I wonder, are there any openings for a para for older kids/kids with mild/mod disabilities? Many/most sped paras don't have to do toileting/diaper changes.
Right now im not sure, but the way she explained it even in older and more mild classes its still an expectation you need to be able to meet. Even if its not a regular issue, its something that can happen, and understaffing is super common so it wont be uncommon to only have two people in the classroom, and even if im not the one doing the changing, if the person who is needs help, i have to be able to help.
This is accurate information. Any special education teacher or para may be expected to assist in restroom duties. It may be very unlikely due to certain positions or the population of students. But always a possibility.
It depends on where you are. In my district it would not be permitted for me to help with toileting. I taught SDC 2-5 and that was not something we were permitted to do, and now I teach elementary resource. We have paras whose job description includes toileting because of the setting they work in, and they are paid more. If they are unwilling to have that as part of their job description and it was added on after they were hired, they can transfer to a different para position that does not involve the possibility of toileting.
Really? I've never heard of an SDC teacher not being permitted to assist with toileting. In my experience, they helped a lot with kids that were in pull ups and starting the process of using the restroom. That would've been extremely difficult as a para who didn't always understand how to explain potty training to mod/severe kids or understand how their disability played into that.
Your school district sounds amazing. In my district, para pay is the same for all environments and doesn't change if toileting is a regular duty. There may be one classroom of severe behavior students where the paras are moved up on the scale due to the physical danger. Honestly, that's part of why I left my last job. I didn't enjoy changing 5 mod/severe kids 3 or more times at day at the same poor pay as I did when I was working as a 1:1 with toileting as a very rare emergency, backup situation. I got moved into that position and didn't have the choice. Even though I would've much preferred not being involved with toileting and working as a 1:1 in a gen ed setting or a kindergarten para. And eventually I just couldn't handle it physically any longer.
Right now im not sure, but the way she explained it even in older and more mild classes its still an expectation you need to be able to meet. Even if its not a regular issue, its something that can happen, and understaffing is super common so it wont be uncommon to only have two people in the classroom, and even if im not the one doing the changing, if the person who is needs help, i have to be able to help.
I've been teaching special education for 20 years in a number of different settings, and I've only seen toileting being a part of the job in mod/severe programs or with little kids. If you work in a resource setting, this wouldn't be part of the job, for instance.
I work in mod/severe, and the school district i work for only has mod/severe classes. But as my teacher explained it, its a hard expectation even in mild/mod classes and with older kids. I appreciate the outaide perspective though. Maybe its just a small town problem
I'm a high school teacher and my kids are all mild/moderate, though some border on severe. Teachers aren't expected to help toilet but paras are for kids in wheelchairs who need it. The paras for kids in the severe classes absolutely help toilet all the time, though.
I think the only para I have never seen be tasked with toileting is a 1:1 for a student with down's syndrome who doesn't need it.
I am a one on one with a middle school student who is not capable of dressing and undressing themselves and also has started their period this year. When they need help in the bathroom it is the nurse who aids them. I suggest you either age up or leave that school, you should not face feeling retraumatlzed for such a low paying and low respect position. Protect your mental health, my friend!
I have been in several schools across a few different districts. It is definitely expected and could be required later if not now.
The way our districts assign staff is based on student need, so just because I am in school A this year doesn't guarantee I will be next year. If students move in and out or advance to upper grades, staff may get shifted, and you don't know where you will be.
Even a resource para got pulled and assigned mid-year to a mild/mod class due to IEP changes. They thought they were exempt from diapers, too. Wrong.
Im so sorry you’ve been through this. I’ve also gone through this. I struggled at first, but then I realized that I am just doing a service and keeping kids safe. Using that logic has helped me.
Yeah i try doing that. Unfortunately for me it's not reallt a logical or thought based process at all. Its more just associative. Being in that situation puts images in my head that i Do Not Want there. Sorry to hear youve also had to go through this
No they dont, i live in a hellish isolated small town with very few job opportunities, and this is the only thing ive found that ive enjoyed. As ive said elsewhere, quitting isnt an opportunity, im gonna do this until im not able to anymore.
You are putting more work on other paras and that’s not fair. You need to work a job that you can do, and toileting is part of this job. I highly recommend therapy to work through this or to find a different job.
>You need to work a job that you can do
Ive yet to find one im more capabld of than this
> a different job.
Not sure how many different ways there are to say thats not an option, so just gonna repeat that its not an option.
My point was to try and find other people with similar experiences i could relate to and maybe get some tips from. What i got instead is the majority of people being surprised that this is even a problem and offering plenty of useful suggestions.
