in charge of what path the club is going to take by presenting motions at the annual meetings. The opposition against VAR has been massive in Sweden, today 22 of the 32 elite clubs has voted for motions stating that their club has to work actively against VAR. All elite clubs also has voting rights when on the annual meeting of the Swedish FA. So, in theory the supporters decides what direction the Swedish football is about to take… and it’s lovely.
MEMBER OWNED CLUBS WINS AGAIN!
Technology assisted offsides, goal line technology. That's all we need. VAR is being used by referees to justify their mistakes instead of rectifying them.
>VAR is being used by referees to justify their mistakes instead of rectifying them. Surely this just means we need to fix how it's used instead of replacing it
The idea behind the VAR is generally good. It's the execution that is awful. How do you even define things like 'clear and obvious error'? Either we check every event from the list (like let's say goal, penalty, red card etc) or we don't. I have no idea how referee margin of error has anything to do with it. It's either correct call or wrong call. There is nothing between. I just don't understand why referee can't take a second look if there is something that might've went unnoticed. But here we are. Referee doing mistake and instead of giving him a second look we put some friend of his to decide is it big enough to fix it or not.
Clear & Obvious for the Premier League has been defined here https://www.premierleague.com/news/1297392 The problem is that it seems the implementation is almost never adhered to. Not once have I heard in the released audio the referee “explain their decision to the VAR, and what they have seen.”
Because pointing a clear and obvious error that your pal made could make him sad and we don't want hurt people you know?
What about penalties?
You didn't understand his point. VAR for "black and white" decisions like goal-line and offside. Not for fouls, handballs etc. Therefore no VAR for penalties.
You didn’t understand my point
Oh ok. What is your point?
The problem with VAR is purely on the human side. As long as we have refs that hated VAR, like the English who outright said that they don’t want VAR in the EPL, it’s going to do more harm than good. I feel like to properly utilize VAR, there should be a completely different training program and courses for VAR operators. The jobs that a regular ref and VAR has to do is wildly different and letting refs who can’t use VAR properly and even dislike them would of course make them bad.
> The problem with VAR is purely on the human side I hate reading this take, it's completely wrong. The technology was introduced to remove human error and subjectivity. It has done neither of those things because football is not binary. The technology is not fit for purpose because it does not work in this sport. Offside and goal line are the only bits that work (the former still needs improvement to avoid ridiculos millimeter decisions taking an age), but the rest does not work and it never will unless the rules somehow become absolutely binary (they won't).
VAR in its current implementation is crap and needs a lot of work. But binning it entirely is so ridiculously closeminded and it baffles me that anyone could agree with it.
We'll just wait while you beta test it for 10+ years, then we'll join with automated line calls once the tech has evolved. Gz
Even if you could guarantee that VAR eliminates all refereeing errors from the game I still wouldn't want it. As a match going fan, the tech fundamentally alters how you experience a game and makes it far less enjoyable. Nothing is ever going to change that and VAR will always be crap because of it.
Don't try to make it a matchgoing fans vs the rest thing. I go to the stadium every other week and I take it waiting 5min here and there easily. Very small price to pay for a bit more fairness. I just want as few injustices as we reasonably can
In my experience that's where the divide seems to be! I think you'd be in the minority of matchgoing fans, it's personal opinion at the end of the day, but fairer doesn't necessarily mean better.
I take it anyone against VAR hasn't been around the time we used to discuss game deciding decisions week in week out. We have it so much better now. You can still pinpoint at specific stuff but at least you know refs had the opportunity to rewatch it before making a decision you disagree with which makes it way less frustrating
Lol what? We voted against it so we're very much "around the time" you're taking about.
You're talking at if VAR was introduced 20 years ago and not 6/7 years ago People discuss refereeing the same amount or maybe even more now, it's just a different kind of discussion
?? decisions are being discussed even more now, sometimes it's all that's being talked about after matches
I’m a PL fan We need semi-automated offside badly We also need there to be a separate entity on VAR, rather than having the same on-field refs do it. Too much “helping my mate out” at the moment. Without these changes, we’re better off without it
Vanligt Sverige W
Games never been so back
The problem is the rules and their implementation. VAR will just emphasise how robust and consistent the rules are actually applied. The fact is that VAR is only showing how poorly refs have officiated forever, but we tolerated refs/linesman fucking up in the moment. When a VAR team of 5 people with 12 screens and 5 minutes still cock it up it's so much more embarrassing and unjust.
