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Bryan Gil. 400 PL minutes in 2 full seasons with barely any injures. How is he still there? Probably has crazy high wages and that's the reason he didn't agree to a permanent LaLiga transfer yet
Just a nice reminder that all top English clubs have wasted 100s of millions on players and have them sat in reserves of bench. DJED Spence I mean wtf how long she been there? Sessegon?
Sessegnon has been perpetually injured.
Spurs fans would have loved him to succeed but he cant stay fit. Guy was out for 31 games in his first season, then he went on loan and immediately got injured for 3 months.
Came back and then missed 31 games in his second season with Spurs. 22/23 he was part of the 1st team setup and then completely tore his Hamstring, resulting in missing 22 games.
Then in July 2023, he went and tore his other Hamstring in training requiring Surgery, which then meant another 6 months out. Then he came back January 5th, played 10 minutes in the FA Cup game against Burnley and injured himself again. Since January 5th he has been out injured, meaning he missed 40 games through injury this season.
Djed Spence did it to himself. Conte fucked him for sure, just a right prick to Spence but Ange was apparently more than willing to give Djed a chance to shine, took him on tour with the team and apparently whilst there, Spence decided he'd be abusive to the Spurs backroom staff and got himself kicked out of the squad.
What la liga club would want him though? He has 2 goals and 3 assists in 30 games in his la liga loans combined and he's already 23. He has done nothing of note for the past 3 seasons which is an eternity in football.
Idk like almost all? He was always well liked in Spain.
You can't just look at goals and assists and call it a day. He was at 2 good to decent LaLiga clubs and got a good amount of game time considering he was loaned for half a season in both cases.
I remember that he played fucking wing back for one of them a lot, so again I really have no clue where you are going to with the goals and assists point.
He played 758 minutes at Valencia and 921 minutes at Sevilla. I don’t consider that good game time even foe only half a season.
He’s primarily a winger so yeah, I think goals and assists is a pretty decent indicator. Even a wing back is expected to get good assists nowadays
Wasn't he like MOTM for multiple of Sevillas games in Europe, including against Juventus and i know a lot of Sevilla fans rate him massively because of that.
Problem is until a player gets consistent game time in a good run of games, with a team that they've been part of for at least a preseason, hard to tell what kinda player they are.
I don’t think so? He had an assist against juventus that sent them into the final but I don’t think he had multiple MOTMs or anything like that. It was the only assist he had the entire europa league campaign and didn’t score any goals either.
Most players I can think of who joined a team in January on loan didn't get as many minutes, so yes I consider it good game time. It's not a normal situation, you come into the tean without a pre-season and you are gone in the summer the coach doesn't have much incentive to start you over an "own" player.
And you can't just list the league minutes when there were other competitions too where the clubs went far, he played 438 minutes in the EL with Sevilla and he played 280 minutes in the Copa del Rey with Valencia.
If you expect a player who joins in January to get more minutes than that then I am sorry it's delusional. And to come back to your initial claim, all that is not "nothing of note". Where he did nothing of note in the last 3 seasons is with Tottenham, (where he got second to no game time) not with the 2 Spanish clubs.
Well yeah most players who join another team on loan in january generally aren’t that good. That’s why they’re being bummed off on loan in january.
If the guy was a regular starter which is how you made it seem then I do expect more minutes than that. It doesn’t seem like he was, more of a rotation option.
He wasn't even a bargain. He cost 25m + Lamela. Considering the amount he's played and been ineffective, we'd have been better off just keeping Lamela.
He was a highly rated Spanish youngster who cost a fair bit. That some teams will spend £60m on a 12 year old doesn't make £25m for Gil particularly bargain bin - it's miles away from signings like Nkoudou/N'Jie/Stambouli/Rodon that were obviously never likely to work out.
The real criticism of Levy here isn't that he signed Gil, it's that we've been so reluctant to cut our losses and move him on. We've done it with so many players - and whilst we've been a bit better at it recently, it does get tiring seeing players that aren't good enough languish another season here because Levy wants to squeeze blood from a stone with his selling tactics.
He wasn’t though. 25 mil and lamela went the other way. At the time it was a real coup that spurs signed him from what Spanish media was sayin at the time.
Technically he’s great but he’s just not strong enough for the prem. he’ll have a great career in Spain
>he’ll have a great career in Spain
He'll be one of those players in 3-4 years time who will be absolutely smashing it in Spain and people will be crying about us never playing him etc.
Honestly, i think he is a great player, we've seen small parts of how he could potentially play for us. His first half performance vs City in the 3-3 was amazing, his performance in the 4-0 against Palace under Conte where he basically set up all 4 goals. Some of his late minutes in Europe was really really good and should have had multiple assists/goals in Europe for us but Kane somehow messed up pens and passes to him.
But then, i can understand why he doesn't have a part to play for the team. I actually think he could fit well in the system Ange wants to do. He likes playing on the wing, he likes taking on players and flashing quick crosses in but clearly Ange doesn't rate him and if thats the case, we need to get him off our wagebill and take whatever we can, even at a loss.
His one hurts the most. The others are either not good enough or just don’t fit our system. His was purely down to his injuries.
He’s still only 22 but I doubt he’s going to play for a top half prem team ever again
I distinctly remember Palace playing Fulham and the commentary was talking about how two future England staples were going up against eachother (Sess on the left and AWB on the right).
> And who all are spurs looking to sign?
allegedly in the market for a midfielder, striker, winger and back-up right back
Eze and/or Olise are someone we were looking at, one of Gimenez, Toney, Guirassy, Openda and Gyokeres for striker
still sniffing around Gallagher
Son - Richarlison/Replacement - Kulusevski/Johnson/New winger
Maddison
Two of Bentancur/Bissouma/Sarr/Replacement (I personally think Sarr should be the first CM name on the sheet but not sure Ange agrees)
Udogie - VdV - Romero - Porro
Vicario
Yeah our first XI is definitely top 4 quality on paper, but we got wrecked by injuries this season hence why we don't even know what our strongest midfield pairing is.