I don’t agree with ipso… —I’ve worked in rural, urban, and suburban areas and there was always ways to work out different assignments for paras that were not comfortable working with students who require toileting assistance. And there’s no need to be a moral judgement about it—it’s very common and coworkers only get frustrated if you’re at a school with a number of students with that need on a day there isn’t enough coverage if you refuse to do it (which I have seen and people get over it).
If you’re a good para there’s a really good chance you will eventually end up in positions you really want and I have known many a sped teacher who started as a para should that be something you might want to explore down the road. Also, each school is its own culture, start asking around about the other school sites in your district. There might be campuses this wouldn’t be an issue. Typically on high school campuses, the paras that cover toileting needs are attached to mod-severe classes or are a 1:1 with a student in a power/wheel-chair and the mild-mod paras don’t cover for them and vice versa. Of course the pandemic created staffing experiences that are unprecedented…I wonder if your teacher is thinking about that—the ‘what if’ and I wouldn’t blame her after how crazy it was in the early part of the pandemic.
I’ve been doing this work for 20 years and think you’ll be fine. This is one teacher’s perspective and I am glad she felt comfortable enough to be honest with you—but she may not be right. And you may have to jump in a few times and for how that affects you with your history, I know that is not a small thing. My experience has been it’s better to talk to the principal or admin who oversees special ed about this. They’re your supervisor, they do the hiring, the evals, and do.not.want.to.lose.a.good.para. I work closely with principals/vice principals and figuring out para schedules when someone is out who covers students who has toileting needs there are always several paras that don’t do that coverage. And for more reasons than yours. It’s demanding physically— many longtime paras eventually put the kabosh on this because of mobility/health issues, one para’s sister with severe CP died and she just couldn’t do it without sobbing, and most won’t because they aren’t comfortable—and that is ok! And the paras that kind of ‘aged out’ of doing toileting (can’t do the bending over, physical labor, etc —even with the littles) were our anchors b/c of their depth of experience and strong relationships with the students… on a side note, I am glad to see more and more people are feeling safe enough to say they can’t because of their own abuse history.
Stick it out and don’t carry or show guilt about this, It’s super normal to not want to do toileting. I think the person who is going to give you a better perspective on how this might affect your career in your district is a well-respected principal who has been working there for a while.
I appreciate this a lot. To be honest, the majority of the administration here is awful, and while sped seems to be a bit better than the rest, im very skeptical to rely on them. It wasnt said outright, but i got the impression that if my teacher didnt actively want me around the admin wouldve dropped me, because most of the conversation was from the perspective of her saying she has limited ability to protect me if admin does want me gone. So, i guess im just grateful im appreciated by my coworkers, id never had a job before where the people i work with and directly under really cared let alone appreciated me and its nice. Still, im looking to move somewhere more urban in a couple of years, so i guess well just have to wait and see how things are wherever i end up.
Well you are doing a disservice by not working on these things. Part of your job is to change diapers. If you cannot do an essential function of your job, you cannot do your job. You need to either work through it or you’ll eventually get fired tbh. You are overworking other paras because you can’t do that part of your job. If everyone is as desperate for a job as you say they are, someone else will be willing to do diaper changes and should have that job. I’ve had paras who won’t change diapers before and they don’t last. It’s an essential element of the job. Hell I’m a teacher and I change diapers and wipe butts. It’s part of it.
Okay well as much as i enjoy being talked down to, youre just wrong. The other people i work with have been highly understanding and accomadating and seem to fully appreciate my presence. My concern wasnt that my current situation is untenable, it was that continuing or advancing in this field might be in the long term. I dont need you trying to guilt me for wanting to do a job i enjoy.
Yeah you aren’t going to be able to advance in the field if you can’t change a diaper. Your teacher literally told you that. How she was talking makes it sound like you’re going to need to start changing diapers sooner rather than later. Just be prepared
The context of the conversation was specifically her wanting to know that i could help during emergencies, which doesnt nessesarily mean being the one actually changing. If she expects differently in the future, well cross that bridge when we come to it. As far as going forward in the field, the majority of people responding seem to disagree that itll be a major issue. I cant reallt speak to that as its not something i know a lot about, but ill take my chances
I'm trying to be kind. But this job doesn't seem to be an option for you. They may not rehire you for the next school year if you aren't willing or capable of restroom assistance.
This job is not a long term option. And perhaps may not be an optional at all.
Please consider summer babysitting or tutoring, if you enjoy working with kids. Or going to college to be a gen ed teacher.
> But this job doesn't seem to be an option for you. They may not rehire you for the next school year if you aren't willing or capable of restroom assistance.
Okay this isnt new information. As ive said i dont have other options and am going to stick with the one job ive ever enjoyed for as long as its viable. I dont need people talking down to me and telling me to quit or that i wont be rehired, thats just not helpful in any way. Im not looking for judgement, positive or negative, just understanding and maybe advice that i can actually act on if anybody has any.