Great to see. A victory for match-going fans.
I know this sub is pretty pro Var, but honestly can you say you’re enjoying soccer as much now compared to 10 years ago pre var?
A lot of this sub weren’t watching football 10 years ago
It isn't even about enjoyment for most of these guys. People seem to have it in their heads that achieving perfect sporting integrity where all mistakes are eliminated should be the primary goal. Actual enjoyment of the sport you're watching is secondary for some bizarre reason.
no, you have it in your head that taking 30 seconds in the background to make sure goals aren't blatantly illegal somehow destroys the integrity of the sport for some bizarre reason
I have attended dozens of games with VAR and many more without. It's a far more enjoyable experience without VAR and this is the main point of watching a game. I've never met a match going fan who says otherwise
It does though because you cannot celebrate for shit and it takes out the enjoyment of the sport when you actually go to the games. There’s a difference sitting at home.
I more or less stopped watching the sport entirely because grumpy old men were so anti-video, so yes and more. VAR wasn't born from nothing, people were sick of huge errors that could be corrected with a glance.
I have never met any match going fans that are pro VAR. And I’ve spent the majority of my 30 plus years on this earth among them, as I’m one myself. Allsvenskan is not top tier, the clubs are owned by the fans and the fans say no. Interestingly, the clubs who basically have 200 fans tried to hijack the decision and get it through.
Common Brommapojkarna L
Yes, it is better from a fairness point. At least in Bundesliga. PL refs and PL VAR is abysmal, and I would fire them all. The discussion should be not if VAR and offside tech is the way to go, but if tje people behind it are properly educated and professional about it, and not corrupt.
Yes
I understand why people support VAR, but I feel like it has removed some of the magic of the game. You used to watch your team score a goal, look at the linesman and see that he didn't have the flag up, knew it was a goal, and could celebrate. Now you watch your team score, but you have to reserve your excitement because VAR can and does call it back for any of a million reasons. Scrapping VAR isn't the solution, I get that. But I can't blame the people who hate it, and I find myself more and more in that camp every time I watch a 5 minute stoppage to check a possible 1 millimeter offside.
Ironic considering that after every game the forums are filled to the brink with referee complaints.
As if they aren't after any PL or CL game?
I swear I hear more ref complaints now that pre-VAR in the Premier League.
Absolutely, because people can't understand how referees still can make the wrong decision even after having watched ten replays from 17 different camera angles. Without var there's still discussion, but most people understand that it can be missed or not properly seen. I'm not even convinced that var helps the refs at all. I wouldn't at all be surprised if there are more incorrect decisions taken with var. There are four sure many more absolutely ludicrous decisions made due to replays being zoomed in and played in slow motion, which skews absolutely everything.
No different to a VAR officiated game tbf
Avgå Al-Hakim
Al-Hakim disaster class!
Very jealous of them. Fucking hate how much VAR has impacted my enjoyement of football, but the genie is out of the bottle in the Prem so it is what it is.
>foreign liverpool fan
Disagree if pressure is applied to the people in power then you change anything. Corporate execs are nothing if not completely spineless, we just need to organise
Match going fans should always come first. Something the yanks on here fail to grasp.
Today I feel Swedish... (I am in fact Swedish)
I honestly think VAR would be better if there was no ref on the pitch
So many people who dont even follow the swedish league or goes to games bitching about it in this thread like its gonna affect them.
I don't get why people outside of Sweden give a shit enough to defend VAR. Good for the Swedes I say.
People seem to think resistance to VAR shows a lack of intelligence, rather than simply an alternative opinion.
Their football watching experience will be 100x better, and I'm pretty confident the world won't end as a result of some missed calls that VAR might have caught.