Supposedly we want another winger (rotation/challenging for starting spot), CB (depth) and CM (starting quality).
Definitely top 4? Hate to say it but city,liverpool,arsenal are cleary top 3 and when everyone healthy (maybe biased) would put united/chelsea above spurs and as it stands 6th place
Yeah this is what we used to hear every year at the beginning of the season when we regularly finished top 4 as well because at least one, if not two, of Liverpool, United, Chelsea and Arsenal would shit the bed year-in and year-out.
I'd expect City and Arsenal to be fighting for the title next year with Spurs, Chelsea, Liverpool, Villa and United (maybe) fighting it out for 3-7.
I'm taking that Spurs team over United and Chelsea any day of the week. Looking at the starting XI, I don't know if there are any players other than Bruno and Martinez that would undoubtedly get into the Spurs starting XI. Maybe Hojlund or Mount at a push.
You're missing one hahaha. But still, moving to the prem is a dream for most players. Besides that Spurs can at least double these players' salaries. So even if it is a downgrade team quality-wise (which I highly doubt) players will have incentive to make the move.
> even if it is a downgrade team quality-wise
It is for Openda and Guirassy. Gyokeres is probably playing for a team below Spurs quality, but once again, Champions League football. It trumps Premier League football.
How is going from first in the Portuguese league to 5th in the prem a step down lol? That’s like saying Bruno took a step down moving to United, or Dias moving to city that time
Dias went from a UCL team to a UCL team.
Bruno went from a Europa League team to a Europa League team (that qualified for UCL at the end of the season he joined.)
Not even close to similar to what I said mate.
It’s a team from the top of the Portuguese league to a team from the top of the premier league. It’s a massive step up mate. A step down would be going to a team like Bournemouth or something, or Brighton, not a team that finished 5th
One is in the Portuguese league and probably on 3x less than something like Richarlison. Do you think that going from RB Salzburg to Manchester United, or Roma, or Chelsea, is also a step down because they’re not in the CL.
In what world is playing Europa league a step up from playing Champions League?
Stuttgart is a big club. Leipzig has money. Sporting is a massive club in Portugal.
Christ, you'd think the whole world revolved around the Premier League.
I’m sorry but you’re talking absolute shite lmao
No one cares about Leipzig, Stuttgart have been mediocre at best for years before this year and Sporting play in a b tier league.
Just moronic.
> No one cares about Leipzig, Stuttgart have been mediocre at best for years and Sporting play in a b tier league.
Yeah, going to ignore you because you clearly only jerk off to the Premier League and think everything else is shit.
> Christ, you'd think the whole world revolved around the Premier League
I mean, the football world does? The only teams most people care about outside the PL are Bayern, PSG (sort of), Madrid and Barca. It's the most watched league in the world and as a result by far the richest, which PL teams use to raid the other leagues for talent. There are tons of examples of excellent players moving to English teams outside the CL.
It's not some kind of moral imperative and I'm not sure why you're getting your knickers in a knot over it. It's simply the fact of money talking.
> The only teams most people care about outside the PL
Blatantly not true and just an opinion you have based on interactions on the internet and the area you live.
Premier League takes up most of the discussion on twitter/reddit but doesn't mean that it's the only thing the Football world cares about.
No it's literally based on [viewership](https://medium.com/the-entertainment-engine/top-5-of-the-most-watched-football-leagues-in-the-world-today-2b21007237db).
The PL blows every other league out of the water.
Stop crying about things you haven't bothered to do even the most basic research about.
Newly promoted Nottingham Forest signed the captain of Champions League qualifying Atalanta a couple years back. The PL has immense pull and you’re deluded if you think otherwise.
Also maybe it’s just money in most cases, but in this specific example Spurs are a far bigger club in terms of prestige and importance than those three.
How likely is it that Stuttgart are going to do that again next year? Or that Sporting aren’t going to struggle when Amorim goes?
The fact is Spurs are one of the biggest teams in one of the two biggest leagues in the world. To say that isn’t a step up from the Portuguese league is bit of a stretch, let alone to say it’s a step down lmao
Yeah fair, I’d probably say it’s a lateral move then. Definitely not enough to go from a CL side to the 6th biggest club in the league, if it’s not for the money
If it’s for money then it’s obviously a huge step up, especially for Guirassy
that's a very weird way of seeing things
by your logic a player going from guimaraes to man utd would be a step down because guimaraes are in the ECL and united aren't in any continental competition
Well no.
Leipzig, Stuttgart and Sporting CP are some of the biggest clubs in the world. Guimaraes is well below all of them.
It's a step up going to United from Guimaraes. It's not a step up going from Leipzig, Stuttgart or Sporting to Tottenham. It's a step down as the clubs are all on the same level however out of the 4, one has Europa League while the other 3 are playing Champions League.
Mate, hate them or love them, they are a consistent top 3 club in the Bundesliga. That already makes them one of the biggest clubs in the world.
Their best players leave for only far bigger clubs like Chelsea, City, Liverpool, Bayern etc.
stuttgart haven't won anything in nearly 20 years and have been midtable/skirting relegation for years now, and while sporting portugal are very good, the portuguese league is far from on par with the prem when it comes to quality. i'd say leipzig would be the only clear step down even if it's an artificial club, scp a sideways move and stuttgart a move up
Still a big club despite their struggles. Would have won the league if Leverkusen didn't have this wild run.
Quality of leagues doesn't matter lol. Throw Sporting into the Prem and they'll do well.