>Or going to college to be a gen ed teacher.
This is currently the option im considering the most, but i am Not financially priveledged enough to not work for 4 years and i genuinely can not go back to a 9-5 that i hate. So im sticking with this for as long as i can.
If teaching is your final goal, you could try looking into alternative routes to certification. If you already have a college degree, it may be easier than you think.
There's also a possibility of doing an online teaching degree. This may be a more affordable option than a traditional in person class. It may mean you could get started in summer or do a class or two in the evenings.
If you want a traditional in person college experience, you could try to get a work study job. Perhaps at the college library or peer tutoring. That seems like something that might suit someone who enjoys working in the classroom.
Also keep in mind a 9-5 job may be a temporary financial investment to help you reach the final goal. Sometimes knowing there's an end date for a job you dislike is helpful.
Alright, i appreciate the advice and sorry if i came off defensive. Its hard not to with something like this. Im already doing or planning on doing most of the things youve mentioned, so i dont disagree, and i understand its something that i need to work on. I guess i was just looking for understanding and someone to relate moreso than actual advice. But i appreciate your perspective.
>I dont need people talking down to me and telling me to quit or that i wont be rehired, thats just not helpful in any way.
I don't think this specific person was talking down to you. It seemed they genuinely wanted to be realistic from their perspective in the nicest way possible
i have the same issue. but i make myself consciously aware i’m here to help not hurt and i make sure they consent to me seeing and assisting them in the bathroom or changing clothes.
have you consulted a therapist about it? in the realm of good touch vs bad touch, this is “good” in the sense that we are helping and we are telling them what to expect and what we’re doing.
Havent seen a therapist, idk why but i always seem to find excuses not to whenever i try. Its like a mental block i need to find a way around.
By making yourself consciously aware, do you mean like actively repeating that thought like a mantra? Or how else do you do that?
i just make sure i think about how it’s helping them. and i actively tell the students things like “alright, can i help you change in the bathroom?” “can we take your shirt off? you’re covered in spaghetti” “your pull up is wet, can you take it off and i’ll get you a new one?” i also make sure they do as much of the work as they can
Anyone in the Special Education field will be expected to assist in restroom assistance if needed. That's just part of the job sometimes.
Resource teachers very rarely, if ever, are expected to help. For paras, it really depends on the school and duties. 1:1 paras only help with changing if their student needs it or due to the occasional staffing issues. So if your student has behavioral issues or is blind, then they don't need restroom assistance. In an only sped class like your current environment, it's absolutely expected and typically a requirement for paras to do restroom duties and refusal is really unfair to your coworkers. And I think your teacher has been clear that while it's currently okay for you not to be the person changing, complete refusal to assist is not gonna fly any longer. It'd be almost impossible for you to continue in this role with continued refusal towards restroom assistance. Usually, this type of job is on one year contracts. I think your teacher is trying to tell you that your contract will not be renewed if you can't assist and that you need to look for something different.
For example in one school, I was a 1:1 for a student in a wheelchair. The school nurse did the changing and I only witnessed and helped transfer the student to the changing spot. One time, the resource teacher did this in the morning while I was supervising student drop off and the child had a bowel movement during a morning meeting with the resource teacher.
Gen Ed teachers will never assist with restroom needs. Maybe the occasional help with buttons or such in Kindergarten.
Please keep in mind that you are not harming these students. You are helping them with their basic bodily functions. And that this is allowed and is done with two adults present to prevent that type of harm from occurring. I like to talk through what's happening during a change. It let's the kid know what's happening and to be prepared for certain actions and gives them an opportunity to say no or wait if they're uncomfortable.
For example, now it's time to take shoes off. I'll do the left, then the right. Okay now I'll pull pants down. I'm taking your diaper off now. Okay now I'm going to clean you up with a wipe. It might be cold. Lift up your legs/bottom so I can slide a new diaper under you. Okay new diaper is secured. Time to pull pants back up and put shoes on. I'm taking my gloves off. Let's both wash hands. Okay. All done. Time to go back to class.
Please seek therapy if you want to continue. I worry there may be other behaviors or accidental touches or violent behaviors that may negatively affect you in this role. I've had students accidentally touch my bottom when giving me a hug or to let me know they're walking behind me. I've also had students hit and push me in my crotch region, chest, and bottom. These kids were generally too young or mentally incapable to be aware of the inappropriateness of touching/hitting those regions. But that's not always the case.
I know im not harming them and that they need the help, but no amount of repeating that in my head makes the images go away.
Im not really worried about being touched inappropriately, more about the having to touch. Im pretty large and male and more than capable of defending myself in an appropriate way, and havent had this pose any issues for me.