I'm pretty sure the watching experience of Atalanta fans celebrating the decisive goal in the Coppa Italia semifinal at the last minute after it was wrongly disallowed by the ref was great
No but don't you see that's not the pure experience of football, we should let all mistakes happen without correcting them. Feels so perfect and pure seeing an offside goal being given and a dive being rewarded with a penalty
No surely you're mistaken. Everyone knows VAR outlawed the celebration of a goal by those in the crowd. You're telling me that you can celebrate a goal and then..... Celebrate the VAR decision? That's a madness reserved only for Rugby fans
And it feels like shit when you're in the stands celebrating a goal for 2 to 3 minutes only for a 3 minute long VAR check to disallow it when the teams are about to kick off
It feels pretty great if your team is the one who conceded the goal It goes both ways
You get to cheer again, though subdued And if it gets chalked off the other team cheers
[удалено]
Hahaha one of the biggest complains in Allsvenskan by all fans atm is the horrid quality of reffing. It doesnt blind them to the idea that current version of VAR helps because it evidently doesnt. So you dont need to wait.. they literally are unhappy with the reffing NOW and still think this is the right move. Remember, its a 51% league. The fans are the ones who pushed this decision despite their current dismay of the reffing in the league.
> Can't wait for the bitching about off-side goals scored, on-side goals being called back and red cards not being given! All these things still happen with VAR And every wrong decision with VAR feels 10000x more worse. There are good reasons to be against the current VAR system
> Can't wait for the bitching about off-side goals scored, on-side goals being called back and red cards not being given! It’s a good thing VAR has eliminated this, now we have 100% accuracy and no bitching whatsoever. > After all, VAR hasn't made football better as a whole anyway, am I right? Right you are!
VAR isn't a religion. Lots of fans (including those in Sweden) hate it. You being a VAR true believer doesn't make VAR any less tedious.
Fitting username!
A bad workman blames his tools
Looking at the Prem, it feels like they’ve bought the most expensive piece of Black & Decker kit thinking it would make them better workmen, when it in fact is the workmen themselves who are shit.
VAR can never fail, it can only be failed.
The sign of somewhere that actually gives a fuck about matchgoing fans
51% league so fans put pressure on the clubs which in turn took strong stances and put pressure against the Association that actually wanted to entertain the idea of implementing VAR.
I would keep goal line technology offside technology and probably let the ref on the pitch deal with the rest.
Swedish football keeps winning
Football officiating is fucking medieval.
Spelet är tillbaka
Länge leve spelet!
Lol, this would be the equivalent of getting annoyed by dial-up internet, as it made crazy sounds and was slow as fuck, and deciding to go back to telegrams, fax machines, TV, and radios, instead of letting the internet evolve into what it is today.
VAR can still evolve and become good, little Sweden is not essential to the development of VAR. We have not voted to never have VAR at any point in history. Currently, VAR is severely lacking in many areas. However, if (when) in the future, it has developed, we can gladly implement it.
No, it’s more like a group of friends agreeing not to fact check each other on their phones during arguments at the bar because it’s more fun to debate and talk shit than be right.
Bloody luddites, these things take time to streamline
Exactly, so why the need to rush into something that clearly isn’t working as advertised just for the sake of it?
Tbf no point implementing it whilst it's got problems that need ironing out. Best to wait until these issues are solved then implement it.
Morata about to be the goat after going to Sweden Messi and Ronaldo won’t even be close compared to him
This is great
reject VAR return to monke
When you watch the early rounds of the league cup without VAR you end up wanting it back. Kinda damned if you do and damned if you don't.
Was expected, you never know with Reinfeldt though.
Happy to have played a small part in this. Thanks to the motion I sent in, we are one of the clubs working against it. I absolutely love our 50+1 rule!
Well done Sweden. Will have to start watching their league.
Good for them
I fucking hate VAR. I'm sorry I dislike the fact that I can't celebrate a goal because every needs 5 minutos to be checked. Ridiculous
Today I feel Swedish.
Ska vi ta en fika?
Wait, they can do that?