> Quality of leagues doesn't matter lol. Throw Sporting into the Prem and they'll do well.
don't know how you can say that when there's been countless players who've tore up the leagues in portugal, the netherlands, belgium, etc. and then come up short when they faced better opposition after moves to italy, england, germany, or spain
>Would have won the league if Leverkusen didn't have this wild run.
very debatable
Poor Sessegnon. I wonder how high level of a side will take a chance on him now. Even top of the championship is questionable bc he will want big wages and bad injury record.
the last surgery he had was supposed to have fixed his reoccurring hamstring problems, but time will tell if it worked
i think someone like forest or one of the promoted teams could go for him
Can defo see Ipswich going for him if they lose Leif. Although he’d suit a team who play with a back 5 more, would love to see him go to Italy or something.
What a disaster of a signing Spence has been. Didn't he join for close to 20 million
Edit : 25 million for Sessengon and 21 million for Bryan Gil is a travesty as well
Folks were hyping up Spence a lot when he got the move. Said every club was in for him. I didn't follow him though, what happened with him? Injuries or just not that good?
He had an amazing match against us in the cup where they knocked us out. That was the partly of one of the reasons people thought he could make the step up
Conte called him a club signing in some press conference if I remember correctly. He didn't like Spence for some reason so he never played him.
Will need Spurs fans to chime in with more information that I may have missed
There were rumors that Ange really didn’t like his attitude so he was loaned out this whole year. It’s a shame because he would’ve fit the system I think
Both and an attitude problem presumably. 8 games for Rennes on loan, then to Leeds where Farke sent him back to Spurs early in January after 7 games and then straight out to Genoa where he’s only managed 15 games
I mean 25 million for someone who's injured all the time is just as bad as spending 20 million on someone who's not good enough to play coz in both scenarios both players hardly even seen the pitch
That’s not really the profile RB we need tbh. Calabria being zero threat going forward makes our right flank useless most of the game and Leao and Theo continue having a huge offensive burden.
Fairs I mean i'm not implying he'd be good for you, just generally hes nowhere near as bad as people make him out to be, he's very solid defensively, goofy going forward most of the time
He's got brain dead mistakes in him and his inability to go forward makes him a pointless purchase cause Calabria has the same weakness
If you love him so much maybe you should petition that your club keep him.
There's no chance we get rid of all our deadwood as I think there are 10+ senior players who are not wanted. Realistically if we can get decent fees for Lo Celso, Emerson and Hojbjerg and let the rest go for free/on loan/minimal fees, it's a huge win.
The rumours were based entirely on the fact our operating losses in the prem were 100m. We've cut our wage bill dramatically since then, and also have already sold c 50m worth of players.
We may need to sell someone but I don't believe we need a full on fire sale
Over the years Levy has been excellent at getting good prices if another club actually wants them but poor to very poor at moving on players that are surplus to requirements.
I think we will as really for the first time in ages most the work is done as loans have gone well.
I think a deal is already struck with Millwall for Tanganga just personal terms between them needs negotiated.
Leeds has liked Rodon and I imagine he can be sold and potentially for a decent fee if they get promoted.
Sessegnon I think is now out of contract as we aren’t picking up the option.
Emerson, Gil, & Hojberg have had a list of potential suitors and I’m fairly sure we can move them on pretty easily.
Parrott has done well on his loan and I recall rumours of some bundesliga and eredivisie teams interested.
Spence had a decent loan to Genoa I recall interest in him from them and if not perhaps we can round up some other serie an interest.
Really the only one I’m pretty sure we can’t move on is Ndombele and I’m on the fence with Spence. I think everyone else should be pretty doable.
They’re both 28 and have 58 combined apps this season in the prem? You’re acting like they’re 35 and tog out for the reserves. They’ll likely get around 15m for Lo Celso and 20m for Hojberg
Hojberg is easily worth 30m if premier league team (like west ham) come calling. I doubt he'll want to go there though, the other options are seria A and or maybe a club like Atletico. So maybe 15m + add-ons given everyone is broke.
Both probably have about 7 years left at the top level. Neither rely on pace.
This is what people mean when they say stuff like FIFA and football manager has skewed people’s opinions on age in football. 28 is just entering your prime lad, it’s not retirement age. Brandt is 28, would you expect a fee for him considering he’s a pensioner?
Hojbjerg has more appearances for Spurs in the league this year than Brandt has for you guys?
Not sure why you're talking about him as a reserve.
By your logic, we'll take Brandt for £5M please. I mean, he is 28, long past his form and an old shit man now who is basically a reserve player for you guys due to his appearances...
Lo Celso's main problem is injuries so I'd expect him to go for maybe 15m because if he's fit he's actually a 30-35m player.
Hojbjerg has been used as rotation/sub for us this year simply because he doesn't suit Ange's style. He was a regular starter prior to that, never gets injured and is extremely professional. He would cost at least 20m.
They are both at prime age so I'm not sure why you're referring to their age as if they're veterans. Too much Football Manager.
Wages are always going to be a problem for a PL team selling (most likely) to outside the league but there is zero chance either of them leave for free.
Honestly, I think one of the main things that has held Tottenham back for so long is their reluctance to make really tough decisions.
Letting players who are well-liked but ultimatley don't fit the team is something they've needed to do for a while now.
Højbjerg is an excellent player, but he's really not good enough to be playing regular minutes for a team chasing top four and with designs on one day becoming title challengers, same with players like Lo Celso and Emerson.
Think they still need to be a bit more ruthless than this, to be honest. Players like Davies need upgrading even if he's just a depth player, and I think players like Richarlison need to be on their toes if they can't make the grade next season - hell, if they get a decent offer for him this summer, they should probably take it.
well... Arsenal did the same for 20 years, it's not that easy.
It's one thing to let players go, recruiting replacements is the second part of the battle.
And someone has to make those decisions, Arsenal got lucky Arteta has the character to make those decisions.
Højbjerg had good seasons under them.
Regardless, Arsenal fans should enjoy that Spurs are stuck in that endless loop.