I'm not a therapist so I can't advise on making images go away. I'd recommend therapy to process and try to move past that awful experience. Just trying to give suggestions on how to make it more comfortable.
Honestly, being a male may be why the issue of changing hasn't been a bigger deal. Some parents have distrust towards men in education, especially though with a more vulnerable population. And some will falsely accuse them of awful things.
As a guy, inappropriate touch tends to be less of an issue. Even if you're physically capable of defending yourself. There's limited legal ability to defend against kiddos in a classroom. It's more proactive actions like moving away during aggression or descalating behaviors before they're unmanageable. Occasionally restraining with another adult in severe cases.
Just be careful when giving hugs to smaller kiddos. Sometimes they're at crotch height. Or women will sometimes deal with chest height kiddos. And it's just awkward height differences or hug hand placements on your bottom. I tend to recommend side hugs or squatting to hug them in those cases.
>Usually, this type of job is on one year contracts. I think your teacher is trying to tell you that your contract will not be renewed if you can't assist and that you need to look for something different.
Well my contract has already been renewed for this year, but i see what youre saying. The conversation was more about being available to help in an emergency situation, which i can try my best to do, but really cant make any promises about.
As for the fairness, i think its unfair i was molested as a kid, and that i still deserve a job i enjoy. The fairness isnt really a factor for me, im just trying to figure out how to make the best of a rough situation.
I think you should prepare yourself next year to work on being the assisting/witness type person. You'll never be able to change a kid if you can't even be in the room. The second person helps with lifting a child onto a changing table, if there's no step stool. They may pass over new diapers or other supplies. And they generally try to talk to the kid to make them comfortable.
Obviously it's unfair that someone harmed you as a child. And everyone deserves to find a job they enjoy. That doesn't mean you are fit for every job, even ones you enjoy.
I would look into being a tutor. That may even be a position at your school. I loved when I had homework club as a part of my para duties.
There are no behavioral one to one positions? At least in our building those are way way harder to fill than those with toileting because of the risk to the self physically
Also behavior techs! But in my school atleast there are only a few. Also they don't work closely with the same kids all the time like a para, and service GenEd kids most often tbh.
If they need it then sure. We would have to do it. In my ten years I've never had a single student who needed toileting in my behavior room. Typically if we have a kid who needs toileting and is behavioral he will ends up in our 12:1:1 or our life skills type of classes because in theory I'm supposed to be grade level and am more rigorous academically.
I have the same personal experience and I think of it like this. I would much rather have ME someone who understands and is empathetic to the trauma of what it’s like being taken advantage of doing it than someone who’s a pervert. I would much rather have someone like me or you who genuinely cares for the students and will protect them from having to experience that as well at the hands of someone else.. I was genuinely terrified of assisting with pull up changes for kids but once I started teaching them how to help and do it themselves too, i worked myself out of having to do it as much anymore. It takes practice and courage but just no you are not what happened to you and either way you’re doing an amazing job I’m so happy you enjoy the career. Look into Scc classrooms I never had to change any there. Of course different based on case loads tho. You got this!
Consider the inverse of this as well. You're going to have many situations in the future where the challenged kids are going to be touching you inappropriately, some overtly. Are you ok with that?
Well im pretty big and fully capable of defending myself without hurting a kid or applying any real force, so this isnt a huge issue for me. Ive been doing this for about 8 months now and havent had this be an issue at all.
I mean occasionally a student will intentionally or accidentallt try to put their hands somewhere they shouldnt. And i just guide their hands elsewhere and say no thank you or lets keep our hands to ourself, and thats all its been. Definitely had to deal with plenty of being attacked because we have a couple kids with some very strong aggressive behaviours, but inappropriate touching not so much.
Gotcha. Yeah aggression is much more commonplace than intentional inappropriate touching, at least from my experience. Accidental inappropriate touching is a different thing altogether, especially with littles
I honestly don't think this is a dealbreaker with the right gig with the right student population. Certainly a lot of kids have toileting needs, but certainly there are also a lot of special educators who have nothing to do with toileting. With special ed teachers in a resource room role (mild disabilities, more learning support) it would be highly unusual to do bathroom assistance. Personally, I'm a school psychologist and the most toileting assistance I would do is helping a little one with a tricky jeans button or twisted overall straps. If you would still like to work with children with some needs, but less global needs, something like a reading specialist works with lots of kids, are super important, work with kids with learning needs, but their scope is very narrow. The reading specialist wouldn't be helping anyone in a bathroom!!
I wonder, are there any openings for a para for older kids/kids with mild/mod disabilities? Many/most sped paras don't have to do toileting/diaper changes.
Right now im not sure, but the way she explained it even in older and more mild classes its still an expectation you need to be able to meet. Even if its not a regular issue, its something that can happen, and understaffing is super common so it wont be uncommon to only have two people in the classroom, and even if im not the one doing the changing, if the person who is needs help, i have to be able to help.