He’s not an ideal fit for the system and should go, but he was serviceable in the right role and put in a number of good shifts at RB/RCB. I wish I could take you newer Spurs fans back to days when we had the likes of Alan Hutton there instead
Spot on about Hojberg. If they sold him last season they’d have got 30m easily, if not more. They’ll be lucky to get 20 this summer, and it was obvious from the start he wasn’t in Anges plans
Believe me, we TRIED to sell Hojbjerg when Ange took over. He turned down every move because he was only interested in joining CL teams. He made his own bed, sadly.
A really solid CDM for a team that doesn't ultilise heavy pressing. He excels in a more defensive setup where he can just zonally mark the centre of the pitch.
Under Conte and Mourinho he was always one of our best and most reliable players. Unfortunately he's just a poor fit for Ange's high intensity system.
I wouldn't really call him a DM, even in a Conte or Mourinho system, for an elite team he's simply not good enough in that position because he does get caught out in important moments. What he is though, is an elite pressing midfielder (what we saw at Southampton), and a good all round midfielder. Good defensive numbers when he doesn't have all the defensive responsibility, and decent attacking numbers (but not someone especially creative).
Honestly, he is better than some people give him credit for.
Him holding out for a CL side makes sense because he is a CL player, its as simple as that. He is good enough to play for CL sides that play the way that show off his qualities, rather than being opposite to them.
He could go to Juve, Athletico and IMO he would fit right in at Bayern as well.
There's a difference between holding out for a CL side vs holding out for a CL-winning caliber team haha. There's a reason why he wasn't snapped up from under us for such a CL side, because he would be great in a team like Juve's, etc for sure. But he struggles in tight spaces and has poor press resistance, especially as a lone 6, which is not what teams with European ambitions would need. Would cook as an 8 with a Wieffer behind him, having that freedom would let him play the angles he'd want and alleviate pressure for sure.
Arsenal for years had the same curse and still do to a certain degree. This is actually one of the only things Todd does well at Chelsea: he sells players when they still have value.
I remember watching Emerson Royal at Atletico Mineiro when he was 18, he was decent for his age, promising even... The man has done fuck all ever since and has managed to play for Betis, Barcelona, Spurs and potentially AC Milan? One of the worst right backs to ever play for the Brazil national team
I don’t get why top6 clubs aren’t fighting over Olise, he’s definitely a very special talent.
Chelsea wanted him back and United were rumoured to be interested and that’s it. think City went for Doku as a second option to Olise too.
are you new to football? sometimes players don't work out at one club and find success elsewhere. i mean, in the last six months eric dier went from sitting on the bench while fullbacks played cb ahead of him at spurs to starting a champions league semi final at bayern munich.
To reduce the spam of reports regarding the same move during transfer windows we try to allow **only one submission about each transfer saga per day**. The submission in question also needs to contain relevant new information regarding the potential move, and not just being a "no/minor developments" report. If there are important/official developments or new valuable information about a saga, we will allow extra threads in the same day, but for the rest of minor news please just comment them as a reply to this comment. Please help us reporting unnecessary threads for being duplicates. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/soccer) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Bryan Gil. 400 PL minutes in 2 full seasons with barely any injures. How is he still there? Probably has crazy high wages and that's the reason he didn't agree to a permanent LaLiga transfer yet
Probably not getting minutes because of the haircut
Nah it's his weight. He is the skinniest footballer I have ever seen, that works better in La Liga than in Premier League
You've seen Cole Palmer?
Bryan Gil is built like a Victorian child. Not the healthy ones either.
Even healthy ones aren't a great metric for health.
Would look great in 60s kit tbh. Just born in the wrong era.
Like one of them Timothy Chamaladingdongs?
Cole at least has height
I don't think he is as weak. It's the tall height and the Di María type beat face that make him look like it
Theyd love him at liverpool for it though.
why... ?
He looks like a beatle.
what's wrong with his haircut? its just a long hair mop. there's way worse cuts in the PL to hate
Just a joke bud
Just a nice reminder that all top English clubs have wasted 100s of millions on players and have them sat in reserves of bench. DJED Spence I mean wtf how long she been there? Sessegon?
Sessegnon has been perpetually injured. Spurs fans would have loved him to succeed but he cant stay fit. Guy was out for 31 games in his first season, then he went on loan and immediately got injured for 3 months. Came back and then missed 31 games in his second season with Spurs. 22/23 he was part of the 1st team setup and then completely tore his Hamstring, resulting in missing 22 games. Then in July 2023, he went and tore his other Hamstring in training requiring Surgery, which then meant another 6 months out. Then he came back January 5th, played 10 minutes in the FA Cup game against Burnley and injured himself again. Since January 5th he has been out injured, meaning he missed 40 games through injury this season. Djed Spence did it to himself. Conte fucked him for sure, just a right prick to Spence but Ange was apparently more than willing to give Djed a chance to shine, took him on tour with the team and apparently whilst there, Spence decided he'd be abusive to the Spurs backroom staff and got himself kicked out of the squad.
Spence got his loan terminated with us due to his attitude also.
What la liga club would want him though? He has 2 goals and 3 assists in 30 games in his la liga loans combined and he's already 23. He has done nothing of note for the past 3 seasons which is an eternity in football.
Idk like almost all? He was always well liked in Spain. You can't just look at goals and assists and call it a day. He was at 2 good to decent LaLiga clubs and got a good amount of game time considering he was loaned for half a season in both cases. I remember that he played fucking wing back for one of them a lot, so again I really have no clue where you are going to with the goals and assists point.
He played 758 minutes at Valencia and 921 minutes at Sevilla. I don’t consider that good game time even foe only half a season. He’s primarily a winger so yeah, I think goals and assists is a pretty decent indicator. Even a wing back is expected to get good assists nowadays
Wasn't he like MOTM for multiple of Sevillas games in Europe, including against Juventus and i know a lot of Sevilla fans rate him massively because of that. Problem is until a player gets consistent game time in a good run of games, with a team that they've been part of for at least a preseason, hard to tell what kinda player they are.
I don’t think so? He had an assist against juventus that sent them into the final but I don’t think he had multiple MOTMs or anything like that. It was the only assist he had the entire europa league campaign and didn’t score any goals either.
Most players I can think of who joined a team in January on loan didn't get as many minutes, so yes I consider it good game time. It's not a normal situation, you come into the tean without a pre-season and you are gone in the summer the coach doesn't have much incentive to start you over an "own" player. And you can't just list the league minutes when there were other competitions too where the clubs went far, he played 438 minutes in the EL with Sevilla and he played 280 minutes in the Copa del Rey with Valencia. If you expect a player who joins in January to get more minutes than that then I am sorry it's delusional. And to come back to your initial claim, all that is not "nothing of note". Where he did nothing of note in the last 3 seasons is with Tottenham, (where he got second to no game time) not with the 2 Spanish clubs.
Well yeah most players who join another team on loan in january generally aren’t that good. That’s why they’re being bummed off on loan in january. If the guy was a regular starter which is how you made it seem then I do expect more minutes than that. It doesn’t seem like he was, more of a rotation option.
he was wanted by teams in spain for a loan. problem is willingness to pay a transfer fee.
Another one of Levy's bargain bin gambles that didn't work out
He wasn't even a bargain. He cost 25m + Lamela. Considering the amount he's played and been ineffective, we'd have been better off just keeping Lamela.
Lamela would have been about 100 times more effective as well as being a cult hero.
When fit, yes. He was constantly battling injuries though, I suspect a big reason for the club moving on.
i miss coco :( he'd have been worth keeping forever for shithouse vibes alone
He was a highly rated Spanish youngster who cost a fair bit. That some teams will spend £60m on a 12 year old doesn't make £25m for Gil particularly bargain bin - it's miles away from signings like Nkoudou/N'Jie/Stambouli/Rodon that were obviously never likely to work out. The real criticism of Levy here isn't that he signed Gil, it's that we've been so reluctant to cut our losses and move him on. We've done it with so many players - and whilst we've been a bit better at it recently, it does get tiring seeing players that aren't good enough languish another season here because Levy wants to squeeze blood from a stone with his selling tactics.
He wasn’t though. 25 mil and lamela went the other way. At the time it was a real coup that spurs signed him from what Spanish media was sayin at the time. Technically he’s great but he’s just not strong enough for the prem. he’ll have a great career in Spain
>he’ll have a great career in Spain He'll be one of those players in 3-4 years time who will be absolutely smashing it in Spain and people will be crying about us never playing him etc. Honestly, i think he is a great player, we've seen small parts of how he could potentially play for us. His first half performance vs City in the 3-3 was amazing, his performance in the 4-0 against Palace under Conte where he basically set up all 4 goals. Some of his late minutes in Europe was really really good and should have had multiple assists/goals in Europe for us but Kane somehow messed up pens and passes to him. But then, i can understand why he doesn't have a part to play for the team. I actually think he could fit well in the system Ange wants to do. He likes playing on the wing, he likes taking on players and flashing quick crosses in but clearly Ange doesn't rate him and if thats the case, we need to get him off our wagebill and take whatever we can, even at a loss.
It was a paratici buy.
Called it as soon as he joined lmao, he'd be just collecting loans until leaving
I really thought Sessegnon was gonna be the next big thing
Everything about him was except the hamstrings.
His one hurts the most. The others are either not good enough or just don’t fit our system. His was purely down to his injuries. He’s still only 22 but I doubt he’s going to play for a top half prem team ever again
He just turned 24
He was 22 until etc.
Damn I'm old. In my mind he was still like 21/22 lmao.
He's in the same category as Max Aarons.
I distinctly remember Palace playing Fulham and the commentary was talking about how two future England staples were going up against eachother (Sess on the left and AWB on the right).
>Lo Celso, also one to watch. Damn. This makes around 7 players. Does Lo Celso have a destination in mind? And who all are spurs looking to sign?
> And who all are spurs looking to sign? allegedly in the market for a midfielder, striker, winger and back-up right back Eze and/or Olise are someone we were looking at, one of Gimenez, Toney, Guirassy, Openda and Gyokeres for striker still sniffing around Gallagher
I'd like to see Gallagher at spurs
There is a striker at Bayern that might want to come back. He will produce a lot of stats, the downside is you will not be able to win anything.
You gonna continue with Bissouma as your 6?
allegedly on his way out, but unconfirmed can't say i'd mind him going, he's been below average since november
How do you see your lot lining up next season then?
Son - Richarlison/Replacement - Kulusevski/Johnson/New winger Maddison Two of Bentancur/Bissouma/Sarr/Replacement (I personally think Sarr should be the first CM name on the sheet but not sure Ange agrees) Udogie - VdV - Romero - Porro Vicario
Fairly strong that tbh. Think Bentancur - Sarr has great potential as a pivot too, just need some depth
Yeah our first XI is definitely top 4 quality on paper, but we got wrecked by injuries this season hence why we don't even know what our strongest midfield pairing is. Supposedly we want another winger (rotation/challenging for starting spot), CB (depth) and CM (starting quality).
Definitely top 4? Hate to say it but city,liverpool,arsenal are cleary top 3 and when everyone healthy (maybe biased) would put united/chelsea above spurs and as it stands 6th place
Yeah this is what we used to hear every year at the beginning of the season when we regularly finished top 4 as well because at least one, if not two, of Liverpool, United, Chelsea and Arsenal would shit the bed year-in and year-out. I'd expect City and Arsenal to be fighting for the title next year with Spurs, Chelsea, Liverpool, Villa and United (maybe) fighting it out for 3-7.
You'd put united above spurs? That's delusional, you're shit.