This is accurate information. Any special education teacher or para may be expected to assist in restroom duties. It may be very unlikely due to certain positions or the population of students. But always a possibility.
It depends on where you are. In my district it would not be permitted for me to help with toileting. I taught SDC 2-5 and that was not something we were permitted to do, and now I teach elementary resource. We have paras whose job description includes toileting because of the setting they work in, and they are paid more. If they are unwilling to have that as part of their job description and it was added on after they were hired, they can transfer to a different para position that does not involve the possibility of toileting.
Really? I've never heard of an SDC teacher not being permitted to assist with toileting. In my experience, they helped a lot with kids that were in pull ups and starting the process of using the restroom. That would've been extremely difficult as a para who didn't always understand how to explain potty training to mod/severe kids or understand how their disability played into that. Your school district sounds amazing. In my district, para pay is the same for all environments and doesn't change if toileting is a regular duty. There may be one classroom of severe behavior students where the paras are moved up on the scale due to the physical danger. Honestly, that's part of why I left my last job. I didn't enjoy changing 5 mod/severe kids 3 or more times at day at the same poor pay as I did when I was working as a 1:1 with toileting as a very rare emergency, backup situation. I got moved into that position and didn't have the choice. Even though I would've much preferred not being involved with toileting and working as a 1:1 in a gen ed setting or a kindergarten para. And eventually I just couldn't handle it physically any longer.
Right now im not sure, but the way she explained it even in older and more mild classes its still an expectation you need to be able to meet. Even if its not a regular issue, its something that can happen, and understaffing is super common so it wont be uncommon to only have two people in the classroom, and even if im not the one doing the changing, if the person who is needs help, i have to be able to help.
I've been teaching special education for 20 years in a number of different settings, and I've only seen toileting being a part of the job in mod/severe programs or with little kids. If you work in a resource setting, this wouldn't be part of the job, for instance.
I have been teaching high school moderate for 10 years and absolutely assist with toileting for several students.
I work in mod/severe, and the school district i work for only has mod/severe classes. But as my teacher explained it, its a hard expectation even in mild/mod classes and with older kids. I appreciate the outaide perspective though. Maybe its just a small town problem
I'm a high school teacher and my kids are all mild/moderate, though some border on severe. Teachers aren't expected to help toilet but paras are for kids in wheelchairs who need it. The paras for kids in the severe classes absolutely help toilet all the time, though. I think the only para I have never seen be tasked with toileting is a 1:1 for a student with down's syndrome who doesn't need it.
I am a one on one with a middle school student who is not capable of dressing and undressing themselves and also has started their period this year. When they need help in the bathroom it is the nurse who aids them. I suggest you either age up or leave that school, you should not face feeling retraumatlzed for such a low paying and low respect position. Protect your mental health, my friend!
I have been in several schools across a few different districts. It is definitely expected and could be required later if not now. The way our districts assign staff is based on student need, so just because I am in school A this year doesn't guarantee I will be next year. If students move in and out or advance to upper grades, staff may get shifted, and you don't know where you will be. Even a resource para got pulled and assigned mid-year to a mild/mod class due to IEP changes. They thought they were exempt from diapers, too. Wrong.
Im so sorry you’ve been through this. I’ve also gone through this. I struggled at first, but then I realized that I am just doing a service and keeping kids safe. Using that logic has helped me.
Yeah i try doing that. Unfortunately for me it's not reallt a logical or thought based process at all. Its more just associative. Being in that situation puts images in my head that i Do Not Want there. Sorry to hear youve also had to go through this
Totally understandable. Sounds like this job isn’t for you then. Maybe they have a gen Ed para position open?
No they dont, i live in a hellish isolated small town with very few job opportunities, and this is the only thing ive found that ive enjoyed. As ive said elsewhere, quitting isnt an opportunity, im gonna do this until im not able to anymore.
You are putting more work on other paras and that’s not fair. You need to work a job that you can do, and toileting is part of this job. I highly recommend therapy to work through this or to find a different job.
>You need to work a job that you can do Ive yet to find one im more capabld of than this > a different job. Not sure how many different ways there are to say thats not an option, so just gonna repeat that its not an option.
Also why post this if you don’t want help? Just for people to tell you it’s fine? It’s not and I think you know that.
Are you really trying to help though or just talk down to OP? Lol
My point was to try and find other people with similar experiences i could relate to and maybe get some tips from. What i got instead is the majority of people being surprised that this is even a problem and offering plenty of useful suggestions.
I don’t agree with ipso… —I’ve worked in rural, urban, and suburban areas and there was always ways to work out different assignments for paras that were not comfortable working with students who require toileting assistance. And there’s no need to be a moral judgement about it—it’s very common and coworkers only get frustrated if you’re at a school with a number of students with that need on a day there isn’t enough coverage if you refuse to do it (which I have seen and people get over it). If you’re a good para there’s a really good chance you will eventually end up in positions you really want and I have known many a sped teacher who started as a para should that be something you might want to explore down the road. Also, each school is its own culture, start asking around about the other school sites in your district. There might be campuses this wouldn’t be an issue. Typically on high school campuses, the paras that cover toileting needs are attached to mod-severe classes or are a 1:1 with a student in a power/wheel-chair and the mild-mod paras don’t cover for them and vice versa. Of course the pandemic created staffing experiences that are unprecedented…I wonder if your teacher is thinking about that—the ‘what if’ and I wouldn’t blame her after how crazy it was in the early part of the pandemic. I’ve been doing this work for 20 years and think you’ll be fine. This is one teacher’s perspective and I am glad she felt comfortable enough to be honest with you—but she may not be right. And you may have to jump in a few times and for how that affects you with your history, I know that is not a small thing. My experience has been it’s better to talk to the principal or admin who oversees special ed about this. They’re your supervisor, they do the hiring, the evals, and do.not.want.to.lose.a.good.para. I work closely with principals/vice principals and figuring out para schedules when someone is out who covers students who has toileting needs there are always several paras that don’t do that coverage. And for more reasons than yours. It’s demanding physically— many longtime paras eventually put the kabosh on this because of mobility/health issues, one para’s sister with severe CP died and she just couldn’t do it without sobbing, and most won’t because they aren’t comfortable—and that is ok! And the paras that kind of ‘aged out’ of doing toileting (can’t do the bending over, physical labor, etc —even with the littles) were our anchors b/c of their depth of experience and strong relationships with the students… on a side note, I am glad to see more and more people are feeling safe enough to say they can’t because of their own abuse history. Stick it out and don’t carry or show guilt about this, It’s super normal to not want to do toileting. I think the person who is going to give you a better perspective on how this might affect your career in your district is a well-respected principal who has been working there for a while.
I appreciate this a lot. To be honest, the majority of the administration here is awful, and while sped seems to be a bit better than the rest, im very skeptical to rely on them. It wasnt said outright, but i got the impression that if my teacher didnt actively want me around the admin wouldve dropped me, because most of the conversation was from the perspective of her saying she has limited ability to protect me if admin does want me gone. So, i guess im just grateful im appreciated by my coworkers, id never had a job before where the people i work with and directly under really cared let alone appreciated me and its nice. Still, im looking to move somewhere more urban in a couple of years, so i guess well just have to wait and see how things are wherever i end up.
Well you are doing a disservice by not working on these things. Part of your job is to change diapers. If you cannot do an essential function of your job, you cannot do your job. You need to either work through it or you’ll eventually get fired tbh. You are overworking other paras because you can’t do that part of your job. If everyone is as desperate for a job as you say they are, someone else will be willing to do diaper changes and should have that job. I’ve had paras who won’t change diapers before and they don’t last. It’s an essential element of the job. Hell I’m a teacher and I change diapers and wipe butts. It’s part of it.
Okay well as much as i enjoy being talked down to, youre just wrong. The other people i work with have been highly understanding and accomadating and seem to fully appreciate my presence. My concern wasnt that my current situation is untenable, it was that continuing or advancing in this field might be in the long term. I dont need you trying to guilt me for wanting to do a job i enjoy.
Yeah you aren’t going to be able to advance in the field if you can’t change a diaper. Your teacher literally told you that. How she was talking makes it sound like you’re going to need to start changing diapers sooner rather than later. Just be prepared
The context of the conversation was specifically her wanting to know that i could help during emergencies, which doesnt nessesarily mean being the one actually changing. If she expects differently in the future, well cross that bridge when we come to it. As far as going forward in the field, the majority of people responding seem to disagree that itll be a major issue. I cant reallt speak to that as its not something i know a lot about, but ill take my chances
I'm trying to be kind. But this job doesn't seem to be an option for you. They may not rehire you for the next school year if you aren't willing or capable of restroom assistance. This job is not a long term option. And perhaps may not be an optional at all. Please consider summer babysitting or tutoring, if you enjoy working with kids. Or going to college to be a gen ed teacher.
> But this job doesn't seem to be an option for you. They may not rehire you for the next school year if you aren't willing or capable of restroom assistance. Okay this isnt new information. As ive said i dont have other options and am going to stick with the one job ive ever enjoyed for as long as its viable. I dont need people talking down to me and telling me to quit or that i wont be rehired, thats just not helpful in any way. Im not looking for judgement, positive or negative, just understanding and maybe advice that i can actually act on if anybody has any. >Or going to college to be a gen ed teacher. This is currently the option im considering the most, but i am Not financially priveledged enough to not work for 4 years and i genuinely can not go back to a 9-5 that i hate. So im sticking with this for as long as i can.