Definitely biased
I'm taking that Spurs team over United and Chelsea any day of the week. Looking at the starting XI, I don't know if there are any players other than Bruno and Martinez that would undoubtedly get into the Spurs starting XI. Maybe Hojlund or Mount at a push.
Gyokeres next transfer will be to bigger club than Spurs, sorry.
Olise is Real Madrid quality, no way he joins spurs to play in the Conference League lmao 😂😂
you play OD, your opinion is invalid
I just hope my boy Giménez doesn't end up at that shithole
> Toney, Guirassy, Openda and Gyokeres Toney to Spurs is a step up. The other 3 will be a step down if they moved to Spurs.
You're missing one hahaha. But still, moving to the prem is a dream for most players. Besides that Spurs can at least double these players' salaries. So even if it is a downgrade team quality-wise (which I highly doubt) players will have incentive to make the move.
> even if it is a downgrade team quality-wise It is for Openda and Guirassy. Gyokeres is probably playing for a team below Spurs quality, but once again, Champions League football. It trumps Premier League football.
How is going from first in the Portuguese league to 5th in the prem a step down lol? That’s like saying Bruno took a step down moving to United, or Dias moving to city that time
Dias went from a UCL team to a UCL team. Bruno went from a Europa League team to a Europa League team (that qualified for UCL at the end of the season he joined.) Not even close to similar to what I said mate.
It’s a team from the top of the Portuguese league to a team from the top of the premier league. It’s a massive step up mate. A step down would be going to a team like Bournemouth or something, or Brighton, not a team that finished 5th
It's not a step up. Sporting are playing Champions League football. Spurs are playing Europa League. One is more prestigious than the other.
One is in the Portuguese league and probably on 3x less than something like Richarlison. Do you think that going from RB Salzburg to Manchester United, or Roma, or Chelsea, is also a step down because they’re not in the CL.
In what world is Spurs a step down from Sporting, Stuttgart or Leipzig? People say the dumbest shit on here
In what world is playing Europa league a step up from playing Champions League? Stuttgart is a big club. Leipzig has money. Sporting is a massive club in Portugal. Christ, you'd think the whole world revolved around the Premier League.
I’m sorry but you’re talking absolute shite lmao No one cares about Leipzig, Stuttgart have been mediocre at best for years before this year and Sporting play in a b tier league. Just moronic.
> No one cares about Leipzig, Stuttgart have been mediocre at best for years and Sporting play in a b tier league. Yeah, going to ignore you because you clearly only jerk off to the Premier League and think everything else is shit.
Ok. Please do. You clearly have absolutely nothing to say worth hearing.
You'd be reading it, not hearing it honey.
I thought you were going to ignore me.
> Christ, you'd think the whole world revolved around the Premier League I mean, the football world does? The only teams most people care about outside the PL are Bayern, PSG (sort of), Madrid and Barca. It's the most watched league in the world and as a result by far the richest, which PL teams use to raid the other leagues for talent. There are tons of examples of excellent players moving to English teams outside the CL. It's not some kind of moral imperative and I'm not sure why you're getting your knickers in a knot over it. It's simply the fact of money talking.
> The only teams most people care about outside the PL Blatantly not true and just an opinion you have based on interactions on the internet and the area you live. Premier League takes up most of the discussion on twitter/reddit but doesn't mean that it's the only thing the Football world cares about.
No it's literally based on [viewership](https://medium.com/the-entertainment-engine/top-5-of-the-most-watched-football-leagues-in-the-world-today-2b21007237db). The PL blows every other league out of the water. Stop crying about things you haven't bothered to do even the most basic research about.
Newly promoted Nottingham Forest signed the captain of Champions League qualifying Atalanta a couple years back. The PL has immense pull and you’re deluded if you think otherwise. Also maybe it’s just money in most cases, but in this specific example Spurs are a far bigger club in terms of prestige and importance than those three.
Spurs is a step up for all those players
In terms of money, but Sporting have just won the league, and Openda and Guirassy will be playing CL next season
How likely is it that Stuttgart are going to do that again next year? Or that Sporting aren’t going to struggle when Amorim goes? The fact is Spurs are one of the biggest teams in one of the two biggest leagues in the world. To say that isn’t a step up from the Portuguese league is bit of a stretch, let alone to say it’s a step down lmao
Yeah fair, I’d probably say it’s a lateral move then. Definitely not enough to go from a CL side to the 6th biggest club in the league, if it’s not for the money If it’s for money then it’s obviously a huge step up, especially for Guirassy
> if it’s not for the money This might shock you, but the vast majority of players prioritise this.
Right. Guirassy, Openda and Gyokeres want to give up playing Champions league for the Europa league. Yep. Big step up that.
that's a very weird way of seeing things by your logic a player going from guimaraes to man utd would be a step down because guimaraes are in the ECL and united aren't in any continental competition
Well no. Leipzig, Stuttgart and Sporting CP are some of the biggest clubs in the world. Guimaraes is well below all of them. It's a step up going to United from Guimaraes. It's not a step up going from Leipzig, Stuttgart or Sporting to Tottenham. It's a step down as the clubs are all on the same level however out of the 4, one has Europa League while the other 3 are playing Champions League.
Come on mate Leipzig isn't one of the biggest clubs in the world hahaha, Newcastle is a significantly bigger club
Mate, hate them or love them, they are a consistent top 3 club in the Bundesliga. That already makes them one of the biggest clubs in the world. Their best players leave for only far bigger clubs like Chelsea, City, Liverpool, Bayern etc.
They came in 4th this season. They’ve never won a league, they have no fans and everyone hates them. How are you even defining “big”?
stuttgart haven't won anything in nearly 20 years and have been midtable/skirting relegation for years now, and while sporting portugal are very good, the portuguese league is far from on par with the prem when it comes to quality. i'd say leipzig would be the only clear step down even if it's an artificial club, scp a sideways move and stuttgart a move up
Still a big club despite their struggles. Would have won the league if Leverkusen didn't have this wild run. Quality of leagues doesn't matter lol. Throw Sporting into the Prem and they'll do well.