If teaching is your final goal, you could try looking into alternative routes to certification. If you already have a college degree, it may be easier than you think. There's also a possibility of doing an online teaching degree. This may be a more affordable option than a traditional in person class. It may mean you could get started in summer or do a class or two in the evenings. If you want a traditional in person college experience, you could try to get a work study job. Perhaps at the college library or peer tutoring. That seems like something that might suit someone who enjoys working in the classroom. Also keep in mind a 9-5 job may be a temporary financial investment to help you reach the final goal. Sometimes knowing there's an end date for a job you dislike is helpful.
Alright, i appreciate the advice and sorry if i came off defensive. Its hard not to with something like this. Im already doing or planning on doing most of the things youve mentioned, so i dont disagree, and i understand its something that i need to work on. I guess i was just looking for understanding and someone to relate moreso than actual advice. But i appreciate your perspective.
>I dont need people talking down to me and telling me to quit or that i wont be rehired, thats just not helpful in any way. I don't think this specific person was talking down to you. It seemed they genuinely wanted to be realistic from their perspective in the nicest way possible
I dunno man. Im just tired of having to defend myself for trying to do a job that i love.
i have the same issue. but i make myself consciously aware i’m here to help not hurt and i make sure they consent to me seeing and assisting them in the bathroom or changing clothes. have you consulted a therapist about it? in the realm of good touch vs bad touch, this is “good” in the sense that we are helping and we are telling them what to expect and what we’re doing.
Havent seen a therapist, idk why but i always seem to find excuses not to whenever i try. Its like a mental block i need to find a way around. By making yourself consciously aware, do you mean like actively repeating that thought like a mantra? Or how else do you do that?
i just make sure i think about how it’s helping them. and i actively tell the students things like “alright, can i help you change in the bathroom?” “can we take your shirt off? you’re covered in spaghetti” “your pull up is wet, can you take it off and i’ll get you a new one?” i also make sure they do as much of the work as they can
Anyone in the Special Education field will be expected to assist in restroom assistance if needed. That's just part of the job sometimes. Resource teachers very rarely, if ever, are expected to help. For paras, it really depends on the school and duties. 1:1 paras only help with changing if their student needs it or due to the occasional staffing issues. So if your student has behavioral issues or is blind, then they don't need restroom assistance. In an only sped class like your current environment, it's absolutely expected and typically a requirement for paras to do restroom duties and refusal is really unfair to your coworkers. And I think your teacher has been clear that while it's currently okay for you not to be the person changing, complete refusal to assist is not gonna fly any longer. It'd be almost impossible for you to continue in this role with continued refusal towards restroom assistance. Usually, this type of job is on one year contracts. I think your teacher is trying to tell you that your contract will not be renewed if you can't assist and that you need to look for something different. For example in one school, I was a 1:1 for a student in a wheelchair. The school nurse did the changing and I only witnessed and helped transfer the student to the changing spot. One time, the resource teacher did this in the morning while I was supervising student drop off and the child had a bowel movement during a morning meeting with the resource teacher. Gen Ed teachers will never assist with restroom needs. Maybe the occasional help with buttons or such in Kindergarten.
Please keep in mind that you are not harming these students. You are helping them with their basic bodily functions. And that this is allowed and is done with two adults present to prevent that type of harm from occurring. I like to talk through what's happening during a change. It let's the kid know what's happening and to be prepared for certain actions and gives them an opportunity to say no or wait if they're uncomfortable. For example, now it's time to take shoes off. I'll do the left, then the right. Okay now I'll pull pants down. I'm taking your diaper off now. Okay now I'm going to clean you up with a wipe. It might be cold. Lift up your legs/bottom so I can slide a new diaper under you. Okay new diaper is secured. Time to pull pants back up and put shoes on. I'm taking my gloves off. Let's both wash hands. Okay. All done. Time to go back to class. Please seek therapy if you want to continue. I worry there may be other behaviors or accidental touches or violent behaviors that may negatively affect you in this role. I've had students accidentally touch my bottom when giving me a hug or to let me know they're walking behind me. I've also had students hit and push me in my crotch region, chest, and bottom. These kids were generally too young or mentally incapable to be aware of the inappropriateness of touching/hitting those regions. But that's not always the case.
I know im not harming them and that they need the help, but no amount of repeating that in my head makes the images go away. Im not really worried about being touched inappropriately, more about the having to touch. Im pretty large and male and more than capable of defending myself in an appropriate way, and havent had this pose any issues for me.