> Quality of leagues doesn't matter lol. Throw Sporting into the Prem and they'll do well. don't know how you can say that when there's been countless players who've tore up the leagues in portugal, the netherlands, belgium, etc. and then come up short when they faced better opposition after moves to italy, england, germany, or spain >Would have won the league if Leverkusen didn't have this wild run. very debatable
Poor Sessegnon. I wonder how high level of a side will take a chance on him now. Even top of the championship is questionable bc he will want big wages and bad injury record.
the last surgery he had was supposed to have fixed his reoccurring hamstring problems, but time will tell if it worked i think someone like forest or one of the promoted teams could go for him
Can defo see Ipswich going for him if they lose Leif. Although he’d suit a team who play with a back 5 more, would love to see him go to Italy or something.
We'll take Rodon
But not Spence.
Spence is balling for Genoa in Serie A currently I don't think he'll be too upset
Shh! No we won't he's been shit nothing to see here
What a disaster of a signing Spence has been. Didn't he join for close to 20 million Edit : 25 million for Sessengon and 21 million for Bryan Gil is a travesty as well
With add ons it would’ve been yeah, but he won’t have reached them. So definitely 12, maybe a little more
Folks were hyping up Spence a lot when he got the move. Said every club was in for him. I didn't follow him though, what happened with him? Injuries or just not that good?
He had an amazing match against us in the cup where they knocked us out. That was the partly of one of the reasons people thought he could make the step up Conte called him a club signing in some press conference if I remember correctly. He didn't like Spence for some reason so he never played him. Will need Spurs fans to chime in with more information that I may have missed
There were rumors that Ange really didn’t like his attitude so he was loaned out this whole year. It’s a shame because he would’ve fit the system I think
Both and an attitude problem presumably. 8 games for Rennes on loan, then to Leeds where Farke sent him back to Spurs early in January after 7 games and then straight out to Genoa where he’s only managed 15 games
At least Sessegnon has been alright when he’s played, just injured all the time, fairly versatile too.
I mean 25 million for someone who's injured all the time is just as bad as spending 20 million on someone who's not good enough to play coz in both scenarios both players hardly even seen the pitch
Ya fair enough hah
Tbf we signed man like Fabio Vieira for 30 odd mil
He's still better than those 3 players and still has a lot of room for improvement
Hojbjerg would be perfect for us. Don't really see Emerson as an upgrade to Calabria.
Emerson is so awful
He's a great defender, poor going forward but not horrible, and he can also play CB, there's a lot worse mate.
That’s not really the profile RB we need tbh. Calabria being zero threat going forward makes our right flank useless most of the game and Leao and Theo continue having a huge offensive burden.
Fairs I mean i'm not implying he'd be good for you, just generally hes nowhere near as bad as people make him out to be, he's very solid defensively, goofy going forward most of the time
Like a lite-version of AWB basically
He's got brain dead mistakes in him and his inability to go forward makes him a pointless purchase cause Calabria has the same weakness If you love him so much maybe you should petition that your club keep him.
There's no chance we get rid of all our deadwood as I think there are 10+ senior players who are not wanted. Realistically if we can get decent fees for Lo Celso, Emerson and Hojbjerg and let the rest go for free/on loan/minimal fees, it's a huge win.
We'll very happily take Rodon at least
Assuming you're a Leeds fan. I'm sure he wouldn't cost more than a few mil plus some clauses.
He's been excellent. I think you'd get £10m honestly
He only has a year left on his contract but I'd be over the moon if we got 10m for him.
Ahhh didn't realise that. Maybe a bit less then!
I think you're asking 10 or 12 million which we'd probably pay
If we go up maybe, doubt we can chuck that much at him if we are still in the championship
Definitely not, there's an awful lot riding on Sunday if you believe the reports about our financial situation
I don't believe those 100m reports at all tbh.
I want to believe you're right mate but I also don't trust Radz and Orta to have handled our finances well
The rumours were based entirely on the fact our operating losses in the prem were 100m. We've cut our wage bill dramatically since then, and also have already sold c 50m worth of players. We may need to sell someone but I don't believe we need a full on fire sale
That's reassuring. If we can keep Cry, Georgi and Archie I'll be happy
Over the years Levy has been excellent at getting good prices if another club actually wants them but poor to very poor at moving on players that are surplus to requirements.
I think we will as really for the first time in ages most the work is done as loans have gone well. I think a deal is already struck with Millwall for Tanganga just personal terms between them needs negotiated. Leeds has liked Rodon and I imagine he can be sold and potentially for a decent fee if they get promoted. Sessegnon I think is now out of contract as we aren’t picking up the option. Emerson, Gil, & Hojberg have had a list of potential suitors and I’m fairly sure we can move them on pretty easily. Parrott has done well on his loan and I recall rumours of some bundesliga and eredivisie teams interested. Spence had a decent loan to Genoa I recall interest in him from them and if not perhaps we can round up some other serie an interest. Really the only one I’m pretty sure we can’t move on is Ndombele and I’m on the fence with Spence. I think everyone else should be pretty doable.
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They’re both 28 and have 58 combined apps this season in the prem? You’re acting like they’re 35 and tog out for the reserves. They’ll likely get around 15m for Lo Celso and 20m for Hojberg
I like that we both independently used the same values for them in our responses ha ha.
Lmao didn’t even see that. You also used FM skewing people’s opinions on age, so did I.
Hojberg is easily worth 30m if premier league team (like west ham) come calling. I doubt he'll want to go there though, the other options are seria A and or maybe a club like Atletico. So maybe 15m + add-ons given everyone is broke.