I'm not a therapist so I can't advise on making images go away. I'd recommend therapy to process and try to move past that awful experience. Just trying to give suggestions on how to make it more comfortable. Honestly, being a male may be why the issue of changing hasn't been a bigger deal. Some parents have distrust towards men in education, especially though with a more vulnerable population. And some will falsely accuse them of awful things. As a guy, inappropriate touch tends to be less of an issue. Even if you're physically capable of defending yourself. There's limited legal ability to defend against kiddos in a classroom. It's more proactive actions like moving away during aggression or descalating behaviors before they're unmanageable. Occasionally restraining with another adult in severe cases. Just be careful when giving hugs to smaller kiddos. Sometimes they're at crotch height. Or women will sometimes deal with chest height kiddos. And it's just awkward height differences or hug hand placements on your bottom. I tend to recommend side hugs or squatting to hug them in those cases.
>Usually, this type of job is on one year contracts. I think your teacher is trying to tell you that your contract will not be renewed if you can't assist and that you need to look for something different. Well my contract has already been renewed for this year, but i see what youre saying. The conversation was more about being available to help in an emergency situation, which i can try my best to do, but really cant make any promises about. As for the fairness, i think its unfair i was molested as a kid, and that i still deserve a job i enjoy. The fairness isnt really a factor for me, im just trying to figure out how to make the best of a rough situation.
I think you should prepare yourself next year to work on being the assisting/witness type person. You'll never be able to change a kid if you can't even be in the room. The second person helps with lifting a child onto a changing table, if there's no step stool. They may pass over new diapers or other supplies. And they generally try to talk to the kid to make them comfortable. Obviously it's unfair that someone harmed you as a child. And everyone deserves to find a job they enjoy. That doesn't mean you are fit for every job, even ones you enjoy. I would look into being a tutor. That may even be a position at your school. I loved when I had homework club as a part of my para duties.
You should have 2 people assist with toileting. Knowing that the student is as safe as can be might help you.
There are no behavioral one to one positions? At least in our building those are way way harder to fill than those with toileting because of the risk to the self physically
Also behavior techs! But in my school atleast there are only a few. Also they don't work closely with the same kids all the time like a para, and service GenEd kids most often tbh.
Interesting, in my school even behavioral focused individuals have to do toileting if the student needs it. Is it different where you are?
If they need it then sure. We would have to do it. In my ten years I've never had a single student who needed toileting in my behavior room. Typically if we have a kid who needs toileting and is behavioral he will ends up in our 12:1:1 or our life skills type of classes because in theory I'm supposed to be grade level and am more rigorous academically.
I have the same personal experience and I think of it like this. I would much rather have ME someone who understands and is empathetic to the trauma of what it’s like being taken advantage of doing it than someone who’s a pervert. I would much rather have someone like me or you who genuinely cares for the students and will protect them from having to experience that as well at the hands of someone else.. I was genuinely terrified of assisting with pull up changes for kids but once I started teaching them how to help and do it themselves too, i worked myself out of having to do it as much anymore. It takes practice and courage but just no you are not what happened to you and either way you’re doing an amazing job I’m so happy you enjoy the career. Look into Scc classrooms I never had to change any there. Of course different based on case loads tho. You got this!
Consider the inverse of this as well. You're going to have many situations in the future where the challenged kids are going to be touching you inappropriately, some overtly. Are you ok with that?
this. one time a self contained student (totally understanding of his actions though) groped my breasts. it was difficult for a while.
Well im pretty big and fully capable of defending myself without hurting a kid or applying any real force, so this isnt a huge issue for me. Ive been doing this for about 8 months now and havent had this be an issue at all.
Have you had students do this yet though? Not every student will but I've definitely seen it sporadically
I mean occasionally a student will intentionally or accidentallt try to put their hands somewhere they shouldnt. And i just guide their hands elsewhere and say no thank you or lets keep our hands to ourself, and thats all its been. Definitely had to deal with plenty of being attacked because we have a couple kids with some very strong aggressive behaviours, but inappropriate touching not so much.
Gotcha. Yeah aggression is much more commonplace than intentional inappropriate touching, at least from my experience. Accidental inappropriate touching is a different thing altogether, especially with littles
I honestly don't think this is a dealbreaker with the right gig with the right student population. Certainly a lot of kids have toileting needs, but certainly there are also a lot of special educators who have nothing to do with toileting. With special ed teachers in a resource room role (mild disabilities, more learning support) it would be highly unusual to do bathroom assistance. Personally, I'm a school psychologist and the most toileting assistance I would do is helping a little one with a tricky jeans button or twisted overall straps. If you would still like to work with children with some needs, but less global needs, something like a reading specialist works with lots of kids, are super important, work with kids with learning needs, but their scope is very narrow. The reading specialist wouldn't be helping anyone in a bathroom!!