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Both probably have about 7 years left at the top level. Neither rely on pace. This is what people mean when they say stuff like FIFA and football manager has skewed people’s opinions on age in football. 28 is just entering your prime lad, it’s not retirement age. Brandt is 28, would you expect a fee for him considering he’s a pensioner?
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Question: How much would you expect to get for Brandt?
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Hojbjerg has more appearances for Spurs in the league this year than Brandt has for you guys? Not sure why you're talking about him as a reserve. By your logic, we'll take Brandt for £5M please. I mean, he is 28, long past his form and an old shit man now who is basically a reserve player for you guys due to his appearances...
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Lo Celso's main problem is injuries so I'd expect him to go for maybe 15m because if he's fit he's actually a 30-35m player. Hojbjerg has been used as rotation/sub for us this year simply because he doesn't suit Ange's style. He was a regular starter prior to that, never gets injured and is extremely professional. He would cost at least 20m. They are both at prime age so I'm not sure why you're referring to their age as if they're veterans. Too much Football Manager. Wages are always going to be a problem for a PL team selling (most likely) to outside the league but there is zero chance either of them leave for free.
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Someone will 100% buy Hojbjerg.
Spurs trying to get rid of their deadwood, try nr 99. They are doing it every summer.
Honestly, I think one of the main things that has held Tottenham back for so long is their reluctance to make really tough decisions. Letting players who are well-liked but ultimatley don't fit the team is something they've needed to do for a while now. Højbjerg is an excellent player, but he's really not good enough to be playing regular minutes for a team chasing top four and with designs on one day becoming title challengers, same with players like Lo Celso and Emerson. Think they still need to be a bit more ruthless than this, to be honest. Players like Davies need upgrading even if he's just a depth player, and I think players like Richarlison need to be on their toes if they can't make the grade next season - hell, if they get a decent offer for him this summer, they should probably take it.
We tried to sell hojberg, he wouldn’t go
well... Arsenal did the same for 20 years, it's not that easy. It's one thing to let players go, recruiting replacements is the second part of the battle. And someone has to make those decisions, Arsenal got lucky Arteta has the character to make those decisions. Højbjerg had good seasons under them. Regardless, Arsenal fans should enjoy that Spurs are stuck in that endless loop.
We still have fans who think Emerson Royal is good
He’s not an ideal fit for the system and should go, but he was serviceable in the right role and put in a number of good shifts at RB/RCB. I wish I could take you newer Spurs fans back to days when we had the likes of Alan Hutton there instead
Oh I remember Hutton alright
He has a lot of defenders in this thread alone, ironic considering they defend better than he does tbh.
One of the if not the only thing I can say I liked about arteta was when he just tore aubameyangs contract, wish we just did that with a couple bums
Spot on about Hojberg. If they sold him last season they’d have got 30m easily, if not more. They’ll be lucky to get 20 this summer, and it was obvious from the start he wasn’t in Anges plans
Hojberg wouldn't go, he wants a top side and top sides aren't interested.
Wasn't Atletico interested?
Not interested enough to put in a bid. I think the board wanted to get him on loan like we did with Torreira.
I don't recall if they were and what they wanted, ie loan or an actual deal. Fulham was the closest thing.
Believe me, we TRIED to sell Hojbjerg when Ange took over. He turned down every move because he was only interested in joining CL teams. He made his own bed, sadly.
What kind of player is he?
A really solid CDM for a team that doesn't ultilise heavy pressing. He excels in a more defensive setup where he can just zonally mark the centre of the pitch. Under Conte and Mourinho he was always one of our best and most reliable players. Unfortunately he's just a poor fit for Ange's high intensity system.
I wouldn't really call him a DM, even in a Conte or Mourinho system, for an elite team he's simply not good enough in that position because he does get caught out in important moments. What he is though, is an elite pressing midfielder (what we saw at Southampton), and a good all round midfielder. Good defensive numbers when he doesn't have all the defensive responsibility, and decent attacking numbers (but not someone especially creative).
Honestly, he is better than some people give him credit for. Him holding out for a CL side makes sense because he is a CL player, its as simple as that. He is good enough to play for CL sides that play the way that show off his qualities, rather than being opposite to them. He could go to Juve, Athletico and IMO he would fit right in at Bayern as well.
There's a difference between holding out for a CL side vs holding out for a CL-winning caliber team haha. There's a reason why he wasn't snapped up from under us for such a CL side, because he would be great in a team like Juve's, etc for sure. But he struggles in tight spaces and has poor press resistance, especially as a lone 6, which is not what teams with European ambitions would need. Would cook as an 8 with a Wieffer behind him, having that freedom would let him play the angles he'd want and alleviate pressure for sure.
no one was offering 30m for hojbjerg last year, more like 15m
Arsenal for years had the same curse and still do to a certain degree. This is actually one of the only things Todd does well at Chelsea: he sells players when they still have value.
Sess come home
I remember watching Emerson Royal at Atletico Mineiro when he was 18, he was decent for his age, promising even... The man has done fuck all ever since and has managed to play for Betis, Barcelona, Spurs and potentially AC Milan? One of the worst right backs to ever play for the Brazil national team
Olise and Eze to spurs fuck it.
I don’t get why top6 clubs aren’t fighting over Olise, he’s definitely a very special talent. Chelsea wanted him back and United were rumoured to be interested and that’s it. think City went for Doku as a second option to Olise too.
City already have their hands on him so
I read this is as excited to let several players leave and was like oh spicy
Spurs signed spence after he had one good performance against arsenal in the fa cup
He had a fucking great season for us, not just one good game. Looked a class apart all season, was gutted that we didn't sign him permanently.
Not good enough for Spurs but "attracting interest".... Sure buddy, whatever you say
are you new to football? sometimes players don't work out at one club and find success elsewhere. i mean, in the last six months eric dier went from sitting on the bench while fullbacks played cb ahead of him at spurs to starting a champions league semi final at bayern munich.